S4 E15: Divorce Month: Why January is the Season for Separation & Mediation

Surviving the Holidays and Embracing the New Year I'm Alex. Speaker 2 Howard and I'm Amanda Silver, and this is Holidays are over. Speaker 1 2026 is upon us. We'd survived the holidays. We did it. We did it again. Speaker 2 And your holidays have changed a bit. Your Christmas has changed. Speaker 1 There's no more Santa. Speaker 2 Why no more? Speaker 1 Santa's gone. Bring him back. I know, right? But it actually was kind of amazing. Speaker 2 So OK, but there's just like. Speaker 1 So much, it's a double the effort. So like already as you know, as a parent, as a mom, there's like so much that goes into Christmas between like the parties and the festivities and whatever, all the holiday gatherings to the actual date, then what's happening Christmas Eve and then stockings and then this and then leaving cookies out for Santa and the reindeer and this. Speaker 2 There's a lot. Speaker 1 So now. Speaker 2 It's the Christmas mental load. Yeah, there's a lot and. Speaker 1 And physical, right? I'm like I have to get different wrapping paper for the gifts that come from Santa. Speaker 2 OK, so see this, I'm not familiar right? I can understand. Speaker 1 Now, there are some 'cause I did talk about this last year, and there are some people who just leave the gifts, unwrap the kids, come down in the morning. Santa's been here. Why would Santa wrap your present? He's just left. Speaker 2 Wire or don't the elves wrap the presents. Speaker 1 Oh fucking no, man. Like everybody tells. Speaker 2 Obviously their kids, their job, there's. Speaker 1 No, like consistent Santa protocol. Speaker 2 OK, 'cause my reference is, you know, the movie Elf, which is sure. Speaker 1 It's so good. Speaker 2 So no more Santa. So Santa's out Santa, the kids, is it? What happened? They just realized one day they just came to you, both of them, and they're like, we know. Speaker 1 We know. Yeah. It's like last year. Bennett knew. Remember? He asked. And I had to break his heart. And then he was like, damn, I wish you lied to me. And I was like, oh damn. Speaker 2 Keep their innocence. Speaker 1 I know. Speaker 2 But so then. Speaker 1 This year he was like, oh, Bridget fully knows. She's just, and she's known for years. She just wants all the extra special Santa love. Speaker 2 I feel like the boys, yeah, even longer. That's the smile. They definitely girls are like, yeah, we yeah, we know this. Speaker 1 We are. We're up to these. Speaker 2 Trips, we're talking. OK, so now the the jig is up. Speaker 1 Jig is up. Speaker 2 It's like, yeah, all the presents are from us so well. Speaker 1 Exactly. And quite frankly, they always were. So it's really nice. Speaker 2 Get the credit. Speaker 1 Get the credit like I spend a lot of time trying to be thoughtful and. Speaker 2 Santa's bringing one gift. It has to be like, really, right? But it. Speaker 1 Can't be an expensive gift because I believe wholeheartedly that Santa has to be somewhat egalitarian amongst all of his people. And so I always try to keep the Santa gift like quite inexpensive. I'm talking like a sub 50 bucks. Speaker 2 OK, well he's which is hard these days. Speaker 1 Exactly. Well, and it's how is he making these things at the workshop? Like the lies were just snowballing. Like they were getting too smart. Speaker 2 He's not making them, he's ordering them to the. Speaker 1 Work on Amazon like this is too. Speaker 2 Much Amazon delivers Oh, that's oh, I I didn't go down that. Speaker 1 Road, they have a lot of questions. Speaker 2 Oh, thank God. See, for Hanukkah, it's like the parents buy it. There's no surprises. That's it. Yeah. We don't have to lie. Speaker 1 It is nice, yeah. You're much more honest. Your religion is more honest than the Christians, which I also don't subscribe to. The whole thing is ridiculous. Christmas without Christ, This is so not appropriate. Anyways, 2026 is upon us. I know, a fresh new year. Speaker 2 I know it just feels like it's just, I just got used to 2025. I feel like I always say that but like it takes me a whole year to just settle in and now it's like 2026. I feel like even years are good years. Speaker 1 Oh, I'm the opposite. Oh. Speaker 2 No, no, don't say that, I. Speaker 1 Know it's funny, but 26 feels like a good number. Speaker 2 It's an odd year. I would say 2025 was an odd year. Like odd. Speaker 1 Literally. Literally. Speaker 2 No, I just feel like it was a weird year. It was. Yeah, it was a weird year. Speaker 1 Like, yeah. Speaker 2 It was it was good for certain things and just like a the world that just like a lot of oddness world odd odd this odd tease. Anyways, 2026. I feel like it's an even number even as when things are like. Speaker 1 Well, I don't know how if you subscribe to because we've not yet hit it or maybe when this comes out we will, but the Chinese New Year, yes, right. And so there the the snake was 25. Yeah, there was the shedding of everything, which I really like this OK way of I love, I like. Speaker 2 The Chinese astrology stuff. Me too. So what's? Speaker 1 I'm super here for. Speaker 2 It So what's this year? Speaker 1 I want to say. Speaker 2 What animal? Speaker 1 Dragon, let's quickly look that one up. But yeah, the the snake is all about shedding what isn't serving you, so getting rid of all of the past garbage that's weighing you down, starting fresh and then 26 is. Speaker 2 The Year of the Fire Horse. Speaker 1 Yes. Speaker 2 Signifies energy, passion, freedom, change, creativity, courage, innovation. I mean breaking through old patterns. I'm here for all of that. I love a horse. Worse of a snake. Speaker 1 Any day, right? Yes. OK, this is good. This is going to be the year, Yes. So 2025, what are we shedding? There was a lot of marriages that got shed. The Mental Load of Holidays and January Divorces Oh yes? Well, it is divorce month. Speaker 1 January is divorce month. Yes, you know, we talk about this every year. You you probably have like a last holiday season, one last hurrah with the kids. Give them a really, you know, one final beautiful memory or. Speaker 2 You're absolutely miserable over the. Speaker 1 Holidays, you're so. Speaker 2 Fuck this. I'm out. I've had enough, yeah. Speaker 1 Yeah, yeah, yeah. Speaker 2 I feel like there's part of. Speaker 1 That and then January comes like. Speaker 2 Realization like, I can't do this anymore. Yeah, because I think it's all. Speaker 1 Well, what did I just literally start this episode with? You're like the mental load, the weight of the holidays. You're exhausted. Speaker 2 Not to mention all the in laws that you have to deal with like I think that's. Speaker 1 It's a lot. Speaker 2 Yeah, people don't really give people enough credit for like, oh, it's the Christmas season, I'm now going to leave my home and go into a smaller space, usually with more people and my in laws and extended family and try and not fight. Speaker 1 Those who say murder each other so fight is generous. Speaker 2 It is fine, yes and and then also get along with your spouse and then there might be issues already there. Let's not show everybody our dirty laundry. Everything is. Speaker 1 Magnified in the. Speaker 2 Stress. Yeah. So that's why divorce Month is in jail. So it's here. It's upon us. If you need our help, we're here. Call us. We call us. Speaker 1 We're shedding the crap from 25 we are riding. Speaker 2 What are files in 2025? We're ready for some new ones. It did, actually. Those are lot. Yeah, this was a busy. There it was. Speaker 1 Up until literally the last day. Speaker 2 We were working until yeah, yeah, yeah. So there's a lot of people out there who need some. Speaker 1 Yeah. So call us. Speaker 2 There are some celebrities who have also shed their, you know, I think. Speaker 1 There's talk about some celebrity shedding. I feel like it's nice not so much to just like talk trash about people that we don't actually. Speaker 2 Know we don't want that. Speaker 1 To kind of give a little bit of perspective on maybe your own issues, it helps like kind of. Speaker 2 Regularity. They're just like us, a divorce just like that. Speaker 1 It's like either comforting to know you're not alone, or it's comforting to know that they're so extra that your shit's like, pretty mundane. Speaker 2 I don't know about you, but I feel like I get emotionally invested in these celebrities. So when they break up, I'm absolutely, I'm actually upset. I don't know these people. I don't know me, I've never met them, but I'm there's some part of me that's grieving because I like them together. Speaker 1 Are they like sort of like inspo like as long as they're together, the. Speaker 2 Yeah. I feel like it's just like when you see some like, really powerful celebrities that are together and you're just like, I don't know if it's like this like Disney version of romanticizing marriage or like, they have what you want and then you're like, and then, oh, no, not them two, you know? Yeah. Speaker 1 Do you know what the I think we already mentioned this one, But for me, the celebrity couple that's that is that pinnacle of like way to go is the Tom and Rita. Speaker 2 You are together forever. Forever ever. Yeah, the death view part, because. Speaker 1 I feel like they are like the world's mum and dad. Speaker 2 They are the world and nobody. Speaker 1 Wants them to break up, so like Tom. Speaker 2 Hanks and Rita, like, they're just, they're so like, wholesome. Speaker 1 Yeah, sturdy, like. Speaker 2 Our sturdy leaders. Speaker 1 Yeah. Speaker 2 There's no scandal around them. Like, there's no like, yes, there's no scandal. They stay out of that. They just seem like wholesome people. Yeah, I feel like that with the Seinfelds. Uh huh. I just, I mean, Jerry, you know, Jerry's, I love him so much. Just love. And I find that I feel like they're like a powerhouse and I just love them together. And I feel like that with them. Speaker 1 Well and you know, like Jessica's all anti phones, like anti technology, so I'm obsessed. Speaker 2 He's always she's like healthy cooking, healthy eating and this is and and he's just the opposite. He just says what like he's just, it's just so funny their their relationship, but it's like the TV. Speaker 1 Show continued. But he kind of settled down. Yeah, but didn't. But he's still Jerry. He's still. Speaker 2 Jerry and I also feel like that with with Kelly Ripa and Mark Consuela. I love them together. I think they're so cute. I love that they're on the show together. They're just like, to me, they're like America sweethearts. Yeah, I don't. Speaker 1 Know that story at all? Speaker 2 No, they were. Speaker 1 They started. Speaker 2 Out. So yeah. Speaker 1 Just Co host no no. Speaker 2 No, no, they started out on soap operas. Hello. So I think they were on, I don't know which soap opera, so could have anything. They were one of the soap opera. She was like night like 2019, so, so young, like such a baby. And they met there and then, you know, her, both of their careers took off. And she, they have like 3 kids together. And then she went on with Regis, right? Sure. And then Regis. Yeah. Poor Regis. Regis passed and then he's took over. And I I don't know. I love them together. Speaker 1 That's very cute. Speaker 2 Yeah, so those people, you stay together. Speaker 1 Yeah, you stay together 'cause we need you, the world. Speaker 2 Needs you. We need the hope. Yeah, we need the help. The Impact of Wealth and Scrutiny on Celebrity Splits I guess there's an there's an expectation with celebrities that like, we kind of expect them to not stay together. Speaker 1 For two weeks. Speaker 2 I think it depends on the celebrity. Yeah. Like we were just talking offline about like, Miley Cyrus, right? She's, I think, newly engaged. And she was with HEMS, with one of the Hemsworths. I always get the mixed up. I just call them the Hemsworth. She was with Hemsworth. To me, they're the same. They're both gorgeous. Speaker 1 Men like the Olsen twins. Yeah, it just. Speaker 2 Well, actually, I can tell. I can tell them apart. Oh, Oh yeah, I can tell them apart. But yes, the Hemsworths, I just, they're the Hemsworths. She's with the Hemsworths, and we were just saying how, like that didn't end. Yeah, well. Speaker 1 No, I don't think it did. I think it. Speaker 2 Did so well. Speaker 1 And it's funny because like we are in this work, I think if the marriage relationship, whatever is not going well, shed that shit, right? Like there could be something better. I. Speaker 2 Think it's easier to shed if you are a wealthy celebrity? That's my opinion, that's what I think. Speaker 1 That wealth makes the divorce easier. Speaker 2 Not just the wealth, but the but the but the you have your with you are both celebrities. I'm talking about both you both of you are like similar list B list A list B list whatever. You're both celebrities. You have your own things going on. You have your own money. OK, so that's we don't have to worry about that. There's not like one person supporting the other. That's already that part is checked off. But then you also have like your own full, not just career, but like life around you because you don't like celebrities have like they're fans and they're groupies and they're people that sort of fawn over them and they're social like. Speaker 1 They're well supported. Speaker 2 They have this, yeah, They have this whole life that most people don't have, most Joes don't have. Speaker 1 Separate. I want to talk about this like separate. Speaker 2 From separate from their spouse. Like I feel like you're socialite, right? You're very much connected. Yeah, yes, you have your friends and you have, but you don't have this like huge network of posse, like a big posse that like follows you around and like everything. Speaker 1 I do not. Speaker 2 Know everything you do is like amazing and like, you know, like you don't have that like cheerful. Speaker 1 Tire pumping. Speaker 2 Yes, but these celebrities do. So do they really so like that support that you get from your husband They can get it from other? Speaker 1 People but don't you think like, you know, we talk about feeling lonely in a marriage even when you're with someone. Don't you feel like for celebs, and obviously we have no insights, but that you could be lonely and still surrounded by this group of tire pumpers? Speaker 2 Which is why a lot of people turn to like drugs and stuff because. Speaker 1 They actually don't think they're getting the support they need. And and two, there is maybe more pressure to maintain this like sort of lifestyle or this personality that you have created. Speaker 2 It's a persona that people are exactly you to be, I think all the time. And that's, and if you want to just like I was watching yesterday on, on Instagram, they were interviewing Taylor Swift and they're like, do you ever just like watch friends and like lie in your bed like a normal person? And she's like, yeah, some days I do. And to me, I'm like, wow, 'cause I think of her as like this billionaire power woman. She got so much going on. How did she ever stop? Speaker 1 Right. And just chill. Speaker 2 And just chill and just like have some normalcy of just like in your pajamas, not answering the door, not not being. Speaker 1 Messy buns just chilling. Yeah, yes, exactly. It's good to know that they. Speaker 2 Still do that it's good to know that they. Speaker 1 I think being financially secure is a huge part of. However the same really could be said of like it's scalable. Like if the two of you regular Joes had this particular lifestyle and you have to divide that, you're still dividing, you know, a, a, a pot, right? They're dividing that pot as well. So they've gotten used to a lifestyle with two pots or a full pot, right? And now that's only half. Yeah. Listen, cry me a river. I have to sell my $20 million home to move to A5. But I feel like you get used to that lifestyle only. Speaker 2 People should like shit on people who are like in a in a position of like super wealth. OK well they still have to make some concession their life. Exactly. Not the same as everybody else, fine. And it's not like the same as someone who can't pay for their, you know, food and lights. But it's not the same scale. But we can still empathize absolutely with the change in their life. Speaker 1 But you're right, Listen, we see a lot in our practices of of people that have to live together post separation. Yes, if you have millions, you likely don't have to. You could probably find a separate location to live. Speaker 2 Right. You're more likely to be able. Speaker 1 To more likely to be able to. Speaker 2 Being or you have another exactly, or you know you have. Speaker 1 Or you have friends with like 17 guest rooms that you could like pull up in. Speaker 2 Or someone's cottage. Speaker 1 Right. There's more of someone else's big Yeah. You don't have your own. You're surrounded by people with vacation. Speaker 2 Properties, right? Maybe it makes it a bit. Speaker 1 Easier maybe at least to have the physical separation while you're going through the emotional separation. Speaker 2 So these celebrities can do that exactly. They have flipping. Speaker 1 In that one way, it is simpler, yeah. Everything is just kind of a sliding scale of like it's hard. Speaker 2 But there's also the all the other side of this coin is that everyone's discussing your marriage. So, for example, Amy Schumer and Chris Fischer just just split. I love Amy. Speaker 1 Into them. Speaker 2 I, I mean, I love her, I think. Speaker 1 She's just being good for each. Speaker 2 Other and what? Speaker 1 The fuck do we know? But the thing. Speaker 2 Is now that they've split she has had to come out to deny rumors about why. Like she said, you know, irreconcilable differences. Whatever. We're just we're going to Co parent. Like leave us alone. Basically, leave us the fuck alone, right? Speaker 1 I'm curious about what kind of Flack he's getting. Speaker 2 Well, because. Speaker 1 Has he had to come out publicly to like? Speaker 2 Well, I guess she's more I mean, he's a award-winning chef, right? And so. Speaker 1 Not as celeb. Speaker 2 Not as I mean, she's a she's, she is. And so she's actually had to come out and say it's not because I lost weight. This is where, and I know this is going to this is going to get you hot and hot and bothered. Speaker 1 Here, hot and bothered. Speaker 2 Because people are so well, because look at her, she's lost so much weight. Now she's out on the market and she's like, it has nothing to do with that, OK? A woman's weight has nothing to do with anything. Speaker 1 It's also just not something that needs to be discussed. Speaker 2 Well, that's what it always goes. Speaker 1 Like why are we talking about it at all? Speaker 2 And then there's also he, he, she came out saying that he's autistic. We are years ago. Speaker 1 Right. Oh yeah, years ago. Speaker 2 Years ago, no, she was like, he's on the spectrum whatever and autism and like whatever. And now she's like, it's not about that either. So people are are trying to find poke holes in their life. So what? Speaker 1 Do you think that says about us, like is it just this morbid curiosity of like we want to jump to whatever conclusion that makes us feel better about our life or that gives us answers because we do have these parasocial relationship with these people, right? We think we know that. Speaker 2 Yeah, we think we're like, we know them. We see them in a movie. Speaker 1 We know that exactly. So I think in that regard, they've got a much shittier time to do it in the public eye. But at the same time, yeah, I wonder why we want to like answer the why? Speaker 2 We have to know the why I. Speaker 1 Don't think it's any different really than knowing like, why Thusi Q in the office is getting a divorce. Like, I think we also want something to be like, you know, at the water cooler. Oh, was it because of this or she did go on her own vacation last year. Maybe it was trouble. Like, we do want to know the I mean, that's literally why we have a dirty laundry pocket. Speaker 2 Why? You're all listening. You're all guilty of it. Speaker 1 We're all guilty. We all. Speaker 2 Want to know? Speaker 1 We want to know the TV. Yeah. So the celeb is just like, I think it gives us permission to not feel yucky, you know, doing it where poor Susie, we see her everyday crying over her lunch. Yeah, we may feel a little bit bad about. Speaker 2 It OK. Speaker 1 That like with the celebs, we're kind of like, we don't know them, we'll never know them. Who cares? Let's like trash talk. I don't know, I wonder. Speaker 2 Yeah. I also just don't think that they have like their relatable lives because like they're, they don't like the day-to-day stuff that people deal with in a marriage. I think it's different for them. They're on set for three months away from their family. Let's just say it is a different lifestyle, this ones traveling in a different part of the world and like they're just they have such independent solo and they're like low Yeah, you. Speaker 1 Keep coming back to that. Navigating Relationships in the Public Eye Yeah, where they live much more independent lives. I wonder how true that is, because again, we're you and I are just guessing? Speaker 2 Yeah, you tell me if I'm if I'm wrong or maybe it's not this. It's I'm curious. It's not true for all of them, but I just see like they're this premier and they're and they're surrounded by their PR people and they have this like, where is their spouse? Speaker 1 Yeah, and how do the kids fall into the all the? Speaker 2 Like are they? Are they? Speaker 1 What kind of parenting plan are they coming up with if I'm on set for two months? Speaker 2 How does that? How does that work? Speaker 1 And if if you know if they're babies, sure, bring them along. You have a nanny you can help, you know. Speaker 2 How does the parenting plans work? Speaker 1 But when you have kids that are in full time school and with lives of their own. Speaker 2 Well, they also get, they also have help for sure, right. So yeah. Speaker 1 Is there a celeb duo that broke up in 25 that you were happy about? That you were like, oh good. Oh, I didn't like them together. Like I know I laughed at. Well, no, I was just laughing at the fact. Well, I shouldn't say laughing. Maybe they're happy. I wish them nothing but happiness. But of Katy Perry. So she had her breakup and then now she's with our ex premier. Speaker 2 Premier, Prime Minister, get your politics brothers just. Speaker 1 Goes to show how little I know. No, I did know Mr. Speaker 2 Justin Trudeau, Katy Perry, I it's it's. Speaker 1 It's like, is that funny? Is that I don't. Speaker 2 Know what to make of this? Speaker 1 Is that good for Canada? Speaker 2 Are we any publicity is good for Canada, We need it like we're not typically. Speaker 1 A better pool? Speaker 2 Map Our cool meter has not been very that's fair, right? America has got more of the cool, but we need to, you know, maybe this is cool, elevates us a little bit. Speaker 1 I mean, when he was our Prime Minister, there was a lot of talk about like, how handsome he was. Speaker 2 Yeah, he's like a bachelor, 'cause he was married, but then they got separated and then there was. Yeah, exactly. People were like he was a CRJFK. Speaker 1 Right. Well, we'll leave that one. Speaker 2 We'll leave that one, but people were excited about someone with like charisma and. Speaker 1 Handsome. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Speaker 2 Like different than maybe our previous Prime Minister, very prime Ministery. We are, you know, like very much like, you know, which is such. Yeah. So it should be interesting to see what. Speaker 1 We'll see where that ends up. Speaker 2 Where that goes? Yeah, we're watching. Speaker 1 We are watching, yeah, but yeah, I don't. I don't know much about her previous life. I think I was kind of married. Speaker 2 To a pirate of the Caribbean. Speaker 1 Yeah, I liked her. Speaker 2 Orlando Booth. Speaker 1 I really did forget after after the Pirates, I really kind of forgot about him or after what was. Speaker 2 It did he do? After I don't know. After I don't know you know how is the difference between. Speaker 1 No, don't. Speaker 2 You say no, no, it's gonna happen. Don't you say I don't. I sometimes I don't know the difference between a Star Wars and a Star Trek reference. Like to me, I've no, I, I never really watched it. Like Luke Skywalker is Star Wars. Yeah. Speaker 1 Good one, Captain Picard. Speaker 2 Who's that? Speaker 1 Star Trek. I could put you on this spot, yes. Speaker 2 Is Star Trek, yes. OK, so you're an old school. Speaker 1 I was a new generation. Speaker 2 But no, like the the more alien looking our Trek, the more human looking our wars I. Speaker 1 Don't think that's AI, don't think that's a Blake and it's. Speaker 2 Chewbacca. Speaker 1 K. Speaker 2 Wars. Speaker 1 Yes, definitely not. Speaker 2 Human R2D2 wars. Speaker 1 Yes. Speaker 2 But whose Trek? And maybe I just know wart. Speaker 1 Yeah, you, you know, like William Shatner was the OG. Yeah. Speaker 2 Beam me up, Scott. OK, He's got Trek, Yes. Speaker 1 Trek, you know more. Speaker 2 Than you think, all right, maybe there's a little Trekkie in here. Speaker 1 There's a lot of Trekkie in here. Speaker 2 What do you call a Star Wars person that? Speaker 1 I don't know, Ryan, do you know? Speaker 2 Ryan, what do you call? Speaker 1 Do you what like not a Trekkie, but what's the? Speaker 2 Star Wars fan What about? Speaker 1 I don't, I don't know. Speaker 2 What he was Star Wars. Speaker 1 Star Wars, I love a hero. Yeah, yeah. Natalie Portman. Star Wars Ewan McGregor. Oh, he, I had such a OK, we are really getting. Speaker 2 On a tangent here. OK, OK, OK. Speaker 1 So Katy Perry's done enjoy our ex prime. Speaker 2 Minister, enjoy our exercise. Speaker 1 Good luck too, yeah? Speaker 2 He's all I wonder. Speaker 1 If he talks politics in bed, is that a turn on for some people? There's got to be some like polyphiles out there who are just like Tuck dirty to me about. Speaker 2 Is that what it's? Speaker 1 Called nature. I don't know, I think I may have. Speaker 2 People get turned on me by like, political talk. Speaker 1 Yeah, isn't that what isn't? You just add like an ophile to anybody to make them a failure. Oh, oh, oh. Speaker 2 OK, now I'm thinking about it now like a Star Trekophile. Speaker 1 Oh, maybe a Star Wars a file. So take a. Speaker 2 OK. Speaker 1 Let's talk about our friends from down Under. Speaker 2 Which friends from down under? Speaker 1 Nicole and Keith, our little Aussie friends. Speaker 2 Yeah, I don't know. Speaker 1 She's so nice to me, seemed so regal. Speaker 2 And unreachable. Very much so very like, like she's just like a doll. Speaker 1 Yeah, like something you put on the shelf and dust. Speaker 2 Weekly porcelain skin. It doesn't move exactly. And like she's just she just plays that. But she's a great actress. Like I love her movies, but yeah, I just. I always thought they were an odd. Speaker 1 Parent, I know, but then here's the question. Is she such a good actor that we assume that's her personality in real life? Speaker 2 We have no idea what she's actually like. Yeah. Speaker 1 Idea. We have no idea. Speaker 2 She was Tom Cruise. Speaker 1 Yeah, also I thought that was mismatched, but again, what the how do we doubt who? Speaker 2 Do we? What do we? Who do we? Relationship experts Marriage experts like. Speaker 1 Divorce could have seen this one coming. See, they were mismatched. Our Spidey senses were right. Speaker 2 It was they were a mismatch. They're no Tom and Rita. Speaker 1 No. Can anyone? Speaker 2 Be love you so much. I love you so much. Speaker 1 Well, not divorce, but there was the Chris Martin breakup. Speaker 2 I like them together. Speaker 1 I like him a lot. Speaker 2 I love him and I like her. Yeah, so. Speaker 1 She's very talented. Speaker 2 She is very. Speaker 1 But again, it's so hard. We don't know these people, how they. Speaker 2 Attracted. Oh, I like him and I like her. I've never met these people. Speaker 1 But we did go to the Coldplay concert. Well, we've been together a dozen. Speaker 2 I've been to a few. Speaker 1 Too and and. Speaker 2 Sitting You know him now, I. Speaker 1 I know him because we, we stood very close to the secondary stage, OK. And so he was like this far away from him. So we're basically besties. Speaker 2 He knows you. Speaker 1 Knowledge so you. Speaker 2 Know exactly what type of person he should be with. Speaker 1 And it was not her, I guess. Speaker 2 I liked him with Gwen. Speaker 1 Right I. Speaker 2 Know, I just thought they were cute together. Speaker 1 Are these also going back to Tom and Rita like our parents, Like we watched them have Chris babies and we watched the babies grow? Speaker 2 I think it's a nostalgic part, yeah, for us. Speaker 1 Because that was like our pop culture. Speaker 2 Like era, yes, I think that's what it is. I think so too. It's a nostalgia, yeah. Speaker 1 Because I feel like they were the first ones to kind of come out with like celeb baby names. Like with Apple, we were like, whoa, lebs. They're wild. Speaker 2 They were also the first one. Give them some credit for the uncoupling because no one knew what the hell that was about. Yes, we were like, what the? Speaker 1 F and I actually believe it changed our entire. Speaker 2 Industry. Yeah. Yeah. Because of them. Yeah. Chris Martin and Gwyneth Paltrow were Trail Blazers in the divorce world. Yeah. Because they were like, you know what? We are in the public eye. Yeah. But we're not gonna shit talk each other. That's a better way. Designing Your Divorce with Dignity and Support We're not gonna destroy each other's relationships or, or a reputation, I should say. Speaker 1 Or relationship with the children like we see a lot of that. Speaker 2 I know the work people were like, what is this woo woo conscious uncoupling? But I think it was brilliant. It was brilliant because it had nothing to do. It didn't matter what happened between them. They have kids together. They're both professionals in the public eye. They have like respect for one another. They support, they still support each other. Beautiful. And I think that is so. Speaker 1 Beautiful. They do seem still quite friendly. Speaker 2 Yeah, like very similar to Ashton Kutcher and Demi Moore, where it was like, yes, their family, they split up, but like they still still cared about each other and respected. Speaker 1 Each other, yes, I agree. No, they were definitely Trail Blazers and you know that because of the backlash they got, Yes, for trying to do an amicable. Speaker 2 Trail Blazers get shit in the beginning. Speaker 1 Exactly. And now you and I, all we're doing is like hi and. Speaker 2 Coupling uncouple you, that is basically what we're trying to do, absolutely. And our mediation is trying to uncouple people. It doesn't have to be. Speaker 1 Exactly, I literally say I'm like I'm just here to disentangle your your shared life together so you can start your own new one. That doesn't have to come with shit talking one another. It doesn't have to come with turning friends against one another. Like there doesn't need to be any of that. Even if you are divorcing the world's biggest asshole, you still don't need. Speaker 2 You don't. Speaker 1 Need to to just be so yucky, right? You know, I often say to people, and I, I did actually just last night in one of my mediations, like how do you want to show up here? How do you want to be in this experience? Like when this is over in a year from now and you're looking back, how would you want to have shown up? Like how proud of that person. Speaker 2 The only push back I have to this as you're speaking is that it's one thing to say, OK, you've uncoupled or you split from some nasty person. Yeah. And assuming that that's where it. Speaker 1 Ends, I know, and so that's ongoing. Speaker 2 That's the problem is that it's not. If that's where it ended and you could both go on your merry weight, great, You don't have to talk to. Speaker 1 Agree with you, however I think because there's an ongoing relationship to be more imperative that you show up as your best way. Speaker 2 Agree. But what what I'm saying is what if that nastiness continues and we know it will, we know from the work that we do post separation, it doesn't continue, it gets. Speaker 1 Worse, it can get worse. Speaker 2 It gets worse, and so certainly. Speaker 1 Worse before it gets better. Speaker 2 Yes. And so it's for for those types of personalities, right. So then what I know and that is I think that's the tricky bit. Can you put on this face to the world that we're just consciously uncoupled? Everything is great and ladi dadi dadi da. Speaker 1 If it's not, yeah. And I think really, let's start this January off right, which is that's the whole point of mediation is you can actually design the process that fits the couple divorcing. Yeah. So like, if you are taking advantage of January divorce month, fucking call us. Because like so much of what I do is gaining insights from both parties to help them. Speaker 2 And show. Speaker 1 Up as their best. Speaker 2 Size, Yeah. And be proud of the person who they Yeah, they are now in five weeks. Speaker 1 Exactly, and it's not a one size fits. Speaker 2 All that's why court doesn't or court because of course one size fits literally it's one-size-fits-all this legislation goes with this case and we will apply it to all these other cases. No right. I mean, yes, there are some, you know, differences. Yeah, but like it is but in in our line of work you can do exactly create your own precedent. Yeah. Speaker 1 And that's what we try and do. And and I think that's exactly to wrap this whole thing up what those who did so well and continue to do so well. So kudos. And for the rest of us regular folk choose mediation. Call, call me call mediation. That's EA, give me a call. Speaker 2 Like what was this 1992 I? Speaker 1 Know called 1800 like. Speaker 2 Don't forget to like and subscribe on Instagram, Spotify, YouTube, TikTok. We're everywhere. So you want to hear more of dirty laundry? You go ahead and do some work too. Yeah, give us some links. You can spread the wealth. Speaker 1 Share Share your favorite episode with a friend or maybe somebody who needs some help. Speaker 2 This episode was written and created by Alex Howard and Amanda Silver. Produced, edited and engineered by RTF Production. Make sure to rate and review our show if you loved it. Give us a follow on Apple Podcast, Spotify, or wherever you stream your podcast. Stay up to date on all upcoming episodes. Thanks for listening and go easy on us. We're not your ex.