The goop Guide to Raising a Family in Hollywood, With Zoe Saldaña

This episode is brought to you by Amazon. I love this time of year. There's a certain magic to the season, the music, the traditions, the gathering over incredible food. But when it comes to gift giving, I am very intentional. It's never about excess or extravagance. It's about thoughtfulness. I want to give things that carry genuine meaning and feel personal. And because of that, I have to start planning early, like right now, early. Thankfully, Amazon is here for the early shoppers with a huge range of gifts for every passion and price point. Get a head start on holiday gifting with Amazon's low prices. Shop now at amazon.com slash holiday. Hi, I'm Gwyneth Paltrow. Welcome to my new show, The Goop Guide. Each week, we'll be tackling a subject with experts, artists, thinkers, and friends. The show is driven by my curiosity and pursuit of resonance and inspiration. Today's guest is someone you know as Gamora, Natiri, and Joe McNamara, and now as an Oscar winner for Amelia Perez. Zoe Saldana is the highest-grossing actress of all time. But ask her about her proudest work, and she'll talk about her three boys. They've grown up on film sets around the world, and Zoe has found clever ways to give them a normal childhood on the road, like buying school uniforms at Target so class on location still feels like real school. We talk about life after the Oscar, cooking with family, and why being present is her biggest priority. This is The Goop Guide to Raising a Family in Hollywood with Zoe Saldana. This episode is brought to you in partnership with Lux by Airbnb. When I travel with family and friends, I love exploring a new place. But there's something equally special about having a home to come back to, and that's where Airbnb comes in. Whether we're making breakfast in the kitchen or gathering on the couch to watch a movie or simply enjoying the in-between moments, I love that staying in homes on Airbnb gives us a space to slow down, connect, and make the kinds of memories that always stay with me. Lately, I've been dreaming about some kind of modernist cabin in the Hudson River Valley with Brad. I'm always drawn to homes with character, and a really great dining space where we can linger over a meal and enjoy great conversation. For those occasions that call for something a little more special, there's Lux by Airbnb. It's a collection of Airbnb's most exceptional homes chosen for their beautiful design, character, and quality. They're vetted in person, so you know you're getting something exceptional. People love to ask me things. How to sleep better? Where to eat the best cacio e pepe in Rome? Or it's weird to use an obsidian gua sha tool on a plane? All my answers, finally, in one place. Listen to The Goop Guide with Gwyneth Paltrow, where I tell you everything, or almost everything. I didn't know you were born in New Jersey. Yes. You're a Jersey girl? Not really. You know what's interesting is I wish I can claim that I am, but I was- What do you wish? Well, because- Because I was on paper, I was born in Passaic, New Jersey. Passaic, New Jersey. Passaic. And like, only Paul Rudd is the only other person in our industry that- Born in Passaic? Yeah, and he brought up, he was like, you're from Passaic. And I'm like, yes, I am. Wow. But my mom, my grandmother, living in the Bronx since 1961, brought my mother from the Caribbean, from Dominican Republic, when my mom was like, officially, my mom was like, and then my mom finished out her high school, met my dad in New York, and we were, you know, and then they moved to New Jersey. My older sister, just by a year, was born also in New Jersey. I was born there. When I was three months old, my mom was like, I'm going back to New York. And at that time, my grandmother was already living in Jackson Heights in Queens. So then my younger sister was born in Flushing. So as long as I can remember, my level- You're a New Yorker. I'm a New Yorker, yeah. But I feel like when I'm in Jersey, I'm like, oh, okay, this is, you know. And what was it like growing up in New York? And did you guys live, did you live with your grandmother? I mean, my grandmother, you know how it's like in a block, in a New York block, you have like four buildings facing on this side, you know, maybe two buildings or commercial sort of stores on the lateral sides, and then like more buildings in the back. And then we all kind of share a backyard, right? Oh, that's nice. My grandmother lived in the building next to ours on the first floor, and we live in the first floor. So we would open our window and go, abuela, and she would be like, hey. That's like a sitcom. I've never seen that. You call like a neighborhood, you know? And it was, it was like a sitcom. And life was beautiful. And- You had a happy childhood? We did. But there was a before and after. What? In our childhood, because we were struck by death, you know, my father died when I was nine. So it almost felt like happiness, joy was evergreen. You know, that was the before. Yeah. His passing and then- What did he die from? A car accident, 38 years old, so sudden. And so, and then after his death, my mom was, I mean, my mom turned 30 when he passed away. Like that's how young she was. And I felt like after his death, joy was seasonal. Like joy was not something that was just automatically around. It was kind of like perennial, you know? And that was- Changes your baseline. Well, it forces you to just grow up a little too soon because you're just aware and that happiness is fleeting. But so is sadness, right? So, you know, I- There's a loss that comes with that. But also again, you know, we began to see my mom very early on as someone that was just deeply human. Yeah. Where she can be strong, but she can also be weak and vulnerable. And that made, that brought, that brought up a superhero in us to try to be there for her just as much as she was there for us. And was she working? Yes. I mean, she went from being a stay-at-home mom to having the, to be, you know, she had to work, a full-time mom and the accountant. And my mom, the thing about like, she was so young and such a stay-at-home mom, my dad managed all the finances. So she had to learn so many things after his death. And it was very overwhelming for her. I bet. But she instilled in us this, this will to always be financially educated, you know, just be financially able to manage your own account, your own money, and so that you can make your own choices. Very early on, we learned that because we saw her struggle with that. Yeah. Did, do you think that watching your mom, this metamorphosis from her being a stay-at-home mom to having to kind of be the captain of the ship, do you think that impacted how you approach work or your desire to work? Yeah. I mean, well, I mean, she was always the captain of the ship. I, you know, I come from a very matriarchal, um, structure of a family within our Latino, you know, um, household, uh, uh, even though, you know, the Latino culture is still very patriarchal and very machista from my great grandmother to my grandmother, my mother, they're just doers, you know, but seeing her be very vulnerable, uh, cause we went from being in New York to then going back to Latin America. And at that time, I was like, I'm going to go back to Latin America. I'm still in the late eighties and nineties, you know, society was very conservative. It's very religious and it's also very patriarchal. So women have to really work double to be seen and heard. And my mom had to learn a lot of things from scratch and it was very empowering eventually for her, but at first it was, it was difficult and, um, and it made her very vulnerable. And, and yes, I think that that's where I learned. I got to, I got to do these things for myself so that I can in turn do these things for all the women in my family. Wow. So how old were you when you guys went back? Um, from New York, uh, we moved to the Caribbean cause we did like the reverse migration. Um, I was 10, I had just turned 10 and we stayed there for seven years and then we came back to New York. Okay. And what was it like there? I, you know, it was a culture. It was a cultural clash because it was the place that we used to go to every year for Christmas. So it was the fun zone. You know, you go there for Christmas, uh, for summers, you eat rice and beans with your great grandparents. All the cousins are together, all the aunts and uncles. And, um, but just to stay there after the summer's over and you have to, you know, it was very homogenous. So you, you speak just Spanish and you are very Catholic. Girls have to be a certain way, and boys can do whatever they want. And, you know, that was hard for us because we were such New Yorkers and my grandmother and my mom were also very progressive women having to kind of tone down and revisit, come back to these norms. It was just difficult. So they kind of raised us in a way where, okay, let's be compliant because we don't want to rock the boat. We're being supported by you know, our entire community. But at home, it was like, you're strong. You know, you don't need to, you know, take anything and learn everything on your own and work hard. And, you know, so they really instilled. And we saw, we saw them be so unconditional. Like I remember one, one year they ran out of money and they couldn't pay for our private school. And they went and they collected, along with my great grandma and my great grandpa, all of their jewels. Which wasn't much. And, and they sold them. And that managed to sort of, you know, give us two more years of private school education. So we saw those things and, and we, we learned to never take that for granted, but to also feel like, okay, I have to get to a place in my life where financially this won't need to happen, you know, and I can then treat my mothers like the queens that they are. So then how do you, when, when do you go back to New York? When I was 17. And then how does the path to your Hollywood domination, where does that start? Yes. Domination. You're the number one. I was. Who beat you? Tom Hallman. And that's okay. He's so great. He's Spider-Man. Wow. And he's married to Zendaya. So we're happy about that. Well, you're still the number one woman movie star. Yes. Thank you. He's a queen. Thank you. And that's a huge. That's huge. It's huge. It's enormous. Like, and especially when you're sitting here talking about your grandparents and great grandparents having to sell jewelry to get you to a private school. And now. And for them telling me also at that age, like you can do anything and, and you're sitting there looking at all this life and sorrow and, and you're like, well, how, how am I going to have everything? I'm, I'm this big and the world feels so, you know, and, and yeah. So to go from that to, oh, you broke this record. I'm like, what record is that? You know? It's very cool. It is. I mean, you've been in obviously Avatar, all those, right? Are there three of those? Yes. Okay. Two more to go, hopefully. Okay. And then, and then Vengadores or what do you call it? Avengers. Avengers. And then the Star Wars. Star Trek. Star Trek. Sorry. Oh, I love you. I just, I want to share, I just have to share this. We were hanging out on the set of Avengers, you and I. Yes. Just talking about life. And I remember you had. Oh God. What is this? You were like, what are we doing? Where are we? Like you just, it felt like. The world of Marvel was happening so fast and your beautiful heart just couldn't keep up. You were like, I just can't keep up. Like, what's the plot? What are we after? Who's dead? Who's alive? Like, it was just hilarious. Well, first of all, I hadn't seen any of the movies. Nope. You haven't either. I, yeah. Admit it. You haven't. Yes, I haven't. Exactly. You can't read the script because they think they're literally the CIA. Yeah. And. There's password protection and all this. And they change everything and they mislead you. Right. Yeah. And names in the scripts are different than the person that ends up confusing. It was so confusing. I'm like, you know what? I actually don't care. Okay? Like, just tell me where to stand. Give me some context. You inspired me. I like, I just watched you like walk away when you finish your day. I'm like, yep, that's going to be me. And I can't wait. I just cannot wait. And here I was like with three kids. Under the age of four, a bad cold, trying to memorize all these scripts to then have everybody tell me the morning of. These are not the lines that you're going to say. And you're like, what? I know. F. Why? I know. It's really, it's a, I mean, I made, I used to make a lot of movies. I, those are very specific in terms of the changing and the secrecy. And I, I don't know, I was going to say something. But I'm not allowed to say it. So I'll tell you later. But okay. I mean, it's not a big deal. Believe me. But it was just like, I had an experience relatively recently where I was like, again, what am I doing? What movie is this? Who's this character? Pepper. I know. Wait, so which one were we in together? We were in the big fight scene at the end. That was fun, though. Remember, we all lined up. Yes. And we were sort of the women. It was like a very goosey. Goosebumps moment. Yeah, that was cool. It was empowering. I don't know what movie that was, but. It was one of them. One of them. And can I tell you, I feel, and I know you do too, I feel lucky and blessed when younger people, when young people come up to me and they're, they're just, you know, so impressed that, that we as women were in this kind of like action driven masculine environment. Yeah. We were, you know, kickers. Yeah. That makes me feel that what I do and all the running around and the back and forth is so worth it. Yeah. It's really sweet. Yeah. It's really, it's funny actually how impactful the Marvel thing is and how much it means to people. It does. And it's really kind of stunning and beautiful and people come up and they're like, you can see it in their eyes, can't you? When they're like. Yes. Pepper. And it's becoming. It's becoming like one of those genres that are one of the only ones that are multi-generational. Yeah. Where a grandpa and a grandson can sit. It's true. And watch something and truly enjoy it. So I'm a sucker for that. Yeah. Whatever is going to keep me in a living room in front of a TV with my grandma, no longer my grandmother, but back then it used to be my mom, my dad, and my children together. And we're all laughing. We're all laughing at the same thing. Like, I love it. Yeah. And I do, I am grateful to have been a part of the Marvel universe in that sense that we get to give back in a way that keeps families kind of like together sharing something. It's true. But like, you know, it started out with a Marvel movie and now. Which one was it? The first one. We sat down. Guardians. Guardians. Guardians of the Galaxy. See how many hits? She's a hit maker. It's crazy. I'm so grateful. Like, it started with like that. Yeah. But now, this past weekend, we sat with our boys and our parents to watch To Wong Fu, Thanks for Everything, Julie Newmar. Oh, my God. My mom's in that. Yes. When I saw her name, Blythe Danner, I mean, I was just looking at it. I'm like, love that movie. Love that movie. It's really a good movie. And the boys are like, why are we watching? I'm like, shh, just watch it. It's a great movie. Do they like it in the end? Yes. I mean, John Leguizamo was just like, you know, did I choose to be on this road trip? No. I don't think so. It's just so great. You need to add more comedy to your action. Okay. I really think so. Let's throw it out there. You're so funny. From your mouth to the universe. Get it in the ether. Yeah. Because you do do a lot of things of like, you kick ass. Like, you're biting, you're, I told you, I just started watching Lioness. I'm behind. I'm a little behind schedule. So I won't tell you. Don't tell me anything because I'm only halfway through season one. Okay. And it's riveting. And you are, you know, like, you just bring this, I just believe you. You know what I mean? Which I think is hard to do in a show like that. That's so action packed and sort of, you know what I mean? You're like, but you are, I'm like, you're amazing. I've never seen you have a false note in anything. You are too. You're amazing. No, we're not talking about this. I just watched Sliding Doors this summer. You did? With my boys. We loved it so much. And that soundtrack. Back then when soundtracks mattered. I know. It's so great. And that haircut. I wish I could do it, but I can't. It won't look the same. Chris McMillan cut that hair. Can you imagine? All the way back in the day. You're incredible, Chris. But, by the way, back to that compliment you were paying me. Thank you because it means a lot coming from someone like you. Well. It's easy. It's, as actors, we can get lost. We can get lost with trying to execute an idea. Yes. And my acting coach, Katlyn Adams, who's been my… You have an acting coach? For 20 years, yeah. Oh, my God. The times that I've not worked with her… You suck. I suck. I think I do. I know I do. My mom tells me. My grandmother used to tell me. It's like, no good. This one, no good. I don't believe it. But Katlyn is like my genie in that. Wow. It's like a bottle that I call, you know, acting. What does she do? She just grounds me in a… experience and reality. Like in detail of the character and the story? I never took any formative training. And I've always had that insecurity about my work. And Catlin did. I mean, she was one of the, you know, one of the first students at the actor studio. And she did, she went through all of that. And she does, she knows every technique. But she's a wonderful woman that just finds a way to ground you as a woman as well. Did you like, get in your body? Yeah, we do all of that. And then like character details? I break every beat. Because I also, I think if I ever act again, I think I need to do that. Oh my god, Catlin Adams. I got you. Well, she got you. She got you. But she, she's wonderful. And she helps me. Because I don't think in English, I think in Spanish. So when I'm reading, you know, things in English, the subtext, guiones completamente. Y ahora con el italiano, la betuta, silencio. And you're like, what is this? Una mezcla fatal. Fatal. Imposible. It's a beautiful concoction of languages. But your thoughts come in these languages as well. But they're, you know, when you execute them, you really have to learn the cadence of the root of English and the cadence of the root of Spanish. And for me, it's much more natural to, act in Spanish, which I've never done besides Emilia Perez, which I hope to do more in the future. But in English, Catlin helps me understand how, what I'm feeling and, and, and helps me put it into the text. That's so cool. Which is great. I want to try to do a little, a small part in Spanish. I can't believe you haven't. No one has ever asked me. The only time I've ever done a scene in Spanish is when I did Glee and I played a substitute Spanish teacher. Oh my god. And I had like funny scene in Spanish. But that's it. You have to do it. Because I wish people knew this, that every time I see you and we connect, we only connect in Spanish. Well, we connect in Spanish first. That's true. We're like, hola mami, como estas? And you're like, hola chica, como estas? And you do this whole beautiful thing. She's making fun of my Spanish. No, because you learned it in Spain. It's not your fault. It's beautiful. You and Penelope, you guys sound similar. I know. She's so cute. I love her. I know. I said to her last time, I was like, you know, to even if it's a small part, I just want to know if I could really do it. It's such a challenge, the idea of doing a film in a second language. Yes. And so I didn't I didn't realize. So you think in Spanish. So but you're not translating into English in your head at all times. Oh my god. At all times. Are you serious? Yes, because Spanish is my first language. But when I speak Spanish, too, I'm not thinking, OK, what's the word? In Spanish, like I'm just speaking Spanish. Does that make sense? And then if I if I can't find a word, I'm like, wait. Yeah. OK. Do you know what I mean? So you mean like you like your brain switches, right? My brain switches and then I'm not perfect in Spanish. So if I can't think of a word, you switch back. Then I'm like, wait, I'm trying to say, you know, puddle. And well, I'm doing the same thing, but in reverse. So the way that I interpret life, it's through Spanish. That was my first language. So I was I was loved, spoken to, cooked for, danced with, you know, healed with with Spanish. Yeah. So it's it's it's a it's a cultural thing. I understand. It's it's it's in my DNA. So everything like let's say I can hear the words. And it's funny because I was born here in the States. I started speaking Spanish to my boys. But the moment they started making sentences. And they started practicing critical thinking. I immediately switched to English. So I do I do kind of like I do handle everything in my life in a very academic way, like in English. But when it comes to feeling, it's all Spanish. Wow. That makes sense. Of course. It makes perfect sense. It's because I remember when I went to Spain to live with the family, I was 15. We so little. I couldn't, you know, I had like high school, a little bit of Spanish. And I got to this little town in Spain and nobody spoke a word of Spanish. And nobody spoke a word of English. I'm sorry. A word. That's probably if you go to that village, that's probably still the same case. Yeah. And so really quickly I had to learn like I was dropped in the fire and I was so homesick and I was sobbing. I couldn't understand anything. And I was like, what is this food, you know, eating? Like morcilla. Do you know what that is? Yeah, claro. And like, I was like, what am I eating? It's the blood sausage. I know. Oh, my God. They didn't tell me until later. I was like, I've been eating blood. I'm still so traumatized. Like I went to a bullfight. I was like, where am I? No, it was terrible. I was sobbing in the, you know. In the square. Sobbing. And everyone was like, oh, cute. I was like, cute? This isn't. Complete culture shock. Total culture shock. It was like, as soon as I could get by and then start to understand, it was like a whole other world opened up. A whole other part of me opened up. And my Spanish mother, I'm really still close to my family to this day. Oh, that's beautiful. And she loved me in such a different way than an American family would. You know? Yeah. I was just like, so it's very deep. I obviously don't understand as well as you, but I have a little understanding. But you were able to. Yeah. It's like your DNA. Your DNA was able to tap into something as if it were with you from inception. Yes, it's true. And so it felt like an extension of you as natural as, you know, your English. Yeah. It's like, so it's a beautiful thing. It's never going to be completely easy, the code switching between cultures, right? Yeah. But what I love is that we are learning that it is absolutely advantageous. It is only a plus. It is only a plus. It is only a plus. It is only a bonus. It only helps a child. The more languages they're spoken to at an earlier age. Back in the day, it was like, don't. It'll confuse the child. As if that child is not adaptable. When children are the most resilient, their brains are the newest and the freshest. Their cells rejuvenate overnight. They can adapt quicker than we can. So speak to them in different languages. As many languages as you teach them. Absolutely. And when you have an immigrant family, they don't have a choice. It's not like they're doing it because they understand what studies have proven. You know, they do it because it's, they're a family from a different world trying to adapt in this new environment. And they're going to be respectful, but at home, they're going to try to practice their rituals. Of course. That's what, that's the whole beauty around it. Do your boys ever say like, oh, we don't want to speak? Every day. Every day. Yeah. Because I noticed that with a lot of my kids. My friends from different countries, their kids are answering them in English. We're going through that right now. You're going through that right now. Yeah. And, and I'm okay with it because I was that kid. Right. You know, I was a first generation. They're a second generation from me, but a first generation from my husband. Yeah. So I'm seeing the push. Who's Italian. Super. Big time. I mean, Margo will sit down at any table and he'll be like, you Italian, you Italian, right? Look, it's nice, but it's not the same. It's not the same, right? It's not the same. Because he's so homesick all the time. Oh, bless. But it's, you know, and in that, I mean, it's so obvious. Like I literally marry an immigrant because I, everything that I went through, the good and the bad, is the reason I am who I am today. So why not go back to something familiar? I feel like maybe that's why when I met him, he just felt so familiar to me. Yeah, interesting. Everything about how he respects a new world, but he's always connected to his world. And that's how I was raised. So to see him fighting with our kids when, I mean, they started school and they came back and they went from calling him Papa to like, Dad. And he was like, what? No, no, buddy, listen to me. Listen to me. He's like, no, no, I'm not Dad. I'm not Dad. And I remember every moment. Every moment of how, like, they bicker at the dinner table. I remember vividly that moment with my mom and my grandmother and my dad, where I came home and I was like, Mom. And she's like, who's Mom? Mami, carajo, mami. There's certain magic to the season, the music, the traditions, the gathering over incredible food. But when it comes to gift giving, I love it. I am very intentional. So what language are you guys speaking around the dinner table? All three. All three in one language. dinner and I mean in one sentence sometimes right because sometimes there's a word in one yes like says it perfectly so did you learn Italian when you met Marco I you know I picked it up just through time with him and his family it's very similar very similar but very different so it's like when you're hearing it and you're around it and it's colloquial you kind of go it's so similar the moment you open a textbook yeah and you start like me yeah me chiamo you you realize that it's actually much more similar to French yeah than it is to to Spanish it's true and and um it's hard it's hard and um but it's so beautiful it is really beautiful I'm trying to learn it and it's it's hard it's uh it's like you really when I go to Italy then I'm like 48 hours I don't I I can almost not speak anything you know so are you speaking like a Malay of Spanish and Italian yeah and an Italian you're surviving and then sometimes there are words like you know conosco is in both but then you're like wait a minute no it's not it's not yo conozco and and you're like no wait it is it is you get very like when you say yo se yes these are things that you say on a daily basis just yeah you'll say I know I know I know I know yo so yo so yo so yo so and and it sounds different coming out of my mouth you do what I mean so it's it's still the Italian is something that I'm learning to recognize but it's still foreign to me what do you guys fight in when you're in a couple fight well I'm fighting in Spanish and he's fighting he's fighting in Italian oh really that's kind of amazing he is I would be scared to pick a fight with you yeah why because have you seen you in all these movies and TV shows oh I love you but I'm a Gemini I'm like a lover I'm here to have fun I know but like I feel like you could take someone out I can't right yeah oh you know why uh it's it's funny I don't I'm learning through experience to advocate for myself the older I get right but for me it is automatic to advocate for others like if I recognize you as my people like I don't know I don't know if I recognize you as my people I don't loyalty is is just there you know and and so anything that happens to you like if you're if you're loving if you're happy I'm happy with you if you hurt it's like I want to tear something apart so it's it's uh that I recognize that strength yeah for others yeah have you ever been like really betrayed yes how do you handle that like not in a romantic sense because we've all sort of have that and then you kind of move on right but like I don't know in my own life right now I'm trying to adjudicate like because sometimes I think I went when I turned like 45 I would you know because I was always such a pleaser and like make sure everybody's happy and and then something happened to me where I was like I don't care like I'm I'm gonna be true to myself come what may and if someone's a phony I'm calling it out and if someone is a liar I'm calling it out and then I feel like maybe I you know if someone's an imposter I'm fucking calling it out yeah and now I'm like maybe I went too far with that you know like I'm trying to in my own life figure this out you know and like okay is it worth it to take a stand like that and bear the brunt and like the discomfort of then being in a room with someone that you know like I think it's okay to be a liar and I don't think it's okay to be a liar I don't think it's okay to be a liar I don't think it's okay to be a liar I don't think it's okay to be a liar I don't think it's okay to be a liar I don't think it's okay to be a liar I don't think it's okay to be a liar it's funny everything that you're saying is so familiar to me um and I and and and even though you're just a couple of milestones ahead of me which is why I love you so much because I learned so much by from just being around women like you I think it's absolutely okay to be a liar and I don't think it's okay to be a liar I don't think it's okay to be a liar I don't think it's okay to be a liar just swing that pendulum to the other extreme in order for you eventually to find your own balance right especially if you've been a giver and a giver and a giver yeah and and you've realized I can't just keep doing this one way situation because if I don't receive what I'm giving out then the well my well of happiness and joy and dignity is gonna dry out you know and and so I'm I'm there with you of you know because I'm 48 so I'm like oh I was just there three years ago and I did start swinging to the fences I'm like fuck this don't no absolutely and and you and you sort of like interpret um claiming respect in a very come as it may you sort of have to claim it you tell yourself I have to claim it regardless and now at 48 what's coming is that fighting is also exhausting so I would like to just be efficient and still set boundaries with love and respect even when that love is not it's not I'm not going to be receiving it back then let me just give it once I don't have to keep giving it let me just give it once because what's important is it's that the love symbolizes the sugar in the medicine I am going to give you you know what I mean and the medicine is fuck off no thank you right goodbye so so I think it's okay yeah to to to be like oh fuck I didn't really and and being in love with a gentle kind of person also helps I feel like I really are March 1st yes that's true oh these Pisces have the same birthday don't you feel like they're always like I think I feel I think I feel all the time and the first like 12 years of me knowing the father of my children it was very much like yes of course tell me what you think tell me how you feel and now in perimenopause like this the throes of it I'm literally like Margot Margot I'm not saying yeah I'm just saying pause because I'm thinking I'm feeling right now and just let me finish with my thoughts and my feelings and then you can what I'm saying is don't interrupt me let me finish and then you can share you know what I mean like and I'm loving this yeah and I'm I'm loving the dynamic it's good of being with this water sign wait what sign are you I'm a did you hear me I'm a Libra oh you're air we are air oh we're helium what are you I'm Gemini Gemini you just said I'm a lot I gotta get into the star sign thing you would think that I would know about it yeah it would be on brand for me but I don't know anything about it I think it's a good thing okay I don't what I like about this the the star signs is the elements that we are we are of you know so so you have Libra and Aquarius and Gemini that are air okay and you have Pisces and Scorpio and Cancer that's water and then you have everything else that's earth you're like I don't care and then I only care about Taurus because my sister is and she's very grounded and she's earth you know my daughter's Taurus that I know I love I love me a Taurus but also my younger sister's a Leo so they're all fire then my fire signs my sons are all fire so they are fiery it's like it's literally like they're gorgeous thank you but so are your children thank you oh god don't you just love being women especially women at this age too we just like it's so good we're able to see each other because we're learning also to see ourselves or we see ourselves and it's so beautiful um but fire signs it's very much like okay boys so we are gonna go left because we already saw that right is really not a possibility and this is the safest path and we're just gonna do it yeah well I'm still gonna go right and you're like okay like that's that's fire which is it's interesting yeah I gotta I'm gonna I'm gonna get into that has your life changed since you won the Oscar at all do you get more job offers less job offers do you get more job offers do you get more job offers do people I mean hair do people on the street know are like tell me what what the experience is I don't know if I think I think the answer is yes there was a lot more attention that that came back my way and um I was very grateful for that but also at the same time um that wasn't why I did Amelia oh you're so good in that movie thank you oh my thank you baby but like I was already working with all these pre-existing franchises and works and and shows and so did you want to was it mine or you like I nothing against the franchise stuff because it's just totally fun but maybe what's your acting coach's name again Catlin Adams Catlin Adams like maybe you wanted to give work with something that was more meaty or juicy I think here's what's funny and I and I hate saying this out in the universe because I just don't want you know the universe to to to to you know uh punish me but it won't um at my age my life my family life my personal life is so damn important to me yeah it gives me everything that gives me joy and purpose and happiness and um and my desire to be more present means that I want to have more um just control of my time so that's the the contrast it's almost but I also want to continue working so that I can also be able to support my family yeah and my entire ecosystem yeah so it's not out of necessity there's also this desire for me to to stop being in a have to mode and go back into I want a wanting mode right and and it all comes back to becoming the owner of my own time yeah so with that said there are sacrifices that you have to make you have to say no even when you have this FOMO to want to do something yeah and um and by doing that your life slows down you're able to be more present and then you're able to take on more things that are just by desire and joy and not by necessity right yeah so Amelia was that for me and improved that concept so I want to continue going after that yeah you know so that I can just do things that make me really happy that inform my the artists and me the person and and then inherently I can have just time with my family because my kids are old enough where I need to start driving that minivan yeah more while they're in the back having those crazy conversations and they think I'm not listening you got to be that driver you know you got to be that that event planner that play dater you know what I mean and because now is when things can get weird yeah and I want to be there for all the people I want to be there for all the weird stuff and not have you know I have a great team staff people and family my mother my husband's mother does she live near you they I mean we are a multi-generational family we're always around in a pack that's really nice you should come over they're always there are they and when we're not having Italian food we're having Dominican food and it's like we barely ever speak English so who's cooking then um they well they alternate sometimes it's la nonna yeah marcos mother and she's making her salsa magica which is her red sauce and what's her secret is it like a long slow it's like it's what my grandmother says it's love it's love you know it's pretty much the same recipe what region is he from they're from Lombardia they're from they're from Brescia like Lago de Garda that all that area northerners and um so it's very it's a lot of risottos it's a lot of um osso bucco heavy meats and um and cotoletas you know it's it's a it's the um what do you call it la milanesa oh yeah delicious yes and then my mom is making it's so funny like my Spanish friends call it paellas you would call it a paella we're making arroz con pollo arroz con pollo yes arroz con pollo where you make it in the same pot right it's it's un locrio we call it locrio they call it okay in Latin America and then in Spain they call it like low profile pot no not in a paella okay we do the big deep pots because we cook we cook our rice is like different and stuff but it's all the same and um so she she makes her food like and she'll do her beans and she'll make her oxtail and and my kids just they just bounce between Italian and Dominican food and every now and then they'll ask for a cheeseburger and we'll make a cheeseburger why not you know you got a total immigrant household but that's like that's a beautiful part of America yeah at least this like melting of cultures and of histories and then seeing it in the kids so my god it's beautiful all the different colors of the melting pot of culture is like well you grew up in New York too partially right mostly wasn't it beautiful just being in those buildings yeah doesn't matter it could be a building in Fifth Avenue it could be a building in Brooklyn and and if you sort of look at one simple building maybe five doors five apartments per floor and it's five different immigrant families or American families let's just say American families because right and and every time you walk down that hallway you can have an Indian family you can live next door to an Indian family so as you walk down you smell those beautiful spices and then by the time you reach a door like mine you're smelling the sofrito you know what I mean like and then this this family they're they're Sicilian specifically so you smell the sofrito you know what I mean like I remember growing up in New York and feeling like I was a child of the world in just one block yeah you know and that to me is what represents America so I've I'm so grateful that growing up as an American as a New Yorker first in America um I was able to to have this innate curiosity for people because they look different from me that that that sparks curiosity going oh I wonder how Gwen eats right I wonder what her kitchen smells like I wonder when I hug her right absolutely it's curiosity ignorance kills curiosity right and um and it's that thing of like being right and being right kills it kills it well I'm being scared but but but I think that fear comes um a lot of fear comes from a lack of knowledge a lack of experience a lack of world sort of awareness and and that then paralyzes you and it makes you feel that if I just stay with what I know that I'm safe when in reality the unknown can also be safe it doesn't have to be scary right and and and that is what puzzles me about it because for me America is a sensorial experience you know interacting with Americans doesn't matter if they have an accent that's from like Tennessee that is from like you know Sri Lanka I'm curious either way or when I hug them they'll smell like apples and cinnamon or they'll smell like human like I for me interacting with human beings is an experience of my senses it's what I can see what I can hear when I touch you what I feel what I smell when I hug you and and that's the one thing that we're trying to teach our kids and and and the way that we do it is we're trying to teach our kids how to be human and how to be human and and the way that we do it is by never staying in one place we have to travel all the time and we're and when we're traveling and we have to break bread with with strangers and when we do that we have to ask questions yeah it's so for the sake of knowing you know feel guilty when you're on set for 14 it's unforgivable like I honestly feel like say that I know but but it's almost like how you feel like as as a as a parent because I see my husband also be so hard on himself and carry so much guilt because you know he has to go and work he's an artist he needs to create and sometimes what we're experiencing now is that the boys are wanting to stay you know they don't want to come along all the time they're old enough where what's happening in their lives is more important is more important back to sort of the whole operation the whole paycheck basically sometimes goes to setting up the shop because if I'm going to take them away from their life I have to recreate that life so holidays remain the same the homes are decorated even if it's an apartment this big or a house that we're renting is that big the grandparents are coming the cousins are visiting you know and and if we have to homeschool we recreate a classroom wherever we go because I don't want them to slip out of from their bedrooms and just come in their pjs and sit in the living rooms like no no no you are getting dressed and I when they were little because we were having issues with that we I took them to target and we bought uniforms and I'm like when you wear the uniform you are in school mode the moment school is over uniforms are there oh my god target uniforms I know red shirt blue pants and white little like you know shirts like polo shirts but did you embroider like well maybe I could have done it no but it it helped me I was able to sort of like maintain their attention span a little longer and and and they weren't as resistant because whenever they wore the uniforms they couldn't get away with all things but what it did also psychologically it um it still made their home feel safe that this teacher who's a stranger can come here and she can give them sort of boundaries and in their home but it wasn't like this stranger had more power of their home over there over them the moment they would take off their uniform then they were home you know so we we managed to make it work and that's really cool that worked but now that they're like 11 and 9 you know I I asked I'm like we're getting ready to leave guys what if we do home we do uniform they're like lady that's not gonna work I'm that lady by the way it's so funny I was um I was in Texas shooting season three of lioness and and the last month of my shoot my husband then was able to bring them back home and they and they were with their because they were so homesick, but I'm parenting over Facebook. facetime and one day there was something that was going on with one of my twins and and i'm talking to him and it was a very stern conversation and i took something away because i needed to and he literally drops the phone and gives it to his brother and i hear him go here you talk to her because i can't with this lady I became the lady who is that it crushed me that day I had off from work I couldn't get out of bed I put back I put my pjs back on I went back into bed tears I was like I'm the lady I called my therapist I'm like what do I do I it was it was but I you know that's what being 11 is all about you your parents become these strangers you know I can't with this lady that's pretty genius it's just a chapter of differentiation which is really important for them to go through did your kids ever do that like where did you ever become that lady I mean please don't say no please say no but you know I'm gonna be crying but I also had a different thing which is like I was essentially doing it by myself so I think the safety structures are a little bit different you know it's like when kids are with their mom and dad and there's like they know how to they know what all the dynamics are I think there's I don't know sometimes I almost think I mean Apple went through a little bit when she was like 14 where she's always like oh my god don't show me this you know she was like she calls it the rolling of the goth kind of yeah there was like no she wasn't really goth but she was like eyeliner emo like a little bit that's what I meant to say I have one and you know she was definitely roll her eyes are like everything I did was like horrifying and but other than that they didn't I so I always thought like do they not feel safe enough to totally rebel you know because I was doing it I've seen you with your children you guys have a beautiful friendship a beautiful relationship it's so thanks they're nice and you're like a mushy mom I love it I'm me too I'm such a pick me with my kids it's like they come by and I'm like I know you do and they ignore me and I'm just like crushed oh they'll come back okay when they're in their 20s they cuddle right back in okay good I do I promise I'm not ready for this episode is brought to you by Amazon I love this time of year there's a certain magic to 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Okay oh yeah this is this new thing we're gonna do I'm very excited okay okay so it's it's like a high low so can you we're gonna we're oh I'm supposed to do this too I didn't realize like a high and a low from your week okay so it could be anything it could be like the proudest moment the most humbling you know okay proudest moment yeah what is of the last you know week or so of this last week I am it's interesting as a mom of multiples um I was always running on this one size fits all so if we're gonna do something let's do it all together because it's also more more time efficient and everything and and what I finally sort of got my husband got this you know before way before I did is that one-on-one time doesn't necessarily mean that by you bonding with one child at a time you're disregarding the other two yeah um so I'm loving this one-on-one that I'm having because then I'm able to discover and rediscover these little human beings that I've been roommates with for the last almost 12 years and that I'm so in love with they teach me so much so I'm just finally removing the guilt that you carry as a working parent and and I'm I'm I'm choosing my time I'm making wiser decisions with my time when I'm with each and every one of them and that's beautiful so that's a very big high for me okay overall I love it overall because like I have an emo I think I I'm I'm literally like I just realized this I've always known but but it was just like this past month or this past week that I'm just like you're sensitive and that's more than okay oh you know you you worry for us all and that's more than okay I just want to make sure that mm-hmm you don't forget about yourself like put your mask on first before you can put ours you know but but discovering that he's such a selfless human being is such a beautiful high for me you know what I mean they're just so delicious I know it's really true okay so what what's your low or what what did you need to learn or what did you get your ass handed to you um oh every day like I'm that's already I mean I'm the lady remember I'm just like the landlady Jesus I can't with this lady I'm dying and I heard my husband some I'm also like outnumbered with this masculine energy so and everything is a joke everything is like the lady the lady you know so I just want to you know hurt them really bad but I won't um what's a low I think that this fucking perimenopausal situation mm-hmm um the milestones because it is a beautiful transition for us all women like the the great thing about perimenopause and menopause is that um it's it's it's not an exclusive club no it's the most inclusive club yeah so it's just a matter of one you know and and it's just um the lows it's it's the limitations it's it's just like when aches that I'm waking up with or that I go to do something and all of a sudden there's a limitation and I'm like oh my god I'm going to of like before you know warm up before you can stretch yeah that quickly and that sternly that muscle or it it's that it's just it's um it's a canker sore of a thing because um I'm having to reconfigure just ways practices that I had down that I had been doing for so long that I just don't think about and now I have to recreate them you know and it's just it's exhausting it's humbling it's really humbling but you said something in that podcast with Amy Poehler you got to gag down that protein and it was and I've been using it and it's so funny because when I say that people really think that I'm implying something else it's hilarious and what I really mean is it's protein powder and meat and or fish or tofu it's hard to oh or eggs I can't eat any more eggs I can't I'm done with that I'm done with eggs too I need a break right now eggs I'm having such a bad reaction to I can't we eat it all the time I can't I can't do it like I don't know what happened and what else are we gonna eat well it's tough because the other thing is I'm realizing like I'm really not I feel like on some level I'm not naturally a meat eater like I kind of gross out when I cook it my husband loves me too so I make meat for him a lot and like he wants meat at every meal and I'm like I like I have to wear gloves now when I like touch yes and the sound of it it's so like the ASMR of like handling meat it's and and my mind goes into some empathetic place that kind of kills my appetite me too but I know that I need it I know otherwise I'm gonna pull a hammy just by getting out of bed you know what I mean I mean you know tofu tempeh Bay. I've been eating fish, you know. But then the mercury, like the consequences. There's a really good company called C-Topia. Have you ever? No. Yes. And it's like, they test for mercury and all this stuff. I'll send it to you. I'm going to write this down. Okay. Can you? It's so good. Yeah. Okay. So yeah, I struggle with it too. And I've been struggling with, you know, yogurt and protein powder and all the things. So I don't know, but that's the other thing I'm trying to see. As I'm getting into my mid fifties, I'm like, where, where do I land on this spectrum of things? Right. I'm like been told my whole life, do it this way. No, do it that way. Whether it's, you know, don't draw a boundary, draw a hard boundary. Like, don't listen to yourself, eat all this protein. And I'm like, maybe I just need to figure out what feels right. Yeah. What feels good. And maybe the protein thing has to, because it can't. It can't be good for you if you're literally gagging as you're like trying to get how many ounces. Like, can that be good for you? I don't know. No, no. And, and cause I feel like food, it's energy as well. So there's, there's a ritual around eating where your, your mind has to feel good and your chi has to be like good. Yeah. Food is becoming a thing that I, the fact that I have to think about it, but not from a place of pleasure. And it's more from a place of like, health because they're like bone density, you know, muscle. Yes. It's, it's awful. So I'm, but I'm happy to know that, that I'm not the only one doing it. You're not the only one for sure. But the insight, I guess, of, of what I've, what I've discovered and I have to, I have to thank the show of Linus, like being a part of Linus has given me, it's a gift. It's the gift of weightlifting as women and women in our forties and fifties. And so, and on and on. How often do you do it? I was, I, when I'm actively like working, I would up to five times a week, but it's not, it's not excessive. It's not like I go and I'm like, yeah, you know what I mean? It's my 20 to 30 minutes where, and I, I will only limit it to two or three machines and I'll just actively just work on a specific area. And then I'll rest it. And the next day I'll work on something else. So it's not like I, I exhaust myself and what I, what it's given, it's, I was talking to, to a friend that we have in common about it. And I know who it was and it's not, I'm like, I can't even say weight lifting. I know. And it's not the cardio. I I'm no longer into running for my life. I don't want my heart to speed up. I'm no longer into running for my life. In any way. Well, it's, but then you go to the heart doctor and then they say, listen, you got to do a little cardio. But here's the thing. When you're lifting, you're also doing cardio. Not according to this. Oh, then tell me who this doctor is. I want to pay him or her a visit. But lifting, I feel strong. I feel like I can pick up things. I feel like I can squat and go up and down stairs and not think it before I do it. You know, I don't want to start thinking before I move. You look so strong too on screen. But it's, it's being on the show, you know, and all the women from. Ooh, let's discuss Nicole Kidman. Is that so fun? She's incredible. And, and, and she sets not even a high bar. She just sets a normal standard. For weightlifting? Of, well, she's, she's, she's athletic. Yeah. At her age, she's very athletic and she loves doing it. And she, her body's sick. I mean, I've seen her in a bathing suit in person. And I'm just like. I'm like, Nicole, Nicole. And she's like, what? I mean, she's a gazelle for the, but you are a gazelle too. But, but she, she owns her health. It's that thing of like, I'm not doing it for aesthetic reasons. Like she's doing it. She likes to feel strong. And, and that's inspiring to me. I love her part in this house. She's sort of like never blinks and she has the low voice and she leans in. She's incredible. She's incredible. That's so fun. And, and, but also being around like her and Morgan Freeman and Michael. And actresses like Jill Wagner and Liza de Oliveira, Hennessy Rodriguez. Is this everyone on the TV show? Yes, yes. And Morgan Freeman's on the TV show? I didn't get there yet. Dave Annabelle, Thad Luckinbell, like James Jordan. Wow. LaMonica Garrett. Like it's just, it's a, it's a, it's a wonderful cast. We've been doing it now for so long that they are friends. I care for them. That's nice. I learned from them. I copy their acting techniques too. Like it's just, it's great. It's, it's, it's really inspiring. But Nicole's a beast. Come on. I mean. And, and having to act cool around her. It's like me trying to act cool around you. Oh, please. I'm like, oh yeah, she's like my friend and I love that. Oh my God. Okay, wait, let me make sure. What else? We're out of time. Oh, we, oh geez. That went so fast. Okay. I'll tell you my low. Okay. And it's kind of vulnerable because it really was like a bit of a eye opener for me, but I work really closely with someone and I found, I found myself reacting to something that wasn't warranted in the situation. Like I was bringing in something from another unit of time and like had a strong trigger around something and didn't give enough grace, you know? And I was like, I went to sort of like a, a mistrusting place. So fast, right? Yes. Without fact checking and. And I feel really ashamed about it because I feel like sometimes I think I'm further along than I am, you know? Yeah. And it's like so humbling when, you know, I think I've had all this therapy and I'm a good person and I own my mistakes. And then like something happens in a tiny moment and you're like, I really don't like where I went. And I, I hate that, you know? Like I want to feel like, oh, I, this all aggregates to me having matured and like to being a person that doesn't do that. Yeah. And then. And then, you know, you find yourself having a trigger and you're just like, oh, I suck. You don't suck. You don't suck. But you know what I mean? Yeah. I completely understand. Like I'm like, where, how did this get, get me? Like shit. Yeah. So that was definitely my. It just means you're human. I know. You're so human. I know. And sometimes we put this unimaginable and unreasonable weight on ourselves. To never make a mistake, to never be wrong, to never, you know, to, to, to know better. We have to always know more and know better. And it sucks. It sucks. And, but the fact that you're talking about it is so, and here, and you're making this a safe conversation and not just a conversation that only needs to happen behind closed doors. But the more we talk, we put it out in the open. We put it out in the open of like, we're, we're human and, and we're not going to be perfect all the time. No. But as, but we're always going to strive to be good, to do, to do good, not be right, to do good. And to learn. And to learn. You know, like now I'm like, oh, what were all the little things that led to me feeling so triggered when that happened? You know? Are you exploring that now? Yes. Good. Of course. I, I'm like, I, I, I don't, I just think triggers in general, like there are a lot of triggers. There are, when, when somebody does or says something and it triggers you, it's like, what is the historical picture here that might not even be about them? Like, what injury am I bringing to this? You know? Because it's like. It's the little girl in you. Yeah. Or the little child in us that felt once at such a loss of control. Yeah. That either something shut down or something turned on. Yeah. You know? Yeah. To help you survive. Totally. To help you get from that place to now. Yeah. And, and the thing is, oh, fuck. I, I, there is no right way. There is no thing like you're going to be okay. We are going to be okay. Yeah. As, as long as we accept that our healing is an ongoing process. This is what I say all the time. It's an ongoing thing. Like there's no finish line here, you know? Yeah. But sometimes I think our culture tricks us into thinking you're supposed to be healed. Yeah. It's like, that's crazy. That's setting us all up for total failure. Absolutely. Now, what's your high? Well, you were actually there. I officiated my first wedding. It was so beautiful. You had so much grace. You don't have to say that. It was a beautiful moment. It was great. Thank you. But I, to be so close to, in such close proximity to people making that commitment. It was so incredible to see their little faces and the emotion and to watch the energy shift and feel it as they like made that decision. that commitment to each other. It was beautiful. Wow. Absolutely. I still have chills when I think about it. Can, can I, can I share something? I saw you when you were walking and you got there and then we all, I realized, you know, that you were, you were there officiating. Just call me Pastor Gwen. Pastor Gwen. That's right. And at first, obviously we all, we all feel the tone when there's like nervousness and shock. But then as the ceremony continued, there was this shift in energy and how you were moved and, and you just started kind of going in this flow and everybody was in sync and we were all there to be very selfless creatures, to bless this union, to wish it well, you know, to wish these two individuals just. I know. Love and longevity and health and prosperity. And it was so beautiful. Thank you. And that stuff matters. Yeah, it was like the collective energy and like, I felt us all sort of thread around them. It was sweet. So that was my hug. It was beautiful. You, Pastor Gwen, you should officiate. Vows, renewal of vows, everything. For people, for pets, for anything. Zoe, Salania. Muchas gracias. A ti, guapisima. Thank you for coming on the Goop podcast. Thank you. You are just heaven. Heaven, heaven, heaven. I'm grateful and thank you for our friendship and for just inviting me over to just hang and chat. So fun. Yeah. Love you. Love you too, baby. You've been listening to The Goop Guide. The executive producers for this show are Moj Madera and me, Gwyneth Paltrow. Production by Allison Turner, Kaya McMullen, Magdalena Munau, and Allie O'Donoghue. Editing by Gabriela Aguirre. Original music by Moses Martin. The Goop Holiday Gift Guides are our calling card. We scour the earth for the best options in every category to make it easy for you to find the right gifts for everyone on your list. Think beautiful jewelry, thoughtful wellness tools, smart kitchenware, clean beauty, and more unexpected finds. Whether you're looking for a little luxury or a big splurge, you'll find something that feels personal in our curation. Explore the gift guide at goop.com. And as our gift to you, take 15% off your first purchase with code PODGIFT. Exclusions apply. This episode is brought to you by Whole Foods Market. Get everything you need to win Thanksgiving at Whole Foods Market. We're talking seasonal favorites from the bakery, easy weeknight meals for before the big day, and sales. On body care and candles for last minute gifts. Plus, with more than 300 band food ingredients storewide, you know it's quality you can trust. Shop Thanksgiving favorites with higher standards at Whole Foods Market. Prime members shop at wfm.com and get your first order over $25 delivered free. Terms apply.