The Untold Lore of Suki Waterhouse

they all wanted a good looking and all the old music. They were like, that's just wipe it from Spotify and start new and like, no one was into it. - That's crazy. - Isn't that a fucking mad? - It is crazy. - Wait, you did Coachella five weeks after having a baby? That is insane. - You're super woman. - I mean, it's like, it's beautiful in some ways as fucking crazy. I mean, it's like, it's fucking weird. - But he's more weird now. - Do you ever get jealous when dating an actor or being with an actor? - The song does touch on those themes. - Wait, this has gone so quickly. I'm enjoying myself so much. - Aw. (upbeat music) - I could not be more excited to say, Sukey Waterhouse. Welcome to Nicky at night. - Hi, how you doing? - I couldn't be happier. - I couldn't be happier either. I'm very excited to be here. - Thank you, thank you. I mean, you have like, maybe the most impressive artistic resume of anyone I've ever seen. Like, you started as a model at 15. You have walked runway shows. The face of a Burberry campaign before. Oh, so casually. - We're getting out. - Like, I think there will be a role. - Like, you have just released your third studio album, Love Land. Like, you have, like, been in all the artistic fields. You are a Renaissance woman. And I'm so interested to, like, pick your brain. - I feel the same way about you. - Really? - Yes. I mean, I think you have, like, so yeah, you have, like, so many interests everywhere. And I feel like, you're sort, yeah, you're of, I just love how passionate you are about music. - Thank you. - I've always really noticed it. And I love your podcast. And it's funny. I actually, I said, you reach out to my managers. But I had said, I would love to go on his podcast. - Really? - Before, yeah. - Yeah. - It was a buying intervention. - I know, I know. It was funny. And then I was like, and then he showed me the message. And I was like, we were, we were telepagically communicating. - I know. - But you know, I reached out after I saw you at Perform at the Peppermint Club. - And you just saw me at the Peppermint Club. - That's right. - And you said you came to the open for Laveray, too. - Yes. - Last year, which was awesome. Incredible tour, also. - It was a big, it was a big tour. And I got to be an arenas, which I'd never done before. And I got to feel comfortable an arenas by the end, which was like a crazy thing. - Yeah. No one, I was so enamored with, like, your visual setup, like with the big curtain and, like, what you were doing with the long, like, flowy dress you were wearing the night that I was wearing. - Did I have, I didn't have any production on Laveray, did I? I feel like that was hers. - Maybe. - Yeah, I would just be in a big cave. - Whatever I saw, I was into a girl. (laughing) - Truly, truly. But, I don't know, I'm so interested in, like, your relationship with each part of your career. And, like, the, the amount of creative pivots you've made in your life. Walk me through this sort of journey from-- - Pivots, I've made. - Yeah. - Like, walk me through that, you know. How do you start in one thing and end up as a music artist? - I don't know, it wasn't, it's not like I had, like, a grand master plan. (laughing) You know what I mean? Like, maybe, maybe, like, I mean, it's, like, kind of, maybe, like, those, those, like, private, kind of, dreams that you keep to yourself. - Yeah. - But I was still, you know, I was making the music all the time. I was sort of, like, I was creating for years and years and years, but I didn't quite ever see it. You never quite, unless it's, like, suddenly in front of you. - Right. - We're actually quite see-a-way. - Right, right, right, right. - That will happen. But I don't know. I can take you back to, like, the beginning, if you want. - Please, like, tell me, let's talk about from, like, fashion to getting your first movie. Like, that sort of-- - Okay. That's, yeah. So I think, like, fashion stuff, I was in school. I was in, I was in, kind of, secondary school. So I think I was about, like, 14 or 15. And I started, I think, yeah, it's, like, slightly hazy to me. I just found, like, my old emails the other day, because I found this picture of me, and it was this Polaroid strip of me and Iggy Pop. - Oh, wow. - And I did this shoot when I was about 16. And I remember that was, like, right at the beginning of starting modeling. And I was, like, doing my GCSEs. - Yeah. - And I had gone to, so I was sort of, like, I was sort of, like, out a lot, like, really young in London. And, like, yeah, definitely, like, yeah, 14, 15. I lived in London, but, like, you know, maybe, like, 40 minutes from the centre. And I really went and found these, like, there was, like, a DJ group, and they had this blog. There's this blog called "Stunners International" that I'm, like, on, like, sometimes, like, just in a DJ booth, like, wearing just, like, a bra, or something. It's insane. It's insane when I look back. Do you know what I mean? But I was, like, out, and it was a really fun, it was, like, very fun scene back then. - Right. - And actually, like, it had great. It had, yeah, it had a really, really amazing time. So I think, like, yeah, sort of, like, out at that point. And then, I remember, so I had, like, there was someone who, like, sort of scouted me. And then, that was one of my first jobs in L.A. 'Cause I was, yeah, so I found that the other day on the emails and that was, like, 2008. - Wow. - Yeah. - That's kind of beautiful. - Isn't that fucking mad? - It is crazy. - Yeah. - But it's also, like, so beautiful that I have really grown to love this, like, docky, like, I've grown to love this idea, like, documenting myself once a week. You know what I mean? And, like, how, it is, like, so beautiful to be able to find these things of yourself in moments and be like, "Oh, like, like, I was such a different person." - I know, finding your emails and then, like, being like, "Oh, you know, like, yeah, we're talking about test shoots." - Yeah. - And you were just like, "Yeah, so I got signed to an agency when I was like, yeah, I guess I'm pretty young to IMG, and I had a job in an office at the time of a summer." - Yeah. - I was like, working for my dad's, so random. I was like, working, like, I was doing this call center, like, I was taking phone calls. - Suki, what a house, I'm like, "Help, yeah." It was, like, for this company. - That's crazy. - Yeah, he's a doctor, and it was for this company that he had that, like, wasn't his private practice, but I was doing that, and I absolutely, I was, like, hating it, like, absolutely miserable. And so that summer went in. That was, like, the summer that I sort of, like, got signed. And I remember, I was, I remember, yeah. I remember it was, like, very immediate them. I don't know, I'm just going, but I remember it was, it was like, I was, it was very, they were like, yes, but you've got to be like, you've got to get those, you've got to get the measurements in. - Right. - So I was at a lot of, like, - Scary stuff. And also to experience as a teenager. - I was really young, and I was like, I do not want to be, like, this is my, I knew it was kind of like a, I felt like when you're doing creative things, it's like a, it's a ticket out. - Totally. - A situation, you know? - Yeah, so much of the school. - I knew it was, like, swinging from vines, you know, and you got it, like, you do ones to get momentum and to, like, go and grab onto the next one, and, like, sometimes you can even see where you're going, but you just have to trust that, like, - Exactly. - The momentum will take you somewhere, yeah. - Yes, exactly. And, you know, and a lot, and that, like, yeah, looking back, so you take a lot of shit from that, you know, from the grown ups around you, and also just, like, yeah, what it was, especially at that time. This is, like, pre-instagram, this is, like, pre-people, like, having any kind of, like, voice, like, you would never-- - Right, leverage. - You'd never, like, hear a model, like, speak. - Wow. - You know, net. - And that's sort of tough time for Instagram. - Yeah, I can't imagine, again, like, experiencing that at 14, you know, much of that would be hard, like, when you're going through all these questioning yourself and experiencing all these things for the first time. - Yeah. - Especially as a young woman. - Yeah, so it was funny going back into those emails the other day, 'cause I went old 2008, and I think that was, like, the first or second year. - Wow. - I'd started it, and I was doing my GCSEs, and I remember saying to my mom, like, I'm going to LA, and I'm doing this, like, job with the hip hop, and I stayed in, like, Laurie start from Chrome Harts, took me out, and I went to, like, the shadow for the first time, and, like, my mind was like-- - What was the shadow? - Fucking blown. And when I looked back, and I'm, like, that was the week I was doing my GCSEs, I'm like, that was pretty fucking cool. - Yeah. - What was going on at that, like, open, you know, suddenly I got to CLA for the first time in, you know, when you were, like, a British kid, you dream big time. - Right, Hollywood. - Oh my god, about going to LA, about going to New York. - Right. - I think I remember, at the time, I had a 35-mile camera that a photographer had taken me, that given to me, and that was, like, the first sort of things that I would constantly, I would always be, like, putting it up, and maybe after a photo shoot, or whatever, or just, like, in an airport or out on the street, and I'd do these, like, self-timer shoots, and I had this blog, called, like, suki-aless.com, and that was, like, it was brilliant. - We've got to find out if suki-aless.com is still sending it. - And I wish I hadn't deleted it. I know I was, like, really broke at the time, and there was, like, a cost for the website. - Yeah. - And, like, a guy that had had a crush on me had started it for me, and, like, and then, when I, like, was like, oh, I don't, like, want to go out, he was like, he was like, "Envoys or whatever." And that was, like, just too expensive, just to it. But I love that blog, and it was, like, there's, like, I've got a couple of the photos printed, and. And I used to rip them, and start to put, you know, I start to write on them, and I think that was, like, where, like, I started, sort of, like, the music, and the poems, and the things that I would, like, be done, and I put them onto those images, and that was, like, where I started, like, kind of. having this sort of like scrapbooky online thing that I think like all of those influences like start it was like beginning to form of like how I wanted to like lurk and sound even yeah that was gonna say because I it's interesting to me that this music process starts in some ways visually almost a little bit because I feel like so much of your artistry is rooted in that like this very like heavy like 60s and 70s inspiration this love of vintage that you have has always been so fascinating to me and I think one of the coolest things about you in your music videos and and all the things that come with it and I love that like I you see that in you so young you know what I mean yeah I definitely I definitely think that was like my yeah I think I think when I think like the the right like I think London had a big I think being in London at that time was like a huge thing yeah for the for like fashion and also just being just being out all the time and like it was I commit you know it was like London was really fucking popping at that point and it was like you you know you're dressing crazy there's no Instagram it was like all about actually being out and like connecting it was really wow but yeah I definitely had like I had like some serious 60s phases like when I was like 17 18 definitely yeah I was like a full I was obsessed with being a mod really yeah I love it and I love it again even like what you do it like you love like the feathers and the big like sort of like robe type dresses you know what I don't know what they're called but when they have like this sleeves and like they're sheer I do love that's like gone a little bit more kind of like 70s floating out but there was a time when it was like white yeah it was like white boots white tights you know like I was I really loved having like massive they look so bad actually but like huge big fake eyelashes on and I just wanted to be like yeah I wanted to be in my mind I was like wanted to look like you know patty boy really huge icon that was the inspiration yeah patty boy marion faithful yeah like I need to palenberg yeah that's awesome so getting into like the start of your journey in music something that is like really fascinated me with you as an artist is with one song specifically like the story of good looking and how that song blew up like years after you released it I know I'm so can you explain like that sort of journey of like putting something out and then waking up one day five years later to it being so much bigger set more than that like seven yeah such a long time so like yeah so the story of good looking I went to a Jake Bob concert when I was like 20 or something and I've been making a lot of music before this yeah anyone that I met out or that all kinds like they were kind of different characters different styles of music like and there were a couple of people that I met around that time actually before Nutt and George I'd met I met someone called Blue May who produced the Lily Allen album really yeah and he and we've worked together for years and years and years and he's amazing and he was like somebody that really like encouraged me and was just such a gorgeous person but I went to a Jake Bob concert and I really wanted to see the opener and she was called Finley and she still has an artist project called Finley like it's fucking amazing and and when I got backstage or something and and met her and she said why didn't you come over and make some music I've got like with my boyfriend they just started going out and his name's Jules upon there and they just started dating that's still together and this was like yeah it was just like years ago when I was like 21 so like over a decade and and we yeah we started we started just making music together and that was like the first time that I think I'd ever been with like I mean it was like being yeah in there in like a little musical thruple and that was the first time where it was like it's just something happened in the room where we had the same taste right and there was something going on where you know where you don't have to where it's actually it's fun and you can like kind of they were right at the beginning of like dating I kind of like came into the mix and we just spent a lot of time together and go we went to we would go to the countryside in France like we it was it was any moment that I had in and at by that point like I had quite like modeling was kind of growing I was doing a lot of that stuff but it was we just loved it we just love making music together so I released brutally that was like the first song I released in 2016 and I remember I got absolutely like sat on by the British press and like whoa yeah it was because it was that they just like did not want that it's like the weird thing and it's like don't talk about like changing changing lanes and pivoting I remember I remember there was like this article that like really hurt me for a long time and I like I just like set me back quite a lot like she's failed to char and I'm like this is an acoustic song and they're eating their words and I don't even have like you know and there's no team behind me in any way I'm like put this up on district it anyway like the next song that I put up and so I was I was sort of like put a song up every couple of I would put like one song up a year wow I was just like kind of yeah I was doing it but I what but I yeah so I threw that song up on district it I really love like when you're on Spotify that I didn't understand that has to be a square so I made this album artwork for it but it doesn't actually fill up so like looks really bad it's just like there's just like dead space I kind of love that I know it's like a beautiful imperfection yeah yeah so yeah anyway put that song up and then put Joe Anna up afterwards like a year after that and yeah and it just had like it just kind of like lived for a long time just sat there yeah and then anytime like I was yeah I don't know like the anytime I sort of was going through making music with other people it's just it's just funny to me because like no one ever really like like those songs that much like when I would approach like managers or you know I was trying to like get my foot more in the door with stuff and then when I signed to sub pop and like like no shade to them at all but like the team I had at the time when I signed to sub pop and was releasing my first record that I'd like so like independently made my first record finally got it together like during the pandemic wow and then sub pop like took it on afterwards but they all wanted good looking and all the old music to just they were like that's just wipe it from Spotify and start new and like no one was into it and they just they wanted a fresh start yeah it's funny isn't it and I was like no way because and now it's your biggest song yeah but like there was like a couple there was like a small fan base and of people that like like brutally liked good looking like just like the couple of songs that I had out and they were like the ones that were really encouraging honestly like people that were just sort of like reach out to me on DMs or ever and be like I love this song but yeah and then and then it with like yeah so so that those songs were just like independent to me and they I don't know what video it was it was some anime thing the beauty of the internet the beauty of the internet seven years later it started and wow and that was really strange yeah it's so weird yeah it's beautiful and and it's I think also like a cool thing about this era of music we're in now where like that can happen you know like in the days of the radio it's like they were cycling all the time right it would have been out of whatever year like you know and the internet is infinite and vast in a way that I think is kind of beautiful yeah when you see these sorts of moments I mean it's like it's beautiful in some ways it's fucking crazy I mean it's like I don't even know how to like process how strange it is and it's like amazing and it's also it's also just like I don't know it's so fucking chaotic is it it's one thing I do think like for me like maybe this experience it's like that has like changed that for me but it's like yeah you really don't know so like the whole thing of like oh like your first week or right all that kind of stuff like I don't yeah it doesn't really like doesn't mean I mean things that I grow to love like albums that I grow to songs that I'm going to love in a couple of months or something off albums that have just come out sometimes I just like don't like sometimes we just don't listen to things totally totally you know the first like month or two or like yeah or I don't know sometimes I'll listen to something the first time and just be like not for me and then it gets me yeah in a different way yeah or you hear it in a setting is like such a thing for me you know like someone plays a song while we're driving in the car with the windows down I'm like wait like you live you know what I mean like like their music is so like that like context is everything I think and it's a tough thing as an artist to learn that you have to let people sit with it for a little while oh my god a thousand thousand percent you have to let people say what all that really matters as an artist is that like you know that you have like fuck with it so hard yeah and got an obsessed with it and like every song that makes your album you have been And like, you've been, at some point, you've listened to it literally thousands of times. Because you fuck with it that hard. - Right. - You know, if you do, then I know that. - Someone else will. - Someone else will. And then that's also like, I feel like the funny thing I hear with artists is that they're like, yeah, then I listen to this song a thousand times while waking it. And by the time that it's out, I'm like, don't, I can't stream it for the first three months. - Yeah, yeah, yeah. - 'Cause I listen to 87 versions of it. And like, and now I gotta like take a break from it. - Yeah. - And then they tore it and fall back in love with it. - Oh, it's so exciting going on to it. It's so exciting. - Yeah. I mean, I'm so, let's talk about Love Land. - Okay. - I am so interested. I would love like, first, what does Love Land mean to you though? - I feel like Love Land is this like place that I've sort of arrived at. It's funny. I think I've been had like a lot of internal turmoil that maybe like, sometimes if you look at someone's life, you'd be like, oh, like there's, you, what turmoil? - Right. - Yeah, but just like, yeah, a lot of just like kind of, yeah, trying to just like adjust to being like, who the fuck am I like after? - I mean, you created life in between the last two albums. - Yeah. Yeah, and it's, and it was, and I think like the, yeah, right after that, it's like, it's quite, it's like a very intense thing to, and I threw, and I threw myself, I think I like had, you know, I don't, I don't regret any of the stores very much, but I think I was, I was very much like, I'm not, I'm not stopping at all. - Wow. - Like I'm doing, I'm keeping, I'm keeping going, like I'm on stage right after, like five weeks after and like did Coachella. - Wow. - Yeah. - You did Coachella five weeks after having a baby? - Mm-hmm. - That is insane. There's nothing you can do. - It was like, no, it's like, it was a very insane decision. - I can imagine. - That was like great, and like right for me, definitely not, but it was fun. It was like fucking loopy, like I'm, I'm a bit, I'm a bit mad, but yeah, so I think, yeah, so I think it's like a celebration. I think it's, yeah, I think it's like a celebration of, of like all of these things co-existing at the same time. And yeah, and it's obviously been, like it's been possible and it's also, it's just been, yeah, it's been like fucking hard sometimes. (laughing) - I can imagine. - The gorgeous at the same time, it's just, it's just, it's just gorgeousness. - Yeah. - And like having her at the same time is like, it is basically like all my, it's like having all my dreams at the same time. - Wow. - At once. - That's beautiful. It's like fragile and it's, and it's also just like, yeah, it's like what an insane thing to have, to have these things all at the same time. And like, it's like a fleeting moment. - Yeah. - Of having like a little small baby and having like the best things that you've always dreamed of having, happening to you at the same time. And they're also happening to your partner at the same time. And also that means that you don't like get to be together for a long time. - Yeah, there's conflict that comes with two people pursuing their dreams at the same time. - Right. - But that's what I love. Like I feel like so much of the writing in this album really touches on that. The song's like weirdo is, I think my favorite. - I love that everybody loves that song. It's like, it's actually such a surprise. It's like, I feel like I was, there's been like times in the last couple of months where I've been like, I think that should be a single. And it's like everyone's like, that's not, you know, that's not a single little. That's it. - I love it. - And then it's weirdly become, I feel like it's sort of people's favorite and it's really nice 'cause it sort of reminded me to, it makes me excited about making the next record 'cause I'm kind of like, I'm like, oh yeah. It's very blunt and very personal. - Right. - And yeah, it makes me want to get back into the studio and be like, okay, I can be more, I can be more personal and blunt. - Yeah, I know it. I think that that is like what people really appreciate it about, you know, like the lines in the song are like, you're on the phone making us laugh. Sometimes it gets me down bad. Our daughter misses her dad. How to counting the days till you're coming back home. Do you feel like your partner was like a muse for this album? - Yeah, I mean, my life is a muse for this album and he's like part of that. So absolutely, definitely. And yeah, of course, of course for that song, I feel like no song, like I couldn't have, he is a weirdo and that, he, so he definitely inspired such a guy. - He is a weirdo. - He's a fucking weirdo. - But he's a weirdo. - Yeah, he's my weirdo. And that's like the beauty of the song. - And he loves that song and he was, he was like, yeah, he, he sort of, I've played him that song before and then actually when it came out, he was, he probably like saw some stuff on Twitter and he's like, he's like, I just listened to all the lyrics and he's like, you know, really listened to it and he's like, I really, he's like, I love that song. - And then he's, yeah, he loves things being about him. And like, so he was like, he was like, then he was like, you know, you should have called the album where Joe, and he's kind of going like, and he's going to, if he's going to, that sounds like the name of his album. - It would have been a cue out. - Yeah, it would have been a cue. - Weirdo, it was a debut album. Oh my God. Another song that like really struck me was Morals and the meaning of that song. Like, do you ever get jealous when dating an actor or being with an actor? - I feel like, do you know what? I think I'm really actually quite good. Like, I'm really, I think I'm incredibly, obviously like an actor too. - Yeah. - So like, you know, I also, I completely like know what it is. What it is. - What it is like. - And I've also like, you know, done films and, - Right. - You know, while being relationship, and everything like that, so yeah, I don't forget it. - I mean, yeah, so exactly. So like, I don't really, yeah, so I don't really find it. I don't really find it that much of a, it's not something that I kind of, I think, but you know what, it would be dependent on, it depends on like who you're with. And like, Robert's like, literally like, I don't really feel that. - Right. - That's beautiful. - Because of, yeah, because of just our dynamic. - Right, that's like trust and foundation and love. - Yeah, we're not, it gets weird. Our relationship's never been like, it's never really been like that, to be honest. - Wow. - Which is really nice. I don't think we'd be able to do what, the way that we do it, if we were like super light. - Right, right. - I just don't think it would have, it would have worked. But, right. - The song does touch on those themes a little bit. - So the song does touch on those themes. And like, it sort of like comes from like a little joke, like if, of our, of ours, like sort of, if, you know, if like one of us is like, I'm like, I think she likes you. And it's like sort of a joke. And it's like our way of being about it will be like, he'll be like, of course, like, you're just like, you know? - Right. - And then if it's the other way around, I'll be like. - Of course. - You're, you're students. - Exactly. So like, that's how we kind of like, you know, have a thing. But in the case of that song, yes, I think it's like, if there's ever been a time where I just, it where I feel like someone's like being a little bit, you know? - They're questioning their morals. - Just a little bit, yes. And then it's kind of me going, it's me going like, well, of course, of course you would. - Yeah. - With like a little wink, because. - I have my dream, man, like, who will you be? - Well, yeah, like, of course, you were because like, I think he's like, so funny and so great. - Oh. - And a weirdo. - All those things, yes, exactly. So it's kind of, yeah, it's sort of, it's sort of, yeah, I guess that song kind of goes, it sort of like touches on that fear of what if like, what if like the girl abandoned her morals, like, what if, yeah, it goes into those fears of like, what if she did? What if you did? - Right. - Yeah. And I think that songs like that are so vulnerable and personal. And I think that's like something that, like, first listen, really stuck out to me about this album was like, I felt like I saw so much of you that I hadn't got to see before. - Right. - You know what I mean? In a way that was so beautiful, like, the way you think about love and the good and bad and like, difficult parts of it, you know what I mean? Like, it's not just only this like, happy-go-lucky fairy tale love songs album. It has a lot of like, talking about these conflicting feelings and insecurities and stuff like that. - I mean, it's scary, like, I mean, obviously, like, we, I mean, obviously, it's like very like, it's glamorous. And I love like, we all like know the stories that happen all the time about like, you know, being on film sets and falling in love. I mean, a film set is literally like, the most. It's romantic, please. - It's very much a place where people do fall in love. - Wow. Why do you think that is? - Because you go and hang out for like, months and months together. - That is true. - Usually make out and pretend to have sex. - Wow. - So like. (laughs) - Yeah, I also do that. - I'm not saying it. - No, that's like such a problem I experience too. - No, but I'm not saying that like, it's like, most people are like really professional and I have them. own lives and like don't it's like for the most part linked it's fine yeah but but of course like it is a of course it is of course we all know like wow right yeah no I totally I totally yeah I agree and you hear it all the time and also it's like you're pretending to be something I love reading about it I just don't want it yeah that was something I loved out what I was watching when I was doing research for this interview is like you're obsessed with memoirs oh I do and you will like always talk about my memoir kick for the last uh for the last record yeah really yeah that's why I called it memoir of a sparkle muffin wow I don't know I was in some kind of like postpartum psychosis or like I don't know what was happening to me when I called my album memoir of a sparkle muffin it's iconic but I do love I think it's so memorable right and it's so like you you know what I mean like I think some of the coolest things an artist can do is when they make something that I'm like no other artists could have like gotten away with this sort of right it's like so deeply rooted in who you are um and it's an amazing album I definitely went a little bit more uh I went a little bit more classic this time yeah yeah yeah you did but I like I'm talking about like the fucking rare colorful Australian spider yeah and that was great and then this time I was like this time I was kind of like it was it was different but I did actually call my record um I quite actually came I came the the name loveland I saw it in an article um and I it was actually someone that I wish had a memoir her name's Augusta Britt and she was uh call map McCarthy's muse and I read this article in vanity fair about her which I really recommend yeah that's where the word loveland uh where it came from yeah and it's part it's a it's a perfect way to talk about the album I think like it you did is you're in loveland you know and and also that loveland isn't always sunshine and rainbows right you know what I mean um but you get both sides of that like throughout the body of work which I think is really really cool um but I'd love to talk about back in love oh yeah because that's I think a lot of people think that that's a song about a person and I don't think that it is I mean it kind of is to me really yeah what does you explain it to me then um I mean I think yeah you're right it's like it's it's all the it's all the things to me but I think I mean it's quite funny like when I wrote that song me and Nat and Jules who I was talking about earlier I think that song was like right at the end and I had this like I mean I've written so many songs for this record like maybe like I swear like I think I had like 70 demos by the end it's a lot I mean we all do you just do that's crazy I know but that's like every when you go up in the vault here in there girl I know I want to so I mean is do you know how hard it is to choose like totally I get to stay and then I my last record I did wait a lot of songs and I was trying and I really like wanted to try and just do like have it be like 14 and not I feel like I've got a lot of criticism last record of like it's too long I'm blah blah blah I know but you know you always try and like for the next one you go okay can I all right I heard you yeah but it is really difficult it like makes it it causes a lot of yeah I get like I do get have like months of anguish and people say like no regrets and I'm like no I always I'm like going back and being like totally the song beyond that and yeah it's like rattles me so what keeps me up and then yes but yeah so with that with that song I felt like I felt like yeah yeah I felt like I was at the end of everything I had so many so many songs but I like knew that me Nat and Jules like we'd made jukebox and we'd made Notting Hill and we made seasons with Aaron Desner and but like I knew that there was like one more for us that hadn't we just hadn't realized yet so it was like just it was actually December which was quite quite recently really if in the kind of yeah cycle yeah and the cycle of everything it was like pretty recently and I was in New York and I kept sort of flying to London for just these like quick weekends to try and to just try and like find something with them and I was in the studio with them in there they sort of live in their like warehouse studio and it's very dark and it's just got lamps around and I did a had to go and we spent the whole day and the whole that we usually don't really say what we're trying to set out to do we just sort of feel it feel it and go for it and and that day it was like if it's not if it's not something like we're gonna that I was like if it's not something I'm going to be playing on stage for the rest of my life and be fucking proud of and like it's good you know then it's then I don't want it I don't want it and that was like the we were going we all said like we're going for epic we're going to epic and then we spend like the whole day doing fuck all like me and Jaws had this like song called if a lady was if a lady was your lover and like we thought we sort of it was like sort of funny and we were laying stuff down and that was like in the corner like this just like this is shit she's from Manchester she's like this is fucking weird and like and she's just say no she's a she's just like in the corner I kind of love that though yeah because sometimes you need that you need someone to tell you that yeah but when we let she say it off to each other all the time we like and that's what you want in the creative collaborator yeah but we were like ignoring her at that point and then and then I went to a and then I had to go and do a call and do a actually like an audition I don't know why I'd like allow myself to do it to do it in the studio and I was like Jaws I need to use the studio for the light and there's only like a light in there and he's like no I'm staying in here so I literally did it in the dark absolutely what was like the worst audition I've ever done but when I came back in not had not I've been going like and I've got a little voice memo of it yeah yeah I just did the song explode a podcast and it goes really the whole thing and I'm kind of like walk back in and I'm like oh that's cool and then Jaws started like laying that down with Melatron and then suddenly like very quickly this song started happening all like chords coming together and I started I remember going like I remember going like back in love again and and I came up with that because I was thinking I was like thinking about I was thinking about like it was like it's personal to me right and it's not like it's nothing it's not like falling out of love but but it's um it's like you know like I do think like after you have a kid like everything changes a lot it's like like I don't know like a weekend together used to go and be like looking at like going and driving around and like looking for a lamp and like waiting up at like midday right yeah it's like you know what I mean it's not just your white friend yeah that there's this this entire person that you have to take care of and yeah and like sketch and it becomes it's that especially with what we do it's like I'm so okay so I think like that that that phrase was like kind of like based around like I don't know like maybe like going on a walk together or like seeing I it was like sort of the idea of like like an action like you know like sometimes I say I just imagine in my head like oh back in love like brings you a cup of tea back in love like takes you for dinner back in love you know like about being is like having that like effort put into being like like romance romance right right right and like feeling that autonomy over your own life again a little yeah or like yeah exactly and like having like having your yeah having like like having your relationship feel like like sexy again yeah yeah exactly and that stuff's like yeah so important and and and it's like and when you have a kid you just like it's just like blackout right I think personally for like a bit because it's just I mean like I yeah especially the beginning why not yeah and newborn you know right you yeah and that's that's how I interpreted this song was like back in love again with like life and music and creating things you know I mean of like you're like like I'm back baby and that's like with why the trumpets I love that you said that we're going for epic trumpets are so epic you know like just the way the song opens right exactly I wanted it to feel if well that started on satar joules played that whole intro on satar and and then we like change to out for for trumpets later but but yeah I wanted it to feel yeah like an open like like an opening like a re-imagining like like like like a gates opening to heaven and then and it made me feel like there's new life that's obviously come into my life there's new life inside of myself like it also felt and then suddenly it was like oh this album like has a completion to it and and and it also felt like I knew that that in that moment very quickly it was like this is the beginning of the album is this the open yeah yeah I felt that exactly it is the perfect like lead single opener like the again like I don't know those trumpets I imagine like the curtain opening and the spotlight drops down on you that's what happens in turn literally there's a kabuki really why you need to yeah yeah I'm not I missed it I know I know I really want it's gonna happen we'll have our moment yeah that's it's again it so I I feel like I'm learning so much about you and a really beautiful way yeah yeah and it's like I I feel like so I don't know again like I said like in the first thing that I felt with this album is like how personal it it is and in a way that is cool. I feel like that has been something that you have had a guard up around for a while. - Do you think so? - I mean, in a healthy way. - Yeah. - Like in a way that I actually admire a lot if I'm being honest with you. Like that you have maintained this intimacy and privacy I think is beautiful. And I honestly think if I was in a similar situation to you I would have a similar approach. But I love like-- - Like I don't know, what part do you think? I feel like I don't know. - I don't know, just feel like-- - I want more, could I say, I don't know. (laughs) - Well you say a lot with the music. And that's what I was thinking. - I know, but do you think I'm like KG? I don't know. - No, not at all. I don't know. This is what I'm saying. I think you have very healthy boundaries. - Healthy boundaries. - Yeah, like especially with having a child in both being like a public figure. That is a hard thing to navigate. And even in the album there's lines where it's like there's people outside our door. - Right, right. - And yeah. - I feel like that was like a hard thing. Like I don't really, I feel like in like normal life if that happens, like it's sort of just like whatever to be honest and like maybe like you look shit going to get a fucking coffee at which it's like. But then I feel like that was that song. It was like harder for me to deal. It was probably the hardest time that I've ever really had with that because it's just so much more when you have a baby because everyone wants to see if you're like what your body looks like after and they want to see like. - Which isn't saying. - It's just like in that, and it's just you really are just like. - In its knowledge. - You're not in the middle eating and also I think that this, like you know, your people trying to take a picture of a child and post it on the internet without the consent of that child or the parent is not right. - Yeah, it's just annoying, it's just more annoying. And then you're like because you're in a really especially when you're like right, like when you're in that first bit, you're like so hormonal, you're so sensitive, you're always really paranoid. - Wow. - Yeah, you are. - Yeah, totally. - Like if you're hormones are like it's like people that have had a baby will know what I'm talking about. It's like, it's literally a roller coaster. - Yeah, you're like, she just said it. - And then when there are people outside of your home, you're like, she's just like. - Right, oh my God, I cannot even imagine it. - And like you want to figure out how to like do things like do the fucking car seat and like, you know, go down the street and you're just doing all this stuff for like the first time and you just don't want to have someone like take a picture of it and then like open TikTok and then people will be like, she looks like she. - Yeah, but I very much resonate with what you just said. And like it's kind of honestly the entire like thesis of the show is like that I want to talk to artists about their music and the stories that are telling their albums, you know, that it's not like, I think this idea that like press and the internet app is so like obsessed with like, like God to journalism or trying to like, farm a viral clip instead of like appreciating like this incredible body of work that you made, you know what I mean. And that's like what my goal with of starting this was to like, re-center the conversation back to. - Well, you're the perfect person to do that. - Oh my God, thank you. - Like fucking smart and interesting. - Thank you. - You actually know what the fuck you're talking about. It's so funny. It's like the, I have to tell you this. - Please. - I haven't told, no, just talking about like journalism or like, I'm not gonna say who it was. - Don't. - But no, so it was like a, no, it wasn't a but, it was like a publication, right? Like a video thing that I did the other day. But I don't like means shape, but it was just funny. And I think that like AI is, I think people are writing their questions with AI a lot, right? But I just thought this was funny. So I'm like, I'm like sitting there doing the interview. - Yeah. - And just like, yeah. And they go like, how was it having Olivia Rodrigo do backing vocals for your, for love land? And I'm like, pay for it. - That didn't happen? (laughing) - I'm like, back in, of course, pay for like, you're right. - Oh yeah, yeah, sure. She's like, interesting. - Oh yeah, and I was like, oh, I didn't. I don't know if that happened, don't, don't, don't, - You're like, I wasn't aware. - Yeah, yeah, yeah, maybe, maybe in a dream version of love land. And they're like, oh, okay. Like maybe we read the wrong article and went, there's no articles. - But I will say that as someone who has done this, there is wrong information articles all the time. - It's so wrong. I have all the time. - All the time. - All the time. - It's wrong. - And then it's weird, and then I feel embarrassed 'cause I think I'm like referencing a credible source. - I know. - And I'm like, wait, I'm sorry. I thought that this was like a thing you said, and it was gonna be like exciting that I read it. - Right, right, right. - But then it is quite funny. - Because then they get it wrong. - Then they're like, oh, how was it? Yeah, then they asked, they were like, how was it being? You were pregnant making this album, and you're like, nah, that was a lot. - Yeah, that was the last one. - Yeah. - Anyway, I thought they lived a Rodrigo thing. It was just so funny. - Well, Suki, thank you for coming on. It was seriously such an honor to have. - Wait, have we had it now? I know. - Unfortunately, we have. (laughing) - That's the greatest compliment I could ever receive. - I know, I've enjoyed myself so much. - Oh, okay. - You got my number, we can hang out anytime. - We can hang out. - We can hang out anytime. - Get a coffee. Show me some music you're working on. - I would love that. - Oh, I would love that. - I would really love that. - I please do. - I need friends. Seriously. - Great, happy. - Thank you. Thank you so much for having me. - Oh my god, and hey, let's do it again sometime. - I would love to, I would love to. - All right, well, thank you so much, and we'll see you next week. Bye.