The Flawless Consulting Secret with Peter Block

Here's something worth knowing. The gap between being a good consultant and building a great consulting business is enormous. Most coaching programs are run by people who've never actually closed that gap themselves. At consulting success, every one of our coaches has built a high 6, 7, or 8-figure consulting business. And inside of our clarity coaching program, you get private 101 coaching tailored to your business, plus access to a global community of consultants operating at a high level to help you attract and land ideal clients with consistency and streamline your business to free up your time, not consume it. If you're at 6 or 7 figures and ready to grow, book a call now to learn more at consultingsuccess.com/clarity. Have you ever noticed that the harder you try to win the business, the less trusted you feel? What if the real power move in consulting isn't persuasion, but in difference? Well, Peter Block has spent more than 40 years redefining what it means to be a consultant. He's the author of flawless consulting. He's shaped generations of advisors who want to move beyond being vendors and become true partners. What makes Peter different is this. He never built his firm around scale. He built it around contribution, around trust, around asking clients one uncomfortable question, what's your contribution to the very thing you're trying to change? In this episode, you're going to learn how to structure sales conversations that build authority without boasting, how to handle resistant stakeholders without losing your grounding, and why implementation always begins with relationship. Because in the end, consultants who win aren't the ones who persuade better. They're the ones who are willing to tell the truth, even if it costs them the deal. Enjoy. All right, Peter, welcome. That's good to be here, Michael. Thank you for letting me into your world. It's a pleasure to have you. I thought we would get started by going back to the 1970s when you co-founded a block of Petrella Weissward. Later on, you created your own firm design learning. Could you share a little bit about what was that experience like in terms of being part of a partnership? Ultimately, why did you decide to strike out and become independent and start your own company later on? First, I had to find something I knew how to do. It took me many years. I remember when it happened, I was in Atlanta running a team building session. The organization developed with I woke up in the middle of the night and had a huge insight. I discovered that what I had done that day worked. I was blown away by that. I also realized I found something I liked doing. That was very affirming. Then the story was, I was working for Exxon. My boss was Tony. My old professor said, "Would you go to Madison Avenue?" There's a group I wanted to do. Harshy Rotman and Druck was a high-end marketing firm on the 50th floor on Madison Avenue. Tony and I get our best out. We go up there. He talks to us for an hour to get roosters all over the place, marketing. He said, "We'd like you guys to start a division of our Harshy Rotman and OD division organization." I left, went to the restaurant and we said, "He really thinks we can do this work." I said, "Yes, he does, Tony." Tony said, "Why would we do it for him?" That's when we decided that maybe we would start something together. I never would have done it alone. We had an Exxon, knew we were leaving and they said, "We just still work with us." We said, "Well, figure out what you're paying us now." It was $75 a day. And we said, "We'll take it." That was client number one for the partnership. Yeah. That was great. They kept us going. I wouldn't have had the nerve without something in hand. It scared me. I was frightened. I looked at an empty calendar and I said, "I'm doomed." And I realized living with that anxiety was the price I paid for having my own practice. So after those years of running the partnership, what was the turning point for you or that tipping point to decide, "You know, I want to go off on your own and create your own company?" I didn't. But you didn't. No. So Tony, tell me what happened. We worked for 20 years. I had taken a little break in the late 70s and I realized I wanted to be able to predict my schedule. And with consulting, you're on call. And I said, "The only way I can do that is if I do some training." And so I said, "Guys, I'll make the transition so I carry my weight, but I want to start a training company so that I know looking out over the next month where I'm going to be." And I was involved with raising kids, etc. And so we all three of us own both businesses. Okay. I didn't know that. Yeah. And then eventually I'd like the training and then I figured out what the train. I had clients say, "Would you train our people blog?" etc. And I said, "Yes." And so I just decided I needed structure in my life. And training had better margins than consulting. You can sell things in business. We figure about 50% for labor costs. Training business is about 33%. And so they were Tony and Mars said, "Good idea, Peter." And so for the next 10, 15 years, I get more and more into the training world. So I mean, you've now taken your company, 35 countries, I think five different languages from what I've seen. Most consulting firm owners get to a point where they try and kind of are they're wrestling with this decision around how aggressively to to scale or to grow their business and are the trade offs worth it or not. What was that experience like for you from the outside? I mean, it seems like there could have maybe been a lot more intentional growth and expansion. But I'd love to hear that from you, Peter. How did you kind of view that balance of growing but do you get intentionally or scaling? Just walk us through that. I love the work. I love the ideas. When I was 40, so after 15 years, I got published or came, heard me give a talk, Peter, would you write a book? Eventually I did. But I never wanted to grow because I didn't manage anything. I just wanted to make a living for God's sake. Leave me alone. Marvin Tony felt so maximum. We had six full-time people. And then if you need more people, you can bring in a film that I never wanted to grow. I never did never matter to me. I just I love the work because we had Marv joined us because I had pulled back so we had three partners. Each of us saw the world differently, spoke differently. And then we have three or four people that we know. Some would do training, some would do consulting. And we just I just never thought growth was important to me because I saw a lot of big firms. And over time, the really big firms got interested in change management or the random soon Accenture and McKenzie and we even helped train them on consulting skills. But it just wasn't a life I wanted to leave. I don't know. Sometimes I felt it was a fault, weakness. And we never were marketing oriented. I always beat up ourselves. I had a great marketing consultant when we started. And it was curly-johns, the work for Exxon. He said, "Well, let me tell you, what is you're looking for people looking for you, Peter. You're not rich enough to change anybody's mind and get them in the way." And the other thing he said was if you have people that aren't working out, get rid of them fast, you can't afford to carry people. And so that was our philosophy, looking for people, looking for us. And we had such a doubts that we gathered a clients together for a one-day focus group. And we asked them, "Why did you hire us?" And they said, "We hired you because you didn't seem to care very much whether you got the job. So if he trusted you and holy, I was shocked. I said, I guess we did have a marketing strategy. It was one of indifference. But you know, being a president is available. And so I always feel in sales as my job is to help people make a good decision not to get the work. I wanted to go back for a moment, Peter, you talked about this almost as pool of sounds like, you know, many people around you saying, why not grow more? Right? The status quo is to think about greater revenues and profits and growth. How did you maintain that steadfast resolve or just the belief that our goal is not to grow? Oftentimes, the environment around us really tries to pull us off of the path that maybe we feel is the right one. And at some point, we don't even know which is the right path anymore. What was your experience like? I mean, what actually kept you going on that path? The pressure is immense because the world wants to know which are and your revenue is. You ever sell the business they want to know what your revenue is? Everybody's proud of that. And I had two partners that were similar. I never could have done anything alone. And we just weren't built. I wasn't built to. And I always felt as an individual, at some point, you say to your parents, I'm not the son you had in mind. My contact, smile, silence. And whether they hear it or not doesn't matter. And I always we always felt that we're not built that way. I wanted it. I hired a sales guy, Jim, a sell-go. And we never turned business down. But we never invested the marketing we did was us being in the world. I learned how to give talks, scared to hell out of me at first. And terrified I have to give a talk in October. And in early May, I started getting worried about that October talk. And finally, I got over it. I'm not going to be dynamic. I'm not charismatic. I'm not a motivational speaker. And I would start my keynote that way. I said, it's like to be motivated, inspired. Okay, you're going to be sorely disappointed in what's coming. I did that for my own comfort. And then I could relax and have it. And then I learned how to do it. I got good at it. I had that way. And that was how we, the book helped create demand. Your work is very clearly focused on relationships, on providing value first to those, you just mentioned yourself right now, right? The goal is not to win the business. The goal is to help respect the client to make the right decision. What is a common mistake do you see concerns making that kind of leaves them being stuck almost like vendors and not true partners with those that they actually want to to serve? Not asking that question. What's the question? Your question. What do I have to do to stop being a vendor? Keep myself as a commodity. And when people ask me, where else have you worked? I'll tell them, but I never claim victory. And people say, "Oh, what results did you get?" I would say, "You having doubts about whether I'm really right for you, aren't you?" And I learned how to trust that because they would say, "Yeah, I don't know. We are you." I say, "Well, I understand your doubts." Here it goes to build trust. I always figured the sales call should be an example of the service that I'm going to offer. So I always figured the first moment of contact, I'm on the job consulting, listening, reframing, whatever style you're doing. And people will decide based on their experience of being with you, not under credentials, in your resume, all of that stuff. And I don't know, you know, maybe that question is the right question and there's no real answer to it. Well, I think you've you provide some perspectives or ideas that people shouldn't at least think about. So that's a good starting point. I was also going to ask you, Peter, I mean, you you've talked a lot about how consultants their job is to get their expertise used, not just delivered. But many people find the organizations, they still resist kind of using what they've actually paid for. In your mind, is that a consulting problem? Is it a client problem? Is it just simply that organizations don't like change? I mean, what's what's going on? It's a consulting problem. It's my fault. And our work is to deal with that. And I, I mean, the whole we started consulting when the IT department came and said, we know we're right most of the time and nobody does anything with our recommendations. Can you help us? And then that's when it occurred to us after trying, you know, is that the relationship is a delivery system for your expertise. In the moment, you can't wait. Thank you very much. Let's talk about it. No. What doubts do you have? And the more you help people express the doubts, the more they're likely to act on what you're talking about. And I also begin to think that really our job, rather than having a half that they asked for, is to present things with choices they didn't know they had. And you know, I was, I was leaning on the people side of the business and what are we going to do with those people? What are we going to do with those people? And in the middle is the top you think they want to fix it. The top the middle and the bottom they want it. Everybody wants to fix somebody else. And so I built a practice on one question. Got it, got it, got it. And now what's your contribution to the very thing that you can and that's the open support of the implementation. If the client cannot see that they're a player, an agent in creating the very thing they want to change, then they'll just become something they apply, it never gets internalized. And is that a real issue in terms of, I mean, many organizations that I think especially were seeing in this environment, they're bringing consultants on not just for recommendations, but now very often they actually want implementation. Right, they want things kind of done for them. I think you you distinguish between engagement and installation. But if they're just want the consultant or the consulting firm for, quote, called the installation, but without having participation, is that where things break down? I will take that job. But I have something in other mind, something else in mind, but we're going to be together. And I will never let the client determine and decide how we're going to work together. Now I may not may not say that out loud, but that's in my mind. And so I'll treat them as a player. What's your role in this? And you want us to come and be surrogate managers, because you have you lost confidence in your people. Got it. Okay, let's talk about that. So I feel that's just the presenting problem. I'll take the job. It doesn't mean I'll do it, and maybe we'll do it in a way that builds supports and looks at the gifts of people that were supposed to be shoring up. But they've lost confidence in because we're certainly not cheaper than the people they hire. We're much more expensive. It's just that so I just treat that as a and with the client what they say they want in the beginning, I know is never going to be useful. That's their understanding of what's going on. If they were right about what's going on, they'd know what to do. And it's always those people, you know, up, down, middle, side, we need a new system. Okay, and if I'm a very technical consultant, you know, I'm from an engineer, IT person. I still know that focusing on their relationship with each other is what will deliver the technology that they want. And so I act on that without asking their permission. We're in a meeting and I'm presenting. I'm in the middle pitching and I stop halfway through. I say, you guys get it what you want. And I say, I'd like to hear from two or three of you about how you're hearing what I'm saying. We didn't come for that, Peter. I know you didn't. Pause, I contact. I'd like a couple of you, which is let me know how this is landing. And I might say, well, how did you feel about what he just said? And I would try to encourage them to have a dialogue together that they're not used to having. We didn't come for this. I know that's why I'm here. Now, I don't see that. I can say it to you because it's long. I just feel that I know that was the way they engage each other, no matter how technical they brought me in for. They'll determine implementation. And if they don't trust each other, they won't know how to use anything we do, even though they'll implement it. So I do that because I want it to work. I'd rather not take the jobs and fail. That's some of that. You have to have some arrogance. I didn't. And that don't what you're asking for. I didn't come. The deliver is an that kind of arrogant. Yes. Thank you. If you're a consulting business owner and you feel like your business has hit a ceiling, this is your invitation to break through it. Imagine this three transformative days in beautiful San Diego, surround by high performing consultants, trusted mentors, and a tight-knit mastermind community. All focused entirely on helping you scale with clarity, grow with confidence, and run your business with far less stress. From April 30 to May 2, 2026, you're invited to a consulting success mastermind. An intimate results driven experience carefully crafted for consultants who are serious about growth. Over three days, you'll dive into hands-on workshops that help you refine your positioning, pricing, and pipeline. Personalized coaching sessions, we'll get direct feedback from world-class mentors. Strategic roundtables with six and seven-figure consultants, high-value networking that leads to partnerships, referrals, and lifelong relationships. You'll walk away with clarity in your strategy, actionable next steps, and a community of people who genuinely want to see you win. Don't try to build your consulting business alone. Come build it with us. Spots are limited and selling fast. Don't wait. There are only a few seats left, and this event has sold out in the past. Secure your spot now by going to consultingsuccess.com/sandiego. That's consultingsuccess.com/sandiego. Unlock clarity, confidence, and real business momentum in San Diego this spring. Your future self will look back at this as the moment that everything is accelerated. You're asking questions. You're being direct. Many people, when I say people, many consultants, don't do that. They're more like yes-men or yes-women or others. They're doing what they think the client wants. Maybe because they're scared of losing the job or ruffling feathers. Why do you believe that more people are not as direct or don't take the approach that you're just referring to, which in some ways just seems common sense. It seems like it's the right thing to do if you really care about the client. Why wouldn't you challenge? Why wouldn't you push back? But so often people don't do that. What do you think is going on there? What I do know is that if I'm getting angry, I stop. So the tone, the way I push back. If I'm angry, I always say I can tell when I'm angry. I hear my voice. I think if I said it one more time, a little more clearly and slowly, maybe they would get the point. Thomas, when I found myself angry, I said, excuse me, I have to go to the rescue. Because it's not useful. And so even the word push back is a little more. Contentious. So I would ask the question. Do you have any sense of what your contribution to the problem? Like that. So what's your role in creating this mess? And then as they say, I don't know what you're talking about. You're just as kind and direct as you can be. And as they try three times, if they don't want to answer, then you let it go. What's your contribution to what's going on here? This is not my issue. Don't put this on me. I said, I get you. I'm not putting it on you, but I wondered if you work contributing what form it would take. Don't use that question and crap with me. You sound like my therapist. That's it. And I say to myself, let it go. So how do you deal with that situation when you're talking to a client or a group of people inside of an organization where you're approaching it in a level headed way. You're asking the direct questions. You're coming from a place of really wanting to serve. But there's either one or multiple people that are really trying to derail. They're not willing to go down that path with you. How do you handle that? I mean, how do you move things forward? I used to give them extra attention. I used to try to get them on board. And then I realized I want to work with the people that want to do something. And so they complained, this is crap, this is belonging, just the kind of thing I thought we should do. God, thank you. I looked at somebody. I said, John, what do you think we should? And I try to teach them how to deal with the asshole using a technical thing. So each time you're there, you're making that moment, that meeting, that talk, and constructing it a way that builds trust, that it's focused on the content and the relationship. Because I know if they don't want to be able to be more authentic with each other. They can't use what they paid me to deliver. Do you ask any specific questions or go through some sort of a process before the engagement begins, before they've signed the agreement to qualify or disqualify that somebody will in fact have a much higher likelihood of being the right fit? Yes. I've learned, I've collected questions over the years. And I find ones that are impossible to defend against. I'd love to hear them. One is what's the crossroads you're at at this stage of the game. And in doing that, I'm asking them as if they have a choice. I don't care if they answer it, the question will work on them. I would say, what doubts do you have that anything good is going to happen? I don't have any doubts. I'm a positive guy. I can do kind of leader. Okay. I know you are. And I appreciate that. If you had any doubts, what would they do? Okay. And sometimes if a little bit better on my say, is there anything you said yes to, you no longer mean? So I'm just trying to, and then I ask them, what gifts do you feel or in play here? What gifts do you have? And are they, do these people have you? Talking about what your disappointments are? What are they good at? And I, I say, tell me if I work with you, what do you want from me? I want this to go, well, you know, I want to get this done quickly. And I say, I know you do. What do you want from me in terms of how I work with you? And if they can answer that question, I don't care what it is. And I say, there's a possibility here. And then I say, well, let me tell you what I want from you. It's the work. This is before we've decided anything. I'm giving them a, a gentle taste of what I think makes projects go. The ability to have these kind of care what the wants are. I want you to be taller. You know, I wish you made eye contact a little better if you're a little, thank you. Anytime I defend myself, I say, excuse me, I go to the restroom. Sometimes I do that without saying it and don't leave the room, but I'm thinking to myself stop. I think you have questions of possibility, questions of crossroads, questions of why does this matter? They want to talk about method. I want to talk about meaning and my hope is that they will taste something in our conversation that they feel will bring them unique. your book flawless consulting. I think you wrote it so 44 years ago. 1978 I sent on a shelf for a year because my publisher went out of business. There we go. So, yeah, that book has had an impact on your career, on your business. If you were to go back in time and just imagine that you didn't write that book, but knowing what you know now Peter, what would you have done to grow the business or to build the business. And I say this with the assumption, and it might be wrong, that business, that book brought in a lot of business, right? Attract a lot of people into your world and to your company. But if you didn't have that, what would you do today to get in front of the right people? Well, I'd have to find some way where my way of thinking was available. Like anybody that wanted me to give a talk, I would do it for nothing. Because it allowed them to sample. Well, I represent. And then I would say in these days when you showed up, but you can do it other ways now. If you'd like to, we have some more information, if you'd like, give me your business card. Oh, guard those. I strap them to my chest. And I don't know, I just feel you have to find some way to tell the world what's unique about who you are and how you do what you do. Not by promising outcomes. Anytime you declare victory, you're losing more clients than you're getting. Just a little deeper into that. What I mean here, you say is that you need to bring unique perspectives. You need to lead with insights. Not just saying, here's the results I've created, right? Here's the outcomes that I produce. But really being a source of new or different insights and value for the market. And you have to find a language that expresses that. That's not boastful, but descriptive. Otherwise, because everybody's hired people, they've been disappointed in. And so they have a right to say, what's unique about working with you, Michael? I don't want to answer that directly by saying I'm special. I want to say, well, you know, and you do this with talks, you do it with which by writing, you try to let people know without boasting. Here's what I think works in the world. I mean, that book was life changing for me, not because it did, but it worked. I was embarrassed by the book. Why? Because it was so practical. I had these very conceptual partners, Tony and Mark, and half the things they talked about, which worked. They helped build the business. I didn't know what they're talking about. And so I wrote this very practical with boxes and lines and steps. And I thought, well, nothing else. I can hold it one copy in my hand. And then it worked. And that was amazing. It's amazing. I love giving talks, because when you give a talk, you find out right away what works. It's not life. Yeah. And instantaneous. You write a book, you don't know for three years, what it's worth. So it's a busy, advocacy strategy of last resort. And I just happened to write a book that worked. I discovered I had a brain. I always thought I had a mouth. I didn't know a brain. And I discovered I had brain. We've talked about the past Peter. Let's talk about the future for a moment. It's hard to, or at least it seems to be hard these days, to have a conversation and not talk about AI, artificial intelligence, and the doom and gloom and the excitement. Depends on who you talk to, you hear different things. You're bringing a wealth of knowledge. Many years of experience and seeing changes in the world. What are your thoughts on AI in general? And then more specifically for those who work as consultants, consulting business owners, advisors to organizations. Technology has been with us a long time. And it matters, but it's not decisive. Okay, no amount of AI will create an organization where people want to work. Well, amount of technology will create a place where people feel accountable for filling their promises. Now, sure, I can summarize a meeting in 35 seconds, but that's nice. You know, I grew up when he had party lines for a phone. Two rings was you. One ring was your neighbor. Okay, and so this doesn't solve anything to do with culture, relationship, accountability, agency, you know, companies that give it up, it was on the board of a dot com and we had pretension bonuses. Really? We have something called talent acquisition. Now, AI may take over the talent acquisition function. As long as we think we're buying people, we have, why I just feel this technology is nice, it's interesting. I think it's profitable. Why is the world so enamored with it? Because it's it's it's low cost labor. And so the world is speed and scale. But that doesn't solve, it doesn't answer any questions that matter. Any questions that have to do with, so I just find it interesting, but it's not important. What's what's the maybe contrarian view or that, you know, if we're playing the game of chess with with AI kind of, you know, in the mix, what's what's the move that you feel is the strategic one, the one that will create the most value, you know, the most benefit for the consultant. Maybe no one's talking about that you believe is just an opportunity that is not getting enough attention as it should. I'm starting to believe in what I've talked about all these things. Just now, huh? Because we talk about connection, you know, what do you have in your own language? I'm really seeing it's even more important than ever. Yeah. And so the only thing we control is our attention. And so wherever room you're in, no matter it was AI and speed and scale and all that stuff, I don't take it on. But let me, here's what I think we need to pay attention to. What I pay attention to. So I have more faith than I've ever had in what I've been paying attention to. And we're holding a conference on connecting for the common good here. And the idea is let's re-imagine what's worth paying attention to. If you have a consulting business, you keep asking yourself, now where do I put my attention? Where do I find areas of vulnerability and possibility that other people aren't noticing instead of trying harder with what they think they're looking for. And AI is going to basically appealing because it replaces its labor cost. Here they sell it with science. The whole world is always sold with science. Look at the liver we can analyze more quickly. But it's being used in thousand ways less important than diagnosis in a liver. So I just don't want to treat it as if it matters, it just is. And I think the wheel was a great invention. I'm not arguing against it. And you know, telegraph was even more stunning. I could actually communicate with people I can't see. And AI is another thing that I don't know. I don't want to argue with it or for it. It just has to solve. Or the pepper. So Peter, I mean, looking at your journey, what would you have done differently or much sooner? And I just wonder if there's anything you look back, not necessarily you regret, but just knowing what you know now. Is there anything in your career or journey that maybe, you know, you thought I really could have done this differently or things would have been so much better or easier or more fulfilling, so just can't stand though. What I was good at was being willing to change my mind and focus. But every seven years, I would, I gotta do something different. And I'd find people that had ideas of philosophy or a poet, a tennis instructor, the inner game of tennis that shifted my thinking. what I was doing. So that always stained me intellectually. My regrets are my cowardice. I said no to things that scared me. And I got a call from the today show years ago. Peter would you like to appear on the station? No, I'm busy. It's scared the hell out of me. But most of the time I said yes, you know, weird invitations, weird places. And in the work, I wish I'd had more faith in myself. I took too long. We had people working for us that didn't work out and I kept them around for too long. My people who left and they felt they were entitled to something. And because I wanted to be a good guy, I gave it to him and I'm still angry at myself for being so weak in those moments. And I thought they were kind of refusals that I didn't make. And yes, not that many. I took jobs for the money from time to time. I mean, it gave me huge amount of money for a 60 minute talk. And I said, can I break them in a small, no, don't do it. We don't want it to your small group crap. But you're a keynote speaker and then Philadelphia, one o'clock in the afternoon. I said, no, we've already told people you're coming. You have to be there, yes sir. Say yes, okay, because you need the money. But don't kid yourself about what you're doing. Forgive yourself. I don't mind doing that. If I need the money, I'm going to do it. I start out with nothing. Next to worse than nothing. And so I, it's just don't pretend and say, okay, I did it for the money. I'm a human being. Thank you God. Forgive me the opportunity. And then when you do show up, you try to make the most of it, which is the story of our life. Otherwise, you become moralistic. I don't do that kind of work. Are you kidding? I know what it's like. I've done stuff for money. And so anyway, that's just a way of affirming our humanity and getting on with it instead of being righteous. I like the notion that the opposite of love is certainty. And so when it comes to looking at the work of my business, you know, we're human beings and get off it a little bit. And when things don't work, you tell yourself it didn't work. My failures were usually moments of caution. And I was afraid. And I remember them and they last forever. How do you figure that part out? I mean, there's that saying, follow your gut or that, you know, your body will, will give you the signals, right? Trust, trust the gut, so forth. And so if that's bringing the caution, right? It's telling maybe there's a signal, a warning to be cautious. How do you suggest that people work through that? There's no answer to that. There's a question. I don't know. But usually I know when I something's not going to work versus I'm just afraid. People are vulnerable to speak up, to show up, to say, yes, do a powerful invitation. And after a while, you realize that anxiety is what you've been waiting for. But exciting. That's what happened with me, given talks. First to terrify, I've never waken up in Dallas, Texas, three in the morning, checking train schedules. How do I get out of this place before my nine o'clock keynote? Well, luckily there were no trains at 3am, hopefully. So Peter, thank you so much for coming on. I appreciate you sharing some of your experience, some of the journey. And really for many of those very powerful perspectives and insights. So thank you again for coming on. Thank you, Michael, your questions create a hard time together. Before we end our show, let me leave you with a question. What would it feel like to finally have a steady pipeline of clients who are ready and willing to pay your premium fees? If that sounds like the consulting business you've always wanted, stick with me for just another minute. Too many consultants, yes, even a highly successful six and seven figure ones, find themselves stuck in the same cycle. They're juggling client work and trying to grow their business at the same time, but their pipeline is unpredictable and scaling feels like an uphill battle. Sound familiar? You've worked hard to get where you are, but staying stuck in this cycle isn't sustainable and is costing you time, energy and future growth. The good news? You don't have to free this out all alone. That's why we offer you the opportunity to schedule a free growth session. There's no obligation, no pressure call is your chance to explore whether our clarity coaching program is the right fit for you. Clarity coaching has helped thousands of consultants like you to scale their businesses, build predictable systems and attract premium clients consistently, all while freeing up more time to focus on what you love most. When you schedule your growth session, here's what you'll get. A personalized conversation with an expert clarity advisor who has seen first hand with hundreds of consultants what it takes to break through barriers and achieve sustainable growth. The opportunity to see how clarity coaching can help you refine your business strategy and scale with confidence and actionable insights tailored to your unique goals so that you can start moving toward the consulting business you've always envisioned. If you're ready to stop spinning your wheels and start building the consulting business you truly deserve, here's what to do next. Visit consulting success.com/grow and book your free growth session today. That's consulting success.com/grow. Don't wait. Your next big breakthrough might just be one conversation away. Thanks for listening to today's episode. I can't wait to hear about your success. Until next time, this is Michael Zepersky, wishing you clarity, growth and success in your consulting journey.