The Bill Simmons podcast is brought to you by Fandall Sportsbook. We're also brought to you by the Ringer podcast network where I have a new rewatchables episode that went up Monday night. Ace Ventura, pet detective. We had not done a lot of Jim Carey on the rewatchables, which is my fault, but we're starting to gain steam. We did Truman show now, Ace Ventura. It was me and Craig Horlbeck and Zach Lowe in his first ever rewatchables appearance. Oh yeah, very fun episode. The next episode that we're doing next Monday is a movie that's also on Netflix. They have all the Bond movies and we're doing Goldnye, which was Pierce Brosnan's first Bond movie. And there's a great story behind it. It's actually an awesome movie and you have six days to watch it. So there you go. Speaking of rewatchables, I am going to be in LA. That's where I live, but we're also doing a live show at the Wiltern tomorrow night. And for everybody that's going to that, just prep on heat would be my advice. The BS podcast lives will turn 8 o'clock away. Prep on heat for the people going. Obviously, everyone is not going up. Sorry, you can't go, but we will be, we will be running it on this feed. So there you go. Coming up on this podcast, Nick Wright is coming back. The Patriots got smacked in the Super Bowl. I'm going to let him listen. I talked a lot of smacked during the season. Everybody gets their turn now and they can smack back at me. But we're going to talk about a whole bunch of general sports stuff, Super Bowl NBA, Winter Olympics. And then I have a little, a little, a Mico Balter six pack that I'm going to do, a little mini NBA mail bag. And then my dad demanded to come on. He thinks that I'm banning it from the podcast because we're also showing it on Netflix, Sunspotify as well. You can find that every platform, but it's also now on Netflix and he didn't think I wanted him to come on anymore. He's very, very, very upset about the Patriots loss. So we're going to talk about that and sub Boston sports stuff. So that's the podcast. We're going to take a break, bring a pro jam. And then Nick Wright. The Bill Simmons podcast is brought to you by Fandall, the football season may be coming to an end, but things are only getting started on the court, on the hardwood, on the wood, as some people call it, Fandall, the number one choice for same game, Parla's live betting and much more during the NBA season. Don't forget with Fandall, you get paid instantly when you win, download the Fandall Sportsbook app right now and play your game. 21 plus and president select states are 18 plus president DC Kentucky, where I'm in game prom, call win energy, game, or visit rg-help.com, call 88878977777 or visit ccpg.org/chat in Connecticut. Right Nick Wright is here. You can see my first things first and like me on Sunday night a year ago, you watch your team just get eviscerated during a Super Bowl. And then your team, you were never the same. I think you went 6 and 11 and your quarterback blew it as knee and it was bad. It was in the dynasty. And here comes the Patriots, our new dynasty. And then they get annihilated in the Super Bowl. Now we're a dynasty lesson, the IFC. Well, all right, so a few things as you just come out swinging. You're of the erroneous belief that I, that the Patriots had one dynasty of 01 to 18. That's your belief, correct? That it wasn't 01 to 04, then the 05 to 13 good, but not good enough with undefeated season. And then 14 to 18. Like I think you, like do you, because if you think the Patriots had two separate dynasties, then I will fold my hand. The chiefs dynasty ended this year. But if you think it's one continuous run, then we're still alive, baby. We can miss, we cannot want to Super Bowl for five years, eight years like you guys and still be alive. So I did what, what are the table stakes here on dynasty rules? First of all, we went 10 years. Yeah, that's right. We went 10 years with a couple really horrifying, embarrassing, ugly Super Bowl defeats. Like worse than getting blown out, losing heartbreakers to the bad manning brother. Like it's hard to get over those types of things. Well, the flow outs, it's like, oh, it's too much. So when during the Super Bowl, somebody put a montage of all the times they almost picked off Eli Manning during the first giant Super Bowl, and it was over two minutes. It was it over two minutes of balls hitting our hand, fumbles that we had the fumble and then somehow the guy rolled over and didn't have it. I got mad all over again. Yeah, we went 10 years and it got to the point that when, when, when curse made that catch, Jermaine, curse on the Seahawks. You thought you were dead? Well, no, at that point, it's like Spygate has cursed us. I remember like walking through the emotions for two minutes there of like, there's something sinister happening now. David Tyree, Miron Manningham, all the weird shit that went on. Now we're going to lose on this freaking curse catch and then it flips the balcony. And so the Patriots run is so special for a hundred different reasons, but it's also so interesting because it feels like man, play five of those games, two plays different. And do you guys have ten rings and then also take five plays to five games, five plays different? Do you guys, if the Malcolm Butler pass play doesn't happen, do you have the emotional gravitas 428 to 3 or is the run over there? You know what I mean? Like I do think that the Seahawks come back, which is an underrated comeback down 10 and the fourth quarter against that defense. Two good drives, two good stops. Right. Was the precursor to the belief we can do it in 16. So the, but we're now, no, no, hold on. This is an important point though because I do think when you're in the mix year after year, you're going to have some either or super balls. So once you definitely should have won and then the lucky ones and somehow that evens out. So the Brady Balla check they, I think they finished six and three. This was a 50, 50 game, but they really had the game and they're doing the interception touchdown, which gets called back, which flips it. Panthers should have been a win. Eagle should have been a win. First Giants game, they came back. We're down 14, 10. We do the drive with two minutes left, but then we can't stop them. That was a 50, 50 game. So is the next Giants game. Seahawks game we should lost. Should have lost. That's a should have lost. And Falcon should have lost. Falcon should have lost. And the last Rams game was the one that one that but they should have won that easier than you did. Well, what about the Eagles game? Where does that stand? Because we Brady threw for over 500 yards and they somehow lost. So Nick falls and Doug Peterson, the billbell check and Tom Brady. It's the one that doesn't add up out of all of those. Especially because Brady was so great. It feels like an arrogance tax and I and I the arrogance on Bella check with the Malcolm Butler weird thing. That there is just no. I understand, listen, falls to his credit was unreal in the conference championship game the week before he was great that week, but there's no way whatsoever where Tom Brady could have the game he had and you lose. And so that feels like maybe the oddest result of the last 20 years in the NFL. Can I the either or thing on the chief side is interesting because we've had no either or super vols go against us. Right. We've had three close super vol wins and two teeth kicked in super vol losses. Our either or games were conference championship losses, but I, you know, can I silver lining those? They're the de Ford game. That was a classic either or a classic either or that to this day. Part of me's like dammit. You win that game Brady's on five rings, not six with the pads. My homes can get that one. He's beat him, but galaxy brain here, if they win that game, they don't and they make the super volumah homes his first year. They don't fire the D coordinator Bob Sutton. That who then they then brought in spags, which, which allowed transformed a underman defense early. So if they win that game, I don't know if they win the next year. I don't know if they have the defensive personnel because that defense was so bad in 18. The other either or game we lost, AFC title game to the bangles when my homes got concussed and nobody, you know, you still have that. I can cut. Right. Yeah. 21 to 3, they blow it. That's like, oh my god, left a super on the table. But again, the butterfly effect of that was that led to the Tirek trade, which led to the next two super balls. It led to the and so the chiefs either or moments have come around before the super roll. But this was that you were so I told wilds on Friday. He was like just the only thing that can't happen.
happen is we get blown out. He was like, if we get blown out, all the schedule folks are coming out. Everything that we've seen the last 24 hours, he was worth or 48 hours. >> The JPMVP stuff, everything. >> Yes, all of it. He was worried that what has happened, what happened? But I told him, I was like, okay. And he was as confident as you. He thought if there was a blowout coming, it was the other way around. >> Well, we didn't know our quarterback got a freaking shot and I showed it right before the game. >> Well, maybe your Patriots should stop lying on injury reports then, because they took them off the injury report. Strip them of draft pick. If you want the sympathy, I want a third round pick. So you took the quarterback off the injury report, thread him for the Super Bowl. But here's the question I have, because what I told Wilde was, a blowout will not, the worst case scenario for you emotionally watching with your sons is a heartbreaking loss. So let me ask you, what was, because I've never had a heartbreaking Super Bowl loss. I've just had teeth kicked in Super Bowl losses. What was harder to deal with, the, let's call it the, the Eagle suit, the Giants are weird because there's extra baggage there. The Eagle Super Bowl loss, where it's like close the whole time, how did we just lose, where this loss where it was pretty clear 20 minutes in, we might be screwed here. >> I'm glad you asked, because I actually prepared something for this, the five levels of Super Bowl losses. >> Wow. >> Yeah. >> What, really? >> Yeah. >> Let's do it. >> Level one, this is the easiest one. We put up a good fight and we easily could have won, but we didn't. That's the Panthers against the Patriots in 2003. Really good effort, we almost won. We threw some haymakers, they beat us in the end, but you feel good, like we got there, we showed up, we embarrassed ourselves, we could have won the game, a couple plays could have gone differently. But if you're a Panthers fan, you're like, man, I wish we had won, but you know, we couldn't stop them. >> Can that only apply if you're like a house money team? >> Yeah. >> Nobody expected a future team. >> That's our, so if the Pats lose to the Seahawks 24/21 and we came close, but you could kind of tell we weren't as good. It was like, you know what, that's a really good season we can build on this. >> Yep. >> That was painful. I wish we lost two weeks ago. So that's, you know, like Raiders Bucks, when the Raiders get to the Super Bowl and the Bucks just kill them. And at some point you're like, I wish we never even made it. But you're going through the seven stages of grief as the game's happening. You probably had that with Chief Seagal's last year, it's like, you know what? >> Yeah. >> The only reason I didn't feel that way was I like having never lost a Josh Allen component of it from the ownership of the AFC. >> For and over Josh. >> Right. Which is a huge thing. But yes, I was thinking the, like the Chargers of Niners, Steve Young game, the way it's like, oh man, maybe we could play with the last Super Bowl. >> Yes. >> That went absolutely lost. >> So however many were out. >> Yeah. >> I'm pretty sure the past game like that was on Sunday, but here are the other three levels. Level three. Wow. We almost won and we freaking blew it. I think to me the perfect example of this is the Jimmy Garoppolo Super Bowl. >> I was going to say the Brock Perty Super Bowl. >> Well, the shit. But you go that Garoppolo, that long pass that he missed the over through the guy by what a yard, half yard. >> Yeah, manual Sanders. >> You're thinking about that 10 years later. >> But doesn't maybe this is a next level. What about the next Niners Super Bowl loss where they had a lead in overtime and the chiefs were in fourth and one? The night that next Niners Super Bowl loss, it is 1916, fourth and one in overtime. Get a stop and you win the game. And Nikki Bosa thought Patrick Mahomes on fourth and one in the overtime of the Super was going to hand the ball off and crash down on the running back and mold to scamp. Like that to me was the more heart breaking loss, but maybe it's a higher level. Maybe you're not there yet. >> It's tough because I always felt like I thought the chiefs were going to win that. Everyone had so much belief in Mahomes at that point. It was just like, as long as he has the ball, I feel like they're going to win. >> Fair. >> Level four. We were demolished to the degree that it now changes every positive member I had of the season. So that's the 85 Patriots where we had this great run. We beat the Raiders and the Jets and the Dauphins all in a row. We extinguished all these demons. Get to the Super Bowl. It is an absolute prison beating. It's like just people coming into the cell and hitting us for two hours. And then two days later we have a drug scandal. There's a cocaine scandal two days later. And by the time it was over, I kind of wish we, now when I think of this season, I'm thinking this first, which is probably what happened to the Chargers, the Stan Humphrey season and a couple others. I don't think that's the case for this Patriot season because they were two years ahead of, one or two years ahead of schedule for there. We thought they're going to be. It was kind of amazing. They made it. And it didn't make me feel worse about the season. So I think this is level two. And I have one more level. But tell me what. >> Well, here's the last level. A brutal, unforgivable, that will haunt me the rest of my life. That's 283 Falcons, that's Malcolm Butler game, that's Scott Norwood. You know the ones for that one. >> So this, the Patriots game obviously wasn't that. And you haven't had a drug scandal. Now, your guys version of Travis and Taylor, Stefan and Cardi B, might have hit the rock shortly after the Super Bowl. So there's that. >> Tampa, if those crazy kids could have made it work. >> No, I really had my money on it. >> It seems unstable. >> It's stunning. But here's why I wonder if this approach is level two territory. >> Sunday. >> Sunday. >> I think it's level two. >> You do. >> I do. >> No, I'm sorry. So I have a second level four. >> I think the level four. >> Yeah, the second, the last level. Okay. >> Yeah, second, the last. I did it backwards. I do think this Super Bowl paired with the playoff run in its totality. For me, has made me shift Drake May and my brain from sure thing to probably, probable thing. Like Drake May, I said after week 10, like he's just going to be a top five quarterback for me moving forward. Like, I don't know if that means Burrow gets kicked out for who, I don't know how it shakes out. But seeing him go over four, he was miserable in all four first halves miserable. And the weather was fine in the first halves of those. >> He had a good second half against the Chargers. He had three good drives against the Texans. >> Yes, he was a dumpster fire for four rounds. >> Well, he was a dumpster fire in the first round for all four rounds. And first half. >> I thought that. >> In the first half, sorry. And I thought that this way the Super Bowl played out was concerning in this regard. I thought it was pretty clear. Vrables, game plan was, Darnell's going to screw up. Like the game plan was, don't make a mistake, Darnell will. And man, the first play of the game, he almost threw a pick six. >> The first, we almost got three of them. >> Right. >> He just, and you almost got a couple drive changing sacks. And he just barely eluded on. And so, Vrables game plan was, don't make a mistake. And those first nine drives, it's nine punts. And then the moment it was like, okay, Drake, you gotta go make a play. Your final five drives, his two touchdowns three turnovers. And it felt to me like throughout this post season, the window opened of all. Against good defenses, in order for him to hit those huge plays that he was so great at early in the year, does he become too loose with the football? Like does the fumbles and the sacks and the interceptions, is that the cost of doing business for him hunting big plays. And that would be my concern. And I think that stuff predates the shoulder injury late in the Broncos game. I thought he was awful. The first half of the Broncos game, before there was a flakasnow in the air. And to me, it was, he was like, I just can't turn it over. I've got to be careful, and that concerns me. >> So, I watch the game again, and that's where I've landed. There's two pieces. One is what you just said. I think he was too sloppy with the ball in the first game. And they were hammering in, you have to protect the ball. And they kind of shut down a switch with him. >> Yes. >> What was great about him during the season? And this is why obviously not, I still am 100% on Drake May. He had the wild plays. There was a recklessness in a good way. And over and over again, he would just do something like holy shit. Whoa, oh my God. And it felt like this was a more, I just got to protect the ball. I got to, so that was the one piece. And the other piece was, I think he just took too many hits during the season. The shoulder thing. >> Yeah. >> I don't know what the injury was. And he was missing, especially in this last game, he was missing throws that he completed 73% of his passes. He was missing.
missing throws that he made for four months. And I've never been in a situation before in basketball you're used to it, right? When somebody's just they they're bad and basketball. It's like, oh, that guy's gacking or oh, that guy they've unlocked something like Tatum and Brown and they 22 finals. So they got the words have figured out something. These guys are young. This will make them better. They're going to come back stronger. The main thing I him may missing 10 yard throws over the middle. Just tell me it just tells me that he was hurt and they were hiding it because they weren't doing you think he got they weren't doing you think we got her for like he got hurt at the end of the regular season because he got if I had to bet on on a scenario, I think he got banged up in the Chargers game because he took big hits in that game. Okay. But I think he got hurt in the Broncos game because if you look at the way they design plays that he uses legs at all, Seahawks are running or they're rushing for they have seven going back, which is like that's like that's like money for Drake mate. Just get me past those first four I'm getting 10 yards. They just didn't want to use them that way. You do it. They didn't want to use them that way, which is different. Yeah. So that so that's I mean he's played 33 games. He's been sacked 102 times that which is a big number obviously 21 in these four playoff games. And that is what made him so unbelievable. The first half of the year in particular was he had a real devastating quality with his legs and and throwing in the run, which was that that was the secret sauce and the best deep ball thrower in the league by a lot. Those first two like the best deep ball thrower in the league the first two months. He was the there was a period where he was the only guy in the league that when I'm watching you know yours obviously you're watching the whole league but your primary focus when the pattern is the pants the pattern you know if one of my focus is he's but he was the only guy in the league that when you saw him chuck at 30 yards deep you expect it was the opposite of how I felt early in the season when Bo Nicks threw at 30 yards deep. Every time Bo Nicks early in the year through with 30 yards deep I'm like that fucking thing is going out. Where it's going yeah yeah right and and Drake you expect them to catch it that changed by the end of the season then into the playoffs. Then there is this other because Greg Jennings on the show the biggest criticism he had was for where Josh McDaniel's for not giving Drake answers to the witherspoon blitz. He's like it's a slot blitz that which means and you said it I think on Sunday's spot. Yeah they just go turn around to your turn around. Um so I think McDaniel's obviously is an awesome awesome but did you see did you see the Seahawks first they said two things one they knew they could attack certain things they knew it was going to work. It's always scary when the other teams like we knew this was going to work. But it seems like they knew within the Patriots were in runner pass that they could tell by the way the lineman were lined up that they could tell what the play was. Yeah and it was like that kind of makes sense. How did they know over and over again when the team was passing. So that would be I mean then. Sorry I don't mean to make you bummed out. I the uh because I want I have one Josh McDaniel's question and then one offensive line point and the do whatever you want. Well that's another thing we found out the left taco had a torn knee ligament. But we knew that he missed a month with it. Yeah but they made it seem like he he could play and it was it was healed. And then he's like yeah I was playing with the torn I mean I think he was playing with a torn MCO which makes sense because there were times people pushed him back and he just fell backwards. Well I mean when people are watching Netflix. Benchum okay people aren't watching on Netflix bill pantomine falling backwards but when Bill pantomine bit his arms weren't T-rex like they were regular so like that's so that's a poor Campbell. I mean listen you took a pretty good guard for overall. It's a tough spot. No. Brable said he's he's I know Brable said it. I know Brable said it. What do we make of this stat? Yeah. 10 Super balls Josh McDaniel's has coached in only to be fair only seven is the coordinator. Yeah but all you know Tom Brady or Drake may as the quarterback for those 10 three first quarter points total. It ties into what happened all season. They always started slow and then took second quarter started come on. I thought the coaching was terrible. Can I read you the common reasons for a shoulder injection according to Google? Jesus yeah I'd love it. It was like yeah shoulder injection. I wonder why somebody would get that I don't know I've never had a shoulder injection. There's five possible answers that Google said number one rotator cuff injuries inflammation or partial tears. Number two, Mercedes or Tendonitis. Information of the Burcer Tendons due to overuse or injury. Number three arthritis. He doesn't have that. He's 23. Number four, frozen shoulder adhesive capsulitis extreme stiffness and pain where the injection helps improve range of motion. And then number five, impingement syndrome pain caused by Tendons rubbing against the shoulder bone. He had to have an injection before the game. Yeah and then he and you could see with some of the throws where he's like whipping 10 yard throws and there's a throw that died 20 yards. We'll never know and I don't think they'll ever tell us because I think they probably lied on the injury report, which is illegal. But they didn't know probably. He was on the injury report Thursday Friday before the game. They removed him and then after the game, he's like yeah, my shoulders shot up. But what's weird about that is the his three best throws of the game we're in the fourth quarter like as the throw over the middle in triple coverage. Not the one that was to the game, but the one that was caught. So was a great throw. The touchdown was a great throw. Those were late. So I don't I don't know. Well, can I see this? Yeah. Cubes, who would you want the next five years? Love this. Love it. Next five said takes us 26 20 basically to through the 2037. The rest of the decade. Alan Mahomes may borrow and Herbert. Is there any one you would bump for somebody else? Oh, yeah, my was may borrow Herbert. Is there anybody on the cusp for you? Well, that wouldn't be my top five. Yeah, that's what I mean. So who you bumping? Yeah. So I would I would go. I would go. Mahomes Alan. So you take Mahomes. I'm not. Yes, of course. The. I'm not an ACL and his early 30s. The early 30s by early 30s, you mean 30. So yes, technically early 30s. Yes, coming off an ACL, I I am not. I feel about Patrick Mahomes heading into 2026 the way you felt about time rating in 2009. So yes, I would have Mahomes Alan one two. But for me, my would have been one. And now with the playoffs that he just had, whatever the reasons were that we don't know the answers. I don't know how he can be one. And I love Jay May. I wouldn't trade it for any QB, but I just I'm trying to be rational. He can't be one after how he just played in the playoffs. And that's what's fair. And I think and I think we can open the conversation up a bit. To hey, May versus Caleb will be an interesting debate over this next five years. So you would say Caleb over Herbert because I would too. I was trying to be generous to the narrative. I there's a there's a lot of people I would take over Justin Herbert because every column on the ringer that is a Justin Herbert defense has this sentence in the first paragraph. You have to be willing to ignore his playoff meltdowns or there is there is this little like cliffs notes version of or footnote version of yes, we understand the two worst games he's played in his last 50 or the two playoff games and they were both meltdowns of the story. Right. And so I wouldn't and I would. So here's because you included burrow I have a crazy stat for you last five years last five years. Burrow in Lamar have played the exact same amount of games. And we look at burrow as like a real injury concern. And he and Lamar Jackson both played 73 games the last five years. They both have not played in the playoffs three of the last five years. So I would if for me my top five would probably be for the next five years. My homes Allen Caleb Drake May Drake May Caleb three four and then my fifth God dog it. Who would my fifth guy be? Burrow her bird. Jaden Daniels is in there. No, it's just a chocolate. I'm James is skinny as I am. Yeah. Jaden Jaden. I would go burrow, but I would be nervous. So burrow burrow is my worst case scenario for the next five years for Jake May because part of the reason I had so many injuries is because he was getting the shake kick that of him every year playing behind no offensive line. And it's like there's so many hits they're just going to add up after a while. And I don't care who you are. But don't you think Vrable will the reason I would not be as worried about that piece of it is Vrable is just so much sharper than Zack Taylor and Vrable like I don't think Kelly I again you know the past better than me. I don't think Elliot Wolf is running things I think Vrable is. Yeah. And Vrable knows what to prioritize. So I think you guys will protect him. Can I ask you one more past question? I know there's other things you want to get to. Yeah. Do you want
them to trade for AJ Brown. No, I want them to build through the lines. I honestly, we see it every year and then we forget. I totally agree with you. You can get to the point where you have a four-man pass rush that's effective. That seems like that's the single most important thing you can have other than a quarterback. And then the third most important thing is, can you block? Can you block? Can you rush with four? Do you have a quarterback you trust? And if you just have those three things, you can win the Super Bowl. And you just said a pass rush with four is the most important thing other than a quarterback. Some would argue it's the only thing that stops the great quarterback. Yeah, you're right. Certainly. It's like Brady lost. Brady lost the Giants because of it. Both of them, the home Super Bowl losses is because of it. The patch just lost because of it. Like our last two Super Bowl winning quarterbacks. Our quarterbacks that you grew too like, like okay there, but you had questions about who had these awesome delights that just made the other teams quarterback pee down their leg. You know, I mean, just play terrible. And so, yeah, that's the, so I wild wants them to trade for AJ Brown because he has the relationship with. I think that, I think the receivables are full of gold. Like, they, people should look at the Tiree trade as like the example why he wouldn't do that. Trade the Tiree. He won two Super Bowl as the moment you traded them. Correct. I, to me paying $60 million for two receivers, I would just never do that if I ran a team, but it does seem like part of the art of this. And I hope the Patriots Bob Crafts been cheap. I'm going to use the seaword. He's been cheap for 12 years. Part of the art of this and something Philly's been really good at. I think the Rams have been good at some of these teams of just, they keep pushing the cap a year later. It's like the dinner check comes and they give it back to the waiter and they're like, when you bring this back in a half hour and then the guy comes back and say, can we take 30 more minutes with this and they just keep pushing it kind of to infinity because all the NFL does is make more and more money every year and all these different ways. And that seems to work. So here's, so that is, so this is something because I listened to Shiel. Shiel talks about this a lot. This is a big shield. And I disagree with him on the efficacy of that if you believe you have a quarterback the level you believe Drake May is. So let me just give a look. So what you're talking about is I'll do this as quick as possible. I don't want people to turn it off. Talk about void years. Yeah. Teeves attacking on void years so you can pay a player a bunch of cash and it costs you cap in years. They're not going to be on the team. Right. You're borrowing from future years. It's like a loan shark strategy. Correct. A quarter of the lead doesn't use them at all. The chiefs are one of those teams. The patch are kind of one of those teams. They don't do it. No, the Browns did it out of necessity because the Watson trade has been such a disaster for a second. The chiefs are doing something because they somehow had the ability to pay. Chris Jones, Mahomes, Kelsey, like they think, but Kelsey makes no money. Yeah, but those are the only guys on the roster. They're playing other than their offensive lineman. But you're really not, you're the expensive guys in the team though. The offensive lineman Chris Jones and Mahomes is the whole list. That's where you landed now. That wasn't where you landed three, four years ago. Well, what the chiefs are doing is Mahomes is a 10 year deal. So Mahomes is deal. Can they? It's not void years. They can just constantly rework that. But let me say what Philly's doing. Yeah. So the average team, like the median team, 16th rank has like $60 million of void years, a future cap that they're borrowing from. The Eagles is at 472 million. And it almost all comes due in 2028 and 2029. So what the Eagles did and they did this previously when Super was they are saying we are stocking up on this five year run. And then we are going to buy definition have at least one season where we're bad. Well, the same thing is down, right? That we were one of the five teams that did this. Yeah. And but they did it because their great quarterback was at the end. They're like, who cares if we suck after breeze, we're going. I wouldn't want the chiefs to do it now when Mahomes is 35, start doing it because who gives a shit about the team when he retires when we bad. But I were you in the pants, I was with Brady near the end. Correct. At the end with Brady, if that's when you do it or you do the seven year deal with Brady and you just keep pushing money around. Correct. But they never did that. But if they did that now with May, it's like, okay, just so you know, when Drake May's 29, all these bills are due and we're going to have an awful team for a year. But that's why you give them like a 12 year deal for $700 million. Well, that's the, the Mahomes deal is so good. So crazy that 10 years, I mean, he's on a 10 year 450 million dollar contract. So he makes $45 million a year that they've never added money to it. They've accelerated money through him. And that gives you a level of flexibility that other teams don't necessarily. So they'll just keep redoing it. All right, we're going to take a break coming back. Some other sports I want to talk to you about. This episode is brought to you by Pepsi. I have one. It's right here. Pepsi Zero Sugar. Ooh. I'll drink it later. Reminds me, you guys have to watch the new Pepsi Zero Sugar Superb-Blood Final Have a Sub. Okay. It follows a polar bear who steps up to the iconic Pepsi Challenge. Labels removed. Which tastes better? Pepsi Zero Sugar? Or Coca-Cola Zero Sugar, the winner? You guessed it. Pepsi Zero Sugar. And that's based on real results. Last year, Pepsi revived the iconic Pepsi Challenge. And 66% of participants agreed that Pepsi Zero Sugar tastes better than Coca-Cola Zero Sugar. I don't know what to tell you. Go out and try Pepsi Zero Sugar. Today, you deserve taste. You deserve Pepsi. All right. NBA All-Star weekend is coming up. It's 37 minutes from my house. I'm not even sure I'm going to go. I'm still on the fence. That's how all-Star game has just beaten out any sort of curiosity out of me over the course of my life. Now they have the world. I don't know what's happening. Brin and Ingram is somehow on a team now. I'm like, I might just stay home. I have a company. Can I try to convince you, hold on before you get to you? Because if you're not going to the All-Star game. Yeah. Because I am, I'm flying to LA Saturday morning for a number of reasons. One of which is in something that I almost think is better if we don't even explain and the audience who doesn't know my story is just perplexed by it. One of the reasons is I'm coming to LA to see my granddaughter who's three months old. Wow. Unbelievable. But the other reason is, and this is where I think if you're not going to the All-Star game Sunday night, you certainly should hit up Ringer, Colley, Rich Paul and come to the Clutch Sports Party Saturday night. The Clutch Sports Party. Well, I. The Clutch Sports Saturday night All-Star Party. I'll be there. I'd officially be a member of the. I wore the Clutch sweatshirt last week, kind of ironically during the trade that led. I know. I'm just saying. Can I give you an All-Star Saturday thing that I just have to put my foot down on once or for all? I don't mean to be a dick and just piss on stuff, but nobody likes tall guys in the Dunk contest. I'm waiting to meet my first person who's like, "Hey, I heard they have three centers for the Dunk contest. Can't wait. The shorter the better, I'd rather watch five foot two people try to dunk than a seven-foot person. I'd rather they pick five foot two people out of the stands. Who wants to watch Jackson Hay's Dunk? I wouldn't want to watch him dunk. He was outside my house right now, my court. Dwight was the outlier. Dwight was fine. I wasn't even sure that. It was fine. It was fine. And he. There was a lot of showmen dunking on a 10-foot hoop. How hard is that? So is this possible, Bill, that we were until we get to the point in human evolution, where somebody can do a front-flip dunk that all the dunks are done. But what's happened to the dunk contest is actually we're out of new ways for people to dunk. It's over. I've been sitting in this for 15 years. It's over. We're done. I was thinking watching the Winter Olympics. I used to love the ski jump as a kid. It was the most terrifying event. They weren't using 1970s skis. They don't have to track the same way. And these people go down. You really felt like their life was in danger every time. You'd watch you, you'd just be like, "Oh my God, next one." Oh, he landed. And now they have awesome equipment. And it's the most boring thing I've ever seen. It's like, "Oh, he's a foot longer than the last person." It's like, "Cool." All right. And I know much of it. There's no danger at all. Well, once we've removed the possibility, there are certain things that the possibility of disaster is what makes it captivated. Well, that's a funny thing. Let's be honest. People are watching F1 part because of the danger. And if they say they're not, they're lying. So I don't, the All Star Saturday, I have a lot of things to do.
lot of feelings about the things the NBA needs to fix and needs to fix from a unilateral just a an edict from Adam Silver. Like not let's let's not have a committee. Let's not you know, it seems like they keep tweaking different all star approaches and none of them have worked. Well, it's like we're both married. It's like if our if our wives were like, hey, I'm going to try that tuna casserole again. And it's like, well, it was terrible the first 49 times you made it. No, but I was talking to one of my friends and they said if I use these different kind of breadcrumbs, it's going to be really good to sense like, all right. I guess it's going to suck. That's that Saturday night. It sucked every year. And the game, here's the only thing that could save the game. And it's not going to be. Can we go back? But I want to get to the game for in a second. The Saturday strip everything down. Forget all the all the contest in the events. What do people actually want to see? Like if you ask your son, if I ask my son, just be like, what do you want to see? The first thing they would say to me is I want to see Caitlin Clark and Sabrina trying to make threes and beating the NBA players. I think it would be the number one thing people want to see. The number two thing would be, I want to see the best players in the dunk contest, right? And that's really it for Saturday night. And then I don't know if you're going to go one on one tournament. No, because I think that I don't think the guys would care enough. I think they would do the half-ast. The Simres and Horace doesn't work. They don't want to be embarrassed. These guys always move into I don't want to be embarrassed mode. You'd really have to pick it carefully. Like you'd have to pick the people, like the Anthony Edwards types, who would be like, I'm actually going to take this seriously. So I mean, honestly, out of anything, I'd watch the Isaiah Stewart running off the bench contest over anything else. Isaiah Stewart, are you coming off to save a teammate, brisky attend-gabes suspension? I'd watch it. Do you think, slight non-sequitur, you guys have talked about how Joker, Joker wants to be, wants to do something with his horses and is kind of cursed by how good he is at basketball. Like, if there's a 100% chance that if Joker could make as much money doing whatever he does with his horses as he can in basketball, that's what he would do. So you think he'd run into a horse event where he rode a horse shooting through his- No, I was thinking about Isaiah Stewart. We all agree that Isaiah Stewart's real passion is fighting, right? Like if somebody was like, hey, you're NBA coach. And the contract is valid, but it's for the UFC. He'd be like, I'm never touching a basketball again. I mean, the fuck off. But the thing is, he's really good. Like that hurt the pistons that he's going to get suspended. I think he's just like the greatest teammate. He really takes things personally on behalf of his teammates, which I love. But we've also seen that go wrong over the- Yeah, on behalf of himself. He's the only person in 20 plus years who actually legitimately got mad at LeBron and one people I love. That's what I was going to say. He was going to fight LeBron. Yeah, and beat his ass is what was going to happen. Emei Doko was the only other one who- Emei and Zodai LeBron and was like, if we want to go, I'm right here. Yeah. Yeah, yeah. I don't think that would have worked out well for Emei. Isaiah Stewart maybe has the age advantage and would have had a- Would have had a shot. You have him like minus 180 over LeBron. Who? Isaiah Stewart? Yeah. Well, I mean, young Isaiah Stewart against old LeBron maybe. LeBron crafty. Like a little who leases our chavis. But I would have LeBron minus 400 over Koji, Emei, Edoca. Emei trying to act. He's a tough- He's a tough motherfucker though. I know he's a tough guy. I understand. I still love the- but this is foolishness. Wait, I interrupt you on your Sunday thing. How would you fix the game on Sunday? Was it fixable? Because I don't think it is. It's fixable in four years if your guy, Con Canippal, continues on this trajectory. And we just have to say, you know what? PC headlines be damned. I don't know where you're going. White guys versus black guys. Luca, Joker, Flag, Reeves, Canippal, against Wimbee, whomever. I'm telling you right now. You guys would play fucking hard. Like that. There would be a real edge to the game. It certainly would get a talking point going that way. Get a lot of attention. And we are getting close to a place where it'd be like, oh, that'd be a good game. Like there hasn't been a moment in the NBA in the last 50 years where if that ended up just by chance being the game, it would be you could see either team winning. But right now. I don't believe a super flag in Con Canippal and Austin Reed. Pete, Pritzel, out there. Yeah. But they also get all the Eastern Europeans. Like you get Luca, you get Joker, you have real talent. That's something in the meantime. I don't know what the hell you do. This US versus the world thing is not good. Nobody understands it. Here's the problem. I do this for a living. I don't totally, when they announce the All Star teams, I'm like, wait. I thought they were going to announce eight foreign guys, 16 Americans. They still did East West. I didn't understand any of it. I can't explain it in a sentence. Fire the guy who came up with the idea. Yes. That's right. Like it's a basketball contest. Can you explain in a sentence? Well, there's three guys in the world. Steve's eight. There's going to be a round. It's like, wait, you lost me five seconds in. This leads to. I really want to dive in Adam Silver here. I might even run into this weekend, so this could be awkward. I thought of this one. I've been talking about Seattle and Vegas in expansion for four years. I was like the first person to bring it up. I think it was serious for a while. Then I think they backed off when the media deal was as big as it was. Then I heard it was just going to be one team. Now there's been buzz for a while that maybe they're thinking about two again. There's a big coalition against it that Jim Dolan is a big part of. And somebody reported this week, it's back on. I think it'd be a huge mistake. And it ties into the other biggest issue that the league has now is the tanking, which has become Groundhog Day. Every February we do this. That's like the first time everybody realized the tankings terrible. And new ways to what the jazz have done this past week is unprecedented. We're going to have two more teams. When we already have eight teams on February seventh that have punted on the season, eight of the 30 teams have punted. We're going to add two more that don't give a shit. Why would they do this? Like to me, there's like huge fundamental issues with the league that they're just yadda yadda and pointing to all the media money they've made and the fact that their players are famous and that everybody loves the playoffs. Like the regular season has real issues. It's too long. Guys are getting hurt too much. Everybody is making so much money. The only reason I have 82 games is because you make money from it. You go down to 70. You make less money. Guess what? Devon Booker instead of making $75 million in 2028. Who makes 73? He'll be fine. All this shit, everything they're doing, they're not serving the larger picture of what do fans want? How do we keep our players healthy? How do we have a competitive season from start to finish? How do we avoid over one fourth of our league, not giving a shit for the last two months? How do we fix this? And it's the first time I've really wondered like, do we have the right guy running the league? Because he doesn't seem interested in actually fixing real problems that everybody can see. And it's not about like look at the NBA cup. Oh, we created this thing. It's like, your schedule is too long. You have to fix this. It's too long. It should be 70 games. So I, I want to, first of all, that's a, that's a great, great three minute Simmons rant. Yeah, I just said that first take rant. Jesus. That was, that was great. That's a great rant. So I got fired up. No, but, but the, the, the, is Adam Silver, a wartime console, Yeri, and does anyone in the NBA office understand it's wartime that I don't care to your point. The media deal is separate from the overall health of the league long term. I, I listened to obviously to your conversation with Chuck about his great book. Yeah. Um, and he talked about kind of a sidebar to your conversation was the ebbs and flows of leagues and popularity and what has been in the, in the sports fan site guy so the last hundred years. And one of the lessons of that is no league, no sport has a lifetime license to importance or to being a major, major American sport. And the arrogance any of the leagues could have, which is it couldn't happen to us is concerning. Major league baseball for whatever criticisms people have, their commissioner who I think is fair. There's a lot of fair criticisms of him. He said, you know what? We have real issues right now. And I don't give a shit if people.
think these changes are too drastic. I am just going to by edict change some of the rules and make the sport because ultimately it's all entertainment. This is the entertainment business. We're fighting for eyeballs. We're fighting for interest with Broadway, with the other leagues, with TikTok, with everybody. We've got to become more engaging. And the NBA's right now refusal to me address what are there in a three front war of what are real threats. Front one, I'm not going to pretend to be smart enough to understand what she is. Something about the way modern basketball is played. Modern athletes bodies are not really able to handle. And we have more. >> Yeah, more guy LeBron said this on more than a game and it kind of came and went the moment, but he's like basketball is way harder to play now. It just is. >> Yes. >> I'm telling you, I've been here for 20 plus years. It's harder to play now. There's more running. There's more stop and start. There's more sprint thing. It's harder. >> They're not going to listen to him. >> They're going to listen to him. What the fuck? >> And you've talked about how the, you know, the canary in the coal mine is the Achilles and how that used to exclusively be an old guy injury and it's not anymore and the soft tissue issues. So that is a big, I'm not saying there's a simple fix to that, but that is something that is >> Fixing the grid, get rid of the Euro step. How about that as a fix? How about? >> Change the rules dramatically. >> How about like the footwork shooting coaches and I don't have to name them, but how come certain clients of certain shooting coaches seem to have lower leg injuries all the time? It's because they're putting too much stress on their lower legs. Tyree's Howard Burn and Jason Tatum shouldn't be blowing out their Achilles at 826-27. >> It's ridiculous. So that's the first one. And that's the, I didn't got the hardest one to solve, but it might be as important as any. The second one is this. And this one, I don't care if I sound like an old guy as I said, I'm a grandfather, I'm allowed to be an old guy. >> Grandpa Nick. >> Part of every sport has an identity that makes it special. For football, it's violence, it just is. It's just the only thing, but there is a violence to it that attracts us. >> I think football is violence and strategy combined. >> Sure. >> Yeah. >> Those two things together makes it the most popular sport. >> Baseball, it's kind of nostalgia and the fact that it just reminds you to a place in the year, a place in your life, summertime outdoors, the feeling of that, that all of that. And basketball for me, for my entire childhood and young adult life was holy shit, is that guy flying? Like it is crazy athletes. It is crazy feats about let us just mix in with balletic brilliance. And- >> And I would throw on coolness too. Even in the 70s going to games, the basketball players just seem like the coolest fucking guys in my life. And that's been the case ever since. And what the analytics revolution and three point shot has done to what is rewarded, what style of play is smart, and what types of athletes succeed in the league has taken away an enormous amount of what was the NBA's identity, which was the rewarding getting to the rim and rewarding different styles of play. And so when I say on this one, I have some drastic suggestions that seem insane, but I don't think in, I don't think in radical changes are out of line. Like on, I loved the Hollinger idea of every team draws their own three point line up to and including a team like the, I don't know, the nuggets three years ago if they were like, we're not having one. And if we get home court, you better be able to win games going by two. And every, it makes the regular season matter more because home court matters more and teams need different styles. I've said and people laugh at me like I'm joking and I kind of am, but I'm kind of, I'm jealous of that three point line idea. He's had that forever, but it's a great idea. It's such a great idea. It's basically the outfield wall on baseball. Every outfield wall is different. And that's how we do it. And in different parks, it's like, oh, shit, we're going to Finway. It'd be like, oh man, we're going to Golden State. Remember, there are three point lines from 40 feet out, you know, whatever it is. And the other, the one I've said that people think I'm joking, but I'm only kind of joking. Hey, everything stays the same except for one small rule change. Dunks also worth three. Dunks also worth three, by the way. And see if you prioritize athletes and a different style of play. And again, that seems insane. And I'm not saying, and the NBA historian part of me doesn't even like it even though it's my own idea. I'm like, yeah, what would you do to the record books? But the sport is on a key to shaky ground because the smartest way to play is not the most attractive way to play. And that thing gets us to the third thing. So you have the tanking. All right. So you have style of play. You have the injury stuff. Yeah. And now you have the tanking. Those are your big three. And the tanking is an abomination. And the fact that it hasn't been nipped in the bud by the, I don't care if you want to go to Mike Zarein's draft wheel. I don't care if you want to go to your idea of, hey, you are whatever pick you had in last year's draft, if it's in the lottery, yeah, you are guaranteed a pick at best three spots worse. So if you have the number one pick, you're captain for if you had, you know, whatever it is. You can't care if you can have two top four picks two years in a row. You can't. So that that kills. So Dallas, Antonio, Philadelphia and Charlotte had top four picks last year. None of them are eligible. So Dallas, tank yourself away. You can only get the fifth pick, but knock yourself out. I also would be, I don't understand how you can see what you saw as done the last couple games. Well, the one which is this week is, I, they made a made history with that with it. Really good players just not playing the fourth quarter in early February. It's not even April yet. It's not even March yet. It's not even Valentine's day yet. It's not the old star game. These guys are actually all sitting. Jan Jackson and Lori Markett and are just sitting on the bench and they win anyway, which was the funniest thing. Well, but it is, but think about what we're saying here. The Utah Jazz traded for a really good player. Yeah. With the intention being, yeah, of course, he's not going to help us win games. The Hawks traded for two players with the intention of, well, not for this year. And we're all fine with it. I shouldn't say we're fine with it. The leaks fine with it. You mean the winters, not the Hawks. Oh, yeah, I apologize. They traded with the Hawks. Yeah, they got tre young and Anthony Davis to never play him. I was in there's injuries. How do the jazz like? Yeah, but here's my question back to you. How do you blame them? The whole point. So I'm going to go back and I want to keep going on your three things, but I'm going to go back to 1984, which was the birth year of taking. This was this was the Jonas Salk polio vaccine of tanking. Hakeem and Jordan are the draft prizes. It's still a coin toss for the first pick. It's so good. Everyone has traded away their first round picks in dumb trades. Indiana, they're one of the worst teams. They'd already traded their pick for Tom Owens. Cleveland, they're one of the worst teams. They'd already traded their pick for Mike Bratz. The Quippers, they'd already traded their pick for World B free. So the only two teams that controlled their own picks that were bad were Chicago and Houston. Chicago starts out 15 and 17. At some point, they're like, huh, they finished 12 and 38. They lose fourth into the last 15. They get blame for tanking. I went and looked at the roster. Their guys all played. I think they had a lot of like drug stuff and weird shit on that team. I'm not even positive. They're tanking. You know who was tanking though? Houston. Houston is Ralph Samson. Yeah. They start out 20 and 26. They finished nine and 27. Their last 36. They lose 14 to 17. Nine of the last 10. There's a famous game that is the birth of tanking. They're the last game of the year. They're playing San Antonio. They need to lose. Game goes to overtime. They lose it overtime. Samson only plays 22 minutes. He is a 22 and 11. They don't play him basically second half. Elvin Hays is on this team. You know Elvin Hays is one of the title of the bullets. Top 50 guys. Yeah. I would say one. Yeah, I would say one of the top 50 top 60 whatever. He's washed up at this point. He's playing 12 minutes a game. He's at the tail end of his career. He's like, I don't know, pick somebody now that's. He's Chris Paul. He plays all 53 minutes of an overtime game. Go seven for 20 16 points. They lose. They never take them out. And they're joking after like he needs an IV. He might need to take them to the hospital. Their way of tanking was to just put up and haze out to fucking die. So what happens? He used to get the first.
pick. They win the coin toss. They get a Kim ol' Aja on. Chicago gets their pick. They get Michael Jordan. And everybody's like, this is fucked up. We have a lottery the next year. And we haven't figured out since. This was 1984. So this is 42 years ago now. Yeah. 42 years later, after this event of the oven haze game, we have Lori market in Jaron Jackson completely healthy, not playing it for the quarters. 42 years later, they have not figured this out. So all right, two things quickly. But by the way, it's worth it. They got Chicago got Michael Jordan. He used to got a Kim ol' Aja on. Would they do it again? Yeah. Of course. But so two things. First one is this. There is nothing you've ever said about LeBron Patrick Mahomes or my hair that hurt me more than you questioning if I knew who Elvin Hayes was. I just want to make sure. That's fair. I like your hair. Thank you. No, it was house. You killed it. I was just here. Obviously. Yeah. I mean, give me a ride. Come on. But um, the I don't know the year you'll know the game. Not that long ago. March. There you go. gratuitous tanking was games 79, maybe 80 yes, 81 and 82 fine. Mark Madsen green light from three no problem. And we kind of like like yeah. And we kind of all were like, okay, we understand it. Like we get that at the very end of the year. But the mission creep of that to where we are now is going. And I, I do think that the simplest solution in addition to what you're describing, about you can't, you know, if you have top four, your next ice you can have a spiver or whatever might simply be. It is back to a version of the viewing lottery, which was everyone has the same on. Like you everyone is at. I call it. Now it's in my book in 2009. And then I somehow got off of that idea. And now I think I'm creeping back onto it. I, it now, it's possible. The negative impact of that would then be teams that could be in the playoffs would be like, nope, we want to miss the playoffs to get in. But I think if you just have playing teams are not eligible because the worst case there would be a playing team being like, ah, we're not going to do anything anyway. And they tank the playing game, which would be an absolute disgrace. So playing teams are not eligible to do that. No of the same odds. The worst 10 teams say mods across the board 10% across the board. And with real harsh penalties, if there is any indication that a team is attempting to avoid making the plan. He's already, he's already been too soft on that. Can I throw an idea at you? Because I think that no top four pick two years in row would solve some of this. Any team that falls below 27 wins for this season. So you have to go 27 and 55. That's the cutoff line for every, every loss under that. You lose a million dollars in cap space for the next season per loss. 2% refund for season ticket holders per loss for the next season. So if I'm, if I'm, ah, I don't know, wizard season ticket holder and they go 16 and 66. They go 11 games under the cutoff. I have 22% off my tickets for the next year. Just like, just blanket. It's, I'm actually, we're taking money out of their pocket. Plus they would lose 12 million in cap space for the next year. So you couldn't do the thing where it's like we're tanking, but then next year we're going to go for it. It's like, no, you can't do that. You didn't take last season seriously. We're taking some of your cap space. We're lowering your luxury tax and we're fucking you over on this because this is not right. Yeah. I'm, I am, I'm fine with like extreme penalties. I would be fine with what they said. Hey, just so you know, um, if you get the number one pick of the draft, if in that number one picks rookie contract, you make the playoffs. It's five road to home in the first round. I would be fine with rast. Yeah. And it was, and it's like, I, nobody, you know, who ends up with Cooper flag is going to actually be bummed about it. But they, that there is like, you can't do relegation in the NBA, but something that is relegation ish where there is a real negative impact of being awful. Well, that, so that, so the way to relegate is cap space. Yeah. That's right. Like it, like to actually like hurt a team's ability to make themselves better and to penalize them. The thing to me that I always go back to is the season ticket holders. Like, they have to pay full price for this shit. You're newton, you're loyal to the team. And I like you, I like their owner at Danny Angels there. Like, I get why they're doing what they're doing because the rules aren't telling them not to do it. So they're actually playing this correctly. But it's not fair. Now Utah's, this is three years in a row where they haven't given a shit about the season. They have Lori marketing who's top 25 guy, top 30 guy. But, but so that is when you, what you just said there is a huge key to hiding also the three point issue, which is just directly contradicting incentives. And I actually had a Sloan conference 10 years ago or eight years ago, name, well, I moderated a panel and our friend Darryl was on it. And I asked him then basically, how do you square the circle of the smartest way to build a basketball team, which is your job might not be the best way for the league to grow. And he said, I am not my job does not allow me to be concerned with anything other than what is the best path possible to build a champion, whether that style of play, how we approach things, whatever, he said, and I'm paraphrasing him, it's the league's job to worry about those other things and put the rules in place to make sure the smartest way to win a championship and build a team does not contradict with the smartest way to grow the sport. And that's where I think the league has failed. I don't think it is an extreme position to say they have failed in that what you're saying is these tanking teams, it's smart for Milwaukee. You know what you should do, not play honest the rest of the year. But look at the people that we think are the best general managers or the best run teams, right? San Antonio tank twice. Yes, right? Okay, see, Presti shut down SGA. I think two years in a row, Danie and with the Celtics, not 2007, the team through Paul Pierce was healthy, they threw him away for the last, all the smart teams have done this, Darrell would do it. I mean, it went out of control with the process, but everything we're talking about is tied together though. The schedule being too long. Sean marks too. But the schedule, tanking, actually, like you can solve a lot of the problem by fixing both at the same time. If you have a shorter schedule, like I look at the Premier League, which has a way shorter schedule than the NBA would ever do, but it leads to some really great things. And you have like, Leicester was able to win that one year partly because the schedule, the sample size was smaller and they got lucky. But if you have a 70 game season or 72, whatever, better for the players, you could space stuff out better. It's more egregious of guys don't play. And you also cut down the last three weeks of the tanking, right? Like I'd conknip on my podcast in December and I gave him a ride back. Or maybe he said this on a pod. I can't remember, but we were talking about, do you ever get to practice? He's a rookie. He's 20. We think like, man, it might be important for con to practice. He just got in the lead. He said they had not a practice at home in six weeks. How was that like in six weeks, they hadn't practiced in the practice center of Charlotte when I saw him in December or January, whenever that was? Like it's like, and Steve Kirst is the same thing. And these press conferences, if you want a free like two minute answer from Steve Kirst, ask him when he thinks of the schedule because he'll talk about it every time. It's like, we don't get to practice. Our guys are playing hurt. Our guys are band up. The sports too hard. The season's too long. Now Kirst is hurt. Like this is part like I was going to go the Leicester game. We're taping this on a Tuesday afternoon. It was going to be a day they rested all their dudes today. And it's like, now I'm not going to go. Yeah. Momentous by the way, because of that moment of silence. Lebron's incomprehensible 21 20 straight all of the days officially dead. I know that he'd listen. He probably wasn't going to make it anyway, but now he won't hit the 65 game threshold. Yeah, I mean, that is a week. And again, this part is cliche at this point. Everybody knows this is an issue. But people coach man, Jeannie, my dear friend and new contributor to first things first. Spies whistleblower, I'll never forget about it.
Turned out he's one of these very men turn around. I had him on my back. I guess once he He and his son were in New York two weeks ago when he was doing the show and They had tickets to Lakers Nets Because he wanted his son to see LeBron Sunday they live in Cleveland, Son's a huge LeBron fan and He talked with me a ton the days leading up to it like Do I need to also buy tickets to Lakers Nets? Because how confident are we that LeBron's going to play and now you know LeBron If they take their chance right right and so but that is such a You can't be and I know people have heard this for but it's so maddening they haven't fixed it You can't be a league Where you are just stars stars market the stars come see our stars our stars carriers and by the way if you go see a game The stars may or may not play to disaster And we're also in five different channels right now and you have to spend 10 seconds remembering what day it is for the Peacock game or Whatever I love the NBA. This is why I care. This is why I wrote a seven-eighth underpage book about it once I would say anything we have talked about for the last 40 minutes to anybody who works for the league I know a lot of people that work for the week. I like the people that work for the week. They know this is a problem and The schedule thing comes down to money and that's it and it starts with that and then the tanking thing also comes down to money and Comes down to coming up with real penalties that would decentivize Somebody like Utah who clearly Utah is Jaron Jackson. They've Lori Markinan They have Kantey George who's been a breakout star They're gonna have another lottery pick and they obviously want to be good next year. Will Hardey's gonna, you know Probably develop a drinking problem If they're if they're actually penalized for how they're handling this year with the cap And the cap comes backwards by 12 million or whatever because of the way they're behaving Maybe they don't behave that way like they have to start thinking about the stuff So here's my question for you because I don't know the people in the league the way you do I but I do care about it the same way you do like this is My whole life up until probably Ten years ago at most I'd be honest probably till my homes came into my life I would have said the NBA is my favorite by a mile. Yeah, and now I don't feel that way I feel like the NFL is slightly ahead of it. Um, I'm like I'm 50 50 and I never used to be 50 50 I was always at me first correct me to I love the league so much I Understand on an intellectual level why shortening the season is a hard-ass because of the money I get it It's six long games for every team. No, I I I think they should do it. You're talking 12 million a year plus TV money Maybe it's 20 million per team split with the players that cost everybody 10 million a year I agree with you. I I agree with you 100% but I still understand why that's hard. I Don't understand why penalizing tanking is hard why right why can that not just be a red line Hey, you taught congrats on what you did this week. You don't have your first round pick now So do whatever the fuck you want to do But you're talking about wartime. Could sell your Adam Silver being like I've had it. You do that again I'm gonna I'm gonna suspend you So another theory that or another idea that a couple readers had was could you suspend ping pong balls? Love it. Yeah, so with Utah They do the lower market and Jaron Jackson thing Adam Silver's like I didn't like that You're gonna be 20 ping pong balls shy at the lottery. Well that you could I'm taking away 20 And this is where I you need to just have hey You need to have a commissioner who people trust is ethical which I believe the league has I don't think people think Adam Silver's That I need someone who they trust is ethical, but you might need a Rool and asshole at this point you might need like mid-2000s David Stern Right, and but the rule needs to be you know if The more lenient than what it takes to overturn a call in the NFL basically like if I think That's fishy you might get penalized It's like you know as though and you're gonna have to trust me that I'm not playing favorites I'm not but just so you know if I think you are not on a night and night out basis trying to win basketball games Yeah, you might end up out of the lottery no matter what you might end up Having real penalties that go against what the whole you think the whole purpose of this is I I don't think it's that hard So the ping pong balls with the lottery um I forget how many there there are for each team Well, there's I mean I can do that. There's a thousand total. So if you ask that's right. Yeah, so the top team gets Or the top would have a two hundred every year. Yeah. Yeah, so 130 would be a 13% trade ping pong balls Like maybe ping pong balls are part of the answer with this Adam Could penalize people ping pong balls when he sees fit and there's just less ping pong balls than the in the thing I mean it's sad that we're have to come up with dumb ideas like this. It this already should have been solved Because there's nothing with the league They do this new cba they basically put in a hard cap right you saw these teams scrambling to get under the tax making their teams worse It's a hard cap because yet again, they took advantage of the players association which got its ass kicked I think for the fifth or sixth time in my lifetime by Go figure by a bunch of rich dudes with like better lawyers They just figured out how to do this cut the costs Because they're gonna make as much money as they can from everything possible Right He could still be kind of a hard-ass with the owners. They all won. They're all winning They all made a cajillion dollars already like start start cracking a little bit Adam Silver Well, that's the part of it And that gets back to the point I was making about the difference from shortening the season fixing tanking Shortening the season I You're right. It would be better long term. I think everyone would make more money It's it's there's a million reasons to do it the one reason they wouldn't do it is those 30 owners would be like wait So 12 million less ad doesn't sound great to me and you don't want to have that fight But there is no it doesn't cost the owner's money To fix the tanking all it takes is a stern will yeah actually enforce your book your rules on the books You have anti-tanking rules just like you have anti-flopping rules that don't get enforced yeah you can simply say like two Teams hey you are allowed if you would like to trade away your best players That is fine. You are allowed to set you do things where you were like we're not there yet So we are you are allowed if you're the Pacers and you see Haliburton's hurt and you want to I know they didn't trade miles turn let miles turn or walk You're allowed to build your team however you want right but once the season begins Those guys who are paid to play pro basketball and the coach who was paid to try to win games If you're not doing it You there is no world where that's good for you. There is no world where People can come on this podcast and be like Mill walking not playing yonis is smart that's not smart That's a warrant and it would never be accepted in the league that keeps growing in the NFL It would never be accepted for At the at the before thanks giving much less before or you know they wouldn't be accepted to Christmas But if the what's a good example this year if the cowboys After the first six weeks of the season was like we're sitting duck Preska Because we really want Julian love out of Notre Dame. Is he hurt? Well, he had that injury last year and you know We're just being careful. But let's be honest. We're not playing for anything You think Roger Gidell would accept if the cowboys were like I know we're playing on Thanksgiving But duck Prescott and CD-Lam and George Pickens aren't because we want to lose the game Well the players are out there will try but we actually want to lose no they wouldn't it would be an outrage Yeah, they'd be probably afraid of the reaction from the person in charge of the league correct, it's As I said, this has been a 42 year problem and it's funny that it becomes A talking point from people like us right after football ends because people look around They're like NBA dog days. What is there to talk about and the irony is we have more good players than we've ever had in the league Since I was a year at a college So it's the most high-end town we've ever had and a trade violinist that had over 80 guys on it Night to night It's been the most entertaining kind of group of games. There's always one awesome game every night We have all these young players that have come in the lead that I love watching this last rookie class was a home run And it seems like this next rookie class is a grand slam the answer to all of this isn't to expand the two teams And don't fix the tanking and don't really fix anything including like what's gonna happen in the clippers thing Like What's gonna happen Because just because
because did it happen? Did it not happen? We've had three months to look at it. Everybody's talking about it. If there's not a smoking gun, does that mean they looked the other way? Like that's been another topic. It's weird. It's just weird. We always talk about. And then the other thing that people are talking about is like, Yo-Kitch isn't going to be an all-n-b-a. He's going to, if he plays 63 minutes, but he plays 21 hundred minutes. If he's 20 within the week in minutes, but only plays 63 games, he's not eligible. Well, the all-n-b-a thing, if you got, there aren't, you couldn't find 10 people in the world who care more about historical accuracy of the all-n-b-a. Two of them are more than you have made. Right. Exactly. So like it is- Two thousand minutes. Just make it 65 games or two thousand minutes. Or again, make it with at the commissioner's discretion. Like the, again, so I'm not going to get it. So I am all, all use LeBron as a for instance, pretend for a moment LeBron was playing at the level he was at two years ago. Yeah. Okay. Just for just for the sake of this discussion. If a guy in year 23 at 70,000 minutes suffered an injury before the year, a real injury and had to miss 15, miss the first 15 games of the year. And then over the next 67 games played 62 out of 67. It's like, nope, that guy's ineligible for everything. That guy, that's the stupidest thing I've ever heard in my life. Like that's, that's not, but I understand why they did it the way they did it because they were trying to crack down a little bit on guys just skipping games, like which goes back to your story about the nicks and the, that's game and not knowing when LeBron is going to be there. So at least in this case, the spirit of it was okay. I just think they came up with the wrong numbers. I agree with you. What's the one bigger question now? Do you think the NBA does this intentionally? Do you think they're intentionally level up? Yeah. Controversy. They're intentionally flawed. They like this. They like that. We're doing segments about this. They like that. We talk about the league and how we should fix this and they should do this and they should do that. Like because that's the only explanation I have because some of these fixes are so easy and simple. Like literally nobody likes the instant replay thing. Nobody. Not one person. Nobody's like, oh, cool. Last two minutes of the game. Now it's going to take a half hour. This will be fun. Nobody likes it. They just bring it back. It's like they like that. We don't like it. So if they, if that is true, I think it is a massive strategic error. Maybe answer, maybe answer replay is not because actually with it like the ratings still go up the late like the longer the game goes. So maybe that's fine. But the other stuff I think is outrageous. But here's the other reason why I think it is a real threat, if you will. Yeah. One thing leagues. Correct. I've never liked, but they are correct about the reason they have rules about celebrations and taunting is because kids emulate. I've always thought that's stupid. I've always listened. I had a kid who played college basketball and was a high level all state level Texas basketball player. And I told him the same thing I would tell anyone tell their kids like, hey, here's the rules. Once your games are on national TV, you can act like the guys on national TV until then your high school athlete, you know, conductors of such. But they are correct. Kids, whether it's the three goggles or the style of play emulate the pros. And I'm watching this kid at Kansas, who is emulating the pros and appears in a different way, which is. Yeah, I don't really need to play all the time. And that's concerning. That's good. This guy you were taught you guys were talking about as the best guard prospects sense. Dwayne Wade or sense. No, no, probably since these Carter North Carolina. Right. So just that may be even better than him. Maybe like the Kobe level potential talent potential. Right. And. They're playing the number one team in the nation at home. Yeah, but that's the, but this is like all I need to know if I'm drafting. Because the number one thing that we know that I'm older than you. Yeah, it's like psychotic competitiveness, Cooper flag. Just like right now, like he just like being like I'm getting my ass kicked. I'm going to keep working that to get better. Anyway, I can LeBron in year 23. Still getting up at five in the morning, you used to fucking Versa Climber. He has every record that exists. What makes him use the Versa Climber at five in the morning, because he, I don't know. There's something inside him. And it worries me that this kid's at Kansas being like, I don't know. I don't know if I'm playing today. It reminds me of Ben Simmons at LSU, which was a red flag when that happened. But my question would be, is there any chance? Oh, it's a double down. Right. It is 20 years ago. If he has the exact same makeup, exact same everything. So there any chance that happens. Or is it like, no, of course I'm playing. Of course I am playing. And so it just, it is trickled down. All of this stuff has trickled down. And do you, I know your, like have you been to a, I guess you have no reason to go to one, but I'm talking like middle school basketball game. It's just three. All of it is. I'm letting the folks, yeah, my, both my kids are in high school. Yeah, it's just pull up. It's fast breaks. The two kids dart out to the sides instead of trying to get a lot. And I know, I know we sound like old cranking men right now. I don't mean to, but what I'm saying is there are, there are real things. There are great things about the NBA. There are things better now about the NBA than ever before. You're point about the depth of talent about how I think it is a testament to the league, the whole weak link theory that it's less about do you have the best guy and more about can you put out five really good players. I think that's all awesome. Everybody plays really hard, which we should point out too. Like that, like there's an intensity to these games when the people do play that people are playing defense. They really like it's always a part of the play and it's smarter and the strategy is so much more sophisticated and all of that stuff. And we have gotten more if we were like, hey, what are the 10 greatest old guy seasons in NBA history eight of them are LeBron, Steph and KD over the last four years. Like we are, we are the all time greats are playing longer. There's so many great things about the league. And then there are these giant warts that seem so obvious to not be directly attacking them head on is frustrating because they're never going to lose you in me ever. But to bring in the larger tent and young people to care is important for the health of the league. Well, you made the key point earlier. You mentioned baseball who realized they were at a crisis point. They were they were at a much more dangerous point than the NBA is. But they realize like we have to fix this. This is like they did it drastically. This is this is like a real problem. Our sport might be going sideways here and they fixed it. And I think the problem I have with the NBA is they think everything's fine because the media deals they signed and because people like their players, which I said at the top. And that that they're still real issues here that are going to get worse. And you could stop it now or you could wait four years from now and be like, oh, shit, we should done this four years ago. And that's just where we are. All right, Nick right. I took too much of your time. This was really fun. No, I felt like we had to do this. I was excited to do it. Well, it was night. You had me on for the first time when as you put it once the chiefs were dead. So it was nice to come on. I had to do the right thing. Yeah. And I guess I'll see you in a few days at the clutch sports all star. Let's see. There's very possible you might. All right. Great to see it. Thank you. It's time for a special part of today's episode. It's brought to you by Miklob Ultra. A really good beer. You should try it to superior light beer. Best serve cold kind of like all the best weirdest, funniest, strangest moments of the NBA season so far. We're heading toward all star weekend. And it's a good time to reflect on all the things that we've seen over the past. What is it? Three and a half months, four months, whatever it is. I have a mini mail bag we're going to do six questions to six tiny questions that I'm going to bounce off from this season. First one's from Justin Cario. And he asks, do you realize that small game James has been sitting there out in the open as a dink name for James Harden all this time? Frankly astonishing that Bill Simmons hasn't been using it. I agree. It's it's petty. It's unfair. It's a little mean spirited. It's right in my willhouse. Big game James obviously was James worthy who, you know, for the record 1984 finals game two through the past that got picked up by Joe Anderson Celtics tie at they going over time they win it. He said the name. He became big game James thanks to game seven 1988 finals. It was just a great big game player in general. Not too late for this to happen to James.
We'll see, but for now small game James is pretty good. Next one from Matt from Ethica. Can we get a quick clarification on the Ewing Therialge ball for Jordan and the resurgent Cornus? He means Michael Jordan. Wow. Here's my answer. I can't believe he's smirching the goat, Michael Jordan, but Michael Jordan deserves it 'cause he was a really, really, truly terrible owner. This isn't Ewing Therial. Ewing Therialge is, you lose a player who's considered to be a superstar and then he gets hurt and the team inexplicably plays better with that one. That's not the Ewing Therialge because if you win a championship, you're an eligible. I think there's a cousin of the Ewing Therialge, which I would call the Yauke family trust theory. This is what happened with the Red Sox where they had the Yauke family on the Red Sox. First time Yauke, he died, gave it to his wife. She got old, she had a trust running it. I can't remember if she even died or not near the end, but the trust was terrible. Fenway Park was a pit. The area around it sucked. The team didn't spend enough money and everybody was really, really frustrated about what was happening with the team and then the team got bought by John Henry and Tom Warner and Larry the keynote. And it was basically, and I remember writing about the set the time, like, it was the very cool, nice boyfriend following the terrible boyfriend. That's what the new owners became. And I wonder if the Yauke family trust theory could apply here to the Hornets because they have a really good ownership, they had a smart coach, they make smart moves, they're actually building a team that has a sense of purpose. This is what happens. It's the opposite. We have new owner syndrome when we have situations like Matt Eschby on people like that when they come in, they try to get crazy. The Yauke theory, that's where you want to be if you have somebody taking over a team. This also happened to Warris, which you'll like, up by the way. Next one, Doug from Chapel Hill. Why don't we call the Yaunes Trade Derby the freak out? It's pretty good. Kind of maddened and think of that, freak out. And by the way, we didn't end up freaking out 'cause it didn't get traded, which leads to the next one from Jack O, not the same Jack O, I checked the email address. He said, "I see your point that I made in the trade deadline podcast that Yaunes could have forced his hand and right near the trade deadline and forced to trade somewhere and he didn't." But he says, "Sastorically, we have scrutinized rightfully hard and Katie, Kyrie, et cetera for saying, I want out or never stop. Shouldn't we be talking positively about Yaunes not being a jerk, keeping in-house for the most part and handling this like a respectable employee." It's a fair take. Here's my counter. He never really 100% did that. He never came out and said, "I don't want to be traded. Please take my name out of these trade rumors. I want to retire Milwaukee." He just never said it. He was kind of like, "I don't know." He was like, "Watching one of your friends being wishy-washy about whether they're going to break up with somebody or not." And then the day after all of a sudden he did that, the deal with the prediction company. And it just felt like the whole thing was a roost to get attention. And if I was a bucks fan, I wouldn't like to be happy that we kept Yaunes and maybe you scratch him for the air, you get a lottery pick. But it wasn't like a Dirk-Than-Witsky situation. Where Dirk-Than-Witsky was just like, I'm never getting traded from Dallas. If I get traded, I'm not going to my next thing. It was basically what he said. I feel like Curry's like that. I was going to stay in Milwaukee. And Yaunes said, "Never." Yaunes was always kind of like, he's getting dressed up and going out to the nightclub, showing some cleavage at the trade deadline. And then pretending he wasn't doing that. I think he was. So next question is from pH. He said, "Can we agree that Chris Paul officially had the worst retirement toward NBA history?" It was pretty bad. The worst one ever though was Elgin Bailer, who was on the 1971-72 Lakers. And his knees were just completely broken down at that point. And instead of having retirement toward him, he kind of abruptly retired. He just felt like he wasn't playing as standards. And we just over. And then the Lakers went on to win 33 straight games, which is still a record. And then they won Jerry West on the title. And not only did Elgin Bailer not just pay any of that, but then he became a famous U-A-Therry. We didn't know what the U-A-Therry was in 1972. That's the worst retirement toward him. Because Elgin Bailer was one of the 15 best players of all time. And probably when he retired, one of the best 10. So now he's probably in the 20. But that was pretty bad to abruptly retire and then watch your team win the title without you. This Chris Paul thing wasn't great. Last question, Nick from North Carolina. The way the Kings and Bulls keep trading with each other is hilarious. I agree. Even in three team trades, they cannot stay away from each other. It's pretty funny. It's like when your friend gets another friend from college or something and the office suddenly bring them along whenever and wherever. It's like, I know we've had this plan to go to Topgolf for weeks, but can my friend Ralph Tagelon or like when a big brother has to bring his little brother along with him to meet up with friends. I wonder if the vet has to check in with the Bulls before pulling the trigger on some of these trades he makes. Hey, I'm about to get fleeced at another deal. You want in. I don't know. It's too funny. I agree. The Bulls and Kings, when you see them in a trade together, the only thing you know for sure is that you want to be the third team. It's Bulls Kings. I want to be the third team. I don't even care who's in the trade. That's where I want to be. The vet just brings an incredible amount of comedy. He's going to probably not enjoy the live show with the Wiltson Theater tomorrow night. The only thing I want to do before we wrap up the six pack. Let's talk about a superior all-star player. I have my eye on Jamal Murray because Jamal Murray has come out and said, I care about this game. I'm going to try really hard. Let's see if anyone can follow your example, Jamal Murray. That's it for today's six pack. Go grab your own six pack, Miklo Baltra. Plus, Miklo Baltra is giving you a chance to win exclusive prizes, including Courtside tickets and more at
[email protected]/courtside. Miklo Baltra superior is worth playing for. Miklo Baltra Courtside 2526, no purchase necessary. Open a US residence, 21 plus. It begins on October 1st, 2025, ends on June 30th, 2026. Multiple entry periods, see official rules at Miklo Baltra.com/courtside for free entry, entry deadlines and prizes and details. All right, last but not least, my dad is here. He thought I was banning him from being on Netflix one of his favorite streaming services, but he's depressed. You'd big blizzard, the past loss, Celtics made a trade, not looking as good, and you were in a great mood with sports a month ago, and now I'm worried about you. I don't know what's going on with you, some checking in. - I was in a great mood two weeks ago. - Yeah. - A week and a half ago. I'm not a big fan so far of the Celtic trade. As you know, I think it upset the chemistry. I love the way Simon's played. He gave them energy and was a great score of the bench. And it's gonna take them a while to get some chemistry with this guy. Maybe it will work out. I hope so. - Did you figure out a pronounces name yet or no? - No, I just called Book. - Okay. Do you wanna give it a try and see how good it is? - Book of it, Tray. - It's up like that. - Bucybitch. You've always liked him though. He was one of your, I always liked him guys, but unfortunately now he's in his mid 30s. - Yeah, I always liked him. I didn't know he was gonna be 36 years old soon, but I liked him. I wish we had traded for him five years ago. - Yeah, I went to the game Friday night to Miami game and then obviously they sucked on a Sunday night. But yeah, we were just worried about going from three guards to two. When the team what was working was these three guards that they were interchangeable. They could play off the ball, like with the ball. You always had two of them out there and you could feel the shift, but they, it feels like Tatum's coming back for real. I mean, every check mark and it really seems like beginning of March, there's two home games in the beginning of March. It feels like it's gonna be one of those. - Yeah, it's the only thing that's getting me through the lack of chemistry that we have right now after the trade. - Oh, I thought you were gonna say the end of the Patriots season. - No, no. - My concerns about Drake Mayn. Okay. - But they know Tatum's coming back. - Yeah. - They know that they're gonna get scoring that they didn't have before to take the place of Simon's. I still though like the three guard movement. - I did it too. - And I was like the three guards coming back with Tatum, but and I understand the money thing and it's a shame. All these moves we've made in the last 10 months for all money motivated, but I guess that's the new NBA. - Well, you know, there's two ways to think about it with the tax and I don't mean to defend the Celtics and you're coming on after a segment where we were really critical of the NBA with their schedule and a whole bunch of things for a half hour. So with the Celtics though, getting out of the tax for one year then enables you to have all the spending flexibility for the next three basically. And I think that I don't think fans fully understand that because on the surface you see like, oh, they're just cheap, they don't wanna pay it. And it's like, no, actually like now they can go all in on next season where they have this trade exception and you know, they can actually outspend some of the people that are competing against who are more hampered by the tax. That's how that's the glass half full reason for it. The glass half empty is pay the fucking tax. You just pay the tax for the team. - I understand all that. It's just, you know, I don't know how many more windows we have with this current makeup with Tatum and Brown and the people that are trying to surround them with. And are you worried about Tatum coming back when it's kind of Jalen Brown's team now? - I am worried because, you know,
was a bent to the games like and you've been a couple. And this is a different Jalen Brown this year. He's kind of black hole in an okay way, meaning that the ball wants to get to the Jalen Brown, doesn't always move to another player because he makes good decisions when he has it. So it's, he does, except for four or five plays a game that you and I always talk about. - No, you talk about, I'm way higher on Jalen. - You get frustrated by the misfree throws that's in the games and I think he's been unbelievable. I think he's first team on NBA right now. - I don't disagree with you. I love that he's going to the basket so hard this year. Looks like he built up some strength because defenders are just bouncing off him. - Yeah. - But he's playing a game that he didn't play when Tatum was here, healthy. And I don't know how they're gonna mesh when Tatum comes back because Tatum likes the ball. Obviously when Jalen Brown is out there, I don't know what his use is greatest, but he always has the ball. - Yeah. - And Tatum always had the ball. So they're gonna have to learn how to live with each other again in a different way I think. And Tatum, I'm sure they'll bring back slowly. - It's gonna be emotional. - You know, we can. - The way we thought before the year, there over under was like 41. I thought they were gonna be better than people thought. I didn't think they'd be a top three seed. But it seemed like the likely scenario was, there'll be a seven seed. Maybe he comes back if he's completely healthy. Played 20 minutes a game, but it's not a serious playoff team. But they have a chance to be a serious playoff team if he comes back, which I don't think. - They do. A game like the game against the next Sunday worried me. The team just didn't look together. And they've looked together all season long. Now I realize you bring in, we haven't had a real post player in years. So you're bringing in a guy who's a post player, a son of a past is very well. And from what I've read and looked at his stats, he has been three. We haven't seen too much of that yet. - We've seen some breaks. - I don't even know if he's had a practice with the team yet. So I guess we have to wait until after the All Star break. And you have a date in mind for Tatum to return in your mind when March turns around. - Yeah, so I think one thing with the All Star break is the two guards in Jalen, I think just had it. Pretty, to me, White looks cooked. - Yeah, White shot. - And White shot has gone sideways. Like even today, then somebody got bounced, somebody got scratched for injury from the All Star game. And I think White would have made it three weeks ago, but he just hasn't been consistent at all shooting us. So Brandon Ingram got the spot. But I think Pritchard, White and Brown really need the break. One of the best things about Brown this season, he hasn't missed, he's only missed a couple games. Like he's been out and he's guarding the best guy in the other teams a lot of times. I think he's been awesome. - You know, that's a very good point. He wants to guard the best guy on the other team. - Yeah. - That's publicly he's talked about that. Pritchard really needed a rest. And I've loved Pritchard all year long and last year. But against, like Sunday against the team, like the next, he had trouble just getting a shot off. When the team really guards man to man very closely, our guys have some struggles. Maybe Tatum will help fix that, but that Sunday game was a worrisome game. - Fun late in the year. - Fun subpot. Well, that's the thing. In February, March, you can't overreact to wins and losses. 'Cause you're just, but the Tatum thing, him coming back and getting in there will be really fun to watch. - I would be very fun. - The past, not fun. - You know, I've thought about it a lot 'cause you and I have talked after the game. I go back to September and I would have been really helpful if they were nine and eight. And excited if they were 10 and seven. - Yeah. - You know, I didn't pay attention to the schedule that much, but I was thinking about the two terrible years we just had where we were lucky to win four games each year. So, nine and eight on a rebuild year with a new coach working with a second year quarterback, I would have been satisfied and maybe we would have snuck into the playoffs. So, this was all gravy. I mean, we were in the Super Bowl. Nobody expected that. And. - Wow, man, your hand on this really well. - I am, I have been philosophizing a little bit. So, I was like, and it was obvious, Rick May's shoulder was hurting him. And now more news comes out, they shot him up. And now more news is coming out about the left tackle. Maybe he never should have come back from his injury 'cause he was terrible. - Well, yeah. - So, this, but we're in the Super Bowl. I can't complain, really. And I love the coach. I love the chemistry and camaraderie. He's built into that team. I hope most of them come back and they supplement a couple of guys with great draft picks. So, I'm not that disappointed. I was disappointed Sunday night, obviously. - Do you disappointed then you got to watch Cousin Sal make fun of me for 15-seller minutes? - I didn't enjoy your position that night. - It was tough. - I always thought I'd be prepared for it. - I've never seen them so happy. - How about if you had told me in the early 90s that we were gonna be in 12 Super Bowls by the time we got to the mid-2020s? Like I was thinking about that the other day. They made the Super Bowl once in 1985. And it was, it was played in '86, but then he 85 Pats. And it was like, we were so dumbfounded. They made the Super Bowl. Then it happened again in '96. It was like, oh my God, we made it again. And now we have the record for most Super Bowls, which was when we were of Pats fans in the 70s, just winning a playoff game would have been, we were really excited. - I know, I remember Sugar Ray Hamilton. Still have nightmares about that game. - And you took me to the Euler's game, the playoff game. - Yeah. - We got killed. - Got killed. The irony is, yeah, we've been in 12 Super Bowls. We've lost half of the lineup. (laughs) - That's bizarre. - And this was the front out of all these, the first one and the last one were the two, where we just felt like we got our asses kicked. Even the Packers one, I still feel like if they didn't kick off to Desmond Howard, I still feel like we would have won. I'm always gonna think that nobody will change by a pity. - I can close my eyes based on where we were sitting and see Desmond Howard coming right at me. And guys had so many shots. - Oh yeah, you went to the game, I didn't. You went to that game. - I went to that game. - Yeah. - Now I give the patch and the coaching staff and the players' energy and there was blood in a lot of credit. - What's the mood in Boston? 'Cause I know you've been dabbing with the TV radio stuff. Has it been more negative than I thought it was gonna be? Or realistic? - No, I don't think it has been, I think if there's anything, there's some disappointment, I guess, in Dirk May. Maybe a little less so when it came out that he had to get shot up before the game, 'cause they really downplayed that he was injured. - Yeah, I'm aware. And they probably should have had him in the injury for the Super Bowl and that could come back to a month if he got shot up, right? - Yeah, you don't get shot in your throwing shoulder and there's something bad happened to your throwing shoulder. - Yeah, and we watched him all year and he was like, you know, he was really accurate. And then in this game he just wasn't. So I don't, like the fear is like maybe his shoulder wasn't that hurt and he just choked. But I'm not willing to go there 'cause we saw too much from him there in the year, but he was so accurate all year and it wasn't just the Super Bowl though, the whole playoffs were kind of a nightmare in terms of turnovers. - Well, maybe he needed it. - He was super bowl. - Maybe this will make him double down and maybe it'll make them want to have a better offensive line next year. - Yeah, of course there is that radio station that talks about is he really Mac Jones and disguise? - Hell, I can't even imagine. 'Cause there's still, I was there this week at, there's still, now it's like frozen snow in the ground. It's freezing. - Well, you know, that's the other thing. If we had won and they wanted to have a parade, - You couldn't even have had it. - They couldn't have had a parade. - Yeah, there's cars that won't come out until April. They're covered with sheets of ice. - And then where did you come down on the second season of Landman? I thought the last four episodes pulled it together and oh, pulled it together. I thought there were middle episodes in the middle, like three, four, five. It was a little bit slow and no other would go in. - What are your top TV shows right now other than all of your favorite Netflix programming? I know you love the rip, I'm just saying that. Netflix plug. No, you love the, what are your top ones? Is the Donny Walberg show up there? Did you, - No, I think it's mediocre. I like the three Chicago's, those Chicago PD fire. - Of the Master Chicago marathon? What is it? - Yeah, I'm into this. >> Police fire in hospital? Are those three? >> Yeah, we'll give them. >> Do they ever murder?
- I said, where somebody sets a fire and the people end up in the hospital and then they have to solve it. That's all one three hour show. - That's coming up. I'll text you when it's the night it's gonna happen. - Oh, that's exciting. - Yeah. Again, you and I both love Landman. I thought you didn't think it pulled us off together at the end. - I thought it was a four episode season. That was 10 episodes. They just padded a lot of stuff, which seems to be one of the moves now with the streamers. You don't watch industry, but the industry's been amazing. - No, I don't. - And then both of us really liked the rip. I think that was my favorite movie I've seen. I went back and I did a second tour of it and I liked it more the second time the first time. - Yeah, first one I think there was too much coming up from it and the second time I was like, all right. But it was like an old school who used to call them the five o'clockers. - Yeah, this was a six o'clocker. - It was a five o'clocker with better actors. - Yeah, maybe. Yeah, I watched it again. I like your new channel. I like the stuff Nestle X is producing. - Oh, thanks for the dance, but I'm gonna miss it. - So I did the 50 most rewatchable movies of the 21st century at the end of last year. It was controversial because I had limitless number 16. You love limitless. - Not number 16. - But you've watched it a ton though. - I watched it a few times. - So what out of the ones that were on the list, what should have been on? 'Cause taking is a big one for you. All three equalizers you would have had. - Oh, definitely. Getting equalized to three was the best. I thought. - Basically anything dens out of your end. - Or John Wick. - You have all the John Wick. - I had a Wick too. I arguably could add Wick one as well. - Oh yeah, I've found Wick one. It's all about the dog. - Yeah, I would want. I would have even, I like Ballerina. I'm probably the only one in the country, but, no, Ballerina'd been all right. That whole genre, you know that I like that genre. - So it's just sort of been all, yeah. - Yeah, all that, it would have been all that genre. - All right, so you're gonna make it. - So you're gonna make it through the gross winner in the terrible Super Bowl loss. - You know that. Get ready for Jackson Tatum. - As we're talking, it's snowing here again. - Oh my God. - This is just awful. - Yeah. - I'm looking forward to, now I can look forward to Tatum coming back, 'cause it looks like that's gonna happen. And, worry about the chemistry when he comes back and this Jalen Brown had taken back the same way. - How interesting. - How did you like, how the Debra's trade ultimately turned out? - Oh my gosh, you and I killed the trade, we're gonna. - It was a money dump. And then had to do a second money dump of one of the guys that got in the trade. There's nobody left. They traded all three guys. But we've been told that they're gonna use that money elsewhere. - Right, which they did. - Which they have not yet. No, we didn't get the big thumper, which is what the papers are criticizing. We don't have the middle, we don't really have contraris. We don't have that middle of the order outfielder or third basement. - It seems like, I don't know this for sure, but it seems like they're banking on Roman Anthony, basically being their version of what happened with Drake May this year, in that they don't need the expensive guy because this guy's gonna be an MVP candidate. - Possible him getting hurt, really hurt our team, obviously. - I'm not sure. - I was having a really fun time with the watch and the team until he went down. - And we really need to get a sense, is he gonna be a power hitter? He certainly was a hitter. - Yeah. - But can he put up those hum ones? - Yeah, people are excited about him. People are always excited when everybody's healthy. It's the injuries that start cropping up. I'd say our pitching staff looks pretty interesting with the brought in the depth. And I did like the trade they made yesterday from the third basement, but again, he's not a power hitter. - That's pretty little more of an element. - And I think they're done. - You know what they're not done doing is taking money from the fans. - Well, most expensive ticket baseball. - They're not done with that. - Same here, checks here. - I guess John Henry's still doing very well money wise, right? - Well, he just sold the penguins for twice as much as he paid. And I'm sure they're in on this if the biggest expansion actually happens, they're probably saving money to be one of the ownership groups going after that. But. - It's just inexplicable how they have stopped spending money. After we won the title in 18. - I would say it is inexplicable though, because they won four titles and they were like, we're good, you're welcome. - Yeah, you know. - And then they scaled back. I think they felt like they did what they needed to do. - It's eight years later. - I know, I'm aware. That's a trade of mooky bets. I don't know if you remember that. - You know, the devours went and bothered me as much because they promised they would be spending that money. Of course, they didn't. The bet trade was an abomination. Also, the devours maybe got out of that one in time. That might have been a good moogin. They paid him a lot of money for a guy that not even sure what position he would have been two years from now. - But the package they should have gotten back for a guy at his age with his stats. They didn't get that package back. You know, they just sold for the first bidder. It looked like. - Well, I know you saw Jack O' this weekend who is only one world series this century. - I might have brought it up. - How are you gonna keep looking? - We've won four times as many as Sam, so that was good. All right, be careful in the cold weather out there. Good to see you. - I'm just gonna keep you this weekend. - Thanks for popping up. - Okay, bye. - All right, that's it for the podcast. Thanks to Nick and my dad and Gahau and Eduardo and everybody at the ringer. I will be back on Thursday with one more podcast. It's going to be our live show that we haven't done yet, but I know it's gonna be fantastic. And I know you're gonna enjoy it. And I can't wait to do it. So we'll be back on Thursday with that new rewatch while it's coming next Monday. We're doing goal tonight. The last one that went up is Ace Ventorico. Check that out. I will see you on this feed on Thursday. Thanks. 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