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Speaker 2I was always the person that, I'll start tomorrow, I'll start tomorrow. But when I was with my ex and always having drugs on me and I would be getting alcohol driven to me, I don't remember, it was like dial-a-bottle type shit. I can't remember. But I always say, okay, once I get rid of all this alcohol and do all of this, I'll be done. But then it's like, it'll still take me a while to keep doing it, right? And then once after the three days are done, it's like, okay, now I want more. And it's that deadly cycle. But I remember, too, realizing that I had maybe this... This is a problem. I think it was... Oh, God. I was... I was just always bailing on people. And I was bailing and I'd rather get high than hang out with people. And I'd rather be alone than hang out with people. I'd rather... Even grabbing a bag with, like, friends and stuff, I'd grab my own bag secretly and then keep it and then just go get high by myself. And then I liked it because nobody judged me. Nobody judged the amount I was doing.
Speaker 3Welcome to Recovering Out Loud podcast with your hosts, Anthony and Caleb. In this podcast, our intention is to help the still-suffering addict or alcoholic and provide you, the listener, with our experience, strength, and hope. We share real, raw stories of healing, hope, and breaking free. The opinions expressed here are those of the individuals and not any organization. Please help support the channel by following and rating the show. This is the best kind of donation we could receive. So grab a seat, take a deep breath, and let's get loud about healing together. Emily, thank you so much for coming on. We appreciate you. Thank you. Yeah. It's a little sweaty and hot, but we made it happen. This was, like I always say, like, cord management and, like, having people is so underrated, so...
Speaker 2Absolutely. Honestly, I was just saying that I feel so inspired with all the work that you're doing behind the scenes. So well done, guys. Thank you. Really well done. We appreciate that. For someone who's been on a podcast for a year and still hasn't had her shit together, I really appreciate it.
Speaker 3Yeah, and let's not get it twisted. Like, we still don't have our shit together. Yeah.
Speaker 2And I think that's, like, why I feel comfortable, maybe.
Speaker 4Yeah. But, yeah, it's nice to have another like-minded person on here. You said that you have a recovery podcast as well, correct?
Speaker 2I do, yes. So my recovery podcast is called Talks on the Rocks. I've been doing it. I know. The name was actually a tough one because I was trying to think... Well, my brother actually helped me out with it. So I was trying to think, like, on a rocky, like, rocks. But then, you know, there's, like, drinks on the rocks. So I was kind of going both ways with it. But then when I started, obviously things were very rocky for me. So I went to, like, Talks on the Rocks in that way. But there are other podcasts that are about cocktail making that is called Talks on the Rocks. And I'm like, fuck. Like, no. So there's, like, ways that you can see it. People view it differently in other ways. But I am really proud of it.
Speaker 3Yeah, for sure. I'm sure you should be. Thanks. And I love the picture. You have a picture for anyone listening. Go check it out. It's a great podcast. But you have a picture of yourself, like, pouring out a drink on the ice. I love that. I know. Seriously.
Speaker 2And then that's kind of what made it, right? Just the rocks just coming out of it and just, you know, you want to kind of let it all out. And I think that was the symbolism that I was going for.
Speaker 4And I think it's super cool. I was saying this to you as we're setting up, like, you know, things, like, that come with addiction and mental health, they're already so hard to talk about. And it's cool to see someone else that's putting themselves out there to talk about these problems. So, yeah, you know, it's inspiring for us as well.
Speaker 2I appreciate that. And that's why I'm really happy to be here with you guys, because I completely understand it. And I respect that for sure. And even your name of the podcast, like, Recovery Out Loud, that's huge. Because I remember in my first episode, I always said the reason I'm doing this is so I can, you know, do this out loud so people can stop dying quietly. Like, there was, like, a thing that I said, and it kind of clicked. And Recovery Out Loud is, like, the best way for, like, us, at least, you know. But it's amazing.
Speaker 3Especially because, like, addiction in and of itself is such an isolating situation. The biggest problem for me, one of the biggest problems is I'm very good at keeping my problems to myself, hiding in my room, not, you know, connecting with people. And that just keeps me sicker and sicker every day, right? So I couldn't agree more. It's like, there was a no-brainer for me.
Speaker 2Yeah, I love it. They always say addiction is the opposite of community.
Speaker 4That's a good one. I've never actually heard that, I don't think.
Speaker 2It's so true, though. Like, if you're not addicted, if you're not, if you're doing this alone, it's not easy. It's really not easy. And, like, obviously, everyone has a different story with it all, but I think it doing, like, having people, like, like-minded people around does make such a difference in your recovery, for sure.
Speaker 4So, Emily, to give the viewers a little bit of insight on who you are and what you've been through, why don't you give us a quick little letdown on you?
Speaker 2Yeah. So I grew up in Niagara Falls. I grew up, actually, in a small town in Niagara Falls with my parents. Like, my parents are very well-off. My dad was very well-off. My mom was at home with us because I have a twin brother. So her hands were full, obviously. But my childhood was really good. I have no complaints about it. I think there was a lot of, like, childhood trauma growing up as, like, you know, I was getting older because I was always really bad in school. And you know how they always diagnose, like, boys with ADHD? I had it, for sure. But they... They never thought I was... They never thought I would fit the profile because I had a twin brother who was just fucking off the walls. And, like, I would be calm, cool. Like, I was a ballerina. I was, like, collected. And so... But I was so bad in school.
Speaker 4Bad in what sense? Like, grade-wise?
Speaker 2Grade-wise. Like, I was always, like, like, just off and lolligan. Like, I was just not paying attention. Like, math was just... I always got Ds, never As. Like, awful in school. And so then my mom set me up with a tutor. And the tutor, unfortunately, was... really bad. He... He... I do say this in my podcast. I don't know why it's hard saying this now. But he did... I'm sorry. I'm kind of nervous talking about this right now. This is weird.
Speaker 4Oh, it's hard.
Speaker 2But he used to, like, touch me.
Speaker 4Your professor?
Speaker 2Yeah. No, my tutor.
Speaker 4Tutor. Yeah. Wow. And this was in that school? This was, like, at home?
Speaker 2This was at home. And I was about 11 years old. So he would come every Friday. My mom would say, like, Hey, whatever. I'm not saying his name. But, hey. And, like, we'd work at the dinner table together. And he would just be touching me under the table and going, like... It was bad. And I thought, in my head, I'm like, Is this right? Like, should I... Is this something that I should be doing in order to get good grades? Like, what the fuck? You know? So it was just one of those things that started that way. And growing up, I was just always... I always cared what people thought about me. In high school, going off on that, I always wanted to fit in. I always wanted to be a part... part of something. And drinking was actually, like, kind of late in my... I was, like, pretty late in my drinking career, actually. Like, I started drinking when I was about 14. And, like, the first sip, I loved it. Like, I'm like, This is me. This is real. I wasn't who I was. I was funnier. I was more talkative. I was just, like, a better person drinking. And then, after that, weed came. And I used to smoke weed every day. And then, from there on, it really escalated to drugs. And when I say drugs, like, it's mainly coke. It's cocaine. And so, that really took over my life. And since I did my first line ever, it was, like, I'm home. This is what I... This is me now. Like, this is my personality. This is who I am.
Speaker 4You have arrived.
Speaker 2I have arrived. Yes. It's so crazy. And, you know, I always thought, like, No, I would never get addicted to this. And then, like, as the years come, like, Ooh, okay, this could be a problem. But, like, you never know, right? You're just kind of in this... I don't know. Like, denial state. Yeah, exactly. Or, like, you compare, you compare yourself to other people. And, Oh, I'm not there. I'm not there. Or, like, you know, I have great parents. I have a great family. Like, I shouldn't be an addict. But addiction actually does run in my family more with alcoholism. But, yeah, that's, like, mainly my story growing up is just always trying to fit in. And also, I was a dancer, a competitive dancer. So, like, my dance teacher always gave me shit about my weight and body dysmorphia completely. So...
Speaker 3Is that a common thing in, like, dance? Wow.
Speaker 2Yeah, especially in ballet. Like, there's a few stories. Like, she made us, I know this sounds really fucked up, but she made us get a penny. Like, do you remember pennies? And you have to put it in between your butt crack and then dance a whole, like, five minutes without it falling. And if it falls, you hear it and you have to do, like, ten push-ups or something and she'll fucking, it's fucked.
Speaker 3How old were you?
Speaker 2I was probably around the same age. Well, I grew up dancing all my life. And this, that time, like, that specific story was probably when I was, like, eight or nine. That's crazy. Oh, my God.
Speaker 3I've never heard that before.
Speaker 2Yeah, I would just go home and tell my mom about it and, like, she's like, I don't think that's normal. But I just, I love dancing because it's actually an escape for me in ways. Besides my crazy teacher and the competitiveness and just the pressure of it, I did enjoy it a lot. And I still do. You still do, yeah.
Speaker 3You were telling me, yeah.
Speaker 2Wow.
Speaker 3That's insane. So, like, from a young age, you're already being told you're not right. You're not enough. Thank you. You're not enough. And that's essentially, you know, they always say, well, one's too many and a thousand's never enough. enough this is a disease of not enough yeah never one pair of shoes is not enough oh my god never so yeah like what are you supposed to you know you're growing up with these like ways of life these kind of um i don't know narratives that they're putting in your head how are you supposed
Speaker 2to recover from that exactly so like how did you deal with it yeah i well i think it was just like always comparing myself but obviously dealing with it was drugs and alcohol that's helped so much like drugs and alcohol were like my savior it was my crutch it was everything that i wanted and more if i had a bad day it's like you know it's gonna be fine i'm gonna get fucked up later and then four days later it's like whatever but that's like kind of how i dealt with it for a really really long time and that's why it took me a while to get sober because i start tried getting sober in 2018 okay i went to my first rehab and uh i was like it was desperation then for sure and i was like okay you yeah like shit this is getting tough like i remember i came home uh after like a four-day bender and i like was doing bumps in my car and i came home after a four-day bender my parents were sitting down and they found like a little baggie and they're like we think you need help and i literally like went almost to my knees my gas like take me like i'm so done like i'm so fucking tired i'm tired and uh that was a lot of desperation there for me um then moving forward i was still not ready i didn't do it for myself i did it for my mom my dad other people not the right reasons that they always say um it was a tough go for me so now dealing with you know shit that i feel different about i think it's more of like a spiritual thing which i really appreciate um when if things get hard i just try to like roll it off my back but i don't want to drink over things like it's not enough to drink
Speaker 3like make me drink you know what i mean yeah it's like this this won't you know i don't i always say is like i don't want to drink over things i don't want to drink over things i don't want to drink i have one problem right and it's whatever i'm the whatever it is in the moment uh for me right now it's money like i have this issue it's i don't have money i'm still recouping and recovering from my last bout and craziness and staying at every fucking fancy hotel in toronto i'm still i'm still paying for that right um but i have this problem and it's like i pick up drugs and alcohol if if i decide to do that now i have two problems yep right and then i have it just multiplies and it's
Speaker 4for me like now that i'm not using drugs to cope with my problems i was talking about this in the last episode i use it like when i get like let's say something's upsetting me or i'm emotional about something i do with it by getting pissed off now interesting like anger anger yeah so i learned this um that anger is like a is like a secondary emotion it's not like you know sometimes you will get mad at the beginning but usually the reason that i get mad is because something is hurting me or i don't you know i don't like what's going on it's fear too it's fear right so then i'll just like you know fuck that guy he's an idiot that's how i deal with my problems right i still think it's
Speaker 2better than you know putting drugs up my nose but you know i'm sorry to interrupt i like how you said like fear is an emotion because like people look at that as a problem yeah yeah crazy but you
Speaker 4need that it's a natural reaction defense mechanism defense mechanism right absolutely and i think that's like when i see people this is inspiring to me when i see someone like like you know maybe this person just got told to fuck off you know someone just you're a fucking idiot buddy and then the guy the guy just doesn't get mad just like he's so emotionally stable and aware of how he feels it's like wow i
Speaker 2wish i could be like that guy it just like rolls off their back you know because like right now i'm
Speaker 4dealing with some stuff that's like stressing me out about work and money as well and like you know i'm trying to like do this on my own and not have to like rely on talking to my family but everything i'm trying to be an adult right of course and it's nothing has to do with anger in the situation but i'm getting angry about it you know what i mean i'm getting i'm dealing with it by getting mad and be like oh it's my boss's fault it's my dad's fault
Speaker 2victimizing right i do that too and i'm still really bad with that and like to like your self-awareness though is pretty good if you're talking about that right now you know um victimizing yourself is always something like that's a coping mechanism for people who are in addiction well i grew up this way so i had to be an addict or my dad like you know what i mean and victimizing i still yeah it's it's it's hard it's really hard and it's hard to stop but i think the awareness is
Speaker 4there for sure for you which is exciting it's it's hard to look in the mirror and be like no this is my fault and i'm the only one who can control this right versus it's a lot easier to be like no it's
Speaker 2your fault it's your fault it's so much easier so much fucking easier i blamed everyone but myself everyone even like for my relapses i'd blame them on other people like i'm like i remember being like oh i was at um like a therapy group and some person gave me a dirty look and i walked out really angry so i went and relapsed like stupid stupid shit like just really like
Speaker 3come on you didn't have to and i remember i had a therapist i would always because i would do that too i would go out and be like oh my mom's pissing me off my wife's pissing me off yeah i'm gonna go i'm gonna go use i'm gonna show them show you like show you all hurt me exactly and she always said to me she's like you're the only one you're hurting when you're doing that right you're every time you use you're going out and saying fuck you to yourself like that's essentially what's happening every time yeah you're killing yourself yeah so okay so you talked about what happened to kind of bring you into into treatment um i was reading you know i i do this sometimes i go on reddit and i look at uh addiction threads okay and people post like what they're going through and all this and i read this one this morning i couldn't help but look at it it was a guy that was about to go into rehab he's like i finally made this you know decision i'm scared i'm terrified i'm angry and i just i was just reading it and i'm just like oh man like i wish i could reach out and hug this guy right now and i commented something like you know it gets better this is the first step like but when you're going into it it's the worst decision in your life
Speaker 2oh absolutely absolutely nobody wants to go to rehab no one came on a winning streak yeah that's i know there's a song about that i think it's jelly roll but yeah no you're you're broken going into that and and i think like for me personally in my first rehab like i was broken i was ready but i was just like let me get this over with so i can be good with
Speaker 4my parents yeah you know what i mean i was i was kind of like i don't i think i just had like a spiritual awakening and yeah because i went into rehab at the beginning and like i actually i think back on this i've talked about it with anthony friends my parents i don't really know there was no real thing in my head like i didn't go to my parents and say please bring me to rehab right it was just like anthony said it was like this like the right time the right timing happened i had nothing left i had no money left my friends left i was just like hey i need something else besides this because i don't even if i had 10 bucks right now i wouldn't go to rehab because i go get high but i don't even have 10 bucks right now so you know i got i got in the back of the truck and or the back of the car and they drove me 12 hours away to go to rehab and it wasn't until like probably like three or four weeks i stayed in rehab for like three or four weeks and i was like oh my god i'm gonna go to rehab for
Speaker 2three months and good for you good for you that's huge it's hard and it was like probably around the
Speaker 4four week mark that i was like oh shit like okay i need to be here i needed help this life is starting to get a little bit better i'm starting to think a little bit better see more clearly because for the first four weeks man i was like i had like the that chip on my shoulder like fuck this place
Speaker 2these guys are not as fucked as i am i'm fine i'm fine and i i also i also share this funny
Speaker 4this funny story i remember like on the way to rehab i was like there's gonna be so many sketchy people there and then i showed up i showed up there i was the sketchy guy you're the sketchy one yeah everyone's fucking glowing
Speaker 2and light and like it's just like who the fuck are these people and i'm the one just like outside trying to light a cigarette being like just shaking yeah and everyone's like hugging me i'm like get the fuck out of me like i'm so much better than you and i was also talking about this
Speaker 4with anthony and it's sad because like we're all blessed in the sense where i don't know your situation but for me and anthony i know our parents sent us to rehab right we were very lucky but like we were talking like how can more addicts get help and it's like not every addict like especially the ones that don't have families that are supporting them they're completely alone like how do those people get help yeah you know what i mean yeah and for me like this the the opportunity to go to rehab was like it landed right on my lap right but for the people that you get to go right but there's so many people out there like you think the guy right now who doesn't even have a phone who only has a tuning to go by crack you think that guy's gonna somehow go to a library get on a computer and try and book himself into a free rehab that's never gonna happen not to
Speaker 3mention the waiting list and i confirm this with my wife like to get into a free rehab in canada in in toronto i should say it's like i think the waiting time was like four to six months she said or something like that wow i'm not gonna live that long the way i'm going you know what i mean like i need to
Speaker 2like sorry no no like if i was if i had that mentality like okay in four months i'm going to rehab let me get fucked up yeah and then i die i'd probably overdose and die that's a good point
Speaker 4if i knew like okay i got because when i went to rehab this much time my dad come to my house and he's like we he said okay you want to go to rehab and i'm like i guess so like i wasn't really sure if i wanted to go he's like no like make a decision i said okay i want to go he's like i'm like i need a little bit of time to like give me like a couple hours here to get my stuff ready he's like no like i'll be back in 20 minutes and we're going like it was and he was at my house like 13 14 minutes later so if i would if you would have been like okay we're leaving in three days no no chance the three days i would have who knows what would have happened right and that's a great point you bring up because like especially when you tell an addict who's like still you know 10 feet deep in the addiction they're going to tell you they're going to go crazy of course you know they're going to sell every last thing they got and they're going to go buy every last drug they can
Speaker 2get and they are going to be a while i gotta get this in now right it's crazy it's crazy and i
Speaker 4remember that because it's you know the the 15 minutes i did have when my dad had went back to the house he probably grabbed some luggage and stuff because he had to stay overnight when they dropped me off i remember that last 15 minutes i didn't pack a single thing i just blindly packed i just got high off my ass for 15 minutes yeah
Speaker 2classic and it was sad because um i don't know if i should be able to talk about this i was on
Speaker 4methadone before i went to treatment and like i got onto methadone probably about eight months before i went to treatment and my parents they ended up figuring it out but um like i would go to the pharmacy in my town to get my drink or whatever and before we left to hit the highway um it was in the morning i said dad like we got to go to the pharmacy and i remember my dad just like i could just like feel his feeling he's like all right man like he knew i was sick he knew i needed it at that point and he's like all right we'll go there and we'll get it like i know you're going to rehab you're doing what i'm asking you know what i mean but i remember that feeling like i felt bad for him and i remember him like getting out of the truck me walking to the pharmacy and just being like that was a shitty feeling i'm like man no parents should have to do this for their kid right now right but you know my dad and my mom they didn't they didn't they're not addicts they don't understand what i was going through or how i felt but my dad was just like he could see me i looked like a fucking ghost he's like all right like just go do what you got to do right and thankfully i ended up getting off that stuff for people that don't know like what does methadone do so what's the point so methadone um it's a it's a liquid and it's a drink you take essentially and it's to help you get off opiates but that's not how it works what it is is it's a very very strong opiate um like very strong i know people that have overdosed and died on that actually um and it's essentially you know and i'm just going to say exactly how i feel about it you go you go to this is how it happened for me i knew people than friends that were on it right and i knew the effects of it because i've taken it before i actually got prescribed it and it would make me feel great it would get me super high
Speaker 2so i went to the clinic one day so that's what you you wanted that's what i wanted right i love it
Speaker 4so i went to the clinic one day as a you know a 23 year old messed up kid that anyone could tell that i was sick and um i asked the the lady to talk to the doctor and within 20 minutes i had my first dose and then i went to go back every single week and i'd say it's not enough they'd bring me up not enough bring me up and i started at 15 milligrams and when i got into rehab i was at like 130 yeah and it's a god sent that i had to go back and i had to go back and i had to go back i ended up getting off that stuff because it takes it's it's it was hard to get off of but it's just it's it doesn't help anyone because if i wouldn't have went to rehab i would i would have kept taking that stuff because i was getting it for free i'm not paying for it so you tell a drug addict here you go here's your high every day for free you don't have to go scrounge up money to get
Speaker 2here you go i never thought of it that way actually and my dad worked at a methadone clinic so i think it was hard for him to like you know look at his daughter and then see people coming he's like okay you're gonna come back tomorrow like you know cutting people off too like it's it's a whole system but i've never it's so funny that like with my addict brain i thought of that too i'm like that would be fun like just going getting free methadone and going but like yeah there's i never thought of it just in that way where people don't want to get off opiates at all they're just this is like free drugs i that's that's crazy that's what we do right is we take
Speaker 3something and we manipulate it to suit our needs so you were taking other drugs at the same time
Speaker 4yeah oh my god of course it was just like a cocktail i was making right that's the one i got every single day and the one more thing i want to add about methadone that i don't i don't like is that i've seen this firsthand in treatment centers so it's a prescribed medication right so you know people are going to to treatment like i did i was you know doing multiple other drugs but if when i got into treatment when i did like my biography whatever you want to call when they asked me all these questions they asked me do you want to get off methadone and i know a lot of people who said no so they're in treatment they're getting off all the other stuff they're doing but they're staying on methadone because it's like it's like how alcohol and marijuana is it's normalized right because you can go buy it at a corner store i could go to the pharmacy and get it legally prescribed to me so but like it's horrible methadone is a horrible horrible drug and like for anyone that doesn't know much about it google it because the effects it has on your body your teeth and thank god i was only on it for eight months so it was hard to get off of but it wasn't like impossible but there was a guy that i seen trying to get off of it that was on it for 10 years and watching him go through the withdrawal was like it was i i felt his pain it was horrible he went through like six sweaters in one day just sweating you know he couldn't stand up he was literally curled up in a ball in the smoke was just curling up shaking and the guy ended up leaving he didn't stay i think i think the bit
Speaker 3of hope and i remember that guy actually too i think the bit of hope with it though is like you were able to get off it and you're doing great now but you had to come to a point where you're like i want to stop this i'm done i want to be clean i see the other side i see like you said the bright faces and rehab the people that are recovering i want that yes right and so there is hope in that senses but yeah you're right if if there's no solution and you know you can go to the end of your life using it forever right and i just one more thing before we you know move on but uh when you're talking about that it reminds me of this like whole california sober idea where it's like i'm gonna be sober but i'm still gonna smoke weed yep man drugs are drugs alcohol is alcohol it's all the same right i was told in utah one time i was like meeting in utah because we ended up going to the same treatment center which is ironic at different times obviously so funny and uh shout out tyler too who introduced us by the way i forgot to do that thanks thank you and uh you know i heard in utah one day a guy said you know he was sharing he goes listen if you're here for drugs you know or alcohol or gambling or porn or whatever it's same different shovel and i love that it's it is it's like we just use external things to fix the internal state yeah that's what addiction is for me essentially absolutely and like one more thing too we keep
Speaker 4adding things here but um for me i won't lie like i did think there was a point when i was like halfway off of cutting off of methadone i'm like you know why don't you stay you should just stay on this man right that's what i think brain comes back this was like this was like six weeks into my program but and it was because it was getting hard to get off if i was withdrawing couldn't sleep but i just want to share that we're talking about maybe a little bit of negative stuff right now but i want to keep it positive when i got off of it um like it took a couple weeks to be completely off of it but i remember like it's just so much better now as i say this all the time favorite part about waking up is just knowing how i'm going to feel right and i can do that every day now because i'm off that crap and i remember the feeling so i did a blind taper that's what it's called so i'd go down every day in treatment and they were tapering me off of methadone so they would just give me my drink in a cup i wouldn't know the milligram right because as a drug addict when you're doing drugs you're like okay this is good stuff yeah you're like finally you're looking forward to it all night but it's like a science i remember i knew i was getting near the end because i had had about uh let's say three four weeks left in my program and i would beg the nurses i'm like what is this like how much is this just tell me because i know i'm getting close to the end and they wouldn't tell me they wouldn't tell me they wouldn't tell me placebo and then i went down one day in the morning to get my vitamins in my my methadone drink and they said congratulations you're done and not feeling i remember you telling me that wow i so that's huge the best part my favorite part about all this um so the methadone clinic that i actually got put on methadone um the nurse she's such a sweet lady she uh she i remember when i had asked to get on it she's like you shouldn't do this you really shouldn't do this right because i was young most people they're a bit older i was a young person going in there and she like i could see like just the heart felt in her eyes she did not want me to do it and she's seen me for months go back and back and go up and up and up everything she warned me not to do i i did it anyways but i asked i asked that day i got off methadone i said can i please because i had to call her before i went to treatment and i'm okay i'm not going to be coming back anymore i'm going to treatment and she was so happy that i was going so i got i i had asked the nurse i said can i please call the nurse back home and tell her i got off of it oh my god i hadn't talked to her in three months special and i called her probably in tears i was just gonna she was she was like oh my gosh she's so happy because especially people like in medical
Speaker 2and see addiction and see it firsthand like we they know that's not us yeah it's not who we are and they can see the bright light that she saw in you clearly yeah and it it's just such uh
Speaker 4a special like it's beautiful it's like a miracle the small wins like that make recovery and it's worth it because sometimes you might think like you know like what's the point of this especially like not now i really see the point of it now that i got in that time in that period in time when i was in rehab and i haven't even been out in the world sober yet i'm like what is the point of this like i don't even you know what i mean little things like that made it so worth it i was like wow like what an amazing feeling i can call someone and tell them i got off methadone with three months ago i was going there every day begging just give me five more milligrams up up up right and then something like that happens it it feels really good congratulations thank you it's amazing
Speaker 3huge so emily why don't you talk about like um you know you talked about what you were like kind of what happened to bring you into recovery what what's life like today oh today oh my goodness
Speaker 2okay today i hate to say it life is not as exciting but it's exciting in different ways um like i'm living in downtown toronto for sure that's when my addiction really started i was working in the industry like the bartending industry clubs i was you know doing like four day binges just like drinking on shift doing lines in the bathroom like it was fun and i would you know i was so young i was about like 20 you know 25 maybe where you know i would get taken on yachts and i'd get taken to these nice hotels and like you know i was living that type of dream but i was up the whole time and so life today obviously is less than that but it's just there's so many more gifts in this um like my twin brother he has two kids and his wife um they've seen me through and i was thinking about this with your episode with your sister that it is a family disease because i totally remember the last time i rehab or a relapse story i was like this has nothing to do with you like it's me like why do you care you know and then they're just like of course we care like are you kidding so seeing having them in my life again has been a gift and they asked me to be their their son's godmother which is so huge like i was like me like what like there's days where they wouldn't let me see their kids so gifts like that are so that's what keeps me but also too like since like there was a lot of shifts in my first year of sobriety my mom passed away which was like the first month of this podcast or my podcast that i was trying to put out there so you were sober at the time i was sober at the time but then i relapsed march 18th i relapsed after my mom died and that's when things got really bad but i was still putting out the podcast because i was like i'm done i'm done because there was a lot more on the line and it this podcast like the main reason why i wanted to start the podcast was like more accountability and it was more just for myself and proving to people but like it kind of sounds selfish but um yeah it just today is just honestly waking up not hung over has is life-changing being able to be an aunt being able to be a godmother i'm a good daughter i'm a good sister i'm a good friend now i i dance now which has been a huge part of my recovery because dance has always been so traumatic for me growing up and now that i'm back into it with like an amazing dance community here in the city it's just oh my god i like i would never be able to do this if i was still drinking and drugging absolutely and just the people and it's life today is great i really can't see myself going back on that other side
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Speaker 4and what i want to say something and you say like less exciting i can kind of i understand
Speaker 3what you mean by there's less like peaks and valleys yeah sure some i say this
Speaker 4lots i'm like now that because like i'm very busy with work and our podcasts and then try and make time for you know other things sometimes i just really appreciate the boredom just because i remember waking up every single day and being like almost like you're in the military wake up every day you put your shoes on all right it's time to fight you know what i mean chaos so and and that's my brain tells me like that was excitement to me before right and and not having no rules really just like rules for myself like no partying hanging out with whoever i wanted not caring what anyone thought no shame no shame right but now it's it's nice like to not have that like i said you wake up every day i know how i'm gonna feel i know what i gotta do right now it's just up to me to do it and i i appreciate that now because like life before man there's so much like
Speaker 2there's so many secrets there's so much lying there's so much like i did this i did that like now it's just like calm yeah and but we're addicted to the chaos at least i am no no 100
Speaker 3anthony says that all the time i loved chaos it's a distraction from how we're feeling exactly and i don't have to look in the mirror when i'm in chaos it's everyone else's fault like we talked about before right yeah that's beautiful i love that and so i'm gonna i have to say this but are the pennies still involved in the no oh my god
Speaker 2well like i do like a different type of dancing now but it's oh my god no do you imagine today even if kids today had to deal with that shit i would forget that if my daughter if my daughter was like telling me that when i go home like you're out of there yeah you're fucking out of
Speaker 4there you mentioned you mentioned something that interests me earlier with the whole adhd thing because i grew up i know i don't have adhd i don't think but um i mean i am kind of crazy but i don't i don't think i have adhd but i did grow up people who did but when you said that you had adhd but you know you your brother had it or whatever and it didn't really like no one really thought you had it i don't know if i've actually ever met a girl who's been like i have adhd like that's like not like say normal because i mean what's the obviously guys get a woman are gonna get it too but like yeah i feel like that's not a thing that's talked about a lot like it is a woman
Speaker 2a woman having adhd no it's not talked about a lot and that's why it's misdiagnosed a lot too and like i definitely had it growing up i was it's hard for me to concentrate so actually i got diagnosed when i was in utah from the psychiatrist there and i was like yes like finally you know like i can feel something and now you know i'm not on like i'm on adhd medication but it's not a stimulant because i know i'd be addicted to that so it's a non-stimulant um i wish you told me that
Speaker 3like four months ago because i probably wouldn't have listened but that's that's why i relapsed is because i started going back on stimulants that way so yeah when you said that to me i was like oh thank god like i feel so much better for you because it's a dangerous path it's such a slippery slope and
Speaker 2that's why even too like i had to get surgery on my nose because i completely put a hole in my nose by doing too much and after the surgery like i had to get like a piece of like rib put out of me and then put in there like it was a whole big surgery wow they like were just like okay so we're gonna prescribe you percocets and i'm just like as much as i want to say yes like i really fucking wish i could say yes but my mom's right there and she's just looking at me i'm like no like i'm an addict like she's just like are you sure like she kept on pushing it like test oh my god if that was the most real time and so going back and forth between like tylenol and advil sorry being like so in so much pain i'm just like you know what this is gonna be okay it's gonna be worth it like i know i just know so grateful that i made that that that's a pivotal moment
Speaker 3and i when you told me that i was like that was a you wouldn't be i honestly i fully believe that you would not be sitting here right now if you chose the other option because one's not enough it's like we you know oh this feels good the pain's going away what would two feel like yeah
Speaker 4what would three feel like right that's exactly how my like drug of choice was painkillers that's how i got it too i got into a very bad dirt biking accident okay and i ended up yeah and like i'm not blaming no doctors at all i don't like to choose that path it was it was me the doctor gave me like and i rinsed through it in like five days and it wasn't even percocets it was something that was less than percocets and i knew a friend that did percocets and so it's the same ballpark right the painkillers i was taking so then i went to him and i remember going back to the doctor and asking hey like can i get some more it was like tramadol or something it was called and he's like dude i just gave you a prescription like five days ago so the doctor cut me off he didn't give me anything it's not his fault it was me yeah you know i went in you know he could read you i went balls to the wall with it myself yeah and um i'm not saying that doctors aren't responsible sometimes for people's problems but for me specifically it was me that did it myself no one put a gun to your head no one put a gun to my head i put the gun to my own head and yeah it's a it's a slippery slope with any medications right oh yeah i don't know too much about like um the whole like like some of the mental health medications that they give i think that they do help a lot of people but the ones like uh the one value kind of like yeah so it is a benzo yeah right yeah like because i love those yeah good time i was taking i was taking those as well when i was in addiction and like yeah they're for anxiety for anxiety when i was saying like i could i was thinking like i could just go to a doctor tell that guy i got bad anxiety and boom oh yeah i took my doctors all the
Speaker 2time yeah we're good at that oh we're so good that even in my in my like deep deep addiction when things first started really coming back for me like i was living alone in toronto um i would not call my mom for like maybe like three to four days because i'd be sleeping and they all thought i had depression yeah and i'm like sure let's go with that i literally said i'm like let's go just fix me yeah so i was put on antidepressants and then i was still so like up and down up and down but i'd never told them about my actual drug problem like i'm like you guys like it's on it's the cocaine but like okay here we are but it's like but it's it's i was just like keeping it a secret but i was manipulating my psychiatrist being like oh i'm so like i don't know what's
Speaker 4wrong with me like that's so funny it's so fun my i remember having those talks with my dad like pretty close to the end i'm like we were thinking maybe he got like bipolar yeah i was told that maybe there's like maybe there's something wrong with you and like my whole life my dad would tell me like you know you're a special kid you're smart you're gonna make a life and then like as the years got worse and worse he's like i don't know maybe not kid maybe there's something wrong with you and then i remember that phone call like this was after like a couple months and rehab i'm like dad like well i'm not gonna say there's nothing wrong with me but like i don't have that i was just it was the drugs you know it was just the drugs
Speaker 3you take the drugs away and it's like you just magically become you know not at first but it takes a while it takes work that's funny you say that no it was just a cocaine
Speaker 2it was yeah it's basically like it's like let's just put it flat out and it's actually funny when you say bipolar because i was with an ex who was also like he had drugs around him a lot and that's probably why i kept coming back to him because he had what i wanted um but i was living with him very toxic very me using drugs every day uh without him knowing and uh he's like maybe you're bipolar like why are you sleeping all day and then being crazy at night and i'm like it's the fucking cocaine like come on bro but then he he actually went to one of his buddies and got adderall and made me take it and it didn't do shit for me because i'm so pretty high and i'm just like i don't i'm not bipolar like let's just like can we be real but god that was such a weird weird time just like figuring out my mental health but i knew exactly what was going on
Speaker 3and it was addiction plain old addiction plain old addiction yeah but you just you can't tell anybody about it because you're weak right and it's i think that leads me to my next question is like what's for me the biggest misconception in addiction and with addicts is that we're weak right what what do you think is like a big misconception in addiction and
Speaker 2with addicts that's a great question that is a really really good question because like honestly there are times i wake up every day and i am grateful that i'm an addict if i didn't go through this type of work this type of you know trauma work inner child work like if i didn't have an addiction i wouldn't have gone through that and i am so emotionally depressed and i'm so self-aware now that it has brought me into like a whole other level of life addicts are not bad people they are like we are good people we are weak for sure we well sorry i shouldn't be saying that but it's it is like um that's a tough one but i always say they're the strongest people because they are they want the help too and if you get better that that helps sorry i'm not really
Speaker 3making it well i mean you've been through a lot of relapse so i would say you're pretty fucking
Speaker 4resilient yeah resilient yeah i love that yeah for sure i think that addicts are very strong people with weak points but doing what we're doing we're equipped with tools to like you know to defend
Speaker 3those weak points right yes and you mentioned spirituality is one of those yes spirituality
Speaker 2was a huge i love talking about it yeah i know you do i know you do and i think that didn't really happen for me until my mom died which um i always like say this like i wish i got sober earlier and for her but it's you know you can't go back in time but yeah when i say that you know if i was just like a normal drinker and never used drugs like i don't know where i'd be today and i i'm just so grateful to be in a place like this like i'd rather be on this side talking about recovery talking about what i used to be and helping other people that way and you know i used to be go through some fucked up shit and now i i just i feel like life is just more um more without thinking of my words but um handleable yeah handleable sure uh precious more precious way way more precious way more to lose now way way more to lose oh my god yeah so yeah the like the definition of addict and how people view it is always going to be such a low kind of look down upon which um that's why it's that's why it's hard but if it was easy then everyone would be doing it right
Speaker 4and it's a hard thing to admit because i was talking about this with ann yesterday a drug addict or a drug addict obviously a homeless guy was asking me for money a couple weeks ago and uh he i said i'll go buy you whatever you need but like i'm not giving you any money he's like i need a tent bro i need a tent i'm like well let's come with me i'll go buy you a tent and he's like can you just give me the five bucks man i'll go buy the tent and i and he was like we're going back and forth about it and i said you know if you just want this money to get high just tell me i said like uh i've been through it too bro like just tell me and then he said yeah like okay i need to get high i feel like shit right now and what i got from that was that this guy is on the side of the street asking people for money right but and he's not afraid to do that but he's still afraid to admit to to anyone that he's a drug addict right and that goes to show like i mean i can tell you right now i would have i don't know if i have what it what takes what it takes in me to go on the side of the road and ask someone for a that takes oh god right but i never thought of it but he still wouldn't admit that he was for drugs you know what i mean until i said hey man like it's okay you can talk to me about it and then
Speaker 2he did it and when he said it you could see like yeah man like like just the like uh the
Speaker 4disappointment the disappointment that he still feels and he doesn't have this well i'm sure he does but like you know he puts the shame aside to ask people for money but like you know and that's heartbreaking but he won't admit that he's a drug addict right he's gonna sit there and do what we do best lie and say i know i manipulate right well like in especially in probably today's world like
Speaker 2homeless people and especially in the city it's grown obviously grown and it's i think people would rather be homeless and admit that they're drug addicts yeah it's crazy it is crazy very
Speaker 4crazy and that's what brings me back to my point earlier about like i'm not trying to get too political but i don't even know in myself what do we do to help that because like these people obviously they don't have two bucks to go buy drugs they don't have two bucks to go buy drugs how are they going to have the thousands of thousands of dollars to get into a rehab center or how are they going to have the means to get a hold of a place and get on a waiting list and not die before they get into that place like what do we do to help that i don't know but i hope someday some type of awareness gets brought around that issue and something gets done about it because it's it's it truly is heartbreaking and mind those people too but there's millions of people that aren't even on the streets that are you know probably in some trap house or in some somewhere they're getting high every day that that'll never get help i think that uh for
Speaker 3one doing this is one thing that we can do you know we're not going to save anyone's life but if we're getting the word out that there's a better life that's my goal here but i think you're underestimating the fact that he was able to admit that in that moment for like for all you know that could have helped him one step closer onto his journey of recovery because for me the first time i told the truth was i've told the story before but when my dad you know 10 years ago when i was 23 my dad all you care about anthony is the next party what the hell is wrong with you that's all you care about is the next party and i was like dad i'm not even having fun anymore i can't stop and that was the first time that i told the truth and that helped me you know i didn't get sober the next day but it was one step closer where i could finally admit that i was doing something that was not benefiting my life and i was killing myself slowly and like your dad was probably like
Speaker 4that probably made your dad realize a lot because i i also said this before i remember when i said to my parents it was like three days before i went to rehab i went to their house and uh my parents asked me this question for years like why the fuck do you do drugs why i just stopped just stopped but they don't understand and i said mom dad you know this conversation we're having right now this is why this is because i can't have these talks i can't talk i can't do anything unless i'm high to feel normal i need to be high and my parents didn't even have like they didn't even know what to say when i said that they were just like that's not normal that's not good you need some help right so but i remember when i said that to them there was some type of like connection they're like i was just open i was honest and i told them how i felt because before i would just give off that vibe like i just do fucking you know i go to work i do this i do that i'm fine it's a phase just a phase mom i just you know what i mean but no meanwhile i'm doing hundreds of dollars of drugs every day that it's not normal at all so i remember when i said that it made my parents they were thinking about sending me to rehab they were for about a month before it happened but i think it happened things like really happened after i said that to them like no like i'm not just partying and doing drugs i'm not just doing drugs on the weekends like i'm doing drugs from the second i wake up time you know my day my morning my life everything revolves around me getting high
Speaker 2yeah i was always the person that like i'll start tomorrow i'll start tomorrow but i will like when i was like when i was with my ex and always having drugs on me and i would be getting like alcohol like you know drove driven to me like by i don't remember it's like dial a bottle type shit i can't remember but i always say like okay once i get rid of all this alcohol and do all of this i'll be done but then it's like gonna still take me a while to keep doing it right and then once after the three days are done it's like okay now i want more and it's like that deadly cycle but i remember to realizing that i had like maybe this is a problem like i think it was oh god i was i was just always bailing on people and i was bailing and i'd rather get high than hang out with people and i'd rather be alone than hang out with people i'd rather even like grabbing a bag with like friends and stuff i'd grab my own bag secretly and then keep it and then just go get high by myself and then i liked it because nobody judged me nobody judged the amount i was doing a good point and i was like okay this is and i remember like i remember talking to one of my oldest friends too like i grew up with her and she kind of had a feeling like i was losing a lot of weight i was so skinny everyone had a feeling especially from my hometown and i was living there and everyone kind of figured it and i remember my best friend at the time she kind of put me around but we weren't friends for a while but i was like actually like i i have like this is bad this is really really bad and then she starts like crying but i'm like okay forget we said on any of this like forget it you know let's just go have another drink and um if that was that summer was not even a rock bottom for me i know i had still a lot more digging to do but that was a realization of like i like this too much yeah and i'm gonna be like i'm gonna fight until i can get this next high every day and that's all i'm gonna do and like
Speaker 4you another good point you brought up lots of good points i'm happy we had you on today thanks um but one of the things that you said to me that's that stuck out was like you know the end i wasn't even like i was like avoiding friends you know i was just wanting to get high by myself right but i remember the christmas prior to the one that that just passed last year uh the 2000 would have been 24 no 23 20 2023 christmas um i come back from work i was gone for about a month month and a half hadn't seen my family right and i was so excited to see them we were talking for weeks before oh i can't wait to see you i can't wait to see you and i was only there for like four days and i had to go back to work later come on like the 23rd and had to leave on like the 27th okay so i got back on the 23rd and um i was like i'm gonna be like i'm gonna i was working in the bush at the time so like i what there was like very little there was still some drug use at that point but like i wasn't getting as high as i would have i would have been at home because there's nowhere to buy drugs where i was right else i would have been getting high yeah but um i come home and i have like aunts uncles cousins like i have a very very big good family and everyone flew into my little hometown like they do every year to have christmas and i went over the first night that everyone got together for a supper i didn't even go right oh my god and then i went on i went on the christmas eve and i genuinely enjoy these things like i love my family and it's so fun to be around them but i was just wanting to get high so bad i remember i got it was actually on methadone i got super high like completely high to the point where like i was like not even there and i went to my everyone was at my parents house and at this point my dad kind of thought because my addiction was about four or five years of getting real bad but this is probably around like two years ago right we're a year and a half and my dad wasn't sure he kind of thought i was getting better a little bit because i wasn't using as hard when i was in the bush so i come home everyone was happy to see me oh caleb's doing better he found a job he really likes i come back and i was sitting on my dad's couch i'll never forget this and there's like 15 people in the house and i'm sitting on the couch we're all watching tv and i looked at my dad and my dad looked at me and he knew i was fucked up he knew he didn't say nothing but i could see it in my dad's eyes like disappointment disappointment right and then i stayed for a bit i went home uh like barely seeing them over the christmas holidays and i had to leave on the 27th and then i remember me and my dad we had talked about it right like before i left he's like you were fucked up the other day when you're at my house like he was disappointed he was whatever feeling he had he was not happy right seeing his his sun like that but i remember like just i didn't even want to be around them i just wanted to sit in my house and get high not even high with anyone i just wanted to get high on my by myself yeah right and it's just the addiction just takes over you know i have such a beautiful family i have beautiful friends i love my brother is my best friend and i didn't want to spend any time with them after not seeing them for months because i was working i just wanted to get high and then
Speaker 3yeah there i am back off the work so emily um if you could say something to someone right now that's really struggling you know doesn't know how to stop doesn't know what to do next doesn't know how to talk about it what you know maybe a woman maybe a man maybe a person what would you
Speaker 2say to that person right now okay so it i would probably give them a huge hug yeah i would give them a hug and say you're gonna be okay you are not bad you are not a bad person for wanting to do this to yourself you are not stupid you are not you know incapable you are enough this is a problem that you have and you're gonna deal with it but you'll always kind of have that and i kind of like make it clear to them i guess this is actually i'm just totally making this like this is what i would do but i would make it clear to them but then i would always recommend therapy or group therapy or meetings and some kind of professional some kind of professional help because i do actually have people that come to me and say like i've been so bad i can't stop drinking and i'm just like oh god i'm not professional right but like this is what worked for me this is what i did yeah this is what i did and it took me a fucking damn long time like two rehabs later all this therapy all this like sober living too oh my god like it took me a long fucking time but it's so worth it it is so fucking worth it and yeah i would just really tell that person you're not bad because like there's so much shame there's so much guilt and it's so attached and it's just you're gonna like hate yourself and try you can't like this you must be suffering so much in order for you to like want to do this to yourself and we see that i see that i hear you i see you type type of thing so yeah i would definitely kind of approach it that way especially you know like younger women who you know especially like in the sex industry too because i have a lot of friends that were in that that's a bad slippery slope as well i never was in it thank god i um i could have but anyways i could have been not easily but like a lot of my friends were just like deep deep deep into that and they had no way out because they were making all this money but then your their addiction was
Speaker 4also getting worse that's like i'm gonna touch on that quickly because like as a woman like that has to be almost addicting in a way like oh you know like you're a beautiful girl you're like i need some money i know if i just you know put this out there like 150 guys are gonna text me in the first hour absolutely and then you get money you're gonna get money like and i don't want to say that's an easy source of money because i truly don't think it's easy what to put yourself back in my addiction if i knew okay i got to go through this shitty thing for an hour with some guy i don't or a girl i don't want to be with whatever it is but i'm gonna get like a couple hundred bucks it's like that's it's addicting and i actually i actually replicate that
Speaker 2with the tutor that i had like shit i have to go through this next hour with this guy in order to get grades and like i always just had it always felt like do i really have to do this in order to be good like it was just you know to the shitty shitty things i don't know why that just came up but like you saying that just replicated that in a way um but yeah like the industry obviously like i can't really speak too much on it but i did have a girl on my podcast who was in it and it was tough for her to get out of that i could imagine um you know especially with the money coming through but uh when she did get out it was hard for a while um obviously you're not making as much money but of course you if you want to align your life into a life where you kind of picture you if you want to have like a husband or kids like you have to get out of it you gotta get out of it yeah it's just not it's just not gonna work
Speaker 4one of the one of the many things that just isn't talked about enough yeah i think it's important to
Speaker 3note too that some women and you know maybe men too but some women are forced to be there too right like there's a huge you know human trafficking problem that we have absolutely and i just want to add to that too that and i'll share this in the show notes too but there are resources and shelters and safe places where women can go yeah um and you know the the important thing is is you have to you have to come to a realization that you want to stop yeah right you want to get out of it and then reach out for help and the help is there because
Speaker 2people have done it before right you're not alone it's there and um and it's it's it's been easier now i think for that um i had a girl i was in a sober living house who was in the sex industry as well and it like looking at her life i'm like oh god that's that looks hard like it just kind of turned me off of it like all the shit she had to do it's just like that's not does not look fun for me um but yeah there is a dark side to it you know it is not so glamorous as people probably put it off like you know if you love sex like why not get paid for it sure yeah that'd be great but no is there your addiction comes in so many different ways
Speaker 4emily it's been great having you on the podcast where can we find you where can people find you
Speaker 2yeah so you can go to my instagram it's called at talks on the rocks podcast with like an underscore you can also follow me personally it's like the letter m s o u r r r i don't know why but uh listen to my podcast it's on spotify i'm actually if i can say this um season three is coming out may 13th nice so watch out for that i'm gonna have my new episode hopefully maybe have you guys on would be a lot of fun and uh thank you so much for having me seriously this was a really good conversation and it's good awareness yeah thanks
Speaker 5thanks for listening please help us grow the channel and like share and subscribe for more content the discussions and stories shared on this podcast are available on our website this podcast are for informational and motivational purposes only this content is not a substitute for professional medical advice addiction treatment or therapy if you or someone you know is struggling with addiction please consult a licensed physician addiction specialist or mental health professional you are no longer alone Thanks for watching!
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