Week 6 Preview: Six for 6

Welcome to the athletic football show brought to you by the US bank smartly vices signature card. I'm Robert Mays. Week six is here. We didn't really feel like there was a game of the week this week. And so we just hit one extended thing from six different matchups. That's what we did today. And if I'm being honest, I kind of liked it. We're going to do that today. Six games we want to dig into a little bit of time on Syco Street with the Rams and Cardinals, which is not a place we thought we'd see the Rams six weeks into the season. And then we hit what we want to know coming out a week six with me Derek and Dave. So let's get to that conversation right now. It's the week six preview. We're going to do things a little bit differently this week. Looking at the schedule, there was not one big game that really jumped out to us. And so what we're going to do is we're going to blow out the one thing froms that we typically do. Instead of doing three of those, we are going to do six of those focus on six games where one of us is going to start the conversation with a specific element of that game that we're interested in. And then we'll just kind of see where it goes from there. That's what we're going to do today. It's a really diplomatic way of saying it's kind of a stinky Sunday. There's a lot of good stuff. There's just not one really jumped out. There's not a matchup between two teams that you just feel kickass about. Correct. I think often when I'm looking at the games of the week, the easy answers are, are there two teams at the table playing each other? If that happens, then let's do it. Are there two teams at the table playing each other right now? No. There are not. And so I think that doing it this way feels right for this weekend. Who knows? We're going to try it out and just see how it fits. We're adaptable. Yes. Sometimes you run 50 plays of 13 personnel. Sometimes you trot the receivers. This is the Tom Brady Patriots, where some some some weeks we're giving Jonas Gray 50 carries. And then some weeks we're getting we're running the ball three times. Let's start with the Texans and the Jaguars in London. This is all me. I want to start this conversation by revisiting our Marvin Harrison Jr. trade discussion, Derek, from Monday. You believed, earnestly, that the power of friendship would save Marvin Harrison Jr. and Houston. That I do. And as I have thought more about it, I'm more supportive of the deal than I had first thought. It's for a couple of different reasons. One, talking to people there, just about the role, how they see it, I actually do think his usage is going to be more in line with what I've wanted to see from him than even what we thought was going to happen in Arizona this year. Even though the scheme changed this year, he still had been pretty much an extraciever on the ball vertical routes. And that combined with him being completely disinterested made it a pretty ugly start to the season for Marvin Harrison Jr. So having him with Nico Collins, having him play like more Z to X running more in breaking routes, just the way that often is structured in Houston. I'm open to him looking as good as he's looked in the NFL period with like the usage and the buy in the other part of it is as I've thought more about this. And honestly, part of it was going back to rewatch the all 22 every single dropback that CJ Stroud had on Monday. I'm with you guys where I have not given up hope on the 2026 Houston Texans like for real. And I think the idea of well, he's going to be good this year and we'll figure it out next year. Part of me was like, man, one in four, is that really worth doing? And as I've thought more about it, I kind of think it might be like I think I'm fine with that mindset and line of thinking from the Texans and making the straight. I have a couple thoughts and to go right off of the last one that you made. Who cares? Hey, who cares about a year from now when you're trying to make a push for a team that we thought of as a Super Bowl contender, and I'm really, I'm not that dissuaded by what we've seen. I know they're one in four. And this is a this is a tough test that you kind of have to win to stay on track. But CJ Stroud's ball and the defense will come along as the season goes. Henry Toa Toa, I think his practice window opened this week. So you're getting healthier at linebacker. I'm not out on the Texans at all. And it makes me think of the Tampa Bay Buccaneers, where a year ago, it was like, do you need this many good receivers and look where they are a year later? And so doubling down on an important position where Newco Collins unfortunately has durability issues. Jaden Higgins, super excited about him. That's not something you can count on, especially coming off of a major injury. So I really don't have a problem with all of that. My only beef with the whole thing is I just can't believe it cost it to. Yeah, it costs a lot. I cannot believe it costs it. I don't think there's any ambiguity. I'm like, they overpaid for what he has been relieved this year. And that's that's a different conversation than whether I'm excited about how this will look. And now that he's here. I get now that he's here. I get why you might be excited. But I can't get over that price tag like George Pickens cost to three and a five. And George Pickens had accomplished far more in the NFL than Marvin Harrison Jr. has to this point. And obviously you've got his college quarterback there. You know, normally the Texans posted a highlight clip of CJ and Marvin college. And normally when a team is posting college highlights of a player, it's like, this is sad. Like what are we doing? But when it's getting the band back together with CJ Shroud of Marvin Harrison, like I think it hits a little bit harder. Power friendship. And I really do think that like so much of Marvin Harrison's issues. And again, there have been some of like the effort on some of the blocking and the way that he's attacking routes. I think it's been a problem. But I do think that there was always just like weird chemistry stuff with him in the quarterbacks that he was playing with. And now with CJ Shroud, there's no like there's no, you know, blanks to be filled in. Like you know exactly what it's, you know, we haven't seen it in the NFL. But we've seen these two make each other look like top 10 picks at the college level. They're going to ask him, I think to run a lot of the routes that he really likes to run, which is some of the over the middle breaking type of routes where it's not even just that the offense is going to ask him to do that. CJ Shroud is one of the best five quarterbacks in the NFL at throwing those exact routes. And so I just think that like I really do believe that this marriage can work and kind of like you guys are saying, if there's still some stuff to talk about the run game and we'll get there. But when your quarterback is playing this way and your defense has the caliber it has, you can do it any given year for a couple of things. Just start to be all right for you. It's kind of my thought, too, as I thought more about it and really sat with it. I think that's where I've landed. And I think also part of it is, we already have a case on booty at home. And I like Jalen Noel. And so I kind of wanted to see a little bit more Jalen Noel. But now Cation booties a role player. Jalen Noel probably at the stage of his career is also a role player. And so the idea that they become your fours and fives and Xavier Hutchinson are they become like your your three and four now is Xavier Hutchinson. Like all those guys really do slot in as like true role players. I think it all does make sense when you think about it. But going back to the point that you just made there about okay, defense we still believe in the quarterback is playing really, really good football. What happens with the run game? That's and that's my one thing from this game because because I feel good enough about the rest of the Texans for this to all come together for it to be worth it for you to give up a second round pick for a receiver in a season where you're one and four the run game is the thing that they really have to fix that that is what has to happen here. And so I was looking at some stats just about the state of the Texans and how weird their offense feels because usually when a run game is really struggling in the way that the Texans run game is right now. It speaks to it's like a disease like it's a symptom of a larger disease where the offense does feel like there's something actually wrong with it's unhealthy to unhealthy offense. But the passing game looks really good. And so I was like all right, how many offenses are this efficient throwing the ball, which the Texans are they're like not top nine and EPA per dropback. The numbers are pretty good. And that's without Nico Collins. I expect those numbers to get even better over the course of the season with a run game that is this bad. Since 2000, there are four teams that have finished an NFL season with an EPA per dropback as high as the Texans have right now and an EPA per rush as low as the Texans have right now. Four teams in 26 years have finished the season like this. The 2020 Texans went to Sean Watson looked like the second best quarterback in the league. Why are the Texans always funny that there's like with their run game being unable to do anything. It might just be the curse on the entire organization. The 2018 bucks, which was that Todd Monkin masterclass with fits and Jamis Winston. And then my favorite part of this, the other two teams, there's one Matthew Stafford team and one Andrew Luck team, which is just so fitting, just so incredibly appropriate for this exact problem that a team could have. It's exactly what it feels like. Can't run the ball offensive line. Can not really protect them. But if they get an ounce of space in the pocket, these quarterbacks can go and make it work. And so it really does feel like that. And it's cool. Like for as much as I was high on CJ Stroud, I don't think that we were positive that that was going to be able to work. And the fact that the run game has been as bad as it is. And he has not only reached the level that we've seen him at before, he's playing better than he's ever been before. It really is like kind of incredible. So this is all around about way to kind of lead me to a point of I think that there's hope this can get fixed because usually when run games are this bad, it's because so much of the rest of the offense is also rotting at the same time. And I do think there are a couple specifics. I went back and just watched like so many of the run concepts over the first month of the season. Like, all right, what is worth salvaging here and what is where are they really struggling? So right now and anecdotally that the what we've said just anecdotally about the run game matches up with the numbers. When you think about the best runs that the Texans have had this year, almost all of them are gap scheme runs where they're pulling somebody, almost all of them. The numbers bear that out per next gen. They are 12th in the NFL in success rate on power and counter this year. They've run 30 of them, which is actually the most of any team in the NFL so far. [BLANK_AUDIO] 43% success rate on those place. They have 35, that's sort of 30 of those runs. They have 35 reps of outside and inside zone. They're at a 20% success rate on those runs, which is dead last in the NFL. 35 carries for 76 yards. They have run fewer of those plays than any other team in the league, but they are 29th in total EPA lost on those plays because they've been so inefficient on them. - This is easy. Just pull those plays out of the playbook, just ripple them out. That seems like you can't run power encounter 100 times a game because it is front dependent. But Derek, you probably will speak to this more than I would, you can build a run game out of duo power encounter and just run it against all of those fronts. And so that becomes my conclusion. The duo runs also haven't been great. They have a 20% success rate on just man and duo runs combined. But anecdotally again, when I look at their offense and what it is right now, especially with Woody Marks, I think his ability to be kind of explosive horizontally where he doesn't have as good a feel for some of the zone runs, just trying to build this whole plane out of duo and gap scheme stuff with the offensive line that they have. And I also think Ed Ingram coming back is a big part of this conversation. He is a powerful run walker. Again, he's the one pulling on all of those runs you're imagining that have hit for the Texans. And so I think there is potentially light at the end of the tunnel for this run game if they lean into some of the stuff that they're good at. - I'm so glad you said light at the end of the tunnel. I know we talk in meme too often, but I'm just imagining the one where the guy's like, with the pickaxe. - Oh, yeah. - And like, don't run back right before you get to all the diamonds. We're right there. - It does feel like that a little bit though. - I do too. And I don't think there ever gonna be a good run game, but you can be good enough that this can work. And you can build it out of it. - Just don't be bottom three. Just don't be bottom three. - Just be bottom three. One team in the league and you can make the playoffs. - Yes. And like again, every team has to run every concept to some amount to keep teams honest. But they, I think with the duo, that one is like a really heavy, almost like, you know, outside zone runs. That's a very like chemistry type of run. Like you really have to know how you're working with the guy next to you. And that I think is just the more you do it. Hopefully these guys can get a little bit better at it. And then I do think with the gap scheme stuff, it fits the offensive line better. I think it also fits Woody Marks better. He's, it's, I think what they can be in theory is a watered down version of like what the Liam Cohen Bucks run game was where they were doing a lot of polling and they were doing a lot of gap scheme stuff. And Woody is kind of a similar runner to me to a Bucky Irving where it's like, just stretch runs outside zone, foot in the ground go, not really what he does. But if he can pitterpatter a little bit around like a polar and then he can just bounce a run or like, cut it back. Like, yeah, man, that's kind of exactly what you want him to be doing. - And it's a good point with the duo stuff whether it is chemistry base. But the problem with those zone runs is, it's chemistry place where you're having to feel how, when you should be coming off of double teams, but also you have to climb to the second level. - And you can't lose. - You don't have to do that, right? And you have these big guys. Like, Urcery is a big guy. You have these big powerful linemen at some of these spots. And so I just think this is the path forward for them. I do think that if they tried to build a plane out of this, they would be able to do it. And the last point I'll make about this before we talk briefly about the Jags, Cade Stover I think should be playing more. That's, that's my other thought because they have all these tight ends and none of them really developed this inline blockers. Like Foster Moro is passable, but right now I think Cade Stover is their best run blocker. And so I just think he should be playing more. Some of those 11 personnel staffs with Dalton Schultz on the field like, I think he should be eating into some of those snaps because they're, they're not a good enough run team for you to be limiting the work of what I think is your best run blocker right now. He's not great. I get it. There, I think Vision for him was more of that two back stuff where he uses a fullback, he's good at that. But right now I think you can make an argument. He's their best inline run blocker along with doing some of that like de facto a fullback stuff they were going to have him do. So all this is to say, I think there's potentially some hope here. And the reason I think I'm clean to it is there's so much to like about the rest of the team right now and how it's playing. - Okay, so we're all in agreement that this is a good one in four football team and we are not out on the Houston Texans. Does that matter? - Right, this week you're going to play the Jaguars. - Because wanting to see a little bit more from the run game, this is not the week to do it. The Jags run defense is excellent. They are third in run defense success rate while playing light boxes of the fifth highest rate in the league. What watching the Jags defense right now is awesome. Like they are so well coached. They've got just class eaters up front. The way that Devon Hamilton and Trayvon Walker play the run, everyone is so bought in Jordan Lewis. Like watching Jordan Lewis as just a normal size nickel the way he defends the run. And I'll tell you what man, there are few guys in the league who have been as pleasantly surprising to me this year as Ventral Miller. Ventral Miller is playing some awesome football for the Jags. You were talking about just duo and what it does to the linebackers and you're playing with them. His just patience and feel and like you watch teams try to run that stuff against them. And those guys are just completely in command. Like you see so many linebackers in the league right now where cats, chase, and lasers were jumping into gaps all over the place. And this group is just so incredibly well put together. So maybe this isn't the week to see some of the fruit from what I'm talking about. But I wanted to sit with it a little bit because after the Marv trade, it really was the biggest lingering question I had about what the Texans can be. Just makes it painful that really the Colts game and the Cowboys game too. But like those two games, if you could have found a way to win one, I'd feel so much better about Houston and with the jet. Like you got to find a way to win this game. I mean, the schedule eases up a bit after this. But I just wonder if the whole they've dug themselves is too deep, especially going too London, by the way. And the Jags have been there. So the acclimation is a different story for them. It's a tough draw for a team still trying to figure it out. Last thing to mention, I think, Anton Harrison obviously not playing in this game. And now you're dealing with the Texans edges. So the Jags offensive line was always kind of a concerning point, even with right now playing the way that he was, even with Harrison, but without Harrison taking that step that we've seen from him so far, was a part of that optimism him being out. And now you got Walker Little and Colman Lannan. And it's like, now it's more of a concern and you're about to play against that group of guys. And sometimes you can, you know, sometimes offenses are perfectly equipped to deal with, oh, we're just going to get quick pressures all the time. If you're like a quick passing team, but that is the Jags have built themselves to be the opposite of that. They want to hold the ball for three seconds and chuck it down the field. It's a little bit harder to do that if the blind side of the pocket's getting caved in every single rip. Let's get to our next one here. Bears at Falcons, Dave, this is all you. One thing you are paying attention to in Bears Falcons. The entry point here is pretty obvious. Caleb Williams is expected back after his hamstring injury in week two. And I would posit to you, you know this better than anybody. The Bears offense, the preferred Bears offense, is probably the unit we've seen the least of through five weeks so far this season. We got four quarters and then they played against Brian Flores in a rainstorm and then we never saw the offense again. And so they're back in week six. I'm curious about what it's going to look like for a few reasons. Obviously, of course you're just curious to see what Caleb Williams is going to look like. I, even if he's Superman and he's obviously like a freakish athlete, probably not at 100% full capacity coming off of the hamstring three weeks later. Is that just like a hunch thing? Yes, absolutely. I, there's part of me that I understand why you're saying that. But I also, it's been a while. He's been out for multiple weeks. It sounded like he was questionable last week and potentially could have played and they didn't play him. I'm, maybe I'm just coping. I'm open to the idea that he might be healthy and that he might be ready to go and that they actually have brought him along at the right pace here. Is that the fun thing? Am I deluded? Maybe, I don't know. The fun thing is we're not, we're not going to have to wait long to find out. Cause what does Caleb do the first time something breaks down? I mean, it makes a crazy play and has like a 20 yards grandma that's about that's what's going to happen. I healthy and it's going to be fine. I hope, I hope you're right. I'm curious to see what it looks like. I'm also outside of that because obviously that's, that's so obvious and it changes everything about who the bears are. But I want to say with that just for a second, there's been a lot of consternation this week about the pass catchers because Matt Harmon did a great job of writing about it for Yahoo. He was like, I know you're freaking out about all these guys like, let's take a beat and try to figure out exactly what's happening. And I get it. Colson level in season is one of the most bewildering things about the NFL so far this year. The fact that a man who looked like one of the 20 best players in the league during the playoff, I don't know what the number is. He looked like a star in the playoffs last year and he's been a complete non factor over the first month. It's just bizarre. We have not seen the offense in like any form so far. And so I'm willing to wait and see before we start having any big picture panic about how the guys are being used. Can I be one bears fans don't know how to be good. The fact that you went two and one back up is backs. You went to two and one with backup quarterbacks and we're panicking about guys not looking good enough. Shut up. Respectfully, sorry, like what are you doing? I think it's more about the fantasy community than it is. There's fans that that's that's what I get. I understand you if you draft a close and loved one in the third round. I'd be pissed off. You you lost the quarterback in week two and week two was just a no go game for everybody. It's not like the Vikings looked good either offensively. I mean, and so to be where the bears are after how this is all started. And I'm sorry about your fantasy draft. Look, I have Luther burden on a team or two. I get it. I'm not thrilled either. but in terms of the bears, they're fine. at least so far. I am a little bit worried about their run game and I'm curious to see what it looks like. A, where Caleb is and B, this thing's beat to shit. And I'm, I'm slightly concerned about it if I can be honest with you. I wanted to bring this to y'all. Do you think the bears need help at running back? Because watching Deandre Swift's usage in the second half last week and he is on the injury report with multiple things, he's got a knee and a hip. And Kyle Menongai has turf toe to the point that he saw a specialist last week. He's not on IR, maybe not a specialist, not a special. You don't want to. You don't want to be seeing a specialist turf toe sucks for running back specifically. I mean, you're talking about the ligament in your, in your big toe in the salt, like in the pad of your foot that allows you to cut and drive forward seems bad. And watching the bears run game last week, I understand that it was with a backup quarterback. But for how much Ben Johnson runs shit through his running game, I'm a little bit concerned about it. I don't think that's weird at all. I, I, I feel the same way because I think a lot of people just assumed, okay, no, Menongai. Swift is just going to get 35 carries. And one, they didn't run the ball that often to Ben Johnson came out this week and said explicitly, we're not going to do that. I don't believe in that. We're not going to put that much on a guy like Deandre Swift. We believe in running back by committee. We want to keep these guys fresh over a 17 game season. And so if you're committed to that and they want to ride Menongai in the Jets game, but Menongai is a different sort of player than Deandre Swift is. I think that's important to acknowledge. And the, so the fact that we, if he's going to have that mindset and right now, we're at a spot where that means a decent amount of Rochon Johnson carries. We saw what those were. It was just a non starter. And so I'm with you. My only pushback would be who is it? Yeah. Running back depth in the NFL right now, I think in large part, just because we had a zero with this running back draft class, there are just so many teams that would love another body at running back right now. I don't think there's like a running back three sitting out there that a team's like, oh, yeah, we'll throw you that. There just aren't that many of them. Well, and I think to me, if I'm just looking at like the running back threes all around the league right now, the only one where I'm like, I could maybe trade for him and give him eight carries a game. It's like Ray Davis for the bills. You might be the best team in the NFL. Why are you giving up useful? Like there's your team's players, exactly. Like they're the only team that has a good running back three, but there's no shot they would give him up. He was huge in the game. They just played against the Rams. And I don't, I wouldn't even say he's running back three. I would say him and Ty Johnson are running back to you on the same line because if James Cook got hurt, Ty Johnson isn't getting the majority of the running backwards. Exactly. And so even that great. Ray Davis is more of a backup running back than he is a third string running back. I think you're probably just stuck. And this could be true. I don't want to be an alarmist, you're, but you need to just hope that Monongai's injury really is just something he can manage. But that's what it is, by the way, like if you're a running back and the issue is with the ball of your foot, you're managing managing that all year long. And that's what concerns me is just how much is that going to affect the run game. I also thought from a in the run game specifically, like Garrett Bradbury did not have a wonderful day against Green Bay. Yeah, in great period. No, it has been an issue. Their run game has been inconsistent. I mean, they've had moments where it's looked absolutely dominant, but it has been a little bit up and down. I think the facts are part of that. Even with the two big days that they had, because they went crazy against Carolina, and they went crazy against the Jets. They're still middle of the pack in rushing success rate. They were third last year, like it's 38% versus 45% right now. And of course, a big part of that could be Caleb not being available. I just, I want to see, I want to see what it looks like. And the Falcons, they obviously got gashed by Baltimore last week, but they've been really good at limiting big runs and rushing success for most of the year. If Baltimore doing it with Derek Henry doesn't necessarily mean you're going to be able to replicate that. I'll say this, the two games where they had below a 46% rushing success rate. And the game where they had the 46% was a game where they rushed for like 260, but they rushed for 232 yards against the Jets. It was against the Packers last week. And I think it's so hard to run the ball efficiently when there is absolutely no respect being paid to the quarterback that you're playing against. And it was against the Vikings in that game. Every other game they've been 46% or above. So I do think that in total, the running game is probably going to be okay, but the backs are absolutely a worthwhile consideration. I do think Caleb will stabilize this for sure. I think Caleb will stabilize it. I think this to me also is like, I think it's an issue for the long term of like what, how good can the offense really be over the course of the season. I do think this week they'll be okay. Like I actually think that like last week was kind of almost a simulation for, you know, Declan Doyle is coming off of the Ben Johnson tree. They run some of the same stuff. I do think that the Ravens were a little bit more gap heavy than like Ben Johnson teams typically are in that Falcons game, but they're in the zone and any team in the league right now. And they haven't that great at it. The Bears. Yeah, exactly. And Johnson's a big zone guy. And I think within that Ravens game against the Falcons, it was a lot more gap stuff. I think the Bears can do some of that. But even on the zone stuff, I will say the, I do think the Bears offensive line matches up specifically like I just think that against some of these attack fronts the way that Atlanta tries to play. If you're big enough, he's just not going to get into the backfield. And so I do think that they at least match up okay this week. Yeah, I will say overall, I agree with that. And I think actually are you arguing their best path in this game is really running the ball efficiently. When you were looking at this, when I was doing this three weeks ago and Caleb got hurt and you're looking at the next month and you're thinking, all right, well, Atlanta, you know, that you feel good about that one. It came coming back against this defense the way that this defense is playing. This is not a walkover game like the defense is playing very well, even if they have some issues. And so we're getting back to our 2025 routes on Sunday because this looks like it's going to be a first to 45 wins kind of game. But I just mean the Falcons defense is not a bad unit. The Falcons defense has played well. And so it's it's more of like a rude welcome back for Caleb than you might have thought if you had the Falcons games circled as the one where he'd be back. Jervon Dexter and Brandon Dorless leading the NFL in interior pressures. I we need more attack fronts in the league. We we need more teams embracing the attack front because I think that you're seeing a lot of benefits from it. Before we move on, let's take a quick break. Let's get to the next one here sticking in the NFC North Packers hosting the Cowboys on Sunday night football. Derek, this is you buddy. One thing you're looking for in Packers Cowboys. I mean, we're coming off a game where the Cowboys have been fine replacing the Blitz this year. Their game against Tampa was as bad as I've ever seen. That can really the Cowboys offense trying to handle the Blitz, whether it was allowing free rushers or not having answers when they were throwing their one-on-ones and their corners losing this. Put that on. Like what do you think deserves the most culpability with that? It's obviously hard to know, but I'm just curious if you spun back through it. Like what were your impressions? I thought Tampa Bay did a really, really good job of so Dallas was consistently trying to block everything up with just the five offensive linemen and the back and they were saying we're going to have six and we're going to be able to sort it out and they were wrong because what Tampa kept doing consistently was either they would like you double mug opposite the back and then you make him cross protect and go sort it out with the guard, which I think they did a poor job of doing or you double mug to the back, which is put a player in the A gap and the B gap at stand-up players and then you fire another safety or the nickel behind them and you're just like bodies, bodies, bodies. He can't block everybody. And I just think the Dallas movie by the way, bodies, bodies, bodies. If you look at the Hollywood movie to watch this month, really good one. Yeah, funny, funny getting a random movie reference from me, even though I have not seen that movie, I'm going to count it. But yeah, I think that they did a really, really good job of that against the Cowboys and the Cowboys were kind of unwilling to put a tight end into the formation and help them out with past pro as much as I think that they needed to. And then I think it was that on top of like I think the Bucks corners just played out of their mind, like I'll like defending all the ones that they want one-on-ones that they did. I thought they just played out of their mind. This to me is a Packers defense that some of their Blitz stuff is okay and they do some of this stuff that I'm talking about. I don't think they're as good at it as Todd Bulls. And then I also now, Dallas is getting 10 days to prep for it. And also, I just, their corners are not going to win the one-on-ones the same way that the Tampa guys were like those guys are longer. They're dying. McCollum is longer. Jacob Parrish isn't as big, but he is just very, very aggressive. The Packers corners, I think, are a little bit more gettable, especially in that one-on-one. Throw it outside the numbers. Our guy can find it. So I just think if you're Dallas and your whole thing is our offense has to win us games, this is a good get back on track team against a Packers offense that is like middle of the pack in Blitzing like they'll do it and they'll make you win it. And so I just think I'm hoping to see the offense get back on track there. I don't want to take too much of a detour here, but I'm just curious where you guys are with this. What do you think of the Packers right now? Long dramatic pause. Um, I think the Packers have done a good job of stabilizing what looked like a five alarm fire. I agree. I don't. So what does that mean? I don't know what it means in the big picture. I don't know how good I actually think they are, but they're not a disaster anymore, which they were through the first two or three weeks of the season. Like one stat I looked up for this game, they're up to like since plugging Lake and Tom Linson and Travis Glover in and Kevin Zyler, my play a role this week, we'll see their 19th in rushing success rate after what it looked like last. It helps to play the Bears, which we didn't mention that. in the Falcons preview, there's a chance Bion goes for 250 in this game. Oh, yeah, that's what I mean, that's what I meant by first to 45. I mean, the Falcons are going to get theirs in that game. Don't worry. Yeah, I mean, hey, they beat the shit out of the bears, credit to them. I don't know what that means in the big picture. I am impressed. I'm, I'm impressed that the Packers look like a functional football team after the first few weeks. Here, here's my read on it. I think the biggest question about the offense was going to be whether the line was going to get to a functional place in past protection, because if that happened, I think the quarterback is a really, really good player. What Christian Watson looks like right now, what Matthew Golden looks like right now. So I hear you. And I, what I was about to say is like, okay, but what is doing that to the bears mean, but they get the cowboys this, but I, but that's, what is doing it to bears mean? I think that's a fair thing, but I don't know where they are. Like, if they, and the cowboys might not be the right parameter either, but if, if their past protection is good enough with the way that the quarterback is playing with the way that, with the receivers that they have, I do think that they've got a lot of firepower. Like I actually do think they're dangerous. And all off season, when we talked about the line, I understood your guys is concerned about the line. I get it. But this team and the bears game is a perfect example. And maybe it's not the best example because they got a beat on those guys. The floor is the one the best past protection coaches in professional football. He has been for a very long time. He talked to other guys who work with him. That is the best thing that he does. The plan that they have is always really, really good. If the talent is just passable, if the talent can feel passable and we get to a place where they can keep the quarterback upright. And he's playing like this and they've got the flamethrowers out there that they have. I don't know, man. Like I still think they're pretty dangerous. I think offensively. Yes. They to me feel like almost the same exact conversation we just had about the Texans where it's like you have enough firepower at receiver. The offensive line is up and down. But if it can be enough for the quarterback, the way that he's playing right now, we can be a really explosive and good offense. The difference for me is I still need to see it from this defense. I know that like Mike comes back sooner rather than later. I know. And that maybe that does change things. But the only time they've played a starting quarterback this year, not in a rainstorm. The way that they did against the Jets was the Michael Pinnix Falcons. Yeah, they barely won that game. But it was the Michael Pinnix Falcons game. And he beat the hell out of them. They dropped 35 on them. All that is totally right. I guess I'm just in a place where I'm like, I don't know what to do with this team. I don't know what to do with them. They're alive. I know what to do with them. They're alive. I don't know how to do with them. I will go. I'll go the opposite way. I really am willing to ignore the defense, basically, because Micah Parsons is a field tilter who couldn't. I've said that I've been consistent about that all year where it's like all bets could be off when he's back. It's just a matter of what you look like when he gets there. And they're alive. So credit to them. I want to see what they look like going against the defense that can hang. And that's not the bears. And it probably won't be the Cowboys this week. Not to take anything away from them. It won't be the lions. It might not be the Panthers after that. It might be a while from now. But that shit can look pretty like bad offensive line play can just wreck everything, no matter what Christian Watson's doing. And the offensive line looks better. And maybe that'll be a trend. But I'm, I'm just going to sit back and wait. I'm going to push back a little bit. The bears are not good on defense. I, I'm more worried about the bears defense that any of you, because I live with it every minute of every day. But they had looked okay previously. They had not looked like a dumpster fire. And the Packers just did that. Derek and I told you weeks like before that ever happened that it was fraudulent. That I knew that though. I knew they were fraudulent. But they are not, they are not dead last and deep in defensive, like DVO way. They have been fine to like two points this season. They have made NFL offenses struggle. And the Packers did that to them. I don't think they're good by any stretch. I think they're actively bad. But I still think doing that to a defense that has just been merely bad this season. There's some signal in that. We should pay attention somewhat to that. It shouldn't just be like, ah, it's the bears. The bears had been a NFL defense through the first four weeks of the year. Just don't pay super close attention to the Panthers game. But yeah, sure. I'm, I'm not trying to shit on the Packers, but I'm perfectly comfortable just letting them hang out here and, and see what they do. And, and their season looked like it was over after three weeks. And the fact that that it's here now is, is good and impressive and a testament to them. The fact that we're, the, the fruit, the fruit that were you used as a live that they're alive in real time when they lost that game against the Falcons. I made a joke to Derek about in Widow's Bay with the serial killer when she follows him into the crematorium. And it's just like, I'm going to watch this until the final moment because I don't believe it. That's how I am with the Green Bay Packers. And I am vindicated right now in this moment. They have revived themselves. I will say even though they have revived themselves, I'm still angry. It took this. I'm still upset with them that they went into week one with those guards and had to sign Lake and Thomas and off the street. What do we do? You know what? Like the Packers think they're better than desperation signings. That's, that's a hundred percent right. It's refreshing to see them be like, Oh, yeah, okay, we got to do this. Before we get out of here, talking about the current state of the Dallas Cowboys. What a week for the Dallas Cowboys defense. Just in the media. I mean, we got players only meetings. We are speed running. Everything is falling apart. Beat by beat. We don't play as only meeting three days. We're hiring defensive assistants, like Mike Patton to come in and try to stabilize this thing. We're having conversations about whether the defense of coordinators going to be on the field or in the booth. They're speed running it. Everything like it usually takes like you trickle this in over a couple of weeks. I will move the defensive coordinator. Then we'll hire a guy. All this stuff. The fact that it's all happened at once feels very like, we'll see if this gets to Halloween sort of like how fast that this is unraveling, which is I to me would be ridiculous. But my favorite part is Jerry's and Jerry Jones loves to do this. He'll get on the radio and say what happened in the staff meeting that morning on the radio before anybody else has a chance to say anything. So he's like, yeah, Christian Parker's going to move to the booth. And Brian Shottonheimer was like, well, we're still talking about that. And I covered this team for 10 years. Typically when the coach says that, he's like, yeah, that's what's going to happen. But I got to save some face here. But then Christian Parker came out Thursday and said, I'll probably be on the sideline. So now the coaching staff is contradicting what the owner said on the radio, which probably shouldn't say that on the radio. That whole sentence is separate issue. Kind of explained the Alice Cowboys just to the girl. So we'll see how all that goes. I don't want it to seem like we're running. I'm running from the Christian Parker conversation. We actually have a space for it next week where we're going to actually going to explore some of this in depth. And so I just want to put that out there. I just want people to know that there is a more considered look at this coming a little bit further down the road. We don't have to do that during the week six preview. Let's get to Raven's Browns. Dave, you were on Raven's Browns. One thing you were looking for in this one is what? Well, I'm emotionally invested in this because I drafted the Browns defense in our shirt at EPA per play draft. Pretty highly I might add. I just want to say right now with the way that's going and the fact that I have the Cowboys. Not only am I going to buy you guys dinner, if the Cowboys finish 30th or lower in defense of EPA per play, I'm going to donate a significant amount of money to a local Dallas charity. I just want you guys to know that right now. I can help you out. I was I'm going to ask you what the right ones would be. Dinner for us three is not enough for me to pay for what I have done. I need to do some good with my wallet if that ends up happening. Just want to throw that out there right now. Anyway, selfishly, I am I am invested in this Browns defense and similar to what you're talking about with the Cowboys after week one against the Jags, I was like, ah, but very quietly, they are they are they are really good NFL defense through and so through five weeks, even if you include the Jags game, they're 11th and defensive DVOA. They're playing good ball ever since. How real is that is the question. They did have a nice day against Carolina, who is a top 10 offense. Their past rush ruined the game. Yes, they are they're past rush. It's awesome. That can ruin a football game. And we're going to talk about the Panthers offense here in a second. Panthers offense has been a top bullet like with a bullet top 10 unit like nothing fraudulent about that. And the Browns past rush completely dismantled them in that game. They had no shot. Their other opponents are a little bit fraudulent. You have the the Baker box and Baker was just having a terrible start to the year. The Steelers who were very schizophrenic and then the Jets in a downpour all day last weekend. Still impressive, but I didn't mean the Ravens is going to be a different test entirely. And I would say that even if Lamar Jackson can't go, I don't know the answer to that right now. He didn't practice today, but it's sound. He wasn't at practice. I saw Jeff Zaryback tweeted that out on what like right before we started recording, but it sounds like he's probably going to play. Is that where we're at? I think you nailed it. Yes. Okay. We're probably not going to know until. Look at me. Go. We're not going to know until we know. Obviously, but it sounds like that's the right direction plays. I'm tired of this. He's playing so well. I want him back. Here's the funny thing though. I still think this is a huge test for the Browns. Even if Lamar doesn't play because so much of Cleveland's success is their top five in and pressure eight, they're one of six teams. with 16 sacks. And that's without Jared verse, even getting going from a sack perspective. They're top top for an EPA per drop back against the past 11th and drop back success rate. They're awful against the run. They are, they are a bad run defense right now. And I think so much of it is tackling only five defenses. So far this year have missed more tackles than Cleveland. And it's some teams you don't want to be lumped in with the cowboys, the bills, the Broncos who even with, you know, some of their numbers are better. They've missed just a ton of tackles this year. They are allowing three and a half yards after contact per rush, which again is fifth worst in the NFL. They're also just, I think this outlines it very perfectly. The Browns are the second best defense in the league in producing plays that gain zero or negative yards, only behind the Vikings. They're also bottom 10 in the percentage of plays that gain 10 plus yards, like 22% of plays against them gain 10 or more yards. And I think a big part of it is they just missed tackles. Like go back and watch the Jets game, the Garrett Wilson touchdown, Ronnie Hickman, just misses a tackle in space that turns like an 11 yard gain into an explosive touchdown. Several of Braille and Allen's biggest runs. He bounced off of Denzel Ward. He cut back against like a crowded gap into another one and was off to the races. Are you willing to tack that up to conditions? That can happen where you just tackle like shit in a game where it's raining all day, maybe, but the numbers bear out that it's just been a consistent problem throughout the season. And yeah, I mean, the conditions were horrid, but I mean, if you wrap your arms around a guy in the ring, I don't bring him down. I don't know. Like football is meant to be played in the ring. We play these games in the ring. I don't, that doesn't hold water with me pardon the pun. I think they're so close to being a really fantastic defense. And I think the Ravens are really good at what they don't do well. And so it's, this is a great rubber meets the road matchup for me. Is Mason Graham going to play in this game? That's their injury list is insane. And so we'll see what it looks like. But like, as of I looked this up last night, so I don't know if they've practiced as of today, but Derek Barnett's on the injury report. Malik Collins, Kalea Davis, Mason Graham, Mike Hall, Carson Swaychinger's dealing with an ankle injury. He suffered during the Jets game. So you hope some of those guys are available because this could be a different conversation entirely. Malik Holland wouldn't practice Wednesday. And neither did Mason Graham, but I mean, a lot of guys didn't. My God, that's, it's a long list. And that's bad. If you cannot, the coast, I mean, the whole thing about the Ravens run game is like if you can get into the backfield against Derek Henry and like get a hand on him or like force the run to bounce in a way that he doesn't want. You can stop them. And that's really all that Cleveland wants to do as a run defense. They want to fire these backers. They want to fire the defensive tackle, stunt them, stem them, whatever it's going to be to get into the backfield. And if you, I think even if they have their guys healthy, that's kind of difficult to do. I think with just how well, how well coached, I think the Ravens offensive line is exactly. If you know what you're hunting, yes, though you can have big games. The, the best example of this, obviously, it's a different coaching staff. Ironically, the head coach of the Browns right now. Remember that Christmas game they played against Houston two years ago? Where you're just hunting the runs against that attack front. And they just ran for a bazillion yards, even against good defenses. If you have a good plan against some of these attack fronts, you can get gashes. It used to happen to the, even the best versions of the Niners all the time, where like they would just get boasts of chasing stuff where they would get just like slam a trap around against one of the defensive tackles flying up the field, whether it's Eric Armsdetter whoever, like you can, you can get them. And so that, that's going to be true again, even if Graham is playing, even if Malik Collins is playing. If they're not in its backups, who are also going to be a step slower and maybe not know that they're about to get yearhold by a guard, there's a chance that the Ravens could just run away with this game again. To that point, I rewatch the Browns Jets game. Joe Tipman's day against the Browns was such an amazing example of how hard it is to play offensive line in the NFL, because if, like if you watch the game on TV and he had, he had some really bad moments like Malik Collins just swam him clean for just an embarrassing sack. And he drew a holding flag. And he was also the guy that couldn't get around to Carson Swessinger on the strip sack that played a big role in the fourth quarter. Like he had two or three horrific moments. And people were killing him for it. Go watch the game. And he was just mauling the Browns linebackers in the run game, like, and like getting to the second level, just cutting guys out of the play. They were gashing Cleveland in the run game because of how well the interior was playing. And nobody gives a shit because you give up like three splash plays. And I think the Ravens offensive line is capable of doing similar stuff if, if the Browns aren't on it or unfortunately, if they're not healthy too, we're in a spot right now where I think it's just what are these defenses, you know, like what, what are these teams? Like we're still only five weeks in in the Browns case again, they played a weather game. They've played some strange games. I look at the Browns defense right now. I look at the talent they have at all three levels. And I look at some of the stuff Mike Roonberg has done over the first five weeks. I think I'm kind of bought into this. Like I think they have enough talent at all three levels. I asked you, Derek, uh, in the production meeting right now outside of San Francisco. I think we can tack that up with the way the green laws played in the fact of Fred Warner's Fred Warner, who is the best lineback in court in the NFL right now. I think my, my answer right now based on how they played would probably be Jacksonville. I just think that both those guys are playing at such a high level. But Cleveland is absolutely in the conversation. Like they're on the podium or they're in your Mount Rushmore. However, you want to bucket it right now. Quincy Williams was a maniac in that Jets power friendship way back with Mike Roonberg, which I talked about coming into the season. And it's better than I thought it was. I mean, he's got it out of his mind. And I mean, like a hat trick of force fumbles is crazy, which is what he did last week. Some of that is maybe, you know, you're, you're playing a not so great team, but still almost impossible to do. To your point though, like, I really do think that there's a group of like three or four teams that you can mention after the Niners. It's like it's the Browns. It's the Jags. The Seahawks, I think kind of even though Drake Thomas is a very specific player, I think that that they are in there. If they're healthy, the Texans guys, but they have not been. But like after that, like that, to me does feel like it's tier. And the fact that, you know, last year, I felt like to me with Devon Bush on the Browns, they were getting by. They were using him in a very specific way. He was only a downhill player and it kind of worked okay, but it really was Swessinger holding a lot of the holding a lot of the weight for them there. Quincy Williams is pulling his own on this linebacking unit. Like they're, they're really, really good. The front is good. Mason Graham was playing the best ball of his career before he got hurt. I'm excited to see him back. We talked about Malik Collins versus what he is. The linebackers are good. Outside corners are solid and manual, but me a warrants playing well. Like overall, I think that a lot of the sliding doors, things with this defense, like what do we get from the rookies? What do we get from the second year players? Like how, what do we get from the new scheme? I think a lot of those kind of sliding doors, things where it was like, yeah, it kind of go either way. A lot of them have turned up in favor for the Browns defense so far. I think that's why I'm bought into this. It made I look good this week, because if Lamar is back, I truly think the Ravens, the Ravens offense is about as potent as any in the league right now, just with the way Lamar is playing and how dialed in Declan Doyle was like it. The idea that I don't know, they're slow playing the Camdjurget thing. Like, God, who get up to speed? The fact that they even feel comfortable enough doing that, I think speaks to how good everything probably feels over there right now. They probably rewatch Vengo. You want to play center last week? And they were like, Oh, we're, we're okay. Take your time. Yeah, you'd go at your own leisure, my friend. Panthers at Eagles. This one's mine. A little bit of a curveball thrown in here. Jalen hurts now out with the blood clot in his leg. What do you make of the timeline with all of this? I was like reading a little bit about it while we were prepping. It came across while I was driving in the fact that they kind of saw it before the game, but then he still played a you, somebody who was like around a team very closely for a long time. I'm curious what your read on this is from that perspective. When I read it, I just thought to myself, I trust that the doctors know what they're looking at and are giving him good advice. I would not want to play a football game if somebody found a blood clot anywhere in my body. To the point where like football players are crazy, kudos to Jalen hurts. He's obviously a tough son of a gun. That's, that's another level for me where I'm just like, man, take, take care of yourself. Please, Lord, and I'm just, I'm glad our flights back and forth. Yeah. I'm glad it, I'm glad it has a, I'm glad this is a benign update. Like I'm glad this is, is no big deal apparently because when I first saw it, I was like, man, I know they got to like tie you to a chair to keep you from playing a game, but that, that, like that's a, that's a different level for me. That's not gutting it through a sprain or something. That, that's, that those words scare the shit out of me. I'm not a medical professional, but that was my initial reaction. Overall, I don't really know what else there is to say about the Eagles, like the perspective from the Eagles here. This season is spiraling. I mean, I give them so much credit. We didn't real time for the way they played against the Jags. I mean, the idea that they came out and if it didn't go off the rails in the final 10 seconds of the game, they beat the Jaguars in London with Jalen Hertz and whoever out there on offense, a derriest Cooper and, I mean, it, it will ship Lee, like that's where we were at. It was, it was, it was Jalen Hertz, Zach Ernie. It's Darius Cooper Damian Pierce, Willie Lampkin and they almost won the game and the defense obviously carried a ton of that jail on Carter had a monster day. But the fact that you could even win an NFL game with the state of their offense is enviable. Now you're removing the quarterback from the situation like it's there in a really, really difficult spot, even if I think their effort and their ability to hang in that game with the Jags last year was commendable last week. I mean, their entry report list looks like an ancient scroll. It's like 20 guys long and that was bad. Yes. You're on the list. Yeah. It's like every every day it just seems like they're adding a new guy on there and that was before you had we have like a pretty bizarre update for having the quarterback go on with blood clots. And so I just this is even if you imagine some sort of bad case scenario for the Eagles going into the season. This is like four levels under that, which brings me to an odd point that I wanted to make about this game. I'm curious about the Panther's defense. And so this might not be the best test or you can spit it the other way. This is the perfect test. If you can't do it this week that I have real concerns a Caleb Evans. If this isn't the week, then there won't be a week. Part of the reason I wanted to focus on the Panther's defense in this conversation, it's akin to what we were saying about the Texans before. I think the Panther's offense is legitimately good. And I was thinking a lot about this this week and we talk about this with defense sometimes where there are different versions of what a good defense can feel like. And I think there are some offenses in the NFL that are good because everything looks the same, right? The Rams are the best example of this where everything is tied together. It's actually a pretty limited amount of what you're trying to do. But because it's also cohesive, you are a really hard unit to deal with. The Panthers are the opposite of that. Like they're hard because you don't know what's coming. And if you can make a seemingly disparate approach on offense, if you can tie it together enough, then it can just feel like you have a defense where their head is just spinning the entire game. It's like, here's an RPO. Here's this. Here's that. Here's an under center run. Here's a play action. Here's a boot. And that I think that was what the Panthers wanted to be offensively. It uses a term that I think is really telling and I think it speaks to what they've been. I want to unsettle the defense. I want them to feel constantly unsettled and they've made good on that. The Panthers defense is unsettled, offenses unsettle the teams that they've played against in a really efficient way. I'm buying this. And because of that, I want to know what the defense is. I want to know what the defense is. So I know what to think of you. Like, should you be the favorite in the NFC South? Are you a potential wildcard team if the Falcons are for real? Like, holistically, what are you? And so I wanted to spend some time this week just looking at the defense and like, what they've even been. It's kind of a strange unit in terms of some of the numbers, the approach. They have a good run defense. They have the fewest run stuffs in the league. And when you watch them play, it actually does make sense because we talk about read fronts. This is, they're not trying to get into the backfield. Those aren't the types of players that they have. They're trying to sit there with Lee Hunter and Derek Brown and be like, move us. Yes. I dare you. I dare you. This is what the Rams were last year, too, whereas like they didn't get into the backfield, but they were one of the bet like a really good run defense because it was like, we're going to sit here and we're going to make you move us. And it's pretty hard to do, especially with as well as the Panthers guys are playing right now. They were really good run defense last year. They've carried over being a pretty good one this year. The thing that's surprising about them and Derek, you and I talked about this in real time in the hangover about why the Lions were so much gun in that game. And I think it was twofold in kind of gathering some more information about it. One, it is because of the amount of pressures that the Panthers have sent this year. And I, when we were watching it and talking about it, I was like, man, the Panthers, that heavy of a pressure team. And then you look at the numbers so far this season, they're blitzing on 41% of snaps. The only teams ahead of them are Brian Flores. Brian Flores is a junior in Washington with Gerrante Jones and Todd Bolz. So we have the guys in the NFL who we think of as three blitz guys, and now we, and that's what the Panthers have done. When you watch it, though, and that being like a real tent pole of who they're trying to be defensively, it feels like they're cosplaying a little bit as one of those teams. And I think it's for a few different reasons, but the success on those plays, they have a bottom five blitz rate on plays where they're blitzing without play action. They have a bottom five success rate on those plays. And I think it's just because they're trying to live outside of what they typically are. Like that what we just talked about with the defense, like the run defense and how they're not making a lot of plays in the backfield inherently this group with ever oh has not been that aggressive. It's been one more of that like that fan geo we're going to sit back. We're going to play a decent amount of soft zone. They play very little man coverage, and so them being this blitz heavy of a team. It doesn't feel like it really suits them. It still feels like they're trying to find their footing as that sort of team. And so I think that's what we're watching right now as they sort through that process. And that's only been compounded by the fact that you see the corners not being out there. You watch what the lions were doing and they were just circling a kale of evidence on all of these plays. And so I think because schematically they're still trying to figure out who they are and because now without the corners for a while, that's something to really worry about. In this game, it might not matter, but I have some long term concerns about how this is all going to be tied together for Carolina. I just love that we have so satisfactorily answered the Bryce Young thing that has lingered over this team for so long now we can worry about like what you're sealing actually is. But that was the whole point, right? Is that we thought the other the rest of the team might be good enough where the Bryce Young question was the only question and the defense has lagged behind the defense has not played as well as the investments would lead you to believe. And I think that was true even before the corners got hurt, obviously, the bear scored 59 points in week one. Yeah. That's a good point. But I would just say they've they've had shit injury lock all year. Yeah. And that starts with like day one of training. Of course, you lose scorton on the second practice of the year, but everybody's dealing with injuries. And that's. Well, you lose both your starting corners and those are the two probably best players on your defense. Yeah. That's a tough one. It's like round and it's like, well, when you don't have anywhere, well, that's pretty tough. I do think schematically some of the issues I have with them and I do think like they kind of caught the lines a little bit where like they're blitzing so much Earth's early in the season, you don't know how much of this is going to be real for certain teams. And they are doing it a lot, but I usually find with the teams that blitz a ton. There's some amount of uncertainty that offenses are supposed to feel going against that. But because with the panthers, it's all five man rush every single time. Like they really do not bring cover zero and bring six or seven rushers. And in my mind, if you're going to be a high pressure team, you need to have the threat, the kernel in the back of the offense is mind of like, oh, everybody might they're all kind of, they got to make them, but you got to make them believe it because you believe it. Exactly. And like all the other defenses that blitz a ton do this, Washington has done this this year. They'll run cover zero. Brian Flores obviously spags and the chiefs will do this. The New England Patriots. Another great example, high blitz team, they will bring zero. And some teams do it with zone, some teams do it with man. Obviously the panthers are more of a zone team, especially with their corners. But I just think if you're going to be that high of a pressure team, you got to scare the bejesus out of teams a little bit with some more cover zero stuff. And again, maybe this week, it doesn't matter because you're pulling a backup quarterback with like eight other backups on the offense. I do think that that's something as the year goes on, the good quarterbacks are going to catch on that. They're going to know that like, okay, if you're bringing stuff, it's 3d 300 every time. I know how to beat that. I want people to know that you brought up that point independently before I told you the staff before the show started this season. They have brought fewer six man pressures, six or more than any team in football. They've done it 12.9% of the time despite blitzing at the fourth highest rate in the week. So obviously they have by far the highest five man pressure rate in the NFL. Some of that is the amount of five man fronts that they're in. And that was one of the other reasons that the lions played the way that they did. The lions, the panthers played less base in the lion's game than they ever, they have all season by far in part because the lions were in lighter personnel because they didn't want Derek Brown sitting over the center. And so they have a lot of five man fronts without us bring everybody. But even when you're accounting for down in distance, nickel, non-play action, non first down, they still are super, super high blitz rate and they're not bringing six or more. Real quick before we move on, I had a question for you about the Eagles. You said that when the Jürgen straight happened, and I agree with you that that is, that's not like a tanking move. That's about way more than that. And the opportunity cost of what Baltimore is willing to pay makes it a no brainer. However, if they lose a couple more games, who would you trade though? That's my question. Who's calling? But I wouldn't trade any of the young defensive guys. I like that would be a non starter to me. You're too good. You turn around too fast in this week. They come on, Barclay. I mean, if the Bears should have a great, a hard thing. So the reason I bring this up is for 30 teams, this is bullshit, water cooler talk that would never materialize. Hey, you were just saying that who has a guy never goes, never to happen. If there is a team, if there is a team that A has the job security and B, the forward analytical thinking to do some like baseball or basketball style shit, where you're strategically selling off at the deadline in order to revamp your restart early, it would be the Eagles. You at least agree with that. 100% agree with that. I don't know how many pieces you could deal off like Sequan comes to mind. it would have to be to re-quillin. Sure. If somebody wants, maybe Seattle's like, you know what, we miss him. We'll take him back, please. I wonder, I wonder if they'd be willing to do that. Because they, I think, are fine quietly tanking. That's allowed. That's loudly tanking. That's loud. And if there is anybody who could sit there and just take every single bullet to do something like that. That's how he roseman is the person. I just wonder if you want to engage in that sort of heat. When you know if this goes poorly, you might fire your head coach. That's just tough optically and it's tough to sell it to the locker room. I just think it's it's interesting because it's the Eagles. I don't think very many other teams would do something like that. But if they lose this game and then they got the Cowboys after that on Monday night football, let's say you lose both of these games to fall to two and five as the deadline gets close. And it's just obvious that you don't have the juice. I'm, I'm thinking about it. If Tanner McKee puts up like 30 on the Cowboys and Monday night football, I have to leave the country. You do. Oh, you do. I got all the fear anymore. I have someone who has the Eagles and the wins blood beats perfectly okay with that. It's going to our last one here. Bills at Raiders. This is all you Derek. What do you got? Yeah, mine, I think is, you know, I think we are excited about what the Raiders defense has been last week was not their best. And that was obviously Drake May is just throwing for like 400 yards on them. It was a tough day. Not what you want when it when you can't touch the quarterback and he's going to do that to you. This I think is a very different test. Obviously going against Josh Allen in the bills, but specifically the bills run game because the Patriots run game is like not that great. They didn't do a whole lot against the Raiders. I think in this game though, the Raiders run defense of this year in against 12 and 13 personnel outside the 10 because I think like once you get into the goal and they gets a little bit different. But I say 12 and 13 personnel because that's what the bills do. They are sick in run defense success rate on 34 runs and they've allowed three explosives. One of those was in the New England game when the game was like 20 point blowout didn't really matter. So really, they've only given up a couple against the chiefs. And other than that, they have been pretty good. But this is one of those things where I am certain the bills heavy run game is real. They've done it for years now. They can do it all sorts of different ways. They've already adapted this season. I don't know if that's real for the Raiders defense yet. There's been some kernels that this is a real thing and that they've been good and they can put Kway Walker on the line and Kobe Deans playing well, the detacles. This is a very much a if your run defense is real, especially out of base. This is the game to prove it. And I just kind of want to see if they've got that to them. I totally get that. And we talked about it. I can't remember what show it was, but just talk about how the way that Tonka Hemingway has played this year and just how good he looks for them and why he's a part of why the defense just feels different. This was a unit. I think part of it. If I'm just interrogating why I felt this way, their mix of like rotational pieces and quasi starters looked terrible front against the Texans in the preseason. And so coming into the season, I was like, man, is this just going to be an interior group that gets blown off the ball every single play? And that didn't happen over the first few games of the year. In part, because Tonka Hemingway was playing really well as a starter and Fattucasi was given them something, but Tonka Hemingway is dealing with a concussion. So he may not play in this game. So this may be this may not be the week to get your answer, because one of the most important pieces on their defensive line is in play, potentially isn't playing in this game. I do think that that that does hurt them a little bit. I still think that most of the rest of the front being healthy and out there, I do think that like you should be able to not this should be a defense that if you are a real run defense, you do not let James Cook go for 130 and two touchdowns. Uh, I will say there are you in that not hydrogen. I would say like 35%. I think that the bills probably can do what they want to do. And I do want to flip this to the other side of the ball. Um, I think James what obviously the fumbles are are what they are that the Rams game was was really gross. And I think that there are certain things about the bills run game that is the scheme is good. And having Josh Allen helps you because you get different boxes and the offensive line is playing well on the tight ends. James Cook's footwork is unbelievable. He makes so many runs right that are wrong or get six when there's three blocks like his the way he sees it specifically on their duo stuff when he's just working it back against the grain is sensational. And I just think against a thing in the NFL right now watching them do that. It's the way that they just bend runs back and he it just feels like he's sliding across like like truly like he's like on a rail behind the line of scrimmage and just sliding across it. It really is beautiful to watch. And I think the way that he'll set up line backers is really impressive. And the reason I say that is the Kobe Dean has been awesome this year. You can get him peaking and guessing and a little bit like the big Kenneth Walker run is because he's trying to peek the backside of a block. And Kenneth Walker's just like fine. I'll spring it out the front side and he's gone for 76 yards. James Cook can do that to you. And so I just think that that is something that I think the Raiders defense needs to be keen on this week. Just keep the Kobe Dean off the phone with Nate Landman. Whatever the hell Nate Landman saw in film. Don't show it to the Kobe Dean. The other thing I point out here. I want to see something that builds defense. I want to see something. We've been in a panic mode about the Cowboys defense all year. And they have been the worst defense in the league. The bills want to win the Super Bowl, right? The bills right now I think have are tied for the third best Super Bowl odds. The Rams are still second, I think, which is hilarious. But I think I'm pretty sure the bills are third at like plus 800 with the Ravens. If you're that sort of team, can you do that with the 28th best defense in the league? Doesn't feel like it. I don't I don't think you can. And it's so funny, man. I would just I'm trying to be better about this when I'm looking up stats for specific things we're talking about. If something pops out at me, just throw it in there and just hit it in whenever we get a chance to when blitzing this Jim Leonard, right? The pressure stuff. Man, like the simulateds and the blitzes and like, what is that? What is that going to look like? This season, when blitzing, the bills have allowed a 57.6% success rate. That's horrendous. That is just that is like MVP, like if a quarterback is if a quarterback had that over the course of their season, they'd be the best in the league by a lot. It wouldn't be close. I'm putting you on the spot here and I apologize, but what's the fix? I don't know, man. I like the front. I like Buffalo front for the most part. I mean, I know they didn't have the secondary. I mean, I don't know. I mean, this is and again, this applies to the Cowboys too. And I don't want to keep bringing it back to that, but patience with new staffs, like just just patience with new staffs, like just because some of them look really good right away, doesn't mean the ones that don't look good right away can't fix this. It's really hard to install a defensive specifically. When you have a defense that so much communication, so many moving parts, it can be hard to get like, get results right away. I am open to the idea that with more time, just the ability to kind of fine tune some stuff and make sure you got everything buttoned up on the back and this can look better, but the secondary just looks completely outmaned. I mean, in pretty much every single game they play. They're outmaned up. They look outmanned and also like it's just kind of a weird mishmash of players. Like I think you look at that secondary and it's a little bit hard to be like, this is what the identity should be because the answer's a little bit different for every single guy. And it's just built for a different sort of defense. And you had to like, now it's a mishmash into the idea that they'd be able to transition into this and they just haven't been able to. It's the blend of, it was built for a previous defense, like it's like spending a first round pick on Maxwell Harrison, for example. And then that of like, well, we have to replace our nickel because he was getting a little bit older. And so we bring in this like mid-level free agent and then we have to save our safety room that's been bad for three years by bringing in CJ Gardner Johnson. And I don't even think that was necessarily like good scheme fit. It was just like, what else were they going to do given the resources that they had? Like it's just, it's a really weird room, which I think that's why all this is so frustrating is that the front to Dave's point is awesome. The front four is so, so, so good. And it just doesn't matter too often. This is, it's so early in the year that like, I think it's just, it's important to paint it with this sort of the condition. I'm not, it can get better. Like this is, it's so early that it can get better. You're on notice. You need to show something to me. That's where I'm at. I am totally fine accepting that it can improve. And this is not what it's going to be cast in concrete for the next 10 weeks. This has to get better if this team wants to do is going to do what it wants to do. I promise, it was, it wasn't my goal to be trade guy on this show. We didn't talk about it. You want to, you want that to be your role moving forward? I'm happy again. Well, happy to incorporate that. I'm just thinking about how unimpressive Mike McDonald's first defense wasn't Seattle and how trading for Ernest Jones made it click. And it looked so much better in the second half of the year. I don't even know what the deal would be. But or, and maybe, maybe they just pick it up on their own over time. You know, and I was going to say, I had such a high degree of confidence. No matter how shitty the bill's defense looked, I always like, well, Sean McDermott's going to whip it together with duct tape and WD 40 by come hell or high water. Sean McDermott's not there. And it's a different scheme. Maybe they just figure this out on their own or maybe something like that could click this thing into place. Whatever you think the problem is, maybe, maybe it could be a linebacker. Maybe it could be somebody on the back end. But if you're trying to ensure that because you have a Super Bowl ceiling, that could be an effective way to do it. Yeah, it's not a bad thought. I think they're the sort of team where you could absolutely justify it. Before we move on, we're going to take one more quick break. All right. Let's spend a little bit of time on Sikko Street this week. Sikko Street for week six is Cardinals at Rams. The Los Angeles Rams belong on Sikko Street right now. You have put yourself here. And this is why I think it's a fitting entry for this framing. I think a lot of people are going to be watching this game and watching the Rams even have probably already, but especially this one with like nefarious intentions. Yes. If the Rams are a 12 and a half point favorite in this game, if the Rams lose to the Cardinals, people are going to be dancing in the streets that had to hear about this being a super team all off season. And I don't blame them. This reminds me of college football where, okay, so late window. I know you don't know the windows have no idea when Peter seems to play. I assume this is late because it's West Coast. Late window. I don't geography. There you go. Good job. Thank you. Mastered Pacific time. East and West actually having it all. Cardinals are Cardinals Rams. Chargers chiefs bills raiders are the three late games. I assume bills raiders is the natural place to go because it's two teams with a winning record. But it reminds me of college football in the sense of if the Cardinals take the lead or like if it's close at halftime similar to when that happens to like Alabama on a Saturday, everybody's just like, Oh, they're given Alabama a game, huh? And you just get more and more intrigued as the game goes along. At this point of the season, you're two and three things are, again, they have the second best super wise. This is the things are far from over. They're probably going to be okay. But you were in a vulnerable place and now you are on display. If you can't hide in the new window, if it's 1310 at halftime, even if they're winning 13 to 10 and a half time, people are going to be like, let me just, let me throw that on the double box, just in case something cool happens in the second half. Are you not saying that bills raiders is going to be compelling enough to steal the attention of most of America or the game's happening? It's a really easy one with this rate. The funny thing is the chargers, the Rams are not supposed to be two and three. And it is relative to the expectations. It's an absolute failure that they are. The chargers are not supposed to be o and five either. But that is just so far gone that it's not even worth visiting on something like Zico Street. I, my take is that the Rams have to be happy. The chargers exist because they can't be the most disappointing team in the league. But now we're getting to a point where the chargers were things are so bad that people are going to stop paying attention. And so now, even if they technically are the most disappointing team, we're going to shift the gaze back to the Rams because chargers are just out of sight out of mind because it's so, so over. They badly need the chargers to steal a game somewhere. Well, it's probably not going to be this one, but they like next week, they, they need them to start stealing some games and get back to three and seven. So we can talk about how frustrating this charger season is because if the chargers get to oh and nine, we're not going to do that anymore. It's over like they have no shot of anything. Even in this window, how great would it be for the Rams? If it is 1310 at halftime, but the chargers are also keeping it close. Yeah, they're like, look, they look over there at the chief scam. This isn't even, I'm not even going to call this coat because you all were the ones that picked the Rams to the Super Bowl. Am I remembering that right? Yes. I did do that. Don't ask me about my Super Bowl pick because it looks stupid right now. But I do want to be clear that all offseason, I was talking about how scared to shit, how scared shit was I was. We were talking about the Rams is some super team because that never happens. And I thought it was nonsense. I want to be very clear about that. So, but I don't think you should back off yet. Let run this thing down through the first five games, divisional game on the other side of the world against one of the most consistent programs in the league over the last five years in the Niners Giants, AFC finalist Broncos, consistently great recent Super Bowl champ Eagles, the Josh Allen bills. That's your five teams. And then the one game where you really looked like world beaters was the Giants, which is the one not consistently excellent team you've played. The Rams opponents to this point in the season are 17, seven and one. They're winning 70% of their games. They've played a lot of good teams. Now I want to see what this looks like because they're by week is in week 11. So they got five more games. Their next five opponents are six, 18 and one. They go cardinals twice, raiders, chargers, commanders. You better be looking like Alabama over the next five weeks. Serious. Not this Alabama, though, right? Previous Alabama's the Saban Alabama's. Yeah. Well, good point. I you could tell me Alabama's any version of quality right now and I would not know. They're not bad, but they're not the Saban Crimson tide are look like Georgia look, look like the dominant college team of choice. That's what you should be doing over the next five weeks, starting with Sunday. I want to be very clear. I think the Rams are still a good team. I think the Rams are still potentially like a Super Bowl quality team, but they're two and three there, there, there's no super team thing happening here. And I didn't think there was going to be even if I thought they could win the Super Bowl, the thought that they would just be this mindless eating machine and just roll over everybody. It's just not how the NFL works. I do think an important thing with this, even if they can still be a really good team after winning this game and after losing this game. And I obviously believe that the problem is that two and four, the one seat is off the table. It is a table out the table. It probably is, but like I still think that they're good enough. If they could just rattle off 10 wins, like, yeah, I don't know that I believe that, but it's when Garrett comes back, like Puka's going to keep playing, like I can, I can see that world. If you lose this game, it's completely done. You have zero shot of getting there. I think it's a really out there bad. I don't want to be too dismissive about it, but I think you'd have a really hard time making that happen. Let's say they win five in a row, though, I don't know. I think 12 or 13 wins is still on the table. I think you're, I think you're backing off a little too quickly. I think it's mostly just that I'm disappointed in them. Yeah. I think that's the reason. It's not that I don't believe it anymore. Which is that I, a price needs to be paid for for what this five weeks has looked like. Well, Harrison Mevis paid the price for those f*** ups because they replaced him with four. They replaced him with Blake Groupy, which, okay, I know he had to know this one's last time. Blake Groupy was like a full-time kicker in the league. He played five games with the cold slash. So five games. He was not their full-time kicker. Yeah. That's not ridiculous that I don't know that. Yeah. He was with the Saints at the beginning of last year before they cut him. They did so much other shit wrong in that game. That's not Harrison Mevis's fault, but he'd missed like three or four kicks up to that point. So it makes sense. Yeah. I think it's, it's okay to cut the kicker at that point. He's not the scapegoat. He is not everything that's wrong with this, but I think it's okay. All right. So what we want to know coming out of week six in the NFL, David, he got from me. I'm calling this the don't look now game because the winner of Steelers Bucks when I turn on the morning shows on Monday, no, I'm not, I don't watch the morning shows. When I open Twitter on Monday, somebody's going to say, don't look now, but this team is all of a sudden really well positioned. And it's either the Steelers or the Tampa Bay Buccaneers. The Steelers go down to Tampa and beat the Bucks with Jalen Daniel starting. I know what he did to Dallas, but you still got to assume a rookie undrafted quarterback. You have a leg up in that game. They're road favorites. If the Steelers beat Tampa, they're four and two. They've won two games in a row for the first time this year. And this is how a ten and seven, seven seed Steelers is made. That's how it happens as you win games like this. And somebody's going to say, don't look now, but the Steelers are four and two and their schedule looks pretty manageable and they're going to do it again. Or if Jalen Daniels maintains that momentum from the Thursday night game, the Bucks could be two and four in an NFC South that right now looks wide open. The Jalen hurts injury kind of affects that a little bit, but the Panthers could be below 500 on the other side of the weekend. The Falcons already are and they play the Bears with Caleb Williams. And the Saints are doing whatever the hell the Saints have been doing the last few weeks. Like if Tampa finds a way to win this game, they are right back in the thick of the NFC South race with Baker may feel presumably getting healthier. And so I want to know who's feeling themselves a little bit after winning. And otherwise kind of forget, forgettable looking game. I want to say this about the Steelers. Part of my frustration with the Steelers over the last couple of years is that I didn't know who they were supposed to be on offense. Like I was like, what do you want this to be? And that was part of that with personnel and just how weird the personnel was coming into this year, the offensive line had a chance to be a real strength from when they played the Bengals in week three. I think that they've just stumbled into or reluctantly accepted their fate. The way that you were built, mash people. Just mash people. Like you have the ability to do that. And what they've looked like over the last three weeks last in these last three games, they are currently third in rushing DBOA. That's what they are. And that combined with the town that they have on defense, like I was excited about Patrick Graham coming in, like having an offense where like, this is what we can do. We can mash people. We said it coming out a week to Derek when we did them in the hangover, it was like, what do you want this offense to be? They have landed in my mind on a satisfactory answer to that question. And so I am much more interested in them because of that because it feels like there's somewhere for them to hang their hat on offense in a way that there was not over the first two weeks of the season. I mean, if the offense is going to be that in the offensive line, like every, every playoff team, I think needs something they can hang their hat on. And for them, it is that offensive line. This them playing that level, and I think the passing game being slightly better moves them into slightly above average offense, which is little bit better than they were last year. And if the defense can maintain its level at slightly above average, today's point, this is a perfectly fine 10 in seven wild card team. And the other thing that I would say, because I was looking this up before we went on as well, one of the other teams that this sealers are going to be competing with for the seven seed potentially is the Houston Texans. The Houston Texans in the Pittsburgh sealers play and I think week 15. So that like that is going to be the game. If we're looking ahead for what the headlines are going to look like, that's going to be the game where it's like this might decide what the seven seed looks like by the end. Buccaneers are top five rushing defense through five weeks of the season. There we go. See what the big boys do. We said we said this after the Dallas game, but the box defense is like right there, man. It hasn't all been pretty through five weeks, but there's a lot to like there, especially in the back end. I agree. What I want to know coming out of week six. How should I feel about the New York teams? I'm just going to fully admit it five weeks into the season. I don't know how I should feel about these teams. Both two of them have played both teams. The Jets and the Giants have played multiple weather games, multiple, right? The Giants played against Washington last week. They played against Titans earlier. The Jets played ones against the Packers and they played ones wanting us the Browns. The Giants offense has done some good stuff. Like there, you look at what I say, a likely production has looked like. You look at what mid league neighbors' production has looked like with the back of quarterback. Like, how should I feel about the Matt Negi Greg Roman thing? Because I think there returns out. It have actually been better than we might have expected. The defense, there's some really intriguing pieces on that side. They're blitzing at a crazy rate. Arvel Reese is doing some cool things. But overall, they're three one and one. I think they're 27th and total team DBOA. It's so early. Those numbers are all over the place. Who are the **** knows? But I want just a little bit more clarity about what this team is. And I feel the same way about the Jets, right? The Jets have been frisky in some games. Then they got pushed around by the Bears. The offense looked really good against the bad Detroit defense. And so five weeks into the season, this is all us trying to grasp on to what we know and what we don't know and the context around these teams and what's real and what's not still still to this point in the year. That's where we are. And so as somebody that is tasked with covering and talking about all 32 teams and figuring out how we're going to do that, I just want a little bit more data on the New York teams. I just want a little bit more clarity over the next couple of weeks about what they are, how we should look at them and what place they're going to have and just the broader conversation about the 2026 season. It's not any more specific than that. If one of them could play a game that's not enough freaking rainstorm, that would be it's supposed to rain again. No, I don't even know that they've played a zone of climate change show soon because I'm so pissed off about the conditions that we're having these games in between the two of them. They've played like four or five games in just shitty conditions. That I just want more information that's literally all I want. I feel like 75% of James Winston passes. I've seen this year have been in the rain. I like it almost. It's like every time I look at my TV. I'm like, God damn, it's raining again. So they're funny. I do think the giants, you know, the jets have a real test in terms of like a good team that they're playing. And so I think we'll get some answers there. For the giants, I think it's interesting like they play a team that they are perfectly equipped to be the giants. If there's anything I think they should do, run the ball a little bit, rush the quarterback. The Saints cannot defend the run and they can't block the quarterback right now because their tackles are hurt or their best tackles hurt. You should win that game and get to four one and one. Yeah. And if they do, it's like, all right, let's let's start having a conversation about what the giants are and that but that's the extent that's exactly what I want. Like show me what you are against the Saints this week. And if you're the jets, can you stay in this gaming against New England? Or do you just get absolutely boat raced? And then we start talking about that type of jet season again. And so I just think it's not perfect. The mirror that we're holding up both teams to this week, but it's enough, right? There's a little bit of a crack in it, but I can get an understanding of what I'm looking at. Hopefully if we can play some non-weather games, for both of these teams. Good news. Looks like we're getting perfect football weather days for both of these teams. Look six these sunny in both New York and the greater Boston Fox per area. Congratulations to those cities and locales for getting a decent spada weather here. Derek, what do you got for me? What do you want to know coming out of week six? So I, the chiefs losing Taikwan Thornton is quietly huge for them. And we talked about this when he went down, but just how an unguy and Taikwan Thornton, the most important players in professional football. They're holding a lot of things together. But the chiefs passing offense had looked the best it has had has looked in like three years probably. And four of their completions over 20 yards this season. They've only had six of them. Four of them were to Taikwan Thornton. And all of those plays went for at least 40 yards. Like those are not just like 20 yard chunks. They are bombs. And so the fact that they're not going to have him. Obviously he's been hurt. He went down in that Raiders game with an ankle issue. Now I just want to see like what is the vertical passing game going to even look like in the first week back? Because obviously they heard that by last week. So they don't really have the great players for it. I think the charge the chargers overall are bad. The chargers defense is not that bad. Like this is a good enough test that you can like show some stuff against them. So just curious to see what they try to do down the field. All right. That is all we've got for a week six. We got Broncos Seahawks tonight, which is a very good Thursday night game. The recap for that will be available right here on YouTube. If you're watching this right now also available on your podcast fees. If you are watching this on YouTube and you are new to the channel, please like subscribe got tons of great stuff coming all throughout the week. For now that is all we've got. Appreciate it. We'll see you guys on Sunday night. Thanks for tuning in. 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