Ten Preseason Stories That Have Our Attention!

Welcome to the ringer NFL show. I'm your host, Shield Kapadia. We've got 10 categories, stories, topics that have our attention here in late August. Billy Gill came up with the list. He surprised us. It's me and Tom Pelicero, but we get into a bunch of stuff happening around the NFL. It really goes all over the place. Lots of fun. So let's take a break. We'll come back with Tom and Billy and get started. This episode of the ringer NFL show is presented by Orgain. Orgain creatine helps improve muscle size, strength and power when combined with a regular exercise and weight training routine. Plus, it's certified with informed choice, which means it's tested for prohibited substances in sports, upgrade your performance with Orgain creatine, available at Amazon, Costco, Walmart, and Whole Foods. These statements have not been evaluated by the Food and Drug Administration. This product is not intended to diagnose, treat, cure, or prevent any disease. Alright, we are back here on the ringer NFL show with Tom Pelicero and Billy Gill. Tom, I thought we had an idea for the pod. We're going to do 10 most fascinating players, people, coaches in the NFL. We thought we'd let Billy come up with the list. You and I would react. But because he's Billy, there may be a little curveball here. So he's going to kind of explain the pod to us. How are you feeling about this time? I'm just quickly realizing that Billy is basically the Joker of this podcast. Does he look like a guy with a plan? No matter what, it's just sewing chaos. And we'll react. But I love it. I love a good, completely blind hour of NFL talk. So let's go, Billy. Wait, which Joker are you thinking here? Are we thinking like he fledgered Joker? Yes. Yeah, I could be walking Phoenix. I don't know which one we're thinking. Oh, that line is it's from dark night rises. It's sitting bedside in the hospital. Okay, there you go. We're off to a confusing stop. But the pod's going to be good. So stay tuned right here. Alright, Billy. So here we go. You've got some type of game, some type of category. You're coming up with 10. Tom and I are going to react. It was nice for us because we didn't really have to do any prep because it was in your hand. So lead us off here. What do we got? I kind of noticed that I was wondering if this is some sort of hazing ritual. It's like, why don't you just come up with all of this stuff and we'll react. I was like, hold on a second. Like I was like, this is great. They trust me. They're handing over the wheels. Like finally, we're building some rapport here, some chemistry, some team building. And then like halfway through I realized, no, they're just dumping all of the work on me. Like I'm the kid doing all the work in the group projects here. Like what are we doing? So I think I may have misunderstood what the assignment was from you guys. You just wanted names of people. We were just going to talk about people. I decided to do shield because we've done this a couple of times here Tom is shield has given me numbers one through 10. And I will give them a number. And he will blindly give me a story to react to, right? But with the blindness of this story, sometimes it could be something that just happened this week or it could be, you know, like a Wednesday story and it's a Friday, maybe I missed it in the news thing. So I'd have to kind of play along and usually I knew it was going on, but there were times that shields just so plugged in that it was inside stuff. So what I decided was we can do a similar game. But what if we did it sort of like jeopardy where you have kind of like a topic and you guys could select the topic. So what I did is I selected 10 topics and I will reach you the topics. You could choose the topic. And from there, I'll give you the information and the question. You ever have seen, you ever like a, you know, a party with like an adult party and there's like four couples and like the one guy brings a game and he's going to teach you the game. And now you're like an hour in people are getting second drinks. It's like, dude, can we just, we'll figure it out. Like let's just play the game. I don't need all the rules. Just play the game. Let's play the game going. Let's start with one of one, Billy. What have we got one of one? So beginning this season NFL rookies will wear one of one NFL rookie debut patches on their jerseys after the game. The patch will be removed. It will be inserted into a tops card, which they will autograph. And then it will be go out to the general public. You have to buy one of those fancy packs. How do you guys feel about this? The new commercialization of the NFL. The NFL has been known to try to, you know, profit as much as they can off of these things. And now they're adding these jerseys patch. We've seen this in the MLB before. Do we like this? Do we not? Are you guys collectors? How do we feel about this? I'm curious what the players get out of it. I mean, it kind of seems like a, now listen, there's all kinds of different licensing deals. This is all through fanatics, which is at a long standard relationship with the NFL. Yeah, they own tops. Of course, Michael Rubin and company are involved in essentially everything on and off the field that the NFL does. So I'm not surprised that this is happening. I would just be, I would be curious to know, Scheele, how exactly this works. If you're driving, hey, you get to wear this patch on your jerseys. It's very special. We're going to take it from the jersey right after you make your debut and then make kids buy more cards to go find it. Like are the players actually benefiting? Because I would think if you're, you know, a Jeremiah love, you might want that jersey for posterity. And now with like, you know, the outline of where something used to be. Yeah, I'm with you. I don't know if the players get anything out of this. We'll see if they do. I don't think my kids are going to be asking for these patches. I don't think they're going to be a big hit here. It doesn't sound like a winning idea to me. But when Billy mentioned the commercialization and just kind of the NFL trying to squeeze money, and you know, is there right to do that out of every little corner? I actually had a follow-up question for Tom that has nothing to do with the prompt. Billy, am I allowed to do that? Yes, sure. Okay. Tom, I've had this idea for this theory for a while and you're going to Australia to cover that's a Wednesday night game, right? In the US. It is a Thursday night game in the US that is Friday morning 10 30 a.m. in Melbourne. Okay. Okay. So I've always had this thought that Sunday's the inventory. And I've said this on the pod before the NFL has this inventory and so much of it is just in these two windows on Sunday. And you know, you remember the Tuesday night game in Philadelphia. I remember you talking about that with Phil Simmons. There was that. We had the Sunday morning window. They've tested stuff on holidays. Do you think we're close to getting to the point because I've been preaching this for a while and it hasn't quite happened where they're just going to be football on a bunch of different windows, a bunch of different days. Maybe they stagger Sunday. Maybe there's a Wednesday night game rather than just having all these same games on in those two windows on a Sunday. It seems and I've talked with, you know, league officials about this for, you know, basically the past 15 years and they've always been believers that if you if you saturate it and you put it on every single night of the week, like there's no chance to miss it. If you're baseball fan, you can tune in any night, any day and you can find baseball games. The NBA has different packages on different networks. It's every day of the week. NHL same thing like the NFL and even me is somebody who, you know, lives it and covers it for a living by Wednesday night. You're kind of like, all right, when's the next game on, you know, like you have two nights in a row and you're like, all right, you know, I need the football here. That's part of the overall strategy. You know, the expansion into the international markets is its own thing because this is all about the hundreds of millions of NFL fans that exist in different countries, people that identify themselves as NFL fans. And essentially, if you look at the biggest, you know, poplices that are NFL fans in different countries, they've gone to every country except for China by the end of this year. Now going to Australia is another step going to France is another step. They're trying to spread it out. But in terms of the days of the week, they've always wanted to have some gaps. What they're trying to do is fill in. All right, one of those other days that a lot of people are home and maybe you have big groups and you need something on, well, Friday, Black Friday football became a thing a couple of years ago. Let's put one there. This year on Netflix, we've got Packers Rams on Wednesday night, the night before Thanksgiving in LA, the biggest drinking day, biggest bar day of the year. And now you're going to have to get Netflix on the TVs because we're going to have a massive game there the night before. But no, I don't foresee this being right now. It's Tuesday and Wednesday night football. Yeah, we did that during COVID and there were games every night. That was not really by choice. Those gaps are important to make people crave. All right, we're ramping up to Thursday. We're ramping up the Sunday and so on. Interesting. I wonder how close they'll try to get to that edge and be like, all right, you know, I think we're pretty close. Yeah, we're pretty close. Triple header on Thanksgiving, triple header on Christmas. It's close. But if there's any other gaps, and depending how the calendar sinks up, there might be, you know, other days, the week just like last year when it was, you know, Wednesday Christmas football. I mean, that's just kind of the reality. The holidays they're taken over, and I don't ever see them giving it back. There you go. All right, Billy, did you see what I did there? That's a professional move. It's that you see this with interviews all the time in sports. You're asked one question, but you pivoted to something else that you want to talk about. I hope you didn't take offense to that. I didn't want to spell it out for the audience, but in just the, you know, we're trying to be honest here. We're trying to build some more. That's kind of what I did there. But I think we're ready to move on to the next category. Is that right? You pick that category. Is she there's no one to blame for yourself on that one. All right, I would just say this. Maybe there's a reason it was the seventh one that I gave you, you know, and we started maybe, number one, Billy, take us to number one, number one. Saturday or glad day. Wow. Okay. Here's a game that we're going to play. It's called Saturday or glad day. Great job, Tom. You don't have to play this game. Here's the headline NFL scraps a pro bowl. So beginning in the the 20/26 season. and 88 players will be named to the Pro Bowl class and in late December and no replacement selections will be made. There's gonna be no AFC versus NFC games this year. There's gonna be no Pro Bowl games this year. There's just gonna be a ceremony ending the long tradition of the Pro Bowl. Now, they have tried different things over the years to make it work because it wasn't exactly competitive. 2013 to 2016, you had legends picking the team. So it wasn't AFC versus NFC. That didn't really catch on. Then we had the Pro Bowl games where there's drone drops or precision pass and dodgeball contest, strongest band, stuff like that. None of that ever worked. In 2021, they had an E-Pro Bowl where to no one's surprised Kyler Murray won the MVP of the E-Pro Bowl because, of course, he did. So all of these traditions now die. They no longer exist. Is it a sad day or a glad day for NFL fans? - I would say a couple of things here. One, even the Pro Bowl games, and people can laugh about it at the late days of the actual tackle football Pro Bowl. They still outrated practically everything on TV. Like there's so many things. If it's something loosely resembling football, you can still sell it. Which, to me, says the product in the NFL's mind and what it looked like had gotten to a point that they couldn't defend putting something on TV that was just an easy money maker. Even when you're looking at seventh alternate, snoop hotly playing in the Pro Bowl, it's still something that's about football and names you know that are on TV. And yeah, I give the NFL credit for trying to find ways to salvage it because once Sean Taylor lit up Brian Mormon, like we just weren't going back. You can go back to watch some of those games. It wasn't like it also fell off a cliff, but there was kind of this slow deterioration of quarterbacks being set on the ground and nobody was going to hit anybody and kind of weak tackle attempts. Which begat the entire transition to okay, what if we get it in this way? What if we add and play Dodge Ball and like longest pass or whatever the other categories were? I mean, that's something they were doing back in the 90s with the quarterback club shield. But it was like, you know, if you ever watch those videos by the way, yeah, that's the best. Like I would still go and watch like what it's just like 100% away and Dan Merino just like coming up like discus throwers and seeing how far down the field they could throw it in a while. Like that was kind of entertaining. But again, you know, the fact that the pool had been diluted of like 150 guys calling themselves Pro Bowl players, like that was a part of it too, I don't think the players really wanted to go and play in a game. But if now there's going to be some type of an event and it's those top 88 that actually get recognized, it's kind of like the expansion of the all pro list, which now there's a little bit of kind of overlap there. So I'll be interested to see how people look at those things here. But listen, if it got bad enough that they decided it wasn't even worth taking the ratings and putting it on TV, that probably tells you everything you need to know. - Yeah, I think it's a glad day. I looked at this and you're right about, I do remember as a young kid just watching those quarterback competitions and the moving target and they would just be chucking it. I honestly, that's when I was like falling in love with football, but I don't know that they've been able to recreate that. This is great because I think what they're doing, we want the Pro Bowl to have this historical relevance. We're 30 years from now, we're like, how many Pro Bowls did this player make? Okay, how good were they during the course of their career? And to Tom's point, now we look at all pros for that. That's the thing you look at because the Pro Bowl has just been such a joke where you're like, "Wait, this guy made the Pro Bowl?" I watched him, he was not good at all. Last year, why are we doing that? So this is much better where it's gonna take some time to catch up, but 50 years from now if they keep this, it can be like, all right, this guy made four Pro Bowls during his first eight seasons in the NFL. Is he a Hall of Famer? Is he not a Hall of Famer? All that stuff, we will now have a better record for than the actual Pro Bowls. I didn't like to watch the Pro Bowl. I know what Tom's saying that the ratings were still good. Billy, here's what we do. Rather than televising the Pro Bowl, let's televise. And this is not an original thought. I've been talking to Anthony DeBundo, some other people at the ringer. They should be teleplex and little name drop there. They should televise the joint practices. I mean, just the one-on-ones, last week, it was H.A. - Fish, rice, Quinion, Mitchell, fish. It doesn't even have to be the scrimmage part if the coaches are paranoid about that. Just great players going up against each other, one-on-one, I think Billy, that would do big numbers. - By the way, quick side note to that. Since we're talking about those 1990s quarterback competitions, am I the only one who had the, I can't remember exactly what the name of it was, but it was that game on the Nintendo Game Boy. And it was like, you could play with the different quarterbacks. There was like the accuracy throwing it like a, you know, like where you'd have the bow and arrow, like throwing it at that type of a target at all these games that were built into it. And this is all, like it's a long story. It's because a bunch of the top quarterbacks opted out of the NFLPA licensing agreements in like the early 90s, which is why, if you played Techno Bowl and you're playing with QB bills instead of Jim Kelly, and you're like, why is that? 'Cause those guys opted out and did their own licensing deal. I can remember spending so many hours, so many long car rides. I don't know if they, I mean, I guess it's now just iPhones, right? Like what the equivalent would be of the Game Boy? Like if you were going on a road trip to like Mount Rushmore with your parents and you didn't have a Game Boy, I don't know what you would do in the Toyota Previa for eight hours, you know? Like that was just a core, core memory for me. Stair out the window, Billy, right? That's all I have. That's all I have to explain. Game may be the thing where you pick the letters off the signs. Yeah, that's one of the good ones. Was it quarterback club? Was that the game you're talking about? I believe quarterback club is what it was called. Yeah, yeah. I mean, if you have it in front of you, you can read off the various competitions. But that's what it was, is it was all those events that you would see at like two in the morning on ESPN from Hawaii and they would put that into a video game. I'm a little mad now, Billy, at my parents, you know? I was stuck with Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles. They had like a sports obsessed kid. I didn't even know this game existed. What's up with that? All right. Well, it's never too late to get a game for a shield. Okay. All right. Now it's the switch. The switch is also very popular. Yeah, mm-hmm. All right. Good one, Swilly. I think that one worked. Yeah. Really took us places. You didn't even know we were going to go. You don't get as a Mario Kart in your house or anything like that. Mario Party. Mario Kart still has a Nintendo Wii somewhere in this house that occasionally gets fired up on you. Yeah. All right. Ready for your next topic, guys? Yeah. Let's do it. I like what Tom did there. We just picked a number. Or are you going to pick the number? I'm just going to go in order now. Okay. I think you guys aren't feeling this game. So we're just going to porophyte. Yeah. That's fine. You didn't want to start on that Jersey patch, huh, Billy? That was a slight mistake there. I thought we'd build up to the Jersey patch. I mean, honestly, I'm just happy that we didn't start by. Well, you gave it numbers. You said we were picky. I'm trying to play by your rules. It's true. You know, and if I'm going to be honest with you, I said, this could be a dangerous game. So let me leave off the 49ers owner and that story from this because if we get that way there, how are we going to end up in that situation? So all right. Next one, NFL rebates. What can this be about? In a joint statement released earlier this week by the NFL and the NFL PA, it was announced this season. There will be an emphasis on five rules affecting players safety. Any player who commits three of these five offenses across any category during season will receive a one game suspension. And here things kind of get tricky. Players who commit only one violation will receive 50% of their fineback at the end of the season. Violations in these categories will carry forward to subsequent seasons. But all players will begin with a clean slate. And then later on, we find in the article, in addition, players who commit a single offense in eligible categories will now have the entire amount of fine returned back to them at the end of the season. So it seems as though we're emphasizing five rules. Hip drop tackle, horse collar tackle, launching, hit on the defenseless player and blindside block. And depending on whether or not it was intentional, if you're a multi-time offender of these rules, if you offend the rules across various categories, you could get some money back. You could get no money back if you're facing a suspension. They're also going to force your coach to go with you to the hearing so that the coach takes on some of the blame for your bad behavior. And these will carry over from year to year. So how do we feel about this? How do we feel about fines being given back to you? Because we've always been told fine money goes to charity. So if you're a good boy, now money's being taken away from charity and theory. Well, first of all, Billy, thank you for crediting me for breaking that story through Netflix in the ring or yesterday. I'm glad you're paying attention to the content that we're creating. Oh, there, listen, this came out of months of discussions between the NFL and the NFL. Basically blow down to this. The NFL's goal was to have an actual agreement saying, yes, we can suspend repeat offenders. They've always had that ability, but obviously there were a lot of fight. Players can still, by the way, they can still appeal. So it's not like it's automatic and your appeal rights go away. They can still appeal. But there was always fights about a ZZL Shire in 2024. Last year was Frankie Louvue. Those are the only two players in the last two years that this three strikes in your out would have applied to, where you get suspended. But this gives them clear cut agreement. Hey, these are the five most dangerous fouls, the ones most likely to cause injury. And if you get fined three times and you lose your appeal on those, you're going to get suspended. And that's one of those things that as much as the union protects the rights of its players. It's your wages, it's your working conditions. Nobody's going to sit there and defend and go, all right, a player who repeatedly, if three horse callers the year or three hip drops like it was with Frankie Louvue, well, you should be able to get off Scott free. No, sorry, those guys need to be punished. But the NFL PA wanted was we got to relieve the financial burden on all the other players because the vast majority of fines that are handed out to players for player safety categories were one time offense. Most guys would say one time thing, but you might be losing 10 grand, 20 grand, depending on what the foul is. If this had been in place in recent years, it would have been of an average of about one point and $7 million back to players. Just because all these guys who had a single file, you get either 50% of your money back, if this is one of those five major categories, or if it's some of those other ones like roughing the passer, use a helmet that are a little bit harder to control 'cause their football plays, those ones you would get 100% of your money back if you're a one-time offender. So it makes sense in that regard, the other piece of this too, yes, there's the coach accountability, that's a big thing. The union wanted that, like, hey, if a guy's got a bad technique, who's teaching the technique? Why is he not making that play better? Let's bring the coach and the coordinator in, so they can be educated on what can we do to try to keep this guy from getting suspended? But the other piece that I think is important here is if you were previously in repeat offender category, you had to go two full years, 34 games, without an infraction, without a fine, to exit repeat offender territory. Now, if you have, just to hide the ethical, all right, let's say you have two points, right, and three points system. You have two horse collar tackles in a year. At the end of the season, if you don't get a third, you drop back to one entering the following season. Even somebody who gets suspended for it, if they don't have another one the rest of the year, they enter the following season with two, if they get through that season, they go back down to zero and they're completely out of the program. So if you adjust your behavior, if you have better technique, if you're not putting your fellow players in danger, you have the opportunity to not be one bad hit away from a suspension forever. We'll see it's on a one year trial basis. The NFLPA wants to make sure that the NFL's not going to now take this as license to like start finding more guys and then suspending them and you got a rash of suspensions. And the NFL's going to want to see like, all right, this is a one time coupon you can use. If we start seeing a huge uptick in these illegal follow ups, you guys are like, hey, I get away with it once, then they're going to have some things to say about it. But the full intention is this is going to be a long term thing. It's also a common sense solution where both sides wanted something that probably, even though it doesn't impact the collective bargaining negotiations that are coming up in the following years, it at least shows like, hey, when everybody looks at this and goes, the system doesn't really make a lot of sense, let's make a deal. At least show the sides could get together and get something done that everybody sees me happy with. - Yeah, part of me, you know, my initial instinct was that, okay, like everything else in the NFL, this is a bit unnecessarily complicated. But as Tom explained it there, as he went, went through it, I'm like, okay, that actually does make sense is what's always the complaint from players. It's like, we're moving at full speed. It was a one-time thing and then the announcers are going, you try to change how you're tackling that guy when you're trying to bring down Derek Henry in the open field. So now that it's like, all right, so one-time thing, we understand football, it's hard to control all those things. Every single snap you play in a given season, and to Tom's point, you can still appeal it. So if you feel like it was unfair, you can still win that appeal and they can look at it. It's not just one official on the field determining whether you get that strike or not. So that makes a lot of sense to me. And then the repeat offenders, I mean, most players would be for that where it's like, this guy is crazy out there. This guy, like Tom said, it only applies to maybe a couple of guys over the last couple of years, but they're looking at that, especially offensive players. You're looking at Aziz Al-Shayar and they're probably like, yeah, that guy, you need to do something about the way that guy plays because it's putting my livelihood and my career at risk. So I think it makes sense, Billy, where do you come down on this now that you've done all the research on Tom's report? - I mean, I'm very happy and glad that Tom broke this news. I'm sorry that it didn't appropriately credit you for the news breaking. I think that to his point, like it does open up a path for potential, you know, gaming the system saying like, yeah, one of these in here and there won't be too many consequences. I did also, as I told you, I was kind of confused by the situation. We start with a clean slate. Money can be given back. You might get some of this, you might get some of that. You're not telling us that you can go from three to two if you're good at the end of the year. So it's a fun experiment. I mean, I look, player safety has been a long an issue of the NFL. We saw reports come out earlier this week that was testing players that have passed away in CTE and all that stuff. Obviously, there's things that need to be done to clean up the safety. So, you know, Kudos to the NFL for trying a new approach to maybe incentivize players because I guess the fines weren't enough to not, you know, continue these dirty hits and dirty plays, intentionally or not intentionally. All right, so Billy is coming out anti-charity. I don't know where Tom came out on that. I for one, maybe I'm the only one at the Ringer NFL show. I believe giving to charity and helping these causes is important, but listen, we all don't have to agree on everything. - She'll pledge before this episode to donate all of his earnings from today's episode of the charity, which is nice, so thank you, Sheel. - Correct, absolutely. All right, the human fund. All right, let's take a break. We'll come back with more of Billy's categories on the Ringer NFL show. The Ringer NFL show is brought to you by Fandall before the football season begins. Every team is undefeated. Every fan believes this could be the year. The year their team wins the division, makes the playoffs, lifts the trophy. And with Fandall, you can bet on any of it. From who will win it all and division winners to season win totals and playoff futures, Fandall has all the ways to bet on the season before it even begins. Get your football futures bets in today. Download the Fandall app now and play your game. 21 plus Lex State or 18 plus DC or Wyoming, gambling problem called 1-800-Gambler, call 1-888-78-977-77 or visit ccpg.org/chat in Connecticut. - All right, we are back here on the Ringer NFL show. I think we've done three, is that correct? - Yeah, we've done three. How do we feel about this so far? It definitely got off to a rough start. We're not going to mince words on that. What's what? - I think it's going great. - I think now we're giving it a great time. I think you just keep going right on down the list. - That's a new approach. And we're just going down the list. I'll give you the name of the category. It doesn't even matter anymore. 'Cause I'm just going in order. But Tom, I think you're gonna like this one. This one's a category called what are we hearing? And here's how this game works. I'm gonna give you the name of a player who is a free agent and we're gonna discuss what we're hearing. So let's start off with former Detroit Lions offensive tackle, Taylor Decker. What are we hearing? - It's been quiet on Taylor Decker, but there are teams with left tackle needs. The Bears is song forever. We're still trying to figure out their left tackle position. Obviously, Washington with losing Laramie Tonsel. Every team needs a swing tackle at minimum. But Taylor Decker's a long time starter. He's had a lot of injury issues down the stretch last season. He killed before the Christmas game that they lost to the Vikings. But still a guy who can function at a high level. I wouldn't be surprised at all if we see him. If he chooses to play this season, but it's also a matter of what's the price point, what's the right spot? There's a bunch of veterans sitting out there right now, Billy, that I would say, all of them right now, you're kind of just going, all right. If they really want the sign, they could sign, but not everybody wants to do what some of these veterans have done over the past week and just saying, screw it, I'll take the minimum right now as I walk away. - Well, how many of the free agents are just doing the whole, I want to avoid as much camp as possible? Like, I'll get back there eventually. Like, I want to play, I don't want to sit up the year, I have my options, but I'm gonna take my time to not do this stuff I don't want to do. I mean, there's certainly guys who are in that category, but I think that a lot of times, I mean, listen, if you're talking about these veteran players, there's still a bunch of them. We saw, you know, Vaughn Miller came in and signed for, I think it was like five and a half million dollars. So Darius Smith came back for six million dollars. Guys like Darren Waller came back and took the minimum. Trayvon Diggs took the minimum. These are guys who were like highly paid, if not the highest paid at their position, at a certain time. And so there's kind of a recalibration at some points. Trayvon Diggs sat out there for a while. Can you now inset out there for a while? Sometimes there's just kind of a, all right. What do I actually want to do? So I've made all the money. This is pennies on the dollar for what I've been making in the past. Like, do I really want to play? You know, does this offer make sense? Or do I just wait until somebody's in a bind? And they got a baby to come back. There's more of that, especially with guys who have gotten paid on the second, it's not a third contract. Then I think a lot of people realize here, it's not that it's all about the money, but the money is a piece of it here. And those guys who are taking minimum deals, just to get themselves back on the field. Naji Harris took a minimum deal from the Giants. Like, those are guys who are just going, you know what, the money's probably not going to get better. If I want to play, I better get in there right now and establish it because if I sit out for several games now and then nothing pops up, like all of a sudden, I'm the guy who didn't have a job for half a season, which if you're pushing 30 or over 30, that can kind of be the end. Billy, can I hijack this into what are we hearing? - Yeah. - Now, you didn't prep Tom for any of these, right? - Okay. - Off the call. - No, I think that's apparent right now, yes. - Okay, yeah, I was gonna, I thought maybe, if it's, you know, specific veteran free agents, like Taylor Decker, you know, we'll work on it. The prep, maybe he'll make some calls. - Bobby Wagner, what are we hearing? - Okay, well hold on, hold on, this one's bad. This one's more interesting, Billy, because this is a, what are we hearing? - Bad team ratio. - Well, because here's what I'm doing. I'm going through all the preview stuff, I wish teams, do I think you're going to be good? What are my official picks going to be? And Tom, I'm seeing a bunch of teams that I like, where I'm like, man, if they had an edge rusher, like Max Crosby, I might pick this team to go to this Super Bowl. And I was just thinking how weird the whole Max Crosby thing was, he gets traded. He comes back, they're like, no, we're not going to trade now. And I'm like, wait, why are they not going to trade him now? Is it just that teams are not willing to give up, you know, anything close to the same draft capital? Is it one of these things where they hold on to him for the first month, see how their season's going? And then a team comes calling it the trade deadline. Do you think he's going to be with the Raiders for the whole season? Because I'm looking at teams like Detroit, Chicago, Dallas. I'm like, these are good teams that, man, if they added Max Crosby, I would be so excited about them. What are we hearing, Billy? That's the category. Yeah, what are we hearing? What are we hearing, Tom on Max Crosby? One thing that I think is important to understand is how close Mark Davis is with Max. So in Max, after everything that happened, And listen, he was not fully healthy. He was like three months away from being done with his rehab. Everyone knew that. Baltimore was within its rights to terminate the trade. Many other GMs they spoke to around the league, you know, thought it was BS how they handled it. But again, that they're allowed before the trade is actually executed, before there's trade papers. You are allowed to do what they did, even though we very, very rarely see it. When Max came back to Vegas and for everything I was told, it was very emotional him getting back with Mark and him seeing his teammates and the people that he still knows around the building, Max wanted and wants to be a raider. And unless he goes to Mark Davis and says, you know what, I want out again. I don't know that there's a great appetite for the raiders to do it. One thing you mentioned is absolutely true, Shia, which is once the trade gets terminated, you had two first-round picks, and that was the high offer from anybody in the league, which is why like Dallas got priced up. 'Cause they weren't willing to do both of their ones this year. Realistically, there was no way until he was fully healthy and showed he's Max Crosby again, that somebody was going to go, all right, he is still worth the two first-round picks, right? So I think that what you're going to see here is, let's say, well, we'll find out what the raiders are. Max came back to a vastly different team. Also, they had spent a bunch of players on defense. You know, they continued to fortify things in terms of other positions on the field. They made a wide receiver signing and in free agency, like he came back to a different team and then they get Fernando Mendoza along with Kirk Cousin. So the team is returning to is not what they were in 2025. Let's see, maybe they're okay. I'm not going to sit here and go to raiders. They're going to be great and they're going to come out. They're going to be ahead in an AFC West, where I think by any objective measure on paper, you would rank them fourth out of four in that division. But let's say they're okay. I don't know the Max is going to go, I want out of here. Max always wanted to be a raider. He didn't want to leave, but he was sick of the dysfunction. He was sick of the losing. He was sick of the constant changes. The Clint Kubiak can come in and calm things down and we did that category last week where what coach is going to make the most first year impact. I said Clint just because it's been he-hasta. And Clint, like his dad, is like this. He is absolutely, totally flat line, totally chill about everything. And that's just his natural personality. I think that's going to be good for the building. If they're sitting there at two in six, two in seven as we come up on the trade deadline, I'm sure they're going to get calls. They didn't have to make calls in the first place when it came to trade them back in March before they didn't end up doing that. They got calls from other teams. I think it'll be the same thing. If they start losing, you'll see them start to get calls. Is it possible that something could happen before the start of the season? Anything's possible. I mean, any player in the league outside of maybe, you know, a couple dozen guys, if somebody offers them two first-round picks, that player can be traded. But I wouldn't say that that's the likely scenario here. I don't think that they, I do not believe that they're going to trade Max Crosby against his will. If he's like, "Mark, I want to be a rater." I don't see Mark Davis as much as he's not interfering right now with what they're doing for the operation. I just don't see them making that trade. I don't see Tom getting involved and saying, "We're going to trade him against his will." You know, obviously, he even had a lot of frustration at the end of last year too. With it being made clear to him, they were shutting him down, which looked to the whole world like they were trying to lose those games. To Max, he wants to play. It wasn't a great situation. But again, everything that's happened, like in Max's world, for what I've been told, this is like the sign from God. I was meant to be here, happened for a reason. I want to be in this place. They could have to another terrible start. We'll see where we are coming November. But right now, I believe Max Crosby is going to be a rater. - Okay, so the scenario would have to be raider, struggling, Crosby feeling the unhappiness, maybe a little bit more that I don't have a competitive team again. And then another team that is contention. Or somebody just told him, "Okay, we will do the two ones." And they go to Max being like, "Hey, what do you want to do? Right, do you want to go and compete for a title? We're not going to win it here." Or do you want to stay with us? Like, I'm not saying it's completely, I'm not painting this as like a binary. He, it's totally up to Max. Like the raiders have to do the best thing for the raiders. But he's Mr. Raider. He's the face of the franchise until Fernando assumes the starting role here. There's more to this than just a normal, you know, portraying a guy away. - Okay, Billy, good category. Let me get Tom's take there on Max Crosby. Appreciate that. - But I think Bobby will play. I think Bobby will be somewhere. It's just a matter of when and where. You know, I don't know that the commanders, you know, are right now planning on him being back there. So it's possible that he's going someplace else. I don't believe the Bobby is done. You know, he could go on the hall of fame tomorrow based on where he is. He's 35, 36 years old. But he can still play. If you look at his tackle numbers, I mean, you have like 140 tackles he'd been last year. Like the guy can still play football. I believe he's going to be playing. Johnnu, it's been really quiet. It really hasn't been a great deal of interest. Again, there's these teams that would bring him in. But Johnnu's, he's made a lot of money. And he may not need to do this right now. You know, with Tyrick, it was a significant injury. You can go back and look at what I said on TV at the Super Bowl. You know, the reason that it was clear that Dolphins were going to release him was because they didn't know when or if he was going to be able to play in 2026. That wasn't just an ACL. That was like a whole knee reconstruction. He said himself in a video not that long ago. You know, he doesn't have the power back in that leg yet. So we'll see. If Tyrick plays, it'd probably be somewhere, you know, during the season and maybe ramp him up and try to get something in the playoffs. But it's also possible we just don't see him this year. He does what O'Dell did. When O'Dell member had that awful looking injury in the Super Bowl where he was the best player on the field for like a quarter and a half or whatever it was. And then all of a sudden his leg is like dangling off. He missed the whole year. Came back and the Ravens gave $18 million to go play for him. That could be the Tyrick plan. That's still kind of a shifting thing. There's no clear timetable at this point. But if it happens, I don't think it's going to be really in the near term for Tyrick. What was the last one you said, Billy? I forgot the last one. O'Dell Beckham, you just mentioned him. He's had a good, he's had a good, here's what you have to ask yourself. If you cut him, is any other team get a sign? He's not subject to waivers. In other words, you could release O'Dell, bring him back on the practice squad, elevate him up to three times and save yourself for roster spots. You don't have to put one of your young guys through waivers. I think that O'Dell will be a part of the team. I don't know, I have not talked to O'Dell. I don't know how he would feel about the practice squad route. Some guys are just against that. And it's like, if you want me on the team, keep me up. But if they can come to him with a plan of like, here's how we're going to get you integrated during the season. I could see that being a scenario here. I mean, John is really fond of him. He's had, I mean, I know he dropped that ball in the preseason game, but like, he's had by all accounts. A really good camp. He's still as explosive as plenty of guys in the league. We'll see exactly how it plays out. But I do think that you're going to see O'Dell most likely with the giants. At some point this year, I just don't know in what capacity or exactly when he's going to be a guy that they're going to be really using on the field. That's wild, Billy. How, what percentage of our audience do you think even knew that O'Dell Beckham, Jr. is part of the Giants training camp in the year 2026? I mean, I give our audience huge credit. I feel like they're plugged in on everything, you know. They just know what's going on at all times. It feels like it would be a nice ending to his career, right? If he goes back, he plays the Giants, wraps it up there, but I don't know. We'll see. Billy, what do we got? What's the next category here? All right. I feel like we're picking up steam here. How do you feel about this so far? Yeah, Tom. Feeling better? Yeah. Feeling great. All right. Well, in a story that was broken to me by Tom Pellicero. I don't know if he broke it to everybody. He broke it to me for sure. No takes. He's back. A memo sent out this week, the NFL informed its teams that any player who returns to college will be prohibited from signing with an NFL team the same season. Now, this has come because the NCAA is kind of a disaster at the moment. They're making up rules as they go. Players are leaving. They're coming back. We have our first situation. We're two different players, Xavier on Harris, who was signed by the Saints and released, and Daequan Wright, who was signed by the Eagles release, signed by the Browns released. People for now going back to play for their former coach, Lane Kiffin at LSU. I feel like the players aren't to blame. Maybe you guys feel differently, and this is just the situation where the NCAA has made a mess and now the NFL is having to react to this. Yeah, I need Tom's explanation on this because I found that I find this to be one of the more confusing things that's happening in anywhere in sports this summer. I can't wrap my head around what's going on. I can't wrap my head around who's supposed to regulate it and what the future is going to hold. So, Tom, like Billy said, you gave him, I don't know if you gave him a personal voice memo or text or just sent it on Twitter. He shot it out. He showed us the memo essentially. Okay. We're talking about this. There you go. Tom, explain this to me because I'm very confused. It's a complete mess. And the NCAA has adopted the posture over the past several years that like every matter should be settled in court. You can pick your various fights, you know, take Brennan Sorosby. They could have settled Brennan Sorosby. They could have suspended him and, you know, agreed to a suspension for, you know, probably close to half the year. And instead, they're like, nope, you're not going to play. And if you want to play, you got to fight us in court. And the NCAA, it would make sense to me if they were winning. But they're losing, repeated almost every time this goes into court, you lose. So they're not helping matters. So we're now, the conferences are having to take matters into their own hands because you have these legal rulings, like the one that restored the eligibility. Basically, the short version is players now have been given a 50 year of eligibility while the players who went to the NFL because they thought they were all out sued and said we should have gotten the 50 year. The courts gave it injunction saying, yeah, you can come back. So those couple of players, you mentioned, all right, they're going to go to LSU, Forley being Kiffin who was already not a popular figure, by the way, in the NFL. So nobody within the league is surprised. Is surprised that like Lane is somehow at the center of this. But now the SEC comes on and says, actually we don't really support this. The big 10 says, hey, you can't do this. The NFL is now putting out their own word because and listen to it. Teams were trying to gather information on this over the past week. Because all of a sudden, like, think about this. All right, the cut down is Sunday. It's 6 p.m. Sunday, which is totally ridiculous. And I wanted to get into it the fact that there's preseason games the night before. Nobody has time to assess their injuries, do injuries, settlements. It used to be on Tuesday. It used to be back in the day, it was like last preseason games. Everyone played Thursday, Saturday afternoon cut down. So you have like 36 hours. Then in recent years, it was all right, the preseason games end on Saturday. You got till Tuesday. This year, it's the last preseason games are like late at night on Saturday. And then you have to cut down by Sunday afternoon. So anyway, that's a side story. But so his teams are going through this. And I've had people within the NFL like tell me about these stories, and it's like, all right, we got two defensive backs, right? We only keep, let's say, just to make enough numbers here. We only keep five corners on the team. All right, coaches want this guy because he contributes on special teams. This guy's, you know, maybe got more talent, but he doesn't really play teams. So if we're going to cut it down, we want this guy. And the scouts have to go, yeah, but this guy told us he might go back to college. So you now have a thing where you're trying to figure out who do we keep because our guy's going to bail what happens with the guarantee money. If we owe guarantees, no NFL team has contract language saying, hey, if you go back to college, we don't have to pay you the money because that was never contemplated. The player from the, from the Browns date, what's the name? Declan, right? I think. Yeah. He, I was told gave up his guarantees to get out because part of what the NFL said was, if you're under NFL contract, you have to honor that contract. In other words, you're going to have a legal fight with us. If you just say, I'm leaving for a different contract in college, the Browns came to the agreement. Hey, we'll release you. We're not going to pay you that extra 25 grand that we owed you. He also got $25,000 signing bonus from the Eagles after the draft, which I don't know, can they claw that back? That's a whole other untapped world. But so these are all questions that NFL teams were trying to sort through. And also like, I mean, I've had scouts being like, yeah, this coach texted me who's now on a college step. Hey, can you break down those two rookie runners you've gotten? It's like, no, dude, no, I'm not going to give you the information. So you come. I was going to put on the practice one. So you can come play for you in the SEC like these are real stories that are happening. So basically what the NFL did was just say, hey, all right, here's the rules. If guys are free agent, if he gets cut, he can go back to college if the rules allow him to, which it increasingly appears that they might not actually happen at all. This might be for not. And these guys who went back to the, they're going to play at LSU might end up playing like NEIA ball somewhere in Wyoming because no one else will let them play. But for the NFL team, it's all right. If they're cut, they can go there. If they don't sign with a calls here, if they do, they're free agent, actually, they're not back in the draft. They're free agents like everybody else. But if you cut them, and this is the part that I tweeted out yesterday, if you release a player, you can have like a week, not hey, we'll let you out, but you got to come back in January. We want you back on the team. The NFL finds out that there is a agreement or even an understanding, anything undisclosed where that player's going to go back to the team, then that team can lose draft picks. They can be fined. There are all kinds of different ramifications there. And the same thing, if you go back to college, you can't come back up this season. I mean, that's the image I was, let's say you're to give an example, Garrett Nussmire. I don't think he's getting cut by the chief. Let's say he did, right? Nussmire in this environment could go, hang on, I can make the rookie minimum in Kansas City as the, you know, second, third string quarterback, or I'm going to make five million dollars right now to go to like Texas Tech. I might go for the five million. And then all right, it's October. And now an NFL team loses their quarterback and the, you know, the chiefs lose. My homes are like, Garrett, come back up. We'll pay it. The NFL didn't want to have it be like a minor league type of assistible. These are all like, I can't believe we're having these conversations, like, but I've had them with all these people within the league who like are dealing with this stuff on a daily basis. In the end, it might end up being a big nothing burger if all the conferences say like NCAA, you're a bunch of morons. Why are you going to court? We're just not going to allow this to happen. It might all end up all being for not other than those players who already went in the transfer portal and got themselves cut from NFL teams. But, you know, right now it is, it is chaotic because we are three days away from the cut down deadline. And normally it would be all right. My guy clears waivers, we want you back on the practice squad. That player might now go, actually, you know, university, you know, Nevada wants me on their team. I might go do that. It's just, it's just dynamic. The NFL has never really had to deal with before. How sick is the NFL getting kind of of this dysfunctionancy and NCAA? Because you mentioned Sorosby. So Sorosby for those who aren't aware had a whole, but basically he had a gambling scandal in college and then Texas Tech brought him in and he was in eligible to play. But they found a lawyer like a judge like you're saying, there's always going to be a court where you can find a judge who's going to say, you know what, this player is eligible for college. And because the NCAA doesn't have any control, they just go back. But this caused his whole stir in NCAA. So then eventually his lawyer said, you know what, he's not going to play this year. Texas Tech gave up pretending that they were the victims. And he declared for a supplemental draft that the NFL had not announced. And then the NFL had to come out and say, hold on a second. There's no supplemental draft. You're declaring for something that doesn't exist right now. We're not holding one of those this year and you're not eligible. So this is at least the second major issue that the NFLs had to address that the NCAA is just kind of letting go this off season. 100%. I mean, if you remember what sores be, yeah, the NCAA, like, all right, he was, he lost his eligibility school rule to eligible, the NCAA say he's eligible. He goes to a former district court judge and gets an injunction that says he can play. And then all of a sudden you have multiple state attorney generals involved. You have conference, you have other schools within the conference saying, we're not going to play in schedule, Texas Tech in anything. I mean, and then it all ends as you said with eventually Texas Tech goes, we're not going to win like they're going to find a way to yank them off the field. We just we can't keep fighting like this. So he thinks, all right, now I'm in eligible. I'm dropping my lawsuit. I'm going to go into the NFL. The NFL does something that really doesn't happen, which is they just go, actually, we're not going to have a supplemental draft. We're just not going to do it. So Brendan Sores be is going to be down in Texas this year, basically studying NFL playbooks and gain himself ready for the 2027 pre-draft process. He is eligible to play in the senior bowl, which would be really interesting to see if through five, the answered company, having played in that all-star game is a one time showcase. You want to talk about something that'll bring eyeballs to that game, putting Sores be in it. I would certainly do that. But, you know, there's a bunch of players who listen, Sores be is not effective. I said this many times. You know, he had serious issues at what point it became a compulsion or an addiction that became a problem as opposed to him making poor choices like that's something that is honestly. They called diagnosis, like we can't really get into that, but like he made the choices ultimately that led to it, but he still was caught up in this broader game where everything is such a mess at the college level and the NFL is having to be reactive to a certain degree because the last thing they want to do, they've always had this kind of understanding with the NCAA. Like, where does the whole, you have to be three years removed from high school to enter the NFL draft come from. It's a joint agreement with the NFL and the NCAA because NFL teams don't want 19 year olds coming in and getting the shit kicked out of them. Like they want you to have time to actually physically develop before you're coming into the NFL. So they've always worked together, but now that the NCAA has lost all control over everything to the point that like I wouldn't be shocked if by, you know, a year from now, there's just an SEC Big 10 super conference with like 40 teams and everybody else, ACC, Big 12, or do whatever you want, like you're not part of this and every kid in America is going to want to go to those schools because they got the most money to play in the biggest games during the biggest stage and everybody else is like in a secondary tier. Like that's absolutely what could happen because the NCAA has no control. And again, the legal strategy, I'm not a lawyer, but I would say repeatedly getting your head beat in in the legal process is probably not a good way to calm a massive dysfunction like they currently haven't called. Well, kind of to add to your point of what you're saying too about like, you know, there could be super conferences, everything, what ends up happening with this story of the players trying to go back to the NCAA is now the individual conferences are having their own votes voting that they cannot come back to the NCAA. So now conferences themselves are banning players from going from the NFL back to college, even though they've really only played like pre-season games or training camps. They're not really NFL players, but even the conferences aren't aligned, creating more dysfunction while Lane Kiffin's just like, we'll take anyone, like whoever you watch is come down here. Alex, we got spots. We got spots for you. Exactly right. You know, the team content part of my brain when Tom was describing the Nusmire thing, I'm like, now that would be interesting. He goes to college, he's playing and then a quarterback gets injured. It's mid-October. A team's like, man, he looks pretty good there and he just jumps up to the NFL, that college team gets screwed. So that's not going to happen, but from like a podcast or perspective, I got to admit, I can't believe we haven't seen Pavia file another lawsuit to try to get memory won the lawsuit a year ago to get the fourth year because he had two Juco years. Well, now by the same exact logic, why wouldn't he get a fifth NCAA year if the Juco years don't count? He's not on an NFL team right now. He would be free again, depending on what the rules are. Like, I don't see an offer coming from in the NFL form. He told me Diego Pavia was the Heisman runner-up last year, can't get $5 million like to go even go back to Vanderbilt right now. These are, I mean, listen, and in no way am I saying, like, I shouldn't make all the money that they can. Like, that part of it is great. Like, players shouldn't. could be going and getting all the money that they can, but you have to have a set of rules and a set of established guidelines and which can't happen. I mean, it would be like the equivalent honestly would be if the NFL was just losing over and over in court and then like, you know, the NFC North was like, actually we're gonna have different rules. Like what? What are we doing here? Like that's the equivalent thing. Like you need someone to be in charge here. There's just, there's not enough grownups in the room and the grownups that are in the room all seem like the type of grownups you wouldn't want to be sitting next to at a youth game. - It's chaos and it feels like part of it's out of the NFL's control. All of it's out of the NFL's control. They have to react and try to come up with solutions to some of these issues that they are not creating. All right, let's take one more break. We'll come back with the rest of Billy's categories. This episode is brought to you by Orgain. Go harder and push farther with Orgain Creatine. It helps improve muscle size, strength and power when combined with a regular exercise and weight training routine. Orgain Creatine is certified with informed choice which means it's tested for prohibited substances in sports. Upgrade your performance with Orgain Creatine available at Amazon, Costco, Walmart and Whole Foods. This product is not intended to diagnose, treat, cure or prevent any disease. All right, we are back here on the ring ran NFL show. Where are we Billy? How many more are we gotten? - I think we're halfway done. So we'll just have like, yeah. - We'll see. - We'll see. - Yeah, we'll go through. - Sorry about my short little acquies. - And that last thing. - No, no, no, no, no, no, no. - Honestly, yeah. - If you want, we can revisit the card talk one of one. - Yeah, I'm trying to, I'm trying to remember, was that kind of conversation? - We can't remember that thing. - Yeah, more relevant or less relevant in the past, I'm not sure. - I don't know if you guys can be collectors. - You guys have kids, I don't know if your kids are in this, can I just say one thing, this card thing, I mean, I understand that every like league now is in business with fanatics and tops and all that. It's gonna bust at some point, right? Like, this idea that these cards are just gonna continue to go up and value forever and ever seems insane to me. Like, this is not gonna be a long-term thing. - I'll say this, I was at like my college buddies get together every year in the summer at one of the guys' lake houses. And like this year, somebody went to like a card store, and they live in LA and bought like, I don't even know, 500 packs of old football and baseball cards, like you can get them in bulk. A lot of times they're like, the ones that they manufacture way too many of, so there's not a ton of valuable ones in there. The thrill of opening the pack is real, right? Like the, I don't know what I'm gonna get in here. Like, we opened all these packs, and we got a Randy Johnson rookie card. It was like, that's a pretty good one. Like, I found like old random football players. So like, I pulled a, I pulled a trace Armstrong card and like, I'm like, that's cool. You know, like, oh, that's a cool, you know, just like people, you know, guys that I like know and remember playing. And then, but we got to the end of the weekend. And it's like, someone's like, and what do we do with all these cards? There's just like 10,000 cards, I know. I'm like, I guess we just throw them away, but that seems weird. - Oh, that's wasteful. - All right, but what do you do with them? I'm not gonna bring home 10,000 flair 94 cards. Like, no. - I think as a kid, I liked collecting cards. Then I discovered like, wow, you can just buy the complete sets. So like, you lose some of that. But like, you know, like, I got everybody like, this is a cool little box. It's like 30 bucks or whatever you put in the corner. But like, now the way the cards are going, you're realizing, this is kind of a racket. Like, you need to buy special like $1,000 box of cards where that's where the actual like big money cards are like, it's not like a lottery ticket. You can't just go into like a target or something, buy a pack of cards and all of a sudden, here's an $11 million card in this pack. The more you can read it. - Well, fairly now, that's what they're promising the people. I'd love to see the number of packs, the Fanatics is producing and what the percent chance is. - I don't know. - You know, it's like one of those, it's like the claw machine. It's like, how many things are you gonna pull out of there? They all cost three cents. And then you might get the one big stuffed animal that it doesn't fit down the hole. - All I'm saying, it's odd that Tom Brady opens up his own card store and all of a sudden, some of the most sought after cards just happened to be sold there. It just seems a little weird to me. - You know what this smells like to me? This smells like a Billy Gill offseason deep dive. - I'm gonna invest in a tour and he's coming for your corner. Write that down, Billy, start building the reporting and they will revisit this maybe after the super part. - Can I tell you something about Pablo? - Yeah. - This is off a lot of powerful people. You know what I mean? I know better. I'm not going after big cards here. I'm just gonna say, it's a little fishy and that's about as far as I'm willing to push. - Interesting question. You're just a man asking questions. - So far as we're going. - All right. - What do we got? - Let's get back on track here and let's, again, lightning round, boom, boom, boom, boom. We'll go through quick. I guess we only have five more. So we don't have to go that quick. But preseason revenge game is something that we might be looking out for this week. So, to a tongue of Veloah, former Dolphins quarterback is now gonna be starting in the final preseason game for the Atlanta Falcons against the Miami Dolphins. Earlier this week, your friend possibly faux coworker, Ian Rappaport put out there. He said, "Tua has made it impossible to be named QB one of the Atlanta Falcons based on his play thus far. It seems like the Falcons are just waiting for Michael Penix to come back. Is there anything that Tua can do in this game to actually win the starting job? Is it possible to have a revenge game in the preseason? And furthermore, preseason week three, what are we looking out for? What should we be watching, guys? - Listen, first thing I would say is, somebody's gotta start week one. And if you were just approaching this logically, can you remember a whole lot of quarterbacks? Can you name one quarterback who wasn't cleared for 11 on 11 by what? The third week of August didn't play in the preseason who was in a competition. There's different types of competitions and started week one. That's what I would say. I do think I know that they like Michael Penix there. He's had a lot of injuries. This is his third ACL, I believe. And there's a, the rhythm and time in the temple doesn't come back overnight. So I think it's possible that Michael Penix junior ends up starting the regular season in week one. But right now you'd have to say it's Tua if for nothing else than by default. And listen, I know that the first preseason game didn't look good and there were some memes that came out of that. I would say we overreact sometimes to those things. They run in the most basic concepts. If Tua does play, if in fact he does start this preseason, and then the thing he's just got to do is just go out and function in the office. They've got pretty good players. I mean, if you look around the field and they've paid them all in this offseason, be John and Drake London and Kyle Pitts and some of the other parts that they have on that offense. Like they should be able to go out and be a, you know, a functional offense. If the quarterback just plays on time and gets the ball where it needs to go. If Tua gives them a better chance to do that because he's just had more time on tasking camp, I don't think the Kevin's Defansky would hesitate to put him out there, and also remember, it's a lot easier to go from Tua to Michael Pentax Jr. than it is to name Michael Pentax Jr. The starter with virtually no reps and Tua goes and becomes the number two. That would send a greater message as opposed to, hey, we still believe in Michael Pentax. We want to give him time and make sure he's back to 100%. Let's ease into this season and get to him later. That to me, just speaking logically. I'm not saying anything's done. I would just say logically that makes a lot more sense to me. Well given Pentax's entry history, it seems like a terrible idea to rush him out when he's not ready to play. And you have a 17 game season ahead of you. Like you said, you have talented players like Drake London and Kyle Pits and Bajan Robinson who do not want to go through a season where no one can get them the football where their season is just totally torpedoed because of horrible quarterback play. So if you're the Falcons, you got to keep the long term in mind. But tell my question is, if they're really considering still starting to in week one, why are we starting in the final preseason game? Like they think the reps are that important that we need him to get in a rhythm here again, given his injury history as well. Doesn't that seem a little strange? Where is Jack Strand? But like what are the odds that week one we look up and you're reporting on Sunday morning surprise? Jack Strand is starting for the Atlanta Falcons today. I'm not going to say I invented Jack Strand, but I guarantee I led the national media in Jack Strand reporting before the draft, because he is like, that dude is like, what is he, six foot six and like 230 pounds? He's a huge guy, the huge, he tested off the charts and he was, you know, enough of a prospect that they made a quick move was right after the draft to bring him in, but that's a developmental type of player. Cooper Rush is there too. He started games in the league. We'll see how they end up sorting out that room. But I would not, in any way, read into hey, the preseason didn't look good for Tuah. Maybe you just want to end on a high note. You know, if nothing else, just go out, let everybody feel like they're confident as opposed to, listen, if you don't, if you don't play Tuah this week, you're almost sending the message here. We've already decided it's Tuah. Like, let's put them out there. Let's have one good drive, move the football a little bit and then put them on ice, so let's see. Billy, Tom's got a nice background there. But I think a little invented Jack Strand banner might look good maybe over the right shoulder. Yeah, there seem to be some shelves there. We can put it on a shelf. There's always a couple of those kind of fringe guys that, you know, over the course of time, you kind of feel like you have a personal attachment to, you know, the Scottish hammer, Jamie Gillan, the punter was another one where his nickname came out and then that became a thing before graph. I'm like, I was, I feel like I played a small part in making that a thing before the draft. There was once an Eagles kicker, Billy, and his nickname was murder like, or murder toe. Murder toe. on him and I don't believe he made the team. So to Tom's point, you try to claim your guys when you can, some of them hit, some of them miss. But to answer your point, I'm not looking for a lot in week three of the preseason. Like Tom said, some of these teams are probably like, we have to make cuts maybe less than 24 hours later. We're going to put guys out there who are probably not going to make the roster. They can get some fill. Maybe we want to hide some guys and we're not even going to play them because we don't want other teams to see more film of them. Maybe we want to sneak them on the practice squad. But yeah, I don't think a bunch of stuff is going to be decided. I think what might be more interesting is kind of the trades, the roster moves that happened this weekend, as teams try to get to 53. I've been searching for murder toe. I don't see anything here. I might have got it wrong, but I'll try to look it up here. Give us the next category and I'll look it up. How do you get that wrong? If the name is murder toe, I feel like I'd have a hard time forgetting that. Tom, where listen, I'm an old man. I don't know what you should have yesterday. I'm not going to remember a story. I wrote 10 years ago. After that, I'm just being honest with the audience here. There's the Tokyo toe. There's a rookie kicking in the Tokyo toe this year. Oh, no. That was good. All right. Tom, we got murder toe. All right. That's a weird place to put those signs. So this is another topic. And this is another quarterback controversy we have going on Monday, one of our quarterback controversies came to an end. The Browns head coach Todd Munkin announced that Dishon Watson will be the Browns game one starter this season in Jacksonville versus the Jaguars. Dishon as many know was booed basically off the field in preseason game against the bills at home. Fans are not happy about this situation. This is just a general quarterback mess that's going on. Fans were so upset that they went and they taped signs to a statue of Browns legend Jim Brown. Signs said $280 million, $27 plus victim zero supporters. Another sign read permanent damage to the city and fan base. Again, we're taped to a statue of Jim Brown. If you do a quick Wikipedia search has some stuff in his past. So I don't know that that's necessarily the statue to, you know, tape permanent damage to the city and franchise too. But it is what it is. How do the Browns get out of this quarterbacking mess? The draft one next year. Like, I mean, that's it's as simple as that. They've got two first run picks next year. Realistically, you know, they're on that list of teams. I think we talked about this last week who they're starting in quarterback for 2027 is probably in this year's draft. It's probably not somebody that's on the roster right now. You know, what Todd Monkin said was in part. They opened with two road games. The Sean started a lot of football in the NFL. They think that the ability to function and to play on time. He's just got the best opportunity to allow them to do that. And if you look at Shadour as well as he played in the second preseason game, like there were stuff down the stretch, you know, late in the half that didn't just operationally look like it was off. And that that's the stuff that frustrates Monkin. He knows what he's getting into Sean Watson just from the ability to operate the offense. You put him out there for two games. I mean, the biggest question, Dishon had a good off season. He hasn't played. I mean, he's played 19 games over the past five seasons combined. He has not played since his two Achilles tears during and after the 2024 season. It's been a long time since he played football. But from a football perspective, that wasn't really the concern. Yeah, he may not never be the guy who was considered by plenty of people to be a top 10. If not top 5 quarterback, when he was at his best in Houston, but it's more so about how is he going to do in the game environments? And honestly, a big part of it or at least part of the factor was what happens when he gets booed? What happens when home and away? He's the most hated man on the field. And he's got to hear all that stuff. He's been through all this. There's plenty of guys like this would be if it when Teddy Bridgewater came back after his, you know, gruesome knee injury, like he had a standing ovation when he came in the game and handed off a couple of times. Most players, if you come back from an injury, Alex Smith, when he went back on the field, you get that bump of just like man, he's been through a lot. Like we as much as me not, I might not think Alex Smith is a great quarterback. Like I have empathy for him. I feel like we can, you know what I mean? Like I feel as if this is a guy that I can get behind the Sean for all those reasons. And he wasn't wrong. Listen, in that post game press conference, everyone's picked a part. I don't think that anything to Sean said was wrong. I probably would have rephrased the I don't regret anything in my life part. But in terms of like, you know, the, the fans are booming for something to do with football. There's some football because you just haven't played, but yeah, a lot of it is you, it is like he's absolutely correct in that. It really ends well when you go after the fans, but time on kids got to make a decision that has nothing to do with who's going to get booed and who's not. Just like I was talking about with Atlanta, it's a lot easier to go to Sean Watson starts the beginning of the season. And then you put Shadour in the game that it is to say, we're going to let Shadour leapfrog to Sean right after those comments right after the brutal second preseason game. At that point now, what do you do with the Sean? Do you just say, Hey, do it. The Texans did back in 2021. And we're going to pay you, but just kind of hide in the training room for the whole season. Like, I don't know what you would do. This is kind of the last gasp. And based on how his contract is structured, they have to hold him through this year. They don't have to do anything. But all of the bonus acceleration would take place immediately. It would all come into 2027. You don't want to have that. They did a restructure in December of 2024. And essentially it allows them to push it out as far as 2028 with some of the cap hits, which is just easier to deal with going forward. So I think you'll be on the roster. I don't think they trade them. I don't think they cut them. You know, even if he is not the starter by week three or whenever it is during the season here, but there's no doubt. I mean, there's some pressure on him to try to turn the tide a little bit. He's going to hear it, but he's going to hear less of it if they're too low when they come back on. I think that contract point is the biggest thing. If it wasn't prohibitive to cut ties with the Sean Watson, this to me would be an absolute no brainer. You mentioned he's played 19 games in the last five years, though statistically, the worst season for any category, any quarterback in the last two years was the Sean Watson in 2024 when he actually played and he was terrible. He's never admitted to any wrongdoing. He's antagonizing the fans. I mean, you add all these things up. This would be a very easy conversation in the front office. We got a cut. I mean, Jimmy has said what two years ago that like we swung and we missed on to Sean Watson. And now he is, he is starting at quarterback. You're a brown fanbase who's like, we just want some excitement with some of the young players on the roster. We know we're not going to be very good. And now this guy's going to be out there being our quarterback in 2026. You can see how they're looking at it. Like this sucks. We want to be excited about football. And even if it's like, hey, no, we're getting our quarterback in next year's draft. And Tom's right about that. They've acquired draft capital. They've tried to build an infrastructure where maybe you can plug in a rookie and have success next season. I get where they're coming from. But I do think it's just mostly contract related where even Shadour Sanders is not perfect and was not good last year. We would find another option if you could cut ties with the Sean Watson. So yeah, when he said this isn't about football, you're right to show everybody knows it's not. I mean, now if you were playing great, now, maybe you would hear that same reaction. But obviously it's everything together. It's the off field stop. It's the lack of emitting. You did anything wrong. And then it's you being terrible when you actually got a chance to play quarterback. So, you know, just in terms of fan bases that go into this season with like just having a tough time getting behind their team, even in September, I think the Browns have to be number one on that list. The only other thing I would add would just be the history lesson of how the the Sean Watson trade happened, which I said at the time, that was not a trade. That was free agency. The Texans basically said, here's the price. If you're willing to meet it, you can negotiate a contract. And there was, it was not just the Browns. There were four teams at that time. They were all willing to meet the Texans asking price for the Sean, which was three first round picks plus additional picks. It was massive. The Sean actually told the Browns, they were out because he was not going to go to Cleveland. And the way that they got him was to give him a five year, $230 million fully guaranteed contract. At that time, what other people in the league said, and they were not happy about it was like the Browns just rewrote the entire economics of the NFL. This exact scenario, this as unique as this is. It's things like this, which is why teams don't want to do guarantees beyond two or three years of a deal. When you see fully guaranteed contracts, they're generally shorter. There's none of us know what things are going to be like four years from now. All the other factors, but the only way the Browns were going to get him was if they did this contract that no one else was willing to do. But again, just just as a reminder here, there were four teams lining up with everything going on to all trade for the Sean Watson. And if he had gone someplace else, maybe things are different, maybe the teams better, maybe he plays better, maybe doesn't suffer as many injuries. If he had gone anywhere, including Cleveland and played well, I hear what you're saying. She'll about, you know, not expressing remorse for his actions and those things. He's got a social media presence that I know rubs some people the wrong way. If he plays good football, no one cares. And that's just the bottom line. I'm not being insensitive. I'm just saying nobody is consumed with it. It's the fact that they invested so much in him. It's set them in. I mean, right now they're in the year two of another five year rebuild in Cleveland. The draft class was really good last year. From everything I've been told, it looks really good so far. It's early, but it can camp. It looks really good again this year. They are all building this to place the quarterback in in 2027 and then roll in that division. I mean, think of all the things that can be different in the AFC north of the year from now. We don't know who the stimulus quarterback is going to be. Aaron Rodgers already said it's his last year. Who knows what happens if the Bengals have another disappointing season and what changes could take place there and even Baltimore where they've been trying for two years to get a little more Jackson contract extension done. There could be further evolution of what's happening. with the Ravens. So it's not to say this season doesn't matter. You can never say that in the NFL because, listen, if it's bad enough, everybody can get fired. We've seen that many, many times, but I believe that there's an understanding in the Browns building that, yes, they love if, you know, should door steps up as the franchise quarterback, they'd like if the Sean gives him a chance to win and they don't have to bench him throughout the course of the season. But the odds are pretty good that the quarterback is in the draft in 2027 for Cleveland. And so all that we're talking about right here is one more year of everyone going the Browns are being the Browns before they hope they're going to rewrite what being the Browns means starting next year. It's a great what if for those other other teams that were interested and even other teams that were interested, but maybe didn't quite get to that point as those were. There are other other teams there. I know it's a what if in Philadelphia that is asked like, huh, I think he might have poked around that to Sean Watson situation after 21 and didn't didn't get to that point. But yeah, it is a move that once you get to the point where you fall in love and you're like, we have to have this player and you're willing to go where no other team is willing to go in terms of guaranteeing a contract, you open yourself up to a situation like this and yeah, no one's done it then. So if you're like, they got what they deserve, I don't necessarily disagree with you there, Billy. So wow. By the way, this is off topic, Billy, but yeah, murder. Okay. Yeah, spirit was the kicker. I know we're jumping around here a little bit. Sometimes you want to close the loop on that. I don't know. I didn't get that far. I was carrying on my story and his nickname was murder leg. I feel like I've done more with spear. Well, yeah, I don't know. The spear. That's why it was murderous at different time. You know, all right. All right. There we go. Kerry spear did not expect to get a shout out on the ringer NFL show today. All right, Billy. What do we got? What's the next stop to care? We're going to come off of the Sean Watson and start talking about trading cards. This is where things took a lighter turn off the field more towards like, oh, these are things that are football related but not necessarily the most important second half of the show. Okay. So we'll move on past that hard knocks announced this week with, you know, one week to go in this season's hard knocks training camp with Seattle Seahawks season finale is coming up next Tuesday. It was announced there will be no in season hard knocks this season, but there will be a return next year to the off season hard knocks, which we saw once before, which was the New York Giants famously. We saw Jones, Joe Shane's son telling him you should trade up and get Jaden Daniels. Quote, you only get this job once. Might as well try to win. Of course, they did not get Jaden Daniels and they have not done much winning since then. His son obviously kind of knew something, but it's not just as easy as let's trade up and get the player that I like. That's not how things work. But when they return because teams haven't wanted to be part of that situation because there was some criticism and you're really showing your cards the entire time, they've decided when they come back and they do that off season version, they're going to do it division, which they've done a couple of times in season where they've just covered the entire division. So when it returns, it will be a division in the off season has hard knocks jumped the shark because we got to a point where we had three hard knocks each year. There was the off season one, there was the regular training camp, then there was the in season one. Now there's different versions of hard knocks with different names with quarterback on Netflix. The chiefs have their own version of hard knocks. I think it's called the franchise where they've just kind of followed the chiefs all year long. Are we over hard knocks and all of the spin offs of hard knocks? Is it too much? Because there was a time I felt like it was appointment watching and you'd come in on Wednesday morning or whatever day it was and water cooler talking like you see hard knocks last night, just see what they said. I'll just see what John Gruden did. Antonio Brownie burned his feet. That was crazy. Like what's going on here? And I don't feel that buzz anymore around hard knocks. I like the off season here, Tom. I think this is the right move because in season when they do it, it's like we're trying to watch games every week. We just talked about it. You're trying to catch up. Everyone has their fill of football in November and December. It's not like, oh, we need more football here. The off season. You're hungry for football. And for me personally, I can't, you know, be like, oh, let me put myself in Patrick Buhomes' shoes and feel what it's like to have this defensive tackle bearing down on me. But you know what? I can be a smart ass and just be like, Joe Shane, what are you doing? If I were Joe Shane, I would have done X, Y and Z. And I think other fans feel like this. So you do that in the off season. I thought that was a great hard knocks with the giants in the off season where you're seeing how ownership comes in. You're seeing the conversation with coaches. You're seeing how you stack the draft board for agency calls with agents. That is a very fun time in the NFL calendar. And I like it, Tom. I'll be tuned in to the off season hard knocks. The Giants off season of hard knocks is the best football show inside football show that I've ever seen. And yes, there were, there were great like some of the classic hard knocks seasons. Like we all remember, you know, the jets with Rex Ryan. You can think back to, you know, the the browns when it was Hugh Jackson versus Todd Haley in every meeting. Like that was a pretty entertaining one. To me, where hard knocks started to change away from, you know, what I would say is the most relevant stuff. It's not just the, all right, we don't want to show some teams, just we don't want to show a guy getting cut. Those are really interesting moments in like highly emotional. Some teams just fill us off the like, that's a private thing. We don't want to do it. Like that's part of it. But it's also like you talk about the Antonio Brown thing where one episode ended and it was that same afternoon, the episode aired and it was Antonio and his agent Drew Rosenhouse like walking on to the field. And that had just happened that day. Then all of a sudden in the seasons that followed, you were weak behind. It would be like the following Tuesday and you'd be like, it would end with the preseason game from the prior Thursday. And a bunch of things would have had happened since that to me was part of the lure of hard knocks training camp was the like you would actually get news sometimes from it. Like you would see what happened with that transaction that happened that day. You would know what happened with that guy's injury and how they're feeling about it the day after. Once you got like five days behind, there was no real news urgency to watch it. And so that was a change with the giants. The reason that I liked it was it was very honest. It was very open. It explained to people for all the the people who are like the cap doesn't exist. I hate that entire line of thinking every dollar you spend hits the cap eventually. So they were actually explaining when you're budgeting and how you're doing it with cap dollars and cash dollars. And the sake lawn part of it, which like when you heard when I heard Joe Shane's explanations like their studies on like all right, running backs over whatever was running backs over age 27. And like what their durability is now letting me they maintain their production. That spoke to me because I'm like, all right, I understand the logical where Joe got burned on that was sake one went to the Eagles and ran for 2000 yards and won the Super Bowl. It's like literally the worst case scenario because you're carefully thinking like the odds tell you this that's that's a big part of it in scouting in you know, the medical and your valuing players coming out in the draft of reagents. You're not just going all right. This guy's the best player. It's also like, all right, well, what are the odds? How many games is he going to play? How long is he going to be productive? Are we an OM guaranteed money? And to show him lots in case several years after he's functional and playing at the same level right now like that's what they're looking at was sake on which was yeah, he had a good year. But like he'd also had a bunch of injury years like what are the odds? He's going to stay healthy. We're going to pay him this much where we can go and pay a couple of offensive line and then we go and draft Tyrone Tracy and we put it together that way. Instead like logically it made sense. But then it becomes indefensible when the guy goes out there but like we none of us have the benefit of hindsight we're making decisions. Outcome based analysis is dangerous. So to me, what they did was fantastic. And I'm thinking nothing away from the Eagles or sake one, happy for everybody involved, but like it didn't hurt. It definitely hurt other teams willingness to be that open and honest because the outcome was so bad that everyone could just go see, told you, told you, if sake wanted had sprained an ankle in week two and it'd run for like 900 yards in the season and the Eagles had been wanting down the plastic, we're up talking about it that way. The Giants still could have not wanted a lot of games. We would have looked at everything differently because of the benefit of the of hindsight. Yeah, it really wasn't a crazy decision at the time when you look at the state of the Giants franchise and where they were allocating dollars and premium positions. I mean that had tried to pay them. They tried to pay safe one multiple times. They tried to pay them at the buy year before. They tried to pay them. The best offer they made them was in March before the franchise take. Once they tagged him, his leverage went away because they had him at a lower number than what they would have had if they had just paid the guy. So the numbers weren't going to get better. You know, sake one, maybe, you know, there were times where you may not have gotten the best advice through the course of the process. He ended up with a great deal in Philly. And then last year, I mean, tell me how impactful sake one was. If it was last year's sake one, you said a two years ago, sake one, you'd probably go, all right, I get where the Giants were coming from. That was tough. Billy, when the owner comes in and says like, I'm going to have a hard time sleeping if he gets, if he signs with the Eagles there. So Tom's right. It ended up being basically the worst case scenario for her, you know, a GM. And I understand why other teams would then be hesitant to do it. But I'm glad that they're doing it because I think Tom's right, it made for good content. It takes you behind the scenes in an area of the NFL that we can't just see as the games are played on Sunday. So I like it. All right. You want two quick topics here to wrap up the show. Let's wrap it up. What do you got? All right. So we talked about how the NFL takes money anyway that it can. A commercialized everything tries to make a quick book as part of the quote unquote year of the Super Bowl, which is what it's being dubbed by Disney and ESPN and ABC because ESPN, where it's first Super Bowl this year. The NFL and Disney have reached a collaboration along with champion and fanatics once again, as well. And fanatics in which every NFL team has had, has been made a Disney pairing with a classic Disney character. Each team has been assigned a character. They are now selling merchandise. That is the official character of the team. So if you live in Minnesota, per se, the Minnesota Viking, character is from the Marvel Cinematic Universe Thor is now Minnesota's Disney character Philadelphia. I have no idea if you're kidding about all this, but no, this is absolutely set up. This is that would be a good thing. He makes up one of these. Yeah. Give me a team. I'll tell you who their Disney character is. The Eagles have Doctor Doom. Each team has been assigned a Disney character. They're now selling merchandise with the character. If you like the Giants, I hope you like Wreck it Ralph because that is now your character for your team. If your device is out, you can buy it probably way overpriced on the internet. Do you guys have a team, a character I guess that would represent you? You seem to be a Joker fan, Tom, or a fan of the comic books. Do you guys have anyone you'd like to represent you as a team from Disney or elsewhere in the world? I do not. I want nothing to do with this and just a PSA for the listeners out there who are parents. Let's, you know, without throwing any one under the bus. Let's check the quality of the merch before we're shelling out those big bucks. Let's make sure the characters names are spelled correctly and then it actually looks like them and that the sizing is right. I'm just looking out for the consumer out there, Tom. That's all. I have no thoughts at all on anything ESPN or Disney are doing. I've missed it. That's safe. Five games on Netflix this season. Starting out week one in Australia, Rams 49ers can't beat that match up. Maybe you can have one of the K-pop demon hunters be one of your official mascots there, Tom. What do you think? I've seen that one a number of times. I've heard that soundtrack about a hundred times over in the car, so sure, why not? Fantastic. Pivot by Tom there. Bill. Yeah. That's a good move by him. Honestly, I probably should have exercised better judgment on my part. Captain Hook, the Buccaneers official mascot, if anyone was wondering about that. Not interested. No comment. Like Tom said. All right, Bill. Real quick last topic before we head out. I wanted to give you guys the opportunity. If you wanted to utilize the Ali partner Tim Curry, not Tim Burton, who may have been mentioned earlier in this episode, he's still very much with us. Any thoughts on Dolly or Tim, either one of you? I don't know that I have anything that anyone else hasn't said. Dolly Parton does seem to have like a universal approval rating, where every corner of my life that I'm looking at is like, oh, everybody actually loves Dolly Parton. Yeah. And there's not a lot of people that you can say that about. So that's all I have on it. Tim Curry is one of the great that guys of all time. I think there's a lot of people who are like Tim Curry and then you show a photo of like, oh, you know, whatever, home alone too. Like he had so many memorable roles, but it was never somebody who was like in the public consciousness of like, you know, a superstar. He had this way of playing villains that was very unique. You know, I think there's something to be said for, and again, he was a very famous actor going all of that to Rocky Horror Picture Show. But the fact that you can go that long and never be like the a-list guy, but being that many classic movies and like the moment you seem to like, oh, this guy, this guy's going to elevate the movie like that to me is Tim Curry. What do you got, Billy? You got something here for us? No. They just sat both either. No. Okay. So what a fan of both, you know, it's sad Dolly would obviously. It's just weird how like, you know, celebrities and people say this like rule of three or whatever with three people go both on the same age within, you know, a day of each other just kind of a sad thing. So it's a sense of inspiration, Dolly, Tim's families. I got to be honest, some when I thought we were doing 10 most interesting, fascinating people for this episode, I was sure that there was going to be a genuine conversation that we were going to have to be very careful about as we discussed it on here. But you know what, Billy, a lesson for young journals, if you got to do a list of 10, do a line and then wait if anybody, you know, might pass away and then that can be your tent there. A good lesson for procrastinators everywhere. I didn't want to put you guys in a bad spot also because things are still coming out in that story and it's kind of like, how do we present that? We're still, you know, learning things. Okay. I like that. Maybe the next episode. There will be more episodes. I think we'll see if that ends up being the case. Alright. Thank you to Billy Gill. Thank you to Tom Heller, Sarah, those are 10 stories that I think have our attention. This summer as we approach, cut down day, the end of preseason and the start of the regular season. Also, thank you to Christopher Sutton for producing Stefano Sanchez on video and additional production supervision by Connor Nevins and Arjuna Ram Gopal. I'm Sheila Gopal. See you next time on the ringer NFL show 21 plus and present in select states for Kansas in affiliation with Kansas star casino or 18 plus and present in DC Kentucky or Wyoming gambling problem called 1-800 gambler or 1-800 my reset call 1-888-789-7777 or visit ccpg.org/chat in Connecticut or visit mdgamblinghelp.org in Maryland. Hope is here. Visit gamblinghelplinema.org or call 800-327-5050 for 24/7 support in Massachusetts or call 1-877-8 hope and why or text hope and why in New York for Louisiana called 1-877-770-78677-867.