What Jane Doe & Cornell 7 Said Happened That Night- All The Inconsistencies

"Berving Barboo." Senior night at a high school football game. It's a very big ordeal. It's kind of like the Oscars and a state of the union address coming together for one singular night. It's like a ceremony for the senior members of the high school football team, cheerleading team, and the marching band. So all the graduating seniors are walking down the field, usually guided by a parent where the crowd is chanting, "Everybody's crying because this is the last regular home game of the season." There's usually some sort of giant balloon arch that the football players and their parents have to walk through as some sort of threshold. Now you're going to be a college student. I don't know. But I do know that all of it is most likely going to be recorded and later edited by another student, probably chugging one to many monster energy drinks. And it's just like slow moes of the players getting already in the locker room with a voice over from the coach as he tries his very best Morgan Freeman in personation. And then once they get on the field, suddenly the coach's voice pauses, and you hear the beginnings of a Kendrick Lamar's song, just summing in the background before the coach's voice comes back and it's voice over, screaming like, "Give it all you got, like that's the vibe." And it's all great because now there's a digital footprint to look back on. Either you go look, see I told you I went to high school with that guy that's now in the NFL. Or you go, "See look, I told you they all peaked in high school." It's like one or the other, there's no middle ground. Okay, it's a very, very big deal, senior night. And in Boise, Idaho, Timberline High School is going to play the Post Falls High School. The Timberline Wolves versus the Post Falls Trojans. And it is said it's going to be a pretty tense game. These high schoolers take football just like way too seriously. Apparently last year, Post Falls High School, there was like a little scandal in Idaho. No one really heard about it anywhere outside of Boise, Idaho. In Boise, Idaho, everyone was talking about it. But there was a protest because I guess these three Post Falls High School, so like three Trojans high school football players. Two of them were fully decked out in Trojans gear, wrapping their own school. And they're on the football field and they had the third high schooler dress up in their competitors gear, wearing a t-shirt from the competition. And he's on his knees surrendering as the two Post Falls football players are pointing an airsoft gun at his head. Basically saying like, we're coming for you. Crazy. To the other high school, you're going to bend to our will. You're going to surrender. You're going to get on your knees because we're going to destroy you in football. Is this recorded? No, the picture starts circulating all over the school campus. Now everyone's protesting at the school. But they're not protesting because the students took the picture and they needed to be disciplined. No, people are protesting because the students involved in that picture, they were suspended for 10 days and were removed from all athletics for the year. Students and parents were protesting the disciplinary action saying it was way too harsh. Members of the football team, a fellow teammate, said, to see our friends that are seniors not being able to play anymore games, I mean, that's it for them. It's sad. It hurts. So we're out here to show our support. Another one says, especially their senior year, that's like their biggest year for getting looks from colleges. I think they definitely deserve to play. Needless to say, I mean, this year seems like it's going to be a lot more tense than last year because it's not-- I mean, it's not even because of Post Falls High School, but it's because of Timberline. Timberline High School has been in the national news as of recent. They have been having a rough month with protests, police, authorities getting involved with their high school, as well as full-blown student walkouts. Students are walking out of class and walking out of school as a former protest. Timberline already missed the homecoming game. They still had the homecoming dance, just like none of the festivities. Like homecoming week is huge in places like Boise, Idaho. In places that you would consider football nations, small town America, Friday night lights, Monday morning quarterbacking, homecoming week is everything. Parents think homecoming week is everything. Parents who pay taxes and mortgages think, no. Homecoming week is end-all-be-all. But the school had to cancel most of it, except for the dance, and they released a statement. This is not a decision made lightly or easily. Homecoming is so much more than one game, one parade, or one dance. It is a celebration of current future and past presence and the families, educators, and community who support them. But they had to cancel it, even the game, which is a pretty big deal, where everything revolves around football. But it's all because a Snapchat group chat started going viral. Supposedly, Timberline high school students of the football team, the Timberline wolves, they were talking about how they were going to our word and kill a female student. The supposed Snapchat messages and these have not been confirmed to be the right ones, but that have been circulating on social media read, drop her bitch, ugly ass. Let's hang her from a light post and let the birds pick at her brain for days. Dumb slut, let's make her life hell, hell yeah. But then the conversation shifts to whether or not she deserves to die after being our worded. And one of them even says, she would definitely let us all fuck her. You think Cornell is bad? Just wait for us. Wait, this is a group of-- High school. And in the-- how many people was in the good chat? We don't know for certain. But one student and their parent apparently showed it to the school and that kick started a whole-- got leaked to the media. Authorities started getting involved. They are still involved to this day. A lot of female students are rightfully walking out, protesting as well as male students, saying that they don't feel safe. They don't know what's happening. They don't know what this culture is. They're also saying everything about what the authorities do moving forward is going to be defining for this entire area, probably for decades. Oh. They did cancel the homecoming football game. But they are going through with the senior night game that's happening in two days. Yeah. The Timberline wolves will be playing. We don't know if anyone in the group chat that is supposedly on the football team will be playing. But people are watching. And it should be interesting to see how it plays out. But they are on the news because they said, you think Cornell was bad? Just wait for us. This is part two of the Cornell 7 case. We would like to thank today's sponsors who have made it possible for Rottenminga to support Rain, AKA the Rape Abuse and Incess National Network. They provide free confidential support services and information to survivors. This episode's partnerships have also made it possible to support Rottenminga's team of dedicated researchers. And we'd also like to thank you guys for your continued support. As always, full show notes are available at RottenmingaPodcast.com. Before we begin a content warning, this episode discusses an alleged sexual assault, including drug and alcohol usage, potential coercion, as well as the greater ripple effects that have resulted from this case, whether that be a silver lining of people finally standing up and drawing more attention, or whether that just be a wholly negative impact. If you are a survivor or find this subject hard to hear, please take care of yourself, skip this one if you need to. There are also lots of discussions of whether or not the victim in this case is to be believed or not. And I know that can be triggering for a lot of people, so take time off if you need. And I cannot stress this enough. This case is currently ongoing. When we describe what happened that night, we're describing what is alleged in court filings lawsuits reported by news outlets which found in public record up until the time of recording. Due to the current pending status legally, we have to use words like alleged. According to the lawsuit, according to Jane Doe, according to the accused, he said, she said, he states, she states, the usage of these words is not to discredit anybody's claims, but just for the purpose of, I mean, I'm not the police, I'm not the DA on this, I don't know what happened. I don't have all of the resources to get all the information needed to give any sort of definitive or conclusive statement on this. I'm just telling you guys, everything that we were able to find online, as well as any comments, theories, speculations, opinions, claims, or leaked information, they were found publicly online and do not reflect wrongman goes beliefs. If there are any massive developments or changes, we will do our best to keep you guys updated, but with that being said, let's get started. Also, just a side note, because I feel like everyone's throwing around lawsuits and defamation, like defamation has become a big thing again, all over the news for just everyone. A lot of the people that are involved in today's case have loyard up and it just feels like their lawyers have lawyers and some of the lawyers are lawyers that we are familiar with. One of them just retained the Agniflo firm. I don't think they're being represented by Mark Agniflo, who was, you guys remember, represented Sean Combs and then was later Louis G. Mangione's attorney, was also Keith Ranieri's attorney, way back then the Nixie M. Sex Cult. But, yes, Tani Garagos, who was also Sean Combs's attorney, daughter of another very famous TMZ linked attorney, Mark Garagos, Tani, she, I believe, is one of the accused attorneys and she has been pretty vocal. - Oh, yeah. - And all of the accused have been pretty vocal, saying that these are lies. This is defamatory, basically. I just want to say, be careful what you're posting online, as always. with that, let's get started. I'm going to try to give you the best reconstruction of events of October 19th and I'm going to tell you exactly how we did it because there's so many little pieces of information floating around and I just wanted a clear idea of exactly what happened that night in terms of who said what happened that night because one party is saying this happened the other parties were saying this is happened did any of them slip up we keep hearing like oh Jane Doe kept changing up her story but maybe she's not the only one that was changing up her story so we took Jane Doe's lawsuit as the template since the alleged action has an accused name attached to it so there's no reduction in Jane Doe's civil lawsuit she's like at this point it was Giulio Loops for example at this point it was Winston Lee for example and so we took that as a template of the allegations in terms of timeline so I'm not saying I took it as a template as the truth but trying to figure out who was involved at which point of the night and then we took that to cross reference with other documents that are online so we cross referenced it with the local DA's first initial very defensive statement that we covered in the first part then the full six page report that the DA apparently received that was obtained by CBS news and released to the public so we took that that one has a ton of redactions so from there we're cross referencing with Jane Doe's lawsuit of okay at this point we think these people were in the room now with any redactions I cannot say with 100% certainty that I think that this is the individual speaking or being spoken about and so I'm going to try to give you as much information of why I thought it was this person but I'm also just going to keep saying like maybe Winston maybe Matthew and that just means it's redacted I think it might be Matthew but it's redacted so I can't say with certainty but it's kind of I would say it's somewhat easy if you pull from Jane Doe's lawsuit because the first interaction sexual encounter is Matthew and Jonathan then it's Jonathan and Giulio Loops then it's Matthew and Winston and that's in the foe fit so like you can kind of see the timeline the timeline matches up from Jane Doe and every other documents yes even though they're redacted yes then from there we cross reference news articles detailing snippets of Jane Doe's interviews with the Cornell police because some major news outlets were able to get their hands on the transcript of this I would imagine multi hour long interview that Jane Doe gave to the Cornell University Police Department and they have just been releasing like random snippets of this transcript and they have not been made public so we're coming through as many articles as possible trying to piece together the transcript because everyone's just releasing snippets so that's great then we took another lawsuit we took John Doe's lawsuit against Cornell we briefly went over this in part one but one of the accused sued Cornell for the way the tidal nine investigation was handled by the school and because of that there's a lot of snippets of this tidal nine investigation that's included in the lawsuit which this lawsuit you can find it available to the public online and it's filled with failed reduction context is John Doe is one of the seven yes he sued Cornell because because he did not agree with the conclusion Cornell came with of his involvement in the alleged crimes right he got some sort of punishment yes some sort of sanction right and he's like I don't like this I don't agree with this tidal nine investigation so I'm going to sue Cornell yes that became nothing fruitful came of it but he did sue Cornell this was actually a lawsuit that was filed before Jane Doe's lawsuit so one of the seven sued Cornell and this lawsuit is publicly available to you if you just google it and maybe go through a few links on google and it is filled with failed redactions download it you'll see what I'm talking about if you're a little savvy right so do we that what you will however a lot of names are still redacted meaning we had to use context clues from all the previous information to figure out who is who in this tidal nine investigation because this actually gives us a lot of direct quotes from the accused it wasn't in Jane Doe's lawsuit no it was not a James you found it from John Doe's lawsuit yes okay and that had failed redactions but even without the failed redactions you know there are lots of snippets of who said what and then judging based off of the context of well I came in at this time or when I came in this was who was in the room you can kind of pinpoint who it is right again we can never be 100 percent certain so obviously because it's redacted we will do our best to tell you you know like maybe Matthew maybe this but just keep in mind at the end of the day we're just taking some guesses we would like to call them educated guesses but we also did not go to Cornell so maybe they're just guesses but with that let us combine it all and give you a somewhat clear timeline of who said what happened and when and try to figure out what really happened October 19th 2024 making the time out of your day to go workout I would say is a big deal and then you do that only to get robbed is the embodiment of the saying no good deed goes unpunished or as I guess the gym rats would usually say like no pain no gain okay it's a bit more positive of an outlook on life Saturday October 19th 2024 Jane Doe is at crunch fitness this is an off-campus trip someone takes her car keys without her knowing the afternoon so it's like 5 pm she's working out someone takes her car keys they unlock her car break in slip inside steal her wallet amongst other things and she realizes when she sees a $400 charge to Walmart that she did not make her wallet is gone her car keys are gone someone took her wallet and is buying stuff off of Walmart she says upon discovering this I canceled all of my debit and credit card accounts and this is kind of pertinent later because of this whole gym incident it seems like the series of events for October 19th get altered Jane Doe was originally supposed to be a sober sister for her sorority party meaning she was gonna be sober the entire night and her entire task was gonna be keeping an eye on the sorority sisters at the bar that night because they're having like a whole event at moonies so they're gonna go to moonies and she's gonna be sober because she's 20 so she's not even legally of drinking age which would make sense but because her car keys and wallet were stolen she had to go to the ethical police department and the sorority was saying like you don't have to be the sober sister because we don't even know when you're gonna come back from the police station and like maybe it's just too much on your plate today we're just gonna find a different sober sister it's fine so by the time that she makes it back to the sorority house try delta on Cornell campus she's like okay I'm no longer the sober sister I'm gonna start drinking so she starts drinking vodka from the bottle she reports I was trying to catch up to my sorority sisters who had already started drinking 30 minutes before I did she says that she typically doesn't drink that much alcohol because she has pots which makes her feel very dizzy and she says on top of that that particular day she probably ate about 400 calories the whole day so she she's got an empty stomach she's taking approximately six vodka shots in a very short amount of time she's sipping mixed drinks from her sorority sister's cups I guess testing out their drinks when she gets to the moonies bar she then orders another drink at the moonies bar even though she's underage she gets a drink called sex on the beach and she believes that drink had about two alcoholic shots in there and she has these giant exes on her hand but they still serve to the alcohol she says she doesn't even have a credit card her friend lends him his credit card so that she can buy this sex on the beach drink and this is you know part of the original six-page statement that the DA received so from there she makes her way to the other bar it's called like bar 10 where another sorority pi five pi it's another sorority they're having a party she stays briefly and then she starts walking back to campus so that she can go to the fraternity house remember the whole DA was like oh it was a mile and there was a lot of emphasis on the distance but she's it's interesting because I didn't know this but when she got to the fraternity house I guess it's guessless only for this particular party so she would have to prove that she knew someone inside the fraternity that she was invited she says when I got there I remember feeling numb from being cold and intoxicated I'd been texting Matthew along the way but when I arrived he was no longer responding to me so I was forced to wait outside of the fraternity he's still not responding so Jane notices that there's these three individuals fraternity brothers standing outside the front door so she walks up to them and asks do you guys know where Matthew is and she reports I said I could prove that I was a friend of Matthews by showing them our text conversation and they responded by saying we know who you are you're Jane she says I found this odd because I didn't think that I had met these three individuals before but they allowed me to enter the fraternity I remember them saying something nice along the lines of like make yourself at home as I entered the fraternity she thought it was odd she said at this particular party was not packed usually the the Chi-Fi parties it's wall-to-wall people people are jammed in their like sardines this one seemed more chill it didn't seem to be that packed at all walks into the main room and she spots Matthew pretty quickly and she's dancing with Matthew and she says I was okay with dancing and being flirtatious because I was attracted to Matthew and I was open to the idea of dating him remember the DA summarize the very first three some and like he summarized it in a way that was so bizarre to me I kept reading it over and over again and I was like asking everyone around me like does this even make sense I don't even understand what's happening right now but he was like Jane Doe is asked by Matthew if they want to have a three-some right and Jane Doe is so excited because that means Matthew and Jonathan the first person in the sexual encounter must be gay and I'm like wait what what is that after I found out she was excited or something it just kind of like in that moment it made her sound like an airhead like oh my god that means you guys are gay like it just sounded bizarre I've never seen that sort of reaction but the six-page statement gives so much more context because the DA's paraphrasing doesn't give any context it's confusing so by way of paraphrasing it's kind of a failure because you're supposed to make it not confusing but the full statement is is that Matthew pulls her to the side and asks if she wants to have a threesome. And she responds by saying, "With what woman?" I responded this way because the idea of having a threesome with one male partner and two female partners is safer to me. There is a long portion that's redacted, but her statement reads, "But Matthew asked how I would feel about having a threesome with two male partners." At first I was kind of shocked, but I eventually agreed due to how attracted I was to Matthew on top of my drunken curiousness. She says that she asked who the other party, who the other guy would be, and Matthew told her that they would find someone. Which a lot of people think is weird, because usually when you proposition someone for something as big as a threesome, especially if you're not even dating this individual. I mean, I was going through reddit threads where people are like, even when you're in a relationship and the idea of a threesome comes up, people have someone and it's like a lengthy process. It's not just like, I'm sure we'll find a willing participant somewhere, even in the craziest of college environments. This is kind of out there. This is kind of crazy. So it seems like people are skeptical of Matthew's intentions because it was so out there. He leads her upstairs, drops her off in a room with the other fraternity brother that doesn't appear to be involved in really anything. Eventually she's led to the alumni room and she sees Jonathan. So it's now Matthew, Jonathan, and Jane in the alumni room. And she says, "I remember being excited because I thought that Matthew and Jonathan wanting to have a threesome meant that they were gay, right? This is the paraphrasing the DA gives." But then she says, and the DA has access to this, which would have meant that they were part of my community as I'm bisexual. I believe I said something along the lines of like, I didn't know you guys were all fruity, and either Matthew or Jonathan responds, "Uh, I'm homo curious." And the other just laughed, and didn't say anything else. I mean, that just gives so much more context. - Yeah. - Like, because what do you mean? You just, I got excited because I thought they were gay, but this gives a lot more context, and also more context of why she might be more open to having a threesome, even with another woman, because she's bisexual, right? And so also another thing to note is some netizens are saying, this might have made her feel more comfortable, because now she almost feels like she's helping other people awaken their sexuality, and that might be something that she would feel inclined or want to help with. The report reads, "I would say that I was pretty okay with having this threesome with Jonathan and Matthew. During the threesome, I began to feel Jonathan hitting me many times on my butt, and I remember that the hits were hurting me." And she says, again, in a later statement, that she was okay with the first encounter, quote, as much as I can be, because again, I was super drunk when I got there, but I was pretty okay with all of this. But she did not seem comfortable getting physically hit. She says, and then of course, I was being hit at the same time, like physically very, very hard. She then states that while they're engaging in this act, Matthew was unable to maintain an erection, and apparently Matthew says, according to Jane Doe, quote, "I'm gonna die." Jane says that she was confused, because she wasn't sure if he was serious about dying or if this was a joke or if something was happening, because this is after she claims that they did ketamine, Jamaican weed, and all of these other things. And so she's kind of freaking out, and she seems to be taking it upon herself to take care of both Matthew and now Jonathan, because now Jonathan is like dry heaving into a trash can somewhere, and she keeps waking up Matthew every few minutes. She's helping Jonathan trying to throw up, even though he does not end up throwing up. Now, on the flip side, Matthew Ingles, in his written statement claims that Jane Doe did not take any ketamine before this first sexual encounter. He also states that he took a lot. He says that he only really knows how much he did, which was multiple keys worth. I guess that's, I guess maybe in like cocaine sense, which is a little more common, it's like multiple lines, perhaps. But he is, I guess, a measurement for cocaine. You like put it on it, I don't know. And he snorted multiple lines or keys worth in rapid succession. He says, no less than 10 minutes after consuming the ketamine, I began to struggle breathing, gasping for breath, and groaning uncomfortably. Several times I lost consciousness momentarily. I was too incapacitated to consent to sexual activity anymore. Matthew is the one that is now accusing Jane Doe potentially of essay. There's a crazy email that he had, crazy as an opinion, crazy email that he had sent to the Title IX investigators, where he said that he was, there were rumors that he was sawtomized by Jane Doe and that he felt the Title IX investigation was completely being steamrolled by gender politics and, you know. Wait, how legitimate is this email? The email seems legitimate. OK, he's telling the Title IX investigator that he has been. It's kind of vague. It's like, I told you in November that I believed I was sawtomized. That's kind of the paraphrasing that I'm giving of this email. I see, I see. But it's vague. We don't know for sure, but it seems like he's consistently kind of throwing back the idea that he was more incapacitated, which means that he would have been the one that's essayed. He says that I attempted to remain conscious. I could feel my face, you know, contorting as if I was crying, but no tears came out. That was the last clear memory I have up until that point. He then recalls Jonathan was throwing up into a trash can while he's on the bed now trying to remain functional, right? But it's interesting because he was still able to maintain enough function to send multiple messages into the Chi-Fi Snapchat. So there is that. Jonathan Newell, in his alleged statement to the Title IX investigators, and this is like redacted. His name is redacted, but I think it's Jonathan because the timeline adds up, right? So the thing with Matthew, however, is he is involved in the Title IX investigation, but he is one of the seven accused, the only of the seven accused that does not do interviews with the Title IX investigation. He gives one written statement, and that's about it. It's interesting because Matthew Engel's dad is allegedly an educator. He's high up on a school board into buy for an American college. So people speculate that maybe his dad has extensive knowledge of Title IX investigations and how they are not criminal investigations and how you do not have to partake in them so that he's the only one that gave a written statement instead of multiple interviews. Some of these other guys, I mean, they were interviewed in January, multiple times in March, May. Like there's a series of interviews that are had and some of their stories evolve as well. So if we're going to say Jane Doe's story is evolving, the accused, some of their stories are also evolving. I'm not going to tell you how much weight to put into all of this, but it would make sense that at some point Matthew and Jonathan's statements are similar because, I mean, that would make the most sense. Jonathan also agrees that during that initial encounter, Jane Doe declined the ketamine. So she did not do ketamine before the very first actual encounter. That's what Jonathan and Matthew were both claiming. But then later in a statement, Jonathan says that they pulled out the bag of ketamine, asked if Jane wanted some and she said no because she'd never done it before. So they didn't ask again. They didn't ask again, right? That's key. However, later he talks about what substances were given to Jane and he responds in that interview, I guess, ketamine, alcohol, weed. Me and Matthew Ingalls did it. We offered it to her. She chose to take it. We didn't force her to do anything. Did you give it to her and she declined and then you never pushed her again and then you never gave her ketamine? You never offered ketamine again? Or did she take it and you did not push her to take it? I mean, it's just, they're two vastly very different things. But the very first sexual encounter occurs and when they take a break because Matthew wanted to sleep, Jonathan is feeling nauseous. Also, I believe this is Jonathan in the red actions because it makes the most sense, but it appears maybe Jonathan is asked about if he was smacking Jane Doe's buttocks during the initial encounter and he claims that it was actually the other party. He's asked about how many times the other participant struck Jane Doe. He says, after the first one, she asked him to do it again. He says, "Jane never indicated that she was in any pain and he was also unsure if it was a striking or grabbing or squeezing situation. He also can't remember which hand was used by the other participant." - Okay, so Jonathan saying Matthew used one smacking? - Yes, but he's also like, I don't know if it was smacking or if it was squeezing or grabbing. I also don't know which hand. I also don't know how many times it happened, but I don't think it was me. And there's a lot of things that he doesn't think. He also reports not remembering sending the initial free Pussy alum PU Snapchat. So yeah, okay. When those Snapchat messages comes up, he maybe Jonathan says, "I don't remember using my phone "at any point that night." So I don't remember sending that text. I was honestly kind of mortified when I saw it was me. He says that this has occurred before though, where he had sent a message without remembering. He said it happened the last time he blacked out, which is just fucking fantastic, isn't it? Because now a bunch of fraternity brothers are gonna walk into the alumni room for whatever reason. And this incident is going to get exponentially messier. But also, is he blacked out? Is he not blacked out? Like, there's so much gray area. Back to Jane though, she says that Julia Lopes walks in because it's his room. There's three beds, a lot of fraternity brothers live here. He's reportedly the first to walk in. So now it's Jane, Matthew, Jonathan, and Jillio. He pulls Jane in for a kiss, and Jonathan starts coming up behind her and according to her, basically, groping her. She says she doesn't remember much of the sexual interaction with Jillio Lopes and Jonathan because quote, "I was pretty intoxicated." The original report that the DA receives reads, "I remember hearing, redacted, and redacted, "say something about having a turn." After hearing that, I realized that the three sums I had taken part in that night were not about each person getting their own gratification out of it. but more so about redacted and redacted using me without caring about what. I was getting out of the situation. This made me feel really uncomfortable in the moment. She says that she felt really used. Then she says Matthew wakes up, sees activity going on between Jillia Lopes and Jonathan and Jane. And according to Jane says something along the lines of, "Hell yeah, that's when he said he wanted to make it a for some." Jane Doug declines. There is a portion of the Title IX investigation which I think could be attributed to Jillia Lopes and his interviews. I don't know with certainty, like the other times, but I was able to cross-reference some information. Maybe Jillio states to the Title IX panel that during his interactions with Jane in the alumni room she seemed very positive, smiling, engaged, talkative, said that everything was completely consensual, the sexual stuff. She did not seem incapacitated. And another one of the accused, who apparently witnessed the kiss between Jane and Jillio, says, "My roommate Jillio walks in the room, Jane invites him in. They start kissing and talking." And I hear from the side her telling him, like, you don't know how long I've wanted to do this. And eventually they start having sex on the bed. And who is this witness? I think it's Jonathan. Again, it's redacted, right? But from what I could piece together from these redactions, what I concluded and this is not a fact. This is just what I'm trying to decipher from the document. And that could not be the truth at all. Whatever is in the document could also not be the truth, right? We don't know what the truth is. But it seems like maybe Jonathan is insinuating. Jillio walks in, they start making out. And Jane is like, you don't know how long I've been wanting to do this. They get on the bed. They start having sexual activities. And Jonathan makes it almost seem like, well, maybe Jonathan makes it almost seem like he's not involved in that second interaction. Matthews passed out and he says, I'm still on the couch, still nauseous, like throwing up. And like, these are the context clues I'm using to believe that this is Jonathan. I see. Right. Because the first one she said she was okay with it. Yes. But the second one, he's saying, I'm not part of it. Yeah. Jillio just walked in. And she seemed like she wanted this. She said, you don't know how long I wanted to do this. And they went to the bed. I'm throwing up. But Jane does saying no, he's he was involved. And it was rape. Okay. He states, I don't remember having sex from that point I threw up to when I went to bed. I feel like I would remember it. But it's possible it did happen. It's possible it did happen. Yeah. Which is kind of vague. Okay. Whereas Jane says it was Jillio and Jonathan. And again, I'm not saying one story is true than the other, but I will say hello. Eventually, Jillio Lopes leaves the room. Then walk in, Diego Sarabia and Winston Lee. They enter the room. It seems like they enter separately, but that's the timeline of when they come into the alumni room. And according to Jane Doe, a ton of guys start coming in. And I know it sounds like just two guys walk in, but it's going to be four because the two scots come in. Jillio later stops by again. So it is a lot of action of people moving in and out of the alumni room. And I'm sure maybe there were other times where maybe someone had poked their head in. I don't know. But according to Jane Doe, there's a lot of guys come in and out of the room. And she is freaking out because she's unclothed. And she's just hiding under the covers naked. She says at some point, one of the guys says something very offensive to her. The report reads, I don't remember exactly what he said to me. I instantly became defensive. And I sat up quickly in the bed to confront, I think it's Diego, but again, don't take it with full certainty about what he said to me. And in doing so, the covers had fallen off my breasts, which are now exposed to everyone in the room. She's saying, like, I'm defending myself, I'm getting passionate and the covers are slipping down. She says, I was defending myself, yelling at him, he apologized and grabbed my face and started kissing me. I quickly backed away to stop redacted from kissing me. And I remember not having many emotions at that point because I was starting to become completely numb to the whole situation. I remember the room we were in had red lights on that were pretty hurtful to my eyes. Also, I remember someone bringing up the scars that I had on my legs from SH that I had done in August of that year. Hearing that my scars were brought up, but no one cared to ask about them made me feel super isolated. And I didn't even matter as a person to these men. Adding to my feelings of isolation was the fact that my phone was across the room and I felt like I couldn't get to it. As well as I didn't have any form of payment to order an uber to get out of the situation I was in because remember she had canceled all her cards earlier that day. She says, at that point, I was still angry with the person who offended her, said that rude remark. So I stood up and I began flexing towards him. So this was like a huge point the internet picked up of like, why is she flexing? Why is she getting up naked? She's saying, I was so scared. I got up naked and then I started flexing. People are like, what's happening? You're either scared and hiding under the covers or you're getting up and showing off your body and flexing and consenting to at least visually being seen by people, unclothed. She says, I was still angry. So I stood up and began flexing towards him while telling him that I would mess him up. I also felt like it was a primitive self-defense manner as a reaction to the situation I was in. It sounds very confusing, right? It's a little difficult to understand. However, earlier in this statement, remember how I told you that she only ate 400 calories that day. She is a weightlifter. She's a bodybuilder. So it seems like she takes very seriously. She ate 400 calories of chicken and rice. She was at crunch fitness. I don't know how serious. I don't know if she's involved in any competitions or anything like that, but it does seem like this could be additional context of why someone would get up and start flexing. And people do report, she kept doing like a bodybuilder pose. So again, I think a lot of people were thrown off by that. Like, what do you mean she's doing a bodybuilder pose? This is some context. You can still have the opinion that is very odd and something that you would not do in her situation, but it is just further context that I think is necessary. The report continues to read. I realize that I was standing in front of the group of men completely naked. So I sat back down on the bed and tried to cover myself with my arms as best as I could so I wasn't completely exposed. She later describes the situation as being surrounded by a ton of men and feeling a severe power imbalance. Whereas, who I believe to be Diego in the John Doe red actions, and I believe this to be his statement, I could be wrong though. Look at the John Doe lawsuit yourself. Maybe Diego says, "Basically, Jane just asked more about my involvement at Cornell." So he's just saying, I walked into the alumni room and I was just having a little chit chat with Jane. They have the same major. So we started talking and bonding over our majors. And then at some point in that conversation, I just remember her smiling and kind of leaning in towards me a little bit. And then eventually I leaned in as well. Then I recall our lips touched in kind of like a pecking kissing motion for maybe two or three seconds. And then I pulled my head away because I realized that there are other people in the room and I did not want to be kissing someone. Which is, again, I'm not saying it's not true. I'm just saying. And it's really weird. You said, you're telling me a bunch of fraternity brothers who are writing free pussy alum pull up. You don't want PDA in front of your fraternity brothers. You don't even want to kiss someone in front of them. Yeah, but also who just like kiss and then realize, like that's really odd. Yeah, it's very odd. Anyways. Yeah. Not saying it's untrue, it's just odd. He says that while all of this is happening, Jane Doe seemed happy and did not seem incapacitated at all. He describes the group as appearing joyous and happy. Sometimes these fraternity brothers use words that boggle my fucking mind. What do you mean joyous and happy? You're going to roll over because there's another guy who says some insane stuff. One thing to note is, and this is, could be speculation on my part, but going through some of these tight online snippets and interviews by the redacted individuals, you can kind of see clicks even within the fraternity brothers. It seems that, to me, from my observation, it seems that Matthew, Jonathan, and Winston are closer. It seems, Jillio Lopes is kind of in doing his own thing. And then it seems the two scots and Diego are very close. And the two scots seem further removed than Diego from the others. Okay, this is all important because there's a separate fraternity room where the two scots are hanging out with Diego before they go to the alumni room. So you got two scots and Diego. Diego's sitting there and the two scots say, I don't know where, Diego just kind of like gets up out of the room and leaves. We don't know what happened, you know, and the two scots are like, we're doing our own thing. We're watching some TV. And then one of the scots, his vape pen dies. And this is like the trigger event of all of this. Okay, so his vape pen is dead. And he's like, what am I going to do? My vape pen is dead. Hey, one of the guys that lives in the alumni room has a vape pen. We should go there. And hey, maybe that's where Diego went because did you see this snapchat? Is that where Diego left to? We should go investigate. So there's like a lot of weird things that are being claimed. However, Diego based off of the context, I think this is Diego's statement from the John Doe lawsuit. But a lot of these guys are asked, what did you think when you saw the snapchat message? Why did you go to the alumni room? Especially if you were not a resident of the alumni room, why did you go to the alumni room? And this is maybe Diego's response. And it reads, basically, I just kind of questioned it because it's something I've never seen before in my entire four years living in the Chi-Fi house. It's just like, okay, I don't know what that means. Question what? He just questioned the free Pussy alum PU channel. that because he's like, I just questioned it. - Right, we are all questioning what that means. - Yeah. - Yeah, exactly. - Whoever send that question marks, what do you mean by that? - Exactly. - Right? - Yeah, and he says, and this I think is Diego, but I mean, they all kind of give similar responses to the Snapchat, and the Snapchat itself is not a criminal act. It could probably be, I don't know if it's, it's probably admissible, but you know what I'm saying? I'm not accusing them of a crime by what they're saying about this Snapchat group, but he says, someone says, I honestly did not have a great understanding of what was happening at the time, but was very concerned, and just overall curious about the matter. - Mm, concerned. - And overall curious about the matter. Just like objectively a fucking odd statement. I don't know what's happening, but I'm very concerned. Overall curious about the matter, the matter being a Snapchat reads, "Free Puzzle Lump Pull Up." Then another one of the accused that was in the room that time says that when they saw Jane and Diego kissing, they were, quote, "kind of laughing about it after." So a lot of the accused are saying, "Why saw some other people engaged in sexual activities?" And they all seem happy. Jane Doe reports that she did not recognize a lot of the faces in the room. So she, quote, "I remember grabbing redacted's arm." We don't know who this could be. We could presume it's Matthew, but it's unclear. And I grabbed his arm at some point, and I remember saying to him, "I don't know who any of these people are." Redacted replied by laughing and asking if I wanted to do more ketamine. When he asked that, it hit me that I had taken ketamine on the couch with Matthew and Jonathan earlier in the night. Redacted would later tell me that I had also smoked marijuana from a large bong as well as consumed Jamaican liquor while on the couch with him and redacted. So I remember smoking marijuana, but the ketamine and Jamaican liquor, I have zero memory of. She says, "All I could remember was the feeling that I had already done ketamine." So this is a huge point of contention in Jane Doe's lawsuit. She brings up before the initial threesome that they ask her if she wants ketamine and she feels like they're pushing her. That's kind of the vague language she gives. It's never straightforward of, I did the ketamine right before the act. It's vague. However, during the Title IX investigations, the Title IX panel, this is not a criminal investigation, but they concluded that they believe Jane's statements of taking ketamine. They believe that her not remembering the first time she took ketamine is on par with people taking ketamine because it is kind of a dissociating drug where you may not remember taking it. On top of that, they think that her candor, her honesty of being so straightforward, of like, I think I took it on the couch because I have this feeling. They think that actually goes against her credibility and she, if she really wanted to have this story be believed, she would just say, "I did take the ketamine." Whereas the guys, the panel points out in their decision, they have differing, Matthew and Jonathan and it's specifically Jonathan is like, "Well, she don't want the ketamine." And then later he's like, "Yeah, we gave her ketamine." So it's very, they're inclined to believe Jane's story that this is now the second time. She says, "I thought if I do ketamine again, maybe I'll pass out." My thought was if I pass out and these men had sex with me, they could be charged with rape. At that point, they poured a line of ketamine and she says that she did it from Jonathan's erect private part. She snorted it. She says, "I snorted the line of ketamine, which was a heavy amount of ketamine." I know it was a heavy amount based on how hard it hit me. At that point, I was back under the covers and redacted God under the covers with me where he, again, tried reaching for the area of my vagina. Side note, I will say some of the accused will either claim that they never saw her do that second hit of ketamine or that the timing of when they came into the alumni room was after they, she did the ketamine. It's just everyone saying, "I didn't see any drugs." Or others that said they saw it. We're like, she didn't do it off of Jonathan's body part, she did it off of a key, like we all did, 'cause that's how you do ketamine. As for Jonathan, he says he has no recollection of Jane Doe doing ketamine off of his body, but he also acknowledged, quote, "There are pieces of his memory that he just can't remember. This is the panel decision. Holes in his memory from that night." He also says he doesn't remember if he did ketamine off of Jane's body, but that it definitely could have happened. Jane Doe's statement continues, "At that point, the group of men began flooding me with compliments about my body. All of them were talking about how pretty I was, which was very confusing to me because although it's very nice to hear those things being said, I was still very uncomfortable with the situation I was in." Okay, side note, this is an opinion by a lot of netizens, and it's a very nuanced opinion that I think a lot of people are gonna be upset about. I'm not saying I agree with this opinion, but it's just food for thought. Some people are saying this statement is very interesting because she's saying they're complimenting me and they're all saying how perfect my body is. People thought, oh, this girl is so insecure and so vain. She's like, oh my god, do you think my body is perfect? Yeah, do just lines of ketamine off of me. But some netizens are saying this sounds like a group of men who are humiliating you and coercing you into things. All of them are complimenting your perfect body and she's saying, I'm still very uncomfortable. Maybe she feels it's not genuine. Maybe she feels that there's something weird going on. It's just a very odd statement. I think people are trying to wrap their minds around and I think a lot of people are pulling from their own anecdotal experience of being round certain people. That does not mean that that's what these seven were doing, but it's interesting, it's food for thought. She says, shortly after that, I believe it was redacted and everyone fights about who asked the question of if they can do ketamine off of her body first. So the seven accused are fighting about who it was, right? So we don't know, but one of them asks if they could do drugs off of her perfect body. She says, seeing as I was already laying down and feeling extremely tired, I told him sure. And then a group of men all started pouring various things all over my body. I couldn't tell what they were pouring on me as I had my face covered with my hands. They allegedly snort ketamine off of her unclothed body. And this point becomes a huge debate because of the words I had my face covered with my hands. A lot of the defense attorneys and a lot of the title nine investigation was pushing back on then how do you know who took ketamine off your body if you weren't seeing it? It's a whole thing, but that is where I leave you with the first half of this audio episode. Stay tuned for the second half because we're gonna go over the other accused statements to title nine as well as what James had happened after the fact of when she went back to her sorority house, how the rumors started on campus and all of the text messages that came after that. Stay tuned, stay safe, and I will see you in the next one. (gentle music) [Music]