Weekly Wrap: Toronto International Film Festival, and remembering 9/11

As a kid in the early 2000s, I joined a scrappy new video site called YouTube. We were girls creating content for other girls. But with our growing success came new rules from the man in charge. There was no reason to believe that anything dangerous was going on. No reason until he was taken away in handcuffs. I'm Lauren White, and from CBC's split screen, this is There Goes My Childhood. Available now on CBC Listen or wherever you get your podcasts. This is a CBC Podcast. The Toronto International Film Festival is in full swing. There are almost 300 movies at this year's TIFF. That's a lot of movies. It can be overwhelming. So where do we begin? Well, I've got a group of insiders here to help us decide. I'm Emile Niazi, in for Elamin Abdelmah. Mood, this is Commotion. Around the table we have director Adam Agoyan and critics Rad Simon-Pillay and Sarah Hagee. Welcome back to Commotion. Thanks for having us back. Good to be here. So Adam, you're a regular at TIFF, both as a director but also as a lover of movies. But this year you are super busy with an opera called Cosé Fantuté, opening this October with the Canadian Opera Company. But were you to step away very quickly for a moment, what would you want to go and see? Well, I think it's got to be Matthew Rankin's Ladies and Gentlemen, Brian Mulroney. I've loved his previous work. He's an exceptional filmmaker and has an operatic sort of side to him. There's a real, there's a sense of playfulness and glee, but a real intelligence and a fascination with Canadian film history, right? There's something about what he does, which is quite magical and transformative. So I'm just dying to see this film. And it's the most unlikely person to celebrate in the way that Matthew Rankin might. But I'm sure it'll be really entertaining and exciting to watch. So I'm very sorry I won't be at that premiere, but I will watch that film as soon as I can. Yes, that sounds great. Rad, I know you're someone who has to parse through all 300 of these movies, figure out what to see. What's at the top of your list? Well, I first just want to co-sign Life, Ladies and Gentlemen, Brian Mulroney, because I've seen it. And that's actually real. It's a highlight for me at this festival. But for me, I mean, the one I'm fighting, fighting, fighting to see, and hopefully I can make it into, is Possible Love from Lee Chang Dong. And I don't know much about what the story is, but it's about like a couple, a documentary filmmaking couple, seizing on another couple or forming a relationship with their subjects. All that matters to me is this is the new Lee Chang Dong movie. Because this guy, I mean, he just makes powerhouse melodramas of such emotional, moral mess. His last movie. Burning came out eight years ago. And it was just like this. It really captured the zeitgeist in terms of capturing this like unspoken, toxic male rage. And so that was eight years ago. His previous movie before that was eight years ago, eight years before that, Poetry. It's almost like he's giving us eight years between each movie to emotionally recuperate from his movies. And, you know, like he's someone who, when I was like a junior student critic, I first discovered his movie Secret Sunshine at TIFF. So basically, I'm always like any, for every one of his movies, like I am, I am there because he's just one of the world's greatest filmmakers. That sounds amazing. Plus, you've had eight years to like prepare yourself, right? Sarah, you love movies. You just talked about watching Amadeus at Paradise last week. What is at the top of your list? At the top of my list is a film called Clarissa. It's a Nigerian movie by these twins, Chuko and Ari Asiri. And it's starring. So it's a modern retelling of Mrs. Dalloway that takes place in Nigeria. And it's like a stacked cast. So it's kind of goes back and forth in time between like the present day and these people in the past. And it's starring Sophie Okunido, David Oyelo. And, oh my gosh, I'm so bad at pronouncing last names, but I owe a debris in it. And it's, I don't know, I'm just, I'm really looking forward to it. It's got a lot of buzz. I'm really interested in like this backdrop of Nigeria. It was shot in, it was shot in like rural Nigeria. And it's just gotten so, it's gotten raved. So I'm very excited. We love a rave at TIFF. You know, one of the great things about TIFF every year is just the, not just the star power, the actors that come through, but the directors, some of the, you know, exciting documentarians. So if you could pull one person out of the film festival this year, sit down with them, who would it be, Adam? And what would you want to ask them? Well, I'm introducing a film by Artavaj Palacian on Monday night. He is an expert. He is an extraordinary filmmaker. He's incredibly reclusive. He doesn't travel much. He's not coming to Toronto. I met him sort of at a festival in Denmark once upon a time. I would love to sit him down, but he won't be here. So I would just have to conjure him in my imagination. But his films are extraordinary. And it's a very rare screening on Monday night. He's kind of the missing link between kind of the Soviet style of film editing, very radical. And he has his own theories as to what he's put into his work. And it's super precious. There was a screening of these films at Cannes. And they were just this window into this other kind of practice. And he's just a deeply mysterious figure, the type of person you kind of want to fantasize about. And I'll try and incarnate something about him on Monday night when I introduce his work. Oh, that sounds lovely. Sarah, what about you? I would love to talk to Mike Lee. I mean, and what would I ask? Anything. Any question. I've just been such a. I'm such a big fan of his work. I feel like he was like a real introduction to a certain type of storytelling for me. Like seeing a lot of his films as a teen. And, you know, he's not young. And his last film, his final film is playing at the festival. And I would just, I would ask him truly like, what do you like? What do you not like? I mean, just to hear anything from him would be great. And I don't have tickets for it. So if anyone's listening. Throw it out there. And Sarah, he's really known for some of like his championing of working class heroes. And is that some of the stuff that draws you to his films? Yeah, there's just such a real quality to his filmmaking. And the actors in it are just like, you just don't see people like that in films anymore. I feel like it's something that it's like such a beautiful type of storytelling that like it's harder and harder to be that real and that honest. And that. You know, not about like glamour and glitz type of thing, which is, yeah, it's beautiful. And Brad, what about you? I mean, I'm going to go with a populist choice here. My white whale right now is Amanda Seyfried, because I've never gotten to interview her. And I've adored her so much, her work in terms of like First Reformed and, you know, her performance recently in The Dropout or Testament of Anne Lee. So she's such an incredible actress who I've never gotten the chance to talk to. And also just seems like an incredible person, like a wonderful person. And also like an honor. And she's very Torontonian because she's worked with this guy twice. And I've loved her work. You've really gotten like some incredible, daring performances out of her in your films, Chloe. And she is wonderful. She's a really, really sweet person. And Mike Lee is also exceptional. So I happen to be on the jury in Cannes when he got the Palme d'Or. Oh, my God. So that was for Secrets and Lies. And that was just this incredible moment where we were all unanimously thinking this is a masterpiece. Yeah. And he has his way of working with actors because he has a long rehearsal process with them. And they kind of develop the scripts together. So he's an exceptional person. And I hope you meet him. One day. One day. Yeah. And what are you wanting to ask Amanda? Oh, my God. I mean, I just want to like figure out, I guess, just her take on the state of the world. And I guess whether she's seeded for that Nathan Fielder, Elizabeth Holmes documentary because she, of course, has played Elizabeth Holmes. Yeah. And the dropout. She is having such a, I mean, I can't even say year or a couple of years. Like she's just sort of seemingly at the top of her game. Adam, since we have you and you're an insider. What do you think about her trajectory? No, I was privileged to work with her at the beginning of that journey on Chloe. And we just always dreamt that we'd be able to find something else to work on. So we got to work together on Seven Veils, which was premiered at the Opera House, I have to say, here during TIFF three years ago. And that was an exceptional night. She couldn't make it because there was a strike, an actor strike at that point. So she was able to connect to the premiere in Berlin. But she's very grounded. She's super generous. She just fit in so well. She's just fit in so well with the other singers that she had to act with. She's just very modest. But wow, when she turns on, like she and also she can just fall in and out of character supernaturally. You know, like so she has an exceptional gift and she's just super musical as well. She finds the rhythm of scenes. I should add that she's here for TIFF for a movie called The Life and Deaths of William Shedd. So that's why it's like so that's what I was really like. Let me try. Yes. Yeah. And when you mentioned her music. It makes me think that she was recently maybe angling to play Joni Mitchell in something perhaps. And she played the lap harp and it was like phenomenal. Phenomenal. Right. When she sang the cover of Joni's song, I think that got more hits than anything she's ever done. Just again, she's just super musical. And anyway, I could go on and on. Yes. Yes. She's a wonderful person. She's super wonderful. Like she has she's super accessible and she. anyway i won't go fingers crossed for both rad and sarah that they can Maybe we can all have a meal together. Oh, that sounds great. Well, I'm Emile Niazzi sitting in for El Amin. In a world where the news feels bigger, louder, and harder to make sense of, Canadians need more than headlines. Hi, I'm Karen Sciolin, news reporter and host of The Big Story Podcast. From world-shaping events to the everyday stories that spark debate, my team and I will explain what matters and why it matters to you. We're here to help you make sense of the news and give you the context you need for those kitchen table conversations. Trusted. Canadian-focused. Curious. Listen to The Big Story wherever you get your podcasts. I'm Abdel Mahmoud. This is Commotion. I'm talking with Adam Agoyan-Rad, Simon Pillay, and Sarah Hagee. We're recording this live on Friday, September 11th. And, of course, this day marks 25 years since the 9-11 terrorist attacks. I was driving in this morning. I was listening to some of these heroines. We're hearing very emotional stories on The Current this morning from survivors. Adam, you were here in Toronto on that day for TIFF. What do you remember? Oh, look, this collision of atrocity and glamour was just something that one could not— I remember having a meeting with someone about a project, a project, weirdly enough, that had to do with the legacy of terror and violence and trying to pitch this. And then behind this person's head on this monitor, I saw this surreal image, which no one at that point could actually reconcile when the first jet, you know, hit this tower. Like, I just felt, OK, that's got to be the most improbable accident. But then it wasn't. And it was just this—everyone was absolutely stunned. It was horrifying. And especially the people who had to leave the festival and trying to get back and just digesting the enormity of that whilst trying to maintain some sort of sense, of what this event is, which is people trying to tell stories, narratives, you know, trying to make each other human. And then, you know, these moments that human beings are capable of just abstracting each other and doing something horrifying, which just happens over and over again. And it's, you know, the aim of a festival is to try and inject some degree of humanity and empathy into each other as individuals and hope to change people. But then there will always be these— there will always be these other narratives that are beyond our control. Or maybe they are within our control. We just don't do anything about them. I can imagine you must have had a lot of friends and colleagues in New York. And you were on the phone right away. Yeah. But trying to actually, you know, for the people who are here from New York especially, who were going back and then in the aftermath, you know, trying to just be a friend, you know, and try to, you know, extend. Well, you're trying to process it yourself, right? It was a crazy thing where you're— what a festival embodies to collide with something that was so cataclysmic. And, you know, it was the most monumental terror attack in history, right? Like it was a single attack. I mean, there's been other acts of horror that we all experienced and we're experiencing now, of course. So it just feels— It all was collided in this way that people were trying to digest and yet we had nothing to compare it to. Like nothing except film images, weirdly enough. You know, like that's what it also sort of felt like, you know. It was something out of a movie and yet we were all living these movies. So it was too much to digest. We're still digesting it, obviously. We're talking about it now. Yeah, very true. Rad, take me back to that day for you. Well, I mean, so that was, of course, like an interesting— I mean, that was—I was 19 years old when that happened. And actually, I was experiencing TIFF for the first time. Because, like, you know, as someone who just grew up loving movies, TIFF had always been so inaccessible to me. Like as a teenager, by the time I'd read about the festival happening in the Toronto Star, I'm like— I'd call up and be like, oh, there's no tickets left. So at 19, that was the first year where I had figured it out. I got a bunch of tickets. I mean, that year, my first ever TIFF premiere was Training Day. So I was dazzled by seeing Denzel in the flesh. And I'm just having the time of my life. And then I wake up. I wake up to this news. And in my mind, in my bubble, I'm like, oh, my TIFF screening is canceled for The Grey Zone that night. You know, a bunch of screenings were canceled. Monsoon Wedding, Miranere's film. Miranere being the mother of current New York mayor, Zoran Mamdani. Yitouma no Matan Bien. And so that's—you know, so obviously the gravity of 9-11 had not sunk into me yet. Like I was at that moment—my head was like how TIFF had shifted. I didn't realize how my world would shift until much later. And, of course, you know, that then—you know, after that event, after, you know, attending this now dressed-down TIFF, I—you know, like the weight of it, it would affect the movies I would watch. It would affect my own film criticism. That would come later. And then, you know, like finding out how everyone else experienced that moment. Adam talked about, like, you know, digesting this stuff. You find out that, like, you know, all these celebrities trying to leave town. Heather Graham renting a car. David Lynch chartering a bus. Sarah Pauly having, like, a come-from-away moment at her— at her brother's house where they're inviting all their American friends to just give them comfort. These are all stories I would learn after the fact on top of the impact of what that event was. Sarah, I know you were just a kid when 9-11 happened. But the impact, as Rad mentioned, would reverberate for years still to this day. Very specifically, there was a rise in Islamophobia that followed. And it put a chill in the air, you know, especially for anyone who was visibly Muslim. How do you feel that that day impacted the portrayal of Islam in media and in pop culture? Yeah, I mean, it's really—it's so crazy when, you know, I was, like, 10 when that happened. And it was, like, it was kind of the beginning of, like, a different kind of chapter in my life in so many ways. You know, entering adolescence, you know, all these kinds of things that are happening. And, you know, just hearing a lot of the discussions about this as a child. And be it on the news or at home and then going to school and kind of seeing what other people would be hearing at home. And parodying those kind of debates at home. It's, like, it's very—it's interesting to look at now as an adult. And, yeah, I mean, it changed—I don't know what my life would be had that not happened. Or how, like, I would be viewed in society or the messages that would be out there. I mean, clearly, it's something that 25 years later. Discussions are still very much the same when it comes to, you know, Muslims and Islam and media. And just, like, you know, it kind of just set off this reaction of this, like, very lucrative kind of fear-mongering that we kind of consider normal now. And, you know, you mentioned, you know, Zoran Mamdani is mayor now. And his mom had a premier. But, like, even just the discussion about him being mayor right now in New York. On the 25th anniversary. And a lot of the disgusting things people are saying. And kind of validating even as though it's a debate for someone who was my age when that happened as well. I just feel like there's never been a proper kind of reckoning about how we're supposed to talk about it. Or how we're, you know, supposed to talk about being affected by it. Because certainly I'm not, like, a victim of this, you know, the day it happened. But the effects of it, be it the war on terror, how, you know, I have been treated in my life, you know, it's kind of never gone away. So, yeah, it is, like, it's very complicated in that sense where it's, like, it's hard to know, like, is this from that? Is this, like, what people think? Like, you know, it just kind of is in this huge question mark of, like, what is this? Yeah. And I can hear in your voice that it, of course, it still impacts you. To this day. Yeah, of course. I mean, you know, it's, like, it's crazy what I consider, like, normal to hear or see now, you know, when it comes to anything about Muslims. And it's not even just Muslims who are affected by it. It's anyone who's, like, brown or looks Arab, you know. So, yeah, it is just, like, it's very odd. It's odd to look back at this time and think, you know, unfortunately we haven't come very far in the last 25 years. I don't think the stuff I'm hearing now today, it's stuff I haven't heard. Since I was 14, you know, just, like, a lot of the fear-mongering against Muslims and stuff. And also, you know, around the world when it comes to that type of terrorism, you know, Muslims have been the biggest victims. You know, I'm from a country where there's been multiple attacks killing their own people, you know. So it's just, it's really, it's kind of hard to see, you know, how much the world has been affected by it. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Really appreciate you sharing that, Sarah. So, Adam, I'm curious, you know, you mentioned sort of almost experiencing that moment for many of us like a film. But how did that day impact the way that you approach storytelling after that? Oh, it had a huge impact. First of all, as I said, the film I was working on at that moment was Ararat, which was dealing with my own personal history and history of genocide and in terms of my own grandparents. But then. Folding that into all of the. crazy misconceptions and narratives that were flying around 9-11, that created my next sort of film, which was called Adoration, which was also about people using these narratives for their own familial kind of vendettas. And just the sense of panic, people not being able to look at where histories come from and weave them into some sort of idea that is able to reflect their humanity and empathy. It's sort of we rush towards these very charismatic leaders that can direct our rage in a certain way. And we just seem to fall into that trap all the time. And some of those leaders are members of a family. You know, sometimes, you know, they're in very small focus groups and that's what interests me dramatically. But it's, yeah, I can't even begin to talk about how it had an effect on my own practice and my own identity as a filmmaker. Such powerful stories. Before we go, I want to ask each of you for something that you want to share with our listeners. You know, summer vacation's almost over. For many of us, it ended a long time ago. But what are you most looking forward to this fall? Adam, let me start with you. Well, I'm directing a Mozart opera called Così fan tutte at the COC and I'm in the rehearsal room now and I'm listening to these beautiful singers and they're singing with a piano, the most extraordinary music. And I'm going, wow, this hasn't changed for centuries. The AI is never going to affect this. This is just a direct link we have towards, you know, an artist's vision, a genius Mozart. And what a lovely space. A place where we can all kind of share and kind of just enjoy the best of what we can do as human beings. I love that. And, Rad, what about you? Well, I'm looking forward to people discovering one of the big TIFF premieres this weekend. It's called Your Mother, Your Mother, Your Mother, starring Mahershala Ali. I'm getting that note of recognition from Sarah there. I mean, this is the new film. This is Mahershala Ali alongside the director he was working with on the Aborted Blade movie, Bassem Tariq, who made a fabulous movie a few years ago called Mogul Mogli, where he brings so much of himself, so much of his, like, Muslim upbringing into that film. And Your Mother, Your Mother, Your Mother, I expect the same in that, where both Mahershala and Bassem are bringing so much of themselves, while also wielding a blade in this movie. So I think I can't wait for people to discover that movie. Yeah, that sounds great. And, Sarah, what about you? Listen, mine is not highbrow, guys. Law & Order SVU. There are 10,000 episodes to watch. You want to be home this fall. You want to be home this winter. You always know things are, you know, Olivia Benson's got it. You know, things are, they might turn out okay, they might not, but there will be a new day. And all I do is watch that show. And I couldn't recommend it enough. You know, they're members of an elite squad known as the Special Victims Unit. You know, it's good. Is there any way you could watch that while you're listening to a Mozart opera? You know, I could, I'm sure I could figure it out. Yeah, yeah, yeah. I'm sure I could help you figure it out. Maybe there's an opera episode. Maybe there would be. There definitely is the opera in Law & Order Special Victims Unit. And some might say that the way they tackle justice is operatic. Yes. No? It's much like your opera. It's like a Tales as Old as Time. Yes, exactly. Well. Blend that with Brian Mulroney and Ladies and Gentlemen, like something else. We call that Law & Order Toronto, actually. Well, thank you all so much for being here. We really appreciate you having this conversation with us. Thanks for having us. Thank you. Adam O'Goyne is a filmmaker. He's also directing Mozart's Così Fan Tutte with the Canadian Opera Company. It opens next month in Toronto. Rad Simon-Pillay is a freelance film critic in Toronto. You can find his work at The Globe and Mail, CTV's Your Morning, and right here on Commotion. And Sarah Hagee is a culture critic and co-hosts a podcast called Scamfluencers. And that's it for the show today. This week, Commotion was produced by Stuart Berman, Ty Callender, Gene Kim, Jane Vancouverden, and Jess Lowe. Our digital producers are Emilia Ekbal, Ray Mona, and Vanya Mutabja. Our engineer is Dave Modi. Our director is Danielle Grogan. John Perry is the senior producer. Our executive producer is Beza Seyfa. I'm Emile Niazi, sitting in for Elamin Abdel-Mahmoud. See you on Monday. See you on Monday. For more CBC Podcasts, go to cbc.ca slash podcasts.