Week 2 Recap: Patriots Offense, Struggling Stars, Rookie Decisions & More! (09/21 Fantasy Football Podcast)

This is Fantasy Football today from CBS Sports. Swap away! Can you believe this? It's a no again. It's time to dominate your fantasy league. To the races, play stays on his feet. Just gotta go to the distance. Now here's some combination of Adam, Dave, Jamie, and Heath. What is wrong with the Chargers and Bears' offense? Is Colston Loveland a bust? Is Devon H.H.Anne a bliss? Are we just replaying last week's episode? Not much has changed, huh? And the Chiefs won a primetime game, 33-30. We'll recap the Chiefs Colts game, which was a super exciting game. I think it was a pretty bad Sunday for injuries, but hopefully the Monday won't be as bad. Caleb Williams doesn't seem like a bad injury. -We don't know. -Well, that's what they said. This is like a half hour ago. He escaped a major injury. Jane Daniels doesn't seem like it's season ending. We'll see how long he's out. A lot of running back injuries. We don't have updates there. But today, okay, recap something. I had football. Yes, we'll talk about the bearers. Yes, we'll talk about the Chargers. Yes, we'll talk about H.H.Anne. Also, George Pickens, what's going on with George Pickens? His target per out run rate actually higher than it was last year. So that is good. The Patriots offense, and the rookies. What are we doing about some of these rookies? Casey Concepcion, Denzel Boston, Carnell Tate, Jeremiah Love, Jonah Coleman. You heard Dan. Now, here's Jacob. What's up, Jacob? Hey, hey, Chiefs 2-0. Giants 2-0 as well, soon. -Wow. -That's right. -You imagine. -You imagine. When's the next time that Chiefs are prime time? They just don't get enough prime time. Let's see what we're going to be. Week 7. We have three straight weeks of Falcons prime time somehow. Who the heck scheduled that out? Really? Yeah. We're stuck with three straight weeks of Falcons prime time. It's crazy. Let's talk about last night's prime time game. Kansas City 33, Indianapolis 30. I've got a couple, I've got some easy questions, some hard questions for this game. Who is the best, just for these two teams? Best quarterback rest of season. Patrick Mom's. Okay, that was easy. Best running back rest of season. Kenneth Walker. That's definitely Kenneth Walker. Jonathan Taylor's average like 28 points per game or something. I mean, he has been that offense has been better, especially first early game script, but you've got to take Walker right now. Walker's these healthy. He's essentially in the mix for RB1 overall. He's like Jonathan Taylor if we play for a better team. -Right. -Anyway, even targets. And got the targets, yeah. He has three more points than Jonathan Taylor. Taylor actually has eight targets. Kenneth Walker does have 16 though. All right, who's the best wide receiver on this team rest of season? Josh Downs. -These teams. -And all teams. Both teams, both teams. I'm going to go over to Chi Rice. I was a little bit more enthused than Jacob was with Rice last night. A little bit. Took one Josh Downs game for me to become completely involved in again. He's the best. Well, Pierce is also injured. That's the other thing. Yeah, Pierce injured and Josh Downs. If you've heard us say on the show, we watch Josh Downs tape. This guy gets open all the time. So good. He destroys defensive backs. I think you saw it. If you haven't actually seen it, saw it last night. It's what he does for a living. I felt so bad for Ligeria's need. He's just not ready for that kind of juice. Also Downs was really close to scoring on one of those quick records. That Jones hit him. It was just too far behind him. I just don't think he's going to score that much. And I don't think he's going to make a lot of big plays. And also, Alec Pierce, like that was a big deal. Alec Pierce going out. Yeah, so huge target, well, big good target volume for Josh Downs, nine targets on 31 pass attempts. That's a terrific target share. But also this team basically never passes near the end zone. They just hand it to Jonathan Taylor all the time. They've run six plays from the five yard line or closer and five of them have been runs. Last year, they had the third lowest pass rate inside the five yard line. Okay. Anyway. So it would work in your favor of the Taylor over walker arguments. I do think the A, the culture more committed to the run and run in spots. They should run more than the chiefs to it. At times last night, I was like, why are the chiefs throwing every single first and second down? But B, it's the red zone work. I think it's a good point. I didn't say Taylor over walker. I know. But you said it's not a given. It's not. I mean, these are obviously two first round RB1s. Okay. And then who's the best tight end on these teams? Huh? He's back. Travis. I'll never go away. Kelsey. I'm so mad at him. Just buy him again in fantasy. You got him for free. He's on waiver wire. Some, some leagues before week one. I mean, he's just going to do it every single year. And yeah, it's not going to be what it was at one point, but it's still better than night. Like, you're starting him every week. Like you have you Kyle pits or Travis Kelsey, who are you starting? Well, I mean, who's quarterback? It is going to be Kelsey. What do you mean? It's, it's Kelsey. But I'm not judge. It's Kelsey. Even when Penix comes back. It's not judging pits on what's happened so far, but it's, it's Kelsey, I guess it's Kelsey or Fanon. Kelsey. Kelsey. So then we're just talking about all the mid Kelsey or craft at this point. Craft. I don't know. I take craft. I don't know. Kelsey or Loveland. No, he won't go there just yet. Kelsey was a top five tight end with Patrick Mahomes last year. Right. It's not crazy. And Rishi Rice is not getting near the target volume he used to and no one's emerging here. So it's not. It's not crazy. I can never take a tight end early again. This happens every single year. We do this every year. Well, McBride. Well, Kelsey is. McBride is, uh, is one of the best players of fantasy right now. It's like, this is just like a huge miss for me on McBride. Yeah. We'll see about Bowers, but, uh, yeah. I mean, Kelsey. So would you take Kelsey over Warren? Yes. Personally. I don't think so. Weird start for Tyler Warren. He has a point eight three yard eight dot so far. He's doing nothing downfield. He's getting a lot of screens, a lot of design reads, obviously, is what they do. He has three of the cold seven red zone targets Tyler Warren were talking about. He has two of their three green zone targets. He has their only end zone target so far. They fell. Yeah. They played Jesse Mentor in spags too. They played tough matchups for sure and things will get better. But man, that satellite looks gross six receptions for 21 yards. I think in more neutral spots, you'll be able to see Warren get more stuff going and then they'll be able to take some more shots down the field right now. It's been, it just feels like they're trying to get it out quick, which is no surprise. This guy does, he does, you know, we talked off the air about Rishi Rice, his inability to get open. Like Tyler Warren is not getting open. They everything. They don't even try to get him. It feels to me like I never see him run an intermediate in break or a scene like it just. It's all gimmicky stuff with him. It's like a lot of it. It's like he's blocking and then he comes off the block and it's open. At the line of scrimmage now, it wasn't necessarily like that last year. No one's, no one has an eight out under one yard. Right. Right. And his touchdown was an amazing route. Let's just beat. But that was a great release off the line of scrimmage. Like he has the capability to do it. Will the Colts use him in that way? I guess the question. I don't even know what to say about Titan right now. If you're going to rank your top five titan his rest of season, you know, McBride's one. Then what? Bower still to. Kincaid. Kincaid over Bower's right. Wow. How? I don't know. I'm just worried about the Bower's post injury. Not being good thing. Yes. Yeah. Unfortunately, we have to worry about that again. It's unbelievable. Two years running with this. Yeah. It's annoying. And then, you know, and DJ Moore being injured right now, hopefully not too long, but that up with all the port is in the mix. I see that in the comments. The port is definitely in the mix. Yeah. I think Kraft's going to be in the mix. Yeah. Really? I think it'll like George Kittle at 80 yards and a touchdown yesterday, and he's only running to half the routes still. Something looks nasty wrong with that Packer's offense to me. Oh, I think I think the rain, I think the conditions are in fact are yesterday. Like they played the white. I'm a big, I'm a big weather guy. So I'll give you that. They played the Vikings in week one and did pretty well considering it was the Vikings. Like they, they threw two touchdowns against a team that allowed one in their previous eight games. And then the weather. I mean, I watched it. I just watched it this morning, like there were some drops. I actually think there are inability to run the ball is hurting their passing game too. Yeah. That's a good point. And I totally agree with that. Jacob's could be back in like a month, maybe. That's just kind of the somebody in the chat mentioned Kittle. I just said, yeah. I mean, he's a game and I don't know that he's going to be a top five tight end. Like that's not a lot of targets so far for Kittle, but sure. It's up for grabs. It's up for grabs. That offense is, I think I saw it again, like number one yet again in EPA per drop back. Pretty had two in completions. One was a drop. The other was just like the end of the game, just like throwing out of bounds or like spiking it or something. They just are unreal. Like even if Kittle doesn't get volume, he's going to get such a boost from the efficiency of that offense. And I don't know. Like Roger singing the chat. Tyden's going to be that bad. I don't know. It doesn't sound bad to me. It sounds bad if you draft a pit so far and Harold Vanden, who was okay yesterday, it actually sounds okay. Okay, Loveland is, but it's not so bad. All right, because you got Hunter Henry now who's running all the routes and had a good target share. Only through 22 passes yesterday. You got Scholz who can factor in. It's not so bad. All right. Any thought? Let's talk about Rashee Rice and Patrick Mahomes here. Jacob and I not so encouraged by Rice. I guess I felt like he'd look better than he did in week one, but still not that good. Dan, you're okay with it. Remember, you had 83 yards, but 31 of them came on the last play of regulation. So really padded his stats. What do you think about Rice? in the home stand. I don't I'm not more like enthusiastic about rice from a fantasy standpoint, I guess. I'm more enthusiastic and some what I am. I'm more enthusiastic. I thought he looked a little bit better moving without the football last night than he had in week one and what we saw in the preseason as far as the other side of that goes. That was what I texted Jacob. That was the first time the chief's offense looks like the chief's offense to me in like dozens of games at this point. That was the best I've seen Patrick Mahomes look in a long, long time. His deep ball accuracy, which has been a big problem for him these last few years. Both charting into the eye test was back last night. The timing was great. The anticipation. He threw the ball into space. Lettings receivers run under it, under pressure, under duress, he manipulated the pocket really well. I felt like in week one, he'd look kind of not all there movement wise. And then it almost looked like one week later, he was back to his old self from a movement standpoint, both in the pocket and out of the pocket. So I was really enthusiastic. The whole idea here is like you add Ken Walker to the offense and hopefully the passing game gets easier because teams are going to have to allocate more recess sources to Walker. That's what it started to look like last night. I will note this. I think this Colt's defense is a near lock to be a bottom 10 defense and most likely headed toward bottom five over the course of the season. So it's important to note that it was a good matchup. And they ensure very, so various word was heard, I believe, for the Colt. So one of their top corners, double check on that, but yeah, I mean, and I think, you know, worthy 73% roster, he had the touchdown, he also had two drops in this game. And if he caught those balls, he has a pretty good game, right? You know, do you think, okay, Jacob, two quick questions, do you think Xavier worthy is worth hanging on to 73% rostered? No. No. No. I do. I do too, Adam. Because I think they're using him like a better version of Rishie Rice right now. I don't think he gets, he gets smacked three times per game where Mike, oh, he's done. I don't think that that's going to last. All right. But he's like, actually got some juice and he's a short area target guy now. And do you think Rishie Rice is a must start player? No. Okay. I think those guys could score points if the chiefs play well. And I think the Kenneth Walker thing is real. The teams are definitely reacting to that, they're getting way more stack boxes. The play actions stuff is open. They were using as a decoy the goal line last night that got passing touchdowns as a result. I don't think either of those guys are very good. So I don't really want to go there. It seems like, I mean, like if you're just, I test Kelsey looks like the best player and he's also getting more first three targets. He looks so good. Yeah. I think I trust Kelsey. I trust Walker and everyone else in the offense is maybe they'll have her in them weeks. But I think Jaylen Royals is fine and they're getting him in more and more. And they really like Cyrus Allen too. So it's like at any point, if those other guys falter, which we've seen them falter every single year of their career, whether it's injury, off-field stuff or on-field stuff, I think the other guys are fine and can step up and the offense will stay, stay rolling. Will you, would you drop Xavier Worthy for Denzel Boston? No, probably not. I mean, if you want to just like, try to trade Boston high or something, but it seems like sustainability for the down-foot passing game with Cleveland is so, so unlikely. Boston had a huge yak play on some pretty shoddy tackling. Boston's a good player, but I really do think it's very, if you look at the top 20 scores or receiver, his is probably the fluiest at this point. Okay. More on him a little bit later. And by the way, we talked about who could be a top five tight end. We didn't even mention, I say it likely. Yeah. Sure. All right, that's it for Kansas City 33 Indianapolis 30. Damn. You know what? Jacob, I think I'm gonna do it quicker. Jacob, what's beyond the box score looking like this week? Just on our usual schedule, so Den and I on Tuesdays do the waiver wire and talk through our film thoughts, digging into all these games. So there's, you know, you want to know, it's basically what we're doing today, but we have a lot more time to get into that, get into all the film on that today's show. We just have like one or two games we've gotten to. And then I think the other thing I would point you to is that Wednesdays, I do these usage shows where I do rest of season rankings, and I really dig into the nitty gritty of these roles for the players. So like, why have things changed for Richie Rice? Why has he gone from like a 30% target per route run player to an 11% target per route run player? You can find all that stuff for running backs, receivers, tight ends, all that on Wednesdays. And once again for Richie Rice's average route depth was more than eight yards. And he has never had a game in his career with an average route depth more than seven yards and had more than six targets in any of those games. Most of them were early in his career, but now we have two to start the year. Okay. We're going to take a break and we've got news and notes and now a lot of them, Caleb Williams update that we just saw and then we'll get into the rest of the show. We'll be right back delivered by little Caesars, the official pizza sponsor of the NFL. Right now scored two favorites just for you with Detroit style slices and sticks. You get two pieces of Detroit style deep dish pepperoni pizza with crispy caramelized cheese edges and four pieces of buttery garlic flavor, dippable cheese sticks with a side of crazy sauce for just $4.99. Heck, that's the biggest duo since Monday nights and football since touchdowns and victory dances since arm chairs and quarterbacks, well, you get the idea. But hurry because this dynamic delicious duo is available for a limited time only and only at little Caesars. Make your game day delicious all season long with little Caesars officially delicious available at participating locations for a limited time. Prices may vary and are higher in Alaska, Hawaii, California. Many areas in New York, Oregon, Washington and third party online sites, taxes and fees may apply. So Jayden Daniels dislocated elbow, his coach, Dan Quinn, says he expects him to return this season. Ben Johnson just said that Kayla Williams is weak to weak with a hamstring injury and we'll see who starts at quarterback for the Falcons this week. No updates. I haven't seen anything on Jardarian price other than X-rays were negative, haven't seen anything on Seikwam Barkley who was luckily able to come in back in the game, but he barely played JK Dobbins hamstring injury, RJ Harvey. I think also a hamstring, maybe a groin for Harvey, he missed the game. So Jonah Coleman is going to be popular this week, Rico Doudal left with a toe injury and that's that. DeMarcus Robinson has a high ankle sprain, Mike Evans has a hip injury, it is not expected to be serious. I hope they get him back this week against Arizona and I'll tell you why because I don't know that I'm going to start him the following two weeks against Denver and at Seattle. So Mike Evans, I'd love to be able to start him in week three, weeks four and five could be questionable. Jayden Reed, left in the first quarter has extremities as has feeling in all of his ex his extremities. And he is feeling in them. So that's good for Jayden Reed. Sometimes those scary injuries, they're not long term. And Alec Pierce has the injured heel and X-rays were negative. Dallas Goddard's going to have an MRI on his knee. Eli Rared and left for New England, David to Joku. I haven't seen an update on David to Joku. He was carted off. You see, we have anything here. Did Collar get hurt too? Yeah, Charlie. Yeah, at the end of the game. It's a knee injury for New Joku. Don't know about Collar. Yes, definitely, Aronne Gatson is going to be discussed on the waiver wire show tomorrow. Collar had his arm in a sling after the game. And a char various word, yes, did leave with a groin injury for the Colts to starting or two cornerbacks. I believe starters, but two cornerbacks for the Cardinals left with injuries. They face San Francisco this week. So I want Mike Evans back. Those injuries not expected to be serious. They both might be able to come back, Will Johnson and Max Melton. I'll just leave it at that. Let's get into more fun stuff here. Snap counts, trends, whatever. This is where you guys just have the floor. I'll start it with the Saints and Travis H and 54% of the snaps, Alvin Camera 29% of the snaps. Travis H and ran 13 routes, Camera ran eight. Camera did not run a snap or did not play a snap on third down. CJ Donaldson was still their third down back. It was like the second half was more encouraging, I guess, for Travis H and he worked at the goal line. He got the two point conversion, but he's obviously been a major concern for fantasy managers. Dan, where are we on the Saints here? I'm going to defer to Jacob on this one because I studied about five games for the show and the Saints was not one of them. Saints look awesome. Dietari Shuck keeps stepping up in clutch moments. They drop back a ton. The Travis H and stuff is definitely concerning. He was already splitting work in week one and then Camera's got a clear role. John Johnson's role is skilled back a little bit, but still made some big plays. He's really good. Devon Veile is playing really, really well. They've got this rookie, Bryce Lance, who's like a competent field stretcher, it feels like. He's actually been able to step in and play right away, which is really, really impressive. That allows them to move the other guys around more. Chris Alave right now is just shredding, just uncoverable. Only Jackson's but the Jigba has more yards than Alave. He looks like, as long as he stays healthy, he's going to be a league winning pick at Wider Silver this year. Back to back years of that, too. But for H&N, I don't really even know. I'm not selling low. I don't think. I just think that it's so obviously. I don't understand. You give the guy $12 million a year and you give Camera a 10 touches, Camera had 10 touches while H&N had two. It doesn't make any sense. Camera doesn't do anything with the touches. There's a doubt in my mind that Travis H&N is the best running back on the team. I think we all know that. Kendri Miller was a big factor last week. I think he was inactive this year. this week. Um, well, you didn't have any touches and I feel like things will get better for him. I'm, however, I'm not confident enough to say by low on him. I wouldn't by low on him. Me either. I moved him behind Basel Tutten before last week. I've, I've got him behind like David Montgomery and players like that. Dude, I think have similar sorts of roles. I'm curious. Is that seem about right to you? Who's that, Tutten? Echin, like behind those guys, behind Tutten, for sure, for me. I definitely have a mind Tutten who was the other back you had Montgomery. I definitely haven't behind Montgomery. I wouldn't definitely have him behind Montgomery. I mean, I, I think I see them similarly. Yeah. I don't think Montgomery has a much better chance at scoring touchdowns than Echin does. That I disagree with because I think so far, Echin, Travis Hann has been the goal line back. Echin, I'm sorry. Yeah, that's all right. He's been the goal line back for the most part. For a team that we are buying their offense. We think they're going to score a lot. Did he have a touchdown call back in this game, by the way? Yeah, he did. Okay. And he had a touchdown last week. So I'm not sure. Nine targets in the first game, just three in this game. I think that trend will continue to come down with Camara back and just that offense. Yeah. So don't see the receiving work. I guess first Montgomery, it's like if Nico is out for a lot, a lot of the season, then I'm weighed further down among Montgomery. I think just that whole offense looks night and day with Nico on the field versus with him on not on the field. So maybe I feel a little bit more comfortable with with Echin in that sense. I just, I don't know where the points are coming from. I think it's, I think he's going to have to get a bigger role. And I just, I think I could. And speaking of Montgomery played fewer snaps than Woody Marx yesterday. And it wasn't just because they were chasing points. The first half you played fewer snaps than Woody Marx. So he's been terrible running the football so far. He has 26 carries for 70 yards. Right. They can't block. Potentially tough matchups. I mean, I think Cincinnati is a good run to events. I don't know about Buffalo. All right. Look, at least that's the range. Like if we're drafting Travis H and today, he's probably like a fifth round pick. Maybe six round picks, something like that. I think I would just take, I think I'd take him over the Patriots running backs, though. That's interesting. I thought Traveon looked pretty good. Yes. Yeah. Yeah. It's just much that whole idea of Traveon to me is probably worth it. If I'm taking, I mean, if you're talking about a six round pick, you're hoping that that's like your RB three, right? Like an upside pick. Like to me, I don't really understand what the point of HN is for fantasy. That sounds weird, but like, what is he? It's fogging in and with the semblance of safety as an RB two, but is there safety? Because he can have games or has like 10 touches or whatever. Like, it feels very dead zone back to me. But then again, like he is safer than Henderson who could have any week where he fumbles and they take him out of the game plan or whatever it may be. But Henderson can also just on one touch get you nine points, which I guess HN can do that. He did it with the jaguars. It's a different scheme. Liam Cohen's gone and I haven't, you know, at that run scheme has been pretty bad throughout Kelemore's career. Run, the run game has not been a good aspect of Kelemore's scheme at any point. If his role stays like this, then yes, Travis HN is going to be disappointing. I guess I'm just saying that I, it's only week two. I feel like he could gain, I don't know why he would. Why wouldn't they do it originally? But I feel like he could get more of a role. Like, we think Jeremiah loves going to have bigger roles a season goes on. I get like HN's different. HN should have it right now, Travis. Love will have to kind of grow into it. Yeah. But all right, I said my piece. Jacob, what do you want to discuss here? Well, speaking of Jeremiah love here in eight routes to 18 for Tyler Algier and week two. That's fun. Painful. I don't know. Yeah, like if anything, I would expect him to get that, like get him out in space. Why do you draft Jeremiah love? You're not going to utilize his route running. I don't know. However, only five carries for Algier. Algier had 17 and week one and love had nine carries. So nice. Yeah, I mean, I didn't think he was a terrible start this week against the Seahawks. But yeah, I mean, when you look at both of those guys, Jardarian price and Jeremiah love, Jacob, do you have hope that things are going to change for them? Yeah, love, I think so. I think there's a decent chance that he becomes a hot hand that we've heard Michael Flora talk about. And he gets the Steph Curry treatment or whatever at some point this year. So you're hoping for that he's just really good and that that shines through. Jardarian price looks really good. But I think his role is kind of clearly defined and they've got somebody coming back who's actually really good at all the other stuff. So like right now, they're already giving all the goal line stuff, the pass blocking stuff. All that is going to like role players. Zach Arbonne is actually a boss at that, like, and I think he's just going to get that and that he might, if he plays well, even take some of the early down stuff too. So yeah, I think Jardarian price, you're looking at basically what Kenneth Walker had last year in terms of a role. Yeah, which was about RB 28. Yeah, it perfectly runs hot with long plays and touchdowns than he can be useful. But that's going to be hard to predict. Yeah, I watched the tape of all those running backs, you know, a manual Wilson to his credit had a nice game. But I just don't see how you could watch Jardarian price versus a manual Wilson and Jeremiah love versus Tyler Alger and not be so frustrated as a fantasy manager. Now, I think we knew this was a possibility. So we were, okay, like especially with price and with love early in the season, you're hoping that love gets more and more work and he did get more carries than Alger this week. But it's just not even close. Like like Jordan, Jeremiah love explodes when he touches the ball. Tyler Alger just doesn't have that not that kind of player. Yeah, it's stupid to me. It's malpractice for these coaches to not be using price and love more. I think they'd probably tell you because I mean, that's how it appears to us. But I think they'd probably tell you because this happens every year, right? This is not we're not going over something that's new to us. Like how could this coach think they'll probably tell us these guys understand the playbook better. They're going to help us more in pass production. They're going to be well more aware of where to be within the route like for the timing standpoint of the quarterback. Like quarterback needs to know where this running back is going to be on that route. And I guess Alger if he's running 18 to loves eight has a better feel right now for that. I don't know. That's what they're telling us at least. But that will change. Love I will see will change that the price thing is getting scary because when Charbonne is back, I don't like I don't know what you're hoping for if you start price. I think Emmanuel Wilson was so bad in short yardage yesterday that they were going to give Jardarian price. Like he got a second in goal carry and he got stuffed. Right. I thought maybe he was going to start getting some of that. He got hurt and we never really saw it play out. All right. Anything else Jacob? I'm sure there's plenty. Yeah, for sure. So just with the goals, I think it's interesting that Kenan Allen barely played yesterday. Even with the injury to Alec Pierce, it was look on look on thread will play more Josh Johnson 91% snap rate. Getting out of 51% snap rate 61% route rate at five targets had one catch for five yards. So if he's not at the point where he can be a meaningful contributor anymore and like really take away targets as a 34 year old, then I do think downs is probably just going to run away with it here as long as he stays healthy and be somebody who's pretty dang productive for for PPR purposes at least. Another interesting player to me who's getting more and more playing time seems like maybe a young guy winning out. We'll see here as Antonio Williams in Washington had the same number of routes as step on digs. I checked if it was like a blowout related thing. Maybe a little bit, but it was similar in the first half where he was playing almost as much as digs. Right now they're using Dimey Brown as like the field stretching player. I think they could move Terry McClure and more and more into that role and play all three of them or at the very least just get Williams out there more. The reason I bring this up is because he's been really productive. He's yet to not catch a target. He's 12th at wide receiver in yards for outrun so far. This is a guy that they freaking ranted and raved about after they drafted him in round three. They seem to really really like him. They think you could play inside or outside playing two receiver sets. Can wonder the ball on his hands and obviously is a route winner too. So he's really I think a really good stash at wide receiver. My favorite stash is freaking image Johnson man. 71% avoided tackle rate on the year. You can it walk her good. Can it walk her as the highest ray out of qualified players at 47% image Johnson's is 71%. Now you could see why I had this whole thing with Heath at him over the dynasty league when I was supposed to be able to draft Emmett Johnson and I couldn't because of the roster thing. I wanted Emmett Johnson. I knew how good he was in round two. I wanted that my RB2 in the class. He's so good. He should be rostered in every league. I mean Jacob talk about this every day of every week but there's in my mind no better handcuff to have in fantasy football because he's the best. He's the best. On a good offense. He's actually really good at football and Walker has a his no history of being a workhorse. Some more meaningful players. Christian McAfry 80% snapper eight out of 10 running back touches in the first half of this game. It was a blowout win. So it looked like the same usage as week one. They were given Jordan James the ball in the fourth quarter up by 30. It's not it wasn't the same. Sorry McAfry. McAfry. Yeah. I guess the only hesitation I have is that Caleb Black was came into the game with an injury. He was questionable all week. So like I was also happy about it encouraged. I know the yards per carry weren't great but I'm he's working at the goal line. It was great stuff. But yeah, I just want to see what happens if if we get a normal week of practice for Caleb Black. I want to talk about Parker Washington. It's just insane. What we've seen. Yeah. So across is six most recent games which is like starting last year with that win against Denver until the most recent gaming in Denver. The dude has averaged almost four yards per out run. Like if you look at his efficiency metrics, they're basically just J.S. and Puka leveled stuff. He has a 20s his his lowest game across the past six game his last weeks this week's game 17 BPR points. That's his worst game across his past six including the playoffs. If you just look at like since he became a full-time player it's 15 points per game across this past six games it's 20 points per game like he's just been unstoppable he's been super consistent he creates extra yards after the catch even in a game where Jacksonville kind of fell apart after the beginning of the game. They should have won this game it was just like a stupid loss for them. They stopped throwing him the ball I don't know what the hell that was he had nine targets in the first half and then they stopped going to the thing that works the best and started going to BTJ and he it's just like what you know how this goes like what I don't know. Yeah Brian Thomas you're just only playing in three receiver sets by the way like did not play single didn't run a single route from two receiver sets so that's going to leave him leave him pretty hit or miss. Who they coming after who's got the sirens it's not me. That's me in the background. I don't know what's going on out there. Basel Tune sticking with the Jags sixth in the NFL in yards after contact on the year ahead of B. John Robinson just behind Jonathan Taylor yards after contact is something that Liam Cohen talks about all the time. He had three of their five touches in the red zone this week for the whole team not just the running backs. There was a target to look went down in the red zone that he dropped and Chris Rodriguez got a red zone touch but like I just think we're going to see him win out here. I think he's the best player and Liam Cohen has had four running backs over the past two seasons that have been top 20 and fantasy points in the red zone. So like even if it doesn't consolidate to him we've seen multiple instances of two backs being really relevant the red zone and there's a chance that it does consolidate I think just the two and because he's their best back. We'll see Rodriguez you know obviously there's familiarity there but yet he hasn't looked like he's adding a whole lot relate to this point where his student has. Yeah and he got a one year touchdown run Basel Tune which was encouraging a design play which like Liam Cohen is I think maybe the best in the league or at least he has been at like designing red zone touchdowns for running backs that are just really easy walking touchdowns. Pretty awesome stuff. Yeah direct snap to him. Cool. Anything else? No, I mean that's that's pretty much it. All right. Dan you got anything? I have plenty of stuff but got a lot coming for the four big topics so I'll save it for that. Yeah. I, uh, Joanne Johnson. I don't know what happened here. He went from an 82% route rate to 59% but he did have a higher target charity just missed the touchdown. Looking at Oscar Delp came back but he didn't play much but like maybe that changed it a little bit. No offense. They're he's running more routes. Yeah, yeah. Two. Uh, the Bears route participation rates. Roma Dune's a 93% Khalif Raim and 78% Luther Bird and 73% Colson Loveland 71%. Loveland led the team in route rate in week one. I'm thinking maybe he was blocking more because you know Minnesota blitzes every play basically. Uh, watching him just get overwhelmed by, uh, by Dallas and the last but yeah, Dallas turn to the last play was just like so brutal on top of everything. Like I don't know. It's obvious. It's like so easy to blame him and then like literally for it to end like that was just like, oh my gosh, it couldn't be worse. Yeah. But he, but he was, he should have probably had a touchdown on the play where where Caleb got hurt. I don't know why Caleb didn't throw it to him. But we'll talk about that a little bit later. Montgomery and Woody Marx played about the same amount of snaps. I mentioned this Montgomery got the first three carries of the game. But it was pretty, you know, Marx outplayed him after that or played more than him after that. Travy on Henderson didn't run a route on third down. He did play four snaps on third down. They were all run plays. Cleveland route participation rate Denzel Boston 94%. Harold fan at 83%. Casey Concepcion 74%. And Quinchon Judkins, Jerry drew it was there too, whatever. Quinchon Judkins 46% route rate. This is now four straight games dating back to last year, including one where he left with an injury where Quinchon Judkins has run more than 40% of the routes. He did not do that in any of the first 12 games of his career. Came close, but he is more involved in the passing game. And he's got four or more targets in three of his last four games. Quinchon Judkins dating back to 2025. You know, it's obviously not looking great for him, but to Sean Watson has definitely been much better than I expected since the first quarter of week one. He could be horrible. I recognize that. I hope better times are ahead for Quinchon Judkins. I'm not putting out any by-low offers, but if you're a depressed Quinchon Judkins manager, at least there's some, some positives to take away. Ted Hearst played over Jaylin McMillan for Tampa Bay, Lad McConkey ran 90% of the routes in week one before his injuries 71% yesterday. He was playing her and they took him off the field at times. And does anybody have an explanation for the backfield splits in Washington? Rashad White played 52% of the snap. Rashad White was basically a non-factor to the point where I was like, man, Chakrasky Merrick, Chakrasky Merrick fumbled in week one and they put K-Tron Allen in. I don't even know what the heck Rashad White is doing on the team. And this week he plays 52% of the snaps. Chakrasky Merrick plays 37% of the snaps. Rashad White was in here the goal line. I don't even know. This is what Jacob was worried about with Bill Crosky Merrick before the year. And it kind of played out exactly as he said when the game script falls to this level. And it wasn't like this in week one where they're kind of in the game the whole time against Eagles. When it falls to this level, we're not going to see a lot of bill. And that's pretty much exactly what we saw in this game. I still don't know if it's going to make white that relevant if we have Marioda for an extended period of time. And I know they said Jayden will play again this year but I don't I guess he'll play again and they'll bring him back and then hope he just doesn't get hurt. I assume he needs surgery eventually for this. I don't even know but they're not going to be able to do it this year. So it's kind of like last year we'll come back and then hopefully it just doesn't get hurt somehow. I don't know how you do that as a quarterback at the NFL level with your elbow like that. But if it's Marioda for an extended period of time, my bill is borderline dropable for me. Oh, not there yet. Not there yet. Let's see what happens. I don't know how he scores. It's not that bad. Like Mario to average seven point five yards per attempt last season. Jane Daniel's average scheme. Yeah. Jane Daniel's average seven point four yards per attempt in his rookie season. I'm not saying he's better or anything. But Mario is not a bad. You could do worse at back a quarter. Yeah, you could do definitely worse for sure. All right, we'll get into the four big topics when we come back. We're going to talk about how the mighty have fallen George Pickens the Von H and Colson Loveland. We'll talk about the chargers, the Patriots always negative stuff here and some of the rookies. Yeah, right? I mean, it was a really weird week. Right. There were a bunch of injuries. A bunch of people played really poorly. I was just looking around at like the leaders and I was like, wow, this is really low scoring week. They're guys that I didn't think had good games and they were like top 12 of their position. Yeah. Interesting. Yeah. All right. We'll be right back on fantasy football today. Welcome back folks. All right, our first big topic. It comes from what's your name, dude? NFL Robick says have the mighty fallen examples. Pickens still a top 15 wide receiver. H and still a top 12 running back. Loveland still a top 12 tight end. Dan, what are the answers to those three questions? Is George Pickens top 15? I still believe more so in Pickens than I do any of the other three. And I'll say Pickens because I still feel like we're in a similar spot with the Cowboys where there are a not so good on defense, maybe a tiny bit better. Be going to be playing in these high octane shootouts and see, Dac looks like to me one of the best quarterbacks in NFL. I know people don't hate to hear that because he's never one of the playoffs and he throws picks in the playoffs, whatever it is. But in the regular season, he processes fast as hell, man. And he looked that was the best tape. I think of any quarterback all season Dac's tape, especially the first half against the commanders yesterday. So points will come for Pickens, especially if defenses start to adjust to take away lamb, which they have in the past. If that happens, Pickens will have continued one on ones and Dac's the type of quarterback who loves to do that. If you're taking away one player, Dac will just out process you and throw the other player. So I'm still high on Pickens. I was never high on H and to begin with, he was on my avoid list and draft him anywhere. It's not worse than I thought it would be. This is about what I thought it would be. I see that the yards for carry his way down from past seasons 3.7 in week two, 3.3 in week one or the early reverse of that. The targets were there sort of in week one, not as much last week. Just generally speaking, this offense kind of stinks. And it's hard to buy into players on bad offenses. So I was never in on him. I don't think he's top 12 rest of season. There's too many guys who have stepped up at running back. Lovelin top 12 is interesting. It doesn't take much to be a top 12 fantasy tight end. But we're getting performances that we didn't expect from guys down the board, likely Kelsey among others. Even you could say Dalton Schultz for as long as Nico Collins is out is probably a more reliable player than Lovelin somehow. The Caleb news helps that he's not so badly hurt. Top 12 is more doable. I'd say on my panic meter, it's number one H and number two, or number one, H and as far as being a top 12 guy, number two Lovelin as far as being a top 12 guys, and that's so hard to be a top 12 guy. And then Pickens is not a big concern to mine. Okay. I will say that H and was running back six and expected fantasy points this past week. Yet six targets. He's running back 12 on the year and expected fantasy points according to the fantasy points status model. And I just think it's I don't know for sure because Miami could just be so bad that it holds down his efficiency, but it just feels like he's so good that And it's hard for him to be underwhelming in XFP all year long. And so if he continues to have a top 12 role in terms of on paper what you would expect given these touches and where they're coming, because the mile knows where the touches are coming. It knows that a rush attempt from the 60 or from the 40 yard line or whatever isn't worth that much. It quantifies red zone touches and stuff like that. And so I just would think that if on paper he's got a top 12 role, he will be a top 12 player. And that's basically the thesis behind drafting him where you did it is like, we don't know how it's going to look. Miami might be terrible, but he's so good and he's going to get 300 plus touches. So we'll be fine over the course of the full year even if we have to have some bad games. I think is the idea behind drafting him. You and I didn't really draft him that much, but to me nothing is changed with HN. That's exactly what we expected and so I don't really know why anything would be changing with our perception of him. That feels reactionary to just I think it's just more than finding that is what I just think it's because there's more good running backs that have emerged behind him. That's only reason for me. So far as top 12. Yeah. Well, if you think about how the draft was, right? Like, let's let's put genty back in this top 12. We always said there's these top 12 running backs just happen to be the number 12 that are first and second round picks that we'd love to get two of them if we could. We definitely want to get one of them as in that, right? And HN was in that for us more toward the back, but for a lot of people right in the middle of it. And Hampton and Walker and whatever. Now we've got guys behind where we've seen Javante Williams didn't have a great game, but he has the best, some of the best usage on the cow, and he's on the cowboys. John J. Swift. The Andre Swift. Without Caleb? No, no. I assume Caleb is healthy. I think without Caleb. And there's still going to run the ball really well, I think. I don't know if he's going to ask for the explosiveness of them. Swift is a touchdown maker, though. It's a more than on that, I think I would take HN over Swift rest of season. Why he had 20 carries and six targets this week like he could have this one. This begs me to ask you the HN question because what are they worth on a team that doesn't score points? I don't. I think we'll see. I mean, would you take Swift over Beigeon? Beigeon is major league concerning as well, not to this bench. No, he's not. Of course he is. Beigeon was on a crap offense last year. And he was RB2. It wasn't as crap. That's the thing. Because they don't have their quarterback yet. They're about to get back. Okay, so if you tell me Penox is ready to go and the fact that he's not able to play the first two weeks, but he'll certainly somehow be fine when he goes. It could be bad, dude. It could be like Penox is not the Penox we saw last year. Then what? We can't go to Russia. We can't go to Strand. And then if Penox, they have two at some point, I mean, Beigeon is going to get so many touches and so many catches. He's going to be fine. Penox was tied to the last year, but he was able to move the ball a little. HN is going to be fine too. Like, HN is going to be fine, but the fact that him not being a top 12 running back sounds worse than I think it is when you consider that he was basically toward the back end of a tier of 12 running back. So all it takes is a few guys in the next tier to move ahead of him. I mean, I don't think we'd be surprised if Buck Irving were better at this point. Wouldn't be surprised if Chavante and DeAndre Swift were better at this point. Breeze Hall maybe, and I use Breeze Hall as an example for Devon HN on Wednesday show when we did the worryometer. Breeze Hall in 2023, he was the number five running back per game and half PPR, number six per game and full PPR. He was top three overall in those formats. And his offense was the 30th. He scored 13.9 points per game, and they had Garrett Wilson who had 168 targets. I guess what? He scored 15.7 points in week one, Breeze Hall that year. And then the next three games he combined for 14.5 fantasy points. And the next three games he rolled off, three straight games with 20 or more points. And that's kind of, I just don't think you're going to get consistency from HN, like you used to. But yeah, I don't think the chat is interpreting what I said right at all. I'm not trading Bijan. I'm not panicking on Bijan at all. Obviously, he's a phenomenal player, but until he gets semi-competent quarterbackly, the ceiling is wildly capped. He scored like a 50 points in week one. And 30 points in week one. The chat's going off. I get it. He had that week, but then he had a week like this as well. So it's not like every, you know, this is not at the level of Gibbs with actual competent offense. There's going to be weeks like this. But of course, like if Phoenix is back or they stabilize somewhat at quarterback, it should be fine. All right. Bijan and Robinson scored 11.1 points yesterday. He scored fewer than that four times last year, right? That's a quarter of his games. It happens. I mean, I'm just saying, it happens, you know, even to the best of them. Sure. I think all of this is a point about HN, basically. Yeah. Like yeah, as long as play this year, 17 yards, he only has two plays that are longer than 10 yards. Like Breeze Hall this week had like what? One yard per carrier, whatever. But he had a good fantasy game. He had 14 points. He was like running back eight or something in a terrible game just because he had some big plays as a receiver. That's six sketches. I think HN could do that. I don't, I'm not buying low on HN, but I'm also not panicking if I have them. I just like wish I had taken Ken Walker instead. Yeah. For sure. Sure. Probably. I would have absolutely. Yeah. Yeah, I hadn't ranked considerably higher. That's fair. On Pickens real quick, I don't know if we really talked about him much. I do think there's some rather than context. I've not, I don't see him as like being worth worrying about it all. I guess with HN in love with that's fair, especially with the Caleb injury series. But Pickens has a 21% target share. He mentioned his target per out run rate desire than it has been. The Cowboys only have 106 plays across two games, on offense, only the Browns and Titans have fewer and they have a hundred and four and a hundred. So they're basically like the fewest plays in the leagues where the Cowboys are last year they led the NFL in place per game and I think that that's some more realistic expectation than being near the bottom. They're also first in the league and pass rate over expectation. So given the circumstances of any given play, are they passing or running relative to like what you'd expect. They're by far the highest in that stat. So I think everything is set up really well. It's just been a weird result. Yup. And they have the sixth fastest pace. So they had one kind of blowout win and one game where they barely had the ball. It's lowered their pass attempts. Only stat I saw from Pickens that concerned me. 34.4% of his routes have been go routes, according to media. And those are bad routes. We don't want that. Last year it was 22%. But two game sample size, I won't panic. He's like the definition of the player you don't worry about that with though. Like I worry about that with like every single receiver except for him basically or like Jamar or something. You'd rather them have a good role, but like he can't succeed within that role we saw last year. All right. Let's get four minutes here on the next topic. Patriots, the Patriots are in trouble offensively says Robert. And you know what Robert? I think I'd have to agree with you. But I also think yesterday was was bad weather. Drake may only through 22 times they had a defensive touchdown. They didn't have to do much, but they just don't have a lot of talent on this team. And they just lost their right tackle probably for the year. Dan, what are you thinking about the Patriots? How much trouble is this offense in and is Drake may a sit until further notice? He's at Jacksonville this week. I watch this entire game and I actually came away pretty enthused with what may put on tape. There are moments where you're like, okay, maybe he's not seeing a fast enough and that's been the discussion. Like I've teams adjusted and is he processing fast enough. But there's still the moments that make him shine where he's just like standing in the pocket and he's understanding like because his offensive line has been really bad. That's the biggest concern for a rest of season for fantasy for me. This Patriots offensive line looks as bad as it looked to me at the end of last season. And now they just had a major injury. But he'll stand in a pocket and deliver a ball to Eli Raird and that's some like, despite not having a balanced base, not being able to set his feet, he puts it right there for Raird and make the catch. And then he'll like navigate the pocket later in the game, create escape and find dabs down the field for 67 or whatever it was. And it looks like the same magical player at times. But overall, this offense is going to take a step back without AJ Brown. And people might look at it like, well, last year they never AJ Brown. I hate to say it, but like a player like Keishan Boudie was something they lot, like losing him was not in my mind good for this offense because dabs is not the same kind of player on the outside. And at this point, they're not giving Kyle Williams enough opportunities to potentially be that player. And so defense is a strong, the field and diggs as well. Of course, that's like a different, a different aspect of what they were able to do, but it's a big one as well. And so teams are playing them a little differently. I think we'll see trait like the run game probably benefit the most by the way that teams are going to play the Patriots, specifically because they're gone a lot and there's a lot of opportunity. I think to create big plays out of that as we saw with Anderson in this game. But right now from a fantasy standpoint, Drake may not scrambling as much as he was. And there's just not as many explosive playmakers. I'm not that worried about it from what I saw. I thought may look pretty good. And I thought the connection with dabs was much improved from week one to week two. Like, that's a player on my radar moving forward, dabs, especially for at least for the weeks that Brown is out. But it's not going to be the same offense it was last year at all. And the matchups are much harder, which definitely plays a role as people obviously noted. Right. I think that's important. Pittsburgh. So that's going to make their past or so bad, but losing their right tackle now he's being replaced by Morgan Moses, who's very experienced player, but had his hands full yesterday with TJ Watt, obviously. But this week, like I'm avoiding them. I think Jacksonville has a pretty good defense. I'm avoiding the Patriots for the most part this week. I'm sitting Drake may again at Buffalo. I think, you know, they're going to have to throw a lot that game. And then Raiders Jets at the Bears at Miami starts to get pretty damn good. And in the midst of that, you might get AJ Brown returning. And I will say, I am very concerned about AJ Brown because high ankle sprains. So I think they have kind of a bad reputation high ankle sprains and I've already given examples of players who didn't really lose any efficiency after missing three weeks with a high ankle sprain in the past. [BLANK_AUDIO] Jonathan Taylor and last year's CD Lamb and I would say Jeremiah Love to me looks pretty damn good right now But this is obviously a more severe high ankle sprain and that does have me concerned about AJ Brown I'm trying to offload my AJ Brown chairs. I don't know how this is gonna work out. I could be totally wrong about it But I don't I just I Think he might not be the player that we hope I am concerned about the Patriots offense I think they're gonna struggle especially in the short term But Henderson and versus Stevenson will be the split. We're all focusing on next week and Hunter Henry five targets Which is actually a lot. He led the team in targets. They only threw 22 passes raridens hurt He ran a ton of routes. So definitely a waiver wire guy Kishon booty had the highest passer rating when targeted as the first three target last year behind only Jaylen Coker in the hole in a Feldman qualified receivers so to dance point I think losing him and then also losing AJ Brown is pretty tough. Especially our you refuse to play Kyle Williams Then yeah, I don't know good luck with Matt Collins or whatever Jacob Wes whose Twitter name is hi. My name is Wes. Oh, Wes. Thanks for coming by sub west wants to know what to do with these rookies So I'm gonna give you a rookie and you tell me buy cell hole drop pick up whatever stash carnell tape Chill and pick him up in a few weeks Jordan Jeremiah. Love every time Jeremiah. Love I Buy I trade for love, but again, I think he's gonna probably be even less valuable in a week or two I think people are nearing the fever pitch of panic. We're not quite there yet. Casey conceps you own He's great. I think he's playing exactly how you can expect I don't think his role is going to change much maybe at some point He plays ahead of Jerry Judy and two receivers sets right now. He's only playing in the slot They're getting him designed targets as a catcher run guy. He's very good at that. So whatever you want to do with that I just don't want the Browns really Denzel Boston Yeah, so he's very good. I still think he's an ad though. I mean 52% rostered you you could sell him for something better, but but I think he's worth rostering And then Jonah Coleman with JK Dobbins apparently good to go it looks like JK Dobbins probably gonna play this week It's Jonah Coleman a nice game for the Broncos. Yeah, he was getting in there already I think he might be their best running back and Dobbins hasn't looked quite like himself this year I think Coleman has a lot of juice. He can pass protect. He can also plant passing downs as a receiver He could do short yardage stuff. He's really complete running back I think that we're only gonna see more and more of Coleman this year I have a couple different thoughts the first would be and just on two players and not different with Coleman I thought a great vision on the cutbacks to me kind of look like a younger version of what I saw from Dobbins Both at a house date with the Ravens remind me a little bit of like a young MJ D MJ D Maurice Jones drew for throwback low center of gravity Understanding where to cut back when to come back went to bet bust outside But also has that ability to kind of like narrow his I guess narrow his path to get extra yards really good They are really good debut for me watching his film. I didn't watch this week one tape Boston for me is actually a buy I'm really high on what I saw from Denzel boss and I watched that entire tape I thought he had excellent timing on an intermediate back shoulder with Watson the fact that Watson's already throwing him back Shoulders was interesting to me I counted three times where Watson went to him on third downs That to me is extremely important. There was almost another touchdown for Boston on a 36 red zone fade Vert that he just wasn't able to come down with that would have made the game even bigger Obviously the big play touchdown was some bad tackling. It was also great contact balance Burst post-catch. I thought he did a great job of running that route to he had to get it It was a really tight coverage throw by Dishon one of the best throws He's made in years and Boston had to run a really precise route to get to that spot He did then there was a late third down where they had a case he concepts him come in motion So they could guarantee that they would get the right leverage from the outside corner And it was just a quick out to Boston But Boston was the guy that designed that play for I just think we can't forget how good Todd Munkin is all the advanced stats All the metric show he's been one of the best five play calls and play designers over the last two seasons as bad as the browns are I feel like a Boston was the go-to guy on third downs B He's showing great timing and rapport and building a timing rapport with with the Sean Watson and see you still have Todd Munkin So Boston for me is somebody I'm really interested in moving forward based on what I saw on tape and you could discredit that the fluke Touchdown he had bouncing off tacklers. That's fair But he also had a six he almost had a 16-yard touchdown up the left side line and just didn't wasn't able to hang on to it So he's becoming a pretty looks like a favorite target for to Sean Watson who is not playing and he did it in a variety of ways By the way the outbreaking routes he had a comeback route He had the vertical route you talked about and then that deep in cut There was just a lot of different routes that he won on which I like I would also say that look this guy's by no means They must roster player, but if you're in a deeper league. I wouldn't give up on Caleb Douglas He had a bad game and you know, they had they had a bad game at San Francisco, but He played again He ran pretty much all the routes and we think he's a pretty talented player So it's gonna be a 40 to hundreds of defenses legit this year too Might be better in the NFL I'd like to see them play a team that's not the dolphins and a team that's not Sleep deprived Did you see that he had a boot on after the game? Oh, no is that Douglas did yeah Oh No, I didn't say I'm sorry about that all right both those guys are good It's just like I don't know. It's just like Karnel Tayy like I just I've got a really hard time buying into these offenses I think there's a real chance these are the best games Boston has no matter how good he is Right we we kind of thought you know some of these rookie wide receivers just didn't go to the best spots But the least they're not on the chargers our last big topic What is wrong with the chargers offense? They had three drops. They had eight penalties. They had the second worst pressure rate allowed They're they're right tackle joe all had a terrible game apparently and It's a Arizona and the chargers Arizona and the Raiders to start the year. This is gonna be amazing. Well, it really hasn't been amazing Jacob you can go first. I think you're gonna spew a lot of hatred right now In the direction of the city a good Los Angeles Chargers Yeah, I watched this game. It was pretty rough But I think it's I think it's mostly the line honestly and there were it could have been so much different It's it was a really frustrating game if you like want to believe in it So just like throughout the game I can just take you through what happened there was Brennan Thompson dropped this perfect throw from Herbert at the beginning of the game would have been a 25 yard game to move the chains They end up getting into third and three on that possession It's Thompson again massive win at the top of his route wide open for a 20 plus yard gain Herbert steps up avoids two past freshers delivers the ball perfectly and her own digats and tries to intercept it and Then like the next drive third and five perfect pass through in joku any frickin like volleyball sets it like alley oops it to the Raiders for an intercept And it's just like here we go like I know it's yeah, like we're all nervous heading in the afternoon games that it's gonna be bad again Next drive starts at the one yard line and of course their line camp lock so they just tried to run the ball. It doesn't work They put next drive third and 11 to mcconkie Finally like we actually get something moving a little bit here the line creates some room to run We're actually moving hampton camp caps it off of the touchdown It's like okay. This is kind of what we thought it could look like but that was like the only good drive to the whole freaking game Two-minute drill perfect ball to QJ on long the sideline right in his hands. What have been 18 yards dropped that one? There's the tray Harris play third and one in the third quarter. He's in motion They snapped the ball into his leg as he's like in motion and her bird gets credited with a fumble He has three fumbles on the game one of them was that And at that point, I think it's just kind of over like it's really really derailed and it's the everybody's kind of panicking It really does seem like Herbert is In panic mode a little bit of this time And so that's where you get to the I think the the sack fumble that everybody kind of saw on red zone where he's like trying to stiff arm the guy That was a that was the first truly bad Herbert play I saw so In week one, I was actually really critical of Herbert. I thought he did not play well But he was still pretty accurate in that game for the most part there were a couple of bad misses But generally speaking he was pretty accurate and in this game I thought he was very accurate again I'm curious what the charting looks like but to me he threw it well throughout the game Until that tray Harris play and then it all fell apart So on that fumble he has tray Harris wide open and doesn't take it and then immediately there's a free blitzer coming And he decides to try to like make the roll out hero play to the right and fumbles and luckily they get it It could have easily been a touchdown and then just keeps getting worse Then you you miss QJ along this eyeline I think a lot of people saw all this stuff at the end of the game And so it feels a lot worse than it was but really this didn't have to be this way man Like it really Spiraled out of control And then at the end of the game it's like there's the the play where he fumbles trying to do this stiff arm And then there's the frickin amarring hampton fumble And I just feel like the vibes at that point were so out of control Bad just horrific It was just so over at that point and then it all culminates in The second straight week of Herbert for some reason trying to fit it into five foot 865 pound areas Davis a double coverage for an interception to in the game It's just like what is going on? And so now we're at the point We are today where everybody is like Magnum Daniel is not going to make it through the season just in Herbert and his his girlfriends the problem He's air wife. He's he's an idiot. He's terrible like I don't know. I think all the players are good except for the line. The line's playing terrible I don't think the players are that good though. I do I don't think the mccoche is good He's mccoche is very good. They don't have an explosive Receive like Quentin Johnson is not that good. He's fine I don't know. I think they're talents overrated. Maconkeys were really, really good. I think Trey Harris is actually really good. He played really well in this game. He didn't play great in the first game, but I played really well today. He's like wide open for a big play, you know, and ran. I mean, I'll trust you. He got himself in a lot. He was open a lot. He was open a lot. I don't think he's a really good blocker. I think he's just a good player. And then Brennan Thompson, I think, is actually really good too. He was winning repeatedly. He had a bad drop of being in the game, but like, he's actually good if you have to go to him. I don't know, man. I mean, I think it might be good, but this is not, I don't think he's one of the most talented offenses. I think it can be, but I don't think it is right now for a lot of reasons from what I saw on the tape. Jacob did a great job. Don't know how stupid these drives ended, but there was one more stupid one where Herbert goes to the play side on a two-man concept, trying to find Maconkeys. It's not there. He somehow found a way to navigate the pocket, step through it, and throw to a wide open Thompson. And Gadsten, like, thinks the ball's coming for him and like, oh, you said that when I was third and three, I was at the beginning of the game. Oh, that was the beginning. Yeah, I missed that one, but that's another one. And Thompson missed the drop earlier. It was a really bad drop. You had the joke. I put all five of the plays on Twitter that ended drives that were either horrific drops by Johnston Thompson, Johnston on another, and then the stupid fumble snap on third and one that killed the drive. But they're also playing at a slow pace, which is not helpful. And I think the bigger issue that I have right now outside of what Jacob said is, is Mike McDaniel a fake sharp? I'm starting to wonder that because this offensive design does not fit Herbert skill set. There's way too many of these slow, long developing play action passes with a bad interior offense line, but where the time where like Herbert turns his back to the defense, but the time he turns around, the pressure is like right in his face. And it's like, all right, you might have developed a good route combination behind this play action pass, McDaniel, but there's no time for it. So now we're all scheduled immediately. There's also times where Herbert, who I think has looked way less comfortable in the pocket than I've seen him since last season when the offensive line broke down, is just missing reads, like missing open in breakers and over routes on the backside of digs at the backside of routes that I usually see him understand the concept of and hit. But he's not because he looks a little more, I guess, I don't want to say the word panic, but just uncomfortable in the pocket than he's used to because his offensive line is bad. But then there's also stats that kind of back up the idea of like, maybe it's not all there for McDaniel as it used to be. And these are courtesy of Pat Thorman, who's really good at doing this. And he said, Mike McDaniel neutral pass rates with 2, 2022, 63% second the NFL, 2023, 62% fourth in the NFL. This is when he was actually an amazing offensive coordinator in my mind. And they were actually an explosive offense that I thought they would be with a player like Herbert. Last two seasons, he's been 18th and 22nd with Justin Herbert, 31st in neutral pass rate through the first two weeks. The chargers are 31st in neutral script dropback rate with the Rams still pending tonight. Another one that he had is related to that, the chargers have a league worst minus 19.7 EPA as are rushing off in through two weeks. So for some reason, he's running the ball neutral games grips more than all, but one team and they've been one of the worst. If not, the worst so far, the league worst team at running the football in through the first two weeks. So I don't know what is going on. I think personally they need to do some of the stuff that Herbert was was great within the past instead of just leaning fully into the things that McDaniel thinks will work. To me, it's like he's running the two offense for Herbert, which I don't know, but the more recent two offense, the two offense before it was, you know, Waddle and Hill, not the 2022-23 version, like the more recent version, which maybe is because he doesn't trust his offensive line, McDaniel. That could be the case. I don't know, but this is not working schematically at all right now. And I feel like Jacob was spot on with Herbert through a lot of on target passes. I mean, you could someone tweeted, I tweeted the cut up at him and Jacob and someone's like, that in a joke who pass was a little bit thrown under thrown. I'm like, dude, he's throwing a far hash rip, 35 yards down the field. 90% of NFL quarterbacks would be under thrown to the point of intercepted or not even trying that throw. The ball hits and jokou in the chest in two hands. It pops it up for an interception. I mean, I don't know, ma'am. All right. Well, I think there's six in running back rush success rate. The EPA is because of the fumbles. Okay. The, uh, the dolphins are fair. It's a fair now. It's a bad suite. That's fair. But the neutral pass, the run rate still is really high. Let me tell you, his first year with the dolphins is 2022. Um, if they started, this is the points per game. 20 42 9 21 15 17 16 16. Pretty bad for the first seven games. Then 31 35 39 30 7 15 17 29 20 two against hurt 21 bridgewater gets hurt 11. They got better in the second half of the year. And there's a article from the LA Times. It says, Mike McDaniel's complicated scheme is turning charges offense into a disaster. It's possible. They just need time to adjust to it. It is possible. Yeah. I will say one player I'm very worried about though is is a player was super high on Quentin Johnson. The reason being the reason I liked him so much was the improvements he made throughout his career, specific last season. Right now he looks like a player who's playing without confidence. The concentration drops are back. This is back to back weeks. And I think it's a big problem because that was what he was in his rookie season. He was a player who was playing unconfidently and that could happen to players throughout their career. More so corners than receivers, but you see it with receivers as well. So he was a player was super high on and I'm, and I'm very worried about right now. All right. If they can have all the random stuff not happen with all the drops and everything, and then also if lad can be healthy, I think that they could be fine. QJ is not playing very well, but I honestly do think that they can replace him with the guys that I said to him here as Brennan Thompson, even Keith Mitchell on some of the drags and stuff like that is fine. They've been lining him up at receiver a lot. I don't disagree that they could be better, but I've run into this problem on this particular show where I've looked at teams that are struggling and I've gone through the tape and I've been like, oh, well, they had this play. It was a drop. They had a penalty here and you know what happens? They keep messing up. And also a lot of teams that are doing well on offense also have these types of setbacks during the game, but they're good enough to compensate it. Right. We can't have a team with the chargers where it's like everything has to go right for them to be okay. And meanwhile, they just played the Raiders and the Cardinals. And next up, they've got the bills, which I think could be okay. Seahawks, Broncos, Chiefs, High, Rams, Houston, Ravens. Yeah. I'm pretty freaking concerned here. Great point. Yeah. It's horrible. Yeah. If I had to guess, it's probably like 75% over like 25% chance. It could get better, but probably not happening. Probably going to go bad. All right. You still start Maconkey with confidence and Hampton with confidence? I don't know. I only have like a 40% route rate. I don't. Maconkey. I mean, Hampton, you still for sure. Hampton, yeah. Yeah. I'm talking about Maconkey. I just don't know when he's back and they're letting him play. Sure. Yeah. I think it's 70% route rate. Maybe I saw that right. Maybe I saw 40% snap rate. You could be right. Okay. Either way, they weren't doing as much of the over the mental stuff. Like when he got over the mental target, he immediately went down. Like it just seemed like they were trying to protect him. And then 19 year order, you up. Okay. Thanks, guys. Great show today. Fun stuff. Even though it was all depressing. That's the people want. They asked us about the pressing teams. They always, yeah, they always want to know more about the players who are doing poorly than the players who are doing. Well, I would have loved to talk about Bryce Young today, but that'll be tomorrow on the WeaverWire show. Thanks for watching, listening to Beyond the Box score. We'll talk to you tomorrow on Fantasy Football today. Paramount Podcasts. A mystery woman found dead in the woods, murdered, but who was she? And how did she die not once, but twice? Follow and listen to The Woman in the Woods wherever you get your podcasts.