80. The Jake Smith

You are listening to Runner's FF! What's up guys, welcome to another episode of Runner's FF episode 80 to be more specific. We are sitting together at the podcast booth at Downtown Camper. How are you doing Victor? I'm 10 out of 10. 10 out of 10. Say it's actually not 10 out of 10 now. It's moved down to, I don't know, it's just like life in general and motivational, that's still 10 out of 10. But now I have got, I've been to the doctor, I've done an MRI since the last episode and I've got the results back and it looks like I'm not going to do anything good in running till late autumn. So I have the two stress reactions, one in the sacrum and one in the pubic bone. So two months of no running at all. So this is my first bigger running related kind of injury after seven years of running. So in that case, missing Stockholm Marathon, it's a little bit of a bummer, I have to say. But yeah, it's just strange, I think I surprised myself with how kind of in good mood I am, anyway. Just keep on just to take it for this. You are, I think I shouldn't say maybe the best in the world, but you are up there of the people who tackle stuff like this in the most brilliant way, I should say. There are huge inspiration in that sense among other as well, but just, yeah, you are very good at staying positive and yeah, look at the bigger picture. Well, thanks a lot man, it's really nice to hear words like that. But I think like, I don't know, I feel like maybe it's because I'm not like feeling stressed about my age, but I also realize that I'm not going to be able to run competitive for another 10 years, for example, I don't think it's many 50-year-olds, they're after grinding. So I think that for me, it works in a good way right now because I feel like I can't do any stupid things like right now, I just feel like every day for these upcoming five years, at least, I definitely want to run for at least five more years, I would say. I kind of feel like I'm motivated to do the right thing, I don't want to start too early, running after this injury, I'm just going to listen to the doctor and do exactly what he says, because I don't feel like I can't afford to risk things and start too early, and so I feel like I'm just motivated with the thing that is put like in front of me, with like maths, what he says, and the doctor, and so, yeah, today, AquaJogging with Nils 70 minutes. The first session of AquaJogging, right? Yeah, so that was much more fun that I expected, because everyone I said that is so boring, and I've seen Jacob Incher-Rickson doing it a lot on his series, and it looks really boring, but I have to say that the heat train that you and I did a lot last year, when you're on the bike in the club, I wasn't looking into a ball, and you would go up and you'd been in the zone three, in the heat zone three for like 30 minutes, I think that is a lot tougher. Like now, I was just actually moving forward in some kind of pace, in a very nice swimming environment in the like Eric Stahl's body, because it's this Olympic kind of facilities, so you saw all of these good Olympic athletes, had their like pictures on the walls, and I always felt like it was a motivating place to just do a session, so I don't know, like famous last word, maybe I'm going to say something different here, a month from now, because I'm not even allowed to do anything else than just being in the pool for the upcoming month, but the first session, and good comfort of the Nils, of course, so it was probably much lighter than it's going to be when I'm by myself, but yeah, more okay than I thought. Very nice, so that's the plan, four weeks of water running, yeah, and then, and then a month with just being on the bike, okay, so I think the plan is just now, I think I've got a beef, I don't know, like two hours in the pool every day, that's why I feel, because it's tough, because you can buy entrance and you get allowed to be there for three hours, and I'm not that rich that I can buy two of those each day to do two sessions, so I think I just have to do one really long session, maybe listen to like some rich roll episodes, two and a half episodes, Mark Manson, kind of like some kind of podcast, and then see how it goes, and a lot of a sauna, I would say as well, so I'm definitely going to do more, the heat training that you and I were, that train we were on, maybe six months ago, jumping back on that train as well, so two hours of aqua jogging and maybe half an hour after that in the sauna in the facility, so I think that is my daily routine from now on, there we have it, but excuse my ignorance, do you need like a specific pool or could you do here at downtown camper in the pool? It has to be so like you're not touching the bottom, so like it has to be a deeper, yeah, okay, so it's good to have that kind of Olympic facilities with like proper 50 meter pool, yeah, okay, so it's not like a treadmill under the water, it's just like, yeah, you have this like float belt, so you're on the surface and you're just kind of if you have like a float or a collar vest, and then you're just paddling with your legs, and you do like the running movement, okay, and I thought that that was not going to take me anywhere, but I actually moved forward a lot faster than I thought, so yeah, okay, wow, interesting, and are you going to structure it in any way, like the sessions are just going to go for 60, 70 minutes, like a easy jogging? We'll see, like I think Matt has some kind of plans, that's what he said, okay, so he just said like, welcome to the world of an injured runner, this is where the hard work actually is happening, like running is fun, now you're doing actually really tough stuff, so I think he said like, yeah, just take a couple of days off first and then go back to it, then just now feel it, feel it in a little bit, but I think his plan is to do proper sessions in the pool, okay, yeah, nice, yeah, and then after that, we will see how the the body responds and hopefully get back into running slowly, yeah, exactly, I think that is the plan, like eight weeks, and I think it's pretty defensive if I look at other people with the same kind of injury, I've seen for example, I know that Connor Mans had kind of, he had a real fracture, I think, stress fracture in the sacrum, and I looked like he went started to do it, get back to running a little bit earlier, because I guess he's, we draw, we draw a buster now because he's a little backfire, so that's the goal to not have it like that, I don't want to have any backfires, so I rather take it a lot easier in the beginning to really make sure that I'm, what I'm fixed, I'm fixed, okay, make sense, yeah, okay, yeah, as you said, a bummer to miss out on Stockholm marathon, but hey, it's, we're giving it a shot next year, yeah, yeah, definitely, definitely, and, yeah, and I just have to say before we move on from this topic, I'm super happy about everyone, I, I think I spent three hours on my life answering people's really nice messages and some running friends or also called me on the day when I put it out there, and it's been, yeah, I feel really supportive, so that's super, super nice from people from different countries, and stuff like that, uh, uh, called me, people from, like, uh, US, I can, yeah, I really feel like it's a lot of people in running, instead I can call my closest friends right now, so that was very, very nice, that's, very nice, that's a very good way to look at, uh, challenges like this, you get to see who's truly like supporting you, yeah, so, okay, very good that you have, uh, a lot of good friends around you with him, yeah, yeah, for sure, for sure, definitely, it's, uh, really cool to see, uh, because sometimes you know, you forget the about to, to, to do the same for, you just see a lot of things on social media, and, uh, yeah, so I think I'm, I'm appreciated because I know that it, uh, when you do it, you really mean it, exactly, exactly, because we're so busy in our own lives, uh, yeah, when someone actually put the effort in and the time in to, to reach out, it's, uh, it's very nice, yeah, definitely, definitely, but then it takes you a lot, a couple of hours to respond to everyone, and, uh, yeah, I felt like, uh, it's like if you do a good race, sometimes you're just like, in the end you have to thumbs up, but I feel like this, this here was just like, uh, this was, I kind of wanted to give everyone who has reached out good. proper answer because I know that that is not so common that you do that for other people. So that was super nice. Yeah, I remember last year when I turned 30. Yeah. I knew on the day when I turned 30 there's going to be a bunch of other stuff happening and I'm not going to have the time to you know respond to everyone congratulating me. So I did I actively chose not to post that I turned 30 just to you know minimize the stress but it's sometimes very nice to see the the people reaching out. It's a little bit of right now now when I did turn 40 less than a month ago. I did exactly the same strategy because I was like I don't want to focus on Berlin here and I also start to feel a little bit of a nickel that turned out to be a very bad injury. Exactly. So I said this show now I turn off all these like no if met on notifications that I'm 4040. So that was just her like posting about when she gave me breakfast on that that was the whole thing that people knew that I turned 40. Yeah. Well, I think we sounds like such a douchebag. Yeah, unfortunately. Yeah, I don't know it's it is what it is but it's more of the stories people are great. So that's and moving on to the next topic that was going to be the I feel like the main thing is that like we're changing focus under a podcast now and we're we're very much dialing into a marathon and the main reason for that is that you my friend, the only one is gonna run Stockholm marathon now. Yeah, touch, touch wood. Yeah. But yeah, I'm moving into a more marathon specific period right now. It's eight weeks out from Stockholm marathon and I think that's the perfect length of a of a block. If you are well prepared, which which I think I am besides from the plantar fasciitis but yeah, I'm looking forward to Stockholm marathon as every year. I think it's one of the most fun races during the year even though the course is pretty bad. The weather is often very hot and the bushes such a nice atmosphere and a lot of friends, family, a lot of people that know my name that just yells fray. Let's go fray. Let's have a look at that and yeah. So looking forward to it. The toll on it's done. Yeah, Stockholm marathon is such a such a vibe. Yeah. So I'm looking forward to standing on the sideline and share for you this year again. So it's going to be, that's nice as well I have to say. So yeah, that's going to be great. And I think we're going to be selfish now using runner's FM. Our contacts all over the running world to just get some good motivation. Try to just invite guests with specific knowledge in the marathon either runners or nutrition people to make sure that you have all the knowledge that you that you that you can have for to running the marathon in a very good way. So it's not cold. Yeah, that's that's the plan. Sounds very good. And today's guest is a very interesting one. Yeah, a legendary guy I have to say. I used to say that I have some kind of 10 out of 10 people and I said that there are not many of them in the world. But I think that this the guest here when I start to get to know him is such a he's up there. He's one of the 10 out of 10 guys. So I'm very happy that that he yeah, he's the first kind of marathon guest for our fading in to making runners FM a marathon pulled the cost on all the way to Stockholm now the last week of May. Exactly. He's the first guest and the road to Stockholm marathon road to Stockholm marathon starts now. And I think you're going to read his name in the description of the podcast episode. Probably, but you can do your good intro anyway. Okay. Yeah, let's do it. Today's guest is one of the fastest British distance runners of his generation. He broke onto the international scene with a standout performance at the European half marathon championships where he took silver and has since gone on to represent Great Britain on some of the biggest stages in the sport known for his aggressive racing style and willingness to push the pace from the front. He's built a reputation as one of the most exciting competitors over the half marathon and marathon distance. Jake Smith, welcome to the podcast. In today's episode, we're sitting here at this beautiful podcast studio at downtown camper in central Stockholm. I'm probably a little bit biased because I love the place, but yeah, I think this is probably the best hotel in town. So if you're on your way to Stockholm, make sure to have downtown camper on your list of the hotels you should book. What do you say, Frey? What do you think about downtown camper? Oh, I love it. I definitely agree with you, Victor, you should get yourself over here if you're in Stockholm and just enjoy the environment. Thank you downtown camper for sponsoring the podcast. We're very, very happy with this couple of generations. Thanks a lot, downtown camper. Welcome to a runner's FM, Jake Smith, how are you doing? Yeah, very good. Excited to talk to you too. I really enjoy listening to the pod and the YouTube series is very, very fun to watch. I'm really excited to talk to you guys, so yeah. Thanks, thanks a lot, but we didn't know that you were that you were listening to our stuff before I talked to you like the first half a couple of months ago. So we're very honored at you. Like the content, Jake. Now, it's good because I think I like, I know, I love really like what Ben is like, I mean, Ben Felton's doing. And I really liked his YouTube. And then I found out about YouTube more through what I've known, I think I've known you get to put quite a while, like in the last couple of years, just results and stuff. But for runners FM and everything, I think I heard from his YouTube. And then I started watching the, it was my favorite. As soon as you started uploading the stuff onto YouTube, I reckon I watched it within three, three hours, two, three hours. It's really kind of fray was I had a lot of respect from training that early in Stockholm and in the evening. And the clubhouse as well, because I went there back in December. Oh, yeah. Yeah, I've been in there actually in the clubhouse because I did I was there for a few days in Stockholm. Yeah, what was that trip about that? Because I was in Australia when I saw that you suddenly, you were just in the Stockholm doing like a park run and other stuff. Katie, my girlfriend had a high rocks in Stockholm. And it's honestly my favorite place. I would move to Stockholm in a heartbeat. I absolutely love. We ran on the trails. I forgot what was called. I thought that you were had a good session around there. You go down like, yeah, that's it. And it was just so it was so easy to get miles in. And then the park runs, but we were very lucky, because we had like, it was still quite warm, but the day we left, each started to get really, really cold. But yeah, fair play for you too. But completely all the runs out there when it's cold. It doesn't come. Yeah, I think I wrote to you on your first drama post for Stockholm. I was like, you're more than happy to come here and we were off in Jake, so I could get some good company to try to just be behind and get some good pacing for a little. Yeah, because I ran with them. I watched your last YouTube, so I've got his name. He's run 2-10. He's racing a hamburger, marathon. Archie Castile. Yes, I ran with him on the long run. So there's a big group of us. So it was, yeah, he was literally, I think, wearing that exact same jacket. He's running exactly in close. It's a true, true, true ledger, that man. Yeah, it's a simple man. Yeah. Nice, nice. We discussed before we pressed the record button here that we are going to mainly focus on, you know, the last couple of weeks with all your half-marathons and then leading into the build towards London marathon. So we know there's a lot more than that we want to discuss with you, but we're just mainly going to focus on that today. How's the body feeling? You've been running three half-marathons now in six weeks, right? Yeah, it wasn't necessary plans. I was always going in for Barcelona's main thing, so I did a training camp in Portugal. It's quite interesting. I think I listened to one of you say as well. You know, like almost every few weeks you get that a little bit fitter. So when I came off Barcelona, as soon as I finished, I was like, I could go even quicker. And I contact my agent because I was doing bath half. That's part of the British trials. It was like three weeks back. If I could do Berlin as well as a bit of a hard session, but after I was seeing Berlin, I kind of wish I like went full in because it was, it's a very quick course. But I think the biggest reason why I want to do more halfs is at the last year in my coach, Gavin and Joe Pavy, they basically said to me, you need to do more half-marathons for the marathon because if you look at the top boys, like I mean, look at Phil Sessman, look at in Britain. for example they have done a lot more racing than I have previously so I normally would do like one big half marathon a year and then take time to recover and not really do what like feel was doing like race on race on race on build out fatigue aspect so it was interesting it was cool three completely different races three different weather it was pretty fun there yeah yeah it's like it was fun because when I was in Santa Pola before Barcelona I remember John Lucas showed me one of your sessions from your camp in Montagardo and he said yeah Jake Smith is getting really really fit so the aim there was it like because I remember I think you put it out on social media that you wanted to run under 62 for the first time in a while but did you feel there that that was more to get out of that race after because I looked through your stuff then when you all look at showman there was some crazy good sessions from from Montagardo yeah Montagardo I feel like it's a bit of a cheat cheat place you can run so fast there I was training I think I was training was so many different impressive people I was actually a bit annoyed John Lucas beat me because I really wanted like so I've known him for quite a few years and I didn't want to lose to him but he had the race of his life so fair play I think I was it is one of those you know I don't know if you to do but you know when you sit like an A star goal an A star goal some A star goal was to run sub 61 30 so was the world champs time and then the A goal I wanted breaks into two it's it's a big thing for me I don't know if you two go but you know when you in order for like to get to the next level I almost need to break the barrier it's like what bend it bend broke 65 you can now go 64 low as soon as you break the barrier you can strive for a quicker time and because it was the first time I'd done it since like redder saw my injuries it was a big step forward I felt like afterwards I could have probably gone a little bit quicker but I sort of needed to like you know it's it's all well and good you can say I could run quicker but you almost need to put it in place so I've put it in place and then I came to Berlin and yeah I was that was good that was children and now I kind of wish I went with a group in front but I was more using it as a session going into London so it's funny how racing works but you told John Lucas I don't want to have a lose to him again yeah well see what he does in rough to them this Sunday but I'll thanks Lock Jake for because you were sticking to the plan that we talked about before Berlin when you said that you could pace before at least that like headwind in the beginning eight nine K so I think you did a really good job there but I noticed that on because I tried to not look at the watch so much I was like I'm just going to trust that Jake is running in this 258 per kilometer so it felt really really good for myself as well but then I around there I think it was around was it 11k when you start to ask people what they were going for it was no it was quite a bit earlier but I don't know what you do you went to the front when I was still on the front you were feeling really good it was it was strange I was like he's going to fly it was only you and I in that group who were pushing yeah yeah I spoke to quite a few of them afterwards and most of it I think say there was 10 guys nine of them round PBs and if it wasn't for us to yeah we did a good we did a good job there but I was like I didn't you know I didn't felt feel directly when you started to increase the pace there was more like a slow burn I feel like I'll always start to feel a little bit harder suddenly and then I looked down on the watch and then I had that you know current pace and average pace I have both kind of data fields and then also like 253 else like all right Jake is pushing it now it was weird because I don't if you remember how far back we were in the first K we were so slow off the mark so but it was really nice like I loved running with you and I think I was feeling really strong in that point and I was like you know what let's my heart rate was low and I was like okay let's get a bit more out of today and you know me I love chasing people down and I sort of like I make a joke with other people but I said like I sort of cheated because it 10 K no at Morgan Logan you know the Swiss exactly so he paced the 28 10 group Petros group yeah and I know him I'm known him for a couple of years so I saw him at 10 K and I shout over it's like oh do you want to help me out and he helped me for 3K and he just brought me forward a bit more but wasn't it like one or two runners that's started to like fall back from the the pack in front of us it was it was weak is I caught Mark in general wheeling out stage and Jimmy fair pay to him finishing actually he was in a world of pain Mark he was his first race back well considering like you should almost take inspiration of him he had a stretch fracture in November December I think January even maybe and he's already come back with a sub 63 so and a lot of caught a lot of Japanese guys I think they're racing structures a bit I can't really say much a bit strange I should say and it was really good and then towards the end I caught Nils Voitz I caught Jacob Barat I beat him in a sprint modern sort of sprint 400 minutes ago I beat him so I was very happy with that and that is impressive obviously yeah I was just talking to people taking just I was having the best time on my life I know yeah you were you were strong and very shatty there the first 10 K I think that's a big thing for me I said to my girlfriend after it's it sounds so stupid but I need to implement these little things in London to have the best time so it's like not talk talk to the crowd but you know like do my little like hand signals where my flat cap almost that's what I'm having fun is when I actually make jokes with people off the course yeah sounds so stupid but that's when I run well so yeah but I just like before we have to I think we have to move forward a little bit faster here would be all the good stuff we could talk with you Jacob Barat but I was just having a thing in my head I remember when you ran we John Lucas the British 10,000 meter champs last year because I remember I watched the live stream because I know that you were gonna run I know that Emil Correst was gonna run and John Lucas was running so and I remember you said afterwards that you ran around 29 30 then right wasn't it something like that it was like 20 on 15 or some just under yeah it wasn't very good and I will remember you said that this is pretty good step forward for having a bad day to run this time yeah it was we do the it was so it was a lot of marathons like two months before and the week before we do this in Wales we do this thing called castles relay so it's basically you have 20 people on a team that starts from north Wales down south Wales so it's over two days you do like a 10 12 more leg and there's six mountain stages so you can imagine goes flat out to mountain so the week before I did this castles leg and then on Saturday night you're just getting drunk based with your mates and stuff and you're sleeping in a tent in a random field and I woke up Sunday and I said I've just run a half marathon over a mountain I've just got drunk and I'm sleeping on a field it's this great prep for 10k for six days before when I tell you I got into that startle and 10k and couldn't be bothered I did not want to be there and a meal a meal had to lap me so as soon as I saw him lap me I was like what I'm doing yeah that was it's almost like have you two ever had it you know when you've done a massive race and it's like you have to almost lose fitness to get better and you it's like that the first race which is the worst race you ever want to be part of and your body's just not clicking and it was just one of them it's so funny when you tell this story because you we always see you know people's result then you know no exactly the background to those results but my take while I brought this up was to say that how easily you ran around 2930 in Berlin compared to that feels like you're in crazy much better shape now that was my whole why I take on this I think I went through five seconds slow in Berlin and I was just chatting and stuff and it's it's like it's one of those because I like I'll raise my hand up I do like you said I look at time to my all-wide and they run quicker blah blah blah but it's so you can't you don't know what they've done the week before you don't know how they're going into it it's like for example Berlin wasn't the main 8th me people might look at the 62 and said oh he ran fast and fast so I don't know why didn't he run fast today but I I had London marathon I had those a reason for it and I think he's like but I like I said a lot of social media out there where you are just saying why didn't they run quicker but you actually don't know the full backstory yeah so it's yeah it's quite interesting yeah and now we are three weeks out from London marathon correct yes yes yes yes is the shape where you wanted it to be before you you went into this block like three weeks out yeah it's it's good it's like it's good I'm feeling really really confident I've practiced gels finally I've done quite a few long runs because I felt like last year like it wasn't perfect like it was it was on the warmer side in London but that still doesn't like it was very it was really bad the last last year in London to be to be to here you don't have to say there it was really I was there watching Ben because I like it was it was not good conditions it was bad conditions Yeah, it is one of the then it's like I just fell apart the last three canes how I focus on that So I said to my coach. I was sat down and said how do we get rid of the last? Me falling to parts pieces of last three or four K. Okay, it was warm But how do we get alongside that so we are okay? We need a couple more long runs. We need to practice gels Because it was so interesting because I caught Alexy last year like 20 miles and the triathletes They are unbelievable taking like fluid and stuff. So he would go over take a bottle have it for a K And I'm just running behind him like what do I do? So it was like but then he managed to finish at the same pace where as I fell off a bit So it's like we've because I knew I was in very good shape like Again, it's like I only I'm a two eleven guy. I can't I can't really say I'm a two and nine two ten guy because I haven't done it But say I'm probably not I'm in very similar Probably a bit fitter than I was last year, but last year I may you've caught a gone a bit quicker, but it's all the other things I have to do around it. So like you said taking gels Conditioning the body a little bit more and hopefully around the European times. So that's the end And when when did this marathon build begin if you if you had to put it into words Generally, I wish I could tell you In so I went to camp like I don't know what it's like in Stockholm in January, but it's terrible in the UK So I went to a camp in Portugal always doing January and that was more for them bar Sloan and builds And that's already where I started doing like fairly long runs at 35 37 K and then after bar Sloan Then the longer runs came in I haven't really done anything marathon specific long runs. I felt like I did quite a few last shit and maybe Do you ever get like when you're almost over fatigue going to a race? I didn't feel like I felt like I could be a bit more fresher. So we have reduced that I've have done the long runs But not nothing to do with marathon pace But yeah, I wish I could tell I don't know I'm very much looking forward to may being a week month of just drinking and Relaxing and go to meet friends. That's all I'm looking forward to So it's not like a head-eye stone if you watch Clayton Young sitting here. We have 18 weeks We're gonna do this. We're gonna put in a race here. This is the block for whatever Marathon they're gonna run for for the moment. That's not how how you build build the the block I like being I like being bit out there that different I think as well. I said to my coach like when you're you know for like bar Sloan I really take it down into it and then had a lot a few days out quite a few week like the week after was tapered So if you take that into account, that was what middle of fab So if we had like a 10-day spell of okay, I know you're racing a hard half marathon, but 10-day spell of Reduced training As you guys know the amount of training we do you if I said to you doing half of the mileage That two weeks later you're gonna feel great and then same and bath bath week. I did half my normal mileage So if you take into that account those two races were a month apart I did 50% of mileage one week through which they did another 50% and I think that's the big thing for me. It's like Let's not say they were a girl races, but I still did some easy running into it tape it into it And that's how my coach likes it But then of course after London, I ain't running. I don't where you will want to put running shoes on. I want a proper break But I think I'm in that phase now like he's he's actually mentioning the other day. I'm very If you exclude all my injuries previously, I've been very strong the last three years like just every race I turn up to I'm getting that little bit better and I think I'm showing Signs of how like showing people how like versatile I am and that is probably because I am able to just keep this training I'll keep this manager up, but also you know take the breaks when there is The L these like 12 16 18 weeks. I don't I don't really understand But yeah, I don't really follow that. I must admit I think it's good. I think it's so fun to just talk to different runners and everyone becomes really really good and in different way That suits themself. I think that is as great Yeah, yeah, I'm very lucky as well because I get I have like two hours of day and stuff I don't have the I have a quite boring life Yeah, very very interesting and and also to hear that your long runs hasn't been very specific you said like marathon specific How would like how are you structuring your long runs then? so So it's um, so for example during the week I do like a double threshold on Tuesday a Thursday's more Progression map more mountain specific LT1 stuff But it's like so for example last few weeks. I've had four by five K, but Every week I either go over the hills depending on how tired I am I love going over the hills and it's more just a heart rate the pace is irrelevant and then Saturday I've literally kept in every single week apart from races VO two stuff So the way my coach describes me is how I get fit for a marathon is training like a 10k guy And then the long runs the long runs are interesting. It's like I did three hours the other day was 45k. I did a marathon yesterday, but it's all very like steady and I then the last like say 45 minutes or 40 minutes. I got go up to the LT1 So just like almost the bottom area where your LT1 crosses over and I only stay at that for say 20 30 minutes Just below that So in times that you know you see people doing like I'm three by 10k at marathon pace. I haven't done anything like that And I feel like the training When I train like a 10k half that's when I know I'm getting fit from marathon It's it sounds so strange because I speak to a lot of marathon guys in there so completely opposite to me But yeah, that's how my coach season how my coach knows I get fit if he takes away those VO two stuff on a Saturday That's when I hate it I'm not saying I'm the fastest guy, but I do enjoy running just hard on a road on a railroad or a park run I love a park run as you guys probably know Yeah, it's good like you know, but you know when you did your it was 2020 right when you did the 60 31 you're curious your PB How how do you feel now like fitness wise? Running a half marathon compare compare to that day and was it was that the Race and Polar right though world road champ. Yeah, well champs. Yeah, I don't really associate myself with that person like that person before because Like of course, it's it's one of those like I ran it was an incorrect like on the day It was incredible, but if you look at actually my health and everything who is it wasn't good. I think I was 8 to 10 kilos lighter than I am now and It's one of those cuz through my social media through my presence. I'm trying to really put like show being slightly heavier and being more powerful is the way forwards and When I bring like those races up like when people ask me my about my PBs I don't now tend to bring that up because I'm like if you look at me now I'm a completely different Health healthy person If you look at all my like I know the testing scores I think I'm very very close and it's a horrible thing to say, but it is the way that is probably The like the horrible thing is the light you are you can run faster, and it's one of those where I was on a bloody red line For a good year and two years and then I completely broke and it's a horrible thing like if I did drop two or three kilos Maybe I would be a bit quicker, but I'm not that's not my way forward So it's I still need a couple more years. I think to get to that level Just because I'm doing it in a completely different way where I'm trying to do it a very healthily way And not the way I used to do ways to drop weight it was actually quite funny cuz I did some testing other day And I'm now at a phase where my coach actually said to me you can probably drop a couple of kilos now Whereas I've never heard that before cuz I was like I'm like five foot seven and I'm like 67 66 67 kilos So it's not like it's a healthy weight, but I can probably drop a kilo too, but I do like my chocolate and my eyes Yeah, I think it's I have for me, you know like I Think like how like you're strength or weakness as a runner. I feel like I can You're a guy that I definitely look up to as someone that is I feel related to so I feel like it's Or I now and here you speak like this. It makes me really happy because like I hear a lot of people I commenting how I look as a runner as well I'm a little bit more like hockey player looking, you know, and it's Like yourself like Jacob Simonson. I that's like kind of people I relate to and just like Feel like it's super nice that you don't like to have to look like a really like skinny person to be along this as runner Yeah, it's one of those in like in Berlin cuz there was Every race I turn up to now. It's like when there's like a windy section or a tough section. I Like I'm loving that part like because I have the strength behind me and Yeah, I think he it's just one of those where I'm so like my mental health towards running now because I'm heavier because I'm not hungry and everything is So much better I can go into all these races, whereas before when I was so light, I would get injured ill after every single race. And I just, I didn't, I wasn't happy. And that was the biggest thing, like, at the end of the day running is such a small part of our lives and everything. And if I kept going the way I was, mentally, I was completely broken. Fair play to my girlfriend for staying, through all wind stuff, but it wasn't very good. So that's why I'm trying to, like, prove to people that, like, slightly heavier can win. So if I get called, like, the slightly chubby boy in the start line by the African Soviet, I'm going to put a good fight against them strongly. I think both Frey and I know the feeling. Yeah. We also love chocolate. Yeah. But yeah, yeah, you're doing a great job. It's, you can definitely tell you're in a good place right now. But let's come, let's go back to the marathon. And is this your third marathon? Yes. So, um, I don't quite a couple of quite a few build-ups, but I haven't managed to meet them, where, so this will be my third one. So we have that, if I just, I'm going to do this for you, Jake here. So we don't steal your whole afternoon, but like, so the two ones is like that crazy pull-foot race when you were a pacer, and then you kind of finished the race into 211. And then you did London marathon last year. Yes. And now you have done sub 62 again. So if you put it in some kind of running calculator, you'd probably say you're on 20830 or something like that, I would, I would guess. Don't say that because I was saying it's real quick, but I'm not. I'm going with the, the main goal for London is running sub 2 and I 30 because, um, I mean, I love Lex Run. I love looking at it. But if you see, it always says back in the day, or Jake's missed wash, done, blah, blah, blah. And, um, if I can get British first, it'll be five years since my last best. And I think it's like, again, through what I'm trying to show is like, if I can get British first and reps in GB, like, it, it, it, it, it, it, it, it, it, it, it, it, it, it, it, it's meant it's what I say by being like heavier works because, um, but yeah, I'm looking forward to London. Um, I kind of want it to be windy. I kind of want it to be a tough day out. But, um, we'll see. That, that's pretty crazy what you said before in Berlin half marathon. You said, GB, it's going to be pretty windy tomorrow, but that's all right. I like the wind. So I can definitely, I can definitely take the first date, but what would you say if you have a last, do you have a, like, a last big session that you guys have planned before London? No, it's, so that's really interesting. So, um, I'm messy, a good friend of mine, you know, Adam, I can never say he's lost him. Lisbitch is South African. Yeah. So he's a two-a-week guy. And he has like, it's like, he has quite a big session this week, whereas I don't really, I have a double threshold Tuesday, Thursday, probably four by five K, and I might actually try and change it, so it's a little bit different. Um, that's all to LT1 and then more of like a 10K specific work on Saturday. Um, the, but all the, uh, like, other runs around it all reduced because I'll start reducing the mileage this week as it being only like three weeks out, but that's the thing I don't, I haven't really had a marathon indicated workout. It's literally, it's literally, I think for me as well, like, did you see what Phil Sessman said? He was really interesting. That, why he did two marathons in a row because he would do those marathon specific workouts, kill his body, and he could have, if he could have run a 210-211, just had to run a marathon. And what he did last, he did two backs back two or seven, so I'm using the same, whereas I don't think I, I really look up to him because I don't, I'm not at that level yet. He's just another leg above me at the minute. And this, the marathon specific workout, I just couldn't do them. So my coach said, okay, instead of these marathon specific, let's just do whatever, however long my marathon build is, but just keep it the same every single week and you're just going to get fitter and recover and round. So I'm coming at a completely different angle, because I listened to the podcast you did with, it was a Christina, the, she ran 220 in Tokyo. And she was like, if you look at mine and her training, it's so different. Maybe we have double threshold, but apart from that, it's so different. So it's going to be quite interesting to see how my training, like how what how London goes. Yeah. And you mentioned earlier, you, you are practicing the, you're fueling right now. How is that looking more specifically? It's good. It's quite hard to take Morton. I didn't really realize the gels are quite hard. I'm not going to lie. You know, these people say like, you have to take, what is it? 90 grams an hour or whatever. I don't make my bottles my agents do. So I'm just going to pick up a bottle and just drink as much as I like. I think I'll probably take a gel like, probably like 10, I'll probably take five gels during the race like 10, 15, 20. I'll take a caffeine gel at 30, okay. And then after 30, okay, if I want another gel, I just, I'm just going to just start collecting. I'm going into it with a lot more free spirit. I'm like, you know, people quite regimented. I'm not going in like that. I think for me, I've actually had this chat, but I think for me, the biggest thing is the fueling you do the days before the race, not the actual day. Because exactly it's like we can, we can, like we do all this training with not necessarily falling, but not as much falling during the marathon. And I'm quite good in that. And if I think I can store my body very well before it, I should be able to get to a place very high in the marathon. But of course, few gels, but I do think the days before and getting that right more important than the actual day. And I might get quite a lot of hate for saying that, but I do think it is very important. Interesting. So there will be like a mix between the sports drink and the, the gels. Yeah, okay. Do you? Yeah. The only problem I have is some of the guys from DSM, the Africans, ahead of me, they do tend to steal my balls. So I need to make sure that doesn't happen. And do you roughly know how many grams per hour or just going purely by feel? Yeah. Just don't feel. I have no clue. I didn't, I genuinely didn't even know how many carbs were on a Morton pack until yesterday. And that's not even a lie. Okay. Then I probably know the answer to the next question. Do you have a specific carb loading strategy before the race? What before the race? I'm actually quite good. I eat like a lot of pasts. So I've, I've certain rules. The week of a race, I don't have any, I drink Pepsi every day. It's quite bad. I do, I love Pepsi. I stop that for a week. I don't be true to you. So you know, just buy from look so far. I don't. There is some science around it, I guess. And it's like, I don't really do that. What do people do? It's like the plain diet where they don't eat much vegetables, like meat the days before. But I just, the way I look at it is I do the exact same things I normally do in training, because it works for me. I don't change anything. The only thing I don't do is have a curry or minced steak before, right? That's it. And then, of course, I like start eating. Like before the half, I really, really focused on quite a bit of past of the day before, whereas I'll probably do that for like two or three days. But I mean, I've done all this training and everything. I haven't, like, fatigued to anything. So I think I've got that spawn. So yeah, so it's just eating when I'm hungry, I guess. Yeah, I guess it becomes that like natural, like, carb loading if you go down like in the volume. And don't you say so much carbs and eat this normal. I guess you're fuel up your, your carb, a car like your glycogen stores. Exactly that. And I always have to have a double Mars bar the night before is what. I don't know why. The Mars bar is there. It helps you run quick. And you mentioned before you wanted to be pretty windy on that day. But, but historically, how is the weather during London marathon? Generally, it could be snowing or sunny this week this year. The funny thing is, people are doing track races before London marathon in the UK. London marathon shouldn't be that late. I mean, Stockholm marathon seems crazy. How late it is. I do think it should be like around the time Berlin half is, like April, we just don't know what it's going to be like. Lastly, it was quite warm on the warm side. But at the end of the day, you have to be carb, and you just have to race the conditions. So yeah, so it's one of those if the conditions aren't say, if they were like similar to last year or like even worse, I might just go for placing as high as possible. Whereas if they are perfect, I'm going for that time. Yeah, yeah, it makes sense. But considering last year, have you done any heat training leading up to this race? I'm just wanting to go out, I guess, which for the one that was terrible there. I have a garage, to know really. It's all, it sounds so strange. Because I grew up in Hong Kong. I tell myself I'm good in the heat. I don't know if I still are. I think last year I still did quite well. Like, I was fourth-brit over the line in a fairly hot London. I do think I tend to do quite well with it. I've done some field testing myself when it comes to that because you know show now my wife. She's from Australia I can say that Jerry when we were up in Queensland where her mom lives right now, and we were running into heat She was not very good. I have to say for being an Australian. I think I I was quite a hit adapted then So I feel like I was a lot better, but Yeah, it's I think it's interesting. I know that cold Gibbons was really good in my London marathon last year I remember I talked to him and he had this like he'd blanket stuff that he used before for the race a couple of weeks before to get used to to heat cattle Yeah, it So last year I was in quite a bit of sauna But my iron level is actually dropped. They were they were like 30 or 40 And last year during the marathon build, but I was taking iron tablets While drinking milk, which completely stops absorption of it Whereas now it's over a hundred and that's literally introducing fit and sea I have a whole package of spinach taught to leave me a lot more like meat and stuff And I do think because there's like I know there's a lot of studies out the birds studies like showing if you could like the more you sweat The more you sauna your iron levels do drop So I'm trying to go into this marathon As healthy possibly I can be in terms of my See my blood supports. I think that will be more important for me running quicker than being more heat adapted So I'm looking at this race as a complete like you know other people like you said might be doing what's heat that stage I'm going purely on how can my blood be the healthiest they can be the strongest they can be to run quick So again, I feel like I'm going at this is completely different angle to most other guys. I think this is amazing I love to hear all this. I think it's so nice to hear how How good you're doing like with all everything to just make sure that you're fast and healthy. It's very And now three weeks out you have started to taper already a little bit So it's it's like I only have one double double run day this week So it's a double session tomorrow all the other doubles will just be on the cross-strait that like in my garage and Yeah, it's going to I'm probably going to do like 25 30 miles less this week Seeing the week next the following week and then the week of the race that will Probably mean my the week of the race including the marathon will probably be like 100k 110k So be like 50 60k before the race and considering I've done I did 220k last week. It's like quite a big reduction So it's like I've I've basically this week. I've just taken out the double runs and implemented them with very easy cross-straiting I do take I said someone it just means I can watch my own TV show without my girlfriend So yeah, just I like keeping that little like I go so easy. It's like one 10 heart rate You know, you just you just move the body then stretching off this. So it's just a it's almost habit basically And then race week take us through race week. How does that look like? So no Pepsi a lot be true juice We're in Cardiff we have the dog Katie's parents have six dogs, so we've taken one of them so It's actually quite good. So instead just sitting there I can like run in the morning and then take him out for like a walk in the evening So instead of just never think about my own thoughts What else and we're going to London I think on the Thursday evening probably goes to the hotel on the Friday and Yeah, a lot of Netflix writing some plans because I mean my friend do some coaching It's a tough one. It's it's like I feel like everyone says it almost the same thing You know just like relaxing everything it's almost boring. We're almost very boring when it comes to a table week. I don't have anything special really. I have a lot of sleep. I still sleep a lot Yeah, just get me to London now You do any like sessions and they're like on the Monday or Tuesday like a little session with some marathon kind of pace or I Think last year on the Wednesday I did like it was probably like a five six mile session So he still wants me to do I think it's actually a bit more than the normal person My coach has found out I can I can run well off quite intense sessions. I still need that sort of Tough of running during the week before big race That it won't be till Wednesday though. So be like Monday Monday or also Monday I don't run on a race week. I never run on the Monday of a race week So say that would just be cross-training Tuesday easy Wednesday will be more of a session Like you know a marathon taper session, but mine tends to be a bit bigger than most people's Thursday Friday just jogging the Saturday Thursday Friday will be just single jogging the Saturday I always double the date for race, but it could be 30 minutes and 15 minutes So like 15 20 minutes and evening pure. I don't know why I Generally, I'm not even a life full session. We did this and took me out once and I haven't I have not done it so sorry I always do it since And my coach and Joe she used to do it as well before big road races Yeah, I don't know it's always after like the meeting you know the meeting in Berlin We had with the elite meeting. I went straight after that like 15 20 minutes. So it's yeah, I don't I don't know why I do it And it's tried to have something after that 15 minutes or just easy I'll start in the morning. Yeah, so I'll go out like with the guys in the morning to do the strides then and then the 15 minutes It's it's literally like it could be five minute caves. Yeah, and then I do some like drills and stretching after I don't know why good knowledge here. It's a yes I really like to talk about the last week. I feel like it's slightly different Between real good runners. Yeah Yeah, it's it's yeah, I mean it's I don't I don't think it's because it's only my third marathon So I don't really I haven't really played around with each week I mean whenever I'm that 211 when I was pacing I went for 50k ride the day before I did a tempo session the Friday Because I wasn't supposed to bloody finish it So that's another so I can't I can't base my training off that So yeah, it's weird And then you said you were looking forward to after the race as well to maybe do some less running and more hanging out with friends and all That good good parts of the life, but do you have any goals for the fall or maybe long-term goals? It literally depends if I get into European team So we need to run the policy says you have to run sub two and I'm 30 So this is for Europeans. I don't know what it is for Sweden It might be similar time But you have to run the time yet to come top six of three guys already picked so it's full assessment my Hammond Mammond and Johnny Mellor so I basically have to break the time come top three Brit if I want to put my place forward And then after that is taught some another marathon. I think you can guys guess if I don't get in which marathon at the end of the year Let's talk for me and I can say if that is the marathon I'm thinking about And say if your Lucas runs really good on Sunday, but you don't want to be beaten by him. You have Evergreen John Lucas is in I will be in I think I could speak for everyone who was saying Santa Pol at that camp I think you're I think we're gonna try to do the same in November and I think you Everyone I think I speak for everyone now to say that you're more than welcome to join and maybe to sell Good motivation if your Lucas runs a very good time to see what he's doing the month before this Specific race said maybe both are you gonna write? I'll tell you I'll tell you off on that, so But yeah, so it depends if I don't enter European marathon team there's world road running champs in Copenhagen and I need to still break 60 on 30, but I put my cuz they take four guys from Britain and because I was top four I'm under the impression. You have to turn up the trials you have that you can get selected like the American system, but British athletes do tend to change depending on some athletes sometimes So I will want to like that Adam has a race in South Africa ended July So I might take him up on that and just go down there and just find so So any race is looking for a sub 61 30 guy. I will be there. I will go anywhere If the problem is that I have been southern hemisphere because it's there went compared to our summer up here I actually spoke to Jake Ran to Japan and said and I forgot are there any racers in Japan? He said do not come in June and July You know not in sub 65 because of the heat so Yeah, so it's they had that one got the gold coast half marathon in July in Australia better Maybe that's a long shot to go down to Australia and he's to work. So was he's the only problem is It's the the depth of athlete to go. Yeah, I could go and I could be solo that's the any problem But then the next year there could be six guys running that time. It just depends on the year. So But basically, I'm I'm all in to try and get a British fresh. I world road running euros. So And then like I said, there might be another marathon depending on how I do and some pacing opportunities But I haven't had my sights and on anything more than London. Oh, I will literally be able to I can message you to At 12 p.m. After learn a marathon telling you what I'm doing Then I just don't know yet. That's good. That's that's that's where the focus should be exactly Yes, exactly that and speaking of all these these distances which which one do you enjoy the most of the 5k to 10k have marathon marathon? See I love half. I think that half is the best distance ever. I'm a massive massive fan of it. I think it's just like he's like for all of three of us is like just over over the hour of running and you like You're not to like okay the weak half that you are tied in everything big hands sort of get back into training and everything And because we we all do thresholds we do double thresholds and they're normally longer than natural race Um, it's such a good distance I'm a big fan, but they don't really tend to have in major I know they have world road running champs apart from that this You know, there's no like I know there's a super series, but it's nothing compared to like the majors Um, and I think it's well like if you speak to the everyday runner The everyday runner doesn't like they're so scared of the marathon whereas when you talk to him about the half they love the half as well So I think for even just on a average person the half is just the best shout Um, also it's not too intense because the average everyday runner might think the fight and 10k to intense because it's just running that hard Where it's like the half I think it's just a perfect distance for every person And will the half be the the main focus going forward as well or do you think yeah? So I still think like I would love to run what like I mean in Britain Everyone wants to beat the meal at the minute in the meals The person who pushed us forwards so um in order to get there I do really really need to get my half quicker And so if I can get into the low 61s or even break 61 that might be next year's goal Then I can really push forward the marathon But I do need to still pick up my speeds and so that's why I'm doing this short stuff still Yeah, it's going to be very some very interesting Jake Smith performances for this year that we're looking forward to So it's uh very very nice to have a chat with you. We um we are with this is our first marathon tilted episode now With just free running Stockholm marathon so it's very very happy that you want it I mean if you are I'm like uh what when is Stockholm It's May isn't it May 30th Am I trying to get out there just a lot of Stockholm I'm gonna be good fun You should and beat you can beat try to beat John Lucas because I think he's gonna run as well He's running as well That was the goal that we were gonna run it together you know with he was just gonna do it just for fun You know because after Rotterdam he's like I'm not gonna be in good shape But you know he he had a Swedish girlfriend before so he was like I just want to be a part of it Did it I know I love the atmosphere so I just gonna I can go there with you and see how long I last you know Yeah, I'm already cuz um I have a good friend of mine. She's racing Rotterdam's world so um I've heard a lot about it I mean Rotterdam's quick so um I will be I will be at what's he called um At tracking John Lucas yeah I mean he runs I want a second quicker. Yeah We like your friends and let's see runs 206 207 which wouldn't surprise me Yeah, we're very much looking forward to this battle Jake thanks a lot for joining us Yeah, I'm looking forward to it. Hold you hold you off on the center of polar in November. I would be much. I would love that. Ah 100% that would be awesome Yeah, take care my man. Thanks a lot. Thanks a lot. Thank you. Take care All right, that was Jake Smith such a nice guy Jake is a real legend that is so nice to just hear him talk so He's a free spirit. I feel like he's just a hard worker and just Don't pay too much attention to for little like one percent or so just do the thing To the the big stuff maybe yeah, yeah, I first time for me talking to him But I've heard so many good things about him from you and it was nice to Yeah, get the same picture Yeah, yeah, it was really nice because we haven't spoken we haven't been speaking so much after After Berlin half marathon We were obviously like hanging out before the start like I was just holding his back for the first 10k and But then I was just yeah, he finished before me and you probably I haven't seen him since the fish so it's nice to you talk a little bit about the race and Yeah, he's feeling because yeah, he He felt like he was so strong, like just shedding away and like It was after all like 2930 we passed the 10k and it felt like he was just sewn to jogging oh wow Yeah, very exciting stuff and very exciting to see how he can perform in London. Yeah, definitely He is he's in good place. Yeah Yeah, I think it's interesting because I you know I see his stuff because he's one of these like when you can Star mark people on Strava so they come up more frequently So he is one of the few I haven't like a star mark because I feel as I said to him as well He's one of the guys I really look up to there is like slightly higher level than myself like that you like Him jocke of Siemens and you know that you you have the same kind of profile And you don't feel like they're in a crazy galaxy in front of you. You just feel like I want to see what these guys are doing that are running faster times than me, but I still feel like I can Be around their capacity for maybe do everything right exactly you can somewhat relate to them. Yeah, exactly exactly So it's fun to see you hear more like how the fourth process behind a training or yeah or or the not so so much you like structured But I guess his coach have a big picture thinking kind of how he strained their weaknesses and stuff like that. Yeah Yeah, very interesting. He has double threshold to you stay Some LT1 longer LT1 session on Thursday some v2 max session on Saturday and then a long run on Sunday. Yeah exactly exactly and I've seen that exactly as he said that it feels One of the loops that he's running a lot there in the card if that I've seen on straw. It's I've I looked it up and it is kind of A bad loop I have to say some of correct pretty much elevation As he said when he just kind of look at heart rate and I don't pay attention to the pace so much so Yeah, very interesting. I The aim is to I guess You might more people of kind of Jake's abilities to just discuss how they Training front of a marathon. Mm-hmm. It's so interesting to hear how other runners approach the marathon and Yeah, you can always learn something. Yeah. Yeah, or a lot of things and I like to knew Jake John Lucas the Jake Smith battle as well. Mm-hmm. Boom. We have to keep everyone posted about how that goes And we've been really fun Probably people understood that there was serval and yeah, we were talking about so that would be What a setup. Oh, yeah, or if Jake decides to run Stockholm marathon. Oh, that would be really good as well for sure. Oh wow It's yeah So yeah, that was the first episode on the road to Stockholm marathon episode 80 Thank you Jake for joining us and thank you Victor for being such a nice guy So you're in a not so fun place right now, and thank you for being a very nice guy yourself And they're only representative from runice FM running a marathon in this marathon vlog. So Yeah, we we have our own little parts in this This puzzle yeah, and thanks to all you listeners for listening to another episode of runice FM good stuff You