The Hidden Nutrient Deficiencies Affecting Your Child's Brain, Mood & Behaviour with Lucinda Miller

Welcome to the Race Podcast. I'm Coral and I'm Natalie and we're here to help you raise your game whilst raising the next generation. We want to help put the power in your hands and inspire you to live your life the way you choose. Ready to raise some questions? Or so away? Hello everyone and welcome to another episode of the Race Podcast. Today we're joined by Lucinda Miller, an actress, a path and children's health expert who's been working with families for years to support children's wellbeing from a really holistic root cause perspective. She's the founder of a clinic called Natchdok and the author of Brain Brilliant, where she explores how nutrition, lifestyle and environment can impact children's focus, mood and development. Lucinda was so excited to have you with us today. Natalie, Coral, it's so wonderful to be here. So can you start by telling us a little bit about yourself, your journey and what you're most passionate about? Oh, well, I've been practicing naturopathy, nutrition, herbal medicine for around 30 years. I've got three beautiful kids who are now adults, which is extraordinary. And so I've seen the full journey of raising three beautiful humans through using nutrition and natural remedies. So I'm quite proud that my son, who's just turned 18, has never had antibiotics. Wow, that's incredible. Yeah, that's incredible. Or ibuprofen. Wow. We've been very lucky with this health. We haven't had big dramas, but I'm sure that has set him up for a strong life going forward. And yeah, what makes me get up in the morning? Well, we see a lot of very complex kids who are struggling with their neurological health, their development, a lot of them are non-speaking, a lot of them have seizures, and a lot just have significant emotional dysregulation. And I'm really struggling to navigate life. And so we can help them in so many ways. And it's a way that we've developed over the last 30 years, my team, myself, of ways to really help to regulate them and help them to shine. Amazing. So your clinic is led by naturopaths, nutritionists and functional medids and practitioners. And you tell us what the most common symptoms are that you're currently seeing in children. So I would say the big one is high anxiety. Okay. Alongside OCD and emotional shutdown where the kids are finding it impossible to leave the house, go to school, socialise. And that means the parents are stuck to. This can be preceded by very poor sleep patterns. So I think the beginning of this is usually you're seeing kids finding it difficult to get to sleep, waking up a lot in the night. And therefore, you know, I guess a overall resilience is slowly deteriorating. And then that infects their mental health. And I think one of the barriers that you then see when there's been poor sleep and dysregulation is a shutdown of the ability to be able to consume nutritious foods. So therefore you see this Vasi eating. Sometimes it's arphid, which is, you know, really proper fear of food and eating three, four, five foods only. That's what my daughter has. So I was actually going to ask you a bit more about that. Well, that would be really good to get into that because it's a really difficult thing to navigate, but it is possible. Yeah. Okay. So you, as you said, you kind of work with a lot of families, you know, with ADHD and kind of autistic individuals. How do you support these families? Like if they come to you, what are you kind of seeing? What are you testing for in clinic? Really good question. I'll start with my story and why I really got into this specifically because I think it would really put in context. So my husband and I are both diagnosed with ADHD and we were shortly after we kind of got together. Okay. And then so we assumed that at least one of our children would have ADHD to and in fact two out of three have it and one is dysplexic to. So it's the one with ADHD and dysplexia that we were most concerned about. He's our eldest and eldest child is our experimental child as well. It's, you know, we don't really know, we can't really benchmark them against others, you know, even, you know, against our friends, children or similar age children. It's very hard to know where their development really is. We thought he was a bright little kid. He was talking early, walking early, but when he got to school, they said, he's got some serious delays here. He might need to go to special school. And we were like, yeah, okay, this is just not quite adding up. You know, it's just kind of that this is a very spiky profile. And they said he's too young for assessments. So we can't say if he's specifically ADHD at that point, you really had to be seven or eight to have those assessments. And he was only four or five at the time. So I knew about nutrition. I'd always fed him really well. I very much followed, you know, that high nutrient dense foods, you know, the eggs, the livers, the, you know, all the good foods back then. Oh, yeah. Oh, yeah. He had fish oil from six months. Amazing. You know, we really went for it. And, but he still wasn't, you know, there's still things that were out of whack. And I think that's where so many people will say, well, you know, actually we do feed our kids really well. And you probably do. But there's still something missing. There's still something that doesn't seem that mother's instinct, that parent's instinct, that, you know, your child could be thriving better than they really are. So I had been, by that point, been seeing a few kids diagnosed with autism or non-speaking or pretty kind of like developmentally delayed, you know, kids of four or five who had the development age of six, eight months, baby, you know, that sort of level. So I knew that wasn't him. But I did know that there was something going on. Also, he had a long term gut issue that the pediatricians were, I'm going to be completely frank, utterly rubbish with. We had tried with things, but we hadn't really got there. And I, you know, we'd read, I'd explored the whole sort of idea of the gut brain connection. So I took the plan and I thought, I'm going to do some tests. I'm going to find out exactly what's going on. And this is where we did spend around £1,000 at that point, which was quite a lot of money, especially then. And we looked at stool tests because obviously his poo was wrong. We looked at something called a metabolomics, which is organic acid, amino acid. It's a urine test looking at about 80 different vitamins, minerals, etc. We did a hair test, which looks at heavy metals and minerals. Those are the three tests I think we may need it. One was sort of like fatty acids. And that was actually quite funny because I had been hearing so much from three actually. Yeah. Too much of a story. So that was quite funny. But anyway, we got those back. And because I've been to this conference about autism and this, I saw these parents lituring their kids emerge out of the ether. And I thought, I've got to try this. Yeah. Got to try this. Anyway, the two things that came back for his results. One was that he did have a parasite in the gut. And I think he picked it up. He went to a little day nursery when he was quite small. And from that point, his tummy was not right. So I think it was probably found in the stool sample. Yeah. Okay. And since then, I have seen only one piece of research about this. And it was on adults, not children, to say that it really affects exact function and organisation. And that's dyspaxia. So interesting, which I thought was really interesting. And the second thing was that we had moved from London to the countryside to a lovely old cold house. We were renovating. And we found extremely high levels of lead in his hair. And we had been sanding a cupboard in his room. We think that that must have had lead in the old, old, old, yeah. Anyway, and that of course can reduce IQ and, you know, and can mimic some of these aspects. So I thought, whoa, okay, we've got some stuff to do. Unexpected, both of those. But everything else was fine. No, food intolerances. Yeah, we did a food intolerance test. Food intolerances, vitamins and minerals perfect. You know, he was a well fed kid. And so anyway, we used this kind of parasite kind of plens and some detox stuff to help with his lead. And I was expecting this to be a very slow burn. I know kid, you know, within three days he woke up. He got himself dressed. He was getting himself some drag first. It got his home workout. This was not my child. My child was the one you were chasing around the house, trying to get one sock on their feet, you know, giving them food in the car on the way to school, complete scatter, brain. And I said, "What's going on?" He goes, "My brain's not playing hide and seek anymore. I can concentrate." -Wow. And I was like, "Whoa, because he's really articulate." -Yeah. -This is what I loved about him. He still is incredibly articulate. And then I sort of, you know, we were chatting over, you know, over the next few months. And he said, "It's like my brain's in a game of hide and seek, and I've got six boys to find before my brain works like the others." And every couple of months he go, "I can see another one around the corner." "Found him." And at the end he said, "I've got one more to find, Mum." But so do the other boys. Can I stop now? -Oh! -Oh! And during that time he started making friends, his tick went away. Academically he went flying. Um, he, you know, and. Yeah, honestly he went to his senior school and no one even flagged near a diversity. You know, there was just nothing. And then he went to uni, he's got a good degree, he's got a lovely job, he's got a lovely girlfriend. Life's good. -If you've been following us for a while, Yolosin has talked about JS Health multiple times. And that's because we genuinely keep coming back to their products. So we're really happy to have them as a sponsor this season. JS Health is an Australian wellness brand by clinical nutritionist Jess Sepple, born from her passion to improve women's lives through nutritional science. The two products I keep recommending to everyone right now are the scalp serum and the eye serum. The scalp serum has become a non-negotiable in my routine. I apply it a few times a week and I've really noticed a difference in the thickness and condition of my hair. Whether you're postpartum or running on empty, hair health is one of the first things to go. So having something that actually works feels like a really big deal. -Same. And the eye serum is the one I find myself telling people about constantly. My under eyes look so much brighter and way less puffy. -I'm also keen to try the more recent metabolism range. The lean plus creating powder and the bare-roam plus capsules. I've read really great reviews online, so I will be adding to cart, eth up. JS Health has given our raise listeners an exclusive discount. Use the code "Rays@Checkout" for 20% of your order. Head to jshealthvitamins.com and we've put the link in the show notes below. -And yeah, he's still got ADHD. He knows he has. But in a good way, in a positive way. And I think when we hear about these super skills, superpowers that is so much to the brain, I couldn't do my job without ADHD. I have to see these incredibly complex cuts and think and listen to a whole health history and piece together really complex test results and go, "This is what we've got to do." And unless you have that adaptable brain, you wouldn't be able to do it. So it's a problem solving brain. It's great. -You actually did a post-recently that I saw that said that there are often, you often find seven nutrients that ADHD brains are deficient in. Can you maybe tell us more and a little bit more about that? -Yeah, so there's a lot. I do go into this in a lot more detail in brain brilliance, but gosh, yes. So the main nutrient, which I have mentioned already, is that has been the most researched when it comes to the developing brain overall, whether it's ADHD, autism, dyslexia. And that is omega-3 fatty acids, which comes from eating oily fish, whether it's sardines, salmon, anchovies, prawns. And all of those help with eye development and brain development. Literally, the 60% of the brain is fat, and about 90% of that fat is DHA, which helps this brain to develop. It's essential during pregnancy, even pre-pregnancy, breastfeeding, and also for children. Because, and it helps all sorts of things, it helps the whole central nervous system to catch up. So even with bed wetting, for instance, that's the sort of thing that it can help with. And Dr. Alex Richardson, who you love, you should interview her. She's based Oxford University. This has been her life long work. And she has a lot of neurodiversity in her family. So she's really passionate about this. She's written a lot of papers, and she has found that if you give these kids omega-3, whether it's through diet, or whether it's through supplements, it can make a significant difference quite quickly within a month, six weeks. Wow. And we see that too. And it's a really good first step. Now, obviously, if your child has arphid, I think it really is. I'm not sure. I'm just kidding. A nice piece of teriyaki salmon or whatever it is. It's just not going to happen, right? And this is where there's so many people out there on Instagram going, you don't need supplements, blah, blah, blah, but actually, when you are dealing with pediatric, when you're dealing with children whose neurological systems have shut down, you need stealth ways to get these in, because you can't just wait and hope that one day, they might open their mouth to a piece of salmon. Right? So this is where these supplements are really helpful. Summer easier than others. And so you're going to say, do you have any that you recommend? Oh, we have tons. We have everything from gummies through to lemon flavored kind of liquids. You know, we will find a way. We will find a way. And that's what we do on Instagram. We do a lot of DMs, helping people. Just they go, we can't fix all their problems on DMs. But what we can do is we can say, some of us is, I'm looking for a fish or my child will have this, but not this. And then we can find the right one. Amazing. Does that make sense? It is most likely to be acceptable or a way round it. So one of my most popular blogs is just a way to hide supplements. You know, that's what parents want. That's how we have to get creative. Do you like that? I like how sneaky can you be? And I think it's so easy in the adult by hacking functions in the world to go seek perfection. And you can't do that with kiddies. You know, at the end of the day, if it goes in an ice lolly, goes in a spoonful of Nutella, you know, it's in an ice cream. Yeah, ice cream's good. Actually, ice cream works really well. Obviously you can do homemade ice cream. That's what we can do. All sorts of them. You can get, so it's healthier. Collagen Pardas and all sorts of things. So, and organic eggs and, you know, you can make ice cream super healthy. So, it's all possible. But again, you know, some parents are not at that stage to be able to do that. You could put egg yolk in there. Yeah. Is it all milk? Ice cream is like a lot of my idea. So omega three is really important. One is I'm always like parents to have an understanding of what they can do without needing to do the testing that we offer within the clinic. Because of course, we'd love to see everybody and help all the kids. But at the end of the day, we know that's not everybody's, you know, story for whatever reason. You know, a lot of parents are just, they have no bandwidth to do much more than trying one supplement or something. So, one of the ways you can understand if your child does need omega three is obviously if they're not eating any. Yeah. That's quite a good indicator. The second one is very dry skin. Okay. Especially chicken skin at the top of the arms. It's often quite bumpy and like almost like sandpaper. Okay. And sometimes you see it on their cheeks. Sometimes you see it on their bellies that opposite their legs. It's sort of the bumpy, rough skin. So that's a good indicator. If X must got very bad, if Asma's got very bad, then again, those are dry inflamed. And so what the omega three is doing is bringing down inflammation. Okay. And in the kids that will take small capitals, we can go in with different versions of omega three. There's something called SPMs, specialised pro-resolving mediators. And they're particularly good for the very high inflammatory kids. We see kids with a presentation called PAN's pandas, which is where an infection can trigger high anxiety, ACD ticks. Sometimes psychiatric symptoms. And that's where if they will swallow a small caplet, that is very powerful and very good. So there are different levels of omega three as well. Interesting. And the oldest and has had a tick, it kind of comes and goes, but I always notice when she's been exposed to too many chemicals or been in a swimming pool a lot of the chlorine. Or even sometimes if somebody sprays like a Mr. Muscle spray, I notice that she starts kind of responding more, but I hadn't actually thought about getting her tested, which is ridiculous. Really come and you think of it in omega three as well. So that would link to the second and probably one of the most deficient minerals that we come across all the time that help with ADHD and other aspects is magnesium. So magnesium works on about 300 pathways in the body and one of them, well multiple parts of this, but is basically working on muscles and twitches, so ticks and twitches and so forth. Heres is like a cough, so she just clears her throat. And I notice it comes up when she's more tired or exposure or yeah. That's interesting. That's interesting. So it may not be a magnesium story, but a lot are are little javelinatry movements and yeah, voluntary movements. And often there's restless legs or growing pains, sometimes there's constipation. What with magnesium? Yeah, for magnesium. Neasantrefficiency. Very sporty kids. So those, you know, the ones, the ADHD kids who are super hyper who are always, you know, they love their running and their football and they're really, really kind of like active. They can sweat out magnesium and that can sort of add more layers to it. Magnesium helps with blood sugar balance too. So the kids that get very hungry, prior to you miss in if they're missing a meal or wake up in the middle of the night two or three in the morning, that's often a blood sugar low. So magnesium is very good for sleep as well. And it's topical magnesium as powerful as taking it internally. This episode is sponsored by one of our very favorite brands, Sweetbee Organics. And if you follow us, you'll know we have spoken about this particular product for years now as we both genuinely love it. It's Sweetbee, Sweet Sleep, Magnesium Butter. It's a beautiful whipped body butter infused with magnesium that you simply massage into your skin before bed. It's become part of mine and my girls evening ritual because it really impacts the quality of our sleep. And what I love is that it's not just functional, it feels so luxurious too. The texture is beautiful and leaves your skin feeling incredibly soft. So you're getting the benefits of magnesium alongside deep hydration. 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We'll leave all the details in the show notes below. I've read but I haven't found actual evidence and I like to work with evidence but what I've read and I think it probably it sounds about right is that an Epsom sort bath or the topical magnesium quite a lot of the topical magnesium. We're talking about one little spray but you know you're actually rubbing it properly in. Would probably be about 50 to 70 milligrams of magnesium. Whereas a child, the maximum a child would have under the age of 12 is 280 milligrams. So it's a little bit and it can really help because magnesium is not that well absorbed through the gut so actually if it's going in through the skin you're going to get the benefit. So I think it's a really good way to start choosing the dark fit. It's interesting when you said that about the restless legs because my daughter used to do that and all through the night her legs would almost like go in the air and slam back down. Absolutely. But over the last couple of months I've been rubbing magnesium into her legs and feet we do massages and actually I haven't noticed that that happened. So it was more I hadn't even thought of it. But her restless legs used to be you know they'd like thrash around and it was crazy but I haven't noticed that that's happened in actually quite a while. So if anyone's got restless legs yeah. Going to be for rubbing in. So my favorite is Epsom sorts and I'll explain why because you were talking about your daughter in chemicals and chlorine exposure. So most magnesium that you rub into the skin so the lotions and the rubs and the sprays and the soaring and all those they tend to be magnesium chloride which can be a little bit itchy for some so some don't like it. That's they don't like that feeling. I'm not anti-it-tool I'm just saying that that's partly why it doesn't work for every kid. And it's a very good form of magnesium but the one that is in Epsom salt is magnesium sulfate. First of all it's not itchy so even a child with quite bad exma for instance and very sensitive skin can have an Epsom salt bath. But as I said it's magnesium sulfate and there is a pathway in many neurodivergent people. You don't have to be neurodivergent to have this it can be in you know it's a genetic thing generally but something called sulfation. Sulfation is one of the livers ways of detoxing certain chemicals. And so magnesium sulfate which is in Epsom salts helps with sulfation and therefore allows the body to clear some of those toxins and one of them is chlorine. So what some parents do is they will after the child has been swimming they'll put them into an Epsom salt bath when they get home. Amazing. Well we've got swimming lessons tomorrow. So I know I'm done after and you can also buy I've only found one relatively good one but it is on the internet where there is an Epsom salt cream where you can rub it in straight you know you give them the shower after the swimming and then you rub it in. So if you weren't going straight to have a bath yeah. So you could get that again. Even on yourself because I work even on holidays when we were in Costa Rica I found a place with a salt water pool because I can't stand going and chlorine knowing obviously what it does. Anywhere. So even for me I'm like if we have to go swimming yeah I can stick that on afterwards. Absolutely. Amazing. Yeah I mean I think you know there are just so many tips that we've learned over the years that my team are able to pass on to the parents. You know these are the sorts of things that parents say they say they're normally okay except after okay you know swimming or whatever and then we just pick your brain all day. Yeah absolutely. What's tips like these that you can just really implement into your normal everyday life and it just feels really easy when you say you're like okay yeah it's great. It's so funny I do lots of talks at schools and I say to the parents you know who puts Epsom salts in their baths and two thirds of the room put the hand up I say do you put in your kids baths and like two people put their hand up for a good come on your kids. So I did this right from the start when they were tiny and it's sweet my daughter who's in her early 20s now she used to say when she was little I always have happy dreams when I have an Epsom sort of bath because it puts you into this because magnesium helps you to make this gaba. Yeah. It makes you feel cool calm and relaxed and sort of zen like yeah okay. She even took a sack to university because it helps with sports injuries I mean all sorts of things it's brilliant with big fans of Epsom I put it in my girls bath but I was wondering actually what do you think about clay in baths. Yeah. Yeah. Quite a question. Yeah. Quite a question. So I we have used those over the years when we know that there's a toxic picture. Yeah. So as I said one of the main things that we do is run a hair test and that will look for heavy metals things like lead mercury, aluminum and and how many. Obviously you know how you know what you do when you find those and one of the things is is the Epsom sort bars and the Ventanite clay bars and there are different different clays you can get and I think it's just a really easy way of doing it you know because there's no way I was going to go down some sort of scary route of hardcore detoxification with my child you know when I knew that he had lead we had to give super calm so we did lots of bars and things like that and it's brilliant yeah actually brilliant yeah because you make it fun we call them mud baths yeah absolutely absolutely why not go through it yeah so sorry it's sweet went off an attention would you go through you have a way yeah my two's and the amakers and then so then I think I'll talk about iron yes oh this is also something that I saw you post about recently as well where people struggle to if they're low in iron even though they're supplementing yeah yeah yeah you have this that yeah so I write a blog every week which goes in I news letter which is called healthy bites and I go into a proper deep dive okay so it's really evidence-based you know there's at least 20 references which I think is really important because our world because we're not medical you know people go is this really you know my doctor's saying something different okay so yes low iron is something which is probably the biggest epidemic in the world in terms of especially women because we bleed each month yeah and when you women have very heavy bleeds and we're being encouraged to eat plant-based foods some people have taken that narrative others haven't but you know if you are plant-based and eating a lot of carbohydrate and so forth annual bleeding heavily each month it's really hard to get 18 milligrams of iron each day so yes there are a lot of women going around with low iron but there are also lots of kids going around with low R and T. And iron is the most abundant mineral in your central nervous system. So if you're a little bit low in iron, the wheels start falling off. And what's really important for ADHD is that you need tyrazine, which comes from eating meat and eggs and fish and so forth. And that needs to be converted into dopamine. And guess what? Converts it into dopamine. Iron. Okay. So it's super hard to bring it up. And you know, a lot of women will go to the doctor get a prescription and you know, then their tummy shuts down because they feel sick and constipated and it's just awful. But luckily there are now more and more supplements available, which are using the collated forms, which are much easier on the belly. And then they've got the co-factors, they've got the vitamin C, they've got the B12, they've got the folate and they're the good methylated forms. And it's, you know, and women are really seeing a difference, which is great. And the kids, you know, there are, again, there are kiddie supplements you can get, easy sprays that taste quite nice to fruity sprays. Yeah. You don't have to taste like blood. And yeah. I think iron can make a massive difference to a child. That often when you compare them with their siblings, the neurodivergent child within your family or with their friends, their peers, they will look sheet white. There will be a different tone to their skin. And we see this a lot. And it's almost like a waxy kind of, it's just a different, it's like, it's like, it's like, it's so pale. Yeah, it was so pale. And you're comparing your arwie alive. Like the kids almost like, yeah, she's like, yeah, yeah. Yeah, absolutely. Yeah. So I get to talk about China Doll in a minute, because that's even more interesting. Okay. So iron tends to be pale. If you pull down that eyelid, instead of it being a lovely raspberry pink here, it's a pale pink. And that's a good indicator that you can go in with some iron, whether it's iron retreats, but if they're offered, it might need to be a supplement. Yeah, she's never touched meat. You've never been able to do it. So it's, you know, it's hard to get that level up with her. 100%. Yeah. Super hard. Yeah. And then this pala, this pale pala, it can be iron, but it's often a complex picture of not just iron, but also a combination of low zinc and sometimes low copper. But most of the time in the kids that we see, they tend to be high copper, low zinc. And when a child is high copper, low zinc, they tend to have quite significant mood swings. They find the emotional regulation is really, really challenging. They're happy one moment. And they are literally in a rage the next for no apparent reason. They can literally be sitting at a table, happy as anything. And the next moment they are, I mean, literally we have families with the kitchen knives out in two seconds. It is these are the kind of situations we're dealing with and it's really, really heartbreaking. And the parents are so distressed and social services don't seem to be that interested, which is extraordinary. So it's so interesting, isn't it, that you can almost just from those two deficiencies have like a profile of what someone is like? 100%. So there is a specific condition that is very, very common in neurodiversity. It will, you don't need to be neurodivision to have it, but it's very common in the families. And I'll explain and it's to do with zinc and the zinc copper balance. So. And I talk about it a lot in bone brilliance because it is something I'm super passionate about. It's called cryptopiral and it's enough to do with Superman tonight, right? Essentially, it's where you wee out, you pee out more zinc and vitamin B6 than you can possibly eat in your diet unless you are an oyster, Easter or something like that. Right. Okay. Which most kids are not. And this is not a gene that you can identify in a genetic panel, but it is a test you can do through urine. It's very affordable, very easy to do. 10 mil of you. We that's all you need to be able to and we get results back in two or three weeks. Cryptopiral when you are, it's a child that is essentially spiraling downhill slowly. So as a little one, they're pretty robust, pretty happy, pretty, you know, like no questions about their development. And then the sort of, you know, two and three, lots of colds and coughs and fussy eating kicks in and they seem to decline. And then often sort of schools start flagging them for behavioral issues and, you know, and they're just difficult to live with. You're walking around them as if on eggshells. And then you get to the teen time where they are, you know, the oppositional difficult rebellious types who often are drawn to, you know, the exciting things in life. And then as an adult, that can draw towards addictions, eccentricity, but utter brilliance as well. So you often have a super skill, the thing that really shines. So they could be amazingly artistic, musical, amazing on the stage, you know, incredible at maths or something, but the rest of the life is chaos, you know. Anyway, this is a profile that we see a lot in the families that we work with. And the parents go, oh my god, that was my dad. You know, he was an autistic, he wasn't ADHD, but he was really eccentric and utterly brilliant. So nice, and he found it because I thought about your dad, but he was just like, and yeah, and, you know, I've seen this in our wider family for sure, you know, I, and so I think that's why I can relate to it so much. And anyway, the most amazing thing is if you know you have this, then supplementing the zinc and a little bit of B6, you don't need to go over the top and we're very careful with that because it's actually shifted six to eight weeks. You're seeing the beginnings of this child coming out of the ether. And I think the three main, so there was masses of research done on this in the sort of 60s. Then it got parked because psychiatric medications came in. And then it's being revisited, mainly in Australia over the last few years. So kind of this, this void of research in between. So that's why people often go, well, there's not enough evidence, but it's all coming out again now. It's not one of those things that you hear considering the profound effects. It's not one of those things you've heard. I've never heard of it. No, no. Anyway, it's utterly brilliant. So the three main indicators are highly selective eating, restricted eating. So very, very particular about what they will and won't eat. And that could be very, very, very specific. And it could be because there's the smell, the taste. So it might be, it's not that they don't like chicken, it's they don't like that type of chicken. And it could be the brand. You know, it's that sort of very, very, very specific. They tend to be very withdrawn. So they're the ones that want to doom scroll, want to be on their, you know, just ones who want to be in their room away from the rest of the family. And it's that walking around on excels, that roller coaster. And anyway, as I said, I'm not saying it fixes everything for sure. I wish it did. But if it's there, it's definitely a very important piece in the, in, in the picture. And I think what you can do is once you've got that sink level up, then because sinks the second most abundant mineral in your central nervous system, your neurological system is better balanced. And then finding food, taste nice, smells nice, feels nice. So they're going to broaden their diet. Once you've got about a diet in, that's just going to help the neurological system again. Zinc helps to make this GABA, which helps you feel cool, calm or relax, so you're less anxious. So overall, and then they start to grow, you know, because they're from their skin, you know, small. So they're just generally just happy and it's great. It's the most amazing thing, but they have one of the indicators in this way. They came back to China doll. They have China doll skin. So they're the one in the family who doesn't tan. They're the one, you know, it's beautiful. They're often utterly beautiful children. It's taro. And it's great. It's like a perfect skin. Almost getting emotional because I like, actually hope that she has this because it's all my life. Because it's all my life. You can do. Yeah. Beautiful teeth, beautiful skin, shiny eyes. You know, this is where the difference is, is they don't look sick. They might be like a bit pale, but it's going to look pale. She's got the biggest, clearest, but I know. Oh, yeah, honestly. Honestly, often they're red-headed or blonde, you know, but not necessarily. You know, let's see. We're going to do this. Okay. Actually, okay. We're going to make her. Yeah. So yeah, we've covered I make a three magnesium, iron, zinc, so with regards to zinc in particular, can you, is this something you could get within like a trace mineral drop or do you recommend a specific type of sub? And obviously it's completely dependent, depending on what the child will take. So trace minerals can have up to I know 72, 84 different minerals and nutrients and co-factors and things, depending on which one you get, you know, and you obviously got things like Himalayan salts and so forth which again have a lot of these minerals in very, very small amounts. Okay, so not enough to make it in the right time. So I tend to go in with straight zinc, but the thing is zinc drops hardly taste. I can get liquid ones, liquid ones and what's great is the kind of, this is not for everybody, but essentially if they're low in zinc, they probably can't taste the drops and once the levels are up, it'll taste a little bit metallic. So you could be puts this, which I love, I love this, it's basically you can be sneaking them into the Apiduce or whatever, every day for three months and then all of a sudden they get, "Eh, mummy, what have you done with the Apiduce?" and you're like, "Oh, they're up today, yeah." And you can calm down now. It's so fascinating, isn't it? Yeah, the body's so clever, so clever. So yeah, so trace minerals are great and we often, I would say that very, very often what we will do is when we have a child that is, let's go down the orphan picture, you know, of super highly restrictive and so forth, we would probably go in with zinc drops and a multiple mineral that is essentially a trace mineral. Okay, to balance that out. To balance that a bit, but also because I don't know if you've ever experienced this, but if you're very dehydrated, everything tastes and feels weird in the mouth. And so often what we do is, and the kids are often putting non-food items in their mouth, they're putting, you know, they're chewing on their collars and their calves and putting fidgets in their mouths and, you know, they're just, but they're not putting real food in their mouth. And that's often an indicator of a broader low mineral picture, especially zinc and iron. Yeah, yeah, yeah, interesting. Which we see a lot of. Yeah, yeah, so often when they're low in iron and zinc, they will often have picker too. And once you get the iron zinc up, the picker starts to go away, which is great. Yeah, awesome. Yeah, it's just really nice to know, isn't it, that there are things you can do to help because we literally had a conversation coming in. Yeah, I won't go into too much detail, but you were like, I need some help. So specifically in a lot of the things that you've just mentioned. So it might not change everything, but even a percentage of it being easy to do. I think as parents of, especially autistic children, there's so much energy and patience and new approaches and new things that you're kind of researching and trying to make a difference and support them in the best way. 100% better ebbs and flows. And we were going through a really amazing season where I thought like everything was going really well, but these last few months, things have really regressed. And it's been really challenging and really hard to kind of figure out. It's that applied guesswork, isn't it? Because they can't communicate necessarily, you know, she can speak, but she can't say what's going on in her body. No, but I can see. I think, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, so you need a task. Yeah, she might even say to anything, if she's got any issue, whether it be mental physical, she'll say I'm hungry. Yeah. So it's like her, she can't, it's her pain or reference towards, you know, going on in the body. So anyway, yes, we've just been having such a hard time and it's been, that's why I've kind of got emotional because I'm like, I just feel like I need to help her. And that's just feels like such a straightforward thing that I can do. So even hearing you say, like, what's on the other side of that if you just give them, you know, this, vitamin, a mineral that they're deficient in, it's like, wow, okay. Yeah. So the other thing to think about, because at the moment we're in May, and if it's been over the last few months, vitamin D, yeah, during the winter. Yeah. So we store vitamin D, the average person stores vitamin D for about three months. So if we're getting it from the sunshine, and yes, we've had a little bit of sunshine over the last couple of months, but very, very little. You know, really the main sun was last August and September. So say the last sun she got was September, then you got October, November, December, by January, you're completely low. And every single cell in the body has a vitamin D receptor. It's like a plug. So it affects your big toe, your brain cells, everything. So when our vitamin D levels are low, our immune systems low, our bones become weaker, but also equally, our mood is low. And so it could be something like that. It could just be that she's a little bit low in that. Again, vitamin D, you can get properly tasteless drops. Yeah, you can. And you know, again, I think what is really good is that in the UK and pretty much everywhere, there are these RDAs, which you're, you know, recommended daily amounts, which are on the label. And if you stick to those as someone that isn't under professional, it's going to help. But these RDAs are very basic. Okay. And I am going to say something, this is not controversial. It is true, but it just is just sums up how nutrition has not been prioritized in human health. So back in the 70s, they discovered that we needed vitamin D. And that in the UK, we were not getting enough because of zero sun shine during the winter. So they did lots of research in human health to work out how much vitamin D we needed. And they published recommendations. But they put the decimal place in the wrong place. No. So the paper came up with 400 international units as the RDA. It should have read 4000. Oh wow. And it has not been changed since. Despite many people trying. Wow. Now I'm not saying dive in with 4000 straight away. It's quite a good idea to have an understanding of whether a child is low or not. And a typical baby can have up to 1500 for six or eight weeks if you know they're low. A toddler, it's two and a half thousand sort of. Childs, I know, four to ten, ish can have 3000 and you know, three to 4000. And then from 12, obviously, you're an adult in terms of supplements. So again, that could be 4000. So I'm not saying taken forever. I wouldn't want to take that all year round that level. But still, it just makes you think these RDAs are not kind of that spot on for today, especially with ultra processed foods depleting us all. And I'm sorry. I'm not having the nutrients. Absolutely. 100%. So I think they are good to be cautious because you don't want anyone to get over the top. And it is important to be guided. But ten times the amount is quite significant. My elderly aunt, she's 85 and she has, she's in significant pain with osteoporosis. And the doctors have given her calcium with vitamin D. There's only 400 intonation units in that. Well, I went to a nutritional dentist the other day and she said the main thing she recommends to every single patient and what she's seeing in children who are having, you know, decayed teeth is vitamin D. She was at everybody and he used to be taking so much more. And she was like, it's the first thing I recommend to anybody who's got new tooth problems as well. Absolutely. Absolutely. So anyway, so that's really important. So I'm going to sort of then another really important nutrient which a lot of people don't know about is called colean. Yes. I think you know, right? Colean. A little bit. Carole. It's good for liver health, isn't it? So colean comes from eating eggs and liver and so forth. And it's really important for making something called acetyl colean. And acetyl colean helps with working memory processing, learning the ability to grab information, keep it in the brain and remember it. And that is so many kids, they just have this poor working memory poor processing skills. And then they're told they're dyspraxic, dyslexic, acetyl HD. And if you could help with that, that'd be great. So that's why eating eggs and liver is so important. It's really hard to get kids to eat liver, but you can get in the bolinase, you can, you know, liver pate and things like that. It is possible. But eggs again, you know, whether it's egg pasta, you know, egg in the post. I've been hearing a lot recently that, obviously, most of the nutrients are in the yolk, but some people are saying that they can be allergic to the white and not the the yolk. I don't know whether you think just the whole leg is beneficial. So in terms of children and allergies, it tends to be egg white allergy. Right. Where's the yolk? It tends to be okay. It's quite difficult not to have any of the white and the yolk. It doesn't mean to really split it properly. But yes, but again over time, it is, I'm not saying for every child, it's not every child's story, but in many cases an egg allergy, once you mature the gut microbiome and the gut lining and really work on that, then they can often start to tolerate and they can go up that egg ladder. Okay. So it is possible over time in many cases. Yeah. But coolean is super, super important, as I said, for the brain. And you have body bio on recently. Yeah. And you know, she's got her PC, yeah, oil and so forth. And so this is why she puts it in because it helps with cell fluidity and the cell membrane. Because what's really important is, I think we all worry about our bloodstream and we've got enough nutrients in our blood. But that's just a transport system. The most important thing is flexible cells to be able to get those nutrients into the cells and to create that mitochondrial energy. Yeah, I'm so pleased that the kind of cells are having their moment because I feel like nobody's spoken about them in it. They're really kind of being discussed and the importance. 100%. 100%. And this is why, you know, gosh, we're so lucky still to have an NHS and it's a bit fragile, but we still do. But blood was not going to give the answers to your children's issues because blood, as I said, things only stay in the blood for a certain amount of time and then they get deposited into different, well, it's into bone, it's into cell and so forth. But I think that's what's so nice, even you talking about the different tests that you guys offer in clinic because blood tests for kids is so hard. And really traumatic in certain situations. So the fact that you can do a hair test or urine or a sore one. Yeah, it's like, but even some of the blood tests that we do do for, you know, if it's really complicated. So if there's severe brain information or there's potentially Lyme's disease, we can do that through finger prick onto a card. So they don't need to see, you know, so that actually, even if it's traumatic for us, it's not the whole, yeah. So but most of the time we do hair, urine, and then we do these DNA tests, which are saliva, which doesn't all swap. It's super easy. Amazing. So we keep it as slick and easy as possible for everybody. Yeah. Because at the end of the day, you really have to, you know, plan a blood test and they won't want a second one. So you have to make, and you can't get that much information out of blood. And so it says it's much easier to do through urine and hair. It's amazing. Yeah, that you have those options. Yeah. Because that's one thing with the NHS, as opposed you don't go. Oh, honestly, you can't get a gut microbiome test. And it doesn't, or even a private gastro, I still have not found a private gastro-ontologist. Really? And we see, you know, we have families. We have such a mixture of families. We have literally like families, you know, of seven or nine living in two bedroom, tiny flat and I know, tar hamlets, through to, you know, a list of us, right? And so we have access, you know, some of them have access to the best of the best. And we still come back with the blood test, or the stool test is normal. And you're going, this child has had a tummy ache for 10 years, or something. And it's normal. And they lit, do you say, you know, the therapy is for you to get mind over matter. And eventually the pain will go away. I mean, imagine telling a child who's been in pain for 10 years, that they have to put mind over matter. And then it's in the head. Yeah. And then we do the test and they've got inflammation, they've got poor gastric output, they've got some parasite or some bacteria. And, you know, within few weeks they're feeling so much better. But also, these are, could all be so preventative. Yeah. If they were nipped in the bud. And it's like, with this chronic inflammation that a child is experiencing, then the stress that's going to be put on the NHS in the long time, that's with something that you could have dealt with five, 10 years previous, you know, 100%. Because we know that these accumulate, don't we? Yeah. You know, a long-term gut issue, imagine if it's some sort of malabsorption, right? Then you're going to, even the best start in the world, you're not going to get those nutrients. Yeah. And that's going to lead to other things going forward. Anyway, one day on my grave. We've got conversations like this is so important. Exactly. And it's really important. So much. I already feel like, yeah, this is already an action plan. Yeah. So when it comes to testing, because I know you probably get a lot of parents and children that are kind of already experiencing certain symptoms, would you recommend doing certain tests like the hair urine, even just to check on their kind of like health of your child? Or do you wait? Yeah, what's really interesting is we have, we would usually see the child that's in crisis first, because that child is the one that, you know, if you think about it, there's a domino effect on the rest of the family and every, you know, you've got to get that one right. And so we will run probably a batch of tests for them, especially, I mean, one of the reasons why that first consultation is really important is to work out exactly which ones they need. So I mentioned to you earlier, so often parents have sourced their own tests and they've coming back with actually very little information because they've got the wrong tests. So it's much better to do that first appointment with us and we'll get the right tests. And if you don't spend too much money on the wrong things. Yeah. So essentially, but we will make sure that we get the right test done for your child. And if something significant comes up and if it tells a tale that is more than just them, I'll actually, my other daughter or my son's a bit like that. Or once we've got that child sort of stable, they go, well, actually what we didn't really say was actually the brothers in a very similar way, but it wasn't just so extremely, we had to pick one at a time. So could we, and we can look at those tests and think actually, you know what, that was the most important one that we did. And that came up with the most information and that would match with his profile. So let's do that for him too. So what we do, this is why I say we do family nutrition is that we start with one child, then we probably see the rest. Then we see mum. I was just about to use the air and just just like this comes from me. Yeah. I'm just so exhausted. And over and you know, because when you know about the sort of systems that go on in the body with neurodiversity, as I said, I have ADHD. I've also got diagnoses of Hashimoto's, Thoiditis, and I've had fibromyalgia. And I'm pretty good. Pretty good actually. I'm like, I think I'm 98% you know, I know, but I do have a very full life. I mean, my mid 50s and I don't. Your energy is so vibrant as well. But you know, when I met a wee, yeah, I do push myself. So I think I'm probably anyone would be 98% you know, you know, kind of thing. So I think I've done pretty well. But all I'm saying is these mums are often really suffering with autoimmune conditions, chronic pain, chronic fatigue, you know, that they're not right too. And partly that's because they're caring for a complex child. And we see complex, you know, really medically complex kids too, you know, with just a whole shopping list of issues. So yeah, you can see it's incredibly hard and often they've got many kids. So you know, there's just got in here and different ages and stages. They're just utterly exhausted. And then eventually we see the dads. And then we'll see Granny and we'll see Auntie and it's lovely. It's great. Yeah, no, it's super. And we're probably making such a profound effect on that one individual that then, you know, as a family, you're like, okay, I want us all to feel the effects of that. But it's just lovely because you know the family. And I think that's really important. So kind of there's a lot of stuff that you've covered already. That you know what mean? You just like you understand. You really get that. And there are some families I've been looking after for 25 years. And it's just great. And there are some who are having babies. My babies are having babies. Can you imagine for that generation then if they've been coming to see you for that long pre-conception or, you know, after-conception pregnancy, they would have the kind of foundations that you've laid for them. And that's really special as well. I mean, you know, no one lives a perfect life. I think, you know, at the end of the day, young people go traveling and they have high-stress jobs and you know, it all goes out of the window, doesn't it? You know, you need this coming out in all sorts of things. But you know, but let them. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. And Blue Sinder, can we jump into plastics a little bit? Because I saw you recently posted about the the recent documentary, Plastic E-Tops, and then I also saw that you mentioned about where plastics could be hiding and how they're affecting children. Yes, I've been looking at this for a very long time, but it's becoming very topical. And I think by the time this podcast is out, we will have been to Parliament to help talk about plastic babies. So there was a documentary that came out recently on Netflix, Plastic E-Tops, it's amazing. The lady, the researcher, who is, I believe, in her mid-90s, you won't think so. No, she doesn't have a lot of money. She's phenomenal. And essentially she took six couples who had unexplained infertility. She found they had very high levels of microplastics and the chemicals associated with microplastics in their urine. And basically they cleared the plastic out of their houses. And three months later, three of those couples were pregnant. And they've had healthy, happy babies. And they hadn't been trying for years, having their life a decade. Yeah, yeah. And no other interventions. And what was amazing was they retested the urine, especially on the men, because it can affect sperm quality. That's one of the factors. And they were like back to zero, which is really cool. So they were very happy to do this test. Yes, they do. So for plastics, 100%. So it's so interesting, wouldn't it? Just so. So we do, it's a brilliant test. It's a urine test. And it looks at heavy metals, mold, so mycotoxins and plastics and PFAS, you can add on as well. It's fantastic. It's so easy. As I said, it's a few minutes of urine. Goes off to America, a few weeks later, you get this full report. So would you be able to say, you know, everything? Yeah. Okay. Okay. So would you recommend if someone was struggling with infertility to do that test? Yeah. Yeah. So before I got into doing pediatric health, and that was purely driven, as I said, by my son's remarkable, wonderful story, was I was helping couples get pregnant and have beautiful, healthy babies. And that was, I loved it. It was just incredible. And there was an incredible charity, which sadly, I don't think exists anymore, called four-site. And essentially they were doing the hair tests and they were looking for toxins and they were trying to eliminate the toxins in the chain prior to pregnancy to help to enhance sperm health and egg health. And looking at at least a three-month program, because it takes approximately 100 days for a healthy egg and a healthy sperm to be developed. So we all think it's just happening now. And then, you know, like it's this month. And I have these frustrating situations where women would come in. And I said, "Well, where's your partner?" And they go, "Oh, and I've got IVF next week." Like, "I don't have a magic wand, love, I'm sorry." You know, we need to do some work on it. But anyway, so that's where it all came from. And understanding the link with toxicity, lack of selenium, lack of zinc, and so forth on. And omega-3 is really important too for healthy sperm and healthy eggs. So, yeah, that was the beginning of where I started and where I understood the impact early on, even pre-pregnancy on a child's trajectory. And, you know, fertility rates have plummeted in the last few years. And microplastics have doubled since 2007. So even though people say, "Oh, yeah, we're now not having plastic forks to take the lid off your cup." I'm not answering my "hide my coffee cup." We're actually trying to get our own cup. So we don't have that. Absolutely. And you get a pound off if you work that better. So, yeah, so plastics are everywhere. It's incredibly hard to avoid them. But, you know, they are, you know, our coffee cups. Take away plastic. Anything you heat up in plastic. So even ready meals that are in a plastic tray. Yeah. Unfortunately, they put chemicals like flallets into some of our perfumed and fragrance items, whether they're household chemicals or, you know, things we put on our face or our bodies because they, those plastics help the fragrance to stick. So you go and get them out with laundry detergent and water. Especially when it is marketed for babies. It makes me so angry. So I've become incredibly sensitive to all of these things now. In terms of, I don't get really bad reactions. Occasionally, I'll get a little splatter on a cough. Maybe that's why your daughter has that funny little cough after she's done it. So it's not extreme, but I know some people literally will faint. You know, they can't even go into a department store, for instance, because of all the pressure. Or like a taxi when they have their air fresheners. I think it's so interesting. But they make me feel quite sick. And so I, and what is extraordinary is we're so lucky. We live in the middle of nowhere in the countryside. And so, and I work from home a lot. And so I know our environment. But it's when you randomly go into someone's house. When they have the plugins. How do they still exist? And you go, gosh, you know what I mean? It's just like you really feel it because you're so not used to it. And you're in your bubble. I had to stay at someone's house a few years ago. And they had plugins and I felt so ill after I said I can't stay there. I feel sick and headaches. That's what I get. So yes, you know, I think one thing. I mean, I, as I said, I'm in my mid fifties. I don't paint my nails. I, you know, I don't wear, I don't dye my hair. I just think there are so many things that women especially have weak control can't wear. And there's so much about this longevity space, which is bothering me. I'm saying 25-year-old saying, I'm doing this for my longevity. And I think great, fantastic. It's good to think ahead. You know, you really should be living life rather than worrying about aging. You know, my age group. Yes, we've got friends who've had heart attacks. And you know, it's a lot with the men with prostate cancer. Yeah, that's where we're, you know, you know, this, that's, that's asking. You know, it's scary because I feel like we're now kind of reaching 40s. But actually, it's happening a lot younger. I think it is. And I think that's what we've had conversations where we're at people around us are age are getting diagnosed or dytonic. I mean, it's like it is coming younger. So I think we have to have it a bit more at the forefront because our generation we grew up on convenience microwave mill sugar. There was no knowledge like blue drinks. It was just was a very little. Yeah, hundreds of hundreds of the wild foundation. And it was trendy. Yeah. That was the thing as well. It was trendy for microwave meals and you know, microwave pizzas and everything. It's like it was convenience for mums. No one knew whether it was now I feel like it's. Yeah, we were damaged. We had angel delight. Yeah, yes. My mum didn't do it. She did. She did it was a French bread pizza straight from the freezer. It was a McCain's. That was our Sunday lunch. Yeah, because she was busy. It wasn't, yeah. Yeah, exactly. Yeah. So yeah, I totally I know that. I mean, you know, my 18 year old, he just turned 18. Three of the lads in his class from primary school. Their dads are no longer with us. Wow. You know, young, healthy because we were the old parents. Yeah. And yeah, they're young, young, young, young. They're all normal younger. So I mean, it's a big worry. It's not just our kids. Yeah. I think the difference is that these toxins are affecting our children's brains in their development. Yeah. Whereas in the, in, you know, when you become an adult, it's affecting fertility, it's affecting gut health, it's affecting. Yeah. It's putting oxidative stress on your cells, which can lead to autoimmune or neurological issues or cancerous issues. I remember Zach Bush saying something about it. It's almost like the universe. We're putting such a toxic load on the planet that we aren't able, we can't, the world can't expect us to keep reproducing and going on in this way. It's like it's not what we're doing to the planet. You know, 100%. And you know, you have these glimmers if you think we're making progress. And then the reality is you're not. Yeah. Yeah. So again, we can be in our little silos and bubbles and think this progress being made. And then you just step out of it and you go, wow. Yeah. And that's going to a service. station, you know, on a Saturday off to the first fashion now because of the internet. And everyone's in plastic clothes, eating plastic food. And, you know, are not looking healthy. Yeah. You know, we say that a lot of don't we sometimes were so in our bubble and then when you go somewhere, like a service station, also, I always say after a theme park and I see people on mass, then you kind of realize that we usually hang around with like minded people, your family, you know, exactly. Like you don't realize the scale of or the lack of knowledge that kind of, you know, because I'm often surprised even I remember watching like a Molly May program or something and all the adverts were for toxic. Oh, yeah. It's containing toxic chemicals. And I was like, how is this still even allowed? Because I'm not exposed to my algorithm doesn't show me these products. But then when you watch advertisement on normal TV, exactly. Is this still allowed? Very normal. I always do. Because I'm not allowed to advertise junk food anymore. So it has to be junk, junk stuff in the house instead. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. It's easy. But actually, I wonder whether I know we're going to probably have to wrap up soon. But you mentioned about plastic and babies. Yes. Can you expand what that message is? So there is evidence that a baby's first thousand days is their most important developmental stage. OK. So that is from conception. So that's during pregnancy up until their second birthday, essentially. OK. Right. So it's what's important when you're pregnant to avoid as many toxins as you can. But equally in that first two years is, you know, to be that green crunchy mama, basically, and to make sure their environment is as plastic for as possible. And, you know, obviously, if you can breastfeed fantastic, but if you can't try and get a glass bottle to feed them with rather than a plastic bottle and so forth. And to try and avoid plastic, like, um, mattresses and those sorts of things. But it's really hard to avoid entirely, but to go as kind of wood, wood and bamboo and things like that is you can. Because that is where these cells are developing and there is apparently and there are kind of, you know, different studies say different things. But these are things that have been bandaged around that we have the equivalent of a credit card of worth a plastic in our bodies at any one time. And that may be causing this oxidative stress on the body and inflammation. And when you've got inflammation in the body and the brain, that can lead to more allergies, asthma, but also in your event and talking issues. So they're not the causes of, but they're a contributor to, there is no research to find anything causes anything, even lung cancer. They'll get there's a higher percentage of smokers that get high, but they can't actually say it causes the same with this. I'm never, ever will talk about causes as such, these are contributors and that's why I love to do the tests where we can to understand really what the profile is. Because there's so many times you can point towards, you know, issues that aren't there. Yeah. And yeah, I did a full hormone panel last year, which included all those plastics, BPAs, glalates, glyphosate, et cetera. And I had really high BPA and I put it down to my sportswear, my actor. Yeah. Because nothing else in my life had plastic or pretty much not. Yeah. Whereas, you know, my glyphosate was zero because I'm pretty much going for it. Yeah. You know, and things like that. So it was really interesting. It was just very particular. Yeah. And I just think that, you know, it could be that. So for someone who, for example, I didn't have the nerve, I think, I'm going to say, for example, I didn't have the knowledge that I now have and my daughter's 13. So when she was born, I remember using the pure pure, um, non-bi-o, laundry detergent. And, you know, she had a new mattress and all these things that I obviously didn't have the knowledge about them. I do now. So are there things that people can do? Oh, hundreds of percent. So help detoxify because obviously you can now remove them. So we don't have these things at heart. Yeah. And then, no, exactly. Yeah. So because obviously that was a period, I didn't know that the first thousand days were as important, you know, and I do things very differently now. But what compare ands do? So, um, the one that's really difficult to clear from the body, which is seen as a forever chemical is PFAS, which comes in the things like that anorex. So you want to make sure that they have, you know, really good quality PFAS free waterproofs. Oh, okay. And even cooking utensils contain those, they're like a pan. Some kind of stuff. So, exactly. So those are things to, those are the really tricky things to shift out of the body. Right. Okay. But actually, you know, the thalates and the micplastics potentially are easier. Okay. And in most people, and as I said, you might have the wrong detox pathways and they do accumulate, but if you have the right detox pathways or if you allow your detox pathways to occur like abs and sore bars, etc. Then they will come out of your body relatively quickly and not cause too much effect. So probably, if you've been doing this a few years, you'll be fairly low. Okay. Levels, you won't be getting exposure all the time. But you need to think about, you know, when you're so many girls going through very, very early puberty, you know, having periods at nine, etc. And then boys having very delayed puberty. Really? So we're looking at 15, 14, 15 year olds whose voices haven't dropped in their tiny. Okay. Because of Eastergene. Yeah. And that can be from the water from the plastics, etc. So again, it's just really important for hormonal health. And one is the indicators that the, basically they're seeing in, in, in the, in the labor wards is they're seeing a difference in the distance between a boy's basic testicles and anus. And if that's, if it, if the distance is wrong, that is more likely that they're going to have undecended testicles, they're going to have problems with fertility going forward. Okay. So they can even spot it as baby. Yeah. Wow. This scary isn't it? It's just thyroid and thyroid. You know, weight gain, you know, so many, so many women just have real difficulties with their thyroid. And that's one thing I challenge I've had, which I'm, as I said, I'm pretty much out. Okay. And so a lot of, obviously I feel like we could talk to you for hours, but can people find out more about this in your book and obviously your blog? So I haven't talked that much about my plastics in brain brilliance, but I have written about it in blogs and I'm going to do more about it. So in terms of what can you do? Yes. Obviously, reduce exposure really, really good. And one wonderful paper came up that actually eating berries are a really good way of reducing mychoplastic load on the body and BPA. So and, you know, you can get really good organic frozen berries now, which are in a paper bag. Yeah, yeah. I have a, Tara loves them because they're the same. They taste the same all the time. So I literally have a whole draw for in reference of all of the packs that we don't find out. Exactly. Exactly. That one off, right? Just like stuck up. But they're amazing. They're amazing. And that is the equivalent of one fresh palette of blueberries, you know, you get double the amount. So it's really, really good. You know, money was too. And yeah, so, you know, so lots of berries is really helpful. And there are lots of other tips that I put in my blog every week. So they're all there on the website on next dog. So, you know, they're there. I've created, I mean, it properly is like an encyclopedia now. I mean, I, as I said, one a week for the last half of many years. There's a lot of blogs on that. Okay. We put those in a book. One day. Yes. So, for a bit, okay. Well, I feel like I don't know if we're going to have time for a quick file, but I think we do anything. Okay. Do you have to fill up with that? Yeah. Well, yeah. I have to have a long episode. Yeah. It's kind of, it's so interesting, isn't it? And I think especially for parents, it's just like so valuable. This kind of information. And we didn't even touch on. We wanted to kind of do this, but on foods as well, because I know that's where you kind of, um, you share those of recipes. I think the difference is, yeah, with my recipes, basically, I realize how hard it is to get these nutrients into kids because they won't eat veg and they won't eat this and they won't eat that. And, um, so what I do is I create recipes that are as supercharged as I can that are also child-friendly. So, whether it's a pizza base made from red lentils or it's a brownie with tahini and black beans, you know, I'm just trying to get as much nutrition into every bite because I know that everybody is really. Yeah. We're only going to need to get you on for another round of that food. Yeah, so we're just doing a little quick fire. Yeah. Okay, so if you had to pick three things that matter most for kids' health, why are they? I would say, um, start early with really diverse diet right from the get-go when you're eating them so that they get this really wide variety of different tastes and flavours and textures, which will really set them up for life. Cut back on exposure to environmental toxins as much as you can. as much as possible, you know, really, because so often when you're starting out as a young couple, you're putting in a new kitchen or you're doing new things, you're making changes, so do them environmentally rather than, you know, so that's a good step. Or be the third thing. Learn to cook from scratch. To cook. Yeah. And teach your children how to cook too. Yeah. To do as an activity, isn't it? Yeah. I know it takes a bit more time, but other countries seem to prioritise it. Yeah. It's just us brits, we're pretty useless. But the thing with the time, and I've seen it going around, it's like, that's the whole point, isn't it, when you have kids? The things take more time, but if you make it more of an activity, like, that's the joy, and get them involved, you know, is then they'll enjoy food. Yeah. Yeah. And I think this is really a fourth thing, but it's really important that if you've got the mothers instinct that you're doing your best, and for what don't, for reason, there's a big block that are answers. It's just they might not come from your GP. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Is there anything controversial that you believe about children's health? I've been out there a bit of an indeed thing, because that earlier was quiet. Yeah. I think it's to do with the fact that their blood tests are normal. Mm. Okay. But I've learnt from, as I said, we see some really, really complex kids and young people. And it's very frustrating when they parents have really gone, as I said, to find the neurologist, the gastrointrologist, whoever it might be, and they're told that their blood's a normal, there's nothing wrong. And you can see this child is anything, but right. Yeah. And if I could change that narrative to take that word normal away, and to say, I'm afraid this is not medically significant enough for us, and there is no medication that we can offer. However, we can see that your child is clearly in distress, and there are other options you can look at. Yeah. That would be a much better narrative to have. So that's what I'd love to do. I wonder if that. What's one thing that would make the biggest difference to a child with autism or ADHD? Where possible, and as I said, it can be a big block at the beginning, is to nourish them with amazing food, help them to find sleep comfortable and easy, and to give them lots of lovely fresh air and natural light and happiness. To bring it back to basics, isn't it? Yeah. Yeah. And what are the three top foods that you would want every child eating regularly? Eggs, because of the co-lean, and the protein and just all the good phospholipids and everything. Blueberries, because they're incredible. Blueberries, they do help with blood flow around the brain, and they taste yummy. Great for the gut, microbiome. And oily fish. Yeah. Really good quality sardines. And I know it's not everyone's cup of tea. But if you put a specific brand that you, as I was about to say, a specific brand that you recommend. Not particularly. They always get ones that are either in olive oil or in just water. Yeah. I know we get the fish for ever ones for ever. They have quite good waters, you know. Okay. Yeah, they do them as I do. But, you know, we have such an international reach, global reach that, you know, we've got clients in pretty much every country around the world. Okay. So they obviously have different brands. Different, yeah. Yeah. And what's one thing you wish every parent knew that nutrition really counts. It's not to be at the bottom of the pile. It really can be a game changer. And finally, what does raising healthy children mean to you? Raising healthy children means that once they get to adulthood, they're able to hold onto their dreams, they're able to do the things they're really passionate about and have the energy to be able to make a really important difference to the world. So that's being a kind person, whether that's doing something good for the world, whether it's doing something interesting for their brain, just something that they can do without being held back by illness. I love that. I love that. Oh, listen to this has been so informative. As we move around to. We do 100%. I'm like, I want to talk to you all day. And where can people find you? So I'm on Instagram nature.kids and obviously nature.com and we have an online shop, nature.shop, which stocks a whole range of amazing stuff. Oh, amazing. And yeah, I'm on the other social media. And your book is available on or everywhere. Okay. Waterstone, Sveta, Amazon, through to our own website. Yeah. Thank you so much. Thank you so much. Thank you so much.