Why NASA Studies This Man (He Attracts UFOs!)

Do you think other people think that you are the Messiah? I came out of a conference speaking and when I walked out the door, this mad lady comes running up to me and tries to kidnap me. What? Yeah. My job is to share a truth that everyone's been told is not real. It was 19 years ago on January the 8th of 2007. I was down and out and lost everything. Lost my home and I'm having a plough for free lunch for my kids. Sick with Crohn's disease. And if anybody has Crohn's nose, how bad that is, you know, you're in the restroom. 10 times a day. I was at 20 times a day at that point in my life. In January of 2007, while fishing with friends in North Carolina, Chris Bludso witnessed a series of bright, intelligently moving orbs in the sky. That moment doesn't end. It starts a series of unexpected and seemingly miraculous events. And then McCron's was gone, ahead and more sickness. In the days and weeks that follow, the phenomena continue. The lights appear again and again, sometimes at a distance, sometimes directly over his home. He reports numerous encounters that don't resemble crafts, lights or UFOs at all. But what he describes as a luminous, feminine presence, deeply unsettling in its archetypal familiarity. Her communication seems to go beyond the clichés and platitudes of normal contact experiences. They touch on humanity's deep moral decay, cycles of civilizational collapse, judgment, the apocalypse, and renewal. They revolve around humanity reaching a threshold. I came back excited to tell it, and that's when the next five years of darkness I talk about my book started. His UFO experience is only served to make him more of a pariah in his local community of Fayetteville, North Carolina, where fundamentalist Christianity is the only way, and anything paranormal is considered demonic. NASA and the CIA show up at Bludso's door. They're not just anybody at NASA in the CIA. I'm talking about a high-level NASA mission control, who has worked on launches at Cape Canaveral since the Challenger missions in the 80s. He said I was at the dinner table with the president handed me that, and this. Scientists, military, and other intelligence officials follow suit, they grill Bludso on his experiences. Some imply that certain dates and symbols he's given by the lady align with things they're already monitoring and have seen from other authoritative sources. So they have like a scientific model of how these angels work at NASA. They know a lot more and we know than we think they do. I personally don't know what Chris Bludso experienced and continues to experience to this day, but I know that his story doesn't sit at the edge of history forever. It's either going to collapse under scrutiny or force us to redraw the map. In this special episode of American Alpomy, we have a markedly different conversation than the one that Chris Bludso is used to have it. He took you to Zainsville, Ohio, when you recovered a little piece of metal? Yeah. Do you know who's from Zainsville, Ohio? I do. Take down some ground, right? What? Instead of just retelling his story, we make some pretty mind-blowing connections from it. It's involving secret societies with access to time travel, anti-gravity experiments done in mid-century America, space metal with curious properties that interact with consciousness in weird ways, what exists on the dark side of the moon, and what the world will look like in the next decade. So without further ado, sit back, relax, and prepare to ascend into the astral plane with this week's American Alchemist, Christopher Bludso. This has been a long time coming. I'm here with Chris Bludso, who many call it kind of a super-experiencer, because I was just rereading your book, UFO of God, and your life is really just remarkable. You've had all these incredible deep experiences, and I want to talk about those experiences, but I also want to talk, because your story is well known at this point. I also want to talk about some of the deeper philosophies that you've come into based on your experiences. It may have kind of a metaphysical conversation, but I want to start with this very interesting discussion that we just kind of sparked up as you were walking in, which is you have this golden pin on your jacket. What is that pin? Well, that pin was given me by someone everybody has read about, down at Cape Canaveral without say names, and it signifies being off planet. So from what I'm told, the people that get these have been in space before. So astronauts are pretty much right. And why do you think this person gave that pin to you? At the time, I had no clue other than what they were telling me. It involved taking me into the astronaut crew quarters and going through a whole thing, because I was, in other words, when this thing first happened, this person from NASA came to my house with a backpack and a whole lot of credentials that had everything from area 51 to the CIA and all that combined NASA. And he tested the whole family with metal. He put a piece of metal in my hand. I was the last one to be tested. So all my four of my kids and my wife, they all went into this one room. So she got Ryan. She got Ryan's the first one and kind of made it secret. He took Ryan in to a room, tested him and said, "Now you go get the next person, don't tell them." So he went out and got each person in the family, tested them with this metal. They brought me in last and I had no idea what I was doing. I sat down on the edge of the bed. It was in Ryan's room. And he put this piece of metal right here and I said, "What do you think of that?" I said, "Well, it looks like a piece of aluminum." I could pose just stamp, size that size then. It was light and very light. Yeah. It was kind of a dull grey. It wasn't like shiny. It was aluminum as some sort. And he reaches in his backpack and pulls out another piece of metal that was different. And it was like aluminum foil. Look like foil. And it wasn't crisp. You couldn't crease it, but it would wrinkle, but it would hold back out, but it wouldn't crease. You couldn't crease it. It would kind of roll up and then straighten out. But when he put that in this hand, it somehow another created this current that went through where it was communicating, this part of the metal was communicating with that part of the metal. And what happened, it caused me to rise the roll back and he reached up and snatched it out of my hand real quick and said, "Why you?" This isn't the book, by the way. And I had no idea what happened. He said, "Why you?" This close. I said, "Excuse me, what do you mean what I mean?" He said, "Well, I would have known you were lying about being taken if you hadn't had a reaction to this." And he said, "I've only ever seen two others, and there were nothing like yours." That's what he told me. So that started the next two, three years studying with them, and I'm being kind to my friend without saying his name, but you know who I'm talking about. I know you're talking about. Can I say who it is? I think it's Tim Taylor who's a mass emission controller who, yeah, his name is now sort of out there. And yeah, we should definitely be respectful to him as somebody who doesn't maybe want to do public interviews himself, but I think he's put himself out there enough to him. So, who is this Timothy Taylor figure showing up in Bloodsauce's life? He's a mysterious rocket scientist who's done mission control for NASA since the 80s. That part is not really disputed, and it's well-documented in his autobiography Launch Fever. At one point, Tim Taylor even had a small YouTube account with videos showing his deep levels of access to NASA facilities. He's also taken people like Bloodsauce through Kennedy Space Center. Religious studies professor Diana Pasalka, along with others, have said that he's worked directly with Elon Musk. But where it gets interesting is that he's also popping up in the lives of numerous UFO experiences, claiming that he's a time traveler and works for an angel. Basically, he exists at the intersection between rigorous real-world aerospace work and totally insane UFO war, and that's why he's still American Alchemist's most requested guest. Some of the things that Tim Taylor told Chris would wholesale overhaul our understanding of reality, if at all true. really smart guy like genius level and really yeah I enjoyed his company we did a lot of stuff together we traveled together we were able to recover some metal together up wow yeah I didn't know that yeah where was that I was in Ohio in Ohio yeah where in Ohio in a little town because Zanes well Zanesville yeah Zanesville Ohio yeah do you know who's from Zanesville I do tea towns and brown right what he took you to Zanesville Ohio when you recovered a little piece of metal yeah a pretty good piece about that big you're sure you went to Zanesville yeah in fact I went in a machine shop he and I and had a piece saw it off the metal which he took with them and we gave the other piece back to the person that had it and I knew the person and he wouldn't give it to anyone in the world but he called me and he drives up in his yard and there's this red piece of glowing he sees this thing every house and it goes away when he drives up but there's a piece of red glowing metal in the yard he lets it cool picks it up and puts it in a shoe box in there it stays for 15 years no way and when he found out about me and read the story he calls me and says I got something on you to see and so I called Taylor and I flew up there this is this is either engineered to make me excited or this is the most remarkable story ever I almost lost it during this part of the interview Zanesville Ohio is where Thomas Townsend Brown was born to me Townsend Brown is the most interesting historical figure in the 20th century that no one knows about I've independently uncovered an absurd amount of information that leads me to believe that Townsend Brown essentially discovered anti-gravity in the 1950s he was funded by the same physics patrons at the University of North Carolina Chapel Hill that sent science down the wrong path with quantum gravity in 1957 he was also backed by the highest levels of CIA and aerospace there are even videos of Townsend Brown at the University of North Carolina Chapel Hill celebrating because his experiments presumably worked here he is with a bottle of champagne and we know due to real declassified documents written by the head of Australia's nuclear program Harry Turner and often cited by UFO whistleblower David Grush that University of North Carolina Chapel Hill was waste deep in anti-gravity research we also have a deathbed confession of French aerospace representative Jacques Corneone saying that Townsend Brown's experiments worked in Paris in the Montgolfier facility in 1956 the tests were very very very tricky it was sensitive to so so many things in actual summary to us so that was a positive result and that's just the tip of the spear we also have Carl Nell who helped set up army features command which led all tech modernization efforts for the army implying that Townsend Brown made breakthroughs in the world of gravity Jesse's done a number of podcasts looking into Townsend Brown and some other very interesting like heretical technology so I'd invite people an unsolicited plug to check out some of Jesse's podcasts not to mention NASA's top scientist in electrostatics Charles Bealer literally leaving NASA to start a propellant-less gravity-based propulsion system that he says is a derivative of Townsend Brown's work term asymmetric electrical pressure is similar to Thomas Townsend Brown's research into asymmetrical capacitors those older papers that older subject matter is probably valid for most of the point I could go on but I'll spare you the fact that Chris Bledso was taken to Zainsville Ohio and otherwise completely unremarkable little Ohio town seems like a very unlikely coincidence and the fact that the goal there was to retrieve an exotic piece of metal seems even more unlikely especially given that Tim Taylor was a sporting bloodso there as you're about to hear in this conversation there are tons of other bizarre connections between NASA mission controller Tim Taylor and mid-century anti-gravity inventor Townsend Brown this episode is sponsored by superpower on this show we spend all of our time trying to understand reality but most of us are simply guessing when it comes to our own health with conventional health care you're firing totally blindly you go to the doctor you get a few basic labs and you're told everything looks normal but that thing that doesn't feel great the chronic headaches the stomach pain the back pain you don't ever really get insight on any of it you don't get the proper data you need you get no actionable insights and no real plan that's why superpower caught my attention superpower gives you a deep look at what's actually happening inside your body it's a single blood draw either at home or nearby lab and they measure over a hundred biomarkers way more than a standard physical you get real data on things like hormones metabolism heart health vitamin and mineral levels even environmental toxins toxins that can accumulate and cause very bad things to happen in your body what I like is that superpower doesn't stop at the numbers they turn those results into a clear personalized action plan what to focus on with nutrition what supplements actually make sense for you lifestyle adjustments you can even get your true biological age and can track how that changes over time instead of guessing when it comes to your health you finally have a map your full health blueprint activated with superpower not only did superpower reduce their price to just $199 but for a limited time our listeners get an additional $20 off with code alchemy again that's $20 off with code alchemy had to superpower.com and use code alchemy at checkout for $20 off your membership after you sign up they'll ask you how you heard about them please make sure to mention this podcast to support the show and so if there's a connection between this NASA mission controller who's obsessed with UFOs and this mid-century anti-gravity inventor and then you're literally going to Zainsville Ohio to collect UFO material which is where it's a that's a random place and that's where towns and brown was born in 1905 and there's their newspaper you know clippings of him creating you know wireless telegram basically at the age of 12 for sorry that's crazy yeah true story that's so crazy I can't please yeah can I feel the metal well I don't own it you don't know it okay yeah Tim has it I would I would love to see the picture yeah and learn anything else about the Zainsville trip that's just fascinating Tim got it originally and then daughter put off got another piece of it hmm put off got another piece I took Tom DeLong and Louis Elizondo to Zainsville or to to Pennsylvania or Ohio I mean you took him to Ohio to Zainsville I took him to the same guy's house and and got them a piece of it as well what what were Tom DeLong and Lou aware of towns and brown I didn't discuss it with you discuss that with so that's where some of their middle came from places that I had I had three pieces of it do you think put off knows about towns and brown yeah he does yeah I'm sure yeah he told me he he he met him but that he never you know he didn't know how far he got you know sort of thing but how you know how can be a little cheeky but interesting yeah for the audience I mean I'm sure they know this but I'm obsessed with this mid-century anti-gravity inventor Thomas Towns and Brown I think right who I am very convinced made real updates in the world of gravity he was a very nuts and bolts you know inventor and he worked at the highest levels right of military government with every kind of aerospace company you could you could guess I mean there's an FBI document on him saying he was the foremost radar expert in the Navy and and he was in charge of the Philadelphia experiment actually which has all this lore about it now who knows whether the you know Premafacious story of that is true but he was that's you know Martin Vega the year that skunk works formed he you know new Curtis Lamay new Bill Lear the inventor of the Lear jet right he was being funded by the guys who are sending physics down the wrong path well he was doing his I think more vital kind of anti-gravity experiments but the kind of subplot of his life right is that gravity and time are very interrelated in general relativity and what I found so fascinating is I made this whole documentary on Thomas Towns and Brown and at the end of the documentary I make this connection that Tim Taylor told your son Ryan blood so that he was part of a secret time travel group in NASA in the Bahamas and that Thomas Towns and Brown was the president and I even then maybe I would have dismissed it out of hand but I'd become this amateur historian of Towns and Brown and he would always go to NASA in the Bahamas And then if you read Tim Taylor's biography, Launch Fever, he's in NASA a lot, so that does kind of place them both in, you know, in NASA at some time. It's called the NASA group. The NASA group, yeah. So he took you to, is that, was the piece of metal, this UFO metal in Zainsville related to towns in Brown at all? Yeah, there was a lot of conversation about that and the amount of activity around that place he said was all part of the land because where this metal was found, it was near the Indian serpent mound, right. So they know that there's a lot of activity and he told me stories about towns in Brown. What do you say about towns in Brown? You know, his daughter was doing a book and Tim was helping her with that book. Tim was helping her with that book. Yeah, he helped write that book, that her book. I didn't know that. I do know, I found an Amazon review from his daughter about Tim Taylor's book, Launch Fever, and this was before anybody knew about, you know, Tim Taylor because he hadn't even been written about, you know, pseudonymously in American Cosmic by Dana Pousalca. This is in the early 2010s. Yeah. So, so he was helping Linda Brown write her book, yeah. Sure was. Yeah, and what did he say about towns in himself? He told me in her stories of these little things coming and landing in his yard and getting that and giving him information. That's real. Well, at least according to his daughter, his daughter did a sort of AMA on, you know, asking me anything on Reddit. She talked about beings coming down and then entering, I think it was like she was in the, they were in the kitchen with her dad and her and they were these sort of pale skinned, you know, looked alien, like looked from a, you know, like they were from another planet or it existed in another environment. And they talked all night and then, you know, they wake up the next morning, she thinks to dream and then two nights later they're at dinner and she brings up the dream and Thomas towns and brand goes, that was a dream or something, like, all right, exactly. Wow. Did he ever insinuate on what the Nassau group, this time travel group in the Bahamas was doing? He didn't. He didn't. He just told me at one point that he thought I may have to go hide out there. Wow. Really? That was Nassau when it really first happened way back because it was a dangerous place. The whole world was different in 2008, it was, it was the highest secured thing in the world. The UFO was more classified harder than a nuclear bomb. But you would have to hang out in Nassau. Well, they mentioned that I may have to go there for protection. Interesting. Yeah. So what's there? I don't know. I just, that was all he told me. You know, he writes in launch fever his biography about flying these cargo jets back and forth between Florida and Nassau. And I think the guy he was flying with was like selling drugs and he didn't even know about it. Like, he was, he was just going to be like a long for the ride or whatever. But then he says some really trippy things around. He goes, time moved differently in Nassau. He's saying it like it's like island time, you know, so it's like, and then you're like, is that coded because he's telling you, you know, that in Diana Pasalco about the adjustment bureau and like, you know, timeline hopping. And then he's saying time moves different in this Nassau group, but then in Nassau. But then he's also telling your son and you that he's in a secret time travel group with towns and brown in Nassau. So I'm like, is he writing in code there? Yeah, these guys are all about, yeah, they're so super secretive. They can, they'll tell you things and code like that and accept you to get it or not. But yeah, I want to meet the Nassau group. How do we do that? I have no idea. Yeah, I don't know how would find them or what. I was just, that was something told to me years ago and Ryan heard it and it never left me. But as far as where and how and who I don't know, we never got involved. Yeah, because it's so, it's so like the world's so interesting because he also, I believe he told you and I think Diana Pasalco that, you know, he said, read the adjustment team or watch the adjustment bureau, which is this, the original was a Philip K. Dick book. And then this movie with Matt Damon and it's all about adjusting little variables to change timelines. Right. And he viewed his role in reality as doing that. And so do you think he actually be, his role as doing that as part of this sort of timeline adjustment team? Tim Taylor, yeah, he told me, he was going to tell me to read, to watch the movie. He said, that movie was created for a reason. Watch it. It's a lot like that. And then he said, and in that movie, you'll find a character named the hammer. And he said, and I worked for the hammer. And the hammer works for God. I'm like, are you going to tell me more than that? And that's all he would tell me, said, I worked for the hammer and the hammer works for God. And you, what do you think the hammer is? When the movie is like an archangel, he's the guy that the lesser beings couldn't, couldn't stop what was happening because of love, you know, if you watch the movie, it's so fascinating. So they send the hammer down to, to take care of it. And of course, I won't spoil the movie, but it ends up, well, but he said, yeah, well, I mean, do you think that he's in touch with a celestial being with an angel? He insinuated that, and I can probably believe that, something was an angel a lot. I don't know. So what would the, because he seems to show up in a lot of, you know, super experiences live. So there are people who've had experiences here and there and then there are people like you who have repeated experiences and a lot of interactions with this other world. And I found it very interesting that he showed up in Charles Hall's life, and then he shows up in your life, I think he knew Whitley Streiber as well. He's a good friend of ours. Oh, so you know, you know Timothy Taylor. He came here because he found out about Charles. And that was when his daughter, the one who had the, the baby was like, what was she, maybe in fifth grade when they came the first time? Yeah, we, you know, why do you think he was, he became interested in your story? My wife can answer all the questions. Because he, he realized as far as he was concerned that Charles was the real article was legitimate. And as I say, it's really concern me because I've tried to email other people because he brought other people to meet us and a visit with us, they, they, one of the guys cooked right here in my kitchen. And so I tried to contact those people because I had in emails for them. And I never got a response about what happened to him. So what do you, what do you think it is with him? Do you think there's some mandate from the hammer, from this angel or something to interact with experiences? If he's been truthful about that, I would say that's probably correct or some kind of mandate guiding him, so he's definitely connected, I mean, big time. Do you think he was being truthful or? Yeah. Well, you know, sometimes you wonder if it's all smoke and mirrors designed to throw you off course, you know, but I listen to everything I work with him for three, four years before Diana met him. I introduced Diana to Tim. We were working on crazy stuff like stem cell research and I have no idea what that is and what proteins are and anything medical right on the carpenter and yet I'm reading papers at night that they would send me and my job was to draw whatever came out of me, whatever I saw. And so usually every week I'm sending in some sort of diagram of cells and all kinds of things. Whoa. Yeah. As you know, on American Alchemy, we cover a lot of technology that goes beyond human limits. This is about technology that helps the body catch up and feel good. 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Head to irustor.com and use code Jesse25 for an exclusive discount. Again, irustor.com code Jesse25. Red light therapy has really been a game changer for me. So I hope you love it. - So it's almost like you were part of like a secret science program where you were given material look at. You didn't even have contacts on the material, but you were getting downloads about it. And do you think any of that made it into his, he had a lot of biomedical patents. He had a company called Vivex Biotechnologies, which he sold for $88 million. - That's who I was working with. - That's your back company. - Wow. They were creating what's called a biograph, which was based on metal. The metal that they recovered. And infusing it into this, well, the particular, and I have a video of the operation of a young lady, the first operation in the United States. I was a Spanish lady that had bone cancer in her thigh and they removed like two inches of the bone. And they wrapped it with this biograph, injected stem cells into it. And in like 60 days, her bone had regrown, the pain was gone, she could walk again. - Wow. - Yeah, no, I mean, that is a operational, functional, you know, company that does real things in the biomedical world. What makes it fascinating is that maybe the backdrop of that company is recovered UFO material and somebody like you intuitively downloading the functionality. - I don't know how much good I did, right? But it was the come from a carpenter being ridiculed by the whole community. So secretly drawing diagrams for NASA was pretty cool thing. - Well, you know, you have all these rumors of like Philip J. Corso and him being involved in, you know, I think armies, foreign technology desk and transferring, you know, crash materials from bras well, for example, two bell labs so they could, you know, help build, you know, semiconductors, things like that. But what you don't hear of is people download, people like yourself who are intuitively kind of tapped in downloading aspects of the functionality of some of these technologies. That's really interesting. - Well, that I'm learning, I'm learning over the last night, it's been 19 years, I've been doing this right a long time. And in that time, I've learned a lot and I keep learning every day. But there is a great correlation with the phenomenon, guiding us and creating things in our path. And if you smart enough, then you pay attention to that. All kinds of things come. So like being sure like homes, I'm like, "Oh boy, what's next?" You know, so that's kind of the way I modeled my life is letting it guide my path rather than me try to drive the bus, I call it the lady, right? Or that, the phenomenon. - Yeah, yeah, it's like the way is not the way. Like you have to, or I think there's a concept called woo way, which is effortless effort. And there's sort of sitting back, being receptive, listening to the signs and then just kind of, you know, following the path and that's an art. You know, it's easy to get into this mode of being attached and trying to over-engineer outcomes. - Exactly, for example, in the music world, I wrote about something that happened. I was given a message that the divine world in cause messages within the music that we listen to and we just don't know it, right? So it's being channeled by these musicians. And that led me to how manifestation works is because when I was given that information, I was given five or six songs, six, five right away and one at another point. And when I read the lyrics on it, it was like, "Oh my God, this is crazy, this is crazy." I couldn't believe you hear these songs, but she never read the words well. That date in 2012, I said, "Lord, I wish I could tell Sammy Heigar from Van Halen or Robert Plant or Jimmy Page or Neil Young." These are the guys or Metallica, right? These are the guys that I just said the simple little prayer. You know, right off the top of my head, "Lord, I wish I could tell them, wow, this is what I was thinking." Last year on my birthday, I get a phone call and it's Sammy's wife, Kari. And we become friends and then it turned into Hammett with Metallica and then I get a text from my friend and he said, "Hey, Chris, I'm in the pub in England and setting beside me as Robert Plantin, he's reading your book." - No way. - Yeah, that's crazy. - He sent you a happy birthday and the same two days later, I get a call from Fred Durs, Lent Biscuit. - Oh, yeah, well, he's super in here. - I love Fred's UFO podcast. - Yeah, I've been on his podcast. So anyhow, it just all poured out and it manifested. I didn't do it. I didn't seek these people out, they called me. And now that's Sammy told me that the song "Love Walks In" - You don't even know where the words came from. - It just came out of it, and the song is like, you have to read the lyrics on it. - Yeah. Well, I didn't even, I mean, it's crazy how much music is influenced by this stuff. Like, I think Paul McCartney, one of the Beatles had a dream about a flaming pie. And that was how the Beatles name came about somehow. - I didn't know that. He spelled differently Beatles and then it moved into BATLES after this flaming pie came down in the stream or something. And so, yeah, you have a lot of these sort of stories. That's amazing. Do you think that, 'cause we often think of like, the aerospace world that's interested in a lot of what you're doing is very kind of nuts and bolts focused. Not, they don't care about downloads or experiences or whatever. Do you feel like they really do, they are really interested in the phenomenon and they are learning from it as much as they are just writing equations on trot boards. - A million percent. In fact, in the last year I've seen, or two years I've seen a huge increase than the scientists, mainstream scientists that forever like Diana, she was the first PhD that would even talk about this, right? And back then, if you even said this out loud, people would laugh and walk away. Nobody would talk with nail. There's over 200 mainstream scientists right now. That was the word I was told by Dr. Estevez and a brightest of it. She's been on the public. We're still coming out with something cool, yeah. But she American deep tech. She's told me that there's at least 200 scientists that want to start working on this thing. - Fascinating. - Yeah, it's fascinating. - And it almost feels like at times, the scientists are being coordinated on a higher level. And this gets into like the three-body problem or science fiction novels like that, where the way that the phenomena speaks to us is through scientific discoveries, innovation through serendipitous meetings between scientists. And I'm sure it's the same thing with art and other creation. - Big time and to the creativity world, artists of all kinds, in other words, I don't mean to interrupt, but if I had to say of all the people that call me, that the majority of these experiences are good, majority of them will be artists that paint, that make music, that act are different type of people. And created people for some reason, they are the ones that have a lot of this experience and have been for years. - Makes sense that they'd be tapped in. I think it's more interesting in a sense that somebody like, I've spoken to Hal put off about this and he goes, I always follow the synchronicities and when they stop, I know I'm on the wrong path. and it's like this guy is a very serious scientist who's popping up not only in areas of quote unquote UFO science, but in, you know, prosaically very interesting science. That's right. So, pretty serious guy. Yeah. And we were talking outside. It sounds like you're in touch with some Lockheed guys, too. Yeah. What's what's the deal there? Well, I have friends everywhere. There's no shortage of people from NASA, from Lockheed, from three young, from from all over these scientists, but I have to have a friend that is a material scientist that works with this material. And he kind of stays pretty close to me. Paul, let me about, we travel together and we study together and doing a lot of things right now. Interesting. Yeah. Who's that? Does he work at a big aerospace corporation? Or he, well, he, yeah, you'll see him one day he lives in Silicon Valley, but you see him one day he'll be in a skiff somewhere under an airport or he'll be in, at NASA or he'll be somewhere in amongst all that. Yeah. Fascinating. Yeah. It's so interesting. He's educated me a lot on this metal and how it acts and, and how it acts differently in zero gravity than it does on, on ground level. How does the metal act differently in zero gravity? It's, it, it, it has a way of, well, just, let's just say that the words I heard, this metal is much, much like an animal and that it is always seeking for energy and seeking to connect. And how I got this pin was being off planet and being tested by that metal knowing that it bonded to me. So that's why this phenomenon is always around is it is trying to reconnect all the time. And because you went up on a craft, you're somehow connected with the, the metal. Yeah. How do you think you're connected with it? Into the DNA is all I know. It's a frequency. I think our DNAs transmit in a frequency which is, I've seen the papers on it. And, and a, and a, a radar type frequency. So it's pinging and it's receiving, sending and receiving. And so it's always, it's always, once it connects with you on that level and I'm being very careful not to say a whole lot here, but I get a phone call if I say too much right. So yeah, but they're clearly trying because they know you have a public presence. They're going to get asked about this stuff. Yeah. So they want to get it out somewhat. Right. Would be my guess, you know, there's a, you know, there's a scientist named Constantine Miles. He's in the Black Forest in Germany. And he talks about a scalar physics and its relationship with DNA, specifically like DNA resonance with these exotic electromagnetic waves that exist in the scalar field. Which, if you think about it, if we are getting any sort of messages via our DNA, a transverse hurts in a classic electromagnetic wave doesn't really make sense because it decays at one over r squared. So if you're in a Faraday Chamber, you're, you know, kind of in some remote place or whatever, the decay function on a normal electromagnetic wave would be too stark for you to really receive a lot of information on going. But if you have some of these more exotic waves that travel at one over r, which a lot of these kind of deeper aerospace scientists believe possibly exist, maybe your body would be able to download and encode a lot more information. And they say they think that the sun is a scalar wave generator. So maybe the sun is, you know, constantly spurring evolution. And Tim Taylor talks about in Diana's book, American Cosmic, that he's, his protocols are around, you know, you know, being in the sunlight, looking at the sun. Well, that's it. And, in fact, I read the paper on it 15 years ago, 13 years ago. And the thought is that the sun, the way it shines at an angle on the earth, it creates the green color spectrum, which is the center of the color spectrum, right. And in that our, the sun is, is affecting what's called ADT, which is the hemoglobin in your blood and the chlorophyll implant. So when it hits that, it starts this energy and it starts creating life. And so the sun is telling everything how to be a pair, how to be a grass, how to be a tree, how to be a me or you. So all the information of life is coming from that green light from what they're saying. It's just constantly sending all information, all encoding to every living thing, birds, swear it comes from. Yeah. It's really amazing. I mean, there's, there's this idea of the Anthropic Principle, which is why is earth, you know, this perfect kind of homeostatic, like, just place that that fosters life. And there, you know, a couple of different explanations for it. One is like, we've tried a million different iterations. This is the Goldilocks zone. We just got really lucky or whatever to live in the, the, the one where it's perfect. And then there's another one, which is this has been sort of created or simulated, you know, for for life. And if you think about the earth's magnetosphere, the way it blocks cosmic radiation, but allows just enough cosmic radiation to allow for the perfect amount of natural selection to allow for, you know, real, real evolution. But then the magnetosphere of the earth itself, like literally the human resonance, fosters human and animal morphology. Right. And in this sort of perfect way. If you put a frog embryo in a Faraday chamber where that's blocked, it doesn't grow normally. So it's this like the, these perfect sort of circumstances. So one thing we figured out this past year, I was on John Alexander called me two or three times. Chris, nobody got it. Yeah. I was on the, this beyond skin walker show with Brandon Fugel. Right. So we were at the Monroe Institute. And they took me in the basement of the lab and put me in a Faraday cage. And it's silent. It's walls like this dig with, you know, I mean, I'm in the basement of the lab in a build, in a basically a coffin. That's what it looked like with ceilings or copper and walls or copper. So no electric magnetism can get in there. And so they had all these cameras outside, pointing up at the sky. And I'm in this thing and they have Dr. Thompson from, from New York, Neuros, neuro PhD and Neurosite was monitoring me. And he said if you, if you sense a UFO over the complex, just point to the ceiling. Every time I pointed, they were filming something about the, the building. And that, from that point on, John and a whole lot of other scientists says this prudest consciousness. It's not a lecture magnetic as consciousness. So as instantaneous as I thought, which is what's creating everything. Wow. Yeah. Yeah. Well, if you think of, you know, we have phonons, which are sort of, you know, quantum vibration packets and then you have photons, which are quantum light packets. Right. Maybe at some point we'll figure out quantum thought packets or something. Well, that's it. It's all thought. Hmm. It's just, it's just how it works with me. Hmm. You know, I don't have to go out and speak to get this thing to come. I just think about who it knows our thoughts. Hmm. Completely. Hmm. And in advance of what you, but I think you can't fool it. Wow. At all. There's no way. Wow. This episode is sponsored by True Classic. This is one of my favorite shirts. It kind of works for every occasion. I honestly didn't think I cared about T-shirts until I realized how many of them I don't wear. They end up just accumulating in your closet. Most of them look fine on a hanger. Then you put them on and something's off. 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Do you feel like, you know, when you read like, this is going to sound like a crazy question, but like when you read the Book of Acts and learn about Jesus, do you feel like he is a state of being that others can get to through kind of really spiritual, profound kind of experiences, what Dynapasalka calls in her book, Hierophany's, Revelations, and again, this is not to make him out to be this exclusive, untouchable, you know, being or state, but like maybe some people can reach a state, and do you feel like maybe you're in that sort of Christ consciousness and that allows you to have a hundred percent effect on you? Yeah, a hundred percent. And, you know, the way I was born and raised a Baptist and married a Pentecostal Holiness girl and, you know, I was very deep into the church and loved it, and my wife still goes. She was at church yesterday and we're a day before Sunday. But the way, you know, when Jesus came, he was in a Christian. He was just saying, the kingdom of heaven is within you. You can talk to God yourself, and you don't need to pay anybody to have that. And I don't think they like him saying that a whole lot in his life was cut short because of that. Well, that's one of my favorite lines. It's in an apocryphal, you know, the gospel of Thomas, but it's, you know, if you look to the sea, the fish will proceed you to the sky. The birds will proceed you. The kingdom of heaven is inside of you, and all around you. And, you know, and then you'll have hardcore biblical scholars say, oh, that was written 150 years later, and you know, as a matter of words, Jesus, he's the kingdom of heaven is within you. Yeah. That's a spark, that divine spark. And you can, yeah. Do you, how do you, how do you, because like, I feel like my, on world view and ontology, in some ways, matches a lot of yours and what you say. And then I think there are a lot of people out there who are like, who is this guy saying that he sees orbs and, you know, that's it's 747 or satellite or whatever. What do you say to those people? You know, I expect that. I've learned until you see it and experience it, you're just uninformed, you know, it's real. There's 100% real, and I have shared it with groups as large as a thousand at one time, with a PA, and as the most liberal, UFO group, you know, I've ever been to, was contacting the desert this past summer, right? And here I am, being drug by the hand all day, you need to be in this room at this time, this room at that time, hadn't eaten all day, hadn't been to the bathroom and it's like seven o'clock at night, and I'm finally, you know, and I deal with rheumatoids of my energy levels and they even in our love, my wife comes in, or the, my assistant comes in and he says, oh, you got a sky watch at, at, at nine o'clock, it was eight, and I'm like, oh my God, I forgot all about that huge pressure, it's, it's cloudy, it's raining and pumps springs, it never rains and pumps springs, right? Sprinkling, and they said, there's a big group setting outside waiting out here. So I like, I'm like, I took my, I told my wife us to take me somewhere to where nobody can see me, because if they see me, there was always 50 people in line, right? So she took me over to a little seating area where it was dark and I lay back and I looked up at the sky and I said, Lord, I need help, I'm stressed tonight, it's raining, there's a thousand people out there wanting to see something. And suddenly when I said that, my wife sent me a sign of me, I heard this telepathic voice say, don't worry about the rain, it'll just get more interesting. And then I saw these three orange orbs come down under the clouds and this digital digit is said, 9.45, just flashed right up. I said, okay, there'll be three orange orbs at 9.45, so I got up, I walked over to the center of a thousand people there in a big circle and I'm in a 20 foot circle that kept that where I could walk around in it with a microphone. And so I told the whole group and I were in advance, I said at 9.45, there'll be three orange that appear underneath the clouds and exactly at 9.45, it happened. Whoa. Do you have videos then? Yeah. Wow. And you can hear me on the microphone, so I recorded, predicting it and now we're in advance, but I didn't predict it. I saw it, it shared it with me. Wow. Yeah. It's so fascinating. It's like that the fatty amount of prophecy, but compressed and at a UFO conference. But you know what I did. Wow. So I had a lot of conference in there, you know, some of them's got ten full hats on and they have all these galactic federation, well, yeah, it doesn't compute with me, right? So I basically held a little church at the most liberal thing. I didn't knock church, but I said, look, we're just going to say a little prayer here. This is how it works on me. There isn't a summoning, all this thing you hear about summoning these things, if they're having negative experiences, whoever's doing this, well, that's why because you're open to anything coming, but I always use a little prayer. And so I just told him, I said, I believe that the Holy Spirit is this beautiful lady that gave me this information and I'm just going to ask her right now to share her presence with us. And that's the only thing I should. What do you think of, because it seems like you're coming at this from a very spiritual perspective? There are rumors that the legacy UFO program itself uses protocols to attract UFOs to come in, sometimes use directed energy, weapons against them, get them to land sionically through what they call sionic assets. So that would be finding somebody maybe similarly tapped in as you are, but who's sort of not maybe come about it in the more earnest spiritual way through life experience that you did. Maybe they just have some ability or maybe they've been given a protocol or something. What are sionic assets? When we look at collecting data, one of the areas that we look to collect data is through a sionic asset, which is an individual who's trained in remote viewing psychic abilities, telekinesis, that type of thing, which is basically through a number of different protocols can transition into a place where they are highly sensitive to their environment from the point of view of consciousness through a consciousness field. How do you feel about that, attracting crafts to come down, trying to derive material from these crafts or get downloads from them, but for like defense, you know, kind of military industrial complex purposes? Well, I've been, you know, I work in and around a lot of those people and I've had a lot of proposals that, and you wouldn't believe even proposals if I could get it to come down could they shoot at it. I'm like, absolutely not, yeah. That's not going to happen with me. You want to study it? What I see is, it's wanting to communicate with us. You hear about all that, but I've not seen it yet, but I haven't seen the results, so there's a lot of talk out there, but not a lot of data to show, right? Where I show the data, I take 1,000 people out or 500 out, and we get things that appear to have wings, orange glowing beans, as many as 20 at the time, fly 25 feet over our head and appear out of thin air, pull, come right over, glowing. And says very spiritual and sacred to me, and I would never, but as far as, you know, I heard some of the things on age of disclosure and they were talking about negative parts of it. Orbs being negative. I've never experienced that ever in my whole 19 years of doing it. In fact, you talked about the book Bax when Saul was on the road to Damascus. What was it that appeared and blinded him? Was it? It was an orb. Flashed him, said it flashed around him, blinded him. It was a ball of light. Same thing. It's all in your thought process. If you grounded with that humbleness and honesty and you loved, then you're going to get that. But if you put something out, I mean, if we want aliens, right, we create this in our brain. If we want aliens with red guns, if you get enough of the population to think on that, that's probably world-manifest. What do you think the orbs are? It's this sort of perennial question. Because I think a lot of people have these experiences. I think they'll meditate. They'll be deep in prayer. And they'll see something. I have an experience like that where I was doing hallotropic breath work with a friend in Silver Lake, California, of all places. The last place you'd ever expect to see anything, and we saw two metallic orbs show up. It doesn't feel coincidental that for him, I think it was his first time doing hallotropic breath work. You're supposed to get you into a state where your brain, I think, endogenously releases DMT and you're in this heightened spiritual state. What do I think it is? What do you think they are? Well, I'm very careful to try not to label because it's all speculation. You ask the question, "What do you think?" Well, I'm guessing, right? All of us are sure. And nobody's experienced it. I don't think any more than I have. I see it just about every day of my life. And it comes in my house orbs appearing in my room, over my chairs and flying through the house and stuff. So you think you experience it more than anybody in the world? I haven't seen anybody with the data I have. It showed me the data, and then we, you know what I'm saying, but people are seeing it now, and I predicted that. In my book, you'll read where I wrote about a certain incident that was going to happen in the future, which was when I ran in Israel, began to exchange missiles at one another. At that point is when these balls of light, these orbs were going to start appearing and revealing themselves to the world. I wrote about that. And that was something I've talked about for 10, 12 years, and then looked last November. These drones, supposedly, drones that show up. Those aren't drones. Their orbs coming out to see appearing and they're saying, "Stop." They de-esculated and they kind of settle. They started putting up 30,000 polling. All of a sudden, now there's orbs all over Europe. Based on the patterns that I've seen. I'm saying I'm guessing, right? But 19 years of research and prayer, simple prayer, that mindset. Don't have to say it verbally, just think it. Lends me to believe it's something connected to our thoughts, very caring, loving, and our beings. I can share a video with you of an orb with a lady standing beside me and another lady. I go, "What on each side?" This one has cancer. Stage four kidney cancer, Jesus. She's missing one kidney already. Year and a half later, my testecizes in her other kidney. She calls me. So she's worried about her chemo is not working. So she had a very poor chance of survival. So she calls me and comes to my house from 2015, I guess, and 2013 maybe. And she brings her girlfriends like five of them. So all of those, myself, a wife, and some of my children, and three Native Americans, they're outside. They just happen to show up at the same time, friends of mine. And so I've got them to kind of do a spiritual song that they do for healing for her. All of a sudden in the video, you'll see an orb appear and it comes zoom in right up to me. And all of a sudden it flashes and out of that comes a tall glowing figure about six to seven feet tall. And then it just kind of moves over out of the camera right in front of this lady. And then she goes to get her scan of Monday and has them or cancer. What? Yeah. And I have it on video. So I would love to see that video. I'll share it in a little bit with you. That would be amazing. That's amazing. So 19 years I have more data about this and more that most people can imagine. Would she ever go on record and talk about that? Yeah, probably. Wow. I'd love to speak with her. Yeah. This is so amazing. So this is why I always lend to the spiritual side. You know, I believe that if there's what is an angel, some messenger, I don't know what it is. I know that it is to me is and it could be just a fractal of consciousness itself, which that word means God. And it comes back to the creation or the creator, that mind. So maybe these lights are just fractals of that. But I don't know. Do you believe Tim Taylor is a time traveler? Well, I'm guessing people say that, but it's very possible. We were talking right before we were rolling about intersection points. Points where maybe you can hop between timelines or something. Exactly. What does that mean to you? Well, it's just hard to wrap your head around. There's no words for that. The vocabulary for all this is just like very small. But yeah, I'll have to think on that one. What it means. I was having a dream the other night about that, about timelines, changing, shifting. And it was such a weird dream, but it was like, you know, it's like their stories have really random, but like Bill Murray, the actor, he'll walk around New York City, and he'll like take a french fry from somebody eat it in their restaurant or whatever. It'll just like literally like off the street. And then they'll look at him and they'll be like, that's Bill Murray, like taking my fry or whatever. And then they'll look at them and they'll go, no one will ever believe you. And that's what a lot of the phenomenon feels like. It feels like self-concealing. You know, it's like the perfect, I'm sure the perfect amount of the video that you described was cut off where open-minded people will believe it. And then some hyper skeptic will not. Right. Then there's it's like there is always some little stigma left on the evidence that you do have that is fully debunkable. But it's always like this. Like the phenomena. That's the phenomena. It is. It's messing with it. And it's designed is doing that because there are three kinds of people. I've talked about this many times. There are three types. Yes. Probably more. But there are people that can see. Right. That can see this. There are people that I can teach to see. And there are people that can never see. Oh, damn. They'll never see it because they're skeptical. And when you're skeptical about this, you will never be in the club ever. It will not let you in because it doesn't want to mess with your free will. But skepticism is also good. Yeah. But some skeptics can come seers, right? Sure. But there are some that can never. Their brains are wired, you know, to where it's a block. You do need some filtering mechanism. You need something in your brain being hooked. That feels wrong or false. Right. Yeah. What's the phrase? You know, your mind can be so open. Your brain can fall out. Yeah. Right. Yeah. So how do you view that? Because discernment seems like an important, you know, part of waiting your way through this topic. 20 years of, 19 years with me when it first happened. All I know is that I was afraid when I was looking at it in the broad daylight. It came out of the sky in daytime. It wasn't in dream. It wasn't at night. It was in the broad daylight. And they came and they took me. So that programmed to me in a way that was never doubting ever. Describe this whole experience. So you, they were using broad daylight and they came and took you. Who's that? Well, they, whoever they are. Yeah. And this is in my book, a UFO of God, by the way. I'll check it out. I haven't plugged it yet. It was 19 years ago on January the 8th of 2007, it will be 19 years. I was down and out and lost everything, lost my home, my income. I had too many houses on the market. I was building a hundred homes a year and it had been for 19, 20 years and the world trade center thing happened and then the housing bubble bust and so I found myself in a place where I was living in a million-dollar home on the golf course and now I'm in a mobile home with no income and I'm having to play for free lunch for my kids. That's how bad it got. And so I'm crying out to God walking along, I had gone fishing at the river with my son and three other guys and they wanted to fish and so I walked away. They were sitting on the bank at a Cape River River and I walked up the way we came in. We were down in the bottom, you know, cross a big cornfield and then you go down into river bottom so that about a quarter mile down in the bottom is where they were sitting on the bank and I told them I'm gonna walk up to the field and look for deer or whatever just wildlife, not telling them how depressed I was and where I was, I mean I was struggling bad. Sick with Crohn's disease, had it 18 years suffering with it and anyhow I'll walk up to that field and it was just about 10 after 5 when I started up that way. Look about 5 minutes to walk, maybe 8 and when I got to the top of that hill there, they were two of these big balls of fire like flaming 40 foot round, red, orange, glowing balls of fire and the fire is going around it and these little tips were shooting off of it flames and there were two of them, side by side, very low down. Probably a couple hundred feet above the trees and about 300 yards away and I'm at the back of the field and they're up at the road to highway, you know, that's where they were. And I'm sitting there looking at them, scared to death. First I was mesmerized like one in the world. I'm a commercial pilot, still have my tickets and so I knew right away what we were looking at, wasn't anything for brag or any military, anybody had. And so the chill came over me, it's like, oh my God, what am I looking at? So this is my mind went from amazement to fear suddenly and then I guess 5, 10 minutes sitting there watching it, I got so afraid I wanted to run. So I turned my body and pointed down the hill because run down to where my son was on the bank of the river and I had to look back one more time. So I turned to look back before I went to run and when I did the third one, the third one above me was invisible, it was not visible, it just appeared and shot right straight down in front of me, 515, 530, and the evening in January, it's not dark. Before I was later, I come walking back to the river where they were and my son was missing, he wasn't there, he had gotten lost looking for me on foot. I couldn't compute any of that, how I had been gone for 20 minutes is all I could think. They were fussing at me, where have you been, we've been looking y'all night and it took me, it took me a long time to reconcile that and then my crones was gone, I had more sickness. And if anybody has crones, knows how bad that is, this so worse thing, you're in the restroom 10 times a day, I was at 20 times a day at that point in my life. So I'm suffering with sickness and suffering mentally and depressed, if I ain't all of it, I'm at the very bottom, crying out, "Lord help me, what do I do?" You're living in a relatively small town in North Carolina where you were very successful and known by all your community members and you were at the depths of despair and I'm sure feeling like a pariah or something out of your community. Well I came back excited to tell it and that's when basically the next five years of darkness I talk about in my book started and it was the pitchforks came out, the holy water came out and the social services came to my house trying to remove me from the house. But real quick, so you said that you thought it was 20 minutes of gone by. It was four hours and you remember what you had experienced, did you recover the memory? I recovered quite a bit of them, I did recover them a time and through hypnosis and a doctor from Harvard helped me and then you got a wonder is it all real but I can tell you, they talk telepathically and it was the doctor from Harvard, Dr. Michael O'Connell, this thing. Is he dumbness with other experiences? He was trained by John Mack. That's amazing. I didn't know there was a doctor at Harvard currently who was trained, so John Mack was the head of the Harvard Psychiatry Department who saw a lot of experiences and originally he got into it because he was interested in missing time. Right. All these people are coming with missing time and then he had been childhood friends synchronistically with Bud Hopkins who was very interested in experiencers, abductees. He is an air at Harvard, John Mack does, Michael O'Connell. Well he's dead now. He died. That's unfortunate. I was literally going to be like, I want to interview. He was a, I love the guy. We bonded really close until he died. He lived in South Carolina, so I live an hour and a half from him, so we visited a lot. Wow. I think another thing for people to understand if they are skeptical of something coming out in a hypnotic regression, these experiences are so traumatic. They're so foreign to you when they happen. If you look at any other extremely traumatizing experience just in the world, a woman who's or somebody experiences child abuse or something extremely serious that just shatters your whole being, you will repress that memory. And it will often, you'll have fragments of it, you'll have shards of it, but it'll be like broken glass and it will, you'll need techniques like this at times to recover those memories. This guy, Michael O'Connell, works with you and what do you end up recovering? Well, what he did, I'll give you a short on what he did. He came and he started, I'm just dialogue talking and told me that he knew from his studies that they can tend to pack a lot of information in your mind and it's locked away in there. If you were to remember it all at one time, it'd probably drive you crazy. I can tell you, I had severe headaches if I tried to think, past that missing time, I would pass out. I did it over and over when they were questioning me, I'd get to a point and I couldn't think anymore and the headaches would come so bad, I would pass out. You know, there's a really great book by, my mind's just going to all these crazy places, but there's a book called Healing Back Pain by Paul Sarno. It's this amazing book that healed a lot of people's backs psychosomatically because it talks about chronic pain as being adaptive from a psychosomatic perspective and so maybe even this was the case with your Crohn's disease that you were facing where it is more adaptive to feel physical pain at times than to process emotional pain. And so it would make sense that actually physical pain would be the blocker for something that was maybe more emotionally painful or transformative or something. It makes sense. We started working together and he would tell me, we're going to program you to where the information comes out little at a time, not too much, but you'll remember it all. That's what he said immediately when he did work with me. Then days I started having these nightmares and dreaming and speaking in my sleep and talking in my wife and kids were videoing me in the bed. They'd hear me saying all kinds of crazy things about my experience and but what it was like, Jesse, was like a virtual tour. In other words, they took me the first thing I remembered was seeing Egypt. Why? Over the pyramids, looking over the pyramids and seeing the spikes, that's all I remember of that. seeing this temple, Hathor's temple, and all the animals in the birds. It was just like this video that was playing in my brain about Egypt. So I studied everything, I could study about that. I went to scholars like Dr. Gilbert and learned from Robert, all kinds of sacred geometry and-- I didn't know you learned from Robert Gilbert. Yeah, you lived in Nashville, right? Close to me. The famous rose accruciant scholar. Yeah. Interesting. Loved to go. Wow. Yeah, he was a very sad person. He was a nuclear chemist and he just passed away from cancer very recently, this year, I believe. Yeah, this year. But a world of knowledge, and he helped me a lot, understanding the symbols I saw about Egypt, and then, you know, 2019 comes along, I write about the Sima book. I'm sick with rheumatoid arthritis now, and I'm been on chemotherapy for like six, seven years. I'm down to 150 some pounds, walking on a cane, and now I'm migrating to a wheelchair. That's where I was in 2019. Diana and Tim were in the Vatican archives in 2017, and I was supposed to go with them, but I couldn't. I was sick. And they were-- Oh, you were supposed to go on that trip? Well, it could have been arranged. Yeah, it was all about me, the whole thing. When they went there, they had a ceremony in the Vatican. It was supposed to be a ceremony for you. Yeah, they had a ceremony. They put my picture in the picture of the Pope on outside of the archives, and then they placed my photo between the books of Galileo and Copernicus. Really? Yeah, to be there forever. No way. Yeah. Sure did. Do you have photos of this? Yeah, I did. Can you send that? Yeah. Wow. This is amazing. Yeah. So-- So, and who was Tim Taylor prompting them to do this ceremony, or-- I think Diana's connection to the Vatican, and the lady I speak about, you know, I hear I come in 2012, having an experience with this lady, this beautiful glowing lady, that-- well, that was something, too, because that was at the end of five years, and I was fighting the government, the social services for my sanity. Yeah. But real quick, so because you were describing your first experience that, you know, O'Connell helped you get out. And so you're around the pyramids, you see the sacred geometry, which, you know, Dr. Robert Gilbert helps you kind of decode. Did you decode anything? Did you notice any sort of messaging? Yeah, I did. I started seeing the likeness, and the way they portray their deities is in the whole matrix of the thing. You know, it's like when Jesus was born, it said, an angel came and said, "Go to Egypt," right? Well, we don't realize that Egypt was controlled by Greece for 500 years before that, right? So, perfect fit for him to go there and to grow up there. And when you start seeing the similarities between the two, there's pretty much the same thing. There are stories between the Trinity, Jesus and the Trinity, and then Raw and Horus and the whole thing. They have a triad there, right? But their deities are portrayed as animals, immerse forces of nature. This is what Dr. Gilbert spoke about. It's all about everything nature and humanity, and so when then you read the story of Ezekiel and the will within the will, right? He walks between two of the cherubim, it says, and he walked between them, and there he met an angel, right? And what was it? It had faces of animals, and only one part human. So it's not like grandma would wings and a beautiful, rather right, is these things are creatures, and they're, it's always, did you see these creatures? No, I only studied them. Okay. I saw the creatures, yeah, drew them when they were little glowing beings about the stall. But those seem more of the variety of the extraterrestrials or aliens, people kind of experience. Well, they say that until you read Daniel chapter 10, when it talks about an angel that he saw. And when I described this little being, I said, he looked like glass. He was so shiny, his whole body was glowing like you had a suit on that was gleaming like glass. Do you see this alien in the, in the craft? I saw it standing from me to you from me. And this was in the, on the, in like the woods near your house. And I wrote about this and, um, and he had a little triangle on his chest. Yeah. Funny. There's a triangle right there, right? Oh, there you go. I was thinking that when you were like, look at my little pendant, I was like, well, was that an homage to the triangle from the alien being? That was from NASA. And two, I have multiple videos and if we go sky watching at some point, you'll see the phenomena will always try to line up in the triangle or in threes. Interesting. So it's like maybe this is telling us something, right? What is that? I don't know. I'm, it's all speculation. I'm learning. What else did Robert Gilbert tell you? Because he did seem like a person who was very tapped into, oh, yeah, kind of deeper esoteric truth. Yeah. A lot. I learned a lot from him that, that helped me understand that this world is so far more complex. For example, he described pendulums. If you go to Egypt and you dig in the soil there, the most artifacts that they find under the ground in Egypt are pendulums. Is that true? Yeah. That's the most frequent artifact. That's the most frequent they find the millions of them. And so he explained to me what they knew and how the people that set Washington up, they did the same thing. Why they have an obelisk in Washington, why they have one in Central Park, why is there one in France and in England, they have, and they went to Egypt and got those things and brought them back and stood the stones up. Well, you know, if you look at Charles Launfant, you have all this kind of freemasonic symbolism around D.C. And that is definitely derived from ancient Egypt. In fact, I've been inside of this like freemasonic temple in D.C. and by the way, I'm not a freemason. I wouldn't be saying this if it was obviously. But like it's, it's just, you might as well be in like an Egyptian temple or something. It's all Egyptian symbology. And so you think there's like a link between, I think there's, there's a big mystery. But there's a link some, yeah, somewhere or another. Wow. Yeah. Interesting. And then the other connection for you with ancient Egypt is, so you're around the pyramids and you see these symbols, but, and then you obviously encounter these beings. But later you encounter the lady, right. And she describes herself as Hathor, is that right? Well, that was one name she is. She said she had many names and she had been called many things throughout the world. In other words, Diana, Demeter, Isis, Hathor, Hara, the Virgin Mary, everything. She's had many names throughout history and by every culture. And the way she explained it to me helped me understand religion in a different way. How people conceive, you know, like the Taoist or the Muslims or the Catholics or whoever, only imagine God in their minds. We all do. We imagine that. And it turns into an ugly thing because religions tend to think they had the Skivion God. And therefore we're going to go to war with you because you don't believe like us. That's the problem that has to stop. This is the message she told me that she had many names throughout history and that God is God. And we don't know what we think we know and we need to set back and reanalysen, you know, be good children and all we're going off the cliff. That's kind of the thing she told me. As she told me about the missiles, that was in 2012, but it was so much there. I came out of the in 2012 telling it like right away what that that she explained to me. And you received a prophecy about 2026 as well, right? Yeah. And what was that? But she said, and I had no idea what it meant, still don't, other than she said that when the star of regulus. which is a blue star. When it appears red on the horizon at the dawn, before the sun comes up and the gaze of the sphinx. In other words, I saw it in a vision. The whole thing you can see, the sphinx facing east and this thing's just cresting the top. She said, "When that happens, that will be assigned usher's in a new knowledge for humanity." So does that mean the return of Jesus or the return of Christ consciousness it could, and I think that's possible. But it marks a sign. She said where the darkness would be exposed and the truth would be revealed. So I think we're going to learn something over the next couple of years that, and this was 12 years ago I said this, 13 years ago, 2012. When these missiles started flying and the orbs started appearing, Deck had a lot of attention on me real quick. Yeah, it's funny, I'm caught between two minds. One is, I think even the book of Matthew, it's something like nobody knows today, other than God, paraphrase, nobody knows the day, and then on the other hand, it does feel like just this gestalt sense of like things are getting weirder. Dark truths are being revealed, ongoing. It feels like it's already started. And it feels like we're on the verge of some sort of paradigm shift. Yeah, we are definitely. Yeah, I agree with that. I think everybody see something coming and a new knowledge just coming and a new shift that things that I know that imagine a world without oil. Do you think we're going to have free energy at some point scene or something? Imagine the world without rockets. Right. So that kind of knowledge alone would change everything. All of humanity. And so that's in our future. Well, that was Thomas Townsend Brown's vision, a world beyond rockets that he had this model of electrogravity, which connected electromagnetism and gravity, which in our standard physics is we don't have a link between those two things. And if you were to get a link, if the input was pure electromagnetism or electrical and the output was some sort of gravitational perturbation, that would be paradigm shift. I mean, you get well beyond what SpaceX is, which is extremely inefficient. Most of, I believe, the starship, their latest rocket is I think it's 5,000 metric tons and an extremely high percentage of that. I mean, the payload capacity of it is like 150 tons. So that ratio alone, it's all fuel. The whole thing is fuel. Right. That's not efficient. That's not alien interstellar space travel. Does it make sense? Well, imagine a day that we won't need those things. In fact, they probably already had that. Do you think they did? I think so. Really? I think it's possible. So why not? Because why not let it out then? Because it would change everything. It could create something that has to be given slowly. It's too disruptive. Too disruptive. Yeah. It would definitely be destabilizing for institutions. Exactly. If you had, say right now, we're paying, I'm just going to throw fake numbers out there, but $15 per kilowatt hour or electricity or whatever, that reduced to $0.10 per kilowatt hour. A whole lot of institutions would kind of crumble corporations would experience a lot of like for the people who are like, it wouldn't destabilize things. I think that's crazy. I think it would. I think it would be very positive. Well, it would be in the end, but imagine the old tankers, the thousands of them are refineries and all the jobs involved with it. So yeah, but then imagine the abundance on the other side. All of those people, their quality of life would be dramatically better. So is that the new knowledge? I don't know. But I think that is a whole lot of things that are going to come forward that have been hidden from us. And the main thing is the truth that we're not alone. Yeah. Well, that's clear to me. I think that's definitely a thing. And so I believe next year we'll be closer to that forever. Yeah. And the word apocalypse, by the way, you know what that means? Yeah, unveiling. To reveal the secret. And people think when you hear that, and if you look on Google, it says the ultimate destruction, the end, it's lying to us. That's not what the word means at all. It means to reveal that which has been hidden. And it's the veil thinning. And I think for some people, that will be very good. And for other people, it will be very bad. It depends on your orientation to it. Right. And I think it does have this connotation of, you know, the beesle bulb coming down and breathing fire onto everybody sorting people and whatever. But like, I think if you were oriented in a good way spiritually, I don't think it'll necessarily be bad for you. I also don't even, you know, we're talking about it like it's one, you know, crazy event with these like divine beings. Maybe it's like a slow moving thing. Exactly the way I see it. It's not like snappy fingers and something. We're not going to wake up on Easter or whenever that time happens. Yeah. I'm torn, by the way, because for eight years, I wrote and talked about this alignment being in September, somewhere in the fall. Because that was the date given to me by some people into astrology. And then they come back right when I go to write my book and say, well, we made him a second. He said Easter. And I thought, well, that sounds plausible because the lady's always coming around Easter. I have this and saying the experience is every year at Easter. Are you still having them? Yeah. That's amazing. It'll speak to the year. And you think the Virgin Mary, Hathor, Demeter, you think all of these, I think it's the Sophia the wisdom, the Holy Spirit. So that would be kind of the Gnostic version or something. Yeah. Yeah. That's who I think this being is. It was a spirit. And it was definitely holy in her presence, right? And so, and she physically impacted me because the wind blew me backwards to the ground. It was such a blast of wind that blew me down. And I started researching that. And the word spirit is the wind, right? And the word Holy Spirit is the breath of God. But it was the wind that affected me and the power from it. This cow came over me. But the wind pushed me back. What does she look like? Look like the most beautiful 35, 40 year old woman you've ever seen. It's just glowing and typical Virgin Mary apparition type thing. And you know, this thing, this spirit appears in every country. It appeared to the Native Americans in, in the Wild West back, you know, they called it a white buffalo calf lady. The Egyptians called her Hathor an earlier before met. And the birth mother, creator in Proverbs in the Bible chapter 8 and 9 talks about wisdom. It's the name of the chapters. And it talks about, and she was created before the earth was created, before the beginning of time. Wow. So who is she? I don't know. But that's my thought. What was the feeling that came over you when you saw her, when you see her regularly? It's, on a first saw, it was, it was very impactful because the cow ran me over. And so I had this extreme fright to start with. And then I land on my back and I roll over to get up and run. And there is this beautiful woman. So I went from extreme fear to, oh my God, what is this in front of me? Is the cow running you over part of the whole thing? That was part of the, her coming at me. She came at me at night out of the darkness as a wind, the wind hit me. And as I'm going backwards to the ground, I see a translucent cow running over top of me and I can see stars up through the thing. I'm like, oh my God. And I was frightened so bad. I landed on my back and I turned to get up and running. There's this woman about from here to that camera. Three feet off the ground hovering. And she looked at me and she said, you know I'm here. And I'll tell you why she said that because five years had gone by 2007 to 2012. And I had been beaten down and broken by the community. My children were falling apart. Schools and teachers were calling them to the side as your dad crazy. We hear about all this. or you all write something. somebody from there called social services on me and I had to fight to be at home with my children. It was that bad. So, five years of that, I walked out on Easter, Saturday night, Easter of 2012. So, any morning is Easter right? And I shouted to the sky, thank you for saving me. Thank you for healing me. But you've run my life. Now my children are affected and I have caused them great harm and I'll never speak about this again. Even though I had to desire, they put this in me like the famous movie Close Encounters where you see he's making a mashed potato mountain on his endure and he's stoning in the wind and bushes and he's creating devil shower, right? He didn't know what it was but it was in his head. So, I was that guy. I had to tell everybody. And the more I told it, the more trouble I got myself into. And what you're referencing with your family is junior your son who had gone looking for you. Yeah. Also saw beings was really shocked at what he experienced. It was a community that caused him to want to leave home. Really? Yeah. It was a 17 years old and my right hand was with me everywhere I went and we come home telling the world about it and now the whole community has come on us and so five years into it, I'm out telling the heavens I quit. I'll never talk about it again. And then she appears and says, "You know I'm here. This is your burden. You must bear. You have to tell what you know." And if you do, I will allow you to video record and fill my presence and share it with others. The lady says she told me that. And are you going to? Well, let me tell you, from 2007 to 2012, I had zero data. I was out every night with a camera trying to get pictures to save myself from the community, right? The more I tried to list it would let me film it. It'd be hovering in the trees behind my house. I'd pull the camera out and it would vanish every time. So I was angry about that. I'm trying to prove myself sane and my child is now left home because the community has just been tough so she's like you're not going to quit. I'm going to help you. So from that point forward, I started being able to film it and share it with anybody. And I have a massed terabytes and terabytes of data, video, photo, audio, and never a picture until 2012 when she came. Why do you think these guys from NASA are showing up at your door? We mentioned Tim Taylor earlier. He's a NASA mission controller. But Hal Pov and Meyer also showed up originally. And I think you Ryan, your son mentioned that kind of at the end of his life, you realized that he was both CIA and NASA. Yeah. And so what do you think their interest in all of this is? Um, and there are a lot more NASA guys. That was just too up. Really? I had dinner with Hal's wife this weekend. She came Florida to a Christianers wedding. Oh, wow. Yeah. We love them. And, uh, but there are a lot of other NASA guys that I'm currently talking with. Hmm. Several one tells me wherever I go, but they're all interested. They tell you wherever you go. They're with me. Really? Yeah. Usually traveling with me. Somebody associated with that. Yeah. What do you think they want? They all want to study it. They want to know and they observe it with me. They take them out. We, you know, we do a lot of work. Are they with you in Austin, Texas? No, but they wanted to be. I only have one night and my wife's friend traveled with me because she was at our house. Yeah. Her kids are right down the street. Uh-huh. But, uh, usually I go nowhere without somebody with me for a reason. Wow. Yeah. I've had some things that, um, caused me to want to have somebody with me all the time. What happened that caused you to want to not leave, you know, go anywhere on a company? Um, well, I've been threatened a few times by different ones. And, uh, was at the PSI games this year. Sci games. I call it PSI. Sci games and, uh, came out of a conference speaking. And when I walked out the door, this mad lady comes running up to me and tries to kidnap me. What? Yeah. Has something with drugs on it. Try to get me in a van with no drought with no tags on it. Security had to come. They had to call the law on her. Yeah. So crazy, crazy people. Yeah. I imagine you attract a lot of nutty people. Time. What do you think the Vatican knows about all this? If they had a picture of you and they were doing some ceremony about you, and you were supposed to come, what do you think they think of you? Well, I can share a couple of photos of you for that. But, um, I got three pictures, several, quite a few paintings that they have in the Vatican that Diana sent me from there and put Francis. Uh, she said to tell me that they know that they're angels, that they don't mean to harm us, but their energy, if they get excited, can cause harm to a human. So just be careful and try to ask it not to get too close to you. And these three photos or the paintings show, um, orbs with the angel center. That's what they told me. Yeah, because, you know, you have same frances of a CC who she writes about in 13th century Mount Levers and Italy, brotherly owes right next to him. And he sees this angel. But if you look at the original Greek translation, it's a flaming torch. Yep. She thinks it's a UFO experience in that the stigmata he receives these wounds on his hands are actually electromagnetic damage. Um, that like, you know, Gary Nolan or somebody studying kind of modern experiences interacting with UFOs might just say, oh, that's like an electromagnetic burn or you let you see it in closing count of the third kind. You see the burn on his face. I got, um, yeah, I got radiation burns plasma radiation. That's what NASA told me it was the, um, so you got, you also got plasma radiation burns. No, I didn't. But I was warned a million times by how Pub and Meyer and different ones at NASA kept calling me honestly over and over. Don't let them get too close. Don't get too close to them. How was telling me that they knew the voltage was like 33 million bolts and one of these things. And if it got near me, it would kill me dead. They know a lot more than we know than we think they do. They just don't share it, right? But so who is this like team like between CIA and NASA that knows a lot about angels? Well, I don't know that, but I know the NRO is the ones that have the keys to this thing. Really? And why do you think that? Because they have the keys to all the satellites and all the eyes on the sky and there are the ones that every rocket when it goes up, right? They observe every aspect of that rocket for reasons for mechanical reasons and for a surprise visit that happens pretty much every time they launch one. Do you think that rocket to track UFOs? That's what I'm saying. Every time they send one up, it attracts them. And they'll come up and look at it. If it has weapons on board, does Tim Taylor know you on Musk? Yeah. Did they work together? Um, for sure. Yeah. Did Tim ever tell you that? Well, he mentioned his name, but didn't say work for him, but he controls all the launches. Controls all the launchers. Tim does. He's the launch guy. He's the dragon. His console is called Dragon Control. Any controls all of the launches? He's the one. And I'll tell you what he does. When they fire rocket up, right? They have these big ground-based cameras like on a World Two battleship where they sit on a gun and they could turn a handle and the gun would go around and you know, they could control this thing they're setting on. Well, they have big binoculars like that. And they can get on this thing and follow this rocket up. And they got it to about 50,000 feet. Then it gets blurry. So at that point, it's intercepted by WB 57. Run out of Houston, a good friend of mine, which is National Reconnaissance Office, works with Taylor. So his crew's up there at 50,000 feet and it intercepts the rocket. So they film it with seven cameras on that thing where it goes right on up. When it gets up to 100,000 feet, then it's intercepted by if one of four starfighters equipped with another seven or eight cameras on that. And so it trails it right on up until it runs out of sight of and then the satellites take it over. and the only ones that can look at this satellites are these in RO guys. Tim walks out of his control into a private room where all the screens are. So his eyes are on all that. Fascinating. Yeah. How did he get into that line of work? Because if you re-launch fever, I don't think he's traditionally credentialed or trained. Well, my friend from Houston told me he helped him get that position. And who's your friend from Houston? I can't say so. Okay. He lives right down the road from here on a big, built on a big ranch right out here. I'd love to meet him. We could figure it out. I'll show you a picture of him later. Okay. Cool. Wow. Fascinating. And because Tim also works at Aerospace Corporation, right? Yeah. And what do you think the link is between NASA and Aerospace Corporation? I know a lot of those guys are in RO. Okay. Interesting. And to carry blackberries everywhere they go. Blackberries. Yeah. Not iPhones, Android. Yeah. But they have blackberries. They do their business. Do you think he's a time traveler? I think it's entirely possible. You know, honestly, I can tell you a story about him. Yeah. I sent my book. I think it made it in. I wrote 140,000 words and we only published 85 and that was what they recommended for the right size of the book, right? So, but in one of the stories I talk about Tim, right after we came back from Zanesville, Ohio, he came to my house and we had this famous tree on my yard that caught fire. This is a video out on the internet. You can see Chris bless a burning tree. Well, we had his tree that just spontaneously combusted in the backyard and rained for two days, grounds wet, everything's wet. And my wife and I walk out the back door at nine o'clock and this poof had erupted into flames. It was shooting 2015 feet up through the tree. And she put it out three times with a hose pipe. I can't read it night and itself. And so that got the attention of everybody. Tim wanted to see this tree. So, he's at my house, come, I picked him up at the airport. He goes to my daughter's homecoming game that night. She was a little homecoming princess in the 10th grade. Now she has a double master from NYU. So, that's been a long time ago, right? We walk up to this tree and having just a good conversation and all of a sudden the one side of the tree is open where it burnt from the inside. The tree caught fire into the inside and burnt a hole through the side of the tree. And when we walked up to it, he walks up and puts his head right up to look up in the tree and all of a sudden this snake comes out of the tree, this silver snake. And it was perfectly, I'd never seen anything like it ever. It was silver as a silver automobile. It's a perfect color. He jumps back and he grass for air. Oh my god, just like that. He looks at me. And he was shortward words and he said, he said, you know, my grandmother is full-blooded Choctaw, and I went to to school on a minority grant. My grandma told me if I ever saw a silver snake, it was part of their history, right? She said it would be a message from God. And he saw that and told me all about it, but I watched his reaction and then it got the best of him when that snake came out of that tree. And you saw the snake. I was standing beside him. What do you think the message could have been from God? It was a message for him, for him to understand this whole thing was from God, somehow another. And how does one of the most interesting things I wonder is if you read American cosmic or talk to Diana Pasolka, it's almost like they visited the Vatican archives. He figured out a way in before she had gotten there. And then they were sort of celebrating him at the Vatican Observatory. Like why would the Vatican Observatory know who a random NASA mission controller? It makes me think he is not a random NASA mission. He's not a random guy at all. He's just say he runs with the biggest Pasolka. Do you think he has a connection with the president? Yeah, absolutely. He briefed a bum on me. That's where this comes from. He briefed Obama. It came from him with a dinner napkin from Camp David Maryland. And you're sure positive. And did he tell you that he briefed Obama? No, he didn't tell me that, but I know that's what it means. Because of the letterhead. Yeah. And where it came from. Bob McGuire, who is I think former Intel and a friend of yours, came on the show and he said that that cannot be faked. Right. That definitely came from Camp David. Yeah, it's a napkin and an envelope with a napkin partially obscuring the address that's on the envelope. I knew the address because it was the address of Chris Bledso. I knew the napkin because it was the presidential seal on a napkin from Camp David. There's only one way you can have that napkin because it's a crime to copy the presidential seal. There's only one person that can get you to Camp David. And the picture was mailed to him by Tim Taylor. By Tim Taylor. And the only person at that story can have been told to in that envelope was Barack Obama. Oh my God. The letter to me is ironclad proof that Chris's story was taken all the way to Barack Obama. The Tim Taylor. Yes. You might think he was trying to throw you off the trail if he said, I briefed the president was bragging or whatever. But he didn't send it out. And right, I found it out. I didn't know what it meant. But I knew that he told me he just returned from Camp David. It was a Christmas when he got to him. Oh, so he did he tell I told you that. Yeah. Yeah. And he said I was at the dinner table with the president and handed me that. He said that. Yeah. Okay. So he didn't tell you that. But he didn't tell me. He briefed him. But he did give me the napkin and the and this. Yeah. And you believe him. Yeah. And there is a knot to him. Have you ever caught him in a lie? No. Ever. I wouldn't know. Not that I can recall. Everything he said is either come out to be true or you're waiting for confirmation. Right. Right. Wow. Have you independently verified some of these 100%. Is there an example of that? No, it's just, you know, it'd be like, it's just so hard to pinpoint any one thing. Sure. Or like, I don't know, some of the things about how the NRO or NASA work together. Have you been able to verify it? Yeah, absolutely. Yeah. Yeah. Do you think that the big dip or earth of major has anything to do with the UFO phenomena? You've said that you've seen UFOs come from that constellation specifically. I have. But, you know, I've learned since then. That doesn't matter. It's wherever I look. I can take you out at night and face one certain direction and only have a hole to look through that direction and it'll come from there. We can turn in any direction and focus there and us where to come from. So do you think the Vatican and the president and you ever Tim Taylor, you know, the hammer? Do you think they're all coordinating in some way? Maybe this Archangel, the Vatican and the president or what do you think the connection is? I don't have a clue. I'm just telling you what I was told, right? Yeah. So, and I've been told a lot of things, but he told me about the movie, the Adjustment Bureau and the story about the hammer. Yeah. Have you ever watched the Netflix show Dark by any chance? No. Do you think that you mentioned Tim's grandmother being Native American? So, is he a time traveler? I know where he came from. Right. As a young boy, which is, well, he told me the story about his upbringing, his Native American grandma. So, I'm just answering that question you asked earlier. Is he a time traveler? I don't know. I just know he told me and shared with me his childhood. Did he say anything else about Thomas Townsend Brown? Not a lot other than we went there. We went to, uh, into conversation about his, his daughter and that he was actively, and I actually have the manuscript saved on my phone. He shared with me that he was working with her own. On, on this book. On that book? Whatever happened to the book? I don't know, but I know I have the manuscript that they were writing. Oh, I would love to read it. Whether they were publishing it or ended up publishing it, I don't know if they did or not. What was it going to be about? about their father or father and his work and Tim's input confirming it. Oh, and Tim definitely knew Townsend Brown. Yeah. He knew his daughter Carter when I was there with him. This is crazy. Yeah. This is so interesting. Yeah. I want to. Are you still in touch with Tim? I haven't spoke to him. He sent word to me a couple years ago. I want to speak to him about Townsend Brown. He's a ghost, Tim. Yeah. Yeah. His whole life I admire him because his real life is in medical, saving children, cares more about the children and the struggles they have and diseases and cancers and finding curious for that. I'm sort of like a part of me is like hesitant to even ask questions about him because I don't like honing in on any specific individual. But when there's a specific individual who seems like they're embedded at the deepest levels of power structures that go as high as he does, they're claiming things to you and Diana Pasolka that seem kind of otherworldly. I just have to be fascinated and both you and Diana have public followings. And so I'm like, okay, like you have to know like some of this stuff is going to get out and you're going to instill curiosity. I don't know if you know this but I met him once for like 20 minutes. Oh, you're doing well. Like a FaceTime or whatever. Tim? Yeah, I met him. It was so stupid in retrospect because now I'd ask him so many other questions. You were tongue-tied at that moment. Not only tongue-tied because I was invested in this rocket company and they were struggling to get off the launch pad and normally I'd separate the woo-woo UFO stuff entirely from like, you know, that world. I don't try not to mix them at all. But I was kind of desperate and I was like, okay, I did read this book American Cosmic and I know that like, you know, there's this guy and he claims to use consciousness to get the, you know, rockets off the pad. And so I'm like, if there's anything there, I know the guys I'm working with, you know, I'm invested in. They're not thinking about consciousness as any sort of factor or component. So that was the impetus for me to talk to him and we talked about that for time. The trippiest thing he said to me, and I don't remember exactly how he said it, but it was clear this was the implication as he said, for you to succeed in your rocket company, like, you have to know what they want, you know, and like Diana said it, you know, called it the sponsors and that's you know, but it's the beings or whatever. Now, you know, he has a private office and the only one with eyes on whatever comes up to that rocket. And he's the only one with eyes on that. Well, he's the one that he's at Cape Canaveral in that room. But where does the nickname the dragon come from? I don't know. Nobody has a tattoo on his arm of the dragon. And when I was allowed to get on bass, I had to get a tattoo right here. Just it was part of the mission. Really? And it was of a dragon. Yeah. Whoa. And then you have the the dragon capsule, you know, at SpaceX. I don't know. Do you think that's a coincidence? No, it was all part of it. You think so? Yeah. When you were at Cape Canaveral, he was showing you around. Did he show you anything interesting? Yeah, a lot of stuff. Anything exciting or kind of beyond what you would expect just at a, you know, I was like a kid right here of the most secure place on the planet. Cape Canaveral. The mission control he told me it was more secured in the White House. Nothing is that secure. And last time I talked about this, I got in trouble, right? Really? Well, yeah. One particular thing I mentioned on Danny Jones podcast. You got in trouble for change? Well, yeah. Well, it got, I don't want to sit here because it got his, got, it got the algorithm killed on that. You said that the views were like, you know, it was like doing 50K a day. Oh, yeah. And then it cuts off. Yeah, yeah. You speak to some rep at Google. And they're like, we don't know what the hell happened here. It doesn't make any sense to click the rate average view duration, which should basically define the video's performance. He goes the one other time I've seen this is with Jesse's David Grush video. Exactly. Performance fell off a cliff. Yep. So. And then he said that he said that my video with Bledso and your video with Grush, neither of them broke any YouTube rules or had any internal red flags that he was able to see. Yep. And he goes whenever this happens, which has happened one other time recently with David Grush. Yep. It's basically the floor above me that I have no access to. Yep. Something above my head that I don't know what the hell's going on. So what the hell is going on? Yeah. Danny Jones said that the video got totally like cut off, throttled. Right. And he was confused. And Danny, by the way, is not like a dogmatic UFO believer at all. Yeah. It goes back and forth on the whole thing a lot. And he's apparently called this rep at Google. And Google said, you know, the only time this has ever happened and it's the floor above us and videos totally gotten nuked was Jesse Michaels David Grush interviewed. Yeah. Right. So that was me. And I put him in touch with my friend in Washington in the CIA. And I said, look, it just killed this. And he got to the bottom of it. But he did. Yeah. And he figured out that there was actual possible obstruction with Google. And from what I heard was just something that I mentioned got the attention of the news and the news called NASA and NASA's like, God, we don't want to talk about this. What? This is crazy. Well, just I mean, Trump just designated NASA as a spy agency. Whoa. And it's already it's it's you're already, you know, you're labeling a thing that's already been the case for, you know, decades. But this is just confirmation of that. That's why. Wow. That's what happened with that video with Danny. Still got what, 1.203 million. A ton of you. Do you think that NASA has other propulsion modalities? I think they've had it a long time. Really? I know they were working on it a long time ago because I was asked to to work on which way electrons move. Really? Yeah. And what does that mean? And what is it when it working on it? Back engineering machines? We're engineering UFO. Yeah. Really? Yep. Are the UFOs like alien reproduction vehicles that like hover and then go into space? Or are they like high voltage chambers that are like portals like in the movie contact where you end up in some other dimensional state is probably both of that exists. I don't know. But and you think NASA is sitting on this stuff? I don't know that NASA is necessarily but there are satellite groups that keep it under wraps. It is so far buried. Do you think, according to Tim, there were two generals at the Pentagon that knew everything. In which general? He didn't tell me. Interesting. Air Force generals. Air Force generals. See, when you go to NASA, the mission control, when you walk in there, it's a square building with a lung hallway in the very middle. And when you walk down this hallway, it's glass glass on both sides, right? And you look to the right here's all NASA scientists and launching, you know, at their consoles and you look to the left, it's exactly the same, but it's all Air Force people. So they have dual redundancy. Air Force over here is a billion on this side running air every launch and Tim's in the middle of all of it. And then once that rocket goes up, he disappears into this one little run that has eyes on it the whole time. What was the most interesting thing you saw with your own eyes that kept Canaveral? Probably. Well, I learned some interesting things that I didn't share. I'm not on here, but I guess going in the crew quarters was the greatest thing for me because when we got there, this building had been built like in the late 50s, when they first started Mercury and launching to the moon, right? And only according to Tim, only 300 people had ever been in that building in all the years, only 300. He said only one president, no congressman, anyone. And he said, you know, don't go around sharing this because here I'm sharing it, because they might get upset while they're not allowed in this place. And those 300 people would include the staff that run the place, the din mother that's been there. I met her. She'd been at 35 years. And she has a small group of people, the daughter that's own that lives there with the mom, the dad and the children. So those 300 people would be John Glenn and Armstrong and their family, right? So their kids and the wives and all. So a very small group of people had been in there. And I got to tour the whole place and sit where they asked her not sit and have the sit in the boardroom and go in the doctor's offices and sit where they put their. their. a space suit song. I got to look through all that and handle it. It's amazing. But I was told that when you leave from here, you'll never be the same. He said that every time that thing went up, when it came back down, something came with them. And it was still there. What came with them, whatever the spirit is, a phenomenon, something intelligent is there. So like, almost like a hitchhiker tag along the fact or something, they would go up and then they'd come back down, but be hitched with some sort of spiritual thing. He told me that and that's why they don't let everybody in there. And so is your take? Because there's to me, there's something weird about moon landing. I think it's necessarily fake. Like, you know, not like full hoax or something, but there's something that feels very managed about our perception on it. What do you think actually happened? That's a big one because I've learned some things since about that. I've seen some photos of the man. And some things I can't dare say. But what I saw makes me wonder, is it, is it real? Is it an illusion? Was it put there? Timon's anyway, that it was, it wasn't there by accident, that it was set there. That's all he would say. They're very sly with the words, but I think that's the case. It's title locked. So you never see the dark side. It's 1/400 the size of the sun, but 400 times closer to the earth from the sun in this sort of yet perfect way. And the conventional story of how it was made makes no sense to me. The idea that there was some sort of proto-earth and this Mars-like object hit earth or whatever, this massive object hit her. Part of the earth's mantle came out and formed this perfect cylindrical. Prima facet, you don't need to be an expert in this stuff to know that that's probably not the case, right? And then parts of it seem hollow, there seem to be caverns in it. They put size monitors on the moon if you believe the face value story of Apollo 11, even conventional, like nobody can argue with this. They put size monitors on the moon and it rained like a bell. And then I think Gordon McDonald, who's Eisenhower's space advisor, said the moon would only make sense if it were hollow or something like that. It's just a strange, it's a strange object. It is. It is. Strange, and it affects our thoughts. You think it affects our thoughts? Absolutely. Well, you have this sort of, you know, check it out. You hide lunacy, right? We had a lunacy. Lunatic. That's where it came from. That's right. If you go to the Sheriff's Department, the jails fill up on the moon. It's fair enough. Yeah. And Mammy, you do have, you know, obviously women's cycles affected by the moon. The idea that it doesn't affect, I don't want to go full astrology necessarily, but you know, the idea that it doesn't affect, you know, ecological processes or biological processes is that's wrong. So then what is the extent of that effect? I don't know, but something I sort of tends to make me think that it's an illusion or it's something, I just can't say without getting, what do you think it is? Something about our soul. What about the backside of it? What do you think? Do you think there are some aliens there or beings there? I think there's something illuminated back there. What do you think is illuminated back there? I don't know. Is it like the John Lear like soul catcher? No, I don't believe in all that man. So what do you think is illuminated on the backside of the moon? I don't know, but I have to leave that. If you were to give a high-level riddle or hint. I don't know, I just think that the backside is nothing like the front side. If you find photos of it, if they're real, it doesn't look anything like the front side. And from what I've seen, there is something behind it hidden back there. And Tim seemed to think that it wasn't there by accident, just the moon. Exactly what he told me, was it by accident? Was it towed into place? That was one of the things. That was one of the conversations I heard. Wow. Do you think, do you get the vibe that he has some metaphysical worldview that is more concrete? The average person you talked to about metaphysics. And if they speak in a self-assured way, they're probably full of shit. And they're either full of shit or they're really epistemically humble. And they're like, I don't know. I take these things metaphorically. So it's like one or the other. And then occasionally, occasionally, especially if you're a seeker, you meet somebody and it's like you have kind of a more concrete understanding of what's going on there. Do you feel like he's one of those 100% that way? Do you feel like that? Yeah. And you don't think he was sort of conning you in any way or not? Well, I thought that some of the things he said flew into face of what I believe then. But now, years later, I thought it's changed on this thing. And so some of the things he was telling me makes more sense today. Do you think there's a Native American connection? A lot of people, you know, I've interviewed Mario Woods on my show who, you know, is a Native American descent. And people say that, you know, if you, yeah, that ancestry, you might be able to get in touch with this stuff a little more easily. Other people say that about R-H, negative blood. Do you think either of those things are true? I think there's a possibility with the blood. I'm not sure about that, but I do know that I was a book showed up to my house that was sent from some folks in the government CIA and said, read this. And it was the miss. And I can't remember the whole title, but it was the ancient missing lore of the Cherokee. And it was written by James Mooney in 1891. That's when it was published in 1891 by James Mooney. And the book talks about the Cherokee little people. It talks about the thunder boys. It talks about a missing time. It talks about all sorts of stuff in this book. And when they gave me that, they were particularly interested if I had a Native American blood in my DNA. And so I went and had all that done through ancestry and 23 of me come to find out. I'm 99% Irish British, Scottish, you know, so no Native American there. Have you ever seen a UFO in a hangar? No, you just seen it in space or on the ground. Do you think that the kind of security establishment in the US has UFOs in its possession, their reverse engineering now? Well, they're big liars if they don't because they've been saying it for years. They're heavily beating that drum right now. They are big liars. Same story for 50, 70 years now. We have this. We saw that. My friends saw it. I saw a letter. Here's another letter. I saw it. I saw it. I saw it. That's all you hear. But you never see. Yeah, that's what's history. Never. Yeah, it's very, I'm sharing it. You know, I'll tell you those orbs there and then we go out and we see, but I'm not liable in it. And do you feel like, because I think on Tron Ryan's show, Diana Pasolka spoke about your experience almost as if you had been like messed with or something. Do you feel like you've been messed with or manipulated in any way or no? I think the phenomenon has a way of doing things to trick you. You know, you hear Jock's full day right about the trickster. Well, that's not a bad thing. I think it's like the adjustment Vera. Same thing. If Jesse, if you want to go this direction, it might trick you to make you go in the opposite direction. So it's kind of controlling your path. So that would be, yeah. I don't do with that. But you don't feel like the Intel world has tried to shade your perception of things in any way. I think they have. Okay. Yeah, they have from the beginning. They tried to make me believe in flying saucers and little green man. Really? Yeah. And I kept telling them, no, I wouldn't like that. It wasn't like that. But that, so who, who was trying to kind of implant those ideas? Hundreds of people within the government. I've met hundreds. Really? And they all go back to that. You know, I got labeled a religious fanatic because I said it was spiritual. I've been saying it was spiritual for 19 years. And so they were really adamant about, hey, like, let's spin this towards this, you know, kind of alien extraterrestrial thing. Yeah, constantly alien, alien, alien, what you're seeing is negative bad. Really? Yeah. That's pretty crazy. Yeah. That's not cool. Oh, it's not cool. How do you explain that? What's happening with you there, where you have these spooky people coming to your life, telling you that what you saw as alien when you know it wasn't. And then you have somebody like Jim Simevian, who's very high up at the CIA, seems to prop. I assume knows a lot about a whole lot of national security things outside of the UFO issue. But the UFO issue, he's gone very deep on for decades. Right. And he's been kind of an honest actor and telling you, you know, experience what you experienced. Do you think he was, you know, honest with you? Yeah, Jim. Yeah. Yeah. You know, I have a deep care for Jim and he does my family as well. And we've shared a lot of stuff. I know about his story and Debbie's his wife. And so you think their factions like how do you make sense of the fact that you have one half of Intel world spinning, you're attempting to spin your story and like kind of manipulate you and then you have another half that just seems kind of like good-hearted. Well, it's kind of, it's kind of like this. There's a group of lower level guys that have a mission to do, disaffirmation, push a certain narrative. But, you know, the people I'm meeting are heads of their departments, not necessarily this low level guy I'm talking to head of the director of operations like Jim was at the CIA. He was James Bond. So he was a director of operation. Yeah. Well, Jim was. Yeah. What is that like, winking of the, he ran the whole northern hemisphere? Well, everybody answered to him. Yeah. That's very powerful. And his friends, I've met a lot up from the deputy director and when you talk to these guys in private, they pick your brain and you start learning more that they're learning. They want to know. That's what I've come to the conclusion. You know, everybody's like, oh, it's a sigh-up and they're trying to manipulate, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah. And I've not been probably in as many of these rooms as you have, but I've been in some of them. I'm sure. And they're like, we're fans and they're like trying to piece stuff together through. I used to be so afraid. I would do certain interviews. I'd break certain stories and I'd be like, oh, I got too close to the truth. They're going to, they're going to come after me. And then now I'm like, oh, they're probably learning alongside me and like using, you know, the stuff I'm learning and through open source research, like for their own chat or whatever. Well, for the most part, they're truly your people like us and they want to know, but there's a program of guys that's involved in the UFO world, keeping that going. But do you think, is there some, because you met, you opened the book telling me about John Alexander. John Alexander also seems to show when people experience paranormal things like the Hutchinson effect, you know, John Hutchinson, California, sort of, you know, metallic equipment seems to hover in like, you know, malfunction around, seems to have like all these electromagnetic anomalies emitting from his body. You, you know, other cases, John Alexander will kind of consistently show up. I think he's briefed on, like I think you knew about Rendlesham before anybody else. Yeah, he did 100%. John is, what's his deal? John has been, let's just say he's probably the number one researcher and the paranormal world for the US government has been for many, many years. Yeah. His wife is work, study and religion as a part of this and he's been to 92 countries doing research and to everything from churches, to ceremonies and in Mongolia, the reindeer herders, you know, the reindeer month, they've rode horses a hundred miles and do you think he has a pure agenda or do you think that he has an agenda to find the truth? But he does often he'll see these things and then he'll kind of semi-debunk them. And I don't think he did in your case, but I think in other, like, you know, the Hutchinson thing, he'll show up and he'll be like, well, it kind of works it sometimes, but it's, you know, like if you read his writing, it's often like, it's not as magical as you think, sort of like he kind of like, you know, but John's more in line of, he don't look at the physical thing as being the truth of it or the alien thing as being the truth of it. He doesn't see it that way. He's more about, it's more, that's too easy. It's far more complex than that. This thing does, for example, in the 1800s, 1700s, go back and read all the reports on UFOs. People were seeing, I read a story of a, a sailing ship with glowing sails flying over London and an anchor comes out and snags a chimney and breaks the top off of a chimney. Yeah. A boat, a flying boat, right? So here's these flying ships, sky ships they called them for many, many years. In fact, the first report that I've heard of in America was Aurora, Texas. It was a sky ship that crashed into the wind, all right? 1897. And they buried an alien there. You know where they buried them? Where? And my family right beside my family cemetery. Really? Yeah. That's weird. Yeah. That is really tricky. It's a Masonic cemetery. What? So do you have other trippy things like that in your family history? Quite a bit of stuff. Tim was the one that started that research with me way back. So Tim is sort of an air in some ways to John Alexander where he's also doing a lot of this sort of animal research. But what's so interesting is he has a functional job at NASA. Yeah. Yeah. Well, that's part of his job. Wow. Do you think that space like our space travel program is somehow related to studying these paranormal things? Yeah. How do you know what you heard him talk about it when you were speaking about creating investment in a rocket company? It's up to them, right? I don't know. You know, I know the history of rocketry, you know, and I know Jack Parsons thought he was in touch with, you know, other beings and literally saw like what you could describe as a Nordic alien woman, you know, while he was testing rockets, you know, in California on the Mojave Desert. I know that Tielofsky, the Russian equivalent thought he was in touch with angelic beings, Hermann Oborth, you know, the father, the German rocket, rocket program, all of them thought that thought they were angels. Yeah. So but then I also know Elon Musk, you know, kind of dismisses the whole alien thing. Well, how father might have told me and before I tell you that, we'll get back to the flying ships, right? In 1947, Kenneth Arnold sees these little chevrons flying about and they were kind of moving freely and you know, half a dozen of them. The reporter says, well, how did they move Kenneth? And he said, well, if you took a saucer out of the cupboard and you threw it and it skipped on the water, he said, that's the way they look, where the reporter said, ah, Kenneth Arnold sees flying saucers, right? So it goes out on the news, AP wire, now billion plus people has it implanted in their brain. And for the next 50 years, what did they say? Saucers. Plan saucers. Where'd they go? Where are they? Right. Then comes a triangle into 80s or 90s. All of a sudden, everybody's seeing triangles. Yes. Then I come along in 2007, these big balls of fire come, midfines like, well, where are they? I said, I don't know, they wouldn't fly on saucers. They were, they were light. They were like orbs. And so that kind of hung it. And from 2000 to the last 19 years, it's been orbs. So our perception of something celestial and in some, almost like other world played to play tonic realm that we can't understand or comprehend is being sort of shaded by basically media, by like our, the memes that we have in our head. That's fascinating. And to anybody, is this such a cool conversation to have with you? Because I think some people throw around the term like siop, like with you and stuff. And I'm like, the fact that you're saying all this stuff is like so opposite the opposite of like somebody who's dogmatically like, you know, proposing the kind of extraterrestrial hypothesis. It's like, well, you're basically saying like we're in some limited, you know, epistemological realm or whatever. And we're seeing something that's unexplained. And that's a humble claim. I don't think that's it. I'm not here to label it because that would be if I told you I knew, yeah, all I can tell you is 19 years of patterns. I can tell you that I get a lot of people to call me that want to tell me their story. I've covered my book and powers these people and I get this little lady calls me one night. It's just for an example. She's like, um, she said, I saw this ball of light go by my kitchen window. Ken, um, and I hear she said that she said she's 80 some. She said, I hear till you're the person that would know about these things. I said, well, yeah, um, I try to help you, you know, so tell me what happened. She said, I was washing dishes and it came up to the window and it scared me in it one way. I said, well, what was going on with you right then? She said, I was washing dishes. I said, no, what was your life like? And as soon as she said it, I knew it's the same story for 19 years over and over and over and over. A thousand times is my husband died the week before. And it's always the same. People start seeing this stuff. I had a near death. My daughter died, my mom died, my son died or something. Hmm, horrible. Hmm. I think it's always that way. It's almost like, um, I think about it them showing up at nuclear sites, which they seem to show up at. And if there was some Archimedes lever point, point of most leverage to shift timelines on like a global scale, it would be there. And then in somebody's life, maybe you'd show up at peak highs and peak lows and sort of the, you know, peaks in the valleys or something. Right. And I wonder if that's the case. I wonder. Well, is that anecdotal ear case? I mean, do you think people even in like kind of peak states also see them? Because that's been my anecdotal understanding there. Yeah, I think it's possible. Right. But I do know that the majority of the people witnessing this now is different because it's coming. It's revealing itself. And there's no stopping that. It's going to reveal itself completely. And what it's doing is cracking people's consciousness just a little bit makes you think, you know, it may not convert that person, but it, they're like, oh my god, there is something out there. So it's expanding our consciousness. Do you think other people think that you're the Messiah? I've been asked to. Yeah, but I don't see it. I'm just a poor guy that had this had a hard time. Yeah. And it's not been easy. It's been a burden more than anything. And I'm just a messenger. I know that I can share this with people. And after I do, then it's yours. You can connect with it from then. So it's not like something that I have. It's something that everybody has the right to. Do you feel like you have an understanding of metaphysics that's deeper than the average person? Is there some sort of thing that you can relay about how the world works? No, I'm still trying to pick up that. And I'm not in a shell. I know that we're not in control. That our thoughts are completely understood by something above us that knows everything about you. It knows your heart. It knows your intentions. And it will guide you or it will tear you down if you're going the wrong way. That's the trickster part of it. But is that bad? It's intended for you to marry this person, not that one. It might do what it takes to get you to meet this person. So fascinating. Yeah. And it's your job to be receptive and to ride the way or listen to the synchronicities. Yeah, that's what I do. I listen to the synchronicities, but my job is to share a truth that everyone's been told is not real. And I caught so much problem from the community in 2007 when this happened. Half my family, two thirds of my family, I quit speaking to my own cousins and family. And it was because they wouldn't believe me or I was being accused of messing with the devil, right? And so they actively got hard on me and tried to remove my children from me. That was early on right after it happened. And so I kind of took offense to everyone. And I made a vow then I'm going to prove them all wrong. I'm going to prove the world wrong. That's what I said. Made that and I've worked on it pretty hard for 19 years of revealing something that nobody says is real. And what that is, I can't tell you with a hundred percent certainty, but I can tell you in 19 years of patterns and never knew harm to me or anyone else that is experienced this. And I've shared it with thousands of people. Do you think the idea of disclosure is kind of a misnomer? It's the idea that the government can disclose some sort of like metaphysical truth that they have this asymmetric understanding of. Yeah, I think we're in post disclosure. Disclosure is not an announcement. They're never going to give you the secrets, you know, if they have a machine, you're not going to see it. And I wouldn't want them to because somebody else could get a hold of it and it could be terrible, right? So it's national security. They're never going to give you that. So they're just going to give a talk all the time we have, we've seen, we have disclosure. There's a one person at the time awakening. Suddenly you see it's real. You saw an orb, oh my god, what was it? I don't know what it was, but it wasn't an airplane and it stopped and it came up to me and it flashed me and it went away. Well, that absolutely changes everybody's world paradigm. It just completely changes it and sets you on a different course than so awakening or disclosure is for those, there's a lot of people that's already diagnosed. So I don't think the government's going to ever announce anything. They're just going to keep telling you we have this and we'll solve that and make people get curious and start investigating. What do you think people's relationship should be to your story because on the one hand, you were sure of Crohn's disease and I know you've had some other physical challenges since then, but that's a really major thing that you were alleviated by and presumably linked to this amazing event in January of 2007. Do you think people can experience spontaneous healings and should they go for that or should they go for the incremental more deliberate thing? It feels like catching lightning in a bottle. How can that happen in a repeatable way unless Jesus is real or something and can heal us? Well, I said earlier, maybe we have our own power to heal ourselves. We just don't know it. Do you feel like you healed yourself in that instance? I think they healed me and I think they can. They can heal you. I've seen it too many times. I've seen it happen in Australia over the phone, long distance. It's it and magic happens at that point. I don't claim that as me doing it. I'm just a mediator guy. I just present our picture to the head. It's all thought and intention. Our thoughts are very powerful and our intentions. I know they are. Yeah, they really are. Everything was once a thought and I think thoughts have a much greater effect on reality than just thought converts to action which produces this mechanical sort of pinball machine which ends up doing a thing. There's clearly something else going on that I think will be proven out by science. I think you're right there. Yeah. Do you think that there's a space program involving consciousness that's deeper than because you think about there's this 17th century Swedish mystic Emanuel Swedenborg and he described going up into the cosmos and seeing all these stars and planets and you've had out of body experiences and you've been to the Monroe Institute. If I was forming some sleeper cell space program that might be able to traverse farther than just NASA nuts and bolts craft. If you believe remote viewing is a real modality, you have to believe some sort of astral space travel is also real. It is real. So do you think there's some sort of vital program in the government that involves consciousness-based space travel? I think they've attempted that and still are trying to. They have to have. Yeah. And you even watch Carl Sagan's And it's like, that's kind of what you're touching on. - Yeah, exactly. - You know, or you, you know, Christopher Nolan, who you read, you watch Interstellar and then you read The Physics of Interstellar by Kip Thorn. And it's like, if anybody was kind of dripped some interesting info, it probably would have been, you know, Nolan. - Right. - And it's just so fast. It's like this fifth dimensional space that, you know, where you can travel kind of, maybe between timelines and then when you die, you're able to, you know, traverse that. And it's sort of hard to talk about a lot of these things, but that's a big one. You know, I believe when we die, that based on the photo evidence I have, you may have some of that that I shared with Anna. - Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah. Yeah, in fact, it's going to come out on our pod where she shows some really interesting photos. - Well, you see photos with people in them who are children or animals. Where'd I get that? How'd I get those? And this was right after the lady came. And at that time, I didn't have a video camera. I had a cell phone with the flip phone, right? But I went out and bought a little pocket camera, a little systematic. And I started taking just every night. I wasn't able to get anything before, but from that point forward, I did. And it's like my dog died. I wrote about this in the book. I was with Tim. It kept Canaveral for a week. And some guys from the NRO and we were meeting and had a launch and had been there all week. And it was Saturday. The launch finally went off Saturday, delayed all week. My wife knew I was coming home at Sunday morning or Sunday night. I was gonna leave after the launch Saturday night, get up Sunday morning to drive home. So at four o'clock, it was over. I said, "Tim, I'm going to Fayetteville." So I got my car and I took off. Didn't tell anybody to drive all night long. All night, pulled over to rest there is 13 hours, right? From my house there and pulled over and took a nap. 830 Sunday morning, I drove in the yard. When I drove in the yard, I knew immediately that my labidore was dead. And I knew it, I knew it, I can't tell you how I knew it, but I knew it. Just came right into my man, I saw it all. I felt it. My kids and family had buried her in the backyard three days before, never told me, 'cause they didn't want me upset, right? It was like my child, this 90 pound labidore, a female named Nelly. I opened the front door and walked in. My wife's to sleep at the front door on the living room, on the couch, the house full of kids. They'd been up all weekend. They had invited all their friends. And mom kind of was staying near the front where all the bedrooms were, our little girl. She was the only girl right, some mom was doing. She's doing her patrol. Keeping any boys away from her, that's what mom's to do. So I walked in the door and I opened it. She looked up at me. I said, "What happened to my dog?" And her eyes got big. And she said, "Oh my God, how did you know?" I said, "Well, I felt her." She said, "Well, she ran out in the road "and got run over by a car." And we buried her in the backyard. So I took, and I thought about it all day. And that night, I thought she don't know she's dead. That's how I knew it was when I turned off the road, right where she was killed. It just kind of felt her, saw her in my thoughts. So I took a little white candle. I went out to her grave and I lit it. And I told her, I said, "I'll be with you again. "Just go to the light." And she comes up out of her grave and a little ball of light and I took that picture. And that's how I got there. Wow, that's amazing. And you should have a copy of it. I would love to see that. Yeah, we could put that up for that. So what does that tell you, you know? What does that tell you? And I've got people, lots of people and children. In fact, I have a child, my wife and I lost a child. Well, four, but we lost a child. And I was out thinking about him. And this lonely orb, there it comes. And I took a picture of it and there was a child. Yeah, in the orb. In the orb, and this is my screen shot. Wow, I'll show you. Oh, my God, that's a real photo. That's a photo of a child and it was a ball of blood. That's a real photo. Yeah, that is amazing. So what does that tell you? I believe that when I think that we're in a simulation or we're in this avatar that we experience time because of our body, but beyond the body, there is no time. And I think when we die, that we go back to that eternal place, which is in church, they tell you somewhere way, far away, but I think it's just around us. Yeah. Well, there's time is created by the mind and the body. And time is the most used now in the English language, but nobody knows how to define it without respect to the movement of bodies or things. It's always something defined relative to something else. So if you're doing that over and over again, then it has to be this soup that you're swimming in where you can't get out of it. Exactly. You're like in water and you don't, you know, it's like this David Foster Wallace beach where he goes, this is water. You know, it's like you're a fish in water. You have no idea what you're in. We're in the stream of time. There's no way out of it. There's no way to talk about it. And really, you know, there's no words for it. There's no words for it. That photo is amazing. Can we show this to like a NASA photo instrumentation person? Yeah, I don't care. A lot of them have already seen it. OK, I'll tell you, I was just to tell you how it is with NASA. I was in a Capitol Hill club when the hearing, the recent hearing happened, right? And in fact, it was Anna Brady and a bunch of those friends of hers and without using names. And we were having, or derives with their Burleson and Anna Luna, right? And afterwards, we went out and did a sky watch on the library congress, right? We were up on the platform. And suddenly a sword appears for 45 minutes. It did figure eights over the Capitol and the White House. So in Burleson saw it. No, Burleson weren't there. He had gone home, but Anna was there and a whole group of other people, Eric Zaidak from PG&E Power. Donna Roberts from the International Space Station. She was standing next to me, others, I can't say their name. But they've come out publicly, this group. Excuse me, Tracy McGill. She's an analyst for the DOD, I think. Well, fascinating. So they all got to experience it. While we were having dinner, he was talking about NASA people. The sky walks up and he gets me a big hug. He said, Chris, I'm a huge fan. And he introduced me to his son. We'd never met, right? But he was one of the highest ranking guys at NASA. He walks up my hugs me and says, I'm a huge fan of yours. NASA is why is NASA publicly? It's their policy. The people there are just like me and you. It's so funny because it's like you see them publicly and it's like they're doing this thing on three-eye atlas and it's like the photo is the resolution of, it's like you're looking at a lamp post, it's like a street light or something. It's horrible and the amateur astronomers are getting better stuff and then privately they're going to use saying we're big fans. So interesting. And that crazy. It is crazy. That's a little frustrating. It's like, can you split the gap a little bit between your public and your private perception? One thing how to make a pub in my room. We loved him. Children loved how because he became my dad died in 2013 and how came in 2008 and just showed up at your door right? Yeah, not on the door. And so he'd come three or four times a year and stay a week at the time. And his biggest thing was my children. They would bring school friends over and he'd have a big, you know, he loved kids. So he'd pull up, mass it on teeth and tech tights and it was just a big party of science and he loved that but how told me he died in 2019, he died in 2019. He was coming to our house with Thanksgiving, he and Katie and he fell and hit his head and went and called him and never woke up, right? But he told me right before he died, he said, Chris, I want to tell you one thing. He said, I've wondered for many years, he said what this phenomenon is, oh, I know all about it. He said it. You know, I've seen it all. He said, "But we've always been on the fence of what it is we're dealing with." But he said, "When I know now, to me is," he believed it was angelic. There were always on the fence of what it is, but he observed it with me a lot and saw its nature and how it would react to certain words and certain prayer. And was he religious? Well, he wasn't religious at all, but he was toward the end of his life. He became very open in prayer and said, "That'll make you religious." Tim Taylor had a conversion right at the Vatican, where he converted to Catholicism. Exactly. It's fascinating. So that's where this thing takes you down that path if you interact with it will. There's an apocryphal quote that's often attributed to the word of Heisenberg, and he's this amazing physicist, but it was also in charge of the German nuclear program under the Nazis. But also, a much deeper philosophical guy, and he regretted his role in that stuff. And he says, "The first sip of the bottle of science makes you an atheist, but when you get to the bottom, you find God at the bottom." Right. Was it the end? Yeah. That's what it sounds like. Exactly what it was. Yeah. That photo, you showed me, with the child in the orb, that looks exactly like in 2001 space Odyssey, at the end of the movie, where Bowman, he's, you know, going up on the ship and then he ends up, I don't know what happens, but there's just, it's this weird, bizarre, little scene, and you see the monolith, and then all of a sudden it cuts to this baby hovering over the earth in this like orb capsule thing. And I watched, I remember watching that. It's one of those things where I'm like, "I am too unenlightened and dumb to know what this means, but I know it means something." And that's what a lot of the UFO topic is. It's like the sound of the one hand clapping, the Zencone, you're like, and it just makes you want to go further. And you're like, you see something, you're like, you don't quite know what it means, but you're like, "That, there's something about that." They're saying this, it's as, and if anybody knew kind of, you know, some deeper truths about reality, like I do think Arthur C. Clarke, Stanley Kubrick, guys like that, what happened into something deeper. And so that photo tripped me out, because I'm like, what did they know, and what, you know, is that photo, you know, somehow lining up with what they knew? I think they probably knew a lot more than they had to. And the government knows a lot more, but this, everybody that's anybody in the ranks wants to see this stuff, they want to know about it. Yeah, I believe it, who wouldn't. Does this stuff you know about the dark side of the moon point towards sort of a simulated world? Yeah. It does. Well, then you get into these things around like, why can't we have disclosure? You can't say that official. If you're in some like official government position, you can't, you cannot sit. I would, I want as much disclosure as humanly possible, but like, if you're Trump, it might be tough. That might be a tough one. You go up there on the podium, you go, we're in a simulated universe. All right. You're, you're, everything is, you're in a karmic whirlpool where you get stuck. You experience the same thing over and over again, but with a different veneer. Time is actually an illusion and that veneer is just the changing of memes that are implanted in your head by some alien thing. Like if you start to go deeper into that, where's that lead? Where's that lead? That leads to a very, you know, and I, I think we might be headed there anyways. I don't think we need authority figures necessarily to say these things. I think we're going to, I think what's going to happen is that basically the way I see this is consciousness is just one big unipod field, right, is all one and everything that exists is in that one from the ghosts to the aliens or to the angels and to us. And I think we're in the process of rolling humanities, rolling into that next dimension. In other words, it'll be a world of where we all in it where we see it more and it's part of our reality is shifting and when it's so fascinating. It's so interesting. It's so fun to talk to you because I think a lot of people have said, oh, like it's like you're too open-minded or something is the, you know, the critique or something. And I have a lot of critiques here all to me, so I don't take that personally. But I think so. I think if you believe in the Paris psychology stuff, which I do, that there's some sort of mind-matter connection. Absolutely. And I think there's a correlation between openness and your effect on the material world or what you perceive as well. And so I think inherently there will be at times errors made due to that openness because you're sifting in this area that is so uncharted. Exactly. But you're also going to come upon really core, deep truths and I don't know if you can have one without the other. And so, you know what I mean? Yeah, 100%. I'm sure I've explored all sorts of crazy stuff, but in reality, I think my worldview is actually sometimes crazier than I can even communicate via the show. And it's really about catching people up epistemically and taking people through this rigorous, well, let's start with the foundation. That photo is real. It's been verified. You need to do that because we're in this materialist reductionist scientific paradigm. And you'll make a lot of errors along the way. It's this really hard thing because you make one error and you get these debunker skeptic types and they'll just hang on that one error for the whole, and they're seeing what they want to see. Well, the thing people give these debunkers and skeptics too much power. Yeah. Oh boy. I don't even pay attention to me. They're just unimportant. Well, I think the thing that deflates them too is like, I'll admit, like I've gotten a whole ton of stuff wrong, like, and I hope I hope you would admit that. Yeah. I have. I'll change. You know, we learned. Yeah. Yeah. And as long as you can adapt with new information that comes in, you know, then this is all it's it's really new territory. So there's no book. There's no, there's no vocabulary for this. None. It's all invisible and we have to create a vocabulary for it. We've got to put a story to it, right? As humans do that. So you're constantly adjusting that as you go and pulling all the information together and down the road, you think, well, what you thought before is not correct, you know? So it could be different. So I'll leave an open mind to it. I try not to label it, but I will go as far as to say that it's been benevolent and I've seen healings from it and I know how it answers when I say certain words. It gets excited. Which words? The lady. Really? So you got to say the lady. The lady. Interesting. Yep. When you start talking about her and I can do this, I could take a group of people outside at night. I've done it over and over and I would take a mic if we got a big enough group. It's pretty, it's gotten pretty simple because I shouldn't say it's simple, it's complex, but still it's happened so much that it's pretty crazy. Do you think there are pockets, air pockets of consensus reality? And what I mean by that is like, do you think, you know the Mandela effect? So this idea that, you know, a lot of people in the 90s thought that Mandela died in prison, which he obviously didn't, you know, do you think that reality might work more like that than we think? And so certain mystical experiences happen and the people with eyes to see and ears to hear experience it and then other people walk away and they're like, yeah, there's a thing that happened or whatever. Or they like, we'll superimpose some prosaic explanation upon the thing. And reality itself is far more fractured, malleable and in the eye of the beholder than what it is. Yeah. And it's changing, it's constantly changing, like the Mandela effect, you talked about one thing that surprised me is my wife and I've been married 43 years, right? So our honeymoon was in New York City, we'd never been there either one of us. We had a plan, we wanted to see the train station, Grand Central Station, right? So we go to Grand Central Station and we get photos and videos and we took a helicopter ride and we did all kinds of things to experience New York. And so I'm looking at old photos of Grand Central Station, right? We'll Google it now. It's not called that. It's called Grand Central Terminal and it says it's never been called that. But yet I got photos of Grand Central Station written on the table. But you see it now. It says Grand Central Terminal. What's that about? Well, they, you know, the, the, the Flintstones, the Baranstines, Baranstine Bears, all these things where people swear that, you know, it was like a one way. And then you, you look at the record. There's another way. Yeah. And, you know, that, it is this faint, really amazing phenomena. And then you get into deeper studies like there's this neuroscientist, Wilder Penfield. And you realize that you, there is no way of distinguishing between false memories and true memories. And it shows this in, with the ability to implant false memories into mice and stuff. And then you get, if there, if there are these beings and, any thoughts can be sort of implanted, you get into really weird ontological territory where the past, and even Schrodinger himself would say a particle is measured in the present, you know, it might change its past. Right. And you get into retro causality in quantum mechanics. There's obviously spooky action at a distance, but there's also spooky action across time. Right. It seems like if you have two entangled photons and two double slit experiments run with those, you know, entangled photons, seems like photon B that you're doing the experiment with two days in the future. If you measure that and you don't measure the first one, the measurement of the one in the future is affecting the one of the measurement in the past. Exactly. There's a great book called biocentrism that the sky Robert Lian's are right about this stuff. So you get into really trippy territory where the past becomes, the present is this constricted present, but it's like an hour glass where you have probable futures and probable pasts. Right. And the present is this measurement sensor that is single line of code updating the past and maybe updating the future at the same time. Right. And it's this very strange sort of model, but you you there's no real way to argue against that other than physical artifacts. So if you have physical artifacts around an event happening, you can argue say this is evidence that this happened this way or this happened another way. If you have conflicting physical artifacts where you don't have physical artifacts, it's it's totally one word against the other word or you get into like numbers of people who believe one thing or numbers of people that believe another thing, but we have no idea how reality works. We have no idea. We have we have a very limited we are measurement sensors. And so this idea that science is some ontological statement of truth like no, we're it's the map. It's not the territory. Exactly. It's just you know, we see like very limited scopes of reality and time is the weirdest thing of all. Yeah. That that as mess with me every since I went there and saw that now everything I dig up it says it was never called that. Yeah. Grand Central. Yeah. But the sun was on the was central station. I was like, Oh, of course, Grand Central station. Yeah. We're going to move a little bit now though. It's not there. Grand Central terminal doesn't even sound as good. Yeah. It's always been named that according to this. Yeah. So I don't know what that means, but it was really it really opened my eyes to how weird this world we live in really is. How do you juggle? You know, a lot of these concepts might seem crazy to the average person. How do you juggle just facing, you know, relationships, issues, things in your own life versus these kind of deeper celestial metaphysical truths. Those two things seem kind of hard to hard to juggle. I was talking to a friend yesterday and he has all these teachers, you know, kind of in the Eastern tradition. He's kind of his own mystic in a sense. And I think I can say this actually. His name is Duncan Trustle and he's, you know, I actually just met him. He's an amazing comedian, but I felt a kinship with him. And he talked, he said his teachers all said that and these are like Eastern, you know, kind of Buddhists say that, you know, they know that the celestial realm exists, but they ignore it because what we need to do is here on earth, we have these because this kind of karmic path laid out in front of you. So I'm sure a lot of people have this sort of escapeous orientation towards this subject where they say, Oh, I will take me up on the craft. You know, so how do you reconcile those two things? I don't. I mean, it's like, it's just, it's mind-ending the whole thing. I'm still grappling with that, you know, to this very day. And I focus on, right now my main focus is on the Rosetta Stone. Really? Why is your focus on the Rosetta Stone? Because I believe that I can find, I think I can get there. I think I know it's talking. I know it is. I know it's talking multiple ways, not just telepathically, because that's hard to prove or explain, but I'm sure it's talking through frequency through the light, pulses of light, with the right sensors and even some sort of morse code or something. Multiple ways is trying to communicate. I've seen it. I know it, and I think one day we'll get there. Do you think the Rosetta Stone is trying to communicate with you? I think that phenomenon is trying to talk to us and to find that Rosetta Stone, that, you know, that's the language. I want to find the language of this. Of the things. Yeah, and it's just putting it out right now. It's talking. We just got to study it, and I'm working on a way to do that. Do you think their language is discoveries? Like the discoveries we make? What do you think the languages, do you think it's the literal symbols and hieroglyphics? Because people say on the crafts that, you know, they see these sort of hieroglyphics. Yeah. I've heard biblical texts in all of them too. And you think we'll be able to decode this? I think we can get actual real time communication through the light and through sensors if we can gather enough data. How would we do this? Put it in a quantum AI computer, and there's two of them that I could probably get access to. So you're working on this? I'm working on it. Have you decoded anything yet? Not. Well, we're working on it. Sounds like you have decoded a little face. Some, some, yeah. Anything you can give us. Enough to get me going full time. I'm saying anything you can give us as far as hints as to what you've decoded. Well, I just did. I know it's there. And I think we'll get there in the next four, five years, maybe. Maybe longer. Do you think there's something special about the pyramids that will learn soon or something? Because you, I mean, one of your experiences was around the pyramids, obviously, how did that work? Well, I'm hearing that next year that something might be revealed from there. What will it be? Well, with that getting ahead of what I was told this week, I've been invited to go down there and being involved in something that is going to release something that was hidden. Interesting. And what? Something under the pyramids? Possibly. Like a little energy grid thing. I don't know. They didn't tell me that. Okay. They just invited me to be a part in the Egyptian antiquities, authorities are part of it. Fascinating. Well, I just interviewed the guy that did the synthetic aperture radar, Doppler tomography scans of the structure under the copper chamber of the Giza pyramid. I can't say that's what it is. I can just say I got a call from the right people that wants me to be a part next year. Well, that's exciting. Yeah. Very interesting. I think something's coming from there that's going to be real interesting. Wow. Like changing. Oh, changing. Wow. Yeah. Danny Jones is funny. Danny Jones, I think, came into the your interview with him, maybe a little skeptical, but then he said he saw a warp with you outside of a diner or something. Well, he called me. He's like, I want you on the show. I'm like, Danny, I'd love to be on your show, but you got to do something for me. I want to come a day or two early and I want to make you a believer, not a skeptic, because our interview will go differently if you're a believer. And he said, okay, okay. So we flew down to my daughter and I and my wife. And we had dinner there in clear water when I went to Indian Rocks Beach out on the beach. And he had his assistant with him at a camera. I said, well, let's watch out of the ocean because I can get it out. It appears up out of the ocean when I ask it. It's just like out of the sky. It comes up out of the sea. And suddenly here it came two of them. Wow. And he filmed it. We all filmed it. See, freaking out. Yeah. Wow. Yeah. We did that last week in California with some pretty amazing people. Wow. He also, Danny said he, I think he cut a small part of your interview where you talked about a neuralizer, like some like machine that erased your memory after seeing something. Yeah. I had to not talk about it. You're not supposed to talk about it. But there is something like that that you experienced. I saw the patterns on it. Really? Yeah. So I mean, that's freaky if the government has something that could do that. - Yeah, the society can transmit chemicals through radio waves. - Do you think they can transmit thoughts through radio waves? - Yeah. It's kind of creepy. Well, then I get all sorts of weird territory, like what is the whole UFO phenomena, some paranormal plague from the thought transmission? - What if you were to see this alien appeared right here and you saw it and you weren't supposed to? - What if it could shoot you with something that would erase your thoughts? - You never remember. - So you think they had the aliens can do that, or the beings can do that? You do. Why are you high conviction in that? Seems like something where inherently if they can erase. - Well, I kind of learned some stuff on that and I saw the patents on it. Well, and you think they're real patents? - Well, it was you as patent officer talking about it. - Damn. - It's kind of crazy. - But as he knew it, it was stuffed away somewhere that dangerous technology. - Hmm, so you could shoot you with a chemical drugs or anything from 100 yards. - A few people have come on my show saying things like that. I just, I never know what to make of it 'cause I'm like, it's just, I don't know. - Just trust me. - I don't want it, but I want that to happen to us from our original conversations. - Hmm, so with like Hal Papemire. - Or with Tim Taylor. - Yeah. - Okay. - Very interesting. Well, I could tell you the world is a weird place. I mean, just the fact that you went to Zinesville, Ohio, did you learn anything else about towns in Brown while you were out there? - I never knew who he was. And till I got to Zinesville with Tim and then he began to unfold who he was and how he was working with his daughter to finish a book about her father and I learned all story up as much as he would tell me about his having visitors come and land. Did Tim Taylor believe that towns in Brown made real anti-gravity breakthroughs as a scientist? - I can't tell you, he believed that or not, but he felt it strong enough that he was, yeah. - I think he, I'm speculating, sure. Have you heard other stories of experiencers being shown a piece of metal and basically evaluated to, you know, to see how they react to the metal? - Yeah, he told me that we're only, he'd only ever seen two other reactions. - Did he mention who he reacted to the metal? - He said, but it was nothing like what I saw here. - Yeah, well, you know there's a story of Warner von Braun showing Yuri Geller a piece of metal and he says, that's not from here. - Werner von Braun takes me into his personal office. There is a safe in the office. He opens a safe, I see a piece of metal. I've never seen such a color, pulls it out. It's not heavy. Says, will you touch this? Tell me what you feel now. I put my hand on it and I say, Werner, this is not from here. He says, you're right. This is a piece of a UFO that crashed on our planet. You know, I'm mind blown because as a child, I used to sneak into movie theaters in Tel Aviv to see films on extraterrestrial life and this is coming from the mouth of Werner von Braun. - Exactly. I saw some things about this metal. In fact, I had a lot of photos of it. I had to delete them classified, right? But I've seen some of it in real time on a lich on the microscope and what I saw, there were different types, and but it was moving. The one piece, I have a picture where it looks like a universe swirling around and around with all the galaxies and stuff inside. That's what the metal, the piece from Zangsville, cut that little sliver. That's what it looked like, actually moving. This other piece I saw was red, it appeared red, but it were thousands of little blocks, little square blocks and they were self-moving and stacking themselves. - They were moving in the material. - Was it like replicating or something? - What? They were moving in the material. - Yeah, this material is like living. - And this is from Zangsville or? - Well, it was a piece I saw. I assume it was from Zangsville. The piece, not the red, I don't know where that came from, but the green, I'll show you the green. - What? - Yeah, I'll show you the, I don't have the video up but I have a snapshot of it. - I wanna see that, that is wild. - Moving like a universe swirling around and around. And the, the, the elements in that metal, I was told it had 51 elements in it. And the most classified, most, we can only blend at that time. He told me about 15 elements. Humans could only figure out how to make 15 elements blend. But this had 51. One of the elements was human DNA and he's like, how'd that get in there? And plutonium, who puts plutonium in metal? - Wait, plutonium, human DNA was in this metal? - Yep, and plutonium. - Yep, what? And he's like, how did they put human DNA in metal? And then they figured out and zero gravity, how to bond ceramic to metal. And then they were able to put human DNA into the ceramic. And now your hip joints and all that, they don't fail anymore. To solve in our medical devices, nobody realizes it. - Us, NASA's. - 'Cause my understanding is most manufacturing and space initiatives haven't succeeded. Like there's a company called Made in Space and it was always this kind of academic project and it never quite got off the ground. But you could, you could in zero G, do all sorts of things that you can't on the ground. - Right. - So but you're saying there might be some secret stuff going on. - Oh, sure. - Interesting. - Absolutely, but they were able to bond ceramic to the metal and human DNA into the ceramic. - But they couldn't do it. Whoever did it, however it was done, we can't duplicate it. - Wow. - Wow. Well, Chris, this is a blast, man. I love speaking to you. And I think we could go on all day, but there's so many threads. I feel like I need to follow up on just from this conversation alone. So we'll have to run it back. And maybe I can come to Fayetteville and-- - I would love for you too. - That'd be a blast, man. I appreciate it. - You should come. Fact, maybe we'll get you to the coast, like on the beach. - Yeah, for one, a couple of three nights and we'll get a group there and blow your mind. - That sounds amazing, man. - Count me in. - Absolutely. - Thank you for coming to Austin, Texas. On such short notice and, you know, I know you travel a ton and so just coming out here for a day really means a lot to me. Well, believe it or not, in the last three weeks, I left Fayetteville, North Carolina. I went to Orange County. That was Sammy and a group of guys. And then went up to Hollywood, met Marta Robbie and some other people. Left there, went back to North Carolina, dropped my wife off, flew back to New York, met some people there, took a train down to DC, met a whole group of met Anna and some others there, then came home one day and I'm back here. So it's been just burning the road up for three or four weeks. - Wow. - So I called you last night and I was so exhausted, I'm like, I'm tired of being just so. - Yeah. - We're out of bin here last night with you guys, you know, going to dinner or sky watching or something. - Yeah, no worries. Well, this was really fun and now we'll do it again and I'll come your way next time. And that's a crazy schedule for somebody who's already gone through all the stuff you've gone through yourself. - Don't end here, it goes for the next 18 days. I'm back to New York, to Pennsylvania, to DC and in New Wilmington for the World Forum. And yeah, I want to make sure I plugged the World Forum. - Okay. - What is that? - It's, it was created by McKill Gorbachev, back in the 90s and 95 to 2000. It was a five year event that ended up in New York City when they dropped the ball. Bono was there, you too, they did the opening. But it was the leaders of the world basically all came together to talk about the Y2K 'cause they thought the world was in trouble, right? We had to have a conversation. So now for the next five years, this year until 2030, they're going to convene the World Forum again and it'll be Abby Loeb speaking, Dr. Diana Hansi Palo and there's about 30 or 40, there's 30 speakers and they'll be, we were going to have it in DC at the Omni Shores this year, but because of the travel and the flights and also we're going to make it virtual this year. And I'll be speaking on their timer too, but my big thing is. On the 14th of the 15th 16th and 17th, we're going to have a group down on the beach. It writes for about 40 of us doing a sky watch and we're going to broadcast it through the world forum. Cool. To the world. Yeah. Have to. All right. We'll go check that out. Buy UFO of God and keep checking out cool stuff that Chris does and I really appreciate you being here, man. Yeah, super happy. It's been too long, right? It's been way too long, long time coming. But you know what? Things happen in their time and I think there is the questions and the conversation we had this time around is going to be, you know, it's much better than maybe what would have been a year and a half ago or something. Absolutely. I've learned a lot since then. I've learned it. I don't know anything. Right. Same with me, man. It's deeper. I get the more I'm confused. Yeah. I said all the time. The more I learned the less I know, right? Well, that's literally true because if you think of your knowledge base as say it's like a sphere, the sphere grows and then the questions are the space around the sphere. The questions are going to grow at an exponent of the sphere growing. And so the more you know, the more you know you don't know. And so yeah, I think the most knowledgeable people I know are the most epistemically humble and they're like, I don't know, you know, because he just gets more and more confused. And it does. Like I said, there's no language for this. No. But you've got to come up with something different, you know? Yes. But it's like if you're going into kind of higher dimensional spaces or like where there's more variables and more information, you do just have to have a better sensor. Like, you know, you need to be able to audit yourself better. So as long as you can do that, I learned that a long time ago, you know, just admit you don't know. You know, don't label this thing and I try not to, because I can't tell you 100% certain anything. None of us can. Nobody can. I can tell you this magical, it's been beautiful and it's real. And I'll leave it at that and I can share it with others. And if I can't, my children can, yeah, they have it in them the same. Do you think there have been any attempts to censor you on any other media or podcasts? A lot. So like, like how so? And what's the motive? And yeah, and what's an example and what's the motive? I think that there's the narrative is it's dark and ugly and evil, evil, but alone. Yeah, but you have such a positive healing story on that spot. And then, oh, it's what they want it to be this like dark and ugly, dark and ugly. Don't mess with it. We might lose control of the people if you mess it so they don't like me sharing this. That all. Mmm. Mmm. I've been told that a thousand times. Yeah. I've been told two or three times you're, you're doing disclosure. Yeah. Don't do. We're going to do. You're getting ahead of us. Yeah. Any, any examples of censorship that you've like, like Danny, Danny Jones. Really? That video and a whole lot more. Which, what, what did Danny, oh, Danny Jones is the, the video's getting throttled. Yeah. Yeah. That was censorship. That thing was going to 100, 150,000 views. Well, was it specifically that you think got it not? That was me mentioning about some technology yet. Mission control. Okay. Okay. And I don't want to say that again. Okay. Sure, sure, sure. Yeah. Got it. That's wild in them. Yeah. And that's crazy. You backtrack, you kind of, or a backchannel, then you figured out that NASA was literally censoring. Yeah. Crazy. Oh, Google. Whoever's controlling that. Yeah. Well, they sent the word. That's what I was told. There, there has to be a connection there. What's about a technology? Yeah. I mean, a macular constellation, you know, which came out in the Shellenberger, you know, testimony, you know, this, this, this, uh, November, 2024 hearing, uh, a macular constellation had like a search spike when David Grush came out. And I think August or September of 2023. So it's like, how do you, you can't make that up, you know, and if that's the case, that's like, you know, kind of what happened with me. Interesting. Yeah. Interesting. Yeah. And then I think there's a manipulation of Google trends because that then this guy, Rob Jones, uh, who I've gotten in a little better since then and seems very high trust, high credibility. Um, he, uh, he found the spike and then the spike got deleted. Yeah. If you're, if you're telling me that Google doesn't have some sort of backdoor around special access programs being named, you know, connection with the DOD around that. You're crazy. You're, you're the conspiracy there. Come on. Yeah. And it happens to me all the time. Yeah. I would have sold twice as many books already going to you, they've cost me a lot of book sales because of, um, um, chat of banning or, um, yeah, well, I think you're, I think it's piercing through. I think, I think, you know, a lot of people, uh, love your story and are reading your book and I, you know, whatever censorship may or may not be occurring, I, I don't think it's really, you know, we're hampering you in a, in a serious way. Right. Well, we're pushing through it. Right. Yeah. They can't keep the light out. The light gets to cracks and, yeah, well, that's this whole, this whole subject. It's like, you know, you do, don't, don't take my, don't distrust everything I say or you say or anybody else, like the, the world is, I think, shifting in this sort of a hundred percent. It's a serious way in like, you know, I, I, I fundamentally believe that and I see it and I feel it. That's that new knowledge that's coming. Yes. One that now. Thank you so much, Chris. Absolutely. Thank you, brother. Absolutely. All right. Yeah. [BLANK_AUDIO]