Toilet Training

(upbeat music) - Hello and welcome to number nine, the podcast, hooray! And I'm Jesse Cox, I'm your host for today. And today we are very blessed and very lucky to have the assistant manager of number nine, Emma! - Hello! - Hello, thank you for having me! - Whoa, thank you for coming! Today we're going to be talking about toilet training. - I know, I'm so excited for this one. I've been holding out waiting for the toilet training one. And so many people, I know this feels like such a daunting task as a parent, because it's a big deal, right? Trying to get the kid to go on the, do the potty, so we're going to ask all these questions of you today, Emma. So first question, when should I start toilet training? - Never, it's hard work, aren't we? - At least until the 32 still using an app. - Don't worry, they're all 18 and toilet training by them. - Toilet training, it's a great question to ask actually, because there's lots of things that kind of a child needs to be prepared for and ready for before you start toilet training. And you want to see a few things that they're able to do, such as maybe communicate with you, that they need to go or have been, so they've got that verbal communication, that they're kind of interested in going into the toilet. Maybe they're pulling their nappy and they're letting you know that it's full when they fit into the toilet, but then they need to develop the physical size of it, so being able to pull their bottoms up and down. - That's quite hard for a kid, isn't it? Like, have I got the wrong trousers on my child? Why are they not pulling? - I think summer's a great time to do toilet training because less clothing is always good. - Yeah. - Little girls wearing dresses is fantastic, it does eliminate a lot of problems. But they definitely need to have that physical ability to pull up and pull down, that helps them generate that independence to be able to go to toilet by themselves. If they've not got those skills, such as that motor skill of pulling up and down and that communication and that awareness that they're going, it's going to be a harder journey. - So what are you waiting? - In terms of like, talking about pulling them, trousers up down, I want to dwell too much on this, but like, what specifically are we looking for, like being able to do it completely independently? 'Cause my kid can sort of get it, sort of near a bum, but she struggles with the kind of getting it over her bottom. - I mean, I think you'd need to be more focused on the pulling down so you can get them to nip into the toilet quickly. - Yeah. - And you can always help them pull them back up and do the bottom up, but I think they need to be able to pull them down and I think it's great practice when you're getting ready for going in the bath with the shower to get them, come, we're going to get undressed and just see how they do it themselves and encourage lots of positive reinforcement to try and get them with that skill set, ready for toilet training. - Okay, so let's say that we've seen some of these kind of pre-signs that they're ready, that they're telling us that they need to go to the toilet or they've been to the toilet, my daughter tells me to go away and she's getting ready. She's going to hate these pod cars as she is. She ever listens back, I'm going to have to be careful with something about too much. When, like, what do you do next? Is it a potty or is it a toilet? Like, should you go straight for a potty? - I think toilets are better because, generally, I mean, at nursery, we use very small toilets that they're loaded on. - And re-plum your bathroom, Emma. - Re-plum your bathroom with a tiny toilet. Potty is a great, but it's better if you can get them used to going on a toilet because then you might get stuck, having to carry on car to potty everywhere, moving it around, where if you get them used to going to the toilet and that's where they go, it forms part of their routine. And then it means that when you're out and about, you've not got to that stuff. - You've got another hurdle, haven't you? If you're like, trying to do the potty and then the toilet. - Yeah, I think it's much better if you can go straight to a toilet. And you can really make it great fun. I know it sounds silly, but when you're getting ready and you think my child is nearly there and we're gonna start this potty training, get them flushing the chain. Children love it. I know it sounds silly, but they do like to flush the chain. Get them in the toilet, seeing what goes on in there, talking to them about this is where we sit. Maybe get them a really nice little seat to sit on. You know, the little steps going up for at home. Make it engaging and fun for them to do. And I know it's hard, but I never get peace in the toilet. My children used to always just walk in on me. So we're just saying, yeah, I'm going to the toilet. This is what we do. - Good day, I had the whole family in there. - Which we're doing, including the dog. - Including the dog. - Just making it normal. This is what we do. I think is really important. Not being, not shying away from your child. And just going, yeah, this is what we do. This is part growing up, making it a norm for them. Like it feels a bit odd as a parent, if you're used to being quite private, that can be a bit difficult to. - And trying as much as you can to be a little bit open, it will go a long way because children learn from you. You're their biggest role model. So if they see what you're doing, then that's a way forward. - So you've got the seat, you've done the steps. - Now what do you do? - So I think you've got to make it really fun and engaging for the children. You can get some wonderful books. We do have a couple of nursery that you can borrow as well, which talks about, I think we've got one called Princess Potty. And she talks about, she's going to have this amazing thrown potty. Really get your child interested in it. Maybe using baby dollies on a potty, just making it as much of a conversation as you can. Picking pants and knickers is great. Going to pry them on. - So do you just go straight for it? Do you just go right, would it toilet and then that's it? No naffies, no pull ups. No, so I mean, a lot of parents do like pull ups. It provides that real comfort to them to think, oh, we're not going to have a major accent everywhere. But really, a pull up does feel the same as a nappie. And the children need to be aware that if they're wet, they've wet themselves and they need to be changed, where with a nappie it's that security. So I would always stay away from pull ups, maybe use them in an evening, because you can maybe, when they're not quite sure. - Do you mean we're going to bed? - Yeah. - Maybe use them for bed times. But I wouldn't use them during the day. It's just too confusing for them. So I think if you're going to make that decision that you're going to toilet train, you need to head to your local primark by 10 passengers, lots of little bottoms, and make that decision of this is the day we're going to start. And you know, get little stickers. My little one used to like a smarty every time she went to the waist. So you can imagine she was constantly on the toilet. So I made a rod for my own back of that one. It's definitely going to stick as well. - I don't need it again, I need a weekend. - Oh, I've got to go again. - Oh, it's a smarty. And just for getting her to sit on the thing. Because making her like, honestly, I haven't tried yet, but I could imagine like some children having a full on meltdown that they want to sit on the seat. - Yeah. - Like how do you even tackle that? Is it just, because I feel like I could have three days of just trying to get her on the seat. - I think you need to make it as a positive experience as you can. And if it's really not going to work, just take a step back for a bit. I think there is no point giving yourself, they're going to always end up toilet training. But if you've got that, that's for you, yeah. 18-year-olds wearing pull-ups. I think if you can see that vessel coming, they might not quite be ready. It might be their confidence isn't quite there. And just give it a little bit more time. But once you've started, you do not want to go back. - So what's the difference between like, I'm starting and maybe pulling back and deciding it's not quite ready. Then what do you mean by once you've started? - Well, I think if they're excited and happy to sit on the toilet, that's a real step in the right direction. And you really want to encourage that. The next thing is actually getting them to go to the toilet. And I think what is really important is that as a parent, you start it. I mean, often parents go, "Well, can you help us body train "and toilet train at nursery?" And I'm like, yes, but it needs to start with you. Because you've got that one to one as a parent. So I would literally lock down for the weekend, have lots of stickers on the go, lots of underwear and lots of activities to do. And I'd literally set a timer for every 15 minutes. Come on, should we try and go to the toilet? And if you think, right, they need to go and they say no. Oh, come on, can we just try and just really try and encourage it for that first day sort of every 15 minutes? Do you need to go get them used to thinking? - Yeah. - Am I needing to go? And then if they have an accent, don't freak out. You know, oh dear, yeah, you've had an accent, it's okay. Don't worry, let's go get into it. - I mean, as parents, we've all had the rope who in the corner of a room whilst we were changing on every running event. Or is it just me, maybe that's just me? - I think it's really, I mean, I remember the summer that I did my eldest child's toilet training and I thought I'd take her into the garden for a little bit and she was peeing up a bush. - Right, but she did it right. She pulled her knickers down first. So like, it's progress. - But you definitely needed to have that one to one with them to really support them in this because it is a big transition for them going from a nappy to underwear. So I would do a lot of encouragement that way. A lot of relaxing. Don't tell them off if they've wet themselves. Initially, get them changed, pop them on the toilet. Do you need to go any more? Or if you finish like, let's get clean, let's try again. And just, you know, treat it as something that has happened because all children have accidents. There's just no two ways about it. And then try and get them to tell you when they need to go. So then really try and encourage them to say when they need to go as well because although you're asking them, you really want them to be coming to you going only to go to the toilet. Let's just get that communication going with them. And then extend the time that you're asking them. So don't do it every 15 minutes. Try and extend it a bit longer and try and catch them when you know they've had a little drink. Just try and really work with them on it. - And like when, would you, how long do you think it should take? Is there a point where you think, oh my gosh, we've been doing this forever and it's just not working, we should stop and try again later? Or do you think, once they're sitting on the toilet and getting into this, you should just keep persevering? I mean, if they've really got all those skill sets, I would try to persevere because once you've started, if you stop, it sends a mixed message. If you just push against me long enough, I'm going to give in. I'm going to give in and some children are so ready for it, but they're really engaged in that game of Lego and they're not going to want to come away from it. Yeah, so you have to sit from their point of view as well. They've had the benefit of not having to come away from something they're engaged with. They can just go freely in an api and now you're saying to them, no, you've got to stop what you're doing. It's a boundary that is being put in place. So you've also got to break that because it's got to become something as natural as I'm hungry, I need to eat. Oh yeah, because they're going to ask you for snacks and things like that. Exactly. Is it worth, like, should you have read someone the other day that it might be worth considering how games that are just for the toilet or books that they can sit and read? Should you be asking them to sit for long periods of time or. I think it all depends on the child. I mean, if you're trying to get them to go to the toilet and you know that they possibly need to go, but they're not really wanting to sit. You can do something that engages them on the toilet. That's not a problem. I remember sitting having a little story. Particularly when it's a bowel movement, I remember my daughter not wanting to do a bowel movement on the toilet. So one of the ways that I knew what time she went on a day and basis. I got used to her bodily functions. And so I knew that that was the time she used to go. So we sat and I had a little story with her. But I think every child is unique and different. Some will just want to jump on that toilet, do their ablutions and get back to what they're doing without watching their hands. But some you're going to need to take a little bit of time with. It all depends on your child as an individual. But it's good to get them used to being in that environment. And what do you do when you go out and about? Like, how do you handle that? Because the visions of wet prams, wet car seats, just fills me with fire. Oh yes, Christmas, John Lewis, 2016 was fun for me when my daughter wet herself in the queue. I've been queuing for like 20 minutes. Yes, I think you're always going to have an experience as a parent. I think the best thing you can do bin liners and a towel. Because I used to stick it over the car seat, stick it over the pram, and put a towel on it. And then if they had an accident, it wasn't major to clear up. I always had like a fabric bag, which had tons of spare underwear in it, just in case and clothes. And then I just bum the whole lot in the wash. But thankfully, once I had that kind of, I did take like three days to just do it at home. And I was quite confident that she was going to be okay to go on a small journey to maybe the shop or something. And then as soon as I'd get to a shop, we're like, right, we need to go to the toilet. And I made it a habit. And even now before I leave the house, I mean, they're a lot older now. I'm like, who needs the toilet? And it's almost a reminder for me too. My sister does it with me and I. And like, so are you saying then the best thing to do is just to stay at home for a whole weekend? I would. And like three whole days, I'd do a Friday Saturday Sunday. Yeah, give it, give it the best chance you possibly can to get that embedded. You want them to be able to know that this is what we do. And they need that support with this transition to being going on the toilet. So I would definitely give it your all, stick with them, you know, and try and do it for those two days. And you're going to know by sort of the end how they're picking it up. And if you're going to need a little bit more support with it. And if it's working for you or not. Okay, that's so helpful. And I've heard like some people, I know like some of my friends were saying to me the other day, they can get quite frustrated with the child. I particularly feel like they're holding it and they're not relaxing to go to the toilet. That can be quite difficult as a parent. And you can feel a bit like, should it be carrot or stick? Like, should you be like telling them off or is it naughty behaviour if they're like, perfectly not going to the toilet? I think it's a really hard call because you really want them to go on the toilet. And as much positively, you can do it the best for you. I mean, as a parent, I had my daughter used to do the exact same thing. And then she would wet herself and want to be changed immediately 'cause she's wet. And I used to then, as this was a parent side, obviously we don't do this at the moment, I'm unnecessary. But I would let her fill uncomfortable for a couple of minutes and not rush to change her so that she felt, oh, I'm wet, this is uncomfortable. Okay, I really don't like this. And then I used to say to her, right, well, that's why you need to go on the toilet, having that communication together. And then putting her on the toilet, you need to do any more just to reinforce this as well. This is where you go. And then changing her. And then I'd go back to, right, you need to go to the toilet. You need to go to the toilet just to reinforce it again because sometimes they do fall in and out and have little phases with it. It can happen. But as long as you stick to what you're doing, they will fall into that routine. And is it worth waiting, like, say, for instance, you're going on holiday or you've got a new baby coming into the house or you're changing rooms or you're moving? Is it worth waiting till those transitions have happened or doesn't really matter? I think, I mean, with transitions, I think it's a really hard one. If we've got a child that's moving across, it's always to a different room, for example. It's always better to get them settles in that room, in that environment with people that they trust and build those trusts with. So I think it's important that we kind of wait for those transitions. Lots of parents when they're having a second baby might want their child to toilet train. Who wants to do babies in napkins? And I definitely think if your child's got all those signs of readiness and you've still got a bit of time before baby comes, give it a go, but you might see a bit of regression when the baby comes along because all of a sudden you're changing a baby's napkin, they're getting there at that attention and they're not. But you can work with that. If that toilet training is established, you can definitely work on that. But I think, you know, trying to do too much at once is always a bit of a difficulty. So just, I think, look at what's going on in their little lives and try and do it at a time that you think this is great for them. I can give them that time. I know that I can work with them on this and that we're going to crack it together. Because it is a bit of a team effort. And should it talk about team effort? Should it be like one parent leading the way? Or should it not really matter? I think both of you need to be on the same page and both of you need to be able to do the same thing so they can see that you're on the same page with it. And I think, I mean, there are times that, you know, we get things wrong as parents. I remember in John Lewis, for example, nearly having a meltdown myself. And literally biting my tongue. Where I always found that my daughter's dad was almost the karma chilled one of the two of us. So she would normally go to him if she'd had an accident and not me, which was quite handy. But I think as long as you're working together and you're following the same routine and you're using the same language and you're doing the same things, it's really good because your child needs to be comfortable to, especially when they come into nursery because we're going to take that over for you. They need to be comfortable for other people to take them to the toilet that they feel safe with. And what do you do about night times? How, what happens there? How do you crack that? So I, I mean, honestly, I didn't crack night time the same time as day time because a lot of the time you'll see that a child has a really swollen nappy in the morning. Yeah. So you really want them to be dry. And so I think you've got to have a little look at your night time routine. Are they still having like a cup of milk or something before bed? Because, obviously, if it's not gone through their system quick enough, it's going to come out during the night. So I'd be looking at their routine a little bit, giving them a bit more time with their drink before they go to bed, always take them to the toilet before they go to bed. And then you'll see when that pull up or nappy is dry when they wake up in the morning. And then first thing, take them straight to the toilet. And I would see how it goes with that because it's really hard work when you've got to get up in the middle of the night and you've got wet bedding and things to change. And they do naturally progress to that themselves. Do they write natural progression? There sort of don't make that too much of a focus now because you don't want them waking up in the middle of the night and you've got that upset. Oh, and for some reason, just go over that waking up in the middle of the night and do what's on that again. So I would definitely see how the toilet training is going during the day, keep them in, keep them in that routine of going to the toilet before they go to bed. And then when they first wake up in the morning, taking them to the toilet and soon you'll see that that's becoming dry. And then that's the time when you tackle your night time. That's what I would suggest. Fantastic. So what would you say was your top like three tips for toilet training? Remain calm at all times. Don't worry. They all have accidents. Just making sure you're really prepared. I think that's that's a real deal. Get your band with your clothes in, your big bags, your towels. Definitely. I definitely get those things ready and in place lots. If you can make it fun, having a little dolly on the toilet where you squeeze it's belly. Have fun with it if you can. Lots of positive reinforcement stickers. Definitely more than food. But really, I mean, it's a lovely step of independence for children and it's so lovely when they've achieved that. I cannot wait to burn the changing man. It's like I'm going to have a whole ritual where I throw all the nappies out and now I'm going to have a party. A party party party. I make it fun and it's always great if their friends are doing it at the same time. That is nice because they do like it. Oh, you're going to sort of some of my. We do get a lot of girls. We still go to the toilet together, don't you? So linked together with some friends if you can, if they're all in that sort of age group, you know, normally sort of two and a half plus is where you're looking at ac mae'n gweithio'r gweithio. 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