19. Why Colorism Is Just As Serious As Racism

(upbeat music) - Hello and welcome back to the Change Maker podcast. The Change Maker is here to inform and encourage and equip you to make a difference. If you don't know me, my name's Marie, and I'm a diversity, equity, and inclusion advocate. On today's episode of The Change Maker, we are going to talk all about colorism. We're gonna go through stats, we're gonna go through what colorism is, where it's most prevalent, why it's such a problem, all that stuff. And you'll walk out of here feeling like an expert. But first, I want to remind you that this month, we are fundraising for the King Center. If you leave a rating for the Change Maker podcast on Apple or Spotify or wherever you listen, I will donate a dollar to the King Center on your behalf. And if you leave a review on Apple podcasts where you type out how you feel, I will be donating five big ones to the King Center on your behalf. And Apple podcast is known to glitch, so double check that your review or rating saves. It's a really easy, simple thing to do, but I also know it's a big ask because I listen to a lot of podcasts myself and I left approximately zero ratings ever. So I get it. But also it's for a good cause of the King Center. And if you think this podcast is worthwhile and helpful, don't you want it to reach more people? This is your time, do it. And hey, whether you review and rate or not, that's okay, we're good. I just appreciate that you spend your free time trying to figure out how to make a difference in the world. You're good with me, you're good in my book. I digress, let's get to talking about colorism. Starting with what colorism is. Colorism is discrimination against people of color with darker skin. And you might have figured that out from the word itself, but something that a lot of people don't realize is that colorism occurs across racial groups, like maybe a white person having prejudices against black people with darker skin or it could even happen within a racial group, like light skinned black people, thinking less of dark skinned black people. Colorism is really prevalent. It's not spoken about enough, but just generally in society, something that we see and I'll have stats to back this up a little later in the episode, is that people of color with light skin are viewed as more beautiful or more intelligent, more horrible. And kind of the logic behind this is that when you see a person of color with lighter skin, they're probably mixed race, not always, but probably. And just in general, they have attributes that are similar to white people. And when white people create the beauty standards and when white people make up the workplace, when white people make up the leaders, then people who remind you of the powerful people, the successful people, the famous people, they're favored, they're seen as better because they're closer to the ideal. Now the fact that you have this narrow view of an ideal, that's really messed up. That's a bad problem. And that's how colorism kind of plays itself out. So because colorism is prejudice or discrimination against people of color with darker skin, then that means that there's something called light skin privilege. Also a note I want to make early in the episode is it's kind of disrespectful to refer to somebody as a light skin or a dark skin. Disrespectful or very informal. And so the preferred terminology, especially for talking, in any kind of professional setting is light skinned, light skinned person. Kind of like the difference between saying white versus a white person using it as an adjective. So that's just a little side note on how to use these terms. But you call it light skin privilege for people who are light skinned. And that means that people of color who have lighter skin, and are often mixed race, that's how you get the lighter skin, have these privileges that come with their quote, proximity to whiteness. And these could be physical attributes like straighter hair, you know, not having the tight curls, but having the wavy curls that white people are trying to get. We're having those pretty hazel eyes instead of the dark brown ones. All of these things are seen as really beautiful in our culture, but then even behaviorally, like a light skinned person who grows up in a white community like me, we benefit from talking in a way that's acceptable to white people, communicating in a way, acting in a way that's really acceptable within white culture. There are certain privileges that come with that. Like you might receive my teaching as more legitimate or trustworthy or credible because I speak how you like people to speak. But if I spoke like some of my friends or if I spoke like some other people in my life, then you might be quick to make some assumptions about my intelligence. So to recap, what is colorism? Colorism is prejudice or discrimination against people of color who have darker skin. And then what's light skin privilege? That is the privilege that comes with resembling whiteness or being more acceptable to white culture in ways that are physical like physical attributes or in ways that are behavioral or other things. Just general proximity to white culture that gives you extra credibility or extra likeability, different things like that. Does that make sense? Okay, good. We're gonna move on to some big brain stuff, which is why colorism is just as serious as racism, if not more serious, more scary, more prevalent. So I talk a lot about racism, as you probably know. But something I haven't directly addressed is how often race and color are kind of used interchangeably because when you can, quote, tell somebody as a certain race, you can't necessarily tell that. You know, I can tell when a person is white, I can tell when a person is black, but what can I actually see? What I see is color. I don't actually see a person's race. I see color or features. I use my best judgment and I draw conclusions about what racial group they probably belong to. So racism is racial prejudice or discrimination based on a person's race. But it's not necessarily based on the race, it's based on the race that you think they are. It's based on your perception of their race. It's based on you guessing maybe correctly that they belong to this racial group and then you bringing in your prejudices or stereotypes about this group and projecting them onto that person. And colorism is really similar, but it has more to do with skin color and just like there are racial ideals, there are also color ideals and things get a lot harder and a lot worse for people with darker skin. So colorism and racism, they're really related because oftentimes color informs the discrimination since it's more apparent than race. To quote an article in Time Magazine. In the 21st century, as America becomes less white and the multi-racial community formed by interracial unions and immigration continues to expand, color will be even more significant than race in both public and private interactions. Why? Because a person's skin color is an irrefutable visual fact that is impossible to hide. Whereas race is a constructed, quasi-scientific classification that is often only visible on a government form. There's this really interesting idea here that as the United States becomes more racially diverse and increasingly multi-racial, racial lines we're gonna get more blurred and what's gonna be most apparent physically is color. A lot of people know that the guesstimate is that around the year 2050 non-Hispanic whites will no longer make up the majority racial group in the United States. Around the year 2050 non-Hispanic whites are estimated to make up about 47% of the population. And so that means that the majority of the population will be made up of different racial groups, multi-racial groups. So naturally, that means that the majority of the population, 53%, will be made up of other racial groups and multi-racial groups. But as Lori L. Tharps writes in this time article, the difference between racism and colorism, that doesn't mean that there will be no prejudice. That means that race-based prejudice might get a little murkier. But she suspects that color-based prejudice will stick around. I mean, this has been a thing within the black community for a long time. You could tie it all the way back to the days of enslavement when enslaved Africans with darker skin, their forced labor was outside in the fields and the enslaved Africans who were mixed race and lighter skin, their forced labor was in the house. But sadly, we do see colorism continuing to be an issue today. Tharps writes, "But black Americans are not the only people obsessed with how light or dark a person's skin is. Colorism is a societal ill. Felt in many places all around the world, including Latin America, East and Southeast Asia, the Caribbean and Africa. Here in the US, because we are such a diverse population with citizens hailing from all corners of the earth, our brand of colorism is both homegrown and imported. And make no mistake, white Americans are just as colorist as their brown brothers and sisters. So with this next part of the episode, I want to run through the different experiences of people of color who are dark-skinned, those who are white-passing, and then those who are light-skinned. Dark-skinned people of color are facing the most and the most intense stereotypes and the most intense biases. Then you have light-skinned people of color who are maybe mixed race and struggle with the sense of belonging, struggle with not feeling at home in either culture, not feeling fully accepted. And then you have white-passing people of color who also really struggle with identity, with belonging. And so the different experiences, they're varied and they're complex and nuanced. And I'm gonna do my best to capture that, though only one of the experiences is mine. So we're gonna start by talking about the hardships that come with being dark-skinned, because dark-skinned people of color, they are the ones who are experiencing the most color-based prejudice and discrimination. And I want to showcase how this works and operates in a few different ways. I mean, starting with showbiz and media, we're much more likely to see light skin people and we see that Hollywood prefers light skin women. Even when there are pushes for diversity, we want women of color, we want people of color. Then the people who are chosen and who get the limelight are the mixed race people with light skin and the wavy hair, not the kinky hair and the hazel eyes, not the brown eyes. Even with good intentions, there's diversity, but then there's this glass ceiling, especially for dark skinned women of color. I mean, when I think of my favorite black women in Hollywood, I'm thinkin' Zendaya, I'm thinkin' Halley Barries and their light skinned women. Or we could go with the music industry, we got Beyonce, we got Rihanna, Mariah, Alicia Keys, like all of these different people and so many of the women who reach heights of fame and success are light skinned black women. Their scene has especially beautiful and especially desirable. Even Zendaya has said that there are roles that she wouldn't be cast in if she didn't meet all of these beauty standards and fit all of these ideals. And this is not at all to blame the light skinned women who have gotten to where they are. It's not their fault, but there's definitely an issue in terms of larger themes and larger things that we're seeing where darker skinned women are being shut out of certain heights of fame. But it is thrilling and exciting to see successful dark skinned women like Octavia Spencer, like Viola Davis seeing the awards they receive and the recognition for their incredible work. But even they have commented that there are all these hoops to jump through and there are all these doors shut in their face because of being a dark skinned woman of color. And if you hear that and you're thinking, well, being a famous movie star or a famous singer, that's not the majority of Americans' experience. So even if there's colorism in that industry, that doesn't mean that colorism is relevant to the vast majority of Americans, but I got facts for you. And we're looking to the same time magazine article, the difference between racism and colorism by Lori L Farps. A 2006 University of Georgia study found that employers of any race prefer light skinned black men to dark skinned black men regardless of their qualifications. Employers. If you didn't care about the Hollywood stuff, which I think we should care about the Hollywood stuff because Hollywood and media, it sets the beauty standards, it sets the beauty ideals. And it's really impactful for, especially impressionable young people who are making sense of the world and themselves and their role in it. And if their story matters or if they're just a side character like all that stuff, I do think the Hollywood stuff matters. But if you don't, then the employer stuff should matter to you. It's especially relevant to everybody. And when we're talking how high rebel people seem, the colorism affects how we perceive the high mobility of people, then that has so many implications. If there's a disparity in how employers are viewing light skinned black men and dark skinned black men, then there's a whole lot of other implications about how that affects financial standing and the chances of ending up in poverty and the chances of staying in poverty. And that affects so much. That alone communicates that colorism is a huge issue. So let's carry on. Sociologist Margaret Hunter writes in her book, "Race, gender, and the politics of skin tone that Mexican-Americans with light skin quote, earn more money, complete more years of education, live in more integrated neighborhoods and have better mental health than do darker skinned Mexican-Americans." So to recap that list, and the disparities between light skinned Mexican-Americans and dark skinned Mexican-Americans, we see significant differences in their income, in their level of education, and the neighborhoods that they live in, and in their mental health. Now, I can't go down the tangled path of correlation causation, but we can all agree that this disparity is alarming. And I'll also have an article in the show notes from Pew Research Center unpacking more of the disparities between light skinned Mexican-Americans and dark skinned Mexican-Americans, because there are quite a few. But let's go back to the time article. In 2013, researchers Lance Hanon, Robert DeFina and Sarah Bruch, found that black female students with dark skin were three times more likely to be suspended at school than their light skinned African-American counterparts. And I mean, this is saying something, because black students already are way more likely to be suspended than their white counterparts. And that's not to say that black students are the most likely to misbehave. Black students are more likely than white students to be suspended for the same actions. Some people call it the adultification of black children. We perceive black children as they should be more responsible, they should know better, and they receive harsher punishments for the same behaviors because of those perceptions. So that's one problem in itself that black students are way more likely to be suspended than white students. But when you break it down further, that dark skinned black students, specifically black girls are way more likely than light skinned black girls to be suspended. That just shows you how multifaceted this issue, and that shows you how dark skinned people of color, they have it harder. The fact that children are perceived with more culpability at a young age that has really long lasting effects. I mean, especially when you're talking about something like suspension, suspension is being pulled out of class. Suspension is being withheld from the teaching and from the learning. So then you're facing these learning struggles, then you're falling behind, then you're labeled as a bad kid, then you internalize that label as a bad kid, then you live out that label as a bad kid. And so we should be especially passionate about combating biases that affect young people, young little children, because prejudice and discrimination that they may face can crumble a whole bright future, a very passionate about the education system, a very passionate about protecting young people. So all that to say, for the sake of young dark skinned black girls, we need to understand colorism and its effects and the disparities between dark skinned people of color, light skinned people of color and white people. So what I hope has been made clear to you by a host of different examples, from Hollywood to the music industry, to employability, to culpability, to all sorts of stuff, colorism really does affect people. And dark skinned people of color in big ways are the most negatively affected by colorism. And again, colorism is nothing new. We see it all the way back in the period of slavery in the United States, and also in other things, like the princess Snow White, she's the fairest of them all because to have fair skin and to be white as snow is to be beautiful, like that's kind of an issue that she was and is our princess for that reason. You also see skin lightning products in all corners of the world for people whose skin is too dark and they should lighten and brighten it up. I mean, there's big, big issues with that. Or even many black people where color contacts to create an eye color blue or green when their natural eye color is a light brown or a dark brown. And that even shows that we're all pulled toward this beauty standard. And we're just going, we're taking different routes to get there. For white people, getting darker brings you closer to that racially ambiguous beauty standard. White people get these fake tans, getting tanning beds to make their skin look darker. And for people of color, getting lighter and lightening your hair and lightening your eyes through color contacts, that's how you get closer to that beauty standard. Okay, moving on and next, we will be talking about the experience of being a white passing or light skinned person of color because it comes with unique challenges. (upbeat music) Hey there, if you are enjoying this episode of the Change Maker podcast, well, thank you. I'm your host, Marie Beacham. And I'm a diversity, equity, and inclusion advocate. That means that I don't just host this podcast, I do a whole lot more. And maybe that means I can do something for you. My life's work is helping people make a difference. And I do that in a few ways. I do workshops, presentations, many virtual options. I would love to speak with the people at your college, at your workplace, your organization, your school. And you can shoot all business inquiries to [email protected], infos in the show notes. Back to the episode. So let's start with talking about white passing, what that is, what that means. People of color are white passing if they could pass for a white person, which means they could be mistaken for a white person. The term passing, like they could pass for one, almost suggests like intentionality, like they're trying to pass as one. And that's not necessarily the case a lot of the time. So I think that can be a little bit misleading. White passing doesn't mean a person wants to be seen as white. Maybe more like white confused would be more fitting 'cause it's not that the person is trying to be seen as white. It's just that people, other people, whether it's other people of color or other white people see them as white. They assume that the person is white and there's a lot of misunderstanding. So a white passing person of color, most often they're mixed race. They might not be mixed race. For example, they're a black people with albinism. So though they are black, they have very light pigmentation and different things like that. Here's a non-example of white passing, the white person who is 92% German, 4% French and 4% black. And they're white passing. Wow, it's so great that they took their ancestry kit and got in touch with their hair. Did you like, no, that's still white. So white passing is somebody who does have the racial makeup of a racial group that's not white, but people mistake them for a white person. Now this comes with all sorts of identity issues and belonging issues, but I think the unique experience for a person who's white passing also comes with their experience of racism because people in their life might mistake them for white. I've found from talking to white passing people of color that they're exposed to racist comments, racist jokes, different things that people would hide from them if they knew that they were a person of color. Like I would not have told you this joke about black people, I would not have done this offensive impersonation of a black person if I had known you were black. So this just got awkward because I thought you were a white person who would laugh with me and instead I'm finding out that you're black and oh boy. So that can lead to really unfortunate awkward situations, unfortunate not that the person saying the racist thing got caught, but unfortunate that it would even happen at all. So I've found that this has been a shared experience from different white passing people. When they're perceived as white, it leads to this confusion of like am I really this? Am I really Chinese? Am I really Mexican? Am I really black? And it can lead to personal confusion in a lack of sense of belonging. And that's been similar with my experience, my biracial experience. I'm a light skinned black woman, not a white passing black woman, but light skinned. And in societal terms, that kind of feels synonymous with a not very black, black person. So like I said, there are benefits that come from colorism of being closer to this ideal, of being seen as more palatable, behaviorally having grown up in a white community, talking and acting and communicating in a way that's really acceptable and trusted and seen as really legitimate from white people. Like there are absolutely benefits. And the hardships are largely internal. I experience external hardships having to do with racism, but in terms of colorism, that's more of an internal battle wrestling thing because you're kind of like in this in between, you know, you get called an Oreo, you're black on the outside, white on the inside because you don't quote act black enough and that's from other black people, you get that from white people. It's really hard to make sense of as a child. Don't ever call anyone an Oreo, by the way, because it is not up to you to judge how, quote, black somebody is or how, quote, white somebody is because all of it's based on generalizations and stereotypes, but you feel too black for white people and you feel too white for black people, whatever that means. And just like you don't fit quite right. And so by racial at times, instead of it feeling like an identity, I'm by racial, it feels more like a lack of identity. I'm not quite white, I'm not quite black and you don't always feel at home in either culture. So that can be challenging in terms of identity, community belonging. But an interesting thing for me living and growing up in a completely white community, I never thought of myself as biracial, not until adulthood. I just thought of myself as black because, you know, you just see yourself relative to the people around you. So when everyone around you is white and you're half black, really the black part is what stands out to you and to others. And so yeah, biracial wasn't even like a thing that ever came to my mind and still I hardly even think of that term. So I've always thought of myself as black among white peers, but then among black peers, is that happened more like in college, then I started to feel too white for black people. I look back at my photo albums through the years growing up, my yearbooks or even searching my own memories. There aren't a lot of black people in them. So in my formative years, I really struggled to identify with people who I didn't know personally. Because my friends, my classmates, my coaches, my teachers, the people in my day-to-day life were all white. And so to get really personal, it's something that I still am figuring out over the past few years. I mean, 2020, my racial identity felt very central to who I am and what that means for my life. But over the past few years, while racial identity is still important to me, it's felt less central in my day-to-day. It's felt like it influences less things and affects fewer things, but it is strange. And I still, from time to time, find myself using they when I'm talking about black people instead of we. And using they when talking about white people, 'cause I don't really see myself as white instead of we. So like, who's my we, if that makes sense? And there have been times when I was flat out rejected by other black people who were like, you think you're black, are you kidding me? There's this story I told publicly about a time when I was racially profound and kicked out of a store, presumably suspect of stealing something. And it goes without saying that I was not stealing anything. I didn't even like this store. But anyway, I shared my experience at this event for black history month and afterward, an African friend of mine came up to me and they were like, that was a really cool story. I didn't know that about you. And I was like, wow, thanks. And then they were like, but you actually think you're black? That's so funny, I never would have guessed that. It's just so funny that you think you're black. I'm sorry that happened to you, but you're not black. Just look at you. And so this person had a very different experience than me, growing up in Africa, moving to American adulthood. And I can't fully blame them for seeing me as like totally different, totally foreign to them. But stuff like that kind of cuts a little bit deep, especially in vulnerable moments. And that was something where they couldn't believe that I thought I was black because they thought my skin was so light compared to theirs. But then there are other times more frequently when I feel or am judged as like not black enough because of my behavior. Like I said, the way I talk or the way I dress or the music I listen to or whatever, I grew up surrounded by white culture. I'm still surrounded by white culture. So yeah, a lot of my personal preferences and things like that do reflect white culture. So I've had to grapple with just because people say that this makes me less black, I know who I am. So if I'm a black person who likes this music, then I guess black people like this music. I don't think that makes me less black. I don't think that changes my racial makeup. I don't think that changes anything about me. And even once I grew a platform and I started speaking out about topics of race and things like that, I received a lot of backlash from white people and black people alike who were like, don't listen to this lady. She's light-skinned and she doesn't know what she's talking about, she's not actually black. That was some feedback, some harsh feedback that I received. And again, I had to step back and it's never my intention to speak for the entire black community and every person everywhere. But I also had to remind myself and remember that my experience and my expertise, they matter. So yeah, the whole not black enough thing, that hurts. That's multifaceted. And then there's the not quite white. I mean, I am half white, but you will never hear me introduce myself as a white person, refer to myself as white, because the world has never treated me as a white person. No one else calls me white or sees me as white. And so I've never seen myself that way. Like I said, growing up with white people, when all the white girls at the sleepovers sleep with their straight hair on their pillows, and here I am, like trying to put a bonnet on or trying to keep my braids right, knowing my mom's gonna comb my hair for four hours on Saturday to get the tingles out. Like physical differences, that really jumps out in your face, especially as a child. Having a different skin color, taking notice of that yourself and having other people pointed out to you, I was really observant that one of these things is not like the other. And all of the like posters or children's books that were like different is beautiful, diversity is great. They weren't very convincing for me. I was not buying it because I knew who I looked up to in media, I knew that I adored my teachers, I knew that I adored my coaches, I knew that I thought my friends were so pretty in like all these different things, and they never looked like me. I mean, I myself am like a tough critic of people who are like representation, fixes everything, 'cause I don't think it does. But I will say that seeing women of color in roles and in leadership positions that I aspired to someday be influential like them, like Michelle Obama being a prominent figure in American history, that was deeply moving for me as a young child. I needed that, I needed to see a black woman lead, 'cause that was what I wanted to do. You know, I saw some black women singing. I didn't want to sing, and I saw some black women acting, and I didn't want to act, but when I saw a black woman lead, I was like, that's it, that one's me. I'm gonna be like her, not that I'm gonna be the first lady, but I'm gonna be impactful, and I'm gonna make a difference. I'm gonna make an impact on the world. So yeah, being mixed race and subsequently light-skinned, I experienced racism on the one hand. I am a beneficiary of colorism on the other hand. So, it's like a both hand, I have privileges, the dark. skin to black people don't have. I'm considered more of an authority and more palatable. I'm praised for all these ways that I think just generally put simply white people are really comfortable around me compared to how comfortable they are around other black people. Specifically other darker skinned black people or other darker skinned black people who weren't raised among white people. And I'd say the big internal battle of being mixed race is navigating between two worlds between two cultures two groups not knowing where you fit or if you fit or how you fit and especially during times of racial turmoil or heightened racial divide and animosity. I could mark two times in my life 2020 being the most recent one where then your mixed race identity is thrust in your face and you're like who am I what am I where where do I belong where do I go to who is my wheat so I wanted to spend a little bit of time talking about my personal experience being mixed race and light skinned though mixed race and light skinned are not always the same you can be mixed race but not light skinned you can be light skinned but not mixed race but that's me that's my life that's what I've experienced growing up and if you like hearing about my personal experiences let me know and I could share a little bit more insight into that I am quite the authority on my life or I could stick more to the facts and figures if that's for your speed nowhere feelings there but I wanted to talk about colorism I recognize the optics of me talking about colorism as a light skinned black person and it's something that I realize something that I realize that I want to acknowledge and then I want to steward well I I don't appreciate there are certain white people like I said who show up in my comment section and they're like guys she's light skinned she's not really black and they pull it out as like this gotcha moment I do not appreciate that I don't think yeah we don't need to get into it you you get the idea you know why that's not good but my point with this episode is I want to shine a light on colorism on mixed race identity on the experience of darker skinned people of color I hope I've done it justice there's a chance that some things in this episode were less than stellar my goal for this year on the podcast is to do more ones through takes I do a lot of work beforehand but then just speaking a little bit more candidly a little bit more freely so if I seem less articulate that would be why we're not doing the double takes but I thought that would be valuable for creating a more conversational tone because you doesn't like a good conversation with a friend you know so my closing thoughts for you are this it's important that we're all aware of colorism that we're all opposed to colorism that we're all like sifting the icky out of our own hearts and doing personal checks you know asking yourself do I favor light skinned celebrities do I favor light skinned entertainers do I favor light skinned friends professionals employees neighbors do I feel more comfortable about light skinned people because they feel more like us than they do like them and evaluating that unpacking that that's that's your food for thought with this episode and I really hope that you learned something new something valuable that you can act on in your life thank you so much for listening to this episode of the Change Micro podcast hosting this podcast is truly an honor and a privilege and a joy and I am so grateful for every single one of you seriously you're the kind of person who learns about prejudice and discrimination in your free time so you can try to make a difference in the world that's great pat on the back claps for you I hope that this episode has been impactful for you and if it has please leave a rating or a review wherever you listen to your podcasts that really helps the Change Maker to reach more people and impact more lives and as a reminder we are fundraising for the King Center so if you take that one second to leave a rating or that one minute to leave a review I will be donating to the King Center on your behalf at the end of January I've got new episodes for you every Tuesday and Thursday be sure to hit follow so that you don't miss an episode oh and if you only take away one thing from this episode I hope it's the Change starts with you