Simplifying ABA Billing: Essential Tips for New Providers with Maria Capiris

(upbeat music) - All right, hello, hello, hello everyone. Welcome back to yet another episode of Safe Space, the ABA podcast. I have been and I am your host, Michelle Zeman. And today I'm actually really excited about this episode. And one of the reasons why I'm excited is because, you know, this is something that as a provider, I find myself very confused on. I find myself wondering how am I doing this? And, you know, I'm like constantly asking questions about this. And that thing is billing. And the person that I have with me, the guests I have with me, I'm super excited for you guys to listen to. She created this new provider toolkit, which as a disabled person, I am somebody who very much believes in access to care and also plain language. And the way that Maria wrote this new provider toolkit is absolutely so easy for me to read. So I cannot help but be super excited to be, be alongside Maria Capira today. Welcome to the podcast. - Thank you so much for having me. I am so excited to be here. I'm so excited to have you here because I know that as a provider myself, I find myself going, what am I doing? Am I doing this right? You know, like what is happening here? And so I am so excited to get into tonight's episode because, you know, you created this new provider toolkit. I cannot recommend it enough guys. I mean, let me tell you, I read through it and it's so easy to read. Ugh, I just, I bow to you for that. - Oh, that's huge. - That's huge. - Thank you so much. Yeah, that was something that was really important to me was to make it easily digestible because a lot of it is very confusing. So, yes. It really, it really, really is. And so I really appreciate that. What inspired you to create it? So I noticed that there's not really a lot of resources available to assist providers with billing. I have come across some resources and they are kind of expensive. So especially for someone just starting out, you know, starting at the business, you already have so many startup costs associated with it and spending hundreds and thousands of dollars on a resource isn't always possible. So I really just wanted to create something that was affordable and easily digestible for people because I don't really see a lot of resources out there. I really appreciate that, especially just looking through it. You know, you had these topics that you selected and they were very easily digestible. You know, I'm someone who has a very hard time with reading comprehension. And so for me, just listening to you talk to me during our pre-reporting and then also reading through the digest, reading through the handbook was just completely game changing for me. So how did you determine what topics to include? So throughout my experience doing billing, I've gotten a lot of these questions along the way actually. So I kind of had a baseline of what I wanted to include just off of previous experience. And then I also have worked really closely with the BCBA. I'm just gonna give her a little shout out, Christina from ABA Made Easy. She's amazing and she helped me a lot with this. And like, you know, making it digestible because as a bill or sometimes I just know these things and trying to explain them to somebody who doesn't know them can be kind of tough. So my first draft of this e-book was a total nightmare disaster because only I could understand it. So I kind of really had to break it down a lot to make it as easily digestible as it is. And I also wanted to get input from other BCBAs, what kind of topics that they would be interested to hear about in the toolkit, most of which a lot of the feedback that I got was already stuff that I had in there because I've gotten the questions so much throughout my experience. But there were some things that I didn't even think about that I added kind of at the end and I think it really just came together. Wonderful. Yes, I agree. And also I love that Christina from ABA made easy helped out. She's actually on another episode of Safe Space the ABA podcast if you go back in time. There's an episode about talking to all of us. She's amazing. She's amazing. I mean, he's definitely is. And, you know, I really appreciate that you got so much input from other providers. You know, I know personally like when I look at billing stuff and when I see things about billing, the first word that pops in my head is, huh? Yeah. (laughing) You know, so it's like, you know, it's really tough for me as a provider because I'm so focused on the clinical side that I don't even think too too much about the billing side other than I build this code under these circumstances. And I don't build under those circumstances, you know what I mean? Yeah, 100%. Yeah. So you mentioned your first draft was a nightmare. I'm kind of curious. I'm going to go like some of the challenges that you encountered when you first created the toolkit. Okay, so I started it as a PowerPoint which I think was my first mistake. I don't know what I was thinking. (laughing) And my PowerPoint like the one slide would just have like thousands of words on it. And I'm like thinking in my head, when we were taught how to write PowerPoints, you're supposed to have as little bullets as possible and as little words as possible. And I was like, this does not fit what a PowerPoint is supposed to be at all. There's just too much information. And I think one of the biggest challenges was kind of what I was saying before is like, being able to almost like translate it from an expert biller who has been doing this for years, who knows all the terms, who knows kind of how to work with the insurance companies. I know the back end process, like the back of my hand and kind of like translating it to someone who might not even know where to start. So that was definitely one of the biggest challenges. And then I also think just having the billing experience, I don't have clinical experience. I'm not there with you guys while you're doing your services. So I don't necessarily know what your job looks like, like what you do as a BCBA. I just know how to bill your services. So figuring out kind of what you needed and what would be the most beneficial stuff to put in there because I don't know your side as well as I know my side. - Exactly, exactly. And it really does help kind of like getting that voice in, especially because we find ourselves being like, wait a minute, like what are we supposed to do? How are we supposed to do this? Like help me. And so it's so nice, it's so nice to get that. - Yeah. - No. Yeah. So kind of as I was stating to, you know, billing for ABA services can be pretty complex because of different modifiers and different circumstances. What would you say are the most crucial points for new providers to understand when they first start handling billing? - I think making sure your credentialing is complete that you know what's in your contracts. I think that's super important. And figuring out a way to keep track of authorizations early on is really important because a lot of denials that I come across have something to do with an authorization issue. So I think really getting a handle on your credentialing and your authorizations is super important. And then also finding a software that is good for you. Everybody needs something different. So really finding that software that fits your practice, fits your needs and, you know, just having a platform where you can keep track of things and, you know, do your scheduling and kind of having a one spot for everything is very important, I think, when you're just starting out. Any specific recommendations for how someone might like track those types of things and also any like any recommendations for platforms. - Yeah, so I think Motivity is great for data collection. And I have actually met some people who work for Motivity and they are some of the coolest people I've ever met. So it's run by amazing people. So I will scream praise about Motivity from the rooftops. Although therapy PN is a great practice manager. management system. So I think that's a really good one to look into. And ABA Engine is great for onboarding. And yeah, I've seen a lot of really cool stuff that you could do in ABA Engine. So I really think the most important thing is getting a list of software that you want to try and demoing them and meeting the people who run the software and making sure that it takes off all the boxes because it's something that you're going to be using long-term. And you want to make sure that it fits what you need so that you're not changing software's all the time. Absolutely, absolutely. I can definitely understand that because I know just kind of like seeing things from my side, you know, we run into issues with certain softwares and certain data platforms and just there's so much going on that it's like how can we have a good system for our clients, you know, for both billing and for data collection and for onboarding clients and, you know, for everything in between. Oh, yeah. And there's so many out there. I think something to keep in mind is to make there's so many Facebook groups out there, maybe ask like, what are the softwares that you've worked with and what has worked well for you and listen when people tell you their experiences because just because it's the cheapest or it might be the prettiest looking software or the most user-friendly to you doesn't necessarily mean it's great. So kind of like do research before you just pick a software. Yeah, I can agree with that, you know, right? Definitely as someone who's experienced multiple data collection platforms, I have my own set of opinions on what I like and what I don't like and some of the ones that I like, you know, happen to be a little bit more on the expensive side, but they do a lot more. Yeah. Your cheaper softwares. Yeah. 100%. And you'll probably end up saving money in the long run because, you know, if you decide to outsource your billing through a cheaper platform and they make mistakes along the way, it could end up costing a ton of money versus investing your money in a reputable billing company or, you know, something like that. So yeah, that's really, that's really important and that's really good advice. I really appreciate that. Thank you. You're welcome. You know, so one of the things that we also talked a little bit about, you know, and you actually mentioned this in your last comment was credentialing. So credentialing is a really big focus in the toolkit. And I know too that the process is very different across different insurance carriers, you know, thinking of some just off the top of my head that I've worked with like, Anthem Health Keepers Plus versus Kaiser Permanente. Why is this process so different amongst different insurance carriers? Like what are the expectations? You know, I, I wish that they had just a universal way that they did everything across all of the insurances, but it really does vary depending on what state you're in, what the carrier is. So you could be in Texas, for example, and the process to get credentialed with three carriers out there can be completely different for each one as you go. So and something really important to keep in mind is some, uh, insurances have a specific ABA credentialing application that you have to fill out where other ones want you to fill out your application under the behavioral health. So I think the most important step when you're doing your credentialing is calling and even calling like two or three times to make sure you get the same information multiple times and figuring out which application you're supposed to be filling out is the most important step because like I said, some have specific autism services, applications and then others are just under the, the broad behavioral health. So I think that's why you can get so confusing is because everywhere is different, but once you get into it and you start doing the research and you reach out to the carrier and you talk to them and you figure out the process, it is not as scary as it looks. So yeah. Yeah, you know, just the idea of credentialing can be kind of a lengthy process in of itself, you know, just thinking about like what the steps you have to take, you know, so I can definitely understand like how each state and even each insurance carrier within each state has its own different processes and also two timelines. That's one thing I've noticed. Yes, I've seen timelines that had crazy fast processing and then I've seen other ones that it could take almost a year. So it really varies everything is and I don't mean to scare anybody. Trust me, like I promise once you actually sit down and start doing it, it's really not as bad as itself and it's really not as confusing and daunting as it might seem, but yeah, they're all different. So you really, it's hard because I can't make a handbook on credentialing because they're all different. Yeah, it's only, it's only right. Right. Right. Oh my goodness. Well, kind of on the lines of going back to like modifiers and ABA, you know, you mentioned that when we talked previously, common ABA modifiers can have a certain impact on billing accuracy. Tell us a little bit more about what that means and how they can influence reimbursement rates because they have different variations I would imagine. Yeah, so your modifiers in most cases are used to determine the education level of the person who provided the services. So for example, a modifier that represents services being done by someone with their bachelor's degree is going to be reimbursed at a lower rate than somebody who has their doctorate or their PhD. So a lot of the ones for ABA just signify who provided the services and they do have different reimbursement rates. Now, not all insurances require the modifiers. So the way you would find out if you have to bill your modifiers, it's going to be in your contract. Usually at the end of your contract, there is a sheet that has all the rates and the codes associated with it. So if your contract has the modifiers on your rate sheet, you definitely have to bill them. Some of them will automatically, if you don't put a modifier, assume that it was a BCBA who, and this is something I've run into actually in my experience, is some payers will see no modifier and equate that to it was a BCBA. So they'll pay at a higher rate and then you realize down the road, you were supposed to be billing the modifier for a person with a bachelor's degree and you have to submit correct claims and then the insurance recoups somebody. So it's really important to pay attention to your rate sheet in your contract and when you get your contract, if you can't find the rate sheet, I think it's very important to reach out to the person who sent you the contract and say, "Hey, I don't see my rate sheet in here. Can you please send me the rates and the codes that I'm supposed to bill?" So that you can have it in writing exactly what you're supposed to bill and how much you're going to be reimburse because it does affect your reimbursement rates depending on what modifier you use. That's so interesting too. And I've seen it on notes that I've done and different, not only different notes that I've done, but also just notes from other people. And I'm curious to know, just across each insurance, are the modifiers the same or are they different depending on the insurance and depending on the state heavy found? I would say the only ones that are different are typically Medicaid. Medicaid sometimes has different modifiers that usually start with a U or something. So Medicaid can vary by state as far as commercial carriers like your BCBS, your SIGNA, like Etna. Most of the time they're the H and H and H O. And I break down all of those in the toolkit as well and explain which each one means. So yeah, across your commercial carriers, they're mostly the same. It's really Medicaid that sometimes has those very modifiers. Interesting. That's good to know though. Definitely something to take a look at when you're doing your notes next time or even like anytime that you're just reviewing some of those things in general, it's really, really good to kind of see. You mentioned Claimer Cooping and one of the things that can ultimately turn into this is Claim Denials. And I know that they are a very common frustration. So what strategies or tools C recommends a help providers effectively track and manage denials and appeals. deals. So I think that one, you have to have somebody who really knows how to read an EOB on your team because sometimes the EOB will have denials that are just completely in error. I think that's something that is very typical for ABA providers. Unfortunately, it is very common for there to be denials in error. And sometimes they'll say that there's no authorization, even though there is an authorization, you have to call and have it reprocessed. And just because the EOB says something does not mean it's true. So you have to have somebody who knows how to read it, knows how to see if something looks wrong and will jump on that for you, you know, so that it's not just sitting there. And I think something very important with keeping track of all your denials is keeping a spreadsheet of all the phone calls that you're making and updating it as you go. So I actually have a stand store where I have my toolkit and I also have a template for the call log that I actually use in my day to day life. And I kind of, I put it there so that any provider can just download it and see how I set up my spreadsheets and follow along because having a spreadsheet where you can keep track of everything is so important, so important. And just so just for our listeners, what does EOB stand for and what exactly does that mean to you? Okay, so an EOB is the explanation of benefits and it's when the insurance company makes a payment on claims. The EOBs have a breakdown of the payments that were made for every date of service, every code. So there's often the denial codes will be listed and you have to go to the back of the EOB and figure out why it denied. So it really has all the information that you need on it. But like I said, a lot of claims denied errors. So you have to be on top of it within a week of posting EOBs you can find from just a week of claims like 10 plus random claims that just denied randomly for no reason. And so you just have to like really be on top of it and make sure you have somebody who's reading the EOBs correctly and who knows how to do the follow up or you know, have your own kind of system in place for doing it yourself. I know a lot of providers like to do their own billion, their own follow up so that they're kind of in the loop throughout the entire process. So I think just keeping yourself organized, you know, tracking all of your reference numbers, the dates that you've called tracking numbers for appeals, especially if you have to mail out an appeal, get a tracking number and put it in your spreadsheet because when 45 days comes by and they still haven't paid, you can say, hey, here's the tracking number. I know you guys got it. Like what's going on. So I'm kind of curious to know too, like from your experience, what would you say are like your top two or three reasons why ABA claim denials happen and what can providers like us do to proactively prevent them from occurring? Okay, so the two most common denials that I see are no authorization or exceeding authorization units for codes. So for that one, most of the time when a claim denies for no authorization, it's wrong and the claim just needs to be reprocess. But a lot of the times when claims deny for overbilling units, like say you've been approved for like 1500 units of 917153 and you bill over that 1500, everything after the 1500 is going to deny. The only way that you can really fix that is if they will add units to your off and you have to catch that like super fast because they don't like to backdate a lot of stuff. Some insurance companies won't backdate anything. So I think to avoid that denial, keeping track of your authorization units, how much are approved and how many are being used on a weekly basis and their BPM actually helps you keep track of that. Just going to say that. So that's going nice. Yeah. And for our listeners that are not BCBAs but are you know technicians, 917153 is actually the code that you know you bill when you're providing direct ABA services. So definitely something to think about too. Yes. So 100% and also the second biggest thing that I see is that there's been a change in insurance and the provider doesn't know about it because the client didn't let them know. So my solution for that is so when you first onboard a client you always do a verification of benefits to make sure that ABA is covered and figure out what their copay is and all of that. I recommend doing verification of benefits frequently. Like at least during the calendar year of whenever their policy starts and ends at the end of that that policy. Doing another verification of benefits to make sure that their policy is either extending for another year or if it's changed. So especially now because the year is about to start, the new year is about to start and a lot of policies reset. I think it is so important to make sure that you're verifying your client's benefits to make sure that their insurance hasn't changed. I love that so much. I mean honestly you know that's that's really important because that is a common thing that happens. You know I know that I've seen some clients that either their insurance will drop off because something happened. Don't know exactly what. But then they might end up changing over due to some other circumstance. You know sometimes these things happen and unfortunately some of that does lead to you know just services being placed on hold as a result. And I feel like you know I feel like it goes without saying communication is so important when it comes to any changes like that. 100%. And I think sometimes like maybe the parents don't even realize like for example I've seen where a parent forgot to pay their premium one month and immediately the insurance policy just terminated. So like something as small as that can like trickle into you know a provider not finding out for months and their policies terminated for months and no one knows. So I definitely think communication and just you know verifying benefits every once in a while will help. Like obviously it could still happen. But it kind of helps be a little bit proactive just in case. Definitely definitely. Something that I want to mention is that we have our first code word that we're going to to drop for those free CEUs and that code word is something we have been talking about all episode and that would be the word billing. That is B-I-L-L-I-N-G. It is billing. So one of the things actually I'm glad that you mentioned changes in insurance too because one of the other things that you talked about when we first met was the importance of billing primary and secondary insurance is in the correct order. Why is this? What exactly does that do for us? So if there are two policies in place and you build a secondary first the claims are most likely going to deny and if they pay and I actually have a whole page about this in my e-book because this is so important. I actually heard somebody reach out to me and asked me for my opinion on this and she was telling me that she had a colleague who Medicaid was the secondary and the primary didn't cover APA so they would just billing directly to the secondary and the secondary was paying all the claims and the secondary would never pay all of the claims if they weren't supposed to and that is wrong. If there is a primary even if they don't cover APA you either need a denial letter from that insurance that tells the secondary that APA is not covered it will never be covered or you need to build a primary first get the denial and then build a secondary. If you do it in the wrong order and the secondary is paying for whatever reason they have like all of these internal audit teams so you know they've got thousands of providers that they have contracts with they could take their internal auditing team years to figure out they've been paying these claims incorrectly and they will find out that they're paying these claims incorrectly and they will come back and it could be two years down the line and recoup all of the money for all of the claims that they paid incorrectly and at that point you're passed your timely filing for your primary so you're most likely just going to have to pay all that money back and eat it unfortunately. So it's so important to make sure that you know who your primary is and who the secondary is and that you bill it in the correct order because if you're If you're interested in this, please subscribe to our channel. If you're billing it to the secondary first and you know that they have a primary and the secondary is paying that is also considered fraud because you're skipping over your primary. So it could be a really sticky situation. So it's very important to know who's primary, who's secondary and billing in the correct order. Yeah, out you know, and that effort, the fraud word is like when you see that word, the alarms are ringing. Yeah, 100%. And it's not worth losing your contracts with the insurance and having to pay back all this money because you don't want to wait for the primary to process. When you have a secondary policy that picks up either patient responsibility or fully pays the claims, it always takes longer. Like you just know that if you have a client with a secondary, their payments are probably going to come to you way later than the other clients. But it's not worth losing your contracts with the insurance and a potential lawsuit and you know, just everything that can happen, billing it incorrectly to just get the payment quicker, if that makes sense. And plus that lawsuit too, I mean, that could just result more money coming out of your pocket and it's like, is it really worth it? Yeah, no, I don't think so. So, and you know, that could just be total like unintentional, just ignorance like that provider might not even really know anything about, you know, the process and that's fair. But, you know, it could turn out to be something really ugly. So it is something that it's important to like educate either yourself or have somebody who really understands how to do billing so that you don't run into stuff like that. Yeah, absolutely, absolutely. You know, and I've seen it before where we've had clients that have, you know, two insurancees, one primary, one secondary and I'd even seen it too where the primary insurance would not cover ADA. But the secondary will cover it just fine. Yeah. So in that case, you know, so you're saying correct me if I'm wrong here. So you would like, let's say for some reason you have client aid, they have, I don't know, a commercial insurance and they say no, ADA is not covered, but trying to go for the secondary, you would have to submit to the primary commercial first, get the denial. And then from there, go to the secondary. Am I correct them? Yeah. Yeah, a lot of secondaries want to see like, like I have to upload the EOB sometimes where the claim denied. They want to know that date, it was denied, how much was denied, why it was denied. So like, you need all of that information for them to process and pay the claims. Unless you can get, I believe it's called an administrative denial letter where the letter will just state like the client does not have ABA benefits and it will not ever be covered by us until this date. And you know, like just having that letter, you can sometimes upload that in place of the EOB, but that also depends on what the guidelines are for that secondary carrier. Like maybe like if it's a Medicaid or if it's another commercial carrier, maybe they don't allow that denial letter. So it's something that you have to kind of figure out if that's an option or if you just need the denial from the primary. Okay. That's really good to know because I know personally like while I'm not necessarily involved with like the billing side of it, I have seen that before. And I'm also seeing it where like with I remember like a few companies ago, I remember that we had one BCBA who had to write two completely separate treatment plans, but with the breakdown of codes looking very different because the primary had a specific set of codes of a secondary had a different set of codes. This was back like five or six years ago too. So you know, just keeping that in mind because I know that we were kind of going through this like change with the CDT crosswalk. So that's also something where we were like having to figure out, okay, what codes are we billing? And what codes can we get in the password? What codes can we not request for? Yeah. Yeah. If a client has an insurance where way back the primary use the T codes and then the secondary use the H codes, you would have to like recode the billing. So you have to submit it to the primary in the T codes and then recode it to the equivalent H code. And then you had to get your off in the H codes. It was just a nightmare. So I'm glad that they at least came up with a new set of codes that a lot of carriers are haven't opted. So you don't have to deal with that. Yeah. That's at least to come more universal from what I've seen. So at least there is that. At least there is that. You know, I wonder if there's that. Oh, absolutely, absolutely. Now something else that you mentioned to me when we first talked in our first like meeting was about the benefits of outsourcing billing. So for any providers that are considering this option, what should they look for in a billing company and what are some red flags that they should look at as well? Okay. So I think the biggest benefit of outsourcing your billing is you as a BCBA, you got into this field to have an impact on your clients. And you know and understand the science of behavior and, you know, I couldn't even begin to understand what you guys do on a daily basis. So you know, you're in the field for that. You're not in the field to be billing and calling the insurance company and verifying benefits and doing all of this stuff that literally is a full time job, like another full time job. So that's why I think it is, it's a great idea to outsource your billing because you're outsourcing your billing to somebody who understands what they're doing and, well, I guess that kind of goes into the next part. Make sure when you outsource your billing, it's your outsourcing to somebody who knows what they're doing and who has that expertise in the ABA billing. I will say a lot of the more like forbrit billing companies advertise themselves as ABA billing experts and from what I've seen in my experience, I don't know how true that is because they have the high turnover rates with like, you know, new billers coming in all the time and, you know, they've got all of these providers that they're working with and I don't think they have that expertise. So I think, you know, outsourcing to someone who really knows what they're doing has a passion for what they're doing and who cares about what they're doing is super important. I think some green flags are just, you know, someone you can connect with. This is someone that you're going to be talking to at least on a weekly basis. I talk to my providers way more than just once a week. So, you know, this is someone that you're going to be communicating with a lot and, you know, you want to have that connection with them, that trust because they are, you know, taking on a huge part of your business, you know, they're dealing with how you get your money. So you want to make sure you trust them. And, you know, I think reports are so important so that, you know, as a BCBA or like a business owner, you know, like what is being built out every week and what's coming in as far as payments go. Like, you know, at least monthly getting a report that shows you what's still outstanding. Like some providers want nothing to do with anything. They just want to know that their claims are getting paid and that's it. And then other providers want to know like, hey, I see this denial of what's going on here. So just having someone who can accommodate how you work, what you need and takes the time to listen is super important. And I think red flags would be someone who doesn't have great communication, someone that you don't connect with. And I would also say like just because again, it's like a corporate company doesn't necessarily mean they're the best. Just because it's the cheapest option doesn't make it the best option. And also if you are currently using a bill or who never sends you reports and you never know what's being built out every week, that's a red flag to me. I make sure that every week as soon as I submit my claims, my providers get a report. They know exactly what's been built out. I have like a very detailed report. I said that has the client's name, data service, CPT codes, units, everything you can see every single thing that I have submitted. So you know that, you know, I did it correctly or not. But just knowing where your AR is, your account's receivable, how much you have outstanding is so important. So yeah, I guess just find someone that you connect with. That's the most important. Absolutely. You know, and you would think like, because like you're talking about your green flags and your red flags and like that's like a pretty common thing to look at in general, you know, when you're hiring anybody, whether you're a polar, a BCBA, a technician, you know, whoever, you know. That's That's so important. And you have your own company too. Yes, you have your own company that you do this. So tell us a little bit about your company and how you help your providers with their billing and credentialing. Okay, so I actually just recently started my company at back in August. I was working for another small billing company and I kind of just had this vision of where I wanted to go and what I wanted to do. And it didn't really align. So I kind of branched off and I'm doing my own thing now. And I offer billing services where it's like full practice management billing services. So I submit your claims on a weekly basis. I do all of them follow up on any denials. I help with client statements. Like I also keep track of whatever patients owe. And I also have like credentialing assistance where I don't do the credentialing for you because I'm kind of trying to teach people how to do their own credentialing because I've noticed there are companies out there that will charge you thousands of dollars to do something that can be done in like 15 minutes. If you really sit down and just do the applications, you can do it really quickly. So I'm kind of more trying to teach people how to do their own credentialing. So how that would work is, you know, you just let me know what carriers you want to get credentialed with. And I do all the research. I figure out what applications you need to submit, what needs to be done. And I send you all of the details how to do it. So yeah, I'm really trying to get people to learn how to do credentialing because it's one of the scariest parts and it's actually super easy. So I do that. I also, I'm kind of like a one-stop shop. I also do like virtual assistance services. So if you need someone to help you with like your authorizations or like some random admin tasks that you need help with every week, I can help with that. And yeah. (laughs) That's awesome. That is so awesome. Well, let me tell you, you know, as someone who is more on like the clinical side of things, you know, I sort of, I don't get the insight that you get. And so it's really nice just kind of hearing what you are saying and how you've been able to do these, how you've been able to help so many providers. I mean, that's really just so, so huge. So I appreciate what you do because I don't think I could ever do that quite frankly. (laughs) Thank you. Of course, of course. I'm gonna go ahead and drop that second code word. So that way you can get your free CEU's and it is coconuts. It is. Sorry. You did not need to apologize. I love the random words. That word is coconuts. And that is CO, CO and UTS. That is coconuts. So last couple of questions I have, since you created this really great toolkit, have you received any feedback or insights from providers that may shape future additions? Yes. So I actually took your feedback very personally. I it meant so much to me. And I will make sure that any future additions, I write it exactly the same. Because I actually am working on a part two and it's gonna go into much more complex things, like rate negotiations and scary stuff like that. So I really wanna break it down as much as I possibly can. And then I've also gotten the feedback from providers who might be a little further along in their journey. So they're not necessarily at the new provider point in their journey and they want more details and more the more complex topics. So that's probably gonna be in a part two. So stay tuned for that. I love that. I love that. And Sarah listeners who don't know exactly what feedback I gave to Maria. So she actually set me a copy of the new provider toolkit. And as someone with a disability, as someone who has a very hard time with just comprehending things in general, for me what I really enjoyed about this toolkit was that it was very, very easy for me to read. That plain language makes it accessible for providers who don't have the capacity to read all those very complicated words and very complicated sentences. So for me, I really appreciated it. And I appreciated the breakdown of each step too. 'Cause sometimes you're reading something and all you can think is, is this Chinese? I've literally read that. And it's like, I can't understand what you're saying. I can't understand what you're writing. I need to know so that way I can go into this. And if I need to do this, then I can do, like I have this plain language thing. And for me, and for any disabled provider out there, and I'm gonna speak on that level because a lot of disabled people have a hard time with comprehending something that has been written or something that's been said to really just, the fact that this resource is out there and it is in plain language is just so crucial and so important. So that was the feedback that I gave. Just so our listeners can know a little bit more. - Yeah, and I truly appreciate that because, like your feedback and feedback from other BCBAs, it's just been great. I'm so happy that I was able to create something and that is easily accessible and easily digestible. That's what I wanna do. So yeah, I'm just very grateful that it had an impact on you. (laughs) - Thank you. Thank you again. I mean, you know, it just goes to show you, like I can tell you really love what you do, but you also know how to explain what you do without using that technical jargon. You know, that's something within our code of ethics, by the way, is use of technical language. We really don't wanna use technical language. We actually want to break it down as much as possible. And so for me, reading your handbook was like, this is so easy, I can read this and this is actually expensive to me. Like what? (laughs) - It's almost so great. - It's so amazing. I'm so happy to hear that. (laughs) - Of course, of course, I will gladly send the praises all day. - Thank you. (laughs) - Of course. One other question I have is, if you have any plans to just create more resources or expand your toolkit with additional topics with an ABA billing, I'm so curious to know that for myself, selfishly, but also for other people. (laughs) - Yes, so I'm definitely gonna put out a part too that kind of goes into more complex stuff. And I do really take feedback very personally. So if anybody happens to read it and wants to send me some feedback, like topics that you wish were in there or would love to read about next, like I would happily take on the recommendations and see what I can do. I really do want to post as many resources as I can. That's kind of why I made my call log template customizable so that you can just download it and use it. And I think I'm gonna try to come up with other templates that might be helpful. And I also kind of want to do a credentialing series, I guess I could call it, where I would go in and show you how to do the research to figure out what needs to be done for each carrier. And it's probably gonna be a really long series because there's so many different carriers. But I really do want to do something like that so that that resource is available. Because like I said, it's something that is so scary to so many people. And people who charge thousands of dollars for it make it seem like it's this crazy thing. And it's actually a lot faster for you to do your own credentialing because there's questions on there that I don't know the answers to. I don't know what your clinic looks like. I don't know if you have certain ramp for a wheelchair or if your entire building is accessible to everybody. Like I don't know that because I'm not there. Or when you last completed your cultural competency course, like I have no idea. So it's so much easier and faster for you to just fill out the information yourself. And it could take me weeks to submit your application because we're going back and forth in email. And I'm trying to get all this information that you already know. So I kind of just want to make resources so that people are more confident with doing it themselves. - Yeah, absolutely, absolutely. My final question is pretty much what advice would you give someone who is just diving into billing and credentialing? What would you say was like your biggest takeaway and what could you say that will help our audience take away from this? - Wow, that's a big one. - I think doing your research is super important. Trying to understand things as best as you can. and you know, put it in your pocket. Getting in affects things that will make your journey a lot easier. So if you have to outsource your billing because you can't get a grip on it or different softwares that you might need, like getting all of that stuff figured out in the beginning is super important, that way you can kind of start off on the right foot. But obviously if you're already in your journey and you're having these struggles, I think just doing the research, asking for help, I think asking for help is so important. There are a lot of resources out there where you can, like I've seen so many Facebook groups where you can connect with other providers who might be experiencing the same thing and just posting a question even if you just do it anonymously and just see if somebody else has experienced something similar, which actually reminds me I'm trying to start a Facebook group where BCBAs can join and ask each other those kinds of questions. So it's called BCBA Billing Collaboration on Facebook and I kind of want to make that community where everyone feels comfortable just asking questions and helping each other answer the questions because I think asking for help is super important. Don't ever be afraid to ask for help because some of these things when it comes to ABA Billing, they can snowball very fast, like one second, everything's fine and then all of a sudden within weeks you can just have a ton of denials and it can feel suffocating. So you know, find those resources, ask for help and do you search? Absolutely and I'm going to make sure that I request to be in that group. So exactly what we've got to work out for a request from me because I will definitely, I will definitely join that group. Oh my goodness, thank you so much Maria. I really appreciate your wealth of knowledge, your time, your commitment to doing this provider toolkit. I mean, this is really just such a great game changer and I really appreciate what you're doing for, you know, providers, not just a provider like me who's brand new to credentialing and billing, but really to everybody. So I really appreciate what you're doing and where can people find you and contact you? Okay, so I have Instagram page, it's called PPP Billing and on there I try and post a lot of like tips and tricks as well, like just like random little tips here and there. So that's a great place to find me and we do have a website, it's called Peace by Peace Billing Solutions.com and feel free to email me. My email is Maria at PPP Billing. If you have any questions, if you're going through a disaster right now with your billing and you need help, I also do AR assistance where I will go in, figure out everything's outstanding for you and do my best to get as much paid as possible. So yeah, just find me and reach out and I would love to connect with as many people as possible and do. Thank you so much again. Thank you to Maria for joining and of course thank you to everybody who tuned in and listened today. I've been your host Michelle Zeman and I will see you on the next one. Bye everyone. (gentle music)