Shanna Moakler: Her Side of the Story

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Hi, babies. welcome to another episode of dumb blonde today we have a true icon one who has lived a full life and not just because of her exes but because of hard work tenacity and her sheer will to shine miss shana mochler hello what's she doing that's a nice introduction i mean listen girl i fucking i i've always loved you but i really had to kind of study you for the podcast you know and you're so you're resilient as fuck thank you and you've been through some shit yes i have a lot a lot and i can't wait to touch base on it and i feel like the media villainized kind though aren't they sweet they're so they're so kind to me i've never had to deal with it on your level i'm just now getting into it sure and just the outright lies yeah i don't know how you you have are like a pop a pop culture icon thank you literally like everybody knows who you are and if they don't they fucking i don't even live under a rock like for sure thank you i'll be more yeah i got you baby i got you but i just love that no matter what life has thrown at you you've always made it a positive you've always got back up on your feet and you've always just been like you hit like a bitch and i'm just gonna keep doing me yeah yeah and you're outspoken east coast i love that so yeah let's talk about it so you grew up in rhode island yeah i was born and raised in rhode island i was born in providence raised in a small town called barrington and i was born and raised there and i just always wanted to get into the entertainment industry so um there wasn't a big booming one in rhode island so i started out in pageants that's how i got into pageantry and uh yeah and i i graduated high school i moved to miami i modeled there i went to new york i modeled there let's uh let's let's slow it down real quick i can tell you're so used to doing interviews because she's like let's get it in all yeah but we're gonna stop right there so you grew up in rhode island how was your relationship with your parents because i know that they both yeah i lost both my parents that is fucking tough dude yeah yeah it's brutal um i'm very grateful that i had my parents for as long as i did and and i mean it's just one of those parts of life you know where you know it's gonna happen one day but you just are like no it's never gonna happen but you know i um i'm they were married for 52 years and they were honestly like two of the most incredible human beings and i'm so grateful that i had them in fact you know i i um i kind of uh thank them my i think my strength and my resilience is because of them because i had such a strong family um you know supporting me through all the craziness and the roller coaster ride yeah so uh you know yeah losing them this is my first you know year without them and i'm like i'll cry i'm like talking about them how are you i'm gonna start crying but um you know this is like my first holidays without them and it's it's hardcore it's just i mean it's just that part of life you know that you just never wanted to have happen but happened and so yeah it's been it's they were my strength they always supported me and they were so good to me and you know without them i wouldn't be where i am today and i'm just so grateful you know i know i i have friends that you know didn't even know their parents and you know didn't have that so i'm just really happy i got to have him for as long as i did he's so awesome chachi's just sprawled out dick and dick and everything just hanging out right now um so cute my heart breaks for you i lost my mom last november and then i found out my dad has stage four cancer this year so i'm watching him die so i couldn't even imagine you know what you're going through losing them yeah i was prepared for my dad to pass you know he was really i'm the last of four he was he was like 85 86 and but my mom was like just a like a super surprise you know so my condolences honestly no same to you um uh whatever now i got all emotional too thinking about i forgot what i was gonna ask um oh you said that your mom was surprised do you think that she possibly died from a broken heart she she actually died first she died yeah she had a massive like heart attack just out of nowhere no no really healthy and doing well i mean i thought i was gonna have her for like another that she was gonna drive me crazy for another 20 years you know but um uh after she died i knew i knew when one went the other one would be really close like some notebook style stuff you know so um at one point my dad was just so sick that i just was like god like please that's how that's where i'm at with like come take him please yeah like i don't want him to hurt anymore yeah totally yeah well back to your childhood let's get off the sad subject yeah sure um back to your childhood so when did you start modeling as a as a baby or like no i started modeling when i was i went i wanted to be a model so bad my dad had this uh it was a dentist and he had this uh model from new york who would come to just see him and she was a revlon model and i just when she would come i would be like wow but i would watch like you know barbie commercials and stuff and be like i want to do that you know like i don't want the best i want to do that and uh so my mom put me in a john casablanca's like model i remember the john casablanca's they used to be at the malls yeah like in the malls and stuff and my only the real ogs know that yeah totally and uh and um i was like 4 11 and like 75 pounds my mom was like i don't know how to tell you you know i'm not gonna this isn't a dream you're gonna have yeah and but she put me in modeling and the uh the pageant uh the miss rhode island teen usa pageant uh people were there and they were like you should come do the pageant i was like 50 years old and i was like okay and i did it and i placed like first runner up and then i i i finally i i just became like a kid model and i started making bank like being a kid like a junior model yeah my parents were like oh shit maybe like she can do something with this you know because i was doing like national campaigns but as like a like like a kid yeah but then i i finally hit puberty and i grew and uh and uh the next year i i ended up winning the miss rhode island teen usa pageant i went to um what is doing pageants like i mean especially at a young age do you did you feel like all the competition how were the girls like did it create like insecurities in you because i would hate to be judged that young because i was so fucking awkward as a teenager i guess i looked at it more of like the glamour part of it like the show like i was like i want to be part of the show and the lights and the um and i was excited to interview and like you know share my personality with people um and the girls were great you know you made friends and they had events for us and um and they would teach you like beauty stuff you know and there was lots of networking you know so like you know they would go to john casablanca's they would go to modeling schools they would introduce you to agencies and that's what i was trying to get you know and so even so even at such a young age you really just had your eye on the prize oh yeah i was like what you wanted to do i was so ambitious yeah i was like i'm gonna and people would laugh at me you know my i remember being in school and writing down like i was like i'm gonna do this i'm gonna do this i'm gonna do this i want to be a model and an actress and like it was like out of a movie everyone like pointing and laughing you know but i was like i'm gonna you manifest i'm gonna do it yeah i was like i'm gonna do and it's funny because i always wanted to be a model and they were like oh you're too little you're too this you'll never be a model then when i when i became a big model then they were like oh well i was like i want to be an actress and they're like well you can't be an actress and then i became an actress and it's like oh well you did tv you can't do movies you know it's always like they always will tell you something so i love that i was just talking about that on my tiktok live today i was like they said i forgot what they were saying but i was like oh they said as an entrepreneur what would you say i said never give up on yourself because you are the only one who's gonna have your back a hundred percent yeah so no matter if they tell you no do it anyways i said yeah try you know even if it doesn't work out i mean there's so many things i've tried and failed at but you know you gotta try yeah and i think just just even the first step you know just getting yourself out there that's the hardest part once you do that then you just keep you know one step at a time absolutely so take me on this journey you were doing pageants and then how did you end up in la and sure yeah was that at a young age too yeah yeah i um i graduated high school i moved to miami i did season there for you know like um there and then i we all you know we follow seasons and we i moved to new york and i competed in miss new york usa what does that mean follow seasons so in modeling there's like seasons where you know the weather is really beautiful and all the clients and everyone go to miami and shoot and then when the weather gets too hot everyone goes to new york and then the weather gets nice there so then everyone they follow the seasons i never knew that yeah that's awesome yeah that's so that's what i did And I loved doing Miss Teen USA so much that I wanted to do Miss USA. So I did Miss New York and I won that. And then I went to Miss USA. I was actually first runner up and the girl who beat me went to Miss Universe. So I inherited the title of Miss USA. And back then we were based in Los Angeles. So I moved to L.A. to be Miss USA for a year. And that's how I got to L.A. I was 19 years old. I was like the youngest Miss USA in like a decade. It was pretty crazy. That is so crazy that you accomplished so much in such a short amount of time. Yeah. And I feel like people don't focus on that with you. They don't focus on your accomplishments. They want to just focus on like comments or shit that gets said. Yeah, they want to focus on who I dated, you know. And I'm like, I have like. And we'll get to that, but that's not you. Yeah, it's crazy to me because I'm like, you know, I've really worked my ass off, you know. I've like beat the streets of Providence, Boston, Miami, New York, L.A. And I've auditioned for everything I've ever done. I had to audition. It wasn't like I was just handed to me. One role was handed to me, but everything else, it was not handed to me, you know. I don't think people realize that. No. Thank you for that. Of course. And that's really one of the things I wanted to highlight in this interview is like you're so much more than what is in the tabloids. Thank you. And so going back to you doing all of this, like where are you living? How are you supporting yourself? Well, when I moved to L.A., when you win Miss USA, you got an apartment in L.A. for a year. You got free transportation and they flew me all over the country. And I worked with different charities, Special Olympics. I went to huge Hollywood, you know, what do they call them, premieres and things. And I signed with William Morris. Oh, nice. Yeah, my career took off pretty quickly. That's when I got on Pacific Blue and became a series regular. And, yeah, everything kind of took off. And then after my year was over, I crowned Allie Landry, the famous Doritos girl. Yep, I remember. And, yeah, I just got a little apartment in L.A. and I just hit the streets. Hit the streets. It's running, baby. Yep, yep. So, okay, you're 19 years old. Yes. You're in L.A. Yes. How is 19-year-old Shayna feeling? Man, I. Coming from fucking small Rhode Island. Yeah. Which is beautiful, but. Yeah, L.A. was hard at first to get used to, especially coming from the East Coast. East Coast people will come to L.A. and do pretty good. L.A. people will go to the East Coast and they usually come back real quick. They don't like it as much over there. But it was hard. You know, L.A.'s. You know, it's a bigger city. It's very spread out and it's very cliquey. People, you know, they see a lot of people come and go. They see a lot of Hollywood people. And so they don't let people into their cliques very easy. So it was hard to make friends, but I eventually did. And I just look back now and, I mean, I just had the time of my life. It was just. It kind of felt like where your soul belonged. Yeah. Oh, yeah. This was like home and, you know, my OG, the old crew of Hollywood. I'm actually going to see them all. So we're going to be celebrating one of our OG's birthdays coming up this Saturday. And I'll see a lot of the old school people. And it was just like the best time ever. It feels like a million lifetimes ago, but it was like the most amazing time of my life. Isn't it crazy? Because you and I are around the same age. Isn't it crazy to think back to 20 years ago and we're just like, bro, how the fuck did it fly by so fast? Yeah. It's going to be like 30 years for me. I'm 48. I'm going to be 49. And, you know, I moved here when I was 19, L.A. when I was 19. And I'm like. Like, how did I, like, how did. Where did those two decades go? I was like, where did my 30s go? You know? And I'm like, wait, my 40s? No. Like, it's so crazy. Dude, my 20s and 30s were a blur. I grew up in Vegas. So I can only imagine. We spent hella time in L.A. too. So I can only imagine living in that 24-7. Yeah, it's so crazy. Take me to one of the first premieres that you ever went to. Like, how did you feel? Like, were you excited? Was it like, were you nervous? Yeah. You know, I. God, one of my first premieres. God, I don't even know what would be my first one. But I mean, around then. Or one of the most memorable ones. I guess. Oh, God, I have really. I have a really funny story for you. You'll like this. Okay, so I was friends with Kato Kaelin back in the day. Oh, my God. And he was like, I got a friend who. He was like, I got a friend that needs a date to a movie premiere. And I'm like, who? And he's like, Bill Maher. And I didn't really know. Back then, he just had, like, his show was on, like, Comedy Central or something. Yes, yes. I'm not a huge fan of Bill Maher. And I'm sorry if you guys all are. But I'm not. Yeah. So, but I was like, all right, I'll go. Like, fuck it. It was like, it was like this Sean Penn movie, you know? Oh, geez, yeah. And I was like, okay. And so I go. And he, you know, he picks me up. And he takes me to this movie premiere. And we do, like, the red carpet. And it was, like, really cool. And I meet, like, all these huge celebrities and all this stuff. And Francis Ford Coppola is sitting in front of us with his daughter. And I'm just like, this is the fucking coolest thing ever. But I'm with Bill Maher, you know? And I'm like, whatever, fuck it, you know? How old was Bill back then? I don't know. Because he's always been old. I think he's, like, the same age as me. But he's, like, real fucking proud to have me, like, on his arm. And he's, like, with, like, the guys, like, you know, like, oh, his friends. And I'm just like, oh, Christ. You know, like, no. Like, it's not happening. Anyway, so we, after the premiere, Sean Penn goes up to him. And he's like, hey, we're going to go to Jack Nicholson's house. Good old Jack. Yeah, come on up with him. And I had known Jack. And I had known Sean, whatever, when we'd get in the car. And Bill puts his, like, hand on my leg. And I'm just like, oh, no. I don't want them, like, you know, like, no. Like, I'm not, no. But this is terrible. This is a terrible story. But I don't even fucking care. Like, I can't stand him. So this is payback, Bill. So, like, he cares. But we, so we go up there to, like, Jack Nicholson's house. And, you know, and it was really fun. And he's trying to get. How is Jack? Jack is a fucking icon. Oh, he's. He. He introduced me to my, basically, to Oscar de la Hoya. I was, like, at Jack's house. And he was like, this is the golden boy. You know, all the ladies love this guy. You know? Oh, I love Jack so much. He's just such an icon. Yeah, he is hot, you know? And then I remember when I went out, like, that week, and I met Oscar. And I was like, that's the guy that Jack was telling me about, you know? And when Oscar and I actually ended up. Did you meet Oscar with Bill Maher? No. Okay, just two separate. Yeah, two separate. Two separate things. So how did it end with Bill Maher? And we'll move on to Oscar. Yeah, and then we'll go over there. So, you know, he's trying to get Sean on his show. And he's trying to get Jack on his show, whatever. And then he wanted me to sit next to him. And I didn't. I don't know. I was, like, comfortable. So I, like. How old were you? I was, like, 20. Okay. Just a baby. I was, like, a baby, yeah. Isn't it crazy how, like. And Bill Maher's the same age. I swear. How old is Bill Maher? Can we Google that? Because he was old back then. I feel like, yeah. I feel like he's not the same age. He's always kind of looked, like, the same to me. Yeah. Yeah. He's, like, one of those people that, like. Constantly old. Yeah, constantly old. You know what I'm talking about? Like, Mr. Rogers. Love Mr. Okay. That's what I thought. I was 40 when I was 20. That's crazy. That's even worse, Bill. Come on. So, like, yeah. Whatever. So, anyway. We end up leaving. And he was really angry that I didn't, like. When he was, like. When I, like. Typical Hollywood dude. I moved from Seattle. I was sitting next to him. Like, he wanted the guys to think that he had this, like. Hot little blonde with him. And I was, like. No, I don't want them to think that I'm with you. Bro, you're, like, old as shit. Yeah. So. And in the car. He was, like. Really angry with me. And so, I just started talking to, like. The driver and stuff. And then we got out. I love how nothing phases you, girl. I need to do your birth chart. Because I know you're an Aries. But what's your moon? I think I'm a Virgo. Okay. Gotcha. I can see that for sure. I think so. Like, I'm not sure. I need to do your birth chart after the show. Okay. Okay. Because it's just. How unbothered you are is fucking priceless. Oh, like. I was, like. You're not going to ruin my time. Like. I was, like. I came out here to, like. You know. Like. Just to have fun. Like. No expectation. Yeah. No expectation. I wasn't here to date you. I was just, like. We were just going out as, like. Friends. You know. Whatever. And then he got out of the car. We got out of the car. And I remember. I walked. I had a doorman. I was on Wilshire Corridor back then. And my doorman knew me. And, you know. And he walked in. And he goes. I just want to let you know. That you are one of the most disrespectful young women I have ever met in my entire life. And I was, like. Excuse me. And he's, like. Shh. And I was, like. Did you? Did you just shush me? And I. And he was, like. He goes. And I just want you to know. I will never, ever be seeing you again. And you should have let those men know that you were with me. And you were completely disrespectful. And I was, like. First of all. Yeah. I was. I was, like. Wait. Hold on. I'm not your bitch. I'm not your girlfriend. And I don't need to let anyone know that I'm with you. And I was, like. And I'm totally fine. Like. Not seeing you again. And I remember he left. And my doorman was, like. What the fuck was that? And I was, like. I don't know. And ever since then. I've been, like. Boo. Fuck Bill Maher. Yeah. I'm, like. Fuck Bill Maher. Oh, God. That is. That's a priceless fucking story. For sure. I'm, like. Thanks, Kato fucking Katelyn. Yeah. Where the hell's Kato Katelyn at now? I don't know. He did Big Brother, too. Not too long ago. Like, Celebrity Big Brother. But. I feel like he pops in at the weirdest times. Yeah. The weirdest. The weirdest times. Like, he popped in for the OJ shit. Yeah. He popped in for, like. Yeah. And I did Big Brother. And he popped in and did a little stint on there. Yeah. And then just, like. Ran off into the sunset. Yeah. That dude has made a fucking career off just popping in. And, like. Being, like. People's friends. Yeah. Like. It's just. It's crazy. Yeah. Yeah. That's what he's known for. I don't. He's not an actor or anything, is he? I don't know what he's ever done. Okay. I'm good. Like, he's a guest house. Like. I know. But he's somehow a fucking household name. So, he figured it out for himself. That's Hollywood for you. You know. People can, like. Yeah. No. Yeah. For making a name off themselves. Just being themselves, I guess. Being roommates of people. Exactly. Yeah. Yeah. So, let's move on. So, how old were you when you met Oscar? I was, like, 22 turning 25. I was like 22. 23 so you had originally met him when you were 20 didn't really know who he was and then kind of just like you guys crossed paths again yeah yeah yeah okay so take me on that gap in between 20 to 22 what are you doing out there just i'm working i'm uh i'm on the usa show pacific blue yes i'm i got that list right here working and you did a bunch of shows you did pacific blue you did csi entourage yeah iconic as fuck people love that how was it on the on the entourage oh that i mean that's such a great show and you know that show was so successful so good when you have a show that is so successful and everyone's making money the set's really fun because there's a lot of money and everyone's really happy and so it's a nice place to work how are all the boys they're just amazing yeah yeah kevin connelly is like so awesome i've known him forever he's such a good guy and um yeah everyone on the on the show i love all those guys just amazing i love that for you it's just such an iconic show you know um and you also were on the wedding singer yeah that was my first that was one of my first roles um i ever did i was at a barbecue and adam sandler was like hey do you want to like that's the one role where he was like hey do you want to yeah you know be in this movie and how do you just go to a barbecue with adam sandler i don't know i'd shit my i'd shit my pants because that's that's father you know that's the thing like you know back then every night you went out you know you were just everyone used to go out back it wasn't so pretentious yeah like there's so many celebrities you just ran in the circles like that's how vegas was yeah vegas and hollywood were so much alike like i would go to the fucking palms and pamela anderson would be there fucking anna nicole you know like everyone nobody had security going out no one had security it was like really fun it was like the playboy mansion you know those parties when he first you know lit the candles in the grotto yeah and after his marriage you know i mean those parties were awesome everyone went like leo and oh yeah everyone i think leo is still yeah i don't think i don't think he's stopped pussy posy yeah all those guys and i love all those guys yeah absolutely so getting into tv yes how did you get into it like you were like okay i'm gonna do tv i'm done with modeling i don't want to do pageants anymore is that what well i won the big the big one you know and so there's really no more to do in pageantry for me you know i could have gone and done miss america but it's a scholarship pageant for girls that really want to go to college yeah and i wasn't going to go to i didn't no desire to go to college so um she's like i already know what the fuck i'm doing yeah i'm like i want to you know and i for me being in entertainment you know going to college would have taken years of you know where i need to be auditioning and stuff absolutely um yeah so um yeah i was just beating the like just auditioning auditioning auditioning how i have a question though so girls literally strive their entire life to make it to that miss america pageant yeah how do what do they what is life after pageantry for those girls who are like hard it's hard for a lot of them miss america you know is it's not really a beauty pageant it's really girls that are have like a platform and really want scholarship money to pay off their gotcha and stuff so it's more of an interview they say it's a talent pageant but it's really more of an interview pageant and so those girls you know they really they really want to be you know they have like a plan already like they want to be in aviation or doctors lawyers okay so there is life yeah there's life like they're going you know to go do stuff where in miss usa miss universe those they want to be um you know they want to they want to be in movies hosting acting modeling so we always say um we always say uh you know miss america is the girl that lives next door and miss usa is the girl you wish lived next door you know but it's it's more of a beauty patch it's more based on physical beauty it's it's not so much uh college-based all those girls are gorgeous didn't donald trump used to host those he owned it yeah i worked for donald for a long time did you meet him did he ever grab you oh i haven't met him yeah he's been with me for a long time he and i were in like a crazy lawsuit together and against each other and together did he ever grab you by the pussy no okay i just had to ask he wasn't my biggest fan oh no what happened um well can we talk about it oh yeah we can totally talk about it's actually pretty famous um you know uh there was my title i used to run i was the executive director for the miss california usa pageant right and um i had a title holder named carrie pristine and she was a very religious girl peter at miss usa perez hilton asked her about same-sex marriage because at the time perez is coming on the podcast tomorrow oh nice oh yeah yeah tell him i said what's up tell him if he says another thing about my daughter alabama we're going to the mattresses i will i will tell him that please tell him that i will um uh yeah i'll tell you a little more okay yeah we'll talk about that we'll talk about later too but yeah so perez asked her about same-sex marriage and at the time it was very controversial we had like prop eight going on and it was a very big deal and she was religious yeah she was yeah she was she was very yeah she was very religious right and so she just said that you know she stated you know that she just felt like you know marriage was between a man and a woman and you know that was like her opinion but the way it came across was really offensive to a lot of people especially in pageantry there's so many you know we have we have just have a huge gay community yeah and so uh it was really offensive to a lot of people and then she basically uh kind of like breached her contract started kind of like running all over the country a huge church the in nam it's called the national organization for marriage it's very it's kind of what created prop a and it's very is highly funded right and um and then you know uh like the baptist churches from the south kind of latched on to her and i think i remember that yeah i wanted her to kind of be like the face of you know of anti-gay marriage and stuff right and started paying her like massive money amounts of money to go to these churches that kind of had like anti-gay rallies right you know associated you know homosexuality and stuff and she was like i don't know i don't know homosexuality with like bestiality it was like awful oh so you know we were trying to like be like you're under a contract you can't just go do these appearances without us and all this stuff so trump at first we had to go to trump and be like we can't control her like and she's losing her mind and he we had like this big you know uh press conference over at the trump towers it was like can spin film festival with the cameras and stuff and i wanted her to lose her crown i thought you know her behavior just the way she treated us wasn't very pageantry like it was you know you know because you want little girls to be able to look up and everybody's entitled to their own appearance but at the same time it's like you don't talk about religion and it got just gross it got in nasty we had sponsors you know that are like i'm a gay you know we're we just gave you hundreds of thousands of dollars and you know she's hates me you know it's really bad um and he let her keep her crown and i resigned i quit i was like i'm not supporting this i'm out i quit i made like i i mean i was on cnn i was on you know it was really big news ryan seacrest and um and then i think even she trump got sick of her and then trump trump ended up firing her and asking me to come back which i did and then she sued all of us and so um she sued trump and i and we all had to like go to what did she sue for she sued for um religious discrimination wow yeah and so how did that end up um this is amazing um she um she she she sued us and uh so you she was suing you and trump you guys weren't suing each other correct yes yes she was suing trump for she went after trump and then myself and my partner in the miss california usa organization um she had a boyfriend um who sent all her she masturbated a lot and she took videos of herself masturbating well that wasn't the turn i was thinking was about to happen she masturbated a lot and she uh she sent uh isn't that against well i mean i'm all for masturbating like i will anywhere i am totally fine for it but i don't you know i'm please be proud masturbate and be proud but she um her boyfriend sold all her masturbation videos to tmz and um now you have to understand that now at this point she's become where she was a little religious right she then was getting making a lot of money with these with these churches and so then she kind of became this really very religious woman right but she was not right not to that extent you know right and i always feel like when people are like that they're always hiding something yeah i grew up in a very religious environment and my family was the most hypocritical people you could yeah it's always that preacher who's like you know and then he's found in like a motel with the you know having a yeah smoking crack and fucking yeah doing weird shit yeah yeah exactly so um so we ended up the lawsuit um you know presenting that you know and um she denied it and to like the you know the camera went up to her face from her vagina to her face you know yeah and then she she so we we settled out oh good yeah ended it so crazy yeah that was my first year as a state director so why did he not like you though just because you quit and you took a stance because i quit and said that i will not support him yeah i wouldn't support because you have to understand the contract that she signed is the same contract i signed at miss usa and miss usa and i had to abide by the contract i couldn't go tell my state directors to fuck off and go do whatever i wanted to do and you know and i felt like well why does she get to breach it because she's bringing in press right donald love that but like right she's also like killing our business right our sponsors are dropping and she's you know people are offended and hurting people hurting people yeah today's episode is brought to you by vented y'all know how it goes you open your closet and have a million things hanging up but somehow still feel like you have nothing to wear that's me and let's be real half that stuff hasn't been touched in forever instead of letting all those clothes just sit there taking up space you might as well make a little money off of them if you haven't used it yet vented is a second-hand marketplace app that makes it so simple to sell the quality clothes you no longer wear and discover you unique 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Yeah, she's crazy. So you're doing TV. Yeah. When did you do The Wedding Singer? I was about 20, 20 years old. Yeah. Okay. And you met Billy Idol. I did. I met him on that. I met him on that set. Yeah. How's his wiener? He was a really good lover. I'm not going to lie. I do. See, I had a feeling because those rocker dudes, for some reason, I love musicians and rocker dudes, but the majority of them, not all of them, are pretty passionate. He was actually really fun and really cool. And he actually was really awesome to talk to. He just knew a lot about history and was really fun conversations. He stimulated you intellectually. Yeah, he did stimulate me intellectually. And he was just a lot of fun. But I was just so young. I was never going to settle down with anyone. I was wild as hell. You're literally living everybody's dream. Yeah. He was super fun though. I love that. So you're doing TV. You're doing these movies. How are you feeling? Did you ever fall into the drug scene in LA or get involved with that? No, I never did. No, I never got into drugs. I wasn't even like too much of a drinker, really. You know, I just was high on life just running around. And I just wanted so badly to be a movie star and to break into movies. And I just was very nuts. I wouldn't call myself like a star fucker because I just ran in those like circles of people. Back then, I don't even think that was a thing. Now, it's more like clout chasers. But back then, it was like, it was where you were and who you knew. Yeah, I mean, people were just everywhere. Yeah, you couldn't avoid it. You didn't pursue them. You literally just ran into them. Yeah. But I, I just was I just was so zoned in on just being successful. And I just wanted to prove everyone that in Rhode Island that told me I was never going to be shit that I was gonna do it. You know, I love that. The tenacity is awesome. So moving on, you meet Oscar. Yes, I do. Yeah, take me on this journey. Yeah, I am. So my one of my best friends from Rhode Island was a pretty guard at this. I think it was called it was a big club in in West Hollywood, the Eden or something Garden of Eden or something. People will know that I'm looking at my notes. I'm not I'm not just taking a phone call right now or anything like that. I literally have No, you're totally fine. You're like, I'm sorry, I'm gonna drink. No, you're so dehydrated. I know you said you're you said you can we say it or you said you were hungover. I'm a little hungover. I actually I've been on this terrible sleep. So I went to bed at like nine o'clock last night, like I told you. And, and I woke up at like, six in the morning. And I didn't know what to do with myself. So I went and played like some cards like some. And I just had like a couple drinks. And I was like, Oh my god, I gotta go do this podcast. I'm drunk. I gotta like Mimi's hungover. I gotta get it together. Come barreling into like 3am. I was like, I gotta do this podcast tomorrow. I'm not drinking with you guys. So yeah, yeah. Yeah. So I went to this nightclub. And Oscar, I remember he walked by and I used to go run around Hollywood. And then I would go to this bar to meet my friend and wait for him to get paid. And we would all go get like pizza or go to, you know, whatever after yeah, spots we all used to go to. And, and he walked by and the other security guards were like, Shana, do you know? Do you know that was? Do you know that was that was Oscar de la Hoya? And I was like, Oh, that's who Jack told me about. I was like, Oh, that's who Jack was talking about. He's really cute. And they're like, Do you want to meet him? And so they, like brought me over to him. And, and we just like, we just looked in each other's eyes. And it was just like, ding. And that was like it. Do you feel like it was some sort of like a connection like from your life type? Oh, my God, instantly. And I knew I was like, I'm and back then I was like, I'm never gonna have babies. Like I'm never having kids. Like I'm just gonna like live my life and I met him and I was like, Oh, I'm gonna have your baby. Like, I'm going to have your baby. And like, and I was so happy. I was like, Yeah, we had a quite a whirlwind there. Does he dress up in women's clothing? Really? No, he does. Because I mean, I remember when that was going down. And I was like, Well, how do we explain these pictures? What was happening? You know, he, he does drink a lot. He had like a drinking problem, for sure. And he's the kind of we've all done some weird shit. I'll do some weird shit. But he's the kind of drinker that like, you know, he can drink a lot. Yeah, but he's like wasted off the first shot. You know, those kind of people like, we have to like, I feel like some Latin Americans cannot drink like they can't like some Indians, they have a really hard time. Yeah, it's like, you know, it's some people's like biochemistry or something like they just like, but like when he drinks like two drinks, and he's like, like as if he had 50, he can drink 50. But he's like as wasted off the first as he would be like on the 50th. Right. And so and but he's very fun. Like he's a fun person. And he's, you know, he's very charismatic. And, you know, and he really just, you know, and you know, he's in training, you know, he would train for three, four months and big bear at a time. And then, you know, he wanted to like, let loose and go crazy after the fights and just be young. You know, he was, he was 25 when I met him. Yeah. And I was 2223 years old. Yeah. Oh, you guys were babies. We were like babies. And, but you know, he's like one of those people that, you know, would like, you know, put like the clothes on just to be funny and silly. Oh, gotcha. You know what I'm saying? Somebody took the picture. And then someone took the pictures and then tried it to like, basically blackmail him, you know, that is terrible. Yeah, I just the media is fucking terrible like that. I've always wondered that I was like, is that his kink? Because I know there are some people with kinks like that, you know? No. So take me into you guys's relationship. Yeah, you guys met that night. And then it was just a six months later. And I remember saying to him, like, did you just move in with him? Yeah, we like moved in with each other. And we just were like, madly in love. And I, you know, like he, I think our first date, like I went to Big Bear, and we took a private jet to Vegas. And he took me to like a George Foreman fight. No, damn, that's iconic. Yeah, it was really cool. And I just remember people being like, champ, champ. And like, I'd never been with an athlete. And you know, there's a difference between fan, like fans of athletes and fans of movie stars. Yeah, there's a real difference. What's the difference? They're just way crazier. Oh, I'm more fanatic. Yeah, you know, fanatical. And I just was like, this is crazy. And I didn't really know anything about the boxing world, or, you know, him, really, I just fell in love with who he was. He was very romantic. And I just loved his culture and the Latino, like kind of, you know, energy of him. And I'm half Portuguese. I'm Portuguese and Irish. I'm Brazilian and white trash. That's what I always say. Yeah, we just like we just fell in love. But you know, we were so young. And we had so he he had so much money and had so much power. And he had so many people just pulling at him from every direction. I mean, you know, we just did an HBO documentary. And I was actually really surprised that he kind of let me be as candid. And he was as candid and really as brutally honest about, you know, his drinking, his drug problem, you know, his womanizing, his sex addiction. Do you think he's trying to right his wrongs now? Now that he's older? Yeah, absolutely. And you know, I, he has, he did me pretty, pretty dirty, you know? Yeah, let's talk about that. Because you had so you had Atiana. Yeah, I had Atiana. She was about one and a half, two years old. And I knew things were going on. I, you know, they were like, you always know when they're cheating. Yeah, you always know. It's not it's never fucking not noticeable. Yeah. And you know, and that didn't bother me so much as like, there were all these third parties. There was like, you know, he had just lost his first fight. And there were lots of new businessmen in and they were making changes and stuff. And basically, like, he went to go do he wanted to sing. He was doing like an album. And yeah, we were like, I was like, I think I remember that is happening. Like, it was really weird. But I remember we like I met him at the Hilton at Universal. Every time I pass it to this day, I still remember. And I met him at the Universal. And, and I just like was like, do you want this anymore? And he was like, you know what, he's like, I'm gonna go to New York, I'm gonna go do Letterman. And when I come back, we're gonna start fresh. He's like, I want you and the baby. You're my girls. We're gonna start the you know, he's like, go. He's like, go buy some art for the house. Go get some, you know, new things for the house. That was like on a Friday. And then do you think he really genuinely in that moment meant that? Or do you think he was pacifying the situation because he wanted to avoid confrontation? I'll never know. You'll never know. I'll never know. I obviously I it was everything I wanted to hear in that moment um but I'll I'll never know but I I was I was in our home our mansion in Bel Air and um my daughter was sleeping in her nursery my mother was there my girlfriend and we were watching the Latin Grammy Awards and um and I just remember they were like Oscar de La Hoya is about to hit the red carpet and meanwhile I'm calling him like hey honey did you get home all right like where are you you know and he's not answering and I kind of like my we all looked at each other like Oscar de La Hoya is on the red carpet like what the the fuck is he doing there this and it's in LA you know so we're like wait what and they go to a commercial break and so we're waiting and I'm like what is he doing there why the fuck am I not there like what's happening and then um he uh it comes back and there he is holding hands with his now ex-wife Millie Corday or I don't know how to say her name whatever Millie and um and I just time you know and kill Bill when that yeah yeah when everything just slows down yeah I mean I just like I just remember I lost my breath and I just was like and he was holding her hand and they were like a couple and I just like I my mom and everybody had publicly known that you guys were together right yeah we were a couple and they just accepted this there was no backlash of like there was really no backlash and he was so powerful and the media was just so he had such control of the media that wow um you know yeah I I didn't stand a chance and um and the next day they had a lawyer come to the house and say you and the baby need to go to the hospital and I was like oh my god I'm gonna go to the hospital I need to you know need to move out and I was like I'm not moving out I don't I'm not I like this is my home and you know uh and it just became like a world like a shit show a whirlwind like of shit show and we were in like you know we fought for probably like did you ever get him back on the phone no he never called me again uh he had his um assistant Raul come to me and tell me that he no longer wanted to be with me and I remember breaking down in Raul's arms and crying I think Raul was crying we were both crying and I think Raul was crying and I think Raul was crying and I just was like is this really I couldn't even like I just remember sitting on the balcony of that Bel Air mansion with a bottle of vodka and a cigarette and being like what the fuck am I gonna do now and I really thought in that moment that my life was over and I was how old were you I was uh 24 years old you're a baby yeah but I like I you know I quit working to you know I thought I was gonna be a wife and a mom was he very controlling about your working because I know that culture a lot of the men do not like they did not he did not want me working I quit working for him I quit like everything so I you know at that point I didn't have like a manager I didn't have an agent anymore and back in the day you had to have those to even do anything there was no social media like we have today no I don't even I don't even think we have phones like we had I think we had like a flip the brick phone a motorola or something you know the sidekicks yeah there was no uh yeah like literally like doing the you know one word like the t9 literally like that exactly you know that's how I'm texting him where are you 15 minutes later you know but um yeah I was like so it's the fact that everybody could publicly know that you guys were together yeah and then him be able to just present a new woman on the right that would never fly oh in today's day and age like are you kidding no yeah and the fact that you just had to eat it I had to fucking eat it behind the scenes like did you go through were you were probably going through postpartum during this too yeah well no my daughter was about two one and a half two years old you know no I just um that's you know what he said to me I you know this is so crazy this part of it I remember because I he wouldn't see me and I remember I went out to a club and Paris Hilton was there and he was fucking Paris Hilton at that time even though he was with Millie you and Paris have a long extensive history yeah he was fucking Paris and um and I got even though he was with Millie yeah even though he had just started dating Millie and um and I knew he was there to meet her and she was like hanging out with me and I was just like why are you hanging out with me like if you're and I was hanging out with her and she was like hanging out with me like if you're hanging out with me like he wanted to meet me and so I went I met him like the next day and I and he and it was the first time I'd seen him since how long ago was how long uh after it was about a month since the Latin Grammy Awards okay gotcha and um and uh we were in the car talking and he uh he came to meet me and I just said to him I'm like why did you why did you do that like why did you internationally humiliate me like you know like and I have nothing you know I have nothing now I don't even like know what to how to like move forward from this yeah and meaning when you say nothing not monetarily you're just meaning like your family or you're talking about all I just felt at that point in my life like my career was over yeah I had no agent I you know my future I thought I had this whole future planned you know and that was like ripped away from me in a matter of 24 hours and I just like you know I didn't know I didn't know what to do yeah and he just said oh I had a I was like okay and I just was like well I don't want to like go to the like I don't want to legally go after you like can we like can you help me like I don't know what I'm going to do like where am I going to live like where like what like I don't know what to do you know and he was like and he goes you know Shana he goes and at that point we had gone to court and figured out our child support and he goes you know you already took me to court for child support and I'm not happy about that and he goes and if you sue me for palimony he goes I'm not going to see you or the baby until she's 16 years old and um did you guys make out or did you just have a conversation no we just had a conversation I mean I was bawling and I mean I was still madly and madly in love with him and I just like I thought I was losing like you know this was the man like I just had your first baby with yeah I worshipped him and um and he said you know he goes I won't see you or the baby till I was still she's 16 and I just was like no fucking way no way would you do that and then he goes and he got out of the car I'll never forget this and he went around to the drive sitting in the driver's seat and he knocked on the window and I rolled it down and he goes I've had I have more money than God don't be too hard on me and he left that gave me goosebumps and he fucking left and I sat in that car I'm only like crying I sat in the car and I cried for like fuck man and I and I just was like there's no way he didn't I sued him for palimony and I won I love that you didn't back down though yeah I really didn't have a choice I honestly was scared and you know and I and I was like and I was him in the car I was like well I don't want to sue you for palimony I don't like let's figure this out but can you help me like can like I don't even know if I have a fucking car like I don't like can you can you at least like give me you know something so that I I can raise our daughter in a safe environment and I can put her in a good school and I I know like I have some uh support or you know um security but he wouldn't he wouldn't talk to me so I really didn't have a choice and you know in the news back then they were like Shana sues him for 200 million I didn't the background of what's going on yeah I mean that was half of his money back then but any woman that has been hurt the way that you were yeah I think you were pretty fucking nice yeah you didn't slander him in the in the public I wanted him back I wanted I I wanted him back so bad but he didn't see the baby and I till she was about 16 years old wow yeah he didn't my heart just dropped yeah that is I feel so bad for Atiana yeah she she didn't you know didn't know her father growing up you know and they've made amends and he's he's he's made amends with me and he's apologized and he's apologized to her how long did it take for him to apologize and to make amends like did he has he been consistent in her life since she turned 16 he was he was being pretty consistent he has a new girlfriend and I think he's midlife crisising out a little bit damn it Oscar he's definitely you know he he's he's trying he's doing the best that he can do and he's really owned up to a lot of his mistakes and his faults and I I will honor and respect him for not he didn't have an easy life and he's not a perfect person yeah and I will always love him as the father of my daughter yeah but he's tried but you know Atiana looks at him like a father and she loves him immensely but Travis is her dad oh yeah Travis is her father like her daddy oh I love that being a bonus parent I that really makes my heart happy because yeah it's it's such a hard role to take on and we'll get into their relationship sure yeah how is your relationship with Atiana are you guys good are you guys super close I have a great relationship with my kids you know you know it's it's hard you know there's a you know parental alienation is a real thing and we can get into that a little later but um you know I was a I'm a I'm a goddamn good mom I'm a fucking great mother and I raised all my kids and I I did a good job with a lot of heavy shit yeah and you know even with Atiana when she was little you know I made sure that because her dad wasn't there I would go to the schools and be like I want her in classes with all male teachers I want her to have positive male role models you know I I would have her go in and spend summers with my mom and dad because I wanted her to see a functioning healthy yeah loving you know um relationship I made those choices for her to see see those things and be a part of those things um I'm I have a great relationship with my kids my kids and I never had any bumps in the road until my ex-husband started dating the uh Kardashian crew you know gotcha and um and I don't fault my kids for some of the things that they said they were kids and they were influenced and you know but a teenager saying one thing one time yeah doesn't take away the years that I did raising my children I'm very confident in who I am as a mother and um how I raised my children um uh but I'm I'm not estranged from my children I'm very close to my children I love that we have great relationships yeah we'll dive a little deeper into that once we get into their births and stuff like that um but yeah I just wanted to know where you and Atiana stood because I mean you guys were babies growing up together we really were yeah do you feel like of like a, sister or no i'm definitely her mom she's like no i'm mom no no i'm definitely her mom um i love it she's beautiful too she is goodness i mean all your kids are fucking gorgeous i'm very proud of the all all three of them but she just has um she has a very incredible sweet kind soul she seems like that she seems very peaceful she is she's she's more um conservative and much more chill than the other two right but the other two are your karma yeah exactly oh yeah god gave me vama last for a reason so i love that yeah um so moving on you're going through this heartbreak you're having to go through i did playboy yeah so is that what you did as soon as you broke up with yeah that's what i did and he never would i was on pacific blue and they wanted me to be a celebrity pictorial and he would never let he was like no absolutely yeah he's like no way you know mexican you know no no no um but at the time i needed the money to like pay my attorney to you know to um uh do the the palimony suit to which did you guys settle in the palimony suit yes we ended up settling he ended up being very uh i don't know like couldn't we have just done this like a year ago i think he just wanted to see if you had it in you yeah maybe you know yeah maybe yeah yeah i didn't have a choice i was like you know i'm like i'm doing a motherfucker i don't want to do this i was like i love you please don't make me do this like we'll do it you know but um yeah so uh i ended up doing playboy but they wouldn't make me a celebrity uh pictorial after that see so it like ruined it hurt my career right and so uh they said we'll give you a make you a playmate you know you can pick your month and would not be better to be a playmate though than just a celebrity pictorial because isn't that like a one-time thing yeah it's a one-time thing but you get paid a lot more gotcha yeah you get paid a lot more so it's hundreds of thousand dollars worth twenty thousand dollars you know and as a playmate you know you have to do a video you have to do certain things but you know what my playboy experience was yeah the most epic coolest amazing like shooting at playboy studio west was steve wada arnie freytag like just you know the kings of photography it was just such an uh a really cool time and hef and just was so good to me yeah i never dated hef no you don't have to fuck hef to be a playmate like he was a complete gentleman a class act to me and welcomed me into his home i love i love that whole era of playboy i felt like that was the time that like women kind of all came together for just a cause and like it was just like yes you know it was like a girl gang and it was like if you were part of that girl gang i i did work for playboy tv i wasn't pretty enough to make it in the magazine um but i did yeah no i don't listen i shot with uh i think his name was bill white at playboy west okay okay yeah and they they were just like no they were there you know they i mean sometimes they power tripped a little bit you know they were just like no they were they were just like no yeah which is fine yeah which is fine but i was all i've you know partied i yeah did the whole playboy thing yeah like um but that era was just i don't know like even though it was for a nude magazine it was so wholesome it was it was so wholesome and like it's so weird to say that but it was it's so true though and you know um it was and you know it was good teaching women to embrace their bodies and like yeah and every it's so interesting because it's like a sisterhood all pageantry there's sisterhood in that uh i used to try to get the pageant girls to go to dinner with the playmates but then that never went well so dude that how epic would that be to have a pageant playboy edition yeah that would be crazy yeah there's a lot of girls now that you know do it now that their pageants are over they're like i want to do it yeah oh i wish you did it here tell me about it so i've met half a couple times too and i thought he was always so sweet he was a little disconnected like he was just yeah he was just kind of like there and just kind of did when i was miss usa and i was doing a charity event and he was still married to kim at that time and i remember he came up to me and he goes you know you're truly a beautiful young woman and i just thought like what a compliment what a fucking compliment from him like you know i mean i went to bed that night like holy shit you know i remember when i was like this is crazy weird people are gonna think it's weird but um i remember my dad used to have like playboy you know say my dad did too yeah in the bathroom in the bathroom i remember looking at them and i just thought the women were so beautiful and i remember being on the bus and kids were like what do you want to be when you grew up and i was like a playboy bunny yeah i didn't know what that meant and i remember everyone being like oh my god yeah and and then you know to ironically end up becoming a playboy bunny later is very very funny but but i was yeah i was 19 when i first met half and then you know i was with oscar i wasn't allowed to do it but then when i was 25 turning 26 that's when i became a playmate and um and i vied for you know playmate of the year it was between me and darlene they shoot on just a white backdrop completely naked and it was between she and i and that's when he had like seven girlfriends and i think like five of his girlfriends were in the contention you know that year but i never felt pressure or anything like that but i was the first playmate to ever have a belly button ring so oh i love that yeah and i had like a little rabbit head so i feel like they were back in the day they didn't let tattoos either yeah they didn't have you weren't allowed to have piercings or tattoos hef didn't like them but he changed that as he got older yeah and times changed how do you feel about all the stuff that's coming out about hef right now and like it's disgusting yeah yeah it's disgusting i mean there's just you know there are playmates that i think do things for money and for attention and for fame and you know the the playmates who really knew hef and were part of that family you know are just completely it's just vile and just you know let him rest in peace what the fuck are you guys doing yeah ripping this man apart and he can't defend himself yeah i have no respect for that shit you know at all i love that you're standing up for him though yeah i just love he and you know i spend every easter there with my with my children you know i mean he was a a wonderful man yeah yeah i love that i love that you're taking a stance especially in a time where it's easy to go fuck off into the sunset seriously gross he did so much for so many women yeah so much and and if any of those women were homeless or had a drug addiction he would have he would have housed them taken care of them and gotten them sober well it's disgusting for them to do that yeah i never knew that i never knew that he um after you did playboy you're getting stella's getting her groove back yeah yeah yeah take me on this journey just yeah i met travis like very soon after and it was literally like the minute i got over i never really got over i didn't get over oscar for a decade or so but the minute i kind of got past it yeah um i i was out in hollywood and my girlfriend was like i met this guy and his his name's rob skinhead rob from the transplants yeah yeah yeah and i remember she was like yeah i met this guy like come with me like i was gonna be her wingman i was like all right we're gonna do this and we went to this i think it was called like the standard or something on sunset oh my oh god yeah i had a lot of drug nights there a lot of people did i think fuck my i think i almost died there one night oh my god cocaine and xanax is a hell of a fucking binge party yeah that'll do that'll do it yeah yeah um yeah so i went there and uh and she was with rob and i think like george clooney was there that night ironically he was everywhere he was everywhere dude he used to i can't even believe i'm gonna say this he when i used to work at the palms yeah he would come and group together all the fucking cocktail waitresses and they would go upstairs and fuck him like i was there when it happened i wasn't in the room but i was i was working yeah i was never one of the cocktail waitresses and he was doing his thing no he was george clooney was the man dude yeah like all he had to do was walk by and bitches would pass out yeah like dropping their shorts he was a fine motherfucker though he was yeah he was yeah he's still sexy where the fuck is he he got married with his wife and yeah just doing his thing he's just living the dream he's living the dream go george go go george go go george go yeah i think i was like talking to him at the bar or something and then you know she introduced me to travis and he had a big mohawk back then and not you know back then no one had mohawks yeah and he was fucking you know he was tatted up pretty not as much now but he was still tatted up pretty pretty uh tight and i was just like i thought this is who the fuck i'm i didn't know who blink 182 was and um and i kind of was like oh i think it was like with oscar i was like oh my god i'm gonna be like oh my god i'm gonna be like oh my god i'm gonna be like oh that's who jack and i was like oh didn't they have like little people on the mtv music awards on bungee cords like flying around like that's how i like you know remembered him and um what kind of music did you listen to to not know who blink 182 was i i listened to hip-hop and rap okay gotcha yeah i listened to hip-hop and rap and uh yeah and um r&b gotcha yeah so uh i had no clue and um and i just remember being like wow he's really you know oscar's so clean cut and more suits and shit he doesn't even have tattoos not one tattoo yeah not one and i was like god this guy's really fucking tattooed and i was like all right i'll be your wingman you know and they were like oh he's getting a divorce he's in the middle of a divorce oh i didn't know that travis was married yeah he was married to a girl named melissa and um just a regular just a regular girl yeah she's a real estate agent today nice nice person and uh and i was like i don't want to fucking deal with a guy going through a divorce like jesus like what a mess i was like i'll just be your wingman george send me a beer you know like that kind of a thing go george go yeah and uh so we just like talked about it and i was like oh my god i'm gonna be talked and i remember he called me oscar like he was like what up oscar like kind of teasing me about oscar because i was you know i was known as oscar's girlfriend the gold digger you know i was like you know i was like okay and i was like what um and then the next week because you know you would go to the same club every week every thursday you went you know the same thing and she was like i missed that because that's how it was back in the day like yeah we used to have like wasted space out here yeah you were like wednesday we go here yes yeah we go here every week you know that's what you did and my girlfriend was like i'm gonna go meet rob again like come with me and i was like fuck okay and um and fuck i guess i'll go i guess i'll go so i was like yay and so i went and travis was there again and this time like he like he came up to me and we like I'll never forget it like it was something stupid like I was just like what's your sign like I said it like what's your sign or something like that um and we just started talking and then Rob and my girlfriend at the time Natasha we all went to like back to his hotel because he was staying at a hotel to be away from his wife and um and we Travis's hotel yeah we went to Travis's hotel we were all just like listening to music and drinking and having fun and he and I kissed and I remember like looking like stepping back and being like what the fuck was that like holy shit like I just met like the love of my life and I was like I'm gonna have your baby oh here we go again I was like I'm gonna have your baby and I just knew it and six months later I got pregnant oh my goodness which I was but I mean and I I was so madly I mean even like I never thought I would love again or kind of meet that kind of connection but Travis is definitely more the love of my life more way more than Oscar what is Oscar's sign uh he's an Aquarius okay yeah that's crazy Aquarius and Aries and Travis is a Scorpio yeah which is crazy to me that but if you have a Virgo moon then that makes sense because Virgo and Scorpio are soulmates I would love to see you guys as charts I'm surprised I'm sure somebody's done them online but um yeah yeah do you feel like you and Travis were twin flames oh 100 because you guys had like a long tumultuous relationship yeah yeah yeah yeah yeah yeah yeah yeah yeah yeah yeah people don't even realize how long after they're like oh they got a divorce in 2008 I'm like yeah we lived with each other like a married couple to like almost 2012 yeah yeah people don't know that take me on this journey you and Travis kiss what happens after that you guys just instantly like instantly connected and he was touring with the transplants and I would drive to his house like every weekend and we would just see each other as much as possible and I just was I mean we just were together I mean did he love bomb you as much as he loved bombs we were the we were the OG love bombers I know I remember I remember do you get deja vu Courtney please like I do remember watching that was just like I was like oh Christ you know like this is hard to watch well he definitely has a pattern you know that's what I think he did I feel like it was a little more acceptable when you guys did it yeah because it felt more real yeah I you know and I'm not talking shit about them I'm just saying like you guys did do it first and it was just more accepted back then too yeah and we you know we got our we you know I got pregnant um six months later and um and were you guys living together by basically already yeah I told him on Valentine's Day and um and yeah we just we were just it was really one of the happiest times of my life no yeah and when we had Landon um we had Landon and then that's when MTV came to us and asked us if you know the newlyweds were going off and asked us if we wanted to meet the Barkers and back then you know reality TV was so new I mean you had the Osbournes and you had the newlyweds that was really it yeah they were like I don't know I don't know I don't know I don't know I don't know there was no other you know that they were the pioneers of reality TV so that's when we did meet the Barkers and that you know that was really our I watched those episodes now and I didn't like who are those people you know it's like another lifetime ago I watched all all the original reality TV the newlyweds meet the Barkers and uh the Osbournes loved all of it and I feel like that's when TV was fucking great yeah and because back then it wasn't scripted right I mean they really just had two teams of people following you around with cameras that was your life yeah and you didn't have to get you know legal to say oh you can go eat in that restaurant or you can go into that store people you didn't have to sign their lives away you could just you just went to that store you know I know how uh TV shows are shot and I know that they're edited and you know they're they're there's always a narrative that they want to paint exactly how do you feel about people always saying that oh Shane all she did was ever lay in bed oh it's so fucking annoying it's so fucking annoying because I'm like what do you guys think I'm like narcoleptic or something like it was supposed to be funny it was supposed to be like a little like it was supposed to be entertaining you know it was supposed to be like a funny part I mean that bed looked comfortable as fuck I I look man I love my beds I I love my beds and I do love sleeping um I do have chronic fatigue like I was diagnosed with that when I was like 19 so when I work um when I first start any work schedule I usually relapse and it's very very hard for me to like function and get up and um and I you know I get real irritable with people but I um you know what they don't understand is that I was the one rocking babies all fucking night long right so I would Travis wasn't he was on tour and he was at the time he also had a pretty heavy pill addiction you know that he's been very open and candid about um I didn't know that at the time I was so naive I didn't even realize it um you didn't know that he was an addict no no I didn't know at all and what was he taking like Laura tabs that was he was taking like darvasets or like like narcos or something yeah okay yeah something like that like loved a good Norco back in the day yeah I'm like I don't even know you know if I took a nor I'd like throw up now yes I would too but back then that's what I used to look for because they had less aspirin in them than the blue pills okay I'm like I have no clue like I didn't even know he was like on him you know he just but that's how he functioned you know and um but I would be you know the the cameras would stop rolling they'd leave around 10 o'clock at night and then you know Travis would go to bed but I would have to go put like atiana in her bed and I'd put on like you know a movie and then I would go and like rock landin you know I'd rock Landon and then I'd go lay down with atiana until she fell asleep and then I would go lay down and then one of them would wake up like five minutes later you know and then I would go rock the baby and then I would go you know lay down with her and then when I had Alabama on the show well then I had to go put atiana down go rock Alabama you know you know then go rock Landon and then one of the you know I was constantly so by the time like our nanny would come at like eight in the morning and the crew would show up I was exhausted you know and it was like I need to sleep yeah you know so I mean so when people say that all the time like oh you're a deadbeat I think I did one episode where the nanny came in and I I the nanny um stayed the night right and I actually got like I was like I need to get like eight hours of sleep like a solid eight hours of sleep like I can't have it broken up every three hours which you do with the newborn and stuff and uh so I had Liz who's still with us to this day um yeah she uh came over and and they filmed it and they asked her they she can't unmute the Barkers they filmed her in the and um and I said how were they last night you know so all the people at home thought that I had a nanny the entire time the entire time every night and it was just like one night and then it's like I'm a deadbeat mom that never like who slept and never took care of her kids that's exactly why I wanted to ask that question because I I know being in the industry and having to film our reality show that we do yeah I know exactly that there's always more to the story yeah and I don't think people on the other side of the keyboard don't comprehend that what you see on TV is completely edited yes it's real yeah but it's completely chopped up and edited and there's so much to make a storyline to entertain you it's supposed to you know it was supposed to be funny yes but you know it and you know I honestly think and I think the worst thing you can do to a woman is to on her as a mother yeah I think it's really one of the cruelest and most vile things and I honestly can't imagine going up to a stranger or to a woman and I can't imagine going up to a stranger and I can't imagine going up to a stranger or to a woman and I can't imagine going up to a stranger or to a woman or to a person or going online and saying to someone you're a piece of mother you're a deadbeat mother like yeah I don't know you from a hole in the wall I can't imagine saying that to a stranger and and saying that to them about you don't know what's going on in someone's home what's going on with their husband and people you know because we had that show they and I know I'm a public person and you know and it's like and you know I put myself in that position but at the same time you don't you don't get to do that this is where this is where I stand up for us and I have been standing up to online bullies and they hate it just because we are open online does not give you the right you're right to tear us apart for no reason they're like well you're a celebrity you should be able to handle it how about go yourself you'd never say this to my face yeah exactly you know I'd stand up to the bullies and I don't like it and Instagram's the worst like I I can't go live right now oh get on TikTok girl you ain't done nothing yet yeah yeah well Instagram's like the well I mean in the way that they don't defend you at all like you know I told someone to like go themselves or I called him a the other day you know shooting on my daughter like or shooting on me as a mother or something and you know and I just was like get off my page yeah 30 days and it's like and it's just I know they probably have a computer that's just like I said the word so now I can't go live for 30 days but it's like did you see the comment yeah that person blocked is that person you know is there any repercussions for these people's actions for that like you know what if I what if I wasn't as strong as I am and I go blow my brains out like you know do you like I I don't I don't understand it it's really you know it's it's but I back to what I was saying I honestly think criticizing women like that especially as a mother is really the grossest and lowest form of harassment you can do to it I could never go to somebody's page and just say anything mean and I if I don't even if I don't want to go with it yeah even if I don't agree with it I'm just like yelling you know I don't have to to word vomit on this person's page just to make myself feel better if I don't like something I don't view it I don't go to their pages I scroll on by you know like absolutely I don't pay attention to it but you know it's I mean people and I used to when my space was big back in the day I love my space we never had problems we had the top A we had we could put music on our profiles we could design our profiles it was so Tom didn't with us right nobody got violations yes like bring my space back please Tom where the are you like bought it Justin bring it back Tom followed me on TikTok and I was more excited about that than like I matched with him on on a dating app tom you dirty boy you yeah he was on the league you only get like three people a day and he's like yes it's really me oh my god that is so funny we never never talk it was the same picture and i was like is this really the the tom oh my god that's weird i would love to see tom in person i gotta get tom on the podcast um all right so moving back to meet the barkers is that kind of where you guys's relationship started falling apart a little bit a little bit towards like the end of the season i think what really happened or really started to affect our relationship which is the irony to this day for me is he didn't want to be known as like a couple or a reality star he wanted to be known as a musician right which i understand and i respected 1000 you know and you know back then i was like you know i i want to do all the things that you see reality stars doing now like i wanted to start a clothing line and a brand and he was just so against all of it like he was so punk rock and that was so against like what but he had famous stars and straps yeah he did but that was but that was yeah straps famous stars and straps but that was like its own company he wasn't using the tv show he had already created that you know um he wasn't an opportunist with the tv show and um and uh and so you know he's we kind of put an end to it so isn't that the point of having a reality show though to capitalize off to capitalize and i'm not talking shit i'm just saying like i would think that you would want to capitalize off whatever you could especially with the attention that you guys were getting yeah and i i just think for him you know he was the star and i think when it became about us like as a couple and i wanted to be like a power couple you know and he he didn't want that he wanted to like you know i think he was used to being the man in the center and the musician and um and he wanted to be known and taken seriously as a serious musician and that i could respect but um that's kind of like where it like it started to decline when did the affair with kim kardashian start it started after the affair with paris hilton okay yeah and here comes paris again yeah there comes paris and i had already got like mind you in that club i had gotten paris hilton's face you know like well when when oscar and i were having a conversation she bippity bopped in and i was like aren't you fucking this one here aren't you fucking this one she was like i don't even know him i'm like yeah you do and so she leaves and you know he and i continued arguing oscar and i left so she and i had already had words like that night and then um uh yeah i don't i i don't know um he and i were arguing and we kind of like separated but we were still living in the same house how did you know he was having an affair with paris uh they caught him like making out on camera oh and it was like all over tmz and everything and i was just like wow i feel like back then paris was the party girl and i don't feel like she really even knew what the fuck was going on because i i had met paris a few times out here and every time i met her she was sloshed yeah yeah i'm not making excuses for her no we were all partying and fucking doing our own thing but 100 she was a kid like yeah i mean and i was a kid i mean i was probably 26 27 and she was like i think like 17 years old or something yeah she's yeah she was young yeah she was young a lot of these men had taken advantage of her absolutely i i would agree with that 100 yeah 100 but um yeah she i remember this is the big incident with her um we uh i i was i was doing dancing with the stars and i think bama was like six months old and um and the dancers back then yeah you know all the famous ones now couldn't get into the clubs and they needed me to get them into the to the clubs so we went over there was like hide on sunset and then there was this other club and uh god i remember hide yeah yeah awful and um i was just there for the first time since this incident like last week for jason momoa's vodka launch party nice not just for jason momoa's vodka launch party but for jason momoa's vodka not for him but vodka i was like he was there but i've known him since he was 19 but like can you guys never heard no no no no no no i've known him since he's single now since he was a model i mean he's cute yeah he's cute he was like young elvis when you know when he first moved to la it was like a model and stuff but yeah anyway um but uh yeah so we were i was at this one club and my girlfriend came up to me she was actually at that party and she was like you you need to leave and she was like mind you i'm married to travis and she was like um travis and paris are coming in like you need to leave and i was like and so were you guys weren't split at the time we were separated um he was like i think doing the whole hotel thing oh you know when i was at the house with the babies gotcha and i only i wasn't going to go out that night i just uh went to get those other dancers those kids into the club and um and so when i went down so i went down to hide and um and i was 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don't even fucking love him you know it's not even like this is your soulmate or you're you think you're gonna have something with him and i'm sure you were really hurt i was destroyed i was destroyed and i um i went up to her and uh and i was like you're you're a real fucking bitch and she looked at me and she went you're she used her voice you know her voice that she does and she went you're a fucking bitch and i just went at it and um you punched her in the jaw right i yeah and i was allegedly allegedly yeah and i was about to go at it and stavros fucking shoved me um down like if the staircase and if like there weren't people coming up the staircase i probably would have rolled down the stairs and fucking died and then um yeah and he came up to me and he got in my face he poured a drink on my head he got in my hand he had like my wrist and was like bending it back and i need him in the in the nuts to get him like away from me and um sam like the owner and stuff they were all like yelling at me and they like basically shoved me out the door the front door to the the paparazzi and that's what all that footage is like if you google it's terrible and i had to walk from that fucking bar down to the other bar to go get my car while paparazzi was like chasing me it was terrible so that was like kind of like the end of it all but and then he went to um paris which was in his book um it's kind of like and he was with paris and at the time i guess he was talking to kim too i don't know i think that's when they first started talking as friends and um and he came back he got flown back from uh tour because he was so fucked up on drugs and i got him sober and i remember telling uh like his friend little so even after all of this um even after you know the situation with paris and stuff like that um and then you know knowing the situation i didn't know about kim at that point oh you didn't know about him at that point okay gotcha um he still came back to you he came back yeah hey i really need help i have a problem and i helped him and i told little chris i was like you in paris was still trying to call him i was like i was like look at your fucking friend right now look at him that's that's what you do your friend don't bring another fucking drug into this house right don't you do it you know and um it was like some johnny cash type shit you know like i mean i was egging people's cars and stuff you know like whose cars did you hate his man like his assistant you know trying to pick him up to take him out to meet bitches and give him drugs drugs you know everyone wanted to be a rock star they all wanted you know they needed him to go party and drink and meet bitches and feel cool right you know but he had a family and you know you're trying to help him heal you know trying to yeah so uh and we got back together and we were trying to heal over that i actually helped um create the the girls line of famous stars and straps and i did all the campaigns and i got all my playmate friends and you know adrian curry and you know tiffany john tiffany um yeah i think johnson uh to model you know big models and stuff and i did all the women's line and stuff and then that's when kim came in and she was just starting they didn't have their show or anything wasn't kim kim was best friends with paris with paris yeah it was like the two of them had like a like a who can we fuck competition in la you know like you know whose husband can we fuck you know like it was pretty crazy i mean they really did it was it was like wild it was like that's why today when they have issues now i'm like oh you know and i always say life always comes back around it always yeah and like i said and i'm not defending their actions yeah they were so young they were and i mean i've done shit that i fucking completely regret that i did in my 20s now that i'm in my 40s i'm like why did i do that yeah yeah for me it's like hey you did what you did yeah you know at least just say sorry or like yeah that's yeah that's fine but it's like you know don't be shocked when you you know when you when you deal with an angry wife yeah is that tiktok sound you're shocked yeah yeah yeah so kim came in and then what happened there so she shot for famous stars and straps and this was the first time that he handled the shoot gotcha my mind you she's wearing the stuff i designed you know and i was just like why is this girl on your because i associated her with paris and you know and i was like why is this girl on your computer like why what's going on and he was like oh i just you know she's up and coming and i just wanted to like you know get involved and stuff and i knew like things were getting weird and at that time we were still like you and i had a house in the same neighborhood and so we were like going back and forth to each other's homes and someone anonymously and randomly texts me uh their conversations and i'm pretty sure it was paris i'm pretty sure it was paris i don't know wow but so somebody just texts you from a random number and it's screenshots yeah of all their of all travis and kim's conversations what were those like they were trying to meet up at her sister's house to fuck which sister i don't know oh i don't know wouldn't that be crazy if it was coordinated i know um i think i think courtney how would that person have gotten those screenshots that's crazy someone someone got in her phone for sure wow and i remember i went to to the house and i showed him to him and i i was bawling i was just so i was just fucking it's exhausting i've been in relationships like that and it's like it's uh it just tears you down as a human and as a woman you just your self-esteem is just shot at this point i just and i wanted i wanted you know i felt like such a failure with oscar i wanted this relationship to work and you know we did get married and we had a successful tv show and you know and i was so in love with him and so happy and i wanted to have what my parents had for my children i wanted my children to see their mother and father in love and to walk in on them dancing and have what i had you know and i just knew like i wasn't going to be able to give my children that at that moment right and i showed him the text messages and he deleted them and so i said i don't see anything and i was like we're gonna do this like we're gonna do this wow and i mean that's the biggest admission of guilt yeah yeah just like and then she called i called her we had words and uh and she just said to me that she didn't like white guys she only dated black guys and i was like kim you'll fuck anyone to be famous like you really will and you fucked you know that little singer boy and you you know and you you fuck the instinct kid you fuck the instinct kid you know or whatever which instinct kid i think she she was with um i don't know all their names yeah um you can google it yeah it's out there yeah yeah for sure it's definitely out there but i was like you'll fuck anyone to be famous you know because they didn't have their show yet and then they just got their show and then travis and i really um never really recovered from that yeah well it's hard because that was multiple times and just as a woman it's like your self-pride i felt stupid dignity you know i felt stupid i was like you're just making me look dumb you know like over and over you know over and over so i i filed for divorce what year is this uh 2008 2008 so you file from divorce from for divorce from travis yeah take me on this you're starting over again but this time you got three babies yes we're starting over again i go back to my house um uh he gets into a plane crash and well we we actually started working on things again we started talking this is where the twin flame thing comes in yeah we started working on things again and um i guess things you know according to his book everyone can read it you know they decided that you know they would just be friends but you know i think there's a lot more going on there um but i mean if you read his book when people read his book you know there's tiktok and stuff about it too and i'm like he was fucking married like you know i mean i caught him with like lindsey lohan kimberly stewart tara connor fucking paris kim like you know he you know he was living the rock he was living the rock star life you know so um but he you know we always came back to each other and that's why i always say twin flames because no matter what you guys went through you guys always came back yeah do you think that he'll come back again if things don't work out with him and courtney i don't know you know would you let him come back i don't know i read people ask me that you know i'll always love him i'll always love him immensely and deeply and um and i'm not bitter or jealous um i i don't know him anymore right i really don't i don't i don't know him as a human being anymore at all so if i ever did hang out with him i would have to relearn him relearn him and and get to know him as just a friend first and as a person you know but i'm as the father of my children and as just as someone that i i look back fondly on some of the most amazing memories of my life i'll always love him for sure yeah so he gets in this plane crash yeah which was a brutal plane crash i was at the house we were together at that time so this is after you filed for divorce yeah after yeah we're not but we're now we're rekindling we were talking about getting remarried and uh and um he uh he it was he had just finished tour and he had to go do this uh show with dj am um in north carolina and he uh he didn't want to go they got a private jet and he was like you know mama like this is this jet is really little and i was like you know and he wanted me to go on it and i and i had this really weird feeling in the kitchen and i it was so strange and um and i remember like going if we both die who's going to take care of my kids i remember just having like that thought and um and i was like my mom and dad are too old and his mom and dad are too old and you know like who's going to raise my children like his sister like what like what's going to happen to him and i was like what's going to happen right and i just said you know honey i don't i don't want to go like i think i should stay back with the kids and i was like you know you're going to want to go play and come home and i'm going to want to go and party you know and you're not going to want to and it's going to be a big fight and and uh i was like just go and come back and like like let's start our life together you know and he was like okay but he took the plane there he did the show and he wanted to get back and dj am and then had another show and he was supposed to stay another night and fly home like commercially but dj am wanted to come back for a gig and he was like i'm going to come home early and i remember when he got there he was like honey i have a really bad feeling about this plane and i was like you say that about every plane we both say this about yesterday that's how i am every time we're about to get on a flight yeah i was the same way yesterday like i was like about to cry on the plane i was i sat next to a pilot and he until dita von deese showed up and i was like we're both not going down dita not not today the gothic angel arrived yes yeah dita the angel the airline angel arrived but i was like i'm going to come um yeah so he uh it was so weird because i felt like he he called me 15 minutes later after the plane crashed and um and i i felt like they just landed i don't know how to explain it to you it felt like hours went by and they like and i in alabama was in the bed and it was so weird alabama sat up and she went mommy where's little chris and i went where's little chris i was like little chris is with daddy honey like lay down go back to sleep and i was watching a movie and i got a call and it was a pair paramedic or police officer and i was like where's little chris and i was like and he was like ma'am is this shana mochler and i was like yeah and he's like there's been a terrible plane crash and i said uh and i thought they were fucking around like joking and i was like that's not funny you know like i don't think that's a funny joke and he's like no ma'am there's been a bad accident and then i was like guys it's not it's not funny and he goes ma'am i am deputy blah blah blah blah and there's been a horrible plane accident you need to listen to me and then i heard travis screaming and and uh he was screaming i'm on fire i'm on fire and uh and he's like we need to airlift him to the atlanta something and he and he didn't want to and then i talked to him and he was like they're all gone like little chris is gone they're gone and and um and he didn't want to get on another like an airlift so they don't blame him so they drove him you know i mean and he was burned on like 70 of his body and uh and i um i think i packed like a shoe and a remote control and a battery and i fucking flew to yeah in that moment you know like whatever so out of it and um and i was with him for the first like three four weeks um there and um in in atlanta and then we took a tour bus back from atlanta to the um burn center in los angeles and uh and i was there with him there for the first like two three weeks and this is where it went bad um we got his computer to uh i've never shared this with anyone before uh so it's kind of crazy uh i got his computer and uh and we were doing it so the kids could FaceTime him, 'cause mind you, the kids hadn't seen their dad now for almost a month. and a half and uh we just and we were hoping that him seeing the kids would also give him the strength to keep fighting right you know and uh was he fighting like infection and stuff like that he didn't have infections but just the pain just the just the what they had to do and what he had to endure and surgeries and the removal of skin and just it was really fucking horrifying um i i wouldn't have lived and i was supposed to be on that plane you know i would have and we definitely wouldn't have lived because the there were four guys and we would have let them have the back of the plane and travis and i probably would have sat in the front and we wouldn't have had our seat belts on and we would have we would have died for sure so um yeah i always think about that but um uh when i was setting up his computer and he facetimed with the kids but um and he was getting a blood transfusion and i looked in his email and i saw all the emails from all the women oh goodness and i just like and that didn't bother me as much as back then you had to to when you went to tmz and you wrote a comment right what tmz will do you write a comment and then they'll email you a link and you have to click the link um to approve the comment you can write you know bob or cindy lu or whatever you want but you have to still you still have to send it to an email and then you have to click the link and then tmz will will you know approve it and i saw all these comments in his email that he was posting about me on tmz about what a shitty mother i was and chris little chris about what a shitty mother i was and i was like oh my god i'm like oh my god i'm like what a shitty mother i was and what a terrible person i was and you know and i had even read some of them and i couldn't fucking believe that he was the one behind some of those comments wow and i left the hospital it'll make me like cry just to say i love the hospital that's so hurtful yeah and i i went home and i cried in my mother's arms for like hours it was terrible i was like it's terrible and so that's when i was like this is a man that you love that you're literally like by his side like you know like i flew to be by his side and i and i just fucking was like i can't go back and i called his drum tech and the godfather of our children i was like i'm not coming back to the hospital and i'm like and this is why and i need to like we're i need to figure some shit out and um and and i granted looking back now i probably should have just fucking ate or licked my wounds and been by his side while he was still recovering from that but at that time i felt like he there was only like two people allowed into the room and he was in la and he was like i'm gonna go to the hospital and i'm like i'm gonna go to the hospital and he had his father and his sisters and he had a huge hundreds of people were going to the hospital and visiting him every day and i felt like he had a good support system and for me i just was like destroyed and um do you feel like he held that against you and that was kind of like ammo for his arsenal and later on for sure yeah yeah yeah and uh and you know and so i just was going out getting drunk you know and i think like they they took pictures of me with like i i i was friends with gerard butler i had known him since i was like 20 and now i'm like i guess i'm like 34 at this point and i had saw him at a club and the paparazzi took pictures of us and they made it seem like i was kissing him and stuff but i wasn't yeah and um and then travis saw that and then we just like never really recovered it's crazy when they when they can do it but if you do it yeah yeah that's all men are yeah i'm sorry that you went through that and that's very hurtful and i don't think that you should have had to have licked your wounds and you know i understand most women would be like well she should have saw our most people would be like oh she should have sucked it up no when you're like oh my god i'm like oh my god i'm like you've already been through so much hurt with somebody sure there's always that one thing that happens that literally breaks the straw of the camel's back yeah that's how i am in relationships like i'll give and i'll give and i'll give yeah and then if something happened it could be the fucking smallest thing which that was a big thing for you but it could be the smallest thing and i'll be like i'll never talk to this person again yeah exactly you know yeah well we ended up talking yeah i know you guys are just like glutton for punishment it's just because you guys really loved each other and i really feel like we could always feel the chemistry between travis and you like it was just real it was i feel like you and travis are going both of you are going to be searching for that connection that you guys have for the rest of your lives whether you guys i'm still searching for it yeah yeah i'm single so yeah i mean but men are men and you know him and his other situation could be very happy and you know whatever but it's just when you have a love like that with somebody it's very hard to ever yes for sure yeah it's a once in a lifetime kind of a love thank you yeah absolutely so even after he hurt you you still went back we got back together and i'll never forget it was the first he got out of the hospital but he was still like on a lot of medications and very and still healing and um and he wanted to go to a restaurant and i i said okay and i remember watching him it was the first time i had seen him since i stopped going to the hospital and he got out of the car grabbed alabama and he took her out of the car and he looked fucked up like he just looked like he has been through it you know he had like a beard and you know and and but i and i remember him grabbing our daughter and i just was like that's it i'm done like i'm going to heal this family i'm going to heal this marriage i'm going to let all this shit go and all this hurt and this pain and these affairs and everything and i'm going to love this man and i'm going to make this family right and that's what i tried to do i um i like cooked for him and i helped give his medications and i wiped his balls and i changed his dressings and i was there for him you know and um and he just was like convinced because of the gerard butler that i like cheated on him you know he's convinced that i did that stop being a scorpio travis yeah like just convinced and he just like you know and we were trying to date again but we just like there's just so much water there was just so much water there was just so much water and i was like i'm gonna go to the and we just couldn't we just we couldn't do it and um but we we ended up living together you know and like was it just as friends were you guys so fucking like co-parents you know like but were you guys still banging and like no but we were just so in love with each other but couldn't just didn't want to let go didn't know how to do it and um so and we wanted to like you know be like there for our kids and so we lived together like a couple i think till like almost 2014 wow you know and until i i met a my ex-boyfriend and i was like oh my god i'm gonna go to the hospital and i'm gonna boyfriend brian who's a hell's angel and uh and then i got kind of serious with him and then i was like okay i don't think we should be living together anymore like we're not together you don't want to work on this i can't be living with you like you know like you should have your days and i should have my days and we did what was like a nesting agreement where at first we you know we lived together all the time and then we did where the kids stayed in one house and then i would go to the house like monday to wednesday and then he would go to the house like you know wednesday to sunday and then you know and then we would go to the house like you know wednesday to sunday and then but the kids would stay in the same place and we would go from our houses to that one house i love how the kids were always the focal point though for sure like always whatever happened no matter what we've been through we're gonna try to fucking make this work that i mean that was the one thing and to this day it's the one thing that he and i agree on is our kids and just trying to give them the best life possible absolutely yeah so you move on he moves on yeah is it over from there so from yeah it's over i mean i stopped talking to him about around 2014 and we started following each other right before he and courtney i don't know how long they've been together maybe two or three years i'm not sure um and then uh when he got with courtney we we we stopped even just being cordial we we co-parent you know if there's some i mean my my oldest daughter's 24 she doesn't you know people still shit on me to this day like raise your kids i'm like i have a grown adult like i have my daughter is 24 years old like you know she's a young adult so like i don't like need to rear her anymore you know like you know like i don't need to rear her change her fucking diapers like you're like i already had a baby yeah my son is 20 years old 24 i'm like he's living with his girlfriend what do you want me to do go what a handsome kid he's they're both just so cute all of them are so beautiful thank you so much i'm really proud of them and i'm he's so talented they're all talented and then alabama she's gonna be 18 you know on christmas eve this month so it's like she is your fucking twin yeah she's and and internally too she's like me you know she's she has that tenacity and doesn't give a fuck and just yeah it's so ambitious and like you know people hate on her i mean you want to talk about bullying a fucking kid that kid has got it since she was 12 and she does not care yeah yeah i mean she's been raised in it yeah so it's like it's probably second skin to her you know yeah yeah but still no child deserves to be bullied like that no child yeah ever absolutely yeah how does it make you feel whenever they did take to like public platforms and kind of talk shit about how you didn't raise them and stuff like that were you guys just a heated argument and it was kid shit or i feel at Travis got with Courtney there was like some parental alienation going on there where you know I you have to understand too you know Travis even when we weren't together always wanted to be the super dad I'm the best parent I'm the this and then I'm like bro you win like you're the winner here like you have all the money and you have all the this like you you're the winner you know give the drummer some you know you win like I'm not competing with you you know like but I think you know when the Kardashians first came around they were enamored just as like young kids would be enamored by them and I think there was a lot of glitter and fame and you know they watched him on TV and now their dad's dating one and they're gonna be on the show and you know and I think they got caught up and that you know which young kids would do yeah and you know they're buying a Prada and they're buying them gifts and they're going to these events and they're meeting Kanye and they're you know the all this big stuff and I can't give them that right I don't have that I don't have access to that I don't have the money to do that I can't buy you guys Prada every you know other week and stuff I don't I can't do it and my house isn't a mansion like Travis I don't have a movie theater I don't have golf carts for you kids to drive around dad yeah you know he's everything you know and um uh and so i think comments were made and i think they were influenced and um and it was hurtful and it was you know and it was like you know and i've had conversations with them since and they you know they've apologized but i'm not going to take one comment that my angry teenage kid says to me and and now all of a sudden 24 hours i'm a fucking deadbeat mom no like they all know i'm not we all know the truth i go to bed at night i sleep very very well um with who i am as a woman and as a mother and how i raised my children and you know and and i think now as time's marching on i think they're seeing things and they're realizing and as they become young adults they're like yeah they see they see through things that they didn't before yeah no i get it teenagers will be teenagers i went through it with our daughter who's going to be 16 yeah yeah you know she she was like yeah we went through a yeah yeah i mean what fucking teenage girl gets along with their mom yeah yeah you know very rarely very very rarely and i you know and at one point i just was like you know what the the difference between a lot of people is you know that shit was all getting played out in the press with one of the biggest most powerful families in the world you know and i'm i don't and and they're a they're a media machine they own the fucking media yeah i don't so i just got fucking hammered and bullied and just you know and over my fucking kids who does that who does that to someone over and to with their own children fuck you that family you're disgusting i have so they haven't ever been welcoming to you no and i would never ever want to know them ever like and you know and i'm tired of people shitting on me i don't have to like that fucking family right people do not have to like that family you don't like just because the media shoves them down your throat does not mean that you have to like that there are people that don't like that family don't watch that fucking show and don't give a fuck what there are people that don't care i don't fucking care and i'm not afraid of them and i don't like them but what i did do is i removed myself i removed myself so that they couldn't let my they couldn't bond with my children over hating me and i removed myself and i took a step back and i was like you know what go do what you guys need to do and when you're ready i will be here loving you unconditionally and i will be here as your mother and i will wait and that's what i did that's what a real mom does yeah you gotta let your kids kind of fall and um you know figure it out for themselves because in the end they'll respect you more than trying to control the narrative exactly you know so yeah yeah good so you're you're so everybody the relationship is great yes they're doing good yes they're doing good and uh everything everything you know this year like i said it's been a little little rocky for me with the loss of my parents and um you know and i had a another pretty bad breakup and yeah let's move on to that so matthew you're talking about matthew yeah matthew that was a public breakup also that was a public breakup too you guys were together for um three years almost three years yeah yeah and i love him i love him very much yeah yeah i'll always i'll always really care and love him we quarantined together and you know there's something about yeah i remember watching you guys with someone i was watching your stories during oh god we were so drunk we were you know we just talked actually like last night and we were laughing about quarantine like we were like wow we really did the damn thing so are you guys friends and you're friends now because i'm working on being friends it's probably got to be hard to get back with somebody who has slandered you in the public eye the way that he did too yeah it's like you can't trust i'm just so used to being slandered at this point by everybody i'm like i just like i'm like whatever you're like what who else wants to shit on me let's bring it let's go you know so yeah yeah um so you guys split and you guys are definitely just not yeah he's on the east coast and i'm on the west coast and you know i don't know what i'm doing in life right now i'm just kind of like floating and kind of just putting my my my journey in the hands of god and in the universe because i i've just i've suffered so much loss this year that i really don't know and i really don't even career-wise i don't even know what i want to do and i'm not i'm not stressing myself out about it i'm just kind of um allowing myself grace and to heal you know you deserve a break thanks you have been going at it since you were a teenager you know pageants pregnancy divorces drama like you spent a ride you probably need to take two years of just peace and healing and sitting be still yeah you know i get a lot of my fan base is a lot of women who are divorced and single or going through breakups and you know they ask me like how how do you do it how do you you know and it's like you just kind of feel it you just got to feel that pain and you got to feel that hurt and and it's not fun and it's uncomfortable and you know i tell some of my some of my fans like you know some days i get up and i make a coffee and that's a good day no you know that's a good day i got up and you know i was able to do that for myself you know so now it's like that's all i'm doing is i'm just trying to like just heal you have a lot of hurt and i can see it in your eyes whenever you talk about it do you do therapy have you considered going to no i don't like i don't like therapy i don't like it but i um i i definitely am doing the self-work and you know the shadow work i definitely do do that i mean i do a lot of um meditations um meditation saves me yeah yeah i do lots of um visualization and meditations i do a lot of journaling i do i do a lot of like you know self-centering work and and i know i'll get through it i'll overcome it but i think with the losing my mother and father that was like my that's where i went to heal you know that's where i went and so i have to kind of learn how to heal without that and that in itself is its own journey i feel like you are always there for everybody else and who's ever there for yeah it's okay but it's not like it and like you know we can laugh about it and smile through our pain but at the same time it's like you deserve to be able to just take time off and just you know fall in love with yourself absolutely yeah just fucking do what you gotta do to fucking just yeah at this point you've raised your babies exactly you're good yeah like you've done the mom you've done the acting you've done everything and i still have you know i still believe in love and i still have hope like you know i i think there is that person like out there for me and mar i love marriage um but i i definitely know that i don't want to go into another relationship broken i want to be like healed and i want to you know you know the next relationship i do get into i want it to be one where i understand boundaries and i understand communication and and all that stuff and and break this that that sort of narcissistic cycle yeah you know you sweet baby well shana it has been amazing talking to you thank you so much you have such a great story dude thank you thank you i feel like like we're best friends now yeah absolutely i feel like we've had moments before i even met you but you just you give that energy too i love that yeah it's awesome i appreciate that and i want you to come back come back and visit me and sit on this podcast and talk about whatever you want i'm excited you're awesome next and thank you thank you you know like you're just you're a precious commodity to the world and i want you to know that thank you why don't you tell everybody where they can find you at yeah you can find me pretty much on all social media platforms it's just my name so at shana mochler um on instagram and wait we forgot to talk about one thing okay you have an only fans i do have an only fans yes we gotta make mama money yeah make yes go visit my only fans yes um yeah i i i love it i don't do anything like uh pornographic um i don't like i don't masturbate but god if you did yeah you would probably i made my i made millions on of i could only imagine if you fucking went down yeah yeah would you ever go down that road or no i don't know no i don't think it's like for me but i i do like what i basically like playboy style stuff you know i do like customs you know and things like that but i don't um i don't get too crazy on there yeah but i have a lot of fun and i chat and talk and um yeah i have a i have a lot of fun on there all right good but you know and i you know and i think only fans isn't as as it used to be and especially with only fans tv i do pageant stuff on only fans tv you know so yeah you know i'm teaching girls like interview skills on there so i love it yeah it's cool i just had to make sure that thank you yes and yeah you can go to my only fans it's shana mochler onlyfans.com at shana mochler and my instagram is at shana mochler my uh twitter threads everything we got to get you on tiktok you need to be more active on tiktok i just am starting so i would love to learn we got you from you guys yeah if you please teach me like got you what works because i do not know and i'm not even verified on there i don't even know oh you will once you start getting more active and getting more views they'll verify you for sure there's no reason why they wouldn't verify you okay cool okay i'm like but i'm learning and bamma just like laughs at me i'm like how do i do this just be yourself yeah literally that's exactly what bamma does she just gets on there and does her makeup thing yeah yeah i'm gonna try i'm gonna do a live on there this month since i can't do one on instagram so i'm gonna do a live on there start moving your instagram over to tiktok okay too like they all talk to themselves but tiktok is it'll grow your business tenfold it'll be insane yeah you guys have masters have to teach teach me please teach me we got you baby thank you so much for coming by thank you for having me i really appreciate you yeah thank you guys for tuning in to another episode of dumb blonde i will see you guys next week bye you Thank you. 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