Socializing with NYC Mayor Zohran Mamdani

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And I do hope that the enthusiasm and the love that Americans show for the game of football and for the countries that we're playing. It's I hope this isn't like we had a foreign exchange student come live with. With us for six weeks and like got along great. But now that they're gone and every now and again, we'll check back in by text. No, I hope that it's a lasting relationship and one that we that we value. But, you know, in these times, these are the moments post World Cup. There's a period of reflection. And and we're going to do that on today's podcast, not reflecting on the world, but reflecting on one of the cities that was central to the World Cup experience, which was. New York City. And who better to check in with New York City and with how things are going at that time than his honor? For God's sakes, the mayor of New York City. Let's talk to the mayor. Why not? Why not us? Let's talk to the mayor of New York City. So, ladies and gentlemen, we have the distinct honor and pleasure today to be welcoming the mayor of the great, great city. That is the one that never sleeps. The biggest apple of them all. New York City. Mayor Zoran Mamdani is joining us. Mayor, Mr. Mayor, your honor. His honor. Your honor. How are you? I'm doing well, man. Thank you for having me. It's a pleasure to be back. Are you still feeling the afterglow, the joy of the of the halo effect of the New York Knickerbockers incredible run to the championship this year? Do you still feel it? One hundred percent. It is. It Nixon five has become a greeting in New York City. It's the most beautiful. One question, sir. At City Hall at the end of the Canyon of Heroes in the parade, there was a great deal of Knicks memorabilia that was hung up around that in decorative fashion. Giant Knicks caricatures, Knicks jerseys. I guess my question to you is, may I? May I have those? You know what? I'll ask the team where they are. I don't know if there's a shed behind City Hall where they keep them, but if they're still there. I will get back to you, brother. I appreciate it. How are you feeling now? So you have been the mayor for you started January 1st. It is now July seven months. What's the reality of being the mayor? Is is how does it feel? After what is the difference between the rhetoric of running for mayor and the reality of governing as mayor? Yeah, I think there's often a lot made of a campaign as if it is easier and a governing as if it is a harder experience. Yes, I think both are challenging. I think what is lost, though, is that governing comes with the opportunity to deliver. When you're campaigning, you're asking people to believe you're asking them to put their trust into a politics that's often disappointed them. And when you're governing. You can earn their trust by what you deliver. And so it is much easier to have a conversation about this vision today when we've been able to pave one hundred and seventy five thousand potholes, put the city on a path to universal child care, win more than sixty million dollars for tenants whose landlords made negligence into a business model. When we have that conversation now, you can point to what these last six months have looked like under democratic socialist principles when you have it during the campaign. Sir, we're being recorded right now. What are you doing? You're throwing in the S word. I didn't mean to use a slur. Don't throw in the S word. I didn't mean to use a slur live on this podcast. Son of a. I just wanted to make sure that we're going to be together in the cell when we're all around. All right. Fair enough. So that's the interesting thing. There's a caricature of democratic socialism and there's a reality of democratic socialism. And then there is just governing that has very little to do with democratic socialism. So. Can we tease those apart a little bit? What would in your mind, what is governing by the principles of democratic socialism? What does that entail? It means making the choice every day to fight for working people. It means that you believe that everyone in your city deserves to live a dignified life, no matter how much money is in their pocket. And what we've found is that this city is many things all at once. It's both the wealthiest city in the wealthiest country in the history of the world. And it's also a city. It's a city where one in four people are living in poverty. And so you'll often hear the phrase, don't sweat the small stuff. To me, being a democratic socialist is also sweating the small stuff, because for a lot of New Yorkers, it's those things that are the measure of how they're how difficult or easy their life is, whether they're able not only to pay for their rent or their child care, but whether they're able to also rely on city government to get around their city, to breathe in their city, to experience life in their city. And I think that we've we've. We've forgotten that at the heart of what we want to deliver is not just the existence of a public sector. It's also the excellence and efficiency of a public sector. I want New Yorkers to be choosing to this city government every single day, as opposed to feeling as if they're subjected to it. See that to me, though, that statement, if if a Democrat was running or even a Republican, to some extent, that feels like something that everybody would say we want everybody to we want everybody be able to thrive. In this city, is there something about democratic socialism as a theory that brings those to bear? In other words, is it about the safety net? Is it about, you know, the caricature is you're a communist who's going to nationalize the industries. You're going to take over Goldman Sachs. I'm actually coming on this podcast to let you know that it's now my podcast. Wait, what? Here's what I love about that. You walk the walk. That's the important thing. Somebody had to seize the means of this production. It was this specific production that I was talking about. I'm doing this in Jersey. I'm out of your jurisdiction, man. I'm not even around there. You were doing this in Jersey. Wait, you're moving me? I'm moving you. Damn you, Stalin. I think that to your point, there are a lot of politicians of a variety of ideologies who will speak about housing as a human right, for example, or health care. healthcare is a human right. right? Or they'll talk about dignity. I think that where the rubber meets the road is, are you actually willing to ensure that that which no one should be priced out of, no one is in fact priced out of it? So I'll give you an example. Okay. Childcare. It's hard to find a politician who'll say childcare should be more expensive. They'll generally say it should be more affordable, right? Right, right. But are you willing to take the step to provide childcare as something that is guaranteed to New Yorkers, regardless of how much money they have in their pocket? So one of our focuses has been universal childcare, right? Take the successes of free childcare for three year olds of pre-K and extend it to two year olds. Now it's not just as simple as saying, oh yes, I want to do that. You have to also be willing to fight for the revenue you need to do that. And so day eight of our administration, we secure an agreement with the governor for $1.2 billion locks free childcare for two year olds for the first time in New York city. Right. And our dream is that this will extend not only to the 2000 two year olds this year or the 12,000 next year, but every single two year old by the end of four years. And it's not just a dream. It's, it's a promise and it's a commitment. Right. So in some respects, it are, is it about the priorities that you have are about quality of life for those, even if they don't make because pre-K or universal childcare or those kinds of things, you know, de Blasio might've brought that up or, you know, it's, it's not something that I think that the caricature of democratic socialism is that you're a different, it's a completely different ideology than those that we have seen, or is it perhaps just a different nomenclature than we've seen? You know, I think, I think part of it is that words have lost their meaning over time. There we go. That's, this is where I'm, this is where I'm getting to is, is it really about the labels? I think if you go back to some of the Democrats that we most admire, FDR, LaGuardia, you will see a lot of democratic socialist principles in their vision. And if you think about a lot of what we've come to accept as just the facts of life across our country, a lot of it is also still driven by democratic socialist principles. Now, if today you and I were to, to introduce the idea of a building that lends out books for free, we would be slandered in the same way that so many new ideas are slandered today. And yet that's the library and the same thing with the fire department, the same thing with public schools. And it's to say that a lot of politics has been a debate about who deserves what. And I would prefer a politics that debates how we can deliver that to everyone. And, and, and to deliver it at a standard that is so good, that no matter how much money in your pocket, you opt for that. And I think at its best, the New York city subway is an illustration where no matter how much money you have in your pocket, you understand that if you want to get from point A to point B, best way is to get on that train. That's for sure. So to, to that end, was there ever a consideration for you because of the priorities that you have? Why take on the label of democratic socialist, knowing that it comes, knowing that it comes with a lot of other baggage that may not be helpful to you in your pursuit of what are, what was it about what they were saying that drew you as opposed to running as the things that you're suggesting to me, if you ran on these as a Democrat, I it's not, I wouldn't say like, what, what the heck, you know, it's, it sounds very much in line with that. It sounds like what you're doing differently is you're being competent or, you know, ruthlessly pursuing those goals and, and, and chipping away at them. So why, why take that on? You know, I, I, I want to be honest with people about what it is that I actually believe in. And I also think what we've seen over many decades is a fear mongering in our politics or anything that we disagree with or anything that portends significant change is described as if it is socialist, you know, at times as if, as if it is communist and the intent of that is to end the conversation there and then, and it especially happens when you're talking about something that would disproportionately benefit working people. And I think it's important because we keep speaking about some of the inequities and inequalities that we see in our city as if they are bugs in a system as opposed to features. And if we truly want to reckon with one in four New Yorkers being in poverty, we have to also ask ourselves about if it's important to change the framework. With which, what we determine success to be. And also, you know, being a Muslim democratic socialist, I thought it would be pretty straightforward. What if I label myself something that scares people the most? I'm a Muslim democratic socialist, and I'd like to run your public transportation system. So is, is there in, in some regard, is this a, is the idea being, if I can show myself to be a competent steward of the day-to-day functioning of maybe one, certainly one of the most complex city systems in the world, I can demystify, I can take these labels that are so loaded with fear and I can maybe take a little bit of that caricature out of them. I mean, my, my, my true goal is to deliver for the people of the city. And if in the process of doing so we can demystify so much of the fear that has become the norm in our politics, I welcome it. And I also think that for a long time, we've discussed democratic socialism as an intellectual debate. We haven't been able to point to what examples look like of it delivering for people. And now we have that just over six months. And I think that it's, it's an incredibly exciting opportunity. Because there's a reason so many New Yorkers lost faith in city government and, and the political impulse of lecturing someone as to why they should believe and why they should vote as opposed to asking yourself, why is it that they lost that faith? When you're governing, you have the opportunity to not just listen, but also then respond in action, not in words. And I think that what's been so exciting is to see that New Yorkers understand that some things will take time and some things that can be done immediately. And if you're able to show that you're doing both, then it is exactly the kind of extension of an arm to say, would you like to join this movement? And I've just heard from so many that they would. Ground News is what it's about. They might, you know what? I used to sometimes think that you guys are my best friend, but I think Ground News might be my best friend. I think I want to get a rental at the Jersey Shore with Ground News. Have like a barbecue, but Ground News is a website and an app because this is America in the 2020s. You got to have an app and it helps you better understand the news you consume. With Ground News, you can see who owns every news outlet and you compare how these different outlets frame their stories, like compare news coverage of a story, see how the same events painted across different news outlets and why the headlines differ. You got to understand who owns it. You got to understand the editorial priorities. They got a blind spot feed, helps you find stories that aren't being covered by your side. The Nobel Peace Center called it an excellent way to stay informed and expand your worldview. And the FIFA Peace Center, well, they didn't weigh in yet, but they will. That's also a very big peace center. To get the same unlimited access to the Vantage subscription, go to groundnews.com/stuart and subscribe to get 40% off. I've partnered with Ground News.com/stuart. That's groundnews.com/stuart or scan the QR code on screen. Thank you to Ground News for sponsoring this episode. It's such an interesting thing because when you talk about the demonization, you know, I always think people always say, oh, that's anti-capitalist and in some respects, I think it's the opposite. You know, capitalism, I think would have faced a much stiffer opposition from communism and socialism in the 1930s if the new deal hadn't been instituted. If we hadn't had created a more robust social safety net, revolution would have been much more on the table without social security, without, you know, better housing for people. And I wonder if that's similar today. That in some respects, this. I mean, I think it's similar to what you're doing is actually a reform movement for capitalism to some extent. I mean, there's some of the things that you've said, social security, if you go back and see how that was treated when it was first introduced, right? It was described as the Sovietization of America. Medicare. And now it is thought of as one of the most American things that we could ever be talking about. That's right. And I think about, you know, when you go around New York City and you see these monuments, you know, you see these monuments. to FDR to the New Deal, you know, you go to Four Freedoms Park on Rose ville island it is it is a sad reflection of the state of the democratic party that a lot of what is said in those programs and those visions today would sound as if it is a bridge too ambitious for the party that we belong to right and i think that's that's part of my hope as a democrat is how do we ensure that new yorkers and americans don't have to look to the history books to be able to find a party platform that speaks about a freedom from want and a freedom from fear i think it's a question of also how you're going to get there because i think you know if i may and you tell me if you think this is wrong as i watch you pursuing your agenda it doesn't seem radical it it seems workmanlike you you know when you talked about uh the universal child care you did didn't seize you didn't uh seize the means of child care and create a soviet style uh system where they all get the same little uniform and they all come in at four years old and they you know pray to the uh the gods of of socialism you didn't even really raise tax you went to the governor and she was able to help uh you know fill in a little bit of the financial gap you created a tax for uh you know second homes that of the over five million dollars in value is that correct like yes sir these are not particularly radical reinventions it feels like smart prioritizing if i may well i i think that a lot of it comes back to how do you judge the success of your work and i think you have to judge it by what you deliver and one of the cornerstones of our campaign was universal child care given the fact that in a cost of living crisis child care is the second highest expense for families in new york city but we're talking about twenty thousand dollars a year for a single child and in this city you have to make three hundred and thirty four thousand dollars to be able to afford that kind of expense and to me it is how do we move as quickly as possible is that all over this city does that vary in boroughs or that's that's the average for all five boroughs that's the measure across the five boroughs that that's how much your family would have to earn to be able to absorb that kind of a hit and people earn less than that and they find ways to make it work but not without it being to the detriment of themselves in their financial situation and i think that you know i never thought that i'd be the guy making it easier for aunties at the family function to pressure you into having a kid but but here we are so in some respects zoron mamdani's for for new yorkers to to begin to repopulate this grand experiment and so i can see the attack ads now exactly zoron mamdani the the aphrodisiac so what about what you're trying to deliver has been slightly more complicated than what you thought it would be you know we we can walk through it housing so you were able to get through a rent freeze a two-year rent freeze yes yeah the independent rent guidelines board established a two-year rent freeze for for over two million new yorkers who live in rent stabilized housing right and again not when they when people immediately cried communism it's not unprecedented the two years is unprecedented but this has been done for one year by other mayors yeah they have done it in the past yeah uh what about in terms of housing what's been uh you know what have you been able to deliver what's frustrated you what's the next step well i think i'll just take a step back to the most challenging thing overall was when i came into this position i expected that it would be difficult in terms of the finances of the city especially given my predecessor's approach to those finances what i did not expect was 12 billion dollars worth of difficulty right and and you're you're the fiscal conservative like even with the city council you've got uh uh what is her name menon julie menon speaker julie menon julie men upper east side wealthy upper east side lady we all know the caricature you know they don't pick up after their dogs you know what i'm talking about you're the fiscal conservative in that relationship did that surprise you you know when i've talked about wanting city government to be remade in the image of a struggling new yorker one aspect of it is that we be as careful with our money as working new yorkers are with theirs and one of the many reasons for that is that this is their money and when we're looking at when we looked at that fiscal deficit what was hard one of the many things that was challenging about it is that you couldn't blame it on an external reality you couldn't say oh it's the fiscal crisis of 2008 everyone can see what's going on across the country and the world this was in many ways purely of city halls doing it was mismanagement and under budgeting and it had been building for years and i think that one of my goals is how do we write the ship not just in a 12 month you know interval but frankly on a medium and a long term because if you're just trying to survive on a calendar year basis you're you know in many ways going to have to rob peter to pay paul and that's eventually that bill is going to come due and the thing that i'm looking forward to next year is that we're not going to have to inherit a 12 billion dollar fiscal deficit no matter how tough it is right right although that's what do you do with you know there are certain things that you know they sort of call them gimmicks as you start to um to balance the budget and there are a lot of the mayors have done that there's sort of these things that they pass along to other i think bloomberg was one of the ones who did it you know how does straightening out that without pulling from different pension funds that are going to you know mature in 2032 how do you begin to straighten those finances out without having to use kinds of you know it's in some ways it's like you're the gm of a football team that's got a salary you know you you don't want to go into that second apron for new york city man and so how do you begin to do that in a manner that is more objectively grounded and and not really budgetary uh uh magic well first you know you you brought it up so i just got to say i'm already missing mitch um it's very hurtful it's very hurtful well we'll we'll continue on i did did you see his comment on the boston celtics instagram page what no oh when he went after the celtics fans when he said i own you god bless can i tell you something there is a monster truck sized hole in my heart yes it's one of the best tiktok pages to go to he's the best so so funny i never appreciated those cars until i saw those videos i know seeing him stand i think that was his truck in the parade by the way i don't know if you've seen it i don't know if you've seen it i don't know if you've seen it i don't know if you've seen it i don't know if you've seen it i don't even think that was i think that was actually he just drove he drove there that day and just got in the back of it i think that's how it worked god bless yeah um but but to your to your actual question i think one of the key things is you have to ask yourself is this arbitrary or does this have a rationale okay and what i mean by that is for example with the pension system we had a deferred payment that cost to the city was increasing and then it was going to just fall off a cliff in terms of the city it was going going to go up about maybe six billion dollars a year and then the next year is going to be zero dollars and some of the challenges that we're facing are challenges of this moment specifically because of just how much under budgeting there was how much money the city was spending but not showing on its books for a lot of its different social programs and services and so when we looked at that and we said you know if you just spread what had already been 22 years if you just extend it by a few years you would then be able to take savings that you will get the year after as you're scheduled to but instead spread them over then you can actually make sure that you're able to steward this in a way that's more healthy in a medium term level now i know that there are others who've seen municipalities move around their pension obligations and there's a worry of what does this mean for you know are you going to honor that this that and the other sure the thing that's different in new york city is that we are not only funding our pension systems at a much higher level than many of the other municipalities that are being cited but also that it's not a question of if we're going to get to 100 funded it's just a question of when in the 2030s we would do so and so that's and and then do you have to look at it because i guess there's sort of different areas like we'll spend less here but we need to raise more revenue here is is there a kind of interplay between the kinds of taxes because albany i imagine is not going to go along with really raising taxes in the same way that you might want to well i i think i think what you'll find actually is there are a lot of people in albany who do agree with the vision of raising taxes a little bit more on the wealthiest so that everyone can afford life in new york city right right and you know what what but what it is as you said is it can't just be one thing it has to both be a conversation about revenue and the conversation about savings so we actually created something called chief savings officers for the first time where we had in every single agency and department oh sure cso's cso's come on cso's it's just sitting right there you're at the water cooler you know you're talking to your friend you're like hey have you heard about the cso's What do you think about the CSOs? Hey, you know, the CSOs coming in here. You got like five CSOs over here. Me and my CSOs are hanging out, catching up. Beautiful, beautiful. Yeah. And the CSOs, they found about $1.7 billion in savings across city government. And they're actually going to continue that work. Because when you look at the size of our budget, and you also look at what the approach has been to the finances of our city, we know that there are more savings to be had. And sometimes these are the efficiencies that come from when you're actually pressure testing how we've been doing things. There's savings to be had when you actually say that, you know, could that contract that you're giving to a consultant actually be done in-house? Right. And it can be a lot of times. Were there stuff in the budget as you went through? You're like, $100 million on mittens. What is this? Like, did you find things that you couldn't believe? You were just like, where's these love seats? What's going on? I haven't. I haven't seen that specific example. You don't comb it through like that. It's not. No, but we do comb through. And there were a number of things where you can't provide a justification for it. Right. And if you can't provide one, then why should the city be spending that money? And a lot of times it comes from a vision of government where you want to hollow out its capacity and privatize as much of its responsibility. And oftentimes it's done in the name of fiscal prudence. And yet what you find… And what you find is you end up overpaying for that external capacity than what it would look like if you invested internally. I mean, you know, we've talked about in the past this, you know, the previous administration had an AI chatbot that cost hundreds of thousands of dollars that was not even usable. Was it just like the Microsoft paperclip that just pops up? What can I do for you today? Like, I thought you lost your job. It's just ask Jeeves. He's just back. Right. That's all they do. They just run it through that. And you look at that, and it's not just the amount of money. It's also the number of vendors that we went through to get to that point. It just speaks to an approach to contracting that does not actually save you money. And it doesn't build any kind of long-term fluency. What it does is just lock you into commitments that will cost you money and oftentimes won't even perform those services. I don't know if you know this about me, but my summer wardrobe is, and I've taken to this, it's been for many years now, is I wear only 19th century swimwear. That is, I wear woolen, one-piece, unitard bathing suits like you would see on Coney Island when they first invented the, the, the camera. And, and, and I also have a giant handlebar mustache that I glue on and, and walk around with. And so that, that's where, that's where the company Quince comes in. 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There's going to be the first snowstorm is not going to be the same as the second snowstorm as Fat Joe has in his song. Today's snowstorm is not tomorrow, but that was the first draft of that. That was the first draft of that song. But I, the caricature, so Trump will tweet out communist lunatic. And are there criticisms that bother you? Are there ones you laughed on? You know, the, the city tweeted out during the heat wave, put your thermostats to 78 and, and immediately Ted Cruz from Texas is like social, the warmth of collectivism. Meanwhile, Texas tweets out the same thing. And so does the energy department of the United States of America, which they pull off of their website out of fear that now they will be associated with this. Do any of those criticisms permeate to any of them land? Have you heard any of the criticisms where you thought to yourself, actually, that's constructive and I will think about how to make, uh, adjustments to that. Look, I, I, I took offense when they came for socialist icon, Rudy Giuliani's energy policy. I said, you say what you want about me, but no, you, you know what? Let's nobody puts Rudy in a corner. Let's, let's, let's not go there. Let's not, let's not, but I, but I, but I think, you know, it is easy when there is this much, this much noise to tell yourself that all of it is exactly that tune it all out. But that's also what it will leave you in an echo chamber. You cannot have it that you are only surrounded by people who agree with you. You might as well just stay home at that point. And I think that the job that I have, that my team has, that our administration has is how do you listen to all of it and then separate out what is actually worth engaging with and what is just driven by the, the algorithm and written in response to what the algorithm responds to and rewards. And, and I think that the, the other part of this is no matter how good we may feel about whatever achievement we have or how this, you know, six months has gone, you always have to push yourself because every day is an opportunity to do better for New Yorkers. And I, and I think that's something that I love about this city is you especially see it in, in kind of sports culture, but I would say even in, in the cultural aspect, the political aspect of the city, there is this sense of having to be the best of driving yourself each and every day. And yet in our politics, that often feels as if it's missing there, the there is somehow in a city that is, that is the best in the world. It's so many things. Mediocrity has come to be accepted as the standard in our politics. And I think that that's, it's something that, that we shouldn't accept any longer. And maybe I think, and it was one of the things that I think drew people to you, if I may, is there was a, it didn't just feel like platitudes. There was a specificity to the affordability argument. You know, I see a lot of politicians that they, they perform the rhetoric of that argument. We need to get back to kitchen table issues and all that, rather than going out to a halal food truck and go, why is this $14? There's like three pieces of chicken in here. It's right. Like, why does that cost that way? You know, it is, is affordability the toughest challenge that you think you'll face? I think so. Is this still, could this still be a middle-class city? That, that is what it has to be. And I think if, if we, if we allow it to continue on the path it's been for many years, it will become a museum of where working class people once lived. And we, we don't want this to be something that people can visit to pay tribute to what it once was. We want it to be a living, breathing testament to that energy. And I think what is one of the most concerning things that I hear is when I, when I turn to someone who is working as hard as they can for the city, and I ask them how long their commute home is, and they tell me it's hours because they're going to another state or another city. That's a reflection of a failure to ensure that those who build the city can live in the city. And the reason I think that affordability will be our greatest challenge and also our greatest opportunity is this is what is pushing people out of the city. You, you cannot disentangle, a cost of housing of childcare of groceries from the exodus of working class people from out of the city. Some of these things are New York city specific. Some of them are true across the entire country. And we have to finally change direction so that people can actually afford to live here. See that I think is said, it brings up such an interesting point and you don't get sick. I don't know what they're doing. You protect, get this man some Purell and that you do not get sick, brother. I'm on that. I'm on that emergency every day. I take that, I take that vitamin C. We need you on that wall. You get on that wall. You're shaking too many hands. I see it every day. The, uh, you know, the big, uh, talking point is my God, this communist lunatic is going to drive out our billionaires as though that is the reason that people are drawn to New York, that, that tourists come here and go, let's go down to little billionaire. And, uh, it's the area of New York where the billionaires live and we can enjoy it. can enjoy a small slice of how they live. But the real danger to New York It's not the couple of billionaires who feel as though taxing their second home is too burdensome for that, but the exodus of essential workers who can no longer afford to be anywhere near this area. Wouldn't that be much more devastating? And I think what you're saying speaks to the fact that for all of the conversation about an imagined capital flight, there already is a flight. It's just of working class people. And we know that the racial dynamics of this are also immense. We've seen over the past few decades, our city has lost 200,000 black New Yorkers. From 2010 to 2019, the population of black children and teenagers declined by 19%. And you can feel that in this city, in neighborhoods that are shells of what they once were, and small businesses that don't have those same customers coming through that came in for years. Classrooms that are a little less full. And if we want to be honest about what it's going to take, it's not just going to be one day to the next. It's also going to have to be a complete shift. I mean, I'll give you an example of this. When we talk about housing, since the early 1960s, New York City started to make decisions that would render it unable to build the level of housing it needed to, to keep up with demand. That, to change that. What were those decisions? Are those zoning decisions? A lot of those. Those are zoning decisions. I see. They're decisions around capacity and also around size of buildings, scale of building. And you walk around the city, you'll see buildings that are incredible, that we associate with our city, yet you could not build them today because they were built prior to those zoning changes having happened. Right. And one of the critical things here is we have to treat the cost of living crisis as both a short-term crisis and a long-term crisis. We have to take immediate action, and then we have to do the long-term. And that's the long-term work of being able to build 200,000 new affordable homes over 10 years. Because if you do not have a city that is growing, a city that is building, then what you have is a city that is dying. And it's difficult because here's, now here's your dilemma. You make this place too nice, then rents are really going to, then the whole, then you're, because you are, you're in a vicious cycle in some respects. Look, we joke about it, but there are a lot of people in Brooklyn that are resentful as Brooklyn started to, uh, uh. Change and develop, it gentrified. And suddenly the people that lived in Brooklyn, as my family did when, when, when they came here, couldn't afford to live there anymore. It's as though when they finally came in and made the neighborhoods more livable, that drove out the people that had been living there. And I imagine that's a difficult problem to solve as well. It's this strange trap. And, and I think anyone growing up in this city has gone through the experience of looking at a construction site in their neighborhood. And asking themselves, is this for me, or is this going to push me out? Right. And, and one of the key things here is that we have to both build more housing than we've ever seen in our city in a long time. And do it while strengthening the tenant protections that we have in this city. So that we're not forced to choose between the tenants of today and the tenants of tomorrow. And I think to what you said, there are a lot of New Yorkers who rightfully associate even just investments in their own neighborhood. Right. As if it is. As if it is the appetizer to displacement. Right, right. And we have to show that these things are not in fact tied together. You do not need new residents to invest in that old park. You can do that. And I think, you know, when we go back to this conversation around the fiscal deficit of the $12 billion, there, there is in that moment, it is all too easy to say, my only focus right now is to get out of this fiscal crisis. And then everything else, we'll figure it out next year. We wanted to also use it as an opportunity to show. So that we mean what we say, that you do want to still fund your parks, your libraries, your cultural institutions, and do it in a way that annualizes that funding, as opposed to making it subject to every single year's, you know, budget dance with the city council. And that's also, to me, what is a critical part of earning those New Yorkers trust back is that they see those investments in their neighborhood and they'd see it before anyone's ever going to talk to them that you may have to leave. We want them to stay. And it's. And sometimes it's a small, I tell you, this seems like a ridiculous thing. One of the most important things you did was getting people to take some of that scaffolding down. Like it's things that you do, like it, the scaffolding is so a part of the landscape that I almost thought of it as like, oh, that's how buildings are like they're built. And people just hang scaffolding like Christmas lights and just never take them down. Like, that's just a crazy weird thing. And when you start taking them down, you're like, oh, wow. New York's beautiful. It's we treated it as if it was part of the physical landscape of the city. Right. And I think so much of what the approach has been is it is what it is. This is how it's always been. And that's just not acceptable. And I think to your point, when you are able to change these kinds of ways that New Yorkers measure their quality of life, it gives them. It's an invitation to them to hope and believe. But if you don't change. If you don't change those things, then why should they take that step? Right. And so getting back to the original sort of, you know, that idea of of redefining sort of what democratic socialism can do for a city this complex and and and this size and kind of the realism that has to go along with it and the budgetary, you know, restrictions and things that you have to get there. Do you in any way have that conversation with. So now democratic socialism. Is considered the hottest trend in the Democratic Party. And and there's there's energy, grassroots energy and all. And these democratic socialist candidates are popping up and you're having to answer for every one of their policy positions. And there are some. Look, maybe I'm an old man or a shit lib or whatever they want to call me. But who's calling you this? Anybody. If you if someone says we're going to abolish all prisons and borders like I do go, I don't think that's a good idea. Like it's it feels like. I think order and security is also a progressive value. Why shouldn't people in neighborhoods with less resources have the same safety and security that neighborhoods with lots of resources? So are there tenets of those that are kind of following in the wake of Zoran Mamdani's success that you're not comfortable with or that give you pause? If you have more than one socialist in a room and there isn't disagreement, then you don't have more than one socialist in a room. And are you allowed to have more than one socialist in the room? We're actually just trying to change that law. Right. We're trying to get it to two. It's sort of like how soccer used to be in the NASL in the 80s. There had to be two Americans on every team. So there's got to be there's got to be two socialists in every room. Well, look, man, now we have quarters. And I didn't think that day was going to come with with with with the World Cup. That's what I'm talking about. So you're comfortable with those kinds of discussions. Well, I'm comfortable with disagreement. And I'm comfortable. And I'm comfortable with disagreement. I'm comfortable with disagreement that doesn't end the conversation entirely, because I think what motivates a lot of people is how do you deliver public safety? And the thing that I've said time and again is we cannot have New Yorkers choose between safety and justice. And, yes, I am doing the work with our police department and we have been able to deliver the lowest number of murders and shootings in recorded history. And at the same time, I'm doing the work to close down Rikers Island and ensure that we are actually building the force. And to your point, the Department of Community Safety, which is, you know, one of those things that you had ran on, which I think was sort of reprioritizing some of those assets so that not necessarily it was always police were the first responders to everything. There was also a social. How has that come? I know it. The money for it didn't exist. You had to do an executive order, I believe. What's what's the status of that? How has that grown? So we've we've created that office of community safety. We have for the first time in New York City now a deputy mayor for community safety. Renita Francois, who's doing great work in putting together what is right now a quarter of a billion dollar budget in a lot of the very kinds of things that you're talking about. And I think, you know, one of the clearest examples to me is we have asked police officers to do almost everything we can think of when it comes to dealing with the failures of not just the social safety net, but also violent crime. And also and also and also across the five boroughs. And what we found time and again is that these. These same officers who signed up to join the department to respond to violent crime to prevent violent crime are also being tasked with responding to a mental health call. And this is the kind of work that undermines both our ability to deliver on public safety as a whole. And it shows that we need to develop a new model here. And so one of the focuses coming out of the office of community safety is how do we provide the investment and the support so that when a New Yorker. worker calls for help with a mental health crisis. that they can also receive that help from mental health professionals as well. Right. And that's something that continues alongside the incredible work that the office is doing with gun violence prevention, which is work that we always need to do more and more of because we know it's an epidemic in this city and across this country. And a lot of that prevention work also comes with investing in gun violence interrupters, in the crisis management system. Right. And I've had the privilege of meeting a number of young people who themselves have been victims of gun violence. And they've told me how organizations like the ones that New York City invests in are the ones that will respond to them in the moment and make sure that retaliation isn't something they're thinking about, but rather recuperation is what they're focused on. Right. So there's a wide variety of interdictions that you can do in those various situations, not just after the fact, make those arrests. There's a whole cadre of groups. There's a whole cadre of groups that, you know, look, they stood in opposition to you. There was a great amount of fear and we can run through them from police department. I think there was a lot of fear there. And I know, listen, the cops in this city, they do incredible, incredible work. They do. And they don't necessarily get the recognition and the care. You know, I think there was a lot of hostility to them for a lot of years. And I think that's unfortunate. I think they're, you know, like you say, that's something that you have to battle with. Right. Right. Right. There's Trump supporters, you know, New York city has, has everything. There's the billionaire class. We got it all. What's your outreach like to those communities? What have you learned from those communities? What have you learned from those people? How do you interact with them? And, and, and how do you take in their criticisms of you or their fears? I think the first thing you have to do is walk into those conversations without having already made a judgment. And when, when, when you walk into it with an open mind, then it means that you can actually have a conversation and make a decision as to how you feel after you have that conversation. Right. And I think in a lot of our politics, we, we label people and then disregard them entirely. We treat them as if they're not even people worth engaging with. Right. And look, I'll have conversations with more billionaires that oppose my fiscal policies than those that don't, but there's still more things to actually be discussed about with them. And similarly, you know, what I've also found is to our benefit, the caricature of me and what our administration would mean was so immense that when I walk into a room and I don't immediately strangle three people that are in front of me, people are taken aback that might not actually be as bad. Slightly low bar for a conversation. Now, what about, did you have caricatures of them? Are there, you know, look, I saw when you tried to go to Staten Island, that was a rough ride, but are there caricatures that you've had of those folks that have been shattered when you've spent time with them? I think when we talk about Staten Island, you know, what comes to mind for me is when I went there, I was being protested outside by a number of, of Staten Islanders who were very supportive of the president, deeply opposed to me. And then when I went inside the restaurant, there were other Staten Islanders who were very excited about me coming there. And to me, it also shows me that you can just paint a broad brush and say, you know what? I'm not going. It's actually funny that you mentioned it because right after this, I'm going to Staten Island. I didn't, didn't plan that. Have a Caprese salad for me, my friend. I got you, brother. It's a beautiful thing. But yes, you, you grow up in this city, you have caricatures of so many people. That's right. And you have to leave those at the door. And you also have to be willing to move beyond them. And for some of those conversations to be actually good, faith ones to offer people the ability to critique you to you. And, and I think, you know, sometimes when you're the mayor, you're in a position of power, you want people to just tell you, oh, you're, you're incredible. Here's, here's what I love most about your agenda. It's like, you're not actually going to get anything done if that's how you want to be treated. We do have some leaders in this country who appreciate, who appreciate that work. And, and, and I'm cognizant of your time and I really appreciate you spending here. So, uh, the final question, which I have to ask you because it's, it's dominating the news. Today, uh, you know, and I, the question to you is, uh, the Netanyahu thing and arresting Netanyahu understanding where you're coming from there. Is there a sense you have that maybe, is that a distraction from all these other things that you want to do? Uh, is that taking a little bit more of the media space than you realized? Well, I, I think I have a responsibility to be honest with New Yorkers. And when I'm asked a question to answer it, honestly. So, That was brought up to you. That was brought up to you. Yes. Yes. And yet I know for many New Yorkers, when they see a clip, it doesn't begin with the question. It begins with the answer. Right. And I think, I think the, the, the focus always has to be on the work that you're doing and how you find a balance between, you know, not giving your kind of a classic, you know, a political deflection where you don't want to answer any of those questions and focusing on the work and still finding that together. And are there any other, uh, leaders that you would also like to arrest? Cause I have a list of just. Anybody who the ICC is called for, I think we should be honoring. Very, very good. Uh, Mr. Merritt, thanks so much for joining us and, uh, uh, keep going and we'll check back in, uh, every six to seven, every Knicks championship. You'll come on this show. See you next year. Fantastic. Enjoy Staten Island. Have a great day. Thank you, my friend. Thanks for joining us. Thank you guys. Oh, folks. It's back. It's bomb buzz. You know, I love the bomb buzz. Cause I, let me tell you something about my feet. I'm a delicate flower when it comes to my, uh, my feet, they, my feet have to be ensconced in, uh, luscious fabrics. Uh, your socks, your socks are the building block of your entire outfit. If the socks aren't going, you're not having yourself, uh, a day. And I have had, you know, those socks that, and you wear them a couple of times. And then if you wash them and they turn crinkly, like how does socks get like, is the Alaskan just melt? Is it some sort of, is it material that's biodegradable and it just turns into a nonsense, but the, the bomb is sock and especially the sports sock, man, this, this bad boy, it's cushioned exactly where you want it to be cushioned and it's sucking up your sweat. The point is this. You put your boots back in the car. You put your socks back in the closet and you got Bombas warm weather foot fair ready for the rotation. They got slides and sandals. Uh, they've revolutionized the feet game, foot game, feet, plural, whatever it is for every item you purchase, by the way, an essential clothing item is donated to someone facing housing insecurity. So not only are they saving your feet, they're saving the world. Head over to bombas.com slash weekly and use code weekly for 20% off your first purchase. That's B-O-M-B-A-S.com slash weekly. Code weekly at checkout. Guy's been on the job six, seven months. How is his hair darker now? He's getting younger. He said he's on minoxidil. He did. Is that really true? He did. Wow. Okay. That's some radical transparency. What is that? Something that, what would that work? We can try it. Jesus. Is that what can wait? What have I been doing wrong? Youth, baby. Youth. I've been on smoke and, and carousing. Crazy that that doesn't work. Somebody should, yeah. Somebody's got to publicize that. They really should get into that. Uh, it's so interesting to me. And I would imagine he, somewhat like Obama was, is very effective in diffusing the caricature because when you do talk to him, it's very clear his focus is, uh, very grounded in, in the brass tacks of the logistics of how he's going to do this shit and not necessarily the broad strokes of, we must take over first the means of production and the, like, he's literally like, there's this fund. And so what we do is we defer the annual of the fund to 35 and then we can fund the, like, it's, it's very serious. I mean, weirdly the AC thing for as stupid as it was. It's just a great example of that where he's like, set your ACs to 78 and then they have a full-blown panic, call it socialism, call it communism. And he's like, set your ACs to 78. Just do it. I, I don't know what to tell you. Well, the funny thing was it wasn't even him set, like, it was like an auto, you know, an auto text that goes out during heat waves that had been going out for like a decade. Exactly. Yeah. It's like, you just end up. You end up looking foolish. Like he's just running the city. But they really, they make it seem as though he literally was sitting back there and he goes, we must feel this oppressive heat because the billionaires must understand that the people, the fever of the, yeah. It is a huge threat to them. It's like any thought about collectivism is a threat to their way of life. You know, they're like radical individualists. They think about only themselves, these politicians. And the idea. that you might have to suffer a little bit of warmth so that everybody else can feel a little cool. cooler is a threat. What I don't understand about it is it's already the dynamic we have in this country. Now, in the last 50 years, obviously, capital has been overvalued and labor has been undervalued. And that's kind of through policy. That's how this inequality, I think, has been allowed to grow. You don't tax capital the same way you tax labor. You know, salaries are for suckers, as they say. But it's not as though collectivism is unheard of. They make it sound like we've all been living the fountainhead. Oh, yeah. It's so fucking weird to me. Like Republicans, Social Security is sacrosanct. Medicare is sacrosanct. What do you think those are? That's setting our thermostats to 78 in a heat wave. It's the same fucking thing. And guess what? People really like them. They're very popular. People love 78. 78 is a great temperature. Who loves 78, Julian? 75. If I may say, it's a range. 75 is, you know. Guys, I'm currently set to 62. That is not true. Yeah, I know. Get out of that house right now. We're going to get the Office of Community Safety on you, Brittany. What's about, listen, I know about like, when you guys are out in the city, do you feel any difference in the management of it right now? Do you feel any, like, there have been times that I've been in the city and I have felt like when I first moved there in 86, 87 and all that, like, it did not feel like a safe place. It did not like, and, and, you know, there was a, in, in that burst of when they started busing in a lot of immigrants that the city was not able to absorb at first, you felt the difference there. How are you guys feeling? Yeah. I mean, I feel very safe. I've, I've felt safe. I've lived in the city for 12 years. You know, I've, I've certainly felt safe, you know, for the majority of that time. Um, I think like what the mayor's office. But realistic, everybody who lives in New York city feels safe, but have to be realistic. Yeah. Like take your headphones out at night, you know, like if you're walking around, we all, we all make those choices. Um, but I think what the mayor's office is doing so well is like communicating what they're doing. I don't know how much I would be aware of that has changed in the past six months if it wasn't for such an effective media strategy, which is a huge part of governing effectively. It's like, do your job, do it well and let people know that you are doing your job. Well, I think he's undeniably changed the mood slash attitude, like towards politics overall, which I think is such a huge win. And like, also just reshame people that like politics doesn't have to be just business as usual anymore. And it's okay. Not like he's just like, we've talked about this, but the good vibes he's put back into the city, like the happiness, the joy, it's like, it's not meaningless. It makes you excited to be part of a community and be out there and, and celebrate wins and, and do fun stuff together. He's also let's, let's, I mean, to come in on a Knicks championship and a world cup, that is, that's also timing. There's a certain amount of timing. Like he could have come in on, you know, the 18th Mets, which he is like simultaneously. Yeah. Nobody gives a shit anymore. I don't even, I watch the Mets now. I'm like eight to three. It's fine. It doesn't matter. Nixon five. It's fine. Brittany, what do the people want? Okay. John, yes or no. Did Joe Biden win the 2020 election? At this time, I'm, I'm not going to be drawn into this kind of conversation, and I defer to my previous statements on the matter. It's simple, John. Yes or no. Joe Biden was certified in the 2020 election. Joe Biden slept in the house that is traditionally reserved for the president of the United States when Joe Biden would at three in the morning ask, the chefs who are on call at that same house to make him a grilled cheese sandwich. They would do it. Uh, thus reflecting his, uh, certified position, uh, at, it's so fucking bonkers. If you woke up from a coma in 2022 and said Biden is the president, you would be right. Yes. Uh, if someone were to ask the question on jeopardy, uh, during the years of 2020, 21 to 2024, uh, the president currently certified of the United States of America recognized internationally, the answer would be, uh, who is, uh, Joe Robinette, uh, Biden. Uh, and that is, uh, all your time is up. That's it. Thank you so much. Next, next question. I yield. I yield my time. What the fuck are we doing? Like it's insane. And it's all done to just like, you know, I don't doubt now that with the ideological heart hiring there, he does have some true believers who are, I mean, there was a guy in Homeland Security who was like, you know, sometimes I, uh, transport myself into Chick-fil-A's like, I'm sure there's like lunatics out there, but overwhelmingly it is a, you know, there's a thing in football. Like sometimes you see it, if you're watching the film, like, you know, Derek Henry will be charging down the field with the ball. And he said, giant running back and like very difficult to tackle. And you'll see a cornerback kind of come up and like do a little bit of a shimmy and not really make direct contact. And they always just call it as a cornerback made a business decision. That was a business decision that was made. These people in these hearings are making business decisions. Their fealty to Trump oftentimes is a business decision, or it's a building block in their larger, uh, project of, uh, reclaiming this country for the heritage Americans who they think built it. And that's, and that's all it is. And they know it's nonsense. And the way, you know, they know it's nonsense is all the years they've had to prove it. And they have never once they can fucking do every, they could do any late night, uh, presidential address that they want, but there are places where you can adjudicate, where you can bring your evidence to, uh, a place that has evidentiary standards and you are allowed to do that. And they don't, they can't, they cherry pick, uh, you know, intelligence reports until they can find the thing, not realizing that the rest of the page debunks it completely. They have no ability. They sh they shoot their own arguments in the dick time after time after time. But if they really believed it, and if it was really true, we'd know it because they would have taken it and, and they would have given it credence and credibility by applying actual evidentiary standard to it. And they don't fuck them. All right. And I was going to say feed them beans, but no, no, no beans for them. They don't, they don't deserve beans. No, they don't get them. I don't know why I got mad at that. That was like a weird, you should get mad. We should honestly be pretty mad about that. We're all mad. It's pretty fucked up. I had like a weird, yeah, it's, it's watching that theater is it's such a weird performance to do. Yeah. Like, especially, I mean, I don't know, not to get like too, but like people that are supposed to then take on a position that's independent of the president. Like you think of Kevin Warsh, the new fed chairman, like you're supposed to not care what the president thinks. And you care so much about what the president thinks you're going against every sense of like every bit of common sense in your head to not be able to say that he fucking lost. In 2020. And then we're supposed to have any faith in this. It's like that. No, no, no, no, no. He's actually independent. How? But it is, you know, in a lot of ways, it's like in the middle of a job interview where you're, you know, where national security depends on your competence, where the rule of law depends on your ability to understand it and execute it. And in the middle of it, they go. And one final question, are Keebler elves real? And you have to go, uh, sir, uh, I've seen no evidence that, uh, they are real or unreal. I do know that cookies are delicious. Whether or not they are made in trees is not my purview. And I would like, that's how ridiculous it all is. These are unserious people. It dumb. Yes. Okay. What else? John, do you think Donald Trump will write a presidential memoir? No, I think someone will write a presidential memoir and it will say written by Donald Trump, but it will not be written by Donald Trump. Yeah. Do you think Donald Trump will write his name legibly on a piece of paper? Yeah, no, I don't. I don't. I think Donald Trump will film a presidential movie about his. I think Donald Trump will do a radio serial on. I think there will be a podcast. There will be a building somewhere in Florida that will look like the Legion of Doom. And you know what? If I'm Donald Trump, the truth is if you're Donald Trump, you're hard pressed not to think you are that special boy. Because he really has lived this weird life that lacks accountability where the rest of us really are NPCs. They stormed the Capitol and they beat the shit out of police officers. They sprayed them. They hit them with flagpoles with the Confederate flag flying off them. And in the next election, he won anyway. And he had sex with a porn actress after the birth of his son. And his wife was like, meh, like, how could you not live that life? And, you know, and paid the actor $130,000 and his lawyer went to jail for it. He was fine. It is like at a certain point, it's that M. Night Shyamalan movie with Bruce Willis, like Invincible. Like, it's a train wreck. Hey, but my clothes aren't even ripped. I'm unscathed. Yeah. Like, how do you not come away from that thinking? I guess I am. Oh, God. Invincible. It walks between raindrops. Like, it's, I don't know. I would, if I was him, I'd think pretty highly of myself as well. Yeah, maybe not. Not that highly. It'd be hard to think that highly. No, he's still like, I think he looks, I think when he was on stage with those Spanish football players who had just won the World Cup. And he was standing there, you know, in his, looking like, like a weird door to another dimension. Like, I bet he sat there like, I wonder if they can tell us apart. We're all fit athletes. Look at us over here. Just, just 21, 22, super hot guys in the sun celebrating a big victory. Huh? Cha-cha. And then he, that's cha-cha-cha-cha-cha. Doesn't his physical say he's like 210 or something? It's crazy. Yeah. They showed it once. If you took his stats, like 6'3", 225. And then they showed like, I don't know, DK Metcalf. Who's like. Like known as a complete physical anomaly of a specimen. And like, that dude's 6'3", 225. And Trump's just like, with his head slowly sinking into his shoulders and his front butt slowly consuming his back butt. And you're just like, what, what kind of fairy tale are we fucking living in here? Why? That's the next thing that they should ask in the Senate when they come for their confirmation hearings. What do you think the president weighs? That would be hilarious. Well, there's obviously muscle and visceral fat. And then, of course, there's bone and hair. And the brain, so big. The brain. The weight is most likely the brain that it's taking on. Okay. Last one. All right. Crunchy or smooth? Oh, I mean, I can't even imagine that this question made it past our screeners that made it past the thing. The idea. The idea that you would settle for only one sensation when it comes to a snack, when you can have two sensations and the same flavor. I mean, that's honestly, why would you opt for less fun? Like that? Oh, do you want ice cream with whipped cream? Uh, yeah. Isn't that more? That's better. Like, crunchy is just better. Smooth, I don't even understand the, what the purpose of it is. Except for like caulking, like crunchy. If you're going to have peanut butter and there's an ability to add a crunch to it. Okay. And by the way, layer, I'm not done. Honey, a banana, some jam, like throw a fucking party. If you're going to have it, have it. Do it. And I, by the way, I apologize if either one of you is smooth and I, and I know I've, I've, I've actually pinned you now down to a very untenable position. I just thought you, I thought where you were going with that is to say like, why limit yourself? Like you can have either one, but I see what you were saying now is you can just have one and it's crunchy. No, this isn't, this isn't, uh, you know, uh, a question of choice. Yeah. I don't know how to admit this, but I'm a smooth girl. Brittany, how long have we known each other? Should I leave? Many years. You know, we, and I, you know how highly I think of you. And how much I value the work that you do. Oh no. And that's why this is, it's so hard for me. Brittany, I had no idea. I know. This whole time, Brittany, this whole time. I didn't want to admit it. Uh, very interesting though, Brittany, this is an insight. The more you know. Is it, uh, strange that I have, uh, I guess more emotion in that than when I'm talking about the straight a whore moves. Is that, is that weird? No, fuck smooth. Very nice. Well, uh, uh, how do they keep in touch with us for God's sakes for more of these scintillating takes that I have on, on food? Um, Twitter, we are weekly show pod, Instagram threads, Tik Tok, blue sky. We are a weekly show podcast and you can like subscribe and comment on our YouTube channel. The weekly show with Jon Stewart. Producer Brittany Mamedovic, producer, Jillian Spear, video editor and engineer, Rob Vitola, audio editor and engineer, Nicole Boyce and our executive producers, Christmas Shane and Katie Gray. Couldn't do it without you guys. And thank you very much. And, uh, we'll see everybody next week. The weekly show with Jon Stewart is a comedy central podcast is produced by Paramount audio and bus boy productions. This episode is brought to you by chat GPT. Hey, it's Bill Simmons from the Bill Simmons podcast. Have you guys heard about. Chat GPT work. It's the new way to use chat GPT for bigger multi-step projects. And when you need more than just answers, give chat GPT work access to your apps and files, and it can create real work documents like spreadsheets, slides, and structured reports. Get started at chatgpt.com by selecting work mode available on plus and pro plans.