Speaker 1This podcast is brought to you by Biogland Smart Minds, the tasty gummies supporting young people's sleep, mood and focus with high quality magnesium and carefully selected vitamins, amino acids and natural extracts to help your child's brain and body function at their best. It's that time of year again, new school, new college, new everything. The year seven and a blazer they'll grow into it by Christmas, the backpack are bigger than they are and here's the thing I come back to again and again. Every child meets this moment in their own way. One's lying awake at night, one can't quieten a whirring mind, one's wobbly and out of sorts and can't tell you why. I remember it as a mum too, that knot of hope and worry as you wave them off at the gate. So these are gummies I'm genuinely happy to recommend because there's something for each of them, a nighttime gummy for sleep, a focus one for those busy brains, a mood and mind one for the wobbles. Sugar-free and designed to support growing minds, balanced moods and restful sleep. Available online and in store at Holland and Barrett. If you are listening to this episode, something in your family is changing or has already changed. I want to start by acknowledging that because separate is one of the hardest things any family goes through and the fact that you are here looking for ways to do this well for your child already tells me something important about who you are as a parent. Today I want to offer you the research on what children actually need when their parents separate, what genuinely protects them and five practical things you can do whatever stage of this you are at. I'm Dr Mary-Anne and this is how not to screw up your kids. The research on children and parental separation is more nuanced as you'd expect and in many ways more hopeful than the headlines suggest. The dominant finding from decades of study is that the majority of children whose parents separate go on to be well adjusted and resilient and to live full and happy lives. Most children two years after a parental separation have adapted. But the headlines need an important qualifier because the research is also clear on what determines whether a child adapts well or struggles significantly and it is not the separation itself, it's what happens around it. The single most consistent predictor of poor outcomes for children of separated parents is sustained inter-parental conflict. Conflict that the child witnesses is aware of or is drawn into, not the fact of two homes, not the change in family structure, the conflict. A large-scale meta-analysis by Paul Amato. So a meta-analysis is fundamentally looking at lots of studies that have been conducted and then pulled together so you can see what trends they're across multiple studies. They reviewed, so Paul Amato reviewed decades of research across hundreds of studies. So not just one, meta-studies are like incredibly powerful because you're getting a collective of lots and lots of studies. And what they found was that children in low conflict separated families often do better than children living in high conflict intact ones. So I want to leave that there for a minute. So where we can prioritize the low conflict in a separated family, the children more often than not do better than when we stay together and there's high conflict. Now, this reframes the whole question because it's not, the question is not how do I protect my child from the separation? It's how do I protect my child from the conflict? And the extraordinary thing about that question, is that it is largely within yours and my control. You cannot undo the separation, but you can control what your child sees, what your child hears, and what your child is asked to carry. Now, the second major protective factor is the maintenance of warm, secure relationships with both parents. Children of separated parents who retain close, consistent, loving relationships with both parents show outcomes comparable to children from intact families, families where there has been no separation. So it's the relationship is what protects, not the address that they live at. So let's have a look at what that, what the distinction is again between the fine lens and the wide lens before we then start shifting to the skills and then my top five tips. So when we think about fine lens, remember it's a problem in a specific situation in a specific situation. So when we think about fine lens, remember it's a problem in a specific situation So fine lens problems may well be my child has withdrawn since we separated. My child is acting out at school. My child is distressed at handovers. My child says they want to live with their other parent. My child refuses to talk about it. My child seems to be managing fine, and I don't know whether to be relieved or worried. And my child is angry with me. Anything like that, that's a very specific problem that we're looking for a solution to. And that's what the fine lens is. When we look out into the world, we're looking for a solution to. When we look wider lens, we then accept that as part of this process is that our child is basically experiencing and working through a grief process. The family they knew has changed. And grief, which can look like withdrawal, it can look like anger, it can look like anxiety, it can look like an apparent acceptance, is the appropriate emotional response to significant loss because it is a process of grief. Your child has not been able to cope with it. Your child the skills gap is often in the co-parenting relationship. Children who are caught in the middle are not there by accident. They are there because one or both parents, often in pain themselves, have placed the child there by sharing too much, asking too much, or communicating through the child rather than directly. This is not a moral failure. It is what pain does. And it is what we are going to address today in this episode. So what are the skills that I want to give my top tips to be focused around? Well, there's two parts to this. There's the skills that we're building in our children, and there's also the skills that we're building in ourselves. So in our child, we're building emotional literacy around grief and change. The language to name what they're feeling, and the understanding that multiple feelings can be true at once. And permission to love both parents fully without guilt. And the knowledge that both homes are theirs, not that they belong in one and visit the other. So those are the skills that we're building in our child. And in us, it's the ability to separate our experience of this relationship from our child's experience of it. And these are two completely different things. And keeping them separate is the most important skill a separating parent can build. Your child does not need to know what your ex did. What they do need to know is that both of their parents love them, and that they're going to be okay. So before we go into my top five tips, it's worth being specific about what children understand and need at different stages. Because separation looks and feels very different to a three-year-old than to a 13-year-old. And the conversations you need to have are not the same. So I've broken this down broadly. Remember that I'm very big into this idea about stages and not just ages. So take these ages as a guide, because your child may well be in a chronological age group that I'm going to discuss. But developmentally, they may be above that or below that. And that's what we want to be thinking about. So let me go through the group. So toddlers and babies, so our naught to three year olds, very young children do not understand separation in any conceptual sense. And so what they need to understand is the disruption to the routine, the change in who is present, and the emotional state of their caregivers. Their distress is real, but it is not about the separation. It is about their nervous system registering that something has changed, and that familiar people are sometimes absent. So what they need when we're in this toddler and babies are naught to threes, they need consistency in caring routines. And they need consistency in being able to communicate with each other. So they need consistency in being able to communicate with each other. So they need physical warmth and proximity. proximity and a parent who is regulated enough to provide co-regulation the most important thing that you can do for a very young child during separation is manage your own emotional state when you are with them okay so that's what our toddlers are not to threes need preschool three to fives children at this age are in the age of that little bit of that magical thinking you know they may believe that they caused the separation through their behavior that something they did or said is the reason that their family has changed and they need this explicitly addressed simple honest age-appropriate explanation mommy and daddy have decided not to live together anymore that is a grown-up decision and it has nothing to do with anything you did we both love you exactly as much as we always have mommy and mommy mommy and daddy whatever the new year is we both love you exactly as much as we always have mommy and mommy mommy and daddy whatever the new year is we both love you exactly as much as we always have mommy and mommy mommy is whatever that the dynamic is for your family we want to address that specifically and they also need both parents permission explicitly to love the other parent you know at this age a child who senses tension around the other parent may suppress their love for that parent in your presence in order to protect you so we want to give them that explicit permission it is completely fine to miss mommy when you are here and i am glad you love them so really explicit there so those are our preschool three to fives our primary age is six to eleven children at this age understand more and feel the loyalty conflict much more acutely they may try to fix things asking if you're going to get back together trying to please both parents maybe even acting as a mediator they may worry about practical things where will they sleep what will happen if they don't sleep where will they about christmas can they still see their friends they need information not more than they can handle but enough to reduce uncertainty and they need explicit release from the role of fixer or peacekeeper or mediator this is not your job to sort out your job is to be a child our job is to sort out the adult things said clearly and often this relieves children of an enormous burden so that is what our primary age six to eleven and then our teenagers are 12 plus teenagers have a more adult understanding of what separation means and often have very strong feelings about it anger grief a sense of injustice they may even take sides they may withdraw entirely they may become a confidant for one parent which is one of the most damaging roles a teenager can be put in they need honest and honest communication with their parents and they need honest and honest honesty appropriate to their age not everything we're not trying to be their best friend we're not trying to have them as our confidant we have to remember however adult like they are that they are still our child so we want to tell that you know be honest and be appropriate to their age but not everything but enough that they're not discovering information second hand or piecing it together from overheard conversations they need the explicit message that their relationship with each parent is important and that they need to be honest and be appropriate to their age second hand or piecing it together from overheard conversations they need the explicit message that their relationship with each parent belongs to them and is not subject to the conflict between the adults a teenager who is angry with you about the separation is not broken they're grieving and they trust you enough to show it the anger is information not an emergency so that sets some context and hopefully that will mean as we move into the five tips you're then able to act from those and of course i'm going to give you some specific information within those about how we then might practically implement them across different age groups so number one protect your child from the conflict including the small moments this is the most protective thing that we can do for our children because the research is unambiguous inter-parental conflict is the variable which predicts harm to our children and this means protecting your child from the conflict is not just about not having arguments in front of them it is about the sigh when their other parent's name is mentioned the eye roll the ask your father ask your mother comment that seems throwaway but isn't children are exquisitely attuned to our emotions as parents they notice everything even when you think they have not and this is very hard when you're in pain and you're going through that process you're not required to have warm feelings about your ex but what is helpful for your child is to manage the expression of those feelings in your child's presence not because your feelings are wrong not because your feelings are invalid but because your child should not be carrying them now practical steps and i understand that this isn't always possible to do this in agreement and mutually and if you can't then simply practice this in your home with when you have your children if you can't and ideally you want to agree between you if possible or as a personal rule if not that the other parent is never spoken of negatively in front of the children that includes comments to other adults made within earshot and trust me our children can pick up on everything if you think you're having a quiet conversation with a friend in the corner while a birthday party is going on your child knows that something is going on and will pick up on it so be really mindful of that children hear what we assume they are not listening to they store it and it shapes how safe they feel to love both parents and when your child comes home with something which triggers you from their other home or maybe angers or upsets you your response in that moment is your child's data about how safe it is to talk about the other parent breathe respond to your child not to the information thanks for telling me that sounds like it was hard how are you feeling you can process their reaction privately or with a trusted adult or even a therapist if you're making use of one but not with or in front of your child so that's number one is protect your child from the conflict including those small moments number two your child is not a messenger a spy or a mediator remove them from the middle one of the most common ways children get caught in the middle and it's through practical logistics tell your mum what time we're leaving ask your dad why he hasn't paid this month let me know what's going on at that house each of these feel small but collectively they place your child in the middle of the adult relationship in a way which creates significant stress and loyalty conflict so the rule all adult communication happens between adults through adult channels handover logistics financial matters schedule changes disputes none of this travels through the child apps designed for co-parenting communication our family wizard and similar can be useful because they create a channel for adult business that keeps children completely out of it what the other parent communicates through your child so do not put your child in the in the position of the adult channel of relay receive the message warmly if it comes to you that way without burdening your child with your response to it thanks for letting me know i'll speak to dad or i'll speak to mum about it then contact the other parent directly model to your child that adult things are handled by adults and from the mediator role if your child has begun trying to manage the relationship between you and you can all be together trying to smooth things over name it gently and release them from it you know my standard phrase i've noticed you're trying to help us get along that is so kind of you and it's not your job we will sort out the adult things between us your job is just to be you so that's number two about our children not being the messenger number three and i know this is a bit of a long story but i'm going to talk a little bit more about that in a minute but i'm going to talk a little bit more about that in a minute but i'm going to talk a little bit more about that in a minute but i'm going to talk a little bit more about that in a minute i'm going to talk a little bit more about that in a minute i'm going to talk a little bit more about that in a minute consistency as possible across both homes now children anchor themselves in routine and consistency when the family structure changes routine becomes even more important because it provides the predictability that the nervous system needs to feel safe particularly with younger children where the two homes can agree and i know this is not always possible but if where they can agree on consistent routines bedtimes screenings and other things that are time boundaries homework expectations rules around behavior this significantly reduces the cognitive and emotional load on the child who is moving between them however i am realistic about the fact that two homes are two homes and will not be identical so the goal is not uniformity the goal is enough overlap that your child is not managing two completely different sets of rules expectations and values which is confusing and sometimes weaponized in ways that damage children if that is not possible then consistency of rules and consistency of routine within your home then becomes your priority now what consistency most benefits young children so i just want to talk about the sort of the which aspects of consistency are the most important particularly with our two to seven year olds and that's bedtime routines because they you know those that travel between homes it's really important a comfort object maybe that goes with the child the same morning routine structure before school and these small anchors matter enormously to a young child's sense of safety and continuity when we start getting to older children and teenagers then where possible if we can have agreement between homes on the big things homework bedtime attendance at school significant relationships a teenager who can play one home against the other because rules are entirely different is often not a teenager who's thriving they're a teenager who has learned that the you know learned the way that they get what they want is to exploit the gap between their parents closing that gap even partially is a gift to them even when they resist it and then the transition moment handovers are often the hardest moment for children of all ages a child who is dysregulated at handovers is not necessarily having a bad time at either home they are managing the transitions between two emotional worlds which is genuinely hard yeah this hard kind of loyalty and disloyalty i'm sad i'm leaving one parent but i don't want the other parent to see that because i don't want them to feel that i'm not happy to go to that parent so keeping that transition moment as brief warm low drama that handover from both parents is then becomes the gold standard if face-to-face hand overs are too charged then school drop-offs and pickups can be used to create that distance so one parent drops off in the morning and then the other parent picks up at the end of the day so that's number three number four give honest age appropriate explanations and always leave the door open children will fill information gaps with their own imagination and their imagination is often worse than reality so age appropriate honesty not everything but enough reduces anxiety and gives children a framework for what is happening that they can hold on to now this is the core messages that we want every child to hear regardless of their age are this is not your fault we both love you and that will never change you're going to have two homes and you belong in both of them and we are going to be okay and these messages really ought to be said not felt children of separated parents really need to hear them repeatedly across months and even years not just in those initial conversations because as children grow and their understanding deepens the questions that they have about the separation deepen too and the conversation then is not is never just a single event it is an ongoing one and you may feel a year or even two years in somewhat surprised when your child brings something up it's something that they are working through at their time scale which is often very different to ours when they ask why we can say things like mummy and daddy have decided that we will be better parents to you if we live separately now that's usually enough for younger children older children and teenagers may push for more give them what you honestly can without burdening them with adult complexity or making the other parent the villain sometimes grown-up relationships don't work and this is what happened to us that is between mummy and daddy and not something you need to carry for example and then leaving the door open you can always ask me questions about this it's an important thing to say explicitly some children do not ask because they sense it is painful and they're protecting you giving them explicit permission to ask and meaning it opens the door for conversations to happen over months and years as your child's understanding grows so keep that question you can always ask me questions about this at any time so that's number four number five my final top tip is watch for signs that your child may be struggling and where possible respond early most children do adapt well to parental separation when the conflict is managed and we do not place the child in the middle and parental relationships are maintained but some children do struggle and the signs are worth knowing not to alarm you but so that early support can be offered rather than waiting until the difficulties just become a bit more entrenched so the signs worth noting across all ages may well be things to do with regression so they regress they start going backwards to some of early behaviors from early years so you might get a lot of stress from your child and you might have a lot of stress from your child at some point in time and you might get a lot of stress from your child at some point in time significant changes in sleep in appetite or mood which persist beyond the initial adjustment period maybe they start withdrawing from things that they previously really enjoyed whether that's activities or friendships they might start reporting physical symptoms stomach aches headaches that you can't sort of explain medically or with a reasonable explanation excessive worry about what's going on in their life and what's going on in their life and what's going on in their life excessive worry maybe about your well-being or the other parent's well-being or reluctance to go to one home that wasn't present before so those are some of the signs that are worth noting of all ages and the difference between adjustment and difficulty so some distress in the months immediately following a separation is expected and absolutely normal a child who is sad confused or angry in those first few weeks and months is responding appropriately to the situation to a significant change the indicator which warrants attention is distress which is not lifting after that initial period or it's escalating rather than settling as the new norm becomes more established and of course what you can do is maybe speak to the school they often see things in the classroom that maybe we're not visible to at home maybe speak to your gp if symptoms are physical or persistent and maybe where you're not visible to at home maybe speak to your gp if symptoms are it's appropriate consider a few sessions with a child therapist who specializes in family change it's not as a crisis intervention but it's more about a space for your child to process what is happening with someone who is entirely theirs not attached to either home and for many children this is enormously helpful even when they appear to be coping now before i finish the episode though i just want a note for those of you who have children who are neurodiverse children or autism often find the transition between two homes particularly challenging not because necessarily of the emotional complexity although that may well play part of it but because of the sensory routine and the predictability with disruption two homes mean two sets of environments two bedrooms potentially different textures and smells and sounds extra transition support and consistency in the things that can be consistent an advanced warning of what is coming next make a significant difference maybe a visual schedule that travels between homes and that can be enormously helpful for neurodiverse children of all ages and of course this is just a starting point there are so many things that we could talk about about how to best support our children when they when we separate but hopefully that's given you that understanding of what is normal so a lot of children will be going through that and some tips and that in the rest of the episode regards of how to best safeguard them and whether you're listening to this podcast because it's for you or whether you're just a regular listener and regardless of the topic you listen to this i would encourage you to share this episode with anyone who you know who is going through a separation it can feel incredibly lonely it can feel incredibly difficult and there is a lot of guilt and worry associated with making good choices making the right choices and really worrying about not screwing up your kids and so sharing this may well play a significant role in just share a little bit of love and help and support on monday something a little different we're talking about reading specifically how to raise a child who loves it why it matters more than most parents realize and five things you could do right now which make a real difference i'll see you on monday and that's all for today be as kind to yourself as you've been trying to be to your children you don't have to get it right every time and the fact that you're here learning and growing already says a lot for more episodes on all the resources to support you head to drmaryhan.com i'm dr maryhan take good care of yourselves i'll see you on monday
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