Supporting Students from All Angles — Careers, Transfer, and Confidence

Welcome to Bison Breakthrough from College to Career. My name is Beth and I'm a Career Coach at Nichols College. I know this is going to be a fun one today. We have Oscar Chavez in the studio, which is a treat since I started recording mostly over Zoom these days to talk about his career path, how he landed where he is now, and who will definitely give us a lot of good career advice as well. I'm sure there will be some laughs too. Oscar, I'm excited to have you here today. Can you introduce yourself and tell us a little bit about yourself? Yes, yes. So hi everyone. My name is Oscar Chavez. I graduated undergrad in 2020, big old COVID year, and then I finished my dual master's program in 2022. Currently working at Quinn's Gaming Community College when I've been in the higher ed space for about five years, going on six. I recently just got a promotion, so I went from a career and transfer counselor to now the coordinator of transfer in articulation. Well, congratulations. My next question was going to be to ask you about your transfer counselor position, but now I'm going to ask you to tell us a little bit about your current role as the coordinator and what your day to day looks like. Yes, yes. So it's funny. I didn't really ever see myself going into transfer, even though my pathway kind of always like crossed into it. So I was a transfer student. I went to Newberry College, which closed my junior year. So I got to go through the process as a student, and then when I got here, I was in admissions. I'd helped with the backer transfer stuff, which is great, and then did some transfer advising at WPI. So now my entire role is all about transfer. And so my focus has been the relationships between the community college, QCC, and our partner institutions. And so my focus will be to essentially create agreements for our students to easily transfer over to the bachelor schools and hopefully make that process a little bit easier for them. And so it's a lot of relationship, building relationships, keeping them alive, negotiating, some good benefits and perks for the students, and just building awareness on what that transfer process looks like for the students. That's really interesting to hear about, because I think when I think of transfers, I think of students transferring in, but you're really talking about students transferring out and how to support them in that way. So that's an interesting perspective on how to think about that type of student. Yeah. Having different areas of higher education, admissions, advising, career services, now transfer students, you mentioned all of those things. What drew you to the field in this area and how was your career evolved over time? Yeah. So I went through kind of a panic my junior year, because I was a sport management major, and I was like, oh crap. Like I was like, I don't know that I want to do this. I was really going to be, I wanted to go into coaching, collegiate coaching, and I was like, there's no security. Like there's no financial security. There's no location security. So I panicked. I pivoted. I started my freshman year. I got approached by an admissions counselor, and she was like, are you going to apply to be an ambassador? And I was like, I don't even know what that is. So my journey started there, and I became an ambassador over with me, my full three years in undergrad. My senior year, I was like, what do I do? And so I started to talk with Steve Cleermann, who was one of the associate directors of admissions. And I was like, what was your path? What did that look like, until he talked to me about Maramax program, but then I got approached by Caitlin, who was like, we have a graduate assistantship open next year. You know, we think you would be great for the position. And so that is kind of what drew me. I liked giving tours to families, talking with families, specifically with first generation students, who like didn't really understand the process, because that's where I came from. I really had no clue how college worked, and I had to figure it out on my own. And so after I just kind of stuck with higher ed, and I've kind of been in this space for a while, I really like having the knowledge of every department. And so that when I'm working with a student, I can be like, this is something you should focus on, keep in mind with this, this, that, and the other. When I find that it's really helpful specifically to those first-gen students. For sure. And a couple of things that you said jumped out at me, the junior year panic, I think we've all had that. I think all of the students have that. Oh my god, what am I going to do? I specifically remember where I was when I had my first like, oh no, I don't know what's next. But I think that's great. And I think higher definitely gets a hold of you. And your coaching student is just in a different way now. It's not on the court. But you're still coaching them and working with them. And I think that that's like the most rewarding piece of it. And Stephen Katelyn are great. I think both of them listen to the pods. So they hated them. Katelyn doesn't know it yet, but she's going to be on. Surprise. Hey. So how has your experience across multiple departments shaped the way you support students in making academic and career decisions? I know you just talked a little bit about liking that, but how does that help you? Yeah. So I think it's been really nice understanding. So I started in admissions, moved over to advising, now career and transfer. And I think it's just been able to give me the tools to give a well-rounded experience for the student. And so one of the conversations that I really have is helping the student navigate through the college application process. And knowing you can negotiate for a little bit more money, it's okay to ask for more merit based aid. And these are the do's and the don'ts. And these are things to keep in mind. And make sure to attend an open house or an acceptance student stay. And I feel like I wouldn't have really gotten that knowledge had I not gone through admissions and advising. And so I feel like that helps me with guiding them in the right area. When I'm working with students, I always tell them. Like I am just here to give you the information. I'm never going to tell you what to do, but I want to make sure that you have all the facts because you should be making a decision based off of what's best for your scenario. And that's kind of like been my motto over the last few years. And I think having the experience from all these different departments has really helped me do that. Yeah, and I think sometimes they do just want you to tell them what to do. No, need to make the decision on your own. Yep. So what skills have been most essential to your success and higher education as student support roles? I mean, I think just like interpersonal skills, networking has really been big. One of the things that I've focused on is when I get to a campus, when I start in a new role or start in a new institution, I always want to get involved because I think it's important that I know how the campus works and functions and who is in what department in my area. Because when I'm meeting with students, it's really beneficial for them that I'm not bouncing them from department to department because that's where a lot of students really like fall off. And then they're like, well, if this person can't help me and they've now sent me elsewhere, then it's like, why would I go get help if, you know, I'm just being bounced from office to office. So I think the networking piece of it is like making sure that I'm knowing everyone on campus, also understanding their roles and getting to know like what exactly they do. How can that be beneficial to the student and interpersonal skills? I think just being able to like talk to someone is because there are people who are people who don't know how to talk to people and when a student walks in, if they don't feel like you're welcoming or they don't feel like they can just like ask any question, you don't ever really get the full story and getting the full story out of the student is really important for their journey. I think those are two fantastic skills and at some point I'm going to go back and relisten to all of the podcasts that I've recorded and count how many people have said networking or talks about the importance of networking and I think it might be all of them at this point. Yeah. It's definitely a skill that we need to continue to grow as we're growing, students need to grow, everyone needs to work on it and continue to do it. So you're working with transfer students now and you've worked a little bit in career development but how do you continue to grow professionally and stay informed on the evolving trends in the higher ed world? So I'm a really big advocate of using your resources and so one of the things I typically like to do is for at least my current position, there's a group of other transfer counselors at the other community colleges and so one of the things I did was I sent all of them an email and was like, I would really like to me and talk a little bit about like your position what you're doing at your institution to figure out like what's going to work, what could I potentially take and utilize that QCC or you know what can I kind of learn in terms of like mistakes and so always like again going back to networking, you know always use your resources in terms of like people who are already doing the job because that can be very helpful in avoiding a lot of those mistakes at the beginning and then for me like one of the big ones as well as Netta the New England Transfer Association which has been very helpful, they do a lot of different webinars, professional development opportunities, they usually have a really big conference, things like Nakata been helpful and so you know being able to kind of like join and follow some of these educational organizations I guess. I believe is always good to make sure and stay current with trends. Being to partner institutions is really important to you know I think it's been very helpful being able to like like I've worked here and like I have my connection with this always being home and then you know I worked at WPI, I've worked at Assumption like I have friends who work at different institutions so being able to also just have conversations with them can be helpful. I think that's so important and I do the same thing. I'm in a couple organizations and associations for career services and it's just nice to be able to email someone and be like have you been seeing this or lately it's been how are your career for registrations going and different things like that so it is nice to have that network but it goes back to it's networking and I get it's talking to people so two skills that I think are invaluable. Yeah. No matter what career you're in. Right and networking I mean it's hard like it's hard to talk to people but with everything else like you know I'm talking to athletes in particular like you at some point weren't good at what you did right like you started out and like you maybe looked like a baby giraffe like not really being able to like move and you know the way that you wanted to but with practice you became a master at your skill and so networking is the same thing you know being able to go in like practice and just have conversations although it can be awkward it can be very helpful. Oh yeah for sure and I'm just thinking back to a friend of mine who it was a gym friend when he first started working out we were like oh what are you doing and now he's like a world class athlete. Yeah. So you have to practice it but it's not just like meeting the new people it's creating and building their relationships it's keeping it going and I think that that's important as well. Right. Alright so let's talk some tips and tricks and advice for students so you work closely with students. Yeah. Now it's transfer students but sometimes it's exploring majors maybe careers and the different transfer options so what's the first step that you recommend for someone who isn't sure what they want to do next. So a QCC offers this assessment it's a 60 question assessment tool that was built called Career Coach and so one of the things I like to do is and it ties it into the programs that QCC and so when people are really talking about like what direction should I go into I definitely point there first then I tell them like take the 60 questionnaire it gives you a whole report back and then you and I can have a conversation about what that looks like. The second thing I like to do is I always say like if I was your fairy godmother and like I had a wand and I could just kind of like wave it and you had no limitations like what would be the dream job and then I start to kind of like poke like okay why would that be a dream job like is it helping people you know is it numbers is it you know organization and then work backwards from there because then we can start to narrow down like what programs do you ideally need to have an order to get to that position. So those are two of the biggest things that I do I always encourage students get involved like do something that you may think that you like and you may find out that you love it and that's what you want to continue to pursue or you may find out that you like hate it and that's okay too you still learn something so that can be helpful as well. Yeah I think all experiences are good ones whether they tell you that this is yes what I'm going to go into or maybe this might not be the direction for me. Yeah. And I think that's interesting I'll have conversations with students that don't necessarily know what they want to do next as far as jobs and I always ask them if you had to get a job tomorrow. Yep. What would you be doing? Yeah. Knowing that it's probably not going to be your forever job but what's the tomorrow so trying to think in those terms of immediate but short term right right and I think that that also helps folks think about what might that be. Yeah. So what are some common mistakes you see students make when it comes to career exploration, job searching, transfer options and how can they avoid them. So I think like limiting yourself like just thinking that like you're not wanting to do something just because you think that you're not going to like it is like I feel like the number one mistake that I tend to see sometimes because like again you know you may think that you like absolutely hate something and like then find out later on that you do love it. So I think that's what I think is really important and I think that's really important. So I think that's really important. And I think that's really important. Right. And this is a time to like, I always like to say like, there are certain environments where you can make mistakes. And it's okay to make mistakes, right? Like, college is that time. And you're now like, right now you're practicing on like, what you're going to essentially do for the next 20, 30, 40 years. And so mess up and make mistakes in a controlled environment so that you don't win your, on your own later on. Exactly. So what are a few practical tips you share with students on writing, say, strong resumes, preparing for interviews, or strong applications for transferring to a new school? Yeah. So I always say, for resumes, I will say this until I'm blue in the face. Do not use a template. They're just terrible. I always say templates are good for like, inputting information. They're not good for editing. And so when you go back to your resume and you're making changes, it's just going to cause a lot of really bad mistakes. So I always say, I say that for resumes. Cover letters are always really hard. That's like, I sometimes still struggle with that. But I like to tell students like, the resume are the facts. And then the cover letter is the story of like, why those facts are going to be able to, you know, why you're going to be able to use those skills that you put on your resume to do the job well. Another one is like, make sure that you read the job description. And like, try to tailor your resume to that. Now don't like just copy and paste things off of the job posting. But like, try, like if it's asking specifically, like if you're an accountant is asking for QuickBooks experience, like QuickBooks should be listed in your skills. Because like, that's what they're going to want to see. And then be specific. Lewin Westreling, shout out another, you know, another great one. And my junior PDS, she basically told us she was like, you can say something and you can make a statement. But until you provide examples, everyone's going to take it at face value. Right. So like, I can say I'm a hard worker. But if there's nothing to prove that I'm a hard worker, then like it's just me making a statement. And so be overly specific. Have examples on the resume, like provide numbers, like or examples of like systems that you've used or whatever industry are going into. Because it can be very helpful. I'm just sitting over here smirking because you can tell that you're a Nichols college student. Because they're all things that we say. Yeah. And I think it's important to hear. Yeah. Because now you've been out into the world for a while. You've had a few different jobs and it is so important. Yeah. And I like how you said the facts in the story. I always say resumes are, think of it like show and tell, show me what you have and then tell me how you have them. But I like the facts in the stories. That's a good one. I have to swipe that one. Yeah, please do. All right. So many students experience imposter syndrome or uncertainty. And I'll even say full-time professionals like myself included. I still like sometimes when people say, oh, you have a podcast. I'm like, uh, yeah. Do you want me to talk about it? I get embarrassed. I'm like, this is season three. Like I've been doing this for a while now. And I think I've been doing this for a while now. What resources or strategies do you recommend for students balancing school, work, and career planning, and just life? That's a great question. A calendar? I was funny. I just texted a couple of friends a few days ago. And I was like, I think I need a secretary. I just like feel like I've run out of time. And I'm like juggling a million and one things. And yeah, I think having a planner, whether that be like something that you write down, something that's on, I love using my phone. I have synced that up with my outlet calendar so that I can like pop things on both of them just in case. Life gets really crazy as an adult between like trying to juggle a full-time job. You're also trying to juggle family, you know, a social life. And so it can get really crazy. So use whatever works best for you. But don't mistake yourself in saying that like you're keeping everything in your head because like you're gonna forget something. And you're really not. I promise you as an advisor, I don't know how many times that I've like heard that. Oh, I just keep everything in my head and like that works for me. No, it doesn't. So you know, just have some form of like organization. I think it's like the biggest piece of advice that I could give people. So that just makes me laugh because I have a couple baseball students in my classes. And I have a nephew who is going to college next year. And I was like, I want to get him something like college-y, like something fun for Christmas this year. So I asked my baseball players, I was like, okay, my nephew is going to college. You're all like second year students. So what's a good gift I can get him for Christmas to help him in college. And deadpan go, I think you should get him a planner. And I was like, thought you're gonna come up with some cool baseball thing planner is what you've got. So they're even thinking about it now. Oh my god, yeah. And you will like, it's funny. As you like start to, especially when once you graduate college, like you're gonna see yourself really start to turn into like an old person. Not to say that like planners are like only an old person thing, but like just how excited you get on finding like a planner that is just like beautiful and like works for you. And it's just like visually appealing. It's crazy how much you're gonna like love a planner in the future. So we've talked a little bit about networking, but I also want to talk about mentorship. Yes. So do you encourage students, and if yes, how do you encourage them to seek mentorship, whether it's from faculty, employees, or peers that they have? Yeah, I mean, I think 1000% important. You know, one of the pieces of advice that I give to students is it's really good for you to find somebody that is doing what you think that you're gonna be doing in the future. And really again, kind of like poke at the story and be like, you know, what did you do? And you know, what mistakes did you go through? You know, what do you wish you could have done better? Because then you now have that insight of like, okay, this was the pathway that I would essentially go down. And these were some of the mistakes that this person made. And so now I get to avoid those. And I might make other mistakes, but hopefully I'll pass that down to the next person that wants to come up that same path. And so I think that mentorship is really important for that piece. For me, you know, I've been fortunate that I've worked with a lot of really great people. And so I pick my mentors based off of who I want to be in, you know, 10 to 15 years. I mean, who I always like make the joke like, I want to be them when I grow up. So, you know, kind of have that same mentality of like, who do you want to be when you grow up? Have some of those similar traits as them. And then that way they can kind of be that like sounding board that, you know, you can ask a lot of questions to probably a month ago. This is shout out to my friend Ashley Buddys, who was also a nickel's employee. But she is like somebody that just, she's great. She's awesome. Like professionally. She's just like on it. And so, you know, I had a situation come up at work that I like didn't really have to handle, you know, I gave myself like a 24 to 48 hour rule. And so I'd reached out to her and I just had like a really candid conversation. And she was like, this is what, you know, I think you should do. I think you know what you need to do. And it was just really nice to have that reassurance. So right now when you're in college, it could be a faculty member. It can be a staff member on campus. But just try and find that person that you're like striving to be or striving similar to be like and you know, ask them, would you be my mentor? Even it sometimes it doesn't even have to be official like that. Go out and get coffee. Go for a walk. You know, keep it really informal. I had a student ask me a couple months ago. They're like, what do you do to like keep in contact with like people? Actually, it was at the sophomore shout out of it. They're like, what do you do to like continue like keep relationships with people? Like, I just send them a text or like, sometimes I just give them a call or like, I ask them, hey, do you want to grab coffee? The conversation doesn't always have to be formal. It can be, hey, how's your outside life going? You know, how's this event that happened in your life? So, you know, keep it informal. Sometimes some of the best conversations have it that way too. Yeah, absolutely. And I think it's going back to the networking and keeping the relationships going. It doesn't just have to be like, let's talk about work. Yeah. I think just having those different kinds of relationships and you don't have to have just one. You can have mentors for different areas of the conversation. Oh my gosh, yeah. I know I've gone through, I know I've gone through so many, but I've had a few different just in the areas that I've been in. Yeah. The way that I've been in life and I feel like I've been mentoring people as well. So, yeah. It's definitely, I think, a good relationship to have and to seek out especially when you are starting and trying to figure things out. And I always say to like, keep in contact. Don't ever lose contact. My best friend Alex always gives me crap because she's like, do you ever fall out with anyone? And I'm like, no, because for me, like a lot of these relationships are really important. And at some point they shaped my career. They shaped me as a person. And it's for me, like I appreciate all the people that have come into my life. And so I always, you know, try and stay in contact with people. And even if it's just, hey, how you doing through a text technology has made some of that a little bit easier. So, you know, sometimes I know we're all tired and we're burnt out. And it's hard to get on a phone call with someone, but a quick text makes big difference too. Yeah, it definitely has helped with this podcast because I'm with you. I just texted you. I was like, hey, you want to be on the pod? You're like, yes. Yeah, yeah. Definitely makes things like that easier. Alright, so let's talk advice for some students and listeners. So what's one small step students can take today to move forward in their career development? Just get involved. Don't be scared. Again, like I think going back on one of the earlier responses, don't limit yourself. You know, I always say this when I'm talking specifically to athletes. Sometimes we get really hyperfixated on our sport being the only thing that we can do. I get it. We're all competitive. I am very, very competitive and you know, I played volleyball in college and I loved it. And that was always my number one. But in the back of my head, I always knew like volleyball is going to end at some point. And I've experienced it and it really hurts. I mean, it's tough sometimes, especially as an adult. And so go out and try other things. You join a club that you think you would enjoy. Do something that takes you away from that number one thing because at some point it's going to end. So get involved in something that you feel like you would be passionate about or that brings you even just a little bit of joy because that one thing could be what opens the door for you professionally. For sure. And I'm glad you mentioned volleyball and volleyball ending because the sports are going to come to an end in college. And I will put a plug in. I actually talked to Mary Lanskarsinski who was a former women's basketball coach here at Nichols and an alum. But we talked a lot about athletes and what happens after the final game and things like that. So that aired in season two. So go give that a listen if you're an athlete and you might be probably don't want to think about it. But think about the after. One of my biggest things I say this a lot is not to steer the conversation into athletics. But I think it's, you know, for me, it was really tough because I was always a part of a team. And like no one ever told me this is what's going to happen when your sport ends. And my situation was a little bit different. You know, COVID took a month away of my season, which was really hard and unexpected. But it was really hard because for a really long time, I worked out and I lifted and like everything for me, like I like to call myself a giver. I like to give to people. That's what brings me joy. And so I always knew my motivation to work out was because like I was giving back to the team. And I was only making the team stronger when volleyball ended. I had no idea what to do. I didn't have the motivation to work out anymore because I was like, well, I'm only working out for myself. And so it was tough for sure. So have something to kind of fall back on, you know, so that like it's not the only thing that you have going on. Oh, yeah, for sure. And I think you can get involved in different things. And like I said, you were talking about you had lifts, you had those casual things. Yeah. And you really had someone telling you exactly what you needed to be doing. Yes. That's figuring that out on your own. Yep. So not that you want to think about like, okay, what am I going to do when my sports over? But think about what are you going to do when your sports over? Are you going to get involved in anything else? Are you going to stay involved in the team? Are you going to try and coach? What are you going to do for yourself that's going to keep you kind of engaged with everything around you? So I think that's definitely important. Yeah. So let's go back to our junior year panic. Some students might feel behind or unsure about what they're going to do in the future. So what encouragement would you give them to make them not feel like that? Talk to peers. I'll give advice. And then I'll talk about own journey. I remember when I panicked, I had a friend of mine. I guess you could call her a mentor. I mean, she was a year older than I was maybe two. But like again, she was that person that I was like, I want to be you when I grow up. And so I remember like going and flying into that panic. And I'm like, I don't know what to do. Like I'm in junior year. I've now started to take really, really major specific courses. I can't really go back now. It was like, just relax. Like it's your, you know, your undergrad. If you absolutely need to, don't forget. And I think this is specific to Nichols is like, it's this is a business degree. So like whatever it may be, even though you have a concentration, you're still getting a good foundation of business. And so you may think that you're stuck into one field, but there are many opportunities out there that you could still use the skills that you've gotten from the business degree. My other piece of advice is everyone's on their own track of life. And I have this conversation a lot specifically with our community college students. It's been really special to see the community college side because like our average population is 25. But I've worked with people who are like 60 coming back to school because of programs like Mass Education, Mass Reconnect. It's kind of open that door. And you know, a lot of them are like, I'm so old. Like I don't even know why I'm like coming back. I'm like, no, like, you know, everyone is on their own path. Everyone's path is going to look different. I took two years off when I graduated high school. So I didn't start undergrad until I was 20. So that also kind of loomed over me too. It's like, oh my god, like all my friends are halfway through undergrad. I'm just starting. And then my junior year, like friends were starting to get married and buy houses and have kids. And so just don't panic. You know, everyone's on their own pathway and you're going to get where you need to go. Awesome. I love that. So this is a self-serving question, but that's okay. It's my podcast. I can do that. How can students make the most of the career services and resources available at their colleges? Oh my god. Yes. I have this conversation every time I go into a classroom. These services are free. People pay hundreds of dollars just for somebody to review their resume and give them feedback. And while you're in college, it's all free. Mock interviewing, same thing. Like, you know, you get to be in a professional setting where you get to make mistakes. And those mistakes are okay to happen. And you get to strengthen those interview skills or those resume writing skills. So just walk in, ask questions, utilize them now while they're free. You know, same thing with like the bison boutique. Like, that was huge. I remember when I transferred here, I didn't have a suit. And like, being able to walk in and, you know, before I had to buy one, like, you know, I just was able to rent one. We have a career closet at QCC and students actually get to keep their outfit. And so I tell them, too, like, you get a free suit. I mean, it may be like partially worn. Somebody donated it, but it's all clean. It's not ripped or dirty. So use it while you have it. I think a lot of students underutilize a lot of different departments on college campus. Career services definitely being one of those. Mental health counseling, being another one of those. Again, people are paying a lot of money in the real world to get some of these services. So use them while they're free now. Yeah, I think that's huge. And probably something you're not going to think about into, like, oh, I have to pay for something like that. You mentioned the boutique and I always laugh, especially when we're rounding the end of a semester because we'll have a handful of students come and be like, this is what I borrowed every time I came in here. Can you tell me the brand and the size? Because now it's like time to go and get my own. And I'm always like, okay, like, yeah, we're sending you off. But I always laugh, thinking about that. But this was fantastic. So as you know, I like to ask my guests some quick closing questions. So I'm interested to hear what you have to say. So first, if you could describe your career path in one word, what would it be? I think strategic. When I started in higher ed, one of the things that I told myself was I did want to have a well-rounded experience. And so I wanted to be able to work in a lot of different spaces on a campus to fully understand how they function. But to go even further, I said, like, I want to work at a small school, a big school, a medium-sized school. I want to work for a state college and I want to work for a private college. And four years in, I've been able to do all of those things. And so again, you know, to our earlier conversation, like, it has made me light years more knowledgeable than everyone else because I haven't really pigeonholed myself into one specific area of campus. Like, I understand curriculum and, you know, how curriculum functions. But I also understand the enrollment process. And all of the nuances that come with that. And I've been able to do a little bit of teaching and, you know, career counseling and transfer. And so I think I was very fortunate to have been very strategic in how my career has gone so far. Great word and great way to plan the things out. So what was your favorite class at Nichols? Oh, my favorite class. Honestly, again, shout out any class with Charlie Robert. That is a person to know. Talk about being able to like network like everyone knows who Charlie is. I know that she doesn't teach here anymore. She's retired. Yeah, she's retired. I think I took an NCAA compliance course with her and like, she's just a wealth of knowledge. And so it was really cool to learn from her to also be in a classroom with a lot of other people who wanted to also go into coaching was really cool. So it was awesome. I loved it. What's one piece of advice you'd give your college self? Learn to say no. One thing I will say is sometimes I do say, you know, try everything. But also like know that boundary of it's okay to say no because there are some days where I didn't have time to like breathe. It was just like go, go, go. When I say my senior year, I had an internship, a coaching practicum. I was an RA. I was an admissions ambassador. I had preseason. I had lift classes on top of all that. I was going from like six in the morning until 11 o'clock at night. So sometimes like it's hard to say no, but you know, be very strategic and learning how to do that so that you protect yourself. I like that classes was the last thing you listed on your list of things you had to do. I almost forgot about it. Oh, yeah. Some adults also need to learn how to do that. So myself included sometimes, but that's okay. What's your favorite memory of your time at Nichols? I think I will say the first semester was a struggle. I was really only here for three semesters or two and a half if you want to count like COVID because we got sent home in March. So one my junior year, I like, there was like the end of the school year and I like walked out to the copper quad and like everyone was just like outside like hanging and vibing. It was just we all loved each other and we could all feel it and that was really awesome. I think another one was the relay for life fair before everything happened in March of 2020. I think that was like the last like big event that happened on campus. And I remember like I had an absolute blast. Maybe just being around everyone. I'm very competitive. So like it was also fun to like. I think there's a video out there of me literally dragging Carrie Sear over the finish lines that we could win like three-legged race. I love to see if we can find that one. I don't know if she would be too happy about that, but maybe we'll try. Alright, so I know you talked a little bit about this, but how did Nichols best prepare you for your career? PDS, I get that question so much and really those professional skills I can tell you I've worked at three or four other like college campuses and that is not something that's normal at those colleges. And so being able to like really like have a class where you work on resume building building out your LinkedIn mock interviewing like going through the entire career process. I will never be able to like stop talking about how important all of those are. And so that was one of it and then the networking piece. You know, I mentioned it earlier of how important it was like that was always ingrained and that's when I was a student here. It was like network network network whether that was like the sophomore shout out event or any of the smaller alumni event. You know, the career puts on like those are all really important and a lot of what I got was because I was able to network. I got out to Susie E. Susie Angle Meyer. I mean she was really great like when I got here and transferred in I was so scared and it was really hard for me to acclimate. But I remember she pulled me in my senior year fall and she was like, "Hey, I heard you're from Oregon and we have some alumni out there that we've been wanting to connect with. And you know, would you be open to you know me connecting you and maybe you grabbing dinner or grabbing coffee while you're home during the winter break?" And I was like, "Oh, I don't know. This is kind of like scary. I don't know these people, right?" But I was like, "Yes, you know, totally do it." And so, you know, I got to have coffee with Jack McPhale and that led to when I applied to the Apple Orchard internship. You know, he was really close with Jim Jackson who did that and you know, they had a conversation and you know, kind of helped me get that position. And so it's the networking piece. I will say it over and over again and PDS like, it's just so good. Yeah, it's networking. It's who you know and it's who knows you. I think that's super important. Yeah. So what's the best decision you've made in your career so far? This is like way before my career, but honestly coming out to the East Coast. I am from a very small town from Oregon. No one ever leaves. Everyone goes to the community college and then to the university that's in town. And so I remember sitting down and I was like, "I'm going to hate myself if I don't do this." And I did it and you know, it has opened up so many doors for me on this side of the country. I think I mean, it kind of does relate to my career because higher ed is so big here. And every other place in the country kind of looks towards Massachusetts for you know what to kind of do in terms of like higher education. And so I think being able to try something new, go somewhere completely different and build a life here has really like changed my life forever. Yeah, it's definitely got to be scary, but we absolutely made you an East Coaster. Yeah, I'm 100 percent. Yeah. Do you have a favorite book podcast or resource for professional growth? Yeah, I mean, I always lean on like, I mean, this has been over the last like three years. This net has been a really good resource and inside higher ed has also been great. They have some podcasts that they do to talk about some different issues that have been going on. So I think those two have been like really like a light for me to make sure that I stay current on what's going on in the industry. So what career advice do you want to offer new college grads moving into the workplace? It is going to be a struggle. It's going to be really hard, but there's always a light at the end of the tunnel. Nothing lasts forever. Everything is temporary and know that right now you may not necessarily get the dream job that you're going to get right out of college and that's okay. But you are going to work hard for the future and that hard work is going to end up paying off for you. So don't panic. Again, you may not get that dream job, but you will. And you know, and it'll be okay with you know, if that takes you a couple of years, that takes you a couple of years. Yeah, it'll all work out in the end. Yes. Well, this is fantastic. Thank you so much for taking the time to chat with me today. Do you have any last words before we sign off? I mean, I wish everyone best of success in their career and their college journey. I mean, really enjoy it. It didn't feel like it flew by in the moment, but now looking back, like I would give nothing more than to be able to like experience it. I just want to like go through it again. So yeah, and if you want to network, add me on LinkedIn. Yes, I love that. Well, thank you again and thank you all for listening. I hope you learned a little something today. We will see you next time on Bison Breakthrough from College to Career. 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