Suzy Kolber

Boxing fans mark your calendars. Ryan Garcia puts his Walter Waite World title on the line against hard-hitting top contender, Conor Ben, plus undefeated Australian superstar, Jaiopataya takes on Noel McCalion. Saturday, December 12, all live on Paramount Plus. The feud between Garcia and Ben reaches a boiling point in one of the biggest fights of the year. The best part? There's no pay-per-view. The entire event is included with your Paramount Plus subscription. Saturday, September 12, stream Zoufa Boxing's Ryan Garcia versus Conor Ben live on Paramount Plus. Welcome to the sports media podcast on my host Richard Dyche, my producer is James Jackson, one guest on this episode. But if you have watched sports in the United States, this is a woman who is very, very familiar to you. Though she has not done, at least from my perspective, many public interviews, if any public interviews, over the last couple of years, Suzy Culber was one of the seminal figures at ESPN, working across that company for 27 years. She is here to talk about her new series for the Scripps Sports Network, which is a new free streaming television channel launched by the Scripps Company early this year. Her new series is called The Originals, which will premiere on September 15 at 8 p.m. This is an interview show where Suzy goes one-on-one with people who defy easy explanation. Her first couple of interviews include Jesse Cole, founder of the Savannah Bananas, John Gruden, former NFL coach, obviously former ESPNer, Lisa Salters, Hillary Knight, the great hockey player, Steve Young, goes without saying Hall of Fame NFLer. And Diana Flores, the Mexican flag football star. Again, the show premiere September 15 at 8 p.m. Eastern on the Scripps Sports Network, and I am pleased to be joined by Suzy Culber. Welcome. Thank you, Richard, and you are correct. I don't believe I've spoken to anybody since I was laid off by ESPN in the summer of 2023. Suzy, where is your YouTube channel? Where's your substack? Where are all these other things that usually happen when someone leaves the ESPN? Well, right off the bat, I had a year left on my contract, so I wasn't allowed to be on the air unless I wanted to forego the last year of my deal. So we could start with that. And it was such a big adjustment for me to go from 100 miles an hour in the adrenaline of live TV to actually being able to kind of sit back and live my life. Once I started going through that transition and experiencing it, I didn't feel like I had this burning desire like I need to be on. And quite frankly, I never really felt like I was necessarily tied to this identity of being on TV. I loved what I did because I love sports and I love football and I loved the process, but the actual being on television wasn't never a driving force to me. So it just sort of made sense to you know what? Once I realized like I'm like busted my butt since I was 15 years old, what if I do just catch my breath and go to every single one of my daughter's volleyball games? And actually like sit on my couch a little bit and take in a life of what I've accomplished. I'm allowed to relax. So that's the answer to I just didn't really feel a need. We're going to get to ESPN and the post ESPN after scripts. I want to start off with what you're doing now. I have seen you're kind enough to let me see a couple of the first episodes. They're really well done. It's a thoughtful interview show. The production quality is really, really high. There's an episode with Lisa Salters, which I would really highly recommend to people where both Susie and Lisa reveal stuff. Certainly that I had no idea about them from infertility issues to pregnancy to being a woman to being a to being a woman over a certain age in the business. It's it's a really, really that one in particular is a really well done episode. So I start here. How did your relationship with script sports come about and at a certain point, whether from them or you someone must have pitched this interview show? Well, going back to what we're discussing about kind of where was I almost from before the time I was laid off. I had a concept for a give back show, which was reaching into underserved communities and finding spotlighting coaches and mentors who are helping kids play sports. And shining the spotlight on them and getting them more funds from more kids to play sports, because it just in general makes kids better people, I think, and in this big world of youth sports. Kids families without money are getting left behind. So I had this concept for a show called Who Inspired You? And almost from the moment I was laid off, I was like working on that because I always felt like if I had a platform, why not use it? And a good friend of mine, also another former ESPNer who had been laid off, he was head of editorial content from one night football on the NFL draft. He teamed up with me and we started meeting with industry leaders and really trying to learn this other side of the business. So I was busy, which was good, because, you know, I kind of I thrive on that kind of thing. And shockingly, as many great meetings as we had and everybody said they'd love the concept, we couldn't find distribution and we couldn't find a sponsor. We even teamed up with Omaha productions, they loved it too. You know, like in their arsenal of stuff, they didn't really have a give back. Anyway, I tell you that because this in this business is like you never know where contacts are going to happen. I go to a great gym near my house and love the trainer when I train with him, you know, we talk. He knows what I'm trying to do turns out scripts is launching this streaming network. They are looking for original content. They hire a local media guy who is supposed to try to help them find original content. The trainer says the John, did you know Susie works out here? No, did you know Susie has some ideas and concepts for shows? No, I was on a zoom with him that afternoon. The next day I was in a zoom with scripts. The who inspired you concept, they liked, but there was another one I had in my back pocket, which is this show, the originals that they liked even more as a let's do something, you know, right out of the box. Originally, the show is called outside the box and a friend of mine had said to me, you know, your whole life has been so unconventional. You were a little girl who played football and you turned that into a whole career and it's a lifetime in an industry that's been male dominated and you have this longevity. This whole idea of really taking what is your passion and not being afraid to follow that and to achieve success doing it. This unconventional type of life, why not find other people who have done the same type of thing and let's have this great conversation where we sort of unpack the the fearlessness, how you do it. What's sort of the blueprint for that? So, scripts loved it. They're looking for original programming. I really liked the position that scripts has put themselves in in terms of really backing, supporting women sports sports and women's leagues, really liked that whole concept. So, I thought we made a really good team. We shot six episodes. I didn't know what to expect from them. They really did not expect from me. Like you said, I think the quality of the program is really well done. That was terrific. So, we have six episodes in the can. A six show run. Really hope to do more right now, Richard. The show doesn't have a sponsor. I can feel like there's so many great natural ties. We really want a sponsor to be able to start lining up the next six. Well, now at least you have nothing else. You have you have something to present sponsors. If nothing else, full episodes so that they can see right and there's. There's value in that it struck me that in terms of the first six that you have. There's a couple of people that you obviously have a long time relationship with Steve Young, for example, Groot, and you must know forever, Lisa Salther's obviously somebody who closed to a DSPN. Then you opted obviously to do the founder of Savannah bananas. That's an incredibly great business story in a very like one that's like right on the news right now. Hillary Knight obviously is just coming off a gold medal. So like that's on the news as well. My sense is in terms of who you wanted to choose. You chose people maybe part that you knew and were comfortable with. And then three other maybe aspirational ones. You're like these are pretty interesting people to me. So I'm going to do them We had a pretty good list a pretty good working list And I thought that Jesse Cole with the Savannah bananas like he is like the quintessential like he defines what the show is about And as impressed as I was before actually meeting him The more impressed I was and then I got to go to Gillette stadium they sold out Gillette stadium just recently. Yeah, he is from that area. It was his lifelong dream to actually be in it and experience it and The joy that you can actually sense from the crowd and I just loved that the motivation is Fan first we want the fans to have a good time never lost sight of that never raised ticket prices Cut deals with networks so more people can see it but it's always available for free on YouTube so Every single move never lost sight of the big picture of bring more joy Something great families can do. I mean the whole idea of that and then Layered in that is that his wife recognized that the foster care system in this country is broken and Jesse and his wife they have a son but they take in to not just foster care kids to special needs foster care kids And in every game they bring out a foster family and the whole crowd gives them a standing ovation Because what could possibly be better for that even say now gives me chills So he sort of lays out this road map of the perseverance the sacrifice What it takes to do something for the right reasons and the right way and he went they went from Sold their house lived on an air mattress to 500 million dollars profit. Yeah, by doing the right way So I know the perfect fit Yeah, I was saying I know somebody was at the Gillette game and they said it was an amazing experience So they they have they have figured it out that organization in terms of figuring out how to combine sports in Entertainment in 2026. Yeah, and I really appreciated that at the core of it is a live game With competitive real athletes that they're able to play the game and also throw in trick plays and oh by the way Broadway level singing and then Steps out on the mound and throws a great pitch like the the quality really of the talent is off the charts So he was we were they are so media friendly That That he said yes, and that's that was our you know, we went to Tallahassee and shot. They're opening weekend And I was just so pleased with that John Gruden Um, we there were you know a number of discussions with John like she knows he knows me well and and Jim my partner in this Knows Jim very well Jim does a lot of his prep and work with him still, but You know, we weren't going to ignore the fact that he's not coaching and why and he had to be okay With us going there, but but he was very forthcoming even with what he wants for his future So scripts loved that show that show is number two because they felt he was very forthcoming My my personal show with Lisa. I mean that's really like at the centerpiece of the whole series But I didn't want it necessarily to all but this series to be about me So we wanted to establish the show with other guests and then okay Here's the reveal. I mean you know me through the years Uh, painfully private Always was people never had any idea What was going on with me Off camera that that I Was navigating wanting to be a mom and I was single and going through all of that while I was on the road and That whole sort of experience. I mean nobody had any idea That's one of those men you can really compartmentalize stuff Yeah, no it was uh, there's again if you're someone who's followed ESPN for a long time Um, there's things in there you would have you'll just would never have known about both Susie and Lisa Salters um Yeah, and Richard the whole idea of the show is inspiring people And inspiring people to like don't be afraid follow your passion and that's that's really the hope there is that Like you can do this you can like be working at the highest level And you can have this too. You can you I you you I you know, I should I shouldn't assume it but it seems rather obvious On top of obviously being the on air presenter you're you're a producer of this co-producer is that your title as well That would be fair that I am executive producer of the show executive producer Okay, and as a gentleman that I said he was looking for the original content for script So John is named executive producer and Jim Carr Who is the editorial for Monday night football and the NFL draft and so many great things for ESPN And he's he's he went to work for Caesars He's had many roles and just such great depth and knowledge and great at finding stories and telling stories So all of us are listed as executive producers. That's cool. I believe Jim Carr and I have conversed at least a couple of times Maybe the email over the years, although it's been a bit um I did want to ask you this because this is just I know you know, I don't know what your interest is here But you mentioned scripts in terms of like what they have in terms of live rights and they have their live rights inventory It's really impressive. They have just in terms of just a listing a couple of the leagues they're partnered with the WMBA and WSL PWHL MLV as Susie mentioned earlier. They really have Um, they really walked the walk when it comes to women's sports. They've invested money Talent time and they have a good portfolio. They also have the big sky They have five NHL teams and then I believe again, this is not an entire list I think they have the pistons and the Las Vegas aces to in terms of individual Contracts. So one of the first things uh, Susie when I learned that you were doing this one of my first thought was that Like do you have any interest perhaps in being part of their live sports Properties and or do they have interest in you because it would seem like You know, they have an opportunity to have somebody's work to the highest levels of sports television in you And they have these properties that are sitting there Even though I understand they've filled a lot of the talent spots for sure Eight that was one of the first discussions that we had And I just feel like at I'm not saying no and I would never say never and if the right opportunity presents itself Yes, let's talk about it But I think one of the things about me is that I only know how to do things one way and at the highest level And I respect all of these leagues and and all of these women and that's kind of how I I did my job all these years like out of the ultimate respect is I'm going to pour my heart and soul in because I respect what you're doing. So you in term respect me It's a lot of work to speak about a sport at that level and present it to the audience and Honestly, I just don't know if I want to go to that level again Like this to me what I'm doing is this really great mix of I get to do a show hopefully it inspires. I want to do this other show who inspired you I hope it reaches into communities and helps coaches and mentors like that's the platform I want to have I want to do things that can help make a difference and bring about a change Again, I don't really need to necessarily be on TV or live TV The adrenaline I got from that it was it was like a big time withdraw for me to like come off of that I'm not That's it's not an ultimate goal If it's something super and it's there and is this relationship with scripts develops Who knows but That for me is not the top of mine I appreciate answering that okay. I want to head back in time a little bit It's been three years since you got let go by ESPN and you mentioned a little bit at the top that For you, it was really like a welcome recalibration in some ways once you probably wrapped your head around it You got a chance to obviously be with your daughter. It probably got a chance I would think to just mentally stop for a little bit and just like because you basically for 27 years Covered major adventure traveling all over the world et cetera, et cetera, et cetera Where would you say Where do I want to start with this? Okay. Yeah, let's let's start here I remember reporting at the time. I wasn't the only one that You know, there there was a lot of talk to ESPN was gonna have layoffs and so you know people obviously in certain positions Depending on salaries age, et cetera, you know, you're all wait. We're all in that same boat at certain age group You're always sort of in Perhaps the crosshairs was this something that you expected at all were cognizant of Um, we'll start there. I'll say first never in my whole career did I ever take for granted? It would be another contract Because that's the nature the business and it's cruel, cruel and competitive. And as you alluded to, especially for women, I believe as they get older. So when this first came up, and I want to, I want to ask you a question too, is I still, I don't understand what it is about the inter-workings at ESPN that these leaks happen. How does it help some executive on the inside who has this knowledge to leak this stuff? Like you're the one trying to find that information and you're digging. But what does it do for that person? Yeah, the weight is over. Football is here and so is DraftKings. DraftKings is now live in all 50 states, one app, every sports nationwide. New DraftKings customers sign up with code 2400, spend five bucks to get $200 in rewards within 21 days, includes all markets. That's code 2400 in partnership with DraftKings. The crown is yours. Gambling problem called 1-800-Gamber, 1-800-My-Reset, Connecticut called 888-789-7777, or visit ccpg.org on behalf of Boothill, Casino and Kansas. Bettax passed through, may apply in Illinois, 21 and over, void in Canada. Bet with DraftKings sportsbook to get bonus bets that expire in seven days, or trade with DraftKings predictions to get predictions dollars that expire in one year. Event contract trading involves risk of loss. Predictions offer void in New York. None with drawable rewards issued as $50 click to claims every seven days for 21 days. Terms at DK&G.co/offer, limited time offer, nationwide based on sportsbook predictions and free-to-play sports contest availability. I'm happy to answer this and again, I'm kind of now at the moment out of the transactions business and like, you know, for transactions in terms of the good part of transactions when somebody gets hired. That's an exciting moment. The bad part of transactions obviously is layoffs. And in this one, I think my colleague, the time Andrew Martian, I think, was more all over this, certainly than I was. I would say, but historically, obviously, I have been in that situation. And from my perspective, it doesn't always come from the executives of the place that that is experienced layoffs. Many times it comes from agents in the world who have heard that someone else at the organization is being laid off or perhaps that their own client is being laid off. And they'd like to get ahead of the story by at least putting it out there to have the client create their own narrative. Whether that's a good idea or not, would probably depend obviously on your agency and who that is. There are probably some cases where there are people probably for political or personal reasons who probably get off on the fact that I have this information. And I want it known that this person is on the chopping block. The one thing that I always tried to think about, hopefully I was successful, but that would be up to other people, is that these are real people. Like, it's not, I think, not I think I know this, especially on social media. Like, who is laid off at major places, especially if you're well known in the sports world, it becomes like kind of a sport like to comment on it or to get clicks for it. So at least from my perspective, I was always trying to think, all right, there's a like you have to try to do this, at least with some sensitivity because there's real people here. And I always tried to let the person know if I could obviously before reporting it in the event that they didn't know. And I do think what's happened. And I'm sure this didn't happen to you, but this happened others. What is kind of gross is when a reporter tells you what's going to happen when your own organization doesn't. And that has happened a couple of times in my space, including once from my end. And that's pretty bad. So I wouldn't say it's always nefarious, Susie. Sometimes it's strategic from some places. And then others, and there's the last one. And you know this, you worked at ESPN for 27 years. Some people just like to freaking talk. Like, some people just like the fact that they know information, right? And then you know what I'm saying? And like, it's just they're like, they're there. How do I sort of say this? They get off on the buzz of knowing something that few people know what their organization. And if it's a person who likes to talk, and you have a source relationship with them, they may just say it. I 100% agree with you that people love to tell you what they know. And I, and I have prided myself as being, I feel like within the industry, one of the few people. And when it came to my trust with whether I'm talking to coaches or GMs or players, like I knew I'd keep a secret. Yeah. Like Chris Mortensen, like say anything, you know, like total, total trust. So anyway, about three weeks before my layoff. As you know, Steve Young and I were the poster child for that round of layoffs. And as I kind of poked around a little at ESPN with one of my bosses, you know, the answer wasn't know your safe. And I remember that day sitting next to my daughter in the kitchen. And for years, I've said, you never know. And I sat down next to her and I cried. And I said, I think this is really happening. And then Steve Young called me and he said, you know, I'm hearing all this stuff. What do you think? And I said, Steve, you know our place, like where there's smoke, there's fire. This is coming from inside. So I'm not shocked. I did about a week before I asked Jimmy Petaro, president of the company. If we could talk, I always think he's very gracious. He did not BS me. He said, Susie, there's a white board and your name's on it. And I don't really know for sure right now, but your name's on it. So again, not shocked, tried to prepare myself, but the morning of that layoffs, I came out of the gym and Norby Williamson, who's, you know, everybody I feel like in the industry now knows his name. He and I go all the way back to the beginning of the launch of ESPN 2 and Sports Night. And I always thought we had a, you know, pretty good relationship. I was glad Norby was the one who was making the call. He texted me, can we talk? And I texted back because I had one year left to go on my contract. Yes, we can talk a year from now. And I say him seriously, like, can you give me a chance to get home and just get myself prepared? Which we did, interesting conversation that from a legal standpoint, it has to be his conversation needs to include certain things and be very black and white. The only part where I lost it a little and may have cursed was when he said, you know, you may not say anything disparaging about the company or we can take the last year of your contract, which I had a year to go. And that's when I kind of lost it. And I said, I have been like the ultimate good soldier. But there's all the crap I've seen. I have never said one negative thing about this company. Like, do you think I'm going to start now? And he's like, oh, you know, I had to say it. Sorry. And the other thing was you have seven days to like clear your email and your office 27 years. And it was a holiday weekend. So I've really had four days. The executives were pretty good about that. They pushed back on, let's give her some more time, which they did. I wound up having the summer to clean out my, I had only, the only email I ever had in my life was my ESPN email. Yeah. I'm going to go, I started. So I had to transition my whole life over. I had never owned my own laptop. My laptop was from ESPN. So like even going to Best Buy on July 4th weekend and buying a laptop. Like this was, it was, it was, it was, it was tough. That weekend was tough. And, and then as I say in, in my show on scripts, probably the most emotional couple things was ESPN said, and what he said to me, we're not going to say anything. And I just thought after 27 years of, it was the first person hired for the launch of ESPN 2. It was the first person assigned to the X Games. I went and shot the marketing tape for it. Monday night footballs moved to ESPN. I was part of some, you know, pretty big franchises. You're not going to say a word. Not thanks for 27 years. Just, just acknowledge it. I didn't understand that. And so I created the post. And I had alerted Adam Schefter, who had so many followers. Like Adam, I'm going to post this. Can you repost for me? And also Chris Laplaca, who is a longtime executive at ESPN and in PR. He also knew I was going to post. And he said, we'll repost and I crafted it. And as soon as I saw it go live, I had a good three to five minutes of full on sobbing. It was real. And then I went to work. I went and bought a laptop and created my own email and add. and just started moving ahead with my life. I'm a very positive and optimistic person. I also know it was just business, it was not personal. - Yeah. - It was just business, but one thing that I had always wanted to clear up was that it was written in the lead up to the layoff about, you know, maybe they'll offer her, you know, less money to do whatever. Or she's making too much money, the contract prior to the layoff, I took a 39% cut. - Wow. - And at the time, to the point of older women in the industry, ESPN was negotiating with superstar up and coming, younger person, I knew at the time they were offering to triple that person's salary. And here they were asking me to take a huge cut. I thought about how much I love what I'm doing. Love the people I work with, even stuff like medical coverage. I have a teenage daughter. Like I took all of that in consideration and said, it's not about her money, I wanna keep doing this. But my pushback to the company was, I've worked year-round my whole career. And my daughter is 14 and we've never taken a spring break 'cause I'm prepping the draft and my summer ends at training camp. And so can I have my life back? That's when my assignments were pulled back to just Monday nights and the draft and the Super Bowl. Up until then, I was still doing a full array and working year-round and full-time. So that was my pushback, that was a natural thing and I did think the 39% cut was gonna get me to the end. - There's a lot to follow up on that. And actually, which something you remind me, Kenny Maine was on this podcast. He told me that they offered him a 61% pay cut, which got a lot of pickup. I think people were surprised about that. Okay, let's sort of start with something that you said near the beginning of this. Did you ask to have some kind of good buy press release or something like that? I wonder on your end, no. But I understand from their perspective, they, I don't even wanna get into their head, but was a thought that we want you to do whatever you want to do as opposed to us because they have since or before, have done, hey, thank you so much for your 30 years of work here. You've been an incredible employee. Here's your last sports center. We're gonna do the going away party. So that's a little curious to me that you did not get that after 27 years. You're not a, you're not a seven year employee here. This is three decades. And again, like part of some pretty big stuff with the cum. Massive stuff, yeah. I feel like we were all proud of. So that, that, that just, I'm a human. It just, that hurt. Why not? Yeah. And did you, and you know, did you ever get anything to your satisfaction on the why not? No. Okay. All right. Next, so the next thing on this is the Petaro thing. I actually, I don't generally reflectively like want to praise CEOs, but I actually am impressed by that because he is the one person it feels like in this, who was at least transparent with you, did not write, did not try to sort of say, hey, we love you, you're great, whatever. And then you wake up the next day, right? And you're on the list. So that's, you know, that's impressive to me if nothing else that what happened you didn't particularly like, but he was at least trained. That doesn't happen a lot in our business. He was at least trained. And one person there is very transparent about this stuff. Agreed completely. And also it was somewhat satisfying to be able to say all the things I wanted to say. Yeah. Just out, you know, even just the timing of a woman in this industry and my age and how does that look? And just like I was able to kind of vent in a business like way. We had a very professional conversation. And I did, I appreciate it. I appreciate it. Something else that like, again, this, and I think maybe you start to think about this more when you get older. And ASPAN's not the only place on this. I lived this at Sports Illustrated too. I think you see sometimes a little bit of the athletic as well. There seems to be the, like the idea of institutional knowledge is gotten more devalued and devalued. Like someone who has put a lot of time in an organization who stands for the organization and knows how the organization runs, right? And like what the organization's value should stand for? I feel like that, you to me stood for that at ASPAN. But if I look at today's the ASPAN, what might be more valuable for them today? Would be someone who would connect, who's someone who connects with the 18 to 40 year old male college football demographic? I was always the ultimate team player. But that's sort of me at the core. It's sort of old school, hard core. It's all about the team. The way we produced Monday Night Countdown or any other shows that I was working on was about, let's make it a great show. It's never about a particular person. It's, let's all work together to make this a great show. And, you know, I don't want to sound old by saying it. Like, I think those of us who've been in the business a long time are sort of nostalgic for that type of feel. But like, that's what it was really about. Like, let's all work together to make something great. - The other thing I want to ask you about is, and this is not a total black and white thing because there are women in the business now, to our spur, Holly Rowe, Pam Oliver, who are, you know, of a certain age and they're doing great work. They have a long term, yeah, Hannah Storm. They have a long term contracts, right? So it's not necessarily like these places are cutting every person who's over the age of 50 or 55. That said, I do want to ask you this. From your perspective, once you got into, let's say, your 50s, did you find it more challenging to work, not, I don't think your work quality was still great. Did you find it more challenging for your bosses or for people in managerial positions to appreciate what you did, given so much of the business always feels to be like, who is the next flavor of the month right, who is the next hot prospect? - I was aware, I think it would be naive to not be aware. It's a visual medium, it's television. I just think overall, in the scope of television, you see more older men than you see older women. That's just like, that's the nature of it. And this is sports, right, and we are trying to reach, you want things to be youthful. I was always really proud of work really hard to take care of myself. I eat great, I go to the gym, I feel youthful, I feel I always did, I feel like I was presented in a youthful sort of way and there's not control what you can control, what am I supposed to do? Is it better than the alternative I'm getting over? - Yeah. And you had said, I know you have sort of said this before or maybe you said this on the Lisa Salter's interview that what you're really proud of is longevity. And I think you can really put your hand up in terms of some of the most significant on air figures in sports during your time, in terms of how long you worked at a major, major place. And you are correct, there are more men who could say, hey, I had a 27 year career there, right, than women. And so if nothing else, I hope you are proud of that because I have no doubt, and I've talked to Pam Oliver about this and Holly Row about this. Like there are so many women who are younger than you who saw you on television and because you existed, like they believed it was possible. Like Pam Oliver has told me many, many times, she's gotten so many like notes from women, and especially as a black woman, right, on television, basically saying to the effect of like, I didn't know I could be a sportscaster, but then I saw you on Fox NFL sidelines and I thought to myself, okay, maybe I could do this. And I'd have to think, if you probably have had people right to you and tell you this stuff, right? 'Cause I think for a lot of people, you were probably that person. You are right about the being proud of the longevity piece, probably what I'm most proud of, that not only in television, but in sports television, to have longevity is incredibly difficult in this super competitive type of industry. So, and I think one of the things that really helped me was versatility, was having been a producer for many years. That's how my career started behind the scenes and learning the ins and outs, and I think that made me better as a host because I knew what everybody else's job was. And I felt proud of on our shows, partly being producer as well, being able to do the sidelines, being a reporter, being a host. All of those things I think contributed, and that's what I tell young people all the time, that there shouldn't be just an easy path that all that is really important. But I would say, among the blessings of the timing of my life, layoff. You know, I've never been big on social media. I find best pool for women, especially in this business. So I never, ever followed myself, followed my timeline, engaged in conversation, too much negative energy for me and just never, I never opened myself up to it. The day and maybe the day after I was laid off, I had friends say, you know, we know you don't ever read it. You need to read it today. Yeah. And Ed Werder, who had been who was laid off twice by ESPN, and Ed sent to me, it's like, it's like it's your own funeral. You get to listen in, but you're like, this too. And in a sense, he was right. Like, to be actually be able to like hear like the people that you inspired to be in the business or that you that sports can uplift and bring people together and make their day. And they recognize that I had poured my heart and soul in and really loved it. And that came through. And and that was all that was really special. It was it was because I was always so like game face and head down and working hard. I was never thinking about I'm a pioneer in this business. Like it just wasn't just not me. So to to take a minute to be recognized for that. And then I'm going back to, you know, no, don't follow me smart. It's much better for take it from me. Someone who's on it too much. You're much better for your mental health space. All right. This is come more things I want to hit on here. You um, just because you're built friendly. Maybe this wasn't a factor for you. But I've talked to so many people who have left the SPN who have gotten inspiration from those who have also left and then found success elsewhere. Maybe the most patron saint of this is a guy like Dan Patrick who obviously created this whole empire after the fact. But Dan Dan is not even close to alone. Whether it's like, you know, Trey Wingo or you know, I can name a ton of people who they've just created their, whether it's they've created their own media companies or YouTube space, you know, Linda Cohen just recently went out and now is doing a ton of YouTube. Did um, did that like, um, I know I did that at all in the last, let's just take the last couple years or the last 16 months when you're doing the script sports stuff. Like did that inspire you or did you note that that like, hey, like, you know, yes, like once upon a time, maybe maybe getting laid off by the SPN in the 90s, maybe that was the death now for you nationally. But we live in a different world now. We live in a creator economy now where you can Susie Colbert Inc can can get her own, you know, um, fan base pretty significantly and pretty fast. Yeah, I do believe that a number of us were institutionalized by ESPN a really long time. And then, and maybe I am the anomaly that that, um, while I really appreciate what Trey has done and Dan has done and Linda, it's, it's awesome. That, um, it's just wasn't where the main motivations of my life were at. And again, the blessing of the timing of things for me was, you know, I spent a lot of time on the road as my daughter was growing up. And I took every imaginable first flight, last flight, whatever it took to be there and not miss anything important. But I still, I was gone, you know, and she got to see a strong woman who does what she loves and comes home and, and our relationship is spectacular. But I've never had more fun than going to her volleyball games. That's cool. Yeah. Nothing in my life better than watching her succeed and spending time with her and TV naturally because it was my career. And that's where I was. Then that held this important place. But once that part of it was taken away, I wasn't eager to replace it. Um, my greatest joy and priority in life was her. And now I feel really fortunate that timing wise, it was her sophomore year, the junior year of high school and senior year of high school. I got to be here to help her achieve her dreams, which, um, she wound up being able to attend her dream school. And there's just nothing better than that. No, I agree with you. That's like my, this is the first year in a long time where I don't have as much full time responsibility and to be able to have twins younger than yours. Um, and it's just amazing just to be able to, like, sort of be around and they know that, you know, they'll, they'll always know when, when they're, when I'm gone, that like I was around. And like that's really important to me. You mentioned your daughter and I did want to ask you about this in the Lisa Salter's episode. Um, you are very, I mean, more honest than I've ever seen you be about your personal life, which as you said, you really did keep, uh, behind the glass, um, you know, Lisa talked about, um, fertility and IVF. I don't know how much I don't want to give away everything here because I people can watch it. Um, but there is one thing like you did, I will ask you about this. Are you talking about having a miscarriage on a flight back from an assignment once? And like, I have to be honest, like that, sort of stopped me cold that you would be, um, willing to share that, um, with the audience. So I just wanted to, like, sort of ask you just like, was that hard to do on camera? And, um, um, would you just feel like you're at, maybe you're at a point now in your life and obviously your daughter is here and exists and thriving in college. And maybe you can talk about this stuff, but you are not one who ever mentioned that in all the many interviews that you did over the years as an on air personality, no, it was never a photo of her that appeared. You know, everybody get would, you know, like get a thrill out of, you know, bring your kid to the set and all of that. I was just very protective of our privacy, personal life. And I think too, like being a single woman, just, I don't know, a lot of it, just very protective over all of that. I'm never looking for a spotlight in that way. Um, you know, I had, um, I had been trying to get pregnant for two years behind the scenes and, you know, trying all of this in hotels alone and on flights and all of the different things. And I was, um, I was offered to, um, host NASCAR when NASCAR was returning to ESPN. And I went to, um, Rich Weinberg out to kind of like see the whole setup and discuss it. I didn't know I was pregnant. I said yes. So now I'm waiting into this NASCAR world and Monday night football at the same time every weekend. And a reporter thought it was, um, like really ambitious to be doing those two sports together in the same weekend. But it was so early on. I didn't tell him in the interview that I was pregnant doing it. Wow. So I navigated a whole season of NASCAR and Monday night football up till December, pregnant. Wow. Which, um, yeah, it was a lot. So, you know, there was, um, there's a lot of things that people, you know, they think they know you when they, they, they watch you that, that you don't know. And, um, and I just thought there was value in, in sharing the journey because lots of women go through this and the struggles of it and sort of the importance of remaining optimistic through it. I, I share in the show that when, uh, when I first found out that my fertility level was low, because I was, I was 40 and I was like happy building my career and working hard. And I thought I just didn't consider the clock was ticking because I'm healthy. I'm, duh. But when I found out that my fertility level was low, the doctor said to me, you have a, but based on all your numbers, you have a 1% chance of having a baby. And I share this. I said, um, if you, as long as you're saying, it's not impossible. It's possible. And, and I just truly believe, like in life, if, if you were, are willing to work harder than anybody else, if you believe enough, like, that, that you can have it. And I guess that's my message is, like, I want to be able to inspire other people, like, don't give up. You can have it. I mean, I, I really, really wanted that. I really respect you sharing. That's not, that's, these are not easy things to share. It's certainly publicly when it, you know, it's going to err on a, on a network somewhere or a couple more things and, and we'll wrap up. How much ESPN do you watch today? Monday night football. Okay. So you're still, you're watching games still, but that's maybe, that's where it sort of ends. Stop begins and ends. That is correct. Okay, all right. Is it, is it, I don't know if paint falls the right word, but is it weird to watch your the place that you are at still three years after the fact? I trust me, I, I can understand if it would be I would think it would be normal for it's still to be a little odd when you're watching one of ESPN's channels. I think I've gone through the whole range of emotions. I was engaged with everything the way I had always been. I think that was just like a level of comfort I needed. I needed to I'm watching. I, I love Monday night countdown. I love everybody on it. I'm, I'm watching. I'm watching everybody. This is my family. Yeah. Anyway, they're all my family. I'm watching. I'm cheering everybody on. And then maybe it feels like a bad breakup in a relationship and then then it kind of hurts. And maybe I had a year there to where it, it was sort of just you know what now it just feels kind of painful and I'm not enjoying watching. And I think I'm back now. Super Bowl this year and like that was always on a radar is how cool you know and I'll be cheering everybody on. But yeah, I think for a chunk there it was just painful. When, when, when the news broke or got out and I don't know your situation at that time with agents or anything like that did and you don't have to mention if any specifics. I'm just more interested if it happened. Did anyone reach out from who liked other places that have the NFL, either game inventory or talk about the NFL in some form or fashion just to check in and say. What's your contract status? You have any interest in talking us. I don't mind telling everybody that not have an agent and that really was a result of when my, my contract that I was under when I went to renegotiate that I was told by a number of agents like we know you're going to take a big cut here. We don't really want to cut that too. You are better off advocating for yourself. And frankly, through most of my career, even when I had agents and I had some great agents who were so cognizant of I kind of did it myself. They didn't even take a percentage. Really like classy high level. So I went into that last negotiation without an agent. And that was where I was at at that moment. Would that have changed things? I don't know because I was under contract for a year. And in this business, if you're young and in this business, not being on the air is the color. Yeah. If you've had all together since my producing days, 39 years, then I was okay sitting for the year. And what did that do to potential things? But again, we've kind of covered that. Yeah. I was scratching and clawing to I want to travel. I want to be on that big show. I know I want to go to high school volleyball. Do you just any, you know, I like I remember your work on the night of the injury to the Mar Hamlin, which you should be very proud of. And everybody from Booker McFarland to everybody to Lisa Salter, as obviously I mentioned, everybody was part of that. Like that was sort of the best of ESPN. And in doing my prep for this interview, I thought to myself, Susie really like if she wanted to, could like find her own platform and offer like very thoughtful, interesting stuff. Not really a hot take artist, but you do have like a repository of stories and contacts and stuff like that does that it mean not at this point because you made this point just like want to do things at your own speed. Does that interest you at all to maybe like now at this point like you have your own YouTube channel you post whenever you want if that's the interest if you're interested in writing you start like a sub stack or be high and you just sort of have it out there. I'm not saying doing it for money purposes, maybe there is money, maybe there's not. But it seems like strikes me is creatively you'd have something to say is that of interest you don't I have had meetings with people to just talk about the process and what that would be like I'm also and you covered this so often with people that that you interview. The time and the level it takes to really dig in with people in the know and then for me to be able to offer real true insights to spend the time the time on the phone the time talking to the coaches general managers players. I've been very aware over this time like so many people are calling them and pulling at them taking up their time like unless I have like something like a true reason to be disseminating that information I don't want to bug them like maybe I'm too self conscious in that way but it would have to be something I feel like big and real for me to want to take anybody's time. And and that's where I always thought was my strength really was diving in at a different level than most people that were necessarily like hosting the pre game show or like that's kind of reserved for you know like the sideline reporter or the insiders but that's how I did my job at at the Super Bowl. There weren't really many hosts at the team breakfast and talking to the assistant coaches and that's how I did my job again it's the only way I knew how to do my job was to get real concrete information from the inside that's what I wanted to share. So I'm not doing my job that way I don't know if I want to do it I want all the information yeah that makes that makes sense to me is there anything that I did not ask you that you would like to add. Wow let's see should I like go through my notes here no I think I think we did a really good job of it maybe to circle back to the beginning about the script shows and it was like a really fun tour of some people that I truly love. Like Steve Young will be the final show because I think he also is like the picture perfect of the first lefty and the hall of fame that he taught himself pretty much how to throw a football because of that and and that the gift he gave that he didn't even know he had to give was that he did it with debilitating anxiety and he wrote a he didn't even intend to write a book but it became a book. And talk about giving people real strength and recognizing somebody like that his his path through life and being a Mormon in the NFL yeah so many unconventional things I mean I I just I loved hearing the stories I hope everybody else does as much and you mentioned you know we reach the women sports represented here. Hillary night is teamed with a good friend of my digit Murphy was a pioneer of women's hockey and yeah many championships with with brown. And and Sam Rappaport was head of D.E.I. for the NFL she's teamed up with Deanna Flores and that episode what's what's hotter sport than flag football so I hope we we covered a number of different things and can be of interest to. Well you're I knew you're in a good mental health space now but I will say and I hope you sort of know this that like the amount of people who have been laid off by that place who have who are really talented thoughtful smart people like has grown exponentially in the last decade. So you know even recently like Damien Woody another guys not really how to take artists just smart like lot of credibility and it doesn't seem like there's a place for a guy like that at that at that company right now so it's not going to make you feel better per say but like you should know that like you're in a now large group and community of people who like did things the right way and. It I feel like how do I say my late mom was a therapist and which by the way never be a child of a therapist doesn't it's really just a nightmare of psychological proportions but the point is one thing she did say that to her clients and her children as well was you always take you take your talents with you. Meaning that no matter where you work you're not going to work in one place forever for most of us at least right but your company never owns your talents you own your talents and you have to always remember that because it's hard when someone says you're not. Here anymore right or you're not part of this anymore it's mentally inevitably you think to yourself what like what I do wrong why don't they want me anymore but she always. Council then choose correct on this is that like you control the next step your talents and your talents they never own that right and and so you. You are a great example, in my opinion, with this project now that you're doing, of sort of recognizing it. I took my talents with me and now I have this really good interview show that the quality is really, really high. And that's you. That's not ESPN. That's Suzy Culp. Thank you. I think I did a good job of not taking it personally. And for everybody else, Sue, who Charles Davis, Tom Pellicero, like pillars of great Karl Ravage. Another one. Yeah. Who, by the way, I think, found out from a reporter. Right. Who found out, again, I'm all about respect and I just don't understand some of the disrespect, you know. And it's a place that I, I mean, I worked for twice that I, again, loved and considered family. So that's where the hurt comes from. Not the, not the business part of it, that it's business and, yeah, like, don't take that part personally. And I guess the nice thing about like being out there and doing the show and, and I think one of my strengths was always interviewing and getting to the depth of the interview. It's been nice to kind of be reminded of that. Oh, yeah. I do have that skill. I have that skill, like, that's, oh, that's still there. That has been. That's really kind of nice. Yeah. You got some great stuff out of Jesse Cole in the first episode too, which is cool. All right. So a little, I don't, by the way, I hope you come back. I'm going to invite you back in a couple of months and then we can actually do your career, Fox, ESPN. There's a lot of this. I haven't even, didn't even hit the surface of everything you actually did. There's a lot of stuff. Yeah. We'll, we'll do that and we'll do that. We'll do that next time. Jesse Culber is the host and, as she mentioned, one of the executive producers of a new series called the originals premier September 15th at ESPN at ESPN. No. I'm losing it. September 15th at 8 p.m., don't cut that, James, like, like my screw up beyond there. September 15th, 8 p.m. eastern time, where she goes one-on-one with people that she described throughout this podcast, who sort of have defied like expectations and have just done things successfully in a very interesting way. The debut episode is Jesse Cole, founder of Savannah Bananas, which has obviously blown up. That's followed by John Gruden and then episode three is Lisa Salters. Check that out again on the Scripps Sports Network, which is free, free streaming television channel, which you should be able to get no matter where you're listening to the United States. For those of you in Canada, I am not 100% positive about that. It's available on all the major streamers with great time. I'm going personally. I'm going to lash it on my Amazon Prime, but it's all, and then it will also be on their YouTube channel. Awesome. All right. There you go. So you'll be able to catch that, actually, no matter what country you're in. Susie, I can't thank you enough. I know you'll be doing more press, but I really appreciate that this was the first long form you did. Thank you so much for joining me today. I appreciate the way you do business and how you conduct interviews. It's always thoughtful, so my pleasure. Thank you, Susie. Susie Culber, everyone. Susie, stick around here for one second as we, unlike you, a professional host, you'll not watch a mediocre host close this up. If you enjoy these kind of conversations, head to the, and I, we appreciate Susie Culber very much doing this, head to the archives, previous episode before this, another very interesting person in the sports media business Gabe Spitzer, vice president of global live sports and entertainment for Netflix. We went through sort of Netflix spots on how they approached live sports, talked about the women's world cup, which is a master project for them in 2027. Their interest, perhaps, in the men's world cup, and then obviously they have the big NFL game coming up in Australia between the Rams and Niners. We've done, obviously, a ton of stuff on Tony Roma and what's going to happen with him. Also did the athletic release in his day in a routine investigation. So head to the archives. You can check that out. If you're into a women's basketball junior, Gino R.M.O was on this podcast in August. If you're into documentaries, Jason Hare, the director of the Novak joke bitch, the wolf, and winter was on this podcast on August 20th. Want to thank James Jackson for all his hard work. Thanks to everybody at audits for their support. And thank you for listening. We'll see you soon on the sports media podcast.