The Alien Interview Tape Might be REAL! - Jon Stewart | DEBRIEFED ep. 69

I can conclusively say that this was filmed by the government. I found out that they were there asking their set of questions, that there was literally a conga line of three-letter agency people waiting to go into that interview suite to ask that bean questions. We found a person that claims, a woman that claims she transcribed the index cards into notes. And I will tell you what she said about this bean. What he did was forwarded me an email that was sent to him from someone he knew inside the DIA. And it says, here's what I know about that film. It was classified as an unauthorized viewing. This film was filmed on April 22, 1991 at 3.15 in the afternoon on behalf of the Department of Naval Intelligence, coordinated by the Defense Intelligence. He said it was a clone extraterrestrial biological entity type two from the Tau Ceti star system. Here's where the men in the room. The first name was Rear Admiral Ned Schaefer. Captain Lowell Jacoby. He becomes director of DIA. Dr. Craig McPherson. Robert Donovan, Army Intel. Dr. Wilford Webb Wilson. The next name on the list was Carthusian Monk One. Carthusian Monk Two. Yes, we're now on the Da Vinci Code. There is a monastery in Vermont. It's called the Charter House Transformational Monastery. I have the picture of this one monk. He's 91 years old. I'm going to blow your mind now. What he said was that remote viewers with the NSA were getting this remote viewing of a white building in the far upper east coast where members there had the gift. There was a total of. Six monks that they used that they were used for counterintelligence in the 80s. They were, some of them were brought to S4, asked to do thought projection interviews with these beings. And he said that he said that. He said that it took a couple of days to describe how human beings live into our time. Seconds, minutes, days. The being did not understand that this type of alien, they measure time in their experiences, layered on top of each other. No one, no one on the internet has ever said this before. If you want to make a general drinking his coffee in the morning, spit up, tell him this. The new designation of aliens is SABRE. I'm like, like the sword? He's like, yes, SABRE. I said, what does that stand for? He goes, synthetic astrobiological extraterrestrial races. Don't ever ask about aliens. You can talk about it. And I am telling you, do not ever bring it up on any of your podcasts or whatnot. And I don't want you talking about other species other than the greys. And if you stick to the greys, you will be safe. I can guarantee it. - So my story is I was about, I was 11 years old living in Germany at the time. My dad was in the military. He lived off base. And I was walking with a friend, the same age, bright daylight, middle of summer. We were just walking along the housing area for the military families. So passing by our school and a chapel. And I remember I was just looking at a playground in front of me. And all of a sudden everything went completely pitch black. And I was just staring into the inkiest, darkest cave sort of blackness I've ever seen. And then it came, everything came right back as if someone had switched the light off on the sun and flipped it back off. So that wasn't strange enough. I turned to tell my friend and she says, "Did you see that?" And the same thing happened to her at the exact same time. They were excited and scared, ran all the way home and no one had had the same experience. Over the years, I've met one or two people that have had similar, if not the exact same thing happened to them. And they were kids too. So kind of weird. And I remember I was like, "Oh, I'm not going to be able to do this. Ladies and gentlemen, today I am joined by a very special guest, Mr. Jon Stewart, former pro wrestler, ran for governor of Illinois. I'm going to be a kid." Like, this guy's done it all, but most of all, you've been extremely vocal in the UFO topic. Now, we're going to get into a lot of different things today, but the main piece of the pie that I wanted to, And the reason that I wanted to have you on was talking about this alleged real video of an alien that is being interviewed potentially at S4. And obviously, with the lore behind Bob Lazar and Dan Bursch and everything else, all these connections. So I wanted to talk to you about that today. So first of all, John, thank you so much for joining me. Thank you for having me. Told you in our little talk before this, I think you're one of the best podcasts out there. your sincerity rings through and comes through the camera i'm not you know i'm not uh giving you a snow job you know um but i i was uh really thought that you could do a great service to my journey which is all this has ever been it's thirty thousand dollars of my money six and a half going on seven years of my time and i'm still telling people i've got my hat in my hand mr Magoo, Inspector Clouseau, I don't know anything. Please come help me. I still got to finish this journey. And I hope you can do justice to that because I have to be honest, I have not maybe at times communicated that to people where they get into a confirmation bias. There's something that I rub them the wrong way. And I want to do a little preamble. The preamble is this. is that, folks, what I have said for seven years has never changed. It is my journey. That is not BS. I'm not looking for attention. I've had attention in my entire life as a pro wrestler, football player, political camp. I don't need attention. And it isn't for money because I'm one of the only UFO reachers that's still in the red. And it's funny that the fortune-telling machine talked about finances because that's what I want. I'm $30,000 in the hole. For what? So I know people like to get into the chat log and this is BS. And you can say whatever you want about what was shown to me, what was told to me, what I experienced, who I emailed, who I caught. That I appreciate. But tell me the story behind why you think something is not copersetic. Yeah. To help me. Don't say Jon Stewart's BS. I am simply the reporter, the journalist telling you, I've been doing this for six and a half years. Can I please just tell you my story? That's all I've asked people. That hasn't translated very well. And I hope that it does today because I know the way you are, your demeanor, your character. And I'm really hoping for great things from this podcast. And I mean that sincerely. Of course. Yeah, and I appreciate you saying that. Skepticism, I think, is healthy, and I, too, practice skepticism, and I'm sure you do as well. We're both skeptics. Yeah, and it's really helpful. So today I will be asking you about a few things that I might want you to clear up or even the things that you're skeptical about, about the things you believe in. But as you know, as you might know on this channel, you know, one of the, I think one of the reasons for this channel isn't to get to the truth necessarily. I think that'll come with time, but I think it's allowing people to speak, allowing stories to be told, unfiltered, no judgment. And after that, we can hold up all that sort of anecdotal evidence to the light and see if it connects, see if it, you know, see if we're finding points of connection and then forming hypotheses, discussing, trying to dissect it as a community. But there are definitely detractors out there online that will simply try to attack your character or will try to simply debunk something out of an opinion or a gut shot. And I think it's difficult but healthy to remain balanced in this, uh, space specifically, because obviously, obviously we're looking at anomalies, you know, we're looking at the anomaly and within that anomaly, there are a million other anomalies. And so we're already looking at one, where do we draw the line between the others? Right. And that's where some people, I think it, maybe you ruffle feathers in a way that people are like i'm not ready for that yet and that's okay i think uh a very famed journalist told me six months ago john you've got a live bean puppet or not real or not that's a really hard thing for anyone the media government ufo researchers ufo community to metastasize absolutely metabolize That hit me. That was like, well, that is a great statement. We're not talking about a fuzzy saucer in the sky. We are talking about a very creepy world. weird-looking being, whatever it is, puppet, interdimensional, off-planet, interstellar, that's going to be very hard for people to metabolize. And you, that's what you're facing. You're facing this confirmation bias of, I'm not ready for this to even remotely be possibly true. And that's fine, I think, too. Everybody's on a separate journey. Some people are still looking at orbs and some people are looking at reptilians on the moon. There's a whole gamut of things to look into in this phenomenon. So I don't blame people if the alien interview isn't the first thing they want to see within this phenomenon. I don't blame them either. Yeah. Go watch The Phenomenon by James Fox. It's a good, nice, easy way in. But after you're done with the crafts, let's talk about what I'm interested in. Let's talk about these aliens. Let's talk about the pilots. Yeah, exactly. Okay. So take us back. Uh, 19, uh, I haven't here. Do you know that I just got a chill? I got a, I got the, the, the shivers. Really? Yeah. It's because it gives me PTSD. I've been doing this for six and a half, seven years. And it's, uh, uh, you just did like a hypnotic thing. Let's go back. That's what, you know, so it, um, that's good. This is good. This is, I, these podcasts are my, my therapy. And I, I don't, I'm saying that candidly and sincerely. This is my therapy too, of talking through this, begging people to help. Help me. And yeah, it's cathartic, but I just got a, I just got a shiver. So that's good. That's a good sign. Um, July 26th, 1996, it was a Friday. This video, this videotape was then handed by, uh, this gentleman, Victor goes by Victor, uh, to John Coleman, who was a president of rocket Tom Coleman. Oh, Tom Coleman, my bad. Tom Coleman, president of rocket pictures who also created the documentary in 1997. Um, you know, sort of this whole story to the world, uh, which, you know, uh, predated the obvious, uh, interview that happened with art bell afterwards on the phone. And then the later interview again with Victor where he shows up, I think a decade later. Um, well, it's nice about my research is that I have the backstory and I can tell it now because I put out my documentary, everything's out, which was great. Uh, which, which is great because I can speak to you now and don't have to say, I'll have to tell you in a skiff or something, you know, something like, Oh, you're in a skiff. So you can tell. Yeah, I know that. So, um, about, uh, four or five days before candy and Tom Coleman, the video we have now since found out that Victor was making the rounds in Hollywood of television studios, um, trying to sell them this VHS tape and by his own admission and by others that, that knew of, this process at rocket, um, these people at these television studios, this guy's a little weird. He's a little off. Um, uh, but the biggest reason was no one could guarantee his anonymity. And Victor speaks of this. They, they, they would not be willing to sign a contract, pay him in cash and not really use his name. And, and, and, and he didn't want to be on, on the video. This is something no one under, no one knows about. Victor did not want to appear whether in silhouette or whether in voice changer, Victor did not want to be part of the video. This isn't just him, uh, shopping it around and, and getting turned down. This is him where his demands weren't met. Correct. Okay. And his, and his security wouldn't be met, which is my first, you know, my first thing, the trial balloon that I throw out there would a, because, and I'm so glad I thought of this when this first came out at, before you were in the UFO community, everyone in the UFO community told everyone that was interested, including me in 97, 98, 99, find out who Victor is. You prove the provenance of the video. If Victor is a, a paid actor, you know, central casting videos, obviously a hoax. But if somehow this is the UFO community, this is why a lot of people run from this. Like, don't, don't throw my words back in my face. The UFO community told me, but if Victor is a government employee, a military person, somebody from an administration, an elected official, uh, uh, a chaplain with the government. Wow. Now we got a whole new, we got a whole new ball game. So I have been living with this in my back of my head, prove John prove who Victor is. And I'm simply asking, the first trial balloon. If you're an actor, are you, are you leaving studios because they can't protect your identity? Wouldn't you want your identity out there? If you're this egomaniac actor that most actors are, they want their name. They want their recognition. That struck me. We realized the last studio head he talked to was Mike Darnell of Fox unscripted television. He just hung up on me three weeks ago because he thought I was lying to his wife. That I, I said, this is John Stewart from Chicago. I have a real quick question. I think he thought I was a bill collector. He literally, the Hollywood people are very, very rough. They are, they are not polished. Um, they, the manners are horrible. And so he, he just thought I want to go confirm the story just three weeks ago. And he hung up on me, but Mike Darnell is with Fox unscripted television department. And Victor goes in and you know, Victor's he's a pain in the ass. He's precise. He's, he's not easy to deal with. And they shoo him out. Victor tells the story, but he doesn't say Fox. We found out that it was Fox TV. He goes across the street to a newsstand across the street from Fox studios. And it's a newsstand. He picks up variety magazine. He opens it up and he sees a advertisement for a Rodney Dangerfield comedic golf VHS tape. And he figures maybe this production company, who's not so, highfalutin as Fox and, and ABC, NBC, CBS, whatnot. Maybe they'll take a chance at this. Maybe I, maybe they'll be malleable with my demands. Yeah. Uh, uh, uh, sorry to interrupt, but folks have to understand as well during this time, like, uh, obviously the, the audience that is listening is a little more mature, but obviously today you just put that stuff on YouTube. You make your own channel. You don't need anyone else. But back then you needed to go through these gatekeepers. You absolutely had to for anything to be seen at all. Um, so, you know, that's the reason he was shopping this around. He couldn't just, he didn't have a platform. And this is why I came on the show. I have been trying to tell people for six years from my knowledge of Hollywood. I have written three scripts. I have had four, um, reality show go, go to pilot, which is, which is huge. They didn't make it on TV. I know about Hollywood blockers getting to these people, Chris, what I'm trying to tell your audience is that it's very important with the background of Victor to get a meeting with a network in 96, the verbiage that you would know to, to, to be able to tell the blocker, the secretary, the receptions to get to a Mike Darnell from Fox and then get that meeting in his office. The verbiage you would have to know would be beyond just a government employee. It was somebody that was familiar to some degree with audio visual, audio visual production, something very, very important to remember that it was near impossible to do, to do this without some knowledge of the vernacular of Hollywood. Very important. So he calls up rocket pitchers. Tom Coleman answers. Tom Coleman thinks it's his brother joking him. He passes the phone off to Jeff Broadstreet. Now this is where I debunk myself a little bit. And remember, I'm just trying to find the truth. Sitting at the rocket pitchers office is the only Hollywood director that has ever been to area 51. Just so happens the hour I'm debunking myself. I know you're looking at me like, wait, why is John debunking his own? I'm sorry. I, I, I, I called that into question. I find that a little suspicious that the only Hollywood director, Jeff Broadstreet, who I talked to three times a month for six years, happened to be sitting at the office, was friends with Sean David Morton. When Victor called, they bring Victor in. Jeff Broadstreet tells me, matter of fact, the biggest PETA pain in the butt on the history of the history of the world, demand after demand, after demand, we've settled them down. We came to a financial demand. We said, there's no way we're doing this unless you come on screen, silhouette, voice changer. You reluctantly agreed to that. It was not, uh, it appeared in the video. However, he was very uneasy and not happy. That caused them to file it differently or give it special handling. This interview is terminated. The interview resumed only after a discussion of the ground rules. Have you personally seen the alien being that appears in the tape? Yes, I have, but I stress I was not necessarily present at the interview session that appears on the tape. He was not a happy camper, not there and not even in the phone call with Art Bell, which he also voiced out that he felt like he was kind of coerced into doing so. Not once did it seem like he was very uh willing to come forward uh welcome to the program victor yes i think it's fair to say at this moment i understand uh this is now who would the telephone numbers get can i ask you who is at your studio at this time um but then you know like later we can talk about this but there there was uh in some people's contention with this was the financial aspect of it like he did receive money for something and he explains that and we'll talk about that a little bit later and i do want to address it because i think it's an important point to address um but yeah he he was very reticent he did not want to come forward on camera so right uh yeah visibly angry well unvisibly invisibly angry and it's funny because the director jeff broadstreet would of the hundreds of talks i've had with him uh an email he would he would tell me john once we settled him down he was actually a chatterbox he was actually very you know very um uh cordial and very and when okay okay you know in chicago we call them you know uh that's italian for you know chatterboxes but he said uh just uh uh very scientific and um and i guess i should say this part now even though it's a kind of a oh it's like a it's a surprise but he slipped about six months ago the director and he said yeah when he um when he put on the wig because he wore like a wiggy toupee on top of his thing and you'll see victor's hair come down over his forehead like this and there's a wig on top of it jeff broadstreet says he had a tuck in his ponytail and i froze going back to what because we're click we're thinking this guy is a scientist to some degree inside these programs i immediately boom think of eric davis who said that these scientists in the program again what we're talking about is that they're not going to be what do we just talk about two people making comments who don't know each other from 10 20 years eras apart and they say the same thing that eric davis said these scientists in these programs weren't ibm types eric davis said quote they wore sandals sometimes no shoes ponytails and they walked around humming pink floyd music and i went this direct jeff broadstreet just kind of gave me a nugget here yeah he's backing up what what eric eric dr davis said about these insiders and that really just like stiffen my back like okay we might be on to something here i'm still again trying to find the truth i've been trying to prove i'm talking to your viewers that this was a hoax i went at this as this was a hoax and i beg your viewers to please understand that so they put the tape out it gets a lackluster response i just realized that it came on the heels of the john benet murder rant a murder investigation and all of that hoopla so it was and people call this the forgotten documentary because not a lot of people really truly remember it coming out it came out on the upn network i thought for it was fox it was the upn network talking about the money i talk about the money with this investigation follow the money i come to find out in my investigation was put up by entertainment on the upn network a startup network on a program called strange universe and they use this as a one-hour special on this strange universe it was like a weekly episodic conspiracy a conspiracy show i research and find out that everyone's got short short pockets there isn't a lot of money i've heard stories uh uh anecdotal that people weren't getting paid by reicher entertainment um so my point is this a very elaborate animatronic alien by anyone sure okay i see in 96 yeah short money victor's got to get paid yeah he's not getting he's not getting millions of dollars no all the all the production company and rocket pitcher has to get paid and reicher's got short dough even jeff broadstreet said i don't think tom coleman got a whole lot of money for this so my point is doesn't make sense was there enough money to produce and and people hate when i say this an animatronic being that we think would have to have had about five operators with remote control cables dragon skin rubber skin um would there be enough money to create this people were telling me it could be done in somebody's garage between 10 and there are some people saying a retail animatronic shop would have charged eighty thousand dollars was there eighty thousand dollars back then what i just described people aren't getting paid i mean it's a short bunch i don't know i'm just putting it out there yeah i there is a money aspect here i'm not running away from the money i'm telling you there is that's a good point there is a money follow the money here and i the number one rule of journalism and i did that and i'm saying to myself i've had fx people come to the site and said do you know how much yeah even at the low even at the low end uh because i i'm not going to assume it was animatronic because um you know at the low end it would have been manipulated by multiple people you know muppet style um you know even even then it seems like the experts in puppetry acknowledge that it was skillfully done right that like they now the experts in puppetry don't believe for a second this is an alien but again that's not true well the ones in the in the movie correct um in the documentary in 97 those two gentlemen they don't believe it but it's also potentially as victor does point out eventually in their best interest to say that i can make it better in the one and the one animatronic person said now think about this i'm a retired car dealer if i tell you well i i know that's a toyota corolla but there's something about it that i don't understand that i can't say it's a toyota corolla you feel like what do you want and are you yeah are you because there was that they were confused special effects person said it does one move and this is a top hollywood special effects person says on camera but it does one move i can't figure out how they did it chris well thought the alien exhibited movements that would be difficult to fake there are there are moments when it this looks very real and and i don't know how they did certain little things about this um so right right when i would say that it's definitely a puppet he he moves a certain way or he'll or he'll lift up in the frame and all that and all these little things are important to the you know to the character of him this animatronic alien does a this it's moving this way while it's turning its head this way it's coughing there can't be a hand inside the mouth because the chin is only three fingers wide you could not fit and um we've showed part of it where um there is really no one in the back of the head from what we can see i'm just speculating here so it would have to be a five-person animatronic we show the mouth going yeah open like that which is which is which is alarming to me i'm just simply stating this i'm not trying to and no the money for that high-tech obviously high-tech alien i just don't see where it came from yeah that's all it's it's the one argument that can be made you know obviously we're ruling out a cgi and so the only argument left is puppeteering that is the only argument left and if you look at it it does seem like either a incredibly skillful uh puppeteering act or animatronics like these at the low end uh a renowned puppeteer uh behind and plus uh even making it like you said in a way that you could manipulate it might in itself be a feat to behold but i'm not saying that it's not and so and he's never come for and and exactly and and you know what that's like much like the um the idea of you know the the and we'll get into this maybe a little bit later but the skinny bob video that keeps cropping up as well um a lot of people say the same thing about that is like there's no set photos there's no costume leaks there's no mold anywhere like like mold of a cast of of any of the costumes and and so to me i always think about the fact that there's no you know even if you look at um what was it x files one of the movies i think it was or where there was this lab of bodies that they had you know and eventually uh set photos would surface and then people would share them as if they were real and then they debunked them because they didn't know it's from the set of x files exactly but just to just say that like when you're on these sets and they're quite elaborate you know you can go from anywhere from like 10 to 50 people at a time being a part of that and that's a lot to contain for people to see and to see and to see such a you know for somebody just trying to get a small check um 30 years a puppeteer yeah no debunk craft catering yeah the accountant the wardrobe i drove the people to the studio the people at the studio or the sound stage the person that made that bizarre monitor which i think is the bombshell um the heart the heart monitor no one in hollywood including the animatronic person has come forward at a pool party to try and make it with some girl to be like so i made that be i that has never happened with any any hoax that if if there is I'm I'm wrong. Sure. That's never happened. It's a little ludicrous to think that it was done for money. I think I think that argument we can probably rule out. As you said, it's it doesn't really add up. I'm so glad I'm here. But the argument that you're welcome. But the argument that still does hold up for a lot of people is PSYOP. Right. That is for that is the biggest argument to be made about this case. So why would someone want to create a PSYOP? Well, if you look at the day or the date that this video came out, it was a few short months after the Virginia crash that happened in Virginia, Brazil, where the American military Air Force showed up in Brazil to haul off, you know, a bunch of aliens and retrieve a downed craft. You know, what better way to sort of, you know, misdirect the audience is to leak an alleged interaction with a being and have people sort of question. I'm not saying that that's the case. I'm not saying that it's real and it's not real, that it's a PSYOP. I'm saying for me, the only valid argument other than it being real is some insane PSYOP. And that to me is just as valuable in this context, because what are you covering up? You know what I mean? Like, why would you spend so much money in PSYOPing people into thinking aliens or what are you what what are you actually hiding that's worse than aliens? And so, yeah, that's just the only point I wanted to make there. Thank you for bringing up the conclusion of my note. I completely agree that and I hope people appreciate this, that after all of this money and all of this time, I can conclusively say that this was filmed by the government, whether it was a PSYOP or whether it was an actual extraterrestrial. I've had two insiders and we will get to this who tell me, you know, don't one of them is Stephen Greer. Don't be disappointed. When you find out it was a recreation of an actual event, a PSYOP, well, first of all, you're not going to hurt my feelings because I don't care. I want to know the truth. And I am telling you because the coding on the bottom, the DNI, Department of Naval Intelligence, which so proud of me and my team for proving Bob Lazar's story on that angle, that the number 27 that I am 99% positive that it was filmed by the United States government. If you want me to shock everyone and 25% now that it could have been done for a PSYOP of a, yeah, we couldn't show you a real alien, but we've created this and we did try and have disclosure. What do you mean you want to put me in Leavenworth for 30 years? I did approve that video release. I tried to show you, but I didn't get the president to show you a real alien. We are, we are definitely, um, under the, the, the distinct possibility that that is a possibility. Is, do you think that if it was a PSYOP that Victor was kept in the dark? Because for it to be a successful PSYOP, Victor getting caught lying would have been a big oversight. Um, they would have had to kept him in the dark. So he, by all means, thinks that it is a real alien and was being told so. Good, great question. We were, we have been told like a planned leak. Of course we have been told that, that Victor was chosen to do this. If it was, if it was a PSYOP, I only have two people telling me it was a PSYOP, not Greer and this other person that said, don't be disappointed. I'm talking actual people. Sure. That Victor was a disenfranchised employee. What's funny about the threat put together this mosaic of S4 and this draconian, um, oppressive regime down there that really turned a lot of people, this cabal into getting somehow information out from S4 to the public. And when you talk about the draconian security measures that Bob Lazar talks about, we have, we have multiple people telling us that that has, that is something that is, to want it to, to leak information. And we have two people telling us that Victor was disenfranchised and that someone from Majestic 12 as part of a public acclimation program. I'm just telling you what I was told on this. Sure. That, that it was allowed to happen. Wink, wink. I don't believe that. I don't think anybody, I don't think intelligence lets you, I don't think intelligence does this and, you know, go ahead and take it. You know, I don't think, I don't know. I, I've got a great, I've got a great, um, quotation. Um, and I'm so glad I, I, I, in classified programs, when you have security lapses, it's at the end of the, the, the classified program, offices relocate, access lists are updated, personnel shifts, and oversight changes. Victor said this was, there was a drop in security. Right. To go from analog to digital. And that's So just to catch people up, um, the tape itself, the reason why he was allowed, because this is a big piece of information here that people were like, why would they just allow him to take a VHS of an alien and sneak it out? Which sure wasn't a VHS tape, but go ahead. Sorry, my bad. What kind of tape was it? Well, that's, that's the other thing that goes to the government filming. We, we have experts, one of them from National Geographic that said, definite original 16 millimeter. The only people. Oh, yeah. It was 16 millimeter. Only people filming on 16 millimeter in 1991 or even 96 would have been the government. It was very hard, very cumbersome. We can't find any, um, producers that would film on 16 millimeter. Right. Um, so, and, and, but we did find out. And because nothing was digitized yet. Right. Right. You see the old Roswell cameraman with the two reels that was still being used when, when, uh, Victor said this was filmed in 91, which we, we have also been told with the, with the leaked statement that I will talk about that April 22nd of 1991 and in 91, yes, they were using VHS tape in beta max. Um, they were also on the audio visual department for many government programs was still using 16 millimeter. And so then during the transfer of tape to digital, which, you know, most media companies had to deal with, well, everybody that had anything on tape had to eventually digitize it. And it was a, it's a laborious process. I've done it myself. I've got real canisters down here that I've had digitized expensive. It's tough. Uh, it's not perfect even today. And so during that time, yeah, you could see, because imagine smuggling something out, like it would have been just the highest security ever. So it would have had to have happened. During a time where there was potential confusion, uh, perhaps like a government shutdown or like any, anything in, in this pocket would have been like the perfect storm to get one of these things out. Yeah. Well, it was actually, um, again, we'll get to the main leaker who I call the chairman, the letter that he wrote, the email that he wrote me, but this was let out of us for, and that's when I went, cause I knew you couldn't get anything out of these unauthorized special access program. You're waiting in the nude. You're when you come, you wait in the nude when you leave fact, nobody's sneaking out a DVD between their butt cheeks. I'm sorry. And, and Victor alludes to that also. Um, and I'm not jumping forward in the story, but when I talk about the email that I got of the whole provenance of this tape was the area 51 cameraman was escorted back to the groom Lake photo lab. He made two copies of the 16 millimeter film, snip three minutes of it, put it in a burn bag and a GSA approved vault. And that burn bag was snuck off of the Nellis test and training range. That's how, so Victor, um, did he obfuscate and lie a little bit that he was the active agent? I think he was protect protecting that cameraman or protecting his own identity. Could he be the cameraman? Now we, the, the, the name we've got a Victor, I'm not jumping forward. We have them on the log, the same log that I saw Bob Lazar's name. Which has Victor working for EG and G, um, uh, which, which did, which built area 51, right. What did everything, you know, what else they did for the government? Highly top secret audio visual documentation. Yeah, it makes sense. So we are very convinced that Victor was a mid to low level audio visual, maybe even the manager or the director, right? He had access. He had access to films, but he also said that he saw the being correct. Well, if you're like, if you're part of the filming, you're going to be, have to be read into this program and you're going to actually have to have some contact with the B or B in the film when it's being filmed to make sure. Cause otherwise why would a guy with a ponytail, you know, just be hanging around this highly sensitive area, you know, you'd have to be some type of experts and the fact that you have the film and you say that you saw this being, I mean, put two and two together. on the team filming. And Victor talks about philosophy, the end of the world. I'm not jumping ahead here. I want to make this great point about him being probably the director, manager, middle-level audio-visual person for EG&G. He talks about esthetology, the study of the end of the world, and religion, especially when it comes back in 08, Mayan calendars. Just a pretty interesting story. We probably believe he had some PhD in film. And we find out that people that get their doctorate or their master's in film, also, most of them, a lot of them, those people also have a double major or a follow-up major in philosophy. I didn't make this up. I read this on the internet. Because he seemed a little too philosophical for a guy that was a cameraman at the NBC station. When I read that on Google, it was just, again, one of those things I'm like, wow, is this really coming together? I would give you that. But I would also push back a little bit in thinking that when he did mention that, he also mentioned that he was nearing the end of his life due to potentially an illness. And the director said he didn't believe that. Which was a counterintelligence operation of, I'm dying. Don't look for me. But that also would be when you get more philosophical. Totally. So that's the story of how Victor went to Rocket Pictures. They go on Art Bell to promote the DVD because the viewership was not up to par on the UPN network. And this actor, remember, everyone's, oh, Victor's got to be an actor. This hired actor is arguing for a minute and a half that he was given the wrong phone number. And you're an actor and you're upset about a wrong phone number you can't get through. And this, what we have found out about Victor, this pendactic personality, pendactic, this precision mentality. It's this way. It's the rules. It's the regulation. It's specificity that really shone through. I just don't think an actor would argue for a minute and a half with Art Bell about the number being wrong. And I found that stupefying. We ran, and I'm not getting ahead of myself, but we hired two people from the Reed School of Lie Deception in Chicago, two police officers. And we also gave this to a retired FBI agent to watch Victor for his verbiage. Can't really, his body language, but we can maybe analyze his verbiage. In the Reed School of Lie Detection, we got two police officers that graduated to look at Victor. And a retired FBI agent who's a private investigator. Please don't look up in Chicago, a retired FBI agent, a private investigator in Stockton. I'm just saying. The FBI agent went, stop. Do you think this guy's an actor? You know, when Victor's talking about the primitive conceptual framework, it's talking from an alien to talk to a human being about the dynamics of space travel. And it would be like putting calculus in the greets and scrunches of a chimpanzee. And the former FBI agent, he goes, I don't know who this guy is, but stop. You're wasting. The police officers said the same thing. And the one of them came in with that word, pedactic personality. So I'm reading all about, I have a degree in counseling psychology, and I'm reading about that type of personality trait. Do you know what I'm reading over and over again? What the majority of occupations that have that trait, scientists. You know, you don't do a dash of this and a pinch of thallium and you just throw in a little bit of that. It's not a very, yeah, he's not, he's not socially, he's not, he's not a social expert. He's not Jon Stewart, the generalizer. Sure. No, he's, yeah, you can tell, you can tell. And what was interesting about the Art Bell interview, and I would, you know, yeah, I would encourage everybody to, first of all, you know, go check out the original documentary, but then also follow up. It's a great followup. Yes. With the Art Bell, and Art Bell, obviously the predecessor of all of this, you know, he is, he is the guy. And even Art Bell, you know, admits that it took 20, 30 minutes for him to warm up to Victor, because at first he's like, I'm not really buying anything. This guy's very cold, reserved, shut down, being kind of rude. And then after 30 minutes, when I guess Victor felt comfortable with Art, because he's, Art Bell had a wonderful way of making you feel comfortable, you know, his, his voice was so soothing and understanding. And after- Stroke his ego. Yeah. Yeah, exactly. And just kind of like allowed him to get comfortable. Correct. He started opening up and then, and then Art Bell, to his credit, was like, you know, I, I believe him. Art Bell believed him. You know, that's a, for me, as far as anecdotal evidence goes, it's a big one for me. Cause I think, you know, he spoke to a lot of people and you can, you can just really put your, level that this man was at least believing that he was telling the truth. And I say that because, you know, maybe he was fed something that he doesn't know not to be true. And yeah, that interview was really revealing. But also, like you said, he was quite upset about the small sort of almost just things that didn't matter. And you're like, why is he so upset about this stuff? You know what I'm sitting with you? I mean that sincerely. Does an actor go on Art Bell and answer, and I know this for a fact, answer an hour and a half of unrehearsed questions? And one of the biggest things he's pissed off about is, yes, we're not telling the public about the extraterrestrial phenomenon. But one of the things that really pissed him off was people that worked on an S4 had little personal mementos and trinkets on their desk, and they were told not to. Does an actor? Even think of that? He talks about Sean David Morton's newsletter, and he's correcting things in it. An actor from CAA or Central Casting is reading Sean David Morton's Delphi's conspiracy. I don't believe it's an actor. I don't think very many people believe it's an actor. Those who do obviously haven't done their due diligence. But I think that, you know, the potentiality for this being a legitimate, close to the program, given some passage material, he believes it to be true. I think that potential is still there. So like I said, like you said, I think this does have something to do with the government. Either it's true, or the opposite side of the spectrum, to me, is just as fascinating. Why would you want this to be out there? Are you preparing people? Are you simply misdirecting people? Like, what is the reason there? And that to me is equally as, maybe not equally as interesting. Obviously, a real alien is much more interesting. It bothers me more because you're taking my tax dollars and making a hoaxed video to deceive me. Even if you think you're preparing me, you're making, taking my tax dollars. I've worked my butt off my entire life, and you're taking my money and creating a hoaxed video and deceiving people. I understand you want to prepare us, but you're deceiving people right there. You know, I don't know what ends. And that to me- Yeah. I don't know what end that is. It's bizarre. It is bizarre. There's aliens. We all know there's aliens. Come on. There's something. But we've got people hiring special effects people to create a really good animatronic alien to deceive us. That to me is creepier and is more bothered than some alien in a random underground facility being filmed. Yeah. Both are bizarre. That's for sure. Okay. So the story gets out, doesn't get traction. He goes on Art Bell. Right. Kind of still angry that people haven't really. Really caught on to this. So he goes back to the producers who first documented this and really goes off on him. He wears a mask in this interview and he's kind of like, just, you can tell, really pissed off and breathing heavily in that mask and there's this fly buzzing around him. You just see his annoyance come through, you know, and he's just annoyed that there's two people here instead of one. That he's wearing a rubber mask. That he's wearing a mask. How much credibility do I have when I'm wearing a rubber mask? Exactly. Exactly. And he's just kind of fed up because, and he really kind of goes off on ufologists and grifters and, you know, and that's not something normally a grifter would do. You know, you don't see somebody who's out there. Let's see somebody who's out there and just screaming at people for not doing the work they're supposed to be doing. They call themselves researchers. I gave them everything. They're not doing anything. Like to me, that really is, again, my conviction level that I think he believes what he's saying. It's been 11 years since I brought out that tape. What follow-up has there been? Who among these so-called ufologists, these self-proclaimed investigators, show me one of them that's demanded information about S4 under the Freedom of Information Act. Show me one of them that has seriously attempted to confirm or deny the existence of the UFOL. Well, you and I hulk something. Do we go back Seven years later in cajole, people to prove it, it's a hoax that never rang true to me. I just find that impossible that a hoaxer would come back and cajole and be combative with people. Again, he's mad at people. He's mad at the UFO community, even the ones that take it, that say it's real. That's right. Because he says, you're taking it for face value. Yeah. That pendectic personality. Research why you think it's real. Yeah. Absolutely blew my mind. Yeah, definitely. There were people in that documentary who took it at face value that it was real. And he's kind of like, you just got lucky. That's what he said. He's like, you got lucky that it was real and that you reacted that way. He's like, you didn't do any research. And if it's so easy to make that alien puppet to all the special effects, people, make one. Go in your garage and make one. So to this day, this video, to me and to everyone else on the internet, I've shared a lot of videos and a lot of things. So. And it's one of those videos that when you when you read comments from balanced individuals, it seems to it seems to surface a lot more conviction of it being true than many of the other videos, save perhaps Skinny Bob. Skinny Bob is another big contention for a lot of people. And I'm still kind of on the fence. I'm like, I guess my I'm around my conviction level dropped for Skinny Bob quite a bit. It being authentic, an authentic alien. Again, not completely out of the realm of it being a psyop, but it did drop a little bit. But I'm roughly 50 50 on that one as well. This one, I'm a little higher conviction because of the nature of the video being like one shot. What part of this video for you raises your conviction level on this being true? And what's one part that lowers it? And I'll start with mine. So the one that raises it for me is obviously the the movements of this being and then perhaps some of the stuff in the foreground that we're seeing the things that lower my conviction for this specific video is a the lighting. But again, that can be, you know, that I tell people that's not the way Victor brought that film. It was lighter. It was bluish. Yeah, it was bluish. Bluish you and no one. Why is it so dark? Yeah. It's a puppet because it's the room's dark. That's not the way Victor brought that video. They did that for theatrical dramatic effect. OK. Because it looks so much better than the blue closed circuit television style. Victor Victor brought a blue hue and you can find this on the Internet. You can see the alien's thorax, his arms, not his hands. Yeah. That is not the way Victor brought that. OK. OK. Point point taken. OK. But the other thing was the doctor. The doctor behind him. And this for me as just a body language observer. There were two doctors that stepped in. One of them had a flashlight and, you know, was looking in the mouth, looking in the eyes, perhaps to see, you know, dilation or whatever it was. Actually hemorrhaging. Yeah, hemorrhaging. Even in the nostrils, if there was hemorrhaging, if he was choking and they were wiping the mouth, you know, there was stuff coming out of the mouth. They were wiping this. Blast form. Yeah. And that's all very compelling. The other gentleman. Wilford Webb Wilson. Who's this? That is John Stewart. OK. But the other gentleman. Died in Watsonville, California, 2014. How do you know this? You talked to his wife? I got the whole story to tell. OK. No, come on. Let's go. But I'm saying. So what about him? You didn't. He touches the bean. He's not really doing anything. And it seems like he's doing exactly what I would do if I were playing to the camera. And that's that's what I read. I'm like, this guy's like, he's kind of like, doesn't know. What to do with his hands. Kind of like pretending to be a doctor. If I look at it through that lens, that's how I see it. Now, I also don't know how I would react if I had to fix a choking alien. I don't know that I wouldn't also act exactly like he did. Right. But am I going to touch something that's going to hurt the alien? That's right. You ginger with it. Are there people with guns looking at me right now? Like, I don't know. Dan Burr says how frail the beans were. Victor tells us that this is this being was at the end of its interview cycle. Um, so it was, it was going to be retired, going to be retired. Obviously you could tell the bean was slightly infirmed, especially with the, the respiratory respiratory illness, illness that he, that he had. And I agree with you. Yeah. So that, uh, for me, that was, that was, I think the biggest contention is just body language of this, uh, second doctor. Uh, other than that, I really can't, um, find much to, to really go on. But what about you? What are, what's one thing that raised your conviction level looking at this video and what's one thing that you're not? That it is such a casually shot video, you know, somebody made a great, a great statement to me. Um, uh, that when you're, uh, the government and you're filming, uh, you're filming something, you're there to document something. You're not there to make, uh, you know, uh, uh, Miley Cyrus look at the perfect lighting. That's not your job for, as part of the government audio visual document. So I think it's a great point. The fact that there is a red stool that you could buy a Kmart in Las Vegas in the nineties sitting off to the side in front of the table. Nobody, nobody realizes this, a stool. You've just left a stool there in this hoax video, the hoaxed video you spend, obviously spending a lot of money to, to, to hoax it as the Hollywood producer, you don't have the medics and pressurized suits. Cause you know, what did you put them in pressure? They come in in shorts, sleeves. These scrubs, obviously knowing that maybe the beans, not a contaminant to humans. You have a monitor that still to this day, no one knows what it is. And that I could talk about the monitor for, for erratic heartbeat. Yeah. Yeah. We're going to get into that. All of this, this, you have two military people in the foreshadow. Nobody even realizes these two men were there until, until Victor talks about it until a guy in England who were enemies. Andrew Burlington shows the patch, the patch on this army officer. The combat patch is like a dragon, a horse, a wing that I have gone through 3000 military patches. So this dirt, this, this, this producer is now created its own military patch that no one can see you in blazing DNI on the bottom of the film of, of, of abbreviation of a department of Naval intelligence that no one can look up in 96 when it came out. We can't look it up. No, you can't look up that agency, even though I've proven that it exists. Why would you do that? How did you prove it existed? Well, I mean, if you want to jump around, that's for me, I'm looking at, you know, I'm looking at obviously the only, uh, the only semblance of this is, is the department of Naval intelligence, which was on, you know, Bob's pay stubs. Okay. And a lot of people said, nah, it's not even a department or whatever. And then, then I had John Ramirez sit here. And he said, you know, sometimes it's a flash ID. So it looks like an official department, but it allows them to sort of go undercover into these darker programs. So proud of this. Prove Bob Lazar story of the DNI at least. Okay. DNI. Okay. Number one, he is an author. He is a school teacher, family of six. He's got a degree in invertebrate, um, uh, anthropology, you know, real dummy and a Navy aviator. And he's an author. And we are talking about another subject matter. Okay. And I went, wait a minute, Michael. Um, this is text. Still have the text. What is the DNI? I want to be clear, Michael, not the office of Naval intelligence. The department of Naval intelligence. Is it real? Yep. I'm like, again, the depart. He goes, I know exactly what you're talking about. I'm like, why can't I find it? He said, it's an agency buried inside the department of Naval intelligence. Lazar. Bob, I'm proving this, a Navy aviator. Can you tell me how you know this? Before I went to, he's typing this to me, before I went to Naval Aviator School in Pensacola, Florida, two agents of the DNI approached me to be an agent with them. And I declined. I wanted to fly planes for the Navy. It's a Naval aviator telling us the Department of Naval Intelligence, not office department, is real. It's buried as an agency in the Department of Navy. And he writes, got this on text, they're the spooks for the Navy. It's like their CIA arm for their Navy. Wow. One thing I will ask of you when I leave. Can you please tell everyone how much I credit the internet for helping me, Inspector Clouseau, through the six years? If it wasn't for the internet, my co-pilot, I would be nowhere with this. Yeah, fine. Okay. That's all I ask. The internet angels have been awesome. Mr. Stewart, hi. My name is Sean. I don't know if he wants me to say his last name. first name is Sean, S-E-A-N. He goes, I have a Canadian security conference brochure of the listing of events. Yeah. And on it is a Colonel Carl Prinslow of the Department of Naval Naval Intelligence sends it to me. I have it. It was in my documentary. I'm like, I've emailed this guy five times. He will not return my email. Don't tell him what it is. So on a conference brochure, we have the U.S. Department of Naval Intelligence. His name is Carl Prinslaw. And I mention names. I mention facilities. I will give you codes. I don't gatekeep anything. And I'm proud of that. And what I would like to do with this conversation is to tell you people, to tell you names, facilities, to let you know that this is all real. So that's two things with the Department of Naval Intelligence. What was his name again? I'm going to write this down. I need to. Carl Prinslaw. I can send you the Canadian brochure. I've got all 22 pages of this conference. You know, it's like you get a little brochure of today we'll be having dinner. After dinner, you know, Chris Ramsey from the DOD will speak. Shocking. This is going to sound like I'm going to tell a joke at a bar, but it's not. A director-level former CIA, what would you call them, member, personnel, owns a microbrewery with his wife who was in linguistics for the CIA. Okay. My cousins take me after deer hunting, and they're like, oh, my cousin's into aliens, and John, this is, I want to see his name. And he told me what he did for the CIA. This is like director-level. Not a director, but he is on the top of the food chain. And we're sitting, we're talking, and I know I'm catching him off guard. I said, can I ask you one quick question? I'll never forget. He was sitting like this. And he said, yeah. And he was looking away from the bar. He was on a barstool. Bar was jammed. I said, is the Department of Naval Intelligence real? I want to be clear, not the office. Chris, he went like this. Yeah. Yeah, it's a real thing. And he caught himself. He gets up. He goes, I'll be right back. He goes into his back office, and my cousins and I are looking at each other. They don't know what TNI means, but I'm waiting. And I'm waiting. I'm like, is this guy dropping a dime on me? Is he going to himself? Why did I just do that? Why did I? It was very, very, very bizarre. I talked to his wife, and we'll get into my emails being stolen. She tells me that she thinks it's the NSA. I don't believe in aliens. You're crazy, so on and so forth. And we are getting into almost like a shouting match with each other. And I said, do you know, is the Department of Naval Intelligence a real thing? She's like, yeah, it is. It absolutely is. I'm just like, well, I've got two CIA people that told me this. I've got a naval aviator, and now I've got somebody, Carl Prinslov, whatever his name was, that he's on a conference brochure with the Department of Naval Intelligence. And again, I have proven, I think, without beyond of a shadow of a doubt, that the Department of Naval Intelligence is real. Bob Lazar said it was the company that hired him. I found out that it's one of the three-letter agencies that runs a program under the umbrella. Now, whether it was that interview, whether that's the way it happens with all of the interviews, because you and I— I believe there's a percentage that that could be a PSYOP. But during these interviews, there are agencies waiting outside in the hallway waiting to insert their questions to this bean, oftentimes. Well, that also lines up with—was it Carl Wolfe? There was a deathbed confession years ago. Okay. Carl Wolfe, do you know? Is it Carl Wolfe? I believe it was. This gentleman said that he was—he went to church. It was a very niche church. I think it was the Church of—World of God or Church of the World or something. It was like some—almost like a sect, like some small church. And the person he went to church with worked at Area 51 S4. I'm listening. And the guy he—so the guy in his deathbed, he was—you know, he had TSI. He had pretty deep clearances. I think what he did was like, I don't know, just paperwork, something, you know, very classified, but mainly paperwork. And he's like—he calls him up one day, and he's like, hey—and he's telling this to Danny Sheehan on his sort of deathbed. He didn't even tell his wife. This is him in his—he's hooked up to tubes and everything, and he's telling Danny Sheehan this. And he said that I was invited to go to Area 51. He's like, I don't know. You know, the guy wanted to show me some stuff around there. He had clearances already, so it was all good. And he takes him. And then they go to S4, and they take an elevator. They go down and get to a place. They start walking, and he sees a bunch of underground hangers with crafts levitating off the ground. And then they go into this room where there's a, you know, one-sided mirror, and there's a being sitting there. And he said, do you want to ask it anything? And he goes, no. You know, being religious, he thinks this is some demon. And he goes, okay, I'll be right back. And he goes in, and he kind of, like, sits there in silence with it for a second, comes back out with a stack of, like, papers, and says, you know, he's done. But now he has—these are all previous answers that we were given. And he starts reading through them. And, like, the answers were, you know, where are you from? And, you know, they say, you know, we're part of the same galaxy, but our mission is to monitor this planet, yada, yada. And that, you know, he asks them. Is God real? And he goes, well, not the God that you think. And, like, gives them some kind of weird, you know, a roundabout answer. But that, to me, again, you know, deathbed confessions are— Huge. Yeah. To me, that's the biggest piece of evidence. You're alleviating your burdens. You're alleviating your mind. You're not worried about any repercussions. It's the most credible confession. It's the most credible, you know, unless you're completely delirious. To me, it's the most credible. It's the most credible thing you can ever hear from another human being, period, is when you're about to leave this planet. What do you want to leave this planet with? A lie, a joke, a farce, a hoax, somebody's cover-up, some psyop. It's all very strange to leave somebody with that, but to leave them with that story. Yes. And so, yeah, I just thought that was an interesting connection there about the conga line of people asking questions. It kind of lines up. And they have index cards. They write the answers down in index cards. The DNI, let me finish with this. Sure, yeah. This is what started my whole saga. Mm-hmm. Voting for United States Congress, and it's 1999. I'm not going to win. This is a hellish 11-way primary in the North Shore of Chicago, the John Hughes where he made all the high school movies, the Home Alone houses, the North Shore. These are all, you know, uppity, very wealthy people in a lot of the neighborhoods, and it's a free-for-all. We are destroying each other. Private detectives smear. A national newspaper, and still to this day, it's on GROK. And Jon Stewart was involved in an 11-way primary that national newspapers called the dirtiest congressional primary in history. Which kind of helped me for being able to absorb what happened to me for the past, you know, six years. I end up endorsing a guy I became friends with, Mark Kirk, who became the congressman and became a one-term senator, Senator Mark Kirk. He was in the reserves, and he was a naval intelligence officer. He was in the reserves. This started the whole thing. We're on the back of the bus, just him and I. Jon McCain is brought in. We're doing a bus tour for the district to hype up the primary. And it's Mark and I at the back of the bus. Chris, this started everything. And Leslie Keen once told me, oh, you touched the third rail. You were, like, asking a mafia guy the code name for a. And so I said, Mark, before everyone gets on, what is the. The DNI, the Department of Naval Intelligence. And he did. And he was over here, and he did this. Oh, yeah, the DNI. Yep, the DNI. And I'm doing this. Yeah? And he's like. And he looked at me like this, and people started filing on to the bus. And it faded in, you know, to the buzz of everyone. And I remember going, holy shit. CEO might be real. Because I just had a naval intelligence officer who became our senator in Illinois swallow his peach pit. I'm still friends with him. I was out to dinner with him a year ago. He's the one that got me involved with Captain John Lovell of the Apollo missions. I'm not dropping names. I'm just saying, he doesn't know anything about this. But that's. And I've had. Again, I remember telling the story to Leslie Keen. She's like, well, this is. Reporters have that. It's. You're touching the third rail. You. You are getting the sense that you just hit a raw nerve. Yeah. And why? Why. why would he not look at me and go, what are you, Naval Intelligence, what are you talking about? There is no such thing. He did it. He just, he said nothing. And he repeated it. And he looked off into the distance. And I just, Chris, I had a, my stomach dropped. And this was two years after the 97 documentary came out. I'm like, oh my God. Oh my God. Are you telling me? Because I thought basically what I thought was maybe a carefully crafted hoax that this thing could be real. And the last thing with the DNI is he worked for NASA, Bob Osler. And he called the IRS with Bob Lazar's EIN, the federal tax number. Every, when you get, when you are a business, you get a EIN number. I have one for my business. It's your tax index number. That's how you pay your taxes for your company. And the IRS took like five minutes, came back on the phone, said, this is, I don't know what this is. This is classified. We can't tell you. This is Bob Osler worked for NASA. He was the one that called that one admiral. He said, yeah, we've got, you know, craft and whatnot. So there's Jon Stewart, the ding-a-ling car dealer, just gave you five pretty damn good stories that possibly, as far as the Department of Naval Intelligence is concerned, Bob Lazar was correct. That, that, that Bob was right. And before Bob, I've researched this. I could be wrong. The Department of Navy Intelligence was never brought up. Bob Lazar. Yeah. Was, I could be wrong, but in my investigation, Bob Lazar was the first one to bring up a, a. That's a great point. A, a, a, a Department of Naval Intelligence that doesn't exist and to write it on a payroll stub and have it and get it, give it. And Bob Lazar created a, a IRS taxpayer ID that another person is told is, is classified. Yeah. You know, I was, I was born at night, but it wasn't last night. So again, we're hoaxing, Chris Ramsey and Jon Stewart are hoaxing this video. We have a stool left in the thing. We've hired two guys to wear military outfits. We don't really put them in the shot. Their shoulders are getting in the way of the camera. We have, we have medics that are not in pressurized suits. We take, I was told by a cameraman, he's in my, end of my documentary, my good friend, James Mastery, he was a cameraman for ABC Chicago. He talked to me, for a half hour about digital overlay graphics. I said, Jim, in 91 or 96, when we think this may, it was a hoax. Sure. How much to put that on there? He goes, like a video production company. It's like, this took hours. You had to cut out the numbers, put it on the film, recopy the film, transfer it. And as far as the transfer and stuff, 16 millimeter transfer to VHS tape. Is Chris Ramsey and Jon Stewart on a short budget going to find 16 millimeter film, film it on that one take. That's a one, we positive. It's one take, take that 16 millimeter film, transfer it to VHS tape, have this actor go around other film studios, have them come back to us. And then finally use this crappy VHS tape that we have to darken for the documentary. Really? Yeah. Isn't the Occam's razor that this was taken out of a government facility. It was shot on 16 millimeter. Victor went home. Again, I don't like this guy, but his name is Andrew Burlington. It's from England. He thinks conclusively that Victor, he knows the computer. It was a 1996 gateway 3000 computer because it's got a white watermark line that Victor used this computer to take the 16 millimeter film or the DVD disc and put it to a VHS tape. So pretty, pretty interesting. So that's, that's our DNI story that I'm really very proud of and proud of that. I can tell people don't throw Bob Lazar to the trash heap of, of grifters and hoaxers. Cause I think you're going to get disappointed. Yeah. Well, that's, thank you for sharing that. It's a lot of information and it's a lot of news to me. So it's very cool to hear about this elusive department of naval intelligence, because as most people who follow Bob Lazar story, no, that's another point of contention that they keep bringing up. But as most of us who, you know, look further into Bob Lazar story, we realize that give it enough time and Bob will be vindicated yet again. And I've got another Bob Lazar story for later on about lunch. You have to ask me that. Oh, well, uh, the lunch truck, the food trucks. Yeah. Um, and it's like asking me, John, as a pro wrestler, what, what, what did you guys say in the backstage? What did you say in the locker room? Yeah. There's only things that you would know. There's a bunch of stuff that only I would know. So I got the monitor. If you want to go over the monitor, cause I, I, I do. I also want to note that, um, according to Victor, this being arrived to us for an 89. Right. That's also when Bob was there. Yeah. And the Kalahari crash. Yeah. So it's, uh, it's, it's, well, I was, that was, I mean, that I don't know to be a fact because I don't either. Yeah. Cause that could also just be passage material yet again. Something I'm very proud of. I have absolutely no idea, no information, no, nothing, even, even, um, anecdotal. Sure. Of where that being came from. Yeah, of course. And where it crashed. Yeah. Please don't look at, give me the look. Oh. And I will tell you what she said about this, this being. Oh, yes, please. It's a little heartbreak. You want me to tell you that now? Yeah, please. That they nicknamed him Oscar. Uh-huh. That this was his first, first mission he conveyed. Now this, again, one thing, Victor, um, and I've, I've interviewed. Who is this lady? I'm not going to tell you her name. Don't tell me her name, but who was she? Like, how did she hit you up? She, she, she contacted me off the internet, my email. Cause I get my email. Did you vet her? No. Okay. Um, I'm just telling you the story. Yeah. I want to know everything. I know that you have, we're talking a lot about S4. I just saw your, um, road where you talk about interviewing. I interviewed for three hours, a woman, a widow who claimed her husband was an S4 telepath and that he went crazy. They made, they turned him into a bust out. The same thing, almost like with Victor. Allegedly I interviewed her for questions. Like I found it fascinating. And I was a person that transcribed the notes of the tele thought projection. She said of the thought projection interviews between the bean and the pants. Okay. Whoa. She's like, I'm not going to tell you anything more. Here's what I can tell you. No way. They nicknamed him Oscar lady. Come out here. Now this is what I'm just telling you what this woman, I'm telling you, I want this lady on the podcast. Let's go. I'll, I'll, I'll backlight her. I'll, I'll do the whole thing. This moved me a little bit. So I don't want to laugh too much because I, they nicknamed him Oscar. It was his first mission. He got, this is what he relayed. There was a lot of, um, there was a lot of fuzz and, and, um, um, opaqueness with, were the beans really telling us the truth or where are we getting the right information? Right. You know, how does it being, or is the telepath, you know, because they put pictures in your head. So how does it being put a picture in that, that you're, he was confused. His name was Oscar. Allegedly he was confused. It was a hard landing and that he described that he was sick and that he wanted to know where his other crew members were, which I don't think it was the Kalahari crash. Cause that was only allegedly two beans. He wanted to know the disposition of his other crew members. And the last thing was, it was that he was afraid of being there. And in that, in the, in the facility of us, this is what this stenographer, put out, whatever transcriber, um, told her my wife was there on speakerphone with me. My niece was there. Who's a corporate pilot, not some nitwit. And we were like, Oh my God. And my two daughters were there. And when, and when the lady said, and she sounded a little Spanish, I'm just saying, I, I, I'm not, I don't want to just giving you everything that I can derive when she said, you know, he was afraid my daughter's got moved. Like they were like, and they, and when the phone call ended, my daughter was like, Eddie, you know, my, my daughter, I mean, there's a, there's a Yeah. But there's also the, the anthropomorphic sort of take where, you know, we also feel the same for, um, uh, Stitch and Lilo and Stitch because he's a Disney character. He's not real. And we kind of feed our own humanity into him, but, but yeah, giving them a name doesn't help giving them a name like Oscar. But yeah, I'm not going to say any more fat ball, Italian wrestler. Don't worry about that. I'm not worried. Um, but that was, again, I give you the whole story. I'm, I'm. And, and, and, and it was, and it was, and it was fascinating. If I was worried about the people, those people, I, you know, wouldn't be doing this. And she contacted me after I told this long hour story of the, of the S4, uh, the widow whose husband allegedly was an S4 telepath and had the same, again, she didn't know a lot about the Victor story. Yeah. Told me whether it's true or not. Sure. That her husband had the same, um, the same issue that Victor had, which was, you're not going to tell the people about this program. You're you're no, no, not on my watch. And her husband felt the same. Same thing. And she said he went crazy at a conference table when they told him that they were that a offensive weapon or something, a system that they were developing was going to be used or could be used or being pushed to being used in an offensive manner for the military. He exploded. You can change the world with this. And they actually threw him out of the program. They did things she felt to inhibit him from getting a real job. She said he was an adjunct professor or lecturer, not a full time. She said, John, I'm telling you, two of his students from UCLA came up to him when we were out because they lived in Los Angeles and, you know, professor, blah, blah, blah. She goes, I know he wasn't fully. But they turned him into a bum effectively. Yeah. Just like what Victor claims. I'm on the run. You know. That's interesting. Very interesting. I would, you know, I'm extending a branch out here to, you know, anybody who knows this lady or anybody involved, like, reach out. I would love to hear it for myself. And if there's any way that we can get some of this information out, even anonymously, I mean, that would be really interesting. This is part of this. For the past six years, people come out of the woodwork. They email and they contact. I've had that too. Yeah. It's interesting. It is frustrating as well because, you know, part of you is like, you can hold this information and share it with other researchers. But outside of that, you know, it doesn't really do any good. And it hasn't helped my investigation. Coming forward, talking about it, begging people to help me has been awesome. It's helped. So, but I wanted to talk about the monitor. Okay. Let's talk about the monitor. This little heart monitor that jumps up and down. Yeah. So, you know, I'm not getting sappy here or whatever. But I'm in my driveway. It's 2019. I just lost the governor's primary for the Libertarian Party. My life isn't very good at the time. In every metric, I won't go into, you know, whatever, every part of your life, health, finances, marriage, whatever. It's just things were not going good for me. And maybe that was that, you know, when you get down, when you're feeling low, sometimes that's when, you know, when you hit, I wouldn't say rock bottom, but when you hit. You know, sometimes that's not the worst thing in the world. Another door will open. And I was sitting in my car and I got home early one day. I remember it was a drizzle was coming down. And this video was bothering me. The whole everything, Victor, the video, everything was bothering me. And I said to myself, I've come home early. I've got some hours. I'm going to find something about this video right now. Fact or not. Proof or not. I'm going to prove this is fake right now. What do I do? I'm like, I don't know. I can't find these doctors. I can't find, I don't know, anybody in ufology, the military, nothing. I started from the ground floor on this investigation. I said, but this monitor, this monitor is bizarre. The blip goes up and I want people to hear me clearly here. The green trace, it's called, that's the technical term, goes up and down. The trace does not stay on the bottom of the monitor. The bottom of the screen, which every oscilloscope, every heart monitor, every EKG, the trace will stay down and it will also go up and down. But the bottom of the trace will always remain on the bottom of the screen. This monitor, that ball comes off of the bottom of the screen. We've stopped motioned it. So it was very weird. Now, Jaime Muson said that 15 cardiologists, thoracic surgeons all claim in Mexico. That the heart monitor, if it was, was, was perfect in sync of that being coughing and going into some, which they thought, which they thought was a cardiac, a cardiac arrest. There was a couple of thoracic surgeons that told Jaime Muson back in 97 that they think that that was, that heart monitor was showing a single ventricle heart. Now we know that what I've been told about this creature does have a weird physiology, a heart, lung, one sac organ. Maybe that's what it was showing. That's what we, and that's what we hear about in, you know, in other parts of this lore. So this is a, this is a cute story and it's, and I love telling it because it's charming. It's real and it shows humanity. So I'm in my car. Thank God for the internet. iPhones. This, I'm in my car. I go on the internet. Who made physiological monitors in the early nineties, right? When Victor said this was made in 91. I find two, two companies. Space labs, not SpaceX and Hewlett Packard were the, were the primary builders, developers, R and D of, of monitors. I find this in minutes. I contact space, uh, space labs. Um, I email them. They email me back. Well, sure. This is the research and development department of space labs. They did monitors for NASA. They send us the video clip. We'll tell you what we think it is. They send it back. I have the email. I show it. Uh, head scratcher. We have no idea what this is. The company that made monitors for NASA doesn't know what they're looking at. Now I go to Hewlett Packard. Hello. Can I have the research and development department for physiological monitors? One moment, please. I'm like, well, this is interesting. Can I help you? Whatever he said. This is Hewlett, Hewlett Packard. I said, is there John Stewart? I'm an investigator. Is there a real really old guy in the R and D department? Crusty old guy. Chris, my, my hand, a bright hand of God, you know, maybe he doesn't talk to a lot of people. They stay away. Maybe he's getting ready to retire, but he's been there forever. My, my hand of God, he goes, oh, we've got one of those. One of those puts me on hold. I hear, hello. You tell the guys like in his sixties. And it was very, very cordial with them. I know I talked fast. I pissed a lot of people off, bothered them with how fast I talk at times. And I said, sir, my name is John Stewart. I'm from Chicago. I'm an investigator. We're doing a documentary, which I wasn't. I've got this physiological monitor I've never seen before. Is there any way I can get your email and email you this clip? And you tell me what this is, what you know, what you can help me. Absolutely. Gives me his email. This is five minutes later. This is after space. I mean, this is talk about the internet in smartphones. I call him back. He answers the phone. And he goes, uh, a kid. I don't know what I, I don't know what I'm looking at. I'm like, you've never seen anything like this. He said, I've never seen the trace go up and down. And I don't know why. And he, he had a statement. I don't know why you would make the trace, uh, go vertically and not horizontally in the, in a physiological terms. It doesn't make sense. Okay. It's a little bit of a good piece of information. He said, uh, where's this from? And I'm like, I go, F it. I'm going to tell him the truth. I said, this is allegedly from an underground government facility. Please don't hang up on me. Allegedly, this is monitoring the physio, physio, physio, physiology, physiology of an extraterrestrial. He doesn't laugh and doesn't hang up. Now, this has been repeated. Thousands of times in this investigation where people do not laugh at me, nor do they hang up the phone. I find that a little weird. He said, that's interesting. He said, um, said it's on an alien. Well, I think you're looking at a one-off. What's a one-off? He's like, well, in manufacturing terms, it's only if you're trying to solve a problem, there's not a device to solve it. He gives me the analogy. If you're looking for gold in 1800s, you would create a gold mine. You would create a gold detector to help you find gold in the ground on that type of, that type of, um, that type of, of, uh, methodology. And he said, if, uh, if you're telling me that he had, this creature has a one sack or, you know, heart and lung is one, one unit, um, a human physiological monitor would not work. You'd have to create a one-off that could monitor this creature. I took my iPhone and I was bashing my head to check me back in reality. Like this can't be happening. This guy is giving me like a breadcrumb trail. And he said, uh, I think that's what you're looking at. I think the government probably would have made this especially to monitor this, this creature. Cause he does not have the organs, as you said, of a human being doing the, okay. If you need anything else, you have my number. Go ahead and give me a call. I hang up in my car. I'm like, I just do not believe. That this, this just happened. This is not enough. I want to be a true journalist. I need another three sources. That's what I've always been taught in journalism classes. Now I find, I'm going to wrap this story up. No, you're good. Actually, no, I'm not going to wrap it up. I find three people from Sweden that did their PhD level dissertation on the history of physiological monitors. Now, have I gone to the top of the mountain as far as physiological monitors in a matter of 10 minutes? The guy's name is Sven. No, I'm not going to wrap it up. I'm going to wrap it up. He emails me back. I have the email. I send him the clip without the alien. I don't want to scare people. Yeah. So you crop it. I cropped it. Yep. Writes me back. This is a guy with his two cohorts. It's just. the history of physiological monitors. Mr. Stewart, we have absolutely no idea what we're looking at. I'm sorry, we can't help you. And I simply said to myself, with having a rudimentary knowledge of Hollywood, is a schlocky third-tier production company really going to invent this monitor that has never been created in the world and whatnot? Let me give you the debunking. I call an FX person. Oh, I could do that. How can you do it? Well, I'll put a laser on a servo, and I'll tap it up and down, and that's how I would do it. A laser on a servo. And what would it hit? A piece of glass. I get my daughters. We get a piece of glass. We manufacture. We put it on a stand. I get the modern laser from the internet. We shut down the lights in my living room. I start bouncing it. Yeah, there's a green blip on it, but it's diffused. It's coming in the back of the wall. So we realized. I realized that this was a lot more advanced, if it's special effects, than just putting up a piece of glass and a laser on a servo. There would have to be masking of the diffusion. There would have to be so much more that went into simply that. Bombshell. I paid $2,500. This is the start of the writing the checks. I give $2,500 to Bill Mums, who National Geographic hired, to do the analysis of the Patterson-Gimlin Bigfoot film. Did I go to the top of the mountain again? Nat Geo hired him. I think he'd be good enough for. I give him the film, pay him $2,500. His name is Bill Mums. He writes me back, and he says, definitely 16 millimeter. Ah, coincides with what we've heard. Cool. Transferred to. He gives me the speed frame, the 60 blank, blank per second. I've got the whole eight-page analysis of it. But there's a. I don't think this is real, but I'm saying that on face value. But it's 16 millimeter, and nobody uses 16 millimeter. There's a problem. Well, of course there's a problem, just like the other FX guy. What's the problem? There's no creases under the armpits. Okay? He writes back, he goes, John, every foam latex doll that I've been involved in since the 50s, during the drying process, around 75%, they let the arms droop down. You know, if they mold a creature, and when they. Every creature, when the arms come down, a crease develops in the armpit. He sends me 20 pictures of the creature of the Black Lagoon to this guy, to this video. I mean, I got my money's worth. And I'm like, Bill, what does that mean? He said, well, it means that some unknown technique has been used by this rocket pitchers in Beverly Hills that did a Rodney Dangerfield golf video. That's me. That's my language. This video production company suddenly devised. Breakthrough. Breakthrough of animatronic foam latex dolls. And I don't believe that, what I just wrote. And he said, John, you know, tread lightly. This is weird. I cannot explain this. Oh, I forgot. Here's the monitor. He sends me the picture of the monitor, where all we saw was the glass. He was able to lighten it. It is bracketed by a metal bracket, not where Chris Ramsey and John Stewart would put four pieces of angle iron metal around a piece of glass. This has got like a bubble, like a bubble on top of metal with a fin. And on the one part of the bracket is a protrusion, like a cartridge of a bullet, like the top of a missile. Like somebody had a mold around that. Why would you just not put four pieces of metal together? And Bill goes, somebody made this. There's a reason for that protrusion. He said the same thing I'm thinking. Special effects guys would just put four pieces of metal. This is bracketed. It's got a fin. It's got the protrusion. Yeah, too much work. Too much work. Are you ready? Hi, Mr. Stewart. I'm blah, blah, blah, blah, blah. Have you seen the video about Whitley Stryber talking about your alien in the monitor? No? Let me send it to you. Whitley Stryber, 2014 at a conference. Do you see this video behind me? It's my alien interview with the blip. He goes, I think this is real. And I want to, I want to, this is Whitley. This isn't John Stewart. And I want to tell you why. Do you see that green blip on the screen? He's got it over his head in the conference. I saw that exact same green blip when I was writing the book communion. I think it's the way those types of aliens communicate with human beings. And I would see it at the corner of my eye in my, on my, at my writing desk at my home. And I would try and put my hand over it and it would not cover the blip. And it drove me crazy. I'd put my thumb on it. I could not get rid of this blip. And I think it's the way the beings were communicating with me when I was writing communion. But I have something to ask the audience. I have never told anyone about that green blip since today. How in the hell, did a Hollywood producer in 1996 know to put that green blip in that video that the gray beans, that is one way or possibly a way of them communicating? I never told a soul. So how did that Hollywood producer, and I'm asking your audience, how did that producer, rocket pitcher, know to put that, to put that green blip in? And I about fell off my chair when I heard that. And again, I want to tell you the whole very quick story. Somebody said, I think Bell Labs made that they turn the modulation, so on and so forth. Okay. Somebody else emails me. He's kind of known in ufology, Mr. Stewart. It's not a heart monitor. It's not a physiological monitor. It is kind of a communication device, but the gray beans give off a vibratory response. Now we've heard this from other abductees. We heard this from the S4 security guard, Derek Hennessey, whether you believe him or not, they would put Vaseline on the hair of their arms and the back of their necks when they were around the Bob Lazar crap in the hangers because they gave off a vibratory resonance. Their skin, the human beings vibrated. And this person told me that grays give off a vibration and that box was built specifically to absorb, to detect, to detect that vibration. After all of this, it's still not good enough. I will finish up here. I did find Tektronix. No, it got, got made into a company, a different company. That's why I love you, bro. Tektronix did make a similar looking green blip. It's this real vivid blip that did not stay on the bottom of its, whatever its machine that I have the video of. So I did find an actual, a human made machine with that blip, but it did not look anything like that box. So that, so, so when you, when you look at the, you whistle past the graveyard on the alien, hoax, hoax, and you just hear of the, of the monitor story. Yeah. How did Whitley. And that's just one thing. It's one thing. You know, there's, there's so many different things in this video from the video itself, how it was filmed, where it was shot, how it came to be. And then yeah, certain items in the video, certain, you know, potential. Yeah. You know, costumes that don't make sense. Chris, can I say one thing? Sure. Would it make sense that the government knew what Whitley knew from dealing with the beans for 70 years that we have devised this green box and this is the way they communicate. That's when I hear like the Whitley Strieber story, I say government SIA. But that almost, yeah, but that almost negates the, uh, the telepathy, you know, that almost, uh, replaces the telepathy then. So. No, that's not true. I was told that the vibration, um, that they give all, they emanate of different vibration when they are in stress or when they, and then someone else told me just a random ufologist that that was the beans way of telling the telepath. I'm trying, I'm sending you something right now. Okay. But that's an interesting person. Sure. It's interesting. Okay. I think we should get to the chairman. Let's get to the chairman. In the list of men in the room. Yeah, absolutely. That would be really interesting. So there were a few people in the foreground. There were the two doctors that are, approached as well. Um, and yeah, what do we know about these people? How do we know that these are real people? So like many things, I, you know, I've always been interested in conspiracies and whatnot, and I always know and realize like with MJ 12, like we'll have a lot of other things. When you go public as an author, researcher, investigator, journalist, sometimes people in the know will approach you. We'll send you things. Yeah. So I go on the Jeff rents program. Uh, this is one of the oldest internet programs. Pre-podcast in America. And he writes me back. He said, I, I told him, I know this video, John, I believe this is real. You're coming on. Let's tell me what you have. I go on there. They had an hand, the humble John Stewart, not the crazy guy. Can anyone help me? Here's what I have so far. I told the whole monitor story, so on and so forth a week after that. Well, I must want to say one thing before that two days, this was Memorial day, 2022. My emails disappear off my phone. My red be specific because your viewers don't, should get specific specificity. My red, but not deleted emails disappeared off my phone. It was in my cup holder. My wife and I were driving in the upper Michigan, upper peninsula of Michigan. And my screen goes blue, black, white, black. I go in all of the blue dots saying your email, they're gone. I looked at my wife and say, well, that's crazy. I'm like, she's like, what? I'm like, my emails are gone. So I talked to the Jeff friends producer pre pre-interview, which is standard operating procedure. I said, I just want to let you know, my, my emails disappeared yesterday. Oh, that happens all the time. To who? A lot of our guests. He goes, John, we're monitored. A lot of these podcasts and radio shows are monitored. This, this happens all the time. And you know, you and Jeff and I have been emailing back and forth for two weeks. You must've been on somebody's radar. Um, don't worry about it. I'm like, well, I am not a UFO guy. I am worried about it. It's like, Mr. Stewart, just relax. This has happened before Jeff friends is producer about, um, 10 days later in June, I get an email from a person and he said, I caught your, your, um, your, your interview on the Jeff friends program. He had some things, right? He had some things wrong. I am knowledgeable of these programs. I'm not in these programs, but I have knowledge and I know people in these programs and I'll never forget this line. If I can give your investigation a nudge, I will. Boom. Okay. Doesn't sign his name or anything. Once a month, very important to know this. Once a month, I get an email from him. How you doing? Or, um, uh, caught you on another podcast. You got this wrong or that wrong. Very, I would say light topical things once a month. This is an interesting exchange. Have to know this. Yeah. On my birthday. So this is about nine months later. On my birthday. Um, I get from the horse's mouth. Now I'm a public figure pro wrestler, but it's hard to find my birthday. I just find it funny on my birthday on a Friday. Um, I get this email from the horse's mouth and it's his email address and I open it up and I want to be very specific here. He's obviously, you know, well, I know who he is now, but he is an old person, older person in his seventies. Not technically, heavy. What he did was forward me, forwarded me an email that was sent to him from someone he knew inside the DIA. What we have found out is the defense intelligence agency runs all things alien extraterrestrial project Aquarius out at, out at Papoose Lake and the N and, uh, Nellis test and training facility. DIA runs the umbrella program. And under that umbrella, umbrella program is NSA, DOE, um, uh, DNI, uh, Navy, uh, air force, so on and so forth. But that the overseer running this program, the air traffic controller, defense intelligence agency, who I found out was created by Senator Barry Goldwater and John F. Kennedy, because the CIA was obfuscating and subverting them. They wanted a department to collect their own intelligence and Goldwater and John F. Kennedy created a department to collect their own intelligence and Goldwater and John F. Kennedy created the DIA and the DIA, believe it or not, uh, the air force was through with the extraterrestrial with project blue. They'd had it. They actually kind of put it up for auction. Does anybody want to take over the DIA brass? Yeah. They took on Stargate as well. Okay. This is why you come here. So he, I get an email from him, from this person. And this is from, so this is like John Stewart sending an email from Chris Ramsey to the, to the phone investigator. And it says, this is not talking to me. This is so important. This is John Stewart to Chris Ramsey, two pals communicating with each other. This guy does not know I'm being sent this. And it says, here's what I know about, um, that film. Um, it was classified as an unauthorized viewing, not a theft, not a, you know, we had a big, you know, investigation, unauthorized viewing. That's what the, they classified that. I think that was to water down that it was removed and to anybody in the higher ups. Oh, it was an honor to do a theft. Let's, you know, water down the language. So we don't get in trouble. And it basically said this, um, this film was filmed on April 22nd, 1991 at three 15 in the afternoon on behalf of the defense and tell the, the, the department of intelligence coordinated by the defense intelligence agency. This being, was classified as an other gray. I have found out that there was so many species. This was so run of the mill that they didn't even give this. Remember round eye tan being not a typical gray instead of giving it a classification like, um, uh, uh, I can't even think of a, of a scientific name. He actually referred to it as one of the other grays, which I thought was startling. If you were going to hoax me, you'd give this. Yeah. It was a haploid. And I, I can't, I have problems pronouncing that haploid is someone that has something that has one sexual chromosome. We human beings are diploids, two chromosomes. This is a haploid. Um, one classification. That is the only classification that I talk about. Why he's because that's what I've been asked to do by people that are advising me. So do not look at me with that. Look, we're going to get to that in a second. Keep going. So the letter continues. Um, uh, the being became, uh, distressed once they, this really pissed me off and I could see why Victor was pissed off at the treatment of these beings. Not that we purposely mistreated them, but that we were bad hosts. Yeah. Bad hosts. Ham handed. After the bean was stabilized, the department of naval intelligence continued with this questioning like, Hey, okay, we've got him. No, don't worry about it. Come on. Finish your questions. And it took them a second to even get there and to like respond. That bothered me. Yeah. Okay. That bothered me. And I felt a realness in that statement, but the realness comes here's where the men in the room, this is like the MJ 12 document where it's going to list military men's names that I've never heard of. I'm knowledgeable enough. In ufology to know most of the players, the Hill and Cotters and the, and the Bobby Inman's and McDonald. I know enough to know enough. And I'm reading these names. I'm at a McDonald's Oasis in Indiana. My hand, Chris, my hand is shaking because I'm getting real. Okay. Maybe not real at this point, but I am getting names to this film. There's starting to become a realness. My hand is shaking. Now I put the document, my, um, I put my, my phone down, I'm writing the name so I can Google them. The first name was, um, rear Admiral Ned Schaefer. I pull them up. Here's his Wikipedia page, his military class, a dress uniform. Um, uh, what was he? He was a head of intelligence, the liaison for intelligence for the joint chiefs reporting to Colin Powell in the early nineties intelligence. Okay. Never heard of him before. Now this list is given to Linda Bolden Howell. And I will tell you what she said about them. The next person he's dead. Ned Schaefer. Um, the next person, um, Captain Will, Captain Lowell, Jacoby, Naval intelligence. I go email him or Wikipedia. I look, there's his biopic and Wikipedia. He becomes a rear rear admiral. I contact my one investigator friend, Chris Jackson. He's a police officer. We're talking back and forth. I'm like, it's a list. Bullshit. I've been MJ 12. It's the majestic list. Um, it's bullshit. I'm Jamie Shandor and Bill Moore. They got to me. And he's like, this list is from 91, right? I'm like, yeah. He goes, do you think maybe in 91, he was a captain and 30 years later retired a rear admiral. And I'm like, Oh shit. Who would think of that to give me a list of men's names and ranks in 91 when that I'm just saying, I don't know if I would have thought of that to give someone's rank in 91. I'm going to, I'm going to, I'm going to stop with the list. I find his email. I email him former DIA director, Lowell, Jacoby. I'm John Stewart. Chitty chatty. Ha ha. He, ho ho ha. He writes me in an email. Call me Jake. I don't wear the uniform anymore. That was a direct quote. You call me Jake. And I write him back. Oh, you're, you live in Virginia. I heard the fried chicken at these gas stations is incredible. I'm going to take you to go play golf and ha ha. And we're just, we're, we're golf buddies now chatting back and forth. And, uh, he writes back. You said you're working on a documentary. What do you want to ask me? it's like this, this space land of the Hewlett Packard old guy. I'm like, Oh God, here we go. Yeah. I said, Mr. Had to get hung up on. No, I'm going to sound like I'm bragging. I'm not. I said, Mr. Jake, my father was in the Navy. I stopped the closure of the North Chicago VA with Mark Kirk. We did that. We stopped it from closing. They ended up building $132 million. Captain James Lovell, Apollo 13 surgical center. I'm very proud that I was a progenitor of that. I'm writing this to him. When I ran for Congress, the military and veterans were at the top of my pyramid. You have my utmost respect, but this came across my desk and I sent, I sent him the email. These are the men in the room. And he goes to me, Mr. We're going to have fried chicken and play golf. Do you know what military people told me when you're honorable and you're in the military, and you don't want to lie to somebody, you won't lie to him. You just, you stop talking to him. Doesn't end. Well, John Stewart's anecdotal story, Dr. Michael Sala, XO politics. He goes, give me his info. I'll contact him. Whoa. So Dr. Michael Sala emails him. You know, I was an international negotiator, mediator. Um, you know, um, it is come, you know, speculation that you may have been part of an extraterrestrial program responds to Dr. Sala, a little respect there. Here's a political figure. And he says, I'm just not going to talk about any of that. Doesn't deny it. Yeah. Doesn't tell him go kiss my butt. Just, you know, doesn't respectfully declines. Right. Whoa. That's crazy. Now we go down. Dr. Craig McPherson. Now, this is slightly funny. I go on Wikipedia. I find Dr. Craig McPherson. He is a cardiologist in Connecticut. He's got the bald head, the lab jacket. Craig, I'm like, oh, cardiologist. Remember the bean was coughing. I find out that he was a pulmonologist before being a cardiologist. Lungs. Yeah. The coughing with the VA. So did they pull him off the bench and say, go to us for, I'm calling his office, you know, like a crazy person. Finally, the secretary's like, I will not, you want an appointment for your coughing? You're from Chicago. How did you get a hold of Dr. McPherson's name? I, and you know, and I, and I'm stumbling and she's like, sir, you got a bad alibi. What are you doing? So, um, you gotta, you gotta work on that. You gotta pick that first next time. I'm going to tell you, all right, let's go. A George Casanza story. So a little bit of time goes by and, um, I tell the story on the, on the internet, um, without mentioning all of the names. Um, and somebody says, I think you got the wrong Craig McPherson. Again, internet angel. Sure. Do you know a Linda Molden Howell interviewed a Dr. Craig McPherson who admitted being a scientist, at area 51? Oh, that's the other thing on the list. This person from the DIA didn't even know who McPherson was. He said, Dr. Craig McPherson, scientist, question mark, question mark, question mark. Cause he obviously was looking off of a memo, a report, an investigation memo. Oh my God. I call Linda Molden Howell. She calls me the human fire. Oh, she goes, you have got to slow down. She goes, John, calm down. I gave her the whole story. This is Linda Moulton Howell. She's writing the names down furiously. William Jacoby. She's like, John, you have gold here. This is Linda Howell. You have gold, G-O-L-D here. I'm like, what do you mean? She's like, I've never heard of these men. John, everybody in 30 years has come to me with these retread names of men in the military and they get retread. They're now part of this program or this program. Whether it's real or not, you have new names of men I've never heard of. I am telling you, you have gold. She said, yes. I interviewed Dr. McPherson. It's on the internet. I find it. He said, yes, I was a scientist. Yes, I worked with alien craft, but I didn't work with beings. Why would you be specific about that? I don't know. I got the wrong Craig McPherson, but I finally found the right Craig McPherson. All of these names are jiving. Now I see Robert Donovan, Army Intel. I spent $400 with private investigators, name searches, my own skip trace software from the automobile industry. He's Intel. I don't want to use a line from a few good men, but he is counterintelligence. There is no Colonel Donovan. Colonel Donovan doesn't exist. As far as you being able to search him, I find a Robert Donovan from the Air Force. This guy was in the Army. I call. I'm telling you, these senior citizens were just, just, they just help so much. I call. I leave a message. I like to speak with Colonel Donovan. Finally, the answer machine picks up. Hello. I said, hi, my name is John Surin from Chicago. I'm trying to call Robert Donovan. That's my husband, but you've got the wrong Donovan. I'm like, how do you know? He's like, well, she's like, well, because other people have called here before looking for him. I said, really? And I'm like, I am, I am so sorry. Was your husband in the Army? No, he was in the Air Force. It's got a picture on MySpace. I'm like, okay, that I am, I am really sorry to bother you. And, you know, it sounds like she's on her deathbed and I go to hang up and I hear on the phone. Thank God I didn't hang up. Hyper nut John Stewart. I hear, but I know which one you want. I said, yeah, that Robert Donovan lives on the East Coast, like, you know, like Washington DC East Coast. I hope, I hope you'll click. And I'm like, whoa, still can't find him. I don't want to find him. I spent $400, skip trace, ancestry, private investigator in Chicago. He is no ghost. Now I've been told this will coincide with Victor's name, which we eventually got. Which is, there's two ways to get on Area 51 in the Nellis test and training range. Your real legal name or an approved, authorized, approved and authorized, approved, given name by U.S. Intel, CIA, NSA, DIA. There's only two ways. You can't get on with your gnome to plume, your fake name. It's got to be given to you by an intelligence agency and the credentials, so to speak, to back it up. So I believe that that was a gnome to plume given to this person by U.S. Army, Army Intel. Here we go. A pseudonym. Yeah, pseudonym. Here we go. Go down to the next, next name. Dr. Wilford Webb Wilson. Webb, nickname. Dr. Wilford Webb Wilson. I Google him. Doctor. Dies in 2014. Born in like 29. 29. There's nothing on this guy. How could you be a medical doctor for 50 years, 40 years? There's no, Dr. Wilson hit a hole in one of the country club. He gave away his daughter for marriage. Everything you would find out on the internet. I, the only thing I found on him was a fifth grade pitcher. Okay. Okay. I find his widow and I called her up and she answered. Now, can you imagine calling an 80 year old woman telling her, I think your doc, your husband was a doctor involved with extraterrestrials, but that's exactly what I did. I'm going to call her Kim. She had a short three letter name. Duh. I, what else could you, I'm going to call her Kim. I said, Kim, my name is John Stewart. I'm from Chicago. I'm a documentarian, which I wasn't. I want to ask you something and just don't hang up on me. Just let me, let me say what I have to say. Is there any way possible that your husband, Dr. Wilson, was involved with a secretive government project program out at Area 51? On my right hand to God. And I know, I know that's a perception qualifier, but I like, it's an Italian Chicago thing to do. Johnny, on my right hand to God. She, there's a pause and I'll never forget the line she used. She's like, that's really interesting, John. A light bulb is coming on over my head. And I said, Kim, I don't understand. She said, there was a real bone of contention with Webb and me. She used his nickname. I did not call him by his nickname. And the nickname was on that document. Whoa. Whoa, right. She says, there was a really big bone of contention between Webb and I. It's interesting. She said, whenever we would go out with our friend group, they were from Korea, World War II, Vietnam. They had funny stories about the foxhole or the food at a base or a funny drill sergeant. My husband would never chime in. He would just stand there, sit there quietly. Friends would ask, what did he do? He can't talk about anything. Doesn't want to talk about anything. She said, John, it was such a bone of contention, that verbiage. There was such a bone of contention that it almost caused us a divorce. I would scream at him. What did you do that was so terrible that you can't tell me? And she said, you're solving a family secret. What did he do out there? Oh, my God. I said, well, not only can I tell you what he did, I have the video. I said, Kim, I almost said her real name, Kim, he was a doctor, a medic for a program that retained and interrogated extraterrestrials. I'm sorry. I know this is bizarre and crazy, but this is what came across my desk. I have a video. Can I send it to you? Yes. I said, do you know how to go on YouTube? If I send you the link? She's like, yes, I know how to. I send her the YouTube video. Five minutes later, I call her back. She's like, John, I am. And we blew it up. So you could barely see like D&I was that, you know, because we wanted to see the, can't really see the right medic, but you can make out the face. Sure. We blew it up. She's like, I call her up. I said, John, I can't be a hundred percent sure, but the doctor on our left, that's Webb. I know the bridge of the nose. I know my husband in a medical mask. I've seen, I believe that's my husband. I believe that's my husband. My husband had an anglier, angular face and I'm not a hundred percent, but that looks, that looks like Webb. And I said, I, I, I can't, Pam, I don't know what, I don't, I don't know what to say at this point. I, I, I'm like, um, he never mentioned anything. She's like, no. And I told you we would get in fights that, you know, she goes, and now I know what possibly he, why he kept a secret from me. Funny. Victor says the medical staff at S4 is chosen more for their ability to keep secrets than their medical knowledge. Interesting. Doesn't end. She goes, you live in Chicago. My daughter lives in South suburbs of Chicago. I'm going to give you her name and number. If you ever want to talk to her about her stepfather, here it is. Like, like I'm getting invited to the next family party. Sure. You know, like, not like buzz off crazy guy. Don't ever call me. Don't ever call me again. I have tried to get ahold of this person, her daughter. She has not returned my emails or my phone calls. I'm going to have to go to her townhouse. It's by an auto auction that I go to him. It's going to have to knock on the door. I've done this before, but that is happening. Um, and she doesn't have a Facebook where I can see if she had pictures maybe of her stepdad. That would, this would be very, very helpful. And I am afraid to go back to the widow. Cause like, it's almost like it didn't happen. Yeah. Does that make sense? Like you don't want the bubble to be burst. I don't want her to say, I never told you. She did tell me this. She told me everything, but, and I don't want to go back in case we have to have to film this again for a docu series. It could be fresh, but that story is 1000% told me how secretive he was. I know Carthusian monk two. Yes. We're now in the Da Vinci code and I'm like, okay, okay, here we go. Carthusian monk. Now I Google Carthusian monk. The sect, the religious sect, Christian sect there, is the Carthusian order. Okay. And they are monks. Take a kind of a vow of silence and poverty and so on and so forth. I am going to jump ahead to let you know what we found out. I have the picture of this, of this one monk who was an alleged thought projection interviewee. Oh, so they were the psychics. So an investigator of eyes actually went there, made contact and talked with him. He's old. We call him brother Tom. Some, some of us call him brother Patrick. Some of us, my investigation cohorts. And he's 91 years old. He said that. Did you get this on film? No, we couldn't film. And I know. Okay. You can't take a camera into the car, the charter house. They basically take a vow of silence. What he said was that remote viewers with the NSA were getting, we're getting this vibe, remote viewing of a white building in the far upper East coast where members there had the gift telepathic gift or whatnot. Wait. So these Carthusian monks were found by remote viewers. And I want to know if this was done in the sixties, would one of those remote viewers be Joe McNagle? McMonagle. McMonagle. Come on. How many could there have been back in the sixties? I mean, potentially. Potentially. So, so that, that, that would be a great interview. He said that they found out that we had the gift. There was a total of six monks that they used. Do you think he said right away, we went right to us for primarily used in what, what was the, um, the ally side of Germany, the West? Yeah. East Berlin was the communist that they were used for counterintelligence vetting or, um, um, in, in analyzing whether a, someone was telling the government, the truth, a mole, an agent, counterintel, you name it, um, where documents were, where this person was, is this person leaking? If all kinds of counterintelligence, um, work he, he, and these, these men were used in West Germany by the government. He said then, um, in the eighties, they were, some of them were brought to S4 and were, uh, were, um, asked to do thought projection interviews with these beings. And he said that him, he said that him and another monk were very adept. He said that he would sit down and he was talking about the, his, his, his, his, and he said this to researcher friends of yours, one of our investigators, one of your, not a somebody, one of our investigators. Okay. And he, and I'm getting the stories third hand. And he said that he, his, the other monk was so good that he would sit down. He would start going like this to the general. Okay. You know, that object you're looking at in the Indian ocean, he said that it's a, it's not that deep and that he was, he was, our monk was good. This guy was like a savant. Next level. One of the only things that he was willing to talk about was how difficult it was to, to relay or transfer back and forth. Basic technical ideas. He said that it took a couple of days to, I know this is going to sound crazy, but to, to, to describe how human beings live in our time, seconds, minutes, days, the being did not understand that. And the monk said that they finally figured out that, that this type of sequence, that they measure time in their experiences layered on top of each other. Wow. I don't even know what I'm saying, but this is what was told to us. And he was willing to, to relieve, relive that, um, that piece of information and how frustrating it was for him, you know, to, to, um, to translate, to translate basic concepts, um, of time, um, of, of, of, of, of other things too, because they couldn't, they were not verbal. The beings were not, were not verbal. And that, and that's, and we've, we got a picture of him. I spent a year, um, negotiating with the family for a lot, to allow us to release it. We finally got them to allow us to do an artist sketch of the photo. He looks like an 80s Philadelphia gym, high school teacher with the 80s, big glasses. He's got one tooth longer than the big tooth. He's got the monk cast on. He looks like he's in a Catholic school gymnasium background, you know, with the, with the laminate, with the plywood, you know, with the, you know, the mahogany plywood. And he was a, he was a communicator for the aliens. Thought projection communicator for the, for the beings. Oh my God. Yeah. Time sequence. And so he's, he's passed now? Still living. He's 91. No way. Our investigator went there six months ago. Here's another bizarre story. Wait, this, hold on. He's 91 years old and he knows he's, that he's. Put it apart for us. Hold on for a second here. Go ahead. Cause I have something else to tell you that's. You're telling me there's a guy a few hours south of here that's living in a monastery. The Charterhouse Transformational Monastery in Mount Equinox, Vermont. Yes. And, and, and I can, can I go there? They're not going to let you talk to him. Why? I don't, well, because they all take a vow of silence. They, you know, that's very, you should go. I'm not stopping anyone. I'll take a vow of silence. Whoa. Vow of silence. Which is interesting too. I just made that connection because the lack of sound and the lack of speaking might heighten the telepathic senses. What if that Joe McNagle said that he was the guy that outed him? I'm going to, I'm going to ask Joe. You have to. But I also want to take a road trip to Vermont. That's right. And I've shown the picture of him in my documentary. I just showed it on X. I'll give it to you again. Can I tell you? Another bizarre thing about this. You should go to verify this. My investigator says, strangest thing. This is a Christian. Monastery, there were two state troopers kind of guarding the grounds in two white pickup trucks. Where else do we see white pickup trucks? I am not saying this to make an Area 50. I am just saying. Broncos. Would you use the discretion and the funds of the military intelligence apparatus to hire Wackenhut, the same security at Area 51? Would you use the same security to guard the perimeter of this monastery? I don't know. I just find it interesting that state police were there, Vermont State Police, and two white pickup trucks were there, too. How fun for them that the people who know the most took a vow of silence. It's also maybe- Well, I'm sure they talked to intelligence about what the being- Do you know what I mean? But they're like, hey, let's get these guys. Not only are they perfect telepaths because of their vow of silence, but they also won't say, and again, I'm like, how did a monk get to- Because Victor says the telepath program was a joke. Yeah. They were hiring people that were 1-800-psychics, practically. Well, yeah. Again, when you are desperate. No, but that was part of the program initially with not only Stargate, but Center Lane and Sunstreak and Grill Flame. They went through a list of natural psychics before they started training the army to do it. But I'm harkering, harkering, harkering. Back to Bob Lazar. When you are desperate and you are the government and you need this information, you're going to do desperate things. You're going to hire a Bob Lazar. You're going to hire a Stan Dale. You're going to hire a Dan Burrish that all have sketchy educational backgrounds. You're going to take a roll of the dice. One of the psychics was a telepath, was a farmer that conned almost the government. He was only in this program. This was told to me by the other. By the widow of the other S4 telepath that they, that they shoot him out. There was a lot of in and out of charlatans, basically. Wow. And, and so when you're desperate, you're thinking out of the box, you're going to make desperate moves. And, and I think that's what Victor's alluding to with hiring these. Yeah. And time might have been the essence too. Victor called it 1-800-psychics. Right. Now, now Victor comes back in 08 and says, we finally figured out what the aliens were telling us and it ain't good. And that's when Victor, I think this is scary, says to the documentary crew in 08, don't plan on any 20th anniversary of this documentary. I might not be here, but I know you're not going to be here. 20 years from 08 is, what would that be? Almost 2027. Oh my God. Whoa. 08, an alleged whistleblower from S4 says, don't plan on a 20th anniversary. Yeah. Not a 30th. Which is. Which is 20, 27. That is, yeah, that's, that's, and you know. Do you need like, do you need like a Pepto-Bismol, a Naloxone? No, there's a lot of just. Headache pills. There's a lot of information in my head right now. You know, obviously I shared with you, and this is something that I'm, I don't, I don't know in what order this will go out, if this podcast will go out first or the other one, but we did have a gentleman here who had received some messages. And telepathically, which once decoded, talked about some imminent invasion as well, or some imminent threat to this planet, you know, and which coming from like the Zeta star system, also the same system that Bob Lazar was briefed on, which was also at S4, which might be these beings, like it all kind of ties in perfectly and neatly. And, you know, when something's tied in that neatly, it's either one by design or two. I mean, that's just the way it is, you know. Thank you. So now, I mean, this is obviously super, super interesting, you know, hearing about all these people that I didn't think were even, would even be possible to get their names, you know, because they're just shadowy figures. And then you intercept this email that drops all these names. You're following up on everything. I got to say, John, you are pretty thorough and hats off to you for, you know, putting in the legwork. I don't think a lot of people realize that when they, you know, you're very vocal on X. And sometimes, you know, my apologies, maybe to a fault. I think, I think a lot of people get put off by your personality because they're not, they don't have that gumption to do the work, you know. So it's surprising. It catches people off guard, you know, because you don't see that in a lot of today's generation. You just don't see that. Right. So. As Ralph Blumenthal from New York Times went, you got out of your car and knocked on his door. I said, this is all the president's men, you know, Robert Redford. And, and yeah, I'm like, yes. Yeah. You're, exactly. You're, you're, you're Denzel Washington in Man on Fire or whatever. So yeah, hats off to, to putting in the legwork. Yeah, definitely. And I think that that needs to be duly noted. Thank you. For anyone. For anyone thinking this is like lazy journalism or, you know, anecdotal, be that as it may, anecdotal evidence is still valuable in my opinion. And the fact that you went out there and did all this work might lead to a breakthrough and that's really, really, really great. So yeah. Thank you for doing all this work. You're welcome. All right. Let's go. Well, I'm going to tell you something that I've never stated publicly as I go into this story. And I'm not saying this to be. Sorry. Can I cut you off? Sure. If you hear anything, there is. There's like a parade going on out here for like Christmas or something. I don't know, but they're loud. You might not even pick it up in the edits. We might, you know, use some AI to whatever, but if you do that, it's rest assured, it's none of this. And it's not me. You know, my wife would say, my wife would say, well, of course there's a parade right outside. You got Jon Stewart here. Yeah. You know, what can go wrong is going to go wrong. All right, let's go. No. So what I'm about to say, I've never said publicly and you deserve that because, you know, I really respect your show and bring. I really appreciate. And I'm not saying this to hype up the drama. I think this story, this very quick part of the story should be told because I think it gives a little bit of it. It adds this tone of this is no longer, you know, happy-go-lucky former pro wrestler, car dealer, you know, going to find an alien. Improving alien video. And I was wrong, but my, but the, the mentality that I had, um, what I'm about to tell you was very real to me and other people were feeding this beware. So, um, and so I just want to say that I don't want people to think, oh, he's told the story for, no, I'm not, I want to be completely and utterly honest and how, how kind of scary things did get for me at times. So I have all this information, what I've just told you, the names, the phone calls. I said, I think I have enough legs to take this to Ralph Blumenthal and Leslie Keen of the New York times who, who were stringers, you know, part-time reporters, um, who could submit stories. Ralph certainly was full-time at one time. They broke the 17 Lou Elizondo, a tip story. And I emailed Ralph and he put me in contact with Leslie Keen. And, um, they were, uh, much to my amazement, they were impressed enough where they agreed to meet with me at the Midtown Hilton in Manhattan. I got a meeting. And so I am telling some UFO luminaries and, and whatnot, and some of my, uh, investigators or helpers who are all like, you're going to meet Leslie Keen. In New York, you, you know, Leslie is, I'm like, no, I, I don't. And I don't mean to be, I am not being derogatory at all. I am just telling you the story. Nothing happened, but I, I want to tell the story because this story is about me too. And I don't mean ego me, but you know, I'm the, the doofus that's trying to figure this out. And they're telling me she's with Intel. And if she's not with Intel, they're following her. They monitor her. She leaks stuff to them. So they leak stuff to her and it's kind of a symbiotic relationship. And you're going to go meet Leslie Keen because you can give her the names of that video and you can expose those. You're fricking nuts. And they worked on me. My own people worked on me so much that I literally cased the Hilton for an hour eating a pita sandwich on the corner to see if anybody was, you know, if this thing. Yeah. The hotel was being monitored, stalked. And I actually went, when I got into my room, it, my, my mentality, you know, this is my Paul Benowitz breakdown scene for, you know, that happens for a little bit. My, the scenario. And I took a wet towel and I put it underneath the door. I didn't know, do they have smoke that could, I don't know. My mind was, was racing. And, um, and of course nothing happened. And Leslie could not have been nicer. And her and Ralph show up with COVID. Mas on, they look like a Thelma in Ned from a Tomah, Iowa walking in the midtown. I'm like, I'm worried about getting a, a sandwich. fascinated. But that was one of the lowest parts of the investigation. They have that feeling like, do you think this is a game? Men have been killed to protect this secret, this secret that you're trying to expose. And not only the secret, you're going to, if they did the story, you're going to have Lowell Jacoby's name in the New York Times. Are you freaking mind? So that's how scary it got for me. And I never told that story. And of course, I don't indict Leslie for anything. Later on, I will tell a story about her. And Ralph and Leslie, we spent three hours, we had lunch. And in about an hour and a half into it, Ralph was like, stop. We believe you. You got enough for us to take to the science editor. That's the process. Something like this. Aliens, take to the science editor. If one, you can do one thing. Get somebody in uniform, get somebody with the government to come forward to say, we have craft, we have a retention program. And I'm like, never going to happen. This is not going to, you know, we parted peacefully and happily. And they were very kind to me. They were, Leslie was going to go fake an illness to go to this cardiologist in Connecticut before we knew he was Craig McPherson. I mean, they were into it. I mean, Ralph, and I remember one time Ralph was sitting there like this, like plotting. How to help me disseminate, break down this story. It's a big story. Big story. And so, um, four months later, my wife said, you got to come downstairs. This guy's on Congress testifying that we have, they have pilots and there's David Grush. And I'm going, holy shit. I'm going to, I'm going to be this story. My story is going to be in the New York Times. And, and I, to this day, don't know why Ralph and Leslie did not at least broach this to say, we have got a, you know, uh, uh, an officer with the air force telling you that we've got pilots craft. There's reverse engineering with the craft, our pilots, this might be a pilot. And I think it goes back to a lot. Yeah. Unable to metabolize this. Yeah, sure. David Grush didn't say that video is real. And that is my quest right now is to find someone just got out, is in the military, somebody from the agent of disclosure to look at that video and say, that's fake. This is why, or that's real. And, and, and this is, and this is why, but that's was a very low turning point in my life when I was so afraid and paranoid that I thought somebody was going to do harm to me. I then get Scott Walter of American Unearthed. It's a great story. He's like, I've been communicating with this agent from the National Air and Space Intelligence Center at Wright-Patt. Have you ever heard of this? No. Yeah. And, um, we vetted him. He's legit. He showed us all our credentials. Like, Scott, you got to put me in contact. This is the guy that will, you know, cause he wants disclosure, this, this guy. And he calls himself Holden from Catcher, Catch 22. Somebody almost ordered him five years ago, got his picture. But so after about six months, I finally get a hold, right before Thanksgiving, I get a hold of this secret agent from the, a Wright-Patt National Air and Space Intelligence Center. Very polite, very intelligent, nicest guy in the world. I just want to say, Chris, every military intelligence person that I've ever spoke with, I, the government hires some really quality people. I'm complimenting the government. It's very nice, polite. And it's part of, it's part of the trade craft. So I finally, after, I, I'm an expert at it. I do things in seconds and minutes, but the stock market, the car business, I'm not good at waiting. And, but I did. So I finally get a hold of him. We finally talked a couple of days before Thanksgiving. And, um, he said, well, I, you know, I can't tell you everything. And he, I said, you've seen the video. He goes, I have. I said, you told Scott, Walter, that it was real. He said, I did. He said, I just want to let you know that the government does have a black, you know, ops magic department. Um, they had one on the West coast at lookout mountain, I believe in the sixties for their missile testing. This is not uncommon for the government to leak something, but recreate it. So they're not violating national security. They're not violating this deep secret. So they can say, we, we try, to tell you, we tried to show you this. And just like Greer, um, as Holden said, just don't be saddened. If that does become the case. Um, he said, they'll even get actors to look like that military person that should have been there at that time. He said, they're very, very, very elaborate. He goes, but that being looks awfully authentic to me. He's like, I just want to tell you a couple of things about him. The, the, the film on the eye, that is a light deflector. And it is a biofilm. It's a biological, it's not, you know, cellular, you know, or it's an actual biomaterial. It does come off. And that's something I can tell you goes, but I, I, you know, Scott said, you're a good guy. I want to tell you something that I haven't even told Scott. And I'm like, okay, what is he goes? And I will tell you, he goes, if you want to make a general drinking his coffee in the morning, spit up, tell him this. The new designation, this was three years ago. The new designation of aliens is saber. He's like, yes, saber. He goes, now he was telling me this. Now this is what astrobiological this, this I'm not getting melodramatic here, but this was, um, he was helping me getting in with other Intel people. Like I know things to let me into your circle, let me into the clubhouse. He was giving me this hyperbolic, um, acronym that to this day, I've never found on. I'm the only one that has ever said this. So he must've been true that this was a new designation, synthetic astrobiological extraterrestrial races, saber. He goes, I am telling you, you mentioned that you mentioned that at a Starbucks in Georgetown and a two-star general is there. He's going to do the spit take. I said, I said, I said, um, I really appreciate it. I said, but Ralph and Leslie of the New York times, I need you on camera to tell me this program is real. He said, I'd be willing to do it, but you got to get it past my commanding officer. I have put this on Reddit. I've put this on my, uh, on, on, on other platforms. I developed a list of questions for him. So explosive, so hyperbolic, but if I was going to interview him, I wanted to get the truth. I agreed in this form to his commanding officer that he would be silhouetted. We could voice the sort of just like Victor, but nonetheless, I had to get answers to these questions. When was the first contact with extraterrestrials? Was it before the 1800s? Does the United States government in their possession, any, any, type of biological being off planet, interstellar, interdimensional, um, uh, any, any of the type living or deceased? What are some of the facilities housing these beings? If they have these beans, I mean, explosive. I gave it, sent it to his commanding officer at Wright Patton. He gave me a code for his commanding officer. Now I'm in the military, you know, like, and I still don't, it was like an, an, an acronym and the fax number. Okay. A week, two weeks, three weeks. I email him. We were emailing each other on signal. I call Scott Walter. I'm like, dude, have you heard from old? And he's like, no, I haven't. I'm like, he hasn't said, John, he's always doing something. Take, it's going to take some time. Six weeks go by five, seven weeks go by. I'm like, Scott, am I in trouble here? This is really starting to freak me out. This guy was calling me. He has not returned. My email after this explosive thing, Scott's like, just please just bear with us about about two months go by. And I finally said to Scott, I'm sorry, this is ridiculous. I need to know if, and I am texting this Holden. Am I in trouble? What, why won't you just tell me, go fly a kite, buzz off or whatnot. Scott go, I agree. This is ridiculous. He said he would try and help you. I'm going to call him. About an a half hour after Scott Walter told me this, I get, this is this happy, kind, genteel person from the NAISC who is nicer than nice. I get this text and you could just tell that somebody was standing over him. You're going to write this and you better write this. Don't ever contact me again. You are to destroy all of our communications. You are to destroy your notes of our communications. I am denying anything that I told you about anything to do um with extraterrestrials or the program i know i have no knowledge of this program or no authority to tell you anything um and you because of your foyer request i never told him i did crazy foyer requests of the dan burris documents to the dia i never told him this chris and because of your foyer request you are now on a special watch list of the dod boom whoa and i was like oh this nice you know nice chris ramsey is all of a sudden is like i'm like you could just tell yeah he's somebody somebody forced his hand exactly and um so wow yeah so uh you know i knew that when was this how how many years ago 20 well it was right 23 i ralph and leslie was august when did grush come forward 23 23 of of i so ralph and leslie was august so this was thanksgiving ish 2023 and when i got that my hand was shaking i'm like how does he know that i did a foyer request i did one from the to the department of defense asking for colin powell's travel schedule at this time of this filming okay and i sent one to the dia asking and i want to talk about this about the q 94 109 a document that dan burris brought forward of the extraction of tissue with the with the pressurized gun because of the the neuropathy that j rod had i sent that i want all the information for this document now i contacted richard doughty and doughty said do you realize what you sent the dia he goes i don't know what if that document is real but that is a code doughty said john every area at s4 at the nellis test and training range has a designation an alpha an alpha designation romeo quebec um delta bravo he goes q is the section of s4 uh 94 is the year that this document was created and 109 is the you know obviously some kind of department cataloging or whatever number this document doughty goes you sent that to the dia and he's i said yeah he goes give me a give me a few days doughty calls me back and he said uh we got a little bit of an issue he goes i'm talking to somebody at dni he's a friend of mine at the dia um about other things and i said you don't happen to know john stewart and and and uh rick said i i said uh rick asked him you don't happen to know john stewart and rick said john just calm down he said the guy went oh we know john stewart very well his foyer request sent trip this quote trip flares up in our agency he goes rick this guy is sending us stuff that we don't we've never even we've never even had to um to look for this is like a first time ever what he sent us he wouldn't tell rick what i what i sent them now after this interaction i call the dia i am friends with cheryl cross robinson who is a friend of mine who is a was head of information of dia it's ray it's uncle john how you doing you know she's like oh i have the stories of you with you're the alien guy it was that informal but i get this guy named andrew on the phone i said i sent a foyer request a couple of months ago i have not heard anything about it he said okay what's your name john stewart and he went hmm and i get this i've gotten this a lot he goes well this is strange i said what's what's the problem he said um your name is on our file logging system but there's no file attached to your name i said what's the problem with that he doesn't know i could be asking about yeah sure an antenna relay at s4 or area 51 again doesn't know what i'm talking about he goes well you can't get on this files foyer file system this is andrew at the dia foiled foyer department without having a file attached somebody had to come in and remove it this was said to me i said okay he goes let me do some digging for you i'll find out what happened he goes i don't know how this happened you you have to have a file somebody removed it for whatever reason i get a call back in about 30 minutes now it's like cold and mr stewart yeah this is andrew the dia hi what's going on yeah so uh you know um we found your request you're going to get an email um from the information officer and then you're going to get a hard copy and uh and that and that's that's the end of it and that's you know i said well who's who took my file off he said i don't know he goes but this is what i've been told and you're going to get the information you're getting an email in a few minutes i get this email from the dia but in the the body of the email says due to the unique nature of your foyer request we are going to have to conduct interdepartmental conferences and meetings to discuss the way we are going to disseminate this information to you like like they're gonna you know the the dia is going to go over to the nsa to the dod and they're going to be around a conference room with bagels and coffee talking about me and my crazy request and um and and you know you know you're treading on this water of like jesus is the rug going to be pulled out am i really poking um the nest the the hornet's nest you know am i getting myself into into trouble and everybody wants to talk about rick dode rick has told me nothing about this film and he's either protecting victor or protecting the entire program yes he said look i know we have an extraterrestrial retention and interrogation problem he goes john that is the unofficial name of it i can tell you that he goes but i was never down at the third and fourth level a counterintelligence is he telling you he wasn't somewhere and dodie dodie one thing i i i i respect and can tell about dodie is same with victor there is reticence and um um i i want to get you the right the right um i had it somewhere perception receptors which is dodie has never said to me look i'm going to tell you honestly we have an alien program victor um i'm not going to lie to you yes this was a real alien those are perception recept that people that liars use those pre-qualifiers dodie and victor have never never said that if anything richard dodie and victor have been reticent i don't know i'm not sure i wasn't briefed in on that i can't tell you those according to the fbi agent and to the reed school police officers is hallmarks of someone telling you the truth which we taught you and i talked off camera truth tellers are they they limit their information it's what are you asking me i will tell you there's no more there's no drama to it they don't um they don't flourish they don't sure they don't build upon information to convince you that that that it's that it's truth and that that is something that i was very impressed with richard dodie what he didn't tell me that he did not know whether that was true that's yeah that's a that's a hot topic you know richard dodie in this space because anybody whether it's william moore richard dodie or even you know as recent as lou alessandro anytime you're involved with counterintelligence the red flags uh you know and and skepticism about these people's uh you know agendas start popping up but what do you do when i tell you a counterintelligence agent tells you i don't know right no that's help me no this is this is not an interview this is a dialogue yeah i don't know what to do with that no yeah i i is that is that another counterintelligence aspect potentially you don't know then that sounds like but i mean potentially i don't know you know that's the keeping and keeping an open mind to all of that is definitely the way to go and just kind of all right i want to i want to talk about this for a second okay um you know you would tweet it out that there's two things you can't talk about all right and and i'm gonna i'm gonna push you a little bit on this sure um you said one of the two things you can't talk about was um some timeline manipulation or something to that effect the future yeah um what i gathered was project looking glass why did you have to say that am i not allowed to say that is that is that something no you said it i didn't say it i said i i have no idea what you're talking about okay it's what i gathered and uh the and and the second thing was other species correct other species of aliens specifically or non-human intelligence correct um you had said and and i think this is your words my intelligence handlers now of course i'm poking people out there oh i knew he's cia well they're all cia people they're all cia people they're all cia people my advisors okay helpers is richard dodie one of those helpers well he's part of the one of the 11 okay well wait a minute well i'm asking i'm trying to you're giving i'm trying to give i had seven it went to nine i have 11 okay is richard dodie someone i call for what does this mean what does that mean richard dodie was he the one to tell you not to talk about these things oh absolutely not okay that's that's what i want to know thank you um absolutely not The person telling you this is one person? One person and another person backed up what he said. Oh, okay. Is this person active intelligence? Okay, so former intelligence. Correct. Okay. I think. Which department? I'm not going to say that. Okay. Come on. Well, I'm going to ask anyways. Go ahead. I'm not going to interrupt you. John Ramirez? Don't know. Never spoke with John Ramirez in my life. I know who he is. Okay. Seems like a nice guy. Never spoke to him in my life. Never spoke to him in your life. Hand to God. I never spoke with John Ramirez ever. Okay. Like to. All right. John. He's great. I'd like to. He's very nice. He's very friendly and very open. I actually like John a lot. Well, I'm going to tell you something here. With talking about the future, timelines, that is bringing me into, this is my opinion, that is bringing me into, talking about technology. I am alive today, in my opinion, without getting melodramatic. I think I am alive today. That the stalking has only been with my phone from the government because I have no idea and have never talked about and never given, please listen to me, anything to do with technology. That is all that the East Coast intelligence agencies care about at this point. Mm-hmm. Who has technology? Will they give it to our enemies? Do they know something we don't? And John Stewart has, all my emails, they must have said, this guy is talking about gray. But specifically. So that is keeping me safe. Yeah, but time travel is a concept. I didn't say time travel. You did. Sure. I said future. Okay. Future, Looking Glass, time travel. Oh, God, you said it again? Well, I mean, because Project Looking Glass was one of the three projects that Bob Lazar, was briefed on. He was briefed on Looking Glass, Sidekick, and Galileo. Sidekick being, you know, weaponizing the technology, Galileo, the propulsion, and Looking Glass, the manipulation or possibly the dilation of time in order to peer into the future, the past, some other timeline, whatever it is. Now, what do you know about Looking Glass that they don't want you to talk about? Or is it they just don't want you to say the word? Are you kidding me? Well, I'm. Like, do you know anything? No. No. Well, then why would they be so afraid? Well, I was going to explain. Okay. Two things. This is my opinion. I think that these little tests or these little, like, requests is more about can this guy keep his mouth shut? Even something innocuous. Even something that maybe isn't even a big deal. I don't know if that. I don't know if that program you talked about. Right. I'm just saying. Okay. Can Jon Stewart keep his mouth shut? You tweeted it. I didn't tweet that name, did I? Well, you pretty much. You, like, bleeped out a few letters. I mean, I mean. But I didn't tweet that name. I'm no king of Wheel of Fortune, but I mean. But I've never talked about it at great length. No. Right. You didn't, in fact, even prior to this, you didn't mention it. Right. I was the one to bring it up because I read the tweet. And the tweet is, you know, it definitely points to that. And I remember the day it happened. It was, don't ever ask about it. I can guarantee it. And I have done exactly that. And I find it funny. Yes, I come off as a very easygoing, funny guy, Italian from Chicago. You know, and I, but I believe that those who want to leak things and want disclosure and drip, drip and find nudge nicks like me, I believe that there are certain, that there is a, if you mention my name in certain groups and intelligence factions of non-retired and current people in intelligence, it is my opinion that it's the good guy, John Stewart, good guy. But you can trust him. I am trustworthy. Tell me something, I'm going to put it in the vault. I can't believe it. I respect that. Because I am a, I am a, how I kept our, you told me not to bleep, talk about me coming on here, how I kept that. But, but I've been, I've been, I'm, I've gotten good at not saying it and respecting people. I appreciate that, you know, and I will pry and feel free to continue to, to, to not talk about it. But I have to ask about it. I understand. So the idea, if someone came to me and said, don't talk about these two things, right? Don't talk about this one thing we'll call this project. And then don't talk about other species other than the greys and you'll be safe. Like this. Direct quote. So, oh, direct quote. Okay. So this to me doesn't tell me that, this to me tells me that there, there's a narrative forming and that, that they want you to uphold the narrative. Absolutely. Yeah. And it tells me that, and it tells me that the narrative. Are you being handled? Yes. To some degree, of course. Well, it tells me that the narrative is A, obviously looking glass is important. Sorry. Jesus Christmas. All right. And B, that, I mean, I don't know what to make of the other one. I just, I just find it. Whether it's, whether it's them trying to create, you know, this distance between us and the species physically because, you know, the such a massive difference, but in reality, you know, does, is it because the other species are like us, you know, is it because that's what's happening and that's what they want to cover is like the fact that they're here. They're like us. They look like us. They're around. Or is it the fact that they're like bugs and they're, they're, you know, strange looking like what's the, what do you think is the reason? Okay. We won't even talk about the other species. What do you think is the reason for, for them not wanting you to talk about them? And I'll bleep out every looking glass that I put in this podcast. If you like, whatever you want to do. I believe that. Um, sticking with the grays that it's possible that because they are, um, potentially a biological Android and maybe not as sentient as we like to think they are. They're part machine part, biological makeup that they are, um, uh, less of a, less of a visual and perceived threat. If that makes sense, you know, it's, it's sending out the, what's more scary. Your Doberman pincher. I think this I'm coming on a good analogy here or metaphor. Your Doberman pincher or your Roomba vacuum cleaner. Right. I'm just saying the Roomba vacuum cleaner is it's a mechanical piece. Right. You're saying, you're saying it's an easier pill to swallow. I, I believe so. I think, I, I think that even. Well, that would only be true if the aliens were looked absolutely hideous like bugs, but not if they look like us. Right. I, I look, I, I, I'm just simple. I'm simply telling you what I was instructed to do. Were you ever given information on any other species? Oh, that's a good question. Um, no. Okay. And I, and I'm telling you that. No, I believe you. Yeah. No, I've, I've never asked. I, I've, I've been Victor, Victor, Victor, alien, alien, tan alien, round eyes, you know. What's the, uh. I mean, I've heard things about greys, other greys and whatnot, you know, that some have, um, um, some have sexual appendages. Yeah, some don't. Some don't. Some taller, shorter. Right. Four and a half feet to three feet. Yeah. Wrap around almond eyes. Hybrids. Gray, blue, light tan, um, peanut butter. Yeah. Um. Peanut butter? Peanut butter color. That was Linda Howell. Um, uh, a dark, real, real dark, ruddy brown. Yeah. Um, yeah. So I, I've heard a mixture of, uh, of, of a lot of, uh, about the greys. But we don't want to talk about Nordics. We don't want to talk about. I'm not. And I don't know anything about them. So that's so strange to me that like they would. Well, Chris, if I'm going to, it's 1975 and I want to expose the pro wrestling industry as fake. And I'm, I've just found this referee that's willing to do it. I am going to give him tests. I'm going to give him pre qualifiers. I'm going to see if he can follow the, the, the, the line, if he's trustworthy and can we. Don't you believe that you. Because my intelligence. Right. My intelligence cohort has added. It is not diminished. Despite pissing off some people from the. Well, to your knowledge. Right. Did I just say that? I mean, just to your knowledge as well. You don't know. You know, because like, obviously, you know, you've ruffled feathers. Oh God. Maybe even more than ruffled feathers, but you've caused a stir enough for you to probably breach that barrier of being technologically monitored to being infiltrated. You know, like that's how I see it. I see it as like, not only are your phones and emails tapped at this point, you've breached a new level where we're going to send somebody into your life. That's going to befriend you. That's going to be the nicest person you've ever talked to. That'll, you know, meet your family that you'll bring home for Thanksgiving and that'll go golfing with. And before you know it, you know, they've got their claws in you. They've got their hooks in you. And now they're telling you what to say and what not to say. Like, I mean, that to me would be concerning if that happened to me, I would be, I would be very concerned. But other than the chairman, he is the, um, how can I put this? Oh, I'm not, I'm not going to even say it. I understand what you're saying. And so knowing that. But like I contacted Dodie, my wife did actually on Facebook. Okay. That's fine. So I'm not referring to this other gentleman. I was going to finish my, like most of my intel I have contacted or I have, um, asked for that person to contact me. From another person, you know, from another Intel person. So nobody in your circle has contacted you out of the blue. Well, the chairman did. Okay. My biggest leaker. Yeah. But look what he gave me. He gave me an email from his friend. I mean. I, I agree. Yeah. No, for sure. Um, yeah, it's, it's, it's, yeah. And his friends, his friend wrote his first name on the bottom and said, please don't associate my name with this material. Like, like I would tell you, I'm just saying. So the chairman is really the only person that is, emailed me out of the blue and what did he email me? Gold. But, um. But I understand what you're saying. It is concerning. And, and, and if somebody told me what I could and couldn't talk about, I mean, that would bug the shit out of me. I knew it was a, I knew it was a test, so to speak. How can we trust this guy? So now do you think you've broken that trust? I didn't say anything about any future projects or programs or you did. So you don't know anything about those? I, I really don't. All I can say is one thing. I, I, I, uh, why? Okay. Well, do you really want the entire world to know how to go into the future to see if their kid dies at 10 or their, their wife, um, cheats on them with somebody at work or, um, that they're going to get ruined in this? Do you really want the entire world to have this technology of looking into the future? And that's your answer of why. Two intelligence assets have kept me completely. Completely away from that subject matter. Is that what they told you? No. Do I want the military industrial complex making that decision for me? That's the other question. I think there, look, you're going to not like this answer, but you, you have no idea what it's like to run the entire world or be president of the United States. You don't know what it's like to think for 350 million people. I don't either. Um, that's, that's definitely true. And, and, and, you know, if, if, um, and I think, that is 90% of this draconian, I don't use that. I know I use that word a lot. The draconian, um, structure that is oppressing this secret is we don't, we cannot let it get into our enemy's hands because if it does, God, God help the fate of the world. We know right now, and I'm, and, and I want to finish my entire speech with this, but right now, the most important, the most important question and the most important phenomenon in the history of the world resides in a country that is run at least part and parcel by democracy. Right. Thank God. But they are also someone's enemy. I understand that. You know, if I was in another country and my enemy was America, I would also be saying the same thing. Do I want America having this in their hands? Like who's to say that we're better So it's a race to the top of the baseball bat, like when we were in grade school. Yeah. It's just, it's just, um, I, I, I suppose. And that's how scary the technology must be that they have that if this gets with any other country, who is nefarious, who does not have good intentions or can rule the world. I, I agree. I agree. Fundamentally, I do agree that there are national security risks to a lot of this information. Um, I suppose I just want to know if any of it is real. Right. And, and that's it, right? I'm not looking to reverse engineer a time machine. I'm, I, I'm not that smart and I, and I, I don't know anybody who is, but I do, you know, if, if, if you're not going to meet me halfway and be like, here are the crafts or we have crafts or we have, if you're not going to meet me halfway, well, then we're all just going to keep digging until we find something sensitive. Right. And when I find, and when I find something sensitive, like a project name and they're like, don't talk about that. Guess what I'm talking about? I'm talking about the project name because I want them to at least acknowledge something, give us something, let us know something. I understand that. They never said none of my friends can talk about it or admonish anyone. Me. Yeah. John Stewart. Now is that stay on mission, stay on point, don't touch something. Maybe it is something very delicate. What's the, what's the end game? The future. What's for you? What's the end game with, with these, with these people? The end game is for somebody in the fricking government or a former military person to stand up and say, this, this is this doctor, this is this doctor, this is the facility, facility was at. This is real. I know this is real. I know where this body is and stop laughing at John Stewart or not laughing. We're going to give John Stewart the truth. Noble. And I respect that. But if I were them, I would see how long I could keep stringing you on. Probably. I would just keep drip feeding you random stuff and keep telling you what to say. But everything they drip feed me comes to fruition or is. Yep. And that's how that works. Right. Why would I want to stop that? Because it's to gain trust. Well, because you're never, I don't think, I don't think these people willingly. Never give anything up. That's a value. I think. You may be right. I think you're, you know, when you're, when you're playing with these, with these people, they are also just taking orders. There's also like, there's probably a case file on you right now, like with, you know, what, what to give you next and what to, you know, and, and that would bug me. But I guess if you have no other choice, because where else are we going to get this info? Could it be 11 intelligence, former operatives and contractors that want disclosure and are very careful about what they're doing? What they tell me is that, can't that be the narrative also? Possibly. Possibly for sure. You know, definitely. But they are intelligence agencies. You know, they are smart. They do, you know. Yeah. It's. And they have a lot of power. You're right. And they, they can be very protective. Yeah. I suppose. And that bothers me because that, you know, that is a, is a, an obfuscation brought on by, you know, my, my due diligence and my, you know, my, my honoring. My security ulse. And well, then you should have never called me in the first place. Yeah. You know what I'm saying? Yeah. No, I agree. I should never picked up the phone when I, or never returned my email, you know, go away, kid. That's the murky water of the UFO scape anyways, is like, you know, on one side, the argument can be made. Oh, it's all this, but the equal and opposite argument exists as well, constantly. And that somewhere in between lies a PSYOP and like, you know. I mean, you've got a guy like John Lear saying, oh, they put that into John Stewart's head in 2019. Yeah. Start researching this bullshit. Yeah. I'm a type A alpha male. You know, I, I want to hunt. I want to aggressive. And this, this thing about this film bothered me. And I did this on my own. There wasn't any intelligence person. And you got Carrie Cassidy from Project Camelot. That'll tell anybody that'll listen to her. They chose John Stewart. That was told to me on a podcast. They chose you. Yeah. Yeah. I don't believe that for one second. I think they went, oh, I remember Dodie's first email back to me. You're invested. Investigating the alien interview. You are on a very interesting endeavor. He must have shit in his pants when he saw after 30 years, somebody was going to start investigating this interview and not crap in his pants. Scared like, like, oh, this is wow. Yeah. That like somebody coming to me, Mr. Stewart, I want to investigate the possible murder of that female wrestler back in 62. And like, I'd be like, oh, if, if somebody came to you right now and be honest. Oh, I don't like the way this. Questions. Well, if they came to you right now and said, listen, I'll, I'll tell you everything, but you just got to keep playing ball and keep pretending and keep doing and keep, we're going to tell you what to say, but I'll, I'll, I'll feed everything to you. Everything you've ever wanted to know about this program, but you got to, we got to send you on a wild goose chase publicly. Do I have to lie publicly? You'll have to cut. No, not lie. Omit. Yes. You would. I would take that deal. You would take that deal. Yes. Yes. Until I know mankind or my fellow, my neighbors were in danger. The correct. That, that is my, that is my. I appreciate the honest answer there. Cause I think a lot of people would have lied to that answer. You know, it's the Tommy Lee Jones in space. Cowboys. You'd leave me down here and go to space. Hell yeah. I would, you know, I would, uh, I would walk away. To find the truth who Victor is. Yeah. God, that would be a tough choice though, to, cause like that would eat at you, you know, and I'm sure to eat. Don't harm my neighbors or my wife or kids. But it eats out a lot of people. I know it does. Yeah. But I'm the one investigating. I'm the one that spent $30,000. I'm the one taking the heat. I can find the truth and the deal is go out there as a blabbering, you know, buffoon. You know, you don't think I could leak stuff behind them maybe or in speech or I could figure something out. And if I could, I couldn't. But, yeah, I would take that deal. I'm sorry. There's no one behind me writing a check to cover my losses. That's right. I appreciate the honest answer. I really do. Thank you. I came here to be honest. Do you want to answer some questions? audience questions oh god yeah of course all right is it true you hit sergeant slaughter over the head with a chair and nine this is about aliens what the hell is why has this video been allowed to spread publicly uh when so many less compelling ones have been squashed by more because i think i think that there's two answers to that one of them them is when this if this was if this is real when this came out i think the government their sphincter probably was you can make a diamond out of a lump of coal and i think and i with on good foundation that they just said we are we are up schitt's creek let's see what happens let's see where this goes at the very least we'll see what the how the public reacts to it well why did you do i think the government knows who victor is absolutely why didn't they prosecute victor it's called discovery you want the government to prosecute victor yeah about the alien film then all of a sudden i thought it's fake why are you prosecuting about three feet of you know 16 feet of cellophane film it's fake oh you're prosecuting because it's not fake so there was a real catch-22 that the government is still in with this film and i think i play an important part of bringing the government out i coined this phrase myself bringing the government out of the closet let this guy yeah go through the whole maturations and he'll eventually you know find victor's cub scout pack and a neighbor and and we're out of it and maybe we can go well he's a crazy car dealer rustler but yeah he did a good job and you know and it diminishes it do you know who victor is i do you've met i know no no no you spoke to him i just know his name and i have his face you have his name and face how is that was that just through your investigation or was that given to you no the director of the both documentaries jeff broad screen who does not care about aliens or anything didn't he do follow-up documentaries about aliens um he might have done one or he was a guest i was a guest on one like some i was like a guest on okay um he gave me uh for 500 i got the first name stanton which i thought was stan that's why i thought it was stan dale because he looks just like victor victor looks identical to stan dale the old ufologist but it's not stan dale what was that look is that same name i've got to look for a guy that looks like stan dale but in but is a jerk like bill moore that speaks french i mean speaks french this is my yeah he spoke french in the 208 documentary talked the deluge of the solar and talked about sardo and cicero and quoting philosophers and the zoltan calendar and and so um so jeff said i will give you the full name i will give you the two cities that we've took picked him up at for the documentaries for five thousand dollars what what a gatekeeper this guy so my wife's like you've already spent twenty seven thousand dollars you're not writing him a check for a couple of cities yeah of angels came through his name is brian pemble he's a ufo researcher he's on x from tucson arizona um and he said i i will cover half i want to know who victor is i mean i like tears of my eyes like you are really gonna help me do this so we paypal jeff i put this on on uh clint walden's night shift i put the paypal that we sent um jeff broadstreet i actually think it was 4200 in broadstreet like victor mr pendactic said well i want the fee that paypal is going to charge me so we had to give him like another 150 i'm like are you a victor and um so we get it so we are waiting for the email victor's name um that jeff broadstreet said jeff broadstreet was shown a tattered social security card with the prefix 262 which is a florida birth from victor not his driver's license victor never took off his sunglasses interesting um was a guy by the name of stanton john willett so we go to the computer there is a john stanton willett who died in october of last year who lived 10 miles from me well of course this is john stewart and jeff broadstreet now this is a guy who died in october of last year who lived 10 miles from me this is when we go back to deception detective yeah work jeff said i did look at his social security card it wasn't john i am positive stanton john willett so we spend six hundred dollars or the private detective is chicago she's like there is no one now think about this jeff broadstreet was given a name that has never been born in america right since 1650 right a little weird not a little intelli that you have come up with a name that is nowhere so now i don't want to say how because i don't want to get arrested but the same methodology we use to see bob lazar on the eg and g entry log this is an entry log into groom lake and the nellis test and training range kept kept by eg and g with bob lazar's names on it for 92 days john stanton willett is the guy who died in october of last year who died in october of last year who died in october of last year who died in october of last year who died in october of last year who died will its name was on it well working for eg and g now i've um now i have produced another log line from this book when we thought when we got the first name stanton i found a stanton how who was a scientist um and and worked out at area 51 i'm like this is victor and we called his family his son's like stop calling me you're crazy and click and that wasn't victor but i got his log line and i'm like this is victor and we called his family his son's like stop calling me you're in its last name a line this is what the groom lake log i am the only person that has ever brought out a document from area 51 and i'm proud to say that it was how a line stanton i think j is a middle initial whether he was a civilian or military civ or or um mil whether he was a he was allowed on the base like a june of 82 to july of 84 usually his two-year stints same thing bob lazard same lineage bob um had um and um i and um stanton and what he worked for in in stanton how the fake victor was lockheed now people have told me that because i've had seven people i've interviewed that were on area 51 and i've had seven people that were on area 51 they said at times you could work for chris ramsey dynamics but lockheed will get you entry onto the base yeah if i'm grabbing you from chris ramsey dynamics electronics company to help us on a radar application sure lockheed will will be your um contractor contractor so i thought was interesting a little tidbit there in in stanton john willett worked for eg and g again we go to eg and g we find out that they did high top high tie top secret audio visual documentation for they also hired the pilots at janet airline in in the whack-a-not yep they hired that very yeah they were they were everywhere there they were the ones who built the whole thing so cool so um stanton john willett is nowhere what we'd like to do except on a log at area 51 correct now i get a one of my intel people hooks me up with a this is it's too tom clancy forget it it's it's it's um all i can say is this is that we are i have been told that stanton john willett was a intel name identity given to him by an intelligence three letter okay it was a pseudonym correct and that's like i told you earlier you can only get on area 51 with your real name or an approved official stanton john willett and you can only get on area 51 with your real name or an approved official gnome to plume from an intelligence agency we believe stanton john willett is not his real name and i've been told by various sources look for a stanton somewhere that or a victor something or a variation they oftentimes will use the real first name of someone to so it's not so detached from their real identity yeah whether that's true or not correct so we were then the director told us in 96 victor flew in from arizona and this is amazing in night in 2008 we picked victor up at a residence in rancho cucamonga california the four former fbi agent private detective in chicago said i heard victor say man man it's called california english and this guy thinks that victor's man man like all right man the fbi guy told me this and i went back and i heard it and he does say it he says i think victor spent a lot of time in california sure enough southern california what we would like to do now somebody on reddit another internet angel mr stewart do you know they lightened victor's face You can see what he looks like. And I went out to Reddit and he looks like Stan Dale with the beard, the goatee, the fake hair. We would like to take this photo, give it to the city manager, because Rancho Cucamonga does not have a mayor, and give it to the city manager to tell the newspaper in Rancho Cucamonga, could you help this guy? This is an interesting story. We've got a huge whistleblower, allegedly from our area. Here's his name and face. Can somebody from his Cub Scout pack his high school? Because I don't believe the government can, it's called sheep dipping. I don't believe the government can sheep dip your neighbors, your Cub Scout group members. Not everyone. And they can do it if they've given you a fake name. You'll never find that. But if his name is Stanton Johnson. And he looks like that. Looks like that, we've got our man. So that is our next avenue with Victor. Sorry, I didn't mean to go off on a tangent. No, it's very interesting. Please keep us posted. Okay. It's like being on a game show. From Hex, have you had any men in black interactions since starting your research and coming forward? No. No, no, no name, no. No knocks on the door. And I've said it to everyone and I've said it on podcast. Hey. Everyone tells you which agency they're from when they talk to you? Well, no, they're from the 2764th Detachment Wing out of Belvoir. They do hire actors. They do hire weird looking people. They are trained. Are you talking about the men in black? Yeah. Yeah. But I mean, the people that you're around, they've always given you, they've always come forward with who they were with. Like which department they were with? Some, some have and some haven't. Okay. And how do you know their intelligence if they haven't? I guess I, you know, I get, you're right. All right. Great point. But no, I have no interaction with men in black and I've said it publicly. You'd stop stealing my emails. You want me to stop that I've touched on something that's going to compromise national security? Be a man. That's, that's, that's, that's combative. I'm sorry. Be a gentleman. Be a woman, a lady. Knock on my door. Show me your credentials. I'll take you out for coffee. I'll go show you the home alone house. We'll take pictures. And you can tell me why I should stop and I'll stop. I'm happy to do that too. I think that's like a good, happy middle ground with like national security and stuff. There's too many, there's, there's, there's, you know, there's no need for tomfoolery. No, I will show you what I am. Yeah. There's a lot of this. Cause like, you know, people say, oh, they're getting warnings or like, oh, my phone, I'm hearing a clicking. It's like, just be overt. Let's just all just come into the light. The best antiseptic is sunlight. Let's just. And that brings me to, I had two different emails. We, so groups of Intel men, not my Intel intelligence people believe that you are, have been, um, you, the, the spy program, um, stingray centipede has been performed on your phone. They had to get a court order. It's not like you did anything illegal. It's a counterintelligence spy program. It's called stingray centipede. That's what we think has happened to your phone. Another group said this too sloppy. The United States government wouldn't steal your emails and let you know that your emails are gone. We think it's like China or Russia or Israel. Oh, weird. Keep you up at night. Another thing. All right. Last question here from the audience. Maybe my favorite question. This is a tough question. Okay. Get ready. I'm an open book. All right. I can answer it. I can answer it. You ready? In the red corner, Victor or Oscar, as we now know him in the blue corner, skinny Bob, who wins or is it a draw? Okay. Here's what I know. Skinny Bob has the same owner's signature and timestamp as the Victor video. Yeah. You've pointed that out before. I don't know what that, I don't know how. I'm that suspect. I do find it interesting, but I also find that the. It would have been much harder to put a timestamp on a film than it is digitally. And so the timestamp that's on the Victor video is more impressive. A group of five special effects people said this, that the, that skinny Bob was put through a program called shutter stock. Yeah. Which is like my daughter's got that. Yeah. My daughter's in marketing. I've seen all that. I've done my due diligence on that. Yeah. It was, I'm going to tell you why. And they can't, again, I can't figure this out. They can't figure out how the black triangle redaction was placed on that electronic film. Not a real, a film. They said that on a YouTube. They're, they were all sitting there like, I don't know how you do that. Yeah. And I don't know. Corridor crew or whatever. Yeah. Now that made me go. When I looked into it as well, I saw the filters were obviously fake, but the core video has still yet to be. I believe it's real. And I, and I think I know the problem. The provenance of it, which was, you can let this out, but you have to put it through some sort of a filter to, to give it a straw man argument that people can try and debunk it. Like, oh, that's through shutter stock and it's over. That is what I've been told about Skinny Bob. Hmm. And that it was not in Russian captivity. It was like a plan leak once again. I think so. Okay. That's all the questions from the audience. Thank you for answering those. We want to touch on one more thing. Well, I just, you know, I, I, I want to encourage people maybe not to be as crazy as I have for after six years and all the money I've spent, but I just want to go over without petting myself, crediting the internet, just by going out on podcasts and doing this for six years, what other people have helped, helped us. And I don't even think you even realize this is to my, my group and to the, to the internet that, um, we have the first document out of area 51, the standout. Oh, log line. We have verified the Wilson Davis men memo. We found two men, um, Castor Nick and another military general that were in the Wilson Davis men memo. Okay. We found those on documents on what's called the military bulletin board. It's like an, an internal, um, an internal memo board for DOD people. And somebody on the internet found the two names. One was a brigadier. Brigadier general. And one was a, one was a, a, um, and they were in the scientific advisory. They had SAB, their name. These two names were on the Wilson Davis memo. We found them on total innocuous documents on this military bulletin board. And I, I'm happy to prove Eric Davis, you know, I don't know if he denies it or not. Well, he definitely, he definitely does not talk about it at all. He was asked about it. He's like, I will not talk about that. We found Paul Kaminsky, USDA. Uh, um, uh, uh, technology and, um, and brigadier general, Mike Kostelanek, O-U-S-D-A-N-T. Um, and those were both on the Wilson Davis memos. People were saying those are fake generals and, but we found them. We found them on, uh, you know, innocuous military. And I'm very proud of that. The internet. I think the biggest, I think one of the biggest stories in ufology, and I don't know, I think people really do hate me. They don't want to see me win. We have proven. I don't think that's true. I'm, I'm, I'm being flippant. Yeah. But we have proven the OPNAC BB, the OPNAC, the, uh, SOM 01 Extraterrestrial Recovery Manual is, is real. I've been in contact with Ryan Wood. Um. Yeah. He's done a lot of work on that. He's got the measurements that, that, that he's got the, the, the, the Ray Z. The crate sizes. Yeah. I mean, I. The crate size. I looked at all of the, uh, all of that as well. It's very compelling. Everything in that. In that document is searchable. All of the names are retreads. S4, the blue room at right pad, except one line. Well, S4 was also the, there was like a, that was a point of contention was the S-4. Right. That wouldn't have shown up that way. And there, you know, there is an S4 at Tonopah. Yeah. There's also, yeah. S4 is like just a storage facility, I think, that, that they use it for elsewhere. There's one line that no one could figure out since 1954. Where to bring living biological aliens. And it was a facility. It was a facility called Opnac BBS-01. And it said, this is where you take living that aren't degenerated. Right. Living extraterrestrial. The Tau. Specimens. No. Sitting there one day, Mr. Stewart. This is on YouTube, on a chat, chat room. I think I know what Opnac in the, in, that you've been talking about is. It's the oceanic platform for the North Atlantic and the Caribbean. And I'm like, layman's terms. Offshore platform. Mr. Stewart, they've got biological specimens. They don't know if they're a contaminant to the continental United States and to people. They would want them on a, on a facility that's separate offshore. Also, nowhere you can drive to. Right. Exactly. And he, and now another Italian guy named Adriano Andiamo. I think if I'm saying his name right, says, I know what the BBS is. It was the Bermuda Biological Station attached to. The offshore platform. Whoa. Wait a minute. John Stewart, the investigator who created Opnac. bbs a guy by the name of now i sound like uap gerb a guy by the name of dr arthur sherlock he was a millionaire he donated this platform to who the united states navy they didn't talk about aliens in his bio and what else did he help the navy with propulsion i know you're interesting interesting art sherlock dr art sherlock was like a was like a what year was this um 50s 40s 40 but they used this facility for aliens in 54 yeah up until 62 when s2 alpha at papoose lake was built and they transferred we have the foia document from that and then they transferred from there to utah correct yeah that's correct and in the mid 90s uh i believe the papoose lake facility has been under caretaker status since since the mid 90s and probably since bob lazar oh yeah the minute lazar came out there he blew them up that was that the wheels were implemented to to to switch the problem i think it's interesting too because victor had mentioned that the alien was brought to um s4 in 89 i wonder if that was the big thing that made the russians leave because there was something there was some discovery according to bob that happened in at s4 at papoose the russians disparted and they were working very closely with the russians and if you're working with the russians it must have been of utter importance to work with like your enemy like that like so closely leave them into like the most right like deepest part of the bowels of like the secrecy and then just to kick them out there must have been like some massive discovery and then this guy's saying that the alien was brought there in 89 so i wonder if that was the reason they were like get the russians out of here get us some psychics in the mountains of vermont yeah um i i i don't i i i wish i knew the provenance of that being like what what crash or what hard landing do you know that two remote view there's another thing folks but separate from john stewart do you know that two remote viewing groups remote viewed that this alien interview video opposed from me yeah and both said we're seeing a tan bean he's sick he's distressed there's a partition and he's in a no man's land no man's land is papoose lake that's a nuclear fallout basically yeah and um to the point where richard dolan was in on the session is like john stewart's don quixote the windmill the alien interview richard richard dolan said i believe it's real from this blind this blind uh study and from what is john john has told us do you think it kind of matches the description loosely to uh dan bursch has been not entirely like there's dan's had like scales on it too and and was like yeah it was in a biosphere these people specifically said a partition we're seeing a partition yeah that's the other thing yeah it was a biosphere to yeah to protect it okay well i just want to say yeah go for it you know um that uh unlike paul benowitz uh that that uh did not have a good interaction i i actually emailed bill moore who everyone told me he was going to be never email me back and he has emailed me back he also is so frustrated with me told me not to email him again till march till march and as rick dodie said did you do realize you're you made bill moore crazy the guy that's supposed to the reverse i said i george costanza'd him he literally said do not contact me till march 15th to the ides of march i just want to say why until march 15th it's the ides of march he's very hyper intelligent if i i would tell you he was victor but he said he said he's not but he knows everything about it and i just want to tell you what he left me what he said to me um claims he wasn't victor claims he had the necktie that victor wore that he threw away six years ago that he knows who victor is and that he's played a small part in this he said it was a hoax listen now why would john stewart debunk his because i don't care if it's real or not he said it was a hoax but then he says but if i tell you the truth of that film and if i tell you the truth of what that film is about you and i will be swinging from an end of a rope that is in an email from an 84 year old former asset of the cia he was an asset of the cia not of rick dodie and um scary if i tell you the truth you and i will swing from an end of a rope wow you ask your viewers what would you i'm gonna keep going and uh i i will find victor's complete identity um is that the mission gotta be the mission i'm on the board i can't get off it's like the octopus that you prove victor yeah you prove victor you prove the alien or you prove the video alien or at least prove the government did it and it was a psyop yeah and and and and again i go on record i 97 to 98 percent i i know the united states government had a hand in filming this or at least recreating the film and i'm on the board i'm on the board i'm on the board i'm on the board and filming this i am confident well i'll tell you where my conviction level has been raised incredibly due to this conversation so i want to thank you for coming here and enlightening me uh you know with your research and i think um i think you know there are some people that give you a bad rap for some reason i can't figure it out i guess i guess it's you have very aggro energy but i mean it's in a good it's directed in a way that we we like you know we want people like you kicking down doors and taking names because we don't want people like you kicking down doors and taking names because i'm not going to do it i'm not that person you know i'm a person who has conversations and who thinks philosophically maybe in my quiet little corner but um you're somebody uh and uap gerb is another person who's kicking doors and i i think we need more people like that regardless of clashing personalities i think uh yeah i think what you're doing is a is a net positive to to some extent and um i'd like to i'd like to see you continue that safely and you know wish you all the safety in your journey and hopefully you get to find out who victor is uh if anybody wants to support you um where can they find you what can they do yeah i i think the best way and it's worked for six years and and i've been told that this familiarity this personal touch is probably what got me a lot of people to help me instead of them having to call a company and go through a switchboard to get all to me i leave my email my email is uh john j-o-n without the h my middle name alan a-l-a-n my last name stewart s-t-e-w-a-r-t at aol.com don't laugh that i have aol i'm an old guy and on on x um john stewart il well john you're uh you're a true gentleman thank you so much for thanks for having me for coming here and i hope we covered uh most of what you wanted to talk about today i know i know you probably got a lot no no no we did and it's been it's just it's it's been uh i'm i'm i am just so uh honored to be here and it's been a great conversation i hope um uh with how people view you on the internet that this this moves my investigation and the conversation and it moves the needle in a good direction that will help us solve this and i can move on i'm pretty certain it will yeah thanks for your time thank you sir you