When we are buying something, it's about us. That's the truth. You're never going to buy something that you know they need, but they're not going to be excited about. Or you're never going to buy something that is going to make you feel bad about that decision. So let's be honest about it. And let's write to the for the intent of avatar, which is the person that's spending the money. Another one that's going to ultimately use it. The person that's throwing a party and buying party supplies, they don't care about the kids having a good time. They need to get it done because they're cute. They're exhausted. And they want to be the mom that has the best birthday of the whole party class. That's the truth. Thanks for subscribing to the ZonCon podcast. The podcast all about Amazon, Conversations. These are the tips and tricks to become an Amazon millionaire. Here is your host Andrew Erickson. He is all things Amazon and so is this podcast. Let's have an Amazon conversation. Hey, hey guys. Welcome back to the ZonCon podcast. This is Andrew Erickson, your host as always. Today I'm very excited to be with one of my really good friends, Kata. Kata Fips. She has been on the podcast two other times. I had to look it up because it was about a year ago. So it's definitely about time to have you back on. But Kata did a 2021 predictions and also military wife to millionaire mom boss back in episode 54 and episode 60. And Kata is back here with us today. Thank you for being here, Kata. I am so delighted to be here. I love your show and I love chatting to you. So nothing better to do, right? Yes, absolutely. Very excited. Today we're going to talk about product development. So Kata is an amazing, fantastic person. And I think you are one of the best product developers and the products I've seen that you've come out with are some of the like most top-notch things I've ever seen. So I thought, oh man, let's get Kata on the podcast. Let's talk about it. Let's hear from an expert. Before we jump into product development, if you haven't heard about Kata, we did a full in depth. Like I said, the military mom to millionaire mom boss. We already did a full in depth, but why don't you give us a quick little intro on yourself, Kata. And also gives a little bit of update. The special thing that happened the summer to you guys. Yeah, sure. So if you haven't heard of me, that's totally fine because I don't particularly think if that excites you to be honest, but I do enjoy what I'm doing, which is Amazon product development. I'm just just enjoying the ride to be fair. We've done really well. Three years, two years, a month seem to our Amazon journey from YouTube watching video tutorials days. We accepted a company for an amount that I can't disclose, but I'm quite comfortable, which is pretty much what every rich person say. They'd someone told me right. So I live a comfortable life now. Shall I say no? The truth is we work really hard. We team up with really good people along the way. Land to network on a stage, which led me to have friends such as Andrew here and some other might in our title network and Be Young. And yeah, we just took everything we could apply to it. The liver, good quality stuff. And here we are. Same retire, I will say, even though we're still you know, launch a second company and I'm debating launching to more because it's exciting. So nice. Yeah. I love it. I love it. So, so Kati had a nice little exit the summer and it was, I know we have a lot of NDAs around it, but we have, let's just say it's life changing money for you guys, right? For anybody, but definitely for you guys. Yeah, I literally had to ask Mark the other they say, how much money do we actually have? I literally did now. It's really funny. It's yeah, it's it's very handling and surreal. I'm sure you know that from your experience, like, you know, you get surreal at times, but hey, the opportunity is there for everyone to take on. So here we are. Hopefully we're going to give you some tips today to focus on what I believe drives us access the most, which is probably the limit. So sweet. And so what got to the thing that actually one of the biggest things that blew my mind. So our exit, we had the 26 SKUs. So I've always been kind of like, hey, let's just I like the product development part of it. And I thought like, oh, let's just get a lot more SKUs. And it's easy to hit $5,000, $10,000 monthly revenue. So let's just do with 20, 30 of them and we'll get up to $100, $200,000 monthly revenue. And that's a million dollar business. And that's that was my strategy. And that worked for me. There's lots of different strategies to do this. You tell me the company that exit for like a very, very large number. How many SKUs did that company have? Four. Five. Five. We negotiated an upcoming SKU that we had developed separately. But yeah, we had our company, as you say, is different strategies for everything. And we have another very good friend, you know, Justin Dyson. And he had a much larger cast illegal products. And the thing is, I believe that one of the key things that one has to realize quite early on in the game is what kind of business person you are. I know I lose motivation if I feel obliged to do stuff called to duty. It's not my call. Let's put it that way. My husband was a military one. But the truth is, I'm rather lazy and I like to spend my time learning. And I'm a bit of a bookworm and I like to watch Ted Talks. And that's my jam. That's my happy place. So if I had to be working, even for 15 SKUs, that for me will be too much work to be enjoyable. So my goal has always, I was always grow a company. And as soon as he was about to heed the A figures, I was out because that's corporate level. And I didn't want to do that. I knew that very well. So I just took the money off the table and I go out again and I get to build from the ground up. We try and enjoy because it allows me to have the small team, but also a very good grasp of what's happening with everything one of my SKUs. Although the downsides to that is as soon as one goes down, you have lost 20% of your revenue, which could be really bad. And it's not something I would recommend if you are very adverse to risk. But I'm a bit of a, you know, realisticer. So I kind of enjoyed it. So I would say, Kata is a work smarter, not harder person than 100%. Was it? Boy, you're looking for a freedom. That's what we do. Right? I find the entrepreneur is like the entrepreneurs have, there's this like really nice cocktail of 80D. It'd be like kind of exciting about starting a new thing. And being a little lazy, you have to work really hard. Also the work can be a little lazy. It's like, I don't want to do that. Let's just have somebody else do that. When I embrace that, let's just have other people help me with this. Let's just figure out a way to do it quicker and faster for less work than the business really did well. So I love that. That's fantastic. You are very good at delegating. And I have to say, is probably one of the, would you agree that is one of the hardest lessons early on when you start doing really well? And you realize that you can't do it all or even worse, it's that people can do it better than you. It's a hit to be ego. A lot of people struggle to let go of task and to change language from spending on hiring someone to investing on hiring someone that can do it better. And I think that's really difficult. So, but it's growing pains. And when you let go, the release I'm going back. I don't think it's the thing is that to delegate, like you have to, so to start the business, to start the business, you really have to be hands on. I can do it all. I can do PPC. I can develop the thing. I can chat to the Chinese supplier. I can schedule the freight forwarding. I can do that because you really need to do it yourself at the very beginning. I guess if you, well, most of us have to do it ourselves at the very beginning. At least you have to learn how to do it yourself at least, right? And then there's that switch when you go from like, DIY, like I can do it all. I have to do it all into the like, let me have other people help me. And how can I effectively build that team? That is a real difficult thing because a person who starts a company generally is a person who isn't as good at like, they're very DIY. To see it through. Yeah. Yeah. Well, that's why the whole thing about visionaries and, you know, well, we're getting in a tangent. But yes, that's part of the growing pains that I think that and what we're talking about today. Yes. And so product development. So, Kata, you tell me you have four or five products that were all very successful. These are all six, well, tens of thousands of months, maybe hundreds of thousands a month in monthly revenue, right? Tell me some of the core concepts. What are the things you look at? What are the, how do you get started? How do you, where you get started? I believe that one of the things that drivers are knowingly to really good product development when I say, drivers, I mean, Matt Fapeson, myself, Matt's, my husband, if you don't know, are married, then we work together and we complement each other quite nicely. But we both have very strong views when it comes down to the quality of what we want to deliver. There are two ways of running an Amazon business. One is to put things out there, hoping 80% of that are going to stick. And, you know, more of a numbers game. And there is another one where you will be very proudly announced to your friends and family and the loved ones and be, have no issue whatsoever being the face of a brand. Because it's
something that you feel proud of and it's a quality something that you're delivering. And again, this goes back to what kind of business person you are. I know I'm a very emotional person. I get very invested and I'm also a very picky customer myself. So if anyone's going to wild me from the time, the moment I receive the product in my hands, everything from the unpacking experience to everything is what's going to take care of me going above and beyond to maybe an exam or an Amazon or I'm prompted to buy an email, I will in fact leave that review. But if I don't get something spectacular and beyond the value I'm paying for, I very rarely will do that. And I believe that a lot of people feel that way and we have forgotten because we don't have the face to face a customer experience anymore. We forget that there is someone actually having an emotional response to what we're delivering to them anyhow. And it will be stupid not to acknowledge at this stage that emotions is what drives money. As strong as it sounds is true. That's why when you start that and sports and music and things like that, it's what sells. And if you make someone feel really really good about, if you make someone feel that they baggage, they just managed to bag a bargain and they are just so overjoyed, well, well, it's a good quality for value as well. Then I think your job is done. There is literally zero per sales customer care. Other than getting the emails that we get, how happy people are. So it's smart, I think. So I don't know if that answers your question. Yeah, that's a great point, Katta. That's one thing I found that's really interesting is that the people really buy with emotions as an engineer, I always kind of thought, oh, it's logical. I got to look at a spreadsheet and figure out what the right answer is. But that's honestly a bunch of BS because people really just think and move and make decisions with emotions. And they might justify it with logic and numbers later, but that's just kind of like re-justifying their emotions. So totally agree. Katta, how do we connect with these people on an emotional level to a customer we never actually get to see in person? So I love it that you actually made that distinction because you're quite right and they are two types of buyers. The ones that are by basic logic, which normally tend to be the consumables type, you know, home staff, practical purchases, right? And obviously there is the giftable, which is 100% emotional. But the truth is, when you deliver and when that person receives your packaging and they have an experience, even if they're not aware of it, they are already having an emotion connected to feeling that they go more value for the backs than they did in before. So even if it's a logical purchase, emotion still is attached to the purchase in the end result that turns into reviews and turns into very little post-customers service for sales and all of that. So it's a win-win situation anyhow. And I think that the key thing is to always make people feel that they're getting more value for the money they pay for, whether it be with a surprise and element in the packaging quality, whether it be with a funny no if humor has a space in the delivery of that product, you know, sometimes I've just got very non-sexy products delivered that have a very funny insert. That's not asking me for reviews. That's not asking me to scan the QR code and get into the flow as I know or register or my guarantee or whatever. It's actually something that's telling me, you know, I bought a bed base recently and it said this is an unbed-fucking livable or something like that. And it was kind of rude but it wasn't. And he's singlin', so it was kind of borderline wrong and I thought that's just genius. And I have thought about it ever since. And every single quote that came to bed where I little bit like sexy connotations that were "I got a borderline wrong and no" but through all the whole, you know, removing the back of these products, they were making me laugh. So they are always ways to get someone connected at an emotional level and regardless of the type of product you're selling. Nice, I love that. So I basically add to over-deliver on your promise, right? Yes, 100%. So let's expand upon that a little bit. I know you said that, so I've a great insert kind of like making sure you connect with the customer with that insert and then you also mentioned packaging. So I know a lot of times people in this space will think, "It's okay, just put it in a brown, super brown box, it's cheaper because most of the stuff happens on Amazon with the images and stuff like that." So why don't you expand a little bit on packaging and why it's important? Packaging is important and brown boxes are okay. So long is your first or second round of inventory. After that is the scene. After that you already have the knowledge that can take on the money to invest a little bit more on what you're delivering and have hopefully learn the power of branding. So brown and polyvags are no longer acceptable, I would say then. It's okay if you're a constrain of money when you're just launching, but no longer afterwards. And the truth is, yes, it's right. Nobody's going to ever refer to your products about the brand name, probably. But the truth is if you ever want to exit your business, a brand is a thing. And there is value to it. And we don't actually ever pull our branding all over the packaging. We made the packaging, something that people could reuse. So if our products came into a box, that box was probably as expensive as the product itself. So that led us to go down the rabbit hole or find them very good manufacturers and hiring a source in agent and then making sure that we could save some place else by getting cheaper actually manufacturing codes all better terms. So we call a four better packaging. And that what that led to was customers actually loving it more because it looks so much funnier than it was or any other, you know, our products were bundles, bundles of things that make sense to put together. So people were glad to get it in that presentation ready to gift, already to use, or everything single element including the packaging could be reuse, as opposed to the poly bag with a sticker with a barcode on it, you know. It's a small thing that we're talking about probably 50 cents difference between your very cheap packaging and a very well-sourced packaging. And I'm talking about my boxes where about probably at least 24 inches by 18. So they were big, but there were still the nicest bags. I mean, think of Chanel bags of packaging. That makes any sense to your viewer, man, I don't know what that would be, an Apple experience. Because packaging porn is a thing. And I'm sure that Andrew's going to love because I can see you carrying the box of a knife on them. They've done really neatly and shrink wrapped and the stickers and who's going to remove the sticker of the screen. And none of that, any sudden experience that where you wanted to acknowledge it or not, the truth is you like it probably. And I always do. Oh, man, I love that iPhone Mac, MacBook packaging thing. Right. When you pull it and it has that suction and like, oh, I love that. And it's like, oh, yes, I love this. It's like, you don't even want to throw away because that's so cool. I know. I'm like, we really have it like sitting like right here, my like, just right next to my desk. I don't use it for anything. I'm just like, oh, it's so nice. Right. Yeah. So again, an emotional response because you may feel good. They may feel fancy to have the experience that you wanted to touch it and take your time to unveil and you know exactly what was inside. But do you think you would have the same reaction if you form whatever arrived in, you know, and I know this is going to be self a lot of people. But if you give me that box in recycleable, save the planet time of packaging, that's great. But it's not the same experience. This be honest. So if you combine two, great. But I'm going to say the one that's going to drive the most money is the one that's going to make people feel better about themselves to be honest. And the ones that are going to make people feel better about whatever they're buying for someone else even more so. So a lot of people are an Amazon don't buy for themselves. They are normal regular avatars. Someone that's buying for everyone else. And that person needs to emotionally justify the fact that if you're going to make a gift, that gift needs to be good enough to be gifted and hopefully be the best gift that that person is going to receive and elicit the attention that you are the coolest person given that way. You know, literally is selfish, but it's also very honest. It's never about the intended receiving. People think, "Oh my avatars, who's going to use the product?" And that's bullshit. Your avatars, the person is going to buy the product to give you to someone else. And if you can make that person looks like the coolest outie that bought the best present that had the biggest reaction, then that's your money right there. So love it. Yeah. That's basically that was my golden driver to all the products and that's what we only needed five. Because amount of times we got a review that said it was the favorite present. It wasn't because of the content. It wasn't because of the price they pay. It was because they had the biggest box with the fun experience to unveil and it was more going into the packaging itself and the experience rather than the contents themselves. So, which were also pretty good. But, you know. Nice.
I think I want to key off of here too is like understanding the customer and again I Because I have my engineering background you had your psychology background So for you it comes very natural or what comes from your training? It comes natural from your training and for me like the the numbers and the dimensions come very natural from my training So I had to learn the emotional connection from people and like you said it's hard to do that when you are You know not really ever seeing a customer in person because hey, it's the internet business, right? So do you have any other tips on how we can connect with these like strangers across the internet? Yes, number one tip that I'm gonna give you all for that is be humble You don't know better than the people that are buying from you That's the number one lesson that we need to learn no because we love it and we think it's great and even if the data Shows that it's gonna be a killer product. You still don't know if it's gonna take off because chances are you're the sign is hideous and He's just good for your eyes. So ask questions be humble to us the right people People are willing to give information for free and even more so it's it turns into money How you get asked people even if it's not your own audience because let's be honest 80% of the people are known even very successful people in their Amazon business Haven't got time to build their audience correctly And if they've done it they haven't had time to utilize this So you can always go to someone else's Facebook group Instagram you can connect with people that you think will love having the product and ask them questions Hey and developing this product. What do you think would you mind just give me 30 seconds with your opinion? These are that color, you know, and what happens is something really quite powerful Which is if you utilize even if you saw the people's audiences You get them invested in the product before you even launch that So when they they take somehow Ownership especially if you do the job well and you go back and say hey, you remember you told me this was I just want you to know that I'm gonna go away that one because that's great that person will be waiting for that product to come out Just so they can tell someone that they gave you their opinion and you went where they're designed That's honestly brighter than there and that's how products get sold out before they even hit the market, you know You're making them Bested in something buy being humble enough and ask what do you think? I mean, I had a lot of great ideas for products But they weren't gonna take off because they were for me and I'm quite particular So, you know, I had to say okay, maybe maybe when I don't need to sell a product for money to get just a full fund, you know But yeah, just be humble and ask I love going into the Facebook groups That's a big killer tip because if you have your own audience You have your own Instagram, your own email, else whatever like yes use them and that's a great time to use them as a figure out the product development But go on but if you don't have that or you don't you do have that also go into the Facebook groups And I like to scope out my avatar and also having a clear avatar is really nice too If you have a very clear niche and a clear person who you're talking to and and what they want and and having an idea I also kind of think of like an avatars you know who you're not selling to I am not selling to middle age men. I am not selling to teenage boys. I am not selling to to cat people You know like that that's if you're like oh my my avatar is everybody No, that your avatar is no one if you do that right? But you're a clear avatar you go into those Facebook groups and you kind of look at what they're talking about what they care about What they comment on other people stuff what post gets the most engagement and stuff like that and kind of get like an idea of what they're doing and what Why they're thinking things and then I found just like you said making polls so making kind of like hey Here's three images or here's three products or here's three logos like which one do you care about We posted that and like we had three logos built out and we posted that in like five different Facebook groups One of them kicked us out for Because they don't like I don't know they kicked us out. It's okay. They got kicked out of one of the five So it's whatever I saw for that or that like me But the other four we ended up three of those posts got like a hundred and forty comments on them right so Cumulatively we had something like 400 people Came in and gave us their opinion about our logo about the product about this about that and stuff like that Which is like and this is our avatar like these are our people doing this and it just helps so much to do that kind of stuff But it's also you know, it's just about taking a minute to step back and looking look around you What's happening in society right now is that people are dying to have a voice People don't longer have time for social interactions if you give them space to be a part of something Inwards is something that for us all for themselves may be assistant They may think and as to just press a or b in a poll in an insta poll or something like that Just leave a comment people somehow Subconsciously feel a part of something in does way they wake up every day to be and that's why current Society pandemics and everything going on doesn't allow us to do so at that level anymore that match Of that's why people engage in this tools much more than if you were to ask a very broad question Because it's something very simple is a or b It takes them a second and they do it and they don't mind it and then they they're almost like subconsciously Take the box off I down my goodwill for the day help someone out, you know It all comes down to that is all comes down to get people invested in helping you out Deliver something to serve them eventually, you know, and that's why I believe that product development is such a key Everybody says including my friend here Andrea Always be launching always be good news and I'm always like that so great And I would love to be that person. I would love to be the person that takes no risk and he's always launching a new product But it's almost like a grow mind and then love and they take like six months to grow and take shape and I have my tools And if I was just to show you right now what I'm surrounded by this is my craft room and have samples and things and craft stuff and glues and tapes and everything you can think of and I made my little boxes and the packaging and a printer and I pulled it up together And see and it takes me a long time but is delivered with perfection in over 6,000 five star reviews in what seven months, you know And I did nothing I didn't even do follow up people do we're just happy and I asked questions along the way and they and I was like You know, I didn't have time for social media either so we ask our micro influences. What do you think people were like the most? They know their avatar better than we do because they have time to interact with them And I was really interested to get to people that much that often socially in social media I mean, I didn't have time for it So it was great that they could tell me because I will trust the experience because they create content every day about very same Avatars so they know very well too So that's another thing you can do you can just have like three to five go to Avatars that you offer your products when you launch something and ask them what do you think people were like and They will be able to give you a pretty good idea and that will probably represent at the very least 50% of their own audience Which is the same as yours so nice a lot of you know, you can do that too. I love that That's such great tips that basic we found a lot of success when we started talking to this micro influencers I again going back to the whole like our data while I see that we're turning whatever I found social media to be very frustrating Because we because I looked at the traffic and the conversion rate and the revenue generator from the traffic that blah blah blah blah blah And it's really not profitable which is frustrating, but We did find that engaging with again engaging with people working with the micro influencers talking to them and kind of Understanding what like how they think and how they influence people and of course their audience and stuff like that and then the product development with the social media That has made a social media very fruitful for us That's been good. So it's not social media isn't necessarily like a very like oh, I'm gonna drive revenue It's a I'm going to learn the avatar and be part of the community thing So Kat that want to hear what do you think about competition? Like how do you look at people like the current people on Amazon and then do you try to fit yourself in or do you just say You know what I'm just gonna make everything perfect myself and I'm gonna I'm just gonna find a card my own niche Are you trying to like find a corner and then when new people come in? How do you handle that? So that's that's sort of like a three-headed question because How I see competition. I don't I don't see competition because I always know I'm gonna deliver something better that involves also Two competitors in one because I like to bundle I'm not gonna forget three years ago when I was in China magic and I met Dan and I said to Dan I don't know I just love bundles and he said to me look at me and said I don't believe in bundles And I had such a joy you know the thing is we have the tools now giving by Amazon sell through brand analytics of what people are buying alongside your products Right we had them before with the frequently bought together. Why not why not put them together and do a better job of manufacturing and sourcing For the same price and off the bus, you know and do a nice packaging and you are there for the win, right? So my And again going back to over the limbrane go on sorry sorry interrupt I just I feel like when you say Bundling your Products I guess technically they would be bundling but they seem so much more special than that like the thing I don't like because when someone's like all right a water bottle and a hammer Bundle this is the wonder man's morning bundle like this stupid like a just a regular stupid water bottle regular stupid hammer like Why would you bundle that right and it's just like all right? I just gonna throw him in a poly bag because there's whatever
the bundle, you know, and just that kind of stuff is why I hate bundles, right? There's no creativity. But your stuff is not like that. Yours is like you created a new product from other things off the shelf. Yeah, so other things on the shelf won't put together. It's like my concept was if we go back to my tattoo, which was my first million dollar product, was the, you know, the fact that it's a gift thing and then to wallet. That was the concept I was going by. People are going to buy something and you need to think again, the customers' emotions are always like this. Even when they're going to give something, they're always going to have a budget for a main gift and a tiny little something extra. I don't know why people do that, but they do. Do you just want to feel gray about what you're giving out, right? And he ends up adding that. So why not just give them an option with a greater packaging that makes it look bigger, but in fact, it's the same two things separately, but I did, I bandled their wallet with, I don't know, with a fake note or something like that, you know. It's not exactly what we did because at the time, I'm not sure if I can talk about my product yourself, because we just sold the company, but it was a kid's product that was normally purchased alongside some other things. It's like, you know, buying a headband holder without a headband to go on. You know, it wouldn't make sense. And it's not really giftable. It's more of an organizing, home-style type thing, if you don't put them together. So that's sort of the concept that I was going by. People are going to end up buying something smaller on the side anyhow, or they can have this gray better gift that only someone will do to give out and make you feel gray and make the receiver feel gray as well. So yes, as opposed to now bundling, but it's actually picking best-selling products within the niche from different keywords, if you wish. So if you go and also the possibilities of that is you never run out of keywords to rank. You always have longer-tailed keywords. You have cheaper launch campaigns because you have different elements that you can target rather than just the main keyword as well. So it's cost-efficient as well. And you have much widercy of opportunities to rank, to be shown, to be portrait, to be big. And in different categories, in this case, for instance, you could be chosen number one best-selling home organizer or bedroom organizer for little ones, or kids bedroom organizer, as well as kid accessories if you were to bundle those two things, which I haven't, but if you want to, you're welcome. It just makes sense. So yeah, it's anything can be made giftable. You just have to be creative. Like even when you were talking about that tumbler and the hammer, I was thinking it actually wouldn't be about others' they give. Like my mind's the same way I go to with nice packaging, you can sell some to the Arabs. Like literally you can just always come out with something. Yeah. Nice. I love a cocktail. These are some good tips. So basically, so to sum it up, so really think about the customer, think about how to emotionally connect to them, packaging and the way to present something is very important. And then competition is real, but also like don't try to necessarily carve out that weird little tiny niche thing. Like just do something great and people will respond to it. And then bundling is great. Yeah. Don't be put out by the competition. I just really want to begin on this. There's a lot of support out there that gives you, I don't know, this IPR method. You have to give away as many as the competitive, the competitive targeting. Selling, that's bullshit. We didn't do that in time. Could you just literally deliver more value for the same price? And that is all you took. And we managed to be out of number one. A company has been selling the products for 10 years. So for me, there is no limitation. So long, there is quality in where you're going to deliver. And that's why product development in my opinion should be the time that you spend longest crafting. What is it that you're going to give? So it will be that. And number two, switch the focus from the receiver of the product, the intended user, from the actual avatar, which is normally not the same person. If you write your bullet points and you write the little one will love this. Or it's going to be a happy man. That's bullshit. You just want to make that person feel you're going to be the favorite girlfriend or the best gift ever given to a man. You know, you want to make them feel that the decision they're making, it will be a selfish one. It will make them feel better as well as but their intended user, that secondary to the one that's spending the money, is about us really. That's the truth. And let's write to the for the intended avatar, which is the person that's spending the money. The person that's you know throwing a party and buying parties supplies, they don't care about the kids having a good time. They need to get it done because they're kids. They're exhausted. And they want to be the mom that has best birthday of the whole party class. That's the truth. They want to have the best party that is not even about the child. They want to be the best mom in that group. Let's be honest about it. So Zelda ones are going to leave them thinking that she hired a pro with the balloons and the arch balloons and the decor. You know, don't sell that because the kids can have a great time because that doesn't sell. The truth is, which is just want to be all the other moms. That's the truth. I love it. God, that thank you so much for coming on to the ZonCon and having an Amazon conversation about product development. And really, I think it's probably development, but it's really more like how to connect to the avatar and understand the customer so that you can provide a good product to them. And that's really more of what this was, right? Which I love that. I love your I love your psychologist, like a emotional connection you have there because it's something that something else I find difficult just because I have to learn it. I don't learn it as opposed to having it come naturally. So God, that thank you so much for coming on sharing your wisdom with us. You're very welcome. Happy to be here. And yeah, it's sorry if I come across to fashion everybody. It's really exciting. No, it's things too passionate. Yeah, well, it's like, is there really, you know, developing your products is really what leads to the truth. It's on the way we're seeking, which is why we're not doing something else and we're here, right? So yeah, love it to anytime. Love the audience. Know how if they want to get in contact with you, what's the best way of contacting you? You can always contact me at casa
[email protected] and I'll get back to you. Or you can find me on social media, Casa Fapes, which I'm sure my name is going to be down there somewhere in the description of this episode. So yeah, happy to link up. Awesome. Thank you so much, Kata. And one thing, of course, as you guys heard, Kata is part is a leader inside the Titan Network as MI. And if it's something that you're looking to grow your business and elevate your product development, maybe you could join. You could, you could, I have everything else. Anything else. So you're looking to find a place for elite Amazon sellers to grow their businesses. Consider coming on to the Titan Network. It's a fantastic place and something I love very passionate about and stuff like that. And Kata is a great example of one of our leaders and we have about, there's no one as special as Kata, but we have another dozen. Well, I thought it was a member. I studied as a member, so I know the full right. No one as special as Kata, we have a dozen or 15 other leaders and another two dozen mentors who come in. And of course, it's a mastermind, several kind of like masterminds together. So Kata's just an example, or she's a fantastic example of one of leaders inside of Titan. So guys, thank you so much for being here and Kata, thank you so much for bringing your wisdom to our audience. Happy to have you here. Thank you so much for having me, guys. I have just been peace and
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