S3 E5: More of an Ideas Guy - The French Revolution, Part I

[MUSIC] It's story time with the history, when you're close. Matt, O'Rea, and Jen, two months. [MUSIC] >> All right, Jen, you know what? >> What? >> Sometimes, the internet, even though it's a cursed place. >> It is, it is. >> Take talk, you in on all that garbage out there. Sometimes it comes through in a big way, okay? >> I am surprised that you are saying this. >> Yeah, well, because you see the script in front of you. You have the outline, you already know what I'm going to say. We hear it story time with the history, so we have a commitment to history and storytelling. >> Of course. >> Or more than anything else, the factual actual. >> Well, yeah, we want to be entertaining and accurate. >> Yeah, but it's accurate more than anything else. Like, we don't want to be Joe Rogan, right? >> Okay, fair enough. >> Yeah, yeah, we don't want to be that. So, the reason that this story today that we're going to tell is so amazing. So, great, is it comes from the Reddit sub or history anecdotes? >> You're on Reddit? >> Well, I'm not on Reddit, on Reddit, but I was snooping around because there's this story that I love. I love telling it in class, I love all this, you know, the intricacies of this totally melted story and on these people who are involved, but everything I kept finding. Because I wanted to go follow up to our previous episode on the Bakeman of Blood. And like, everything I found was like Yale, Booring, yeah, British content and it's not fun. And I'm falling asleep at my keyboard and all this sort of stuff. So, I have to unread it to the sub or history anecdotes. And I found this guy, he's gone. He's a deleted user, poster, but he had this awesome breakdown of this story I love. So today, we're going to hop into the flight of Varenz and we're going to tell this incredibly melted story, and it's a huge assist today from Reddit, which I never thought I would put those words together in the history of my life. >> I never thought you'd ever go on Reddit in the history of your life. Now, I do go on Reddit, I love the Am I a circle stories? Because usually if you have to ask that question, you totally are. Every once in a while, maybe slide over to the non-historical side and see some really entertaining stuff. Which is most of, I love how you like the non-historical side of Reddit, 99.98% of Reddit. >> My God, that's what we should do. We should get on Reddit and start posting Am I an A circle for historical figures? >> Nope, not doing it, not doing I want my job. I need this job, not doing it. I'm already going to be in language, put jail today because flight to Varenz. I can't, let's just, I can't say this word. I'm not doing it like the French. Like peanut butter stuck in my mouth. We're doing flight of Varenz. I'm saying it in the English way. >> All right, you know what? I have to say though, I really enjoyed our interesting way to start this pod. And the fact that you've actually branched out a little bit. >> Always, well, always interesting, never branching out, but I guess there's a time for everything. >> Hey there everybody, welcome again to Storytime with the Historists. The podcast for world history students, enthusiasts, and teachers. This world history, but told our way. And today, I'm super excited because we're talking French Revolution. And it really, it goes nicely with the bashing of the French that we did today as a result of our discussion on the Treaty of Versailles. So, it's a nice flow. >> Yeah, well, I think in general, like European history has this really nice arc of making fun of France that we can really tell. >> A little bit, yeah. >> I know, it's true. >> I'm with you, but immediately I can already hear students and listen to you. And it's falling asleep when we're like, we're going to talk about the French Revolution. >> Oh my God, no, it's so entertaining. >> We're going to do a bit of a sum it up today, from the basics of the French Revolution. So that we can get into the best story. I think it's the best story anyway of the entire revolution, the ill-fated flight to Versailles, and then the aftermath and fall out of like this. >> Oh, it's still lighting up. >> It's still lighting up. >> It's a really idiotic plan. And so, listener, don't worry, don't get your pillow out, you know, don't unplug and wander away. >> It would be great. >> Turn on TikTok and just have this playing in the background. We're going to get through the revolution, but we're really teeing up our next two episodes. This is going to be a three-parter for us. We haven't done a three-parter in a while, but we're going to get to the good stuff here. But before we can get to the good stuff, we got to get through the like the wise. What's going on in the wise is all happening. >> I think you're selling this short. I think this is a really entertaining context too. >> I agree it is entertaining, but I just want to make sure people also don't immediately unplug and walk away, right, like go make eggs or whatever the kids are doing this day. I assume it's scrambled eggs. >> I feel like you're selling a short, but that's all right. Our students do that every day, so it's fine. >> Pro egg? >> Where does our information come from today? >> So we get a lot of stuff today. Usually at the top, we acknowledge all our sources and go through the lot and really less. That would take us a while. Because while we started on Reddit, we really did branch out. The poster who do that stuff on the our history anecdotes, which I do have a link to that we'll make available in the description had some sources that they cited. And then we use that to track down some books and some articles and some stuff. >> We even went to Oxford History because the British do it right and some stuff by William Doyle, some sort of melted old historian, but we'll throw all this stuff up in the description so that we don't spend the next 15 minutes boring people with all the different places that we want to. So check out the description, hyperlinks, all great stuff. But Jen, let's get into it. We've already left the listener, you know, baited in anticipation, French revolution. Let's get into it. >> Okay, so 1789 hits, right? And things are not going down well in France for a variety of different reasons, right? They can't win a war at the stage to save their lives. And then, that's a big one. >> That's a big one, but I'm just taking them off, keeping for the list of it, the variety of reasons one can't win a war, but they're French, we already knew that. >> So they put themselves in the tremendous amount of debt and because they lost against Britain in the French and Indian war, they decide to help the Americans fight against the British in the American Revolution and yay, we win. >> But we win, we win, France was there. >> Well, I know, but- >> Yeah, United States, yeah, go America. >> Let's say, you, let's say, you, let's say. >> We get nothing to give to France, in all honesty, like there's no, like sport. >> We give them that, you're welcome, you're welcome, it's a gift, they keep that now, they can get a good credit rating. >> There you go, see? >> So one, we're just thinking ahead, two debt. >> Three, the most ridiculous, outdated, social, hierarchical system, just terrible, with the three estates where, you know, you've got the first estate, who's the clergy, second estate's the nobility, they pay no taxes, the third estate are all basically poor people and middle class, and they're forced to pay every single tax for the people of France. And so that is stupid because you've just angered 98% of your population. >> All right, three, angry about social hierarchy, stupidity, taxes, always the taxes, taxes are too high, story of your life, all right, so we're setting them up, we're not going them down. >> And then when they do try to solve all these different problems at the estate's general meeting, the outdated voting system is ridiculous because the first and second estate are always going to outvote the third estate, so nothing's going to get accomplished. >> Yeah, well, that was a stupid move, the king, so I think that's number four, which you drastically undersold is stupid, super king. >> Well, it is stupid, stupid king, though, in all fairness to King Louis, he did try to raise taxes on the nobility, before the estate's general meeting, they simply said no, and he's like, all right. >> Yeah, the assembly of the noble walls, yeah, he called together the richest people who had no available basis for taxing themselves, and was like, hey, do you guys want to pay taxes? Shockingly, they were like, no, we're straight, dude, let's continue to not pay taxes. Let's continue to have the people with no money pay taxes. >> Yeah, right. And the kings, I go, yeah, I'll show you, we'll get the estate's general together, and we'll have everybody vote on paying taxes, except for that the vote will never go the way I wanted to, which is like, this is the dumbest plan of all time, which makes the dumb plans that we're going to talk about in varence and all that, that are dumber than that, also just mind-dumbing. >> That's ridiculous. >> I have this mug that says stupid people doing stupid things because they're stupid and reference to the awesome TV show Archer, and I feel like the French Revolution was a pre-cursor for that mug. It's just like, over the dumbest thing that could possibly done was done. So then we're at the estate's general, the vote obviously doesn't go the way of the king. So then like, what's his like trump card, when is he will lay it down, when does he play the Joker? >> He doesn't really play a Joker, what ends up happening is you have members of the third estate, who, at least the middle class part of the third estate, has been exposed to enlightenment ideas, like John Locke and Natural Rights, and- >> Yeah, we have a whole episode of that, right? >> Yeah. >> So check out shopping cart over, back out a lot. We have 30 minutes of great content on that one for sure. >> So because it's, you know, this time period in history, they're not just going to sit down and go, oh, well, I guess it's just the way it's always going to be. So they fight back and they create this national assembly and they meet it Versailles, and they, they're going to meet until they form a constitution, and, you know, their meeting and everything's going well until one day they go to meet again, and the room to the, are the door to the room is locked, and whether King Louis locked this, or this was just a big freaking mistake by an idiot at Versailles, it doesn't matter because- >> It sounds like six or one half dozen and the other- >> Yeah, right. >> I don't know. So I think this is the wild card right here, this is the Joker, he's like, you know, it's totally going to stop them from radicalizing, me locking them in a room where they're just going to radicalize each other. >> I can't imagine that he was that stupid, like what- >> I don't know, I don't know if it's not a deep gene pool. >> It is, it is not, it is true. >> Splash pad of genetics. >> God. So as a result of this, it doesn't make the national assembly go away. They meet at the tennis court and make the famous tennis court oath that they're going to create a constitutional monarchy and a constitution for the people of France, and that's just the way it's going to be. >> So I have the greatest thing done on a tennis court in France until Rafael Nadal. I think that's still timely, but if it's not, don't cancel me, please. I don't know. >> He's a bit, he's older, he's not one of the newer kids, you know what? >> He's indolible, he's got like a thousand wins on clay. >> He is a great clay court player without a doubt, anyway. >> And that's a France. >> And what is it, it's good, he's a good reference. >> That was a good reference. So basically as a result of this, they're going to set up a constitutional monarchy. The royal family actually gets moved from Versailles to Paris. >> That's a big one. >> It is, it's a big one, they're like, you can't isolate yourself anymore, so suck it up buttercup and see what's going on with the masses. And that's great. A constitutional monarchy is great, and a constitution is great. And actually, King Louis agrees to it, right? And I think at the time, desperation because he understood the writing on the wall, but he knew. >> Yeah, I think we say agree to it, but we got to remember, like the reason, like you said, they leave Versailles and they ended up in this place, the two layers palace. But that had way more to do, I think, with like the great fear in the countryside, in the burning of all those states, and the women's march, like this much maligned event, by I think more contemporary sort of people, I remember the women's march being much more of a center of French Revolution history in the years past, not to say that we undersell it, but you know. >> Right. >> So, the point here is that, like the King is not acting out of, like you said, this like Magnanimous Mature. >> Oh, no. >> There's some desperation here. >> Yeah. >> This is a threatening environment. >> Yeah. >> And he and his wife, the Queen, Marie Antoinette, are at the upper center of a lot of the potential violence, and a lot of that has to do with the mismanagement, those big reasons that you listen off up at the top, and the fact that nobody liked Marie Antoinette. And she was a magnate for violence and disdain, and just general hatred, I'm glad for her that she did not exist in the time of the internet. She would have been roasted and flamed. >> And not even paying attention to the whole Let them eat cake, because we know that's not true. But what did she think was going to happen when she goes out and public with boats in her hair? I mean, come on. >> Your people are starving, but you're spending a ton of money on a freaking boat piece of your hair. >> I feel like we need to dispel a myth a little bit, because yes, she did spend some money. But she's with royalty and all these old school European monarchs, they're all absolutist pigs who are spending money left and right. She caught a lot of flak because she was German Austrian. >> Austrian, oh yeah. >> Look, they're Germans, with their Germans. But yes, she's Austrian, she married him. And she gets married off as a teenager to this older man, which is gross in and of itself. And she immediately starts catching flak because she's kind of weird, she's an odd duck. She used to dress up as a milk woman and she'd go out and milk the cows, even though she was the queen of France, but she gets the dad. >> Why is that weird? >> Look, she just fronted. >> It's not weird to me. I'm not judging. >> Yeah. >> I'm not judging, but it was weird for the people of France. >> She was trying to get in touch with her, also she can't win because that's like a humble thing to do. But then later she gets blamed for the diamond necklace affair and stuff and that's not her fault either. >> True, true. >> Yeah, I mean, the preceding king and queen were the ones who commissioned that diamond necklace and they're the ones who stiffed the bill on the jewelers and they're the ones who created the debt and Marie actually didn't want to pay for it, but she couldn't win, she just couldn't win. And come the revolution when things sort of just eat up and 1791 after the constitutional model is really set into place, and Marie Antoinette's father, the king of Austria is now looking at his son-in-law, the king of France and being like, you suck. And then everybody, you've been there, gone now, no one wants to be the dad, so to speak. So yeah, Louis XVI's got a lot of problems, but Marie Antoinette, I don't know, I feel like Louis deserves all the roasting that he gets. We can flame on this guy all we want, but like she's an odd dog, but I think it's unfair. I think we got to dispel that myth, she is not as wasteful as she is made up to be. >> All right, fair enough, I'll give you the benefit of the doubt for now. >> For now. >> That's how I missed the point. >> Oh my God, can you imagine, I can't even imagine being Marie Antoinette's dad, just like really, this is what you married into, but they had to have some scene, it wasn't it arranged marriages, I mean, I know they all had to be some other lady to marry. >> It was like political expediency and this had more to do with Megan's fear that like France and rise up, but like this is like deep down European grease ball stuff. You know what, take an AP European history class, and then you can spend five weeks learning all of this stuff before you get to anything. >> No, no. >> Speaking of Louis' father in law, Francis I of Austria, he, an absolutist monarch and his own right, was more than just a little unhappy about the occurrences in France and the loss of face and the threat that he saw his daughter, but more importantly his very powerful neighbor of kingdom, under after the constitutional monarchy has set place, because constitutional monarchy's tend to spread and saw this after the English Civil War and the threat that that put the rest of the European continent under, and then there's that direct through line to the American revolution. So this seems like a moment of like legitimate fear, right? >> And rightfully so, rightfully so. >> Right. So then Marie writes a letter to her dad actually, right? >> That does. >> And so I know you've got the text here and we'll have to do the reading for this, but she writes a letter, so she kind of undercuts Louis, which like, okay, yes, Queen. >> It's not really a hard thing to do. >> I'll remove, do it. She writes this letter, though, that kind of gives us an idea of what she is thinking, feeling and fearing during this time, right? So take it away, what is she saying? >> I will, but I am going to say right off the bat, first world problems and it's a little over dramatic. >> It is a little dramatic. >> Here we go. The occurrence which has just taken place has confirmed us more than ever in our plans. The very guards who surround us are the persons who threaten us most. Our very lives are not safe. But we must appear to submit to everything until the moment comes when we can act. And in the meantime, our captivity proves that none of our actions are done by their own accord. Our position is frightful. And we must absolutely put an end to it next month, the King desires it even more than I do. >> Yeah. >> Please, really captivity, captivity, frightful. >> Like Megan Markle and that other weird and glad Prince from Britain who like are like it's slumming it right, slumming it. >> Slumming. >> Slumming, you know, one of my students was telling me like, oh, there are a new object because the ceilings are kind of low. Like, I don't even know that means, right? >> We know vaulted ceilings versus non- vaulted? >> Like, even vaulted. Like, I don't know. I mean, I'm six foot four. All ceilings are kind of low to me. Like, I don't know what they're talking about here. And this is the same way that like living in a palace with a girl. >> Still the King, using Queen and one of the biggest countries in the world. >> Yeah, this is that piece where like, yeah, maybe she doesn't deserve some of the like roasting that she gets for like being all like bad money management and all that sort of stuff. But like, yeah, I'm with you. That's a little over dramatic. But it's going to be a break reference something that is going to be pretty problematic for the rest of Europe quite frankly. And that's this plan that's already being said. >> Oh, my God. >> This is asking a plan of idiocy. >> Oh, my God, seriously, it is so, so stupid. So the royal family is going to hatch a plan to escape their captivity. And then their goal is to raise this, what they think is going to be this huge force of loyalists. >> Who are then going to. >> I believe in the country. >> Right, wait Tim and he's like, no, no, we're going to have a huge force. And then he's convinced and probably rightfully so in this that these loyalists are going to be backed by the Austria and he's going to be retake the throne. >> Going to renegotiate it, huh? Hey, yeah, I want to do over. Now that I see what's happened, I want to play this reverse card in the UNO deck and see if we can do it again, let me put this in really plain language for all our listeners. What Lui is proposing to do is to side with a foreign country to attack his own people, simply so he could get back in power. >> When you say it like that, I don't say how this could fail. >> God. >> You know what, I think the problem is, he's not an ideas guy, he's not a details guy, right? You need to have somebody in your crew who's like a big idea person and I think that's him. I think there's a lot of yada yada yada in these planning sessions. The way I think they're going down, they're hanging out, they're eating chocolate, they're swillin' wine, they're hanging out and they're slightly lower ceiling castle and complaining about all this sort of stuff. And he's like, you know what, that's Austria and I don't even know what it is. >> I was like, I can't tell myself, I can't tell myself, it's over, it's ruined, I'm sorry, I'm sorry for everything, but yeah, he's just like, we're not going to do this constitutional marmonity that I just like, immediately agree to, what we should do is totally break out and we'll just make this happen and then we'll have, you know, your dad's got an army and right, Marie and she's like, yes, right, and he's like, oh, perfect. And so you have these two idiotic personalities put together and they're just hashing this stupid sort of plan. And then the problem with people like this is, right, all these Nepo babies, people born into royalty, people born into position, is they are never surrounded by somebody who's like wants to tap the brakes on the dumbest idea that you've had yet. Instead they get people like to say this Swedish guy, yeah, this cow, Axel von Ferson, who's hanging out with Marie Antoinette, right? They're probably hugging up, by the way. >> I was going to say, they're not hanging out. >> This is this, but yeah, this is where the reddit face of the preacher will come then. But we will call them likely bad mates and he's definitely like, yeah, you know, we should totally do is we should take your husband and me and then we can go continue our affair in your dad's house. Right? This is dumb. This is dumb plan. It's dumb plan. Right? There's no details and everything else and, you know, like it's just, and then unfortunately the person who has to wear all the blame for this in a lot of ways is Marie Antoinette. She's going to be the person because they're going to Austria. >> Yeah. >> It's going to be like, but it's not her fault, it's, it's von Ferson, it's, it's Louis, it's, you know, you know, Francis, the first of Austria, it's these people who are pulling the strings, which she just gets caught up in it, right? So our reddit post kind of like sums us all up really simply and nicely, our unknown author writes, quote, one night the royal family would travel by coach in disguise to the fortress at Montgomery, near Francis border with Luxembourg. The king would be a safe distance away from Paris and have loyal troops at his command. So he would be able to deal with the constant constituent assembly that's Francis legislature and the Parisian revolutionaries on an even playing field on the night of June 20th before slipping past the guards with his family in a few attendance in disguise. Louis left a proclamation behind in the palace, can't tell me. >> Yeah, so God forbid we just leave. We have to have the last word too. >> Yeah, all right, so like I like how this like lays out that this escape attempt is going to be like, hey, they're just going to slip away on the night. Because like, first of all, no, it took a long time for them to depart, right? Because this wasn't just like running away. This was going to be fun with cast in time because like you said, Marie, she's a slave to fashion, she wants to dress up not as a queen for the escape. She wants to be like a governess, she's going to dress up like a teacher, but she's going to be a fan. >> I'm insulted. >> She's a fancy teacher, all right? He, the king, is going to dress up like the stage coach driver. However, he refuses to sit outside of the stage coach. So he's going to sit inside of the stage coach dressed up as a stage coach driver, which makes no sense. >> This is so insulting, they're like, it's like play time dressing up like the peasants. >> Yep, yep, and they're not going to take just a regular old coach. They take the official royal coach, the one that's not going to give them away at all. >> Flying Air Force one, but like dressing up like a bag of off, who's in there, like clearly the king? And they packed up all their luggage. We're talking about all the luggage of the king and queen of France. You know how long it took? It took like 12 hours, and- >> Get ready? >> Yeah, and that's not even the biggest problem with all of this. He left a note. >> He's so stupid. >> Yeah, let's go back to the reddit post and it says, Louis left a proclamation behind in the palace condemning the revolution. He leads a note that's like, hey, leave in the Austria, going to come back with an army. What are we doing here? What are we doing? This is dumb, this is capital D dumb. >> Right. >> Right? >> That's what you said, we- >> The note could have just read, like, hello, Swine, we're leaving, we'll never, you'll never find us, we're leaving the Austria. >> Yes, his peasant so sucks to be you, me, Marie Antoinette, and the rest of our codery of idiots will return with an army. This whole revolution is stupid and I don't want to play anymore. Toodles, hell, like, that would have been, right, clean better, somehow. >> Oh my god. >> Come on. >> I would have rather just had him write suck it and called it good, at least you're going out with dignity then, you know. >> Then you could have posted that to read it. >> Yeah, see? >> Yeah, all right, so as we get really close out for today, like this whole thing- >> Are we going to, are we going to leave him on a cliffhanger, whether this guy on works or not? >> If we did this whole thing, we would have like a Dan Karlin episode on our hands, like two and a half hours and a minimum, maybe, I mean, if we really got into it in the detail, this is one of those Karlin, like, hour seven, now the king finds a man, right? It's like, we can't do that, but I mean, this whole thing, they're dumb. These are dumb people, these stupid people doing stupid things because they're stupid. That's really- >> That really is it. >> That really comes down to it, right? All right, so we know this as we get ready to close out. We know that the sweet Axel Von Friesen did leave a written plan as well, basically outlining the escape. And it wasn't left on purpose. >> Okay, I'm like, are you kidding me? >> No, but it was probably also kind of left on purpose. Like, it's hard to see what his endgame here is in this. I think he's, like, hedging his bets. >> No, I think he's planning it out because he's like, dude, if I could bust, if at least Marie and I can get to Austria, totally bust out Louis XVI, he's out of the relationship. We don't have to worry about a little threesome, now it's just me and Marie and we got this. >> This is definitely internet logic. >> I'm telling you. >> I'm telling you. >> This is not like, nah, man, he's gonna risk the revolution. This is great. This is great. And I think he's hedging his bets to an extent, being like, nah, if he gets caught, he's like, it was all on them. Listen, I left you this kind of a skit because what he leaves, dear listener, is a stop-by-stop turn-by-turn road map for where the King and Queen are going to go, and they're ill-fated escape to Varence. And that's where we'll pick back up next time, you're on Storytime with History. >> Ladies and gentlemen, thank you once again for listening and as always, you can follow us on anywhere you can access your podcasts. So definitely, if this is your first one you've listened to, oh, you should check out some more. >> Oh yeah, check us out. We got a whole back catalog of episodes. We're really excited, three-parter comment. This is just the beginning. This is like the tip of the iceberg of Dom, our next two episodes are gonna get weird and wacky and then they're gonna get cruel. There will be blood, right, 'cause it's us, it's us, it's us, we're on plan. We're just gonna play to our strengths at this point in time. All right, yeah, so make sure you like, subscribe, hit us with a review if at all possible. If you're on iTunes or something else, hit us with a like. Makes it easier for other people to follow. We've definitely seen a nice increase in listenership over the last couple of months. And so for all the viewers out there who are streaming and listening, thank you. We love you guys so much. And like you said, if you have a quick opportunity, hit us with the like, five stars only if it's one star keeping yourself, fine, that's fine, it's to be honest. All right, so until next time. >> Until next time. >> I dare listener, don't be dumb. >> See you later. >> Bye. [MUSIC] (upbeat music)