Your Slow Metabolism Might Be Your Thyroid – The Shocking Lab Mistake Keeping You Sick with Dr. Amie Hornaman | #1311

They're being told the same thing even in 2026 and that is wrong because you know what they end up doing? They end up starving themselves. They end up taking macrata as a GLP so they don't eat more than 500 calories a day. They end up shutting down their own metabolism. They make their thyroid worse through starvation and overexercising and driving up their cortisol and it's a vicious cycle. So that myth is not just a myth, it's a dangerous piece of information that women are given. Welcome to the Benazadi Show. You're daily ritual to live longer, healthier and happier. Here we use real science, ancient wisdom and a daily dose of vitamin G gratitude. So you live the life you were always meant to. Let's lock in. Welcome back to the Benazadi Show. I'm your host Ben Azadi. You can learn more about me over at Benazadi.com. Hey, what if everything you've been told about losing belly fat is wrong? What if you could eat clean, train hard, sleep eight hours, drink the water, do the fasting and still not lose a single pound around your midsection? It's not because you're lazy, it's not because you lack discipline and willpower, but because a tiny gland in your neck is quietly sabotaging every single thing you're doing. Today's guest is Dr. Amy Horniman and she says that millions of people are walking around with this exact problem and their doctors are telling them, hey, you're fine. Their labs look normal. Everything checks out on paper yet they still feel exhausted, foggy, anxious, they're gaining weight out of nowhere and slowly being convinced they're crazy. They're not crazy. It's not their fault. Dr. Amy Horniman flew down to Miami to record this podcast just for you. She's one of the most respected thyroid specialist in the country. She's the founder of the Institute of Tharroyd and Hormone Optimization, host of the Tharroyd Fixer Podcast and she's helped thousands of people, many of who have given up finally get their bodies back in her brand new book that comes out tomorrow called the Tharroyd fix. It's a no nonsense playbook for anyone who's been gas lit, dismissed or told to just eat less and move more. We take a deep dive into her book today. We talk about how the thyroid is linked to your metabolism, how to understand your thyroid labs, not just about TSH or T3. There's much more to it. The hidden pandemic, nobody's talking about, which is thyroid disorder symptoms. Most people brush off until it gets really bad. Why you can fast perfectly and still not burn fat. Can you do keto and fasting or even carnivore with hypothyroidism and the first step to take if you suspect your thyroid is an issue. I'm excited to bring her on. This is a fantastic conversation. I learned so much. Amy is incredible and you're going to be so blessed together information today. Before I bring on, I want to just let you know I'll be in Austin, Texas at the end of this month, at the end of May, to deliver a keynote lecture at Dave Asprey's conference called Beyond. I'm also speaking at other conferences, doing keynotes and book signings throughout the United States throughout the world. I'll be in Cancun, Mexico in September, Houston, Texas in October. I'm in Florida in November and there's more dates being added, but I'd love to see you at Dave's event. I'll be doing a keynote, then a book signing for metabolic frame. If you go to Ben as a dot com slash events. You could learn more about my upcoming keynotes with coupon codes and different locations and dates will update that page periodically as well. Okay, without further ado, here's Dr. Amy Horderman. I'm holding up five pounds of visceral fat visceral fat is the nasty fat that wraps around your vital organs that creates pressure and eventually disease and I have an thyroid expert here, a great friend of mine, Dr. Amy Horderman, Amy. What is the connection here between thyroid health and fat loss, especially this type of fat visceral fat? So first of all, the thyroid runs your metabolism. I always say from head to toe, it runs the show of your body. So it's controlling, it's dictating whether or not you're going to burn the fat that you grab, you're like, oh, I don't like this right here. I'm tight in my clues are tight here, but the visceral fat, that is what lives on your organs behind the fat that you want to get rid of. That's the fact that causes disease and does its dirty work behind the scenes. We don't think about visceral fat, but we need to because that's what's going to cause disease as we age, that's what's going to kill us sooner. And if the thyroid isn't working properly, your body will lay down fat left and right. I mean, literally, I joke, I say you're going to gain weight looking sideways at a brownie. You, I mean, you talk a lot about insulin resistance, you literally can gain weight looking at sugar. If you are that metabolically broken, same thing with your thyroid. If your thyroid's in the toilet, you have no control over your metabolism. You could be doing all the things, but you're going to lay down this sort of fat on your body. Gain weight looking at a brownie. It's so you're right. A lot of people feel like they're doing everything right and that happens. They don't even eat the brine, but they look at it and they're like, what's going on here? And you made a good point. The visceral fat, you can't see it. It's not the fat that you pinch, which is subcutaneous. Right. And that's not necessarily a dangerous fat. This fat that wraps around your organs, that is dangerous. It applies pressure. Of course, we've here a fatty liver disease. We hear of a fatty pancreas. And that's leading to a lot of disease. Right. So a lot of people they feel like they're doing everything right. And their body is still not burning fat. You just said, if you don't fix the thyroid, you can't burn fat. Go a little bit deeper. What is the connection? How is the thyroid controlling our metabolism? Okay. So the thyroid dictates all hormonal functions. So if we think about the thyroid up top, it's controlling everything below it. So it's controlling every single selling your body, your hormone balance, your insulin and glucose balance, your cortisol released, your stress resilience. Everything is controlled by the thyroid. Now specifically, the thyroid produces two hormones, T4 and T3. T4 is inactive, T3 is active. So it's the T3 that needs to get to receptor sites on your cell, almost like a lock and key. And the T3 finds that that receptor site inserts the key turns the lock and then boom, you have a metabolism. Now you actually have the ability to burn the food that you're eating as fuel instead of having it stored on your body for later fuel. The thyroid dictates that. So I have seen so many people and I was one of them many years ago that you could be doing literally everything right. I mean, eating a clean diet, gluten free, watching your carbs, macro counting, going to the gym, lifting heavy, doing biohacking and nothing will work. In fact, even a GLP one that people are now taking left and right to lose body fat. I have seen it slide out, not work. If the thyroid isn't functioning properly, if the thyroid is in the toilet, if the T3 is low, and if something called reverse T3, which is your anti thyroid hormone we can talk about is high. That person's body is in lockdown mode. It doesn't care what their desire is. It doesn't care how much they exercise. It doesn't care how perfect they eat. It doesn't care that they're taking a GLP one. It will hold on to that fat for dear life because it doesn't have the signal from the thyroid to turn on their metabolism. So we need to get T3 into the cell is what I'm hearing and why is it that the gold standard of testing thyroid for thyroid health is not T3 reverse T3, but it's TSH explain what TSH is. Let me actually give you this little thyroid here and you can actually show it to the camera. But is TSH thyroid stimulating hormone the gold standard to see how your thyroid is functioning? Well, it's standard of care. Gold I would not give it a gold star whatsoever. Okay, it is standard of care, meaning when you go into your PCP or OBGYN you go in to talk to your doctor, say, Hey, Doc, I heard this woman on a podcast. I want to get my thyroid tested. They are going to test TSH thyroid simulating hormone. Now what that is is it's a signal from your brain. So it's literally your brain sensing is there enough thyroid hormone in the body. And then what it does is it sends out a hormone called thyroid simulating hormone TSH to the thyroid gland to basically like, hook it to wake it up. It's like, Hey, thyroid and I do a good job. You need to you need to work a little bit better. So now TSH starts to go up a little bit and then the body starts sensing. Oh, wow. The thyroid really is not online here. Not a good employee. It starts yelling thyroid. Let's go man. Claw. You need to work harder. TSH keeps going above above above. So if the TSH on paper on a lab is screaming at us, you know, if it's a five seven and nine, we go, oh my goodness, well, this person obviously has a thyroid problem. But what if it's not? What if it's within normal range? What if it's within that standard lab value range? Well, we can't stop there because that doesn't. tell the whole picture. That just tells us what your brain is sensing and what it's seeing to the thyroid. It doesn't tell us how much thyroid hormone this guy's making. So when he's pumping out that T4 and T3, doesn't it make sense that we actually test the T4 on the T3? Of course. We want to test the hormones just like we would test estrogen, progesterone, testosterone. Let's actually test the hormones that the thyroid is making to see how much you have. Now, of those hormones, we have to break those down too. I said already, T4 is inactive, T3 is active. We want to look at T4. We want to see how much inactive thyroid hormone you have that almost is like invading. It has potential to become T3. We want to know how much do you have in your savings account, essentially. T4 is like your savings. You can't use a debit card and take it out of your savings. You have to transfer it to your checking. Then you can spend it with same thing. T4 has to be transferred or converted to T3 i.e. your checking. Then you can spend it. Then we can use that T3 in our body. So that brings us to testing the free T3, the unbound active thyroid hormone that's going to get to your cells. There's so much more testing that we need to do beyond TSH. So TSH is the signal to the thyroid to produce the hormone. It produces T4 inactive. It needs to be converted to T3 active. Without that activation, you still might not feel well. You still might burn fat. You're not going to feel good. You need to get that T3 activated into the cell. You mentioned reverse T3 as another marker to look at. What is reverse T3 doing inside of the body? Reverse T3, I would put it equally as important as free T3 for testing. So free T3 and reverse T3, the two most important tests you can get for your thyroid. If you don't have those two markers on, you don't have a complete panel. Do most doctors, like if somebody goes to their annual doctor appointment and they're doing their thyroid tests, are they testing for these markers here? No. What are they testing for? Just TSH. Definitely. Maybe T4. T4. Yeah. But that's just such a small part of the puzzle here. In fact, those are the most, like not important ones. Why are we even testing them? But no, you have to request free T3 and reverse T3 and the antibodies that we can talk about. You have to request the specific labs that you want. If you actually want to get those tested. So reverse T3. I said already, it's the anti thyroid hormone. So what it does is, and you know, that I know you can appreciate this. Our bodies are so beautifully and wonderfully made. And God knew that in times of crisis, when we are in a car accident, we're lying the ICU or the ER, fighting for our life. He built into us this mechanism where reverse T3 will go up, specifically because it knows that we don't need to burn fat, make major decisions, feel good, have energy, or even poop every day if we're lying, they're fighting for our life. So reverse T3 is important because when we're in that situation, we want all of our bodies energy, dot, old towards healing and survival. The problem is, is if reverse T3 is elevated and we're walking around trying to live life, more, that sucks. It's like your body feels like you're lying in the hospital, but you're trying to run a business and take the kids to school and do all the things, but you can't because you literally just feel like you're dying. And I've had many patients tell me that they literally feel like they are on their deathbed. It's because their body thinks that they are. So we have to check reverse T3 to see how much of that anti thyroid hormone do you have? Is that blocking T3 from getting to the cell, attaching to its little keyhole and turning on your body? Is reverse T3 outside the cell blocking that? Does your body think that you have, that you're a baron hibernation, that you are fighting for your life? We want to know that. Now what reverse T3 also tells us is, are you on too much T4 medication? So the only thing that converts to reverse T3, and I know this might be something that everybody has to rewind and listen to five times, but you'll get it. I promise and I talk about it in the book. The only thing that converts to reverse T3 is T4. So going back to that standard of care, right? Standard of care for thyroid treatment is you go into your doctor, your doctor tests TSH says, okay, then you have a thyroid problem. Here's a pill. You're going to walk out with T4, the inactive thyroid hormone, centroid, levo. They're going to patch on the back, wish you good luck, and we'll retest you again in six months. Meanwhile, you walk out with the inactive thyroid hormone in a pill. It's driving up your reverse T3. It's putting your body in the survival mode, and that is why, and I know many people listening to this are going to nod their heads after this statement. That is why so many people say, why am I even taking this medication? It doesn't make me feel any better. In fact, I feel worse exactly because you're taking T4 only and your reverse T3 is probably driving through the risk. Wow. At what point here, because that's a lot for people to take in who don't know this information, I know, I know, but it's important information. At what point can people realize that it's not their fault. It's bad information that was given. They were not aware when you know better, you do better. So what would you say to that person who, you know, it feels like, my gosh, like, that's me, but it's really not their fault, but it is their responsibility now that they know that. I'd love for you to speak more on that. I'm so happy that you said that because that's the most important message we can give today is that it's not your fault. It's not their fault at all. Here's the thing. If we just look at thyroid disorders in general, they occur very, very frequently and they occur from even simple biological processes like pregnancy or paramedic and post-emetopause hormonal fluctuations. So no, that's not somebody's fault that they're a human being and that their hormones are fluctuating or they decide to have a child. That's not their fault. And it's not your fault that your doctor doesn't know how to test properly, doesn't know how to treat properly. It is what they learned in med school. Years ago, I talked to a group of integrative wellness physicians and they were transferring. They were the alopathic, traditional, conventional model and they wanted to open a place in e-repencil vein, which knew nothing about functional or integrative medicine. They wanted to open an integrative medicine clinic. So I came in to talk to them specifically about the thyroid and I was telling them, "Okay, first of all, here's all the tests that we need to do. We need to test beyond TSH to get the full picture." And then I said, "Over here, we need to get out of this centroid box that you're all in." That's the only thyroid hormone that you prescribed. I said, "If somebody came in with depression, you would try five different anti-depressants, stack on a benzo until you found the right combination for them, but you won't use more than one thyroid medication when we have others available. Why is that?" And the one doctor raises his hand goes, "That's all we've learned." So no, it's not the patient's fault. Is it the doctor's fault? Yeah, they're not being thought thoroughly in men's school, but it is their responsibility to go out and learn more. And if they really want to be the best doctor and they really want to help you as a patient live your best life, then they need to expand their knowledge on the thyroid. Yeah. Now, Amy, I have right here a liver. The liver, I call the MVP of the body, the most one of the most valuable organs in there with the thyroid, of course. Those who struggle, I see a lot of people struggle on a corn of or dye or a keto dye to somebody who has the, who can't break down fat. We know the liver produces bile breaks down fat, bile is so important. For many, many, many reasons, is there a connection, though, between liver health and thyroid health? And let me just say one more thing here. If that liver is not functioning well, it's hard to burn fat. Eastore toxins. It's like a sponge for toxins. You might experience loose duels diarrhea. That liver is really important. You might wake up at 2 a.m. 3 a.m. because that liver is dumping sugar. You're raising cortisol. Yep. So is there a connection between the thyroid and the liver? Oh, beautiful connection. Beautiful connection. So the liver is one of the main conversion glands in the body, when the main conversion organs. So we convert T4 to T3 in our gut, our liver, peripheral tissues, and the thyroid gland itself. The liver is one of the main, main conversion locations. So if the liver is clogged, junky, loaded with toxins, we're walking around with non-alcoholic fatty liver disease, how can you possibly convert that T4 to T3? So the liver actually produces enzymes. They're diodenase enzymes. And that is specifically what takes that T4 and pulls an iodine molecule off of it and converts it over to T3. If we don't have proper enzymatic functioning and our liver can't work the way that it should, you are going to have an elevator reverse T3 because it can't convert. Then you have another layer, something that you said about it. We can't get rid of toxins. We can't push them out of our body. We can't deal with a toxic load that we're being bombarded with on a daily basis. Those toxins are another layer. So it's almost like the liver plays a dual role. Number one, it has to produce those enzymes to convert T-403. Number two, it has to filter out those toxins because that is in just another category that comes back and affects conversion on its own. So even independent of a deliver producing enough enzymes, if we're bombarded with toxins and our liver can't take care of it, that's a whole other factor. So now you're under like a double whammy chance of your body being in lockdown survival mode with an elevator reverse T-3. The safest cleanest doctor formulated protein powder for building muscle and shedding fat that won't leave you a gassy or bloated. I'm talking about prime protein from equip. It's 100% grass-fed beef protein powder full nose to tail nutrition, not just the collagen powder like a lot of competitors on the market. 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From their award-winning probiotic to their full line of gut, immune and brain health supplements, just thrive is ready to help you live your healthiest life. Start your 90-day risk-free trial today at justthrivehealth.com/azadi and save 20% off your first order. That's justthrivehealth.com promo code azadi. Be the best you with just thrive. We'll also include that link in the notes down below. What are some other lies we've been told about fat loss specifically? Oh, lies about fat loss. Well, I mean, the big one is E-Less and exercise more and I see that and I know that that's so cliche. But honestly, I still hear it to this day. So in the clinic, I still hear these women coming in and I heard it 25 years ago during all of my misdiagnoses for my thyroid problem. They actually told me to eat less and exercise more. It's getting ready for a bodybuilding show. I brought in my diet on paper. I'm like, look, Doc, I'm eating chicken broccoli asparagus and I'm doing cardio twice a day. Oh, eat less and work out more. What? Do more. Do more. But these women, they're being told the same thing. They're being told the same thing even in 2026. And that is wrong because you know what they end up doing? They end up taking macrados as a GLP so they don't eat more than 500 calories a day. So that myth is not just a myth. It's a dangerous piece of information that women are given. I see the same thing even in this day and age, it's unfortunate. You know, the problem with the calorie is calories versus calories. Alconversation is that it works in the beginning. Yeah, I'm going to lose some weight. Right. But then the body adapts. All right. If your body thinks it's in a stressful, fearful state, as you mentioned, reverse T3 will go up because God designed your body that way for a purpose. It doesn't know that you're doing this on purpose because you want to compete for a bodybuilding competition or you want to drop 50 pounds like stress is stress to the body. When we think about thyroid though, because this is a major player here in the metabolism as you referenced. How many people do you think are walking around unknowingly with thyroid issues? Yes. Okay. So the stats, the published data that we have right now is one in eight Americans. But that's not accounting for the undiagnosed and the misdiagnosed. That's not accounting for the listener listening right now going, well, my downforce in my thyroid is normal, but I'm still gaining weight and losing hair and I'm constipated and I'm fatigued. So now maybe who, bam, maybe it is my thyroid. That's just the totally undiagnosed. Now the misdiagnosed are the ones who are like, "Um, Susie, you might have subclinical hypothyroidism, but we're not going to give you treatment for that. We're going to give you an antidepressant instead." So we have this huge subset of people walking around with symptoms. Yes, it is their thyroid, but they're not being acknowledged. I would put the stat one in three, especially with women, especially with women. You have a new book coming out tomorrow that thyroid affects that no nonsense guy to fix fatigue, fogginess, and fat that won't, but you'll get it. We already go a little bit into the thyroid and talk about labs. What else can they expect to discover when they read or listen to your book? So then I built that book. Remember back in our younger years, the Choose Your Own Adventure books. Yeah, I love those. I wanted to give my audience the reader something totally different than what they're used to in all the other thyroid books on the market. So I joke. I say, it's not a diet plan, it's not a workout plan, it's not a recipe book, it's not a sprinkle adrenal fairy dust on your head and do a rain dance and your thyroid will heal, right? It is not that. It is real core science, but in a way where we're just sitting here talking and and I'm your best friend and we're going to figure out your sorry problem together, but we're going to do it in a way where we go, okay, if this, then this. So if your reverse T3 is and I get specifics in there, if your reverse T3 is between a 16 and a 20 and you are on, then you move over here and you are on a synthetic or a levo only, then here's what you need to do. You need to drop your T4 medication and add in T3. I joke. I say it's going to make the the blood holes of many a doctor, pucker, because they're going to be like, she's talking about medication and she's actually teaching people what they need. Oh dear you Amy. That's our job. Well, you guys haven't done a great job at it. So I decided to take into my own hands. Yes. And you know what the bottom line is, the patient is so powerful and knows their body far better than any white coat out there. And that's not slam in the white coat. That's not slam in the doctors, but it's putting the power back into the patient's hands to know exactly what their body needs and to be able to ask for it. You know what's really cool is that we live in a world right now where the patient knows more about the body, uh-huh, than the doctor, like the thyroid, right? They could read your book. They will read your book. Go get the book. Once you read it or listen to it, you will know more about your thyroid and your metabolism than your doctor who unfortunately, it's not the doctor's fault. It's their standard. They're they're training it. They're not trained on this. So how cool is that that we get in power ourselves and we can make a change and we get feel better. I am curious though, you know how much I love fasting. I know you love it too. Yeah. We see fasting kind of, coming going in terms of its popularity, right? 2019 was super popular and then it kind of died down, but it's always going to be around such a powerful tool. It's been around forever. There's nothing new about fasting. I see people reference fasting as too stressful. Women should not fast. If you have a thyroid condition, you should never fast. And while there is some truth to that message, fasting is a stress. Does it mean that if you have a thyroid condition, a thyroid issue, you should never fast? No, no. Everybody wants to take these huge polarizing stances on things. It's kind of like, can we just meet in the middle and figure out a middle ground? Yes, we can't. So for fasting, no, I don't like my ladies to do like an omat, like a one meal a day, right? Because it is a little bit stressful on the body. It can stress the thyroid a little bit. And you know, women just aren't good at getting in their protein in one meal. True. It's really hard. Yeah. It's really hard. So something extreme like that. No, but can we meet in the middle? Can we let's say do about a 14 hour fast, baby 16, like you know, but in a 16, ladies, and that's enough time for you to get all of the benefits of fasting, all of the benefits of autophagy without having it increase your cortisol down, regulate your tea to reproduction. Now, it's a little bit different if you're going to be fasting for let's say cancer prevention. If you're going to plan out five to seven day water fast, that's different. We know that the body's going to take a little bit of hit at that time, but we were doing it for another purpose, a greater purpose. We also know it'll recover on the other side. But what you and I are talking about right now is the day to day, practice of fasting for my ladies out there. I like them to keep it 16 and under really makes sense. Yeah. It really does. It gives them enough and they're eating window to get enough protein. How much is enough protein? What is your general recommendation? One gram per pound of lean body mass. So whatever you're you're happy weight, you're fighting weight or as you're that should lean. Yeah, you're high school. That's your lean body mass. So if somebody watching listening is let's say they weigh 180 pounds, but their ideal body weight is 100 and let's say 40 pounds, they should aim to get 140 grams of protein most days. This is what you're saying. Aim for that. I mean, are you always going to hit it? No, listen, if you hit 120, that's a win. Great. Yeah. Star. Yeah. But if you do oh mad one meal a day, you probably will never hit that. I mean, I'm a guy, I'm six foot two and you know, over 180 or 180 pounds, I could consume 100 grams of protein or single meal, maybe 120. Most women cannot. Right. And it will be very uncomfortable to try to force that in. Yeah. I want to talk about insulin resistance because this is a big piece here. I know from the research I did with my previous book, around 93% of Americans have some sort of metabolic dysfunction. And the first thing is hyperinsulinemia, which could be happening for many, many years before blood sugars begin to shift. What is the connection between the thyroid and elevated levels of insulin specifically hyperinsulinemia? Oh, it's huge. It's huge. And I love that set that you gave a metabolic freedom because I use that all the time. Yeah. I mean, it's mind blowing. It is mind blowing 93% 93 out of 100 people. It's insane. Crazy. It's crazy. Well, really all you have to do is go to the U.M. Walmart. Yeah. So do all like you're like, yeah, it is 90 or the air for you just see it. Yeah, it's an opportunity. Yeah. So the thyroid again, going up to the master gland at the top, I always go up here at the top, the thyroid. I always talk about a thyroid insulin cholesterol triangle. So I'll pull that in now and then we'll tie it to the rest of the body too. So the thyroid controls insulin. I have seen so many people with elevated insulin levels on a keto or carnivore diet, all because their thyroid is not functioning properly. It's like their body doesn't get the signal of what they're doing over here with their food. It doesn't understand it. It's literally, it's seeing a stake as a candy bar and it's seeing broccoli as a piece of pizza. I mean, it's just insane. And their pancreas is pumping out insulin left and right. The insulin can't get to the cell. They're totally insulin resistant. They're gaining weight. They're like, I'm doing carnivore. What gives? But it all comes back to the thyroid. Now, the reason why I say the thyroid insulin cholesterol triangle, as you know, as you've talked about insulin drives elevated cholesterol. Not red meat, not butter, right? It's not the 1990s anymore. We now know that high glucose high insulin sugar process foods drives cholesterol. So we see the thyroid controlling insulin. We see the thyroid also having control over your lipids. So you could very well have an elevated lipid panel and that's a whole other podcast. What's elevated? What's not? But let's say you have wonky cholesterol numbers because your thyroid's off is the thyroid disregulating your insulin throwing off a cholesterol. Is it a direct effect? Yes, and all the above. So again, the thyroid's going to control insulin and cholesterol. Now with insulin, when we see that insulin resistance, insulin resistance is one of the many factors that drive up reverse T3. So what we were talking about earlier, the survival mechanism hormone, the hibernation hormone, the anti thyroid hormone reverse T3. That is driven by insulin resistance, estrogen dominance, vitamin D, magnesium, iodine, salineum, deficiencies. So certain mineral deficiencies and certain genetic snips can drive up reverse T3. But insulin insulin resistance right at the top there. So again, you have another connection just like with the liver. You have that direct connection and then you have an indirect connection where yes, the thyroid's going to be low and slow insulin signaling is going to be off. That elevated insulin is now going to drive up reverse T3. It all makes sense to me. I want to dive into supplements in a little bit on what you recommend, which you believe are the best kind of mentioned in a few there. But before we get there, based off of the book, The Thyroid Fix, can you share with my audience one thing they could remove from what they're doing now that you haven't mentioned to help improve thyroid function. And then one thing they could add for the same benefit. Okay. So one thing they can remove and and I say this in the book, gluten free is not a fad, it's not a fad. It's really not a fad. So we want to go gluten free because the thyroid, it actually when we look at this under a microscope, it has a very similar structure, molecular structure to the protein gliadin. So gluten contains a protein called gliadin. We can look at both under a microscope and go, wow, those look a lot alike. Well, the antibodies that you have in your body to if you have Hashimoto's, which 95% of all hypothyroidism is the autoimmune form Hashimoto's. So whether you know it or not, if you have a thyroid problem, you have a 95% chance that it is Hashimoto's, maybe your doctor just in test your antibodies, not sure. Those antibodies are like little soldiers that your soldiers are conditioned and programmed to think that your thyroid is a bad guy. They think that this this little guy is an invader and they go out and they start beating it up. So over time with Hashimoto's, we can actually see the thyroid change under on an ultrasound. It's what it look like. What do you look at anything like these? Oh, yeah, there we go. Hey, okay. So it's going to get a lot smaller. If I have a nodule, it looks like eat nut. This one looks like does look like it looks like my dog chewed it up here. Yeah, exactly. And that is that's the soldiers destroying your own thyroid gland. That's the mean, you mean systems attacking it? Your immune system. So over time, you know, it gets to smaller and smaller. The last thing we want to do is build our army and and launch more of every single dang. I want to sell feed on yourself on your own gland. So when we eat gluten, your little soldiers that are programmed to think this is a bad guy, they go, oh, hey, there's something coming in the body here that sure does look like the thyroid gland. I don't know guys. What do you think? Should we start? Yeah, let's go. And they go out and they literally launch an attack on your thyroid, destroying it, making it itty bitty. And they're also building your army. So just by going gluten free, which is so easy these days, there's no excuse. Just by going gluten free, you can lower your antibodies and literally stop the attack on your thyroid. It's a good tip. Now, what if you're in Europe? And it's a different type of gluten there that we have here. Would you be okay with having that sort of gluten? Oh, that's a great question. I don't know. Now, I know anecdotally, every single person I know who has gone to Europe, even some celiacs, they're like, so I can eat pasta. I'm in Italy. Pretty incredible. So I would argue, yeah, you could, because it's not the same denatured Frankenstein type of dwarf wheat that we have here. Yeah. Yeah. Okay. So if you have a thyroid condition, number one, remove gluten, remove wheat, gluten free as much as possible. Hopefully 100% of the time. That's what you're removing. What can we add in now? Adding in. Well, do you want food or can be anything? Just do food. Food. Okay. Adding in. I don't like people getting their iodine from food. So I'm not going to say like seaweed or kelp. Interesting. Why is that? It's not a complete source. And it can have heavy metals in it too. They don't know which is going to make things worse. You know, truthfully, there's nothing I can think of that they can add in, except just protein, which doesn't directly affect the thyroid, but it's just so good for the overall, I mean, every function. Now, I go one step further with the protein amino acids. Oh, The amino acid tyrosine, it helps the thyroid gland produce more tea for in tea three. So just by eating high amino acid content, IE animal based protein, you're going to be getting more of that amino acid. But there's, there's not a specific food that I can say like, well, this food will help improve your thyroid should not necessarily. Yeah, I appreciate the honest answers. I like that you distinguish though with the protein, like you're talking about animal based protein, this is very different than plant based protein. Yes. Now, let's transition transition to supplementation. You know, if you come to my house here and I'll show you my house after and you look at my pantry in the kitchen, it looks like the vitamin shop. Same. I know. It's like, oh my gosh, you take all this? Well, no, I kind of rotate and target it. But the average person doesn't have that sort of pantry like you and I have and they have a certain budget that they could afford these supplements. We want to be, you know, understanding of that. We have somebody could, let me choose three supplements to help support thyroid function. We're not talking about specifically Hashimoto's or hypah or hyperb, but just thyroid health in general. What would be those three supplements? So I would go with number one, the most controversial iodine. Number two would be magnesium, which we're all deficient in. Magnesium is vital over T4 to T3 conversion. It's kind of along the same lines as selenium. So put those two together. Okay. That's fine. Because then the third one I want to add in as L-tyrosine. Oh, the amino acid. Yes, I mean acid. Okay. So we have selenium and magnesium. We have iodine and we have L-tyrosine. Right. Iodine. Yes. There's a lot. If people go on the internet and let read blogs on thyroid health and iodine, you read things that say you should never take iodine if you have Hashimoto's, if you have hypothyroidism. It's going to create a thyroid storm. Did you break down exactly the role of iodine with the thyroid? Explain it early, but a little bit more. How do you actually use it the right way? Yes. This is so important. So important. Okay. So I just go back to science iodine on the periodic table. Kind of go back to seventh grade chemistry. I remember. Periodontic table of elements. Iodine is next to bromide or bromine chloride, chlorine, fluoride, fluorine, the halogen halide family. What we know about the human body is that every single cell also has a receptor site on it for iodine. However, if you don't have enough iodine, it, those toxic halides compete for that receptor position. We are exposed to chlorine, fluoride, and bromide every single day. Even if you have all the things, you have a whole house water filtration system. Cool. Do you ever eat out? Do you take a sip of their water? Do you drink the club soda? Do you grab a bottle from the store when you're on a road trip? Of course you do. Even the vegetables, they're washing that water out. You can't control everything. We all use fluoride toothpaste at some point. I did those little pink pills from the dentist that, you know, fluoride treatments, whatever. We're being exposed every single day. So we are at huge competition with those toxic halides that are toxic to your thyroid, but also toxic to your body. I mean, they're carcinogenic. They can cause cancer. So iodine is the only thing that will come in and knock those off of the receptor site on the cell. So right there you go. Yeah. So why wouldn't I take iodine? All right. Well, let's take it a step further. Iodine is antiviral, antibacterial. It helps improve my immune system, 10 fold. I mean, I haven't been sick in a couple of years. I take iodine every single day. We know that your thyroid gland needs iodine to produce thyroid hormone, but it also needs an iodine to convert T4 to T3. One of the biggest causes of elevator reverse T3 outside insulin resistance is low iodine. Now, here's the problem. Now I'll get to the controversy. Yes, there are people out there saying, my gosh, your causes hyperthyroidism and the thyroid storm. Yeah, if you take too much and I really believe that that's where it got the bad reputation that it has now. Practitioners were starting people off on 25 to 50 milligrams a day. And that is high. That is high. In case like Dr. David Brownstein, he's an iodine guru. I love him the death. He talks about using that high of a dose in patients that he had that had cancer and that they were literally detoxing bromine from their breasts onto their bras and nightcounds. Well, yeah, he's using a higher dose for a greater purpose. For us folks average every day that we just want to support our thyroid and support our immune systems, you could take like six milligrams, 12 milligrams. Like keep it in the low end and I love using dropper, like liquid eye. You control the dose. It's just yeah, you can titrate, you can control, you can go up a dose, down a drop, whatever. And I really like nascent iodine. So I've been studying this now, been for like three years because I heard a lot about lubealls, which is kind of the your OG, iodine formula, potassium iodine, iodine versus a nascent. It's a monoatomic nascent iodine. And I was looking at both of these types of iodine going, all right, which one is the best, which one is I fell on nascent because it's more bioavailable and it's gentler. So the problem with the lubealls is some people will take it and they'll be like, whoa, did I just drink five red bulls? What's happening right now? Okay. Yeah, you went a little, it's hitting a little too hard. You didn't one drop too many. That's okay. You back off the next day to the lower dose. But nascent doesn't punch in the face like that. It's much more gentle, much better, well tolerated by everybody that I know. And you just do a drop a day and go up by one drop per day in a small amount of water until you reach your desired dose and your body will tell you what that desire does is. 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And with the thyroid, what are the top symptoms to pay attention to that your thyroid is maybe whispering, but going to scream at you eventually to pay attention. One of those top warning signs the thyroid is showing you that there's something happening underneath the surface here. Yep. The top ones would be weight gain or the inability to lose weight, hair loss, hair thinning, hair breaking fatigue, but like extreme fatigue, crushing fatigue. You wake up and you don't feel like you slept. It's 2 p.m. I mean, you really, really want to take a nap that crushing fatigue, constipation, mood swings or just low brain function. You know, kind of like that, like, I just can't find my words, I just can't remember things. I feel really depressed or I'm anxious for no reason. You know, that's just that low mood. The outer corners of your eyebrows missing. We'll start to see this thinning of the outer corners of the eyebrows in people. And that's a classic, classic sign of hypothyroidism and then the one that I spot most on celebrities that I just want to reach out and be like, let me help you. Rachel Ray, come on man. The swollen. So the thyroid gland can actually develop nodules and become swollen. You can see it. You can almost see like a fat ring or like a swelling in the neck. Yeah. And that's a huge visual sign. Interesting. So Rachel Ray has that? I'm telling you. Rachel Ray, somebody tag, Rachel Ray. Let's get the, let's get the, yeah, this is the pro right area. All right, fatigue you mentioned is one of those symptoms, but like, tell me more about the fatigue part because I think most people feel tired all the time. Yeah. Right? They're relying on stimulation, caffeine, four hour energy drinks, but the type of fatigue that you're explaining is like, you just crash hard. You can't focus. Is that what you're saying? Like you sleep for eight hours, but you wake up and you're still not restored. Exactly. Like if you do, we'll have the some set of people that are like, I slept for eight, 10, even 12 hours. I don't have the people that like, I can't sleep at all. I had insomnia, but then I take a nap during the day and their sleep is all messed up. So it could be either end of the spectrum, but really independent of the quality of sleep that you're getting, you are just tired. Is that whole body fatigue? It's that I can't even think about walking right now or working out or doing anything. I mean, I've had, I did not have it that badly, thankfully, but we've had many a patient that has had to quit their job. They literally could not go to work. I mean, and that's really where the thyroid starts, starts affecting other areas of your life. You know, we talk about the fat, the hair, the aesthetic things that people notice every single day, but just like you mentioned in the very beginning with the visceral fat, there's a longevity aspect with thyroid. There's your increased risk of cancer, increased risk of heart disease and type 2 diabetes. And then there's just the social relational aspect of hypothyroidism in that it starts affecting your desire to go out to be with your friends. You don't want to go to happy hour because you're going to be five pounds heavier the next day. You don't want to go on vacation with your family. You're going to be 10 pounds heavier after you come back from that. You can't even think to go to work. You don't have the energy. You don't have the energy to be intimate with your partner. I mean, it trickles and it has these tentacles that starts affecting every single area of your life. - What's a weird symptom? One weird, very weird symptom that most people never relate to the thyroid. - Frozen shoulder. - Frozen shoulder. - Yeah, tell me more. - Frozen shoulder. So in the book I go into that in a section where the thyroid has control over the muscle fibers and firing and communication and nutrient delivery and circulation. Because if you think about hypothyroid, low and slow, hypolo and slow, everything in your body is slowing down. So your recovery from an injury is slow. Your circulation and nutrients getting certain places is slowed down. So frozen shoulder is a very, very common symptom of hypothyroidism. Often diagnosed as an overuse injury. - Yes. - Or whatever, lifting, you're lifting, you're doing crossfit too much. But if it's stacked with the other symptoms that we talked about, it can be a sign of hypothyroidism. - Interesting, makes sense. It makes a lot of sense. Okay, if somebody suspects it's their thyroid and I suspect every single person watching listening is thinking that right now or most people, what's the first step they should take here? - Get the book and then-- - Get thyroid fix. - Fire. - More right here. - Because then there it's gonna give you all the other step. - First emphasis. - First emphasis. - What's the next step after that? - Test. - Just, you gotta get the data. - Let's run through those labs again. So, hey, grab your note, your notepad and your pen, 'cause she's gonna run it down and there's gonna be more than what she shared earlier. Go ahead. - Yep, exactly. So on the one side of the piece of paper, I want you to bullet list your symptoms. So just all of the symptoms. That's what you're gonna do. That's what you're gonna bring into your doctor. Your doctor is gonna wanna see your symptoms to get the diagnostic codes for the tests that are gonna be on the right-hand side. So on the right-hand side of the paper, you're gonna write TSH, free T4, FRE, unbound, free T4, free T3, reverse T3, and then TPO, which stands for thyroid peroxides, antibodies, and TG, which stands for thyroid glowylin antibodies. Or you might see it as an anti-TGA. - So there's six markers to get there, but you're gonna write down your symptoms. Okay, that's gonna let you get to the testing. So, you have the six markers. For a wine this, if you need to, that's gonna be your next step after you actually read the book. I've interviewed you before, and you shared your story before, but there's a lot of people that are watching and listening now who don't really know your story. So I'd love for take this opportunity for you to share, why are you writing this book? Why are you so passionate about helping so many people reclaim their health, Amy? - Yeah, well, because I was there, I was there, I was there in your shoes, I was suffering. Now this is 20 some years ago, but I was doing all the things. I was in contest prep mode for a bodybuilding fitness show. I was eating the chicken, the bronchidisparagus, the doing the cardio twice a day, which is insanity, but that is proof that I was literally doing all the things, all the things. - When was this, how long ago? - This was when I was around 22, so about 30 years. - So you two years ago? - Yeah, just to see, yeah, like 30 years ago, I can't believe it's been that long. But yeah, the scale just kept going up. Now, you can't see it, I'm sitting, but I'm 5'2". I'm 80-bitty, so picture an extra 40 pounds, that's a lot of 5'2 frame, that's uncomfortable. It's depressing, especially when you are doing all the things. And especially when I was seen, you know, in my community, at my gym, as the girl who competes. I mean, that wasn't my first show. I had done fitness modeling, I had done other competitions, I was training other girls to do competitions. So then it was like, "Oh, she's cheating on her diet, "isn't she? "Look at that." I mean, I was hiding under sweatshirts, hiding my body in various frustrations. That's why I say, when it starts affecting other areas of your life, I know that firsthand. I didn't want to go to work, I didn't want to have sex, I didn't want to go out, I didn't want to get dressed, like scrubs were tight. Like I remember working at a medical esthetician office and my scrubs were tight, like that's bad. So I know firsthand what it's like, and I was in a major medical system. And that's the most disappointing part. I wasn't in like podon, QSA. I was in the UPMC medical system. That is equivalent to Mayo Clinic, equivalent to Cleveland Clinic, Rochester. This is where all the people go because they think they're gonna get the best of the best care. And six doctors told me I was normal and fine. Six, Miss Dying knows me, six gas lighted me. One of them pulled me to eat less than exercise more. So going through that, like even in my 20s, I knew I'm like, how many people are suffering with this? How many people are suffering the same way I am, who maybe don't have access to a major medical system? Or for that matter, even if they do, they're getting missed eye-nose like I was. So that's what led me, I mean, it was, it was functional medicine that saved my life. So that's what led me into functional medicine so that I could do this for everyone else. - Wow. - There's a good percentage of people who feel like their body is just fighting against them, working against them. They feel like their body's broken. I hear that all the time. I see the YouTube comments, "Bend my body feels broken." Is this what aging feels like? And what would you say that person feels that way? They think that their body is working against them. Is this what aging is going to feel like for the rest of my life? Like what's the message you wanna give this person? - Okay. So we have to remember that our bodies weren't built that way. Our creator did not build our bodies broken. He didn't build it to be fat, foggy and fatigued our whole life in pain, frozen shoulder migraines, muscle pain, joint pain, depressed, concentrated overweight, dealing with all these band-aid medications and frustrations. No, we were built to be vital and to live our best life and to be healthy. But we have to do things to make sure that that happens and to make sure that our body falls in line with what it's supposed to. So I would say to that person, it is not your fault. It please have hope because things can change. And just because you're hearing from doctor number one or doctor number seven or doctor number 10, that you're normal and everything is fine. If you know deep inside that you're not, if you know that this is not how your body was made, this is not what you were used to, then keep going. Do take that next step. Do not stop until you get an answer and a blueprint and a direction of which way to go to regain control of your health, to get your body back. It can be done. I promise you it can be done. We do it all the time in the clinic. I have another program called total thyroid sex where I teach people exactly what I do in that book. I teach you how to read your labs. I teach you what medication you need. I know this can be done. I know we can give power back to the people. They just have to believe it. So it has to start with hope. You got to have hope that you can change. If I lost hope at doctor number five, which anyone would have said, well, sure. I mean, that's logical. And if five doctors told you you're normal and everything is fine. If I would have lost hope, I would not be here right now. Amen. All right. Before I ask you this last question, your book, The Thyroid Fix comes out tomorrow. As I mentioned, where is the best place for my audience to go get the book? Oh, Amazon, Barnes and No, we'll target wherever you wherever you feel like it. But if you go to a bookstore, and here's the key. So we are having a an all day live event on May 16th. So wherever you go to get the book, if you go to a bookstore, Barnes and No, we'll target and I'm taking this off of your idea. Yeah. I love. I love this idea just for the record. And you email your receipt to info at doctor Amy.com, D R A M I E info doctor Amy.com. What we're going to do if you buy it from a bookstore and support those local bookstores, we're going to do a two hour intimate Q and A. That's all. Where it's just everybody that buys the book from the bookstore. Now if you're like, I don't want to go to a bookstore and buy it from Amazon. Okay. That's fine. You still get a ticket to the zoom room of our all day event. That's the only way that you're going to interact with me. That's the only way you're going to have your labs read, get questions answered. Everybody else is going to watch on YouTube and that's fine. But you want to interact. You want to ask questions and be right there in the room. You got to buy the book before May 16th. That's a cool opportunity. Yeah. Go get it. The books available on paperback, which I do recommend you go to the bookstore to get. I usually what I do is I buy the paperback and then I'll get the audio version, auto-bore Spotify. I do both. I read and I listen. Amy narrated her audio book. Do both. If you're more of an audio person, then get the audio. It's Amy's voice. You get that cool consultation, not consultation, but Q and A with Amy, which is awesome. The last question, the theme of this conversation today, I love it because I'm all about this. I'm all about understanding that God created your body to heal itself and it needs to feel safe. If it doesn't feel safe, your body will do everything it needs to protect itself, which means you won't burn fat, which means you have all these symptoms because these symptoms are a gift from that innate intelligence. I can actually say that all the time. I love that you said that. 100%. We're totally lied. And what I believe, one of the best ways to lower the stress hormones, put your body in a state where it feels safe. So it could digest food, it could burn fat, it could produce T3 and let it enter the cell is with gratitude. And I call it vitamin G. And gratitude is incredible. It's not a practice. It's a feeling. And if it's really amazing about gratitude is the second you feel it, you produce oxytocin, gala, dopamine, cortisol drops in your bodies in this healing state automatically. So I want you to be there right now by asking you the question, what are you grateful for? What do you want to give vitamin G for today, Amy? Oh my gosh. Well, actually, as you were talking, I felt it. And I actually just sunken and I was like, I am just so grateful for the here and now. Like to be here with my friend talking about this in this beautiful studio in a beautiful city. Like just in the moment. And I think that's the thing that that we miss so much, especially in the rat race that we're in. We're always thinking about the next thing, the next thing we have to do instead of just dropping in and literally being present. And that is that is what actually sunk into me when you were talking. I'm like, I'm just so grateful to be here with you. Like, this is amazing. It is amazing. I love it. I appreciate you, Amy. I always learn when I get to hang out with you. Rooquick share with my audience where they could learn more about your website and anything else. Yes, absolutely. So dr Amy.com dr AM i e dot com. And then you can go to the, but you can buy the book anywhere. But if you go to cyrid fix book.com, you'll also see the bonuses on there. We're going to leave those up until May 16th as well. So you can win a year supply of thyroid fixer. You get 20% off fixer formula is you get access to a private vault of podcasts that haven't been released yet. We all kinds of stuff there. And then you can of course find me on youtube on instagram at dr Amy Horniman dot com. And our Facebook group. I want to mention that because I mentioned in the book too. It's called just fixture thyroid. And anyone who's been in different Facebook groups, they might roll their eyes and go, gosh, those Facebook groups. They're just a bunch of complainers. I know I get it, right? Like I've been in other Facebook groups too. And I'm like, all these people are doing. They're just complaining or they're selling multiple marketing products. Like what is this? I have curated this group. I mean, it is love. It is support. It is real advice. Nobody's in there selling multi level marketing product. Like it is real genuine love support advice for me, for my aunties, from patients that have been with me for five years that have them no more than I do now. This boy is awesome. So I really encourage people to join that group too. Because it's a great place. Even if you're like, ah, geez, I still don't know if I have a thyroid problem. Maybe get the labs down pop them in the group. We'll we'll decipher them for you. That's awesome. We'll put that in the notes. Well, thank you, Amy. Go get the book, everybody. It's out tomorrow. If you're listening to this interview on the day of release, it's called the thyroid fix. But Dr. Amy Horniman, thank you guys for tuning in. Thank you, Amy. Thank you. I hope you enjoyed that conversation with Dr. Amy Horniman. If you want to watch the video version of today's interview from my brand new, incredible state of the art television station/ studio in Miami, then head over to youtube.com/kidocanpe. You could also find it on Spotify. We're posting the video on Spotify as well. Go get Amy's brand new book. It comes out tomorrow, May 12th, the thyroid fix. It is an incredible resource. It'll take what you learned today to the next level and go check her out on her podcast on her social media. We'll put her information down below. Share this with somebody you know. Leave the podcasts at rating and review. And hopefully I get to see you in person, shake your hand and see you at one of my key notes over at benazotti.com/events. I've got a ton of vitamin G for you. Thank you for spending part of your day with Amy and myself. I'll see you on the next episode. [Music] This podcast is for information purposes only. Statements and views expressed on this podcast are not medical advice. 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