TIM HEIDECKER Talks Contrarian Comedy, Sincerity, and Playing the Long Game

This episode is brought to you by PayPal. You know how a mom's bag has everything? Sunscreen. Snacks. A stapler? The new PayPal app is like that, but for your money. Shop, pay, manage your account, and earn rewards all in one place. And with purchase protection on eligible items, biometric security, and pass keys, you're protected at every step. Download the new PayPal app to get started. See paypal.com slash protection terms. This message is brought to you by Apple Card. With Apple Card, you earn unlimited daily cash back on everyday purchases, like groceries, merch, or tickets to the game. Plus, it can be used anywhere MasterCard is accepted. No matter your team, no matter where you shop, Apple Card is here to help you tackle game day. Apply in the Wallet app on your iPhone today. Subject to credit approval, Apple Card is issued by Goldman Sachs Bank USA Salt Lake City branch. Terms and more at applecard.com. Did you ever consider being a rings guy when you moved to Hollywood? Get a bunch of rings and stuff? Yeah, yeah. No. No. Okay. Do you have any tattoos? No. Do you have any piercings? I had an earring. Oh, you did? Yeah. But I took it out one night. I could see a little of the remnants of it. Yeah. Very embarrassing. Very embarrassing. Ladies and gentlemen, this next guest is a legendary comedian, director, filmmaker. He's the host of On Cinema and Office Hours. Please welcome Tim Heidecker, everyone. Hey, look at you. Hey, the five guys. It's the five guys from the burger place. It's my friends. We're very excited to have you here. Your clapper guy said as he passed me, he says, good luck. He said that? Yeah. He's an intern. What is he saying talking like that? Good luck. He just got out of New York University, this kid. He's got a job. He's got a job. He's got a job. He's got a big future ahead of him. Sure. He's a good guy. I'll stay on his good side. I feel like I impart too much wisdom since Zach started, and it feels, I hope it feels genuine to him. Well, good luck. I guess so. Yeah, Tim, I told you this on the phone, but 12 years ago, you were in D.C. Yeah. I was, it was, I was like nauseously nervous, and you ended up coming back to our, me and my ex-girlfriend's apartment. We hung out after the Comedy Bang Bang live show. Yeah, with James Adomian. With James Adomian, who performed at, we, I had like a DIY venue in D.C., so he performed there before. Yeah, you told me that. I don't remember it, but. It was a, I don't know. I was like, I've only acted like that twice around people, like, and it was you and Dice. I was like fumbling over my words when I met him. I was like, it's him. It was an odd move for me to go to, this would have been 12 years ago. Yeah, yeah. To go to an apartment after a show. I was 14 years old at the time. Yeah, see, we don't. And we smoked crack. Yeah. I bought you guys beer, right? Yeah, you bought us beer. Stopped by the 7-Eleven. Yeah, and Whippets. Yeah. Yeah, no, I was living with my ex-girlfriend, who's at that time receiving DJing lessons from my best friend, and they are married. Cool. Yeah, yeah. Pretty good. They fell in love behind the ones and twos. So you grew up watching, you were a fan of what? What I was doing back in Adult Swim? I was a big fan. I was a big fan. That's nice. And like, you know, I wasn't like a celebrity yet, so I didn't know how to be around. And how was I, was I decent with you? You were so down to earth. You did take a cigarette out of my mouth and said that it's for trashy people. I did not, really? Yeah, and you were like, promise me you won't ever smoke again. Oh, that's so funny. And I think I said, I promise, I promise. I was a real zealot with that back, because I just quit. Yeah, yeah. And I was like, I was a real staunch anti-cigarette guy. Yeah, yeah. Now I sneak one every once in a while. Yeah, yeah. You're like a reformed sinner. I'm at the wedding or whatever, I'll have one. Whose wedding? Anybody's. I go to so many weddings. I do comedy and magic at weddings now. Just to rip cigs, yeah. I've done a lot of magic at weddings. Yeah. I just found out that like our Indian friend from college, I wasn't close enough to get the invite, but you get to wear like the outfit. The sarong? It's like the one time you're allowed to culturally appropriate if you're the white guy at your Indian friend's house. Well, I'm culturally appropriating my own culture today, but it's just from a different era. What is that? It's all Amazon. Amazon? Really? Yeah. I had Blake Griffin on the show, and he's doing the NBA like team, like studio team for Amazon. Okay. And I asked him if he thought that the workers were paid enough at the factories, and yeah. He's doing, oh, well that's, I mean. Yeah. Please, call it out when you can. Yeah. Let's be honest about our hypocrisies. I don't know. Bezos is the one I respect, the one billionaire I respect. I know people lump him in with the rest, but I just like the fact that he's still a Miami guy. He's a good looking guy. Yeah. He just looks insane. Yeah. His girlfriend is so Miami. Yeah. Yeah. He's real trash. Yeah. I mean, all due respect. I don't know. I wonder how much. He's tight. He's tight, I should say. His body is tight. Yeah. He's kind of got a Rogies thing. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. I don't know. I don't know. Yeah. I don't know. I don't know. I don't know. I don't know. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. about the way i look by the way uh well network said they want you to lose 200 pounds before we air this who did the network oh yeah the same the most odd actually people think right now that i'm i'm uh getting paid by the dnc like they think that i'm the one they chose shill yeah i haven't gotten a call yet i wish you would stick to comedy too because i would funny boy no i want money at this point i just want money at this point do you well do you don't you're not on the social on social media i have it yeah but i try not to and stuff i've been looking yeah i do post a lot about all sorts of stuff and when i do obviously when i do post about politics which i'm just a guy who has opinions about my work the world i live in yeah and people get very upset and say you should be you should stick to comedy that's i get that every every time and i'm wondering if that's now just a uh shut up and dribble they're saying yeah yeah if if that's now just like an ai a bot is that a bot can we figure out if they're bots are those people out there who really feel that way no those are the critics yeah those are like yeah guys at the times those are like those are smart guys that are doing that yeah i like his fake uh talk show laugh for that shit joke it is should i should i punch it up for you yeah go ahead let's do another take of my laugh um okay just keep it clean well those guys are probably college professors is a yeah I do wonder that though cuz like like I just did News Nation with Chris Cuomo me the clip I've never seen anybody yeah so quickly send somebody else it was the next day we were talking about it when I was there I say you the picture of me and Geraldo yeah you send me a picture you and Odin cry no both try to come on like I said we have ten minutes lock the door please guys now lock the gates well they're sucking up to you and they're like they have no respect for me Caleb said put on my suit in an aggressive way can we just step back a second talk about my outfit because I feel like I started telling you and then we went on Amazon and we went all over the place yeah let's talk more about you it's just an interview with you anyway yeah go what who are you wearing I'm going I'm here in New York for this premiere at the Tribeca Film Festival and I get very uptight about what to wear to these things and I think everybody look everybody I don't look I don't I have issues with like when I try to dress up I look stupid in my opinion but it's a power move to look crap well good yeah that's your thing I could go in like a t-shirt yeah people are like that guy's a wildcard that real mania yeah face up your style yeah sure yeah but then so I looked on the internet and looked at Tribeca film I just typed in Tribeca Film Festival you know images and one of the first ones that came up was this Jerry Lewis picture from like five like two minutes before he died two minutes before he died really the hospital him with Robert De Niro they must have been doing anything a comedy I mean retrospective or something and this was what he was wearing essentially really and so I had my friend track it down and get me I mean I had my this girl that does costumes for us and and so I'm gonna wear this on the red carpet so this is my little are you gonna meet Bob Bobby D Bobby D Bob Dylan well those are the two best best ones yeah I don't know I don't know how that works I've done that I've been to the Tribeca Film Festival before and he's never he's never I've never met him before so I doubt what would you say let's practice your first lot your opening line okay everyone does that to him all the time everyone does that to him all I would say mr. De Niro pleasure you know what a guy what an actor I've got nipples to Greg can you milk yeah he'd like that meet the fuck it's not imagine the moment they said we're gonna we're doing this their last name is Fokker it's we're no I don't care what the fucking studio says I watched parents you can't say Fokker it's f-o-c-k you can't say Fokker it's f-o-c-k-r you can't say Fokker it's f-o-c-k-r you can't say Fokker it's f-o-c-k-r yes we can his name is gay Lord Fokker you yes we can his name is gay Lord Fokker you yes we can his name is gay Lord Fokker you can't make comedy anymore no that's can't make comedy anymore no that's can't make comedy anymore no that's just that's just a that you know the just that's just a that you know the just that's just a that you know the freaking you know Democrats I guess they freaking you know Democrats I guess they freaking you know Democrats I guess they took it away I think it's the Democrat took it away I think it's the Democrat took it away I think it's the Democrat I think it's Pelosi he's a little cringy I think it's Pelosi he's a little cringy I think it's Pelosi he's a little cringy when he gets into the Trump stuff when he gets into the Trump stuff when he gets into the Trump stuff De Niro say I think yeah I've also heard De Niro say I think yeah I've also heard De Niro say I think yeah I've also heard he's not like well yeah he said fuck he's not like well yeah he said fuck he's not like well yeah he said fuck Trump the first the first he gets real Trump the first the first he gets real Trump the first the first he gets real he's real he said fuck Trump and then he's real he said fuck Trump and then he's real he said fuck Trump and then there are all these videos of guys on there are all these videos of guys on there are all these videos of guys on Staten Island like smashing like Staten Island like smashing like portraits that they had their house so mad about I had a lot of respect for you when I lost it and they you know they have like those airbrush paintings with Pacino De Niro Gandolfini if I could be on one of those that'd be incredible I'm going back to you yeah let's get back to okay so like what do you make of the common accusation that you and Eric just stole Sarah Sherman's whole act I've never heard that one before I believe you're at the Laugh Factory Joe Rogan brought Sarah Sherman up on stage this was 2004 yeah 2004 this was the day before Mencia I think the Mencia one took all the headlines but right so Sarah Sherman video and then sure her vagina exploded you were like that's a good idea we should put this on adults yeah Eric and I were club comics yeah and we were just doing kind of like airline stuff and veggies vegetarians are people that was one of my big you remember that that I used to do vegetarians are wimpy people I remember Sarah Sherman doing that yeah what I'm saying is Sarah Sherman was doing something was doing weird cable access kind of things she was 10 I think at the time yeah the youngest comic at the comic strip but I love Sarah we did we produced some kind of some pilot for her before Lauren got his claws in her Lauren that's right Lauren Boebert Lauren Boebert yeah I love pretending that he's a woman when I when I talk to my friends about him you know like yeah this like Lauren running SNL she's got to go yeah I want to fuck this shit out of Lauren Mike I'm sorry I don't know why I went there this guy's a father I'm let you read for news audition for SNL no no okay but can I tell you something yeah it would have been so cool I would have bombed yeah I would have gotten so nervous I I still like have a it is still bar seems like the the evidence to me seems like the bar can be low though like if you're auditioning and you just have it at the moment you're just like I'm the ketchup guy and then you hear that what you did is that what I did that's what you got all the way up and then like you had an audition for SNL it was between me and Katan really mm-hmm the ketchup guy I had the ketchup guy I just watched quirky what ketchup I watched quirky Romano recently yeah phenomenal is it phenomenal he had his insane on SNL do you know that what no I didn't risk a tandem yeah what happened everyone hates him from that era right I don't know about that he's a coke liar he's a cocaine liar I don't know about that but and I don't know him but all I just you can look it up what is it they do what is a PBD always do chat GPT oh yeah what's your name again Jonah John Jonah look it up look at the Chris Kitten book his neck look it up what do you do I don't know he was doing magnitude pratfall yeah yeah died he's dead he was killed oh my god I forgot how funny the other characters in that movie are because it's like you Romano yeah he has a brother whose whole character is that he's illiterate he doesn't know how to read and the other one his entire character is that he's gay but he doesn't realize it oh and it's like to use these characters those are no well those are the yeah like it's a really just deep stuff but incredible but he was actually very kinetic and physical and like yeah yeah but my favorite you called him a cocaine liar right I did not you did I thought that's what he did right yes yes he claims he broke his neck oh yeah that's a sketch called MSNBC investigates in May 2001 he stated that the injury almost paralyzed him and led to a struggle with drug addiction and career setbacks he did sneeze because he broke his neck this yeah yeah and career setbacks this is famous I'm sure I mean if you don't want to include this because everyone knows this already yeah I'm sure everyone knows the story about Dana Carvey shooting master of disguise I think on 9/11 and I was in that turtle costume I think it's not true it is the best thing it has to be true to be true it's like when my dad my dad said like if the moon landing wasn't real he's like it just has to be real yeah it meant so much to me yeah yeah him being in the turtle suit but it's really debunked I think it has been debunked it broke my fucking heart when I heard that I just yeah turtle turtle yeah that unreal yeah taking a moment of silence in the turtle suit would it I mean that had to have been it has to be real I mean who would have made that up probably Chris Cotten coke liar yeah well ordained Mike Myers might have planted it but because those guys were feuding but really yeah I mean maybe it's one of those things where it's like well we were shooting that day but I was already I hadn't gotten into costume yet you know it could be one of those like sort of true but not not as good as we want it to be yeah I'm not sure I'm not sure I'm not sure yeah yeah you're from Allentown Pennsylvania yeah you want to do comedy as a kid or no yeah of course yeah yes what like who what did you what did you see when you're a kid that you like I mean from the beginning with like Abner Costello no I'm not joking if you wanted a real answer it's hard to not joke around I don't have the criteria on collection Abner Costello meet Frankenstein's great move is it it is it is a fun it's really it's good they it is really funny I actually just recently saw Chaplin for the first time because I was like there's no way that's funny yeah and it's funny he's he is really funny yeah good at it yeah good at what he's doing it sounds like it's from the olden days and it shouldn't be funny I watched recently very recently Sherlock jr. which is the Buster Keaton a Buster Keaton movie yeah and that's also like unbelievable not necessarily funny but like he's doing stunts and and you know a elaborate jumping off of trains and still like Mission Impossible kind of stuff yeah the clock thing right that's not that's him that's Harold Lloyd I think I mean there's a repeat of you go through like a million things but definitely Weird Al Yankovic Yankovic Yankovic Yankovic Weird Al SNL kids in the hall Monty Python you know that in my high school days Spinal Tap yeah anything I can get my hands on there wasn't that much there was not you know I didn't have the internet the way we do now and so I was just whatever was there was no like underground comedy that I was watching you know well I was talking with Caleb before the show it's like interesting though like Steve Martin was like selling out Madison Square Garden and Andy Kaufman was huge yeah he was on I mean those things nowadays I I wonder if they could be mainstream nowadays like what was it about like that era where like something so left field could be like uh so I don't know embraced like in the mainstream sense Steve Martin and Andy Kaufman are very similar yeah I think Steve Martin's way more palatable like he kind of did a lot of the same things but did it a little broader and not not in a bad way just in a yeah yeah yeah yeah yeah yeah yeah yeah yeah I think Steve Martin's way more palatable like he kind of did a lot of the same things but did it a little broader and not not in a bad way just in a way that's what it is it was but I think my opinion is there they there was not that many outlets so people were watching what everybody everybody's kind of watching the same thing right but it's weird it is really weird especially the first guy to be to be like doing weird shit like that because Kaufman is kind of like emulated so many times now but it was kind of the first guy yeah right there were a few very very like brazen uh artistic minded producer types that pushed for that stuff yeah I gotta give credit to our friend Lauren Michaels he was early early adopter of hello yeah I mean we'll say what you will but it's true he was the first host of SNL right Andy Kaufman wasn't that was George Carlin but he was on the first episode I'm writing a book about the first first year of the first so bad so now I'm actually writing a movie about the first episode of SNL it all takes place that one night but my other point was that they were they were baby boomers playing they were like they were the first generation to have grown up on watching television and they were sort of the first guys that were making fun of television or making fun of entertainment postmodern about it and that made sense to a lot of you know my parents generation they understood house they they grew up with the pretense of the phoniness of show business and it hit right at the at the peak of that and there were a couple guys like Steve Martin Andy Kaufman till and and Albert Brooks's talk show appearances have you seen those is the second host of s no second episode no he was he made films for SNL yeah no but I hosted Albert Albert was like incredible as as a guy I mean you do like a norm thing - yeah it was like high concept yes hi yeah very written he did like the ventriloquist thing have you ever seen the ventriloquist chorus yeah he's the best he's what he's the best we just in the office watch the watch the Gary Marshall scene in lost in America to take a break yeah I could I wish I'm not the kind of guy that like me I'm doing this lately I've like at the Jordan Peterson thing when I close my eyes yeah to try to remember people don't exist yeah yeah but it is helping me these days but I'm not the kind of guy that memorizes stuff but I would memorize I would like to have that scene just fully memorized yeah and be able to just tell my children acted out it's kind of it's kind of like right one of the best like see us at any movie like the desert in his heart right the desert I I was saying I was saying that I just hate that song that I do I always remember it's not a good song he's like I'll write a jingle for you I can't give you money back you're a nice guy you've amused me but he's unreal it's the best he's unreal speaking of Gary Marshall I mean we should just acknowledge who I sat in front of last night at Penny Marshall at the Glen Gary Glen Ross who is that the Arthur Fonzarelli no shit the font tiny right like five foot one yes I don't know if you've ever heard of Gary Marshal I don't know if you've ever heard of Gary Marshal yes I mean I saw Scorsese once and also just five yes I mean I saw Scorsese once and also just five foot one and just dressed so slick and I was like foot one and just dressed so slick and I was like that's the coolest guy I've ever seen in that's the coolest guy I've ever seen in that's the coolest guy I've ever seen in my life I felt very well it's funny you my life I felt very well it's funny you my life I felt very well it's funny you mentioned the height because I we were mentioned the height because I we were mentioned the height because I we were fairly uh close we I saw Glen Gary Glen fairly uh close we I saw Glen Gary Glen fairly uh close we I saw Glen Gary Glen Ross on Broadway mm-hmm all right it's Ross on Broadway mm-hmm all right it's Ross on Broadway mm-hmm all right it's a big deal check it out let's get a big deal check it out let's get a big deal check it out let's get applause maybe give it up I saw the play applause maybe give it up I saw the play applause maybe give it up I saw the play yeah in a lot of ways yeah in a lot of ways yeah in a lot of ways um and so Fonz one of my I mean if we're um and so Fonz one of my I mean if we're um and so Fonz one of my I mean if we're talking about my background the guy that talking about my background the guy that talking about my background the guy that we sent a videotape to was Bob was Bob Blumkirk and Bob to this day is still Blumkirk and Bob to this day is still Blumkirk and Bob to this day is still someone very close to me and like I I'm someone very close to me and like I I'm someone very close to me and like I I'm just being honest with you he's like he just being honest with you he's like he just being honest with you he's like he was my mentor he's almost like an uncle was my mentor he's almost like an uncle was my mentor he's almost like an uncle figure a father figure to me and still figure a father figure to me and still figure a father figure to me and still very close and uh it was very moving to very close and uh it was very moving to very close and uh it was very moving to get to see him in this play like he was get to see him in this play like he was get to see him in this play like he was so good and everything about it was so so good and everything about it was so so good and everything about it was so good and I was there as his guest which good and I was there as his guest which good and I was there as his guest which was quite an honor but the theater was was quite an honor but the theater was was quite an honor but the theater was I'd say these wonderful seats fairly I'd say these wonderful seats fairly I'd say these wonderful seats fairly close but the stage with this the stage close but the stage with this the stage close but the stage with this the stage itself is fairly low and the seats were itself is fairly low and the seats were itself is fairly low and the seats were not these were not Stadium seats I'm not these were not Stadium seats I'm not these were not Stadium seats I'm promise you so you're blocking Fonz so promise you so you're blocking Fonz so promise you so you're blocking Fonz so I'm blocking the Fonz but there's a guy I'm blocking the Fonz but there's a guy I'm blocking the Fonz but there's a guy in front of me who's bigger head than me in front of me who's bigger head than me in front of me who's bigger head than me higher up and so my view is blocked uh higher up and so my view is blocked uh higher up and so my view is blocked uh huh and so I'm trying to find this like huh and so I'm trying to find this like huh and so I'm trying to find this like medium where I'm not out of respect out medium where I'm not out of respect out medium where I'm not out of respect out of respect for oh hey Fonzie and he was of respect for oh hey Fonzie and he was of respect for oh hey Fonzie and he was by the way he was very nice and do you by the way he was very nice and do you by the way he was very nice and do you Matt Winkler well I did a movie with his Matt Winkler well I did a movie with his Matt Winkler well I did a movie with his son all right I was in oh yeah so that son all right I was in oh yeah so that son all right I was in oh yeah so that was my that was my in oh I turned was my that was my in oh I turned was my that was my in oh I turned around I said around I said around I said and people were coming up to him and and people were coming up to him and and people were coming up to him and stuff and yeah I was trying to be stuff and yeah I was trying to be stuff and yeah I was trying to be respectful but I said I did a movie with respectful but I said I did a movie with respectful but I said I did a movie with Max and he goes I did this movie called Max and he goes I did this movie called Max and he goes I did this movie called flower because of course you did flower because of course you did flower because of course you did and then he was so sweet and then we and then he was so sweet and then we and then he was so sweet and then we just we got along real he wanted to just we got along real he wanted to just we got along real he wanted to know about me and we talked for a while know about me and we talked for a while know about me and we talked for a while and you you hung out all night we went and you you hung out all night we went and you you hung out all night we went backstage you went back to your to your backstage you went back to your to your backstage you went back to your to your loft your DIY apartment I don't want loft your DIY apartment I don't want loft your DIY apartment I don't want people to say things about me what I'm people to say things about me what I'm people to say things about me what I'm this elitist and everything but there this elitist and everything but there this elitist and everything but there are moments that you have in life where are moments that you have in life where are moments that you have in life where you it's neat to be in this business you it's neat to be in this business you it's neat to be in this business yeah show yeah and I mean I grew up I yeah show yeah and I mean I grew up I yeah show yeah and I mean I grew up I'm not about you I'm watching the Fonz about you I'm watching the Fonz about you I'm watching the Fonz every week no this is my generation it's every week no this is my generation it's every week no this is my generation it's your generation I was watching uh I was your generation I was watching uh I was your generation I was watching uh I was watching the news Wolf Plus 3 I was watching the news Wolf Plus 3 I was watching the news Wolf Plus 3 I was watching no you're watching I was watching no you're watching I was watching no you're watching I was watching the OJ trial Iraq getting bombed watching the OJ trial Iraq getting bombed watching the OJ trial Iraq getting bombed in the 91 I remember the OJ trial as a in the 91 I remember the OJ trial as a in the 91 I remember the OJ trial as a kid that was like one of the first kid that was like one of the first kid that was like one of the first things I I remembered because my dad was things I I remembered because my dad was things I I remembered because my dad was like the only white man in America who's like the only white man in America who's like the only white man in America who's convinced he was innocent really yeah I convinced he was innocent really yeah I convinced he was innocent really yeah I think he was projecting his own life think he was projecting his own life think he was projecting his own life onto the trial was your dad in your onto the trial was your dad in your onto the trial was your dad in your debt you're from DC was your no no I'm debt you're from DC was your no no I'm debt you're from DC was your no no I'm Las Vegas actually yeah I was I was born Las Vegas actually yeah I was I was born Las Vegas actually yeah I was I was born in LA and then we moved to Vegas the in LA and then we moved to Vegas the in LA and then we moved to Vegas the desert in has heart it's such a bad song desert in has heart it's such a bad song desert in has heart it's such a bad song it's terrible well he's desperate he's it's terrible well he's desperate he's it's terrible well he's desperate he's in his robe he's not good the first in his robe he's not good the first in his robe he's not good the first idea is not gonna be the best idea in idea is not gonna be the best idea in idea is not gonna be the best idea in that situation it's yeah it kind of that situation it's yeah it kind of that situation it's yeah it kind of those movies are so good real life is my those movies are so good real life is my those movies are so good real life is my so I mean this is like losses I want to so I mean this is like losses I want to so I mean this is like losses I want to say early fairly early maybe high school say early fairly early maybe high school say early fairly early maybe high school but lost in America was a movie that we but lost in America was a movie that we but lost in America was a movie that we bought my parents had great taste in bought my parents had great taste in bought my parents had great taste in comedy so there's lots of those movies comedy so there's lots of those movies comedy so there's lots of those movies on and my cousin and I used to watch on and my cousin and I used to watch on and my cousin and I used to watch that lost in America and that the scene that lost in America and that the scene that lost in America and that the scene where he's the crossing guard yeah and where he's the crossing guard yeah and where he's the crossing guard yeah and the kids are driving their bikes around the kids are driving their bikes around the kids are driving their bikes around him and calling him a brillo pad fathead him and calling him a brillo pad fathead him and calling him a brillo pad fathead yeah we just would use we'd say brillo yeah we just would use we'd say brillo yeah we just would use we'd say brillo pad fathead all the time just like that pad fathead all the time just like that pad fathead all the time just like that made its way into the lexicon yeah made its way into the lexicon yeah made its way into the lexicon yeah absolutely and you bullied a lot of kids absolutely and you bullied a lot of kids absolutely and you bullied a lot of kids screwing did I believe a lot of kids screwing did I believe a lot of kids screwing did I believe a lot of kids not that I wrote not that I recall were not that I wrote not that I recall were not that I wrote not that I recall were you popular kid little respect let's get you popular kid little respect let's get you popular kid little respect let's get some wd-40 on that door I was at the gym some wd-40 on that door I was at the gym some wd-40 on that door I was at the gym this morning at the hotel and they this morning at the hotel and they this morning at the hotel and they have the peloton there yeah and it was doing have the peloton there yeah and it was doing have the peloton there yeah and it was doing that did you complain front desk that did you complain front desk that did you complain front desk thought about I thought about saying thought about I thought about saying thought about I thought about saying it's not complaining but letting them it's not complaining but letting them it's not complaining but letting them know like no one is gonna do anything know like no one is gonna do anything know like no one is gonna do anything about this it's too squeaky yeah and about this it's too squeaky yeah and about this it's too squeaky yeah and it's it's it's a small room it's just it's it's it's a small room it's just it's it's it's a small room it's just like if it's even with my headphones on like if it's even with my headphones on like if it's even with my headphones on I just hear it it sounds like kind of a I just hear it it sounds like kind of a I just hear it it sounds like kind of a sex sexual sex sex vibe was I popular in sex sexual sex sex vibe was I popular in sex sexual sex sex vibe was I popular in high school yeah not yeah I was I had a high school yeah not yeah I was I had a high school yeah not yeah I was I had a morning I'd not no joke had like a morning I'd not no joke had like a morning I'd not no joke had like a closed-circuit TV morning show in high closed-circuit TV morning show in high closed-circuit TV morning show in high school really and my last year high school really and my last year high school really and my last year high school second to last two years of that school second to last two years of that school second to last two years of that yeah so you kind of been doing that yeah so you kind of been doing that yeah so you kind of been doing that yeah we did like a wacky morning news yeah we did like a wacky morning news yeah we did like a wacky morning news show that was in everyone everyone's show that was in everyone everyone's show that was in everyone everyone's classroom every morning and they let you classroom every morning and they let you classroom every morning and they let you do it they did can you get in trouble at do it they did can you get in trouble at do it they did can you get in trouble at all I remember getting in trouble we all I remember getting in trouble we all I remember getting in trouble we probably did or probably got told to not probably did or probably got told to not probably did or probably got told to not do things I don't have a pretty bad do things I don't have a pretty bad do things I don't have a pretty bad memory about that stuff but where I grew memory about that stuff but where I grew memory about that stuff but where I grew up in Allentown it was I went to up in Allentown it was I went to up in Allentown it was I went to Catholic school and very not very Catholic school and very not very Catholic school and very not very diverse I should say not very not a lot diverse I should say not very not a lot diverse I should say not very not a lot of other types of people around in of other types of people around in of other types of people around in Allentown in the 90s and I went to Allentown in the 90s and I went to Allentown in the 90s and I went to Temple University in Philadelphia which Temple University in Philadelphia which Temple University in Philadelphia which is very diverse lots of different kinds is very diverse lots of different kinds is very diverse lots of different kinds of people and quickly became really good of people and quickly became really good of people and quickly became really good friends with a guy named Jared Alterman friends with a guy named Jared Alterman friends with a guy named Jared Alterman who's Jewish and when we came I came who's Jewish and when we came I came who's Jewish and when we came I came took him home to meet my parents I took him home to meet my parents I took him home to meet my parents I didn't take him home to meet my parents didn't take him home to meet my parents didn't take him home to meet my parents did your dad show his gun he came back did your dad show his gun he came back did your dad show his gun he came back with me and he was like hi I'm Jared I'm with me and he was like hi I'm Jared I'm with me and he was like hi I'm Jared I'm his Jewish friends I'm like his first his Jewish friends I'm like his first his Jewish friends I'm like his first Jewish friend really what your parents Jewish friend really what your parents Jewish friend really what your parents say P you he was he had to take he had to say P you he was he had to take he had to say P you he was he had to take he had to get fumigated and everything before he get fumigated and everything before he get fumigated and everything before he came in the house yeah it's kind of a came in the house yeah it's kind of a came in the house yeah it's kind of a Borat South and yeah no they were they Borat South and yeah no they were they Borat South and yeah no they were they didn't they thought it was funny but didn't they thought it was funny but didn't they thought it was funny but that was kind of the environment I grew that was kind of the environment I grew that was kind of the environment I grew up in pretty monocultury did did Billy up in pretty monocultury did did Billy up in pretty monocultury did did Billy Joel get it right in the song well I Joel get it right in the song well I Joel get it right in the song well I think Billy Joel got it pretty close think Billy Joel got it pretty close think Billy Joel got it pretty close but it should have been called Bethlehem but it should have been called Bethlehem but it should have been called Bethlehem which is the city next to Allentown which is the city next to Allentown which is the city next to Allentown really people don't say that you know really people don't say that you know really people don't say that you know what's called Baba O'Reilly actually Baba what's called Baba O'Reilly actually Baba what's called Baba O'Reilly actually Baba oh that song yeah of course I know oh that song yeah of course I know oh that song yeah of course I know that yeah and you know why that yeah and you know why that yeah and you know why Jeep so do you think that the because Jeep so do you think that the because Jeep so do you think that the because Baba Pete Townsend was into this child Baba Pete Townsend was into this child Baba Pete Townsend was into this child pornography oh no okay he's into this pornography oh no okay he's into this pornography oh no okay he's into this guru named Baba something baby Baba guru named Baba something baby Baba guru named Baba something baby Baba baby wasn't O'Reilly baby O'Reilly baby wasn't O'Reilly baby O'Reilly baby wasn't O'Reilly baby O'Reilly what no I want sure baby for the sake what no I want sure baby for the sake what no I want sure baby for the sake well so you went to college with Eric well so you went to college with Eric well so you went to college with Eric yes and then it was filmed on post-grad yes and then it was filmed on post-grad yes and then it was filmed on post-grad med school and we also went to law med school and we also went to law med school and we also went to law school you're a lawyer and a doctor school you're a lawyer and a doctor school you're a lawyer and a doctor yeah wow and so then what led you into yeah wow and so then what led you into yeah wow and so then what led you into Sarah's worm style what the copying are Sarah's worm style what the copying are Sarah's worm style what the copying are no yeah i just i feel like especially growing up with your guys stuff it's just um been replicated so much that as an aesthetic and i know that you directed a lot of commercials kind of like we're in the language of tim and eric yeah um did you do the old spice commercials well we did one of them i don't think we did the one we did the one with terry crews he his breasts yeah did you have him do the boob thing i don't i kind of feel like they're like when you do commercials you have this these ad agency types with uh it was such a weird sip because it's dripping and this i just got this suit look at all these drinks i have i have i was earlier today i walked around and got my hair cut by the way i don't know if you noticed in the suit no in a white t-shirt and i got a coffee and it was just like i had dribbles all down this white shirt it was like there were girls there live huh there were girls looking at everything probably yeah it's embarrassing man um but when these commercials you have these ad guys who kind of tell who kind of write everything and most like we're there for like 10 for 10 percent of the zhuzh you know of like the little extra push yeah i was uh and getting it done just kind of like facilitating the production of the whole thing so i don't take a lot of like pride or ownership over any of that stuff but the aesthetic kind of bled itself into like the kind of zeitgeist yeah i mean like we were doing that on our own with and i should always say like i always make try to make clear that when we say tim and eric or me or eric anything it's really us and like doug doug and john kreisel ben berman jonathan mugar like small group of people that we were that were doing a lot of this the work as well it's also very editing heavy heavy yeah i mean like that's kind of like a half i was very i'd say half of the equation i was barely a part of what we when we said you just showed up just i'm hired a hired gun yeah i heard anybody i heard you were whacked out on uh i was on a lot of horse keto at that time you're on keto a lot of keto yeah really mean really oh i saw this great clip on i was watching an old movie uh on the plane rat race no it was armageddon oh i was really watching armageddon i love that it's really good criterion collection i don't know if it is it is not armageddon china chat gpt is that i know i don't need to check it it is okay good by the way that's my uh pbd by the way we gotta chill with him dude we gotta get on that show go down to um casa it's you know palm beach right no but there's a restaurant that he this great youtube guy rm brown did this video about he all the time he goes to this one restaurant called casa casa de angelo because we were last night there's no joke 11 of us at casa de angelo we had a great time great meal great steaks he goes to one restaurant he has a compilation of all the times it's so funny but uh oh you're watching armageddon and they say like there's this like where they're all the guys are having to get physicals before they go into space yeah and he's like this one guy was on he had ketamine in his system and it seemed like you could take that meme together something of elon you know what i mean jonah let's get get on that'd be funny blow up that'd be really funny do you think that like what's the what's what replication of that your guy's style or aesthetic has bothered you the most what's the worst kind of effect like attempt at at the tim and eric adult swim kind of language talk i don't know i don't say the worst one you know it i don't think i know of anyone do you have one of me of well does anyone ripping you off yet it's on the it's kind of i hope so um i don't know i don't i can't i mean nothing's coming to me right now yeah i don't know um are there post adams probably not yeah uh i'm sure there are listen i'll be honest with you i'm sure there are there's just nothing coming to mind i don't really there are a few a few um specific jokes that like maybe like i'll tell you one sarah's sherman sarah sherman is way over the line what the is she doing even it's disgusting i think jimmy fallon has done a few things where there's like a shorts jorts thing that he did with like i hate to say it with like will ferrell who i love that's your friend that's your best one of my closest friends he stabbed you in the back and uh well that's we're not talking about stabbing what was that oh sorry sorry um they did some like very very similar to our sort of kids break thing really wearing jorts these are my jorts and they're like on green screen and yeah you know dancing and bad rapping but it felt a little lazy i'll say that but did you have revenge live you have revenge on your mind while you're long term yeah yeah you're playing a long long game yeah it'll happen when they least expect it there's a there's a bill cosby joke about like a spanish fly yeah no not spanish fly yeah where he's like he was in a snowball fight as a kid and he got hit really bad so he took this snowball put it in the freezer and waited for it to be the summer time and then like when the kid was at least he just threw a snowball at him in the in july that's good that's what i'm going to do yeah he's what a legend give it up for bill bill cosby bill cosby bill cosby bill cosby this is the deal um did you like what do people misunderstand your work i mean sure why wouldn't they i mean what because it's so confusing it's so random obfuscating i mean what what do you think is the most common like misreading of of your guys stuff or the stuff anything you've done yeah uh well i guess uh you know i've done i've done a lot of characters that i use my own name for yeah so uh i suppose there are people that think i'm a terrible leather jacket right wing type uh stand-up comedian because i do a lot of that stuff online um do you think people can't just process like art anymore no well i think the hard part is that's what people probably that's what excuse me sorry sorry no no i just want to finish before i let before you answer but that's what comes to mind with the with the andy kaufman and steve martin thing is like i don't know if that could translate it into the mainstream now i think that people had more like kind of like uh capacity for it perhaps maybe but i think back then well with steve martin there was there was a way into his work it's just me speculating yeah i'm not an expert but i felt like there was a way into that work he set it up in a way that you're like i get what this is i get this is like a corny guy there was a child as a childishness to it kaufman was a little more like hard to figure out i'm sure a lot of people back then didn't get it yeah the same way they wouldn't get it now you're saying that you're basically the kaufman of today absolutely yes but he was also like cast on a major sitcom that was very popular yeah taxi yeah so it was like if kramer if kramer jim kramer from emma from cnbc cnbc yeah no if kramer from seinfeld during its peak would go out and do really weird pratfalls pratfalls without resorting to the n-word over and over again that i thought yeah if you could do that in a weird way it would be a similar experience that america would have had when when you saw that the first time did you have to remove that it was kramer when you saw the michael richards tape i didn't know to me in my mind that character is so ubiquitous i'm like that's kramer right yeah the funniest thing on the one of the saddest apology apology on letterman stop laughing yeah yeah hostage video situation have you ever seen the like bloopers from seinfeld where like he just he's the only one serious like he's the only serious actor he's like god damn it like when they when they break he's like this is unprofessional oh no yeah i haven't seen that no that's not fun well no i think it's you wouldn't expect it out of uh a cosmo um i worked so hard on the adam friedland show that i usually realized that i forgot to eat and that's why i'm happy for huell's black edition ready to drink parentheses rtd rtd saves me for breakfast post-workout meetings school drop-off and errands it's a complete meal that i can drink and it helps me say stay consistent guys it's 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What's interesting is, like, that you, like, worked through in a network system and that you've kind of transitioned to, like, producing yourself independently. Yeah. And, like, I guess, like, was it out of frustration with, like, working through, like, networks or, like. I think it was just disinterest. Yeah. From those. From those people. I mean, the sequence of events is, like, pretty linear. It's like we do a certain amount of things that eventually come to an end. There's no. There's no interest in doing more of them from those places because times have changed, interests have changed, things that were desired are no longer desired at that level, or there's just priorities are different. People leave. The people that were your allies or support cheerleaders have moved on or whatever. Yeah, white men can't. They won't give jobs anymore. Yeah. You're reading between the lines beautifully. That's what you're saying, yeah. So there were a few things that were like, all right, well, what are we gonna. What should I do now? And there's still, like, still work within the system on other. on certain things, but. Do you think the Jews have too much power? Is that what. I'm sorry. I mean, I knew you were gonna go there. I'm sorry. And I really don't know how to handle that shit. Well, you can say it. I mean, I'm a little uncomfortable. On Cinema seems like your opus. Like, it's like a project that keeps growing. Yeah, yeah. Like, how'd you meet Greg? Well, um. Really? I've never heard it. Oh, no. I mean, I'm just kidding. We've listened to a bunch of interviews that we've never heard. Really? Yeah, I don't think you. So you're not on all the Reddit AMAs that I do, which I do quite frequently. Sam, is he saying it on Reddit? I'm just kidding. I haven't seen it. Yeah, you have. I haven't. No. I was a huge Neal Hamburger fan. The best. And so I would say, like, 2004 or something, we were. Eric and I were doing an awesome show, and I was a fan of Neal's, went to go see him. He had relocated to L.A., or he was living in L.A., and went to go see him like I would see anybody, and met him afterwards, and we knew some of the same people, and just kind of. I think our bridge together was his wife was Australian, and my soon-to-be wife was Canadian, and we were, you know, breaking the ice, talking about who are. Foreigners. Foreigners. Yeah, get it out. And I wanted some advice on, like, immigration stuff, actually, for my wife, or for my potential wife, my fiancée, whatever. What's that Dan Bongino clip where he's like, I'm divorced from my wife? Not divorced from my wife, but we're separated. Not separated, but I'm not with my wife. I love how red that guy gets. I know. His head is so big. It's like Vinny. Vinny gets red like that. I guess that was a bad question. How'd you make that? No, it's fine. I'm sorry, dude. But we just became friends, you know, and, like, as you become friends with funny people, you tend to, like, goof around, and. That project has grown so much. I mean, like. Yeah. You guys are. And we still. We just shot something the other day for it, and I swear to you, like, I get the giggles with that show like nothing else. Because of how funny Greg is and how funny I am when I'm in that character. And the basic premise is he's a snob, but he's only seen, like. Like, he's a snob about Raiders of the Lost Ark. Yeah. He's a snob about, like, just, like, the Marvel Cinematic Universe, but he considers himself, like, Criterion Collection. Is that, like. Yeah, his takes are just, like, wildly stupid. The Smurfs. The Smurfs. Everything. All movies are equal. That's the one thing. The only way you can be a better movie than another movie is if you're a better movie. The only thing that makes a movie better is if it's longer. So he's, like, really in a run-time, like, spiral, death spiral the past couple years. You guys talk about run-times so much. And he's comparing run-times and why something. And then sequels versus prequels and something's a remake. Like, it's just garbage. And then your character is you just have never heard of movies? Is that, like. I think I'm just, like, so preoccupied with other things in my life. You're, like, a narcissist? Like, a. A severe narcissist with, like, many problems. many physical and mental problems. And with rage issues, and all sorts of man problems. - It's just, I just hope you guys never stop doing it. - I don't see a way to stop. Like, we just enjoy it so much. - It kinda is your opus, a little bit. - I would think that's for the historians to determine, but yes, you can do it super affordably. I enjoy everybody involved so much. Tornicola, who we write it with and direct it, he directs it, and I mean, again, you shot something the other day, and I was like crying, laughing, halfway through it. Like, why would you stop doing something that makes you that happy? - I can't imagine, like, it'd be so hard not to break. - Oh, I break, and sort of-- - He's so good at that character. - He does a thing that we've talked about for years, which, and I do it too, but because a lot of it's so improvisational, if you get into this drone, where you start talking, and you're just talking for a while, and you're going on and on about something, and you're waiting, you're just like, wrap it up, 'cause if you're gonna laugh, you're gonna spoil a minute of footage, because, so you're just like, just get through it, but sometimes you just break. - There's a clip from the last season where he was talking about the Chalamet Wonka, as it should be considered Wonka 4. Yeah, like, yeah. That he was just, what did he say? There was something about, like, Wonka, like, oh. - Wonka heads. Why am I doing this right now? - Well, it's all independently produced now. The high network, highnetwork.tv is where you can, for five bucks a month, and it's been working, you know? We get to make it without anybody else involved. - You've been doing music. At a certain point, like, you released a sincere music. - Yeah, making all the Irony Boys very uncomfortable. - Yeah, yeah, what is that like? - Is it like Dylan, like, Royal Albert-- - Better than Dylan. - No, not the music, but it's just like-- - Just the feeling of it? - Seeing those clips of, like, the people being like, I came here for a fucking folk concert. - Yeah, yeah. - Yeah, it's just like you-- - The rock and roll. - They're, like, mad about it, guitars. - They're so mad. I love that stuff. Give me Bob. We've talked about this through, over the phone, but he is my, one of my guiding lights. - He's my favorite. - And that was always, when I was thinking about, you know, making that shift or, you know, I mean, this all starts with you just sitting around, for me at least, writing music 'cause I like doing it, and when something comes up that's, like, not funny, the decision is, like, do I pursue this or do I abandon it? - Is there a, was that stressful at first? - No, no, I thought it was cool. I thought it was, like, this is an exciting thing to try to do. - Yeah. - Because I never, I think I got to a place where I was 40 and had-- - Right. - Got married and had a kid and was, like, all right, I'm, like, living life. I'm not just, like, all about the goofs in my personal life. - Yeah. - And maybe I have things to say or I have a perspective that's not all clowning around. - I think-- - So, yeah. - I'm sorry, I cut you off. - No, but that's all right. I mean, but looking at Dylan and being, like, oh, that guy didn't give a shit. He just did what he wanted. He zigged and zagged and, like-- - Correct. - Tried shit. - Yeah. - And wasn't really worried about it. Now, maybe he was worried about it. I mean, he never talks about it, but it didn't look like that. So I just-- and I had enough people around me that, like, serious music people that were, like, very encouraging and supportive. So I, you know, I continue to do it because I'd get pleasure out of doing it. - I guess what I'm, like, probably projecting onto your decision to do that is that there is kind of a, like, you can insulate your feelings through irony, right? So, like-- - Absolutely. - Someone could be, like, this sucks. And you're, like, it's supposed to be bad, right? But, like, releasing music that's so sincere is scarier, in my mind, at least. - Yeah. There's nowhere to hide. I mean, but it's also, like-- - Plus, music's just better than comedy. So, like, it would be, like, I would want to do a good job. For this, I'm, like, you know, I've pooped my pants and stuff. - Yeah. I mean, I thought the interesting thing was, like, can you do both? Can you go back and forth? - Yeah. - At whenever you want? - Yeah. - And maybe some people have a hard time with that, for me, you know? - Yeah. - But I plan to be doing this for a long time, you know? Like, in the biz of making-- I was literally going to say, in the biz of making show. - That's right, baby. - It's so gross, right? - Yeah. - You know, like, I'm a lifer. And I plan to live for a long time. So I've got some designs on how to do that, medical things that we're going to be talking about very strongly. - What have you been doing? - Um, the weights. - The weights, yeah. You probably get 140 years. - I always-- I mean, we talked about Andy Kaufman before. But it's like, don't you think, like, Andy Kaufman got out early? - Because of cancer? - Yeah. - Yeah. - So, like, if he's, like, 48 and he's, like, still going on Letterman, doing, like, weird guys, you might be like, all right, it'll play itself out a little bit. - We kind of felt that we-- I was on-- we did "Cometown" before this and-- - What was that? - For the last, like-- - Four or five years, we just, like-- - And now what's that? - It was a-- it was a podcast. - OK. - For, uh-- - Like "WTF" or-- - Pretty much like that, yeah. But, like, yeah, we-- for the last-- of six years, for the last four years, we're like, oh, we're going to do this crap again. It was like-- - Yeah, yeah. - A little bit like, what if, you know, Elvis Presley was Chinese, and, like, it would go a little something like this. - Right. - Then these guys loved it. But it was just, like, it felt like-- - You could-- you could play the-- you could-- you figure out what's working. And then it's the balance of how much do I continue to-- continue to play into what's working versus, like, stretching and trying new things. And-- - Right. - But so you've made-- you've also-- have you been navigating, like, a journey of the sincere to some degree? - This show feels like the first time I've ever tried, to be honest. - Right. Because you're-- like, tried it. Tried just doing anything. - Adding anything, yeah. - I saw you say that. - Because it's scary. It's scary. Yeah. - But so you-- - Because, like, if something sucks, then you-- it'll hurt your feelings if you work really hard on it. - But people seem to like where you're going, right? Do you have people that are like, this sucks, because I-- why don't you go back to, you know, like, being offensive for the-- for the yucks? - No, maybe. But I-- - But you don't pay attention to that. - At this point, I don't pay attention. If my friends like it, I like-- I'm happy. - Yeah. - And my dad can watch it now. - Yeah. - Yeah. - He's proud of you. - And he's becoming a little bit of a stage mother about it. It's a little bit annoying. - Well, let me send a personal message to your dad, who's watching right now. - Fuck-- fuck off. - Adam-- - Old man. - What's your name? - Take a look at my-- - What's his name? - Old man, take a look at my life. I'm a lot like you. - I'm not like him at all. - What's his name? - I'm-- I'm-- uh, Max. - Max? - Yeah. - Let me speak to you for a second, Max. - Careful. - Your son, Adam, met me with a gay man at his apartment 12 years ago. - Uh-huh. You and the gay guy? - James Adomian. - Uh-huh. - Openly gay, proudly gay. And Adam was such a fan. A fan of mine. I inspired who he is to this day. - Not much, actually. - And-- - It's a little bit weird. - I'm here to tell you that he's made good on that by having his hero come on his little podcast. - Sarah Squirman's not on the show yet, so one day-- - But he's a good son, and you should be proud of him. And if there are any allegations coming out about him, I was unaware of these allegations before I came in this studio. - Yeah. You heard? - You have anything coming out? - Um-- - Because these people, all the time, are coming out with bad stuff, you know? I always feel like-- - I never had the gumption to do anything bad. - Right. Are you a single man? - No, I'm engaged. - Oh, you are? - Yeah. - OK, where's the ring? You don't wear an engagement ring like a man should? - Yeah. No, I don't. I never actually want to wear a ring. - Really? - Because I don't like my hands. - I think that's the only reason I got married. I like the idea of having a ring on. - You're like, I'm like Depp. - Yeah. - It's like a Depp style. - Yeah. - Like a Criss Angel, kind of Depp, kind of rings guy. - Get a bunch of rings and stuff? - Yeah. - No. - No. OK. - Do you have any tattoos? - No. Thank God. - Do you have any piercings? - I had an earring. - Oh, you did? - Yeah. - I could see a little of the remnants of it. Very embarrassing. - It's pretty embarrassing. Yeah. I thought it was cool, actually. But I thought-- yeah. - I kind of want to talk about-- I don't know. I've heard you speak about where you've seen comedy go in the last couple of years. And-- - You're going to be like Mark Norman again. - Oh, OK. - Where did I see it go? - Yeah. I mean, you deal with it a lot in office hours. Like, you know, you do it sort of in the sense of parody. Like, you did that Rogan parody. And then you did the Marr parody, which is so funny. But like, does it suck? Do you think it sucks now? - You know it does. - But it's always kind of sucked, no? - Yes. - Yeah. - Well, sure, I guess. I mean, I guess the thing that's changed from my perspective-- I mean, yeah, comedy, when I was in the '80s and '90s, there was like 90% kind of middle-of-the-road crap that was filling time or was fine. Wasn't for me. But then, like, you know, 10% of the time, Norma would come up there, or somebody like that, and you'd be like, this is crazy. crazy. This is great. I love this guy. So I'm always going to have that kind of, I guess, refined, or like, I love comedy so much that I don't accept stuff that's just hacky. But I also don't mind, I mean, but it's also my definition of that. So there's that whole thing of just like personal preference. And there's, you know, comedians that are playing to a wide audience is generally not going to be for me, but it's not that it's terrible, but it's a hipster. It's kind of hipsters to say that. There's plenty of the hipsters stuff that isn't for me either. There's definitely stuff that's for a wide audience that you like. Norm was pretty wide. That's true. But again, I mean, some of these guys break through and they can, like the Beatles were incredibly innovative and crazy, but they're also hugely popular, right? So some things are great and popular, but most things are just either popular or great. Maybe that's one way of thinking about easier. No, I just, I think that like, you know, you can also have crap that has fewer fans too, right? Absolutely. Yeah. Well, most things, I don't think the amount of people that I would say most things are crap that nobody knows about. I don't think that most things that are made, I don't think that anything that's being created is defined by like the size of the audience. I think it's just, is it good or bad? Right? Like, well, it's all, it isn't, it's all personal preference. Right. What do you, what do you, what do you actually like? Yeah. What makes you entertained or happy or thought, thought provoking or, but then, I mean, the real, I mean, other, I wouldn't probably care except that these guys are now all like dipping into social issues and political issues and it kind of feels like they're becoming like Kate McKinnon SNL, like, but it's the right wing version of it. Yeah. And it's, but it feels a little more hypocritical or something because they're coming from this, Hey, uh, we're just asking questions. Uh, I just, you know, and it's also just not funny too. It's boring. You grew up listening to Stern. Do you think there was any influence on like the casting that you guys did? Like from the whack pack? Absolutely. Those, yeah. I mean the, the, the whack pack, you had a high pitched Eric, right? Never had, that was one of our rules was like, don't poach from that squad. Really? Yeah. You had too much reverence for it. Yeah. That was his domain and it felt like we got organically, you know, people came into our world kind of organically with somebody who would come in as like a small character and we'd be like, that would be a great host of a kid's TV show or something. In retrospect, do you ever feel like, Oh, this guy's just a little bit, a little bit. Yeah. I mean, I think there's still, it's so funny still, but like at the top, you know, there was very, this was 20 years ago or something like that. 15, 10 years ago, 15 years, whenever it was, we weren't thinking about like, you know, we weren't thinking about anything except what we thought was funny. And on the set, we always tried to be fun. We tried to be, you know, uh, respectful and polite. And we knew we were trying to make something very strange and disturbing. And so that would push, you know, we bring in people and tell them to say, crazy shit. And they were pleased, happy to do it. Everybody was thrilled to work and do something weird. And, uh, you worked with Tommy Wiseau, right? Yeah. One day, one day with Tom, what was it like? I mean, he's an interesting guy, smart guy, smart guy, really talented guy. It was kind of a weirdo. When I was in college, we, we were the perfect demo for it. It kind of broke our brains. Yeah. I watched it like 10,000 times. I watched it many times. It was, we were just starting to make our stuff when that, when we were made aware of that show, or we were like, you know, done Tom goes to the mayor probably. Yeah. But, um, yeah, I mean, we came in and we, you know, we've, we fucked around with him a little bit for sure. Like, how could you not, you couldn't resist. Like, I think our bit with him was like, let's make him the director of that episode and just do whatever. Because what we really wanted to do was, let him try it, like create the vacuum for him to do what he does. But he wanted, in all fairness, like, and I understand he wanted the, he wanted, um, like real production. Uh, he wanted the infrastructure of a real TV show. Yeah. But we were like, but if we give you that, then it's, you're not going to get what you are so good at making. Right. So you can't, it's like the quantum physics thing about like, as soon as you observe something at a quantum level, it changes. So you can't really control, you know, I say that all the time. Yeah. I mean, look, look, look, I mean, about the room, especially, but so we, we, we kind of played with the idea of working with him in some way more, but did it feel bad afterwards? You were like, it wasn't as far as cool as we thought. I feel like it was just, it sounds to me like you're saying it was just a drag to meet this guy. No, it was not a drag. It was very interesting. Were you laughing a lot? I like being around eccentric weirdos. Yeah. Whatever you want to, that's the thing we start, you go down, you pull the thread of like, what do you, what do you mean by weirdo? Right. And then you go, well, I, maybe that person, you don't know what their background is. You know, if they had some kind of, you know, I guess it's like, does someone have, I guess the threshold is probably does someone have a developmental disorder? Yeah. And I would be much more as a teenager. It was, I was listening to Howard and it was like, exactly. And my position, my position on that is probably is evolved and it's not something I would want to do anymore. But at the time it was what everybody, not everybody was doing, but it, we didn't, it didn't feel like, Oh, this is, this is wrong. You know, it just felt like these are interesting weirdos that, uh, I want to put on TV and treat like they're celebrities or something, you know? It was like, and also LA is filled with just like those kinds of people with headshots and yeah. Desperate. Yeah. Desperate maybe. Yeah. Or just like, I don't know, just people that wouldn't get cast in a lot of other things. But I grew up like not only Howard Stern, but I mean a lot of like the Coen brothers or Woody Allen movies or a lot of like, there were just always interesting people in those movies that felt like sort of outsider types. Fellini-esque. Fellini-esque. Yeah. So that's where we were coming from and we were, you know, just trying stuff and when things worked, you do more of it. Um, yeah, I, I listened to a lot of Howard growing up and I've been like listening to like an archive of all of Trump's appearances. Oh, right. Recently. And it's, first of all, I mean, it's pretty obvious. It's so funny. He's the president. I mean, like it's obvious, like it's crazy. He's the president. Right. But like, second of all, it's like, um, it kind of is in retrospect, seeing Howard shift to sincerity. Like, um, I, I want people fucking hate it. You know? And I, I wonder like to what extent he feels like partially responsible for like prompting that, uh, like, or like kind of propping him up and like, you know, helping, I mean, he was one of many that did. It's not, he didn't get Trump elected obviously. And he was pretty, I mean, I remember the Stern, the, the right after he got elected the first time, that period is maybe the weirdest period of all time because they didn't know what to say. They were lost. On Howard. On Howard. From what I remember. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. I mean, well he's the president so yeah anyway what else is going on you know it was like that it was very like the voices on tonight he like loves talking about the voice yeah yeah i there's a p there's a period there's stuff about him that i love and i don't really listen in that much anymore to be honest with you i haven't really listened since high school but yeah since high school really yeah yeah because we would be late to first period because we just like want to stay in the car and listen what years would those is that is that like uh 2005 that's already years yeah already years the best well i'm a jackie the joke man guy myself i mean i've i've gone back through now with the wait no that's bad jackie sorry but i did like i i did love it so much like i got really sad like and we're not sad but i got really emotional when beat like went back on recently and there was like this tenderness oh yeah and like this like love there you ias but i love richard and sal i think they do sal's prank calls are the best i would say richard and sal's prank richard sorry yeah yeah yeah um they're very creative and you know i like when howard's yelling at gary about something petty and yeah you know uh one of the ugliest guys of all time baba boo uh gary delabate yeah sorry i don't like to comment on people's looks yeah all right it's just a better way to live he is a legendary uh first pitch at a met game i've seen that you've seen it shot yeah you can't i mean i don't i don't like talking about people's looks but you gotta think he's got bad breath yeah and a hog just absolutely packing big wang huge dick who you live in hollywood who's who's got the biggest biggest in town um well i've watched these uh pornographic films some of those guys yeah yeah i don't know where they live though i'm actually having a terrific time by the way and i know you have to cut this shit down but i think you should do a patreon you could put the whole thing up for you know how are you paying for this state of israel state of israel gelman's guy um yeah i guess i guess like the last the last thing i would really ask is like i guess like what what i really find inspiring is like that you that you really got bored it seemed and tell correct me if i'm wrong like you at what point well you just like wanting to put out music it's like uh like and like uh i don't know i think that that's like very cool to me i suppose because like it must get tiring to like have a niche that you have to fill for people and stuff yeah i mean i think when i have a creative partner like you become you get absorbed into the identity of that partnership yeah into that thing and for you it was come town for me it was tim and eric and then i'm like well who am i like what am who am i in that or who am i outside of that did you guys break up no we're still friends and we write we're trying to write a movie and you know thinking about doing stuff but the the uh it's not like that white hot like we i mean we did a lot we made a lot of shit you know we made a lot of horrible shit do you think it's a product of youth like feeling like more free to like uh make uh horrible shit you know i don't know we just were like we were in the middle of something and there was the only thing we had going it was the only thing it was also your world too yeah you had like a whole squad of guys and then you kind of a self-contained world yeah and then that comes to an end yeah as it naturally did not out of any kind of strife and not out of any kind of when you had a kid you said it was your child ruined everything yes he well we had agreed if we were going to do this we wouldn't have children really and then i disobeyed him i thought you guys said that you can't you're not going to get married until gay people can get married but things come to an end and uh that like i want to make stuff with him and he wants to make stuff with me but it will be probably very different than what we're not going to go like the band pavement or something where you're like well those are the six albums pavement made yeah and we're going to probably tour and we're going to do stuff maybe together but it's not we're not going to do another pavement album or the pixies or something or talking heads so something like more traditional narrative like it's more of like a uh um kill tony well elaborate pranks i will say elaborate very jackass style uh more like in the fielder more at realm more abstract or long form very cerebral yeah uh these are long plays like i don't want this is part of it that's all i'm going to say this right here is part of it really yeah you're in the show you got a show you got hate in your heart i've hit uh do i what no you got hate in your gut is that a reference no i don't know yeah yeah no i don't know what we'll do we've got a couple of things that that we have plans for but uh if we if it doesn't happen i'd be i'm proud of what we've done will it culminate in donald trump going to prison let's just say the third act of our movie is a little bit something that happened in butler pennsylvania but a little more i'd say it's a little more of an accurate depiction that nerd the nerd looked like elizabeth warren a lot don't you think the shooter give me a break give me a break dude so false flag i want to end on yeah yeah a reading from paul simon no did i send you i sent you this clip of bring it back to jerry lewis i sent you this clip of him on the um joan river joan river show did you watch it yeah yeah it's probably not beating his son yeah he tells the story he says uh because he's on with the child psychologist who's the and this is 1968 or something like that and the child psychologist is introducing a fairly novel concept of like not beating your kids you know like love your kids and sure and you know be a positive influence your parents watch that or no do they watch that clip yeah yeah i don't know probably not the mind didn't know well my parents never hit me but um jerry lewis is well let me tell you my perspective yeah my son gary delabata gary lewis from gary lewis and the playboys which is true that's really his son's name that's so funny uh came home with some grades that weren't let's do it without the sniff sorry i didn't take claritin today my son gary came home with grades that were below my expectations for him and he knew that he did not live up to my expectations and he came into my office and i have a belt i have a big western belt nice and i took the belt off and he pulled his pants down and i gave him a whack for each grade that disappointed me and they left three fairly sizable welts on his rear that's hot and i said gary you've taken your punter now go up to your room and stay there until i say you can get out gary lewis gary lewis from gary lewis and the playboys now i went up we have an intercom system in our house so i can listen in and when they're sleeping and what not and i went over there to listen to hear him cry and it's okay to cry by the way i always say that real men cry sissies don't and i listened and his mommy came in because his mommy came in because his you know we we have the relationship where when his mom is down on him i will go and be with them but when i'm down on on the kids she'll go and be with them and let them know that we're not ganging up on them and i listened in expecting to hear my son crying but i i only heard this i heard him say she said um are you it's okay to cry and he said no i don't i don't have to cry i know that daddy did that to me because he loves me why did the french think that's funny why is he the best american comedian to him uh he's a bad bad guy yeah good news is he's passed on rod and hell jerry lewis thanks a lot close your eyes exhale feel your body relax and let go of whatever you're carrying today well i'm letting go of the worry that i wouldn't get my new contacts in time for this class i got them delivered free from 1-800-CONTACTS 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