The Heat Aren’t Hot, How OKC Can Survive J-Dub's Injury, and the Knicks’ Ring Conundrum | Real Ones

What's popping real ones Logan Murdock here Howard Beck and Roger Bill in a few had a great show today. Also a sad show today, man, we had to talk about the Miami Heat's bad start as I talk about J. Dub's injury and case in Wallace's injury in O.K.C. and how does that, how does O.K.C. move forward from this, right? It's hard to say, you know, how do they want to title without J. Dub because like Sam Presley said in his press conference, it's about the people in Oklahoma City and the people in that organization and how they move forward, very tight-knit group. And it's going to be very, very illuminating and interesting to see how they go forward. And then we talk about, you know, it was one of those stories where we're like, damn, we wish we could have talked about it right when it happened, but we did a podcast and it was already ready to go when it happened. We'll talk about the New York Knicks and the Fishing Incident and also the Ring Incident and how do the Knicks move forward from that. And then we introduce a new segment, Rodgers Tales from the Road, where he talks about his time at Dallas for the Red River rivalry. We'll get that done. We'll get that figured out as Texas continues to go on and de- it continues to do great things there. But we talk about his hubris and everything that happens with Rodgers on the Road. Some of the story that we get behind the scenes, but we're going to bring to the forefront with you guys. It's very hilarious. All right. I think that's the podcast. Makes you check us out. We are Tuesdays and Fridays on Netflix and Spotify, wherever you get your podcast, we'll see you very soon. Episode up next. This episode is presented by Sam's Club during the holidays, everyone's in a club. The last minute gift givers club, the cool aunts club, the food coma club, whatever holiday club you're in, Sam's Club is the club that helps you pull it off. Need to get a meal on the table in under two hours done. Shopping for the brands they want, like Dyson and Lego, without blowing your budget, check and check. Sam's Club helps you make the most of the holidays come join us, Sam's Club. What's poppin'? Real ones. We got a lot on the bone here for real ones, I want to start with the Miami Heat, who are now O and 4. It's not looking great for Roger's Heat over there. I have some observations really quickly. I have some observations really quickly, just I watch the Vav's Heat Game. These are the observations that I had from probably watching all 48 minutes. They don't have a full time facilitator. They have no offensive organization whatsoever, nor any organization, or offensive structure, whatsoever. They want to run. They don't have the guys that are going to run, so it's a bit of a weird, a viewing experience, and because they play so fast, they cannot lock in defensively with the personnel that they have, they have the 27th best defensive rating in the league, which is the second to last, or second or third to last, and they have one of the worst offences in the league as well. I'll start with you, Roger. How do they rectify the situation and what is going on in Miami? How is it going? You are our Miami Correspondent. What is going on in life in Miami and how it was in totality? How is it going? I'm not super tapped into the Miami fan. It's not typically, I'm not out in the streets like that to hear what they're saying. I watched last night, and I walked away with a few things. Yannis still looked great. I think I was on a week or so ago talking about how he needed to facilitate a bit more for that team. He had a triple double early in the third quarter of the game. They don't have, they don't have a lot of creators on that team. Yannis is tasked with having the ball and basically doing all the creation for that offense outside of, you know, the PG's, you know, can create his own shot sometimes I've drawn a blank on his name. Davion Mitchell. Yeah, Davion Mitchell. Yeah, like he had 20 some last night. He's fast, right, like he wants to go. But Yannis has to do so much of the creation, they need another person that can, they can kind of create. Theoretically, like when he came, you said, well, BAM did that for them last year. So those two together, like the space in won't be great, but BAM can do that too, but BAM's not doing that. BAM has taken a huge step back, not in terms of what he is as a, as a player in terms of skill set and ability, but clearly something's happened where he's like deferring. He's a swing swing guy now, like I watched through huge portions of that game last night. And I, BAM didn't come off the page at all. And then he did a few times late on a tip, you know, a tip in and a fast break dunk, but he's lost in whatever their sauce is right now offensively. So that really does just leave it to Yannis defensively, they're good in the paint. They're one of the better paint protecting teams so far early in the season. They're the worst in terms of points allowed from the three, from the three point line. And that's what my eye was telling me last night. The first thing I noticed was like, damn, they don't, they don't stay in front of the ball well. Pick and roll, a lot of, you know, drop coverages at times or maybe they were blown coverages because they, they look like they were switching and then, you know, they, they get into one extra swing into a, into a sprint pick and roll, then they fucked that up and, and Cooper flags in the paint again or whoever the next guy's in the paint again. And they're, they're caught in rotation and then the next guy's driving the close out and they're spraying it and they maybe philosophically, that's what they're asking them to do, but they are getting torched from the three point line. And there's a huge difference between contested threes that you have to work hard to get. And wide open threes because we can't keep the ball in front of us and we're allowing straight line drives. And they do that a lot. Um, so, you know, when you have a relatively flat offense, safe for Janice, you don't have a lot of creation outside of him, um, you're, you're going to be one of the lower scoring teams in the league. It looks like and you're going to get your head bashed in from three every night. It's a recipe for disaster. Yeah. It's, they're 25th and three point shooting, 28th and total team rebounding. Um, you saw that even last night where the, the, just the timeliness of the offensive rebounds at the Miami hate heap gave up down the stretch, right? And they can't get stopped when they need to. The only stop I feel like they got last night was when Cooper flag got the offensive rebound to step that a bounce, um, but other than that, it was, it was, it was, it was really tough to watch them. Um, and they talk about, they took, they died my bad, but they took, they took, they took a couple charges on him, like because Cooper, Cooper was good, but he, you know, he's a little out of control. He's still young. Like they took a couple charges, but I think even those charges illustrate what I'm saying. Yeah. He has walked by somebody and like the fact that he continues to walk by people and you have to step up and take that charge, Walter Clayton, Jr. did it, like you're trying to close out and he's up and under you and he's hitting floaters like they, they just have a problem keeping people in front of them right now. Yeah. Yeah. I'm not going to get the power because I do want to get him in here. Bam is averaging 11 points to seven rebound and 40% shooting so far this season has not averaged a lower amount and scoring a rebound. This is second year in the league. And also one of the things offensively that I've seen that was pretty bad. Like they don't have, because it's not that they don't have shooters. They don't have shoot team and then the other thing is they don't have, because they don't have an organizational structure on offense. You know, these guys that are typically just coming off streams to shoot like a Tim Hardaway Jr. or a Clay Thompson who can't be streaky at times. They're having to create their own shot in a lot of ways, right? Or they're going to, out of nowhere, they're getting a kick out and it's like, oh, I guess I got the ball now. I guess I got to shoot it, right? It's, so it's, it's very weird to see. And this also from what I've seen is just a, honestly, a function of like how you can and cannot build a team at this year's, at this era's NBA Howard. This is say about like how you can construct a roster in today's NBA and how, how are the heat kind, kind of being just a victim of that at this point, too, aside from all the other stuff that's going on offensively and defensively, but like there is a, a roster construction component because they are up against an apron. It's really hard for them to get players that could be cohesive in this, on this roster. I think it's a lot of things, Logan, like, so they're, they're oh and four. And I always say this, it looks a lot worse to have your, a four game losing streak to start the season because that big fat zero, then if they had started off like, yeah, three and three, they're working through some stuff and then they lose four in a row or you lose four in a row in the middle of December or January, it's just different and this could all even out, they could figure this out and the panic in the streets of Miami, which apparently corn to roger's not happening. He says he's got no feel for this. I guess they're not writing in the streets outside roger's house, at least, it's our son's out burning yet. I know. Like there's never, what's there ever to be mad about down there? Let's go to the beach. It's fine. Um, I do think. Look, I'm going to, I'm going to do the reasonable part here first, the nuance first, and then we'll get to the, the let's panic and, and ride in the streets outside of Roger's house. The nuance part of this is the, you just imported one of the highest usage players, one of the most dominant performers, a two-time MVP of the, you know, one of the greatest players of the last 10, 15 years, one of the greatest players of all time. That requires an adjustment. And they didn't have a guy like that, right? Their higher usage offensive players were like, the guys who went out in that trade like Tyler Hero or like, they let, uh, um, Norman Powell leave. So like, and, and Bam did carry a lot last year, #83, um, but he's not your prototypical like, we'll just, we'll just have Bam run the offense every night. Yannis is different that way. So you do have to adjust to that. So that's part one. Part two is, Bam did have an enhanced role in the wasteland that was the heat roster the last couple of years where there wasn't a whole lot else going on and they did have to play through him a lot. And he is having to take a backseat or he is deferring and taking a backseat like Raja touched on this like, I'm not sure how to read that yet. Raja, but yeah, I mean, Bam's, it's not just that his scoring is down like he's, he's averaging less than 12 points of game. It's lowest as the second season in the league. His rebounding is down, mostly at the defensive end. His shots per game are on par for like one of the lowest of his career. He's just not doing as much. He looked a little lost like yeah. So yeah, he just looked lost. And Raja, I think the offensive part of it, we probably anticipated like, okay, spacing and you know, this kind of like two bigs who they're very different players, but they got to find their way with each other like that could take some time. But you thought at a minimum, they would just have the lane just fucking shut down, right? They'd be great defensive. They'd be dominant. They'd be blocking shots left and right. Nobody wanted to drive the lane on them. And that hasn't been the case either. So to me, and this is where I'm going to start to veer away from the stats and numbers and analytics and just go into like sheer, just like observation and speculation, vibes don't feel great. And I wouldn't be pushing this button so soon if not for Bam's very, very, very extremely and seemingly unreasonably defensive quotes after last night's loss. He's asked about like, I think his own performance and he says, can't overthink basketball, man, for me, it's my shot's not going in. It's funny how the outside noise wants to make me the scapegoat. But when the tables turn, when the energy shifts, just be prepared for that. I'm like, all right, I'm not sure who's trying to make you the scapegoat. People just like noting that your numbers are down. Denny, there's a question later that I think was about Janice and his answer is, the media are going to be the media. They're going to try to bear you when you're down and then it's quite when you're up so you expect that from the media. Dude, you're oh and four and your numbers are down and people, including like a lot of this was like former players. And I think that was cited in the question maybe, but like KG and some others, everybody's got their own shows and podcasts. Stan Van Gundy as well. Sure. But like observing that you do not look like yourself or you're in your comfort zone and that your numbers are down is not scapegoating, Bam. That's just a sheer observation that he is this defensive. I'm going to do it. I'm going to make the leap. I'm sorry. I try not to do this. I don't think that that's actually actually about the media. I think that's about something he's pissed about internally. Like you don't lash out like that after a just four game losing streak and people pointing out that your numbers are down. Oh, I'm the scapegoat. Like I'm going to just guess and I could be wrong that this is more about something internal. And I'm going to guess that that internal thing is like he's not real happy about where he is right now in this universe that has now been completely reconstructed around Giannis. And I don't even mean it as a jealousy thing. I mean, it has just a discomfort awkwardness thing of trying to figure out who I am now in this construction. So to your point, Logan, that's the first part of the construction. The other part is, yeah, there's salaries. There's all the players you had to send out to get him. There's the fact that I think the heat were the first to say after they got Giannis. This is not a complete roster. It's going to take some time. You need shooting. So they went out and got a couple of guys who are pretty much, you know, on the back end of their career and claim and Tim Hardaway, Jr. They're both shooting like near career lows or career worse from three point range. So that's not helping. And besides that, they're both also averaging like 19, 20 minutes a game because you can't keep them out there much longer than that because they're both defensive liabilities. And so just getting three point shooters doesn't solve your spacing issues if those guys are giving it up at the other end. And so like, yeah, there are roster construction issues. I don't think it means like, oh, you can't do this Logan. I don't think it means that Giannis trade was a mistake by any stretch. You get the guy first. You figure out the rest later. It's the figuring out the rest later part that they're stuck in now. Yeah. I mean, when I like and I want to get to your opinion on this Roger was the game last night. I was a few Miami heat games in the problem is like, and I don't want this to get misconstrued. But you know, we were talking about hubs last year or last week, right? And like offensive hubs and how that's, we're talking about that with the sixers and like how that really helps their offense go. Well, with Giannis, sometimes it just seems like a black hole, right? Like he gets the ball. He's going to take it. He's going to go right to the cup a lot, right? Or if he passes out, he's going to just pass it at the last minute. And that's really tough. Not only when you're playing alongside that if you're a badmout of bio, or if you're an angel Wiggins, or if you're Clay Thompson, or if you're a Davia Mitchell, it's one thing when it's just Giannis doing that, but it seems like when I'm watching this team, it's whoever gets the ball is just going to go up to the cup and just throw some shit up, right? Like when I see Davia Mitchell, who I think can be who's not necessarily a facilitator, but he is a change of pace guard. Like I feel like if they had a starting guard on that team that they would be a little bit better, right? But they have a lot of these guys. The offense is just in flux because it just seems like they're getting off the board and they're just going no matter who gets it. You're just going to be a point guard. I don't still like they have the personnel nor the team to be able to sustain that type of offense. And it winds up being Giannis scoring a lot of points, but like a lot of people just like, no, well, you know, yeah, yeah, I mean, look, they're certain, they're certain, I mean, they're certain guys, they've, they've always existed in the NBA that are so gifted with the ball in their hands. They can do so many incredible things in terms of scoring it and, and dictating defenses and coverages that, you know, coaches and players alike. Because like I said, we're evaluating every day in practice. Like we're watching Giannis do what Giannis does. Like we know we can't do that. So you're going to defer, right? And, and there are guys that are even better at it than, than, than the top tier guys. Like there's one percenters in that space. And, and typically with those guys, you have to get the recipe around them perfect. You just have to get it perfect. Because to your point, you know, towards the towards, there was a part of my career that I learned and I was trained how to just stand and wait and then be ready to shoot, right? But that's not an organic thing for a lot of people. Like I wasn't a play creator early in my career. I wasn't good enough to do that. But man, I thought a lot better about shooting this three if I had touched the ball a couple possessions in a row, even if that was just a movie, you know, even if I was setting a good screen and popping and catching and then rotating. Like I didn't have to create the play, but I was in the play in the way that kept me focused and, and, and happy, if you will, and, and involved enough to that when you did throw me the ball, I was now ready to convert that three learning how to do that if you've learning how to do that can be an art form around guys like Janice. Look, our six years team was not unlike that with AI. Like you had to you had to put a certain type of guy around him to let him be his best and be able to carry that to the heights with which, you know, he carried it or to which he carried it. So I look at them and I feel what you're saying, Logan. I felt, I felt like, yeah, like, and these guys are crazy and I guess what I'm trying to do is not say what I'm about to say, which, which is like, you know, it's going to be interesting to see if they can ever get that right around Janice again. I'm not saying that you can't because he is such a force, but watching them, I often feel like, I often feel like like that, that style might be just on the tail end. Like, we might have just passed that style of play and I could be wrong. I'm not, I'm not trying to make a hot take, but that's how I felt in my soul last night watching the last two times I've watched. I'm like, man, that's a lot of him. He's great, but, but, you know, and it could be a, I don't know what came first, the chicken or the egg. I'm rambling. I don't know if it's because he doesn't have the type of players around him that could take some of that load off of him or if it's like, yo, this is the way I play. You know that. I'm great at it. Like get the recipe right around me, but it's going to be fascinating. So that's, I had to, I'm glad that you brought that up, Roger, because I have the same thought to watching them. It's like, Janice is like, I'm going to be me, and I'm going to get mine, right? And that's just what it's going to be. And with this team, the other thing that I would like to say is, I feel like they're playing an offensive style that I can't say this enough. I feel like they're playing an offensive style that does not fit their roster. If you look at the roster, you're not, but with the honest, with the honest, you're right. But with the honest, that's what I'm saying. This is what I'm saying. You are correct. But when you have the honest, that's the way you have to play. That's the style, right? Yeah. That is the style you're playing. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. And that's the tough part about this because they're not going to change unless they have I guess the they're not going to change their the result of what is going on unless they have they build out that a little bit more as funny. There was a play last night that I and I was talking a cliff about this before to pod. There was a play from the Mavs last night where there was was early in the first quarter was a long rebound and it got into Kyrie Irving's hands at the top of the key and instead of like trying to go get his shot or drive in the way the Davi Mitchell would or somebody other guys on the heat roster would he just caught Cooper flag for just an easy layup. He just threw it right into it for an easy it was easy fade away to Cooper flag and that's just more of the stuff organizationally that that the the heat need right where it's okay a long rebound happen. Let's just get easy shots right it's just you know two steps in a cloud of dust with this offense and it there's no there's no continuity continuity whatever you want to call it would call the second one. There's there's none of that right there's none of that connective tissue when there's good players on this roster but there's nobody that's able to connect it right even if Janice is the guy that's like okay when I get the ball y'all know what I'm going to do I'm gonna just run the floor and I'm going to get easy buckets for myself there is no wait up. Janice I'm gonna get you to ball in transition and get you when your spots so it doesn't have to be so hard everything feels like it's straining with this team offensively and it leads to their defense when he was when when he was at his most capable of winning I don't want to say at his best because I don't remember statistically but when he was when they were their heights of their powers he had multiple dudes around him he had a he had an organizer and a playmaker in Drew holiday who could who could do things with the ball he could score it he could get you organized like he was he was you know a winning PG and you had Chris Middleton who could get buckets on his own and create and that's that's what gives me hope for the heat right like it can you have to get that right around him though you can't just keep giving him the ball and making it Janice go like that's he is incredible but he needs he needs help with that that's that that Milwaukee team is what they have to try to find you find them a wing that can play a little bit and get some buckets and and and what not and then you get him a above average and I'm doing Drew this is a disturbance because he was better than that but an above average PG who's played at a high level and and he can you know handle the reins of that offense and you have something working but right now it's tough to watch hey Howard is this a warning label for anybody in the modern area to light with their thinking about just building this super team are going to go get a generational superstar in trades or free agencies is this type of situation or at least early on right now just a warning label for every team around try to do that or is it a bit more nuanced than that right now I think every team that could get Janice would go and get Janice at this stage like and you again you deal with the consequences and the the roster build later it's just like they would have almost this is going to sound like I'm going to commit multiple acts of heresy over the next minute brace yourselves fucking girl this would have almost been easier if they were importing Janice with almost a Baron roster meaning no BAM because you BAM was your best player and he's the hardest one for Janice to fit with that doesn't mean it can't work but it's a bigger challenge than if your best player had been Tyler hero or something and if and Tyler were still there right you know what I mean like there's it's it's it's who you brought in and who they now have to fit with the second act of heresy is maybe one way out of this would be to trade BAM for somebody else that fits better with Janice I know now the streets I have a tough thing about it is though is like is BAM is such a pillar that you don't want to say that right no of course not you don't want to say it and it's and he's also coming off a year where he scored eight three points at a game right like he is so miss it in that fabric he's the embodiment of he is the current embodiment of heat culture right haslam was that Dwayne Wade was that various others along the way have been that he is that torch carrier and to flush him to then accommodate your new superstar feels wrong immoral again heretical but you went out and got Janice one of the most dominant forces in the league and now you have to figure out how best to build around him again I'm not saying that means trade BAM but if you're asking for for ways out of this if the if this continues if they can't figure it out they don't have a whole lot else to trade for one and if functionally part of the problem is that your shiny new superstar doesn't fit with your incumbent star that's a problem so this is a way way way premature version of this conversation or premature framework to you and put this in but like I don't know man like in another month if things are still going badly like what else do you do so but again that's a really smart front office Pat Riley Andy Ellisburg the whole group there they have gone through various versions of the spulster there too like they know what they're doing and they know what the everything that we've just discussed the awkward fits and everything else and roster construction and how to they knew all this going in I think we have to give them some time and maybe they could do it between now and the trade deadline to at least make some adjustments both on the court and often terms of like you know recalibrating on the fly but they might not be able to and I think they kind of said at the outset in July like hey look this is get this you know we want them for the rest of his career this is not a one year is it not championship or bust this year well that's fine but but right now you're you're very far from even a shadow of contention so you don't want first year to be not even making the play in yeah so yeah like what I'm scared I'll go right to you Roger because I'm going to lead into I what I think you're going to say though but like I'm looking at their their upcoming schedule it's kind of there's not a there's some games in here that and theoretically they can go get they just lost some maps up close they got they got Atlanta tomorrow on Wednesday they have Indiana at home for the first NBA Cup game then they go on their first road trip they have they have both LA teams they have Golden State they have Sacramento they have Utah and then they have Cleveland coming back right they have to get the gimme games because they have a lot of hard games coming up on their schedule and all that to say to add to what Howard saying they're on for now if they're one in six one in seven that's when it gets really really tough right that's when bam starts hearing ghost in his head that's when you know people start asking questions about should the trade happen now right like it's gonna it could get really really spooky uh Halloween puns intended over the next couple of days Roger yeah I first of all I think they're going to win a few like they'll win some games you don't expect them to win I think I think you're catching night where somebody's hot they're making three easy other teams cold like it I believe that they're going to win a few of those games I think Howard made a really good point and that if anyone any organization I would trust to kind of figure out in a timely fashion how how to get this thing pointed in the right direction to build it around him I think I put the heat up there in in terms of organizations that I would trust they they be up there with a few others um I want to I just want to say this about bam it I don't think this is a bam playing poorly issue no that's that's that's not what this is this is a bam being asked to do things that aren't his usual role on teams and he hasn't figured that out and they haven't figured that out yet so like um if hypothetically bam were to be on another team tonight and they asked him to do things that he's used to doing in NBA games he's going to look like the bam from last year maybe not to the tune of 80 some points but like he hasn't forgotten how to play he's just being played out of out of his normal role to some degree and normal spots on the floor the the the the thing Howard and heat fan is look I'm not I'm not advocating for trading bam either I think this is early right like but let's say this does play itself out for a while and you're like wow this is bad and we can't figure it out he's he gets you need multiple pieces around y'allness to be the team that you want to be it's not like you need one with bam right so you need multiple pieces um because at that point if this continues bam bam clearly isn't a piece that fits organically with him so that then becomes your best avenue to go out and get the things that you would need right theoretically and so it's gonna be it's gonna be real interesting I think they win a few I don't know how those two work together if I'm being honest do I trust the heat yeah dude but like trust in the heat might mean trusting them to make a hard hard decision maybe maybe that's what it means but but but like this is weird and I don't know if you guys can follow me on this when you put the big three together right you had Kevin love kai re and LeBron or you had you know um paul pierce Kevin Carnetten weighed LeBron and Bush when the three got together you asked the third the third guy in the equation hey man you're gonna have to give up some of yourself dude you gotta give up you gotta give them a lot of yourself right this one's weird because it's only two of them and you're telling one of them hey man you can't be anything like yourself that's a problem and it also the number two guy that you're talking about is an institution on that team, right? It's kind of like in a weird way, like D-Wade, when LeBron came, except they were winning, like it was funny. I was looking at the starts for all the super teams and one of them, of our past year, I went to like 2010 to start with the big three in Miami, right? And just looking at the records to start. I remember like being in high school and like thinking, man, that was a very like tough start for that, that 2010 heat team, they only, it was a seven, it was a nine and seven start. It wasn't actually that bad, right? Like this is really, really, really tough, and it was also a difference in terms of like fit, right? With those two, with those two players. And it's really hard when the institutional guy has to take a back seat because, or how he acts or she acts that they act when they have to take a back seat because other people in that locker room are looking at that institutional guy to see how they should move, right? And that's the tough part that's going on right now is like, you see, bam, really going through it. And it is his team and it isn't a bit and the heat did this two theoretically get better. And it's just going to be a tough thing if they, if they, that's not, that's not bam's team, dude. That's, you can watch the game like, it's just not, it's not, that, that, that, I can speak some more to the difficulty, right, because at a point in time, it was bam's team, right? And it is, it's just not, yeah, but I would also just say like the, the super, this is not a super team to me. Super team is like three stars that come together, not two, but like, that's fair, that's fair. Like, if we're going to talk about super teams of the passion and even like the heat team, the heaters are a team, like, the thing with LeBron and Wade was they were both do it all superstars with the ball in their hands, right? Scoring, playmaking, leading, organizing, everything. And, Yannis is sort of a version of that, but bam is not, that's just not what his role was, right? Like, so it's a different kind of fit anyway, like if you got, you know, you get multiple guys who are awesome with the ball in their hands. All you have to do, and it's not an all you have to do, is just have them figure out what the best distribute, like that's what we're seeing in Philly, right? Max, he's best of the ball in his hands, Jaylin's best of the ball in his hands. LeBron's best of the ball in his, but you can kind of figure that out because you can also play off the ball. In this case, Yannis is a wrecking ball, ball handler type, and there's nobody else on that team really who, you know, graduated out earlier, like Chris Middleton and Drew Holliday, like their championship season, those guys both average like five, six assists a game as did Yannis, like, they had like multiple guys who can make plays. So like, this is just a different kind of and more difficult fit period. I do want to flag one thing to real quick. I want to say like one positive thing. Like Yannis had more assists in the loss to Dallas than he had in his first three games as a heat player combined. So like, I think he was trying to find the balance a little more and looking for teammates more and not just like, watch me go, I think it's a positive. The flip side though, and this is fucking small sample size theater to the nth degree. But it's just a, it's a, it's a glaring warning sign. Yannis is on off. There are plus two with him on the bench and minus 20 per 100, not, not totals per 100. There are minus 20 with him on the court. I just looked it up again and had to put my glasses on to look down to make sure that I was seeing the minus correctly. So like it, it, the format is not working right now. And so Eric Spolster's got a lot to fix. Yeah. Can I ask one last question? I don't even sure. I mean, I did not intend on talking heat this long. And I, I, the, the, the BAM of it all because I was thinking about what I said, like, yeah, he's not a part of the big three. I tried to draw an analogy to that, like he's not a big three, but he was being billed in, in Miami as a, a, maybe not a superstar, but like a star, no, like, what am I, am I miss, miss, is he a, is he a role player? Like you're asking him to be a role. Like if you're telling me, I mean, I do anything with a ball like, Oh, then, then what I'm saying is we've grossly overvalued who BAM at a bio is as, and, and I'm not saying that definitively. I'm saying if what, if what we are saying is he can't do anything with a basketball. And he's, then he is a role player. Well, you need to ask yourself this question during their finals runs. Was he bonafied the best player on the team? No. Not at that point. No, not at that point. Yeah, I'm not, I'm not saying that the heat's very, but like you, you, you, you clock the, I'll, I'll be honest, man, you, you can clock what a player is. Now there are exceptions to every rule, right? But you can clock what a player is through their first six years in the league, right? Like you can clock what they are going to be in their trajectory. And when BAM, he was always like a really, really, I would say teetering on star, I would say like teetering to like not start like stars. Right. He's a three time all star and a no time all NBA player. And his last all star appearance was in 2024, right? Right. So that is, that is what the, then he's all the same old offensive. Yeah. But he's paid like you're really paid like a superstar. He's paid like one, though. And that's, that's the distinction there. And I don't, you know, I don't talk as pockets get your money. But like that's just that is a circumstance is that he finds himself into, right? Yeah, um, sometimes, you know, this is the other thing that that runs in with the, uh, with the heat. Sometimes, and I'm seeing this in the Bay Area right now. Sometimes the best player on the court is, I mean, the best player on the team isn't on the court. You can take that for what you will, right? And that's, I think, sometimes been, you know, what, what's been happening in Miami. So we'll see who a really long on the heat. It's a great heat discussion. Let's take a quick break. Um, what do you talk about? Okay. C and it's going to be sad. No, the sad segment up next and we are back, um, a couple of days ago that the NBA world was rocked, um, when Jay, uh, went down with an injury, he dislocated his left ankle and broke a fibya. I have not seen the, uh, the video. I will not see it. I will not even look at it. Nobody sent it to me. It was, I, I can imagine it was gruesome cliff hit me with some crying emojis and that's all I needed to see. Um, but he's out, um, indefinitely, probably the, the, the definitely the rest of the season. Case in Wallace also torn labor, um, got to shout that out as well. Like just in the same game, that is pretty tough. Um, Sam Presley had a press conference yesterday, which I got to say, man, like, no, we give, especially on this program, we give a lot of stuff to people that like maybe aren't the best at speaking, you know, for the team and Sam Presley was not one of those people. We did a really great job in the 30 minute press or out in OK, so you just being a steward of the franchise that he's representing, um, and, and, and we'll get into those comments in a second. But it's almost weird for me to ask, uh, you guys this, um, I, my question here was like, how do the thunder win a title without him? And I just think that that's just so low. How do the thunder move on from this situation, Roger? Like how do they, how do they go forward? I think is the better question, organizationally, after something as gruesome and as, as just catastrophic as this happens because this team is so close as team, just loves each other's organization is a tight knit one. How do you go, go on from this? Well, I mean, you're professional basketball player. So, you know, we all feel terrible for what happened, um, from afar. If you were there, you saw it, you saw his emotions, like you got, your heart had to just break. But at the end of the day, you are pro. So you have a job to do, um, and I, you know, I hate to always use the term compartmentalized, but like, you really have to do that. Like that, that fucking sucks. Like that is terrible. That's gruesome. It will be at the hospital. We'll be there to see you. If your family needs anything, we'll connect our families. Like, well, we're going to get, we'll rally around you. But we then got to go out there and play basketball games, man, because, you know, that's what we're paid to do. And, and you just keep stacking those days, Logan, until, until you fall back into the normalcy of it, right? Like you just keep showing up, keep working, keep going to the meetings. I know this sounds silly, but that, that's what you do because that's the job. Um, as a team, I think they're, you know, on court, not it, they're clearly not as good without them, but they have played for long stretches with without him. So I think they can weather that to a degree. I think there's a ceiling on who they are at times when they don't have those extra guys that can play make out there, um, not unlike the heat, but, but, uh, you know, that, I think they weather that. I mean, they just came off of not having him, right? It's got to be heartbreaking, though, to have had the familiarity again and falling back into old rhythms and see how it clicks when he's out there and then have it ripped away from you, but you just, it's, it's always next man up and like the, the, you know, I've been on teams and we've sustained injuries and training camp that you thought would derail your entire season. Like I've talked about Amari Stadamari, my first year in Phoenix. I got there and he was out in training camp. You're like, what the fuck? Like this in training camp and you, you show up the next day and you who, you show up the next day, you who, you start the regular season and, and guys are pros. They step up. They make plays and we had a really, really good season. We were too probably capped in what we could be because we didn't have Amari, but I mean, we got to the Western Conference Finals that year, you know? So like, you just got to keep hooping man. You figure it out. Guy, step up. There's opportunity for other dudes to, to get more minutes and, and, and, and grow their games and provide a service that they ordinarily wouldn't if he was there and that's what you do. What are the last few days? he's showed you, but okay, see, Howard. - Well, they smoked the sun's last night, despite not having, I mean, I know it's the fucking sun. I get it, look, you don't need to like do the chagrin thing, all right? (laughing) Okay, okay, okay. You still have to, you still have to beat teams having to play to win the game. You play everybody puts their shoes on, just like everybody else. - You asked how they responded. I'm telling you, like, you get over as Roger just eloquently noted, like, this is how NBA players are wired and teams are wired. And I remember being shocked by this in a way, or just, not, it took me, I'm an overly empathetic person, and I, like, somebody goes down. - It's one of your best qualities, brother. It's one of your best qualities. - I just, it was early in my Laker beat days, and I remember, it might've been like Rick Fox or somebody, and it was like some devastating injury, and I remember how quickly they were just all matter of fact about, well, you know, we're gonna plug in Devin George, and we do this, and I'm like, oh, and like, this was awful, and they're like, what do you want us to do? And that's kind of how it is. And it was like, the reality hit me very early quickly, in my NBA writing career, that like, there's this cold-hearted reality. The games keep coming. And as Roger noted, like, you're professional. You're obligated to go do your best, go play, plug in whoever, and move on. And it doesn't mean that in your private time, you don't feel, you know, terrible for your teammate. And as Roger said, rally around him. But like, the season doesn't stop. So you just keep going. So look, no surprise at all that the Thunder, who obviously have won a championship, and we're, you know, one of the youngest teams ever to do it, but like, we're professional and mature beyond their years when they did it, that they would be able to take the court with JW, JW, JW out. And Kason Wallace gone too, and just go out and still blow the doors off the suns, who, despite their, you know, issues, are still like a professional basketball team with some talent on it. Like that to me showed you what you can expect from the Thunder. They are not going to miss a beat. They're going to miss Jalen Williams, but they are not going to stop being who they are. I was on Zack's show yesterday, and he asked me the question, and we immediately both answered, yes, can they still contend for the title? Or does this take them out? And we both were like, no, they can both still win the championship. But at that time, we weren't aware of how bad Kason Wallace's injury was. Like it was clear, Jalen Williams was going to be gone for the season, but Kason Wallace, that was a mystery at the time we recorded. Now you're down probably both those guys for probably the rest of the season. And I want a perimeter defender and your second area scoring option, too, that's tough. And Jadob's a pretty great defender at his best, too. On top of that, guys, they're really down five players. They're down five players from last season, because they offloaded Lou Dorte and Aaron Wiggins and Isaiah Joe, a starter and two key reserves from their championship run for cap reasons, for second apron reasons. And the reason that they felt that they could do that comfortably was, well, we've got all this amazing depth. We've got Jadob coming back and he's going to be an all NBA caliber player again. We've got Kason Wallace to plug in for Lou Dorte. We've got Jared McCain and AJ Mitchell. And like we're, we are just flush with guys. We can afford to offload three rotation, guys, because we could just plug three more guys in. Well, now you just lost two. And suddenly that depth is being tested to the extreme. Like they can't afford a single other bumper brews at this stage. And they still have very good depth relative to most teams. And they still have the two-time MVP and a really great player in Chet Hongren. But like, we praised them for the last few years for like, this is a team that wins not just on high level talent, but on depth. They're like the first depth champion in some ways. Well, that depth is like, you know, devastated right now. Part of that's because they, they, they volunteered to lose players this summer because of the fucking second apron. Like this is, this is the cruelty of the system at play. Kai, can I ask you guys a question? What, what, where did, where does, where does this hurt them more offensively or defensive? Like because they've, they, you know, they've been defensively. I think they're defensively. I think offensively. They still have Chet and Isaiah Hartnstein back here. So there's a one thing Dimara, right? Like the back line is still the back line is good, but that's what you talked about depth. And she's a good, a good defender on his own, right? Yeah. And you've still got Alex Caruso. Although Caruso gets banged up a lot and he's asked to do a lot. So, I mean, this seems, I know what this seems like though. This seems like one of those, you know, the, the, okay, C is always a team that is like a high one season, right? That, that always has to have the high one season 60 plus. I think the biggest thing right now is health for them. If they, they don't have to blow the doors off, they have to just be fresh enough to go in into the postseason type of team. I think that that's where they have, have they have kind of aggressive, aggressive too on that. The other thing now, I want to get to Raj's point on this because you guys mentioned Chet Hombren. And this is the thing that I kept thinking about after this injury, like after just thinking about how horrible this injury is. But I kept thinking about Chet Hombren, man. And I do think it's time to take the training wheels off on how we talk about him this season. He has to be a bonafide dude, right? Like he has to be a bonafide number two. And it has to be night in and night out. He, we've been waiting for him to try to take this step that he, that we've been waiting on. And I think there's been a lot of excuses that have been, then made on his behalf and why he hasn't taken that step that we haven't all really been seen. But he has to be that dude. He has to step into that role. He has all the ability. He has been able to do that in spurt. So I think, you know, in his saga days and in high school, but he has to be that. He has to take that next step for them to even be in the contention of a champion. And I always see like, we talk about the heat. It's a different example here. But when I see the heat, there's always just like, ah, they're not getting to this next step. There's not, they're, they're, they're, they're, they're trying hard, but they're not getting it. I feel that on a similar way to Chet Hongren where it's like, that's all of the tools. Has everything there for him. But it's just, there's always seems to be a ceiling on his game. He needs to break through that shit for them to be good, Roger. And that, that's the thing I keep thinking about. And he has to do it. We can't, we gotta take the training wheels off. All right, look, I, I, I want to be honest with you. I, the reason I, like, let me just go back. The reason I asked you guys about the depth and which one it hurt more was because I always felt them when I turned them on as a really good defensive team that when they got into their depth, it became a suffocating defensive team. And like, and, and yes, all that around the rim is still there, but I'm talking about perimeter wise. Like I remember watching them at times last year being like, Jesus Christ, that's gotta be, that's gotta be just overwhelming to have to deal with that kind of pressure. And they're in your passing lanes. And they're, you know, like I, I really do think that's gonna, that, I mean, that hurts them on that end of the floor. But to back to what you were saying about Chet, I kind of see it like, bam, like you're not, he's probably, he's not number two. Like I just, I don't, I don't think that's his game. I don't think he's a number two dude. I think they're, and you know, that was, that's what capped them last year in terms of their ceiling. You throw J Dub into that series where you have a number two, a real number two, then, then he gets to be who I think he's supposed to be. And you're not having all these beefs with him. You're looking because it doesn't result in the loss. You know what I'm saying? Like, yeah, sure. I think that's asking a lot of him. I just don't, I just, and it's not a, I don't mean it to be a knock if it sounds like one. I think he's fantastic for what they ask him to do. Sure, there are things I want him to do better, but I don't think he becomes a number two this year to where everyone's looking around the league saying, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, that's, that's real. 'Cause again, you would see it, right? You would already see it, or see Sparta seven. He would, he would show you that it's just, it is frustrating. I want to get to Fandoah's to win the title before this was happening. I think it was the right around Spurs, Thunder, they were tied together. And now the Spurs are a favorite to win the title. My thing is like, how does this reset the Western Conference Howard? Who are you looking here? Who are you looking to kind of fill in that void that we're already seeing that this injury kind of creates? Yeah, I mean, I'm still, I had picked the Spurs coming into the season for whatever the hell, that's worth. Buy a little bit over the Thunder. I think it's still the Spurs and the Thunder at the top until further notice. Let's see how Oklahoma rebounds from this. Let's see what AJ Mitchell can do in Jalen Loom's place as he did last season like that. The good news weirdly for the Thunder is that, they're not used to being down this many bodies, but they're used to playing without Jato. Like, AJ Mitchell was just a revelation last season. And Jato only played 33 regular season games. And they still won what, 60 plus. And he only played like five games in their playoffs. And they still made games seven of the Western Conference finals. Like they, they have shown they can win at a high level without Jalen Williams. It will be tested again this season. What I do think has happened is that the margin between the Thunder, and you, if you want to say the Spurs too, because they're like scuffling a little bit out of the gate, like maybe the gap isn't as big as we all built up. I think it will be. I think the Spurs are going to figure it out. And I think they're going to put definitely distance between them and the rest of the conference. And maybe some between them and the Thunder as it goes. But, yeah, fairly you could say, well, this kicks open the door just a little bit further for the Rockets, for the Timberwolves. Who look great by the way. The Rockets look great. So as do the Timberwolves with one exception. The Lakers, you could throw in there. The Nuggets are having their own issues. So I'm not quite ready to say that, but reasonably, you know, and they've got frickin' nicolayokage. So those other four teams that have been like what we've been all dismissing as kind of this second tier jumble. Like they all just got a little bit more hope. The door cracked a little bit wider open because of the unfortunate injuries with the thunder. But I don't know that we're seeing a reset yet in the West race, but I do think maybe it'll be a little more competitive than what we thought a week ago. Alright, so quick break. What to talk about the Nix real quick. Okay, and we're back. Okay, the next thing I wanna talk about is the classic thing that happens in the podcast world where you finish your podcast, it's all produced, it's ready to go, it's ready to get shipped to Netflix and Spotify and all those wonderful people over there. And then a story happens that would've been like damn. That'd been great to talk on real ones, shit. And it happened on Thursday evening, I think, when the athletic reported that, let me just tell the story, this was by the great Joel Vardin. Seven league sources, all speaking on condition of Anatomy so they could not talk freely, said the Nix assistant coaches did not get their rings on ban or night. Two of those sources told the athletic that the assistants learned over Tuesday that they would not be getting their rings that evening which came as no surprise because they had not been fitted for one and the boxes that the rings, the boxes of the rings that we saw on television, may or may not have had anything in there, right? But that's not even the hard part. The hard part happened when, according to the athletic, the team sent out a fishing email to all of its employees about to get, to just like say, hey, we're getting one in a championship, let's get fitted for your rings. And it winds up being a fishing email and a click, the link is click to a cybersecurity survey be for it from the team. And since that has happened, there's been a statement by the Nix to the New York Post to Fond Bundy and the Nix say there's a great deal of misinformation regarding the championship rings. The plan has always been a distribute more than 275 rings in jewelry to the people and the organization were part of last season success as it's common with many teams. The players were always supposed to get their rings in the opening night and everyone else will receive theirs in about four to six weeks. Regarding the fishing email, the process of securing and reminding our employees to protect our IP was not a mistake, but the choice to use the ring to do it was a mistake and we apologize to our employees and fans. Howard, the fuck are the Nix doing? You know, we had a lot of choices on what we could have talked about today. Logan decided to go negative. We could have spent 30 minutes talking about the Axel Lennonborg just like destroying the nuggets last night, but no, we're gonna talk about the Nix. Look, I, first of all, great story by Joe Varden, hell of a flex when it's 17 sources or seven sources. That's phenomenal. - We need a lot of people pissed off. - We verified the living fuck out of this. And yeah, Logan, a lot of people pissed up. And when the Nix get all, you know, they get their get all backs against the wall and just start issuing statements left and right. You may have reasons for like, "Oh, well, we were gonna do this and we always plan to do this." Like, your employees are pissed off. And if they weren't, it would not have been leaked. Joe Varden would have never gotten wind of it if it weren't for the fact that you either were denying a lot of people the rings that they normally would have gotten. Or maybe you intended to do the right thing and you just didn't communicate it. Either way, it's your fault. Like, this is not a media creation. This is the organization screwing up and then trying like crazy to put the fire out in the wake of it. It ain't great. I will say, you know, we are Spotify employees, Logan. We get those, is it Hoax Hunt? Hoax Hunt, I can never tell. Like, we get those phishing emails and it is. It's a little test thing. And you know, if you click this-- - You know what's hell is funny about this? - Oh, we got you, bro. - Then how is that? - I always, whenever I see those emails, I'm like, I shouldn't click this. I really shouldn't click this. - I'm really good at this. - I'm less than a while. - I'm just kidding. - I don't think it happened and I've got to click it and I get-- - Yeah, and then you get-- - And then you get the Tisk, Tisk messaging back. I'm really good at this. Like, I always get, like, you were a mom-- - You click the link. You click the link and it's immediately like yo. You're an idiot. It's the email that says, you're an idiot for clicking this. You know you're an idiot for clicking this. It's always that way, whatever. - And now I'm wondering, does MSG, does the garden have the same-- they also using Hoax Hunt, H-O-X Hunt? Those are fun. Why you would choose, I, listen, I believe in cybersecurity, I think it's very important. However, did you need to use fucking championship rings as the bait? Everybody is gonna be all excited. And you're like, that's how you're gonna, you're gonna be like, ah-ha-ha. We got you. Not only were we not giving you championship ring, but this was a fishing test. Like, what are we doing? Find a different way to test your employee's cybersecurity awareness, Garden. Yes, this is not great. And it just adds to the bad vibes that have been swirling ever since Dolan put on that hideous orange jacket back in June, which he keeps wearing in public. Like the second apron, line the sand, letting Mitchell Robinson go, stalling on contract talks with Carl Anthony Towns and Josh Hart, and then saying, we're not gonna talk about it anymore. Like, all of this stuff, like, bad vibes. It may not matter in the end, but they're not looking great on the court and the vibes are-- What do you need to talk about the pending White House visit that might happen that's also lingering over this season? Yeah, that's a thing. It's a lot under shoulders right now. It's a thing. Oh, okay, Roger, just from a player standpoint, this shit happens, what does this do for vibes in an organization? All the things that we said that you've read, like, if you're out of player, I feel like, if you're winning a championship, and if you're trying to be a good team, this other stuff just seems like a distraction to vibes. And how do you think this effect? They're all in three. We haven't talked about the basketball of it, but this specific type of things happen to this effect. I mean, I don't, yeah, I guess if coaches didn't get their rings, I would, that would get to me as a player, right? 'Cause like, you'd probably hear about that in the locker room, but the rest of it, fishing emails and so on, like, we don't. I don't even, I don't even open emails now. I'm like, we know, I'm like, I ain't nobody. I don't even worry about a fucking fishing email throughout the company when you're playing, man. Like that, that's not affecting you in any way, shape and form, you know, I don't think it has much of a effect on the team. Now, the contracts, like, you know, if there's repeated things from ownership or the front office that are always contentious and you guys feel like you have to fight for everything as a collective there, and if it's never easy, I can't speak to any of that, I'm not there, but if that's the culture within the building, then that can have an effect on the team, but just generally, like, botching ring night for the coaches and the fishing emails, I don't know that that really affects the team in any way, shape or form. It's just crazy Howard, because we were just talking about last week, like how awesome the ring ceremony itself turns out it wasn't a ring ceremony, it was a box ceremony, but we thought we, (laughing) - That was just, that was for a few coaches, this is the way I understood that, right? Like the players got their rings, right? - Yeah. - We don't know, did we, yeah, okay. They didn't get all that in place. - I think that's different, if we didn't get our rings, like I think if the larger group didn't get their rings, then I would have a different answer to what you just asked me. But if it was a few coaches, like, we'd probably be pissed, but I don't know that that's, that's really moving the needle. - Before we get to the new segment that we are about to start off, I do wanna say, I found something, you know, I fact checked, Howard. And I think this is correct. Rick Fox suffered a torn Paranoius longest tendon and aligned a misplaced heel in his left foot in April of 27, 2003, during a first round - Minnesota? - Minnesota Timberwolves, yep, there it was, yeah. I remember, 'cause it's such a weird thing. I don't know if this, if it happens for you guys, you can remember where you were standing for certain things. And I just remembered it being in the Minnesota Timberwolves arena in that hallway talking to like Phil Jackson about, you know, whatever. And like, that was, yeah, that was a seriously devastating injury for them, a key player, you know, a beloved member of their core group. And a really important time. So yeah, no, thank you for looking that up. And thank you for trying to pronounce whatever the heck that was. - The torn tendon in a leg. - Yeah, let's just leave it at that point in the foot. - Yeah, that's right, that's right. - All right, we are now going to introduce a news segment called "On the Road with Raja." We have the graphic right here, okay? We've really spruced this up. Raja now has a son in college right now. And he's, that comes with a lot of hijinks as we've been hearing about off-mic. We want to bring that to you guys. There was, I think there's going to be two stories here. I don't know, but there was a story. - I don't know. - Dallas, maybe, what the hell happened in Dallas for the Red River rivalry? What the fuck happened? - No, you had a time in Dallas. - Forgive me, this is the first time. And we're, like, I'll get better at this segment, I guess. So we went, it was Dia's first Red River rivalry. And from the East Coast, like, I didn't know what the Red River rivalry was all about. But I found myself in Dallas trying to make the team 2003 maybe the same year your I was talking about, and I was standing at the wind 'em and a toll at the time. And there were just people everywhere. It was like festive. I was like, what the, what is going on? And they were like, oh, Oklahoma, Texas today, Red River rivalry. So like, and I'm a true college football fan. Like, I've always been, but I didn't know anything about it. So ever since then, I bucket list for me, right? Red River rivalry. What do you was playing in it this year, or his team was playing in it? So Ty and myself were my wife were on an official visit out in Tempe, Arizona with ASU basketball. And Ty and I stopped in Dallas to head out to the Texas State Fair to watch Oklahoma and Texas play. I don't have a great story other than, like, if you've never been to the Texas State Fair on Red River rivalry day, it's pretty incredible. Like, I don't know what it looks like ordinarily when the game's not there. I've been to a lot of fairs, but the Texas State Fair was out of control in the best possible way. Like, there were people everywhere. There was all kind of cool food that vibes were incredible. Parking was less than desirable. I wound up, I wound up, there was a dude offering, like $40 spots, right? Now, I knew damn well, this was a public street, but I'm trying to get in and out of there. So I paid him $40 to park on the street and I, he gave me one spot. I was like, I don't like that fucking spot. I'm gonna get boxed in there. Let me get that other spot. So it gave me the other spot and Ty and I went about our business. So we're in the state fair. The game was not what we expected it to be, the longhorn. Sorry, pal. Come away with the win. But the game itself, relatively old stadium, half for 51 way is Texas fans. From 50, the other way is Oklahoma fans. That place was bananas. It was absurd. It was truly like, check one off my bucket list for going to that bad boy. But when we're leaving, Ty and I looked at each other, it's like third quarter. I'm getting a bad feeling. I'm like, yeah, I don't like fucking traffic. I'm like, Ty, are you ready? We had been up at like four in the morning to catch the game. So we got up out of there, got back to the car and guess what I was? Boxing the fuck in. Boxed in. I couldn't have been, I, people. Was it because other people had the same ideas, you? Were they like, yeah, we got to get the fuck out of here too? Okay, buddy, where I picked a spot that was almost impossible to box me in, right? 'Cause there was open road right in front of me and he was parking cars on both sides of the street. But he parked a duly like one of those big trucks with the four tires in the back. Yep. One car in front of me and I couldn't get out of that son of a gun. So I wound up like just beating the shit out of this rental car. Like I took it up on the curb, scratched the hole undercarriage over some roots. Like, we made the shit happen 'cause I wasn't getting stuck there and got out of there. Not a great story, I'm not a great storyteller, but I would say to anyone who finds themselves like either in and around Dallas during the Red River rivalry or you wanna go see something really cool and check it off your bucket list. If you're a college football fan, there are some environments you have to see and that bad boy at that Texas Fates there, Texas State Fair is one of them. I have a question. Somewhere else and then take an Uber. Do not try to park them. I have a question for you, Roger. And this is a very deep cut. We in Howard know this about you, which you're fucking terrible with rental cars. Why is it, why is rental cars your Achilles heel? Like this segment should be sponsored by Hertz or something. Like on the road with Roger sponsored by Hertz. Can we do this? I love Hertz. I love Hertz. So my name's on the board. I'm just walking to the car. I love Hertz. That's tight. But I'm just saying because last time we had before this one, we had a rental car situation over the summer. I think in 25 where like you were going to Atlanta and you just misplaced. Mis time with a rental car situation and you'd say. Rectified. Rectified, right? Like I'm only running from Hertz because my name's not on the board. I don't ever have to stand in a line to get the car. Now they might do that in other places. I don't know. But Hertz, I'm a gold club member. So I don't have to go stand in that line. So if you have 300 people in the line, not my problem anymore. What that really boiled down to for me is, it's why I don't go to games. You guys asked me all the time why I don't go to games. When the games add Texas and like I can basically like walk to it from where I'm staying, not a problem. If I have to drive, if I have to park, if I have to deal with the crowds getting in and out, it ruins the experience for me a little bit, right? This one was so good that it didn't. But if it hadn't been the Texas State Fair and that was just a regular game, like, nah, dawg, like I don't want to do all of that. It's too much, it's too much. - Could you just look the guy like an extra 40 to not be boxed in? Was that an option? Like did he have like a whole pay schedule where it's like, well, I, you know, I could get you a spot, but if you really will, like some negotiating going on. - So we were, there were so many dudes out there asking for money and I thought I had gotten the premier spot. - Howard, like I had gotten a pretty good spot. - You felt really good about yourself. You were like, hell yeah, I did this, we're good. - I didn't feel good about any of that shit because I told Ty, I was like, these are my fucks. I don't have to pay him, but I'm gonna, just so I know this car is safe here and we can not worry about anything. It was a day though, like, those are the memories Ty and I'll never forget that. So like, it was worth it. - Last question, how much do you have to love someone to go to a game? (laughing) - Oh, bro, yeah, listen, how about this? I mean, you got probably got to be one of my family members for sure, and ass. - For Nash. - Like, preseason, for Steve. - Well, the last time you went, was that - That's the way, yeah, yeah, yeah. - You want to look proud. - That was preseason, bro. - No, no, no, I will say this, you did go, I remember this, this is a story time with Lolo, but I remember this happened in the 22 season when you went all the way out to go see Nash when they played Brooklyn. When Brooklyn played Miami because you sent pictures. - That wasn't a preseason? - No, that was late in the season. 'Cause I remember because I saw, this one, this before Roger was at the ringer because on that same trip that Brooklyn was on, I saw Howard, and we got a great meal in Brooklyn, and then you sent me pictures from like Miami when Brooklyn was on that same trip, and I'll show you the pictures. And then it was a picture of KD with your kids, and it was a picture with Kairi and your kids, and it was a picture 'cause you had beef with Kairi at that point, but so I squashed a beef, and you had, it was a hug of you and Kairi. - That was a regular season game. - I remember. - I had no beef with Kairi. Okay, maybe, but that's in my city. I'll just tell you like this. Right now my wife and I are beefing over like dea plays and or their team plays in like Baton Rouge. They got one coming up in Missouri, and she wants to go see her baby, right? Like she's like, "I want to go see him." I'm like, "I am not fucking going to sit in some raggedy ass seats in Baton Rouge and get stuck in Baton Rouge." And that month I was not even to play him. - I'm not doing it. So when he gets his ass on that field, I'll be there, but I'll be right there. - I'm not taking my ass in Baton Rouge. - The splinters in my ass. - Out there, I'm ready to go. I am not going. Hey Howard, he did the thing where he says, "I'm not good at storytelling," and it was his brother. Like it's hilarious. He did the thing again. - It's tremendous. - I love how you're an emo Virgo like myself. I appreciate that about you, sir. Good job, keep continuing to do that. And watch, I gotta predict you. You go go to one of them two games. I bet you that. I bet you go to one of them two games. - I might have to concede something. I don't know if I can do it. - All right man, that has been another, that has been, we're gonna try to do that every Tuesday, especially during the football season. That is on the road with Roger Bell. All of his hubris and all the things that are going on down the recruiting trail from Roger and also him being a dad. Okay, all right that's been the latest edition. Real ones, we will see you guys later in the week. Ah, ah, ah, all the shits. Bye. - That's your 21 years and older and select states for Kansas and affiliation with this Kansas Star Casino or 18 and older in president D.C. or Wyoming, opt and required. Bonus issued is now in travel profit boost tokens. Restrictors apply including any token expiration and max wage or amount. See terms at sportsbook.fandal.com. Family problem, call 1-800-GAMBLER or 1-800-MY-RESET, call 1-888-8-789-7777-7 or visit ccpg.org/chat in Connecticut. Or visit MD-Gambling Help and Maryland. Hope is here, visit gambling-helpline-ma.org or call 1-800-327-5050 for 24/7 support and Massachusetts or call 1-877-8 hope in Y or text hope in Y in New York for Louisiana. Call 1-877-770-7867.