Taking A Top Student’s Profile To The Next Level [Case Study]

[Music] Welcome back. My name is Sam Hassel. And in today's episode, we are going to be taking a look at yet another case study that was submitted. So we've done, I want to say, maybe three or four of these for students who are in grade 11 or lower. We've done a lot of 10th graders and this is going to be yet another 10th grader. So we did, I think, through four of these back in November and December. We had a whole bunch of you who submitted, sort of, applied for this case study. And so we do still have all those emails. We will still be kind of going through and revisiting those case studies and the emails that everybody sent in on a rolling basis. So we do have them in the archive. And so we're going to be returning to this and doing a case study for a 10th grader here. So let's dive in. The students gave us her demographics, her academics, her testing, her awards honors, extra curriculars. And so we'll go through everything here. So let's start off with the demographics. She is a female. She's Indian, Indian American. She is from a, I won't give the particular state. Obviously, I've removed it for privacy purposes. She is from a state in the United States that I would say is like a middling state in terms of sending students to top colleges. It's not a, you know, it's not Wyoming or Mississippi. It's not an extremely underrepresented state, but it's also not New York, New Jersey, Massachusetts, California, Texas, you know, Florida. You know, Maryland. It's not one of the bigger, bigger states in terms of sending students to top colleges. Her intended major is she put computer science, potentially data science. We'll talk about that a little bit more. And then as I mentioned, she is in grade 10 in terms of academics. So she put here, she has a 4.0 on weighted GPA and a 4.22 weighted GPA. Now again, weighted GPAs are very difficult to basically assess because the scales are different for all different high schools. So really the more noteworthy thing here is the 4.0 on weighted GPA, which means that I mean, hopefully she has perfect grades. I don't know what this looks like on her poor card. It could just be that a 4.0 is above a certain grade threshold, but the school actually has the actual one to 100 grades on the transcript. I don't know exactly, you know, we don't have our full transcript here about. Let's hope that basically she has a perfect and flawless transcript before any waiting in terms of the rigor of her courses. So again, as I mentioned before, you want to view your grades, not even GPA, but your grades. It's just in her case that it was a 4.0 on weighted. Hopefully again, it's a clean sheet of all the highest grades in every single class. But you really want to look at the actual grades and the actual transcript. The GPA is sort of an average, and so it doesn't necessarily show you the variance or all the different grades and in what subjects. So the two construct are grades and then separate from that course rigor, not combining the two and coming up with a weighted GPA, but you have your grades. Okay, how good are your grades? That's one criterion. And then separate from that, you have your course rigor. So we'll look at her course rigor with her freshman year courses and her sophomore year courses, sort of freshman year. She took AP computer science principles pre calc slash calc accelerated accelerated biology accelerated English nine accelerated world history French three and then intermediate coral ensemble. And she put only 10 freshman out of 50 who auditioned got in. And so we'll see this bit of music piece will sort of emerge a little bit in terms of some of her positioning and her resume. Now is important in terms of, you know, the sort of core academic classes and whatnot. So what am I looking for in terms of her, her classes here. So as we mentioned the podcast we're looking for that the student is taking all the core classes. And so she is in freshman year she's taking all the core classes. And then we're looking of course for, you know, how challenging other courses. So she's ready and pre calc and calc and accelerated in ninth grade. Right. So she's really here about two grades ahead or so compared to many students. And so that's very good, particularly for a student who's lean towards STEM. And obviously she's advantage as well being in STEM given that she's a female applicants depends what area of STEM if it's biology not so much biology is more female dominance. But for something like computer science, it's used strongly the strongly mouth. So that's obviously to her benefit. So she's quite accelerated a math probably about two years ahead of most students. She's got the EP computer science principles already in ninth grade, which is good. And it's obviously relevant to her admissions hook. At least what she thinks her positioning is. And then she's got accelerated levels and biology, English and history. And then French three, I'm going to assume there's probably not an honors level offered. I don't know. Again, this all depends on the context of the students high school. And what sort of course, right, her is offered by their school, but she has a very rigorous schedule. And she is taking all of the all the core classes. And then she also has on top of that AP computer science as well. So she has basically six classes here. Then for her sophomore year courses. So she went from AP computer science principles to AP computer science a as a typical. She is taking AP calculus BC this year in 10th grade. So again, about two years advanced more advanced than most students who are taking COP BC by senior year. We see many, many students who are in STEM who are years ahead of the typical curriculum. And so you just have to understand that. Where you're going to be need don't she is taking AP physics, see mechanics in 10th grade. So again, very accelerated taking calculus based physics by 10th grade. She's also taking in science accelerated chemistry and then accelerated English 10 and then French four. And then she put here as well. Coral select ensemble. This is the top coral ensemble. Let me three sophomores made it in and the choir itself is made up of the top 20% of the program. One thing I want to point out is I don't see all the core classes for 10th grade. So I don't see a history class. I don't know if that's an omission. I don't think it's an omission because she's taking so many science classes and then the computer science. So she basically has here six classes and three of them are almost she almost has three sciences now, AP computer science, not typically, you know, it depends on how the school sort of classifies that such traditional science class. It's also not really traditional math class. And so just sort of consider that's like sort of another, you know, slash a lacto class. But she is doubled up in terms of taking accelerated chemistry as a science and then also taking a music see. So she's doubled up there and that is the AP computer science elective on top. And so my guess is that she just basically ducked out of the history. And as many of you know, I have mentioned many, many STEM students do this. You see again and again and again. I wouldn't be surprised at this point if there's some sort of, you know, like whoo book that all the STEM students are all following because they all seem to do the same stuff where they double up they accelerate enemy basically cut some of the social sciences or the humanities classes, the progression, they're short. So that is something you don't really want to do. I would suggest to the student that you get back on the history grind in a lot of grade. I don't even, I mean, history is usually, you know, obligatory, especially in 10th grade. So I don't even know how she's kind of getting around the history stuff here. Anyway, that is something that you don't want to have as I mentioned many times top colleges are looking for you to be fairly well rounded academically inside the classroom. And so she wants to go take you know, and double up and take some stuff that's fine. But as I mentioned in our last episode, you don't want to do this like plus one or plus two in terms of, you know, optimizing your STEM rigor. But then you're sort of taking a step back when it comes to your other subjects. Right. So, you know, maybe you can't take, maybe she can't take accelerated chemistry and a music see and a computer science and take all three of those, but maybe she could take two out of the three and keep her history alive. Right. And again, I've mentioned, you know, other solutions you can take classes externally, potentially, you don't want to again sort of do this sort of deliberate optimization in one part of your academics and then deliberate de optimization another part of your academics. And you don't really ideally want to break the core maxims and guidelines of not taking core classes if it can be avoided. All right. So I don't have an issue. Obviously she's also doing well. You have to make sure that you can still pull off is if you're taking this type of very rigorous schedule and doubling up. But it seems like she's pulling it off quite successfully. But again, I don't like this sort of like I'm going to plus two on the STEM side and then minus one of the social sciences, the man any side. Could you say it's more relevant to her admissions hook. Yes, yes, but you don't want to give admissions officers reasons to not word for your application for them to be a red flag. Right. And so you really have to sort of make sure that you're not doing again this sort of like plus two over here in STEM, but then mine is one on the other side. you are. expect it to still be an academically well-rounded student when it comes to inside the classroom, not outside the classroom. When it's outside the classroom, you can ignore history and English and all these subjects all you want. And you can 100% focus on what you're really good at and what you really care about and what's interesting and unique, but not when it comes to inside the classroom. It's just not a good, it's just relieving holes in your candidacy and you're also intentionally putting them there. So again, it's like sort of, you know, it's like you're basically pouring, the students like pouring a bunch of water into a glass thinking they're filling it up, but they're also at the same time kind of creating holes in the glass and some of it's leaking out, right? It's like this sort of again, you know, it's like you're taking two steps forward, but then one step back because you're, you know, you're giving emissions out of those, you know, you're giving the impositives like, oh look, this student is really accelerated, they're doubling up, but then you're also giving them issues as well because you're not taking core classes like history, all right? And again, this can depend by the college and the emissions committees and, you know, whether in engineering committee or faculties reviewing you versus a liberal arts committee or what the college is, but I just don't really believe in giving emissions officers a reason to have issue with the part of your application, right? And so I just don't like that that strategy of doubling up or tripling up, you know, as a STEM student or whatever it is, even if it's, you know, vice versa. Based on your strengths, I don't like deliberately de-optimizing a part of your candidacy and breaking the rules unless there's a very strong, strong compelling reason. And I think the students, I think they could still take history here and still get pretty advanced STEM rigor as well at the same time. So I would refer that that be the case. Okay, so so far through sophomore year, she will have four AP classes, two of them are in computer science, which is, she says is, you know, her main hook or her main interest, she has four AP classes. She's two years ahead in terms of math, even compared to most, that's again, two years ahead for students getting to Calc BC by senior year, which not every student does. So she's pretty advanced in terms of math. She's also again taking Calculus-based physics by 10th grade, and then pretty much all of her other classes are accelerated. So very good there, very rigorous in terms of, you know, her course rate or her grades, there's not really much that you could say outside of that history issue. Then in terms of testing, so her PSAT was a 1430, I'm assuming this was taken in fall 10th grade, probably. So 1430, 670 on the verbal part, 760 on the math. So verbal's not, you know, verbal's not exceptional. So I have to see how that sort of comes out. It's not a, it's not a bad score. She's also obviously in 10th grade, and I'm sure that she'll do pretty well on the SAT, but that verbal's not a, I wouldn't say it's top notch. She played here planning on taking the ACT junior year, and potentially the SAT this summer. So I don't know why she would have to wait to take the ACT junior year. I've mentioned before that a lot of students and parents have contingencies that don't need to exist, or they have requirements that don't need to actually exist. So I'm not really sure why we need to wait until junior year. I imagine that's maybe something related to like timing with like her, her, you know, the difficulty of her course is this year. I don't know what it is. Most students that I've mentioned should be starting to, you know, turn the band into SAT and ACT prep about halfway through 10th grade. So basically right about now and ideally buy around the summer. So she put SAT this summer. So I'm not sure why she's waiting on the ACT until junior year. I'm also not sure why she feels the need to take both the SAT and the ACT. So that's totally not necessary. I've seen this in other students cases as well, but they have both an SAT and an ACT, and they're just, you know, it's like a 35 ACT, but they're still, they still want to take the SAT. It's just like you're wasting your time. I don't know why you're doing, right? You do not need to take both the SAT and the ACT. If you get a 35 ACT score and assuming there's no really low subsection scores, you're done. So I'm not really sure why she feels compelled to take both the SAT and the ACT. I would say take diagnostic tests for both of them. Go get, you know, full length exams, see which one you're better on, SAT or ACT. You could even potentially use the PSAT score, the 14th or 13th or you potentially as a proxy. Even for the SAT, I probably would just go take a full length SAT diagnostic exam online or, you know, a tutoring company or tutoring center and just see which one is the better exam and then just prep for that basically and try to get it knocked. You try to get it knocked out by the summer going into junior year is generally not pretty ideal timeline or early in junior year. So you just get it out of the way. Again, there's just no, there's no reason to either take the SAT and the ACT both of them together. It doesn't add any benefit to your application. You're just wasting time and you're potentially getting less focused because you're dividing your attention between two exams potentially. There's no reason to do that sort of dual strategy and there's no real reason necessarily to wait that long to take the ACT and junior year as you sub. So like I said, that could probably be accelerated. Just figure out which test is the better test. Go all in on that test and try to try to bring it out by summer or fall of junior year. Okay, let's look at her awards and honors. So she put here USA computing Olympiad, Silver level tier. She finished 12 plays at a state competition for the Scythering round. And she put that that's a statewide math competition only 100 qualify. She qualified for a regional math league. I'm sort of removing some of the names. She won first place in a local cyber security capture the flag event. Fifth place at a tech showcase for tech showcase project. She got the National French Exam gold medal twice outstanding choral actor award. Ninth grade math medallion, which was given to the student who's the best at math competitions in the grade. She won first place in the 10th grade division and then second place in the 9th grade division math contest. She is part of an extremely competitive, she put part of extremely competitive audition to groups in music. I removed the names again just for privacy purposes. And then she has a state level, she's superior ratings in state level music. Again, some of these titles I've sort of changed them around a little bit. So a little bit more awkward just for privacy purposes. If we look at her honors and awards, they are definitely pretty solid, especially for a 10th grader. And so I'm going to kind of go through them a little bit. Silver level, silver level in USA computing Olympiad. It's not really top notch to sort of be in a better tier. I would say for top 20-ish, you know, sort of what we typically define as top colleges, broadly speaking, top 20, top 25, top 20, top 30. You really want to generally be up to the goal level. I think silver in the United States is probably around two or three thousand or so students are at the silver tier. When you get up to gold, I think it's around maybe somewhere in the high hundreds to maybe a thousand high school students. And then once you get to the platinum level, I think it's somewhat rounds 200 students or something like that just off the top of my head. So in terms of the tiers and the levels, ideally, should really want to bump up to gold by the time of application. Platinum is not as easy, obviously. And there's just a very big inflection point going from silver to platinum. But platinum is really more of a differentiated level, particularly for top 10 colleges. So if you get up to gold, it's definitely a noteworthy level for I would say, you know, top 20 or so colleges. Platinum is really more of a standout for top 10 colleges. So our silver levels probably about age appropriate. And she should probably be able to get up to the gold level by the time that she applies to college. And so that's that's fine. It's nothing that's standout yet. But it's potentially on trajectory to be solid. I would expect that she get up to gold level. I would not plan her getting to platinum level by the time of applying. In terms of the sort of math awards, she has a lot of sort of state competitions or regional level awards. In a state that is not necessarily, you know, it's not really a breeding ground for top math talents. And so it's a lot of high school level awards. You know, it's sort of, you know, state competition. She has some of these that are also, you know, so cyber security first place. And so these are definitely pretty solid awards. In terms of her math prowess, you know, she's not, there's many different tiers. When you're sort of talking about like very like strong math, students. She's probably in tier one, which is a student who's strong at a high school or regional level and maybe less competitive region. And then there's many tiers. There's a huge pipeline all the way straight up through international math, there's many different levels. She's a tier one 1.5 student in terms of she's a strong student at a high school or regional level. But she's also again 10th grade and so it's definitely solid. She is also more underrepresented. She's particularly underrepresented in computer science, a little bit less so in terms of the, you know, depends on what you're looking at in terms of the competitions. But math is much more, you know, females are more under, they're underrepresented, but they're even more underrepresented. Generally speaking in computer science and math is obviously the competition. It is much more longstanding than it is for computing competitions as well. So definitely very solid profile in terms of by 10th grade already having some very good STEM awards. And then she has some that are a little bit sort of outside of sort of math or computing. So she has these sort of musical awards. She's part of these extremely competitive auditioned groups. She has a national French exam. That's like, oh, hi, it's nothing sort of like stand out, but it's not really the core of her candidacy. Sort of like nice to have. It might be overflow awards and like the additional information section. And then she has again like extending a choral actor awards. She has some of these musical awards. And then again, sort of like the computing or the tacking, oh, she has the fifth place. And this tack showcase project. So several sort of computing or tack related awards, some high school or regional level math awards. And then some related to her music background as well. Okay. In terms of extra curriculars. So she put these in no particular order. So secure to job at live by potion low, a prestigious competition math tutoring organization. So a lot of STEM students, as I mentioned before, do like STEM tutoring. And it's just a very, very cliche activity. Right. Just not different cheating at all. That being said, this is a step or two up versus just any tutoring position. So for those of you who don't know, potion low is a professor at Carnegie Mellon. He is the former coach of the team USA, Olympiad team. And so he's a pretty well known figure, especially in competition math. And so this is a, you know, this is a pretty, it's a much more notable position when it comes to math tutoring versus just a student who's doing peer, you know, peer, peer math tutoring. Being said, it does sort of underscore the importance of making sure that your activities and your awards are pretty clear, especially if they're more impressive or something more impressive about it, you have to make sure that gets through to admissions officers. I don't know that every single admissions officer off the top of the top of their head knows who potion low is, or is tutoring organization per se. So you do probably need to describe that a little bit more to the best of your ability if you're putting in the application because she just put here a prestigious competition now tutoring organization, but like a procedure is very non-specifixive virgin air term. And this is what a lot of students do in their application. They just put a word like prestigious, but that doesn't really tell me anything, right? And so prestigious is an extremely subjective word. So you do have to put something like potion low, you know, former college of the math Olympia, you know, like how hard it was to get into the tutoring organization, they selected this number of students out of this number if it's impressive, et cetera, et cetera. So you do have to make sure that you make these things clear if you have something that's legitimately impressive, but might not be as well known by admissions officers. Then she put competitive CS, participate in the USA coding Olympia. It's not really an activity because it's more of a skill or a competition. And so I have in some of the application reviews sort of flexed between something that's sort of an award or an activity. Sometimes it'll take something that's an activity and I'll put it in the award section. Sometimes vice versa. Sometimes I'll split it and I'll take the same thing. I'll put the award part of it and put in the award section. And then I'll put the, you know, the sort of the doing part of it, right? The process part of it as an activity. It just depends on the optics of the students' application, how many awards do they have? Are they late on the awards? Is this something that I want to turn into an award? Because that is a title that's related to the students hook. And I want that, I want that throughline or that keyword to be in the award section as well. And so it just depends. That being said, generally speaking, just participating in the USA, she put coding Olympiad. It's not the coding Olympiad. It's the computing Olympiad. She should know that. But yeah, it's not really an activity. It's more of a competition. And so I wouldn't really consider those much of an activity. Benchipa competitive math, co-president of the math club. So that is a legitimate activity. And then one multiple regional award. Does it really, you already know for her honors and award section? She put top choral ensemble leader in the choral program and taken many computer-need performances plus selected audition groups. Then she put GV, Acapella in 10th grade, freshman Acapella in 9th grade. It participate in a selective Acapella group. My school offers 30 across varsity, GV and freshman out of 150 in the choral program. And then she put sound engineer for Acapella, one of three people who manages the sound system for performances. And then she put co-president of computer science club, I have taught people multiple concepts such as React, HTML, CSS, game development, etc. Additionally gathered all the females and have together she put and have together wins. It should be have together gone to conferences designed to get women into STEM. Benchia is an insforate. I think that's how you pronounce it. This is like a private organization. AI scholars, a summer program participant learned about AI and ML, machine learning, and made a music recommendation engine in a span of two weeks. Recreational piano been playing for eight years and classical Indian dance been dancing for eight years. And then she put at the moment some other things I'm anticipating will happen. Likely securing internship at a local company. And in the process of deploying a project to aid my choir with selecting a solo repertoire for competitions. Okay, so I'm going to sort of just recap that because that was a lot in terms of her activities. So the touring organization with Potion Low, that's nice. It's not a standout activity, but it's nice and it's much better than most STEM kids, you know, math tutoring that they do. The participating in the coding lumpiaid, again, the coding computing lumpiaid, not really an activity, so disregard that. She is co-present in math clubs, that's solid. This is sort of just school level club leadership. So it's not absolutely like a standout for top colleges, but it's still nice to have its relevant her interests with math and tackens computing. So that is solid at a school level. She has these various music activities, so she's a leader in the choral program. She has these selective audition groups, which is again, bit of activity, bit of an award. She has some selectivity there in terms of these different choral programs. This is the one that I really like a lot because I think this is going to be what her actual hook should be versus what I think she maybe thinks it is. And again, hook is not a major, right? So when she put sort of at the top, she put a computer science and data science, those are majors. That's not necessarily what a hook is. A hook is something that is basically your mission story, it's your themes, it's your interest, majors, that's what you convert a hook into, right? So a hook gets converted into what it looks like at the college campus, right? And so it gets converted into majors, it gets converted into minors, it gets converted into certificates, it gets converted into the classes, it gets converted into working with specific professors in the classroom, it gets converted into specific types of research, it gets converted into specific types of clubs, activities, extra curriculars. Your hook is basically your interest and your themes and the throughlines and the strengths of your application, right? But then there's a translation process and that occurs in the application and that hook needs to get translated and sort of distilled into what it will look like at the school, right? And so on that other side of the translation process is certainly is the majors, that's the biggest part, I would say that's the thing that most people most associate with a hook, right? Because the major is sort of like very big subjects and disciplines and very large themes, but a hook is not synonymous per se with a major, it's very easy and convenient, I'll even do this as well, I'll say this soon as a cognitive science hook. And that's fun, they could have a cognitive science hook and then also be applying for cognitive science, but a lot of colleges also don't even have cognitive science, right? And so So that student's majors may vary how their hookun and gets translated me very on a school by school college by college basis and it will inevitably change in terms of the professors or research projects or extra curriculars. That will definitely change in a school by school basis as well. And so hook is not necessarily per se. It's very adjacent conceptually to a major, but it's not exactly the same thing. And so what I sort of come up with in terms of the student's hook and what I would suggest going forward, it's not necessarily just going to be pure computer science or even data science. I think that will be part of it and those will definitely be relevant fields, but I think it will be bigger than that in prior little bit more interdisciplinary. It's sort of subsumed more of the student's strengths and some other interesting creative themes that will help differentiate her from other STEM applicants. And so to that ends, we're sort of starting to lean in that direction. This activity, the sound engineer for Acapella, I love. And why do I love it because it's taking our STEM skill sets and our STEM interest, but applying it to the more creative part of her background, which is the Acapella and the music. And so this is what we refer to as a nexus activity. This is when a student has a couple of different hooks or strengths, right? And there's an activity that glues them together. It's a nexus, it's a bridge, right? So she's a sound engineer for Acapella, one of three people who manage the sound system for performances. So I love that activity. She's a co-president of the computer science club. She has taught people multiple concepts that we already talked about. And she also has the sort of like females and STEM theme, which is okay. I think this is fine. If you're like, if this is really, really important to you, the females and STEM, then by all means you could make it a much bigger part of your mission story. I don't, I think the student already has something that's even more compelling and even more supported. It looks like by the evidence here and their activities. So I don't think she really needs to hammer into this like females and STEM too much. And I don't see it evidence anywhere else. I think it's a theme that potentially you could hit in like one of your essay questions in the supplements and the applications. I don't think she's probably building a whole candidacy around it or even it's probably not even really a secondary tertiary theme of her resume building. But it could be like a tertiary theme in her applications, right? Just you know, a sort of when you, when a school for those four essay questions that you were five supplements, you can't say the same thing four or five times, right? You got to kind of hit. You have to kind of keep dancing around the same topic. So you hit different aspects. It's sort of like a hub and spoke model. You hit the core interests in different ways. So a student could be interested in the environment, but they have an activism component to it. They have a hard core science or research component to it. And so you're hitting the same topic, the same hub from different spokes, right? And this is what prevents basically redundancy or just being extremely repetitive in the essays is that you're talking about the same area, but you're hitting it from different angles, right? I have the sort of the music plus the stem or the music plus attack, but then I have the female. And so it could be sort of a third, fourth, fifth, you know, essay question or topic or something more. If it's just a better, if it's a topic that's better suited for particular prompt, that being said, it is a little bit like the sort of the females and stem is like a little bit cliche. I feel like at this point, and if you're in biology, like the females, I don't even know what you're talking about because you're overrepresented in biology. So like, you know, like very tone death, if you're talking about like females and stem and you're you're applying for biology, it's like you haven't really done the math correctly. To understand that you are the dominant of the two sexes in that field. If it's something again, like on the back end in terms of just like statistical and emissions and you're interested in the physics or computer science of the student, she definitely has an advantage. And particularly, this sort of gets to the positioning. She will have a much bigger advantage. She applies for engineering than if she applied to the little art of the arts and sciences college at a university at a top college. So that's definitely the case. All that being said, she will get the benefits of being a female and being underrepresented regardless. She doesn't have to hit that theme in her resume building per se. I don't think it's a big theme for her resume building. It could be just sort of a peripheral essay response. She then has this sort of this AI scholar summer program. This is I'm pretty sure a pay for play program. But it's good for like intellectual vitality. She had a project that came out of it. And so you may try to rebrand this. I've talked about some of the other application episodes when you have sort of these pay for play programs. You might like maybe take out the name or something. It's not a big deal. You could leave the name in. It's not the end of the world. And it does have some like true intellectual vitality. She has a project that came out of it. And when I like about it more specifically is again, she made a music recommendation engine. And so again, it's hitting this cool intersection theme of the music part of her background with the tack part of her background. And so the two that I actually highlighted here was where the sound engineer for the aqua pala and the music recommendation engine project that she did. Because I think this is really what's probably going to be her hook. Then we have recreational piano and classical Indian dance. I feel like every girl whose Indian has classical Indian dance is just a very cliche activity. It's like the same as with tennis for a lot of Indian girls. So that's nothing. If this is even hitting any amount of your time, I mean, from a call to admissions standpoint, she's doing nothing. I obviously understand that many students are sort of, you know, connect their cultural backgrounds. And they like some of these activities. But I'm just speaking clearly from admissions standpoints. If you've sort of said how much of my time from an purely from an admissions ROI perspective, purely from an admissions ROI perspective. Not from any other thing of sort of pleasure or any of these fluffy concepts I'm kidding. Like how much should I devote in terms of the ROI that I'm getting? I would say zero hours, right? Same thing for the piano. If you said how much based on the value that is returned to me for the time that I'm putting in, how many hours should I devote to piano? I would say zero. Right. Same thing with the classical Indian dance from admissions perspective, purely from admissions perspective. Also because she has so many other things that she's doing and so many other more promising avenues, it's even more so the answer is zero. And again, only from an admissions ROI perspective, right? Don't be leaving podcasts reviews saying Sam is telling kids not to love their cultural background and dancing. It's like separate buckets. That's for optimizing for other things. And if you want to do that, that's fine. But that's not what I'm here obviously to comment on. I think the student probably is trying to get an assessment in terms of optimizing for their candidacy. So I'm speaking only unequivocally, linger, wear sand through that light. And it's up to you to make those decisions on the back end in terms of the trade-offs between your college admissions candidacy and everything else like constitute life. But I can't do that for you, unfortunately. And so I have no common equating scale. And so I can't get into that. Right. So I'm talking about the student's personal admissions perspective, the piano, the classical indedience. Now she was going to do something like South Asian studies or she was going to incorporate that or I'd seen multiple activities that did sort of tie back in with her cultural background. Then I would change my stance and I would say, oh, this is relevant. This is a bigger part of admissions narrative, but that's not the case here. And she's so many other time commitments. She's taking very hard classes. She's going to have, you know, she's taking SAT in the ACT. She has so many other promising things in terms of her extracurricular profile up leveling her skills, the competitions, building out what I think is a very cool intersection between the music and the tech. She in particular does not have a lot of time to be just throwing around, you know, Willie Nilly, right? So even more so in her case, she has to be laser focused in terms of her time. The other thing she's considering, she's put a security and internship at a level of the local company. I don't even know what that means. It depends on what the activity is and what the themes are of that activity. And so internship is just a structural category. I don't know what is nothing to do with whether it's an internship or research or a club. That's just a type of activity. And so it doesn't tell me anything, right? And you know what the theme is. If she's working, if she's securing an internship at a local company and she's building out, you know, a machine learning recommendation engine for this whole, but then that's different, right? And then I would be like, that's amazing. If she is, you know, doing some random internship at a local company, then obviously not very meaningful. And I would probably suggest that she not do that. If it's not as relevant to I think what she should be building here, what sort of unique about her candidacy. So it doesn't really tell me anything. And then she put in the process of applying a project to aid my choir with selecting solo repertoire for competitions. If the project is tack oriented, I would like it a lot more again because it hits at this intersection theme that I think is very cool, which is the music on the tack. If it's just the music, it's okay. So if she's building an intersection theme here, as I would strongly suggest she do, then she's going to have activities that are purely just music related. And then she's going to have activities that are purely just attack or math or computing related. Right? And that's really fun. Right? You just want to also ideally have activities that are at the nexus of the two that tie them together. It's okay if you have one, not every single activity is going to be a nexus activity or a glue activity as I refer to it. And so she might have four activities that are on one side of the wall or one of the hooks and then six that are sort of on the other. I'm sort of using hook loosely here, sort of like a double hook, or two pronged hook, right? And so you might have four that are sort of on this side and then six that are on that side. And then you might have two or three that are sort of both. They instantiate both sides, right? Both of the prongs, right? Both the the attack, the stem, more of that side, but then they also instantiate the music or the creative aspects as well. So I would really love the project if it has some technical aspect to it or some stem aspect. And it's also music related because that would help her further start building out this intersection. It's very cool theme. Now, why is this intersection powerful? Well, one thing is sort of how is she going to stand out? Right? And so she is already standing out in some potentially traditional ways. So she does have pretty good skill and mouth, but she's not the best at mouth. Right? She does have pretty good skill in terms of computing, but she's not the best. Right? And so she is very good and she will get a benefit being a female applying for computer science and applying for engineering in general. I should definitely get a big bump there, right? But that being said, again, she's not necessarily the top in sort of those very skill-based fields person. Right? And so I often say that fundamentally what you need to achieve in emissions, it's all about supply and demand, right? There's a very small number of spaces for a very large number of applicants. And so you must fundamentally be rare. Whatever the level is, you need to be one in a thousand, one in 10,000. But you must be very rare, right? That's the reason why the platinum level is much better than the silver level for USA Computing Olympiad because there's 200 the platinum level and there's 3,000 at the silver level, right? It's not very hard to figure out that the higher levels associated with the higher degree of scarcity and the higher degree of scarcity is what's going to be more valuable to colleges and in a market of supply and demand, those are the students who are going to stand out and have more leverage in the process, right? And so if fundamentally what you need to do is be rare, I need to be scarce in some way that's desirable to the colleges. Well, you sort of have two strategies, as I typically say. You can either try to be the best in a field or the best at something or you can try to be the only, right? And so the best is basically you go into a game where there's a lot of players, that's like math, competitions, computing, you know, Olympiad, coding competitions, etc. You go into very crowded lanes and very crowded fields, robotics, etc., etc. And you try to come out the top. Very, very difficult to do. Very, very difficult, right? And from what I see on paper, she definitely has a very solid background in these fields, but she's not, she's not world-beating exception, right? And so she's good, but trying to play the best in these fields, trying to win that game, I always say like that's, it's a losing game for the vast majority, right? Then there's a different game that you can play. So you can try to be the best, you can try to be the only, right? Different game you could play is you can try to set up the game, such that you're the only person playing it, right? So it's no longer a crowded field, you're not trying to be the best at math, you're not the most code-in-kid, you're, you design something around your interest, or something that's unique to you, and you set the game up such that you're the only player and you win by default, right? And so instead of trying to be number one out of 10,000 or 15,000 or 100,000 or how many kids take the AMC or trying to be good at math, you set up the game such that you're the only player and you win by default, your number one, because there's only one player, right? And it's a little bit of hyperbole, right? I don't mean necessarily that you have to be the only, only, only player, but you certainly want to set up the game and your resume building, ideally, and your hook, such that you've identified a much more unique niche or vertical and there are way fewer players in that area, because it makes it much easier for you to stand out, right? And so there's sort of, as I say, sort of scarcity by way of talent or skill, that's sort of the math competition, the USA Computing Olympiad, that's that path, right? And many people try to go down that path and they will not succeed, right? It's a very risky path. And I don't, I don't take bets like that where that's, that's the only, that's the only engine that the plane has. And if that engine doesn't work, if it fails at some point, there's no backup engine. It's too risky, right? I'm not saying you can't go down that path, but you better hedge it with something else, right? And so you can still try to do the talent or the skill route and it may work out for you. It may work out and that's fine, maybe you hit the lottery, right? But you just still hedge it with something that's very unique just in case it doesn't work out and something that's more controllable. Because the skill in the talent can she control it, can students control it, can do all the practice problems and all that, yes. But again, we still, we still don't, you can't control it as much, you can't control the distribution of talent and the skill set of all the players in the game all across the country and all across the world, right? But when it comes to identifying that something that's more unique, you really can. I mean, I mean, take this for granted just because we do it all the time, that it's not, it's not, it's still very difficult for many other people and actually they are better off maybe just playing the very traditional talent or skill game because it's at least, you sort of, it's difficult, but it's not, it's hard, but it's not difficult. It's, it's hard to do, but it's not that complex in a lot of ways, right? It's like sort of being a recruited athlete. It's like, you know, if you're a recruited athlete, you know, in a sport that's very meaningful to the college, you sort of know that the ROI is there and that is a big boost to your candidacy. It's just hard to sort of do it, but it's not, it's not complex per se, right? Like I sort of think of the difficult as being sort of like much more cerebral and intellectual and much more strategic. It's not necessarily, it's hard, but it's not difficult. It's not complex, right? And so maybe for some people, they are just better off because they don't really understand strategic positioning extremely well. They don't sort of put together a sort of, you know, they're sort of finesse the narrative or really, they're not really great at identifying what's really unique about the students or sort of seeing how that would manifest over three years. So maybe I just take it a lot more for granted because that's just what we are very good at is being very creative in the positioning and playing the uniqueness game and the being the only instead of being the best, but I generally want to play that game the only game and should try to find like niches and verticals and hammer them that the student is going to be very different shaded in. And again, to try to instead of trying to go straight into the crosshairs and win a game, that's going to be very difficult to win again to try to set up a game, set up our own game. That we have a much better chance of winning by default because we can just make the student a lot more unique and interesting and strategically decision them around something that is just very interesting. In this student's case, it doesn't always work out this way, but she even just in her activities has a very cool theme and she's already sort of intersecting it with this sort of this music at this talk. And so for some students, I think there's a lot of STEM students out there and they sort of have this like they do these well-rounded things like they do music, they do track, right? And it's just like mostly what they want to be doing is the STEM stuff and that's like what they're good at, but they're sort of doing like the well-rounded things with like the music. But in her case, she's actually, she seems like she has some pretty good ability and she really enjoys the music side and she has several activities that speak to it and a couple of awards. And so it's not sort of the like the STEM student who's just doing it, you know, to sort of fall the well-rounded archetype because they think that Emission still lives in the 1980s. It is actually like a genuine strength of hers and it seems to be a genuine interest and it plays like a very big strategic role in her case. By incorporating this creative, these creative parts, it will help to differentiate her from the STEM students, all right, who don't have this creative aspect. And I've mentioned this in other episodes, really one of the best frameworks that I laid out. And you sort of know all sort of intuitively know if a concept or framework or even on the back end, like a document or checklist that we have, if it's a good idea or a good framework by how often we actually use it, right? And so if you create a document or a spreadsheet or checklist and you never use it, it probably isn't that good, right? If you create a checklist and use it all the time, or you criticize. a framework and you find yourself constantly referring back to the framework, it's probably a pretty useful framework. And so in the episode that we did, the, um, purid activity for, I think it was perfect activity for IV plus colleges. I laid out a framework and the framework was something like the six aspects of a perfect activity and really by essentially a perfect resume and it was breath and death or death and breath. Um, it was logic and emotion and I think it was talent and uniqueness. And I very often when I'm thinking about as soon as canoncy, since I sort of did the episode, I very often think or reference that framework right, um, which tells me that it has some sort of, um, conceptual utility for how I think about a student's canoncy. And so in terms of her depth, I sort of think about that as like more of the stem stuff, right? But her breath, what will sort of laterally position her way or more, make her more unique versus all the other stem kids is the creative side, right? And then I think of logic and emotion. Well, I think of the logic of sort of the competitions and it's like a certain scarcity number and like there's this number of people and it's this place, it's very logical, right? Um, and I sort of think is like skills or talents as being much more towards the logic side, right? They're like logic, they're benchmarked, right? And so there's sort of more like skills and math and, you know, computing, these are sort of like skills. They're not really activities, right? It's, they're not as much activities, right? They're sort of like beating on a skill person. Um, they don't have the sort of the same feel, um, you know, as doing research like on an interesting topic, right? It's just sort of you like getting the raps into sort of hammer at the skill, right? And then today to certain level at the skill. And so I sort of think of like the competitions and all that stuff, which is very indexed on currently and she mentioned that even in her, in her email, she's very, I don't want to say over indexed, um, but she has a lot of the sort of competitions and stuff and in that and the awards and all that, which is very good. Like it's a very good on a signal. It's very succinct. It gives you a place and a scarcity and number of people, et cetera, et cetera. She's very good, right? Um, then I also need the emotional components, which is the creative part, the music part, um, that she has in her backgrounds. And then the interest factor, right? Not just I'm great at this and this is a number, but this moves me like I'm an interesting student. She needs the emotional appeal. And we're going to get more of the interest factor is going to be for more unique and creative narratives, right? Not just a competition placements, right? And so this is where on the emotion side, she has these creative, the music and she can get more unique, um, with the, with the sort of this intersection theme, right? And then again, you have the talent, you have uniqueness. So the talent again, this is sort of the competitions, how skilled is she? Oh, she takes AB physics, she takes Cal PC. That's the talent component, but she's not inside the classroom. She's definitely way up there outside the classroom in terms of these fields. She's not really like essentially a math, not like on a top tier track, right? So, um, the uniqueness also comes in it serves a head. She definitely has certainly clear talents in a lot of these fields. I'm not knocking and just saying that it's not, it's not going to compete with the best of the best of the top colleges from a purely talent perspective. And you don't even necessarily want to play that game. You want to have hedges, you want to have, you want to have backup enters in your candidacy as well, right? And so the uniqueness is going to come again from having a more unique narrative being the student who sort of applies the computer science background, the tech background, machine learning skills, the AI to music. That's going to be the more unique part of our candidacy, right? And the students who are the most dangerous, you can try to like just have it all on one side. You can try to just be pure like logic, pure talent and pure depth. But if you're purely indexed on that side and you want to get into like the most competitive colleges, you need to be super, super skilled, right? Like you need to be accept, like absolutely exceptional because you're so over-induced, right? And so for you to go and write pretty boring essays and not be that unique and you're like interested at math, like none of the original officers understand anything about math. So, like it's very inaccessible to most people. Um, it's just very hard and it just puts more pressure on you to purely like if that's the game that you're going to play, it's fine, but you're going to need to be absolutely exceptional to an even greater extent. For students who are not going to be absolutely exceptional, it's just better for you to put other parts in here and to try to win the game in other ways by trying to be more unique. Or you're very like your talent level is good and you have awards or whatever is that speaks of that. Um, but you also have uniqueness and so it's sort of by aggregate, you can also come out more on top. What I would sort of suggest here is in terms of some of the more skill or the talent-based parts of her, um, canner to see here. One is I would definitely try to get the USA and I know she's already tried. She tempted gold, um, but such that she didn't get up to it. I think that she's on track and she definitely probably can't, I won't say definitely, but I think she can get to the gold level for USA Compuining Olympiad by the time she applies and it gets meaningful in a good allocation of her time. Because I think there's a meaningful inflection point there between the silver and the gold. I would not count on her getting up to a plan on level and so I would say between silver and gold, that is a worthwhile time investment in terms of the hard benchmarking of the sort of the skills and the technical proficiencies. Certainly if there's other competitions to compete, you know, to do and whatnot, um, she can certainly still, um, keep pursuing those. I'm not saying to totally neglect the, the logical or the skill or the competition or that side, but I think you need to build on top of it and you need to have backup engines as well. Um, things that again make you more unique and so you're not even necessarily competing against other students in these top colleges because they don't even have the narrative or the interesting the wow factor that you do, right? So it's looking at it from a few different aspects. So from again, the technical benchmarking and the skill aside, I would try to move up to gold and I think that's that's feasible by the time she applies. In terms of the math side, probably the next level and she probably isn't, you know, with some amount of, I don't know, I just don't know what her math level is. It's very hard to sort of assess. Um, you know, it might sort of be like aim-qualifier, um, getting up to that level, taking aim-c12, studying for it, um, and trying to get up to aim qualification level. I don't know basically what you're trying to figure out in an ideal world is you're trying to figure out what are sort of the meaningful inflection points in terms of moving the needle from my candidacy, like where are the deltas basically? How big are the deltas? Like how big are the jumps in terms of the ROI to my candidacy? And so you're basically trying to figure out the reward of the upside. Then you're trying to figure out how much time would it likely take for that delta on my candidacy for the upside? So you're really trying to sort of assess these two variables. And what happens sometimes is students sort of try to bump up a tear or get to a certain inflection point that doesn't really matter that much anymore, right? And so it's sort of like going from a 1550 to a 1600 SAT. And it's like if you were spending 10 hours a week, it just, it doesn't make any sense. Like it's just you're not getting anything. And there's students who are just again, maybe they're not compared, like they're doing something that would be required for a tear of college. They're not competitive for anymore. And so they're doing something that would be required to go from like top 15 to top five, but like they're not competitive past the top 15 tier. And so any time investment to go past that inflection point of upside doesn't make any sense. And so that's basically what we're trying to do. And so there's a big inflection point between silver and gold. It's very feasible for her to hit it, right? And so it's a it's a pretty it's a pretty worthwhile investment of time. To go from the gold to platinum. Yeah, it's a pretty big delta, but I would say the probability of occurrence or the expected value, right? The sort of reward of the upside multiplied by the probability of occurrence. It's just not a very high EV, I would say. And so her best EV bet would be go from silver to gold. And it's a worthwhile investment of time, therefore, right? Now for the math, there's all different types of tears. Are there there's many inflection points, right? You know, going from, you know, aim, qualify or all the way to math, Olympiad program to international math, you know, like there are all there's a whole bunch of like a ton of those parts along the pipeline are meaningful inflection points, right? Maybe between this slight aim score and that, you know, getting one problem, you know, plus or minus one problem might not be a huge inflection point per site. But there's a lot of different jumps in terms of that that math competition pipeline, right? The problem is the EV is not going to be very good pass a certain point. And so what I'm trying to figure out is sort of, okay, where does she get like a pretty good inflection point, but has a pretty high probability of occurrence that the time invested in that will be worthwhile. And so again, maybe something like Aim Qualifier, sort of bumps up her mouth to getting it to a little bit to the next level with a little bit more of an honest signal, but it also has a reasonably high probability of a current such that if she spends her time or allocates it, it's not going to be ideally for naught. And the problem with competitions I will say as well is that they're not activities. And so if a student does research, and they don't get a peer-reviewed publication, let's say, or they don't get, you know, we're generally on semi-finalists or finalists or whatever, right? And again, that's sort of like the award accolade part of it as well. They still have the activity, right? And if it was a cool activity or an niche project or an field they were pursuing, it's sort of like, they still have that backup engine. So you don't hit the sort of super high level of the award. So they're super, you know, really interesting output or the accolade. They still have a fallback because they were still putting in all the work and they still could put that in their application. And so this is also when we look at sort of the risk of the awards and the risk profile for different activities. This is why some of these, you know, like if you want to go do, you know, USCSO or something, you're studying 13 hours, you know, you're studying 13 hours a week for a year or something like that. But then if you don't get it, you don't have anything to put in your application. What are you going to put? I studied, I studied for USCSO for 13 hours a week and I didn't get it. That's not an activity, right? And so the nice thing also about doing something like research or an activity or an internship or something like that is even if you don't get the crazy high, you know, super impressive output accolade, especially if it's more niche. And this is why you should be doing things that are more ideally more unique or as unique as your interest and skills and talents and candidacy allow for. It will still sort of, it will still be its own thing and sort of stand out on its own, of its own accord, right? And so it's sort of de-risked a little bit more. Even if you don't hit the absolute highest levels, it's sort of like you don't come up with and it's sort of nothing to show for it. You sort of understand these risk or award dynamics, these EV dynamics, these time allocation dynamics, and pretty much everybody doesn't really do them justice. So I would say bumping up sort of some of the tactical, the logical parts, the skill, part of our profile with the competing Olympia at the math, I think those are worthwhile time investments up to a certain inflection point, as I mentioned, where you sort of have the greatest expected value, right? Or again, there's a good amount of marginal or worth that will be your return here, but I could see the probability is fairly high that the time investment won't be worthless. Then in terms of the rest of her profile, what she really I think she'd be doing is again, building in this music tack, this sort of intersection between her singing background and the tactical aspect. I think this is what will make her more unique and stand out more amongst STEM applicants. And so she's competing against computer science, kids or data, whatever it is. I think that music application is very cool. She already has activities that speak to it. She has a skill set that speaks to it. She has some awards that speak to it. She's part of some of these competitively audition groups, as she said. And so I think that will help give her some lateral positioning away from some of the other STEM applicants. And it'll be a very unique application of her technical proficiency and her STEM skill set to a very niche specific use that can differentiate her. And so we had a student like this a couple of years ago who was sort of in this like music tack area. And he still did like interlocking, which is a famous arts program. He had a research internship of the professor who was at this intersection at NYU. And so what I would strongly encourage the student to do is to build up this music. There's the different aspects of our campus. You see there's the STEM and the proficiency as well as the clubs and like still keep working on your music side. Like still keep working on both of the prongs. But start really one of the biggest things that she can do is also on top of that. Start really homing in on the intersection and that sort of unique narrative or the unique application of the STEM, the technical proficiency to the music side. Right. And we've already seen that with the music recommendation engine being the sound engineer for the Acapoe. And so what do we do there? Well, first and one of the first things is going to be research. So there are, there's a very prominent lab at MIT. That's probably perfect for this. So I'm not going to do all of the work for the students. But you can, it's not hard to find these things. There are programs at Stanford that are in these fields. So just you're looking for like music, tech, the intersection of the two. There are look for any specific programs. If you can find a specific program or a school that is like technology plus, you know, the arts and music or these types of themes, then you go find a list of 30 professors and you head up that list basically, right? And so and you try to get an internship or research opportunity with them. So you have professors like just off of the top of my head, I can think of programs, labs at Georgia Tech, NYU, MIT, Stanford. And so that's what I would be doing. I would be trying to get a research position or an internship at that intersection. Second, in her particular case, there's a very clear vehicle for an internship at a like in private sector, which would be something like Spotify. It could be a local company, but anything. It doesn't have to be Spotify. Spotify is just sort of the big one that you think of with sort of the music recommendation engine, AI, the machine learning, you know, you have Apple music. All these different things. I would be trying. This would be like awesome. Would be try to get an internship with some company, some thing in the private sector. Again, it doesn't have to be-- even with the research, it does not have to be like a huge name brand college, right? It just so happens there are a lot of really big name brand college, name brand colleges that do have programs and do have a lot of professors who are at this intersection, but it doesn't have to be. You could be working with a professor. And a lot of times it might even be better if you get some really niche, weird, cool project with a professor who's working at Colorado State. That's fine, all right? So it does not have to be just as reclurified that because I think a lot of people are like, oh, I have to get a research position with somebody who is at like a top five college. And that's not the case. The project, the depth of contribution, a lot of that stuff matters a lot more. So I would be looking to probably get an internship, something related to this music and tech theme. You could also further build out any of these sort of like independent projects. If you sort of take this project from the scholar summer program, the music recommendation engine, scaling things, having higher measurable impact, getting broader reach. I don't know if this project for her choir. Again, if she came up with something interesting, you could be scaled to different schools, whatever it is, so you sort of have this independent project route. That's also potentially there for the taking. I like more a bit of the structure and working with somebody in research or getting sort of again a private sector or music company internship, something that again is the intersection of music and tech. I would say this probably would be my number one and number two targets for hammering this theme even more. But again, it could be hit through a variety of angles, whether it's independent projects, whether it's just continuing to sort of up her level as the sound engineer for the aquapella. And then again, she's still building out the technical sides and the proficiencies there, whether it's via competitions, aim qualification, USA Computial Limpiad. She's still building out and still continuing her actual music activities and then her technical activities as well on top of the intersection of the two. In terms of longer term positioning, she will be much better. So for those of you who attended our master class back in October, I walk through a case study of a student who was a female. She was interested in computer science and was applying to Duke. And so at Duke, you could apply to Trinity, which is Arts and Sciences, the Leroyer's College where you could apply to Pratt, which is the engineering college. And so there are these strategic variables, particularly as a female. And for something like computer science, computer science can be situated in engineering or it can be situated as at Duke in the Arts and Sciences as well. There could be a BA. There could be a B.A.S. There's the more technical, there's the more humanities side of it. She will be better off from a positioning standpoint, applying into more of the technical side, whereas if she were a boy, that would probably be a little bit more-- well, I'm going to be a little bit. It's a lot more disadvantaged, right? And so I wait, just something to be aware of down the line. I can't go through how this plays out at every single school and how this interface of the resume building versus the late stage storytelling. This is a free case, OK? But I will just as a general caveat, I will say positioning down the line. She will want to position more. And again, it will depend by the college, but more for the technical or the engineering because of her demographic background as a female. And so that's advantageous. And so how you balance that-- you might sort of say Sam, but you're also say, fit in sort of like more of these creative sides and the music and stuff like that. Well, you would still do that in the context of engineering as well. It's just that you're using the technical proficiency and the target happens to be music, right? And so that's just the application for colleges where it's maybe broader, you're choosing, you know, it's maybe a broader level arts curriculum. She also can certainly formally incorporate the music and she can put music as one of her interests in terms of majors or minors or whatever's offered. Depending on your skill set, if they're sort of an audition, you know, based or there's technical component or portfolio and you're not really absolutely outstanding, then you might want to duck that. But for, you know, schools where that's not the case or you can sort of duck out of that or you're going to apply to a later version, you can also you can she can incorporate that into her positioning on paper. It does not mean that you have to study that when you get to the college, but it will be strategically advantageous for you to potentially incorporate that at least into how you apply to the college. And then it's not you're not signing a contract in blood that you have to go do music up the college as a major. But again, that will depend on sort of what the positioning is, what the level arts versus engineering, you know, what the breakdown is. And so I can't sort of do that for every school right now. But these are some sort of big picture of things as well, just a sort of mindful of down one. So that was a lot, but hopefully that was was pretty helpful as we sort of went through her whole profile here. If you would like us to do a case study for you or for your students, you can email it in and we'll essentially take a look. As I mentioned, we'll be doing these on a rolling basis. So we have all the ones that everybody has submitted. If you submitted or applied for a case study, we still have it. And we'll just be going through an rolling basis, picking them out as I sort of see fit. Some are better than others in terms of the case studies. I think this one was very good because she actually there's a pretty clear path and pretty clear directions in her case as to what she should be doing. I feel like based on just what she has done in terms of activities, whereas with many other students, you really would have to like die very, very deep into like the discovery process that we do, which is like a lot of questions and just like a lot of deep dive and a lot of material analysis because they just don't have the activities yet. That would even allow me to see some of these themes. So and if you're younger, then it also tends to be a little bit more the case as well. If you don't have as many activities and I wouldn't be able to see the themes just by looking at your profile, which means I would have to ask you a whole bunch of questions and like then look at paragraphs upon paragraphs of answers and responses and common factors analysis. And it's just, it's not as practical for a podcast episode. So I do sort of take that into account when I go through some of the different case study prospects, but I think this was a pretty good one and hopefully pretty elucidating for the student. And hopefully everyone else as well. So we'll leave it off there and we will talk soon in the next episode. Bye bye.