You Can't Make It to Heaven without This Prayer

Welcome to Divine Intimacy Radio, a co-production of EWTN radio and spiritual direction.com. When we provide you with a spiritual haven of rest and explore the riches of the wisdom of the saints and the path to union with God. This is Danis Deffany Burke. Welcome to Divine Intimacy Radio, your radio haven of rest. Your hermitage of the heart. Your monastery of the mind when we look to hearts and minds that have been drawn upon the wisdom of the saints. So that we can navigate the crazy tumult of this life. Today we're going to be talking about a prayer that if you don't pray it or kind of prayer. Actually several doctors of the church have said you can't make it to heaven. That's unserious. It is serious and it's a kind of prayer that every Catholic should play, obviously, if you want to make it heaven. But it's the most difficult kind of prayer to teach is a conclusion I'm coming to. Over the years do you disagree with me? I think it just kind of eludes people because the language used to describe it's just, "Oh well, yeah, I do that all day long." And my life is a prayer. Which has nothing to do with the kind of prayer we're talking about. Right. Yeah. Right. Right. Right. But I think it gets confused with that. Right. So if you hang with us, we'll tell you what this prayer is. And we're also going to go through some Q&A to help tease out the questions we've received to help tease out what it actually means. And then we have an amazing opportunity for you that is very rare. Yeah. And one of a kind. And it will have a huge impact on you. It's an invitation to join with us in something that I'm super excited about. Yeah. Me too. I'm really, really excited about it. I love what we're going to be doing. Okay. So why don't we jump into it? So what's the prayer? What's the prayer? The prayer is mental prayer. Mental prayer. So mental prayer means what? It means a loving conversation with the Lord, letting our minds be filled with the Lord, filling our minds with the Lord. Not emptying them, letting ourselves be loved, loving him in return. It's the prayer of the heart. It's a lifting of our hearts and minds to God. To heaven, to res and to receive avalan and there. So why do you think it's so difficult for people to understand what how to live that day to day? I actually think part of the problem is that we don't engage our hearts and minds very often in the way we live. We tend to be task oriented. You know, we're busy living life, maybe even busy being Catholic, running to one thing or another doing this thing, saying this prayer, checking this off. Right. And this kind of prayer requires stillness. It requires attention, sacred attention. In your book into the deep, you describe, describe three elements that we need sacred time, sacred space and sacred attention. What sacred time means I have to slow down my life and give time to God that is allocated to him, set apart for him and I to be together where nothing else gets in. Wait, you can't do it on treadmill. No, well, I'm not in for this. You cannot have it stack. You cannot have it stacking for mental prayer. And you have to actually have to be still. You have to be still, you know, so sacred time. Right. Sacred time. Time set apart that you dedicate to him that you promise to him that you give him that you don't take back. Sacred space means there should be a place that draws your heart and mind to prayer. I have two places that I love to pray outside of adoration and those kind of things. I have a little space in my room in the corner where I have a beautiful crucifix. I have a beautiful statue of our lady. I have blessed candles. I have holy water. And then I have a plethora. I do mean a plethora of little, either. I have a little, you know, my mind just went blank relics. So second class relics or third class relics or even first class relics in my space with different images that help remind me of my saint friends who've been accompanying me in my journey. I have that space and then my other one is on the back porch in the middle of the morning, around 4 4 30 am in the dark when the sun isn't even coming up yet. And I can listen to the earth kind of wake up the silence of the night, you know, creatures. It's just exquisite. I can see the stars and it is very, very conducive to mental prayer as well. So that's jumping a bit ahead into the wall. How is this fine. I think we need to back up to the what the why. Because the title of the show is that you says you can't make it to heaven. Why is that you know, two doctors of the church said that least. Santa Fonzzo Soguari. He and then Saint Teresa of Abula, Saint Teresa's way of putting it is quite brutal. She says if you can't, if you don't practice mental prayer, you don't need the devil to drag you into how you'll do it yourself. Yeah. Yeah. So why is it that those two saints are so adamant, great saint, one great, great theologian, moral theologian and the other, of course, a great mystical doctor of the church. Why do they, why do they make this claim that's so strong? Well, I would put it in terms of let's say when the church describes mental prayer, this relationship with the Lord, the use covenantal covenantal, so right. Relationship, the relationship between a husband and a wife, holy marital embrace on not the kind that's been distorted by the world, but this just this beautiful, holy, pure, marital embrace where there's nothing else that gets in from the world. And why is that important? If I claim to love you, Dan, and have a relationship with you and desire relationship with you, if we don't spend time together in that way, where it's just you and I, loving each other, serving one another, without the world without interference, we will not have the glue that bonds us as has been in wife, and pretty soon over time, we will start to fall apart, because our hearts are not, you know, set on one another. If I don't have a relationship with the Lord, you know, he, he describes in a couple of passages, one of them being the 10 virgins, the other one being Matthew 7, 22, is that right? He says, "Depart from me, I never knew you, you know, I don't know you." Right. And that knew, and I'm going to get this wrong, but it's the translation from the Hebrew to the Greek, correct? Where in Genesis, where it's described that Adam knew Eve, say very, very intimate relationship, it's a, it's a, it created a child, it creates a child, that's what we're talking about, new, in that context. Yes, it needs to be a relationship such that it brings life, right? It has to bring life, it has to bring life in my heart, my spirit, my soul, my body, when I rise from that place of prayer, I should be changed, I should be changed, I should be filled with the Lord, and therefore purified, sanctified, and then carry that grace that he's given me out into the world, to then love and serve those he's interested to me, right? Because if not, who am I? You know, what is my purpose? Why do I live? If not, to become fully who he's called me to be, and to know my creator, you know, my redeemer? Every saint has prayed this kind of prayer, and daily, and it's, it's super important, which is why this is what I wanted to get to to, to invite people to, so if you're listening to this podcast, cast either through spiritual direction.com, YouTube page or whatever. By the way, if you're blessed by the show and you're on YouTube, please like and share and Subscribe and all that because it's hard to get the word out. We don't have a ton of money to be doing that sort of thing. We need your help But we have a special Event coming up soon and that is you and I will be leading Thousands of gods people if you want to join a wonderful cadre of people studying a book entitled remain in me and I and you by Father Wayne sat or you can find the book at spiritual direction.com for a Forts last shop, but the if you want to register for the study which will be free and it'll be second and fourth Saturdays 8 a.m. Central time and it'll go to spiritual direction.com forward slash book study Terrible name should could be like remain or something, but Book study because it's not it's not like a book study. It's it sounds so banal But we're going to be exploring one of the best books written in the last I don't know 50 years at least on mental prayer and this subtitle says it all relating to God as a person and not an idea And we will also have a special guest Father Wayne Soutler the author Who was a Dias and Hermit for about six years and now is a spiritual director in the diocese of Bismarck North Dakota He will be joining us to do Q&A and that sort of thing But remain in me and I and you so get the book at spiritual direction.com for a slice shop and then type in spiritual direction.com forward slash book study and you'll get on the list. We're working on Software that allows us all to join in a particular group on our website and But if you get on that email list, we'll tell you it's going to be soon. They were targeting late April it's March now we're going to we're targeting late April like the fourth Saturday and April right now It looks like we're gonna hit that date. So sign up spiritual direction.com forward slash book study We'll look forward to seeing you study when we come back from the break We're gonna continue to dive dig into what is this thing? Mental prayer what's different about it than vocal prayer? Why is it so hard? And there's a handful of questions we've been given as well The beautiful fact that no suffering is wasted that all suffering has a purpose and To wrestle with the idea which is that everything that happens in our lives is either willed or permitted by God Okay, God. Why would you permit these things? I know that you're a good father and you're loving father So there's something there. So I have to bridge this gap between your permission of my suffering To your love for me as a father and Uniformity with God's will the book by by St. Alphan's the Gory bridges that gap and he explains as only he can because he's such a hard hitter the reality that these are all moments of Gruff of Virtue of hey your legs are weak. You're like a newborn deer. You can't stand on your own We need to get you to stand on your know those sorts of things even even desolation You know the day-to-day kind of the ebbs and flows of the spiritual life Those things are all permitted Or a greater good whatever that might be Check out the brand new updated version of uniformity with God's will titled finding peace in the storm with commentary by Dan Burke Dan Stephanie Burke welcome back to Divine intimacy radio We're talking about mental crede most Powerful prayer that you can pray, but what's weird about mental prayer, I think is Is when we think of Catholic think of prayers they think of something they do As the primary thing it's like well, how do I do it? Right and and you did at the beginning describe what I wrote about in my book into the deep about how to do it and we'll go back to that But it's more about You know, so I guess I'll put it this way I grew up in a context that taught me to be pretty much in the underthole That is 100% correct. Wait a minute What is that about? I am just agreeing with you dear So I was taught to be in the underthole in a very very male environment and Some it was a good I learned to work hard and with a very relational heart, so it's just kind of a weird thing very beneath all the mess Yes, right So one of the reasons I didn't become a priest when I became Catholic because I was single Though I discerned it because I was an Anglican seminarian was because I was such an idiot I knew I was not going to be able to function if I did not have someone to tame me to some degree This my wife has done so part of My taming was learning how to be To have conversation and to slow down in a lot of ways My my closest friend when I was converting Michael Andreves Had grew up in a family where they had family dinners and things so used to drive him crazy Because I was always eating with the food in my lap while driving and food is fuel and there's no relational stuff Here and so he helped me a little bit, but you you you mostly and that is Just slowing down and and learning how to be human and relational And eating meals together and I still of course, you know 10 back towards my old habits. Yeah, you did it last night Well, that was I was like where is he? I picked up his food and he left well. There was I actually had no choice last night because it was back to back back back meetings but But yeah, I mean you were all sitting at this anyway The point is that God designed us as the catechism the prologue that the catechism Says that we're invited we're constantly invited into this relationship from the from our first breath You know from our first First, you know thought is it's he's inviting us to speak with him and if you can't relate to others on the human level You're going to struggle with God now. There are some exceptions or artistic or neuro divergent brothers and sisters are to autism and other things they They are blessed by the Lord with a greater measure of mercy than those of us who don't struggle with those things But we're called to be in relationship which means a mutual exchange of love which is why that mystics use the highest expression of that mutual exchange of love It's the marital embrace the marital embrace. We're talking about the conjugal embrace now The in terms of marital intimacy the conjugal embrace or the marital embrace isn't all there is to marital intimacy There's also intimate conversation That is also uninterrupted People are not around. There's only you and me Whatever so mental prayer is that realm of intimacy The so we got some questions last night or Yeah, last night from a group of good group of women who were they were using my Video series into the deep which you can find it's a free video series. It wasn't free to us But it's to use spiritual direction calm forward slash pray and it was very expensive and I think it's very well done I think They were very blessed by it, but I want to ask some of their questions because it route they reveal Some of the normal struggle. There's nothing abnormal about this group One is a posture question, which is fine My father-in-law would get up every morning at his prayers spot in Neil in prayer Do you have advice on our posture during prayer? Neelings sitting the same jump all the second the Neil for hours you would kneel for hours. Yeah, St. Dominic Dominic had nine postures, you know, nothing prayer postures. Yeah, we have a like a Modern icon of that. Yeah, yeah, his arms straight out standing up Lane Cross-grain healing Yeah, all kinds of cool things so it but then the West is not I should say authentic Catholic tradition has in zero obsession with posture We do exercise posture as it's helpful Posture and mass is different, but in mental brothers know There's no prescription that's universal so I sit when I practice Mental prayer practice interesting word, isn't it when I when I pray mental prayer I sit in a very comfortable chair You are described I have a sacred space mind much simpler. It's just a single thing candle she has like 300 and I have seven. You have seven. I have an icon of Jesus Patto Crontour from St. Cassins, Egypt and it's just very simple. The one thing Stephanie told them which I think was or anthroposis great was don't hang on your back. Right because they asked if that was you know legit and the thing is if I'm laying in bed I'm going to sleep. Yeah and if you want to learn to not like prayer pray it laying down because you're always going to fall asleep. And walking or standing it's very hard to do mental prayer. Yeah. You do have to have it is important to be in a place where your body and your mind and your spirit can rest. Yeah. I truly believe that. I think it's very difficult to do otherwise. Now I have experience mental prayer kneeling in adoration but for the most part you know when I'm sitting is when the world can slip away and I in my mind and my heart can truly be centered on our Lord. Yeah the last time I experienced mental prayer kneeling which is once and probably five years or so was at Institute of Christ sovereign King parish and Tucson at St. Bridges was it and wow it's just a beautiful yeah I don't know there's a beautiful mass and a beautiful Latin mass and just it was a low mass so low masses are great for mental prayer because depending on how you participate in the mass that's a very good way to participate is just expressing your love to the Lord and quiet mental prayer so that was very powerful but day to day I sit in my chair Stephanie sits in her chair yeah I think that's the most common posture so if you ever see anyone and there are some ones emphasizing your shoulders need to be back and you know we're a little posture things there they've been influenced by non-Christian spirituality and you should throw away whatever it is that they're talking to you about because we don't have chakras you don't need to align your spine you don't have you know little magical spots of power that all need to be in a line that that's just a joke so it's just a monic okay the the other so and this is a very interesting question regarding regarding prayer how do you approach someone who you know is not practicing prayer in the way we've discussed and then and they listen to the series without sending judgmental or disrespectful to their spiritual life how do you know that though I guess they tell you yeah that's the only way you can really know or you're watching them they're in your family right they're sitting in front of the television they're going into prayer and they never they never leave the couch you know so yeah it's it's interesting it I mean it's an honest question because once you discover the beloved right and you start to be blessed you want everyone to know right because you love them you want them and happen with you you want to share the Lord and sometimes that desire can actually become it becomes an ache an ache of the heart of you know I was one way and then I was another and then in the middle with him you know to quote the chosen right Mary Magdalene in the chosen and so you've become different you've encountered our Lord and you want people to know because you love them the problem is as we have not been given others to fix we haven't been given you know our spat you know you are not mind to fix I'm not yours to fix you know and and so what we can do is love really well and to give our testimony because our testimony is something that when I share my testimony nobody can refute it because it's my testimony but it can be very compelling right if somebody tells you how the Lord has changed their life and you see in them something that you long for you might start asking questions you might read it what they've shared with you or whatever right so I think invitation but through love and relationship because if you truly want a relationship with somebody for them to listen to you you have to implicate yourselves in their life with love and that's how we're going to finish this show right is invitation invitation right so we're inviting you to an upcoming study on this book an amazing book on prayer one of the best written in the last probably hundred years remain in me and I and you relating to God as a person and not an idea by Father Wayne Sattler you can find the book at spiritual direction dot com board slash shop and then while you're on the site do spiritual direction dot com forward slash book study and register for the book study and you will get a link that brings you to wherever you can you can get on a zoom with us will be meeting two times a month starting at 8 a.m. central time spiritual direction dot com forward slash book study 8 a.m. central time second and four Saturdays of the month they can for Saturdays in the month starting probably in the last Saturday of April or the fourth Saturday I'm sorry the fourth Saturday some months have five so I don't know what April has but so spiritual direction dot com forward slash book study and you will get wisdom you need to understand how to pray the prayer that can help you to heaven what we didn't cover we're gonna cover in a in a subsequent show is why saint migrory alphan's a so gory argued and Teresa Babylon we didn't cover either why they argued you can't make it heaven we did talk about the necessity without menta prayer yeah that we did talk about the necessity of relationship but we didn't talk about some other key ideas so when we come back for the next show we'll go ahead those topics okay we'll be right back well we won't be right yeah until next time may the god of peace make you perfect in holiness may he preserve you whole and entire spirit soul and body and we're virtual at the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ learn more about the interior life visit spiritual direction dot com divine intimacy radio is a co-production of e w t n radio and spiritual direction dot com and heard worldwide on the 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