State, Consciousness, Liberty and Religion - Graham Hancock intervew with Sonia Doubell

The State's War on Human Consciousness Consciousness, The expanding of consciousness. What does that actually mean to the average person having this expanded consciousness? Speaker 2 Well, first of all, I would say that we need to realise it, that our consciousness is the most precious, the most intimate, the most wise part of ourselves. That is, that is ultimately what we are. I believe that's what human beings are. We have consciousness incarnated in bodies. So, you know, don't make the mistake of thinking that your body is you. It's your consciousness that is you. And actually, mainstream science really has no idea what consciousness is. This is one of the reasons why I am I am deeply opposed to the state, which is one of the most negative influences in the world today, seeking to patrol and control human consciousness. For example, these visionary plants that we've been talking about are in fact highly illegal in almost all societies around the world. The state does not want us to have those experiences. And to me, it's really ironic that we live in countries that call themselves democracies and that call themselves free and that yet will send us to prison for exploring that most intimate and sacred and personal part of ourselves, which is called our consciousness. And you know, as I've said many times, if you really get to grips with it, if we are not sovereign over our own consciousness, then we're not sovereign over anything. And freedom is a meaningless term to use unless we have established that that my consciousness, your consciousness, our consciousness as human beings has to be a no go area for the state. The state has no right to tell us what we may or may not do with our own consciousness, what we do to other people, how we, how we interact, and perhaps, you know, get in the face of other people. I can see a role for the state there. But but in the privacy, the sanctum, the holy of holies of our own consciousness, the state has no right to enter and no right to tell us what to do. So for me, it is an abomination and a gross abuse of human rights that we have this thing called disguised as the war on drugs, which is really a war on consciousness, which is really designed to restrict us to the very narrow band of consumption and production and entertainment that the state wishes to channel our consciousness into. So that we become simply passive consumers who never ask any, any, any questions. Our consciousness is what we are. It is the, it is the sum total perhaps of our experience through many, many lifetimes. And it is, it is what we enter this realm with, and it's what we leave this realm with. It is absolutely the most precious and the most sacred part of ourselves. And we should do everything we can to make sure that we grow rather than restrict our consciousness in the years that we have in this human. Speaker 1 World. I think awakening is that kind of moment where you realise that information is being fed to you constantly and when you wake up to that, you stop receiving it. You start becoming the gatekeeper of your mind and your consciousness. Speaker 2 We have to be sovereign. We have to be sovereign over our own consciousness and we, and it's really important to understand that that huge massively funded efforts are being made to narrow and restrict and limit human consciousness. And this well, I spoke earlier of dark, dark forces at, at work on, on the human project. These are these, these are they that they, that instead of the majesty and the magic and the enchantment that is our true birthright, that we are to be limited to what can be weighed and measured and counted and to what can be exploited commercially. And that we are to, instead of being questioning creatures, we are to ask no questions and to simply accept what, what we are told. This is very negative for the development of, of human beings. It's a very, and, and it's got worse in many ways with the modern world because I think you know, but bear in mind down the, down the, the, the, the centuries and the, and the thousands of years since such a thing as the state has existed, which is approximately the last 5000 years, that the greatest guarantee of human freedom has often been the inefficiency of the state. And unfortunately, we are entering an era now with computers and electronic technology where states are becoming extremely efficient. So while we have this illusion of freedom called democracy, we actually have a system which is controlling and locking down our consciousness and using the media and the education system as a way to to do that and the whole consumer ethic to restrict and narrow us into a into a very limited ban. So I think that it's incumbent on all of us to resist that. Yeah, to question that and and to assert absolute sovereignty over our own consciousness. The Internet: A Liberating Force for Humanity Do you think that there is a positive aspect to this? You know, information availability on computers, the way that people are able to download an interview, watch some great piece of, you know, mind evolving information. Yes. Speaker 2 I, I do, I think that the, I think that the Internet is, is an incredible instrument of liberation. It isn't only that like any powerful instrument, it it has, it has negative aspects as well. But but fundamentally, this is the first time, as far as we know, yeah, that the whole human race pretty much has had the opportunity to communicate one with another and to share ideas across, you know, these artificial constructs called national, national boundaries. I mean, I always wonder, why should I, I, I detest patriotism and nationalism. Why should I feel particularly loyal to another person just because they happen to have been born on the same bit of land that I was born on or because their parents happen to have taught them the same system of religious ideas that I was taught? Why should I feel any special connection with that person just because of that accident of both? What I want to belong to is a community of ideas where where I I gravitate to to to people whose ideas I enjoy and value. I don't care where they were born or what colour their skin is or what religion they were born into. That's completely irrelevant to me. I'm only interested in their ideas. And that's fundamentally what is the Internet is offering us. It's offering us a worldwide community, many different communities of ideas into which people can choose to participate if they wish, not even forced upon them. It's their free choice in order to do it. So I think that that it is incredibly liberating. And This is why we are seeing again, States and large corporations seeking to shut down and control the Internet, because they know that the Internet is a massively liberating influence. And wherever you see the state and large corporations joining hands to control something, you should worry. There is a sign that there is a real problem there, that something is being done. So we should worry very much about these efforts that are now being made under the disguise of copyright and so on, to shut down the to shut down and control the Internet. The Internet must be free. It is. It is a tremendous asset to the growth of humanity, just as the visionary plants are. And again, huge efforts to shut down the visionary plants. It's a sign that some dark force is at work. We must awake to that and and resist it. It's our, it's our, our responsibility to to, to do that really it is responsible. We have to be take that responsibility to question everything. Struggle, Confusion, and Hope for Humanity's Future Do you think we're moving into that, moving towards that now this 2012? Speaker 2 I think we're in a time of, we're in a time of struggle and a time of, of great confusion and great promise. Huge forces are at work to shut humanity down and huge forces are at work to open us up and wake us up. And, and, and all of these, in this interesting epoch in which you and I have been born, is at work now. And, and I don't think that anything is a foregone conclusion, but I, I believe in my heart, in the fundamental goodness of humanity and in the strength of the human spirit. And when I look at the past, this is also true, that the strength of the human spirit and the great force and power of love have always won through in the end over hatred and control. So, you know, all these messages that are generated in the world today are fear and hatred and suspicion, which seek to divide us from one another. Yeah. Opposing those are messages of love and unity and of waking up. And and I think what what we need to do is to make the right choices rather than the wrong ones and to make them. Speaker 1 Can you? Ayahuasca, Organized Religion, and the Serpent's Truth Do you feel anything about next year being the year of the snake? Speaker 2 Well, it's, it's interesting because of course, you know, ayahuasca is, is most often manifests in the form of a of of, of, of of a serpent, a great and, and wise serpent entity. Well, look, we live in very interesting times. We mankind in some ways is, is standing at the edge of an abyss. It, it, it is possible for us to make terrible errors at the moment, but it's also possible for us to make the right choices. It's not too late. I, I, I, I really believe that there is more hope than darkness. Yeah. In the, in the present situation, I, I myself have have encountered mother ayahuasca in her form as a, as a, as a serpent. Of course the Bible bashes will say, oh, that's the serpent from the Garden of Eden. That's the that's the devil. Yeah, but it's so predictable that they would, that they would say that. But actually, if you can, sorry, I'm going to say something which which many people may find offensive. But if you look at that entity called Jehovah, who is the God of the Old Testament and who is the God of Islam and Christianity and Judaism of the three monotheistic faiths. And you look at what that entity has done down the ages, stoning people to death, burning people at the stake, burning books, destroying, destroying beauty and truth wherever, wherever it is found, the cruelty, the harshness, the hatred. I am, I'm not sure that that's a God at all to, to me, I would cast that more as a demon, which has, which has been misleading humanity for a very long time. So if you go right back to the garden of Eden's story, what did the serpent do except wake mankind up and, and, and, and say you don't have to listen to what that creature is telling you. You know, if you look, if I think it's a really good idea to, to, to judge systems by what they do rather than by what they say. Extreme religions, you know, all talk the talk of peace and love and beauty. But the walk they walk is a walk of hatred and cruelty and oppression and pain and pain. You know, the tortured figure of Christ on, on, on, on, on, on on a cross. What are we supposed to take from that? The notion that somebody dying 2000 years ago could forgive our sins? I'm sorry. We have to get to grips with our own sins and live and learn the lesson of life. Nobody else can do that for us. We have to take responsibility for it directly. If you really examine these messages that are coming from the mainstream religions, and if you examine what they've done, whether it's stoning somebody to death or burning them at the stake or depriving them of their freedom because their ideas are a little bit different from somebody's ideas. Yeah. You know, whether it's, whether it's that fundamentally the, the influence of all of the mainstream religions has been extremely negative on the human spirit for a very, very long time. So you go right back to the Garden of Eden's story and you find that that the serpent, which of course the mainstream religions project as the bad guy, is in fact offering awakening to humanity. That's, that's what that spirit is saying. It's saying this thing that calls itself God lied to you. It's said if you ate at the tree of knowledge that you would die, but you ate at the tree of knowledge and you didn't die. What kind of thing is it that lies to you in that way and that wants you not to have knowledge, That wants you just to be a robot, a sort of meet robot that goes through life doing exactly what it's what it's told? Speaker 1 That's. Gnosticism: Questioning Everything for True Awakening Exactly a meet robot and just to there is an ancient system of of knowledge which touches on all of this called Gnosticism. And for the Gnostics, who were one of the the many groups that regarded the figure of Christ as a great teacher, for, for them, they never bought in to the suppressing and controlling system that became mainstream religion. And as a result, and for them, the serpent was the good guy, not the bad guy. And of course, what happened to the Gnostics in the early century of the Christian era is that the other faction of Christianity that became the Roman Catholic Church burnt them all at the stake. Of course, there's a lot to wake up to. And, and sometimes, you know, the thing that we regard as automatically good, we should question that too. Do you? Speaker 1 Think you should? Speaker 2 Question everything. Yeah, we really should question everything. That's that's what we that's what the universe gave us. These amazing things called our brains to do, not to accept, but to question. That's part of our fundamental birthright as human beings. Speaker 1 I think that's a really good message to anyone. I think that you should accept nothing and we should question everything. Really. Don't take anything just because it's given to you or because you read it in the book, unless it's Grace. Speaker 2 No, don't, don't, don't, don't take that out. Question. Question then. Speaker 1 Thank you very, very much, Grace, been lovely talking to you. Good. Speaker 2 To talk to you too.