Steve Aoki

Welcome, welcome, welcome to Armchair Expert. I'm Dax Shepard and I'm joined by Monica Lily Padman. Hello. Today we have one of the biggest DJs to ever live, Steve Aoki. He is a Grammy nominated DJ and record producer. His albums are Neon Future, Wonderland, Colony with a K, like Krispy Kremes. That's right. Quantum Beats. Cool. And he's celebrating, as he should, the 30th anniversary of his record label, Dim Muck. Yes. And guys, if you're like me and you think, well, I'm not terribly interested in DJing, it doesn't matter. Steve is such a fascinating guy. What an incredible story he has, work ethic. The whole thing is just a fun ride. Legendary father. Yeah. Oh, it's such a good episode. I really loved him. I think you're going to too. Please enjoy Steve Aoki. We get support from Quince. You know what I think about a lot? The stuff in my closet, I actually wear. Not the trendy pieces. 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Honestly, if I could just flip a switch overnight and be better at one thing, I'd want to be better at handling stress in a healthier way. Like not letting the small stuff snowball into this whole thing where I'm tense for the rest of the day over something that didn't even matter. It came to mind immediately because I know I do it. Someone cuts me off. I'm in traffic and somehow I'm still thinking about it at dinner. Two seconds. That's all it was. So yeah, that's what I'm working on. And that's where BetterHelp comes in. You know how I feel about therapy. It's just necessary. In fact, sometimes I know I'm not supposed to say this. I judge you if you've never tried it. Better is a feeling defined by you. And for BetterHelp, it's a BetterHelp therapist who really gets you. It's a focus on global, emotional well-being with thousands of therapists and millions of members in over a hundred countries. It's progress. And it's getting better at letting the small stuff stay small. That's my better. Sign up and get 10% off at BetterHelp.com slash DAX. That's BetterHelp.com slash DAX. BetterHelp.com slash DAX. It's just timing of you coming today. So a month ago, my daughter turned 13 and I was taking her to Disneyland for like the weekend. And I said, is there anything special you want to do? And she said, yeah, I want to eat at Benihana. And I'm like, oh my God, that's great. I love Benihana. I'm not even sure how she knew about Benihana. But anyways, we go to Benihana in Anaheim, right? And I'm looking at the wall inside of Benihana and I'm like, hold on a second. Fucking Benihana was. Benihana was sponsoring offshore race boats. Yeah. I'm super into boats and all racing. So I was mesmerized by these photos of the Benihana racing boat. And I was like, that's such a weird thing for them to sponsor as a restaurant. And then I'm fucking reading about Steve. His father is Rocky Aoki, started Benihana and raced. Sorry, I said Aoki. I didn't say your last name right. Aoki is the American way. Okay. I mean, if you're in Japan. It's Aoki. If you're in Mexico, it's Aoki. If you're in England, it's Aoki. Okay. So we can get away with Aoki. But we got to do. First of all, what was your relationship with your father? Do you like talking about him? I love talking about my father. I mean, he's a legend for me. No, he's a legend. But I love to bring up his name because the people that really knew him. Yeah. Are older than us. You have to be like 55 and up. And then you knew you heard about him because he didn't have an impact in the 80s. He's crazy. Yeah. He was the Evel Knievel of restaurateurs for sure. Okay. So let's start. He's from Japan. Yeah. He's from Japan. And he was a wrestler there. He was a wrestler. He went to the US. I think he was wrestling for the Olympics on the Japanese team or something. You know, he's a high level wrestler. Came to the United States. And then this is where it gets kind of blurry. He came out there for some reason. I think some wrestling thing. Hurt himself. Couldn't wrestle for Japan. And then stayed. Stayed in New York. That part, I don't know the exact storyline, but he then came to New York. Did he speak any English? No. No. It's 1961. So 1961, he came to New York. It was difficult for Asian immigrants. You're in the least friendly city in America not speaking the language. Yeah. I mean, it's got to be a jail. Like his book, he does talk about like living in Harlem and being broke and trying to figure things out. He had an ice cream truck. Uh-huh. He was like, okay, you know what? I'm a wrestler. So I'm going to paint. A Japanese wrestler on the side of this ice cream truck. See what we get. Try to run Harlem, try to sell ice cream. It just didn't really work out. What a cool guy. And then he was taking classes for restaurant management at some small college. He also won like a flyweight wrestling division. Like he also was a really successful wrestler. And then he was like, let's start this restaurant idea. And his father, my grandfather, had the original Benihana's was in Japan. Oh, it was. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Benihana means it's a flower. Basically named it after a flower that grew outside of the rubble of post-World War II. Yeah. Next to his cafe. And it's like this resilient flower, this red flower that just grows through anything. And it's like, okay, let's call this, it wasn't a restaurant, a cafe, Benihana. And it wasn't like hibachi grill type cafe. No, no, no. It was just like a small, humble cafe. And my grandfather really helped him. He brought the chefs over. He brought the hibachi grills over. And it starts with four grills, right? In a restaurant. And the idea to like cook in front of people. Yeah, yeah. That's actually, interestingly enough, that's not a Japanese concept. They don't do that there. They don't do that. So that's very much an American born concept. Oh, wow. Where did he get that idea, do you think? I don't know where he got the idea. Well, he's a showman of some sort. Yeah, yeah. Just about to say that. Because no one really did that. There's no invention. It's not like he invented it. But like definitely founded this idea of entertainment. Yeah. Entertainment. Entertainment. Already conceptually out of the gates. There's problems. You're not going to have huge turnover. In concept, I can see someone going, well, how's this going to work? You only have four tables and they got to cook at the table so they can't be cooking for other people. On top of that, Japanese food in the 60s, they only served Japanese people. Yeah, like the little like immigrant cultures, right? Yeah, yeah. So if you want to eat Chinese food, you have to go to Chinatown. Uh-huh. And you're going to be eating with Chinese people. It's not made for Westerners. Right. Right, right, right. So when they opened Benihana's, they opened in like a. a Western, white, New York. 56th street or something like that. Yeah. 56th street. So what my father was thinking was like, well, I want to try to break this open to Americans, not to Japanese people. This isn't a Japanese concept. Japanese people won't adopt this. They don't like it. They want traditional Japanese food. It's not Benihana. Yeah. So it was struggling because it was a completely foreign concept and it almost didn't work. Sure. The first phase of it was almost a complete failure up until this one New York times writer. Oh, back in the days when you could make a restaurant with one review and she came in and ate there and was blown away. And then she wrote this incredible review and then business picked up and it's sustainable. Yeah. And when did he start franchising it and building it out? This is 1964. He started it. I think in the seventies, it just took off. Okay. He was privately scaling it out. Yeah. I think it's like late seventies or early eighties is when he went public. It was a publicly traded company. Yeah. At some point it went public. So he probably got absurdly rich overnight kind of from that public offering. Then he became like an employee of the company. But in the seventies, when it was his company, he's like, okay, I'm going to do the offshore boat. I want to do all this stuff I want to do. Yeah. But I'm just going to tag Benihana on the side of the boat. So it's all right. I'm going to tag Benihana on the side of the hot air balloon. His father's the first person to fly a hot air balloon across the Pacific. Oh my God. And it didn't say Benihana on the hot air balloon? Yeah. It would be like his face on the balloon. Like the guy was like a marketing magnet. Yeah. He was the Mickey Mouse of Benihana. Yeah. He really, he was like a Colonel Sanders. Yeah. Colonel Sanders, Dave Thomas from Wendy's. Yeah. He definitely marketed himself really well. And he was never afraid to be in front of a microphone or never afraid to talk to people. Never afraid to be in an interview. Yeah. So inspiring. Yeah. And for Japanese people, which are known to be more like, keep your head down. Don't make a ruckus. Don't make noise. He was a complete opposite. He adopted it like this American mindset of showmanship. A very incredible story. So what he is doing, I mean, he's a thrill seeker. This whole hot air balloon across the Pacific is nuts. The fact that no one had done it and he does that. And then the offshore racing was serious. Like he almost did it. He was like, I'm going to do this. He was serious. Like he almost died in San Francisco under the golden gate bridge. He started a porno magazine. He did. Yeah. So he started a Genesis magazine, actually sold to Larry Flint. Okay. Yeah. 40 years this magazine was around. Yeah. He had a club. He was trying to be like Japanese Hugh Hefner. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. He was married to my mom, but then had a whole other family. There's a quote from him saying he had three children from three different women at the exact same time. Oh wow. Yeah. So there's that story too. Okay. Okay. Didn't age, didn't age great, but in the 70s that was great. I guess you don't get that type of person without that type of, you know. Yeah. Yeah. He kind of did it all. It was like a no rules. I'm just going to do whatever I want. Yeah. Mm-hmm. Yeah. So you have like a million brothers and sisters that you do or don't know? There's seven siblings from my father's side. And honestly, we're all very close. Oh, good. Oh, that's lovely. Yeah. So we'll do family get togethers with all of us. Now we're in our forties. Soon to be fifties. Let's be honest. Soon to be fifties. I was like, thank God music keeps me young and hard. And my longevity and stuff like that is important. What a character and how present was he? I mean, he sounds very busy. He had a lot of shit going on. He was definitely present though. He was. So when they go public, he's got some cash. He's like, let's go live it up in Newport. The crazy part of the story is, and this is very public. Yeah, yeah. Is that he had a major boat accident, came out of a coma. And that's when he woke up to my mom on one side and to his girlfriend. Okay. I don't know if I was born yet. So I think mom and my older brother and sister and his girlfriend and my brother, my half-brother, her son. News to your mom or she already was tipped to this. Oh, shit. Dude, this is out of a movie. You wake out of a coma and all your secrets are revealed. He's just like, oh, we're going to go back into my coma now, please. Yeah, I would have been like, oh, I wish I died. Yeah. You know, this is pre-social media. Everyone's life was a fucking mess, but no one knew. Eventually my mom did divorce and then she moved from Miami where I was born. Great boat racing down there. You got to be in Miami. Yeah. And also Benihana headquarters moved to Florida. Oh, okay. So you moved. I was one. So my mom moved to Newport and then I grew up in Newport. Wasn't born there, but really I'm a Newport born, not born, but raised there till 17. Yeah. So did he stay in Florida? Like how often were you seeing him? He had a place in Florida. He was really in New York. He could not leave New York. He was a New York guy. It sounds like his arousal template, what he needed to be alive. He could only exist in New York. He needs a lot of stimuli. He's not a Floridian. He is not a Floridian. He is a New Yorker through and through. He had a brownstone when he was living in 63rd for this last part of his life. But he was in New Jersey, 30 minutes outside of New York city when I was young. That's where I would go visit. You would go visit him in the summer? In Englewood. And that's where you can get acres of land and a big house. I was surprised. I don't think the house was that big. It wasn't that extraordinarily expensive. In the eighties, it's a different price point. Probably a $380,000 house. It was something ridiculous, like less than a million dollars. And you have all this acres, you have 10 square, you have a big Victorian style house. Kind of creepy, not something I was excited to be in at night. You know, it's scary. Ghosty. Now I know you love Bruce Lee. There's weird parallels here. Bruce Lee was breaking the mold. He was this fucking sexy dude. He was in San Francisco being cool. Yeah. And in the sixties, right? Yeah, I guess so. Right. Sixties. Cause he passed away at seven. Seventy-seven, I think. Okay. Your dad never met him by chance. Did he running in these fun circles? You know, he met a lot of people. He loved being out. So he's definitely extrovert socialite guy. Is he a drinker? Not so much. Oh, interesting. Not so much. Yeah. My grandfather was a drinker. My father wasn't. He had a whole book on sake and stuff like that. You know, it's a kind of sort of Japanese food, but I never actually experienced him drunk. So I never saw him drunk. Yeah. From a child in the seventies? Well, he was getting high on other things, clearly. Yeah. He got his dopamine on life for sure. He has friends with a lot of people in the art world, the club world. He also needs to be said, he visibly looks like a stud. You can tell there's a dude who wrestled, like he is a stud. I mean, he's stocky, short. He's a perfect wrestler type because he's not tall and lanky. Good luck with that. It's hard to take him down. Okay. So in Newport, '78 onward, I mean, for people who haven't been to Newport, it is like blonde chads who go surfing and skateboarding and it just couldn't be whiter and blonder. Yes. I always joke about this because my mom, who is through and through a very Japanese immigrant, speaks ain't broken English, moved to the widest neighborhood in Orange County when 10 minutes away is Irvine. It's like majority is Asian and Japanese. Yeah. She could have been in Alhambra. She could have been, yeah, there's numerous nice enclaves. 10 minutes away is like she could be in a Japanese community. She could have spoke Japanese all day. Yeah, yeah. But she moved to Newport. We always kind of laugh about that. In the end, I'm glad that she did do that for me because being a fish out of water, in many cases, when you're younger, it's just different. Being an immigrant is a very different life than when you're an adult. You get to really experience racism or you get to really experience feeling left out at the loudest levels. Yeah. Yeah. At your most insecure, where you are. Yeah, exactly. And then you're also so impressionable. You're so vulnerable. You're so emotional. You're so confused. There's multiple factors. A, you've gotten older and you've found success and status. That's going to change what you deal with. But also just being Japanese in 1978 versus now is a much different thing in the US. Yeah, definitely. Social media is almost like an educational tool for so many kids just to go like, "Oh yeah, I shouldn't say that." Right. "I shouldn't do that." Yeah, that's not cool. The social norms are, "If I do that, I will get canceled so therefore I should not do that." Yes. Back then, it was like, "No. Oh, the social norm to not do this." Also, we got a really big education on Japan in the early '90s when Japan was really rising to economic dominance and there were now movies about it. Some of the culture was coming in this direction. I also just think the general understanding. There's the kids now that love anime and manga and Japanese cultural stuff that's cool. Yeah, that's true. And the food. Everyone eats Japanese food now. Yeah, exactly. Everyone's been to fucking Benihana. Your father is weirdly part of that movement. I know. It's so cool. That's really cool. Yeah. I mean, he miseducated us. I was like, "Cool. This is how they cook in Japan." I know. That's another funny thing is that Benihana is more American than Japanese and people don't realize it. The cooking, the showmanship, the hats. That's a French style hat. Right. Yeah. So there's a lot of interesting things that my grandfather was like, "Oh, we want the red French style hats because they're louder." They can't do that. They catch shrimp better when you flick it in the air. Yeah, exactly. But it's smart because he was trying to get Americans in, so he has to visually make it appealing to Americans. You don't want to push them away if they walk in and they're like, "I don't know. I don't recognize anything in here. I'm leaving." Well, the only offering was the food and it was good. I love Benihana. Yeah. But if that was the only offering, it's not becoming some big national sensation. Just going back to what you were saying about your daughters, it's a birthday thing. Yeah. It's like every kid's birthday spot. "Okay, it's my birthday. Let's do Benihana." It's just kind of like part of normal conversation now when you're a kid. It is, yeah. Yes. It's cool that it's become that. I forgot what the statistic is. I used to work at Benihana when I was a teenager. I think it's like 70% birthdays or something. Something ridiculous. It's like, I don't know what the percentage is, but it's a large percentage. Do you get any fluff off of people knowing you are associated with Benihana that provide anything cultural capital? For me coming up as an artist? No. No, I mean, as like a kid on the playground. Oh, no, no, not really, no. I mean, my close friends would be like, oh, can we get a Benihana? I'm like, is it your birthday? Yeah, but not really. So how did you do in elementary and in middle school, and how did you find your way? When I grew up, when I was first through fourth, fifth grade, for a period of time, I was one of three boys in my class. Whoa. Usually that's a good thing. Yeah, exactly. But like when you're a kid, if the two guys don't like you, you're kind of screwed. So in your school, there was only three boys in your class? Oh, that's so bizarre. Was it a private school? I hopped around because I just could not make friends. So my mom was like, okay, let's try this school, let's try this school. I had bad socialization. Like, I could not figure it out. Yeah, yeah. Well, let's be fair. It wasn't your fault. I don't think it was being offered to you to figure out. It was really tough to make friends. So what was the inroad? Like, for a lot of kids, it's skateboarding or it's smoking weed or, you know, you find a little niche you can cement yourself in. Yeah, yeah. So the interesting thing that I saw is that I went to public and Catholic or Christian. The Catholic and Christian private were the most difficult. My grades were the worst. My socialization there was horrible. One thing I recognize when you're an outsider, the teachers all recognize that and you just get sent to the principal's office all the time. Oh, really? It's like easy to pick on the guy that everyone doesn't like. There's something wrong with this kid. No one likes this kid. Okay, just go to the principal. And then I would just get spanked and like. Oh, God. Back then I would get. Oh, man, it was horrible. The spank with the big old holes in the paddle. I just hated. Oh, that's brutal. And my mom would have to pull me out. I was like failing in these classes. And I love. It's being in public schools in Newport because also public schools in Newport is going to be different than other places, too. But it was still pretty brutal sometimes. It's the dude who himself got shit on by another echelon of popular kids that decides he's got to find someone to shit on. So you're just going to be next. My mom put me in school early. Oh, boy. So I was one year younger. No, that's not the move. So I'm just physically smaller. And that doesn't help. No. Would you ever. I was curious when I was learning about your dad. I was thinking of. Kind of the pressure when you have a dad like that. I don't even know. But if you ever shared with your father the challenges, I would assume his response to be like, yeah, get tough. Like I did. You know, it's interesting. I never, ever shared that stuff with him. You didn't. Because he's not one to listen to that. He always wants to hear the good things. So I'd always have to tell him the good things. I would never tell him the bad things ever. Yeah. I would never like complain to him. One of the things I learned growing up. Let's say. I like got hurt. I think I went to the hospital. The first thing I would hear from my dad when I see him. I had to pay for that. Oh, like stop getting hurt. Oh, God. Okay. Like, why do you always go to the hospital? What's wrong? You're not hurt. You can't really say the bad stuff. I always want to try to impress him. I think with him, he has a lot of kids. So we're always trying to compete for his attention. Even, you know, when we were like children to adolescent to like adults. My late 20s. When I finally was like. I actually making money on my own and I wanted to share that with him immediately. Yeah, of course. Of course. Your siblings were older. I'm kind of in the middle, but for my mom. Yeah. From your mom, you were living with. I felt like a only child because my mom's kids, they're 10 and 11 years old, way older than you. So by the time I was eight, they were already out of the house. Okay. So from eight to 17, I was like a only child there. Who welcomed you in, in high school? Like what ended up being your niche? Like you said, skateboarding and punk and hardcore music. Yeah, yeah, yeah. And that changed my life. Saved your life, maybe. Yeah. It really was like 13, 14 year old age. That's when the clay gets molded. Yes. Yeah, yeah, yeah. My son's nine months. When he's 10, 11, 12, I'm going to make sure that like we set him in a really good clay molding. Yeah. Environment. Because that's a really important age. Well, you start becoming aware of, oh, people have identities. I've got to pick one. Yeah, exactly. I mean, what one feels natural to me? Which one will I be accepted in? Most of the time it's sports. Yeah, right. If you're not a jock, you're like, all right, I'm an artist. Yeah, I tried the sports. I tried all that. It wasn't working. And then it's always peers. Peers have so much influence. Yes. So when I went with these kids to a show, we're skating and going to shows. That's what we did. That was my life. Yeah. And then you see other kids, like they're your age and they're like screaming around and like thrashing guitars and they're like not on a stage. They're running. I hear. They also have all been shit on in school. So there's like a beautiful bonding and acceptance. And they're singing about it. Yes. I relate to all this stuff. Yes, of course. I am that same kid up there. Yeah, yeah. You're like the barrier of entry to be that kid is actually right there. And they're not that good. That's another thing I try to tell. That's the good thing. Yes. The great thing about punk music is like you go to a show and you're like, I don't know, I think in a few months I'd be able to play drums as good as this guy. That's what I did. Exactly. That's why I love punk. Because then I was like, I don't know how to sing. I don't know how to play any instruments. My friends that we were going were like, we don't know. Let's just figure it out. Yeah. We know a guy knows how to play drums. That's the most important guy you need. Because that's the most technically skilled thing that you need to have is a drummer that knows how to keep a beat. To keep time. Yeah. Yeah. And we found a drummer and hey, we'll bring him to the shows and get him inspired. I'm like, can we try to do this in your garage? Yeah. And he lived off the street from me. And then I would just go there after school every day and practice and learn how to do to play bass, guitar, drums. And I was like singing. I didn't know how to sing. I was like, we're just fucking around. That was the start of my music journey. And it's like this rough and tumble. Like you could just show up. Yeah. Yeah. Wake up out of bed and whatever. And then just do it. That's the cool thing. To care would be uncool. You're buffeted from any failure. It's such a great entry point for creativity. It allows you to feel like you can become something. And then when I did that with my friends, we were like messing around and we're like playing. We were playing in living rooms, which was a start. Then everything opened up. This idea like anything I could do at all, whatever is exciting to me. Then we started writing in a zine. We'd go out with my friends, the Kinkos, making a little poetry and cutting up a little fun, like, you know, ransom note letters and making poetry out of them, making zines and passing out to friends and silkscreen t-shirts. Like everything was like, oh, this is all doable. We could actually make a business doing that kind of stuff. Yeah. I think when people that were in that culture, they just see a mosh pit. They're like, oh, all these kids are crazy. But it's like, yes, everyone did. We made zines. We all made collages. Wait, sorry. What's a zine? It's like a handmade magazine. That you're making at Kinko's. You're like, you're going up to Kinko's. Yeah, Kinko's was the spot. You're figuring out how to rip off Kinko's. Yeah, I figured that out. I don't know if you remember, like they had those big rectangular blocks. You stick in there and then we make a copy. It's like one, two, three, right? Yeah, yeah, yeah. So you go, you make all your copies, right? So you do like a thousand copies, which is a lot of money. Yeah. A few cents a copy. Then you take that, you go to the bathroom with it. Yeah. Yeah. You smash it. It goes to like a million. Then you go to the front. Your friend takes like a thousand copies, runs out to the store. It's like, I only made like 10 copies. Uh-huh. I was doing zines all the way through college. We had a friend, my roommate, he worked there. So I would just bring it to him. He's like, okay, here's like five cents. We also all had this little device that you would put on a payphone so you could get free calls. That was like everyone in the punk rock world in Detroit had these. When you drop a quarter in there, it makes a digital noise. And that's actually what puts the, the credit on the phone. So we all had these little things from Radio Shack and you'd pick up the thing and you'd like put like $3 worth of coins on it. Oh, that's awesome. Yeah. All kinds of like mildly, gently illegal stuff happening. It's so fun. Yeah. Another fun illegal activity I did when I was a kid was sneaking in movie theaters. Sure. We did all do that. That was always fun. Yeah. I was always scared. That was like one of my favorite. Well, you had multiplexes in Newport. So you could probably go in and bang out six movies. We've loved doing that. The way I do it. I don't know if, you know, you could talk about this, but it's kind of wholesome. It is. Yeah. But you go in. First of all, in order to get in, you say like, oh, I left my wallet inside the theater. So they let you in. You go in the theater. Then you go through the back. I had a belt or a shoe. Put the shoe in through the exit door. Leave the door open. Then you have to go down a whole flight of stairs. This is at Edward Cinema's in Triangle Square. And then you go to the bottom where it opens out to the street. And then you let in like six. Six of your friends. Oh, perfect. And then they go up. Then you go out to the front. I got my wallet. Thank you. And then you go around and then you go around the back. And then once you're in, then you can watch like however many movies. Just keep it going. Okay. Wow. Yeah. Let it ride. We would just buy one ticket and then see like eight. We did pay for one movie. For one. You got buy one, get eight free. That would be the solution if you didn't want to pay. Yeah, exactly. Stay tuned for more. Armchair expert. If you dare. We are supported by Allstate. Checking Allstate first could save you hundreds on car insurance. Not checking what the warning light means before pulling out of your driveway. You absolutely convinced yourself it was probably just a sensor thing right up until you were standing on the side of the road waiting for a tow. Yeah. Checking first is the right move. So check Allstate first for an auto quote. It could save you hundreds. And for fast, reliable help when you need it. Add an Allstate Roadside Plan today. You're in good hands with Allstate. 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So you must have done pretty good in high school because you got into UCSB. I'm surprised, to be honest. I got in. I applied to like every UC school. I got rejected to every school. You didn't get accepted at UC Santa Cruz? Nope. My GPA was 3.1. That's pretty good. That's not horrible. For UC? Well, not for UC. Yeah. But in general. You have to be a 4.0, like UC Santa Barbara. I don't think you can get in now unless you're 4.0. Plus, plus. Yeah. So I was like, I got in. I think they had to let me into one of the UC schools. They were like, we got out. You plan to like all of them? Yeah. Like, I just got lucky. They all talk. And they show which one's going to do. I would also, just for the listener, I would say, I can imagine if you're a listener in Milwaukee right now, you're like, they wanted diversity and they wanted you in there. But you should know in 95, already all the UCs are already predominantly Asian. They didn't need Asians. That's true. In 95. That's still a question in my head. Like, how did I get in? I think it's like, it has to be because they had to. Yeah. They had to let me into one UC school because I'm from California. Yeah. And they had preferential treatment to California residents. You're a little weighted. Yeah. I think that's part of it. Because I went to UCLA in 98. And at that time, it was 39% Asian and 31% white. And there's no way they. Yeah. It's not like they needed you. That's not affirmative action for Asians in there. Yeah. I don't think that was the case. Yeah. I did write in my newspaper thing. I was like, I think affirmative action helped me get into school. But then I was like. But there's so many Asians here. Yeah. I don't think. I don't think. I don't know. So here's where you and I could have potentially met in real life, which is I graduated high school in 93. I went on a road trip for a year with my best friend. And we ended up in Isla Vista for like four months, just living in people's dorm rooms and on Del Playa and some friends' house. Oh, yeah. Just couch surfing for months. The most mind-blowing place imaginable if you're from Detroit. It's like this college is on an ocean. The first party we went to on our first night there was like these dudes living on a couch. It was like a cliff with the ocean in the backyard. An infamous Isla Vista for these insane parties, right? Halloween is just this enormous party. Tens of thousands of people come. It's a wild, exciting place. I then went back to Detroit and then I moved to Santa Barbara in 95 when you started at UCSB. Wow. But I was living downtown on Bass Street, like right next to the state. Yeah, yeah. But I would go to Ivy occasionally to get hammered. You have to like, there's a house party at every other house. When they designed Isla Vista, I don't think they realized. They didn't realize what. Was coming. Yeah, what kind of chaos. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. You put a bunch of 18-year-old kids in a bunch of houses. On the ocean. Yeah. Yeah. It's almost like anarchy. You do what you want. Yeah. They're throwing parties every night. I didn't want to leave, actually. Yeah, I'm sure. So when I graduated in 2000, I was so embedded in that little world. I was kind of a king of a castle. You start this record label. Yeah, so I started my label. But really, that was a byproduct. Being in this hardcore punk world, we would just put on shows in my living room, which was the size of this room here. Yeah. And you were in student housing? So the first year, I was in student housing. And then the next year, I lived in a vegan co-op, typical for a straight-edge hardcore kid. Okay, okay. I'm vegan. And you're not drinking. Yeah, that's another interesting dichotomy because I'm living in Isla Vista with the party capital. One of the biggest party schools because of Isla Vista in the United States. And I'm straight-edge, like no drugs, no drinking. But there's a really. There's a really small but strong and present straight-edge hardcore scene in Isla Vista's Santa Barbara that the whole hardcore community knew about. Oh, wow. Okay. Mainly because of this label zine distribution company called Ebullition and Heart Attack. They're publishing their zine from there. And they had a record label that was putting out all of those kinds of bands from there. So when I went to school there, I was more excited to be close to this label. Yeah. To be going to school at UCSB. Actually, that was the most excited kid in me. I was like, oh! I want to intern for them. And I ended up writing for the zine for seven years. Wow. Everything for free. And you would never wish to get paid. No. Because you care so deeply about this, you know? Yeah. And I just wanted to contribute. Like helping put on the shows and writing reviews for the bands and eventually starting my label, which requires no capital, by the way. That's the interesting thing, as most people think. It's called Dim Mac? Yeah, Dim Mac. And how is that related to Bruce Lee? I know it's a nod somehow. Yeah. When I was coming up with this label idea, I'm like, what is that thing that represents me in a symbolic way that's cool? I love Bruce Lee. So I was like, oh, Dim Mac is a Chinese death touch. It's like a martial art move where you touch someone. It's like a mysterious thing. And they can die like two days later sometimes. Yeah, yeah, yeah. But Bruce Lee was known to harness it. And he mysteriously died of a brain hemorrhage. So some may say he was killed by it. Yeah. So I was like, there's that mystery. I'm like, that's cool. I love it. By the way, did you ever buckle? Because I just tell you, my best friend Aaron and I, we lived in a punk house, this band Current, that was huge in Detroit. I love Current. You know Current? I love Current. My cousin Justin was the bass player. I love Current. Yeah, the greatest. Wow. Council Records? Yeah, Council Records. I love Council Records. Ottawa? Jihad? Yes. That was my world. That's the real screamo emo. Yes. Pre-emo. Yeah. Because people, when they think about emo, they think about, you know. The produced emo. Yeah. Sunny Day Real Estate. Yeah. Yeah. But like the ordination of Aaron, I don't know if you know. Oh, yep. Saw them play many times. All these bands stayed at our house. So we're in Detroit in Dearborn and I'm living with half the band of Current. Oh my God. I love all those bands. Yeah. They're the greatest, right? I never got to see all of them. Jawbreaker. I love Jawbreaker. Yeah. Oh my God. We could geek out forever. We could go down a music tangent. Yeah. Shutter to Think. Of 90s. Oh, I love Shutter to Think. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. I mean, at some point, I would love for you to see my vinyl collection. Oh, yeah. - I would love to see it. - And you too. - Thanks for the advice. to my house okay i pick up these records of constantine zancotti and that era i love it aaron and i move into this house half the band lives there bands are sleeping at our house every single weekend because they're in town playing shows so just like every great band and aaron and i are drinking 40s and eating steaks and everyone else is straight edge and vegan but over time we fucked them up and they started drinking so i think we won so i'm wondering did you ever buckle and when did you start drinking because that was a big deal back then oh it was yeah so i was straight edge all the way until about 2002 oh wow last year before i left santa barbara i was living in another vegan co-op called bico co-op and we would put on shows there this is post pickle patch where i had 400 bands play in my little apartment there so anyways i moved to that house guy got kicked out of that apartment oh shockingly yeah yeah this band came in town that i was signed on my label called kill sadie they're from minnesota anyways they came to my house and i was like oh my god i'm gonna be like oh my god i'm gonna be like oh my and then like i was really close with them and those boys got me into drinking sure sure i mean at that point i'm like why am i straight i'm 21 now 22 or whatever age i was i'm like 22 i'm like like what am i doing questioning everything like i'm not putting x's on my hands like i'm like going to hardcore shows really anymore i'm like okay let's do this we just see how fun it is yeah and everyone's drinking they're all my friends that's like you know you have the nice bonding yeah drinking is a bonding thing oh yeah this is fun yeah i love these guys yeah why is straight up is it like you want to keep your clarity what is it like why my understanding of it is basically you have like the godfather of all of this the michael jackson of punk is ian mckay who had minor threat yeah absolutely discord records yeah discord records which put out all the greatest punk bands all dc they had real good musicianship you would have heard of fugazi that was his next band fugazi yeah and so he was very vocally progressive he was like into women's rights he was into living a clean life and he proselytized and i think it all fell from him no yeah it really did so like in the 80s when minor threat was around this is the early 80s punk music was the opposite it was skinheads and racist yeah there's a lot of that but there's a lot of nihilism like i don't care i'm gonna get drunk i'm gonna do lots of drugs and just say fuck everyone and this is like this negative energy and i'm like oh my god i'm gonna get drunk i'm gonna do lots of drugs and fuck the world yeah which is all british that's all comes from london yeah it's like kind of like really angry energy and then ian's like hey we could be punk and rebellious against things that are controlling us but let's have this attitude of the opposite unfuck the world yeah positive mental attitude help people at shows someone falls down help them up community yeah exactly then it's like oh you could be punk you could scream you could go to shows but you could actually go i live a free life i don't drink healthy i don't have sex yeah yeah yeah yeah that feels extreme yeah yeah you know with everything there's like the extremes yes and then there's a lot of straight-edge people that are really into harry krishna you know like shelter best merch ever still have a ton of it and i love those bands too yeah and i was like oh i don't even know what harry krishna was but like because of the bands i was like you've like learned about yeah like i'm into it yeah wow cool and that leads all the way to jack antonoff a couple weeks ago who we had which is like ben he's doing shows he's eight years younger than us or 10 years every show has to have a philanthropic component so it's like you know there's a food drive at everyone's like he started a thing that really just kind of carried on even to when jack was doing it it's really cool okay so you leave santa barbara thank god you're drinking now and then you go to la yeah so i moved to la there was a fork in the road because i was super into academia yeah you double majored sociology and women's studies yeah that's right yeah so when you're a sociology women's studies major it's all critical writing and thinking and then once you get to that fifth year i was like in school for five years i just didn't want to leave school and you started early this is perfect you actually finished right on time true yeah yeah it's true i kept going i'm like how do i stay in it because now i found my groove now i'm hanging with the professors now i like want to get professors respect and have them talk to me like a colleague almost yeah yeah yeah i'm like okay now i'm reading the text i'm having real thoughtful conversations and those thoughtful conversations are already being had at these hardcore shows so there's a lot of cross and we're all reading books and talking it was just cool to be intellectual to talk about yeah so i was like this is great this is aligning with my academia and then i was like okay well i guess maybe i'll consider staying academia i sent off for graduate and phd programs i accepted the two and then that's when i had to make a decision because i was like okay do i go down this road do i follow music wow at the time my band or my bands i mean we were playing to like 30 people it was fun but it wasn't like sustainable and then i got a demo from a band that was like interested to get signed or have me release their music yeah the singer of the band played at the pickle patch which was my apartment she was in this really cool band called discount don't know discount yeah discounts from no idea records from florida i was like obsessed with discount she was on tour with hot water music it was discount hot water music and another band and she's like i'm in this new band called the kills it's a rock and roll thing i couldn't believe what i heard on that demo and i was more like wow she just asked me to put out this record yeah i'm just a little guy but i put out some other bands that kind of showed proof of concept so i was like you know what because she gave me the co-sign and i like so inspired by her i'm just gonna do the music thing wow i think this is what i need to do and the kills was probably your first really successful it was the second okay or potentially the third it's like the first would be planes forsaken for stars that was like And then this band called Pretty Girls Make Raves from Seattle, which was one of the members of Kill Sadie. They got me drunk. Okay. That band is the reason why Allison from The Kills was like, hey, I saw your success with Pretty Girls. Would you consider putting out this EP? And I'm like, yes, yes, yes. Exclamation point, exclamation point. I wish I could find this letter because back then there was like handwritten letters. So it was just interesting time, 2002. And then I moved to LA. I said, I'm just going to do the label. I'll do the academic route maybe later in life. It can be there waiting for me. Yeah, yeah. You could resume that. Yeah. So then I moved to LA and then I was like, well, it's definitely the best place for me to start Dimock. This is the music hub of America. I mean, in my mind. Well, you got Capitol Records, you got Warner Brothers. I mean, you really historically, this is where all the big labels are. Yeah. And then I moved to LA and then I already got hit up by major labels. Smart major label A&R scouts are always looking for other ones in the underground that are scouts. Which are indie labels. Okay. So they're tracking all of that. Yeah, they want to incubate their bands with indie labels. I'm like, free dinners, free lunches. I'm in. Yeah. And so I started hanging out with Capitol Group and Interscope and all the different labels. And I was like trying to get a swing of things in LA. It's already kind of like buzzing. And then the next band, once I moved to LA, this was even before I was really DJing. So probably coincidentally at the same time, but I was just kind of just playing here and there, was a band called Block Party. Oh, yeah. And once again, it's the same kind of thing happened with Alice from the Kills. The manager of Block Party was like, we saw you doing some really great work with the Kills. We would love for you to consider releasing our music. And Block Party is way more electronic. Yeah, there are British indie rock 2000s, like Franz Ferdinand, Pre-Arctic Monkeys, that kind of British rock invasion that was happening in the US. Okay. But they're one of the earlier ones because we got their first demo in 2003. And that's right when I started DJing. All right. So how do we start DJing? You're just, you get some equipment because you're bored and you start fucking with it? Yeah. So when I moved to LA, I was doing the label full on. When I thought of turntables, I had a record player. Right, right. People don't realize there's two different things. Yeah. Turntables are the ones you like go backwards and forwards and scratch. You need a techniques with magnetic drive. Yeah. A record player, boom, you put the needle down and you play a full side. Go make a cocktail. I had a record player because that's how I listen to music. I had a pretty sick vinyl collection. And when I moved to LA, there's this bartender. That became my friend. He was tatted. He was cool. And he definitely welcomed me to LA. I remember he's like, I've seen your band. I was in a band called Esperanza as well. Another punk band. I used to play guitar. And it's like, I saw your band play at Headline Records. But the word on the street is you have the sickest vinyl collection, which I do. Yeah. I definitely do. The aforementioned vinyl collection. Yeah. I'll tell you why I have it. I'm a collector. So I've been collecting since I was a kid. And it's not like I had a lot of records, but I always was a completionist. I wanted all the revelation. I want all the. Yeah. Yeah. I want all the labels I followed. But the thing is, is I'm also a hoarder. And I'm a known collector in college. So when my friends would leave college, I remember Koji Bodanishi, he used to be in Strictly Ballrooms, this other band. He left. He's like, I don't know what to do with these records. I'm like, give them to me. Oh, yeah. So you were a dumping ground for other people's collections. Yeah. I'm like, you can take them back whenever. I will just be a great, you know. Steward of it. A steward. Yeah, yeah, yeah. And then they're like, you know, Steve will take all your records. It's not like it's like a valuable thing. Like expensive thing. It's just heavy. It's a lot of space. Yeah. So I just became like the dumping ground of vinyl. And I just amassed this insane collection. I imagine your apartment being no room to walk. Oh, my God. It was like that. It just milk crates everywhere. And so my friend, the bartender of Three of Clubs, he's like, come to Three of Clubs and bring your records. I'll show you how to DJ. It's very simple. And play whatever you want. And I'm like, I could play hardcore. Yeah. Wow. This is amazing. - Let me get this straight. Me and the bartender will be happy and all the other people hate it I'm in he had a night called Sides and you just play whole sides of records you just sit there and you play whatever you want I was a radio DJ at KCSB I was K-Juice which is like the platform for just the library and for the dorms but I didn't make it to KCSB status I was never good enough but I was like oh this is cool I get to play records for 30 people drinking beers and me and my friend I was like this is awesome so I started going there and playing and then he's like hey you know we should just DJ together and I'm like yeah I'm down and we'll call ourselves the Cry Babies because he was always thinking of ideas I mean Cali DeWitt if you look him up he's got an incredible history of LA he ran with the Red Hot Chili Peppers and then he started his own record label and now he has an incredible fashion line people really follow oh wow yeah and he designed for Kanye West Yeezy Collection like he's just a well-known curator creative director street kid just an awesome burst of creative energy and I didn't end up DJing with him ever okay but my first gig I have to find the flyer was under DJ Cry no one really knows this it wasn't Steve Aoki and it wasn't Kid Millionaire which I later used as a name it was DJ Cry how were you spelling cry? C-R-Y okay the conventional yeah yeah yeah and I opened for my friend this guy Sam Spiegel who was a producer I was always in his studio and he was a big part of my early part of my career he let me open and stuff like that when do you get bit by the electronic bug? so this was like 2002 era right when I moved to LA I was starting to DJ a little bit there was a record by James Murphy's LCD sound system he dropped this record called Losing My Edge and it was 118 beats per minute and it was this loop of a beat and him talking over the beat and he's just talking about the history of dance music it was hypnotic when I got that record I went to Amoeba or wherever I did to get that record and I was like I'd play it and that was when I was like wow I could produce something like this it's simple enough it's hypnotic and it grooves and you stay on track with it for a long time beats have the same appeal that punk did in that okay I get an 808 or I get these three pieces of equipment I don't have to know how to read music if I have rhythm it's very again accessible and even like the hip hop revolution is like oh I don't need expensive instruments I have these albums they already have the music on it it's all very deep it's kind of weirdly similar yeah I remember the beat because the beat's like do do do do do do do do do do do do do do do do do do do do yeah very 70s do do do do do and the bass line just stays there the whole time and it grows with the vocal and then it gets louder with the live drums and stuff but I'm like fuck I think I can do this and then I was like okay I went on Craigslist and I got this guy that can teach me pro tools I was like I love the Neptunes I loved that world of music and I was like I kind of want to do that you know I was kind of figuring out what I wanted to do you know I'm a hardcore punk kid but I love pop music as well my sister Devin she was in Fast and Furious oh yeah she was Suki in Fast and Furious very attractive and she and she had a successful modeling career which led her into some movies and it opened her up into music so I was going with her in the studio when she was doing more of an R&B thing and I was trying to learn to do a very very quick sampled beats and sounds to make hip hop beats for my sister really that's adorable and then I heard LCD sound system losing my edge and then that's when I was like I'm the artist now yeah this is where my heart is going I want to go faster I don't want to go 90 to 100 BPM I want to go 118 to 130 BPM I want to start playing this out yeah so I have to give a lot to the LCD sound system James Murphy what he was doing in New York at the time in the early 2000s and the party scene you know what I was doing with Dim Mock and the party scene in LA yeah yeah yeah that was a wonderful so fun yes that was wonderful what a ride I was going back and forth I love it so we took more time at the beginning which I love that's my favorite so we are going to have to kind of fast forward a tiny bit and let me on so whatever I knew about hardcore I know nothing about electronic and the dance world yeah yeah yeah just quickly remixes you kind of get known for remixes first right right right so you're just kind of mashing up different things remixes or remixing is the best way and this is why I tell every young producer or someone who wants to start producing or someone who wants to become a DJ or wants to get into the world start with remixes because now there's technology that you don't need to ask for the stems let's say you listen to a track a stem would be like bass, guitar isolated instruments isolated vocals exactly and you need the stems in order to remix you know or change production back then you need the stems luckily for me I had my label and I had the stems for the bands on Dim Mock so my very first remix happened to be Block Party because I had the stems when I was remixing Helicopter I also called my friend who was on tour with MIA at the time to also remix the other side of the 12 inch because there was no digital back then you would press the 12 inch and that's how people would hear this he was also throwing a cool party and I was throwing my LA party so it's interesting because all around the world there was these little pubs of communities growing where we're playing indie electronic underground hip hop and we had this cool little thing happening I was doing it in LA he was doing it in Philadelphia someone was doing it in London Japan and that's where we would end up if I did a show I would probably play it these underground little hipster parties so he did the other side I did the other side with my friend Blake Miller from Geoscience it was his first remix and now he's a very well known DJ and people know him as Diplo another ding ding ding he was at the fight I was at Saturday and I was seated three seats next to us and I love his body so let's just be clear I love his physique but he was up and down a lot we had to get up and let Diplo in and out a lot and that was my first sighting of Diplo oh and you said it was tied in there it was tied I was sitting next to a linebacker and then Diplo was very social so he was going back and forth but again a great physique so I didn't hate seeing his biceps and stuff yeah he does work out a lot it's fun to go back in time and see who's still in the game you know and Wes is still crushing it so it's good to see that Wes is still crushing it when do you start going on these massive tours and when do you start getting the big audience I mean I know by 2012 you're the highest grossing dance artist in North America I know by 2010 you've recorded with Will.i.am now when do you make that big leap to where you have an audience 2007 was a pivotal year for me that was the first time I played Coachella oh okay yeah so that was big it was a horrible show okay okay sometimes they go bad yeah it was nerve-wracking it's like kind of thing you just want to throw up after a set because you're like it was so bad just because it went wrong or people didn't like it oh many times technical difficulties or you just weren't on your game I wasn't on my game I was nervous the wind blew the needle off the record okay the wind seems to be an issue at Coachella they don't tell you about the wind the wind blew the needle and went oh fuck and then the music stops I'm like sorry there's a crowd going who are you oh god like I don't even know who you are and you suck I'm on four hits of E and now I'm miserable how do you make that happen who let you up there they still booked me again I was surprised but by 2007 I had the most insane party in LA we had Lady Gaga's first show we had a lot of pop artists first show a lot of underground hip hop like Kate Cuddy's first show Kanye was rolling through at the time what venue were you hosting this at it was Cinespace right on Hollywood Boulevard which is very small but we had the best underground shows and then at the same time I'd formed another allegiance with one of my best friends at the time DJ AM and we had another party I was curious I was friends with Adam as well yeah yeah yeah yeah sweetest so we were like running LA's hipster underground rock electronic hip hop anyone that was about to blow up they had to play at one of these dimmock parties I was just getting booked because of that not necessarily because of my songs I only had a few songs I was like the guy that had a cool scene like your dad yes I mean it all circles back yeah yeah it's similar and different yeah and then 2007 I mean I think I was already doing like 300 shows to how big of audiences at that time I don't know a thousand maybe less I don't know it wasn't like crazy but I was getting paid like 500 bucks so it's easy to like spend 500 bucks especially if there's a record store in that town yeah and I was playing everywhere stay tuned for more Armchair Expert if you dare we get support from Instagram Tina accounts so we talk a lot on this show about how the world is different now than when we were growing up and one of the biggest differences is obviously social media and I think a lot of people wonder okay what's actually being done to make it safer for teenagers which is a fair question yeah so Instagram has got something called teen accounts and they come with automatic protections built in by default so anyone between 13 and 17 is automatically placed into this experience they get age appropriate content settings contact limits so that by default only people they're already connected to can message them and time management tools daily time limit reminders and also sleep mode that mutes notifications from 10pm to 7am sleep mode is genius right and here's the thing for anyone under 16 a parent has to give permission to change any of those settings to be less strict the guardrails are on and Instagram keeps building new safety features to create age appropriate experiences for teens I am really glad Instagram's helping to give parents peace of mind with teen accounts. more about Teen Accounts and Instagram's ongoing work to protect teens online at instagram.com slash teen accounts. Discover Pandora Talisman, a new collection designed to help you express every side of who you are, because the most powerful statement you can make is being yourself. Featuring meaningful zodiac symbols and personalized jewelry pieces, each design tells a story that's uniquely yours. A reflection of what you stand for, what you believe, and how you choose to show up every day. Whether it's your sign, a symbol that speaks to your soul, or a piece that captures your personal style, Pandora Talisman lets you wear your identity with intention. Pandora Talisman, a new language of self-expression, because every version of you deserves to be seen. Shop new styles in-store or online at pandora.net. I was exposed to this world a little bit through Adam, DJ AM, and knowing what he was making on a weekend to fly two cities and play two cities in one weekend. And it was astronomical. If you're making 40 grand in a weekend, you're king. Like he was making 20 to 30 grand, turning him down sometimes because he's getting that consistently. And I'm getting like maybe a thousand dollars, but I'm happy with it. Yeah, sure. You're playing music. I was. At one point making $50 in a bar tab, you know, a few years before that. Now I'm making like $500 to $1,500. And then sometimes on like the privates, you get like $5,000. This is crazy. And you're probably thinking the whole time, this has got to be the ceiling. Yes. Right? Like, oh my God. I'm like, I just need $5,000. Yes, yes, yes. I remember like in 2007, I got booked in the Philippines and they had billboards up of me everywhere. They gave me like five grand. At that time, I'm getting like $500 to $800 at Mike's. My own party. And sometimes a little bit more, $1,500, $2,000. I'm getting $5,000 in the Philippines. And this movie wanted to book me to be a DJ. It was like a scene where I was like a slave DJ in this guy's office. Okay. It was Tropic Thunder. No! So like, I didn't know because they don't say the movie title. Yeah, yeah, yeah. They don't say who's going to be in the movie. I have the script. It says DJ Aoki on every, you know, because it was like actual physical scripts. They're all watermarked. Yeah. It was Todd Phillips. He was the one, I think it was. Still directed it. Yeah, yeah. So they're like, okay, hey, we want you to be the slave DJ for the scene with Tom Cruise where he plays Get Low. Yeah, yeah. Yeah. He plays the iPod. Thank God he didn't have to book another DJ. I was like, when I saw that he didn't book another DJ and he used the iPod, I was like, yes, they didn't book another. But anyways, I had this Philippines offer and I couldn't say no to the Philippines offer. So I passed on the movie. Oh. To this day, I'm like, I wish. It's like, you know, there's the I wish moment. It's like, I wish I made it in that movie because that would have been so epic to be part of like, one of the funniest movies at that time. Yeah, yeah, yeah. But you had to say yes to the. Yeah, because it's a free thing. It's like, you get a thousand dollars. It's not like about the money. It's about just being in it. You couldn't pass up five grand. You couldn't pass up this year's career. So fast forward to 2012, five years after that, you're the highest grossing. Now you're making millions of dollars DJing. Yeah. It gets pretty crazy, right? Imagine some of these festivals you're going to are astronomical. Yeah. The other thing that's interesting is that I did become the most traveled musician. In a calendar year on the planet. So I was touring the most. I didn't realize that I was, but what got me there was being in the punk bands. Right. You're just so used to. When you're in a punk band, first of all, like every single tour I was on, I toured the US 14 times by the time I was 21. We never stayed in a hotel. Right, right, right. You're at the other band's house. Yeah. You just stay in like friends' houses or you sleep in the van or you just figure it out, but you never stay in a hotel. So when I started staying in a hotel, I was like, "I get a hotel?" Yeah, yeah, this is easy. I'm like, "I'll play for free." Yeah, yeah. What are you guys talking about? Yeah. I get like a car to pick me up. This is crazy. Yeah, yeah. Touring, you get that boot camp of being in a band. Yeah. And you go from touring alone. Up until 2011, I didn't tour with anyone. I was touring alone. And I was happy to fly eco in middle backseat. I was like, "This is better than being in this band with four sweaty guys." Yeah, yeah. Smelly. We haven't showered in two weeks. Bunch of vegans fucking eating too many beans. Party or. Yeah. Touring was a cinch for me at that point. So 2012, you put out Wonderland, and that's your first solo album. I'm just thrilled I learned this today. I cannot believe you had John Duncan, the guitarist for Exploited on this album. That's impossible. Yeah. I mean, I was like, "I'm gonna do this." Yeah. I was like, "I'm gonna do this." Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. echoes from the punk and hardcore world. And you got nominated for a Grammy for that album. I did. Have you been able to look back, obviously, 2012 to get that honor, that distinction of being the highest grossing DJ? That's a moment. But being at the Grammys from where you started, were you able to like be there and be present and accept that that really had happened? Yes. The two times that I've been nominated, I went to the Grammys and it's definitely that moment. I'm like, it's really happening to me. You're a shithead for my love. Exactly. Like, this doesn't make sense. How did I get here? And it was everything we were against. And all of a sudden you're there. It's so true. It's so interesting. Yeah. To try to integrate that, like, oh, I'm at the place I made fun of and guess what? I like it here. It's like, how did I get here? I'm not supposed to be here. Yeah. It's been a mix up. It's a mix up. Like there's something not supposed to happen. Definitely felt that way for sure. Yeah. I still feel that way sometimes. I'm like, how am I even here? You know, I'm just doing what I love to do. It is hard work when you're doing the work. Yeah. But when you're on stage and you're having the best time of your life, it's not hard work. And you're like, wait. I'm getting paid for this? Yeah. This is crazy. Now, when you play shows, how many people are there? Well, it depends. So like the festivals, like for example, EDC, I just played last weekend. Okay. Where's that? It's in Las Vegas. So that is the largest, I think it's the largest festival in the world. 200,000 now a day. Wow. Three days, 600,000. Oh my gosh. So when you're in the pit and you're looking out, how many people are physically right there? Tens of thousands of people? I would say minimum like 60 to 80,000. Oh my God. But it's like so massive. At some point, you don't know. It's just a sea of people. Yes. You're not sure if it's a hundred or 40. Yeah. Anything beyond probably 30,000. All you're looking at is like just the flagpoles of signs because it's just like a lot of heads, a lot of little flashing lights and flagpoles of signs. It's like, as far as you can possibly see. And you do a bunch of crazy shit at your shows, or at least you used to, right? Yeah. I've toned it down a lot. You have, because you're getting older. He said, don't bring that up. Acrobatic crowd work, surfing stunts, throwing cake at fans. Cakes are still present. Oh, they are. Yeah. Yeah. I had to get an arm surgery at one point, but yeah, the cakes are definitely for people that don't understand it. Yeah. It is a signature. How did that start? It's funny that you asked that. I just posted on my Instagram, the first cake video that I'd done. And that was back in 2011. You just picked up a piece of cake and threw it? Well, no, no. It does require, I had to go to the bakery and like decorate the cake. Oh, it's a thing. Okay. I got a video guy. Let's film this. I think this will be a funny, cool idea. I have no idea what to expect. This is going to be confusing to a lot of people. Maybe no one's going to get caked and I'm just going to be holding the cake going, what the hell do I do with this thing? So there's a lot of those questions that arose. But now when you do it consistently and you post it up and you're like, that's what this guy does. I'm going to show up and I want to get caked because it's my birthday. Birthday, Benihana. We're just repeats of our parents. Yeah. I mean, look, you have a real run with Wonderland getting nominated. Then between 2011, 14, now your stuff's getting licensed. You're like in the Scion commercials, Budweiser, you're in Step Up, all in the movie. You and Diplo have a song in 22 Jump Street. I mean, look, I don't know DJs and I know your name. You become ubiquitous and one of the titans of this space. It's a very drug heavy space. It is. Yeah. Yeah. How have you navigated that aspect of it? Well, the straight edge lifestyle, it did rub off as we talked about, but I never did drugs. You never got. I never did coke. I never did meth or heroin. Just some MDMA when appropriate. No MDMA. No MDMA. As a DJ. Yeah. Because most of the audience is on MDMA. Yeah. No MDMA, no acid, no hallucinogenics. Before I was straight edge, I tried one drug and that was acid. Oh, that's not a great starter drug. That was 13. Oh my God. And I did it like by myself, trying to be like ballsy. And then I realized I was like, I can't get out of this. Not all your hours, I'm stuck. It's going to be forever. That scared me away from all drugs. That can take you out. Make your life a long time. That took me out. I was like, I will never touch this again. And still, I never did. Now I'm like in this place, if it has a healing or it's like a longevity. The Michael Pollan approach. If there's like some benefit that I could be more creative or something, then I can baby step towards something. So I'm curious. Yeah. You're kind of like Machine Gun Kelly in that he's a volcano of things he is interested in and starts like you had or have an e-sports company. You're into gaming. You're in different video games. Right when e-sports was taking off in the mid 2000s. intense 16 17 anytime i have this interest or curiosity then it leads me down into a space and then yeah i want to figure out like how do i get myself involved monetize or to help provide another mirror into this world yeah you're doing yourself or guy what year did your dad die in 2008 oh bummer yeah he missed a lot of this stuff that i wanted to i wonder what the moment would have been if he a would have been able to say like holy smokes i think you're more successful than i was he would never he would never he would never say that if he would say it could he say would he be proud or would he have that terrible dad thing where it's like they can't be surpassed by their son or they love it one of the most important things he said to me before he died was i don't have to worry about you anymore that was big for me it's the subtext is i'm proud of you yeah yeah yeah because he didn't overly say anything you not a lot i love using stuff no no yeah not really not his gym but he was relieved like yeah that's him saying like i'm relieved you've done it yeah that's why like i was always thinking of like how do i get him to say that yeah uh-huh yeah you're gonna have to win an offshore raceboat race i mean i do have the adrenaline junkie and that spirit of chasing the edge no dude you guys are very similar in a lot of ways you're just like not as crazy modern version you're not starting a porno mag or having three babies on the same weekend well luckily he was in the castle culture i mean yeah he wouldn't have made it yeah okay my last question is you had a baby in july i did yeah boy rocky his name is rocky oh yes fuck yeah he's back can't wait to take him to benny honover's birthday oh my god how fun yeah when you think about the future obviously i don't even need to ask i'm sure you're just fucking loving this it's so fun right you're having a little kid yeah because he's that age now where he's laughing a lot he's alert he's not aloof he's not walking yet so i'm not sure what that'll be he's crawling so it's easier to control yeah no there's a very rough phase from when they learn how to walk to they actually get good at walking they just want to walk everywhere yeah my house lost stairs and stuff yeah you might be shopping for a ranch in the next little while but obviously i'm not going to be shopping for a ranch in the next little while you won't be able to two or two hundred days a year once that little boy's in school yeah yeah so i don't know what that's going to look like i don't know how we're going to navigate that because my wife travels with me everywhere too right we have a great nanny though we have an incredible nanny yeah and you can do that for the first five years yeah then he'll go to school and he'll want to be with his friends and you'll go i can't take this kid out of his life all the yeah exactly i don't know how to deal with that i'll also be like my early 50s at the time yeah you'll be 53 you might be in a different headspace it's hard for me to like i've been touring since i was a teenager yeah it's weird i've never broken below 200 besides covid really yeah 207 was the lowest last year so it's strange to me to not have a free weekend for example you don't have to worry too much about that yet you've played all the shows that's true what you haven't done is this chunk if there's something novel left in life it's that thing right right no i'm excited about that chapter but man i love the stage yeah i love playing for people i thrive yeah i thrive there yeah that's all i live for it i love it oh i'm so happy because you've been doing it for a long long time and you haven't burnt out no and also the thing is is like when you play like festivals like edc or ultra or tomorrowland these festivals you have to prepare all this new music it forces you to be creative exactly yeah yeah that schedule is important to me that challenge yeah to maintain my presence of my current music it's not about like your last singles it's not about all the songs that have impacted the culture it's about what about now do i have a song now that's gonna actually matter yeah and you'll get to like a stand-up you'll get to evaluate that real time you'll know if it works or not exactly you'll have real feedback real time i love that that's why vegas is like my laboratory so do you have a residency currently i do where so in vegas i do about 50 shows a year there i play on town beach the whole world but that's great because i'm in vegas yeah yeah so i just drive from home and then 150 on average like oh my god wow you're aging slower that's the only good news yeah yeah time moves just a fraction slower at altitudes so you said you're spending so much time at altitude okay i didn't know yeah your your clock's a little behind ours at sea level that's a good thing i definitely think about my biological age a lot more than i have yeah because you also give a lot of money to regenerative brain research the brain is who we are yeah you know like you could change your heart out your liver your body parts but your brain you don't want a transplant of that you can't do that you can't actually now with parkinson's patients could take a chunk of your brain out so you're not having to have the jitters and still be who you are because your brain's so neuroplastic right so who you are can just move over to this side of the brain yeah looks like stroke people they lose their control they just relocate it to a different part of your brain yeah the brain is so interesting yeah yeah yeah yeah well steve this has been a delight i'm really infected by how much you like it you're so passionate you so deserve to be here the fact that you've loved all this since a kid it's the gratitude when you're fighting for it for so long and then you finally get there yeah you gotta remember like the second you don't think it's that important to you someone else does and someone else will take it yeah and then when you're like oh i'm back guys they're like no we have someone else it's like you better fight for that every single time you have the chance this is the 30th anniversary of the label yeah it is yeah 96 2026 we survived 30 years as an independent label it's amazing that's so impressive it's really wild well this has been lovely man i'm really glad i got to meet you yeah thanks for having me yeah you deserve all this i'm thrilled for you yeah thanks i sure hope there weren't any mistakes in that episode but we'll find out when my mom mrs monica comes in and tells us what was wrong you oh sometimes water is so delicious sometimes rarely never almost never for you i know at least once a day for me or i haven't i just go like oh thank god this exists it hits yeah i like i feel it hydrating me it's got a good taste i know people say it doesn't have a taste but it does have a taste it tastes like water it does that's true it's unmistakable yeah god right when you have a sip of water you know right away that's water could be good or bad water huh but you wouldn't that's interesting we've filed it under no taste but that's not true interesting but it doesn't have any of the properties right that taste has like umami salty whatever the heck sweet i'm taking one of my shoes off i can't possibly take off the left why oh no shit no i can't take off the right why because of the deformities oh well just do it just like who cares you know i'll keep them under the table that's how i'll handle that because i didn't wear socks i'm in a special outfit because we have a special guest yeah and then i i tried footies oh yeah they were visible i hate that i know i struggle with this as well i think it's a common struggle and even if you get the ones that are not visible then it doesn't go up high enough and then the odds of it falling off in your shoe are like 80 i know they need to make it with like an adhesive on back or something but all to say i i because this person is so fashion forward i was like why can't i have socks hanging out i'm gonna go socksless in shoes which i never do because my feet sweat real quick all right and that's what happened so well let's just see your feet feet well this one is fine ish no it's got that crazy toenail well yeah there's a bris on it and fuck yeah and then that disgusting toenail that i have to use a drama you can't really see so it's fine okay it's fine wow well we went to a momentous event we did we sure did yeah we went to a graduation yeah no i'm sorry a culmination a culmination exiting elementary school you know i rarely i'm almost never on the side of like oh like why do we have to have a new word for everything like i'm generally like sure who cares doesn't bother me i do think it's crazy that we can't call it a graduation oh i didn't even interpret it as that but probably maybe you're right well i don't know i didn't think they put a lot of thought into it like we're not we don't use that word as much as just for calling it this no i looked it up it's you don't call it that because there's no diploma oh a culmination is a graduation without a diploma basically by the way they did give them a diploma i know i know a graduation i guess only counts if it's like high school or college right but i think that's silly and we can they can just all be graduations well that's what's fun about the experience of having kids in the modern society which is it's so different from when i was a kid and then so your knee jerk is like this must be crazy and silly because my thing is like no you got one graduation it was hugely meaningful because you only got one of them and you looked forward to it and it was finally done and that's what i enter it with going like this is silly and indulgent oh why do they got to step up from every grade yeah that part it's the whole like get a trophy forever everything you know yes i do think that's yeah there's some like i have some hesitation against it sure and then i'm there witnessing it and i absolutely love it i know and then i go why do i care what is what is it i care about you care about people getting soft um and the world getting soft which i tend to care a little bit about but not you know whatever we're all on the spectrum Probably perfectly proportional to our age and generation. Yeah. It's like you guys had a little more of that than I had. Right. And now they have a lot more of that than you had. I still eye roll at a lot of the things that are happening now. Yeah. But yeah, I had a fifth grade graduation. And then I try to step back and go like, there's no right or wrong. It's just they did it that way when I was a kid. Now they're doing it this way. And then if there is some real obvious problem as a result of it, people will notice and they'll write op-eds about it and we'll probably fix it. So what's the big deal? But I do, I just bristle like, well, there's another thing that's like, this is what I'm telling myself when I'm objecting to it is like, you're setting them up for massive failure in that the world's not going to celebrate them. That's how I feel. A mediocre job doesn't get a ribbon. You're not going to get a raise or a promotion at work for just being normal. It's misleading, right? Yeah. But then I guess you could quite easily make the argument of, yeah, exactly. That's how life is. So why not give them during childhood when they're innocent and they're carefree? Like, why not let them have this experience since they're never going to have it again? Yeah, there's just different schools of thought, like on childhood. Like my parents' school of thought was childhood is to prepare you for adulthood. Right. It's like it's not there just to be carefree and fun. It's like to learn lessons. To learn things that once you're an adult and you're on your own and you don't have help from us that you can live. But the Japanese, they're kind of the opposite. They go like, oh, adulthood is fucking rough. It's sacrifice, sacrifice, sacrifice. So they weirdly really protect the childhood as being way more carefree because they know what they're going to have to take on. So it's like, I don't know. They've been doing it that way there for a very long time and it's worked out just fine for them other than that they're not having kids. Yeah. No, this is not. This is not my learning college, not my observation. Oh, yeah. I was going to say, I was like, I don't like I don't think of Japanese children as like being like so effervescent or like running around or be like they're pretty contained and mellow. Well, I haven't been to Japan to even witness how kids are, but I do remember having a class where they were saying specifically they're not trying to prepare them. Oh, they're recognizing this is a once in a lifetime chapter. Yeah. Which is like, no, this is the time to be all these things because you're not going to be able to be all these things. Yes. Which whatever. They're all valid. Okay. But then the event itself. Yeah, it was great. So we went, you and Kristen, obviously, and Lincoln and grandparents and me and Anna and T.T. Carly. Yeah. We all went and we're going to talk through the whole thing. Okay. So. First of all, you have been given a number beforehand. You didn't know what it was, but you gave you a number on a purple piece of paper and the number was twenty four. Okay. Yeah. So then at the top of the graduation, the principal says, okay, if you were given a number, if you're in this person's class, you'll go to the left and you'll make a line and here in the middle aisle. Exactly. And then if you're in this person's class, it made no sense. Right. It didn't make sense. What? She was. She was saying it was clear everyone was confused. I was muddling around with all the parents holding numbers and no one knew where they were supposed to line up or in what order. Yes. And and then she said it again. Also confusing. And then you did have a loud clarificate. You said, well, there's. I raised my hand for a while and she didn't call me. Okay. And then you. I was like, okay, I got it. I just. Yeah. So I loudly said, hey, there's a couple middle aisles. Is it the ones? Yeah. Is it the ones running parallel to the stage or these ones perpendicular? Oh, it's the middle. Oh. And then we got clarification on that. So. Okay. The middle. That's the middle aisle. That's great. I do think because it was an auditorium. Yeah. It was. It was with gust. It wasn't exactly the way you just did it. Well, I had to be heard in the back row. Yeah. It was extremely assertive. It was. Yes. And I was like. You were certainly nervous. I got nervous. I did a little bit of sinking down because, you know, what happens is they see. They see it's you. They look at the group of they look at your people, obviously, because that's how life works. That's how people work. They're like, oh, and people are laughing. And then they're looking. And I was like, oh, my God, a lot of attention. A lot of attention. I was thanked by all the parents that were in the confused because we were just trying to comply. But I just got that sense. We're not moving closer to this being lined up the way it's supposed to be. I stand by that. It needed to be sorted out. Yeah. I agree with you there. And a ton of the parents thanked me like this. Oh, thank God you said I didn't know where the house was. So I was getting tons of validation there. But then I started getting really self-conscious. Like, does that principle feel like I just completely interrupted her thing? Right. And then I was planning to go apologize to her after. That's nice. And so my full intention was to find her and to say, I'm so sorry if that was disruptive or rude. But she found me. I was like in the middle of talking to the teacher and she came up. She goes, oh, my gosh. Thank you so much for. I was like, oh, thank. And I go, thank God. I was I was I was coming to say I'm sorry if that was. But she she did at least express that she was grateful that I got involved. Yeah. Right. So anyway, you guys got lined up appropriately and you were one of the lucky ones that got a special flower. Yeah, Delta handled me a flower. Yeah. You stand there with a flower. Yeah, it was so cute. Yeah. And then you sat back down. They sang a beautiful song. Oh, they sing such a cute song. What was it? And I just I just saying on the last fact check, I've come to terms with the fact that Delta's little, which I didn't know. Right. So weird. Yeah. I really don't know how I didn't know that. I think this is because her personality is so big. Well, also because she's just the person you see every day. It was when she went to the dance and I saw these photos. I was like, oh, she's a head shorter than everyone. Yeah. So then at the big singing thing, I'm like trying to find her and she's kind of buried behind tall people. Yeah. But you can see her teeth from a mile away. That's how you find. Delta, her rabbit teeth. She just has the biggest smile. She's the cutest rabbit teeth that you can see from so far away. Yes. And the song was so, so sweet. Cry, cry, cry. Yeah. Everyone's already crying at that point. It just has just begun. And then they did a really, really beautiful thing where at first I got anxious. Yes. When this was announced was going to happen. Yeah. You're doing math immediately. Yep. Yeah. So the graduation is just two classrooms of fifth graders, but. So probably like 80 kids or 70. So many. Those. I didn't realize like how many kids are in these classrooms these days. A lot. And then that made me so like, God, these teachers, you know. Oh, my God. They're nurses, you know, it's them and nurses. Oh. And so for each kid, a teacher spoke about them, like wrote a little like paragraph about, you know. About them and said it out loud. As they came up and got their little diploma. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. And yeah. So at first when I hear this is happening, I was like, oh. I did the math. I was like, it's going to take at least a minute to read each one. Probably more. Yep. That's like 75 minutes at the quickest version of this. Yep. This is. Yeah. The brain starts doing that. And then I was like, OK, but good. Her class is first. Not that it even. Well, no, I did, too. But then I'm like, well, I can't believe. Yeah. You did. So it's almost worse. There's nothing to look forward to. That's true. Yeah. So anyway, they say all these beautiful things about these kids. And it really after the first couple, I was like, oh, my God, this is just so important that they are doing this, because as we know, what teachers say about you. Yeah. Yeah. It really sticks. And I was like, each one of these kids gets a moment where they're being told about their, you know, assets and moments throughout the year that happened. Did you have. So first round of anxiety was the time. Yeah. Second round of anxiety was like, oh, these teachers have to say something unique about each student. How are they going to do it? I was. How is it not going to become generic? Yes. But fucking hats off to the teachers. It was each one was so specific and thoughtful. No one. No one phoned any one of them. Yes. They were all you. They're all unique. And I was like, oh, my God, this is great. But then I. I did. I did have some. What's it called? Like mirror neuron stuff happening. Yeah. With some of the kids, because I was like, OK, some of the kids got the teachers to cry. Oh, sure. Over them. But I thought in a great turn of events, it wasn't like the most popular kids in class. It wasn't like they got double like a they were already really popular and the teachers crying over it. To me, that wasn't happening. I know. But sometimes it was sometimes. But sometimes they deserve both, I guess. Yeah. No, it just I just know me. me and i was like you would be i would want that so bad even want your teacher to cry and not be able to keep it together at all when they had to say bye to me that is the high bar i just want them to be so sad devastated miss me so much announce their retirement i can't possibly go on if you're not in my class yeah that's what i would have wanted it would have been what i was striving for yeah and some people got it some people didn't and there was one that was like i have no idea what's you have no idea about these kids obviously and what's been going on but there was one that you based on the little speech you could kind of put some pieces together about this kid and it was everyone was crying it was so moving and i did think this person will hopefully never forget this yeah and make decisions based on that based on no i'm a leader i'm a this i'm a you know oh it was just so lovely and of course the deltas was so so wonderful and we're crying cry more crying yeah i felt i did feel a little dead inside you did yeah because all of you guys were crying so hard and oh you felt judged well i know i didn't feel judged i didn't even clock whether you were no one was but i knew i was like i'm not like really i was feeling emotional but i wasn't i wasn't um emoting crying i wasn't crying tears um and then and then i was like like not these people are pretend not you but i was like some of these people are just performing you know i thought it crossed my mind that you thought i was performing no if it's your kid i mean i felt i was like oh my god i cannot believe she's graduating fifth grade i can't believe she's this old look at her oh my god i mean it was definitely like i had tears in my eyes in your mind in my mind's eyes um no i had tears but there was no spillage right right you know it didn't break the and some people not the parents obviously but some other people were crying so hard okay that i was like this isn't real you were calling and then i know it was real yeah it was real and everyone's on a spectrum of how easily they cry and what they cry about you know but i felt a little in my head about that yeah stay tuned for more armchair expert if you dare it's so great how you can be having multiple experiences at the same time because i too was having like a lot of times i was like oh my god i'm gonna cry i'm gonna cry i'm gonna cry i'm gonna cry i was having like three levels of um engagement with it a it's my sweet spot right we know what i'm gonna cry about it's earnestness it's like it's earnestness in the face of a cruel world yes that's that always hits me of course yeah it's vulnerability and sweetness yeah in spite of the fact that everyone's fucking terrible and mean yes and then there was this little girl that was just brought the house down this little girl with a lot of different developmental stuff going on who fucking graduated fifth grade and the way she was celebrating waving her diploma over her head i was that girl made me cry like five times and then i just stared at her in the front row swinging her feet she's so happy it made me so happy it's like it's it was happiness cry i know she's like too happy for her to not be crying about it beautiful yeah okay i had an experience with that beautiful girl as well yeah where i was like oh my god she's so happy like yeah she's so happy but then i was in the class was so supportive it was not like when i was in fifth grade those kids were like separate i know and they were in a room and you're like oh no stay away i know it was it was so beautiful but i did have a moment of like i felt sad and then i felt guilty for feeling sad right and i was like you can't feel sad about this or what you probably have is fear which is like look at this beautiful human being on earth and and and earth's not designed for her how will she do i know but look at her i'm fucking crushing it i just hope it stays yeah yeah but that's what's going on it's like you you you immediately care and want to help and protect and that's what a wonderful part of us that we all feel that anxiety yes yeah and that's nice and then i go we're kind of nice most of the time i think we're terrible but then we're kind of nice all of us feel this way about this little girl right and that's so wonderful yeah oh she was so cute so i have to say i'm so grateful for her and i'm so grateful for her and i'm so grateful for her i had all that stuff going on and i was like very present for that stuff but very very actively as well i got crazy um aware in a very anthropological way and this will be so duh to you and to everybody but it took me a minute to figure out why but ceremonies are often when we most coalesce around what our group values are these are kind we declare group values and like pro-social and anti-social like it's these rites of passages where we kind of talk about how you should be in the world and i just got like hyper aware of like oh wow yeah culture's being passed on to them right now like it's so concrete right now because it starts with a song about having dreams have a million dreams you go get those dreams i know and i was just like this is so american like this is how the system works everyone in here should be dreaming of being spectacular right which obviously is not reality not everyone's going to be spectacular and then i was just thinking about how opposite this is probably from the japanese graduation that's more collective society right right and finding probably how to be a great family member or whatever whatever virtues are reaffirmed in those moments for their expressing so it was like have a bazillion you know dream to the stars it's just so interesting again i say it was zero judgment of course there was a moment i'll never forget it and i of course argued with him at my brother's high school graduation um you know the valedictorian comes up and says something and salutatory and it is and it's like chase your dream you know it's all this dream work hard chase your dream not work hard you know like that part's not really in it yeah even similar here right it's like just go after it yeah and and be the best you can be and blah blah blah blah be great be great be great and my dad was like squirming in his seat and after he was like what is this he was like why don't people just strive to be mediocre yeah he literally said that he was like or strive to be mediocre which was i was like dad yeah that's a pejorative in our society exactly but he means strive to be safe just strive to get some things you don't have to get all the things you don't have to be the best just have enough yeah to to live a life try to get enough yeah yeah and he really hated that the swedish thing is the right amount oh lacoma or whatever yeah he really and i was so eye-rolly with him i was like dad that is not like that's not an inspiring message that's not what you do and he was like it should be and i of course thought that was silly as someone who was chasing a dream yeah but i do as the older i get agree a little more with it i think i mean that's not really fair for me to say because i did get a lot of the things i wanted to get yeah there's a certain reality which is like of these 75 kids all 75 of them can't be president of the united states it's not gonna work out time wise for them yeah and they're not gonna be ceos and they're not gonna be a world famous artist so on on some level i start a little judgmental like man do we not set everyone up for total failure like when they're not spectacular which 99.9 of people are not spectacular then they're just disappointed in themselves they didn't fulfill this thing that seems so easily everyone should be achieving yeah i know so i and then i go like yeah this is a little messed up but then i step back even further and i go forget right or wrong it's like this is just how it is here and what's the result so we have a system and regardless of what the intentions of the system were whatever results the system produces are what the system creates yeah and the result is yeah dude a person came to this country from south south africa and became the first trillionaire to ever live because he came and every invention not every damn near every fucking invention happens here and so it's just the system by which you get this other thing you can then decide all the way later yeah is it good or bad to be america versus japan versus spain versus whatever i don't know i kind of think no i think well they're all there's a better yeah it's just all trade-offs yeah there's good things about all the places so i literally wouldn't i didn't leave it going like this we shouldn't do this i just like oh this is how we get this result and it's really baked And this is a very progressive and very self-aware school. Yeah, it is. And even they probably haven't consciously thought, oh, we're passing on this culture. It's just what you do and you do it innately because it was given to you and then you pass it on. I know. It's hard, though, because even though I agree that it might be maybe setting us up to all fall short. I also fully bought into that fully. And like I was like, I'm getting what I want. I'm I'm chasing this crazy dream. I'm going to do it. I like, you know, when you're like young and you need like some so embarrassing design wise now, you know, but like you like get like words from like TJ Maxx. And if there was a dream, I'd always get it. Like that was like such a word for me. And it worked. Yeah. Like. Like for me, it worked. And I don't know. The system is is living and breathing because one percent do break through. Yeah. And you need to be motivated. And we'd rather live in a place where that's possible, even if it's not probable. I would. Exactly. I would. And a lot of people would. And then some people want it. Yeah. It's just all really interesting. And so, yes, there was that thing that was being passed. And then even the nature of this thing. That was beautiful. Everyone gets something read about them to identify something special about them. Yes. And it's like, yeah, that we all like we all need to be special. We all need to be individual. We all need to be uniquely special. Yeah. I know. And we'll figure it out because that's what we want and what we do. And again, I'm not right or wrong. It's just like, oh, I was aware. I was just noticing. Oh, now this bit of culture is being passed on. Exactly. And this bit of culture. Well, yeah. No, at first, again, she said the thing, this is going to happen. And then I was like, oh, my God, we're going to be here for so long. And then I was also like, oh, I also was like, Jesus, like, can't they just write? It feels indulgent. Exactly. It felt indulgent. And then a part of it was like, can't they just like write it on a paper and give it to them or something? But this whole like standing in front of everyone while you're hearing nice things about you felt was a little bit like, oh, my God. But then it was happening. And I was like, this is a beautiful thing. I love it. Yeah. Because this is my culture. Yeah. I don't know. I don't know. It's really, it's just funny. Before I had kids, maybe, I don't know. I just sat through all these things. I never really was aware of what was happening during these things. And I was just, I just kept. It's like, I know each one's like, I know you're going to be a star in sixth grade or I know you're going to be a mathematician. It's like. One of them was like going to be run for president. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. Yeah, I was really putting myself in the position of being up there and like. What I would have wanted them to say about me. And like, what would they have said about me at that age? Yeah. I was thinking about that, too. What they would say about me. I felt really, I was like, oh, my God. I'm thinking way too much. Because I'd be a naughty boy, but I bet I would have won them over enough. Like they would, they would have, they would have talked about me being naughty and then said I was really funny, I think. Well, there was one boy that before the one, before the teacher could speak about him, he said, OK, I got it. I want to say something. And I was like, oh, this is Dax. But then it was so sweet. sweet he wanted to call out a dude that works in the office yes it was so sweet because at first i was like oh my god this kid is way too confident who's he thinking he's everyone has come up and played their part and he has to do something different no stop stop i need to say something you're like well what's this tall poppy doing exactly but then it was selfless i know it was great but it took a turn because i was like oh no and then i did i was like this is just like dax but then it was sweet and i was like i guess it is like him i guess that is part of it it was neat i really i really enjoyed watching and then all the kids participate in my culture a criding what's that the kids crying all the kids were bawling after i was happy to see that because as i told you when i picked up lincoln from the fifth grade dance no one was everyone was crying because they realized they weren't going to see each other and then when i picked up delta they didn't seem to have any awareness of that but now it seems to have hit them at this ceremony that'd be great sad and it is sad like these these chapters you know i was thinking about her little preschool graduation that we did in covid remember it was covid so we just like went one by one this is when i had just crashed the motorcycle exactly i was in there in a sling yeah same day and um and like i just that we were said bye to that school and now this school and it's like what the fuck is going on i hate time yeah and you really i think you specifically hate chapters yeah endings yeah i hate endings yeah i think the i think the the more you look at life as chapters the easier it is to handle the bittersweetness i don't like which is you go like yeah this is sad i'm leaving this chapter and there'll be a different chapter i'll experience and that will be special too and i'll be sad to say goodbye to that one but then another one will come i know i said that to her when she was crying i said it's hard to it's it's hard it's a really big chapter yeah but yeah and my inclination was to say but there's gonna but there's the next one's gonna be so fun but i didn't because i was like yeah it's just it is hard to end things it's hard to say goodbye to things and but it also shows you that you cared about things and that they were special and important because you will miss them and long for them i know without that part we don't get the other part i know everything's a given then you just take everything for granted i know that's our terrible nature it's yeah it's just hard but i also it is funny because i was like oh my god like they're so old and this is like they're in college tomorrow and like i hate this but then i was thinking back to fifth grade and i was like oh that was so long ago like i like can't really remember it so there's a lot a lot will happen yeah it's not it's gonna move fast but it's like things are going to happen and they're and yeah yeah yeah i was thinking about that the other day i was i don't know what i was journaling about but i was thinking oh in a few birthdays i'll have been on tv as long as i've not been on tv enough oh i see i see i see yes yeah i think i was 28 when i hit 56 uh half of my life i'll have spent having been on tv show business and what i weirdly liked about that was i thought oh that that's so long ago yeah it's so long ago and i still have that chunk of time ahead of me yeah that's really comforting yeah i know yeah i know i think about that as well it went by so fast but also so much happened yeah and so much will happen in the next that next chunk of time but it's still stressful anyway well happy graduations to all it's a time to think about like moving forward new chapters next stages yeah what we are as a people how we prepare each other for that how we i don't know like you know ceremonies and and rites of passages maybe because i was into anthro it's just a human thing yeah it's really interesting that we all have developed these actually it's an animal thing i mean i feel like right don't even animals like elephants do like a little mourning thing elephants mourn yeah they have elephant grave sites where they play with the bones and stuff yeah yeah yeah but their rites of passage are more like you get kicked out of the the the they call elephants caravans right oh that's sounds right you get kicked out of the caravan because you're an adolescent male and you can't be around anyone and then you get to come back when you've chilled out so i guess that's a rite of passage yeah i guess so but yeah wanna do some facts yeah let's do some facts pack of elephants is a memory or a parade parade oh wow i like that a memory yeah that's interesting because they have such good memories but that's that's why that's why like you wouldn't call a pack of cheetahs fast it's a fast cheetahs that'd be great a fast of cheetahs that'd be great they also look like they're fasting cheetahs yeah because they're spending so much energy yeah they're gonna stay light and quick okay well this was for steve steve aoki who i really really liked me too you know i think i even said it in the episode but i don't have a ton of interest in djing uh-huh so when we're considering a guest like steve i go i gotta recognize that this guy's like a world fucking famous one of the biggest djs to ever live so that's that's worthy of an exploration but i personally am not so into djing yeah but this whole punk rock thing that happened and to see how enthusiastic this guy is and always has been about music yeah i thought boy does he deserve all this yes i agree yeah i like him so me too he was also just very kind to me and i think he's a great guy and i think he's a great and sweet energy. - Very sweet energy. Almost so sweetly, it's amazing he made it. And what a cool counterfactual to his father's approach. I know. But yet they both were wildly successful. Yeah, it's true. Okay, when did Benihana start franchising? Wait, iPod? Embarrassing. IPO'd. Oh, no. IPO'd in 1983. iPod. It's like, that's not what I asked. In 1983 and started soon after. The exact date is unclear, but by 1970s, there were many locations. First store opened in 1964. I want to go, I want that fried rice. I want it with butter. We were just talking about it last night. Oh, I want that. No info on the percentage of birthdays that are at Benihana. Hard to find out. I think it is 70%. I think he would know. Yeah. Is Kill Sadie banned from Minnesota? Yes, from Minneapolis and active 1997 to 2001. What is this? A band. Kill Sadie. Oh, not they were banned like a book band. No, banned. Got it, got it, got it. Yes. I'm like, I was having a lot of cognitive dissonance. I'm like, Minneapolis is very progressive. They wouldn't ban anything. No, they wouldn't. That's true. No, okay. Devin, some fun facts. Fast and Furious and City. His sister. Yep, DOS. Okay, Mutant Chronicles. Modeling career. Walked for Balenciaga, Comme des Garcons, Chanel. Wow. You know, I immediately, not immediately. It took me three days, weirdly, but I got on the phone with my cousin. Oh, yeah. Who was in the band that Steve was obsessed with. Yes. And so I wanted to tell him, I'm like, dude, that DJ Steve Aoki, he like loves current. Yeah. I just want to tell him all that. And then also pass on the fact that he authenticates records. Yeah. Yeah. For his dad. So cool. Oh, yeah. He was telling us about that after. And we were going to talk about that. Yeah. So he has a company that now authenticates records and yeah, gives them a quality and then encases them. Yeah. And so he had offered to do that to my uncle's record collection, which is kind of famous. And then my cousin said, oh, yeah, he was like a Santa Barbara punk rock kid, huh? Like he kind of knew that he had that origin. And he goes, and doesn't he, he's got a super hot sister. And I go, yeah, yeah. She's like crazy, huh? Yeah. Those are the two things he knew about him. Well, yeah. She replaced Naomi Campbell as the face of Versace in 98 at the age of 16. Dude. Wow. Okay. 2007 Coachella. The headlines were Bjork, Red Hot Chili Peppers and Rage Against the Machine. Steve played on Saturday afternoon in the Sahara tent. Sahara? Sahara. Sahara. What year did e-sports take off? He guessed 2010s. Yes. Sources cite 2010s as the big surge in popularity, mostly after the launch of Twitch in 2011. In 2013, viewers watched 12 billion minutes on the platform. Oh, my God. Oh, my heavens. Yeah. I mean, there's also like some obviously fun stuff on his dad. Was he wrestling for the Olympics? He came to the U.S. with the spot on Japan's 1960 Olympic team, but never competed. And a scholarship to Russia. Russell in the States at Springfield College in Springfield, Massachusetts. His 1979 offshore powerboat crash near the Golden Gate Bridge resulted in many injuries, including a ruptured aorta, a lacerated liver and multiple broken bones in his arm and leg, leaving him with a 10% chance of survival. Oh, my God. This guy's a maniac, Rocky. It is claimed that the hepatitis he had at the time of his death was from a blood transfusion from the crash. Oh, my God. Ooh. Wow. Okay. He won a bunch of. Awards, wrestling and powerboating, backgammon, hot air ballooning. Backgammon? Yeah. Won the World Leisure Class Backgammon Championship in 1974. This guy might have devoured life more than anyone we know of. Exactly. Yeah. He's kind of my new hero. Part of the hot air ballooning, part of the four-man crew that completed the first Trans-Pacific Balloon Flight in 1981, setting a 34-year record for the longest manned balloon flight, covering 5,208 miles. Probably until Richard Branson. Oh, he didn't have to do that. He traveled the world. He didn't need to. He circumnavigated the earth on a hot air balloon. Poor Rocky. Well, look. He got unseated. I think you correct for his level of technology versus the other balloon. I think it's probably more impressive going across the Pacific and the thing they did. Those are the facts. Well, Steve, if you're listening, you're so likable. It's crazy. Yeah. That was really a lovely interview. Yeah. Really? It really was. A lot. All right. Love you. You're special. You're great. You're going to be the president. Oh, right back at you.