Tracee Ellis Ross Isn’t Waiting to Be Chosen

I know when you have posted a bikini picture I know but I am not even on Instagram in that way. I know because I will just get texts very varying degrees of Tracy. Oh my god, that is Tracy damn. Yo bro Tracy. That's then I know okay Tracy has just posted something. First let me go and see what was posted so that I can understand. I'm dying right now. Because with other people it would be they've said or done something in public that has brought you don't I mean great shame to them in their lineage. That's what most people would be. That's what most people would be texting me about somebody. Yo did you see what your man said oh my god what happened with you. I know every year you are in Europe somewhere. Yep. A picture has been posted in a pool on a boat in the ocean and then I must now I must now field dating requests. What is there no one that's been worthy? Tracy would I not have sent them to you. Yes, yes, yes, yes, yes, yes, yes. Half of them are married. Yes, oh god. No but in their defense they're not saying like a real but they're just expressing it to me. What do they expect you to do? They just need to tell someone and they just tell the person who's there. I don't know why. Because they're going like you know her then I'm like yes then they're like yo. Then I'm like okay so what do you want me to do with that? Why are you doing this to me? This is what now with Trevor Noah Oh Tracy wait wait wait I want to share this with someone who doesn't understand because it never won't. I discovered Elum tomatoes the other day. What color? Red ones. The yellow ones are the best. Yellow ones are the best. Yeah I say this because I can't eat tomatoes because they're too acidic. Okay. And I love tomatoes and heirloom tomato season in the summer. Sometimes I fucking do it anyway. I'm like fuck it. You know what I'm just going to have acid reflux and I'm doing it anyway. But the yellow ones are the least amount of acidity and they're sweeter. Sweet of them the red. Yes, yes, unbelievable. So you just discovered them? Just discovered them. I mean it's a wonderful time to do. What are you doing that you discovered them? I went to the park to the market, the Washington Square Market. Yes. And then there were average tomatoes. Then I was like I just got paid. No. No. Did you go cash your cash and bring all your cash for them? By the way at the farmers market now, do they take Apple? Yeah, they do. They do. Okay, good. So I had the confidence of knowing that I could afford it. So I went, it's just good. It was wonderful. It was a connection that we were not expecting. I never thought anyone would say that about tomatoes. That's what I mean. He didn't say. I was looking for tomatoes and then I realized I just got paid because in all the weeks that I've been going, depending on my financial situation, at first when I didn't have enough money, I would go to where the old people are. So the stalls were the old people's shops. Then I'd be like, these are bargains, two dollars for this. And then the more my financial situation changed, I went to where the young people were in a week. We need to talk about what is happening here. We need to talk about how you live in your life in a week. Okay. But first of all, I have no need to laugh at that. But I do. No, no, that's not funny. But it was unexpected. Was what the giggle came from? Because it was farmer's market, tomatoes and financial situation, which was not expected combo. How do you think I felt? No, obviously I'm the one who made the realization. Yes, I was standing by the stall. Now, who called you into the heirloom tomato stall? First week, it was where the old people were and they realized they were bargained shopping. And they didn't do heirloom tomato? No, there's no heirloom to it. Just normal, Roma tomatoes. You know, salad tomatoes. Then I went to the other side of the market where we're younger people are. Now, what you have to weigh stuff, because I realize that's where the is. If you have to weigh stuff, then a customer. Yes. Also, because you don't weigh where you've just taken the stuff, they mess with your confidence. There's a whole thing going on in this farmer's market situation that I'm very unaware of. And then they play on your ego as well, because once you've taken three aluminum tomatoes in the bag, weighted in a queue, and then when you don't have to buy them, you're not going to take one out. Yeah, you have to buy them. No, you have to buy them. You have to buy them. Then I took them home. My life changed. I was never the same again. I want to look up how you define heirloom tomato. Like, I know what they are, but like the more grotesque the beta. Yes. Oh, you mean like the farmers. Yeah. By the way, that's the same with neck drool. Nectarines and stone fruits. Yes. When they are more blemished and they have texture on the skin. They're sweeter. It's the ones that are pretty. The more pitina, they're better. Yeah. Isn't that the general issue with American fruit? Is they've made it look beautiful? And they've done that at the expense of the fruit actually being delicious. No way. Yeah. All American produce looks good. Yeah, because and it doesn't taste like anything. Yeah, but in Europe, the produce is not about looking good. No, it tastes good. Yeah. You're in Europe like every year, aren't you? Yeah. And I grew up in Europe. Wait, tell me more. So I moved to Paris and then I went to boarding school in Switzerland. Wait, what? You didn't know all this. I didn't know all of this. And in season two of solo travel, I go back to my boarding school after 40 years and it hasn't. She was like walking in a time. But wait, hold on. This is really interesting. Yeah. heirlooms. I like how she cut out of her life to go to heirloom tomato. It's important. Wait, this is really interesting. Me. Me. Old varieties grown from seeds passed down through generations, prized for their diverse, complex flavors and colors, unlike modern hybrids. They are used in minute. Yeah, that's so interesting. That felt like somebody was reading our like 23 and me. Yeah, I thought that was interesting. That's like how they were talking about us. They're known for rich, complex and sometimes sweet or tangy. Yeah, this, yeah, this sounds like Alvodea. I'm loving. You're exactly. Open, pollinated and grown from seeds saved and replanted year after year. And here's the kicker, the grandmother, the mother, genetically modified. Yes, that's the key. So that's the key. Yeah. And that's what they do with with pumpkins with like competition winning pumpkins. Oh, yeah. They take the mother. What competition are you winning? Pumpkin, pumpkin growing competitions. You know, you're not in the, you know, they have them here in the old country. I just like, I just like I sometimes people will say something and then you just have to keep it moving as a few things are known. You know, like I've noticed that in pumpkin growing competitions or pumpkin, you just said pumpkin competitions. In fact, you don't know this pumpkin. Yes, but he just doesn't understand why you know about them. Yeah, but you said it. This is my, this is what Eugene does. Yes. Thank you. I'm glad traces here now, because now I have somebody who can at least see my point of view. You said, yeah, it's the same thing as in pumpkin competitions. As if you're in them. Thank you. Have you ever been in a pumpkin growing competition? No, but I've seen them on YouTube. Okay. This is what I'm, you know, my hope is to go to range. Your hope is to go to one. Yeah. Okay. But wait, Trace, I want to go back. I want to go back. Yes. Okay. I want to go back with you. I didn't know. I didn't know. Yeah, you, you want to go back. What do you mean you grew up in? Okay. So I was born in Los Angeles. Yeah. And then my mom moved to New York to do the whiz. Your mom died in a rush. Correct. That is just just so in case you don't know. Yes. And so we were here in 1979. Yes. And then in about seventh grade, my mom was moving to Paris to do a movie that didn't happen. Okay. But we moved to Paris. And shortly before that, she had met my stepfather and they were dating. And he had three kids. My mom had three kids. And we moved into this beautiful apartment in Paris on the avenue montagne, right, three doors down from the Plaza Antone hotel. There's some really wonderful stories about that. Yeah. And then we went to boarding school in Switzerland. My stepdad's kids were there. And I went to a boarding school called l'orose, which is in a role, which is just outside of Geneva. I'm not French. We speak French. Oh, okay. Yeah, because the way you're saying all those words. I was like, you better speak French. You better speak French if you don't. You roll, roll, roll, roll. Avignon de montagne. Avignon de montagne. Stade. On Switzerland. You see? So yeah. So we then went to boarding school. What do you want to be? What's wrong? When you say down like this? Oh, yeah. Oh, what is it? Who? Me? No, it's okay. Like this. Okay. Great. Perfect. I moved it when I coughed. You're moving again after the work again. Yeah. But technique flawless. Yeah, I don't want to cough. You can tell people who've like worked in the business for a while. Yeah. Like a professional singer. And I know. And then they go, no. Or they go. Or when the note gets big, you go, Oh is that what they're doing? - This is your ha, yeah. - But I just loved your technique there. You know what, like Haggad, but like a performer who's been in the game forever, and they have like the autopilot of the performance part. You know, so they're on stage. - The old biggest video. - Body is falling apart. They get like wheeled out onto the stage, and you basically hit play, and they just know how to do it, and they just get out there and then it's like, "Sookie smooth, and I dream of a world where. " - Yeah. ♪ You find me ♪ - Yep. - And the audience has no clue this person is dying in front of them. No clue whatsoever. - You don't again, but mute the cough. - What do you mean? - So the cough has to happen, but no sound. - Oh yeah, that's the thing. - And you find me again. - Exactly, no. - Dreaming of you. - That's dreaming of you. - That's like, you did it so flawlessly. Okay, wait, so. - Boarding school in Switzerland. - How old are you? Boarding school? - 13 and 14. - Did you like boarding school? I'm always torn on boarding school, like some people say they love you. - It was terrifying. I found it really terrifying. I mean, especially I'd lived at home with my sisters and my family. I mean, my sisters were there. - How old were you? - 12, 13. - Perfect age to get rid of someone. - My mom went to London with my two, her, my step, my youngest step sister and my youngest sister. Me and my older sister, Ronda and Katinka, my step sister, we were all at Rose. There for a year and a half and then when my mom got pregnant with my brother Ross and Evan, we moved home to the States. But my stepdad always had a place in Switzerland. So for the next 10 years, every summer Christmas, we were back in Switzerland. So Switzerland was a huge part of my growing up. But also those are such formative years. 12 to 14. - He keeps saying this. And yeah, you mean because that's a tough age. Do you have kids? - Yeah. - How many kids and how old? Jesus, how many does he have? - I'm like, what happened there? - I was one in Bangladesh. - No, no, no, no. How many kids do you have? - My daughter's 19. - 19, okay. - I mean, studying 18, sorry. - So you made it through the tough years. - Yeah, yeah. But I did contemplate boarding school and teaching. - You contemplated shipping her off. - I just didn't have the guts to do it. I mean, you did it. You know what would help you ship off your child and use spouse? - 'Cause alone it makes. If I had one of those, you'd have been long gone, you know. - I mean, the thing that's ridiculous, what's so ridiculous is my mom had a new spell. (laughing) I've never thought of it from that perspective. But you did, you kind of, you put it in a, you know, a different frame. Maybe, I don't know. I loved it. It changed my life. - Did it, did it? - Yeah. It changed my perspective. I became a child of the world, not an American. And that completely changed everything. Also, I learned another language. I was living with and around kids from all over the world, like everywhere. So I became a child of the world. And you, I realized, I mean, there's a thing as Americans that you're very American. There's that sense of patriotism that is unlike anywhere else in the world. And slightly bizarre, you know. When you go elsewhere, you realize like, it's like, what is it for that sense of that kind of patriotism? - Right. - Because I'm, I'm love the connection of being a human. And when you live elsewhere, you really go, God, we're all the same. - Yeah, I think, I think sometimes America's patriotism is a little adversarial. And I find in other places, and it's also because America's been so big and so dominant for so long that it sort of, it makes sense. You know, not in a negative way, but it's like, it's very like America versus America. You know what I mean? But most people in the world who come from most countries, you just come from your country. - You just come from your country. - That's it. - And I mean, listen, I am, depends on how you want to define patriotism. I mean, I love being an American. - Yeah, love America, you know what I mean? Absolutely. But there's a different thing that I, if you only have lived here, you have an experience that other thing of like, yeah, this is where I'm from. And these are the special things that we do here. This is part of our culture. And so I just had a sense and an ability to kind of learn the world in that way. And also to be comfortable traveling. Like from a young age, my sister and I were on planes by ourselves. We would take the train. - All the Europe is like that. - Europe is like that. You know, you, we would take the train from the Geneva Airport to Raul and just, you know, you're just figuring it out. You like do that, but there's a sense. And that was, that's very European to do. - Yeah, you see teenagers on trains all the time. - All the time. - Crews of backpacks, just rolling, hopping on a train going to Italy and then Belgium and then the Netherlands. And then like, it's, it's, huh. I never thought of that as a way of like, it's interesting because America's quote unquote very free, but I'll say more restrictive than any other country when it comes to its parenting. - Yes, I, that, that, I think. - But kids are not free in America. - How so? - Well. - You've walked around New York for like a few weeks now. Have you, have you, have you seen the, the kids in the streets? - Tethered to each other? - Literally. - Yeah, yeah. - Have you seen them like, do you have a shouting? - Like a, like a, like a, like on a leash? - Like a prison gang. You know, you know when, you know when a gang in, what's that, what's that movie? - That's, that's a bit, it, it, it, okay. - What's the Nicholas Cage movie where they're all, it's the famous one. Con air, thank you. Con air, yeah, yeah, there's that scene where they're all like walking. - It's not quietly, but yes, but it is. - It is like that. - But it is. - They don't look like it's not chains, but it's leash. - Yeah, but it's like mega, it's like a whole squad of leash. - Yeah. - Go to a park. - Yeah. - No kid is thinking about the parents. - Yeah. - Kids don't just like walk home alone. - No, I mean. - So there's like a, there's, I'm just saying, there's a, there's a different level of like, so can, climb down on kids. - Yeah, I mean, I also think now with safety and security, I mean, growing up, you know, latchkey kids and all of this. And New York is different. Being in a city is different. Growing up in, in New York versus being in the suburbs. But, um, but yeah, I mean, it, it did change my life. It's, who was your first friend in boarding school? Like, who's the first, like, international friend you got? - Well, there was Fabio and Fabioola. - Fabio and Fabioola. - They were twins, Brazilian. There were, um, my best friend was Muhammad Al-Karejee and Caledal Zubati. And, um, I dated, I mean, when you say dated at that age, like, what did we do? I don't know, we kissed on the lips once or something, maybe kissed on the cheek. But Juan Jose Pujana Fernando Luis. - Thank you. - Who we called Puti. But my two best friends were Muhammad Al-Karejee and, um, and Caledal Zubati. And Muhammad and I are still friends. - Till the state. - And I dated, um, also, I say this, it's so funny to me, but I was in love with him. Um, this guy, Moody Elf, I had. - You've ended two relationships now. - Yeah, yeah. Just, I was just tossing him, tossing him, tossing him. - Tracy Ellis Ross. - Yeah, I was Tracy Silverstein then. Tracy, I don't know, Tracy Joyce Silverstein is my real name. And, um, and then who else? Um, the, the twins Jada and Rosie Ardizone, these two Italian girls had the best style in the world and changed, like, I feel like I, I, I, I, I became a style person when I was in Switzerland. - What was the school? Was it like a specialty? - Very fancy, very expensive boarding school called Lerose, L-E-R-O-S-E-Y. And for the winter season, so it was three semesters. - Yeah. - And then we went in the hall for the two summer and spring or the first whatever. - And then we went skiing for the final one. - Yeah, it, we were stodd. - Oh, so you did go skiing. - And we would ski every day for sport. - There you go. - Mm-hmm. - There you go. - And we knew it was fancy, fancy. - This answers so many questions I've always had about you. - Yes. - Because you, from the first time I met you, you've always seemed like the most normal, like, born celebrity person I know. - Mm-hmm, that's kind. But you also exude levels of luxury that I've never quite understood. - Mm-hmm, gennese quoi. - Yeah, true gennese quoi. Because you don't, you don't have it like, like you have money, that's different. That's not what I'm saying. I'm saying like, there are some people who exude like a, it's like a thing about them. And you're just like, where is this from? 'Cause you're extremely, you're one of the funniest people I know genuinely. - That's from Trevor. - No, no, no, no, no, you comedy, and you know what I mean. Tracy just lives in like, it's like the music is always playing comedy, but she can just like, she can just jam anytime with anyone, you know those musicians, you know those musicians where it's like, you can be like strumming something and then they can just jump in, but they can just jump in with you, they can just jump in and start playing with you, that's what you have with comedy. Thank you Trevor. But then you're very normal for a very funny person, which is no, that one is not normal. That's not normal. But you're also normal. Yeah, you totally are. I mean Trevor and I, we have dying to fight hard to be normal. You don't shut up. That's ridiculous. By the way, when I said to you before, I looked back up my phone and you were like, that was ages ago. It was 2024. It's been two years since I saw you. No, it's been two years. That was the last time, when I saw you, was the airport a museum? When was the last time you saw each other? The museum was before the airport. No way. Yes, it was. Damn, time. Yeah, it was two years ago. I was like, that is embarrassing. No, if I had bit money on it, I would have said like six months, eight months. That's why when you said that was ages ago, I'm like, what are you talking about? Yeah, no, no, no. I text you after whatever the last thing you hosted, I text you then But I haven't seen you when I look back the last time I told you it was 2024. It's weird Because I text you to tell you I text you to tell you did a great job hosting Thank you. Did you reply? Huh? Did he did okay? Okay. What is that supposed to be? I am a chair Kanji Wow you G. What is on G. What's that on J on J? J is just it's like you know just I'm just checking. Yeah, I said hi Oh, I first of all I said the ton of Housey Coats interview interview or conversation was great. You said thank you Um, and great job tonight as usual. Thank you Tracy. Yeah, that was out February 2nd. That must have been after the I'm so insane at the words as usual. Yeah, but this yes look um 16 July 12th, 2024. That's when I saw you How often do you see your friends from boarding school? I don't I'm not uh Muhammad very rarely because he lives overseas It's like the ultimate curse of being I sometimes feel this the more you've traveled and the more you've had the privilege of living in different places The more you also have the joy of knowing different people But it also means as life progresses your people are just everywhere. You don't get to like Yeah, there is like a charm of coming from a place and staying there because Yes, yes, yes, and then you have your people. I mean, I have my group of friends. We travel every year in July together Um, I've seen those on Instagram. You know that group. Yeah. Can I tell you? Hmm the amount of How can I phrase this? There are two people in my life that I Load hanging out within public Or having people know that they're attached to me. Huh. It's Tracy Ellis Ross. Why? And it's Idris Elba. I need to understand that the amount of first messages I get What are you talking about? Like I can help those messages. Let me tell you something Tracy. What are they ever people that you should set me up with? And are you failing? I need a mouth. Let me tell you something. I'm so ready. No, tell me. I know Because I will just get texts different very varying degrees of Tracy. Oh my god. That is Tracy damn Yo bro Tracy that's then I know okay Tracy has just posted something. I'm dying right now because with other people it would be They've said or done something in public that has brought you don't I mean great shame to them and their lineage That's what most people would be. Yo, did you see what your man said? Oh my god, what happened with you? I know every year, you are in Europe somewhere. Yep. A picture has been posted in a pool on a boat In the ocean and then I must now I must now feel the dating requests But is there no one that's been worthy Tracy would I not have sent them Yes, yes, some of them are married. Yeah, oh god. No, but in their defense. They're not saying like a real But they're just expressing it to me. Okay. Okay. Okay. You know what do they expect you to do guys? I don't know why They need to tell because they're going like you know her then I'm like yes, then they're like yo Then I'm like okay, so what are you only to do with that? Why are you doing this to me such a bird in it? Ah bra, Idris Elba's the other one. I can imagine let me tell you something Idris Elba be anywhere close to me shake my hand hug me guys. It's finished. It is finished. It is finished the women in your life every woman That knows that I have a phone number uses it And those people all send the same thing Idris That man That's hilarious. Sorry about that. No, don't be I'm just letting you know. Okay. Well, I'll know about I know about your yearly trips to Europe. Yeah. How many friends? There's a group of us Smyra, Remy, Karen, Monica, Kevin, when there's five of us that are always there So and we've been doing it for 21 years. This was the first year 21 years same place And this is the first year I didn't go because I was doing the play. So how many how many of the three of the six Us civilians and how many I think Trevor might be the only like famous person I know In that group that can't be true. No, I mean, I'm just not I my friends. I've known them for 30 40 years. So they have normal jobs Yeah, Monica is a creative director and creative director Smyra is the editor-in-chief of Harper's Bazaar Remy's a makeup artist Karen is a designer that works, you know, for different brands and her own brand Kevin works with Martha Stewart Hi hero So but no, I mean and then I think of my other best friends Anna is the manager of So vintage stores in Los Angeles. Yeah, um and My other friend Anna is a therapist Um, so yeah, this is sounding more like your friend group. Yeah, but I've remember I've always said this yeah I have a I don't want to say this in a way that sounds too judgmental But I'm always suspicious of celebrities that only have celebrity friends. You know, I just find it weird I don't tell you all your friends and I get it all your friends. Yeah, it makes me comfortable It's different if like your friends or celebrities that you worked with yeah, that I understand you've been on a movie for six months Yeah, yeah, do the TV show for 10 years, but if all your friends I'm saying all your friends and then you get new ones as well By the way, yeah, people get new friends along the way And then their new best friend is also celebrity and then they're waiting and the celebrities then I'm like The only thing I'll say is that some people that grew up in the business like that's just who they know Um, I'm one of my best friends is Kelvin Harrison who played my son in the high note. We remain No, he's Kelvin Harris. Oh sorry. Oh Harrison, Jr. Oh, sorry. Okay. Yes Um, and he and I remained just best friends. Um, he's like a really close friend who's an actor Um, I was trying to think that you have to think Yeah, I'm talking about the old. Yeah, yeah, I know. I I do. That's what I love about like so for instance like Rihanna Nope, you've seen like her it's her people when she post now she like post like more like fenty stuff and everything But when Rihanna used to post like her travels. Yeah, no way. Who's that? None of your business. That's who it is. Yeah, the only one the only one we there's one we know Yeah, um, but other than that and we know her through Rihanna. Yeah, no way. Oh, yeah No, it's her friends from her friends. That's like one I think that's one of the most important things You should try and maintain or keep. Yeah. Is just like people from all walks of life But it's also something that for me like my Um, with my people that have known me forever that know my family that know my siblings like they just know my people My and there's my entire nervous system calms down like there's you don't have to do anything You're just yourself. You don't need to be someone. Yeah, you know, um, and we when I'm here go to dinner at there You know, we cook dinner at someone's house or whatever like we're all going over to Kevin's on the 13th And it's so nice. It's so nice to just be with your people Kevin's only guy in this group Um, he's one of the only guys there's husbands and stuff, but he has been yeah There's husbands and children they like Monica like my best friend Monica from college Yeah, my Monica from college her he she had the first kid of the group He's going to college like me met in college does that make you feel like now? Yeah, I mean, I have so much pride, but also like Like I we knew each other in college and now her kid is college Yeah, yeah, like I remember when he came out do you know what I mean like I remember the night we went to dinner before he Like there's like so many things like that that are just nutty to me But then also I have a really big family and I'm really close with my siblings Seven um, no, there's five of us and then there's three step siblings But the five of us are really close and all of their kids. We're really close So I'm the only one that doesn't have kids in my family um, so my older sister ronda her son is about to turn 17 Reif He um lives here in the city with her my sister chudney has two kids call away And everley who were just here came to see the play and came over the apartment the other day and then Ross has two kids Indigo leaf and indigo beautiful names and then Evan has two kids um Jagger and Ziggy and so there's like a full on you know, we have a big squad of a family That was another thing that blew up my phone Is there was a post going around about you that said you were looking for a sperm donor And then you all you had accepted one that was that I was pregnant. That's a weird. By the way I was like was that a slow news day like what who out of nowhere decided to come up with and they took a picture of a pregnancy test Yeah, my favorite thing was whoever was holding the pregnancy test everyone underneath was like those aren't Tracy's fingers Those aren't her nails that's not her uh-uh that she was nuts I thought that was crazy. I was like what are you guys talking about? What are you talking about? I never understand Like I don't know where was like like I if there had been a picture of me with like a bloated tummy I would have been like okay, no just was a just so so what I've learned in in the weeks You know or months since that story came out is there are I don't even know if you call them like companies. There's like a bunch of people online Who generate fake content is that true? Yeah, yeah, and all they're trying to do is create engagements and that's all no They just create fake stories about everyone everywhere - What does that do for them? - Clicks. - Clicks. - Clicks, and clicks. - And then. - Look at how much this story, we're talking about it now. - We're talking about it now. - And it gets aggregated. - Yeah. - And it goes up, and it blows up, and it blows up, and it blows up, and it blows up, and it blows up. And they're getting money from it. - Oh, really? - Yeah, you get paid. If your tweet gets you to a certain amount of time, you get paid. If your Facebook post gets you to a certain amount of time, you get paid. So now, because we live in a world where-- - Clickbait is-- - Yeah, you're rewarded for attention. People now use any means to get attention. So you find, that's one of many stories about you, but that one just got you up. - So you find they'll make up-- - I've seen ones about me that range everywhere from, I like, retired with my family on an island somewhere. - You did it? - Yeah, with my wife and kids. I'm like on an island. - You have a wife and kids? - Yeah, apparently. - Neat. - And then there's another one, where-- - Look at that. - That would be nice. (laughing) - That's so nice. (laughing) - There's another one. My favorite one is like, there's a series that does very well on Facebook, where I like save people's lives. And it does very well on Facebook. - I'm so happy right now. - I have people's lives. - Oh. - And when, like, they know, just like-- - Like randomly, it'll be like, it'll be like, let me tell you a story about Trevor Noah that no one else will. One day, my family and I were in our car and we had just been in an accident. The car caught a flame and started burning. We thought we were surely going to die. I then heard a tapping sound on my window. - No. - I looked. There was a man beckoning for me to move away. He smashed the window, then pulled me out, then proceeded to pull out every single member of my family. - And it was Trevor Noah. - At the end, I looked up. It was Trevor Noah. At first, I thought, and this is a whole story. And then, like, people in the comments, like, yeah, I knew it was a great game. - Yeah, wow, this is so good. This is beautiful. And I'm just like, this is weird. - That is great. - And if you know what, it doesn't, it doesn't sound very far-fetched. - I could see you save-- - You are the kind of guy. I wouldn't save-- I wouldn't save a person in America. I would save someone everywhere in the world. - Yes, you know what? - Explain why. Explain why before you judge me. Explain why. - I have judged you. - My lawyers have told me. My lawyers have told me. They've said, in America, if you make that mistake, you can lose everything. - What do you mean? - If you help somebody who is in an accident, they can then sue you and say that you are the reason that they are now hurt or disabled or paralyzed, what do they mean? - Do you have to be famous to avoid that trap or just anyone? - No, no, anyone, anyone. - Really? - No, no. I'm being, it's something I hate, but it's like, because the country's so litigious, if you, let's say you, someone's in the car burning and you pull them out. - If they're injured. - And listen, they have a spinal injury-- - Pills off. - Whatever. Yeah. - Most of it is in your hand. - There you go. - And then they just half-- - Now they're like a zebra. - Listen, you've gone too far. Now they're like a zebra. We've gone into another story. - This is, you're wonderful, you, you, you, you, but this is too far, okay, because yeah, it's okay. And I really enjoy your company. I think he feels wounded. He's picking lint off his pants. - But yeah, you can, they can sue you. - That's really interesting. - Yeah, because they can say you caused the injury and then you'd have to disprove it, you'd have to go to court. It's a whole thing. - Wow. - So you have to, you have to be very careful. It's, it's sad, but it's, it's a real thing. - Huh. - So I would try to save people in almost every country in the world. In America, I would be like, this is risky. It's a tough one. - Very interesting. - I mean. - Haven't you been told these things? I was told once if I'm ever in a car that has an accident, I must jump out immediately and just walk away. - Oh, what? - Not me driving. - Even if you're not driving. - Yeah, especially if I'm not, if I'm driving, I have to stay at the scene. - No. - Who's telling you these things? - If I'm driving a, Tracy, do you not get the celebrity snapple that has the facts on the bottom? That tells you what to do for your celebrity. - I've never, I don't drink snapple. Maybe that's why. The snapple still exists. - It does. It really, it really exists. No, but this is, this is another thing. You've never been told this? - No. - Damn. Maybe my, maybe the people I've met in life have just been like, ultra-corsors, or they've just been scamming me. I was told. - I'll go with ultra-corsors. - Wait, do you have more? That's the one I was told. If I'm being driven, you know, like those SUVs come and pick you up. That car gets into an accident. Get out. Get out. Walk away. - Well, now I know. - Because otherwise the person will now make it about you, not the driver and the car. So how will they make it about, they'll be like, because they'll go, Tracy Ellis Ross's car hit me. And you're like, it's not my car. They're like, no. We'll find a way to make it your thing because you are the person who has the highest possibility of paying, like you can pay a higher amount of money. - Yeah. Wasn't there a story of someone who rescued someone from a building and then, oh, they caught them jumping and then they broke their fall and then that person sued them for breaking their fall. Yeah. I'm sure you don't know these things because of breaking the fall. What's the craziest thing? Surely your mom like taught you like crazy things that like you can and cannot do. - First of all, Trevor, please don't use the word your mom just to write it down. - What must I say? - Someone's mom is Diana Ross. - Oh, she's my mom. - No, but, Tracy, it's okay. I'll take this. - No, no. Okay. (laughs) - It can't. It can't. (laughs) - Go. Okay, go. (laughs) Oh, my god. (laughs) - Oh, yep. Okay. Please. - You can just say, oh, so, how much I say it? - No. He said it right. - You can say, Ms. Diana Ross, your mom. - No, because. - Oh, that's a nice way to say it. - Yeah, that's nice. - Also, we mustn't pretend, not only, but, okay, that's a nice way to say it. - That's just for me. - Okay. - Everyone else, not all do that. - It feels like I do. - Okay, okay, okay. - So, Tracy, what were you taught by, were there any lessons you gleaned about the world of fame from Ms. - Second. I love this. - That's good. - That's very good. Thank you. - Yeah. - Although I have to say, maybe for the podcast and for you, but like, if we were at dinner and you did that, I would punch you. (laughs) - And then you'd have to walk away. - I would feel like Trevor. Go to your room. - You'd punch him and then get away. He doesn't sue you. - Exactly, exactly. And then I'd run. So he doesn't sue me. Good. Circle back. Nicely done. Oh, he said it. I'm like, what? - So. (laughs) - I'm not sure about that. I don't know. I don't know. I did it. But then I was like, I don't know. I don't know. I liked it. - Oh, man. - Honey. - I don't know if there's some lessons. That's really interesting. I mean, I think there's so many things I learned that I don't know that I learned. - You must have seen. - I mean, there's tons. - Like. - But you know, because I grew up in this. - Yeah. - So it's different than coming into it and then sort of someone giving you lessons. There's many things that I'm very aware of that I know other people are not aware of. - Okay. - That I, I mean, I scan a room. I can, I can feel and see and know what's happening in a room. I can tell people that are, you know, for example. So I'm doing this play right now. Every brilliant thing. And in the beginning of it, in the pre-show, it's an interactive play. So there's-- - What does that mean? - That means that I tell the story with the audience. - No way. - So there are, I'm telling a story and there's a list in the story. And when I say numbers in the list, we've given out cards and people throughout the audience from balcony to on the stage. - Yeah. - Say the things that are on the card. And then we also cast five roles from the audience in the pre-show. And we bring, so we, so in that moment, I'm scanning the room, along with the three other associate directors. And we are looking for the right people who are willing, who are a little bit reluctant. - Little bit reluctant. - He would be a no. - He looks, yes. - You see how high you're almost. - Yeah. - I mean, he didn't even let me finish. - He said willing. - Exactly. - And you're almost having a little bit reluctant. - No timing is too much. - And we look for five people who are willing to do five of the roles that make that part of the story better if I do them with someone. - Why do they have to be a little bit reluctant? - Because the onus on me is to keep the story moving and to sort of conduct the room and the energy in the room. If people are too eager and they try to perform or be funny or act, it pulls us into and away from the story. - You get people who are going to come to the show to try and make this their own difference. - Yeah, ready to act. - Yeah, yeah, yeah. - And it doesn't work. The main thing that we ask of people is to be kind. Everything works if you're kind. And if you're open and you're honest and you listen. If you try to perform and be funny and pull the attention, even me, like my job is not, it's not about me. I'm there to be of service to the story. And so in those moments, this is back to the mom thing. I'm Miss Dine Ross. So in the moment of scanning the room, I'm very aware, and this comes from my childhood. I'm very aware of which people are real fans, which people are pulling attention. Like if you've ever been in a room and you can tell people know that you're there and so they start laughing louder because they're being, they're conscious that you're there and they are trying to be comfortable. - I've never caught the laughing one, but they're certain. Mine is the opposite, silence. I know when the silence around me is artificial. - Yeah. - So people just quiet down, because now they're listening to your conversation with your friends or whoever you were. - Or they're doing this? - Yes, very casually doing that. - So I grew up. - You also know because they've been cutting the same piece of steak for like five minutes. (laughing) You know what happens in a weird way? No, it's really strange. Like people turn into backgrounds. extras. They just, they listening. Well, people get also people just get uncomfortable, you know, they haven't seen somebody famous that they, you know, know from a TV show or from your stand. It's understandable. Yeah, you know, it's like, it's like when you, this is what I was liking it to, like if there's a guy or someone that you're flirting with or you like or whatever and all of a sudden you're like, what do I do with my hand? Like all of a sudden you're hands, we come these like, these things that are just like, hello. You know, this happened to me yesterday. I was playing, I was playing pickleball yesterday and it was like a random session with no one knew anyone and then it was a random session with nobody knew anybody. Okay. Do you guys find more ways to make the sport more awkward than it already is? So, so the place I was playing at has giant windows that look out onto the street. Like the street, I know this, the street streets. So if you're playing on one court in particular, people are just walking by you in New York. Not one way, two-way glass. People are walking by you in New York. So at some point, some, no, a whole group of people gathered. But they were really funny. It was like these kids, it was like, I want to say like eight, like 13-year-old white boys with like fluffy hair. Just like they looked like they were having a lot of fun. And they came and stood by the window and then they saw it was me. So first they were like, oh, it's Trevor's. Then they made it like seem like they were watching the US open, which made it so funny because it's pickleball. So they were like cheering, they were screaming, then when the point would go wrong. That's actually amazing. It was amazing. They were doing the most like extreme version of it. But then the people who we were playing with, shame, there was one kid, because we're in like random rotations. One kid I was playing with, he didn't know what was happening. So he turned to me and he went, say, kid, you played like eight. No, I played with, because I played against him, but I also played with, oh yeah, you're right. Sorry, there was a kid who was on the team that I was on. Thank you. Thank you. Thanks always looking out for me. So the kid, then he just turned to me and he went, what is going on? He's like, why do these guys love pickleball so much? That's so cute. Yeah, but then he couldn't, he couldn't play. He's like, he's like, I can't do this, but this is so distracting. Why does that guy have a shirt off? And one of the guys had a shirt of the most swinging in the round and they were cheering. That's amazing. I wish people would be more like that, just like, just acknowledge it. Or be obvious. Yeah, yeah, be like super, super obvious. As soon as Tracy Ellis russets down next to you, just be like, Tracy Ellis russ just sat down next to me. Well, my dinner got more interesting. This is not the way. It's out of the way now. Now it's out of the way. I mean, people get uncomfortable. I don't know. I mean, it's such a funny, it's a funny thing. And our culture and American culture is so obsessed with it is. Same in a way that's odd. You know what I think it is? I think it's because America doesn't have royalty. Maybe I was going to say, because I also think like, I was, I took some time to figure out like with sports and professional athletes. Yeah. And I was like, they're modern day warriors. They are. So it's similar to, you know, it's like, they're these, these gods that like do this thing. And then I guess celebrities, yes, it's, it's royalty in a way. It's this, you, you're held up in this way that you are super. I think this country understands, or the reason why it loves celebrity so much is because it understands that fame is a, it could come to you at any time. So people believe that if they read it now, I think people believe that I don't think that always stick to. No, I think they do. I mean, and they can, by the way, you can't be that person. It was the people, they, that was unreachable. There's super famous kids that you and I don't know about. But in their world, on YouTube. Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, that's competing. For sure. For sure. Oh, yeah, yeah. We don't know them. No, no, no, we don't even understand, I don't even understand some of that. I mean, there's people, there were these kids that became famous for like opening up toy boxes. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Like massive, massive, massive. Yeah, fascinating. Only Ryan, I think is his name. Yeah, is he still a kid? Actually, that's going to be interesting. It's going to be Ryan's growing fun. Yeah, the kid. Yeah, he was massive, massive, massive, massive. We're going to continue this conversation right after this short break. Is this your first time on Broadway? No, my debut. I heard that the other day, I was like, that can't be true. And it's a one person show, a Tony nominated one person show. Yeah, it's amazing. How was this the first time the finger touch forces us to engage? Yeah, that is very intimate. And also the attention that is required. Yeah, you have to take a lot of focus, which is very random. Yeah, I don't know. And it's like the, you know, but the next level of it is locking in eye contact. Wow, okay, you were telling us about this. We'll get there. We're not there yet. That's the we've gone too far. No, but congratulations. Thank you. It's been really exciting. Why has it taken you so long is maybe the first thought in my head. And I mean, I mean, I mean, this is a compliment because someone said this to me that other day. They said, this is Tracy's debut on Broadway. And I was like, no, that's wrong. I confidently was like, nope, that's wrong. They were like, no, it is. I was like, nope, that's wrong. It can't be. But it is. I mean, it's interesting. It's felt like coming home in all of us. That's what I mean. Yeah, I mean, I, um, and this play in particular is extraordinary because it uses every aspect of my skill and my ability. Like, it's the, there's improv. Okay. There's me telling the story. There's some singing in the middle of it. There's humor. It's real. It's a story about mental health and depression and suicide and removing the stigma around that. So there's that underneath it, but it's the stigma around committing suicide. Yeah. It's a story about a person whose mother has made multiple attempts. Oh, wow. And in response to that, this seven year old comes up with this idea of making a list of everything brilliant about the world. And so it's, it's, um, it's both heavy, but it's told in this joyous, buoyant, like, life-affirming way. And it's a really beautiful piece of material. And it's like 75 minutes, 80 minutes. And it's, you know, house lights up. There's, audience on the stage with me. It's participation with the entire room. And, it's not stand up because there's a script. Yeah. But there's, there's an element of that, that sort of energy and it's glorious. It's glorious. It seems like you're having fun. How long have you been, how long have you been going now? I've did a five week run. I'm in my last week right now. And then it's done. Oh, no. Yeah. And, um, yes, but oh, no. Yeah. I mean, it's, it's, it's been the perfect amount of time. It's been wonderful. Um, I did, I took about two weeks to learn the material. I got to rehearsal pretty much off book. And so I had three weeks of rehearsal. And when I first started, it genuinely felt like swallowing a whale. Like, have you ever tried that? It's a lot. I'm, I'm trying to understand what that analogy means too much. Exactly. It was just like, what is this thing? I was like, I can swallow away. What's wrong with you? It's okay. It's weird when you've been alive for more than 40 years. And then you hear a phrase you've never heard before. Correct. I've never heard it's like swallowing a whale. I was, I was trying to figure out what it felt like. And it felt like trying to swallow a whale and then mama bird it back to the audience like it wasn't a whale. Like it was just the thing that I was delivering. And even though I had learned the material because of the improv, the novelty of every performance is different choosing the people. Like the whole thing was just like, what? And so even in rehearsal, you are sort of gaining your way. It's so it was, I don't even know how to explain it. And then by the, by the, by the second week in rehearsal in the rehearsal space, there's 25 people in the room that you don't know. And you're all of a sudden doing the play, bringing these people in. And so it was just like, I felt like every cylinder was firing. And then you get into the theater at the end of your third week of rehearsal. And on Broadway, I didn't know this was a thing. But your dress rehearsals are called invited dress. And they invite other Broadway people who can't necessarily go to other shows because they're doing shows. And my dress rehearsals are at different times. And so the street nights, but it's during the day like they're weird times when there aren't shows. And the first dress rehearsal had 150 people. The second dress rehearsal had 400 people. And then all of a sudden is the first night. And the theater's full. And you're like, there we go. And I felt like I was flying with my feet on the ground. Oh my god, that was crazy. And then what was it? Here we go. That was so brilliant. Yeah, that was so good. It was like nuts. I was like, okay. And we're off. Like it was. Have you done the animation? Yes. Okay, thank god. Thank god. I was hoping. I was like, surely there's like every, every, every different platform. I would hope as it's like reached out to you. - Which animation did you do? Which show? - Oh God, I did Rugrats at one point. - No, I did a fun silly role on there. I did a series recently that I had so much fun doing. I don't know why I can't think of what it's called. I'm about to do another one right now, a really fun one. I think I've done about five things. The series I did. What was that series called? I loved it. - What were you doing in it? - I was playing like a blob. And it was, God, what was that called? Rachel, what was that called? - Rachel, what was it called? Where's Rachel? Where's Rachel? - Rachel is just what Tracy says when she can't think of it all. - Rachel is my alter ego. - Rachel, what was that called? Rachel and Tracy's AI. - That series was so fun. And I played a, yeah, it was like a blob. I also just did another one. That isn't out yet about the planets that was fantastic, that is all about the relationship of the solar system, but we're, you know, humanized. And I played, I want to say I was Saturn. I don't know. And I had a really funny voice. - You would seem like you're having fun. - I enjoy what I do. - No genuinely, like every time I, I. - I mean, otherwise. - I've never asked you this, but like how do you, how do you keep finding the fun? How do you keep enjoying it? How do you keep? - Some of its gratitude. - Yeah. - I feel grateful to be able to do what I love. You know, I run a business. I have a beauty company and I'm a CEO and founder and I'm day to day in that business. - But there's like a real company. - No, no, like a real, no, no, I'm just saying this 'cause you know some people founders and CEO of nothing. - Oh, yes. And I say this with respect to them. - Every time someone says that, there's no respect included. 'Cause if it was respectful, we'd need to mention the respect. - No, but sometimes. - But a lot of people say CEO and founder. - And the next thing it's not. - And they are, but they are the only person in the business. - Yeah, there's just an IP address in there. - Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. So no, this is like a real thing. - Yeah, I've got that. - How many years has Pat been going now? - We're about to be seven. And, you know, we have 11 retail partners. - It's got a huge now. - Yeah, it's really, it's a, you know, booming company and it takes a lot of work. So there's that part of my life. And I'm very good at that and I love it. And I love being a boss lady and I love going to the office and I love that kind of solution work that I do. And the creativity that's in that, for me, because the marketing and branding is really my, and storytelling and visual language, that is really my wheelhouse. And I love that. But every time I get to be an actor, every time I get to play to have a sense of play to use my imagination to be this like, you know, just creature who is not afraid of anything and just has complete liberation within my body and my mind and all of that. And to just do that, I am lit up in a way that I cannot explain. And I'm so grateful. I mean, also, you know, I'm a black actress in Hollywood. It's not like they throw in parts at me. Do you know what I mean? That's not the way this business works. And still, I mean, I get great work, do you know what I mean? But it's still, it's a thing. You know, you've got to figure that it's a thing. And so when I, and I do say no to things now, like, you know, it's wonderful. Some of it is pattern. Like, I've been able to, I have, you know, an income and I have made good money and I don't have to do things to uphold my life. And that is wonderful. And I say things, I say yes to things that either not for financial reasons all the time. Sometimes it's just that it like lights me up. Like it's just something I really want to do or try. And I just feel grateful, I love it. I love being a human. I love what being an artist and an actor allows me to do is a human to touch other people's humanity. I love being silly. I love, you know what I mean? Like I always say to people, like when it comes to dating, one of the things I'm like, you can't think that I'm going to be the prize on your arm and be that thing. Where in my life I get to fly like an eagle every day and be as big as I want to be and as small as I want to be and as sexy as I want to be and as, like, to do all this and then I'm just gonna, I'm gonna cook it, like, you know, and joking me wrong, like I'm a caretaker and I'm gonna cook for you and all those kind of things but not because you expect it, not because you want it. - Just because that's part of who you are. - You're not gonna put me in a box and just be a little thing over here. Like I'm a, I'm a full planet. - Does that mean dating hard? - Yeah, so let's just be. - I know. - Yeah, I'm a solar system. - Yeah, I don't think you're a planet. - I think I'm a solar system. - Yeah. - And I don't know that it makes dating hard. - It does. You think it does? - A hundred percent. - Why? - I think what you've just explained is what a potential partner sees. - Can I tell you what you've just explained? - No, but also what you've said. One of the greatest pieces of advice I got too late in my life and but I wish everyone got was from Esther Parall, she was a guest on the podcast and she said the number one thing she would encourage people to do is date as friend groups. And I was like, what do you mean? And she said, one of the worst mistakes people make is they go on dates as individuals. And when you're on that date, you're only seeing one side of the person because it's a very natural thing. It's not like, you know, it's not always like people are pretending or not pretending. But it's very difficult to be all sides of yourself when you are with one person. But they said like, if you go out as groups of friends, like literally she said, people should try their best to go, hey, me and my friends are going to do this. Would you like to bring some of your friends and we're gonna hang out? She said, you'll be shocked at how quickly you get to know the person like really, really quickly. - That's actually sweet. - Because the other person can't hide themselves when all their people are around. - No, you can't. - So you'll see them, like you might be shy with strangers, but when you're with your friends, you really come alive. You might be nice with strangers and with your friends that ask for it really, yeah. And that thing, you know, to what you're saying now, it reminds me of that idea, I get what Eugene is saying, because if somebody meets you as Tracy in one dimension, in one planet of your soul, - And they have met you? - Yes. I can see them going, oh, this is who she is all the time. And then the boss lady comes up and they're like, whoa, I'm a little intimidated by that. Wait, she can just go to Europe when she wants to, and yeah, I've always wondered that genuinely, especially when it comes to ultra-successful women, is how much harder it is to date. - But I think ultra- - Because men can be very insecure about being with an ultra-successful woman, because what do I bring to the table? - No, but I think that cuts across everyone. I think what ultra-successful and famous people take for granted is the fact that their potential partner wants what a normal partner would want. They want the exclusivity. - And so do I. - Yeah, they want to be with, but also if you're ultra-famous, people already know you, and they're already known you before you knew them. - Interesting. - They can't pretend they've never seen you before. - Interesting, yeah. - So they want the side of you that has never been-- - The guy who played pick-a-ball didn't know who Trevor was. - But he was a 14-year-old kid. - Don't date him. (laughing) - This is not appropriate, Trevor. For me, or for you, sorry. - I don't know where that went. (laughing) - Just, I'm sorry. I realized it was not what I thought. - You see the comedian. - I thought he was a grown person. So when you said that, I was like, "Oh, no." - You see what I mean now. - This is what I mean. - That was so funny. I had not pictured him as a 14-year-old. - No, oh, I'm sorry. - I'm so funny. - I should have painted. - For some reason, when you were painting the picture, I didn't picture him that way. So when you said that, I was like, "Ah, no!" (laughing) - Sorry, okay. - The exclusivity thing is it's an interesting-- - That's interesting. - And also, you're loved by more. Like, I mean, you know, if you're dating me and then I put up a bathing suit picture and Trevor's getting-- - Yeah. - Yeah, yeah, yeah. - Yeah, I mean, I don't know. It's interesting. - Who do you think it's been easier for you to date civilians or fellow celebrities? - I've not really dated fellow celebrities a couple of times. No, no, I have a little bit, but not so much. I don't know. I mean, I feel like right now there's a question, I'm like, should I be dating, 'cause I'm 53, I'm like, should I be dating like a 62-year-old man? - No. - He's so weak with his answers. - He's already like-- - Like, he's-- - He believes he believes in himself. - No, he's not. - I know, but so here's the question then. Make my profile, what are we doing? Like, go! - Yeah, no, no, no. - Maybe like, at a stretch, 45. - At a stretch, what? - Yeah, if you like, I'm dating someone who's old at your age and your looks and your ability-- - But 62 is not-- - But 62, but 62 is not-- - It's not a f-a-vestance. - I have f-a-vestance. - It will all be a f-a-vestance. - You do a f-a-vestance. - Any 61-year-old. - Really? - Yeah, you should be with someone who's as bright as-- - I mean, I'm dating-- - I'm just bright-y. (laughs) - This guy's as brightly. - I know, I know, I used to be in a way. - This guy's as bright as-- - I'm moving to the old-- - I moved to-- I moved to-- I moved to the old-- I moved to the old way, like it was him. (laughs) - Spritely, get the fuck out of here. I'm not that-- oh my god. I don't know, I mean, I've dated younger guys, and that's been interesting, and then sometimes it's-- I mean, it's individual. - It's always individual. I mend my age often, I don't know, I don't know. I think it's individual. Every guy is different. I will tell you-- - Image your sentence first. - No. - Men your age? - No, I'm not doing it. I'm not gonna do it. But what I will say is-- - There are really great guys out there. I'm not gonna-- I'm not one of those women who's like, "I don't know, I don't agree with it." I think there's really great guys out there. I think my thing is, think of how many people I know like me. Not so many. So maybe it'll take some time for me to meet the person that's a match for me, I don't know. I mean, how many people are out in the world like you? You're pretty unique. I don't know you well enough to say that about you. I don't want to leave you out, but like I know Trevor decently well. (laughing) - Yeah, you're a great guy. - No, no, no, no, no. - You should have lots of options, but you're in the other hand. - I don't know you. - You just discovered Enlune Potatoes, man. - I don't know you, I don't know you yet, okay? - I don't know if you go in with anyone, man. - I don't know you, okay? - But I know him, and what he said was. (laughing) - Okay, so I'll tell you this is what I've learned from myself and from my life. There is, it's interesting, as having a conversation, I was in Sweden, I was in Stockholm. So that's some random dinner was an event with mixed business people, there were actors, blah, blah, blah, just a real smog as bored as they say of people, right? And I'll sit next to this woman who's just like, man, you want to talk about a boss lady, like, has connected everyone in the world of business and she's run successful businesses. She's like, killed it. You know, she's like, vacations on yachts and like, like, full on, full on, full. You can even tell how far I'm from her 'cause I say yachts, 'cause rich people say boats. That's what I've learned. Yeah, if you've grown up with money, you say boat. - Oh, so, yes. - If you haven't grown up with money, you say yacht. I say yacht. - That is great. - That exposes how I grew up. - Yeah, yeah, yeah. - Yeah, I haven't like, you turn a lies money. It is a tell, but when you grown up around money, you say boat, always. Do you want to join us on Gerald's boats? - And the boat could be as big as a city. - It will be as big as a city. - But it's a boat. - Yes, you always say boat, when you have money and you've grown up in money is the important thing. When you haven't, you'll say yachts. So anyway, as she would say, she's on boats, I was like, oh, she vacations on yachts. So we're talking, we're talking, we're talking. And then she said to me, it was really interesting that we have in this conversation. And then she said, I feel like I'm a failure in life. I was like, this is strange. You've just told me about the greatest list of accomplishments ever. What do you mean, you think you're a failure? And she said, well, I'm 60, 62 years old. I, you know, my kids are amazing and they love me and we vacation all the time and they're great and they're doing well. And my businesses are doing well. And like, you know, my friends and my ventures and everything I touch turns to gold. But I just, I can't find the person for me. And, you know, it feels like love is a story that I will never, you know, complete. And I feel like a failure. - That's hard, hard perspective. - Yeah, but it was interesting because I said to her, I said, maybe it's because it's so clear to me because you're saying it from the outside. But I found it interesting that she was willing to define her entire life. - Through that. - Through one lens alone. When every other metric, and I mean every other, she's in shape, she's in shape. - But you know, I've done speeches about this, really? - Oh, yeah. But that's societal. She's pushing up against a societal norm and a cultural and a patriarchal and misogynistic norm that is, even if you don't know, that's what you're fighting against. That's what you're fighting against. - The thing that defines your value as a woman who wants you. - Yeah. - Oh, damn. - And I won't subscribe to it. I don't. My life is wonderful. And I experience loneliness and all of it. And I want a partner. And I might not find one. Why, I don't know, you know? And I'm not going to make that mean something about me. I'm not going to decide that because I, and you know, and then the other thing is on girlfriends, I talk about this all the time, but on girlfriends for eight years, 173 episodes, I was a successful woman who couldn't find a partner and was waiting to be chosen. And I didn't realize it, but when I left the show, I have spent years and I talk publicly about it now because I didn't realize how much I had spent years waiting to be chosen. And I started to realize, I'm like, what the, I'm the chooser. I can choose my partner. And I can choose, I don't have to sit around being a prize, making a life so that I get chosen. I'm also the person looking for a partner. And society tells women that that's our worth, that having children and, I mean, not everywhere, but that is, that is the most part. And finding a partner. I mean, and then it's the thing that people ask you all the time. And I'm like, oh, yeah, why are we so interested in this? You know, you know what I've noticed, though? It's similar to alcohol. People press you until you say you went too far and you've stopped. But if you just say, I'm not drinking. So if you say no thing, if you go, people will press, you do like a drink and you go, I don't drink alcohol. They go like, why not? Why do you do like a drink? But if you say, I stopped, people are like, oh, oh, oh, oh. Same thing with your relationship status. If people say, are you single or you married? You say, no, never married? You've never been, no, you've, but if you go like, yeah, divorce and then people go, oh, I understand. I understand. Yeah. You have, okay, okay, here's my favorite. You know, I'm 53 people like, for a while there, there was, have you ever thought about having children? No, never thought about it. I'm so glad you brought it up. Should we talk about it now? You and I, should we talk about what? Let's, well, let's get into it. What the fuck are you asking me? I've never thought about it. I'm so glad you brought this up, though. I'm so glad you brought this up. I never thought, do you think, what is, I mean, is it time? Do I do it now? What am I doing? I would hate to meet you on the wrong day in the wrong setting. Your brain, 'cause you see, that's what I mean, you're the perfect combination of the linden. Yeah, but like, she's too smart and too funny to not eviscerate you. Now, imagine meeting this person red and blue. Can I tell you funny? And stepping on the wrong land, my brother. It's finished, brother, you finished. And you don't know what happened and I'm laughing. I'm like, can I tell you a really funny story about a famous, a very famous comedian? Yes. Who came on, I'm gonna make it as vague as I can so that no one will call that. Electrical, who came on a show that I was my show. Yeah. And came and was doing a funny bit and decided in front of everyone to try and viscerate me with his comedy. Who we? Tried to think that the pretty girl who was, this was back in the day, nobody really knew what I was capable of or not. But you know, when I get pushed into a corner, I, you have that, that's gonna happen. And so I, with humor, on camera, in front of everybody and it was my house, you know what I mean? I eviscerated him and I was like, and then when I walked away, I was like, wow, that was harsh but I was like, he did it to me first. Yeah, no, no, no, that thing. But you know, when two standard comedians. Don't put us, don't put us in the corner. Don't do that. I've seen people do it with Eugene, where I watch, and I see Eugene's eyes, like slowly like build it and I'm like, oh, goodness. Oh, goodness, you'll get him. No, I've seen you. I've never had that. You'll get Eugene on like a chill day and then you get like random people like, look it is. What's up with that shoe? And what, you look like a, and they stop like, and you just see Eugene like sitting there like. No, you don't, you don't have a fighter. That's like, that's what I, yes. That's exactly what I'm saying. These are lethal weapons. It's like, but like he's in the movie and he's that guy who like, stop fighting long ago and he's just sitting there and guys are like, hey man, you're gonna get off, you're gonna do something and he's just there like. He's like, don't read me. Don't read me. Don't read me. And then when Eugene starts, you're like, you have that. But I think we all have that. If you have like a comedic, like real, it's not about being funny. No, no, no, no. I'm not a funny person, it's not that. You have this thing where it's like, oh, and don't, don't put me in a corner. That version of Trevor, I call him the Shibin Queen. Yeah, he does. The Shibin Queen. Yeah. In South Africa, we had Shibin's, Tavins. I don't think it's easy. Well, speak easy. Okay, yeah, yeah. Like in America and, but in the, it's funny. In black America, you had it as well. Where it was like the woman who ran the underground, the Duke joint, I think it was cool. Yes. And they ran it and they had a comeback for every drunk man in there. They had a line for the cops. They had like, they were already all the time. Eugene calls me that. He calls me a Shibin Queen. He's like, you don't want Trevor Shibin Queen to come on. That's fantastic. 'Cause I'll be very chill. And then at some point I'm like, all right, all right. But also, you know, what I love about you to be able to move the bike away. Which is similar to me is that your humor is kind. You're not, I don't try, like, yeah, I'm not trying. No, I'm not that person either. I'm not mean at all. But. Don't push me in a corner, man. You'll lose. You'll lose. Don't put baby in a corner. I was, yeah, yeah, I mean. And I know it. And also they don't always expect it from a woman. No, never. Never. Never. Don't press anything. We've got more. What now? After this. Uh, girlfriends. Yeah. Why didn't girlfriends get the mainstream acclaim at dessert? I was, I was-- You think of the time period. Think of what was happening then. So it was '90s and it was very segregated television at the time. Was it really? Oh, yeah. So I'll give you my perspective just so you understand why I'm so confused by this. In South Africa, girlfriends was one of the biggest sitcoms on television. So in our world, in my world, in fact, when I hear people talk about shows like friends, I don't say this with any like disrespect to you. Not disparagingly. I'm not saying this is prejudiced me. But I go, what bullshit are you coming with telling me that this is the greatest sitcom of all time? I like him. He means no disrespect. Yeah, but-- No. I grew up with friends and girlfriends and all of these came on around a similar time. So I was watching them back to back. Granted, I was my kind of a still and we didn't have the hierarchy that American TV had. So family matters and full house were like, let's go baby. Back to back to back to back to the same channel. So there was no like, oh, there was no interest. There's a big back of similar. So there was no indicator that one should be perceived in a way differently to the other. So for me, I remember watching girlfriends going the comedy, the situation, the elements of the story, what is being defined here, that to me was revolutionary. But it was never credited with the revolution, which was weird to me. No, and it's been given that in hindsight. Oh, it has. A little bit. Okay, good. But we certainly didn't have it back then. No. I mean, never had gotten no talk shows, no tonight show, no David Letterman, no, no Emmys had never been to the Emmys, had never been to any. You were never asked on a late night show? No, as a matter of fact, I have a story. It was Jay Leno and I had girlfriends and the comment was, we love Tracy. Call us when she gets something. Why on girlfriend? Oh, yeah. And I was like, I remember thinking, get what? Like, what else do you have to get? I don't know. And it just was not. We love her, but it was not considered. And the other thing was, I remember this, I remember specifically, the show Monk. Do you remember that show with Tony Shillope? That show had a quarter of our viewership, a quarter of our viewership. And I remember seeing him on the show and I was so confused. And I was like, I don't understand. Is it viewership? And the only thing you can boil it down to, you're like, is it just racism? I'm not sure how to, how do you categorize it? Like, I don't know what it is. Never went to the Emmys. The first time I went to the Emmys was on Blackish. Yo, this is crazy. Yeah. This is like, to me, this is mind blowing because they all existed in the same. Yeah. And ignorantly, because we're in South Africa, we're just watching this going, these are all the same. That's really, they all occupy the same level. That's so interesting. I've never heard that before. Thank you for sharing that. While let's see the show was great. All of it. So we didn't, we at no point watched any of these shows and thought that they were not of the same caliber whatsoever. It was really interesting to me when I came to America and, well, wait, why go for it? And then it was like, almost only Black people knew about go for it. And by the way, when I first did Blackish, I remember I first went in to do my looping session, like, you know, for voiceover or whatever, with the stuff, the lines that weren't working. And I remember the team was like an old school, like, TV, like, veterans. Okay. Yeah. And the guy was like, my God, I mean, it's like, it's like you've done this before. Oh, God. And I said, you didn't, I took about that all the time. And I said, I said, no, but, but, but I have. And he was like, I mean, but it's not like you were on a comedy. And I said, no, I was on a comedy. He's like, I know, but it's not like you were a lead. And I was like, no, but I was. He's like, well, it's not like it was network. And I swear to God, exactly. And I said, no, but it was. And he was like, but it wasn't prime time. I mean, he was like, it was like, it was like, exactly. And I was like, but it was. And he was like, oh, I see. What was it called? Oh, wow. And I was like girlfriends. And he was like, I'll have to look that up. Wow. And I remember thinking, wow, it's like we were just not even. It didn't even exist. But, you know, again, back to my gratitude. I'm like, but I had eight years. I started on girlfriends. I was pretty talented. I thought I was pretty. Whatever. But I became a seasoned actress. I became a, you know, 173 episodes. Yeah, you're okay. Yeah. You learn how to do it. You know, and it's different than movies. But like, it's a real thing. You learn, you get, you become a veteran. You know, I had an opportunity to do 173 episodes of a show. It's no joke. And then I did 170 summer episodes of Blackish 16 years of my life on shows 16 years. I'm like, girl, that's okay, career. Yeah, no, for real. Like that blows my mind. And I remember after girlfriends, I remember Christina Applegate. She had her third. So is married with children. And then there was the third show, her and Julia, Julia Louis-Dreyfus, were two actresses that I was like, I want that career. I want that. I wonder if a Black woman could get that. I wonder if I could do that. I've done it. That's, I mean, it's pretty, it blows my mind. Like at 53, they're, you know, you take stock. You look at things. You're like, okay. And I just go, wow. And then even with this Broadway show, you know, it came to me. It just felt like a divine moment. And I'm like, I didn't go looking for it. And it came to me. And I thought, wow, in this chapter of my life, which is such a beautiful chapter at 53 years old, to experience something that like is a dream. Yeah. A dream. My first time on Broadway, a one person show, a Tony nominated show that I didn't ask for. And I came in here. And I'm like, what a, what a treat. Like look at this. I'm still working. This is great. No, this explains it now. You sound like how I sound inside whenever I'm doing something. Just like, no, no, no, like can I tell you? No, you're not as funny as you have that. One of the greatest gifts in my life is how Eugene reminds me to do that about like the world. I'm good at doing that for like work things. Strangely enough, I've struggled to do that with the world. I understand that. So Eugene is the person who'll go, man, do you ever appreciate all these trees that we get on our walk? And I'm genuinely like, I'm never actually, yeah, I mean, the trees. And it's like, Eugene's like, no, man, look at, you're, look at these trees. That's really, okay. He's like, yo, look at, I mean, look at the, wow, look at that river. I am. I am. I am. I am just trying very much that person. Yeah. So, but you, you have, I would argue, the super combination of us, because I can do it with like work things. Yeah. I always appreciate it. I have to remind him on the work. And then he has to remind me on the life things. But even when I've been with you when we're in an art gallery, a museum, at dinner, what you have, that's a rid. Now it, it actually explains it to me now. I've always wondered how you are so not just normal, but radiance. But I, I, I, I, I wonder where you get, where do you think you got it from? I think I was born with it. I do. I think I came out with a, I mean, my middle name is Joy. And my mom said, no way. You want to know what my middle name is? What? Which means Joy? Oh, there you have folks. I want you to know I a little bit feel like E.T. when we do it. That's exactly custom. From one species to another. Joy. Yeah. But I don't know. I mean, you know, I also know that for me, the capacity I have for Joy is matched on the spectrum with the capacity I have for darkness. Oh, interesting. You know, I would say more. I just that full spectrum of who I am. Yeah. Um, but the truth is my, my genuine temperament is Joy. That is, that's, that's your, it's my, it's the way. The way I think of it is, like I always think of like people like coins when we're spinning. There are two ways the coin can spin. It can be spinning almost silently and balanced. And then it can be spinning like in a wobbling. And I go, like you want to be your, your ideal spin. But there's also the other side of your spin, which is like it's still going, but it's like, okay, I hear what you're saying. So your default. Yeah. My default is Joy. Um, I ran at a pace of anxiety for many, many years of my life. Um, and I don't anymore. I mean, when did it stop and what changed it? I've said this to him the other day about you or about him. About myself. Yeah. You, you've settled. Yeah. That was a time for you. 45 this year. Yeah. Wait, what, what, what change? Um, all the work I've done. Um, yeah, but something must have changed. Like what I, I, I, I, I want to dig and understand this because I think it's valuable selfishly to me, but to anyone else is like, what clicks? Some people will won't hit that until 70. Some people don't hit that until their deathbed. Some people never hit it. So my question is, what changed? Cause you had, like you just said, eight years on a primetime show, eight years on another like, I was terrified and anxious through girlfriends. Okay. Um, not comfortable in my skin. Yeah. Um, I've done a lot of work that is felt like chewing on ground glass. Um, in the attempt to, um, get comfortable being where I am. Um, and trusting like, trusting that I'm okay. And that has been, hard earned. And it's something it's a daily reprieve, you know, um, and then blackish I started to [BLANK_AUDIO] I think I became a woman during girlfriends, but I didn't have time to integrate who I had become. And then I spent years, you know, thinking the pearly gates of Hollywood were gonna open. - I didn't. - And having to self-generate my own sense of creativity and ambition and make my own way. I spent, you know, my childhood tangled in the rainbow of my mother's extraordinary light. - Yeah, right. - Also in her embrace, not in her shadow, in her embrace. I've never felt, but it fanned a flame for me to figure out who I am. I felt like a fraud if I just enjoyed her attention. - Oh, okay, that's interesting. - I needed to know who I was and fill up my own light and my own planet and my own system, you know? And then Blackish, it's been extraordinary. It was an extraordinary experience for me and that partnership with Anthony was something. I found a sense of safety and an ability to explore my gifts and my talents in a way that I hadn't before. Pattern occupied something for me. I felt like I built something that meant something that had purpose. Pattern was the first thing that I made that was just absolutely mine. What was that? - What do you want to do? - There's a thing that you want to do that. - No, I was saying, I was saying this to Eugene literally in the car on the way here. I said to Eugene, one of the things we take for granted in life is that we very seldom have been asked the question, what do you want to do? - And people were like, no, people also, hey, what do you want to do? No, no, no, not casually. I mean, like in the meaningful moments of your life, how many times we take it for granted, literally from the beginning of our lives. When you're a child, you are very lucky. If your parents or carers, whoever caregivers, whoever say, what do you want to do? And really mean it. What would you like if you have all your agency? What would you like to do? And then facilitate it, not a platitude. And then you look at it like when you're old. And then you become an adult, your work doesn't ask you what would you like to do? - No. - The things you do in life don't ask you, what would you like to do? And it's interesting, as you keep moving through life, when you stumble upon it, you go, oh, this is the first time it was what I wanted to do. - Not where I was pulled, not what I was offered, not what I'm good at, no. - Yeah. - Because a talent can be a trap. - Talent can be a trap. - Yeah, that's really interesting. - Yeah, then people assume that just because you have it, you must use it. Then they give you what they think is good for you. And then you start feeling ungrateful for not taking what they think is good for you. - It is, especially I think, I don't know if it's the same as a man, as an African man, but as a woman to not take what you're offered. - Same. - Black woman is like, it takes a lot to learn how to do that. It's the same. - Yeah, I think it's layered for us, because it's like one, you've got the color side of things. So remember, in South Africa, we saw the first generation of non-white TV or public anything, right? - Wow. - Comedy wasn't legal in the country before 1994. So there wasn't even like a comedian that you could like look up to. That wasn't a concept as a child. So that's why the American TV we saw were so formative, 'cause it was like, oh, that's a thing. And then people laugh and then, you know. - That's so sad. - But when we entered those spaces for the first time, the custodians were still generally white people who without realizing it at times, still approached you with an attitude of, hi, you, wow, well, you're lucky to be here. - There was that feeling. And so I think that that still has, and then I mean, I know for us sharing this, like coming from very modest backgrounds, there's also that element where it's like, you should be grateful for everything, even if you do not wish for it to be. - Oh yeah, I mean, the politics of gratitude are intense as a black person, intense. So you just have to have to have to have to have to have to have to have to have to have to, but then what people don't realize is gratitude isn't gratitude when it's forced. - No, it's very different. - Then that's acknowledgment. - Yeah, that's acknowledgment. I can acknowledge what I have to be grateful for it is different. - Yeah, it's very different. - So people will say, like, I'm grateful for everything. You must work, no, no, no, I get that. But then you, I genuinely believe sometimes you just acknowledge that you have it. Being grateful for it is the difference. It's like, it's the difference between eating something and being full and tasting and savoring something good. - To be in the actual-- - That to me's gratitude is to go, wow, what a delicious, I'm sorry, where's this from? You know, it's like it's that feeling. - You just said the word compliance, which is really interesting in that context. Gratitude as, I think that's in the politics of gratitude is there's a sense of compliance. It's like it is a way to be deferential and to say, yes, I'm grateful for what you've given me as opposed to this sense of being of this is what is mine. This is what I'm worth, this is me as a human being. You can, whatever you're doing out there, but this is, and I think that is what shifted for me, a sense of belonging to myself, a sense of belonging to myself, and also to my humanity, which I think is something that I've grown into and discovered, and having a sense of that for myself has allowed me, not every moment, I mean, you know, I'm human, but it really has allowed me to be inside my life in a different way that I'm deeply grateful for. - Yeah. - See, that's beautiful. That's, that's, that's where it is, that's, that's, that to me is true to this sense. - Now, your friendship makes sense to me. - These two? - You do. - Yeah, these two. (laughing) - It makes so much sense. - Yeah. - I mean, Trevor, I, I think you know this, I don't know, but like I don't, you know, I've gone to your house for dinner, and like, that's not something I do, like I don't, I'm not. - I don't have people over. - Yeah, no, you know what I mean? - You will tell you this. - Yeah, and like. - You're saying you've been to my house for dinner, it's like a, some people who know me would be like, what? - She's been with you already. - But that's, by the way, same thing with me, the people that have been to my house for dinner, I'm like, people are like, oh, so and so, maybe I can come over, I was like, oh, no, no, no, no, maybe I can join dinner. - I'm so, like I just don't, you know, I don't do that, and it's, there are certain people that you go, oh, that feels safe, that'll be good. This is a real person, like it's always your same friends. - Yeah, yeah, yeah. - You know, and by the way, the guy, like we share now, we've been, you know, so, and those are things that like, I don't take for granted in this industry that we're in, you know, there's a lot of, there's a lot of stuff, there's a lot of bells and whistles, there's a lot of fun, it's nice, it's fun, I love to enjoy it and all that kind of stuff, but then there's something different, you know, and, and I'm, I'm grateful for those touchstones that do exist, that you see, you know, we see each other at a event, you're like, I know him, you know, that's a good one, but, you know, it's a, it's a, the business is funny, and it will take what it can from you. - I think, I think life is like that, the business is a, is an amplified version of it. - Yeah. - But I think life is like that. - That's true. - And, and in life, I'll, I'll often say this, you know, like now I'll, I'll be asked to like, talk to high school kids or whatever, go and do these things, I was like, what am I doing? Could I still feel like a high school kid? - But keep that forever. - But genuinely, one of the only pieces of advice I'll give them is something I wish I had when I was younger and that is, I go, choose your friends by how they make you feel. - Oh, yes, Trevor. - That's like the big one. - Do you, Trevor, are you going to do it? - No, that's his thing. - Mm-hmm. - Okay. - Yeah, there's rock papers. (laughs) - No, like, choose your friends. - But it's true. - Yeah, but, and what. - By the way, this is also what I say about dating. - Yeah. - I always say to people, when you leave that date, ask yourself how you feel. - Yeah. - Even when you're on it. - Ask yourself how you feel. Not what you're doing. - No, no, no. - Now, what do you look like now? - No. - No. - How do you feel? Did you feel small? Did you feel like yourself? Did you feel like all those things? Because people forget to ask themselves those questions and they don't check in. - Yeah. - And then you're like, in a relationship and you're like, "Oh, you're like, yeah, well, how did he make you feel in the first date?" - Yeah, the thing I say to people is, you should never take for granted that every part of you is you, right? I've always, like, I shouldn't have, but I've like, I fought with a few like gurus and monks. - Yeah. - I have, man. - Oh. - He just said I fought with. Maybe that's what's going on. - I have. I have. No, I have. - I'm dead. - You know me, bro. - Yeah. - You know me too. Like, because I like, if I, there's something I don't agree with or I don't understand or I think it could be like, clarify, I just, I'll say it. And there's like a few gurus in monks will be like, you know, this one was like he's like you you are not nervous, that is not a part of you, that it nervous is an external way. - I'm not sure of something. - And I was like, "Yo man, I was like, "Yo, I don't agree with you." I was like, "No, you are nervous." All of these things are a part of you. The difference is, there's a state that you are most, not comfortable, but you're sort of vibrating at your best frequency. - I cause my favorite part of me. - Yeah, that's the best way to put it. Your favorite part of you. And so when I'm, I'm gonna think about my life. - Outside you, Gene? - Yeah, you're going, "Who are the people in my life who in some way shape or form remind me of that person?" So even when I'm not them, they sort of go like, "Hey, hey, where are you?" Then you're like, "Oh yeah!" Okay, that's a nice thank you without judging you, without pushing you, without pushing you. And there's even like work that you will do, or activities that you will do that will remind you of that part of you. - Of that part of you. - And those things, like everything you've said, it's funny you say this, I haven't asked her about this, 'cause I mean, it's not like we're like friends and speak, but from the few conversations I've had with Rihanna, she had like that, like, and I don't say this in a familiar way, honestly, but she, she just like, she may have always had it, but man, you cannot deny that fenty, like, it just, because what it does is, it's exactly what you said about Patton. Depending on who you are in life, depending on where you are in life, you may feel like you are always in a position where you are waiting on. So you're waiting for a train to stop and pick you up, you're waiting for the bus to stop and pick you up, you're always waiting for the thing, you're always on the platform. And then if you're lucky enough, you get to build your own station, and you're the one now. - You're the conductor. - You're carving, yeah. You know what's interesting about Rihanna? I mean, I really enjoy her. She's not necessarily personally, but just with, but I remember when she did the halftime show, I saw something I'd never seen. - That's what I'm saying. Yes. - Yeah, that's what I mean. - She was like, we had never seen it. A black woman who, at the height that she is at, and who she is, do it in this way of like, I'm not giving you guys all of me. I'm gonna give you what I wanna give you. And I'm doing this, it was, I don't even know how to describe it. - Here's what it felt like to me. It felt like Rihanna was saying, I'm happy to be here, but you are also happy to have me here. - Yes. - So the halftime show is not me coming to pedal my ways. It's not me coming to-- - It's so beautiful. - It's a showcase, and I'm enjoying this showcase, and I'm having fun, and I'm like hitting my little, you know what I mean, it's like, and she had, you're not wrong. It wasn't like a-- - It was so beautiful. - Please go ahead and buy my records, this is why you should love me as a woman. - Yeah, this is why you should live, there's none of it. - No, no, she's like, uh, uh, uh, uh. - And then she whipped open that fenty mirror, and I was like, girl, it was so beautiful. Watching her is so beautiful in a way that we don't talk about it enough, but I really, it's really beautiful, and it teaches us something. - You can even-- - When we see it. - You can even see it in her interviews. Look at her interviews when, before she has fenty, and people are asking her about when the new music is coming out. Look at how she responds, and then look at her interviews when fenty's come out, and they ask her where's the new music. Previously, she would have like a slightly like apologetic, like, oh yeah, you know, I'm working on it, and we're trying to find, yeah, you know, the album and we're getting the, you know, and then after fenty, people ask her, yo, the music, she's like, yo, bra, relax with that question. The music will come when it comes. She's just got like a-- - Not a asshole, but she's like, no, man, why are you doing this? She-- - The music will come when it comes, the same way we can't ask Shadee, when's the music coming out? If Shadee comes back, she comes back. - But she doesn't, she doesn't. But it's something I wish for everyone in life, in any part of your life. - I agree. - It's just the ability, you said it articulately, to feel like you belong in yourself. That's it. - You see it in her, and it's beautiful. - Yeah, no, 1000%. - Yeah, I really, it's, that Super Bowl moment was something very special for everybody. - Now, man. - Especially from a black woman. This is lovely. - This is you, this is-- - You are lovely. - Come on, one more. Also, when he does it, he goes, yeah. - It's really good. - I'm channeling all the energy. - Oh, is that what you're doing? - He like focuses it. Do you have a show tonight? - I do. Yeah, I have a show tonight. - I don't want to let you, what's your pre-show routine? I don't want to like, what's your-- - I usually, I like to be there an hour and a half before we open the doors, because I'm in the audience for the door opening. And I do vocal exercises. - What do you do, lip trills? - I do trills, I do pumps, I do-- - Do you do the, the blowing straw? - No. - No, okay. - I do ha ha ha's. I had two weeks about 10 days, or I was sick as a dog. - You're lying in the middle of the run. - And I had to keep going. - No! - Let me tell you something. - No, understood. - First, no, it's just me. - No! - First of all. - I could have come on in, I could have done this. - You could have, by the way. - I could have come and done it. - No, I would have known. I would have been like, you guys haven't seen me in person. You don't know, that's why I look like I look like Trevor Shaw. I do. But I will tell you, it's fascinating what your body can do when it's sick. You can still do it. But what is crazy is the show I did with a fever? I have no, it would felt like a fever dream. - Yeah, you have no memory of it. - I was like, wow. But I, you know, my body knows what it's doing. It's done the show enough. It does it. And it was still a great show. But boy, did it feel fucking wonky. - No, yeah, yeah. - And then for a minute there, I couldn't hear out of my right ear. And thank God I didn't have anything contagious. I had no, you know, I've been, I tested for everything. - Yeah, yeah, yeah. - So I was sure that I wasn't like spreading it around everybody. And then there was that one show that I was just like, - You just hit like the. - It was, it was the, you know what it was that made me feel like I was so out of it. That night, I hadn't slept. I couldn't sleep. And I, you know, I'm a sleeper. So if I get my sleep, then I can do all these things and I can really be present. You got a sleep, right? - Got a sleep. - Got a sleep. - Got a sleep. - And my sleeper. - Yeah, and my sleep etiquette is like no joke. - Too sleep. - I don't fuck around with my sleep. - Now you have good sleep etiquette. I just focus on my sleep. But your etiquette is impacting me. - I do have very good sleep etiquette. - You have etiquette. - Yeah, she has. - Yes, I do. The wind down. - Yes. - No, this is a GA when it comes to this. - Otherwise. - It's a wind down. - There's a wind down. There's a, you know, no sugar like before bed and stuff like that. Like I just, and I, the screen goes away. I. - How long before? - At least a half an hour if not more. - 'Cause the audience is coming in and then she has two. (all laughing) - She being green is like. - This should be in green. - Yep, yep. (all laughing) - Is it this should be in time? - Yeah, there's a, there's a 12, there's a 12 o'clock spike. - Oh my God, I'm dead. - And then there's a 3 p.m. spike. And then from 6 p.m. I'm always like, guys, you're in God's hands now. - Oh my God, that's so funny. - So now the time is two o'clock. - Two o'clock. - Yeah, so we're in between two time zones. - Yeah. - I'm gonna try and get myself some lunch. - No, man. This was so beautiful, thank you. - This was so nice. - That's not, that's not make it. - Two years, I believe that is stupid. - I will say this though. When you have that feeling with people, that's when I feel like you guys vibe. - You like them? - Yeah. - And then it's normal when whenever you. - But I also think that becomes the downside is that you genuinely, until you said it, I did not, like now when you were two years ago. - That's what I said, I was like one or two years. - Two years seems crazy. But I am in the city for the next two or three weeks and maybe we'll go to dinner or something. - You let me know. - Okay, great. - You let me know. Alright, this was great. (laughing) - Fantastic. - You are fantastic. - Fantastic. - What now with Trevinoa is produced by day zero productions in partnership with Sirius XM. The show is executive produced by Trevinoa, Sanasiamin and Jess Hackel. Rebecca Chene is our producer. Our development researcher is Marcia Robiu. Music, mixing and mastering by Hannes Brown. Random other stuff by Ryan Padduth. Thank you so much for listening. Join me next week for another episode of What Now. (upbeat music)