Triple H

Hello everybody. Welcome to what do you want to talk about a fanatics and WWE original production. We are approaching WrestleMania and we have the guest of all guests. Ladies and gentlemen, the cerebral assassin, the game, the King of Kings, Hall of Famer, WWE Champion, World Champion, European Champion, Intercontinental Champion, also 1988, Mr. Teenage New Hampshire at that and the Chief Creative Content Officer. Yeah, one of those. Yeah. Ballpark. Ballpark, that's it. Yeah. Ladies and gentlemen, please welcome to what do you want to talk about Triple H? Thank you. I will start by stating that we have wanted you on the show, probably it's the beginning of the show and you are incredibly busy as you're running all of this and doing all of this. So my producer off camera will say to me, I think we got him and I will send a text that is image I found on a Google search of a pig with wings. So I'm pretty excited. I'm just making your way so it seems valuable when you do it with this. Well, I mean, supplying demand thing, you know. That's that classic pro wrestler. You make him wait. Exactly. But what better time than as we approach WrestleMania? Feels like the right time. Things happen for the reason, right? Yeah. 142 loss Vegas. Did I get it right? 1988, Mr. Teenage, New Hampshire? I think so. I don't, you know, I have, I'm like the worst person with dates. You will see this over and over. Yeah. We do this and you'll bring up events and times and all of that of no clue when they happened or anything. I remember them for the most part. Yeah. But what year they happened or the only thing I know about that time, like during that is I was 19. I just remember it was my last year of being able to compete in the team division, right? Got it. And do something. And, you know, contrary to what a lot of people believe at that point in time, you know, a lot of people say, oh, he's a bodybuilder that got in wrestling. I wasn't. I was a kid that was going to the gym with the sole goal of becoming a pro wrestler somewhere in my mind. I fell in love with the training aspect of competitive, the competitive aspect of it, bodybuilding. Was just something to do to promote Asian and keep you wanting to get to that next level and always improve training wise. It was a fun thing to do at the time. I enjoyed doing it, but it was never a career thought or anything else for sure. I wouldn't have been very good at it. You, because you were, of course, I opened this up by mentioning Teenage New Hampshire and bodybuilding. And this is something that's been brought up on the show. This is not the first question I thought I would ask, but I'm actually curious as you're take. First thing has gone through stages where 70s, 80s, it's all shapes and sizes. It's everything. And then it's, you know, the golden 80s and the 90s where the physique was very principal, very important. Do you weigh in? Where do you feel in 2026 going into 2027? Is it as important as it was the physique, the presence, the body? I feel like it's mixed depending on who you are as a performer and what you're bringing to the table. So, you know, I don't know. Would Brock Lesnar be as frightening if he wasn't, if he didn't look like Brock Lesnar? Sure. But I don't think you have to have it. I don't think it has to be. I'm a bigger believer in the variety of things. Somebody doesn't have to be there. There needs to be some semblance of believability to what we do, right? But I don't think that means you have to be a bodybuilder. I don't think it means you have to be, you know, lean where you can see your abs or, but I think that works for some folks. I think that there's also room for the Gunthers. I'd love to see the Kamala. Yeah. And I'd love to see. I don't know. There's something for everybody across what we do and, and I don't know, you know, I talk about history a lot because we're both history buffs in the business and stuff. I'm dual of the butcher Kamala, people like that, who just is frightening to me as anybody else, as the road warriors were or anybody else that was jacked up in a different level, right? So I'm a big believer in variety sort of makes everything better. So when you get fed one thing for a while, after a while, you get tired of eating the same thing. So you want that variety. I, uh, this made me think of when I was at OVW, Greg Valentine came and to speak to us, which was slowly funny. Yes. Because so often his advice was it almost became a bit. I remember me and punk sitting together laughing. His advice almost always was slow down. Like every match was, I think he could, I think he could slow down. Okay. He's going to say slow down. There's not one person here who's not going to get that. But then out of nowhere, he just went on this tangent and I never forgot it. He asked, he goes, you know why we work out guys? And everyone has the wrong answer. I have to look great to TV presentation. He goes, now we just need to, we just need to look like we can beat up the marks. That was his, his whole take. And I thought, okay, yeah, that's fair. Like, you just need the, the fan to at least be, oh yeah, that guy's intimidating. Oh, yeah, that, that's, that's, and to some degree, that's a fairly accurate, right? Like, you know, um, it's funny. There's a, there's a moment in time when I remember, uh, it's actually a funny story of Dan Severn, yeah, who could kill everybody in a locker room probably, right? Like for the most part at that time. Be said, look like it. You know what I mean? He looked like a, a construction guy or somebody that you might see down, down the street and, and just look like a regular dude. So it was tough for people to buy into the fact that he could stretch half the locker room and was kind of letting everybody do all this stuff. But there's a funny story once where he walked to the ring and he had a white t-shirt on. I was like, or had just happened to be a gorilla. I think I made it was like next on raw and uh, he walks to the ring and there's white t-shirt on. It's like it's sweat stains on it and stuff. And he walks down there in the bell rings and Vince is like, Jesus, tell him to take the t-shirt off. Tells, tell the referee, referee tells him he goes, takes the t-shirt off. Vince sees his, his, he goes, Jesus, tell him to go get the t-shirt and put it back on. I know. Yeah. And you see the referee tell Dan. He's like, well, it's happening. He rolls out on the floor, gets t-shirt, puts it back onto the, they start the match. Yeah. I, you know, there's a lot of reasons why you train in, in this day, in age, like we know a lot more about what keeps you healthy and everything else too, right? So training is just as much a part of your longevity in this business as anything. So I think it's that. I think it's looking like you can beat up the marks. I think it's just having some semblance of, of believability to what you do and, and the role you're in. Yeah. You know, especially in, in my generation of stuff, you know, you needed a cane, you needed a takeer, you needed an Austin, you needed a Sean Michaels, you needed a, ex-pop, you needed a McFolly, you know, you wanted to have all that variety of stuff and, and, and to make it all work and have that variety. I, uh, I felt bad. I apologize to you the other day because after, uh, we had the blood bath on Smackdown, I didn't feel like getting on a commercial plane. So I asked if I could hop on with you. Right. Yeah. And you are always so nice and everyone on that plane is always nice because they leave me the seat by you. And then I felt bad because while everyone else slept and rested, I had to ask you every question. Man, I love that stuff. I could know wrestling. I love it. You know, I don't get the opportunity very much. He's just sitting bullshit wrestling. You know, not, not like I used to and usually when somebody's bullshit wrestling, like you and I were just bullshit and about wrestling. Yeah. A lot of times when you, if there's an agenda to, to the bullshit, if, if people are talking in world sitting in a room talking, there's an agenda to it or what they're trying to get or what it is for me to sit on a plane with you. Uh, I, you know, I'm, I'm still just the kids sitting on my couch watching wrestling on a Saturday morning. You know, like, I love this and, and I love every aspect of it. So sometimes it's a job where there's a lot of, there's a lot of work to it. Um, but for the most part, when I have moments like that where we can just sit and, I don't know, tell old stories and tell, tell our wrestling lies and do ourselves and all that stuff. It's just fun, man. It's fun. And I love that stuff. And it's part of, I think what guys have, maybe it's different now. I know in our generation and, and you, you were there of the, that constant travel being in the car every day. That was daily life. And that was part of when you sort I've got to the end or when things started slowing down for you, that was the stuff you missed. You know, that camaraderie of just sitting on the road talking wrestling and talking about the business and, you know. Well, it's almost more than camaraderie. I've found in a sense that every time I come up here, one of the reasons, for example, we do the podcast here. And same thing when the bus pulls up to the arena, I turn on now, it's on YouTube, everything, the vault. And I need wrestling to be on. I need it. Yeah. I need it around me. Yes. Sometimes I'm watching and I'm having fun. But almost always I'm watching and also picking something up. And a prime example we're having this conversation. I had no idea. The, you know, I knew about Kowalski. And you mentioned like Kowalski's robe. But then you wore. Yeah. I knew his, you know, actionable part of your career and who he was. But I didn't know Jack Lanzah. That was the thing that I was. I'd never heard anything other than Jack Lanzah wanted to in the show on time. And that was a big Jack Lanzah thing. Flip the tie or all right, guys. You know, can you get it done in seven? And you were telling me just really smart, really helpful. Yeah. I really was, I don't know if you wanted to speak to that. I was just really, I was curious myself. I left thinking about that. So, you know, certain people that you come in that are around in your period of time that sort of you gravitate towards, they gravitate towards you or you find their presence helpful or, you know, their point of view helpful to you. And I was, I say this all the time, I was so fortunate in that, you know, I got to sit under the learning tree as so many people, Vince, Lanzah, Pat, the smartest folks in the business, even chief, Arnie Skolan. Yeah. Right, little bits and pieces that you took from everybody. Your dad, you know, flare, Sean. And so many different points of view and it was so funny that as I came in, like when, when the click was all together, Kevin and Scott and Sean and you learned so many different things with so many of their pieces came, they'd say, oh, Pat taught me that. Oh, Lanzah taught me that. Yeah. Jack was one of the boys, but was your boss, but was so like, you know, one of the boys in, like what was you said, like, you gotta go 30 minutes a night and you guys, you gotta go 25. You gotta sit here five minutes earlier. You got something to do in this town, right? Like, you know, you just want to get out of the building and, but yet when you came back, he was invested as invested as anybody else in the, you know, that might be his thought before him. But afterwards, it's like, okay, you want to get out early, but now he'll sit with you for 30 minutes and analyze all the stuff you did and break it down in the wise and the house. And, you know, when we were at TV, when I first got asked to sit in on production meetings and was sort of participating with everybody else after even if it wasn't my stuff at all, you know, the meeting would get done. Pat would come and find me immediately and be like, hey, get something to eat. I'll meet you up in the stands. We'll start talk about the show. I'd get done with Pat after a little while Pat could talk about it for so long that he want to take a break. He wanted to go have a smoke. Pat would leave. I'd walk out of the stands. I'd, the lands would be waiting, hey, come here, let's go sit and we want to talk about that stuff. And like, man, I was just so fortunate to sit in that, in that, that learning tree, you know, and again, Jack's one of those guys that I don't think it's a lot of credit in the business. Yeah. But was a really smart, really nuanced psychology guy work wise. I don't think he got credit for ever. And even from an agent standpoint, just if I was to say who is the agent after Pat lands a for sure lands on. The undisputed WWE Championship title is mine and I don't plan on giving it up. Lucky for you, you can climb the ranks and earn your very own championship titles in WWE Supercard. The new road to immortality features WWE ID evolve NXT, Smackdown and Raw. As you challenge for titles each week, you'll gain in lose fans depending on your performance, allowing you to advance in your WWE superstar career. The titles up for grabs correspond with the real WWE schedule. Like the real show, you need to prove that you are the best to stay on top of the leaderboard. Download Supercard, flash the QR code and claim my WrestleMania 42 card for free. So I know the promo where you the game becomes a thing. Yeah. The game and referring to you as the game and you referring to yourself. Because of what you're sharing with me now, it seems very obvious. Well, that would make sense. He's actually making a suggestion. What would you do here? He's learning this is the way our information in wrestling. This is the way our lessons are taught. You don't always know you're in a learning lesson. And the next year you've, that was interesting. You mentioned Kuala'ske earlier. Yeah. And most of the stuff Kuala'ske taught me, I didn't realize for 10 years later, I'd be repeating something in a different way and be like, that's what he meant. Like that's what he would say that, that's what he meant. He couldn't teach, per se. We could tell you all the things that he was doing. And people forget that Kuala'ske was in the 40s, 50s, 60s. One of the probably the first sort of global guys, you know, Japan, Australia, over in the US, over in Canada, over in Australia, all over in Japan, like over in all these places where he became a name globally. But I didn't realize all those lessons until much later. Sorry, in Reptile. No, I feel like people, if they don't know, because time, you know, time moving so quickly, if they don't know who Kuala'ske is, that's a really good one to look up. Because what's a unique look about? Yeah. And that different phases in his career, completely different. So, and it's hard because if you look at his later career, which is most of the film, you're like, wait, the big, lanky old guy with the bad two play. And the, you know, name like, I'm not seeing it. By the time film becomes a big thing, he's past his prime. He also became a vegetarian at some point in there, and his body completely transformed. But if you see pictures of him from like the 40s, even before he was Kuala'ske, when he was Tarzan Kuala'ske, like, I think Walder was like 6, 7, 6, 8, something like that. Maybe 6, 9, which at the time is like a giant. And Jack'd, like, stories, and he's told me himself, doing pullovers like 3, 15, like, this is, this is, like, just knowing him, like, he's not certainly not a drug guy. He's before that, and certainly wouldn't be anything like that. But look like, if you see those pictures of him from back then, he looked like he could have been like a Mr. America or something like that at that time frame when you look at those physiques. Just ahead of the time and that. And then he increased the speed of the business when a lot of guys were just, I don't want to say it in a negative way. They were working holds, right? So the business was built on in and out of holds, and there was a lot of, you know, working holds in our parlance today. You know, a lot of people would say they were just laying around, you know, selling these holds. He didn't do that at all. He would, his pace was non-stop. He might maybe grab a hold for 10, 15 seconds, and then he was right up to the next thing, bumping, bumping, bumping. When Harley first was talking to me about Walter, he, one of the stories he told me, he was like, dude, you know, he said, sometimes I ate it working with him because he just was non-stop. If we had to go an hour Broadway, he was like, you didn't stop for an hour straight, and I used to think like, God, this guy's got the most incredible gas tank ever. Yeah. Just doesn't slow down, you know. This is a different time in the business. Yeah. I want to, even now it's kind of been bolden to the question. I was asking you about the game and the name and you sang in this, see interview with Jim Ross, right? I wanted to ask because I remember sometimes as if I'm growing up right in the age where, prime example, you and rock are doing the latter match, I'm growing up right in the age where I am following the narrative exactly. how it's supposed to be followed, but I don't realize that. - Right. - I don't realize I'm following the air. So that's the moment I started to go, "Oh, this guy, yes, this is my guy." And the latter match too, I remember, and I had dad to help, 'cause he'd be behind me on the couch. - Coach, you're doing a great way. - Like look at these, but then also people like Sean, he did not understand why I like Sean. He didn't, but he never ruined my fun. - Right. - He always, he watched me watch that Iron Man match, and you could tell I was not happy. And then Gorilla comes out, they're gonna do a sudden death, and I could see he was like, "Thank God." - Yeah. - He was, "This kid can't sit through another WrestleMania." Like, and he used me as a litmus test, but also with other people, when randomly, you know, melmascarus or dick would show up in a royal rumble, he'd be like, "Hey, so this is such a set, so I'd have a leg up." Everyone else, but you mentioned the game, and this promo, I always wanted to ask, did you know, you cut this promo? Did you know that there was a change? Because it feels like that promo happens, at least from my viewing perspective, that it was a different ball game for you. - So I was already trying to find the change. - Right. You know, you go through a sequence of events in your career that open up opportunities for change. I knew where I wanted to be, and I knew where I was, and I knew there were certain changes that needed to happen, but you kind of can't force those without them, without the right things taking place. I knew that promo with JR. I knew it when we did it, and I felt it, and there were changes happening in the business. The line was pretty much off the cuff, pretty much, you know, I've seen people take credit for I wrote that script, and I wrote that and whatever. There was nothing written at that time. It was, JR's gonna ask you these couple of questions, how are you gonna answer them? And if bad best, you jotted down a couple of, maybe like bullet points for yourself to have them in your head. I remember we did a take where I said, "The fucking game." And then they were like, "That's okay, we're actually gonna show it "from the other side, we don't see you mouth." "All right, we'll beep it." I was like, "I wish you had heart." So if they think that's good enough, like there was something there, when I really realized it was the following TV, because if you're in tune to it, and you do something, and this is where the live events too come into play for everybody that we don't have anymore, and it's difficult, you try things, and then you gauge that reaction, and you move with the reaction, and if you're smart, you're sort of following the tide of where things are going. When I came out that next TV, and I just remember stepping on the stage and looking out over the crowd and seeing like, I don't know, like five or six signs with the game on it and thinking like, and we're on to something with that game thing. I gotta jump on that, like now, like I need to say it all the time, and JR and I had a conversation about it, and he started to, you know, JR was, I can't give him enough credit for being the soundtrack of our generation, but. - Soundtrack of our generation, but also he's, people think JR and they think Steve Austin all the time. Jim Ross is hatred for you as the is legendary. - Yeah, some of the commentary is just, it's a man shouting into the microphone. - You had just held up a bit. - Yeah, how I'm set he is with you. And then it takes this turn to where, when he's talking about you in a positive way, he's talking about, but he's still from the place where he was. He's, I know what he would do for that championship. His way of connecting you with the WWE Championship, and the world championship is how important it is, and again, tag team wrestling rules, if we don't, you know, if we care, they care, and just, I wanted to ask, 'cause now we're talking about the game, I think that's very important, and I looked for it. For me, when I came back, I wanted to find Michael Cole right away, and basically say, what can I do? And I want, you know, you have a Jim Ross, okay? And Austin has a Jim Ross, and Dusty had a Gordon Soley, you know, like, how can I do that with you? Is it, have I earned that even? And if I have, what do I need? And I remember thanking him after WrestleMania 40, and just, that was, they're so important, the soundtrack. Yes. The announcer to the story. I think about Ali and Cosell. Yes. Back in that day, right? Like, part of his, part of Ali being able to show his charisma, part of it was because Cosell was setting him up to know the show it. And giving him that platform, so they're so important to each other. Yeah, people mentioned, you know, J.R.'s connection to Steve all the time, because Steve could put J.R. over, J.R. who put Steve over. There was like almost like this television friendship there. For me, it was the exact opposite. He was almost like, J.R. was almost like my nemesis on commentary. And it really, really, really got me over as being a heel. And even just, he was so amazing with, you know, cerebral assassin. Yeah. Just made me seem different than everybody else. Yeah. Because I had to approach things as smarter. At first, I'm not going to be taken as tough as Steve, right? Or as savvy as rock. So I have to have what is my different thing? My different things. I'm smarter about. We're conniving. I'm all those things, right? I'm getting in there on the backside. The cerebral assassin thing was magic. So all that stuff, yeah, you know, along the way, there's so many aspects to what we do that help get you in a position and keep you in a position. That it's hard. You know, when you start talking about the people that influence your career, or part of it, or things like that, it's hard to go like, well, this person to help make me or that person because everybody does it. Every little moment along the way does, this business is you're so reliant on the other people. Yeah. You really are. And your wife, she's going in the hall of fame. You bring up your so reliant on other people. I learned a lesson from her just last night. I learned several. But the one I learned that I thought, well, well, she walked into a room with, I thought we'd already said hi to all these folks. Yeah. And I say hi to everybody. I'm still a wrestler, hey, and shake. She said hi to everyone in the room and made that moment to hear the only one here. And I, that's real. Yeah. And I thought, woo. That's a funny thing is I don't even think she knows she does it. It's just who she is. But everyone in that room felt we're part of this now. Yes. Everyone in there. We are part of this segment that they're doing. Even if we're just sitting here quiet and listening to the process and all that, I just, I thought that was, I thought that was really unique. Again, a lesson. Do you know, because we're talking about announcers, when I was a kid, I'd go to the WCW shows, you know how they set at the stand. They were away from the ring. Yeah. I used to, my first little job, one of the first little jobs I had in wrestling was I used to be a runner. And they had a whiteboard. And they'd write what they wanted. And this is the perfect time for me to plug Wheatley American Body Kit, which I have in my American Mule, as always. But Bobby Heenan only ever asked me for one thing. He just orange juice. And it was always the funniest thing ever. I'd go like to catering and like get everyone out of my way. I'd get the orange juice and bring it back. And he'd whatever, have his moment, you know. But I always, that was my first little, was gig as I'd sit up there and help out. I wanted to be part of it. And I don't think my dad wanted to bring me around backstage unless I was going to be functionally active. But it was such, also such a different business than like, you know that he introduced me to you at Saturday night. He, I know that your crossovers, real, he introduced me to you. And it's, it's, we're in the warehouse where it's serendipity everywhere. It's all meant to be where there's some sort of cosmic fate in the wrestling space. And literally whether he was, you were brand new to him or whether he sincerely meant it. I remember him saying, he introduced me to you and he said he's going to be a really big deal. Well, and I, and I was scared because I, I, he didn't smart me up. Yeah. So I'd shake hands because he told me to shake hands. And then just kind of, okay, you know, like go away because I'd like to be 20 feet away watching everything in a distance. And remember this whole moment happens and it just, it's funny that that moment happens and here we are sitting here. You know, we're going into WrestleMania. Do you consider WrestleMania 40 your, your first full WrestleMania as the Chief Content Officer as the, I think so though, though, you know, there was, and again, this is where I'm terrible with times. But the, it's not like one day here at yours and. Everything else went away right sure so many aspects to that of You know, hey Vince is stepping away You're gonna take this spot, but he's Triming in and where he's still meeting with me all the time and he's still you know directing traffic from the side Yeah, and there's no real It's a weird No real clear moment for me, but I would consider it that yes Would you have preferred there been a real clear moment or did you like the very I mean I'm part of being there Yeah, it's a trans transition No, the only thing that Is difficult in that transition You're you're trying to At the end of the day when people are like yeah, but it's your decision, right? Yeah Yeah, shorter You know what I mean like you're your Yes, and you have to defend your position and you have to be able to sell that to people and explain it to people If it's a little bit not your position or a little bit well, why did this happen and you don't want to say well because You know It's not wasn't totally my decision or and not because you don't want to seem like you don't have that power but like you're You have to position it that way. It's it's just such a complex. There's so many Aspects to what we do even just on a regular general daily basis where you you know You're putting something out there and in in some manner You're like if in an ideal world I would do this We don't live in an ideal world right live in a realistic world where I can't do that because of this and I can't do that because of this and I can't We'll do this here because you know it can be something as simple as these two people don't get along Or this I then I know this person has an injury that I can't Man, I can't put all that there. Well whatever whatever the the moment the sequence the scenario is the There's so many factors to all of it that are just you know I wish it was as simple as what people Think when they just go like why don't they just do this? I wish it was that simple. Yeah, I really do you know I don't know if you know and I've probably shared it with you before but one of the bigger bigger honors of my career Sometimes you're something really special happens you at TV and it's simple. It's this thing somebody said or Some and yeah, that was that meant so much yesterday. I'm in the garden and I've been in the garden where they're patting you down at the door and asking for your credential and it's okay It's in then yesterday I pull in the private entrance and the guys holding the elevator says elevators open for you champ Yeah Yeah, I could have done anything. Yeah I could have I I felt like I floated into the elevator. I was it blew my mind But something that Nick Khan said to me that when you You know fully started out in terms of where we're WrestleMania 40 was what we'll say here He said that you and myself and him all entered this really at the same moment. Yeah, and I felt I I really thought damn That's a big responsibility. Yeah, and and and You're lucky to you know, I'm so lucky to have been in it But I thought that's such a big responsibility and it made me I want to hold on to it, you know and I want to ask you this because You're now in the position of the chief content officer leadership the creative you're directing this this movie As my dad would say we're making movies here and you're directing all these movies It's multiple movies and TV series and TV series about TV series all these things And a TV series about making the TV series. I love making the TV series. I just told them. Yeah, so yesterday I was I told Stephanie I said well the challenge with Unreal is to show them everything but not and she just went like oh What that's so hard. I'm like yeah, it's it's it's it's we're it's a challenge show them everything but not and then show them What you want to show them. Yeah, you know what I mean? It's no different than I feel like When talent do interviews or they do podcasts, right? Yeah, I see all the time like Five different versions of the same story all by whose point of view told that story and and what Most people on the outside of our business don't get Include like especially the the the and I'll use this term with the dirt sheet guys whatever it's like wrestlers most of yeah, not this generation this or the ones before that Their entire life was built on just tell people what you want to tell them and eventually it becomes a reality of At the situation. So yeah, like Mayway's telling you what they want to hear yeah, and and when the time is right They'll say anything if it's gonna get them the extra moment if it's gonna get them an extra nod of it's gonna make them seem more important We'll say anything so yet the versions of the stories change Over the years that you get 10 different versions because there were 10 people there. Yeah, and their point of view on it is all different It's it's so it's such a unique You You mentioned this generation. I want to ask you because I know it Working working with you is is different than working with any other boss management booker that I've worked with But do you have a pet peeve about This the the talent is there a pet peeve you have I don't I don't Is there something that just that that gets on for example is there something I do no? You know the outdressing everybody thing no no It's it's not a pet peeve. It's the the Sometimes there's frustration of Being able to have the perspective of looking back over a long career and so many people's careers and so many different talent Yeah, all different levels of success And then wanting to say to a talent like dude, this is meaningless and you are arguing And wearing yourself out mentally and wearing yourself out emotionally over this point that is meaningless Like literally by next Monday show no one is going to think about this again. Yeah, and it's so many people They get so caught up in the minutia of the little tiny things that Don't really make the difference And there are big things sometimes that go by the waist but it's like these little tiny moments and guys will like You know They used to be saying here's like pick the hill you want to die on this isn't it like pick the hill If you're gonna die in that hill it's gotta be worth it and there's so many things sometimes we're guys And it's not for me necessarily I see them There are moments in time when agents or other talent come up to me and they're like I swear to God if this person says it's one more time today I'm gonna lose my mind. Yeah, right Because they're just so obsessed with yes one little nugget of something that Everybody else around them is like who cares, right? Yeah That's that's the biggest thing for me. It's like I I don't want guys because I see it in so many people They're gonna get to the end of what is a magnificent career in So many levels creatively successfully your It's like the guy that played in the end. He makes it to the NBA He plays in the NBA. He's a top player in the NBA But as name doesn't get mentioned next to Michael Jordan's and it just eats him alive. Yeah, it's like Do that success that you have Like the misery that people create for themselves based around certain places like What they don't get to or or they're right there, but yet they have this unbelievable run I think you might even been there at the time I heard R&1 time talking you know These guys were putting them over and there was this conversation about Mid-card guys and he's never gonna be champ and all this stuff and R&1 off on this huge promo about like I don't understand all of you like Said you guys all see me as a big deal, right? Never was like yeah, you're fucking our N Anderson Yeah, I'm a great small time, but but like he said I got a Hall of Fame worthy career. I've got all this stuff right he said Mid-carter nothing more Ever I never made event that a thing unless I was in the ring with flair I never made a event of a thing if I was tagging with flair I was in the main event if I wasn't Nothing I was a mid-carter. I was a guy there to get guys over on the way to getting up to the dust. He's and the flares and the people like that. I was a mid-card guy. You guys see me as this unbelievable legend that you all listen to and all this stuff. And when it comes to your own careers and many of you have already surpassed the position I was ever in, you're miserable about it because you think that you haven't reached the success of other things. But yet, I see myself as having this amazing career, fed my family. I got to do things I would have never done. And all this stuff like incredibly successful. Like, man, what a journey I've had. But if I used your metrics to measure it, mid-card. I'm nothing. I never amounted anything. They wasted my talents. They wasted my ability. They never gave me anything. They never did anything with me. You create your own bitterness. And that is the thing that is a pet peeve to me. Not because it bothers me, because it bothers me for them. There's so many talent that I go like, dude, you have so much going on. You're so in a position that there's a small handful of people on the planet are in that spot. And millions behind you that would cut off a limb to have that. And you're miserable every day because you're not considered the next guy. Now, that's not me saying you shouldn't be ambitious to want to get to the next level. That's not me saying. But I don't believe the misery of I didn't get that makes you miserable for this. It's be thrilled and excited about the stuff that you have and the proud of the accomplishments and proud of the things you've done and all that stuff. Yeah, always strive for more. I'll never tell a talent you're never going to get past the point you're at. Because I don't know. And things can flip on a dime. And you can be in that spot because the right things happen at the right time and you can be in that spot. But even then, that doesn't change the other things. And I get that feeling of wanting to walk in the door and have the elevator for you, champ. I get that. But the-- I'm just telling you at the end of it, it's the journey along the way. It's more meaningful than the moment that you sort of get there and land on it. And that journey and the people and the moments and the time and you don't realize it until it's done. No one tells you it's the fucking good old days until later when you look back at it and command else the good old days. If somebody would tell you that then, you wouldn't think it. We didn't know that, too, there. We kind of felt like some special was going on. But at the same point in time, you just-- Thursday and I got to be in Toledo or whatever. It didn't do the thing. And you were thrilled to get it. And you were working your ass off. But I don't know. I just-- I wish people could have that perspective. Because I think it lands you to bitterness and angry over things that don't manage to just be thrilled at what you accomplish in the career that you had. When I was preparing to come back to WWE at WrestleMania 38, I had some doubts and some nerves. But choosing to bet on myself was clearly one of the best decisions I have ever made. If you're starting a business, you might feel the same. So much work goes into this thing that you are not entirely sure will work out. That's why it's helpful to have a partner like Shopify by your side. Shopify is the commerce platform behind millions of businesses all around the world, and 10% of all e-commerce in the United States from household names to brands just getting started. You can get started with your own design studio with hundreds of ready-to-use templates. Shopify helps you build a beautiful online store that matches your brand's style. Shopify is your commerce experts with world-class expertise in everything from managing inventory to international shipping to processing returns and beyond. It's time to turn those what-ifs into-- [CLICK] With Shopify today, sign up for your $1 per month trial today at Shopify.com/cody. That's Shopify.com/cody. You mentioned something. The producers-- talking about the producers. Yeah. I've just wanted to shout them out because I've noticed and watched you work very differently with our producers than in the past and how the producers were. And we got a great crew of producers. And for people who don't know the producers or help agents help us tell the story. Help us put this match together. And not only that, but help put the story in the match together. But then when you're in the ring doing it, help make sure that your vision is caught on camera and relayed to the world, right? Because you can have the greatest vision in the world. But if we don't show it, we don't capture it, right? Then it doesn't happen. So they're sort of the link between it happening live and what people see. And the link to you, in a sense of, here's what the vision that Triple H has for this is the vision that Creative has for this. We need to accomplish this. Well, let's collab with yours. Let's see where we get. How do we manifest it in a way that all those words sounded great. But now people see it and know what we're talking about. But Bobby Rude works really closely with you. And I've really enjoyed working with Bobby Rude. Is there something you see in Bobby that there's more to-- Or is it just a sponge? Is he someone-- the game, like, in a sense of learning and going? He's a sponge. It's a funny one. I very first-- I didn't know Bobby at all. And he came at Dan XT when we were there. And a couple of things I realized very quickly about him was one, he had an innate ability for this, two, I don't think he'd been taught a whole lot. From not from the wrestling standpoint, he knew that the television standpoint and the psychology standpoint, right? I think because TNA was sort of, hey, just go do it. And then that's what comes out. It was nobody did TV like here. Right? So guys would come in. AJ Stiles said this to me after he'd been with us for like six months, and he made a comment to me. Pulled me aside. He was like, hey, mind if I give you something I notice. He said, don't ever let anybody come here that didn't go through NXT first. That's why he said that. He said, because, man, if you'd told me that when I was coming here, I would have been like, yeah, do you mind and know what I'm doing. And then I got here, and I spent the first six months lying to myself and to everybody else. And you can-- well, I know what's going on. I was just trying to hang on to the tiger by the tail. I said, I didn't get it. I couldn't see it. You guys were saying and doing stuff that I was like, what are they talking about? And then later I'd really say, oh man, that's great. I never even heard that before. And he said, you guys shoot a movie, right? Everybody else is just following wrestling. Whatever's happened, they're following it on camera. Bobby was a guy that same thing. He had learned it just he was just new what he was doing. And they were following it, doing it all the time. But when he came in, man, he was like a sponge. And I would see him picking everybody's brain and just for his own stuff. When his career started to wind up, at that time, I remember thinking to myself, when he wants to be done, taking bumps, he's a good guy for this. I always start out with-- he's a grown up. That's a huge part of it. Yeah, grown up. He's not-- Lived. He's not a kid. Just looking to get another paycheck, right? He understands the difference between business and being one of the boys and all that stuff. Growing up, but gets it and just has a great demeanor for it and is a sponge for it. And then the more I got to work with him, once he got-- unfortunately, at an end of the year, that wasn't subsiding. He and I spoke about it. I said, want you come in and start learning to be an agent. And if the medical stuff clears up, you're great. It'll help your career. If it doesn't, we'll start using it. But he jumped on it. And just very quickly, I started moving him up the line and then having a conversation with Michael about mentor him, like Michael Hayes. Had a birthday yesterday. Favorite? Had a birthday, yes. Which had a birthday on Sunday. He told me about many times because he was very pissed off at the fact that he-- with all the TSA issues-- that he was going to-- he can't stand in line that long and he's not sitting in a wheelchair. I'm like, my-- I can't change the TSA, right? So he goes to the airport three hours early and then sends me a note pissed off that there was no line. And now he got through immediately and now he's stuck at the airport with three hours with nothing to do. Happy fucking birthday. The plot thickens on his birthday. I texted him while he was at the airport, hey, I got a jet. Don't feel like doing TSA. And he kind of-- This is when you tell me. Like-- [LAUGHS] I-- Hey, for that reason, if you'd have told the minute, it would have been phenomenal. Even if you didn't have a jet and you just call them-- No, yeah. --I got a jet at that point would have been the best. So I got to tell him, I'm going to tell him-- I'm going to give him a lot more lead, like advanced numbers on those things. You know, you're-- - So to go back to Michael, because if Pat was the be all end all, Finnish guy, psychology wise, in ring guy of that generation. Michael is this generation's Pat. And as Pat was winding down, Michael was very quickly becoming. So even at the end of my career, takeer's career, chance career, Michael was the guy and still is the guy. Put all his Michael Azisms aside. And I often think if he hadn't done all the stuff he'd done to him throughout the 70s and 80s, man he'd be a certified genius. 'Cause clearly he's killed a lot of brain cells and he's still at that level. But yeah, I can't say enough about how good Michael is at that. And now Bobby is sort of, to me, picking up that, he's sort of running side by side with Michael right there and learning from him at an incredible rate. Much like Michael did from Pat, right? Like that's the fun aspect of our business. - Michael's one of the guys that I try really hard to impress. And I don't think I've got there yet. And now at this juncture, 'cause he's been part of some major moments. - Yeah. - At this point, I kinda have to always, "Hey Michael, what's wrong here?" Like what? - Yeah. - Well, 'cause he is one of the certified super geniuses that you have that's around you. You have Mr. Heyman and you have Michael Hayes and you have Bruce and you have these people have done it at the level and actually seen that play before and how it works and can feel the crowd psychology. And what if we did this also great what if guys? Which is like the road of what if is sometimes very, hmm, what if we did that? But Michael's one that I actually look forward to his, enthusiastic outlook on what I did because he's, I know he's honest. - Yeah, well that's the thing with him too. You're gonna get the, that was awesome or you're gonna get the, I would have done this different. Everybody else can be coming back. And I think you have to have that in some degree. - Yeah, nobody wants to come back in just this or the, you know, I think, get, well what's, 'cause we're in the stage where I feel like when records started being broken and again, we're gonna have to do this for as many 40 or as many 41. These are stadium record gates, massive, the revenue report TKO just put out. These numbers are wild. I think explaining that to my mother, it sounds like I'm just lying. It's so, the numbers are so wonderful. But with that in mind and with the thing, the first thing I think is okay, okay great, what do we do? So what do we do next? - Yeah, we come up against your own records. - Yeah. - And you're like, oh man, how do you surpass that? How do you top that? How do you get it to that next level? And it's difficult. - And the other aspect of that too is is what people don't, so talent come back in there immediately, like, you know, looking for that thing. And sometimes you don't wanna kick 'em. - Yeah. - In that mug, talent come back to the girls, pretty good, they was pretty good. Here's how we could have made it better. - Sure. - You don't wanna say that in the moment where the guy just hit the home run and you're like, could it have further? - Yeah. - You know what I mean? Where it just like, take all the wind out of somebody's sales. And I think about our business a lot about like, it's, and you'll see this as your kids get older. Like your kid can be playing basketball and stinkin' the joint out, right? And no confidence, head down, just kinda like run 'em through the motions, playing basketball or whatever. And then all of a sudden they throw a shot up and it goes in. Everything about them changes. Standin' tall, all of a sudden they're Michael Jordan. They're running down the court. Like their confidence levels up, now they steal the ball. Now they're like, right? Like confidence is such a motivating factor for people, mentally confidence in that, capitalizing on that success and knowing that you're good, knowing all these things. And when you start to have a decline, it's why in baseball it's hard to get out of a hitting slump. It's also hard to derail a guy that's on fire, right? There's these mental moments. So you don't wanna take that out of talent. You don't wanna put 'em over. You wanna make sure that they know when things are good. You always wanna make them know when things are bad, but maybe sometimes not in the exact moment that you're like, you know, it's calm over. Like, you just went out there and did really well and they come over and like, God damn, what the fuck are you doing? You know, like, it's tough. It's a tough thing. So it's having that, having that sort of middle of the road approach and going back to guys later or, you know, even for me sometimes, like if I say it, just because of the spot, it's a different weight than if so sometimes I'll be like, tell 'em later when everything is calm. Talk to 'em about this, right? So then they can go back to 'em, maybe tell 'em, come back to me a day later to talk to me about or something, but like it's an easier way to do it than like, yeah, if I thought that was good and he hated it. I didn't hate it. I just wanted to change, but it's taken differently, you know? I have a joke with the writers, which is more sports confusion for me 'cause I say quarterback, but then my joke is baseball related. It's always, they're always like, yeah, that was a home run or I always tell 'em, like, yeah, it's a double. It's a triple. We're not gonna hit the home run. I don't like the conversations that are so quick, where it's like, it was great, it was done in its over. No, especially with the lack of live events in a sense of, this is my moment. I got, I want to teach me something and we can learn stuff in the ring, you can learn stuff that I need that all day long. It's a funny thing. Sometimes town are coming back looking, I used to say it yesterday, "Do we really need somebody to tell me that was good?" I did, right? Did I need that? Or I fucking was out there, I knew. Yeah. I knew, I was doing, I know when it stinks, I know when it's pretty good, I know when it's really good, I know when it was phenomenal. I might be asking about things I couldn't see, right? Like, hey, how did that come across? Because I can't see the camera cuts, I can't see the moments, right? But sort of, you know what I mean. For that moment, I wanted to make it, 'cause there was a lot of, are you sure? Are you? Yeah, because it felt 100% real and we heard 'em. And we're still, and I didn't want my dancing partner to, there's a lot of critics and again, I love hypercritical, great. But it was funny, I was basically saying something you say to me, are actually Sean said to me much differently when I came back from something and asked, was it great? And he went into me a little bit and he had a bullshitter, you know, we, you were out there, you already know. You know, 'cause it went awesome. Thankfully, I was talking, I was like, I got it. There enough, I won't ask, you know, setting again. He was, he was 100% right. He just, sometimes talent, they just, they want you to tell them. That was great. Yeah, right like, I know, I know it was great. Everybody else said it was great. I want to hear it from you. Yeah. Tell me that was great. It's important. Yeah. So, you know, when, when, when stuff's a home run and look, there's times when, for me, sometimes you guys do something, I'm like stuck in the next thing, trying to make sure that doesn't fall apart 'cause anytime I walk away, there's something else going on. There's something trying to do that. And then I realized like, hey, where'd they go? Oh, they left. They're gone. All right, now if I go chasing, it's, that's, that's, I, now I'm out of pocket for longer. Or if I ask them to come back, now they're like, yes, let's come back. Well, that's been bad. Like, you know, so it, right? It's sometimes a tough scenario, but when stuff is really good, I try to get up and come over there. Either really good or really bad. If I come up and come over to you, I'm like, feel like that's my, that's my tell. Otherwise, I'm like in a pretty good place with everything, you know. Spring is a season of change, but it doesn't have to throw off your foundation. 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The daily immune supports help me stay at my best two, powered by antioxidants, probiotics, and functional mushrooms. Go to drinkag1.com/coded to get an AG1 flavor sampler. We'll also throw in a bottle of vitamin D3 plus K2 for free in your AG1 welcome kit with your first AG1 subscription order. That's a $72 value yours free only while supplies last. Go to drink a G1 dot com slash Cody. You, um, we talked about Bobby and being close to you and the sponge and learning looking at the field now. It's a whole new ballgame for WWE in terms of you and the chief content role leading and directing the ship. Do you see anyone in our current, you know, and all across the board producers. I mean that HQ people don't realize the amount of talent. Adam Penucci's just sitting in a room genius talent. You know, there's there's such talented people just on every floor around there. Do you see anyone that you think will help kind of lead the company? Cause I've heard Bruce say it before when when Bruce is not there when, uh, Heyman is no longer around where Michael goes and we talked about Bobby. Do you see others in our current space? I do. Yeah. I do. Um, there's a certain passion for the business that begins to I think you begin to see it shift and the, and the way that people look at it differently. Yeah. Where it's, it's not just about me and what I do next. It's about the product. Yeah. And what the product does next and the questions that are asked and, and the things that are asked. Um, you know, I, I saw that with Bobby. Yeah. Right? It was a different level of that. I see that in the now and it's an interesting things like AJ styles just retired. Yeah. So towards the end, AJ was like, I don't know, I don't just want to be done with the business. I want to be done wrestling. Yeah. Like, and I don't think I'm maturing a confidence here. But even in his last match, he was telling me like, I so know I'm done because like I was out there in that last match, thinking like, well, let's just get over with. I just want to get to the end. Oh, wow. Yeah. But he wants to participate in the business, right? But being an agent or a producer is a different world. Being, um, being in what we do, there's different fits for different people. Yeah. AJ came in and he sat in on some creative meetings. He sat in on some, you know, production meetings. And I think he realized like the writing things for me, the producer thing, I don't think is for me. What I really like is getting to these young kids and spotting talent and then trying to help, you know, fan the flames of the little spark that's there and try to make them into something more, the developmental side. Yeah. So great. Let's utilize him in that and grab those talents there. There are some guys that just sort of get done the business and just want to be done with it. They don't want to be on the road. They don't want to be the hassle. They don't want to all the other stuff. But I do see a lot of, you know, and it's your show and I'm not trying to both smoke up your ass. But like, you know, we're good with that. Go ahead, blow away. Um, not like you. You're one of those guys that I believe as you come to the end of your career, it behooves you to start to pay attention to the other things. I remember very early when Vince, I don't, and again, I've never asked him, but I don't know why. I guess he just, just if he creatively saw like he's got a little something there and like, let's cultivate that. Okay, come to the production meetings and we'll start talking about other things. And then I know, I know that he told Pat Mentor him, help him teach him, same with Lanza. Um, once that started for me, I very quickly realized like, holy shit, I know nothing about this business. I know this tip of the iceberg of what I do as a performer. But it's like saying, um, I'm a very good actor, but how many actors become great directors or do other things in in Hollywood or, right? How many great players make great coaches in sports? Like Nick talks me about that all time. I'm not the biggest sports guy, but Nick talks me about it all time. A great player struggled to become great coaches because they can't understand why people just can't do it. The way they did it. They just don't get it. Let's just do this. You know, like, it's just not that simple for everybody, right? You have to be able to get that greatness out of them in a different way. Once you realize that and then you begin to become fascinated with that, if, if guys will cultivate that and want to know and the other stuff and you've asked me about it numerous times, which is why I say like, I know you're going to be good at it because you've asked me that numerous times about how can I do this? How can I do that? I also know the difficulties of being in the position you're in as a talent and then trying to do the other things which is really difficult to do and not have it change everybody's perception of you. But there was a moment even for takeer with me where when, you know, now he's in Mexico working on AAA and doing extremely well with it. But there's a moment where he was talking to me about it and saying like, man, I used to think seeing you do all that stuff in a way, man, I spent all that time and he doesn't have to do it and he's like in there and it's hours and time and frustration and all this stuff. And it's really the end of the day mostly making most everybody ate him or, you know, it's had a different opinion of him. It's really like a detriment to him in some manner, but he's just still doing it. Now I look at him and go, I wish I had done that because you have this skill set now to where you're still so ingrained. And I say it a bunch like this end of my career is almost more gratifying to me than the other end of my career. Learning that stuff, this stuff, this all seems like it goes on forever. Yeah. And it doesn't. And that's the good old days thing, right? And then no, it tells you it's the good old days until after they were over and then you're like, "Fuck, that shit was great. I wish I had paid more attention to it than." But so much, like while you're doing it, you've got to be preparing for the other side because very quickly there's this moment where you're like, "Man, the top of it passed me by. Now I'm on the down swing and I'm a legend or whatever that is, but I'm here, but I'm not grinding to go the next level." You're laying in the plane. Yeah, laying in the plane. And then what happens when the plane lands, you want us try to explore some of that skill set. It doesn't mean you have to activate it. It just means you have to explore that so you know what it is so that when the time comes and for those guys like I try to put things in their head of like how they could do other things on the other side as the business moves on. But there are a lot of guys that are so passionate about this and it's in a different way. You pump, Seth, right? That I see this when that day comes when you're like, "I don't want to take another bump and I don't want to be in that spot anymore." Great. You know how to help other folks get there and do it and not everybody's going to be amazing at it, but there's a spot in this big, big wheel that keeps on going and you want to be a part of that wheel because I think the worst thing in the world can be, not for everybody, but can be. Or it would be for me if one day you just said, "Right, you're done." And then you just go home and you're like, "Yeah." Like, "Now what do I do?" Right. I don't know. What other skill set do you have? Right. And so it's there. It's just cultivating it in guys and having them, you can't make somebody do it though they have to want to step up and take it to the next place. It's wild to think about, "Oh, you're done." Because my acting coach, I remember him saying he was describing the craft in terms of acting and whatnot. But a lot of people were there for the, of course, want to be famous, want to get a big movie, that's all makes sense. But what he was saying is, you'll do much better if this is your life's work. You'll do much better if this is the whole thing, the whole enchilada, the entire thing, that commercial is taken just as seriously as the big get that you're trying to get. This is your life's work. You've learned from every step along the way. And just I couldn't imagine. I go home for two days and you've received some of my texts. They put you through. You know what drove me nuts when I first came up here trying to find your way, right? Like you find the people that you want to hang out with. How, you know, some people think like how I landed with the click, right? Because I'd rode with all these other people. And what I found out really quickly is most of them want to get in the car after the show's over and never talk about wrestling. Don't mention wrestling, don't talk about the show, don't talk about anything about it. They just want to drive to the next town, train whatever do whatever they're going to do. And there's no conversation of it. And I hated it. So I wanted to talk about it. So I wanted to think about it. So I wanted to, I'd watch every single, you know, when their match was over, they'd be like, hey, let's get out of here. Like the whole long, there's three more matches. I want to watch old show. I was going to the shows that I wasn't booked on because I just wanted to see what was going on and take all of it in. It drove me nuts when people didn't want to engage in it. When I got, the first trip I took with Kev, Scott, kid, take the hospital excursions out of the equation and all that stuff. But all we did was talk about wrestling. And Scott would be the first guy to talk about it, but he would say, "Can we just not talk about wrestling tonight for one night? Can we just not talk about it?" Great. But before that, did anybody notice in the third match? That's all we talked about the whole way, right? I immediately, in the car with those guys, like I said, take all that other side, stuff and put it aside. It was just this moment where I was like, "Dude, that's what I want to do." I want to sit in the car and just dissect this stuff right wrong and different, like that's, I want to be immersed in it. I almost stole something from your fellow click member, Kevin Nash the other day just because I always heard every now and then he'd come back and say, "Follow that," or just that was. That was a big. You know that. You have to do that. Like on a not great set. Yeah, yeah. Yeah, yeah. So confident about it. So terrible that you came back like, "Follow that." Yeah. Yeah. Good luck with that. Yeah. That was. You know, talking about good old days and all that stuff. Everybody had a perspective. Sean had the workers perspective. Kid had like this indie worker perspective. Yeah. Kev was like. Kev thought of everything in like movie scenes. Scott was like the basics. Scott would hit you with this like, "Let me get this straight." And then he would say something so profound, simple, but like profound that you were like, "Wow." Yeah. That makes no sense or like holy shit. Like the levels of people's in that car was just. Again, talk about learning tree, right? Vince, Pat, Landza, all those guys in that car. Then, you know, my friendship with Regal and just all these different things just all makes it. Yeah. What it is. I love a regal post segment. Just because he'll talk to you for quite some time. But yeah, every. I always tell you, a man, he said something though that I can never do that now. I know I won't do that again because it was so simple. Yeah. But needed it. In WWE, every road leads to one place, WrestleMania. And every journey starts on the road to gold. Now that journey comes to life with WrestleMania, road to gold, only at Fanatics Casino. The game features 20 WWE superstars from Bianca Belair and Rhea Ripley to Seth Rollins, John Cena and me. Get your money in the bank or win the Royal Rumble and elimination chamber with bonuses every step of the way. Every reward brings you closer to the biggest stage there is. This is WrestleMania, road to gold, and it only lives at Fanatics Casino. Must be 21 and over. Gambling problem called 1-800-Gambleer, not available in all states, C-Fanatics Casino app. I know we have had you for extremely long. Are you okay hanging out for a few more minutes? You sure? Okay. Awesome. What do you want to talk about? Myself, Wheatley, American vodka, we like to consider ourselves as the American Dream Team and I ask everyone who comes on the show who makes up your Dream Team. And often I have to throw a qualifier in there because at the first it was all over the place. Animal sports teams. You can really do anything with this. But also if it becomes difficult to lock down, then sometimes I just say, hey, you're Wargames team, you're Survivor. What is your Dream Team? Who's going into this battle with you? What is the battle just life? Well, I'd say because you brought it up multiple times in a way that I think everyone in here really thought the good old days. In our case, we're going into WrestleMania 42 and these are good days. This is an unbelievable time. So in this moment who's coming with, who is there with you leading this event, leading or event? Well, I mean, forgot that's a long list. People, and it's funny because as you even say it throughout this entire interview, well, you lead this, you lead that. It's such a big team. And I don't even like that term, sometimes with the leader. It's the responsibility at the end of the day you have to make the final call when it's a, you're the tiebreaker, whatever that is. You have to set that final guidance, but it's such a team. And there's so much nuance to making the team. Even to the point of, you want to encourage people to throw ideas out all the time. So you don't want to ever never not take, you know, like if they're throwing out 10 ideas, you want to take at least a couple of them. Because otherwise you're going to just stop throwing stuff out there, right? That's an important lesson that I learned along the way too. There's a moment when I look back, there was this moment where a bunch of us who were in a room and Vince was there, famous meaning Indianapolis. And Vince took out a roster and was like, who leads who stays? And I have this point in time when I was kind of new-ish, right? Like I didn't feel qualified to even be making that thing. But I remember there were some people on there that their names came up. I remember one in particular in his Bam Bam big alone, right? And Bam Bam hated the click. I think I don't know that anybody had an issue with him per se, but he's just for whatever reason. Sure. And his name came up and we had all written down our stuff on paper and given him events and he's like, you guys all unanimously won him here. We're like, he's fucking really good. Yeah, but he hates you guys. So what? Like he's good. One of them on my team. Yeah, yes. Yeah, I want him on the team. Yeah. Like it's not about he don't like us or it's not about it's like he's fucking good. So he should be here. There's some other guys on there that we like a lot. I like him as a person. Yeah, that's a hard one. Yeah, but yeah, I like him as a person, but come or go, doesn't matter. You know, those are tough decisions to make. So when you say, who do I want to my T-Goth at list as long as a long list of people first and foremost Nick? You know, like smartest business guy I've ever been around. Yeah, just just yeah, like I couldn't I couldn't imagine the last few years of trying to do this without doing it with him. Yeah. Even when you when you're unsure when you're not positive like that that reassuring guidance that hey, you want to relook at that like where you're like, oh, you relook at it and you're like, oh, yeah, that's good. Right, right, right. There's just he's just so good and he's such a great businessman, but also such a fan of what we do. And he has the the ability to look at it from an outsider's perspective. Right. So, but man, there's so much talent in this, whether it's producers, agents, people at the office, people that I just I wouldn't even want to make a list because the list would be so long. Of people that I would want here. And to be honest, it really comes down to desire to do this. This is so busy. You know how hard it is. Yeah. You have to want it. You can't be here fill in space. Yeah. You can't just be phoning it in. You got to be all in. And those are the people you want the fox hole with you. Yeah. You want a blind rank? You good with a blind ranking? Yeah. This is my first, we've never done a blind. All right. This is a hell of a moment. All right. Choose the controversial. I think we try to keep everything not controversial. This, but then the one thing, like I did say that. Okay. We're going to blind rank. You have some of the most iconic WrestleMania entrances of all. We're going to blind rank these. We have 10. What? This is a random order blind rank. Where do you think WrestleMania 30, you versus Daniel Bryan on the ranking? That's you the throne Charlotte and Alexa are part of that. There it is right there. Yeah. Where's that one at? It was like one or two. Yeah. It's because of the imagery of it was so cool. The timing of it, like this authoritarian figure against the sort of the guy bucking the system. Yeah. Be plus player plus the Charlotte, Sasha, Alexa, like when this idea came up to do this entrance, I was like, oh, can they, you know, can I use them to do this entrance? Because yeah. But I wanted to miss that on that stage. I remember saying it to him right before we walked out there. When you walk out there, like this, maybe the last time you ever get to walk out there without the responsibility of you're about to go have to do what we do. But know this is coming your way and just man take that all in and feel it. Yeah. I love that. Okay. So that's one or two. I'll put that at two. That's it to WrestleMania 25. that's a U versus Randy Orton. I remember you throwing the sledgehammer through the mirror. Yeah, there it is. Put that down around eight or so because I almost slipped and killed myself when I threw the hammer. It was all wet on the floor. And I was sure that I looked like, you know, like one of those cartoon scenes where I was like, and caught myself and didn't fall. Like, thank God I didn't fall. But like, I bet you that looked ridiculous. Okay. So we've got that at eight. Just made it 33 U versus Seth Rollins. That is the bike ride with the police escort. And then of course, that up there at three. That's a three. Yeah. Yeah. Step with me. The police escort was, yeah, it was just cool. Cool visual. Yeah. And then you did the thing where you basically just put it in neutral. Like, you're not actually, or were you driving it? On the way down? Yeah. No, I was driving it all the way down. There's motor vehicles. And yeah, no, it's tricky. Those those boss host, yeah, try to also don't have gears like a motorcycle. Okay. They have like two speeds. It's an automatic. Nice. So you sort of got to put it in gear. Okay. But you got to be careful with it because it's like crazy. So that's that's our number three. Yeah. Okay. Oh, WrestleMania 12. The ultimate warrior. And this is your first WrestleMania. I'll put that like a seven. Seven? Yeah. It's not the coolest of entrance entrances of all time. But it's my first WrestleMania. And I'm about to walk out there with the ultimate warrior. Yeah. Which, you know, I know a lot of people talk about that match over time and all that. But like, Vince coming to me at that point in my career to say, hey, the ultimate warrior's going to come back, but he's not going to come back until the day of Mania. And I want you to be the guy in there with him. Yeah. And I want you to do all the media and all that stuff. So this will be huge for you. I was like, I work 64 straight days before WrestleMania every single day on a media tour and in between shows and all that just because I was like, I'll do everything. So, you know, walking out there, WrestleMania facing the ultimate warrior was cool experience. Also that thing you came out of that stage, that was that entrance that was used for, that's one of those things like the winged eagle that at a certain point I'm going to get all pre-workout up and send you a text like if we just did it for one night, I'm telling you. Okay. It's a funny thing like that's where our business is like, you know, you're like, I'm going to get pre-workout up. You know, like, well, that's what I always try to say. Like, because you know, sometimes you get the endorphins are flowing, you get super going. And then you send something. And then an hour later, you look at it, what was I thinking? Because it's the hill you want to die on. But also sometimes it's, I don't want him thinking this was my, of all the things he pitched, you know. You know, usually when I, like, if I get sucked from Michael, I'm like, what is this? Like, there's a different reason for it. It wasn't pre-workout. Oh, God. We love Michael. All right. WrestleMania 22. That is you versus John Cena and the, the, the throne. Yeah. So, I'll put this up there. What I say, the other one was three. I'll put this up at four. That's four. This is one of those ones where where they first, when we sort of first get into the like, hey, you guys want to do some kind of like a elaborate entrance. Yeah. You know, I think this is where John does the, the Tommy gun. Yeah, the Tommy gun with the mobsters on the car and all that stuff and coming up from underneath the ramp and all that. And I think punk was a part of the entrance. Is riding on the car. Yeah. And, you know, I'm backstage and this, like, this is all. Like, last second, I don't see the gear until the moment before the quick story on it, the, the throne gets caught as I'm coming up. Like, the throne gets stuck in the lift. And it's like, and it's like stuck and I'm thinking like, holy fuck, I'm going to have to climb out of this whole dress like a rock. This is the most embarrassing thing. But just when I'm like panicking, like, I have to get out of the seat. Like, Ellis is panicking next to me trying to, and he like pushed it over and it fit in the hole and it like started going up again. I was going like, thank God, like this could have been the most disastrous thing ever. We have, we've never talked about it in the midst of these blind rankings. I think it is, you never once, when I came back, asked me about clearly taking your throne, making it imagery in my entrance away from here, starting my own thing and taking your hammer to it. Yeah. You never, we never saw it as your hammer because it was smaller than mine. Okay, yeah, I know. Look, look, I did that kind of shit to me. It's like, I remember when people brought it to me and said, like, it's Joan it's me and I was like, fuck, yeah, I'm good for him. Like, that's the kind of shit you do. You try to make a name for yourself. You try to get out there. You try to do some cool shit, try to do some different stuff. But do they believe me? If I would have thought there was malice in it. And maybe indirectly there was some of the time I don't know. But like, if I would have thought there was any serious malice and I would have called you and said, hey dude, it's like a wheel, okay? Like, because I was, I was, you know, I was so close to your dad, but then I always felt like a connection to you. Yeah. And when you were here and it was difficult for me when you left because I couldn't say like, yeah, I couldn't over the top, like, dude, get the fuck out of here and go, go, go out there and make a name for yourself and make yourself, you said it desirable and we'll fucking come chasing after you and bring it back and fucking, sometimes you've got to get out of the rut. You're in, you just got to take, just bite it off and go in a different direction, make the left turn, right? And, but so difficult, but during that time, I remember thinking like, right, that's, that's getting out there. That's being bold and making a statement. You did tell me because you said, you know, go rattle the cages. Yeah. And you kind of made yourself the target for me to rattle in terms of the optics of wrestling. And I, there was no malice for sure because this is after I won the Ring of Honor title. Yeah. One of the first texts I got back to was yours, congrats as I was walking to the hospital in Lowell because my lip was busted open holding my first world title. And yeah, no, I just, you know, it was one of those things where you see somebody going off doing their own thing and having success and I'm like, yeah, go, go, go, come on. Get yourself in that spot. Yeah. We're like, hey, we should go, like, I don't know what he did different, but let's go get him. Yeah. Well, I'm glad the feeling is good on it versus because I'm thinking, man, if he's mad about it, it's a long road to whatever, whatever that payoff is. He's waiting on that. He's waiting. Yeah. Oh, now it's happening. No, man. I never, even I never thought about anything other than, yeah, good for him. You know, go, go, go get it. Oh, WrestleMania 34. You Steph Kurt Angle, Rhonda. This is the, the separate bikes. Yeah. And then all woman biker gang. Yeah. I might put this up as one just for that moment right there. You know, I'm sort of at the end here and I'm just enjoying the moments and having the opportunity, Kurt, Rhonda, Steph's going to be in there. Steph is like out of her mind nervous. Like I remember her thinking like, how does like you do the water spit and coming to me like, I got, we got to practice this. I don't want to box this. Yeah, yeah, yeah. You know, just a stream. Yeah. Exactly. The whole thing and it was just such. The whole thing was just so cool and to be able to do it with her. Yeah. You know, it's it's a. It's a strategy partner, man. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Thanks, you left. Sorry. You know, brand new, be part of WrestleMania 40 and the same reason. Yeah. It's it's, don't get me started. Yeah. Okay. I didn't get my estrogen check after the whole thing. I don't have to do it again. Okay. WrestleMania 31, CU versus the Stinger, the Terminator. So what would, which also seems like the most unsafe platform? Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. I know like, you couldn't have got a 10 penny nail at my asset. At this point where I'm out there. Like, I'm, it's, that thing's rattling around. It's shaking and there's like a little piece of thing holding me up there. So I don't fall off. This would have been so much more epically cool that night. There's a couple of funny things on this is one super cool that Terminator, the movie they come to me and ask like, yeah, hey, we want to sponsor the entrance to the whole thing. I think the first one that really gets fully like full baked sponsored. Nice. Arnold does the read. Right. They're like, Arnold won't do it. I said, like, really? I'll call them. It's who night call them. He was like, fuck yeah, I'll do it. Yeah. Right. Like, he gets into doing it. Funny story is we call to get all these props from the movie and they're like, sure, then like a week and a half before they're like, hey, we don't have any of those things. Now, God, like, there was no way. So robots, there was no, there was all CGI, right? So we had to like go to like a prop house and order every terminator robot that they ever made that you could buy. And bring them to the point where the terminator movie then when they did the red carpet for the movie called like, hey, can we borrow those robots? There you go. Put them on the red carpet and stuff, right? The other funny piece is, sting goes out first. I'm down, you know what it's like when you're down in the elevator. You're in that pit, then rehearse the sting smoke. So we're in there. It's windy. Sting's black smoke starts to go that entire underneath the stage fills with smoke. But none of us know what the fuck is going on. Yeah. I don't know if the shit's on fire. Should I get the fuck out of this hole? Like everybody's panicking. Nobody can see shit. I mean, it was crazy. And then all of a sudden the lift started going up. I was like, I guess we're going. Yeah. But nobody knew what was going on. Things either, okay? Yeah. Crazy. Okay. The next one. So there was four? I'll put that in four. I don't know if it's not in 10. Okay. Oh, I thought I put, no, that's not four. No, you put, it's our very end of four. All right, I'll put this in five. Five or that? Yeah, do you see this is hard, man? Yeah, I know. And I feel bad. Resomania 29 versus Brock Lesnar, Giant Skullhead. And this is also where you were explaining to me because that cryo can take a PC. It's time. Yeah. I always seem to have like cool lightages that somehow don't turn out epically in my favor. Yeah. We had rehearsed this all gone great. I get in the thing and they blow the smoke on me. And, you know, first of all, I'm about to go face Brock, which is, you know, I love working with Brock and it's physical. You're very. And so I'm about to go do that and, you know, I'm getting older here and I'm standing in that smoke and all of a sudden as the smoke starts to blow, I realize, hey, this is really burning. Like it didn't, I don't recall a burning in the rehearsals like this. And now I'm like, boy, it's really burning. I got to get out of here. And I step out of it and it like, you know, you can hear shit internally in your body. Like I can hear myself sizzling over the music. Like I can hear a sizzling sound. And I am like, what is that? Like, and I start to walk and then I realize like, I'm still burning and I'm not walking down, but I'm in like the zone and I don't realize what it is until Brock is like looking at me from the ring like and he's like, what is on you? Yeah. And I'm like, oh shit. Like I have stuff all stuck to me and it had burnt the shit out of my skin. Oh. Oh yeah. One of those things. Where's that one go? What I got left? I'll go 10. Yeah. Yeah. I think you're, I think you made the right call. Yeah. The next one you've got, these are going to be two back to back. You've got WrestleMania 35, but Tista, this is Mad Max. It's right into the ring on the post-apocalyptic vehicle. Yeah, this was a weird one. Cool imagery, little weird. When I got left. Six. Six and nine. I don't go nine. Nine. And I think that, I think that probably was the right call because this is you 21 also versus Batista Motorhead is playing you down to the ring. And a pretty eye. Yeah. And I totally, not even thinking about this one. Yeah, like this for me, you know, it was a huge Motorhead fan growing up. They do my music. It's epic. They get to play me there. And it's classically Motorhead, like they are so out of their minds that I don't think Lem saying one actual lyric, like, that the rehearsals were so bad that Kevin Dunn came to me. He was like, should we just kill this whole thing? Yeah. And I'm like, they hadn't gotten right yet. They were just hung over from the night before and stuff. And Kevin was like, it's, this is horrible. They can, should we just kill it? I was like, I think once they get straight before the gig, it'll be okay. And it was, it was epically powerful. This is the lesson of, it's not what you say. It's how you say it. It was just, yeah. And for me, coming up with those guys there and all this just really, really cool. Oh, man. Well, there's our last. And Lem was such a good friend that, you know, meant even more. Incredible. And thank you for indulging that, of course. But also this went very long as when talking about wrestling. It often happens and goes. Yeah. And it's funny thing because you talked about it at the very beginning, like them wanting to do it and it's taking so long because I never wanted to go like, yeah, I have an hour here. It's not going to go an hour. Yeah. You and I are going to start talking and bullshit and it's going to go long and it's going to be fun. And, you know, thanks for, thanks for making it easy. No. Thank you. And I'm very excited. Again, this is WrestleMania 42 and up against our own records as we are saying here. And I'm very, very just this is an honor to be on this team and I'm excited to see where we go. And this was just an absolute treat for me. So thank you very much for being here. We touched on it briefly, but the position that you're in was not easy, right? And people will tell you, shit your whole career, neppo, baby, whatever. Fuck them. You earned this and then some. You are one of the most diligent guys in their locker room of wanting it to be rights with no stone unturned. You think about it nonstop. You're so engaged in it. And it's never really just about you. It's about the company and the product as a whole, which makes you a dream to work with. It really is. And I don't want this to sound in some way like I'm talking down to you because of the position that you're in, but I'm proud of you. And for all of it for gambling on yourself for taking that step at 99.9% of the people in the world wouldn't do to get to where you are and doing it in a way that every single step of the way you did it the right way. And in a way that would make anybody especially your dad proud. Well, thank you very much. Ladies and gentlemen, what do you want to talk about? Triple H. Thank you guys. Thank you. Thank you.