WarRoom Battleground EP 1021: The Founder's Mentality Of The United States

[MUSIC PLAYING] This is the primal scream of a dying regime. Pray for our enemies, because we're going to medieval on this people. Here's how I got a free shot on all these networks lying about the people. The people have had a belly full of them. I know you don't like hearing that. I know you've tried to do everything in the world to stop. But you're not going to stop it. It's going to happen. And where do people like that go to share the big line? Mega media. I wish, in my soul, I wish that any of these people had a conscience. Ask yourself, what is my task and what is my purpose? If that answer is to save my country, this country will be saved. War room. Here's your host, Stephen K. Bannon. OK, welcome. You're in the war room. And my favorite war room, so we get to talk to bringing people, many of whom happen to be writers in one of our favorites, author Herman. How are you doing, sir? Thank you for coming back. I'm doing well. It's always a pleasure to be here. Always an honor to have you here. You've got a new book out. Everybody's talking about Founders Fire. You've also got another book that's in the constant headlines being read over the Pentagon, or the Department of War all the time. And with Peter and the Varaness team, that's Freedom's Forward. We're going to talk about the industrial power in might. I do want to address. You've had an article up that read, in preparation for our Memorial Day weekend special on MacArthur in Asia. And of course, the president coming back from the meeting with the CCP. And one of my favorites-- because I always get your book in paperback, also, so I can mark it up. But one of my favorites, your biography of MacArthur. Let's start with Founders Fire, just an update. How's the book doing? I mean, people, our audience really loved it. And what they loved about it, you take a very different take on 250. You go all the way back, but you're not given a-- in which we've got Eric Batax's thing trying to get Eric on the start, trying to get Eric on to talk about his book Revolutionary War. You took a very different take on commemorating the 250th anniversary. What was it, and why did you do that? Well, what I wanted to do was I wanted to focus on the notion of founding and founder, as opposed to just founding fathers. As you know, there's a slew of books going to be coming out. They're already out for the 250th, talking about the importance of the Declaration of Independence and talking about it from the point of view of how the ideas came together and what its impact has been on us as a political system and our Constitution. What I wanted to do was really talk about the founders themselves, men like George Washington and John Adams and Thomas Jefferson and the others who were part of that meeting in event and philosophy. Revolutionary generation, but the founders also-- That's right, yeah. And what they showed was with their vision of what the future could look like for America, but not only for America, but for the world, but also that willingness to sort of put everything on the line, including their own lives, to make this bold step to declare independence from the greatest empire on Earth, Great Britain. And also to this kind of commitment that they had to pushing and devoting their energy to make sure that this kind of thing happened. So it wasn't just a dreamy vision of what could happen if America would become independent. And then let's get down to real business. That was their business. All of those are characteristics of what we call the founder mindset. And that's true for those-- that group of men in 1776 and those who supported them. But it's also true for an American business. And in certain crucial moments in American history as I explain in the book, it's also important in American governance. And when you look at what happened with Abraham Lincoln in the Civil War, when you look at Martin Luther King, Civil Rights Movement. And I think of what if you look at what Donald Trump has been working to accomplish both in his first term and in the second term, you see that same combination of drive, of vision, of willingness to take big risks in order to achieve major opportunities. And also too, from the point of view of our government, and thinking about it as a way to re-dedicate America to what those founding principles really were in 1776. And then again, in 1787 with a constitution. The-- because I break that period down in the three sections, the American Revolution, which I say essentially culminated-- a part of it culminated on the signing of the Declaration of War, Declaration of Independence. Then you had the Revolutionary War. You actually had a fight for it. Then you had Nation Building, where the Revolutionary Generation-- some of them came back with others and had the Constitutional Convention, but set the Constitution up, et cetera. What ties together freedom's forage, which is really talking about World War II and a totally different take. You look at industrial power in the way that the industrial power was essential to actually becoming-- the underpinnings of global freedom really was in addition to the valor and courage of our fighting men from the eighth-air force over Germany to Pellalu was this underpinning of a massive industrial power that could take on the imperial Japan and the Nazis simultaneously and defeat them. To tie it back, because in your-- in Founders Fire, you do talk about individuals. But what's fascinating to me-- you talk about times in history you've had groups that have a Founders Fire. The industrial revolution and how we perfected it to the United States and maybe Britain didn't is because you had a generic head-- guys that can't afford it, but they inspired a generation. When you get to Detroit in the 1930s and 40s, and then the aircraft industry, you have a mindset of a generation that's very different than the individual. I mean, a lot of times we think, and I can serve a president Trump. It sounds-- it sounds-- oftentimes, it feels like you're fighting alone or with a handful of commodities, where we've really moved the needle. It's when that Founders Fire spreads throughout a generation of like-minded individuals. And then you have huge things like the 30 or 40 years it took to actually the revolution, the winning of a war, and the founding of a powerful nation is a 30 or 40-year process. The-- what gave us freedom's forage, the ability and capacity to do that in Detroit was a 30, 40 or 50-year process, but you had like-minded mindset. Mindset, across, and it was embodied or manifested in many different individuals, right? And then all the way through these institutions, what they institutionalized the revolution in the building of the nation. They institutionalized the industrial revolution in the modern industrial power of the United States. And I think this is what separates us from really who founded the industrial revolution in the British. The British. And that revolutionary generation in Britain, who create that industrial revolution, who harness steam power. And one is if you take the whole history of the earth and you go back, it's the steam engine, you've got agricultural production, da, da, da, da, da, da. That's right. Boom. You've got everything, boom. It's 10,000 years, and then suddenly-- Talk to our audience about that. Talk to our audience about that. Well, how-- Well, up until then, everything, the power, the way you got things done, was basically muscle power, either animal muscle power or human muscle power. From the building of the pyramids all the way through to the slave plantations in the south, the slave plantations in the Caribbean, the peasant economies of Europe, continental Europe, for thousands of years, going back before the Romans, which all built on muscle power. Steam power, for the first time you have an alternative source, much more productive, much more efficient, much more energy density compared to having to rely on human muscle. And being able to do a single steam engine, a power engine, able to do the work of hundreds, even thousands of people in a shorter amount of time. That generation who brought that about men like Matthew Bolton, who's really the great titan of the Iron Industry in Britain, Josiah Whit Wedgewood, they were a generation. And they enabled Britain to win a war, a world war, against Napoleon, arming both the Navy and also the Army, and also financing all of the continental allies, Russia and Russia and Austria, all depended upon the money, that that economy, that that globalized economy that Britain was able to build, thanks to that industrial revolution, was able to bring to bear. And that was the case with us, too, in World War II. Yes. It wasn't just an industrial might to arm America. We were also arming our allies, including Russia, including the Soviet Union, in ways in which they could never have survived the war without that economic industrial muscle that was-- built into the American American mindset in the 30s and 40s. You have to help me out here because the 18th, when you look back over history, the 18th century is just so. So we talked about last time in 1776, we released in within six months. We released the first volume of the decline in fall, Gibbons decline in fall and an empire, Adam's nest, the wealth nations, and topped off by Jefferson and Adam's with the Declaration of Independence, right? Not a bad run in six months, right? But the four runners of all the great industrial revolution being manifested were all learning and thinking and tinkering at that time also. What was it about the 18th century, particularly in Scotland and the British Isles that led to this magnificent flowering in ideas about man and man's relationship to government, man's relationship to economics, and at the same time, the mechanical arts, really taking the beginning of science, but turning it into what we call technology. Why was the 18th century such a major foundational element for the modern world? Great question. A lot of it I talk about in my book that you know very well how this got some then in the modern world. And I talk about a backward, a backward country that's on its ass essentially, right? Because and is broke. How does that happen broke? How does that happen? It happens in two ways. Number one is that this bankrupt impoverished country, no natural resources at all. Scotland is go to the hot. There's nothing there. And for generations, even after even after the union with Britain, Scott's try to get away from the homeland as fast as possible. Whether it's to North America, whether it's to Africa, or whether it's to be in the Caribbean beyond. But one, the one resource, the one imperishable resource that Scotland had, thanks to the church, thanks to the Presbyterian Church, was literacy. That you it was, I think without doubt, in the 18th century, the most literate population on earth. How did that come about through the schools and the insistence that every boy and every girl in Scotland learned to read in order to read the Bible? Was that back from Elizabethan times? Because Elizabethan time is known as starting the grammar school. I mean, one of their big things that's never mentioned is to teach actually to break through the church and make sure that the you had a population that could actually read the gospels in its own native language. It's on the way. They started these grammar schools. Elizabethan education is so important. It's kind of missed over. Is that a raw? It's a similar outgrowth that springs up in the 16th. It's the result of the Reformation. And the Reformation is that the church, the Catholic church, was widely believed had kept the message ignorant of what the true message of God and Scripture was, and that the best way to make that message immediate to everyone was to disintermediate the priest cast by giving a fancy harbor business will turn, but the same concept disintermediate the priest cast by the printing press. But people have to be able to read to take it into the pre-miss. And the Reformation, every man or every person is on priest. The priesthood of all believers. And that the essential equipment that you're going to play that do that kind of role. Is you're going to have to be able to read it. But how does literacy then turn to the magnificence of what you had, you know, what you had Gibbons, you had you had, I'm Smith. Right. You had Jefferson and those guys who admit they got this from the English Enlightenment, right? What happened? But also the technology part and the science part, the foundations of the industrial revolution, the foundational element of that all took place in the late 18th century. And what happens is in Scotland, you get a generation of intellectual leaders, like Adam Smith, who are able to watch the process of commercialization of society, of the changes, the positive changes that take place in a society as a result of trade, and commerce. They watch it happen from the ground up. They can watch it grow up from the ground and from a workforce that has this incredible gift of literacy. But also too of a philosophy that takes root in Scotland in the 18th century, the philosophy of common sense. The idea that every human being is equipped with an ability to understand the right and wrong, to understand what's up and what's true. Drill down just because in Germany and the continent, you have, Voltae, have these great thinkers, but it's very theoretical. And a lot of it's just when you look at it today, it's like it's just dead wrong, but it led to a lot of problems. It did. Why did the Scottish and the British come to this whole thing of common sense? It's a break from the elitism of the continental philosophy and the usual approach to enlightenment that you see in which is that enlightenment and understanding the world belongs only to a few trained minds who are able to understand the world as it really is, who are able to stand the larger metaphysical principles that underpin everything. The Scots say no. This is something everybody is equipped in order to do this. And if you have that trust in the ability of ordinary people to understand how the world works, equip them with the power of literacy and of being able to make and to create based on how they're able to understand the scientific, the mechanical principles that they're able to learn and understand of how to enter into that world and to make a difference and to make a life for yourself. You've unleashed this tremendous source of power and ingenuity that comes from there. Is this one of the fundamental different things? The guys we're talking about are Scottish enlightenment figures. Adam Smith is just one of the ones I talk about in the book How the Scots Invented the Mar and World. You've got David Hume is there William Robertson is there. Francis Hutchison is there. What they're doing is they're watching this process take place before their eyes. And they're writing about the what happens when people become part of what we call modern society. That there's a transformation of personality, a transformation of means in terms of the material growth and prosperity that comes a result of that. And that that becomes a benchmark for understanding what it is that distinguishes us from the past, from the agrarian society or the ancient societies that of Rome that depended upon slave labor, for example, Edward Gibbon understood all of these principles from his Scottish friends and use that analysis that framework. That's it. The shape his view of the decline and fall of the Roman Empire of understanding that in the end, the Romans for all their suffice cultural sophistication, for all their great architecture and art and great law that they were still trapped in a primitive economy that depended upon slave labor, on human labor, and on was not able to enjoy the kind of benefits that flow from modern commercial side. I want to hit this one more time because it's important for the audience to understand. Gibbon tells you that he's done the grand tour of Europe and he's particularly gone to Italy. And he's quite frank, he's blown away. It was so overwhelmed him to what he thought it was. He's sitting there in an actual room and you can go the very steps of one of it's a church now, but he was a. He's sitting on the top of those steps and it's late in the afternoon and he sees a group of monks go by and they're chanting to do evening vespers. And it hits him and he looks around and he goes and he sees the other arch of Titus. He's right there at the center park right near the Colosseum or the Forum. The Forum, you can still see it, he sees these magnificent ruins. And he looks around and he goes, "How did all of this happen?" And this is what we have. We have this group of monks, investors in a city that is just a ruin and a shadow of it for himself. How did that happen? That begins his 30 or 40 year effort on research and writing it. And was it the framework he worked with? The work is magnificent and people don't realize it goes all the way up to the. the most constant. The most constant? The most constant? No, he takes. I tell people, if you want to start with the issues with Islam, Gibbons laid it out for you in 1776 because. or later, I guess it was a couple of years later, the volume came out. What was it again that he picked up from the Scottish Enlightenment? That was the framing device that made that all made sense eventually in his writings from the ruins he was sitting in to evening vespers with the monks that he couldn't figure out. How did this all happen? What he realized was that the Roman Empire and the Romans in the ruling elite of that society simply didn't have the means by which to confront the challenge of barbarism, that in a primitive economy of that sort, so dependent upon agricultural labor and a workforce that are basically enslaved or peasant bound to the land that you just don't have the material resources necessary. - Although Roman engineering was at the elite, to separate their roads, the way they brought water down, the way they threw bridges across the calcium, bridges across the Rhine, sitting there in the forum, looking at the ruins of a great temple of Jupiter and the other surrounding the remains of the greatest empire of the world had ever known, and then realizing that all of this came to nothing, all this crumbled and collapsed. And part of it is he gives part of the blame to Christianity in the sense that Christianity is sapt away the morale of that we don't need to keep this empire going 'cause there's another empire coming, which is the city of God. And that therefore, that by directing the Christianity directed human beings, goal and horizons towards a world beyond this one. - Also sapt. - And it also sapt, it did sapt the military focus of the ethos of the warrior class, particularly the central ruins. I see that's not so interesting 'cause given understood, that's all there was. There wasn't an economic base, what we would call an economic or industrial base of a modern sort on which you could rebuild an economy and rebuild society. It was either, you had the soldier emperors who held the empire together with an iron clamp and kept the barbarians at bay. And then if they, if their grips slipped, then barbarism and collapse. - It's interesting because in his case, well, the line he was drawing is, this isn't gonna happen to us. And the reason, people often read, given in that regard, oh, he's predicting decline and fall of the British Empire. - Exact office. - Exactly. - Why is that? - Because in a modern society, we have the resources, we have the means by which it's sustained, civilized existence and in fact to build a brighter future. And that's why I think the founders, American founders, writing a declaration of independence could go forward with confidence that they had now entered into an era in which political freedom and liberty and life and liberty and the pursuit of happiness were now possible and sustainable. - Well, they had the concept of pursuit of happiness. Is this why fundamentally the American revolution is quite different than the French revolution? - I think that happened the exact same time. - I think it's exactly right. - That the story of the French revolution which happens in almost the same period of time. That revolution is one that celebrates not the freedom of the individual, but the power of the community, the general will as Jean-Jacques Rousseau framed it. And if you look at the two paths, and I've written about this at an essay in Cibitus Outlook, the magazine, the online magazine, if on this, that the modern world is, I believe, shaped by two legacies. One from the French revolution, the events and ideas that it set in motion and the other of the Scottish enlightenment. And the American revolution as part of that branch of the revolutionary generation of the 18th century, that from the French revolution, ideas and direction, the necessity of supporting the community over the individual, that the individual is free to submit to the standards and demands of the general will of the community. We get Marxism, communism, the national socialism flow from that heritage that springs out of France and the French revolution, including the violence and terror that flows. From the Scottish enlightenment, we get the American revolution, we get the changes within Britain itself of evolving into modern democracy in the 19th century. - This is the current fight we have within this country. - It's right, it happened right now. - It's the mandame, when mandame is promulgating in New York City, what you see in Minneapolis and the streets of Minneapolis, is exactly those two revolutions at worth themselves here in the United States today. - Today. And what is dismaying is that I don't think people really understand that. I think they under, I think they see someone like Mamdani or even AOC or Bernie Sanders, they see them as figures who flash and who have magnetic personalities that draw media attention and have interesting things to say. Instead of saying, what are they, what ideologies are they really conveying here? What's the future that they're looking and setting out for us here? And it's ones that I believe are ultimately rooted in evil. And I listen to Mamdani when I, the face that I see, when I heard him in the very first debate, the very first debate he had in Marl debate that they broadcast. I said, who is that face remind me of? And I said, reminds me of Paul Pot. Paul Pot, the genocidal dictator of Cambodia, he had the same smile, he had the same magnetic personality that kind of youthful exuberance, that marks his ideas that he had learned at the university in Paris. Arthur Herman, you're so good. Nobody can make that thing. That's so, so brave about you. People think of Paul Pot. Today if they think about it all, they think the killing feels of some monster that has something. He was, he was a open vibrant personality. This reason he was able to do what he could do. So delightful guy to go and sit in the cafe and one of the biggest parts, one of the most brutal murderers in modern history. No, I don't think Mamdani has a right goal. But you're saying we're setting up the cold, the killing feels or not. But, but, but, but, but, but, but there is, but there is nothing in his outlook on what needs to be changed and transformed. That Paul Pot, that's what we're going to be in. That, that, that doesn't overlap with what Paul Pot's great goal is. We're going to take a short commercial break. We want to thank our sponsor, Birch Gold. Take your front end text, band it at 989898, get the ultimate guide for investing in gold in precious metals in the age of Trump. 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Do it and do it today. >> War is here's your host, Stephen K. Madden. >> It's okay. Welcome back. I want to continue this for a minute. Go back to the industrial revolution part of this. Oh, by the way, I always tell my favorite story in front of the French Revolution. It's when Nixon and Kissinger show up to Mao Zedong. And they go for this huge mean. Kissinger has been working on this in secret for a year. They finally go and William Rogers, the Secretary of State goes over the whole entourage like President Trump had. And they land Mao who just raised an emperor, just does a deal. They said, well, the formal things are going to screw the formal things. They said, get Nixon and Kissinger over here right now. I want to meet him. And they go, no, the protocols and they say, no, I want to meet him. And he's at his pool house where he lives in Joe Hinchay, which is the, where President Trump went with she on the last day. And they go over and it's just four of them. And they go to Nixon and Kissinger are very jet lagged and you have Chauin lie and you have Mao. And they're just kind of sitting there, Mao is trying to figure out what these guys are like. And of course, they have translators and there's some slowness, you know, there's a thing. And so Kissinger, who is very nervous to keep the conversation going in one of these laws, you know, turns the show in line says, you know, your revolutionary figure. What are your thoughts on the French Revolution going back to your points? The railhead of that in China line looks at me, takes a while and he says too early to tell. But in their mind, it's a long view history. It's a long view history, but it's a correct view of history. It's what you've just made the analogy that, hey, you see AOC, you see my dummy in the media presents them as, you know, my dummy had the little tic-tocks and he was going through the grocery stores, but people forget. And we're not saying he's going to be a poll pot. But if you look back at the time, people don't know anything about poll pot except he was a worse murderer than even Hitler. I was thinking of 30 million people in Southeast Asia, or was the darkest days for Americans? Well, we left Vietnam and Southeast Asia and just left it to them when the Democrats after the War to Gate scandal cut off all the funding they did in 1975, I think. Shameful episode. Shame. Is it not the most shameful episode actually America's relationship to the world? We just walked away and let all the people that we worked with for years, just the devil kept stopping us. I was saying that one and maybe also the abandonment of China to Mao's forces. That's 40, 40, not. We're going to get to that. There's another one. I think, far about 35 million casualties. It did not. We believed all the propaganda that the communists and their supporters were providing about what a post-civil war Maoist regime would look like and it was a complete fabrication and we fell for it. I'm going to get to that in the MacArthur. By the way, we're going to try to do another episode very quickly and do the part. Let me say this about poll pot. Poll pot didn't start by saying I'm going to go massacre a million and a half of my fellow Cambodians in order to bring about my dream. This is what happens in socialist political process. And communism marches. And communism is springing out along the same, flowing from the same branch. And that is, it's all built on the idea that human beings can be perfected and be perfect. And that you just have to create the conditions through government in which human beings will always act on their best behavior and will always be able to carry out the wishes of the highest wishes that we have about what makes a perfect world. You told me in view of the world. But what of course what happens is humans don't act the way socialists want them to. So what do socialists do? They have to impose new, more coercive measures in order to get people to act the way socialists want them to act. And then when people rebel, resist that, then they have to go to the next level and then to the next level. That's what Frederick Hyatt called the road to Serfdom. It doesn't start with communist or socialist politicians wanting to create Serfdom. They don't see human beings that way. But they're forced to do so because their pursuit of their utopian dreams makes them impose more. And the road to tradition is paved with good intentions. And good intentions. And the best way to deal with those good intentions is keep them out of power. Let them sit in the cafes. Let them sit in the seminar rooms at Harvard or at a Brown University and spin their ideas about what a perfect society would look like, about how we would save the planet in terms of protecting against climate change. Don't give them the power, the means by which they can put their absurd ideas, utopian dreams into action. We talk about these, because they will do whatever they can to pursue that. And human liberty and happiness pays the price. Isn't it fascinating that the same cafes and clubs that were the foundational element for the French Revolution? That's true. Ultimately, if you go back and look at the Chinese Communist, if you look at Ho Chi Minh, if you look at Cho In-Li, if you look at Pol Pot, the Asians that really took the model of the French Revolution more even than the Bolsheviks and really tried to perfect it. All of them, Den Schaupeng, all of them started their education. They were all brought in. They were all in Paris. Right. And they were all in Paris in the same cafes with the same types of philosophies being top of the same types of people. Same Marxist professors at the university, like Louis Autoussale and others, I can have a long discourse if you like. I can't even give a shav, and who, the sort of, the-- Well, that's what we're trying to have in here with Herbert Marcusa and the Frankfurt School. There you go. We have to come to the United States. People, we have to understand this. It is a, it's interlocked, right, of what they've tried to do all from the railhead in Paris in that radicalness, whether it's the Frankfurt School coming here to the United States, or it's taking these Asian young kids, and that's what they do. Chooing Lie, Den Schaupeng, Ho Chi Minh, Ho Chi Minh, Pol Pot, they all go to the universities or the left bank of Paris. They all sit in the same cafe. They all get infused at the formative years with these radical ideas. And you see later, you get the killing fields of Asia. That's right. In the chaos that follows post-colonial Asia, their opportunity springs up to do just that. First in China, but then, of course, also in Vietnam, as well as French rule, or even, I would say, French misrule, declines and falls apart, those moments then come to put-- All of those ideas-- You can't understand that. You can't understand how there could be hatred by the working class people against French elites and French aristocracy because the most arrogant-- the French aristocracy and most arrogant world-- the great story of the French Revolution is when, after-- and this was so fascinating about the story-- having financed the American Revolution, first of the French and Indian wars and then the American Revolution, the French-based government was broke, right? Because that's because of the first global war was really the French and the English fighting on battlefields all over the world for essentially global control. And the French under wrote that. The French under wrote that. In fact, we would not have one-- This guy knows his history. We would not have known-- we would not have known victory if we didn't have the French fleet and the French team, but particularly, frankly, those guys are where they get French money. French cash. When they come to them and say, look, we're broke. This is the same time that we're just trying to now come out of the war and build our nation. And as you know, the United States has-- we started with the English because we don't want to pay taxes for the French and Indian war, but we're not a stiff and the French either for helping us. They go, they said, look, we got to figure out how to pay for this. And they said, well, how do you do it? So as well, we need to raise taxes. But most importantly, we need to get our hands on some of this church revenue and church income. over in England that made them a global power. And but the way to do that is we have to bring the Estates General. Everybody has to come together. We haven't done it in a hundred years. And so the King says, yeah, okay, let's do that. Let's do it. Let's do it. That's good. And we'll do that. And we'll explain it. It's taxation with representation. Taxation with we're going to exactly different than the things that we're going to not have a revolution here. And and the and the non-nobles and non-clarex in that the three Estates, you know, aristocracy, clergy, and then the bourgeoisie and the towns, they that group said, okay, hang on. They're going to they're actually going to take one step farther. They're going to elect their groups, see, and that's they get young lawyers like a lot of lawyers like Robotspear. A lot of you who are not right. But the the the finance minister says and one better, King, because you know, your people are seeing that you're going to have taxation with representation are through. Let's go ahead and just publish the books. Let's give them the complete financial situation. So they'll be our partners are making this change. And the King's not Einstein's cousin. He says, okay, that's a good idea. They say they so they have these broadsheets and they actually put the books of the cash flow in and the debts. And these people are looking at it and they're going we're living like animals in the sewers of Paris. And look at this. These guys have all this they own everything and they pissed everything away. The single biggest line of demarcation is once people saw the books they go, are you crazy? We're living like animals and you're living in Versailles. And you've got all this and you've bankrupted us and you know, you have you can't manage the government at all. The fact that there has to be that empowered the one estate. The the young lawyer said, I think we can have a better idea on this. And of course you had all the radicals underneath the people that believed in God and the people they know as a spiritual war too. But the practical nature of it is once you open the books that the little guy understood, why might live in like an animal? Why am I being screwed? Why am I being screwed and they're living in Versailles? That's right. And you know, in some ways I sort of feel just to bring it up to contemporary events. I kind of feel like this whole anti-fraud campaign that the vice president that JD Vance and others are lynching has a similar could have a similar impact of making people because we have been sold. The American public has been sold for since the great society that all of these wonderful welfare state programs. The 39 trillion that we paid for the welfare first was all in order to just happen to quite a bit randomly with the number of our dead as well. That was all done for the better. Well, this was in Laquan. You've got that in Laquan. But his original construct that we can cut a trillion dollars in our annual budget because the whole thing's fraud. He didn't really have the ability or the to do it only be does, but you're right. There's been so much for what are seeing the surface of it. It's so corrupt and how it's misallocated money. He had the he had took one look made a common sense call on and said we can we can clear out clear half a trillion dollars just off the top. But I think what we're really going to discover Steve if if the vice president if I were advising him and advising the anti fraud task force that they're working on is you can expand this narrative and you can begin to show that this entire welfare state great society apparatus that we've been paying for that has been built on the US government has all been a fraud that it's all been a means by which to enrich a whole range of NGOs of a whole range of politicians and government bureaucrats who have made their living scooping out the money the taxpayers are providing thinking that it's going to make the lives of the poor and oppressed the halt and the lame the widows and orphans better and as you know Walter will relate Walter Williams to see said just imagine if you'd taken a fraction of the money a fraction of that of the of the trillions that have been spent on welfare state and just wrote a check to the halt and the lame and the widows and orphans the how their lives have been so so much better than what the welfare state has done done instead. But and I'll include among those I would include among those who have benefited from this fraud the teachers unions. All the all the all the teachers unions which is as you know the University of California is now the professors are saying we got to get back to the SATs because I think the report they did the other day of high schools graduates in the state of California graduating with A's and mathematics and most and many of them in advanced mathematics classes they have come to the assessment in the STEM programs in the at the University of California system that the vast majority of the graduates are at a sixth and seventh grade understanding of mathematics that that that has to go back and this is with people graduating with A's that go to the University. I want to go back I want to close the segment we're going to keep your rubber and doing the go back to the common sense yeah because because that's a two different railheads the Scottish Enlightenment and the American Revolution and the French Revolution about the community because they all talk about the community all the time the fundamental difference in the in the is the understanding of practicality and common sense versus utopianism. That's right and and at the beginning of the French Revolution as you just pointed out the first steps there were much more similar to what had happened in America in 1776 taxation with representation letting people see the numbers show us the numbers show it what's really going on and people will use their common sense to figure out and sort of say this is not going right we need big changes in big transformations and for a few crucial months in 1789 in France the early stages the French Revolution they were moving in that kind of direction and then the radicals seized seized control as the government began to lose more and more grip on civil order and the situation like that it's a story that's been told in not just in France but across the around the world ever since of what happens when the status quo government loses control of civil order and the radicals are able to grab a world and put another power I don't want to put another burden of a book but you get to take that essay expanded to a book because people don't understand this is quite fundamental every day in the news you see this you see what's happening in Minnesota you know your Bruce Springsteen with the song run around his concert you see the the basic fundamental difference comes from that period in the two revolution that were inspired one by the Scottish Enlightenment right and the in the practical nature of just the English speaking people versus the as Thomas more warned us about in the book utopia and then we were born again in brave new world right the whole concept of kind of do good erism you know to do good but it ends up in the killing fields of polpont if I can conceive a perfect world in my mind why can't there be a perfect world in reality that's what you that's the kind of framework of thinking about the world that you're often taught at the university level at an academic level and then when you carry that into if you're given the opportunity to carry that into reality as happened in post-colonial Asia as it happened in France after after 1792 the result the results can be truly horrible the we're going to get you stick around I'm going to do this we're going to play it the second part tomorrow night but in team up to talk about Asian everything with MacArthur all that the industrial revolution what we saw in freedoms forge give me a couple minutes just to end this episode but to tell us what happened what was so spectacular about what manifests itself in the 1920s 30s and 40s in the United States in our industrial hardland well actually I talk a lot about this in the in founders fire also which is that what you had was a a revolution that is set in motion by the tram by again a revolution in terms of sources of power as America moved away from steam power as a primary means of moving industrial development and manufacturing the inheritance from from from the British from the 18th century from that point of view and then make the crucial jump to using to using gasoline and caracene in the internal combustion engine and that is a jump not we think about usually we think about the internal combustion engine and and and the power provided through the the energy density of of gasoline or its predecessor caracene that's how John de Rockefeller made his fortune was by refining from gasoline getting caracene and using that for illumination but also for power as well we think about it in terms of the automobile and our mobility but it also became a key factor in transforming how Americans factories ran and how American the power source of power for America's industrial industrial might in the 20th century flows from that same sources of power and so what what happens in the case of Detroit is that these two these two revolutions, these two developments, our industrial revolution and the mobility revolutions that Henry Ford and he's not alone, set in motion with the automobile, come together. And the result is to make Detroit and the automotive industry the center of the economic world, not just of American economy, but also the center of how America becomes the dominant, the dominant economic forest in the world. The great depression is a represents a kind of speed bump in that development. There's no doubt about that. Factories close, the economy winds down, unemployment, as well as the reduced demand closures. The government doesn't help with its redistribution as to approach to dealing with this economic shock. - All of Roosevelt's plans, by 1938, we're back into the worst days of the world. - Okay, the second, what they call the second great depression hits. But that generation, this goes to the point we started with. That generation who had been, who had built Detroit into this industrial as well as automotive hub, they simply persevered through. They just powered through the great depression. The same patterns of, they're making cars, of getting American consumer to face that, to make the decision to buy a new automobile, continues and goes on, and then carries through when that same mentality and mindset and base has to be mobilized for more. - We're going to continue this conversation tomorrow. So let's put it over with the right stuff. Arthur Herman, where they go to get all your books. What's the site? - Oh, you can go to my website, Arthur-Herman.com, you can go to Amazon for Founders Fire or for Freedom's Forge. Barnes and Noble, I recommend going to Barnes and Noble as well. - Buy it by the store. - Want to thank Birchgold.com/bannon and to the dollar empire. This is sold out on backboard, but you get all free, all eight installments, all free. We'll see you tomorrow evening. - The American healthcare system is broken. And for most Americans, nothing changes. There's still delays, denials, high cost, insurance roadblocks. 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