‘Shampoo’ With Bill Simmons, Cameron Crowe, and Sean Fennessey

This episode is brought to you by Ethos. As a parent, life insurance feels like a no-brainer and just gives me peace of mind knowing my family will be taken care of and Ethos makes getting it fast and easy. Apply online in minutes. Get up to $3 million in coverage with no medical exam, just a few simple health questions. Take 10 minutes to get covered today with life insurance through Ethos. Get your free quote at ethos.com slash rewatch. That is E-T-H-O-S.com slash rewatch. Application times may vary, rates may vary. The Rewatchables is brought to you by the Ringer Podcast Network where you can find the big picture with Sean Fantasy. Oscar season. Yeah, sure. What's your leading contender now for best picture? One battle after another. Okay. That's the favorite? I think so. All right. Cameron Crowe is here. You've never done The Rewatchables. I have not. You've had movies on The Rewatchables, including a movie we haven't done yet that is the most. I'm almost asked why haven't you done this yet movie, Almost Famous, but as I always tell people, it'll be the last movie we do. It's asked not just by fans of the show, but by many employees of The Ringer. When are we doing Almost Famous? It's also the one that the most people who work for The Ringer have demanded to be on, which is really going to cause some problems, but regardless. And you have a new book, The Uncool. I do. But let me thank you for the honor of The Almost Famous Rewatchables Pantheon spot. It's the last one. It's the walk-off Homer. But we asked you. I didn't want to have you on my real podcast because you've already been on it. I have. I was like, yeah, I do The Rewatchables. Delightfully, I must say. Really enjoyed it. Asked you for a pick, and you picked Shampoo. And we're going to do that next. This episode of The Rewatchables is presented by State Farm. Whether you're debating watching that award-winning sports drama or re-watching your comfort buddy comedy movie for the 10th time, choices are important. When it comes to choosing coverage, a State Farm agent can help you find options that are right for you. Go online at statefarm.com or use the award-winning app to get help from one of their local agents like a good neighbor. State Farm is there. All right. Shampoo came out in 1975. This was your pick. Why? I really started coming on to movies that I didn't know about. That spoke to the era that I felt we were in. And I loved Mike Nichols' movie, you know, The Graduate and Carnal Knowledge and stuff. But Shampoo kind of bubbled up into this place where the music was great. I loved the interconnection between the characters. And I just thought, like, here's a new generation really in play of movie makers that I'm going to love. And I've gone back through it over the years. It's fun to talk about. I chose it for us. So how old were you when Shampoo comes out? Are you in high school yet? I think 18. Yeah. Okay. And it was iconic in the moment, you know, because Warren Beatty, who was known to be a womanizer and stuff, a ladies' man par excellence, was playing this hairdresser who was using the fact that he was a straight hairdresser to, you know, sleep with, you know, all the women in his friend group. And the complications that happened as a result of that, I just thought, like, like, magnificently handled by Robert Towne. Hal Ashby was already my favorite director. So this was the third in a run for Hal Ashby that starts with Harold and Maude. So it's Harold and Maude, last detail, and then Shampoo. And you're like, wow, this guy can do a ton of different stuff. The actors love him. The words are great. And the music is epic. So I bring it into the lair to discuss. Good music. Sean, what's your relationship with this movie? I was negative seven years old when the film was released. So I don't have that same in-the-moment connection to it. But the 1970s is my favorite period of American filmmaking. Hal Ashby is one of my favorite filmmakers as well. Robert Towne is also in the middle of an insane run. And so, like, when you're getting your film education as a young person, as I was probably a teenager when I really started diving in all these movies, this is one of the big signposts. This is one of the big and one of the most meaningful generational movies because it's a huge hit. Yeah, yeah. It's politically relevant. It's sexually and socially relevant. It's a huge movie star movie. And a movie star persona movie. Some movies are actively riffing on their persona. So it's got all this squishy, fun stuff to dig into as a fan. And it's also just very watchable and funny. You know, it's not a slog. It's not difficult in any way. It's not homework. It's a popcorn movie. It's not about its time, which is a very hard thing to pull off. So I've always really liked it. And I'm stoked we're talking about it. It's funny characters. Really funny characters. Well, I go through the teenager with cable version of the arc of this movie where you watch it the first time and it's like, these women are hot. Is there going to be some nudity? Can they show more of the sex scene? And then you get older and you're like, this movie's really. Then you get into, you go to college and you get into that. I'm now a film critic. I now have thoughts on how they make films. It's like, well, there's some really interesting choices in here. But you're thinking like, ah, this guy's trying to get laid. It's a really funny movie. And then as you get a little older, you're like, ah, there's some layers to this. And now I watch this in my 50s and it's not a sex comedy at all. It's really about the late 60s and all of these different things going on. It's all stealth underneath. And it's so cool how it's pretending to be three different movies when it's really the fourth movie. That's really well said. And the way he lays in politics and Nixon's being reelected the night of all this and it's just, there's no dogma. There's no like, you know, hitting it on the head with the, the generation is changing. It's like, it's just there. He's just like, Nixon is in scenes and stuff and actively like in a scene you can just see him. He's so large that he's right in there with Beatty. It's brilliant. So you have Nixon in there, but you also, it's like what you said about with, they're not overt about this generation does not fit in with this younger generation. It's the little stuff like Jack Warden, should I go in the hot tub? Yeah, come on in dude. And he's like, he's just fumbling around. It's so funny to watch him at the party just awkwardly fit in. I don't, I don't feel like movies do that enough anymore where they, they'll try to bang you over the head with it versus like this very subtle. But that's kind of the point of the movie, right? The point of the movie is all of this stuff is happening. Right. The world is happening and unfolding and decisions about how power operates is happening. But in Beverly Hills and in 1970, in 1968 and today, people, myself included, are just, just trying to get through their day. They've got their own concerns. They've got their own shit going on. They're trying to open salons. You know, they're trying to record podcasts. Like I got a lot of stuff I got to do. I can't actually participate civically in the way that maybe I should be. And it's, it's like it's empathetic about that struggle, but also most of the characters are kind of buffoonish in a way too. Like, and it, it likes them, but it also sees that they're really flawed. And, it's trying to balance this very delicate thing of it's not trying to hector you about what your politics should be. It's not trying to hector the characters about their failure to identify those things because it's, everyone has kind of, you know, been somehow invoked in this. But, you do walk away watching it a second or third time thinking like, hmm, we're, we're a little, we're like a little fucked. You know, like there's definitely, it does have a kind of, there's a very bummer ending in this movie that is very, really interesting to talk about too. So, it's not just a sex comedy, and it's not just a political observation. It is this weird fusion, this mutant idea that is very rare in movies, I think. Is it, is it a Bravura performance from Beatty? Or is it, is it quietly Bravura? This is the thing that I always wonder because it's so kind of like, huh, he floats through these scenes. He has great stuff to say, but like, it's kind of like, well, some say that's what he was like in that, in that, in the day. Just his, his seduction is in fact how he's kind of slightly bewildered by what's happening. But I'm incredibly handsome that like, help me figure out how I'm going to sleep with you. I'm just, I got other things that are bothering me and, you know, and it's like, they all fall for it. Yeah, I wonder, he's one of those actors where you don't know where the person stops and the actor begins. Like, huge for that. Basically, Heaven Can Wait, which we did a few months ago on Rewatchables. I'm not sure there's any difference with this character and Joe Pennelly because I think he just kind of bleeds into whoever he's doing. But I think this is what he's really like. Women liked him. He was always stumbling from one place to the next. Like, when he made this movie, apparently he didn't have, he just bought a house. He didn't even have anywhere to live. Right. And he would just bounce around and have these different relationships. He's living in a hotel, right? The Beverly Wilshire. Right. So this guy's on a Triumph motorcycle. He's dating like five people at once and he's just kind of bouncing around. I think that was him. It's hard to know if he's incredibly enigmatic or extremely clear to us. Like, because he's only given five movie performances in the last 40 years. I mean, he doesn't really work very often. It's usually only in films that he directs. He didn't direct this movie, but he clearly had a huge hand in making it. Huge, right. And so, it does seem like in this movie, in Heaven Can Wait, a little less so in Reds and in Dick Tracy, but even in Bullworth, it's kind of the similar persona that you're talking about. The sort of like bumbling person in charge. But he looks like Warren Buffett Beatty. and so like some great stars are like that with the hairdo yeah well he's very handsome dude tall strong like not like I worked out with a personal trainer to do like you can see in some of the scenes like there's a physicality to him and you can kind of see it with every woman like ah they're not going to be able to resist this guy which I think is a really hard place to get to like even in Almost Famous like Russell Hammond had that you could be like I see it I totally I would not want to leave my girlfriend alone with this guy for 10 minutes like some people had that but that was basically Beatty's entire 70s where you're like I see it no question he gives himself like a showcase moment in the bathroom scene where he's like you know cutting Felicia's is it Felicia? Jackie so he's cutting Jackie's hair but he gives himself a moment where he preens just a little bit you see the physique you see this like freaking belt and his turquoise and his necklace and everything and his ass is in the mirror reflected behind it's like yeah it shows a little ass crack okay we get this it's three seconds but you know you're here for the three seconds and you know what you're trying to do and so it's fascinating there's a cool little easter egg of a piece of information that I thought I'd share with you guys so Paul Simon was like the hottest guy around at that time for doing you know a song for a movie like Sounds of Silence Graduate all that stuff so Beatty really was looking for a song to end the movie but he was also looking for a score from Paul Simon and I guess we can look it up but I guess there was quite a dance to get the new song from Paul Simon or the new score but ultimately all he came up with was do-do-do which plays throughout the movie in every possible way it's just but it's just do-do-do that's all it is it's very strange it's very strange so meanwhile I guess Beatty is dating or is about to date Joni Mitchell and he asks Joni Mitchell for a song and Joni Mitchell writes a song called Sweet Bird as in Sweet Bird of Youth that it that references kind of the iconography of Beatty and Splendor in the Grass I mean it's a it's a seriously insightful song about the persona and the character and he heard it and he's like ha ha no no no no no no no no great song not great for this movie and if you listen to the song and think about what the power of a song like that would have been over the last scene it's not the bumbling guy it's the movie would know that that was a persona under which was incredible insecurity and doubt but he was like no no no no don't need that song in the movie I'll take do-do-do right oh that's great it's fascinating and so well didn't Carly Simon write You're So Vain too about him supposedly yeah that was always the rumor yeah well if you get too real good song not for me I think if you were an attractive celebrity in the 70s you definitely climbed in the ring with Beatty at least one night and were circled by him I don't know if anything happened I think he I think he there was always a moment where he's probably like oh you haven't met you yet how are you I'm Warren Beatty and just did the Warren Beatty thing and then I mean in this movie he's breaking up with Julie Christie he's starting to date Michelle Phillips who had just broken up with Jack Nicholson he's propositioning everybody in the like he's just but I think he did it in the same way that the Shampoo character does it where it's it never feels like he's right going for it it's just kind of oh I do oh my and then he's stumbling into yet another another thing it's so funny too because I think a lot of critics and academics read the movie as kind of an end of the free love era correct you know 68 being this critical time and everything that's coming soon but Warren Beatty is still living in the free love era at this time yeah Pesky is still living it hasn't closed for him so he said the book that was written about him which is really good by Biskin it's called Star Beatty's explanation for the movie was Vietnam polarized the town Shampoo's audience was the audience that didn't want to go to war that used every means to end the war then Watergate destroyed authority in the country ended trust in politicians what Shampoo had to say was our generation at the time had to say about America which is we're not being honest about the way we're governed our leaders are not being honest we're not honest about what we stand for we're not honest I don't think the people today remember very clearly the heat of political passion that existed during this period now nobody gives a shit now he said this 15, 20 years ago interesting kind of kind of still the case to some degree right interesting like to me the big theme of this movie is selling out right it's people that absolutely maybe they could shape what's happening but they're like they're kind of good with their lives I like my house yeah I'll end up with Jack Ward and even though he's way older than me and I'm still in love with this other guy but I'll have a better life with this person that to me is the theme of the movie yeah and Jill Goldie Hawn's character really ends up being the one that like pries herself out of that cycle in a cool way we never know in the movie the guy with the mustache yeah Tony Bell what is it Johnny Pope Johnny Pope the giraffe with the neckerchief but we never know if she sleeps with him we never know if she gets the job to go to Egypt that he's dangling all we know is that she she opts out of the of the the baby stew of people who are selling out to one degree or another and it's interesting because even as a little guy seeing it I knew that Goldie Hawn's character was my favorite character even though he he doesn't really profess love to her in the movie and it's just kind of subtly put in there that that that she takes off and in a heroic way and actually is the only truth-telling character to George like she's the one that says you are not real you're a phony be true to yourself and he just he not only doesn't he take it he really doesn't take it and barely is believable when he professes a kind of love to her later in the movie it's an interesting character but I think Goldie steals the movie she's great she's the only non-cynic in the movie every other character has has been betrayed or been lied to in a way that was so unforgivable that they then have like metastasized it she still feels like she's pure she's at the beginning of something so maybe well she gets the only real answer out of him right he's like yeah I just like having sex with people like yeah all of them guilty yeah I fucked them all yeah well I have to ask because there's there's definitely a lot of DNA tissue for Almost Famous right where you have there's a big party scene there's Goldie Hawn you have the daughter who Goldie Hawn I think would have been Penny Lane 25 years earlier no question you have the selling out piece like what it's like obviously you see this movie you love it when you're 18 and then that stuff gets sprinkled when you have the ability to make a movie but what did you take from it well I'll tell you there great question when Goldie Hawn Jill discovers the earring you know in an early scene and realizes that that he's fucking all of the people right everyone's in play you guys that moment and I didn't even realize until I watched Shampoo again recently the moment where Goldie Hawn goes through the realization cycle is so much like Kate in Almost Famous what kind of beer right and I wanted that kind of moment and didn't even realize that I was going for a moment that her mother had patented in that movie because he leaves the camera on her he lets you know Ashby leaves the camera on Goldie and lets her go through it and it's fucking amazing and Kate does it too and Kate's also great in her new movie this Song Song Blue movie she channels the same kind of reality as Goldie in Shampoo she's great it's so funny that Kate like basically is replicating this Goldie persona it's almost like when Kobe was like I love Michael Jordan I'm just gonna you know but in this case they're related so it makes way more sense but it's just funny like I was watching Goldie Hawn in this movie thinking like Kate probably could have been the character in this movie right I don't know another another parent daughter slash son thing where the people you could just see them switching parts for like 10 years of movies basically Rachel Benson starts podcasting that's when it's gonna happen my son takes my job wait can we go back to Beatty for one second let's do it so we did this a little bit in the last Heaven Can Wait it's about like how aware he was of who he was and what he should be in a movie and what he shouldn't be in a movie like there's stuff like did he ever really get in a fist fight with anybody in a movie was he ever a bad guy there's a struggle in the parallax view right in the apartment I can remember yeah he always was kind of close to himself but we did this the last time all the movies he turned down he turned down in the Sundance Kid Michael Corleone Gordon Gekko oh wow Jack Horne Jack Horne he turned down in The Sting Great Gatsby Superman Splash Big turned down Dave Indecent Proposal which I think would have been great Kill Bill and Kill Bill and Misery that's all in 20 years he turned all those down because he was like he was almost like he didn't want to take risks he would have been great in like 90% of those too you can see why the writers and filmmakers wanted him for those parts so interesting if he's in Indecent Proposal that movie's amazing yeah because it's like amazing she might not come back like this could be amazing wow and then the other one he did that that he's actually in that's really fascinating that I might want to do on rewatchables at some point is Truth or Dare when he's dating Madonna and he's in there as Warren Beatty like kind of interacting with her world and he's so confused by it not a performance though but a performance like you can you can measure but like you can measure what his screen persona is against that documentary and the fact that there is not such a wide barrier between those two things so what's his best what's his number one performance for you oh wow um Sean's gonna go stealth with his pick I'm just warning you I'm gonna I'm gonna go Shampoo I just I like it yeah yeah I really like it I think his best movie acting is probably Reds and it feels the furthest away from what he actually is um that's a good point and he holds that big movie like that on his shoulders but I would rather watch this movie any day of the week I love Parallax View as well yeah I would go Shampoo as well only because I can't imagine anyone else playing this part and he lassoes that thing that we're talking about and he's also running the movie right yeah at the same time there is no movie without him right he's in all of the movie so I love it I need to know more about his relationship with Ashby making the movie I wonder if it was you know there's a lot of good stuff written about that in the two Biskin books about um hard to tell how much he took over the movie but he definitely did and it felt like on the set there's too many it didn't sound like a very happy set and there was multiple people kind of weighing in and then I think Ashby everybody would always say like the editing was like the he was just the master in the editing room and that was probably where he had the biggest impact on it but it sounded like on the set have you ever had a situation like that where you're making a movie and somebody you're making the movie you don't have to say who it was but somebody that you're making the movie with had kind of too big of a voice or tried to have too big of a voice yeah it's happened yeah and you know you take a walk with the person and you talk to him about it or you know have a beer afterwards and talk to them and just you know be a player coach and just like you know give me your opinions let's talk about all of it I'm a really collaborative person but it can it doesn't have to spill into a public jousting you know right I can't believe Cruz did this like what a dick you know what I can say he actually was the furthest away from this because when he had agreed to Jerry Maguire well actually when we were talking about him for Jerry Maguire like all my friends were whispering like oh you know you just the keys to the kingdom go to him immediately you know that you'll barely get a parking space this is like it's gone you don't have it anymore yeah he'll be in your movie but you know you can stay home it's like these were the kind of raps that I got but when Cruz read the script he called and said I love this script I really relate to this guy he was in England doing Eyes Wide Shut and he said how about if I fly out there and just read it for you guys and you can tell me if you like it so I called all my friends back and said he wants to audition and they're like well he's cool and he's like the most famous under 35 actor in the world at this point yeah and he did fly in and he sat in a chair and he read it out loud for us and we were like holy fuck I was playing Magic Bus by the Who the song that opens the movie and he's reading it and it was just like the voice in my head when I wrote it except better and immediately and maybe he just knew this that you know giving you a taste of that you were going to do everything you possibly could to keep him in the part and make the movie and that's the movie and then the business of it all happens which is pretty easy but he was not going to spackle himself into a project that he didn't feel was right for everybody involved he's you know he's a guy who's at the top of the call sheet who isn't the person that tries to influence everything he says I don't want to be a director but I'll show up you know on off days to do you know off camera stuff where I'm not even on camera for Jay Moore or someone like that and their minds are blown because he knows their lines and his lines too that's who he is it's oh go ahead I have a question about Jerry Maguire related to Shampoo so one of the things that's really interesting about this movie is that it's a recent history movie it's like it's set seven years in the past but it's essentially it's attempting to capture something that we understand Jerry Maguire is like very similar it's a present day movie something you were creating a world that had to be really close to our world for people to buy it and that feels really hard to do like Shampoo does it really well the Beverly Hills of 1968 which still kind of looks like the Beverly Hills of right now it feels like a real place shot on location like Jerry Maguire feels like it's happening in the world of sports and sports agencies like how do you do that how do you make something feel real I think like try and get the details right like do your best to have the little things at the corners of the scenes be accurate well you're like a 10 out of 10 maniac for that though I mean you're like all time you would get every single detail possible that's why it takes so long to like put the movies together because the research phase is so seductive it's like I can talk to one more person I can talk about like you know can you go crazy doing that though being like oh the cocktail napkins aren't right in the hotel rooms in 1974 the cocktail napkins actually were red they actually made me feel that way when we were doing Almost Famous because there were these crowd shots San Diego Sports Arena for Stillwater and stuff and the audience there was a bunch of the audience there and we're going to be on camera and a lot of them are doing this you know like the devil horns and that didn't exist in 1973 that was like Van Halen era so I'm like we gotta shoot this again guys let me talk to the crowd let me talk to the crowd I'm gonna go hey guys it's Cameron I'm the director just want to let you know like this didn't happen in 1973 now meanwhile the guys are standing around like whoever's there visiting from the studio and the people making the movie they're doing this look yeah what a jerk talking about fingers on the extras and then they say that thing to you this is the thing that they say which is so not true if they're paying attention to that you're lost you know but they are paying attention to that I'm paying attention to that yeah they didn't know YouTube and the rewatchables and all of our podcasts were coming yeah you lose me if you've got that going on they had no idea I would watch Almost Famous 350 times but I will and I would have noticed just wait till we get to one of my nitpicks and shampoo it's gonna blow your brain I have one nitpick where I'm like I can't believe they did this one thing on on Beatty and Cruise that I was thinking as you were talking about that it seems like the biggest stars and I think Beatty in the mid 70s is in the conversation for biggest star he's at least one of the people mentioned for sure but it seems like they had this force all of them have a force of personality in different ways that the people talk about them what it was like on the set or in the books that are written after so Cruise's is always like that dude's just fucking gung ho he's all in he's ready to do anything it takes and then you have some of the other people are like yeah he's method actor didn't really want to talk to anyone on the set you know like he would throw himself in the character and the implication is oh he seemed like kind of a dick and then Beatty's like always involved in the movies he's making so he's like a boss but he's also an actor I think that's like the hardest one to navigate it's gotta be you're ordering people around but you're also in the movie but you're not the director but is he ordering them around like a Beatty character totally I don't know there's something a lot of passive aggressive off about this the third act I don't know I don't know I mean I gotta re-read Biscuit and just get more of a taste of that it does seem like he seduces with a lot of ease that's what they say that he draws people in and says do this Biscuit writes a lot about how he would draw people in for not as much money as maybe they were worth to do things he had an ability to convince people to you know Julie Christie and Goldie Hawn and all these people who were if not already huge stars you know rising stars making a movie for this low budget that is like gonna be a huge smash and how much are they making on those movies all that stuff is kind of interesting about his ability to do that but also he kind of loves the seduction like he takes a long time to figure out what kind of movie he's gonna make and then Robert Towne says that once he starts he's like a maniac once he's working on the movie he's obsessed but he'll take years just developing and chewing over the idea that he comes up with and they say that thing of like when he looks at you you're the only person in the world but you know I'm just remembering this now I had the good fortune to write this book on Billy Wilder and spend this time around Billy and Billy passed away and one of the first people that said let me be a part of this memorial Warren Beatty and he did show up and he was not George from Shampoo he was like what can we do for Billy so maybe that's a little bit of the guy who decided on the movie because he was straight ahead I'll tell you another little story that I'm just remembering now which is wild when Almost Famous came out we had a bad opening weekend we actually got beaten by a reissue of The Exorcist so a movie from 1973 slaughtered our movie about 1973 which was you know brutal and so I was getting like 75 phone calls a day and everything was really exciting then the opening weekend comes out things start to taper down then the LA Times did a story about the budget of Almost Famous and it was a nasty little story about he spent so much money and he did a lot of takes I hate when they do that you were just We were just complaining about this recently. These assholes. out no calls the day that article comes out and we're all sitting around the office and we're like oh shit man nobody came to see the movie the la times is like kicking shit on us this is really a drag and the phone rings it's like nine at night and we're still there in the office because we're too despondent to leave yeah it's annette benning and she says hi it's it's it's annette benning is cameron there it's like yeah we're just here weeping um and she goes um i i want to put warren on oh and warren baity comes on the phone he goes look i don't really know you he goes but i just want you to know you made a great movie and there's no actor in town that wouldn't want to work with you i just wanted to tell you that and he hung up wow i'm gonna just start cold calling people it's on their worst day cold cold calling podcasts people have failed hey it's bill keep plugging away you're good they'll always remember you that must have carried you for like a month after that it did and you know what when when we won the oscar for best screenplay yeah i went to the vanity fair party and as i was getting there baity and annette were leaving and i i saw annette i was like hey it's cameron thank you for that call and she's like warren warren get back here and uh and he came back and he shook my hand like see what i said came true and walked away what a great story look at look at what you did how did you not lead with that yeah that's amazing so weird because it it was lodged in there but we're so focused on shampoo that i forgot my own um kind of baity moment that happened um which which was not like george well and one of the few guys with the weight that i mean how many actors in the last 50 years if you get that call you've just your entire year is changed that's this person liked your movie and i and i i don't say this to diminish him at all but i do wonder if uh he is as understood as one of the key participants creators of this period of american movies because he didn't make as many movies yeah and he hasn't made as many movies in the 21st century and so obviously what we're doing here celebrates what he contributed but he doesn't you know when red for past he's like too short it's i agree there's there's just like it's kind of important to locate his legacy because he did more on individual movies than most of his contemporaries as well as a producer as a writer eventually as a director and as like a conceiver of the projects yeah you know he really he didn't just wait for someone to call him to say do you want to be in my movie and he's distinct in that way i think from almost every single one of his contemporaries right i mean i don't know who else really transitioned as clearly i mean i guess you could say woody allen is in that conversation doesn't seem like anyone turned him down if he wanted you for the movie you just did the movie yeah yeah biskin had this interesting theory that i don't know if i agree with but he thinks he thinks baity was um george and lester and that was part of the reason he wanted to the movie because these were he fancied himself as the sharp businessman with the great house by the way he bought this awesome house apparently as he was making this movie and this wheeler dealer and you know but at the same time he was also george the hairdresser just trying to get laid wow i don't buy that he certainly he certainly makes a mini hero out of lester yeah lester comes out you don't hate him at the end no well it's also jack warden is jack warden yeah born free he also has this he's this quote in the movie that's really funny as long as i can remember when i see a pretty girl and i go after and i make her it's like i'm gonna live forever and that's where you're like i don't know who's saying that are you the character are you weren't baity could be either um all right we're gonna talk about some of the other components of this movie when you shop kroger delivery you can expect the savings you love and fresh groceries delivered right to your door our refrigerated trucks keep your items cool while our associates are committed to getting every detail right carefully selecting and packing your order with care because bringing you fresh quality groceries is what we do best right now enjoy free delivery on orders of fifty dollars or more with your digital coupon restrictions apply c-site for details kroger fresh for everyone julie christie they dated for a long time they made three movies together mccabe and mrs miller which sean owns and five different forms of physical media i do yeah did they have that in 8k uhd yet or no just in 4k but just in 4k great shampoo heaven can wait they broke up in 1974 famous relationship there's all kinds of good stories supposedly they were on the outs because she made that donald sutherland movie where they may or may not have actually gotten it on in the scene yes he lost the baby lost his mind who knows what's true and not true 50 years later but they had a very long storied relationship and then she came back and worked with them again um there's nobody like her now who's her now nobody not really she's such a perfect counterpoint to his energy too yeah she's so frank direct strong you know she does have a little like brittle vulnerability but she is just the absolute awesome counterweight to him being like oh well you know i'm just kind of looking off into the distance they're great together craig had some thoughts just a just a magnificent woman just an unbelievable cocktail of intellect and sex appeal oh my god yeah and confidence and just and the accent it's like what was she missing that first scene when she comes in and she's wearing like the the long pants with the she's just so there's elegant confident just just a star of her time in shampoo dress wise hair wise amazing and darling right darling is quite the character piece yeah she's she's she's wonderful they're wonderful together um kind of heartbreaking in the best way another one that turned down some she turned down reds turned down the verdict wow which would have been oh wow a crazy part charlotte rampling part yeah yeah yeah charlotte's good it worked out yeah and then you have goldie hawn who's not quite goldie hawn yet but she's almost goldie hawn it's in sugarland express shampoo but it was like yeah i don't feel until foul play i don't feel like she could have she had done like a major movie by cactus flower and all she had done all those movies in the late 60s obviously yeah but we didn't know if she could carry an nba team to the third round of the playoffs yet yeah you're saying that's what she does here no foul play oh okay foul play foul play it's like yeah i'm here guys um she's another one that i don't there's not a lot of parallels to her either yeah do you do you think there was a big casting call thing for for that part of jill or did he always know it was goldie it seems from the research he knew he wanted to make a movie with those two i don't know what his history was with goldie i'm assuming they probably dated first but second at some point but yeah it sounds like he sought her out interesting one yeah smart smart really good with casting and her jill and jackie being friends is really interesting because goldie and julie christie's dynamics are so different yeah but you you buy it you could see that they're running in the same kind of circles right you could see that they're running in the same kind of circles right you could see that they're running in the same kind of circles right you could see that they're running in the same kind of circles right you could see that they're running in the same kind of circles there's like strikingly beautiful women do travel impacts so you know it's you you buy it julie christie had this quote that she felt bad that goldie hawn's part wasn't better and that she wondered if they should have switched parts i don't think that would have worked at all that was going to be literally my hot take is oh you want to do that now is there any is there a world where they switch parts in the movies better i don't i'm just it's the hot take so we can explore interesting yeah it is interesting it's it's different it's a side of goldie hawn we probably never saw in a movie because i think that there's a way darker jackie's a way darker character yeah yeah i don't know i think you get julie christie's rage at the end you get julie christie doing the third act in the goldie hawn part that works she couldn't do that yeah yeah yeah goldie being a little bit harder edged a little bit more cynical it would have been an interesting my question is the the persona julio has had i think she's just on to this guy immediately who he actually is whereas goldie you could see her being like fooled right for half the movie because she's like so innocent and pretty and happy and i have she's part of my hot take too later to hear town talk about it he i think he feels that like uh jill is the only one that has a future so does george does george actually get the money from lester to do the salon or is george just this is my number one unanswerable question is that just this is the is he just emotionally and spiritually dead and has given up and he too is a sellout well so here's in the i was gonna do this later in the research but apparently there was an epilogue ending oh wow town had his version baity had his version because they had these two they're developing this for seven years they have they each had their own script it was one of those things and then they finally kind of merged the scripts but they always want to have an epilogue set in 1975 and the point of the epilogue i have it somewhere was that everybody's life is still a mess and they couldn't figure out how to land the plane on it so you don't need it and they they just decided to dump it and end it with him on the little mini cliff which is a way better ending yeah but it works out perfectly because isn't it like 10 days after the film comes out that nixon resigns so like they got their The exact epilogue they needed in real life. In real time. Ashby said… The upper class is full of shit, man. You know, they don't give a fuck about anybody. They were all whores. Everybody was selling out all through that picture. That was his take on shampoo. So I think they're making this in 74. That's the height of everybody's just fed up. Watergate has already happened. People are just pissed. All the assassinations that happened in the 60s, Watergate, now people are like, all right, fuck this. I do want to shout out Amy Scott's documentary, Howl, about Hal Ashby, which is an amazing portrait of him. And that quote specifically, and him saying those words is in the movie about shampoo. There's only a limited amount of time devoted to shampoo in the movie, in part because it's not a paycheck job for Hal Ashby, but it's like a for hire thing, which most of his other films are not really like that. And his role on it is so interesting because all the other actors describe him as being extremely calm while Robert Towne and Beatty are fighting throughout the production of the movie. But then, like you said before, he's like, it's all going to be in the edit. Like, we're good. Like, basically, everybody who's on set here, there's a genius and we're going to figure this out. Like, I'm really not worried. And that turned out to be true. Like, there's not a bad performance in this movie. That documentary is great. And it convinced us to give Amy a Counting Crows doc for the music box series that we do that's going to be on an HBO later this month. Okay. Yeah, it's really good. Well done, well done. Jack Worden, quickly. Oh my God. Just a powerhouse. From 75 to 82, shampoo, all the president's men, heaven can wait, the champ, injustice for all, being there, used cars, and the verdict. Just ripping them off. Yeah, ripping them off. Pretty good. Heaters. Heaters across the board. Across the board. Did Lester have to be a little bit more evil or was this the right casting? I think it's right. I think it's so right. When he doesn't beat up Beatty and when he has that scene at the end, it's just. Like, he's listening to him. It's like, you know, this guy. Yeah, yeah. It's like the Robert Loggia part. There's like the Jack Worden, Robert Loggia, this type of part. The older guy. You can still see them maybe getting a little horny. You can see them running a company. There's a dark side of them, but not really. I don't know who that. Who's that actor now? Oh, gosh. I don't think that actor exists now. Oh, man. Like Jack Worden? Like the Jack Worden, Robert Loggia part. The Loggia. The guy who would have been in Big. The guy who would have been Lester in this movie. It's a hard one. I don't know. Oh, man. Maybe it's just gone away. John Goodman? You know, someone like that? It's someone you don't see very often. Oh, John Goodman. Coming in on flight. Well, he just. Banana Boat coming. Jack Worden is one of those people who every. He just improves everything he's in. Every time he's in a movie, even if the movie's not totally working, you are having fun watching him cook. And I think we talked about that in The Verdict, where he's just. He brings a completely different energy to Newman. And, you know, he comes in every movie, and he's just like, what is this bullshit? Like, that's kind of the attitude of every character that he plays. And he's perfect because he's not a mustache-twirling villain. He's a selfish, rich guy. But he's not like, I'm going to destroy these kids. He's like, I'm losing my youth. And I kind of got to get my youth back. How am I going to do it? It's so great when Beatty is like, maybe there's something we can do with your hair. I don't know. Layer it. Get a little. Puff it out a little bit, Lester. It's just like amazing. It's amazing. Man, I just want to come up with who's the modern-day Loja Warden. We'll figure it out like four days from now. Yeah, exactly. What's your favorite Warden performance, just out of curiosity? By far this. Because I can't get him coming up the walkway doing Born Free out of my mind. Since I saw it. Since I was 18. I can't even. I just want to sing it like that all the time. Born Free. And then you mentioned the Hal Ashby movies that led to this. But then afterwards, yeah. So coming home and being there in back-to-back years. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Coming Home is a fascinating movie. It's a Tubi classic. It's been on Tubi for like three years straight. Yeah, I love that movie. Did very well at the Oscars. It did. Very, very important movie for a lot of people. But there's a feeling. There's a real to it that out of all the Vietnam movies, it's the most. It's different. Kind of interesting constructed Vietnam movie. It is interesting. It's different. I look at these. I look at the Harold and Maude, Last Detail, Shampoo Run as its own little pod. Right. I can't even tell you why. Because I know Ashby continues, but those three movies feel like of a piece. And I think my hot take-ish thing is that of those three movies, Shampoo probably has the most bumps in it like that make it a little dated, you know, like the gay stuff. Yeah. It's just. There's little things where you go, oh. And over time, I think less so Harold and Maude and Last Detail. Yeah. So though the layered and the texture and the depth that allows us to talk like this about shampoo makes it completely memorable and important. There's something about the flow of the other two that's a different thing. There's a different kind of elixir that might make them more seamless, you know? That's just my thought. I don't know how recently you guys have seen the other two movies. Last Detail is my favorite of the three. It's spectacular. Incredible movie. It's an interesting movie too because I think without that movie, this movie doesn't happen or at least not in this way because, you know, Beatty and Nicholson are close friends and Ashby kind of enters Nicholson's orbit after Last Detail. And so he starts coming up to the house on Mulholland Drive and they're on a Lakers game. He takes his girlfriend. That happens. It happened. 70s. Really something. But he finds somebody who, like he knows how Ashby can hang in this environment with big personalities, with complicated subject matter. You know, like Last Detail also famously, kind of like the roughest language movies of the time and then Shampoo pushes it even further. Definitely. Some stuff that I'm sure we'll get into about what Julie Christie says in this movie, which in the movies you didn't hear very often. And Jack. By all accounts, how was smoking pot morning, afternoon, and night? Yes. This is what they say. Yeah. That was the word in the street. Whatever gets you through the night. Robert Towne. Chinatown, Shampoo, Last Detail, all in a three-year run. Did you go through the uncredited thing in the 70s? I mean, the uncredited, it's basically him and Goldman were attached to 78% of all movies made that succeeded. The uncredited list is super wild for him. You don't even know what's true and not true at this point. Yeah, yeah, yeah. It just seems like everybody brought him on and just wrote him a check and he just made money. Then he has like this weird 80s that include Personal Best, which is a fascinating movie. Yeah. Which he wrote and directed. Keele of Sunrise, where he earnestly tried to get Pat Riley to play the Kurt Russell part, which is like one of my favorite weird movie things. Like genuinely tried to, wrote the part for Pat Riley, tried to convince him to do it. Did you ever talk to Riley about that? I don't know if anyone's ever, Riley's never come on my podcast because he can go fuck themselves. No, I've never had him on. I don't like the heat. Let's bring him out, Pat Riley. Keele of Sunrise, then Days of Thunder he wrote. And then he goes into the 90s where he's just writing like The Firm, Mission Impossible. But he did Without Limits, which I think is one of the best sports movies of the last 30 years. But he had this three decade run and each decade was a little different. I think like Beatty, he was kind of in so many different places and like, you know, knowing everybody. I mean, he was mixing, what was the movie after Tequila Sunrise that he did? I can get it. But it was, I mean, Days of Thunder was within two years of that. Maybe it was, I think it was after Tequila Sunrise. He was mixing in the next studio and I think we were doing Elizabeth Town. Oh. And he was completely great. Wanted to see a reel of our movie and then showed me a reel of what he was working on and was, it was, I think he had one note that was kind of great. But it was that, it was that feeling, that Beatty-like thing that we're talking about of like, I'm an amoeba that's, I'm kind of present in a lot of stuff all over town. And I have an effect on the movies that are being made and I dig it. The two Jakes? Is that what it was? The two Jakes. So he's, he's, and he's also kind of avuncular in his own way. I just thought he was very welcoming to a younger guy making his movie in the next one. So you're probably making singles at that point. This was after singles. Yeah. This was Elizabeth Town. When was the two Jakes? That was 90. Oh, so maybe this is, it was one of the ones after. I just, I remember it's something that he was, he had been tinkering on a lot. So he didn't have quite a, a lock on what he was doing. But was very charming about talking about it. Maybe he was doing Ask the Dust when you were doing Elizabeth Town? No, I'll, I'll figure this out along with the New Loja. New Loja. New Loja. New Loja is a good category. Are you one of those people that can work on four movies at once? I'm going to, I'm going to say no. I can. I can, I can not finish four movies at once. No problem. You're an all in on a project guy. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Usually. For sure. I think Town just had that, my perception of it was that he had that shaman quality where people would call him and be like, can you help me fix this? Yeah, yeah, totally. And they have an answer. Well, he had like a very intense relationship with Warren Beatty. And, yeah, it's like they took this forever. At some point, yeah, it was like you and CR. At some point they had, he started to have this same kind of hair that Warren had, all this shit. Like, he was like looking like he was almost doing an impression. You don't want to compete with that. That's tough. Same type of like trying to get the ladies. But then, I guess his big contribution in this scene, they had this huge, or to the movie, other than all the other stuff he did, but they had this huge argument about the key scene when he confesses to Goldie Hawn's character that he was actually having sex with everybody. And the big argument was whether he should be standing or sitting. And Town was like, you have to be sitting. You're bigger than her. It's, threatening. she has to be in control, you have to be sitting down because she needs to be in control of the scene. And Beatty didn't want to do that. And they fought about it, fought about it. Really? And then got him to sit down and that's why the scene works. Because she's like this. It's a great choice. And it's better. It wouldn't have worked if he's standing and towering over. But that was interesting. I think he's right. I mean, don't you think? If you imagine that scene with him standing, it is way different. And then there was a whole thing. Beatty has a, it's a co-screenwriting thing. And it's a big, there's a lot of stuff written about this, about Towne was pissed about it, but he wouldn't say anything. And then David Geffen was finally like, Towne's pissed about this. And then Beatty got mad at Towne. Towne's like, I'm not pissed. And all the Hollywood shit that we like in these books. A lot of lore. Yeah, a lot of lore. Much lore. Three Oscar nominations in a row for Robert Towne, by the way. Year after year, banging him out. $4 million budget, made $60 million. Third biggest movie in 1975. Damn. Lee Grant, who we didn't mention, got nominated for an Oscar. Wow. I would say rightly so. Ebert. She won, didn't she? Did she win? She won, yeah. She won the Oscar? Yeah. I probably should have had that in my notes. That seems more important than getting nominated. Her speech is really interesting because she, you know, was like. Sean has the speech. Come on. Well, I watched the speech last night. She said something interesting about Ashby, which was just that, all the actors, she thanked Towne and Beatty and was like, they are the shepherds and architects of this movie. She was like, Ashby was the one who basically let us feel like we could fail, like we could take chances, like we could do things, and it was going to be okay. And she's the last person that he thanks, which I thought was interesting because of this, you know, Bermuda Triangle of creativity that this movie is operating inside of. The screenplay got nominated. We also had Jack Warden getting nominated. I love that. The movie did not get nominated. Do you know why? Tell me. One Flew Over the Cuckoo's Nest, Barry Lyndon, Dog Day Afternoon, Jaws, and Nashville. Holy shit. Good luck. Good luck cracking that crew. Number six, baby. We do this on every episode. We used to know how to make movies. I was just going to say, is that the best picture lineup of all time? Because there's other movies. We have asked that question before. Up there. Well, especially when you think of the directors that are involved, I mean, holy mackerel. It's pretty great. It's got to be in the top three best five because there's no weak link at all. It's the one I always circle back to. Are they spurring each other on is my question. Are these filmmakers just tweaking each other to go further? What do you think? I think yes. I think yes. I think it equates to music too and eras of music where there's people that remind you of a certain kind of greatness that makes you summon your own greatness. It's super powerful and fun. And it's fun when you have something to compete against, obviously. And I think there was, I don't know, Billy Wilder talked about a greater camaraderie in that time and that he felt that it kind of splintered away in the time before he died. That there was less elbow jabbing with a smile and a smirk that made it more fun to go up against your peers. It's hard to explain the movies and music scene in that decade. Where it's a combination of things evolving, people just, just some of the best people we've ever had just all in one place together. And then like the kind of new shit being created that nobody had heard before. I just don't know if we'll ever see that again. And in that time, like not all of them knew how to use music or knew modern music. And not all of them knew the new like popular music or how to use it. Nichols did, obviously. And Ashby to the max. But a lot of them just wanted to lean on score and all that stuff and like grandiose kind of music. So it really stuck out when somebody was able to like land a needle drop where you just went, fuck. That's the marriage where everybody is just high watching it. We always talk about with writers, if you cover the byline and you know who the writer is, that usually means they're a good writer. Like, oh, I know who that is. And there are so many directors. In that decade where you could have been like, oh, that feels like a blank movie. And I wonder like if we still have that in the same way with as many directors now. I mean, we make more movies now. Yeah. It's really hard to compare to this year, this time, this six or seven year period of films is in America alone is just to completely shape my taste and what I'm interested in and what I like from movies. But movies are back. I don't know if you noticed. I think so. It's a good movie year this year. A lot of stuff I've liked. Sean's been. I hope movies are going to be good. Sean's nipples have been hard for all of 2025. He's been delighted. Our guy, Roger Ebert, disappointing one for him. We do rewatchables. We always do the Roger Ebert review. Two and a half stars. Shocking. Ooh, tell me about that. Shampoo is a movie I expected to admire enormously. It was made by some of Hollywood's most gifted talents. And the critical praise from New York has been almost deafening. But the movie didn't quite work for me. Its timing wasn't confident enough to pull off its ambitious conception. And he was basically like, this movie's trying to do a whole bunch of stuff that didn't totally pull off. But sometimes, I do think it's a movie you need to watch a couple times. For sure. There's a lot going on. For sure. It's not one of those you're going to solve it right away. I did think he had a really good insight in his review, though. He wrote, the sexual gymnastics aren't the movie's point. However, in the sex scenes, they're never developed in an erotic manner. They're directed by Ashby Moore as symptoms of George's dilemma, which is that he likes being loving and kind. He listens to his clients and sometimes even really does care about them. But in some final way, he's too blocked to develop a relationship to really give himself. Which I think is a really smart reading of that character. And maybe even a baby more broadly. It's weird that he doesn't like the movie. It's so in his wheelhouse. I bet he upgraded it when he did his thousands. He upgrades. We're going to do the most rewatchable scene. But before we do that, we have to talk about what you brought us for the set. Well, you know, I wanted to bring a little something for this hallowed room. And I just figured, we'd go with one of the hidden heroes of Jerry Maguire, Kush. Jerry O'Connell as Kush. And there are three of these, I must say. One is in the hands of Jerry O'Connell. And one I have. And now one belongs to this. I mean, what an honor. One of the great honors in rewatchables history. Kush's big promo posters. Was this before Kushlash? Kushlash, Kushlash, Kushlash? Yes. Yes. Yeah. And I must say, Jerry O'Connell. By the way, he looks great in that. He does. He's definitely selling it. The Jets are going to draft him first. God willing, if only we could have drafted Kush. He sees the future in his eyes. You can see that right there. It's all ahead of him, and he knows it. He's going through his progressions. Slight paisley backing, I thought you might enjoy. Hint of the undershirt. Just nice texture. Talking about details. So this was in his hotel room? Where was this in the actual movie? I think this is possibly. I'm going to say it's in the hotel room with his dad when Jerry goes, and they have, like, all that paraphernalia in the room. It is in the Beau Bridges hotel room. He did surprise me with this, so I'm going blind. It's so crazy, though, what a perfect match it is with the rest of the decor. Yeah. It does feel as though you found it on eBay, and it is a real quarterback that you watched in 1979. I'm going to find the perfect spot for it. Right now, we want to display it there. I don't want to. Like, Michael Myers was there. I don't want to. No. I can't long-term. I don't want to piss off Myers. Yeah, I got you. You know, because he's a serial killer. I do, yeah. It'll find a place. No, it's going to find a place. It'll be. It will gravitate to a special place. Honestly, the 77 Red Sox might be in trouble over in the corner there. Interesting. But we'll figure out the perfect one. So thank you for that. I always love when people bring guests. My pleasure. Most rewatchable scene. I'm going to give you a couple choices. George goes to visit Jill after he had sex with Felicia, and she realizes. This is the Goldie Hawn character. realizes that they're not going to have sex. And it's just kind of a funny. I'm going to go, make some food. And she's like, wait, what happened? I thought. And then. So the light bulb's going on. Like, I wonder if he just had sex, but I just like how they handle that. Great. It's great. George, it's short, but George flipping out after he can't get alone when he dumps garbage anywhere. It's just a great Warren Beatty being a star scene. I like when he throws a jacket in and it's like, oh, wait, I need that jacket. No, fuck this jacket. That chaotic hair salon scene when everybody's coming in and out. It's like a Three's Company episode. Beatty and Chris, in the parking lot. Hey, I don't fuck anyone for money. I do it for fun. It's like, oh. Brutal. Brutal. George doing Jackie's hair in the bathroom, which you mentioned. Big scene. The Carrie Fisher scene. Big scene. The party with the two Felicia-Jackie interactions, but specifically the stare down the second time. They're just fucking locked like UFC fighters for. It's like 90 seconds. Yeah. They never. The gaze never changes. Jack Warden moving through the groovy part. He's already like an alien. We talked about that. George confessing his love with Lucy in the sky with diamonds playing. Kicks in. And then they get found. But I'm going to give this the Kid Cuddy Pursuit Happiness Award for Best Needle Drop. It's going down low and then it kicks up. I know you're one of the masters of. I'm with you. Thank you. George admitting to Joe that he slept with a lot of girls. Let's face it. I fucked them all. And then George makes peace with Lester. Also a good scene. And Jackie dumps George on the mini cliff. Unless there are any other scenes you want to mention. those are the nominees i just want to just the first first first scene of introducing the movie in the dark wouldn't it be nice in the darkness during the sex scene which is like such a disorienting way to open a movie you can't really figure out what's going on yeah you know that they're having sex you can't really see lee grant at all even when he gets up when i'm 13 i'm like is there a boob yeah exactly no it's nothing yes my first viewing i was totally there yeah but like that like leaning forward thing that you're doing when you're watching the movie is a great way to get you interested in what's going on with this guy that scene gets done a million times later and you find out that they're that they're actually just like you know moving a piece of furniture or something you're like oh they weren't really having sex that movie's like they're having sex it's actually happening so what's your most rewatchable scene man as you watch it i i just as you go through it i just kind of start thinking what about my choice but my my choice really is the stare down bistro scene because i just think i was tempted to go with the the lucy in the sky with diamonds like that whole party i love love love and that really destroyed me when i was a little guy first seeing it but the orchestration of all the relationships in the bistro scene nixon getting reelected the big wall size picture of nixon um you know jackie getting drunk and baity with with my favorite reading in the movie where he's like you know she's going on and on and he's like you're drunk it's just fantastic in any other movie it's like you're drunk don't you realize what you're doing he's like you're drunk right it's uh it's just brilliant and i and i think without that scene where you're drawn into the interlocking relationships and you're feeling jack warden's pain and all that stuff the movie isn't as seductively layered without it so kind of structurally i go with that what do you got sean i love the scene near the very end when when lester and george are that was my scene that was my pick i just think the whole movie talk about one thing how some guy fucked him over it's like that's fucking great stuff yeah the their their instant camaraderie and just being assholes is very amusing and it's the whole idea of the movie is in there too which is sort of like of course this rich guy is like yeah they're all bad i don't care i'm just trying to get through my day you know like the to pack all that into that little moment and you know to just show that like the through these guys eyes the women are secondary you know what i mean they're props they're like a means to an end of trying to get off horror he calls julia chris character fucking kind of really reveals i think what they really think about these guys but also you know that it's it's true and it feels sincere but also they're critical like it's a really fascinating blend it's fascinating and also lester not once but twice has a problem with the housekeeping how do you look like this it's not a dirty clean glass in the house like pour you a drink that only i am gonna drink it's just crazy i think warden's so good in that scene he comes in a little menacing so good and then george whatever george says about like your wife all she wants to do is shop all day her daughter hates her and he's like oh that's that daughter hates her yeah what do you mean he hates her like he's he's just his whole body like jolts i know it's like it's a great scene there's a great back and forth in that scene where jack calls or jack warden calls jackie a whore yeah and then baby goes no i think she really likes you and he goes really yeah really really yeah she likes you that helps when she that scene is awesome i mean that's such a well-written scene too he's like the perfect actors he's been there all night that's like the awesome thing at the top like i've been here all night doing what you certainly didn't do the housework this is like you fucking sat there steaming about the glasses being dirty they're just brilliant together all right next category what's the most 1975 thing about this movie a little tough because it's set in 1968 interesting um i'll give you a couple nominees though warren beatty's hair word groovy yep every time you're groovy it's like that's a word that is gone jack i mean there's some unfortunate gay bashing in this movie but he uses the word fairy which i haven't heard in 25 years i know um i have la just seems so sprawling and traffic free and happy to navigate and it's just not like it is now yeah even when they show the shots of the hill on sunset like the houses aren't just seems true like this happy mid-70s place uh the seven years after nixon got elected subtext is good yeah but i am going to go with my winner is uh riding a motorcycle without a helmet just fucking hopping on the triumph and moving around it's just noticeable when you watch it call it's like yeah it's just not a real action it's a happier time i'll be coming back to the triumph in a later category what do you have for this anything else i mean even just purely this the style of every character you know the haircuts that he's giving to match felicia and jackie is like such a chill it's it is like more 68 than 75 maybe that should have been the category what's the most 1968 thing about this movie yeah the music and yeah what do you have camera i would go for the extras and the people populating the party the big sprawling party those people do not exist anymore they don't exist anymore but also like why are they there yeah whose house is that which goes to another category unanswered questions like whose house is that is it lester's house it looks like lester's house also it's election night so is every is every election night a tuesday and are people partying on election night i guess in 1968 maybe like these are supposed to be the counterculture crowd like how do they end up in this house yeah like it's not it's not like it's a shack in laurel canyon this is like an estate i don't know who they are but they aren't really convincing particularly the guy that offers jack warden the joint he just kind of like it's just hair really he doesn't really have anything to do and there's a lot of like scarf you know scarfed headed women and stuff and you just like it's a little it's a it's a little caught in the in in a time warp you know who dipped into this madman when they would have don draper go to la for those seasons and it was like same kind of thing like what is this world who are these people how did they get in this house uh can i say one thing about that for for so many movies that like try and do the era and like work real hard to get the extras all dressed up properly and stuff all they have to do is watch the movie monterey pop monterey pop has the best photography of the people in the audience and it's just it's that's what you should go to to do your research on that because like people in that era and i guess that's 68 i think it is 68 okay so monterey pop is 68 so that that's the era there's people in the 50s there's people who look like they could be there now it's just like the the the stew of what people in that era really looked like is there in the the crowd shots of monterey pop and sadly that's not shampoo which is good on so many other details they just kind of fumble on that and um and it is it is 1975 68 or whatever we're looking for i was trying to think of other 68 movies that would be representative of this too and i feel like isn't medium cool also 68 medium cool yeah yeah which is also like there's it's all a lot of real people in that movie even though it's not a documentary and it's the same thing like you can see exactly how everyone was styled yeah this movie is like some of it is accurate and some of it appears to be like satirizing or riffing loosely on what it remembers seven years ago to be the beverly hill stuff is pretty accurate it feels pretty accurate of course they're all in tuxes and craig would you rather go to a party in 1968 or now 1968 i mean my it just seemed like a great time i'll just do it now the flex category you guys touched on this mine is the den of thieves benihana award for a scene-stealing location it's just unrecognizable la of 1968 versus now it's just completely different it feels so small relaxed approachable the height of every building seems lower yeah the winding roads of the hollywood hills every single part of it is so appealing and attractive and you completely understand why you would fall in love i fall in love with it again just watching it convincing myself that like right now is somewhat still what it was in 68 which it's clearly not but it's it's it's magical there is a way though in which it is it has aged the best in terms of la too because this is sort of what it's like to live in la where like everybody lives in their house and they don't really leave their house and the houses are kind of dark and the curtains are closed and they're skulking around and even though this you think of this as like this sunny paradise that a lot of people especially people with a lot of privilege are just like i don't really want to leave like i'm just like i'm doing my thing in my own house like i don't want to go out tonight you know like there is still that quality of every time they're in one of these houses they're not bustling the only time we see that is at these two parties it's also funny to have a bunch of counterculture people at this mansion which is also very la that's what i was saying they're committing to that but they also have one rich friend that they're okay using their dad's house yeah they're okay with that the la in this movie is the la that as a kid when i watched all the tv shows and i was like man it just seems great there when they did like battle of the network stars in malibu like what's that yeah that's on a cliff with an ocean like what the hell is that hell is going on or charlie's angels they'd be in the hollywood hills like oh that looks awesome the only thing though is is like it is smoggy cloudy la it's not always sunny true you know like especially the last shot when he's looking out yeah it's like that's not the beach you know that's not rosy that's that's doom where is the offices the views from the offices the movie producer's office lester's office are gorgeous the views the balcony is it jill's house i mean yeah unbelievable uh one more break and then uh we're going to what's aged the best. When you shop Kroger delivery, you can Expect the savings you love and fresh groceries delivered right to your door. Our refrigerated trucks keep your items cool, while our associates are committed to getting every detail right. Carefully selecting and packing your order with care. Because bringing you fresh, quality groceries is what we do best. Right now, enjoy free delivery on orders of $50 or more with your digital coupon. Restrictions apply. C-Site for details. Kroger. Fresh for everyone. All right, before we do what's aged the best, special category, the Steven Seagal shitting on himself award for most unbelievable anecdote from the actual film shoot. We're here with legendary filmmaker Cameron Crowe. And you're doing this award. This is like, why am I here? Lee Grant walked off the film for two days during the scene when her character comes in after it seems like her daughter might have had sex with one lady and they argued about what her mother did. What her motivations would be. And she kept playing it the same way. And he kept telling her to play it differently. And she got fed up and she left. And was gone for two days. And she came back and Warren said, basically, my bad. He's like, what do I know? I'm only a guy. And that was it. Wow. What would be your, do you have a Steven Seagal shitting on himself award for many of your movies? Just out of curiosity. Do you know this story? Tell me the story. It's some Seagal movie. What was it? Like Above the Law, one of those? Hard to Kill, maybe? There was some stunt guy in the set and the guy said he could choke anyone out. And Seagal's like, there's no way you could choke me out. And the guy's like, oh yeah? And he was like, all right. And it became this thing. And the guy chokes Seagal out and he shits all over himself. This is urban legend. Might not have happened. May have happened. But it had to become a category in the rewatchables. I love it. He got choked out and may have shit on himself. Steven Seagal. So anyway, I don't know if you have anything that good. Let me think about that. Think about that. That's a high bar. Think about 2025 Logia. Yeah. And just file that away for the end. So many unanswered questions. We'll get back to that. Sean, what do you have for what stage is the best? I love a Hollywood LA movie that is full of all these smart self-referential choices. Like we did The Player on this show. We've done a handful of movies. And so casting Carrie Fisher, who's Debbie Reynolds' daughter, and the way that the movie uses her and uses her as this kind of vessel for a new generation. Sexual frankness. And Debbie Reynolds, of course, this representation of kind of like a pert and prim version of Hollywood history is super smart. There's like a series of versions like this. Like even just the idea of making a movie about a hairdresser and what the role of the hairdresser as a significant participant in not just making Hollywood movies, but Jay Sebring, who was tragically killed. John Peters, you know, who became a power player in the space. Seems like those were the two people that kind of drove this. And then there was a third one. There was a third one. Whose name escapes me, but that I think Robert Towne talked about, about somebody that he had met whose ex had cut hair and was also an inspiration for this. And that these, I don't think we see hairdressers in quite the same way culturally now. Yeah. But it's fascinating because that is a really intimate act. You know, to be with someone by yourself, touching them, cutting their hair, developing that physical relationship with them. And then the movie using that and that being such a significant part of, you know, presentation in Hollywood and the way that you can do that. The way that you look is so paramount to what you're doing. I just love all that in this series. Well, Peters was, I mean, he had some big celebrity girlfriends and then eventually just became a producer. But it was all because he was around these women all day who were attached to powerful people. I was kind of surprised in the movie when, I mean, because George seems to understand people's intimate feelings and stuff and how when he's got his hands in their hair, they start talking about it. And he, it feels like he listens, you know, and he knows the power of that. But then he kind of sells himself out at the end saying like, yeah, they all fucking talk about the same things. I'm going to fuck them over. And I'm like, George, come on. You've felt more than that. Do you think he's performing for Lester too, though? The way that he like shapeshifts for people too? Good point. And that's a very, you know, LA sycophantic thing where you like blend into the moment so that you're not making too many waves. Like you got to be like Lester in this moment. But when you're cutting a woman's hair, you got to be sympathetic to her experience. Like that reveals a little bit of like the phoniness that is at the heart of the movie too. I don't know, it's really like, it feels very much like LA. We're like, I am sincere every day and I also feel full of shit. And that's a really hard way to be. But I do think the movie really taps into that well. I totally agree. Plus, remember he puts that scene in where he's like got this woman's hair like right. Oh, yeah. Almost looks like a blowjob. He's just like shaking her around and then like whipping her back up. And then he wants to like give her away in the next scene, like, you know. That would have been a good hottest take as hairdressers were the original podcasters. Just doing a podcast all day with 10 people. Yes. That is a hot take. And getting people to reveal their secrets. Yeah. Wow. Because they have to remember stuff about every person they're doing. They're bringing up conversation. They're finding out stuff. They probably have more information. When you're getting your hair cut, are you telling the truth about your life? Yeah, I was. Because my person is the same person my mom goes to. Don't ask. So we spend half the time talking about my mom and how crazy my mom is. And it's just like she really, really knows about my life. It's how you communicate. Do you have a What's H the Best? I do. I do. It's the cinematography of Laszlo Kovacs. I think who I was lucky enough to work with on Say Anything. He was the guy that shot Say Anything. So don't think I wasn't aware that I was with the guy that did Shampoo. And Ghostbusters. Another movie with a party scene. Exactly. And that was on our minds too. Yeah. Definitely. But Laszlo was amazing. For a first time, director. So helpful and so soulful. Had a great crew. Really cared about all the textures. And the thing I want to shout out about this movie that I've always tried to learn from, and this is from Beatty, I think, because he does this in Bonnie and Clyde too. He knows what a screen kiss can do. It's better than sex in a movie. If you get that kiss right, because, and here's Beatty's secret. And I, and I, I learned this from watching his stuff, which is he gives you the moment before the kiss, the desire before the kiss, which I definitely went for in Jerry Maguire. It's the decision to make the kiss. The moment before they come in is where it's all decided because you know, in fact, when the kiss happens, everything's going to change. Beatty does not deny you that moment. He does it especially great in Bonnie and Clyde. And he does it great in this movie with Laszlo. Every kiss matters. And it's beautifully shot. And it's very packed with emotion. And the kisses in this movie shampoo are great. Such a good point. Cause they're in the bathroom. He's doing her hair and she's just staring at him with those big fuck me eyes. And then he's kind of doing her hair. But then every once in a while, it's like, Oh, something's going on. And you could just see it. And they're doing it for almost like 45 seconds. And you know, it's going to happen. It's a really hard thing to pull off in a movie. It's a hard thing. In Jerry Maguire, we really milked it, you know, because, um, they're in there. He's with Renee in the doorway. Oh yeah. And it's just, there's all kinds of longing going on. And then he breaks the strap and all this stuff. And it's just like, we just wanted to live in that moment. And, uh, I think we have some Paul McCartney music. That's kind of like, do, do, do in that actual moment. But, um, no, I just thought, I thought like, that's the thing that like, is it a little shining star that happens a couple of times in shampoo? It's the kisses. I had a couple with Sage, the, the best, um, the Warren, the warden beta combo. Just like, I just love those two guys together. Lester's house. I'm just going to give the Amanda Dobbins award for best piece of real estate. It's a really great house. There's like a tennis court. Unbelievable. Upstate thing. Like things. I just, I wanted to see like a whole Google or a shot of how that house was laid out. Where is that? I don't know where it is. We have to know where the house is. Beverly Hills. Maybe somewhere in there. Uh, young Carrie Fisher is just hilarious to just see her three years before. She's about to become one of the most famous or two years first, but become one of the most famous actors in the world. It's her first part. Yeah. She eats Beatty alive in that scene. Yep. I think like there is such boldness and she just does not care. We can say it now. She gets the Dion waiters award for best seat check. It's just not, that's done. Yeah. I, this movie made me wonder, like did the star Wars thing, it almost, I wish there was an alternate version of her career where there's no star Wars. And she's just in, she's making all these movies for 15 years, right? Absolutely. Apps. Great, great, great. Cause I can, when Harry met Sally and she's the friend, the sarcastic kind of insecure friend, and she's just really good. And it's like, why didn't we're there six more of these for you. But I guess star Wars just eat you up when you're in that franchise. Jerry McGuire trivia, the, the line, um, you know, you're not show friends, you're show people. No, what is it? Um, they're not, what is it? Uh, you're not, it's not show. It's not show friends. It's show business. Yeah. Um, I heard that from someone and I put it in the movie and they came to me later and said, uh, I actually stole that from Carrie Fisher. That's Carrie Fisher. Oh, wow. So thank you, Carrie Fisher. Thank you. Um, I have for what's aged the best, having a late sixties Kumar. I just put that in for Sean. Thank you. We always have great jokes. Yeah. I think dating back to the godfather is just like, it was the head of the Kumar era. I don't know that, Leicester Carp would have used the word Gumar to describe Jackie. That's really more. Maybe the 90s were the key. You need to be like Ileana Douglas to be identified as that, right? That's a different. And then the soundtrack, which features two Beatles songs. It's crazy. Probably not getting those 10 years later. Plus Manic Depression by Hendrix. Plus Mr. Soul. Mr. Soul is my favorite. Two Jefferson Airplane songs. It's nuts. And the Beach Boys. Opening and closing. We're up with the Sean Fennessey word for stealth homage that gives every movie nerd a criteria orgasm. That's another category, Cameron. There's not a lot in here. I went with film director William Castle. World renowned for his work making experiential movie-going experiences for scary movies in the 50s and 60s. He shows up in the movie as Sid Roth, who's the guy who promises Jackie at the 1968 Republican Party. Oh. And he is a legendary showman in movie history. There's a Joe Dante movie called Matinee that is loosely based on him and the movies that he made. And yeah, that's an interesting choice for a guy like that who's always trying to sell you on something to be the guy at that party. We have a Great Shock Order Award for most cinematic shot. I personally would go for the high shot when they end up on the cliff and they have the high shot to begin with and you can see all of L.A. and you know something's going to go down. I just think it's a really cool one. I had the same last shot, best shot. Yeah. I would go with that. For sure. Where is that location? Do we know? I don't know. You know, I researched it and couldn't figure it out, but it's got to be somewhere like up in the hills like near Mulholland Drive or somewhere in there. That whole vortex. Sean, you have a flex category. Hmm. Did you already do it? No, I didn't. You already mentioned it. Well, I'm going to do a different one then. So my flex category is the I used to fuck guys like you in prison award for craziest quote. Oh, that's good. I was going to do I don't fuck anybody for money. I do it for fun, which you already mentioned. But what if it was I just wish I knew what the hell I was living for. You can lose it all, you know. I mean, you can lose it no matter who you are. What's the sense of having it all? Market went down 10 points last week. Goddamn Lyndon Johnson. Maybe Nixon will be better. What's the difference? They're all a bunch of jerks. That's Lester at the end of the movie. Yeah, yeah, yeah. I think just doing the thesis of the movie. Yeah. Wow. A thesis that might apply in 2025. Sure does. We have the Butch's Girlfriend Award for weak link of the film. I'd like to nominate the I'd like to suck his cock scene. It's just so crazy. And Beatty, apparently fought for it to be in there, but I almost think it's too crazy. I think she was too classy to do that. It always bothered me with this movie. Interesting. Would be my take. I might be wrong. I think you're supposed to believe she's very drunk. But then an hour later, she's fine. Yeah. I wouldn't say she's the best drunk acting actress. Yeah. Julie Christie, at least not in this. She starts off, what does she start off with the Dubonnet? Isn't that what she's drinking at the start of it? She's had a few. Yeah. Cruise from A Few Good Men to Jerry Maguire got way better at being drunk in a scene. Big time. Because A Few Good Men was not as good. That's really true. Was not as strong. We always had a theory he had never had a drink before, so he was pretending how to act when he had a drink. But Jerry Maguire, he had a pretty good act. How do you direct somebody being drunk? He had a poker, so he had like a prop that was kind of helping him, I know. That's a good question. How do you direct somebody to be drunk when they're not drunk? Glasses are huge. It's really hard. It's really hard. They kind of either have it or they don't. And if they try too hard, which they usually do that, you just have to scale it back and scale it back so that it's just good. So you're like, that was really good. Just get liquid. Let's try one more. Scale it back 10%. Get liquid-y about it. Helps. Because usually they're just like, ah. Just get like you're underwater a little bit. It's good. That's good. It's kind of like doing a hula with it. So who's the best drunk scene actor of all time? I mean, Dudley Moore was drunk during all of Arthur. Yeah. I don't know how he did that. That's not acting. Arthur did really well. Not acting. He wasn't acting. I mean, we talked about Newman in the verdict. But it's that like that sullen, quiet drunk. It's almost like it's dark. It's like entrenched in your body drunk. It's not the should we or should we not follow the advice. The harder one is like the rom-com where somebody got too drunk and starts yelling at our hero. Yeah. It's usually when it goes really wrong. Cameron Diaz is really good in My Best Friend's Wedding. That's a great one. That's some good drunk acting. Yeah. That's a good one. I think Bill Nighy in Love Actually is pretty good. That's a great one too. He gets pretty liquidy. Especially on, what is it, Christmas Eve when he shows back up to his manager and you're not sure if they're going to have sex or something. A couple of what's aged the worst other than some of the words. The Paul Simon soundtrack I wrote down before you even mentioned it. It's just corny and weird. You know I get with that. You know. It seems like he did write a bunch of songs at least at that time that ended up on Still Crazy after all these years. Yes. But you know what happens. They write songs for the movies that ask them for a song and when the song turns out too good they keep it. They don't give you that song. Yeah. They give you the fourth best song. There's even a thing in the Bruce Springsteen movie where he writes a song for Donna Summer and it's, is it I'm on fire or what is it? Yeah. It's like I'm on fire and John Lando in the movie goes like, I'm sure glad you didn't give that song to Donna Summer. Oh yeah. Truth. Truth being told. I mean honestly you could have done that with Fever Dog. You could have just said fuck it. This is a real song. I'm giving this to Pearl Jam. Thank you. Give me a writer credit. I think maybe not too late. I don't know. If Pearl Jam ever sang Fever Dog in concert. You would explode into molecules. I just think it would be really good. I just think there's certain songs that like they would have been great. There's a couple Springsteen songs they would have crushed that. Cameron we always, Sean and I always joke about when you own stock early in somebody. You're the all time with Pearl Jam. He had PJ stock yeah. He was like he had NVIDIA stock in 2015 with Pearl Jam. They weren't even a band yet. Come on. They were Mookie Blaylock when you had them in singles. They were indeed Mookie Blaylock. Yeah you were like the original stockholder. We put our chips down on that. Unbelievable. It's so funny that they're still together too. Of all the bands from that era. Yeah. And Alice in Chains. I mean though they've you know sadly. The only other what's aged the worst is Carrie Fisher did say years later that Beatty tried to tried to get it going with her which is four times she said. And is it true that Debbie Reynolds like made sure that she wasn't lit seductively? Yeah. She had Debbie had some notes. She tried to get them to change the scripts and she couldn't get them to change the scripts. Well I'm sure she was like oh shit. I think they wanted to change wanna fuck to wanna screw and they couldn't get that over. Yeah. Interesting. Ruffalo Hannah Rubinette Partridge overacting a word. I gotta bring it up but Warren Beatty when he's getting broken up with at the end kinda dials it up a little bit with the crying thing. It's a little out of the comfort zone. I can't say it 100% worked. I'm with you on that. But please don't He keeps saying honey over and over. Honey no. It's like the fake true crime cry. Yeah I don't I just don't think he would actually cry in real life. I also had the Jay Robinson the guy who's the real owner of the salon you know who's like the running number two behind Norman Yeah Norman pushes it a little hard. He turns it up a little bit. Although it's great when he goes nickel and dime. You gotta learn to nickel and dime George. So we have the CR thinks Luke Wilson could have been Harrison Ford hottest take award. What do you think of that? Luke Wilson could have been Harrison Ford's career. I love that. Chris Ryan's the best hottest take in 400 plus rewatchables episodes. I almost fell out of my chair. It's fantastic and it's true and it's true. Wow. I can't tell you how true. I feel that deeply in my soul. Yeah. Mine is for this Sean already did his. Did you have one? Cameron? Yeah. It's that it's the least rewatchable actually of the three picture run that Ashby was on. I think that's fair even though it's probably the most successful. Yeah. So it kind of hurts me to say that in a way because I love Shampoo so much but when I go back over the other two I kind of find myself gravitating towards The Last Detail or In the Right Mood Harold and Maude of course. Funny that we didn't say it. This is the number three movie at the box office this year. That's crazy. It's $60 million. That is crazy. It's good for Warren Beatty. How did The Last Detail do? Not nearly as well. 12 or 15 or smaller. My hottest take I think Goldie Hawn in this mid-70s era was the single most adorable actress of all time. And it's different than prettiest sexiest all that just like adorable where every human being was like oh she seems cool or oh she's so cute or every guy would have had a crush on her. If you're on a movie set with her you're just going to have a crush on her period. I can't think of other people have swam in these circles but I don't think as well which leads to my second hottest take. 15 years too soon. She misses the whole rom-com blow-up era from 89 on starting when Harry Met Sally. Yeah. Meg Ryan doesn't exist. Meg Ryan's working down the street. Goldie's taking every part from her for 10 years. - Meg Ryan's working down the stairs. - Meg Ryan's gone. - Yeah. - Meg Ryan's delivering She's a male. Yeah. She works at Dunkin' Donuts. She's Parkinson's. She doesn't exist. She's gone. But Goldie Hawn, I just think they didn't have the right kind of, they had great movies, but they didn't have these movies that just would have kept it going for her. She kind of gets it back with like First Wives Club and Banger Sisters and those movies, which is like kind of in the same zone, but she's not quite the rom-com. But she misses that sweet, sweet, sweet spot. She just could have been in My Best Friend's Wedding type of movies for 10 solid years. Killing it, for sure. I watched Private Benjamin recently and she was, that movie's really good and she's incredible in that movie. And it's a really weird movie that they just wouldn't make anymore. She's incredible. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Casting when Fs couldn't find any. Best that guy were, Johnny Bill as, Tony Bill as Johnny Pope. He was an Academy Award winning producer on the film The Sting. So he was, he was not, he was a very well-known person in Hollywood. But he occasionally acted. Didn't act very often. I love Tony Bill. He looks like Warren Beatty on a bad day. You know what I mean? Like, he looks just enough like him where you're like, yeah, this guy should be at this party. Like he could be the extra? Yeah. Jack Wharton thinks he's getting it on with George. Yeah, right. Come on, you know. He also has a period mustache that kind of is both timeless and caught in a cedar. But it's like if Beatty was in disguise or something in the movie. You know, we're like, why is his brother here? I love how annoyed he is when Lester gets in the car. Like after the bistro. Want to get a drink? Yeah. Oh, man. Recasting couch director or city. So, can I just, I think this movie is very well cast, but can I just offer you for Johnny Pope, sadly? No, we just gave him another one. Do this, do this. Can I just throw John Cazale in there for the hell of it? Yeah. That's pretty great. Just grab his time for two weeks. Yeah. And he could do Ascot commercial director. You know, we saw him do it as Brady. I think he even played like five parts in this movie. Just get him in there. You did your flex. Half-assed research. So, you mentioned the Paul Simon stuff. Paul Simon did write a title song called Have a Good Time. No. That Brady said no. So, we scrapped it and they put it on the Still Crazy after all these years of them. You mentioned all the Debbie Reynolds stuff and we did everything else for that. So, Apex Mountain is a category we talk about when somebody had the most juice they were ever going to have in their career. And I actually think Beatty is, this is a yes for him. Yeah. Because this movie, he owned a lot of the back end of it. He put a lot of time into it. It's a huge success and I just think he can do whatever he wants after this. Not that he couldn't have before, but this is the best example of that. This sets up Reds. This sets up everything he wants to do. It all, for sure. But, is he even higher on the mountain at Heaven Can Wait or at Reds? I don't know. Like, after Heaven Can Wait, or after Reds, has he ascended even further? Maybe it's Heaven Can Wait. I don't know. It's a really good point. Is it Heaven Can Wait? How many years after this movie is Heaven Can Wait? Three years. And in between is? He's turning down stuff. He was. What is the fortune before or after this? He's producing, yeah. Yeah. The most interesting one he turned down was Hardcore with Paul Schrader, a movie we've done on the rewatchables. Turn it off! Turn it off! We've done that one. I don't know. I can't see Warren Beatty. He didn't want to have a daughter. That's why he turned it down. Oh, wow. Oh, interesting. I'm too young and handsome to have a daughter, so can it be my wife goes to Newport and they're like, nah, that's not. No, no. It's got to be a teenage daughter. Yeah, so he, yeah, he has Shampoo and the Fortune in 75 and then Heaven Can Wait in 78 and Reds in 81. For some reason, I feel by the time of Heaven Can Wait, Beatty is a little less like feral Beatty, you know, where he's just like in the culture. Heaven Can Wait's kind of like, you know, like a nice pass, a nice romantic comedy turn, but he doesn't have his teeth in it the way he does in Shampoo. I think it's this the more I think about it. I agree. Julie Christie, obviously not because she did Darling and Dr. Zhivago in the same year, which is like pretty good. Hall of Fame, Apex Mountain year. Pretty good. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. Like one of the biggest movies of the 60s and a movie where she won an Oscar. You're not topping that. Goldie Hawn, no. Robert Towne? This is a pretty nice run for him. He's got Chinatown in this back to back. Yes. I'm going to say yes. I have yes. Jack Ward in no. It's somewhere in the late 70s. Old school Hollywood scenery in a famous Hollywood movie. It's in play. Triumph Motorcycles as a character in a movie, definitely. Definitely. And then late 60s party scenes trying to think of a better one. This was the most sprawling for sure. I'm going to say no on party scenes in general because not just because Cameron. What about the Peter Sellers movie, The Party? The answer from Oh, yes. It's about a party. Good call. Party scenes all the time. Apex Mountain. I'm not just saying that because he's here. I'm not even going to look at him. Yeah, Project X. No, it's Russell Hammond in Topeka, Kansas. Yeah. Yeah. Golden God. You're just not getting a better party scene. Thanks, guys. I want to see the stand. I'm intentionally not looking at him. Do you think that was a good party? Which one? The Topeka party? Yeah. Oh, yeah. Yeah. Seemed like a good party. Yeah. Everybody's having a good time. That's what happened in the 70s. He's participating with them. Yeah. It's like he's one of them. He's there with Aaron when the snake gets eaten or the mouse gets eaten by the snake. Next category. And it's the 1984 thing, you know, when he says, like, in 11 years, it's going to be 1984. Think about that. Think about that. This next category we have anyway, but this will be really fun with you here. Cruz or Hanks for the lead part. Who's winning the career total? Is Hanks ahead? There's only one rational answer. Hanks is currently ahead. With Cameron here, there's only one rational answer. I think it's definitely Cruz. It's the role. I don't know if Cruz ever would have played, although he did do Eyes Wide Shut, so maybe all bets are off with Cruz. Frank T.J. Mackey is the closest. Oh. Yeah. For this collision between, like, I'm a sexual god and all this vulnerability. It's definitely Cruz. Yeah. I think he could have done it. Hanks trying is funny. That would be amusing. That's a different comedy. It gives the movie a totally different flavor. I don't know if he could pull up the haircut. His hair's like mine and it just goes up. I don't know if I want to see the hairdryer stuck in his, like, pants, you know? I don't know. Scorsese or Spielberg to direct? Scorsese. I agree. I agree with that, too. What role would Philip Seymour Hoffman have played? Lester. Lester. Had that as well. That's a dream to think about. That's one of the great Philip Seymour Hoffman stories is his story. You had him for two days? Yeah. Well, no. I think. And he was sick? Or you had him for a week? We had him for a week. He was sick most of the time. Yeah, he had the flu. That's why he's, like, a little red in the face and stuff and was, like, kind of. Cool. He was coughing and his energy was low but completely brought it. Did you know as you're filming it, like, this is, like, a legendary Philip Seymour Hoffman? Yeah. Did you know you were changing my life when you were making those scenes in that movie? I kind of did because it was the first scene we filmed and he was on the street with Patrick Fugate and they were doing this scene where I was walking with the real Lester Bangs and so I was watching, you know, him do the very thing that I had done with Lester and I was listening to it on the headset and he sounded like Lester and I had this moment where I was like, you know, where I wanted to call up David Geffen and just say, talk to him about it because I felt like it was such a gift that I'd been given to be able to do this in continuity and everything so they got David Geffen on the phone and said hello and I go, David Geffen, it's Cameron here. I just did my first scene and I just, like, I can't believe that I'm here on the same street where it all happened and we're filming with the same people, you know, on film that felt exactly the same. I can't believe. How did I get here? And he goes, Jerry Maguire. I hung up. Oh my God. How's that for belief? It's right to the chase. Yeah. No, it's like. Unbelievable. Let's speak truth and I'll be gone. So out of all the parts in Almost Famous, which is the one that you felt like you had to get the actor perfectly for the part just for your own sanity? Was it Lester Banks? No, it was Patrick Fugate. Yeah, William Miller. William Miller. Gotta be. But followed closely by Lester because we saw a lot of people for Lester and Gail Levin the casting director said at the very beginning you're going to see everybody in town and you're going to end up with Philip Seymour Hoffman. And it happened exactly like that. And he said. I talked to him and I said to him on the phone please play the part. He goes, okay. And I said can you come and do like, you know a couple of weeks of rehearsals to do it? And he was like I don't think you're going to need that. I'm like, well, I knew this guy. He's very important to me. He's like a mentor. I gotta get it right. And he goes, you won't need that much part that much time with the part but like I'll come out. So I said, thank you so much. And he showed up. He came to the office. He didn't have the flu yet but he was in a pretty good mood and he sat down and he goes, well, let's just do the scenes. And he did all the scenes back to back. And I said, okay, we're rehearsed. This is great. He was there 45 minutes and he was back to the airport to fly home. That's how dialed in he was on Lester. But like kind enough to know that that was what was going to happen but still came out on the promise of two weeks then when he showed up he had the flu and uh so like battled through it but it gave him a quality that i think was kind of corrosive in a really cool way he would have brought yeah he seemed like beaten down so you kind of needed him to be physically sick and and then when we got to the scene where he's supposed to say you know like we're the uncool and stuff um i always saw that as like a victory scene like you know we're the uncool it's like that that todd rundgren picture that's on his album something anything where he's like this was in my mind and it was uh phil hoffman that said like why don't we do the scene like we're the only two people awake in the world me and william miller we do a quiet and i'll be sitting we're uncool and uh yeah it's spectacular then you cut the scene where he's like william how's the peeping how's the peeping didn't make sense didn't make sense why why why but yes he would have been the lester uh of of our current time have you met his son no cooper yeah no i i dig him but great kid really yeah we have we have some mutual friends excellent and he's very cool about his dad he's just like you know and he's a really good actor but he's just like ask me anything about my dad like my dad was awesome like i i'm totally cool talking about it but i love that he's a really good actor all right picking nets would would felicia have been more upset that george probably just fucked her 17 year old daughter i feel like yes i suspect yes so maybe baity was correct so you yeah you you too have notes on lee grant's performance i'm just trying to i i can't judge the 1968 what was going on that year there's a case to be made that there's like a shell shock protectionist quality that goes into play when something like that happens where you're just like block it out pretend it didn't happen yeah okay what do you have for picking nets what's your biggest one um just like the thing that doesn't quite work the thing you're like come on after you've seen a movie seven times and you're like all right that blah blah blah i had a note what was it it was uh yeah it was like i i just got confused whose house the party was and stuff so that to me was like why they all end up there and i don't quite get why lester is upset to go there and it's kind of supposed to be his house so i i kind of got tripped up there but that may not be the most stellar choice but that that kind of rubbed at me uh one of the things i was curious about is like are we supposed to think that she slept with johnny pope on the night of the party jill or potentially ambiguous it's ambiguous like like baity accuses her of it or kind of hints at it i think but are we supposed to think it happened yeah he like come into the house but she says no which indicates that like he would follow her into the house because they had been intimate but we don't really know what happened and is she sleeping with him to to get the part or does she have more agency than that and she's just gonna be who she is man and i don't know it's a little it may not be the perfect answer but um how do you get a loan when you're a hairdresser to open a salon in 1968 what do you got to present to the bank what's a good like what's the process there like do you bring in clients and say like these clients are coming with me like how what was george's plan that's why they shut him down but like if you were actually trying to do that how would you do you probably just need an independent investor you can't get a bank to do it um but just this whole process pursuing that is very funny where he's thinks he's gonna be able to get this and he's just like just trust me bro i got i got clients um that whole thing is all a little squishy as well i was a little squishy on how low the ask was it's like 10 000 or something so lester has to really think about it it's like does this guy really have money or is he even in 1968 or is he a fraud yeah yeah how rich i have two for the party this would be a good example of how picking knits works one is pretty stealth um the valets just get the cars way too quick it's a huge party great cars are part you're out at that party you're out there for 20 minutes other people are out people are smoking you're talking to people the valet show these these cars are ready in it in it but this is the bigger one how does the motorcycle get to the last party we see him in a car with julie christie going to the party then the second thing but he leaves the last party on his triumph motorcycle how wow he didn't take the motorcycle there wow nice call man wow should we delete this episode what the hell this movie is null and void oh my gosh wow maybe maybe maybe he made a call and someone brought it over well since cameron's here we have to do a couple of picking knits for jerry mcguire please oh gosh why would denver don't why would denver want to trade up for frank cushman in 1996 when they had john elway where was your sports consultant on that one can we travel back in time and just get in a room what do they need another quarterback well maybe they were thinking about you know how to continue the legacy yeah yeah yeah guys it was a parallel universe please okay all things are possible jesus um don't you want to live there dorothy had dorothy had a young kid in health benefits is she really quitting she's got a young child this did come up in our discussion in the film i think yeah pretty risky move but she was inspired right she was inspired i will go with you and this is this is a this is very close to the theme of uh the movie you guys this is like you the people you don't expect who show up that that's a good when you need somebody it's the people you planned on being there for you don't show up and that's usually how it works when you were suspended by espn where was i right by your side you were i was right by your side you didn't care about health benefits i did not warren baity calling uh the night of the la times story it's like fuck where did that guy come from all my friends silent like this is this is this is why dorothy makes that move she is that character sean what if you had a child yeah would i have followed bill yeah no he's producing nba countdown um this was the big one we've argued about this in the movie how he got back to the to the uh divorced women's support group after the monday night football game how long had that meeting been going on so the monday night football game starts 907 eastern 1995 707 phoenix time or is that 807 phoenix time so one hour back one hour one hour one hour back 707 game ends 10 30 press conference airport pre-9 11 though the time travel happens in the airport 11 30 that's where the splice happens lands in lax so the divorced women's group is still going at one in the morning absolutely okay so that so we just have goodbye fucking problems man they gotta work through some shit is there coffee tired you can tell is there coffee at that point is it like 11 30 like i need a little caffeine by the time he gets there my mom is counseling everybody in the room it's like you know all their stories are gone and she's just talking about neural pathways and stuff i mean i like your close attention to this but you know this is what we do i'm here to help you through this stuff there's intentionality yeah the biggest the best one of all the ones we just mentioned that was the tramp motorcycle is not at that last party it's just not um you just want to ask her you can only give one oscar to anything in the movie what do you give it to can i give it to the guy that does the indian chant at the bistro best supporting actor i just want to give it to him or the woman who's next to uh to jackie when she's talking about like wanting to suck his cock oh yeah the woman reaction at the table oh yeah well lee grant won it so i guess that's the answer that's our answer somebody actually won the i would make a case for town i think the script is interesting yeah yeah yeah yeah probably an answerable questions we already did all mine unless you guys have any other ones uh i mean did george ever get a salon did lester pay for it did lester and jackie make it oh that's a definite no yeah you think they made it no no i'm saying i'm agreeing with they broke up but how long and does she move on to another situation no i think she found somebody else who had some money and i'm with you maybe a little younger what happens um does george get the shop at all i'm gonna say he's too much of a he's a flake he's too much of a flake i don't think he could run a business did anybody talk about what happens to george any of the filmmakers bounced around a few hair salons i think there might have been some late 70s cocaine right a path for him try this this stuff's great no tragic end two years later he's just getting fired from his third salon i got you yeah i think it goes kind of badly for george yeah yeah take um what piece of memorabilia would you want or not want from this movie i think the triumph is eligible so that's what i chose i am not a motorcycle person in fact i don't want to get on a motorcycle i don't want to ride in one i'm scared of them and yet i want the motorcycle that's how cool that motorcycle the brown leather jacket i think is in the running too the jacket he has for the the one he whips into the garbage i was kind of disappointed by that jacket you don't like it really yeah i just i didn't know if it was iconic enough it seemed kind of thin and shiny in a way like it's just me a little cheap a little cheap and maybe that's good character um yeah what about the blow dryer oh that's a good one that's a really autograph yeah that's good it depends it's like do you want a usable prop you know do you want something like the triumph where you can just like ride around on it um is the triumph just for show do you want i think it's for show it's for show right in the living room yeah got it i feel like it's this should category should be modified a little bit to be the rewatchable studio prop from the movie what could you put in a glass case in this room like yeah what would be in the kush spot yeah kush corner yeah i would go with the just because it's like that's good it's like the scene in the apartment you know like the cracked mirror it's just everything kind of spins on it and it's just it's just there are you aware of the memorabilia auction rise for Hollywood stuff you must be a little bit yeah like the Shawshank Bible going for like $450,000 damn I didn't know about that yeah like shit's going down people are paying for stuff how much can we get for the Penny Lane coat Greg's excited in the corner he's like wait what he keeps you keep it all the Penny Lane coat could we get some no I think are you asking us to bid on it or no I'm just like asking just like you know I'm like I would say just from almost from almost famous wouldn't it be the Russell Hammond guitar used in the concert scene that would be the highest Lloyd's boombox maybe something like that Lloyd's boombox you don't have that do you it's in my garage oh my god come on don't sell it oh my god don't sell it don't sell it yeah there you go don't sell it no never never I never saw that that's like yeah that's up there did you see it came back that it was memed again when Cusack was at the Cubs game did you see and he had his arms up and people were putting the boombox up I did I'm surprised it's eternal man it's so amazing my daughter said this era's coming back the Lloyd Dobler era's coming back god willing her theory this show Summer I Turned Pretty on Amazon everyone loves this character Conrad and he's a big like he's like a quarter yearner person and my daughter who's 20 was like this is women want to be courted like nobody courts us anymore and that's why we like Conrad and I was like it sounds like you would've liked Lloyd Dobler Lloyd is the only one that I would write and have thought about writing more about you know more of the story of Lloyd but Lloyd now he owns a series of Muay Thai studios in northern California or any number of eras just he's so much fun to write for write that character I loved it I love it still that's the little that's dangerous to say out loud filmed by Laszlo Kovacs the boombox scene is fucking filmed by the guy that filmed Shampoo also a very important song choice scene indeed yeah only one song worked and we did try everything yeah Coach Finstock wore Best Life Lesson everyone sells out I don't know if I agree with the lesson it doesn't have to be that way but that's the lesson of the movie or the theme right yeah we're all gonna sell out at some point well it's kind of like an acid burn takeaway in the in the year that Jaws comes out and kind of changes movies forever you know that like you could say this is the the highest arc of being able to end a movie where everyone loses yeah and then did you have anything different just that Jill is the only one that that claws her way out of that so so optimism and hope do does does triumph in in some way even in this kind of circumstance so Jill represents the Jimmy Carter presidency or I'm just keep going yeah or what didn't Towne say Jill is his attempt to write what a 70s woman was going to be you know who had more control over herself and was able to make her own choices and not be so dependent on finances or men and that's his attempt to like have a little bit of a happy ending to it so I kind of go with that as a mini lesson there's a way out of this sellout generation what do you have for double feature choice uh I wrote the parallax view down as basically just like the two sides of the baby persona where like there's not a single laugh in the parallax view the whole time you're like what the fuck and it's right the movie right before this yeah and it's right before this interesting cool choice cool choice I went rules of the game which I I think was you know a a father of this movie in a way uh the inner relationships the the kind of wistful feeling that Jean Renoir the the director who acts in rules of the game has it's I would love to watch the two of them together I had Nashville I just went 1975 sprawling that's cool two different areas yeah both political both full of music then who won the movie it's gotta be baby baby yeah baby all the way alright this is where we ask producer Craig who hasn't seen a lot of these movies especially before the 2000s what he thought loved it totally loved it um I'm increasing starting to love all the movies from this era but the charisma we've corrupted him yeah the charisma of all the actors in this movie just jumps off the screen so much I also just appreciate that this movie's trying to both trying to say something and is also just a good time and very enjoyable and it feels like more and more now movies that are trying to say something have to be serious or depressing and a lot of your movies say something but are fun hanks and are not and are enjoyable and laid back and I don't know this movie's just so unrecognizable to everything that's going on today in so many ways like we talked about LA but I mean just the fact that it's such a small movie such a small story and it made 60 million dollars which is the equivalent of 360 today it made 300 million adjusted for inflation domestic which is the same that Jurassic the new Jurassic Park made this year like it is just so remarkable that a movie this small can do what it did back then um but yeah I just loved it across the board it was amazing it was both small but had major stars in it which always helps this is a really hard thing to do and it's also really true to make a point and sugar coated enough in like charisma great casting and all that stuff where you just it goes down so easy and it's not about you must remember this which does make those movies so serious yeah I love it when you realize later how much was packed into the shit that made you laugh sometimes it's good to have major stars in a movie like that and other times it isn't like I was like the the sliding doors almost famous was if Brad Pitt's Russell Hammond is it a better or worse movie right and that almost happened and I actually think it's better that he wasn't even though I love Brad Pitt but in this case it's so important that Beatty who we everyone knew at the time to be a ladies man to make a movie about being a ladies man and he never made a movie like this so the idea of him leveraging that persona for everybody was genius like Burt Reynolds couldn't have been this he could have done it it just wouldn't have been it just would have been it wouldn't have it would have felt off for sure it would have felt off I have a question for you guys yeah what is the best use of celebrity in a movie like big stars what's your favorite use of big stars when they're slightly off brand or when they go full into brand so we we talk about this a lot the thing I always say is every once in a while I want the A-lister to be an A-lister just like do like in Cruise Cruise Jerry Maguire is one of the ones we mentioned right he's like in Interview the Vampire the year before dyed hair he's in Far and Away and sometimes people just need to be the person we fell in love with in a movie in a movie it sounds like stupid but I don't think it's stupid just every few years be the person that we like yeah I always think of Denzel as an interesting example of this because he very rarely transforms he's always always Denzel he doesn't dye his hair blonde and his movies are very in quality right and when they're good they're the best movies of all time and when they're bad they can be pretty bad and yet there's something always very watchable about him you know you'll watch him kind of make any I've watched every Equalizer movie and I really enjoy myself watching them another actor I don't think I would have any time for those movies so I do think that that is a but that's the 1% of the 1% of major stars I mean you know better than anybody like how hard it is to find somebody who you the audience will be like I'm with you no matter what yeah which I think Chalamet might have that quality I agree he's the next one of the under 30 guys Leo definitely had it you've seen Marty like that's not a very likable character and yet you're with him throughout that movie did you see it coming early on Chalamet you know that he had that yeah in Homeland season 1 when he played the young yeah the boyfriend of the girl's mother yeah I didn't see that one right away with him because he was really good in Call Me By Your Name but I certainly didn't think he was going to be like the next guy Leo was a little different because he was clearly really good I've told this story about seeing him in a Growing Pains episode when he was this adopted kid in Growing Pains and he was just so much better than everybody he was crying and flipping out and I was like oh my god but it wasn't until This Boy's Life where you're like oh protect this person at all costs with Chalamet I've just been saying that this next movie I think is the ultimate test of if the thing that a lot of your movies have that a lot of movies over the last 75 years have still exists that like can you make an original movie character based drama that is not IP that is not an event movie and will people show up primarily because of who the star is and is there enough of a wave of excitement for him that they'll buy into it because of that and Chalamet has evolved into what Leo didn't have to do 20 years ago which is Chalamet knows how to sell his movie and is actively involved in the marketing of the film I saw that viral piece and he just has great instincts for that which is something Leo didn't have to do and actively refused he didn't do SNL he wouldn't do stuff like that Tim leans all in when they know kind of like how to use themselves and like how much you can kind of like move the aperture but like really it's got to be this kind of thing and they're smart enough to know that like going wildly off in another direction might be artistically satisfying and you know sexy but it's not going to work and Cruise is a little bit like that like I heard I heard him talking to somebody once who wanted him to do basically a cameo and uh and wouldn't it be fun if and he was he was he was really smart about it he said like i could do it but it would mess up your movie because i would i would that ship would tilt in a way that it would take on water and i i almost wish it wasn't that way but when i'm in a movie it kind of has to be right there and uh tj mackie is the only time where i kind of could mess around and be a smaller character doing such and such but still use the thing but like basically i have found over time that if you put me in a movie i kind of draw attention and so it's got to be kind of used in that way and i thought that was so super smart you know what's interesting is pta feels the exact opposite he loves bringing like major major famous people into his movie and and kind of explaining i don't even know if there's a right answer because i agree more with the cruise angle of like i don't want to get taken out of the movie i'm watching because somebody's so famous yeah you're like oh this person's in there but yeah it's it's i mean if i was an up-and-coming star i would just want to work with good directors i think that blueprint's been established like that's how you're gonna win but i do think the the the superhero cape screwed everything up for an entire generation you felt like totally agree it was like can you can you make it to the point where i might get a superhero movie and that was your goal instead of like oh good directors want to work with me yeah yeah you hit a point in the 90s where people are like if i'm in that guy's movie i'm gonna come off well and that's that's where i was to be yeah that would be my chalamet advice just go where the directors are dude i think you got the best advice ever from leonardo dicaprio right he said no hard drugs no superheroes wow that's great advice and keep a little mystique keep a little mystique is huge yeah because you can blow that so easily and and you're basically asked to blow it constantly because we got to sell the movie we got to do this and this and this and this and the people that know to hold back those are the ones that you lean forward you go to that was nicholson that was nicholson nicholson was like coming up next on the tonight show it's jack nicholson like if he went on anything you were stunned they they wanted him to be on the cover of rolling stone once and i remember and he sent back the message like i i don't know i don't know i don't know i don't know i i don't want to appear as myself on the cover and i won't do it uh i also won't be on tv because then i'll be in your living room and i'll be your friend i'm not your friend i'm supposed to be very big and i'm supposed to be somebody that you come to see because you don't know enough about me and uh sorry well that's what made it so crazy when he came to the 84 finals in boston and he was just there as a laker fan everybody was like oh my god nicholson's here this is up there like giving us the middle finger like we just said like it broke our brains which is mystique yeah it's just crazy they did it leo's done a great job i mean leo's in his 50s now and i still don't feel like i know that much about him which then he likes the ladies you gotta love it's about it um you want to talk about your book for a quick second how long were you working on it i don't know a couple years definitely it was it was writing for pure joy uh i just like we had i'd done enough scripts at the time and we had worked on a musical almost famous and i just felt like i want to get back to like the analog thing a little bit and write about learn about my dad and some stuff that happened growing up that i didn't really know enough or had written about and to also tell some of the stories behind the stories that i'd written for rolling stone and so this is just me basically the first language of writing just writing for pure joy on yellow legal tablets i had like 800 pages and fingers still worked literally my fingers stopped working it's my don't work anymore it's my favorite kind of writing do they work we'll see one of these no it's good yeah i guess you do write some letterboxd stuff for once every once in a while yeah i read emails that's about it at this point i wrote like five million words i mean what do people want from me for 15 straight years time for mystique 10,000 words a week for 15 years they're demanding more they're demanding more from you i love writing i just love it i love it and i love directing where the where the words come to life with the actors kind of actors that we were talking about it's the most fun you know what's the most fun of directing besides putting the music on the scenes the little things that an audience finds that cracks them up that you had no idea was funny because that means you built characters that they care about right like the little things what's an example of that in one of your movies someone told you about um i don't know like in jerry mcguire i can come up with with bonnie hunt saying don't cry at the beginning of like i do which which you know we thought was like a funny little filler line and it's like huge laughs um in almost famous eric stone street saying uh you got a message from your mother she's a handful biggest laugh in the movie that's a great clerk saying she's a handful so like that's the fun the stuff that makes you really laugh because you know you're you you you've cut that line a million times and somehow it snuck back in and it ends up like bringing the house down it's the most funny thing about it it's the most funny thing about it it's the most funny thing about it it's the most fun and you never find out until the first time you show the movie and it never changes yeah the only experience i've had with that with that dune documentary same thing you're it's always shocking what hits you just have because you've seen all the cuts of stuff and you have no idea it sometimes it can be a word oh that one really yeah you can't believe it it can be a word movie it's got to be more fun sometimes it's a gesture it's wild um and and so you know i just i love doing it and and the book is really interesting and i'm an extension of personal writing, which is my favorite kind of movie making and my favorite kind of writing. I'm glad you're writing again. And songs. I mean, shit. The personal stuff. You've had one of the most unique careers. The Rolling Stone, how old were you? 15 when I started. Think about that. Think about that, Sean. How old's your daughter? I'm a huge failure. What do you want me to say? I've accomplished nothing. I agree. My daughter's four. So 11 years from now, writing for Rolling Stone? That seems inconceivable. I don't see that happening for a variety of reasons. But I will explain to her how special Cameron's life and work is. I just think that's crazy that you were able to fulfill a task at age 15. I was like barely handing term papers in. Will you do like a follow-up to this? Because this is only a part of your life. This isn't everything that you've done. Yeah, I probably will. The next one is going to be a collection of the journalism. That happened during the time. Because this is kind of like how the stories happened and everything. So the next one is going to be a collection of the stories from the time. And also, I re-interviewed a lot of the same people. Fleetwood Mac and even Bowie. In the last 15 years, I went around and talked again to a lot of the people that we did those big cover stories on. And it was fascinating how they related to their younger selves. And so that's in there too. And then maybe I'll write more. But I want to make some movies now. What was the best concert? Especially talking to you guys. I know, you're rejuvenated. Come on, man. Come on. What was the single best concert you ever went to? The Who, San Diego. One of the first concerts. Maybe the second concert I ever went to. Amazing, amazing concert. I had like a cheap seat. And I snuck down right before The Who came on. And the audience like huge. Like all the general seating people just like crammed. Slammed up to the front. And I got caught up in it. And I got slammed to the front of the barrier. And so they were six feet away from me. And The Who come out. Fucking Keith Moon tumbles onto the drum set across the stage. And Daltrey comes out swinging his mic. And Entwistle puts on his bass. And then Townsend comes out in this silver jumpsuit with a crown. And he goes, hello, San Diego. What a pleasure to be here in your trash can. Because the sports arena looks like a trash can. I'm like, fuck. Yeah. He knows San Diego. He knows everything. And then the audience crushed me into the barrier. And I couldn't breathe. But that was the best. That's great. At some point, can you write a book about movies the way Tarantino did? I love the Tarantino book. Just like eight, nine movies that meant something to you and why. Absolutely. I think it's an easy layup book for you. So fun. Thanks. This was chapter one. It would be about the personal experience that you have with the movie. I think every great director should be forced to write a book like that. Forced? Yeah, forced. Like in a fascist regime where they all have to write books? Like Trump does a decree. Great. Okay. We'll look into that. Here's what I've decided. We're going to have these people. It's going to be great. That's the kind of thing I would ask him for if I got his ear. I'd be like, can you please send down a decree that Cameron Crowe write a movie book just for me to read? And protect movie theaters. Can you do that too? Cameron Crowe, this was a true pleasure. Good luck with the book. So great. Thank you, guys. And thank you for our Kush sign. Well, Kush will be here to bless your future experiences. I'll figure it out. It'll be prominently. Somewhere. Just as long as you hear a little strains of Kush lash when you look at that. Yeah, yeah, yeah. This is great, though. Thanks. Thanks to Gahal. Thanks to Craig as well. Thanks, Craig. Thanks to Eduardo. And we'll see you in the rewatchables next week. Fantastic. Thanks for letting me come in and hang. 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