The Party Line on how the royal commission justifies genocide ft. Yasmine Johnson

Hi and welcome to episode 56 of The Party Line. This podcast was recorded on Aboriginal land and we stand in solidarity with our indigenous brothers and sisters in their struggle against racism and capitalism. Oh my darling, oh my darling, oh my darling party line, oh I never will forsake me or I love this life of mine. Hi. Hello. Hi. Hey. I'm not going to be in the address. I'm Hi, oh my. Does it look like I'm not famous? Does it mean you give a treat me like shit Annika? No, I read an article about you guys. Yeah, what do you want it like what kind of famous do you want to be? Maybe not like Hassan Pike famous, but maybe like, what's a good amount? Jordan Van der Lampe. That's good. If SBS asked me to go on TV once every six months or so, that would be pretty good. That would be a good thing. It's only been like twice. We were deciding what headlines to do today and we were talking about some of the housing ones and Jordy was like, oh yeah, well I was in this one. Just a humble crowd. No, not the fort. They wouldn't interview me. Only the Harold Sun. Only the real estate.com. Trash made it appropriate. Next is just going to be domain. The main news side. Exactly. Yeah, I've been there. That was when it was when it was nine and they were talking shit about real estate.com. They like to do that. Hey, a lot of people died this week. Did you guys know that? What? No. Like not like so like a mixture of people. So some of all days, yeah, cause for celebration rather than the usual. So. Probably American. Well yeah, so Andy Graham. He's dead. And Mitch McConnell is like on the way out. I've seen a lot of funny things online about the idea that Mitch McConnell like did a deal with the grim reaper to take. Linsy Graham instead. So as extended, he's sort of time on her. Mitch has been on the way out for years. Yeah. All these people are. Yeah. It's like crazy that these like decrepit fascists just get to continue to be senators. He's like, he's like dying in hospital and it's like he's like and I'll be, you know, in the parliament building to do excited. That's very hard work being a congressperson. Yeah. And then Ann Whittickham's dead. She was a like extremely right wing British sort of politician and media personality. Awesome. Oh, she's the one who got bloodshed. Yeah. I mean, we don't support that like the murdering bit, but it's like, wait, what? I didn't know that. Yeah. Whoa. But then Nigel Farage just like used it as like a whole like a media thing for him. Like he's done this really like sort of like elaborate video of him laying like a wreath for her. I mean, he's got to get the votes above Ben Face. Exactly. He's got to work pretty hard. British politics is so depressing. So if you, yeah, Faridies died and then also Sam Neel died, which is a bit sadder. That's less exciting. Sorry. I have no emotional connection to Sam Neel. Really? Great act. Don't even know what he's in. I'm hungry for the world of people. The event horizon. Not the first movie. Yeah, I know. I'm for the world of people, but I don't know which one he is. I was talking about hungry for the world of people last night. It's a really good movie because the main enemy is like, like the department of human services, whatever it's like, you know, the people that steal children like from their families. Like that's the main enemy of the film. I think it's really life-wing. It's great. Yeah. That's a good story of resistance. Yeah, exactly. So RIP to Sam Neel, rest in peace. Yeah, to the rest of the rest of the rest. Should we do some headlines? I think we should. We've got a good one to start off with. There's a four corners report last night. We're recording on Tuesday morning. And it just, you know, it said what we've been saying for a very long time, affordable housing. They've put affordable in brackets in the headline, which is, I mean, quotation marks. Affordable housing isn't affordable, would you believe? Four corners analyzed affordable housing, quite. We found a reality that didn't match the promise. So what's the reality? I mean, like affordable housing is raising market rents. Like a lot of them are more expensive than market rents. Like no one can actually afford the affordable housing. There's like three houses. There are three affordable homes that are affordable for a single person on a low income in the entire state of New South Wales. We're spending billions and billions and billions of dollars on this to, you know, make private developers and various like church run NGOs, heaps of money. Yeah. Can you explain, Jody, in like two sentences, how it can be that enough. Something classified as an affordable house is more expensive than the market rate. I mean, like that's just the scheme. That's how this game is determined. So like, for example, one of the examples that they use in the article is they've built a studio apartment in an expensive area in Sydney, for example. And they've listed it at the slight discount to one bedroom house or apartment rather in the same area. So obviously shooting apartments are usually cheaper than one bedrooms. They're allowed to do that under this scheme. So of course, they'll do that under this game because I'll make more money. But also like there's because you can choose the price depending on there's like various criteria. So you can be a single person on a low income, not actually actually be it low income. You have to be like there's a very, you have to own, there's like a one to two thousand dollar like slice of income that you can actually earn to be eligible for affordable housing. Because if you don't earn enough, then you're not like trustworthy enough to be in this beautiful apartment block. Exactly. But then you're eligible for public housing, which is 20 years. Exactly. You're like 20 years and you can get public housing. So yeah, so that's the that's the like there's these random slices, but they're based on whether you're a single person, your family, of two, or you have a kid, or you're a single person with a kid and blah, blah, blah, blah. So they choose whichever one can have the most, which can pay the most pretty much and then set the affordable housing at that rental price, which is usually it's usually like slightly less than market rent. But it is often quite a bit more like there's one, there's like actually heaps in Bondi, for example, Bondi Beach, that are like hundreds and hundreds of dollars more than the like the market rent. And these are getting government subsidies to be constructed. Like not just subsidies, like yeah, for like they're just paying them like billions of dollars to make and it's why we should be really like circumspect of people and parties that make their argument that we're for like more affordable housing. It's like where for like in Victoria over 100,000 public housing units being built to mean that people can have access to high quality public housing. You know, we want a return to rent prices from like four or five years ago and then a freeze put on it. We think that people who leave their homes empty and have multiple homes should have those homes seized and people should have access to live in them. Like we don't want just like affordable housing. We want like a sort of a totally different way of approaching the way that housing is constructed and provided to be able to. Totally being modifying it. Yeah. Yeah. Getting rid of the market. I saw a headline which we haven't got here, which is fine, about it was a resolved monitor poll or survey and they found the majority of Australians one house prices to fall at least 20% of them want them to fall then more than 20%. So this myth because it's always spun to us by the media, Australia is like this entrepreneurial housing country where everyone's just making money off housing. It's like for most people, a house is something you need and you live in the same place for a long time and it's not a money maker. Yeah. But the media class is so co-opted and oriented through this small slice of parasite investors that they act as if we're all like that. Yeah. So people want prices to fall. Everyone acknowledges the prices are too crazy. Yeah. And because guess what? People think about others. They're not just thinking about their own. They're thinking about their kids. They're thinking about other people's kids and just the country generally being a bit more fair. Yeah. People can recognize that. There's been like over the last couple of weeks or last week really the data really some rent rises and stuff like that and obviously everything's fucked. It's getting heaps worse. It's like record rent rises all over the country but house prices fell 2% nationally and this is like an aberration while there's like you know some uncertainty in the market or whatever. But the media has built trade this is like this disastrous event. So bad. Like like ignoring the fact that over the last like you know five to ten years house prices have increased 400% and then now there's a 2% drop and this is the end of the world. Yeah the graphs like yeah that's the world that we live in. Yeah. All right in other good news. The Iran. The Iran war is back on. It's just so fucked. So yeah Donald Trump after losing the first round or the second round or the third round or whatever round it was has now reopened. The fourth round saying that America will resume and the blockade of Iran and now actually charge 20% shipping on the straight of home wars which is funny because one of the rational for the war was that it was disgraceful that Iran was charging shipping on internet. national waters. He's demanding that people call the US the Guardian of the Strait of Hummus. So like I think South Park did this awhile ago didn't they call themselves like world police or something like yeah. It's just so yeah it's just incredible the sort of like imperial hypocrisy that America never ceases to display yeah it's like oh yeah Iran they're destroying petrol prices like commodities are stuck in this thing and like America's like yeah we can do it better. Trump and Jillian Seagull should really hang out on some of my records. Someone should set them up. I reckon probably they already have a bit of an episode of maps I reckon with those two would be really cool. That would make me break my TV and I love maps. So this one shocked me when I saw this this is from the Guardian. So in Quartet Quotes we will never use them. The California University's stockpiling AR-15's grenades and submachine guns and it's like you look at that headline and you're actually like what the fuck are they talking about. Omar was like what do you mean when I showed him this one but it literally is that the campus police in universities across California have like military grade arsenals to use on students who are causing disturbances. You never know when you might need a machine gun or a grenade. Well they often thought this article also talks about some of the other stuff that they have. So they have those like audio like they're called the voice of God. They're these like sonic weapons. Yeah it's a sonic weapon that can like destroy people's hearing. Yeah yeah yeah. And then some of the like assault rifles that they have they're not even required to report to any like government body. Yeah. How many they have because it's just like totally legal for them to have it. Yeah. So like you can walk onto like Berkeley University or California State University and there's cops there with grenades just ready to get you. My favorite part of the article actually is because they actually it's so this law allows them to you know create these massive armories like these military armories on university campuses. But it says and I'm reading from the article that law which passed in 2021 also requires police to make all of their equipment dealings exceedingly clear to the public. So they do have to tell you know what they've got next sentence. However not every college follows every part of the law. Awesome. Laws are made to be broken. I've always thought that and it's fine if the police. The California police agree. I mean you never know what might happen on a university like there could be some students who decide to set up a peaceful camp. Yeah. You know grenades might be necessary. Might just have to hold those. Yeah. Yeah. Sonically or definitely I guess. So I mean yeah I guess like it sort of it's we've talked a bit on the podcast previously about how you can look internationally and sort of see a window into the future that Australia is stepping into and later in that episode we're going to be talking to Yasmin Johnson who is a co-convener of students for Palestine who is featuring in the Royal Commission over the over the week. But a whole part of the discussion has been the universities and it's like I bet fucking I mean who's the vice chair like I really can remember Duncan Maskell whatever but like these vice-chancellors like Margaret Gardner whatever like they're saying that out. You know they're like they sort of been so good if we could have done this one way with the vice-chancellors at these prestigious universities. Yeah it's really bad. I mean and on the topic of universities the government is now so this is a headliners trail in universities will be required to adopt definitions of anti-Semitism and Islamophobia. So following the Senate inquiries into you know anti-Semitism etc on university campuses these accusations that the fact that there's been pro-Palestine movements on our campuses this is apparently an anti-Semitic move. The government is now giving the sort of arbiter the body that oversees the universities more power to punish universities if they don't adopt these specific definitions. So they've genuinely reflected to the idea that it's like oh yeah and of course Islamophobia and of course anti-aboriginal racism. They're really concerned about those. But obviously the sort of push is to curtail and limit their capacity for people to speak about what the state of Israel is actually doing. Yeah like at Sydney University the Islamic prayer room were like broken into graffiti with all this kind of appalling racist shit. Nothing happened. There's no consequence. There's been obviously no royal commission into that. But yeah as we've been we're gonna talk about like the main thing that's happened on the last three years according to the university management and the tax owe and the government is like some supporters of Israel's war crimes and guys that have felt it's out about that. So let's round through some laws. Yeah and I people can fact check me but I believe in the article it talked about Clare O'Neill saying that the universities are or maybe it was Jason Clare yeah would probably be Jason Clare that makes more sense. That the text either has a feather or a sledge hammer and so they really need you know something in between like there needs to be more capacity for the universities to be disciplined. It's kind of like all the houses. Yeah. When they get the cops to say that they stop shooting people. Yeah or a baton. Yeah. Yeah. So I think like we've seen a whole a lot of actually crack down on university academics speaking out about what's happening in Palestine including you know university lectures at the University of Sydney who have had a disciplinary process against them for hanging a Palestinian flag. On the window of their office space. It's traumatising thing. Yeah. So you know it's going to be I think a real problem going forward for just the capacity for democratic rights freedom of speech. You know universities talk about themselves as these places of liberal ideas. The right for people to debate. But yeah you're not allowed to debate when it's you know about something that a state that the Australian government has these ties and relationships and connections to. I kind of feel like we're just desperate to get into the main topic. So let's lay with there and bring ours in. Yeah. Probably good idea. Let's get yes. So Omar's just run out and got yes. Welcome to the podcast yes. Hello. Thanks for having me. No problem. So yes is a university student in New South Wales and a co-convainer of students for Palestine and it seems like the only person who was sort of treated as a defendant in the Royal Commission on anti-semitism out of all of the people who've been witnesses in 107 hours. Would you say that that's fair? Yes. There was a lot of listening to people tell sub stories about how seeing Palestine flags is really upsetting. Yeah. And then I was on the witness stand for I think nearly an hour being yeah cross-examined by by the council assisting so the commission itself. Yeah before I actually got cross-examined. And Virginia Bell. Yeah. Yeah. The good progressive kind-hearted liberal who was running the whole thing. Yeah. Just wanted to check really how Jewish she were. That's insane because you oppose Israel so you can't really be Jewish can you. Yeah exactly and if you didn't grow up with a childhood affinity for this state. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. That's while that's coming up. Miss Johnson can I ask you a couple of questions just about your background. And then you grow up in a family that identified strongly as Jewish. We talked about background and our kind of history and so on. I went to a secular school. I went to a public school. Do you have relatives who live in Israel? I don't know. And when you are growing up did you have an attachment to Israel in the sense of feeling some strong identification with Israel as the nation state of the Jews? I never felt that. In fact my mother went to Israel as a younger person and at the time felt that what Israel was doing was not right. She witnessed its suppression of Palestinians and so no I didn't feel that this was connected to my background. Yeah. Sorry Miss Hague. You go on. So yes can you before we get into some of the stuff about the sort of process of the Royal Commission and you know what you said and what the response to it has been. Can you just give us a bit of a background on the Royal Commission itself and how you see what its purpose is and why they called it. Yeah I mean you know ostensibly it was set up to investigate anti-Semitism in the wake of the Bondi massacre. Actually it was a push by the the right in this country and the pro-Israel establishment to have an entire commission to listen to the hurt feelings of Zionists because there's been a growing Palestine movement. And that's basically been the whole thing. I mean if you listen to the hours and hours of testimony never mind the far right and their anti-Semitism. So much of it is just about you know there were Palestine flags, what about the cuffirs from the river to the sea. Arabic writing. Yeah. So much of it is just openly racist and none of that ever gets challenged. Yeah. and there apparently there was a war that's been happening for the last three years all i know about is like these these poor supporters of israel have been attacked yeah something else been happening not according to the commission no impossible to know and the numbers of debt i mean we couldn't possibly get an estimate the real highlight of the commission last week was like july and segar pointed out that the abc said twelve thousand babies were going to die in forty eight hours rather than any year which apparently is like a crime of epic proportions as opposed to the death of twelve or fourteen thousand babies in here which is what was proposed yeah so i think we can like pretty confidently say that this has been a sort of quite extreme political attack uh. on the palestine movement in this country and to try and draw a connection between the palestine movement and the atrocities uh. at the but undyped beach at the beginning or the end of the end of last year uh. it's been going on for months now uh. and this hearing block uh. that you were part of uh. has spent a lot of time talking about universities uh. and the sort of experience of people in university campuses so when you spoke uh. there was uh. sort of anonymous anonymized witnesses um. from the south Wales and from Melbourne and from canberra talking about the trauma of having to say uh. pro palestine movements on campus um. which yeah i mean if that's trauma you've got to wonder you're like what you know there was a moment where um. somebody giving evidence before me said that she was in a politics class and at one point the genocide in gaza had come up and basically the tutor had said something along the lines of you know israel is dropping bombs on on palestinian heads and she said i don't really see how that's relevant to anything you know in the commission and then she spent her whole testimony going on about the palestine movement on campus but it's not relevant you know the israel's killed well you know we say seventy thousand like actually the estimates are a lot higher that really so i think that uh. so it's a really political affair to target the palestinian like the pro palestine movement but also i think it's a fast uh. i don't think that it's exaggerating anything to say it's a fast was that your experience of it yes i mean yeah i was halfway through the first day of this university's block uh. and the whole first half of it you just sit in this room with all of these people who are here to defend a state that's committing genocide and then they just listen to in utter seriousness and silence as they talk about you know all people were chanting things in arabic so i couldn't understand it and that was very scary and threatening you know there's not a single moment where that's challenged it's just you know yeah uh. uh. i wasn't gonna say anything but i'll jump in uh. like i standing to my parents this morning about your uh. your testimony before the role commission and they're they're quite right wing uh. like pro-Israel generally uh. and uh. they even they think it's a bit of a fast because you know their concern is about uh. you know a_z_o_ failed uh. to you know control the guns and whatever and like it's quite clear that you know the guy that a_z_o_ um. guy that was hired to to investigate that has resigned because of you know that the lack of any will to do that and it's quite clearly just an attempt to prosecute the idea that criticism of ageniside criticism of israel uh. is anti-semitism and i feel like if if if if people like that can be convinced that this is ridiculous and farcical and that's i don't know that's something like the fact that there's a two weeks to you to block in a commission designed to deal with why to adult kind of it would be a conservative Muslim and who neither of them have been to university shot uh. uh. a fast like a jewish ceremony like what why are we talking about university students like what has that got to do with these people it's so clearly a stitch up and so clearly politically motivated and i think a lot of people can see that i mean you're you really gone viral like your video of of your like what you said has gone so much support and just common up to comment this is the only thing worth watching in the whole time like this young woman's like the star of the whole commission hundred and seven hours of rubbish and we finally got something worth watching stuff like that you know not even editorial is just literally disclipsed the words you said yeah i was on at the commission in the audience in the gallery watching as and you know what but like i felt like i'm sort of like and this i don't mean just like to patronizing but like i was right in your line of sight so i look like was like i felt so proud like just like it was like this people in parliament who strategically played yeah like diversity and they nod really supportively i was watching along last night and then it was the bit where you you were questioned about your socials alternative speech which is ridiculous first of all but the there's a bit where you question about like socially supporting the use of violence against their oppressors in whatever and you restated those words and then it cuts to the the questioner and i think her in the background and she's just like nodding violently and then i think her rang me um yes a lot of very um anyways funny photos of me on tv but uh yeah i think that it's really right that like yes um well i think that there's part of the whole farce of it is that you and Sarah Schwartz are basically only people who have been um heard in this entire commission that don't actually support a genocidal project that don't support a racist state so there's only in two people in a hundred and seven hours that aren't supportive of the state of Israel yeah and and the whole commission is about us and our movement yeah and the other thing is you know glad that i got the opportunity to go and like challenge some of their narrative but the fact that they've refused to call anyone else from the Palestine movement including a single Palestinian despite you know how many times i actually should go through and count like how many times have they said the word Palestine but they will only allow people into the commission who are Jewish even though yeah they're attacking our movement it's it's outrageous so then i think the other element of the fast has been sort of referenced by everybody so far but the thing about it's just totally unspoken that there's an ongoing genocide in Gaza and i thought it was really powerful the way that you begin your your testimony or your statement with the the murder of hindri-jab and the uh just the way that this like you know these people have to be reminded of what they're supporting and i think it was really powerful that that that you that it was incredible that all these people say that being called a genocide supporter is a slur when they all support the genocide yeah and no one ever pointed that out like no like you did you were like so yeah is is it wrong to say that this woman supported the genocide and then of course nobody nobody follows up on that but it's just like that's what these people do yeah anyone at any point could have said no i support the Palestinians and plenty of Jews did and they were fucking welcome like weren't you telling me a while back but you feel you feel almost embarrassed by how much support you get as a Jewish supporter of Palestine yeah there's all these people that come up and say oh you're so amazing you know and it's like i'm just like one like everyone else but that's actually how the movement feels like as one of the people who's helped organize the rallies here in Melbourne like every time a Jewish person speaks they just get showered with support and love and stuff so it's it's absolutely like the case that if you were getting criticises a genocide supporter you probably were yeah i mean even the use of the word Zionist like a bunch of them got up and said i'm a proud Zionist and then they said how dare you guys call me yeah yeah i'm the slow one we say yeah well i think that um what i wouldn't wanted us to talk about was this sort of idea of lived experience which has been something that's been very central to the Royal Commission so far um the lawyer who was acting for students for Palestine attempted to cross examine one of the people who gave witness statement earlier on in the in the proceedings and she was denied the capacity to do that by a Virginia Bell because it was a lived experience testimony and so you can't actually question someone's lived experience so i mean like what lived what lived experience is being prioritized through this whole this whole affair i mean yeah it's just the lived experience of of genocide supporters dare i say it you know um and their their feelings about classrooms where people have talked too much about the genocide in a supposedly unbalanced way you know that was one of the claims that was made uh you know technically i was there as a lived experience witness and yet i was you across exactly that cross examined um so you know you can tell by that how far you are so it's some of the experiences that equal but not all of them um yes so so there's definitely a they've picked aside and and yeah and then if you don't support Israel your lived experience is questioned you know like Virginia Bell's line of questioning about whether i was really Jewish yeah uh you know my child is my background yeah which is outrageous yeah so i mean that's like actually quite anti-Semitic to ask really because it's like it is putting forward an idea that there is only one way of being Jewish or expressing your Jewishness or having a relationship to Judaism. And is Virginia about Jewish? I don't think so. So is she? Do we know? I don't know. But there was a hilarious moment as well where then they showed me this poster, which was a poster for a meeting we put on at the camp about anti-the anti-zionist tradition. Yeah. And one of the complaints that somebody had made about this poster was that talking about the anti-zionist Jewish tradition. Is telling Jews what to think? I mean, like we've literally heard more than 100 hours of this commission telling Jews what to think. And then Virginia Bell says, oh, you're not a Zionist. Like, how can you really be Jewish? Yeah. But we're the problem. Exactly. This association between Israel and Judaism, which is the entire purpose of the Royal Commission, that's the thing that's doing the associating. Yeah. And it's an attempt to say that Jewishness means this. And like one of the points you made is there's a growing Jewish minority that oppose Israel. And in America, it's like getting close to a plurality. So yeah, but then you have this person basically cast out on you. And she actually did it in a break. Like the lawyer was like looking for some papers. And Virginia Bell was like, oh, before we get any further, I just want to undermine your entire character. Yeah. Because of course the only character that matters is Jewishness. And really just press you on whether you're really a Jew. Like it was just the most transparent political act. Yeah. And Virginia Bell is meant to be like the liberal progressive that all the left are like, at least we've got her and she'll keep things on the straight and narrow. It was quite satisfying to be able to get in there that like, yeah, my mom did good at Israel. And it was a terrible place back then and it's a terrible place now. Yeah. Absolutely. So yeah, I think like the people who's lived experience is being prioritized. People who currently support and ongoing genocide of the Palestinian people, the murder of over 70,000 civilians in Gaza, the ongoing theft of land in the West Bank. Actually one of the biggest thefts of land that's happened in the history of the state of Israel. You can't say that. That's like a really biased statement. Have you thought about the Israeli perspective that they're actually just building a buffer zone and reclaiming land that was promised in 3000 years ago? Yeah, of course. I forgot to. You got to ensure the podcast is balanced. Yeah. For those listening at home, I'm a sarcasm has been a bit unclear this morning. I'm actually shocked. And then I wanted to sort of talk about some of the organizations and individuals that have been represented in the Royal Commission. So the first being Julian Segal. Queen. I don't really internalize her into my process this morning. Yeah, Julian Segal, who is the anti-Semitism envoy. And I wanted to sort of briefly talk about some of the things that she has argued for, including wanting to muzzle completely the ABC and arguing that the ABC has been responsible for an increase in anti-Semitism in Australia, which is just ludicrous, considering the fact that there has been an article put out by Pearls and Irritations, which is like a left-wing blog, whatever. They did a data analysis into 14 months of ABC's RN coverage, their radio program, which showed very, very clearly that Palestinian voices have been absolutely and completely silenced by the ABC. Every time there is a Palestinian who gets a chance to speak, they are attacked, they're undermined, they're questioned, they're lived experience, and their reality is denied. And when there's one Palestinian, there has to be multiple people representing a pro-Israel stance on that program. So the idea that the ABC is responsible for more anti-Semitism, that the anti-Semitism envoy is putting this out is absolutely farcical and diabolical. Yeah. I mean, there's all sorts of things she wants to do. It's pretty crazy. One of the other things she's saying is that she and her department should have the right to just withhold university funding if they don't do what she wants, which is if you don't say that from the river to the sea is an active anti-Semitism, then your uni will not be funded. This is the kind of thing that they're pushing for. By this unelected far-right activist, you know, fuck off. So then some of the other organizations have been the Australasian Union of Jewish students, as well as pro-Israel academics, who spoke in the last couple of days. And one of the things I wanted to point out about what they have sort of talked about is this idea that they support free speech and the right to protest as long as it's ineffective. So one of the academics who spoke yesterday talked about the on Monday, spoke about the protests at the University of Sydney, the University in Kampment and said, "Well, of course protesting is fine, as long as the university puts it over there and shields students from it." Yeah, I mean, what kind of democracy are we talking about? We're like, I mean, one, you have to ask permission first very nicely from the university who you're protesting against. And then you've got to put it somewhere where nobody can see or hear it. One of the other things she said was like, "Oh, yeah, when people march past classrooms and they're making a bit of noise and there's banners, that's a problem." Yeah, so put it in the field and that's fine. And yet the Victorian government hosts a formula one every year, which like defends half the city with noise. So it's just like the MCG, you know, it's just like the most farcical things. We're talking about adults sitting in a classroom voluntarily as if they can't feel too bit of noise. But then obviously the unsdata premise all throughout this is like learning some bullshit university is more important than people fighting against the murder of thousands of human beings funded and supported by our government. Yeah. Then another one from yesterday was a representative of an organization called Stand With Us, which is a basically like a lobby group directed at children, which is putting on like information sessions for why primary school and high school students should support the state of Israel and that's what it does toers of schools, talking about how incredible the state of Israel is, which I think goes back to your point before about, you know, this person complaining about your poster, talking about the anti-zyner's tradition is telling people what to think. Here we have quite clearly an example of someone telling people, telling children that they should support the state of Israel and then he complained about an event that he put on. Where you could put a VR headset on to experience being an October 7 victim. Like you could put this VR headset on and experience this. Complaining about like this was a non-political event and it was terrible that it was protested because it was non-political. So it's just like the hoops that you have to jump to to get to the conclusion that that is a non-political event that doesn't require some sort of discussion or scrutiny. I find that like hypocrisy around the thing about the children think so funny because one of the main things that's been taken offence to in the university sector is an event that happened at Sydney Uni where like Randa Abdelfatar and academic put on a holiday workshop and there were kids at the camp and you know they had a little demo and they did some like educational sessions about the history of Palestine or whatever and this is like treated as if it's some like horrifying, protesterous event. And then they're also trying to influence the children. Totally. And Randa Abdelfatar faced serious repression over this event. Then one of the women who spoke before you did Leart who we can't know her last name because you know they would be terrible if she if anyone ever knew who she was except she also like has done all of this media appearance and is like a leader of Orges as well. She talked about how it was so terrible that she got to give a 40 minute speech to the Australian National University's board of directors or whoever. A 40 minute speech about how terrible it was that they were pro-Palestine students on campus. But it was really really upsetting because at the end of her speech no one asked her any questions. I know. It's like this twerp, this private school educated twerp, presumably a law student, fuck it. She's like probably 21-22 at this point. Get a lecture aboard of a university for 40 minutes like on her chosen topic which is like why is Raleigh Gray and anyone who opposes it should be imprisoned and complains about it afterwards. Imagine if any Palestinian official access to any of our public institutions like the it's like an extreme self delusion but she would believe it you know she would really believe it because you know it raised in this culture of like Israel is like the highest point of principle and anyone who criticizes is a devil and even speaking to management for 40 minutes is somehow actually a sign of victimhood. And actually you know you're not supposed to ask questions of people's lived experience. Exactly. Like what would there be more than someone after they speak for 40 minutes? You've also got a point in here that she said while the Palestinian flag is not inherently anti-Semitic the saturation of such symbols produced the conditions for anti-Semitism. or just the shea quantana. - Yeah. - It's like, democratic representation at an individual level. It's like, that's not allowed. - But like any or just event that you've ever been to, has about 5,000 Israeli flags. - They have like, bunting? - Yeah. - Yeah. - Lots and lots of bunting. - Yeah. - You've got about a number, that's the point, right? - Right, in gold, the party line. - And so the final sort of people that I wanted to talk about who are represented at the Royal Commission, both in this block and then also previous blocks, is the Louis family. So the Louis family have talked about, so they're a prestigious business family in Australia. And they have argued that there needs to be national service in order to give Australians a sense of national pride that would, to help Australia get ambitious about its values and giving young Australians an outlet to contribute to the pluralism of Australian society. So. - Monoculture. (laughing) - Sounds like the opposite of that. - We can unify and murdering people in other countries. - Yeah, I guess there is a certain kind of like, cohesion that comes through military discipline. Like, surely that's the point. - Yeah, that's what it is. - This has got that in space. - Oh yeah. So then once we've gotten all the children to do national service, then we also need more police, just to make sure everybody's doing the right thing. - Maybe some of the service could be in the army and some could be in the police. - It's a good idea they should think about that. And then also we need the government crack down on anti-Jewish hate, so he called for more deportations. I'm tapping in Australia. - But in a particular? - Just deportations. Yeah, obviously there's a certain skin color that might be associated with said deportations. - No. - So I mean, who, what are we missing here? Like who aren't represented in this role commission? Anyone with a soul? - Like seriously, like you sit in this room. When I was telling the story about Hindrajab, it was like, you know, there were a few of our supporters in the room, but the rest of the room were, they were angry. - Yeah. - Like that was the feeling in the room. It was not like, oh, what's happening? What's she doing? It was like how deshi come into our room, which is like this beautiful place of sanctity and whatever, and talk about what's actually happening in the world. Like that's who's represented. And so as soon as you crack through that, like our side to have some humanity and wanna talk about children who were killed by Israeli forces, like, you know. - Yeah, one guy, I shared your interview with some positive comments and one friend of mine posted, it was like, matter and anti-matter meeting. Like you being in that room. It's like a room full of psychopaths and then like your voice just so clearly pointing out like all the people who've died and what this is actually about. Yeah, I mean, it makes sense. You're like the only activist that's been invited, like Sarah Schwartz has been on it and she was pretty good, but you're like an organizer of the movement. And I think there's a reason for that. It's because our narrative is very strong. - Yeah. - And I don't think after your testimony, they're gonna bring it back. - I know, yeah. - Sorry, sorry, anybody here. - You know, it was applied to lift to appear from our sides. I think they're done now. They've ticked that box. - Yeah, 'cause your opening, like, one of the opening questions is like, you know, what made you personally want to start getting involved with the encampment stuff? And you're just like, how can you not see, you know, a child in their car riddled with bullets? And you know, what follows and everything. Like how can you just not do that? And like you can't argue with that. - Yeah. Well, I went back, you know, like, you spend a lot of the time with the lawyers talking about what are the formal proceedings like? What can you say? What can't you say, whatever? But I just actually did go back before, I went before the Royal Commission and listened to this recording of Hint, calling, you know, and she's like pleading for help. And it's like, how can you then see in this commission? And just answer those questions and, you know, like, not try to bring some humanity into this hell that they've created. - And it's really telling that they haven't allowed a single Palestinian to speak. - Yeah, absolutely. - Including like, yeah, I mean, all sorts of groups and individuals who played roles and have public profiles and so on. Because again, it's suddenly the narrative shifts from like the victimhood supposedly of like people at a late universities in Australia to like people who are actually connected to a genocide and an ongoing process of ethnic cleansing. - Yeah. - So it's a very deliberate choice. And it's one that history won't be kind to, I think. - And so both councilor assisting and Virginia Bell herself and the lawyer that was representing Orges. At multiple times throughout the time that they were questioning you, asked you, don't you think that seeing, you know, flags or chance like from the river to the sea might be upsetting to some people. Like, is it okay to make people feel challenged or upset? - It's such an outrageous opposition. - Of course, yeah. - You know, nobody can ever feel bad about anything. - That's why Pauline Hanson, I think, is currently censored. - Yeah. - Because he just can't say anything like this. - Yeah, exactly. And you know, yeah. So yeah, they did. This was the main line of attack, you know. Oh, well, you know, we might even accept that from the river to the sea is not inherently anti-submitted, but it is upsetting. And so isn't that reason enough to find other words, you know. Like, it's just a basic principle of free speech. Which all of these people, by the way, put a little caveat into their statement to say, of course they support free speech. - Of course, yeah. - And protest. - Yeah. But I mean, I said it to the commission, but like if you go to university and you support genocide and your views are never challenged once, like that's a failure of that university. Like, you should be challenged on that as you should on any race's beliefs. And that's how movements for justice have always worked, you know. I thought it was really like awesome and totally like correct the way that you sort of talked about. Well, yeah, there were racists in America who opposed like children going into, you know, formally, predominantly white, like only white schools. There were whites out-Africans who opposed the end of apartheid and felt upset and challenged. - Yeah, they were probably upset by that. - Like women going into pubs, you know, probably if some men didn't like that. - Absolutely. It's like, yeah, people who support racism, who support genocide, who support oppression, they should be challenged in those views and beliefs. One of the people who spoke earlier before you, she complained about the fact that when people found out that she is in her words as Zionist, they didn't want to go party with her anymore. That this was an example of anti-Semitism. No, it's not. That is an example of your former friends realizing that you support the murder of 70,000 people and saying, I don't want to fucking get drunk with you. Like I don't want to get drunk with people who support the genocide of people in Palestine. This is not anti-Semitism. This is humanism. This is humanity expressing itself in the way that it should be expressed. - Yeah, and also on the point of like, just the emphasis on people being upset at statements opposing genocide. They've never asked it a fair work hearing or whatever, or people making wage claims. When they get a wage rise, it's below inflation. Wouldn't that upset workers or anything like that? - That's just not a question, but it is. - The whole thing about social cohesion, is it's all targeted at the left and at the resistance to oppression. It's never targeted at those in power. Ben Goliath wrote a really good article in Red Flag about the social cohesion narrative has just been dropped because we have one nation now and the media are reprinting her lies, promoting her, giving her platforms. And suddenly, she's actually the one who's shaking things up, speaking what no one else is dead to say. But when the left says things are no one dead to say, "Well, that's criminal because someone's against it." So it's obviously so partisan and bias and ridiculous. But I thought your comparison with white South Africa was so good. In my head, it's just like that. It's like, imagine all the white South Africans who in Australia in the 70s and 80s. And the left was protesting against apartheid. They would have hated it. But who cares? We've been upsetting probably. - It's so far. You're on the wrong side of history. - I think the other point that's quite important is that the people who support Israel in Australia, they're not allowed to feel upset or challenged. But there's never any humanity expressed or granted to the people who are literally dying under bombs. The world is not a safe space for them. They're being challenged in their capacity to eat, to survive, to access medicine, to rebuild their homes. - All upsetting things. - But where's the compassion for them? - And every single Palestinian in Australia has lost dozens of people. - Totally. - And the West Bank. - Yeah. - And the West Bank. So every single Palestinian in Australia has that story to tell. Not one of them has been allowed to tell it. Instead, we're censoring these people who probably haven't lost anyone. Maybe they've lost somebody. - Yeah. - You know, it's just ridiculous. - So one thing I wanted to raise as well is the idea, and it connects to this, like the whole double standards that run throughout the whole, the whole hearing, the whole commission. And there was a testimony from a guy. I think he's student. was like ACJ or something like that. And he talked about at the University of New South Wales where he was teaching at the or tutoring at the UNSW College in business that there were some fucking idiot edgy kids who did a Nazi salute at him in class. And they got a verbal warning from the university they weren't disciplined. Now, I think like it's disgusting that anyone would do a fucking Nazi salute at someone at a university campus it's revolting. But I think it says something about where we're at with the universities that it's like students do, like these presumably far right students do a Nazi salute on campus. But then who are the ones that actually get formally disciplined by the universities? One of our friends, Gem, Seymour, she was targeted by the University of RMIT for doing a video where she revealed the name of a weapons manufacturing in, what's the word research facility on campus? And its address. And its address. And it's address. And which was on its website? There was a man at the Monash University who was physically dragged out of class by security for putting up a pro-Palestine sticker on campus. He was also removed from his position that he had studying medicine because of his support for Palestine. So who gets punished? So it's not actually these edgy Nazi teens, the ones that are actually anti-Semitic, nothing, nothing happens to them. But the people who are standing up for Palestine, they're the ones that get disciplined. Yeah, I mean my favorite, not favorite, but you know, at the University of Western Australia, someone got disciplined for putting up six posters. One of which said free speeches under it. That's the world we're living in. And it reflects like Jillian Segal took days, I don't know if she ever did say anything about that Nazi rally at the front of Parliament. Totally. Whereas like the moment that anyone says anything pro-Palestine. Yeah, you know. Yeah, absolutely. So the focus is all on the left. So you were fact checked in the bio-Viginiabell her fact check, I think was incorrect. Because you sort of talked about, and we'll get into it a bit when we talk about the media response. But you talked about how acts of violence, by and oppressed against the oppressor, is a legitimate political act. Do you stand by that still? I do stand by that. And you talked about how the first and second interferer were mass movements of resistance by Palestinian people. And Virginia Bell says, well, yeah, I can understand that about the first interfered of, yes, but wouldn't you agree that the second interfered of that was just terrorism and suicide bombing, which is just like absolute rewriting of sort of history. But, well, wasn't fact checked in the commission. Why don't we talk about that? Yeah. Well, they just let the anti-Semitism envoy, who is a paid government official, like appointed government official. Taxpayer fund, yeah. You know, has plenty of research officers who could do her background checks, fact checks for her. But she just said that the death toll in Gaza was grossly inflated in the context of attacking the ABC and SBS for reporting in actually a very biased towards Israel way. But, you know, reporting numbers of deaths. So that happened and nobody said anything. Well, she was questioned on like, so, okay, I think is the toll and she's like, oh, I couldn't, I couldn't give you an answer kind of thing. But that was the extent of the challenge. There was a really excellent Deep Cut news sort of report on Julian Segal's testimony that actually did all of the fact checking, which the commission refused to do and every claim that she made was false. And I think, yeah, it's like, again, it shows you the hypocrisy the double standard, the fast of it all. That Julian Segal is allowed to say no, there weren't as many people killed. But you're not allowed to say that you support the mass resistance of Palestinian people under occupation. Yeah. I mean, the question of violence is like such a crazy one because yeah, they spent the whole time and now the media's whole line is like, you're a supporter of violence. It's like, I'm in here in a commission of people who support Israel and its violence. And who defend, you know, they defend openly. It's right to use violence supposedly, you know, to defend itself. Right, you know. And yet, the oppressed are not allowed to use violence. I mean, this is a total hypocrisy. And I think not a single country on earth that has achieved independence in any meaningful way without some violence. And that doesn't like, socialists have opinions about tactics. And it's not like saying that you support the right to resist. It doesn't mean you support every act totally. But the point is like, them trying to say that like, it's Palestinians who are the violent ones. So like, well, firstly Israel's violence is much more dominant than the Palestinians. But secondly, the oppressed have a right to resist. It's like, you know, the Nazi occupation of France. We didn't support the gaule fighting back. But we obviously support the French fighting against the occupation of France by Germany. The examples that you gave of like independence movements. Like, it's just, you have to fight, when you're being militarily fought, you have to fight with military means to some extent. Like, there's just no way around it. Hello, the Warsaw Getter uprising. Yeah, exactly. Like, honestly. So it's just like the most A historical. And like, you know, we should probably bring them out. But like, the Australian has got this dig about like, Jasmine supports violence. And it's like on the front page, they have a story about like the Iran war and her greatness. Remember that, like the Australian ran a whole series of articles about how disgusting it was that Trump did a ceasefire with Iran. And then they claim you're the violent one, like, seriously, these monsters. Yeah. Which one do you want to show first? I think just. Well, the Australian is actually, you know, maybe slightly less offensive. Because it's main point is just, I don't hold movements for justice to a standard that says there can never be any violence, you know. Yeah. To me, that's pretty, you know, pretty, pretty normal. But the, what is it? The Daily Telegraph. The hair of the car was not, yeah. Also, that's a great photo of you, by the way. I know, yeah. I have to say one. This is what their headline is that I said murder of Jews, acts of mass resistance. I mean, this is just such an obvious attempt, you know. They do this all the time, the media, in an attempt to slander our movement. They spend an hour pressing me on like, oh, and do you really support the Palestinians right to do X, Y, and Z. The thing I came there to say was like, we're for an end to a genocide. And their headline is about me being provile and sick. Yeah. And on that point as well, I'm glad you said it. But because you were questioned on the, you know, from the river to the sea, Palestine will be free. And, you know, on the, on the, on the Wandaq cause and fear and blah, blah, blah, blah. And you were like, the idea that, you know, the people opposing a genocide are, you know, advocating for a genocide of a different people. It's just outrageous. Like, it's ridiculous. But yeah, that's, I guess that's what they'll, they'll say. So, what wasn't fact checked, Julian Segal? What wasn't challenged? There were just a few things in here. I just, I really wanted to draw people's attention too, because I just thought they were real gems. And it's like, I can't, I don't know what the word is for this, but it's like other than like really, really crazy. So, one of the academics that spoke, the one from the University of Sydney, described this vigilante organization that she set up to stalk pro-Palestine activists on campus. She said that she spent over three hours a day sort of taking photos of posters, taking photos of graffiti, then going on all of the different social media accounts associated with the student activists on University of Sydney campus. She sent her son into a situation that she described as harmful, which was, sorry. She got into film a bunch of kids. And then you got accused of like pedophilia. And then she blames the people accusing him, like, rather than man-filming children. How many even accused him of pedophilia? What was, you know, the thing she took offense to was, why is he interested in the children? And I said, "We children." But yeah, so it's like this woman literally set up a. I wonder if you went to a Jewish school and filmed a bunch of kids? What they were saying about that. Oh, that's just normal, you know. But it's like this woman is literally admitting to setting up a vigilante. She's an academic who works on campus. She's admitting to setting up a vigilante group to stalk students. And this is just like. It's self-defense. It's so beautiful. It's so beautiful you did that. You just don't understand. She should get a job. Yeah. Professional protest. Professional anti-protest, so yeah. Then the other thing is the idea that Arabic writing is harmful. This was never challenged. I didn't hear that. Where was that? Was that earlier on or later on or something? No, the same woman. She talked about how they were flags that had Arabic writing on them and they couldn't understand them. But they just. Yeah. Because it was Arabic writing, it must have been directed at them and must have been harmful. It was in a lot of submissions as well. It's just racism. It's just Islamophobia. Then the other one which sort of really got me was this student who she was ACL. That was her anonymized thing. She was from a university in Melbourne. Who's. claimed that it was harmful, that a lecturer spoke about the the depletion of agriculture, the control of water supply and the deliberate starvation of people in Gaza. Now the reason this was harmful was because it was said in a lecture, so she didn't have a right of reply. -Oh my god. -That sounds pretty traumatic. -It's like this is the world that we live in. -Imagine if we got a right of reply to if I couldn't everything that was said. -Yeah. -I love a right of reply. -She didn't get her 40 minutes to the university. -Exactly. That's the standard for the pro-Israel side. Like, unless they get a chance to do a 40 minute response. -And then she said, "How could someone with such extreme ideological positions teach a class without bias?" So I put that question to you guys. -Put 'em. -But it's like, what about the her extreme ideological positions? Like this isn't bias, this is just, you know. -The whole thing is just through the looking glass. -That's why I don't think anyone's watching any of this on the left. -Because it's just ridiculous. -You just want to kill yourself. -We had to endure it to like get this moment of jazz brilliance, but then like as soon as the jazz finish-up, I got it. -This is it. -No, walking this website. -Never want to be confronted with this rubbish thing. -We were saying before the traffic probably blew up when you were. -I was just thinking, but also like, it's not an extreme ideological position. -It's like, this is what's happening. -Yeah, I did in preparation, try and sit through the whole thing, because I wanted to know what had been said. And you just can't do it, because the rage that bubbles up within you, you know. -We were all in the background sitting there silently through all the crap that was being said. -I honestly, it's lucky I wasn't there. -I've been kicked out of many events in my time. -This would have been one of them. -I will say that a comrade behind us, when the woman, the counsellor, assisting asked you, but why not just say free Palestine now? I heard a comrade, "Mada, why don't you write it on a black art and take it to a protest yet?" -Yeah. -I thought it was pretty good. But okay, so all of that was a bit like funny, but I think that the point I wanted to end this sort of section on was the thing that ACL said about in describing the experience of being in this global politics class and her lecture talking about the experience or what was happening in Palestine and happening in Gaza. She said, "When Bondi happened, so this, like you talked about, this atrocious murder, done by men who have nothing to do with university campuses at all, she said that she hoped that her lecturer could see that what he was saying had real world implications." -It's like the thing where after Bondi, very soon after Bondi, Jillian Segal came out and said that this has to do with the march for humanity across the Harvard Bridge. They just jump instantly to this. It must be the Palestine movement. The whole commission has been framed around like since October 7, as if there's some inherent connection between the Palestine movement really picking up in Australia and anti-Semitism existing. There's no mention of the polls about the rise of the far right or anything else. -I just think we can say categorically that this lecture at some university in Melbourne has nothing to do with what happened at Bondi. The idea that this has real world implications is just totally, totally wrong. -There was only one moment in your whole thing where they even talked about Islamism or something like that, which is the people who did the killing. It was very brief and it was just about his Bataria who, again, have different ideologically to ISIS. They support a caliphate and they're very terrible in a bunch of ways politically. Terrorism is not their chosen method. They prefer military coups in the Middle East. But one brief mention, the vast majority is just about left-wing activists, left-wing lecturers, left-wing academics. It's such a transparent, if you were doing a review into why this terror incident happened, none of this would be the topic of conversation. -Yes. Do you want to talk a bit about your experience of when you found out you were going to be in the hot sea? -Dada-loon. -I heard that you were quite grilled in the lead-up to this whole affair. -Yes, some vetting went on. Unpleased to me how much this happens to other witnesses. -By the commission. -By the commission. -Yes. -You know, they clearly wanted somebody there to basically tick a box because they have some, I don't know, legalistic idea. -Exactly. -Yes. -We've heard from both sides now, like tick. -Wow. -Well, it alternated between nerves, like a lot of nerves because you're just on this podium to be grilled in this insane McCarthyite which can't. But also, like, someone's got to do it. -Right. -This whole thing has been farcical. It's actually good to get in there. As soon as I sat down, I was like, oh, yeah. -Yeah. -I'm ready. -You know. -What can these people say? There is nothing that you can hold against the Palestine movement in this country that, you know, is not like, yeah, well, we were standing up for justice and freedom against a whole section of, like, the political establishment, the media, like, the universities, everyone else. -Yeah. -Also, we have the majority on our side now. Like, you know. -Yeah, absolutely. -Yeah. I mean, I just, like, I can't believe how incredible you did. Like, it was actually just like, there was comrades at the bookshop in Brunswick who were watching it live together. And the stream of messages, because people could see that I was there that I was a seeing. It's just like, oh, my God. She's incredible. She's amazing. This is the best thing. -We're all cheering. -But it is that thing of, like, yeah. It's like, this whole thing is just disgusting. And then finally, we have someone who's not afraid to speak, you know, truth to power, and actually say, yeah, like, we do support Interfathers. We do support Revolutions. We do support shaking off. We do support a free Palestine from the river to the sea. We do support a situation where people in that, you know, region can live free of oppression of genocide, of starvation, of land theft. This is what we stand for, and we're not afraid to say it. And it was so just, you know, moralizing to have you do that. It was incredible, yeah. -And I feel like you really built into it as well, like, because you know, sitting there and you're getting these questions, and it's a horrible situation, but then like, you kind of really got into your stride, and the stuff about, like, from the river to the sea was really well handled, going through the different ways in which Palestinians are fucked over. And then I thought the weirdest thing was that stupid lawyer from Orges who was like, who quoted your speech, and then proceeded to read out how you're like, actually quite critical of Hamas, and you don't think October 7 was very good, and didn't really take the movement forward. As if that was a gotcha moment. And you're like, yeah, you've just said it. And I support the right to resist, but I'm also not uncritical of Hamas and October 7 like. -Yeah, it was kind of great. The whole room looks confused. Like all of these supporters of Israel, who obviously just assumed that I'm a Hamas supporter because I'm pro-Palestine, like with their prowess forward as she read out this long quote about, you know, Hamas is a bourgeois, nationalist organisation. You know, and then it's like, yeah, no, I'm for revolution all across the Middle East. -Yeah. -I'm for all sorts of resistance. Like, I'm not here to condemn anyone, but also like, yeah, you've kind of said it. -I think you had the wrong bit, honestly. Like, I think she fucked it up. -Well, in the room, when she sort of asked you a few questions, she received a post at night from other lawyers and it was clear that the post at night literally said stop asking her questions and she just had to sit down. -I was surprised. I thought they were going to do like a 15 minute token thing because it was obvious to me in advance that you were going to kill it and that they were just, they were giving the enemy a free kick like, by just allowing you to talk. And so they eventually worked that out. -Yeah. -But it took them a long time. -I thought when I started with Hindrajab, like instantly, even if they had planned to give me longer and ask more questions, they'd be like, oh, this is, let's not do this. They went to the whole thing. I like the Orgis woman just basically leading up to all of these questions by being like, so students for Palestine is like, you're really important. -You're quite a big deal, huh? -You're really big. You've got a lot of followers on social media. You would say that you're influential. Is that correct? It's like, where are you going? -Yeah, like, yeah, I have tried to use that influence. -That's even possible. -That's so good. -Well, let's talk about those implications of the Royal Commission, like what it's all leading up to what they're trying to achieve. I mean, obviously, the starting point is just to demonize attack slander the Palestine movement. -Yeah. So they're trying to rewrite history. In the same way, they re-wrote history with COVID. Like, other lockdowns are so terrible. We should just let everyone die. This is an attempt to do the same thing. Like, this historic unprecedented mass anti-war movement with a war that were not even directly involved in, which is so unusual. Like, the Iraq war was, Australia was invading, World War I, etc. This was like, yes, Australian money and funds. There's obviously connections, but Australia was not sending people over. there and yet you have this enormous mass movement, 300,000 people on the bridge. So one of the main things is to put a full stop on all that and say that was bad and actually that was all racism and it should never be repeated. Yeah. And to denigrate the fact that actually we've won over popular opinion, I mean those opinion polls the other way was so heartening that the vast majority of people, including like 87% of young people, have an unfavorable opinion of Israel as they should because it's committing atrocities. And so they have no no recourse to do anything about that aside from just base slander, which I think is what's going on in this Royal Commission. Then I think another clear thing is that they're trying to attack free speech on university campuses and beyond, but very much targeted at the idea that there should be the right for students to express any opposition basically to the priorities of the state of Australia and Ergo as well, the state of Israel, that this is a no-go tone. And it's worrying for all sorts of reasons. Obviously the commission itself is mostly about the Palestine movement, but the idea that you can't put up a poster on campus or that you need permission for what exactly your poster is going to say. So you're only allowed to have some kind of harmless clubs and societies bake sale. Yeah. Universities, which are supposed to be like, there's a nice idea of them as like hubs of free speech and democracy and students learning how to think big thoughts about the world or whatever, that those universities are just going to become like, total dictatorships and the vice-chancellors and the priorities of the government. And it's no accident the labor on the first day of the student block announces all these regressive reforms designed for like stifle universities. And that's the thing, like I think for a lot of the left, rightly, we've tuned off this appalling thing. We haven't been following it. But it's, target is not us and it's not even the mass of public opinion really, although that's part of it. But the target is the establishment and the institutions and the media and the politicians and convincing them that there's been this atrocity committed and the atrocities, not guards, are the atrocities like the broken hearts of the people who are the atrocities. And like also on another one of the implications, it's like, you know, this was a role commission announced in the wake of a terrorist attack in Bondi that has done nothing. But it's to investigate like all prosecute, you know, the failings of whatever it might be. But we'll result in azeo getting more powers as a result. Like so many of the like draft recommendations that have already been made are redacted. We're not allowed to see them because they, you know, concern the Australian security state. Australia already has like very, very tight control and powers over like civilians in the wake of, you know, 9/11 Australia implemented sort of more anti-terror legislation than even the United States did. This is already a state that, you know, limits and catales people's capacity to live in privacy from the government. And this is going to result in more powers to this body. And it's already happening like the whole discourse about Palestinian refugees from Gaza and just Palestinians generally coming to Australia. And Jillian Segala herself wants to be able to personally vet every single person who arrives here. I think it's clear who's who shall reject. Like the argument is like Hamas are a terrorist organization and that definition of terrorism is just expanded constantly. And so anyone associated with Hamas who's ever said anything positive about Hamas is also a supporter of terrorism. Like that's a really dangerous slide. I saw just I think today or yesterday the British government has declared that the IRGC, the Iranian Revolutionary Guard have also been designated as terrorism. Now obviously I despise this scum. But like they're like a part of the government of Iran. So basically every Iranian has been associated with them. Every Iranian who doesn't support America has probably once said like it's good that America got shot by, you know what I mean? Like this creeping definition of what terrorism is. It's basically like anyone who doesn't obey the government is either a terrorist or a supporter of terrorism. And that's like going to have long lasting implications I think for democracy. And then I think the final, well it's not really the final implication but the last one that I sort of think we should talk about today is just this idea that Julian Segal should get to be the arbiter and the dictator of what is allowed to be said in the media. She's been gunning and pushing for this and it's very clear that this is where they want to take it. Yeah. Yeah. I mean the comments she made in this about the ABC and the SPS and so on are kind of one part of her agenda. It's like what doesn't extend to the thing about okay you want the media, you want immigration, you want universities, what else, you know. But I think the stuff about the media is also the case that like giving this person the right to control what's in the media opens up a whole like new way that there should be state controls in a bunch of ways on what's published, what's allowed to be said, you know questioning the numbers of the dead, etc etc. All of those is really worrying. And it's also outrageous in the face of a media establishment which is right wing already to be called. As if the ABC needs to be any more pro-Israeli. But you should get out of the list is famously pro-Palestinian. The interview with Narset was just like so generous, just gave him all these free shots. The ABC reportage of the Royal Commission yesterday was, yeah it's like it's so clear you don't need a girl. Yeah, you'll find it. Like it's like. There's a mini-sagarl in every editor of every media. Absolutely, like just the, you know, the word count that they gave to these substories of just like pathetic people have no capacity to like, you know, well if you believe in this to stand for it, like sorry you feel challenged, hold on to your ideas. I'm challenged all the time. I'm a fucking communist. I don't get upset when the government is all like the media is like, socialists are really bad. You're a trouble family. It's like yeah, mother fucker. I'm a trouble family. You know, so it's like the ABC gives like all this air time to these pathetic little fuckers. And then they're like, and yes, Johnson, you know, sets them stuff. And she said that she puts, supports violence. And it's like, okay. Yeah, that's balanced. You all got to mention it. Yeah. It gets more air time in the far right media than we do in the left wing media, seriously. Yeah. Yeah. So I think that one important point about all of this and sort of to bring this sort of discussion to a close is just to, I guess, emphasize the point that this is Labour's Royal Commission. Obviously, they were pushed to do it by the right and sort of a whole bunch of different institutions, sections of the Australian ruling class. But they chose to carry this out and they're going to choose to uphold the recommendations and the finding of the Royal Commission. So as we sort of go into a future where the media, you know, discussion is curtailed, where university students have no right to speech on campus, where academics are the victims of which hunts, where Palestinians are attacked as terrorists, where Arabic writing is seen as somehow harmful. We can thank the Labour Party for all of that. And they're jumping to do it before they're even asked, you know, all this stuff about the universities, like they implemented it before the hearing block even happened. Like, who knows what else will come out of this. It really is like the kind of progenocide side says jump and they're like, all right, how high, you know, I'm sure. And I think that really in terms of understanding why we've, we've had this point quite a few times, but like there's still a wide feeling that this is because of the Jewish lobby or whatever. And I just think it doesn't make any sense. Like the reason is it's where tied to America for the same reason that Albanese stands there holding modies fucking hand in the air in the stadium, this fascist mass murderer of a leader. Is the same reason why we stand when that in Yahoo, it's not about the individuals, it's not about the color of their skin or anything like that. It's about the US block and what we're fighting against or preparing to fight against, which is like China. That's what August is about, that's what this is about, that's what Pine Gaps about. So yeah, understanding this is a serious, you know, this is a long term issue. It's not going to be resolved just by like somehow dealing with the Zionist lobby or whatever. It's a function of capitalism and imperialism and it's something very deep in Australia's DNA. Well, yes, is there anything you'd like to add to your testimony? No, yes. Cool. All right, always do it outro. All right. Well, thanks so much, Yaz, for joining us on the podcast. You're welcome back anytime. We do prefer your like corporal form. So you can try and come be on the pot in person again. That would be really good. But if we have to do one Zoom, we'll do it. But to our listeners, thanks so much for listening to the app. This is a good one to share with your friends and family. If you're feeling rage about what, you know, what we've all witnessed, the attack on the Palestine movement, hopefully you've enjoyed raging alongside us. And yeah. Get involved in the party. We didn't say that I keep Yaz's in the Nisapwa Socialist as well. Are you a candidate? I am not a candidate. No, yeah. They should make you one. Yeah. I think I've counted it on the show basically. So yeah, yeah, yeah. Right in the world. But yeah, like it's, it's a really important time. This show is what we're up against. Join us. Get involved. Give to our Patreon. Give us money. Yeah. Yeah