The Psychology Of...The Traitors - UK Season 4 Episode 10-12

This podcast is part of the Sports Social Podcast Network. Hello and welcome to the award winning gutter brought to you in association with Richmond sausages, I think. No. No, it's not Richmond sausages at all, is it, John? It's not Richmond sausages at all because you've got that actual sponsor. I've totally forgot myself for a minute. It's all right. See, I don't. For me, I would always go with and we have gone with NordVPN, yeah? Because I like something, something, something. You tell me what we say with NordVPN? Well, I know you're like into a protector. Oh, that's the way I do it. I know you're like, peace of mind, we're logging into public life. A big fan of that. I know you love the ability to change your virtual location. All over it. In the world to enjoy streaming services, things like that that maybe aren't available where you are. Yeah. That are somewhere else. Yeah. And NordVPN, it's the fastest gun in the west for all of that. It allows you to do all that. And much, much more. So people want an exclusive deal. Just for you, you can go to nordvpn.com/taw. Loads of stuff to throw in at you at the moment. Loads of our subscribers have got stuck in. They're all enjoying it. They all say it's great. You can join them. Come and be part of the Nord Gang. And part of the Nord Gang and a highly-referent. I'm part of the Nord Gang and a bit of the crew out on tour in Australia, part of the Nord Gang. I love it. They'll be loving it. They won't be missing their favourite TV programmes back here. They'll be doing it for sure. And for a month it's cheaper than. I don't know. Three packs of Richmond sausages. So I mean. Between the prices, right now, it's cheaper than what? No offense to Richmond sausages. Well, exactly, sure. All right. Unfortunately, we have to also talk about transfers on the award-winning gutter. It's a bit of a at-buy-and-space special. For those who aren't familiar with at-buy-and-space. Love it. He is an ex-legend. Not an ex-legend. He's on ex, you know, the Twitter thing. He's on that. And he's been dining out on quite rightly so on the Florian Verts story that he broke whenever it was last summer. Going to Liverpool that Florian was fucking off everybody else in Europe and wanted to play for the Reds. He's put his head above the parapet again. And we're going to feature him time and time again in this show. And we're going to. No apologies for that, Josh. But we'll start off with his manager, Ruma, because this is a semi-manager-sucking special as most gutters are these days. Nothing like a manager-sucking special to get your teeth into. What he's been saying is. So I read what he said. Florian Verts, that guy again. It's almost as if he's got some connection to Florian Verts. Has told German teammates that Alonzo's assistant Sebastian Parrija recently contacted him asking detailed questions about life at Liverpool. If Frimpon also involved in Verts favouring Alonzo as the next Liverpool manager, the talks are seen as serious and potentially the early stages of a coordinated move behind the scenes. Hmm, wow. What's your first reaction to that breaking news from By Me and By The Space? I suppose I can believe it. I mean. plausible. Yeah, even if there's been no contact between Liverpool and Alonzo, I think Alonzo would look at the Liverpool job and the scenario at the moment, and I think that it's potentially a destination for them, considered a sluts from the press. But couldn't use that fifth. But it's here, more than things like that. So he probably looks at that as a potential land on the spot for him. I don't think there's many that he would look at at the moment and think that, considered he's managed in Germany. Yeah. He's had the goal in Spain, got to try to already. He's not going to take the Barcelona's job. Maybe Paris is an option for him, but there was an UK, so he must be doing pretty well there. Yeah. I remember putting it in Rico, I'm a market anyway. Yeah. So if it's like his next land and the spot is probably Liverpool on one side, I would assume. So I must be in cute to get Sebastian Parrija. I can't say anything, Seb. He'd be so. Well, you do it and pretend it's nothing, it's not on me. Well, these guys often come and like paste, don't think they're collective teams and all that. So it probably is a case if you're just wondering just how bad the weather actually is here and things like that. I mean, and you can find that I would through players who you're familiar with, like, Florian Beard. So yeah, it wouldn't be too surprising, is it? It's a funny one, Sean. If, let's put it this way, if Alonso is making enquiries via Sebastian Parrija, it's because Liverpool have tapped him up some other expression, but had a word, had a word, you know? So we might want you in the summer. I would advance, do you think things actually are behind the scenes to replace Alonso. I honestly don't know if not at all to Defo, they know they want someone else for sure. I think they're the latter. Yeah, for sure. I think the starting point on it is, I think if you're on a slot, you want to go? I think there's a jump before push, or hope they push you. Let her shake hands, mutual thing. But give me the money. Is agents and these legal representatives will be saying absolutely not to maximise any financial payouts? Of course. You know, if they're young and less, they'll go away, they'll get away, then. Maybe slot alright for the next few years. But put yourself in issues. This isn't his final destination. It's not like Roy Evans taking the job where it's like, this is, this is everything to me. This is one club of many that Arna Slaught wants to manage. So he's got to get out of here with his CB intact. So if he can be at least competitive against PSG, get Liverpool into the Champions League, even if that's belief in his sixth, depending on everything lands. If you think about, go back to the Netherlands and be with his family, which he's not, and he's got a young family over there. You've got his mate, Sport and Director Ajax. He's going to want the door. He's really going to do Ajax job, right? Which I think is really in between the lands. They're very close in in the Sport and Director. The even rumors have been being at the final. Ajax game wasn't there as well, whether that's true or not. I can't see. Of course I can't see. But I can't. That's step down. Yeah, just so tough. But Barcelona, if I was his agent, you'd be all over that waiting for that boss. I think he'd be a perfect fit for Barcelona. And for both sides, it would work perfectly. Whereas there's a danger that if, ignore what Liverpool may or may not want, there's a danger. I think that if he stays at Liverpool and start an X-E's and goes bad, the CV starts to get a bit damaged potentially for some of them, for some of them jobs. I wonder with it. And also you don't know how much of a total loss of Barcelona took on it. Just on an emotional sense. You know, you can't go. We have a Nobel in the room. We bring in all the good guys. And we have good personalities here and then go. They don't suffer a bit under the weight of everything that's happened over the last 12 months. Like this job puts you years on you. I just wonder whether for him, if he can sort of get out of this season with one year left on his day, I'm much energy and then to use you as an, can you bring into that when you could just possibly part ways in the summer. And I think for Liverpool with maybe a new sport and director coming in. Or maybe an old sport and director or old sport and directors maybe roll share in it. It might be the perfect opportunity to bring a new head coach in. And if you think about the FSG model, it has very much been to move away from one manager, who you lose him and the whole football club, pull the part, the whole point is that the scouting network, the data side, the fitness side, that everything, hypothetically means you can plug a head coach in and plug one that's that meets your criteria for doing well in the role. And the juggernaut continues in that sense. I don't think FSG will be averse to having a head coach for two or three seasons. As long as you've got the right one to come in next. And that's the big criteria is how they got the right one to come in next. So yeah, I think Alonso stands out as an elitist of an elite. You look at his record, which we discuss later, but any name you want to throw in the mix, they can't alter Candelter in terms of his record and what he's done so far. Because come on, Sir. There's just speculations more about Alonso's job. We say several things at once. I think about the potential for a new manager and the current manager exiting. I must think there are some contradictions in my mind. Help me resolve them. On the one hand, we know that this this Liverpool hierarchy, FSG, etc. Edwards and Co. If they want to make the change, they're likely to do it at a time. Well, they like to plan it at a time. If they've made their minds up that he's not, Scott's not our guy for the next season. They are likely to be in very deep with somebody or attempting to be so. So they're just sort of not floundering around in June. But if we're to believe their subtle briefings, vice, or it was like on Steena Week or so ago, that they are actually committed to Anastod. That they understand their limitations for what's happened this season. And that they're going to look at the bigger picture and go with, and in theory, are planning to go with the next season. How vulnerable are they if they're taking that view? Because there's one or two views that are taking, exactly more back him, right? If they're taking the back him into next season to you, how vulnerable are they to events that happen between now? Because you can say, we're going to be mature about this. We've seen, we've seen what's happened, the injuries, maybe the squad building didn't quite acquire, according to plan, the job to things have more of an impact, et cetera, et cetera. Collect responsibility. We want to back him into next season. But if things go from where they are now, bad, to worse, the best laid plans I would contend are hard to stick with. Go on, let for example, you got to BSG this week, and we finished seventh. Yeah, yeah. That's the paradox of sorts. The way it's we do the hard, it'll be for him to turn around, and that's because next season, yeah. And, you know, with the fans, it was much as anything. It would be interesting how much weight they put in to the strength of fan feeling. I think it'd be something that some would maybe try and ignore, but I think once you start struggling to sell hospitality tickets and stuff like that, I think it'll be put in front, so then that lessened, you know, if from a financial point of view, I think to be older people. It's always interesting, I think how football clubs work, and I don't know, but like, you know, for example, you've got Richard Hughes, and then you've got a both here, Michael Edwards. We know that as like a football structure, then Michael Edwards goes straight into FSD. Well, where does, for example, Billy Hogan fit in with all this, so you know, to see, you gotta say, you know, if he's saying, listen, this is all well and good, but, you know, I've got commercial partners saying that you don't want anything to do with it. I'm not saying this is happening, or you know, say, you know, from a partnership point of view, it gets tricky for the sponsorship point of view, it gets hard from hospitality tickets, maybe, you know, there's just people going up, you know, me, and I wouldn't, I would have spent, you know, 500, 600, 600, or whatever, so to watch it again, crop team, but but also enough for this, does that start feeding in, or do they just go away? This is called non-sidiality, we don't have the, how does that, the source of higher-off you work? I haven't got a clue, I'm not sure, but that's an interesting source of dynamic for me, really, how much they're feeling around, commercially, around the football club, influences, from a support, but basically, do they go, this is just got so toxic within the ground, and over here, it's quite there yet, but, you know, we'll say, - Loose to Everton. - Oh, my God. - Honestly, I'm obviously sleepless nights, so I'm having sleepless nights. If we get beat badly at Everton, I mean, it'd be a good job, he lives in Manchester, that's all I'm saying, but I think, you know, so this, and then the home game after that, and things like that, it's like, you know, you're in this situation, but how much attention do they source of pain to that? I think they'll try and shut it out, but it surely becomes a point where you just can't, like other people within the club start saying, well, hand got this, this is making source of, you know, our jobs are tough in it, and we all rely on, you know, you're coming, you're coming and asking for money, and overlaid, so I'm getting it from all these other areas, and they're saying that they want to pay us, which because the team's not doing as well, and so it's, it's also what's the club with the, with the lane, let's just say, do you do finish seven? And we're out the Champions League in the next time of asking. The entire football world will consider the lane that manager, regardless of what, what they decide internally to. It's going to be that much harder to recruit as well. - I don't think so. I think Liverpool's still a draw. If you're talking about a manager, I still think any manager would be a bad player. - You're a bad player, you're a bad player. - You're a bad player, Liverpool. You're not going to be one of the last fella to do shit, because it makes it a little bit easier. You know, you want everyone to sit on the base of the egg as the hardest job in the world. It didn't necessarily transpire like that, but, you know, coming in where, you know, I, you know, this, if we finish seven, that'll be, you know, you know, I don't win anything. That'll be our West season for absolute ages, really. Won't it? But, you know, you're the first. - Yeah, but even then we got to sort of a final and things that we have to two finals, didn't we in that year? And so you can make arguments with some answers. - Yeah, you can. - Some answers. - Well, I think, you know, for, I think, I don't worry about that. I don't worry about, you know, how can you get those in good management? I think they'll all want to, you know, come to Liverpool. I think even player wise, I think in COVID, one year out of it, from a status point of view, financially, that's a separate thing that I, you know, I'm not sure about, you know, whether the, the money would still be there to go as hard as what you did. But I think from the points of view of attracting players, you know, to Liverpool, it's still one of the biggest clubs in the world, you know, it's still, you know, a club that's shown, you can sort of, you know, bounce straight back and get back up there with the right manager. And so I don't necessarily, so as a concern, about that. For me, it's more about time and it's more about, you know, the issue for me, you wait until next year's, and is, are you missing the boats with an Alonzo or whatever, if the CISH job becomes available, we don't know what's going on with that. I think it's looking a little bit more like Pep Guard, the all of the stayin' than it did maybe a few months ago. But I mean, I know even less about what's going on in months, this is the reality of how this is at Liverpool. So they might think they could sort of gamble on that, but it wouldn't necessarily be a gamble. I think the, the strange thing about Liverpool is there's just too many questions around the whole hierarchy. The moment there's these rumours about Richard Hughes, coming to Saudi, that won't go away. That, you know, it's, it's whether that's, I wonder how much of that is. It says his people, because he needs any contrast. You know, every talk's about honest lots of you, contract, Richard Hughes on three years as well. So, so is that, you know, I'm not saying he's put the stories out there, but it might be an isn't interesting. We'll just let them sort of, you know, tick tick on it, and we'll let them, you know, remind them that, you know, we need sauce and else. Michael Edwards came in very vocally to set up this new multi-club system that has apparently now been shelved. Well, what does Michael Edwards want to do? What's his job? Well, like, what would he do? It is easy. He's also happy with it. He wasn't desperate to go back into working with the football club. He seemed quite happy where he was with the engrave, and then got tempted by this project, but there is now complete need there. And so, you know, who is doing the recruitment? Are the people doing the recruitment? Sure, the day you want to stay. Like Sean said, I'm not convinced that Anna Slott wants to be manager beyond this contract. He might decide that I just want to do one more year. It must be tough for him, you know, away from his family. He doesn't like the football in this lead. I don't think his reputation has talked too much of a hit. To be honest, we don't think he could still walk into it, not walk into a top job, but I think he could still get one because to have a manager, he's worn one of the top leagues. Yeah, he will football. And I think he would be quite easy to be able to say to Barcelona or whatever. They said, well, in there, they did that. I then look at all this stuff. So it's just not going to happen. So I think you'd have no problem, you know, getting a job at a league that would suit how he wants to do more and more. So I think it might be that we all shake hands at some points, but it's, it's who's, what's obviously interested to me is that who's doing the handshake and who's who's part of this sort of next move because if it is, you know, Richard Hughes is sort of part of that then. I imagine he is having these conversations with a ronsor or whatever because you can't just get to the someone, go, right, shake hands, right? Who's available? You know, they're not going to do that. There's no need for that with anyone. And so they might even be doing a little bit of a sound and I'll just in case, even if they haven't made the sort of the final decision at the moment. So then, yeah, that's risky. It is risky, but I don't see how else you can do it. I, well, my top and says, I think you have to say, even if you think we could see a world where we keep on a slot, we could see a world with it. You'd have to say, but what if it goes wrong? It's going to now go very wrong. And then I'm talking about the beginning and next season. And by that stage, the horse has ported. I don't like the talk of if you get to Champions League or if he does this. I think it's gone too far now. Well, that's my, you know, most people even if you look at the data, deep has to be really near the five game role in XG. You would want this, you'd want to see that improving. And you know what I mean? The XG4 going off in the XG against going the gaping greater. It's going the wrong way. It's never been worse under his tenure. It's never been worse. As the game is getting easier. Don't worry, it is right now. And look at the runner games you've got. And that's not me saying, I'm not in the get rid of it now, camp. Unless whoever you're going to bring in in the summer's like bringing in now. Maybe that's different. But my point is, if you're looking, if the data team looking at this, I don't think you can make an argument for this continuing. Now, if you're on the, maybe if you risk your use, I'm not supposed to be quite pally, aren't they? I think that's where there's maybe a load of mitigation. And I think there's the collective. I have said this on a previous show. The collective part of the aspect. If you're sacking slots, you're almost emitting the U-fucked up to if you're introduced. Yeah. And the fact that it's contrasting, I've been disgusted, I think, says a lot. But, you know, is it a Damien Camoley Kenny? 22 rounds. It's nine wins in the last 26 league games. Do you know what I mean? Nine with a champion winning squad. With everything's gone on, yes. But this isn't getting any better. The only, and the other problem is, if you're looking at on the eye test, the defensive shape, the defensive structures are abysmal. Like the distances, basically, we went through this on with you, but the category did a piece on Monday night football, which we put out on review first, by the way. But the distance is vertically too great. The gaps between Van Dyke and Canate, unbelievable. Like if we were rock solid and you were like, we're getting the ball at the pitch and not scoring. You go, okay, well, the mitigation is no easy, it's okay. It's okay, Salah. But when you're a shambles at the back, I'm just, I'm struggling to make a case for them, other than all the sensitive mitigation issues that you haven't put in football. I don't think there's a legal, I think, should save them more otherwise. But we're at the security with people who say we're aware, so when the champion's weak, and people are so afraid of us, they're like, you should still go. I think you, if you say, now you're under estimate and just one lechima, and that will be, I don't think we will, when the champion's weak, by the way, I think it's more likely they're not, we'll get knocked out in the next round. I hope I'm wrong, obviously. But if he wins the champion's weak, I don't think people, where people say, like, if he wins the champion's weak, you know, still go. I don't think the thinking about how hard that would be. If he beats PSG over two legs, and he sets the team, - You did, I was being wrong with that. - Then he'd have to be well with you, and all by him after two legs. - And then he'd have to. And then he'll have it in the fact, like, that's, if he was to do it, - It's a body of work. - That would be like, an unbelievable, with this squad, as it is. I don't think he will be able to do that, because I'm not even sure any manager at the moment with what we've got will be able to do. But if he could, I think you'd have to say, fucking hell, he's sailing us sort of out in this fella. Yeah, and all those things would have had to improve. But by the way, what are the odds of that? - They don't want no Liverpool's odds of the 2020-31s. - No, they won't be that far. - Can't be high away. Sorry, it can't be particularly strong. - No, it's probably really tough for them. - It's at a level where it's sort of, if you're planning for the future, okay, let's say it's 20 to 1. I can't believe it's much. - I'm gonna say 12s, I guess. Someone look at it, Andy look at it, I'm gonna go with 12s. - I said there's only 18. - What do you think? I just think the odds are going out to be as GSO's. I think it could be near it. 25 to 1. Yeah, really. All right, because of that run. I know. Because of that run. But people still be better on doing it. I mean, she's been sure. It was one of them. I think it was one of them. It was one of them. Come on, Sean, you've got to play. What do you think? I just think it was a discadre of the weight of money from Matt Liverpool fans. It'll be too long. It'll be too long. Yeah, it'll be too long. I think I'd have to say 16 to 1. So that's a good point. I'm going to say 16. What does it say? This is better. How about 16? So 30. That's 12 to 1. Yeah. I'm not that 30. Oh, right. I said that. How is John Gives just quickly letting you know what's going on Amfield over the Easter holidays? So, of course, there is the stadium tour that is going on every day. But did you know there's a dedicated cop kids version that keeps younger supporters engaged with interactive games and puzzles? Also, for two days over the Easter holidays, we'll get visits from Mighty Red to on the level two concourse on the 29th of March and on the Eastern Monday Clubmask at Mighty Red, we'll give fans post for photos, sign merchandise and take part in interactive football fun. So if you're kids at Mighty Red fans or you, of course, then there's a couple of days there where you can book in and meet Mighty on that stadium tour. And of course, don't forget as part of the stadium tour, you also get access to the world renowned record-breaking, fantastic LFC Museum, which is home to our six European cups and loads more besides. So make sure you're active in time to go to the museum as well. There is, of course, for the brave, the Amfield app sale as well that's available through our Easter. And a couple of special events to let you know about over that period too. Samu Lee is doing the Legends Q&A on the 4th of April. Now Samu's a great fellow, so humble and he's got some great stories of within European cups and going on his debut and all of that. So he's always great value. And I think the Legends Q&A itself is very good value indeed. So that's on the 4th of April. And on the same day, if you want to go very bougie and get the Amfield VIP experience, that's it. Former LFC captain and of course assistant manager Phil Thompson. And that is unforgettable experience. We get five star hospitality, a Q&A we feel hosted by Steve Harder. So live music, great food. It is absolutely unbelievable way to spend your day. That is on the 4th of April as well. So something for everyone. I am field over the Easter holidays. So if you want to have a little bit of a look at those and anything else that is on offer and I'm field on a non-match day, get yourself over to LFC.tv for us last tours. Okay, that's what I was out about. Get playing. Stop, we're all, stop. I'm not saying I'd take it. Dumbledore's responsible. Yeah, the 13 to 1 is a 14, it's about 7%, 7% and a bit percent. So now if you're saying the achievement of winning the Champions League should keep you, it would make a strong case of keeping this job and you can't underestimate it, which is fair as quite as a statement. There's about 7% chance that that happens if you go with the bookies. Yeah, that's not a strong chance. I think my view Josh is if you're irresponsibly at the top of the middle pool, you're going, we're not winning the Champions League because there's only 7% chance here should best. We're not finishing 3rd in the Premier League because Manu and I are a site, probably not finishing 4th because Valera are far ahead of us at the moment. So we may stumble over the line there at best. We have to plan ahead for a new guy next is, is the best outcome? For the Liverpool football club sitting here right now that Shari Yolande is the manager. And what are the chances of that happening, given what other options that Manu will have? What percentage on this if you like? Yeah, it's sad. I've become increasingly more of the belief that I think it's, I think it's almost a bigger risk going into the next season with him in charge. It's not in charge. Yeah. And I've maintained, I still believe throughout the entire season that he's not the main problem. John said before, you know, that you're going to put any manager in charge of this group. And I think he would find it difficult. I think it's a difficult job this season. For many many reasons, lots of mitigating factors in there. Well, that's that big of the question who built the squad. Was it collective? Yeah, there's a lot of that in there as well. Yeah, and that's where I disagree with you a bit on what when you say if you'd said that he'd say that I'd be shown that he's made a mistake, I think if he keeps them, I think they're saying, listen, this is on all of us, I think there's a, I think if it starts to manage the next season, I think that's the people who make the decision saying, it's what happened this year is not all on him. And it's on source of all of us. I wouldn't rule out the eventuality, but I would not be that surprised. The first game of next season, I lost lots of charge because of how these guys work. And you know, you mentioned before about fan sentiments and all that. That in their book is largely just categorized as noise to be understood. And the dead decision will stem from. They'll probably themselves be not listening to that one, they? Yeah, but the problem is if the noise starts affecting. Might, yeah, might be. Well, there's a very big clout. They didn't allow Johnny Hayton to come back in. And I think that's a law. Because that's just an additional compensation payment. For us, if you want to be. The San Broncos got his job though. Yeah. So, remains we've kind of. You've got that space, Phil, I suppose. I think my thing, right, regarding the decision, what makes it difficult, I think is the almost the opportunity cost of not doing it. Not getting rid of. As in. If you make the decision to stick with him, which is a huge decision by the way. Yep. And in six months' time, we're not that much better. Fans haven't turned. Still gave them holes between, you know, the attack and the defence and that sort of thing. If you do that, you suck him anyway. You potentially, in the process, rise off another season because you're starting to get in the middle of the campaign. Can't give him anyone. And. Yeah, we launched those potentially gone somewhere else. Nigles, months, potentially gone somewhere else after the World Cup. And you're left thinking, right, we need a new manager here. Our first true second, they've gone like, I mean, we. So, I think that's the cost of sticking to your guns and saying he's our man. You could be left with proper leg on your face in six months. And that's what I worry about. Shall we. Shall we. Let me move this on to. I mean, we can't. Shabby and Lonzo, we can't assume anything. There's a spectra city of Guardiola. Suddenly analysis is leaving. Expecting right on right all night long. Sean, Sebastian Hurnes. He's German footballing royalties. He's an incredibly well-stuck guard. He's got 56% win rate. Well, he saved him from relegation with eight games to go in his first mini season. Then immediately finished second to get them into the Champions League. He had a bio-munica out in the year, he'd ever go somewhere on the league. Dipped down to ninth and he's currently there. They reside in third place. So, his hot-yong prospect is Sebastian Hurnes. But, I was saying before we came on air, there's been a lot of hot German prospect managers in the year since. Yergen made being a German manager fashionable. How many well? Quite frankly, but how many of them have really shown that they can be the real deal? I mean, we're talking the Nagelsmunds, the. Who is Herzler's, Glasners, maybe. Sure, sure. I'd argue, Tuchel isn't the fullest real deal. I wouldn't have Tuchel at Liverpool. What's your assessment of this candidate and the phenomenon of the German manager who was left to Gagan Press supposedly? If you sort of look at the positives yet, he's gone into a team that at the time didn't have a great budget. I'd say, six-year Dortmunds, obviously Bayern Munich, could be miles ahead of that. In the relegation zone, and very pragmatic. He uses a back-of-five, keeps him up and goes, "That ain't the way I want to play." That's a pretty season. Get him in the Champions League. So, it sounds awful. It's a bit like a poor man's year. Gagan Club, like 4-2-3-1, wants to high press, win the ball, back high, develop players, improve what he's got, and all around, generally, good guy. Like to wear in caps. So, six or a few of the Jürgen Boxes there. And then. Yeah, it's a transfer. get them into the Champions League. They finish second to Lavercusem. And then in the Champions League, like nearly beats Madrid, Thomps, Juventus, five, one away. So, he's got a little bit of form for Euro, which is always important to Liverpool. Sturk club like this. Yeah, yeah. And then they struggled a bit with the squad size and league forms. That bit, like I say, new castle on the ready hour, when they sort of a Champions League qualification. And then the German league's gone a bit less pressy. Team started to change how they set up. Maybe similar to Anna Slotslubberpuh. Team's changing how they approach games. And he's tweaked a few things. They're defensively pretty strong. He likes building out like an Anna Slotslod, like back four with fullbacks. You know, we'd love a trend in that kind of a role to play out. And then he loves crosses. So he's a bit like Jürgen's old. You know, when you have the wingers coming, so you know, you're three forwards and you get the wit from the fullbacks. And so we care cares and frimpong and players like this. That would really suit somebody loves crosses. And that obviously creates room on the inside. And the main thing is very high pressing kind of coach. Issues, you know, he's not going anywhere near. Club of this magnitude. Not dealt with players with the CV and talent and quality. And in nice as possible way, he got. And status. So from the man management point of view, you've got no evidence that he can do that. English is going to be a second language. So you've got the communication aspect of that. So there are question marks. If you were to look around Europe, you'd understand why. A bit similar to Anna Slotter at Feynord. When you look at kind of style of play, method of play, developing players. But just as an older candle to a Lonzo, like amaze, I cannot believe on the rest of me to travel to a Lonzo. It's like this is a guy went on the UEFA at least coaching course. And there were international from all over Europe. They're like rarwholes. there and the story is that no other coach could compete with him on this course. So, our goal goes back to Madrid and wins. You have to get him. So, that's why they put him into the under 14s at Madrid to try and keep him in there because he just blows people with minds with his coach and ability. So, she's daddy has a team of kids, wins the league, never been done before at So, she's dad. For FSG, you've developed the academy. They were in 2002. So, you get them promotion from the third tier into the second tier, but with the team of kids like Zuba Mendi was there and stuff like that. And then he goes to Lavercuzin. And this thing that he's wedded to a back four, I mean, firstly, well he defends in a different shape to our attacks. They all have different shapes in that possession. So, she's dad was a back four, Madrid was a back four. And then he goes to Lavercuzin and goes 32 games on beating in the German league, 49 games on beating in an arc. Like these are records, a by a Lavercuzin. And I think if you're all on, so it's now on, never for Laverpool. Imagine coming into Laverpool with Florian Bertson, Frampong for a start. You just couldn't have a better sex. So, I'm stances for him, I don't think. I think if you're here, it is now on, never for the Laverpool job. Or you wait for Sisty or FSG, maybe even if it's in the next. So, I think if you're Laverpool, I think you start Raven Mabbe, you don't kind of mean right now. I think it's interesting why you put that shorn. I think it plays into Josh's point, which is the opportunity cost point, which is you could have some faith in Anna Slot. But what odds do you place on Anna Slot totally turning around next season? What is the likely it is possibly turns around? There's also a strong, John. Anybody, if they are having this conversation back at base, he was able to have some coat. They have to acknowledge even if they're instances to back the manager, there is a strong chance that it continues to go around next season. And even if they think it's 60, 40 in favour of it going better. If they're wrong, there's a strong chance I keep repeating myself that it goes wrong. They don't then get a plan B in all likelihood, because for the reasons I think the boys have been saying, because Alonso is not available, maybe even second choice, herness isn't available by then. So, the opportunity cost factor can be sniffed out. No, it can't. And there's not a lot of elite coaches about at the moment. And that'll change. And, you know, from when I was told when they got on a slot here, do it, do it, you know, so keen to get it, not just because they really liked Anna Slot, but before to drop after that was, was like huge. But do you remember, by a minute, by a minute we were on the new coach, it was about three months, and the end of the pass couldn't go out of the old. You've got to be made to it. And I was like, yeah, and I think it's a company. Yeah, to be fair, it's a storm. It's done really well there. But apparently, it makes me laugh people. People say things like, oh, they should never let have, I don't have to come without his family and stuff like that. And that was the deal. Like that was for me. He was like, I'm not leaving me family and they were like, fan, come over on your own. You wouldn't have gone otherwise, put them at desperate, desperate to get them, but that key to get them. Because, hey, they liked them that much, but baby, they were like, after him, like, fuck them, forget about it. You know, it might be Josh, you know, me and so like, I'm back. But, you know, so, so they'll be looking around at the moment. And, you know, the landscape's not changed that much. The one that has is the alone zone factor because he obviously pulled out. I'd love to know if he hadn't, whether, how they would have chose between the two, between alone zone and slot. We'll never know, we'll never know who they would have gone for. But, you know, he's the one who's who's changed now. So when they were looking last time, who's who's available now, there wasn't them because I, and it's him. And if he suddenly becomes not available when you're looking at an October, like that a bit, that a bit sort of such a blow, such a blow because he's gone somewhere else. If he's gone to another European club, it's part of itself. If he's gone to an English club there. If you tell him, you're not just fucked yourself to somewhere, you're fucked yourself forever. Yeah. If you're focused, it's like two years time to put into perspective of like what that would be like, you know, imagine Anastasia Mancise in two years. Or, Shabbie, Anastasia Mancise, you know, what, what feels more ominous, what feels worse, you know what I mean? And I think, I think the idea of an Anastasia Mancise of arrival, which isn't entirely possible, what is me scared of. Well, I'm just, I'm missing Anastasia Mancise lot. How many coaches, if you include Anastasia Mancise, go to Sociedad with the team of kids and do something they've never done before, like ever, and then go to buy a lavercuse and win their first ever title and break European records. I reckon they might only be one who can do that and he's on the market. And that's not criticised. No, it's not like ripping down another person's skyscraper to make Shabbie's better. What do you think about what I'm doing to make sure? Because I've got my opinion, it's always. It's not disaster, was it? I mean, if you get sacked within six months, it's a bit of a disadvantage. But the rest of the story was, the story in the Spanish press was that he was allowed to, was that they'd said, look, we've got Anastasia Mancise, let him use lads, run the dressing room. You come in and be a bit of steel and be a guadiola, in Madrid. And the players go running to Paris and straight away. What he's been told on the tin isn't there and he's knocked off the backing of the upstairs. So, you know, if you're, if you're on Daddy's home and you're Will Ferrell as the stepdad and every time you tell the kids that they can't eat that chocolate biscuit, they go running to mom and get it. How he's supposed to go out of the environment, you see what I mean? And in Madrid, the players are just going to Paris and he's going, yeah, yeah, I sound like that's not on. So, that's, I've got a little explanation, though, Sean. I mean, that's one way of saying the other one, you could look at it and I'm being devil's advocate here. You could turn the lens around and go, it lead managers control big players. Yeah, they weren't in a mess. They weren't in a complete mess when he left. No, it's more reputational, I know they'd lost in the supercure, but he wins in than who camp? They're starting a title contention when he leaves. They're in title contention and they don't, well, they're doing all right in the championship. I think it was a great thing. You changed us, too. I think it was to do with Venetius mainly. I think it was to do with not getting the superstars on the side. And when Guadalupe goes in the basket, he kind of, yeah, he has a few moments where it's like, it's me or Van Aldenio, it's me or some of your lesser or whatever and he changes quite a lot in the club back, Guadalupe. And he brought in his own players from the B squad who hang on the table. Yeah, he'd be worth it. Why don't you look at it and watch it? He had to fight battles with the likes of him back, he didn't he? You need to assert himself. I think Perez has had a similar situation with Alonzo as in Venetius or the coach and classic Real Madrid, they went for the place first and he got sucked, but he just played devil's devil's have a good time with Guadalupe before and don't shoot the messenger on this one. This is just the death shot out on Josh. Yeah. I don't really think you could do the job, mate. That was just the job. Or I'm back in the back. Yeah. The shot in the season. The record that Alonzo got on paper, you know, you're social and it's really, very impressive. But someone, Anaslot's agents, for example, Mike points out what he does with AZD, as in nearly Wednesday, the Air Adve須ance will call with happens. Then he wins it with Fionaud, despite being up against Ajax and PSV. Comes to Liverpool, wins the Premier League of the season. He also reads the European final, but Fionaud lost Alonzo, which is European final, but by Alvacuzon and losers. So there's lots of parallels between both. I think the big difference is, Slot has the ability to have the Alvacuzon. Although he does lose his job, he hasn't got the results fall away season that Slot has now. This is a big lack of. Well, it's second season for Alvacuzon with the finish shot like the Air Force. But he says, well, it's the ordinary season. Second season, he wins the league, just new. And then he gets the chance to qualify. Yeah, the Champions League season was a relatively ordinary camp, by me, just a lot of mana away, we did it like. But that's not like a black, you know, blotch on, record all for me, I mean, by and should be winning that league. I'm just saying like, objectively, if you look at both the key points on paper, one Alonzo has gone on slot, is that the unbeaten season was just unbelievable. And the fact that he's got an affinity with Anfield and he would get support from the youth development. I think, yeah, and what he does, yeah. What he doesn't go to social dad with a team of vets, he goes to social dad and wins it with kids. Does another fact have things got to be a factor? Does the other thing psychologically, right? If, if Alvacuzon survives as being cold cut in the summer, when Liverpool turn up first game the season at Anfield, say the fixture computer gives it to us, albeit maybe with a couple of signers, they've got people excited. There's still something in the back of the minds of most of the fans, and I think 99.9 would have sacked him, going, we really got a big season to look forward to here, say the same guy we all wanted got. Or you've turned up first day of the season, shall we go on, so he's got a clean, slight, just the simple fact of him having the clean slate. Plus those two new Scythrene signings means as an enormous amount of buying. Doubtors, which we all are at the moment, and would be quietly beginning the next season, would be believers, at least on day one. And probably even if we were only to have our first five, we've got, 'curses that a little bit of teething.' I thought this was to have his first five, it's pandemonium, it's fucking hell, season's gone. It's partly psychological momentum thing. I'll not say you can make that argument for any old bum, you're the people that meant to be like, 'Oh, the Alonzo isn't any old bum. Final word for you, John, then.' I think you have, I've got to put it on. No, you have, I have, they've got to consider it, and you hope that I hope that the support of sentiment is part of these conversations to with gay. I don't think it could be the old, you think I don't think these should be sat, they go, 'Well, the support is what I'm going because so let's sack him.' You'll do the pain. a'r ysgol, mae'r ysgol oes ymwyr a'r ysgol oes. Ysgol oes ymwyr a'r ysgol oes. Mae'r ysgol oes ymwyr a'r ysgol oes. Mae'r ysgol oes. Mae'r ysgol oes. Mae'r ysgol oes. Mae'r ysgol oes. Mae'r ysgol oes. Mae'r ysgol oes. 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Oy wyddai'r發 yn di feio'r eisiau sabdias ddim. 'Wedai sięg Yn있 aw ag o g氣raddau oégr eu eich derodda. Hyd Maggi addynol. Mae'r gyd hynny, mae'r gyd hynny, mae'r gyd hynny, mae'r gyd hynny, W y ac mae dal g Ramsol yn fúri eu transpose ymfer. Ew ac mae'r llwfrull yn hwyl yn f百 aquestu Mentorösteu, a wedi Türwyddol Оdd출an, so y fanелu hefyd swydd yn ddim. Oesothernau rhwyd wntyn ag nid genwn bydleydoedd newig. Yna er y odny ar ni avydd o fe wedi fod yn y rhwydwyd branch sendo dimodd. Mae'n niwau at gwebogi'r llunild an�� clerg yn medhaeton at陌dech erol Ryw�� ond roedd. Mae'r llunild roedd yn ymfer, mae'r llunild roedd yn ffyrd yn ymfer. Mae'r llunild roedd yn ffyrd yn ymfer. Mae'n ymfer, mae'r llunild roedd yn ymfer, a wedi'r llunild roedd yn ffyrd yn ymfer. Mae'r llunild roedd yn gweithio'r llunild roedd yn ymfer. Mae'r llunild roedd yn ymfer. 'Wah if the room is a true that slot one would end back in.' 'That is wild to me.' 'Yeah.' 'The head coach doesn't just …' 'Do you know that, that's not just …' '…if that's going to help us do it, there's going to be a reason for that.' That's a very like FSG thing. Know it's a bit like, 'Well the sun's got the job now.' 'So, 'Oah, wow, we spend the next year like 500 grand on Sir.' 'Yeah, 'I don't know we don't need Sir.' 'That's like …' 'It's like we've already got a wall of security. 'Why do you want them to do it on overdue?' 'Like, that's just very them.' 'That deep wall has been like that.' 'Yeah, yeah, I couldn't have seen that happening.' 'Okay, we're going to have to wrap it here. 'What you did miss out on, 'which you'll get next time is some serious, 'a Lisay rumour chat and other winners.' 'That's some of the buying space for us, isn't it?' 'It's …' 'Now keep them up the action.' 'It can't keep them up the action. 'I wanted even more at buying space than we've had time for it.' 'Sorry mate, while you're out there. 'Maybe you can shoe-haul in another couple of zingers 'before we …' 'Before we next year.' 'Do you remember the YLWA4 where we had jet-arts made on there? 'That was good, don't it? 'You just come in every couple of months and just they jobs and then disappear.' 'Addy Florians, Florians made some …' 'That's where I thought it would be.' 'I think it works in the canteen at buying. 'Got on well with Florian.' 'Anyway, can we expect all day about Florians' mates? 'Um …' 'So we won't, so we'll just say bye.' 'And I'm going to be giving you a Zoom, 'gotcha, I think, in about four or five days, 'from my Portugal HQ. 'I'm going …' 'I need some Vitamin D, John, I can't lie, 'I need some ray, so I'm going to leave you.' 'I'm going to say thanks to Shawnee Shroom, to Josh, 'to Johnnie and say hi to all the boys out in Oz at the moment, 'and see you all again, well as I said, real soon.'