The Epic Movie Draft

I'm Sean Finese. I'm Amanda Davin. And this is the big picture a conversation show about epic movies CR is here and we are drafting again in honor of the Odyssey. We are conducting the very first and maybe only epic movie draft. What does that mean? People asked Chris, we're going to break it all down right after this. This episode of The Big Picture is presented by Amazon Prime. One of the best things about streaming is that you never just pick a title, you pick a feeling. And Prime makes that easy. With great entertainment and fast shipping that brings the moment to life, Prime helps you experience the feeling you're craving. Shows you can't wait for and deliveries you don't wait for. One click away. From streaming to fast shipping, it's on Prime. Okay, we are going to draft epic movies today. A lot of news is transpired. We've just returned. A lot of news. Yeah. A lot of news. There's a lot of stuff in the news. Yeah. Okay. Why don't you tell us your highlights. I mean, I just think it's an interesting time for the Senate. That's what's the top of mind. Patrick Dempsey will not be throwing his hat in the ring. Yes. Did he announce that? He did. He did. He did. He did. He announced that he was not going to be running. Can you believe Strom Thurmond had 50 some lot of years of continuous service in that seat. And then Lindsey Graham came right up behind him. So like for 70 years, it was just those two guys. Pretty cool. Good ridden. I live in that state. Yeah. Yeah. What's that? It's kind of like the big pick. Oh, so when you die, she'll take over, right? Okay. Yeah. And then maybe, who does that make you? I don't know. James Telleriko. Okay. Enough politics. Beto. So we, speaking of, of, of international intrigue, though, we, um, we did, we, no, we came back from Canada. We went to Canada last week. And I just wanted to say thanks to the fine people of Canada and Toronto where we had a lovely 72 hours. We showed a Christopher Nolan film, tenant. We did a live draft with some special friends that will air on this feed. I look at him and say, you, thank you so much for tuning in, you're turning your back on me. Mid-potton. We just started. You're already shunning me. I can't believe this. He just, he feels bad about his behavior in the car on the way to the airport. And so he's trying to, you are done with us by the end of the trip. And maybe we can get into that during the draft, which, and actually, I mean, and I were locking in. We were having the most fun. And you were like enough because you were like, this is where I get off the bus. And it was the green room after tenant. And you said no more. And then, I don't think that's true. And it is 1,000 percent. Yeah. What? But it's okay. We're back. And also, you know, after the last draft, has the last draft aired yet? The last draft, the draft we just conducted. Yes. No, no, no, no, no. The last one that we three did together with you to remember this. What was it? Can someone help me out? In the auction? Yeah. The auction. Yeah. That's right. Are you okay? The auction aired? Yeah. Yeah. Listen, we saw Tenet and I'm on board in space attack right now. Backwards. I go forwards. I'm here in the moment. But he turned on me a little during auction. The auction as well. Right. So we're healing right now. We're healing. We're healing. We're healing. But I've noticed that the chair is inching that way again. Back to me. My son. Okay. Let's talk about real news, real movie news. Sam Neal passed away. Terrible news. He was 78 years old. And it struck me. The minute I heard this news, just what an essential part of he was in my early movie going and movie loving life. In the 1990s, if you look around, you see Sam Neal everywhere. And obviously he's had a full career starting in the late 70s that ran all the way up until the present day. But just in the 90s, Jurassic Park, of course, the hunt for red October in the mouth of madness, the piano, event horizon, a number of movies that we talk about with a great frequency on this show. Amanda, when I say Sam Neal, what do you think about? I would like to have seen Montana, which is, you know, and to your point, he, that's from the hunt for red October. And then obviously he's one with the dinosaurs forever more. And that's where I probably first saw him. But it's been fun as we have been doing our various theme episodes. And also as Blankcheck has been doing, um, God, we're we're we're we're, I think you I was like Australia. I'll see. Yes. Australia. Um, to go back and discover him, he was obviously a big part of Australian and, you know, New Zealand cinema and, and bringing that to the US. So getting to see things like dead calm, uh, which I had not seen until a couple of years ago. Maybe when we were doing a thrillers, right? Was that it? I can't remember. I would have said that it was the George Miller episode. No, it wasn't. Something about boats. Nicole Kidman. Did we do a Nicole Kidman? Nicole Kidman. That's what it was. Okay. Anyway. Really building a true temple here. It's like Wikipedia. Sure. It's amazing. It's true. Yeah. Well, someone who was introduced to us blockbuster wise, but um, obviously had like a rich and varied career outside of the dinosaurs. No doubt. It's got to start in 1979 in my brilliant career, uh, Gillian Armstrong. What was the, um, I think it's a New Zealand. I think it might be Roger Donaldson, the one that he made with like worn oats. Sleeping dogs. Yeah. That's a, that movie came before my brilliant career is like 76, 77, right? There's an arrow addition of that movie. Okay. It's a really, really cool movie. Um, and yeah, I mean, he, he did have this kind of rich period in his career in Australian New Zealand making films before coming over to Hollywood. But then by the time he came to Hollywood, he just became a pretty entrenched leading man who could also go real crazy. You know, he was famously in, it was the Omen 4 where he was for president. He's Damien, right? Um, he plays Damien and, and, you know, obviously movies like Verizon and, and uh, in the mouth of that. That's just Damien Omen. Yeah. Uh, just had great range and was a really talented actor. So, yeah. I think, uh, in some ways, a less flashy version of careers of slightly younger actors may be, or probably actually contemporaries of like Malcovitch and Defoe who are capable of doing everything from Jim Jarmish and, you know, a period piece to an action thriller or to a sci-fi movie to Robert Eggers movies or what have you. And, uh, I just hope we continue to see actors who have careers as varied and rich as him. He was metronomic. You could just depend on him finding like locating the, like, the best emotion for each scene. But also, would be able to like, take the handbrake off at any given moment and do something like he does an event of Verizon that's a little bit more dramatic. Yeah, yeah. I mean, he, like, even obviously possession is a legendary film that he was a huge part of, or, and even this recently is Tygo YTD's Hunt for the Wilder people where he's doing like a much more broad comic outsized performance. So, he was just an amazing performer. So, we honor him on the show, um, from the sublime to the absurd, uh, Moana. Moana was the big release while we were in Canada. Uh, I saw the film. It's a live-action remake of the 2016 Disney animated instant classic film. I love, uh, a great deal. Mm-hmm. And-- Why don't you perform some of it for us live? Uh, make way, make way. I think that's-- we're in copyright territory. Okay. I-- I did see this live-action remake with, with my daughter in 3D yesterday. Sure. Wow. On purpose. She were the glasses. She did. I thought it would be an interesting experiment. Okay. And she wore them and she enjoyed the 3D experience. She said, "Moana is coming out of the screen, dad." Yeah. And, and that was exciting. It's all that the 3D makers could ask for. Yes. That was about the only exciting thing about Moana, which was just not very good, as you might imagine, um, and is a huge bomb. It made $43 million here in the States, $95 million worldwide opening, and it was reported that $125 million will be lost to the Walt Disney Corporation. You say what, Amanda? I was-- I was going to turn it around on you. I was going to say, and it inspired a new wave of hand-ringing coverage of the box office. Is it up? Is it down? Mm-hmm. You say what? Uh, I think it's interesting. I think it kind of checks out with how everything's been going, um, which is to say that we're kind of out with the old and in with the new. This is the-- well, there's two-- there's two things about Moana specifically. One is that Moana 2 just came out a year and a half ago, and it was a big hit, even though it was critically not acclaimed. And so this is just way too soon for another Moana movie, and that this movie was paused to fast-track the Moana 2 animated movie, and they gave us this more quickly. The second thing is that it's only been 10 years since the animated Moana came out. Most of these live-action remakes are films that were made at least 30 years ago, and sometimes even 80 years ago. So Chris, you saw the film four or five times this weekend, what do you think? Yeah, that's probably why you guys were reacting to my mood, and Toronto is that I was quite busy attending Moana's screenings at any time I had a moment to myself, and I come out of those, you know, multiple trips to the theater, and I ask you this, is The Rock Dead? I think this is an under-reported component of this story. I have helpedfully compiled the filmography between The Rock Johnson, a professional wrestler, non-poreal, really one of the goats. Since 2016, since the original Moana was released, here are the films that Dwayne The Rock Johnson has made, The Fate of the Furious, Baywatch, Jumanji, Welcome to the Jungle, Rampage, Skyscraper, those are two different movies, Fast and Furious presents Hobbs and Shaw, Jumanji the next level, Jungle Cruise, Red Notice, Animated DC League of Superpets, Black Adam, Fast X, Red 1, Moana 2, The Smashing Machine, Moana. and then later this year, Jumanji Open World, woof. - I was gonna be charitable and say, this happened to Schwarzenegger. This happens to lots of our great action stars. You have like a shelf life. People get tired of your moves or people move onto the next thing. But he doesn't have anything in his filmography that even approaches like lower mid-tier Schwarzenegger. - I agree, let alone a Terminator 2. There is no Terminator 2 in his-- - So I don't know what to say. I mean, I can never not think that I'm watching the rock when I see him on screen. I also have to, unlike you, I would say that some of his charms are lost on me but not necessarily in my life. I'm not like anti-Dwayne Johnson, anti-the-rock, but-- - No, am I. And I think I've only seen half of these movies. - I've seen every single one. - Well, some of them I was-- - Isn't that crazy? - Some of them I was on leave four. And skyscraper, I just-- No, I think I saw skyscraper, actually. - They don't stay in your mind. But these are-- - What's your favorite? - Critically, I was gonna say critically, these are just, this is maybe the worst list of movies ever made. - It's a rough list. - Box office-wise, it comes at times. - The Jumanji films are huge, so there's that. Obviously, the Fast and Furious franchise was very sturdy for a long time. - But these movies, I would have to go back and double-check my work. His movies that are not Jumanji or Fast movies have like a $150 million ceiling. - I think that's more or less right. - Like San Andreas and Scramming Me is obviously pivoted by going to do Red Notice and Red One. Those are more or less streaming movies. The Smashing Machine was more a prestige play. I like the Smashing Machine. And I thought his performance in it was very good, but a lot of these choices are really bad. And this is like kind of a reckoning for somebody who has only pursued a certain kind of movie for such a long time. And he wasn't like, he was bad in the live action, no wanna, he originated Maui, he looks a lot like Maui, he's charming enough, but it's just a repeat of a movie we've already seen. And there's nothing in this live action remake that improves upon the original in any way. - Well, he's also, everything you said is true and speaks to his career. And also the way many big budget movies have made in the last 10, 15 years. And so it does speak to this moment that we keep coming back to have like, oh, our things changing and are people tired of franchises and you stick the rock in some junkie XYZ with bad CGI. And for a while that was enough and/or studios and businesses and the rock thought that it was enough. And maybe now we are turning to a point where it is not. - He's got to find a middle ground between probably a 24 stuff and imaginary Scorsese movies and Jumanji, but I do wanna point out that we have now entered a new era that being so over in fact means we are so back that movies failing means that people have like higher taste standards or something like that. - Yeah, I think there's some truth to that. I think it is not unanimous at the moment but the success of movies from younger filmmakers and young people getting excited about those filmmakers. It's the thing that I think has turned, you know, because a lot of the people who were excited about Moana when it came out, let's say they were eight years old when it came out, those people are 18 years old. Those people are not interested in going to see a live action Moana also when Moana came out most people who were parents at that time are like, well my kids are grown up. So I'm not interested in that either and that picks our way where Pixar draws in a lot of parents. So the movie is really like neither Fish nor Fowl. I think it'll be interesting to see 'cause a handful of movies to have now kind of skipped, you know, we talked about minions, skipped a beat. - It held, it's sort of. - It did okay. - It held. - It did okay. - Let me just, and let me say, I said this off camera. I said it off camera, but I'll say it to you and Andy right here. Next time, call me, you know, you have my phone number. I'm available. - I don't like to bother you, you know, like you're a busy woman. - You guys always say this and then you just never answer my text and then you know, sell me in the car. - I've been since your corresponded in a way. - You have. - I've made an effort. - I think it's fair to say that a lot of younger people have, you know, but they, if you grew up with Moana, chances are you went and saw obsession in the last six weeks. - Exactly. - Yeah. - Your silence has been deafening about Indy Navarity attending a Mads game. - Well, we were already cursed, so not sure how the worst things could get. - Do you think that's better? - She, her character was actually doomed to in the movie. - Yeah, that's our ultimate fate, is that you feel forever. Yeah, that's where I'm going to be buried. So maybe she can join me there at the last set about the Mets the Better, but I am going on Mets Corner tomorrow and we will say a prayer to the demons who have overtaken that franchise. The Disney Live Action Future. So, should they keep doing this now? - I mean, Lilo and Stitch made a billion dollars, right? So that worked, and that was in that sweet spot where the kids who liked it when they were kids are grownups and they have their own kids. That was a smart strategy. I counted. There have been 18 live action Disney remakes this century as part of this new initiative. - Right. - And they haven't done a couple of all-time classics, Bambi is probably the most prominent, Pocahontas comes to mind as a movie they haven't remade and probably shouldn't. - Yeah, shouldn't. - You know, some more recent films, Hercules and Tarzan. - Hercules, hercules, hercules. - The Nutty Professor, you're thinking of what you guys were talking about when this topic comes up. - Have you seen the Ember's New Groove? - Is that a movie? - Oh, I saw that in theaters, I think. - Yeah, it's an animated comedy. - No, I didn't. - Listen, I was a child once. What do you want from it? - Oh, this is from when you were back when we were kids. - Yeah, yeah. - In 2002, so you weren't a child. - Yeah, I was graduating from high school. - But you went to see that in theaters. It's a movie I like. I saw it. - Okay. - I'm curious to see how much they keep pushing this. Tangled is being remade and is gonna come out in a few years. - Many more. - Is she the star? - Wasn't she in the original? - Well, she was the star of the original, but I don't think she'll be playing Rapunzel in the new film. - You don't know, maybe they're updating it. - She's, you think it's gonna be about a 40-year-old former pop star? - Yeah. - That would be a weird Rapunzel. You know, Frozen's gonna happen at some point. There's gonna be a live action Frozen. There's a billion, two billion, three billion dollars waiting for a live action Frozen. But after that, I don't know. Hopefully this is over. - It's been kind of reported that these are all eager mistakes. I thought that was interesting that they're like, these were all Bob's green lights. And Josh tomorrow's not gonna get fooled with the banana and the tailpipe again. - Yeah, I think it was just, it's not, they weren't mistakes. These movies made $800 million for years and years. They did a good job. It was like they eroded what's special about Disney. Like Disney was a creative space that took pre-established stories that you knew and put their Disney touch on it and made, you see them in a new light. That was something exciting that they accomplished for 80, 90 years. And what they've been doing with these movies is taking movies they already made and making them again and making them less good with human actors. And so it should end. That's my take. - Okay, okay. - Thanks guys. Speaking of human actors. - Omkruz will appear in Digger. - Yeah. And also on top of some random structure on the Warner Brothers lot during the trailer release event for Digger because this man climbs on things. - Does he not know how to just be like, I'm gonna let this movie sell itself or like. - I don't think it's gonna sell itself. I think he has to sell it. - But do you think there's like a cognitive dissonance from the showmanship of the way he's kind of presenting this movie to what this movie is supposed to maybe be about? - Perhaps. - I think that they think the superpower of the movie is Tom Cruise. - Okay. - And so it has been Tom Cruise-Ford. - I think Tom Cruise-Ford. - The trailer was released today. We're recording on Monday. - Yes. - Chris, what did you think of the trailer for Digger? Alejandro Gonzalez-Inerito's new film. - You know, it didn't determine me from seeing it. I was a little surprised by how much seems to be in it. That seems to be what Digger is about. It's about environmental crisis caused by this oil man who is also in the cabinet of John Goodman's presidency and has to go fix what the problem he started. I don't think I found it funny or like, I was like, wow, Lev Grossman, but like from Texas. - Yeah, incredible. - Less Grossman. But I'm still gonna go see it. I just, this was the one that felt like there was like a little bead of sweat coming down. Mike Lucas Forehead and he was like, we need to make sure everybody knows what this movie is about. And there's been a lot of talk online today about how complicated and hard satire is for people to do well. - Sure is. I mean, as soon as they put a comedy on the poster back in, last year I was like, oh, you guys are nervous. You need to tell people, and I mean, this is the trailer that we saw in Santa Monica. - It was like an extended two minutes scene that led it right into this trailer that we saw. - Yeah. - But I would say my reaction was the same to yours. - To mine. - Yeah. - That you thought it was not funny and you were concerned. - Well, that it didn't assuage any of my concerns just from the basic shouting comedy really loudly with like bright lights to try to get you to laugh, which is I think a problem. You know, the crews of it all in the trailer and in the extended scene that we saw is very funny. I'm excited for that. I like the rest of the cast. I think it's cool that people are trying things. Again, my inery to history, you know, is Hit Miss. - Checkered at best. - Is that cat CGI? - Couldn't tell. Couldn't tell. - Honestly, took me out. - Okay. - Took me out. - You just have a real cat. - You cat guy? - Yeah. - For sure. - Yeah. - Love cat content. - Let me ask you something totally unrelated. You've seen disclosure day yet? - No. - Okay, so let's, we'll circle back on that one. Um, they're cats in it along with Tom Cruise and John Goodman. I don't have to see it because it made over a hundred million. Oh, okay. So you're, that's right. You're not in debt. So what else can we get you to spend your money on this summer? We'll figure that out. Fix you as soccer. They're going to need more than five million. You were allotting for disclosure day. Uh, Riz Ahmed is in the film, Sandra Woolers in the film. Um, yeah, I would say I'm intrigued, but I have concerns as well. I think not a beginner or two guy either. I think it looks good. Why is it so washed out? Don't like it. I think it's a very clear stylistic choice that they made. I don't think it's unintentional by any means. I joked when we were at cinema con that it looked like a Roy Anderson movie. And at times, it kind of does that big kind of, um, almost like Coliseum sequence with all the men, the older men in one space, um, kind of recreating a strange, lovey and, um, type of scene does look like a Roy Anderson movie on speed. Uh, uh, you know, he reaches a great stylist who I think just like circles the drain with very similar ideas about bleakness every time he makes a movie. And he sometimes tries to undercut that bleakness by making comedies like Birdman. And those comedies are often not that funny. That could be the point, you know, that could be sort of something that he's trying to say that like, in the, you know, death rattle of life, the absurdity is the, is the struggle is the, is the humor. Um, um, but I wouldn't say that that's my favorite kind of movie to watch. And, and, but I am avowed to cruise, you know, I, I am fascinated to see him reach back for something different. It's been a long time since he's done something different. So we'll be watching and covering on the show. Will you be watching and covering? On my show or on the show? Which show do you mean when you say your show? You have so many shows. I talked to Thruin's solo pod just breaking down. No, I'd, I'd love to come under the digger podcast. You would. Yeah, okay. Yeah, yeah, keep that in mind. Um, you have to see the film. I will. Okay. I, I do my homework assignments. Yeah. But during the roll cup, I have, it's true. It's, it's followed by the wayside. It's not fair. You've had a lot on your plate. And I support you. Thank you. So when you have to sketch back this way a little bit more? That's nice. That's very adorable. You keep moving in and out of your shot. I think be careful there. While we were in Toronto, the Dune Part 3 trailer. Yeah. And on stage, after presenting Tena, Chris asked us if we'd watched it. And neither of us had. Yeah. Have you since watched it? No, because I thought it was what we saw. I mean, I thought we saw it in Silicon. No, this was new. This is an uncut Peruvian flake. Yeah. Well, listen, let me tell you that what we saw in Vegas was just straight up fire. It was unbelievable. I don't need to see anymore. They did it. Show me the movie. They did it right after Dune 2. We didn't have to wait five years. Timmy is Hymethy. And he has due in Tyra Banks. Like Pattinson is going for like, honestly, he's going to fucking win the triple crown this year. Yeah. And two of his movies could be bad. And he could still win the triple crown. He is out of his mind in this trailer. On you covered in blood. Oh, yeah, we saw that. And are you sure we didn't see this? It's possible. I don't think so. I think that we saw it. Okay. But you haven't seen it since. So you don't can't confirm. Well, I had to drive. But you know what I'm talking about, we did. Cindy is like, wait, trust it you. Yes, yeah. There's a lot of Jason Momoa in this trailer. Who's returned for some sort of vengeance? Is he what version of Dunkin' I to host? I mean, it's a complicated. It's okay. It's fine. Don't worry about it. You're going to see this film? Yes, I read "Dune for Nothing." "Dune" or the Wikipedia page? It's going out. I like to roll. You own a copy of "Dune Messiah?" No. An audiobook? I mean, I've picked it up. I picked it. My mom had one. I think I've been like, this is a real "Bind of Proc," "Bind of Proc" situation here. This is like, I like literary criticism because I get both. Do you, can I ask, do you do audiobooks? Oh no. Me either. No. Do you do audiobooks? I was supposed to go on the way here. "Dune 3." "Dune Messiah." No, not of "Dune Messiah." No, no, no. We're real estate too. "Able for Arras Memor." Oh, okay. "Sine" and "Red by Abel." Yeah, I was going to say, "Dude, he's off for you." Yeah, that's beautiful. You're never like driving into work, listening to "Lonesome No." I love film. Anything of what you listened to? Of course. Did you listen to it at 2X? Uh, 1.5. Okay. That's better than 2X. He gave me a ride home from the airport and the podcast started playing on 2X when we got in the car. Your car wasn't there. It was, unfortunately, the big picture, which was even worse. It was an auto-play. It was an auto-play because he had been sharing its fine. That part is innocent, but it was the most psychotic. Can you get those numbers up? Yeah. I would send her to my self to listen to my own podcast, however. 2X, I had a physical reaction to it. And I do think that I now understand you in a slightly different way. It's important, you know. I've been repping 2X for a long time. I know that, but I had never experienced it. I had never experienced it, and that is unnatural. That's right, and that's what makes me special. Yeah. Speaking of special. I co-programmed a series on the criterion channel. Can I tell you something? Yeah. Really cool selection of films. Yeah, that's great. I just was looking at that this morning. Yeah, there's seven films that are currently available, and you know, the idea was how can a space like criterion honor. Everyone being excited for what is clearly the movie event of the summer. It's clearly, especially some of these bodies washing a shore of other summer blockbusters that are not totally panning out. It does seem like there are a lot of people who are kind of saving their coin for the Odyssey. And so the films that you can find on the criterion channel right now, which will be eligible in one of our categories here, are the searchers, the Darjeeling Limited, Sullivan's Travels, walk about the straight story after hours and over. There are, though. And all of those stories to some extent or another are inspired by Homer's The Odyssey. And Journey's home. Journey's back somewhere. And I was very happy to do it. I love working with Criterion on stuff like that. Speaking of Criterion, I was just there at the mobile closet at the Hollywood Bowl over the weekend where there was a huge West Anderson event where like they transformed the Hollywood Bowl into West Anderson world for a day where you could listen to music in a vinyl room. For free days, excuse me, right the whole weekend. And I didn't get a chance to go to the concert, but now you did. I got to go last night, which was a delight and very charming, hosted by Bill Murray. And you know, it was a collection of the songs that have been featured on the soundtrack, performed by, in some cases, the actual artists. Oh, cool. And also the scores played by the orchestra and there was a children's choir at one point. Oh, wow. Jackson Brown did these days, which was like pretty moving and like telling a story about how he, that song was not a thing until Ten of Bounds. And he said he wanted to see the theater, see the movie in the theater. And he was like, I'm sure I'd given approval, but didn't remember it. And then the song starts playing. He's like, I used to play guitar like that. [LAUGHTER] And then, and then perform the song. So it was really magical. It was very exciting to go. Yeah, that's great. So epic movies. Mm-hmm. What do you think makes a movie epic, CR, as you were thinking about this project? You know, I could throw out like some definitions, but this is, this is a real pornography one. This is like, you kind of know it when you see it. And I think that there can be epic movies that could have gone a lot of different ways. Yeah, I know. Is your epic pornography? Mm-hmm. That's a really good idea. Should we start making like four-hour multi-locational-- $100 million pornos? Yeah. Okay. What do you think? Good business model? Sure. That seems great. Yeah. You just pay for your porn? Uh, well, morally and ethically. That's right. Yeah, you pay God. Yeah. It's sort of an Odysseus of porn. Oh, boy. I think that this is the kind of thing where you know an epic when you see it. And there are some times films that might kind of have the trappings of an epic movie, but fall short. I, and there are domestic chamber pieces. I'm sure that you could call epic. Mm-hmm. But to me, I'm very curious to see with our picks how left field and how argumentative we get with each other about whether something classifies as an epic. I thought that this was a very fun exercise to put them in their various categories. I left it somewhat vague. I think you have to, like, think about the scope of the movie though to answer your question. I agree with you. What-- yeah. How do you think about these movies? The-- I think there can be a pretty literal definition, which is number one, like, extras, the number of people actually in the film where you just get, like, a person count, background actors. I'm sorry. I know that's the preferred terminology, which is a way of measuring scope to your point. But just this sheer number of crowd scenes because they really went for it back in the day. And that is one of the things that is diminishing as we move to CGI crowds, which they just-- the technology is not there. Did the crowd scenes are, like, a huge-- No, or better days. It was better, like, 25 years ago. Yeah, it's really, really, really bad. So if you have actual people in a crowd scene, and because that indicates also budget locations, you know, scope, all of these things. And then, I think runtime, I think anything under two and a half hours is probably not on this scale. I have been thinking about that, because there is a category that speaks to that concern. But can a movie be two hours and eight minutes and be an epic? What do you think? I don't think it's durational. I think it's-- I don't know that I have anything that that is at short, for instance, but I do think that it's about the multiplicity-- for me, it's about the multiplicity of locations, the scope of the sort of landscape that you're covering. And then I think a lot of the genres that we think of as epic would be stuff like films about the Bible, or films drawing from the Bible, Roman, and Greek, classical sort-and-sandals movies, King Arthur movies, nights, night, like those kinds of things, and then Westerns. - I would say war films. - And war films, yeah. - Yeah, yeah. So the Odyssey is 172 minutes, and we just had a chance to see it, and it is, in the conversation for the most epic movie ever made, I don't know if it completely fulfills every single thing that you guys outline there. For example, I think even just sustaining the same number of background actors is like the 1967 war and peace. Like, I don't know if anyone will ever do that again. Like, there's certain kinds of movies where you just, they're not made in quite the same way, but in terms of just traveling the world, the scope of the, like, the way that the battle sequences are made, and the intensity of the production design, I hadn't seen the movie when I came up with this idea, but it fits, you know, like it now, I think instantaneously kind of goes into that canon of these kinds of films. These kinds of films though, I would say, as I've watched more and more of them as I've gotten older, you know, they're not always good. It's like just being big doesn't confirm any kind of greatness. It confirms grandeur, but. - But I always kind of like them. Even like, even like, how the West was one, which has its ups and downs and is very, very long, I kind of marvel at it's, just it's simple act of being, and I don't mind it being on in the background for long stretches, and I'll be like, oh, I can get up because they're doing this now, but they'll get back to the, to the, the part that I like. - Do you like them as much? - I completely agree with Chris, and I was doing some refreshes, because many of these, I have only seen once or twice, because you see it, you're like, okay, they really did get all that, all that, that many people in one place with some cameras. I like, I get it, but a funny way to kind of speed wash through a couple was just any time it's two people in a room, you're like, okay, whatever, I got to care, I can just force the next set piece in the next time, that's just like the camp, you know, you get the vast expanse. But yeah, I mean, I, like, I am forever, like begging people to film in real places and to pay attention to production design and to all of the, the, the, the, the, the finery, the frittery of, of a movie. And sometimes they went too far, and I grew with Chris, that they, they're not always good, or it doesn't live up to the amount of money put into it. But it's, it's really cool that they tried. I like it. I mean, I think that way, I feel that way about seeing, I'm sure when I see Odyssey on, on IMAX, and I kind of feel that way about watching Ten Commandments on a small TV, where I'm like, wow, this is really crazy that, yeah, she's a big deal. I think it's fitting that we're probably doing this draft now, because one of the things that's really been a theme of Matt Damon's rather extensive and globe trotting press tour. He is running is him saying, I'll vote for him. I think this is the last one. I think this is the last one of these movies that I'll try to do or that may ever get made, you know, like, yeah, we, we'll, we'll touch that on the Odyssey episode. I do think that's a really interesting idea. And I think it's related a little bit to like, what is Christopher Nolan going to do next? Because the escalation run that he's on now is quite fascinating. These films, some of these films may be eligible here. We can discuss the Odyssey will not be eligible, though, because it is not yet been released. Okay, well, I'll share the categories before we set the draft order. Okay. So for those of you listening along at home, as I said, Odyssey inspired epics, which includes the eight films that were programmed for the Criterion channel, as well as other Odyssey inspired movies will be eligible there. Okay. The second category is epic, best picture winners. Now, this one could be interestingly fungible, is what I'll say. There are, I would say about five no doubt full-blown epics that have one best picture. There's 35 that you can have an idea about. Yeah, that's exactly right. The next category is biblical epic. The next category is romantic or war epic. Then we have biopic epic, which I think maybe undercuts some of your descriptors. I do think that there are some biopics that maybe don't traverse as many lands or feature as many extras, but could fit the bill. We can talk about that here. Yeah. The next category is movies that exceed three hours, which there are many. And then the last category is wild card. Okay. Guys, feel good? Yes. Yeah. Shall we set the draft order? Yes. Yes. Okay. Jack Fireway. All right. Proper. Back to our old Bruce Dungeons and Dragons. Now, here we go. So the Toronto fiasco will people will catch up on that? Well, is it really a fiasco? I think it was a fiasco. Yeah. Drafting first is Christopher Ryan. Okay. Wow. Interesting. Once again. Drafting second is Sean Fennesy. Amanda Dobbins third. Okay. Interesting. I have no idea what the right, what the power rankings of this are. But you know what? Today's epic movie draft is presented by State Farm. Life is all about choices like deciding whether or not to check out the latest release in theaters at State Farm. Their goal is to help you make decisions that you feel good about. Speaking of good decisions, it's time for the first pick of the draft. CR, you've got seven categories to plug into. And my movie could go into almost every one of them. Okay. But I'm going to put it in movies over three hours. Oh, interesting. I'm going to take what I think is the number one C, which is Lawrence. Lawrence. Okay. We knew that. Yeah. David Leans masterpiece, one of my favorite movies ever made. If you get a chance ever, ever, ever to see this in 70 millimeter, do yourself a favor. Can I just send a personal plea to American cinema tech? I know it's a long movie, but like the 2 p.m. 70 millimeter screenings of Lawrence Arabia, I just, I can't do it. It doesn't fit with my lifestyle. And all I wanted to do is go and see this film. I just can't abandon my children. For like the eight hours required to get to Santa Monica and see this movie, but I'm desperate to. Some of the most awe inspiring shots and sequences in terms of, you know, real locations out in the desert. Huge swaths of people storming. Acaba, like amazing, amazing moments that you'll remember forever. But then these incredibly powerful, intimate moments of people exchanging ideas and talking about their lives and going crazy out in the desert and blowing out matches and perhaps falling in love with one another intense and all the things that happen in this movie. And like a lot of epics is really two or three films. So I think in some ways, like the older I get, the more appreciation. It's kind of like a second half of Goodfell's thing where I actually quite like the the last hour of this movie now, whereas when I was younger, I was like, once they're done really fighting the war, I lose interest. And you know, I don't need to watch Anthony Quinn remind him of morality. But man, this this film is is one of the true heavyweight champions of the world when it comes to to global filmmaking. Can I tell you something sweet? Nox watched a lot of this with me just after me. Yeah, because he got home from a birthday party from from Alice's birthday party. And then was like what to watch in and just sat down and was transfixed for almost an hour. And I think you know, it helps that there like planes and camels and real things happening, which he responded to. But even through the parts where it's, you know, people talking in rooms, which those you shouldn't fast forward or those are amazing. I'm a hero tool forever. But yeah, it held his attention. I feel like this is the movie that every generation has been trying to live up to since. Like if you listen to the heavy weights of the New Hollywood, if you listen to the way that Spielberg and Lucas and Coppola talk about the movie, they're trying to live up to it. If you know, and screen this movie, or actually, I think Tom Holland screened this movie at their request. It's Sony's print, right? Yes, because we had to go to Tom Rothman who runs the studio that makes the Spider-Man movies to screen this before they made the Odyssey. They're not, they're, I don't think they're similar movies. The Odyssey and Lawrence of Arabia, their scale and scope might be somewhat similar. I think they have different things on their mind to some extent. But it's interesting to have like a benchmark, you know, where you can look back in a movie that was made 65 years ago and say, we're still trying to get to this. Yeah, I wonder if I would imagine that for most people listening to this, if you close your eyes and I said name an epic movie, this would be the first one that came to mind. I think so. Although I have a couple of other ideas that may or may not get drafted here, because I do think that each generation gets their own, you know, they get their own, totemic, classic, or maybe even a couple of your born in the 1910s. You might see a few of these movies as the most meaningful. We made on agree on who will win this draft, but with the State Farm Personal Price Plan, you can choose the right amount of coverage to help create an affordable price. Talk to a State Farm agent today to learn how you can choose to bundle and save with the personal price plan. Like a good neighbor, State Farm is there. Prices are based on rating plans that vary by state. Covered options are selected by the customer, availability, amount of discounts and savings, and eligibility vary by state. Okay, second pick. I know I'm trying to figure out what is the category of need, right? Like what is it? It's tough because so many things complete into different categories that I don't really feel like there's like a. And the one that feels the most limited is biblical epic. Yeah. It depends on your definition of biblical. Will you be stretching that definition later this draft? It depends. Okay. Well, I don't mean to wound a man because I know she revisited this movie, but I would have done it. I think my best choice is to take the last temptation of Christ here, which is Martin Scorsese's adaptation of the controversial novel that portrays Christ in a more human-like fashion, which is very much an epic story, very much a biblical epic. But and told in a somewhat similar fashion to the Odyssey, it came up over the weekend in a piece in USA today that Christ. and someone said that he watched the movie and the way, for example, that Scorsese allows the actors to use their natural accents. - Hey Jesus. (laughing) - Yeah, pardon, I tell, giving you a real outer burrow, Judas. The movie itself is beautiful and tremendously painful and a fascinating portrait of a, I think a deeply spiritual person in crisis. Scorsese was roundly castigated by the Catholic and Christian community for this movie and it was supposed to be made in 1980 and then it was canceled and Paramount got cold feet and he had to fight and it's sort of the story of his career to get this movie on screen. But what he ends up making, I think is not offensive at all but is like a very sympathetic and sincere and deep portrait of what we imagine. It means to be a faithful person, a person with deep moral integrity. And I've always thought it was a great movie. It's not the Scorsese movie that I rewatched the most times, though, you know, it's one of those. To your point about like you watch it once or twice and you're like, okay, this is a very, it's literally a cross to bear and not always the most fun thing. But this is I think an outlier in this category and so far as the era in which it was made and the kind of film maker that made it. - Right, and the tone and the, it was fascinating to rewatch it, having seen the Odyssey and knowing the influence but you know, the interpretation of the main character, the hero, and sure, yeah, you've heard of it. Heard of him. No, it was great. It's definitely what I was gonna pick. But that's okay, you know, you won some, you lose some. - I would have probably taken it even if you hadn't told me you just revisited it this morning. - Well, yeah, because Biblical epics is a necessary but kind of annoying category. One class temptation is off the board. - It was just such a, it's such a huge part of Hollywood history, you know, and it had a huge golden age. But how many of those films are actually good? Is it an interesting conversation? - There are how many do you actually wanna follow up? - Okay, man, you got two picks. - I have two picks. And I guess I'm just gonna go with my heart here a little bit. Well, I know what I'm gonna do for the first one because it means a lot to me and you've got a real soft spot for it. So in Romantic Epic or War Epic, this is both, I will take the English patient. - Much maligned by Seinfeld and Sean Fantasy when I made him watch it. - It's like very pregnant moment there, right there. - You say go with the one. (laughing) - Chris has been celebrating the 4K and I've been a gon of the way. - Oh, no, no, no, no, no. - It's a must to add to his collection immediately. - Is your home also, is Tara too? What's the name of your house? (laughing) - To anyone listening at Lanna, we will not do a live show until the terror theater changes, its name, okay? So you guys organize. Anyway, the English patient is Anthony Mingela's adaptation of the Michelin dodgy novel. And it famously beat Fargo and some guys were mad, but not me because I think this is an absolutely beautiful. And maybe one of the sexiest movies that I have ever seen and I was of an impressionable age at this point, but there are two plot lines, but the Ray Fines, Chris and Scott Thomas profile. Herodidus, you know, by the fire, that's just what I'm trying to be and I'm never going to get there. - Are you though? - No, but it's like-- - 'Cause I feel like you would not be into a guy reading to you by a fire. - Well, I'm not, she's telling the story and she has everyone captive, you know? And she's got the blanket draped over, just like so, and the firelight. - So what a lot of people is having everybody's undivided attention. - Yes, exactly, thank you for understanding that. But then also the bathtub scene, sure, the Christmas party scene, tough one. The naming of the winds, you know. And then there's a time every year when it's daylight savings or daylight savings goes away and gets dark very early and then the lights are all gone and I'm riding alone to you in the darkness. I mean, this movie just fucking gets to me. I love it, it's beautiful. It obviously is paying homage and/or stealing and not quite living up to David Lane, depending on your point of view. But I think it's a really good partner pick with less temptation. It's a very modern sensibility attached to a very classical film. - Yes, reactions to Hollywood history in some ways. - Yeah. - But I think it's wonderful and I was not bored. Unlike Elaine, who is another person? Elaine Bennes does not like the English patient in Seinfeld and I aspire to her. - I think it's fine. I really like Miguel as a filmmaker. It's not my favorite of his movies. Heartless, you know, you don't know what it is. - The romantic epic is a tricky thing. It's a really tricky thing and it isn't my preferred mode of film as listeners of the show. No, the romance I kind of struggle with. Not that I don't love romance, you know? Many are saying, I'm a romantic at heart. - Yeah, that's what everyone says when they think of you. Yeah, this is beautiful movie. - Okay, so I have a second pick and I'm trying, I don't know how many of the other things I think you guys are gonna like rip away from me at this point. That's my real passion and I wanted last sensation for technical reasons. But maybe I'll go with what I really want and perhaps this will give us an opportunity to debate the definition of epic a little more. But in three hours or more, I'm going straight to the heart of both of you and taking JFK. - So I do have it on the list. - I think it's, I think. - I have it on the list. It's eligible. - I do have it on the list. - Shortest. - And let me ask you this, it's certainly eligible in three hours or more. Is it eligible in biopic? But not as a portrait of John and Cindy, but is it a Jim Carrison biopic? - I think certainly that's plausible. I'm taking it in three hours or more. I think this is a great pack. - Because I think that while it could be eligible in biopic, it obviously is more lasting and more honest as a fever dream about an entire generation of people not understanding what happened and go and slightly crazy, trying to figure out. And then understanding it all too well. - Understanding it all too well and teaching the rest of us their secrets. I see you, Mr. Axe. So I love this film. Maybe not quite as much as you guys do, but a lot. And I love this episode of The Rewatchables more than end. This is my all-time number one episode of The Rewatchables. - But Sean thought that the CIA was gonna keep down the door to Reston. - I wanted to talk about the filmmaking. We got there. I thought that was the most extraordinary part of the film. - You did get there, but I mean, just Bill and Chris, just 30 minutes in, and Brian as well. But I still have follow-up questions for Bill about some of the things that he said. Anyway, Oliver Stone. - You think it was the Mafia? Who do you think did it? - What do you think that that's right? - The Mafia was hired by the CIA. - I think it was primarily-- - Yes, the CIA operation. - Oh, you do now? - That it's tended to Cuban dissidents and the Mafia. - Okay. - Extended too. Can you define that? - They're brought them into the fold. - I see. - How many-- - But there's a lot of debate about - How many men do you-- - Who was calling the shots? - Yes. - And how was the-- - How many shots were-- - There was even a head of the snake. - Yeah. - It was an idea that got out of control, which is the Delulo. - Yeah, I mean, I was gonna say, I've read Libra a couple of years ago, and like points were made, you know? It's like, I understand. It's plausible to me. But that's kind of everyone mingling together and taking advantage of-- - I do think, I just feel like Mr. X was on to something. Maybe not in the details of what he shares, but in the manner in which he shares it, the fact that there is some sort of larger conspiracy in the world at large inside of government doors, I do believe in that. And this is not some Q&N on thing. - Of course. - I think for 200 years, this is how power operates. I've seen it up close, and I'll never forget. Okay. I gotta make a pick. - Yeah. - Mm. Mm. Now, do you feel the need to be selecting epic old heavyweights? Like, obviously you've chosen one. Now, we've chosen three fairly contemporary films here. Is there something just more centrally epic about a movie that was made 75 years ago? - I think the reason why they're still held if not in high critical regard, like, oh great film dude, is just sort of like, you have to respect real horses died during making this. You know? Like, you have to respect what we used to do. And we are losing the fine arts. We don't throw cars off of cliffs anymore. Stuntmen don't get dragged behind, you know, carts. Like, that's when you watch these movies, you are watching people literally put their lives on the line to entertain you. And there's, it's like Jackass, you know, you have to respect it, even if you don't like it. - Okay. With that in mind, then I will take a cure chorus. I was seven samurai in movies to exceed three hours. - Very good. - Yeah, there you go. - One of the largest scale productions, ever one of the longest movies commercially released at the time. The movie's ever draft. - Yeah, this gave it a mind when I was thinking of this idea. I was like, how many of these will be all time mega classics? But like, we really haven't not talked about seven samurai that much on the show over the years. It doesn't fit. - We did it when we did Kurosawa, right? Didn't you would I do a Kurosawa. - We did Mufune. - We did Mufune turning 100. So we watched a bunch of Mufune movies and talked about it. Of course, Mufune is the star of this movie. Takashi Shimura, many of the major stars of the Kurosawa films. This is the biggest, it's not my favorite, But it is the The most, it's the most movie. I think that he's ever made a runtime exceeds 200 minutes. An epic story about seven men standing up against a massive army to protect a small town, been reimagined and retold many times over the years through Hollywood eyes and elsewhere. Just the feast, an epic feast that is still being imitated to this day. And I don't, I really love a long move, like I love a three and a half hour movie. If I like the movie, if I hate the movie, I'm not as angry about it as other people are. Sometimes you get like a very hostile reaction if you've got a long film that doesn't live up, but remember we talked about this a bit during the brutalist era, you know, where I was just like, just throw it on me. Like put another hour on it, I'm into it, you know? So stuff like this when I was younger, you know, my friends would make fun of me for being like, I'm gonna watch Seven Samurai when I was in high school, but I don't regret it now. But the thing with an epic movie in particular is that it is told with the scale and intent for it to be large and have a lot of things and thus, like, be long. That is part of the proposition. I get frustrated when it's a movie that really just, it could have been a tight 150, you know? And because of people not making choices or things just getting a little bloated, it the movie overruns, it's, you know, designated ideal time. But these are supposed to be big. And I, again, I like it when people try things. - Yeah, it's funny how like the mechanics of like one of the Star Wars sequels, while having a lot of the trappings of what would be an epic film, like didn't even occur to me to put in the attention, you know? Not that I would pick, you know? - Yeah, yeah, I know what you mean. - I know what you mean. - But you know what I mean, yeah. - The last Jedi you say. - I thought that I would pick it, but that goes to multiple things. - Not that you would. - It's like huge scale. - Because that's not your Luke Skywalker. - Why would you not choose it? (laughing) - What is it, Order 66? I'm an Order 66 Truthor. - Okay, see, or you've got two picks. - Okay, for romantic epic, stay alive. I will find you. - Okay. - Let's go last the Mohicans here. - That's beautiful. - This is Michael Bands '92. I believe adaptation of James Phenomore Cooper's Legend, Legendary, like it's like Legendary book. It's one of the most sort of foundational US texts in fiction. Anyway, also like is regarded, I think, well, or remembered more for its battle scenes for West studio's incredible performances. Mogwa, but like really the heart of the film is this romance between Daniel Day Lewis's character and Madeline Stowe's character. And these are a guy from who's living out in the woods and has been raised by indigenous peoples and this British aristocrat comes over the daughter of a British officer. And yet they connect and have like this kind of primal star cross lovers thing. And he goes over waterfalls and up mountains to make sure she's okay. And that's what it's all about. - And that doesn't speak to you at all. - I will find you, love you, marry you. - Yeah, sure, of course. I'm a fan of this film. - Yeah, it's a pretty good movie. - It's an hour and 50 minutes. - Well, it's okay. - You don't think this is epic? - I do think so. - I think so. - I can tell you. - I just, I just, you know. - It's made to be perfect. - That's why I asked that question. So I think this is-- - And my command drove people totally insane making this where he was just like, you have to weave that quilt and cobble that shoe. - There's only one thing that could have made this movie better. Do you know what it is? Score by audio slave. That would have, that would have really improved it. Otherwise, great film, great pick. You got another pick, Sierra. - I have such a desire to mix it up in terms of era. - You did a nice thing there by you both, that you weaved romantic and war epic. - Sure. - Into the same, to have to do the same, should it have been romantic war epic? - I mean, which romantic epics don't involve war or great strife and loss? - That's a very interesting question. They are like intrinsic. Not all war epics have a romance. - Strife? - Yes. - Sure. - You know, Titanic, it's not a war. - Yeah, that's true. Well, it's a class war, you know? - Amen, amen, sister. That's absolutely right. You were siding with Billy Zane. We all know it. (laughing) - For biographical epic. - Yeah. - I'm gonna go Malcolm X. - Okay, I wanted this. - I was hoping I would still be there. - God damn it. - So we're really, - It might have been my next perk. - Smash in the '90s. - Yeah. - The reason why I was drawn to this, not only because it's just on it. - One of the great American films is also because of, it pulls off the most difficult task of one of these movies, which is to convincingly take someone from a very young age to the end of their life and not have it feel boring or Wikipedia. And you are so rooted in Malcolm X's subjectivity, throughout this movie, the film's color scheme and musical identity changed throughout the years and throughout the decades and throughout his change in consciousness. And it's one of the great performances, I think in movie history from Denzel Washington. - Absolutely. - But it also actually feels like a story where someone starts to one place and ends some place else on every possible level of humanity and has a grab this one here. - That was a good pick. I was gonna do that. So, good job. - It's interesting. I mean, we have so many films, but there are some cream of the crop ones, I guess. - Yeah, there's gonna be a long list of honorable mentions. It's interesting. I mean, we're betraying our generational favor, I would say, by some of these picks. I'll do it with my pick as well. I'm gonna choose in the same category, biopic epic and I'll take Amideus, which is a kind of a dual biopic in a way and told them-- - To hold that from the list. - It's okay, I got one more. It's gonna be okay. - Told in an unusual fashion, based on Anthony Schafer's play directed by Milo Shformin. It's the story-- - The series is pretty good, by the way, the one just came out. - Yeah, I haven't watched that yet. Who's the star? - Bettany. - Oh, Paul Bettany. Is he playing Salieri? - Oh, yes. - Okay, so-- - Ooh! - Yeah, that makes sense. - Yeah. - There's an edge at this point. - And Wilsharp is-- - Oh, fun, okay. - This Mozart-- - This Mozart. - So, this is the story of Mozart and Salieri to V&E's composers through the eyes of Salieri, sort of in the aftermath of, is that he's just attempted suicide and he's survived, and so he starts telling the story of his life and career through the prism of watching Mozart rise to genius in real time, in this complex battle between his admiration for Mozart's evident greatness and his jealousy, and the way that the jealousy is sort of, like he constantly is kind of working to undermine Mozart in the face of the court and failing. Very fun performance from Tom Holtz says, as Mozart, you know, very ecstatic. At a time when it seemed like Tom Holtz really had Hollywood in the group of his hand. And, yeah, I mean, of course, F. Murray Abraham won an Academy Award for his performance at Salieri, and maybe the biggest movie that form it ever made, form it not, no stranger to an epic. - Sure, but just an amazing film. And one of those films that, like, you hear about when you're a young person that, like, actually lives up, you know, that, like, lives up to its A.F.I. 100 films, building-- - You think this in bio or an Oscar? - I'm taking a bio-pick. - Okay. Although you could take it in Oscars as well. - Yeah, at the Hollywood Bowl last night, I saw that they're doing Amadeus Live in Concert. - Oh, very cool. - It just would be very fun. - Yeah. - Yeah. - Yeah. - Really me sick. - That's good. - Okay. - Is it the L.A. Phil performing? - I believe so, yeah. - Yeah. - Things like Mozart. - Mozart. - Yeah. - Mozart. - Yeah. - Yeah. - Risen from the Grave. - A.I. Mozart. We brought him back. - A.I. Mozart. - Wow. - I'm sure millions of people are doing that, but-- - It's like a Waymo robot. You're like-- - Okay. - All right. - Okay. - So, how long is Amadeus? Let's take a quick look. It is-- - It's longer. - 161 minutes. - Yeah, longer than I remember. - Pretty long. - Okay, so you've had two takeaways from you. - So I've learned, and then I got to lock my bio-pick down. So in bio-pick epic, I will take reds. - There you go. - Yeah. The 1981 Warren Beatty film that we talked to a great deal about on the Diane Keaton Hall fan, because it stars Beatty, Dan Keaton, Jack Nicholson. There's also obviously would be eligible in Romantic Epic. 'Cause if you were mine seen, really very special. And then, I guess could be eligible, while romance and war are the same thing. So this is another one where it's full-liticle. Yeah, fits the same struggle. - I should have taken what I was doing. - Not eligible in Best Picture Winner, because it lost two chariots of fire. But does this count as modern? This feels newer than the 50s, 60s, but it also feels a very different generation than ours. - It's an interesting pick, because I think the conversation that we wanna have about the Odyssey, we'll never be able to make movies like this again. I think there was some sense of that around a movie like Reds at the time. One of the reasons it was so honored was because it was like, well, this is like the culmination of 10 years of greatness that Hollywood's been churning out with these unabashed otors, and they're taking these huge chances on epic canvases. So I don't know, can never close the book on them, but this is an amazing movie. - Incredible movie. And definitely over three hours long. So I guess it would have been eligible in many of the categories. - Yeah, I would like to see you featured 30 years from now in a similar fashion the way Henry Miller's featured in this movie, Testimonial Style. What would you be taught? Like what would they be bringing you into talk about? Henry Miller, the novelist. He's one of the witnesses who speaks about-- - Because you know, Neil is in it, right? - He is a character in it, but Henry Miller is interviewed as one of the people who witnessed John Reed and Henry's Bryant. - Do you too? - I'm not asking you. - What do you think you would be asked? To speak about you think it'd be a film I'm in an epic film about me. I'm in solo. I Think I would look great in those hats. I think that that would work out for me. Brian hats. Yeah Yeah, yeah, but I mean I am keen is just like on the tundra alone for a good solid point of 20 minutes of this movie She's yeah unbelievable in this movie. So good. I didn't hear the hall of fame. Yeah, Reds did it. Don't worry Don't worry. What is it ushanka? What are those hats called? With the flaps and the big Oh, yeah, I did hers have flaps. I don't know about that anyway could be a Cossack, but it's a Cossack something else as well. Aren't they mean again? We did explore on that episode how our knowledge of Russian literature and culture is limited. It is quite limited. Yeah, yours is robust. It's really jagged though So like I have a about Several tomes have finished you're right 1219th through Annika right and then I watched our city to completion That's good pushkin. I never never dabbled. Okay, turgative That's a much not done it. Hey, so I have a second pick here, and I don't know whether Pushing turgative dry five five So I did I didn't you know, I just haven't read it. I haven't read it So I could be strategic or I could kind of go with my heart here and I think I don't know I think it's already been mentioned. So in epic best picture winners Well, I don't know. What should I do? Oh boy. Oh my goodness. Are you not me really see the Queen's wet as exact? She is unsure. Well, I just I guess I should do honestly. What's your color story? What do you want to say about yourself at this pick? Well, I've already said what I want to say with English patient and reds and JFK which just the features a lot of really hot people and some of them are solving conspiracies and the others are happy Tommy Lee Jones absolutely some of the hottest shit I'll ever see Love triangles, you know, so among other things. Yeah, that's true and seeing wig work in there. Yeah, long triangle between the C. A. Sure, exactly, you know, the greatest love affair of all. Yeah So I that's my that's my color story or our love triangles and this doesn't really should pick with your heart I mean the my heart also does have a love triangle. Did you get biblical yet? No, that's the thing. Should I do biblical? I'm going to do biblical. Yeah, so I'm going to take better because whatever but the Sharia scene. Yeah is that's that's pretty awesome. Okay. You know, speaking of forces who died to RIP to them. So many It's really insane that they did that and for how long they did that and it's incredibly memorable Do you think Cecil B. Demille would recognize Hollywood today and it's woke kosher Interesting question Yes Uh, you know, I watched Ben her for the first time during COVID. Okay. I'd never seen it before and um I say this with respect. I was surprised how gay it was It's like it's a shockingly homo erotic tone about men sort of returning from war to be reunited and this sort of like Brother. Yeah, it is I like clutching each other in very dramatic fashion And obviously there's something in a lot of biblical storytelling that has that and they parade around with horses But there's a lot sort of their epic passion for lost love amongst men. Um, it's a huge part of the film. You don't relate to that I get it. I get it. You know, it's as somebody who has deep bonds with with with with male friends. Yeah Um Ben her I would say intermittently great, but it's when it's great. Well, it's greatness is like the ceiling. Yes Like epic Hollywood filmmaking. Of course. Yeah, so you fast forward through to get the vistas and the chariot race and then When it's Charlton Heston in a dark room kind of Recreating a Rembrandt with someone else. You're like He's in a stable and he's gonna have his hand on a man's shoulders and you're like you guys are really close to each other right now What's so great about it being on during the holidays when it would just be on TNT for 24 hours It was completely like I have no I'm recollection at all of what the narrative is and whenever Chuck would go into a dark room I just get another tricky sandwich Um Okay, so I strategic So is it back to me it is sheesh well I'm really betwixt in between I guess for romantic or war epic. Mm-hmm. I'll take the deer hunter Um, okay, which I I think is is a war epic. Is it not? Of course it is Category do we have romantic or war war war war yeah, you're not to do romance. Yeah, but you did anyway Yeah, that's that's why I was saying when you chose last the mohikens you kind of The romantic part of last mohikens is when he tears his fucking heart out and shows it to everybody That's true love um Michael Chimino's Best picture winning would also be eligible in best picture story of um Four friends from a steel town in Pennsylvania who um All of what their girlfriends one of them gets married and then they go to Vietnam and terrible things happen there and they're forced to live with the trauma and PTSD of what they did there and what happened to them and some of them don't really come back some come back But they none of them really come back um Have beautiful movie Robert's Nero, Meryl Streep, Christopher Wacken, John Savage uh Yeah, I mean, it's I think also sort of similar to Amadeus like sort of redefines how you might think about a war movie This isn't a movie that is like defined by its battlefields. It's defined by Everything surrounding those experiences But very much of its time very much commenting on a group of young men who were just coming back from Vietnam And sort of like the flip side to other big epic movies like apocalypse now, which we come up in this conversation In a movie that I've always really loved and is kind of the end in a way for Chimino because he makes heavens gate next and that augurs The end of that red Sarah that we're talking about and um, you know, I did just pick up his film desperate hours In Canada, Mickey, Mickey work, Mickey work kidnapping. That's right. I like that film. Yeah, I do too. I got it on blue right Mickey work on the drafts that we did I was talking. I don't know. It was funny. Anyway, boxer. Yeah, good boxer. I really had no idea. It was probably good boxer Was he? Yeah, he was also just more than I ever did. He was also the Pope of Greenwich Village. It's true Were you over the Pope of the neighborhood? Hillhurst right now. You are the Pope of New York. No. I have that kind of sway on home. It's not like they see me Coming in there. Listen, there is nothing more fun than walking down hillhurst. That's right. It was it was 2015 other men in chorejackets Sir, sir. Yeah, such a big fan. I never do this. It was early. It was January 2015. Yeah, we went to little doms me who I lean in Phoebe bring her had not even started yet And you know, I think we had a couple of penicillins, you know, I like to have the penicillin a little doms and Maybe maybe some meatballs. Maybe some are in cheney and we walked out and and three of those chore coded men That Amanda was describing came out. They all had beards of some fashion. Yeah, it's all they're really in a craft cocktails And that's if you're not 20 for just make sure to penicillin they rewatched band of brothers like every two years I they were named like Tyler Lyle and Keith and Keith the perfect And they they grabbed you by the shoulders and they said sir Your great works will live on in me. Thank you for everything you've done and low. Yeah, here you are We've launched so much around that. Yeah, you know You're your beautiful shirt. Yeah, that's right. Okay, you got pics Okay, you just have one pic. No, I have several really too, right? Oh wow. Yeah, I'm just really sitting on the edge. You got to you got to wait for a little while Amanda What categories you have? Kristina. Yeah, I have Oscar. Well remaining you mean Oscar biblical and wild card And what about Odyssey inspired inspired oh not it so we have I former pixelized. Yeah, well for Odyssey inspired um I'm gonna go with the searchers Which is John Ford's version. Yeah That Is about the cost of going home or the cost of trying to get back home. This is a film about John Wayne's character Ethan Is not really fit for the increasingly modernized and Civilized Wild West Going to quote-unquote rescue his niece from Patchies I believe when she's been when she was kidnapped as a child and It's it's an incredible epic tale of of going out and coming back but the what it costs the people who do it and the The myths that they tell themselves about why they're doing what they're doing and um, I know it's like It's somewhat You know controversial film in in some ways, but is honestly one of the most amazing things to look at that I've ever seen in A screen um great 4k was back in the news and for one bottle after another of course many over acknowledgements of you know kidnap the young girl and There's a an Apache figure sure figures prominently in the story Huge framework for the movie. So I'll take that and movies inspired by the Odyssey And then in best picture epic I'm gonna go double lean and I'm gonna take version of the river wire. Oh I'm looking you so 57 and this is Yeah, um, this is David Lien's World War II epic. Do you think DJ screw like David Lien Films? I don't see why not probably, right? Just leaning back and some promethazine. I wish you would have sampled some William Holden dialogue from this movie. Wow. Allikiness and William Hawk, uh, William Holden and Jack Hawkins, uh, playing prisoners of war in World War II, um, and they got build a bridge, you know, and sometimes that's a foolish thing to do. Do you think you'd be good at building a bridge? I think that would be good at getting people excited about the project, the engineering aspect and honestly, you know, what I think I, I do feel like this is probably my last couple of years that I can carry planks of wood and stuff like that before I enter, you know, my wife keeping me propped up in a hospital bed with a newspaper to prove that I'm alive. Yeah. Um, they use a live one. I love birds on the river. Why I love this film? Um, were you going to take it? I forgot to write it down. Yeah, I just forgot. Yeah, so here's, so let me bring you up. I probably would have taken it three rounds ago. Let me, let me bring you up to speed, Chris. So you guys, you dropped to the van on Friday, you dropped us, and that's where I'm sort of you dropped us off first terminal, you continue on your way to, to live your East Coast life. And we sat in the lounge and like sort of talked to each other, sort of looked around. It was a nice time. Yeah, and then, and then we get on the plane and we, and I think like plane Sean is about to be upon us, you know, I've prepared the inbox, I've prepared my mental state to get ready for plane Sean. He held it at bay while we waited for the plane, which I appreciate it. And then we get there and, and I'm getting ready to do all my prep for this draft. No Wi-Fi, no Wi-Fi to be had five hours. Nothing but my own brain, small talk. Well, we weren't sitting together, yeah, we didn't really, so no, I slept. Yeah, I just raw dog get the whole time hands in my lap. Anyway, so that means the mechanism, it's not true. What I did is, I watched the guy, Richie film in the gray, okay, I had a nice time. Was that on the, like, down loaded on my laptop for just this, just this occasion. Oh, in case of emergencies. Yeah. And what did you read? I read it for you to do it. No, I've already read the rat in case it's really good. Yeah, I've tried to have a whole conversation. I know this is what happened to us. I don't, you know, we were off sync. That's all, I know. But we talked about this and I was like, it really helped me understand London. You know, I know it's just like one person's story. Okay, I guess it's when you were giving me the news I just about Captain Pinhead or whatever. Captain Pinhead. Captain Face. Captain Pinhead. Pinhead from hell, right? Does he, does he think you're going into, I don't understand what I did in the van right out there that was so controversial. Well, it's you just, it's not what you didn't think we were funny anymore. Here's what I remember. We were talking about things that would be on each other's family crest. Oh, yeah. And the things that would be on my crest that I described sincerely were chicken. Right. Remembering the good times that would be represented somehow and then a third thing of indiscriminate memory. I don't remember what that was. I think before a live show, you guys have to be 1000% yourselves and you're like, I must buy media and you're like, I have to buy a saline dress. As soon as it's over, as soon as it's over, you're like, I'm a fucking goofball. And I'm like, well, I've so got work to do out there. Yeah, you do. You do. I'm Chris Ryan 24/7. Jake Tyler and Keith's hand and look them in the eye and make their day. Okay. You have another pick, right? You took Bridget and the Riverquay. And what was the other one? The searchers. Oh, the searchers. Wonderful. Those are good homes. Yeah. Yeah. I picked cool movies. I've heard of those films. Okay. Autocene-spired epics. I'll take over other word, though. Which is, I feel like I keep overlooking. You know, I'm going. That's kind of becoming your brand, though. And when we talk about Wes Anderson, it's to be like, I'm what about the Darjeeling limited? So it's good that you did this here. Well, this is sort of my Darjeeling limited for the Coins, right, the movie that I overlooked and maybe didn't take as seriously. Yeah. But the real ones, no Darjeeling limited, is kind of high up there for Wes. But that took years to happen. Upon release, it was everybody was like, oh, actually Wes Anderson, are we sure? And now you go back, you look, you know, clear to loon drops. Let's get high and they're around the fire. That's the real shit. Wes is the man. Yeah. I got to say when I was at the bull thing, everybody wandering around was like, we all know Astrid City is the one. Yeah. There was like a lot of that going down, which is nice. Nice to be amongst your people, um, men crying with spring. Yes. Talking to my five year old, um, brother or aunt thou is, of course, not Wes. It's the Cone brothers. Oh, wait. I thought you picked your feeling limited. Sorry. I was looking at my list. No, sick. It's still available. Okay, great. Oh, brother or aunt thou is, is the Odyssey in many ways. It is. It's also the tale of the soggy bottom boys and a trio of aspirin. How would you describe their music? Bluegrass? Hillbilly bluegrass? Yeah. Gospel tinged bluegrass. I guess. Yeah. A historical movie, ingenious construction around Homer's epic poem, but with a very specific Cohen's set of humor and paythos, I guess. George Clooney never better. Tim Blake Nelson. Incredible. Yeah. John Terturo. Goodman. Wonderful cast all around. Isn't this right? Yeah. He's like the cyclops-esque figure. And yeah, I love this movie. It's a great one. It's honestly probably worth a revisit after seeing the Odyssey and just seeing just how close it is in the episodic fashion of the Nolan's film. The Cohen's really robbed us because when they broke up, I feel like we haven't really gotten too pot about them as much as we would have. No, we did. I did Buster Scruggs with Adam, I remember. And then that's their last film. So yeah. Did we do Hell Caesar? Yeah. It came out before the show started, 2016, right? Yeah, I think so. Hell Caesar. I think it was like first year of the ringer when it came out. Thought at the arc light when that still existed. Yeah. They're the greatest. I got my fingers crossed on Jackie Spades. The Ethan Films hasn't been going so well. Joel, we've really only gotten tragedy of Macbeth. But when are we going to get EPMD back together? Great question. I mean, hopefully soon. Is that Ethan and Joel making dollars? EJMD? EJMD. Yeah. That would be pretty good. Two X. Okay. So Darjeeling is on the board for you. Well, I'm good. But so in Odyssey inspired EPX, I would like to put forth the Wizard of Oz. Sure. Which is about a girl getting home. So maybe not. This doesn't speak as much to the other people on this table. A girl love to be in these movies. Does Daniel Day-Lewis say for her? Yeah. I mean, otherwise has all of the hallmarks, there is no place like home, gets waylaid, waylaid by various weird people and drugs, and a mythology of a world that she is not totally familiar with, but learns over time with the help of various deities. So a Cambillion Heroes journey. Yeah. So there we go. The Wizard of Oz. Pretty good movie. Don't go to this fear version. See the whole thing. Please. Yeah. I think watch it in full and then go to the sphere. Sure. Yeah. But don't start there. Exactly. Exactly. Correct. But I, you know, Darjeeling Limited was going to be my backup. Okay. And then. That's all you got to say about the Wizard of Oz, huh? Well, I think we've talked about it once or twice. I've compared it to the Odyssey, which was the parameters of my pick in this one. Yeah. What a beautiful movie. Yeah. Love it. It's my favorite movie. I know. Why didn't you pick it? You just didn't. You forgot all the Oscar nom, like winners. I didn't have Wi-Fi on the plane. I don't know what you think is that this movie was robbed by a guy on the wind. Yeah. I guess so. I mean, I, like, I understand the accomplishment of going with the one. It is. It is a great film. It is made in hateful history. Yeah. No, there's a lot of really rich clipping material. You're providing people today. You're probably right. The Bible is gay. And I call it the way it describes. I mean, both things can be true. Yeah. I agree. There's, there's lots of really amazing stuff in going with the wind. But, but the Wizard of Oz, you know, this single moment of it going from black and white to color is just like, you know, hey, it has become a stand-in for, or like a, a shorthand for, like, a transformative experience, but that's what it was for movies as well. So, and, you know, it's beautiful. They share it. They share a director, sort of. They're Fleming. It's a credited filmmaker on both films, right? Even though the Wizard of Oz had like four filmmakers attached to it. Okay. So, you have gone with the wind. Did you take a second one? No. Choice as well. Okay. So, epic, best picture winners. Hmm. I mean, back yourself into a bit of a corner here. No, I don't think so. No. I think I'm going to do. So, are we not counting Godfather Part II as an epic? It is an epic for sure. Yeah. So, I'm going to take Godfather Part II. What? You're just nodding your head. I was kind of hoping you would have to take Patton. Okay. There's a lot left. I think. Yeah. There's a lot. I'm picking from other good things. But, um, this is, I still think the single greatest screen performance, Al Pacino, and Godfather too, um, that I have seen. I mean, there are many good ones out there, but I pick this one. And. I think there's a Abe Vagoda. Also a good performance. Yeah. Um, but I think you're as to its epic qualities. it's multi-generational, multiple locations. - Sure. - Jumps time, yeah, jumps at the international things, crisis of family and of life and death and also the CIA or the mob is somewhat involved. So, there was over the Godfather. - We have this conversation every time we talk about this. - But in this format, you would take it over to Godfather. - She's right, because it has the flashback. - Yeah. - That doesn't, you think it makes him more epic? - I do, yeah, because of the time quality. - I mean, he goes that way. - He goes that Italy. - Sure. - Yeah, but it's like, you know. - He blew that car. - They do, that's very upsetting. - And then there's another car. - No, well, you and Bill spoke very specifically about that young actress. - I don't think we were aware of what we were saying at the time. - Okay. - I can neither confirm nor deny that I was aware. - I see, all right, continue on. - Yes, I feel for the purposes of this exercise, part two is more epic. And I, part two is really good. I at least-- - Hades will remember. - So is part one. You know, they're both really good. - Yeah, part three. - What is the longer runtime? I don't know the answer to that. - I think two. - Two, probably two. - Is that a really longer runtime? - No, right. - 255 for the Godfather. - And 32 is what I'm looking at for Godfather, part two. - He's 22. - So there. - That's three, just like you're asking. - Didn't Google that? - Three is nine hours. - Two hours, 40 minutes. - Yeah. - As you know, three is good. - Yeah, I thought that. - I'm not, really, I really enjoy it. And it has flaws, sure. You know, you know, it also has flaws, the Bible. These things have flaws. - These things have flaws. - You're so right. - Thank you. Nice to hear that out loud. - Okay. - Click that. - I say that I say I was wrong. I say you were right when those things apply. - Which is frequently. - Okay, you've gotten two films. - Yes. - So I'm gonna take a film. - The Wizard of Oz and the Godfather, part two, just really slumbered it over here. - For crazy crazy draft. Epic best picture winners, I'll tell you what I'll take. The Lord of the Rings, the Return of the King. The rare fantasy film that neatly fits into this. - So in that one, he gets the ring. - Who's he? - Who's he? - Yeah. - The ring goes. - No, no, no, the ring goes against the ring. - God has the ring. - Into the volcano. - Who touches the ring for one second. - Nope. - No, so on is the, he's the villain. - Three people. - No. - I know what the gear being serious. I think you know more than you're letting on. - Isn't this a great movie? - This movie? - Yeah. - It's the third best of the trilogy. - Wow. - He's turning back. - I think that's right. - Okay. - I am most swept up in the fellowship of the ring. I think two towers has the most epic battles. - That's got Helm's deep. - But three is really satisfying until you get to the third ending. And then like hold on two more endings. Dean, how long the extended version of the return of the King is, the extended version that, you know, people know. - It's like four hours long, right? - Four hours and 13 minutes. She's never seen it. - Do you know which- - Yes, I have. - Do you know what the towers are? - No. - Okay. - Don't tell her. - You're going to be so mad. I saw, I saw two towers into return of the King. Like in college. And it wasn't for a boy also because that was not the flavor that I was going for. - Why are you going to do it? - I don't know. - You're crying. - Because I was trying not to laugh as you guys just said Lord of the Rings words to each other. - We didn't even geek out. - Would you have made fellowship of the ring available for movies inspired by the Odyssey? - I don't think so because it doesn't complete it. - You can't pick the trilogy, right? It would need to be the trilogy. - That's when the guys start whining about going home. - That's true. If you were given prime real estate in the Shire, would you take it? - Oh, the Shire is an incredible investment opportunity. (laughing) - And on LA neighborhood, you can pair too. - I would feel like Wembee at the Shire. 'Cause those guys were all four feet tall. So I'd be like, "Yeah, you guys will play pick up." (laughing) You got to be dunking on Frodo. You're like a bitch, you wish you fucking fell in that volcano dog. - That's good. - That's funny. - Remember the photo of, I think it was Paul Muscle at Andrew Scott and I did like, our greatest-- - It's the Hobbit Shire. - It was his Irish life. - Yeah, the Hobbits after Shire opened his art. Really very good job. Who started it now? - Your turn. - I have, how's the new laptop going? - Pretty well. - Okay. - I mean, I feel definitely like I'm just hanging on your every word. - Okay. - Yeah. - I'm not getting distracted by-- - With my laptop, you've drafted three minutes a little lady and Hartburn in the Epic movie draft. - Here, let's spice it up a little bit. - Okay. - Let's throw a little cayenne in here. Let me see how much you guys like me. Because in biblical epic, I'm gonna take Kingdom of Heaven, the director's cut. - I think that that's not technically about the Bible. - But Crusades and in defense of-- - But the Crusades are because of the Bible. If you don't have the Bible, there is no Kingdom of Heaven. You say what? - The Crusades would though are not denumerated in the Bible, which is a point of contention. - I will allow it because I did not to find biblical epic by saying it must be stories of the Bible. - I also asked you. - It is a war over the Bible. - That's just because he likes you. And also because he thinks the Bible has a lot of, you know, homerotic tendencies and showing his love. - I will move the filmic representations of the stories, you know? - I mean, biblical is right there in the title, but I think it's fine. - Well, I had said, I texted you and said, do you think we should make this religious epic because that way it's more non-denominational? - Oh, okay. - So you could-- - Well, why don't you say that to Old Hollywood? - Kingdom of Heaven. You know, it's a spiritual religious epic, you know? It's not necessarily a book of the Bible, but rooted in it. - Yeah, I think it's okay. I think the excited version, I don't think you should be able to choose. - Why? - 'Cause that was just like, that wasn't released theatrically, right? - What? - That's what you're standing on right now? - Well, we're not choosing it. - We're not choosing it at all. - We're not choosing it. - First of all, you're just absolutely, you're stabbing Joanne in the heart right now. And I say that as someone who thought that is like-- - Because of the easy-aegs, I version. - I thought that you made the correct decision. I thought it was very, very apparent. - Yeah, I kinda like saying this on my previous simulation. - It's like it hurts, but you have to do it. - Okay. - Okay, we're not talking about that. - But then you're gonna allow him to-- - After Flop Central from Argentina for five straight matches, get out of here. - I know you're gonna find your goal for this podcast if we gave you yellow and red cards. (laughing) - And you could start showing this. - Yeah, you'd be sent off to the five minutes and every episode. - Maybe like if we like disagree with it, you would go to Var. - But just me, only I could feel the first. - You're the most referee of us, I think. - Okay, I mean-- - I think you would get the biggest thrill sending me off. - I mean, I would, I've been begging for props, you know? And yellow and red cards have become a big deal in my house. But for whatever reason, nox thinks of them as tickets. So he's like, "Sign, it's a red ticket." And then just like runs away. So yes, I think that's great. The thing here is, I mean, Biblical epic is very clear. You know, this folds like-- - I don't know, this is a periodic thing. - There's no appeal process here, like in a court of law. Like I don't know what we're doing. But I like that he wants to give it to you because of friendship. But then the reason that he's going to disqualify it is because of theatrical runs, rather than the very obvious title. - The director's had a road show. - Is that true? - Yes. - Where? - At theaters, at some theaters. Which theaters, name them? - I think like they was at like the arrow. - You might be right. You might be right. I'm looking it up right now. - What happened to one yourself? - I've really lost your fastball. - It's been an insane fight. - Honestly, but it started when you were just like, I don't care what's happening to Leo's and the planets. - Oh, and I was just, really, can I, I'll just say, tell you what, I don't remember you ever talking about astrology this much. And I think-- - Well, that's because the planets were not aligned in our favor until yesterday was the day July 12th. It was when we were supposed to start taking action. I don't remember what I did to take action, but it's a long process until 2020, sometimes. So you guys are going to be taking action until 20th. - Yeah, and then everything is aligned for us. And I was trying to tell Sean about that, my fellow Leo. And you were like, get out of here. - If I haven't been taking action before, I don't know what else I could do. I feel like I'm at the end. I feel like I got wrapped the shit up. The Kingdom of Heaven director's cut was released on December 23rd, 2005 at the Lemley Fairfax Theater in Los Angeles, eligible. It was unsupported by advertising from 20th Century Fox. They didn't want people to see Ridley's vision. - Okay. - Too bad I saw it. Did you see them theaters? - No. - No. - Okay. - No. - Do you see that the theater at which it was released? - It's unclear if it played other theaters. - Do you have that steel book? - No. - I don't have any steel books. - Not in a single steel book. - No. - Got you on that. - I bought a hunt for a October on steel book. - Okay, that seems valid. That's beautiful. - It may have been $100 Canadian dollars. I didn't really understand the transaction. - Well, steel books are expensive, you know? That's the problem with them. Okay, so did you take two films? You got a wild card, right? - Oh, so I took biblical kingdom of heaven. - Kingdom of heaven directors cut to you. - I mean, justice for a Joanna, but kingdom of heaven. - I mean, a Joanna can have a revenge. And she will. - I, you know, I agree with your rules. then and I support the spirit of this ruling now, but I would note that we are not applying the same consistency of spirit to to Chris as to Joanna. We didn't define biblical epic before and we did define. Okay. I mean, I think we did in the word biblical. You know, it's a it's a text. I mean, are you bringing in are you bringing in the unrecognized? I'm a liar fighting me. Is it just because that you just like I sat in with Chris because I love Chris dearly like what is the issue? He's making decisions. You yell at me to vamp every single time now. Thank you for you know, I appreciate that. Make a decision for pricing. You're the one who gave us the heart out. God damn it. I'll take Carlos and wild card. Biographical. Oh, sure. Great. No, I do fucking incredible. Yeah, sure. Edgar Ramirez is Carlos the jackal. One of the most infamous, you know, revolutionary slash terrorists of the 20th century and one of the most breathtaking hybrids of mini series and film. I believe this was released in theaters for those who wanted to plant themselves in there for that long amount of time. Yeah, but can be viewed. I think it's on there is a criterion version of it, right? There is. And it was on Netflix forever. I don't know if it still is. And basically two films. Yes, and an amazing soundtrack that's largely made up of British post punk from circa that era. And it's just it's just a fucking phenomenal film about the post. I would say like the sort of rolling out of the 60s and into the 70s. So speaking of us as I started to watch the Wizard of the Kremlin on that same plane flight, right? I'll sleep because of the perform like because of the film or because you see what I mean about the the dano accent. I was enjoying it. But I did you get to Putin? No, I didn't. Yeah, well, then you haven't seen it yet. I you know, as portrayed by Jude law. Yeah, I'm aware that that was coming. I was I will watch it. I was excited about it. And the way you'd be excited about like a honey baked ham, you know, I was like, this is my one honey baked ham of 2026. I'll be watching one, two hour and 20 minute preposterous biopic of world figures. But it wasn't compelling enough to stay away. Was it better than Michael? No, I guess you didn't. I guess it wasn't. It will be. I think it will be. But you know what, Michael had Michael Jackson's music. Yeah, which is inherently entertaining. I wonder if Wizard of the Kremlin ever thought about adding some Michael Jackson tunes. Probably expensive to license. All right. Get it for it. I don't think he paid for the film. I have a wildcard pick, right? I think so. Okay, this one's newly eligible because this was also recently released in theaters. It's called Kill Bill, the whole bloody affair. It's the entire Kill Bill saga, which is just about one of my favorite things ever. Quentin Tarantino's originally conceived as one movie movie that then became two movies because Harvey Weinstein had an idea about splitting it in half to make more money. That I think made maybe the production a little bit easier on Tarantino. But seeing the movie together, which I saw last year on my birthday, before it was like officially re-released, the version that I saw was the version that played at the Cannes Film Festival 20 years ago and still had the French subtitles hard-coded into the print. But now they made it available earlier this year, and it's going to be, I think you can stream it on peacock now. It's going to be available on home. That's my preferred horror watch films. Yeah, I mean, most content, really. That's where I watch everything peacock. But yeah, I mean, just an epic samurai story, shades of the odyssey, about a woman, you know, traveling to retrieve her daughter and go back home. Spoilers, I guess, for Kill Bill, the whole bloody affair. Just an amazing movie. Recently at video tech, local video store in our neighborhood, I screened Shogun Assassin, which is a movie that is basically the first two lone wolf and cub films spliced together and then edited together. And then it has a synth score attached to it. It was released in 1980. I bring it up because in the fateful scene where Beatrix Kitto meets her daughter at the end of Kill Bill volume two, which is now just part of the whole bloody affair, the movie that she watches with her daughter to go to sleep is Shogun Assassin, which is insane. That's awesome. And my daughter turns five today no longer four, but I often think of what it would be like to show her Shogun Assassin, which is incredibly violent. But Kill Bill, the whole bloody affair is huge, huge, huge movie. Your daughter is so far shown. Yeah, I was going to say Alice would be like, this wrong. Yeah, nothing that interest and openness. Promises complement, gotta be the worst thing is like, you don't know how far is too far. We've never done viscera. Okay. Oh, okay. Yeah, you know, we're someone's like stem to stern slice with a whole lot of watching jobs, which yeah, yes, yes. Like we can do ghost busters in Godzilla and monsters destroying things. We've never done bloody stuff. I feel like that's I think also like there's something they need to they should learn about like that. You know, I remember that. On the battlefield. No, like the first time I saw like a not 80s action violence. I was like, oh my god. This is this is very upsetting. Yeah, yeah. I think so. I think it would be it's way too early for stuff like that. I think she's gonna be watching save a prime Ryan. Undrafted here. Although it's not too late. You've got one more take Amanda. Believe it or not. I'm not gonna take saving prime Ryan in wild card. I'm gonna take Barry London, which is still on the board. I don't think you should be allowed to pick this. If you why? Because when he picked it in the best pictures draft, you went, why did I do that? True. Because I think it was two and a half hours and two of podcasts and you were just like you're being boring. You were trying to score points. That's what was happening. I don't understand that. I don't yeah, with who and with what it's one of your funniest things like you were just like out of nowhere, just you just went, eh, but well, I don't just goes to show. I guess so. People change. Yeah, you know, people grow. That's right. Why are you mad about something that happened in a draft? It was very extremely rude. I don't remember it, which is what you say after every other conversation you've ever had. So it wasn't in the spirit of the game. You know, if I have to deal with and Bolo being sent off, I was also recently served a clip of when you and me and Zach and Amanda potted together and you were quite rude to me. What did I say? Because I took once upon a time in Hollywood over Moneyball and you really get your fucking shit together. Yeah, we have to kill her. Well, you know what? We all have weak moments. Yeah. I was also I think eight months pregnant at that point. Just exactly my point. We're testing your metal. And you were you were really mean. You had something big coming up in your life. I needed to make it stronger. I was wondering whether once upon a time in Hollywood would be eligible for this. I don't think so. Okay. It's close. You can make the case as like a Hollywood epic, but they do travel to Europe. Yeah, that's true. I'm not sure it has the scale. Okay. I mean the ranch. Yeah. Okay. I overhead you. I listen. I think there's a key. Is it epic? No, I don't. Okay. I think it's beautiful, but I don't think it's an epic jangle. I think it's an epic. And I want to hear you talk about Barry. Well, I just I actually just rewatched it. If you can't shoot in candlelight, the father shooting at all is what I have to say. Well, there's a four movies. No, I mean, didn't you know, one of our greatest filmmakers making one of the most beautiful photographic painterly, whatever you want to call it. It's just astonishing to look at. And I think very funny. The able for our book that I was talking about that I was just listening to on the way here. He was talking about it because in the run up to making the driller killer, he said that Barry Linden was made. Everyone went out and saw it. And he said because of the way that Kubrick shot the movie that essentially invented independent film because he did not need these massive lighting rigs to make a movie. And that the movie kind of taught you even if you were making a down and dirty exploitation movie like driller killer that you could figure out with a photo chemical process and how they figured out how to make that look good on film that like, it changed movies forever in a very I never heard it put quite that way that like it made things actually easier. You don't think of Kubrick as somebody who like, yeah, simplifies things. So I really loved that insight. Obviously, Barry Linden is wonderful. Barry Linden on the rewatch boss. What do you think? Unlikely. Unlikely. Okay. What's going to be the next Kubrick movie that gets in? We've had eyes wide shut. Full metal jacket 2001. The shining. Full metal jacket and the clockwork orange. I could also see a whole Hollywood gray beard being like, I want to do strange love. I think we could do strange love when Digger comes out. Yeah. Yeah. Do you think Bill likes strange love? I don't know. Strange love is 10 star masterpiece. That's the problem with Digger in any movie like it. It's like you're you're aiming for the moon. You know, like you're aiming for the moon. Man, the moon exists. Anyway, I'm just pre-predicting. That's that's the end of the draft, right? I think so. Yeah. Yeah. So millions and millions of honorable mentions here. I mean, not millions. Okay. I'll give you some of mine. Okay. Well, let's start with epic best picture winners. We can say whether or not we think these these are eligible. Okay. Gone with the wind. Yes. The godfather. Yes. Gandhi. Yes. Out of Africa. Yes. The last emperor. Yes. Dances with wolves. Yes. Titanic. I almost did it. Gladiator. Braveheart. Braveheart. The sound of music. Wondered. I mean, I think so. I think that there is, you know, I noticed as people were writing about this that once you are once it's a musical, then it gets put into a different classification. I've thought about musical epic as a category because there are some movies that have real huge scope. [BLANK_AUDIO] American in Paris like three plus. I don't think it's American in Paris. That long. But it is wonderful. Another genius. Kelly film that is very long. But funny girl is very long. You know, there's like some films and singing on the rain is not as under two hours as well. Would you have put best years of our lives in this? That's interesting. Oh, the emotional epic is like is something you think about that. I think it could have gone romantic epic. It could have. I agree. Other best picture winners. What about a man for all seasons? I mean, I guess it is long and they were, you know, from another time. It doesn't have the scope. Right. It's more, I mean, it's courtroom to me when it is epic. And I think, you know, a courtroom can be part of an efficacy. You haven't said Oppenheimer yet. I was going to say our last two best picture winners, I think qualify. Those were the last two on my list. Oppenheimer and one battle after another. Both of which I think really fit the scale. And honestly, with those two movies have done, which I've noticed, and we can talk about this a little bit with the Odyssey as well later this week is they have complicated what the trend had been for best picture winners, which was much more modestly scaled movies for like 15 years. You know, if you think of parasite shape of water, green book, moonlight, nomad land, kota, like all the, so many of the movies that had been winning best picture for 10 plus years were these lower scaled, intimate dramas and comedies. And now Oppenheimer and one battle are huge. Okay, other movies that I made on my list, Biblical epics, nobody took the 10 commandments. I would prefer the robe. That's the one that I like the best. If you're gonna go with those Technicolor 50s and 60s films, Pasalini's Gospel according to St. Matthew, the Passion of the Christ. - Yeah. - I'm saving that for the next one. - Nicholas Ray's King of Kings, I think is a good one. Greatest story ever told. I don't think that one's very good. Darren Aronovsky's Noah. - Sure. - Great New Yorker. - Yeah. - I'm gonna tell about it. - For article that broke Darren Aronovsky. - Quovatus is another one. - Bravis. - Aronovsky, yeah. What else? - Is that a bodice bodice thing? - Bravis. - Bravis. - I wasn't around, so. - The bar? (laughing) - Any other Biblical epics? - Guys get crucified in Spartacus, but I don't think that's what they meant. - Yeah, Samson and Delilah, there's Bathsheba. There's a lot of those kinds of movies. I looked at a lot of those and we were doing the program in the criterion thing. We were like, well, should we do it? As these Odyssey inspired swords and sandals movies, like if Virginia and stuff like that, or should we do this kind of story and we ended up going in that direction, obviously. Romantic or war epic, saving Brevarine, all quiet in the western front. Crashing tiger hidden dragon? - Yep. - Sure. - Latoon. - Yeah. - Once upon a time in China, Dr. Javago? - Yes. - The curious case of Benjamin Button. - Oh, interesting. I didn't think of that. - I didn't think of that one. - That's a good one. - I like, but romantic and long. - My least favorite of the Finchers. - Yeah. - You guys gotta open your hearts. - Done Kirk? - Yeah. - Well, for war, yeah. - I think so, yeah. - Definitely. - Longest day, bridge too far. - Yeah. - Out of Africa? Not a movie. I like either. - Would you consider great escape of epic or just like a really long, good, well, great, more adventure movie? - Or an adventure movie, I feel like. - Yeah, great. - Any other westerns? How the west was one? Once upon a time in the west, I think I'd probably-- - I have one time in the west of another category. Yeah. Yeah, there's more. What are the other westerns that I'm not thinking of right now? We already mentioned dances of volks. God, there's gotta be a couple of three hour westerns. I'm not thinking wider, for sure. Lauren's cast is wider. - Geronimo. - Walter Hillfield. - Sure. - Biopic epic. - Is Lincoln up there? - I wondered whether you guys were gonna do this. - I was thinking about it. I had that if Malcolm X had been taken. The aviator. - Sure. - Oli. Recently on the rewatchable. - Jay, part one and two. - Yeah. - Definitely. Okay. Is Goodfellas a biopic epic? - I can't really complain because you let me get Kingdom of Heaven in Bible, but I personally just think of it as a crime film. - I think that there are other Scorsese movies that would be eligible in other categories, but I didn't have this one down. I mean. - It spans a great deal of time. - It does. - The huge cast. It is a real person, story of a real person's life. - Yeah. You couldn't make it a strong case. - I think. I didn't choose it. - No one did. - You had after hours in your collection. - I did. I did. That's very odd to see coded. - I mean, but if you're gonna do Goodfellas and Biopic, then Wolf of Wall Street. - What also be? - I was gonna also be speaking of Leo. Ask you, I'll catch me if you can. Is that an epic? - Yeah. - They go a lot of places. - Certainly the aviator. - But not that many people. - The aviator for sure. - I mean, there are people at the airport or whatever, but. - What about the Revenant? - I think so. - I think so. - I don't know what category I would put it in, but I think it's a war epic. - Really? - Right? There's so much battle. - Man versus nature. - Man versus bear. - Yeah. The Revenant? - No. - No, me neither. - Yeah. - Sheenler's list? - Yeah. - The right stuff. - Mm. - Marginal, but I think yes. - The double VHS. I mean, this is the problem. It's like, I have like this association with the word and like the giant brick VHS to tape for Lisa. But that would put like Prince of the City in there. And it's like, was Prince of the City an epic? - An epic. - Yeah, I guess so. - Yeah. The right stuff. Irishman? - Yeah, I had it on it. I was gonna do it in Monkard or three hours if I didn't get to FK. - Bernardo Bertolucci's 1900, which I don't care for. - I don't know. - Yeah. - It's like five hours long. - R-R-R? - Yeah. - Definitely a recent epic. We don't get them as much these days. What about Kenneth Branagh's hamlet? - Chef. - No. - The scale of that movie is like-- - Well, sure. I mean, I guess that's true. - I mean, I guess that's true. - Is Henry the fifth an epic? - Well, then we kind of get into, because you're adapting a play, and if you're doing like the unabridged version or close to unabridged, plays were just really long. So are musicals. So, you know, is wicked an epic? I don't know. - Maybe if they made it one movie. - Sure. - You chose the guy with, or with Wizard of Oz. - That's true. - A couple of other ones to round us out here. Tarkovsky's Andre Rublev, for sure. Chris, you actually drafted Carlos, you crazy son of a bitch. Speaking of Leoni-- - Should I not have? - No, you did. - But should I not have taken it? - I had it here. Once upon a time in America, as well as once upon a time in the West, I think also qualify anything else. Do you want to list? - Well, if we're doing Scorsese Killers of the Flower Moan. - I skipped over at your right hand, that here too. - Or then Leo's. - Doon, yes or no? - I think Doon II, put them together. - And then it would be one. - Doon does more world hopping, doesn't it? - I guess you're right. - I only see three different planets on Doon. - But then Doon II-- - Doon II could doon II be-- - Doon II is more biblical. - I was like, can I do Doon is biblical? - But princess-- - But literal. - Irulan or Chani. - Just decide right now. - Well, I want to know is why he has to decide at all. He's got Emperor. - You want him to have like an invite situation. - Yeah, yeah. - That's a good idea. - Doon II, two chicks. - At the same time. - Okay. - God, it's so good. - That's great. Let's recap our draft, so Chris can go. - See are you chose first? Why don't you tell us what you chose? - In I see inspired films, I took the searchers. What's wrong with that? - You pivoted so elegantly from Doon II to chicks. - You'll throw on your, like I'm doing a voiceover voice, and it's very funny. In Epic Best Picture Winners, I took bridge on the word "requai." Biblical Epic, you guys were nice enough to allow me to have Kingdom of Heaven, the director's cut, which played in one theater, in movies over three hours. I took Lawrence of Arabia, and in Wild Card, I took Carlos. - You forgot romantic Epic. - And in romantic Epic. - In romantic Epic, I took Lastamo, he can send in biopic Epic, I took Malcolm X. - Sounds like the phone era is off to a rocky start. - No, I'm not trying to be like the guy on his phone. What I want is to be the guy who doesn't need any devices. - That's the problem, is you, even with the phone, you were flawed. This is why there's nothing wrong with a laptop. - But you guys don't make room for me. Get a bigger table. - No, get a smaller microphone. - I'm not doing the set design here, and I take no responsibility for it. Anything that happened here was designed by the wonderful people at Spotify, or this person. - Okay, I've heard your request, the answer is no, okay. - Well, then you guys are gonna have to deal with me for getting multiple categories. - In Odyssey inspired, Epic's, I took Obrother War art, though, in Epic Best Picture Winners. I took the Lord of the Rings, the Return of the King. In Biblical Epic, I took the last temptation of Christ in Romantic or War, Epic, I took the Deer Hunter. In Biopic Epic, I took Amadeus. In movies, they've received three hours. I took Seven Samurai. And in Wildcard, I took Kill Bill, the whole Bloody Affair, Amanda. - You could also just get a smaller laptop, you know? You just have like a Cadillac of a laptop for no reason at all. - You should have a really normal size laptop. - She get a SkyTell Pager. - I want to get the Zero Dark 30, like Dell Toughbook. Which is for all your rough housing. - Yeah, just in case. - Yeah, okay. - I think he's getting a bell helicopter to fly. - Now I'm just getting there. - So I have a much bigger computer. - I think that's a good fit. - I'm gonna set up a monitor. - Yeah, great, okay. - Okay. In Odyssey inspired, Epic's, I took the Wizard of Oz. In Epic Best Picture Winners, the Godfather Part II, in Biblical Epic, Ben Hur. in Rome. romantic or war epic the English patient in biopic epic reds in movies that exceed three hours JFK and in wild card Barry Lyndon should did the voice. I do. Yeah. Yeah, we all have a voice like that. Um, this was fine. This was good. Okay. I think this was this was a lot of fun and we picked some great movies. But this was. This speaks to, um, this, this genre that we've sort of invented being interwoven into the fabric of the greatest films of, of cinema history. So now in the future, do you want these categorical drafts to be more narrow? Would that be better to focus in more clearly on? I mean, I think our swords and sandals draft would have been boring, but probably more. We just drafted like the best movies ever made. Yeah. So I don't, I don't really have a huge problem with that. Many are saying Carlos is one of these movies ever made. Honestly, do you see me on Hillhurst? Talk to me about it. Buy me a $22 cocktail and I'll tell you all about Jonathan. Thank you for your work with Carlos. Well, sorry to spread the word. I want to say thanks to Jack Sanders for his work on this episode, our producer, thanks to Lucas Kavanaugh. On Thursday night, you will be able to hear a man and I speak about the Odyssey. It's a film we've now seen twice. Yeah. Just us. No one else. Really what the people want. No, they don't. Well, you're gonna come back on Monday to win. We can go full spoilers. All right, by then, I'll have taken lots of action and audience views. We never discussed the Doomsday concept art with Amanda. Oh, I got to go, but I'm just saying we didn't do it. We should keep bringing up top. Is that real? That can't be real. Look at it images. Oh, dear. It's in gambit in that concept. I think it's going to be in the film. Did you see Deadpool in Wolverine? Yeah, you did. You like it? No, whatever's wearing like a mock neck shirt here. What's going on? Thanks for joining us on the big picture. We were brought to you by State Farm, right? Don't you say that? Let's say things like that. Okay, we'll see you next time. Bye. [MUSIC PLAYING]