S3 E2 - Stephie Place & Ovidio Prudencio

Welcome to ESSportlights, my name is Amir Amin and my name is Taylor Robbins. In this episode we sat down with two of our own from the MBA class of 23, Ovidio and Steffi. Originally from Benin, Ovidio Prudenzio has made his way to ESA by way of a few career changes in Canada and France. Since his arrival, he's managed to change his career path once again from finance to consultancy but still manages to find the time to build his own startup on the side. And Steffi Place, from Buenos Aires, Argentina, arrived at ESA as an excellent scholar and forte fellow. Throughout her time in the MBA, her classmates have learned so much from her experiences at companies like Bain, Ocado Libre and now Amazon. She loves to live by example, whether it's at the Asado or in the tech club. She also arrived on campus with her now-fiancé, Nacho, and we're delighted to have such a uniquely diverse duo on the show. We hope you enjoy. Well, obviously extremely happy that we have two of our own classmates with us today. Thank you for both joining us. We have Steffi, Ovidio. Can I start by asking both of you to give us a little intro by yourselves? Sure. First of all, thank you for having us. This is something that definitely I didn't think I was going to do previously before the MBA and it's just one of the things that I've had the courage to do during the MBA. So it's a new and great experience for me. But yeah, I'm Argentinian. I'm born and raised in Argentina. I think a lot of my personality comes from my family. I have both a mom and dad that are entrepreneurs and Argentina being the macroeconomic tornado and disaster that it is. I think that being an entrepreneur there requires a lot of resilience, creativity to get out of tough situations and yeah, that persistence. And I think that inspired me to become an engineer like my dad. So I studied engineering and I was fortunate to have an internship at SIP where I got my first taste of the tech world and I was kind of naive. I didn't know what I was walking into. It was just like the first internship I interviewed for and I was lucky enough to get it and it was amazing. I had an incredible experience there, a lot of growth, a lot of freedom to do a lot of things and in my university, we got a consulting bug and I applied for a banking company and it was a great experience. I worked with friends from my university. There's very talented people. I learned a lot. I grew a lot and I was not necessarily looking to leave but I contacted by Marcado Di Ure, which is a huge e-commerce in Argentina and I got a great opportunity to join a new team there, which was hell of a ride because COVID happened and e-commerce boomed, so it was exponential growth and it was great, so I don't regret at all leaving Spain as well. But through those experiences, I think that I was able to have some impact in the country, which is ultimately what drives me, like seeing my dad work so hard to have that impact really rubbed off on me and I think tech is a vehicle to achieve that and touch the lives of a lot of people, so looking to continue there and continue in tech. Try and be that one, I video. I will try. I will try. Sure you will. Thank you, Amir and Teal for having me. This is also my first experience like this, but I hope many people will learn from my story too. So I'm a video, I was born and raised in Benin, in West Africa, where I grew up until the age of 16. Are you the first person from Benin? The second. The second. Wow. The second ever. So like Steffi, both my parents were entrepreneurs, you know, under developed countries, that's mainly the only way to make out of life, so both my mom and dad were entrepreneurs and I will say that also give me some, my core value from the beginning. Like from my parent, it was never about the problem was always, what are you going to do about it? So I keep that mindset with me when I moved to Canada at 17 and in Canada, I studied Actuarial Science. Sorry, when I was in high school in Benin, I wanted to become pilot, but because of my eyes problems, I couldn't do it. So I was almost lost. I didn't know what I wanted to do. And my math teacher, toward the end of high school, talked to me about Actuarial Science, which was a combination of math and stats, and I love math and stats. So I remember going to, to remember Cyber Coffee, you pay like two hours in turn. I remember doing there, like looking on forums, what is Actuarial Science, talking to Actuaries in the world to get to know what is the, what is it about and I fell in love with it. And then I applied to university in Canada and I've been Quebec City, living 24 degrees to minus 30, minus 30 degrees. So the first year was surprisingly easy for me to integrate because I have, I make friends easily on campus because going to all the parties and was, was a really good experience for me in, in university. When I finished, I started working in consulting for pension fund in Montreal and also a little bit in, in Toronto, but at one point in my career, at that point in Toronto, I was, I was good at what I was doing, but I was not fulfilled. And I wanted to, to care for my comfort zone, try new things. That's when I moved to Europe in 2018, one year before COVID, I moved to, to France also in consulting for Ernst & Young and spent two years there after that I decided to go for my, for my MBA and I would say personally would drive me and would push me to get into MBA as well. I said, he's having an impact too, having impacts, many back home in Africa and I hope I will be able to do that one day. Amazing. Yeah. One of the things that both of you shared is that you come from a background of parents who are entrepreneurs. Did either of your parents do MBAs? No. No. So, how was that for you? I mean, when you sold your parents, I'm going to go to Barcelona, I'm going to do an MBA. How did they feel about that? I can take this one first. My dad didn't go to, he, I think he finished, he dropped out of university second year, so he didn't finish all the way. But for him, getting educated is the best investment you can do. So it was not difficult for me. I just explained to him, listen, look at these big CEOs of this company, 90% have an MBA. And an MBA help you have those skills about business that you learn quickly on the go. But actually people teach that in school and it's, we are in the same world, you and I. So, and I will need that too, to help me and he gets it, that was pretty much it for me. Yeah. I mean, like my parents were fully supportive, especially given the education piece. Like they've always said, wherever you need help with education, we're there. They even said, like, we're not paying for your wedding, but we're paying for your education if necessary. Like, they've always prioritized education, I'm really thankful for that. And they were super supportive and still are. I mean, of course, being the youngest daughter, I have three sisters. Of course, my mom, it was harsh when I left because it was like the last little bird leaving. All my sisters have also been abroad. So I was the last one to leave. So of course, it was hard, but yeah, fully supportive and I love that about them. I mean, yes, it's super amazing to hear, you know, slowly about more about your backgrounds. And you're very curious, you know, we just talked about obviously, you know, pretty easy sell on with both your parents around going to the MBA. You know, what was it specifically in regards to ESA, you know, I know a video you touched on on sort of, you know, wanting to be able to go back and deliver an impact, you know, within Africa. But you know, what drove you to, you know, ESA versus, you know, any of the other MBA programs that are out there? I think diversity was a huge part of it. So our first decision was whether we were and I speak about we because I'm doing my MBA with my partner, Nacho and yeah, our first decision was like us versus Europe. And I think we quickly like discarded the US because of the lack of diversity. I know there's a lot of Americans there. And while it's like a great network and it's a thriving country, like we thought we both needed that that difference in perspectives throughout my whole professional career. I've been very focused on that time. So I was really looking to open up my mind and e-commerce has been has had so many different developments in Asia versus Europe versus US like every place is a different game. So I thought that having that international perspective would definitely help. And then the values of ESA and the people are definitely something that came across when speaking to to alumni. Everybody was very open to speak to tell you about their their experience. They seemed super honest, super open. And I feel I felt that in other universities, like I didn't get that same vibe, maybe more of a competitive vibe or, you know, which I have not experienced at all that competitive vibe at ESA, right? So it was definitely the values that was something that attracted me as well. For me, it's similar. But if you if I have to point out one thing I would say is the people is the people and how how they are at ESA. When I was looking at business school, first thing it was for me, I wanted to do a business school in Europe. I lived in North America for many years. So I wanted to get out of my comfort zone and do a business school in Europe. And then I started reaching out to alumni from different school and people from ESA were just different. The way they care about it, the way they find time to explain how everything is in ESA. A little story, even before I get my offer up to Barcelona, just to to visit the campus and see if I like the city. And before that, I reached out to NBA 2022 on LinkedIn. And when I came to Barcelona, her and her team made an invite me for dinner. Four of them went for dinner, talked about ESA, the school. So that's how ESC people are. And obviously, when I was ranking school, I look at when I was looking at my choices, I look at ranking, academics, all these things. And after that, for me, it was kind of an emotional decision to do I how I feel about these people, because all these cooler, pretty much the same, but it wasn't really the difference. And the people made a difference for me at ESA. And then after the people, you have the the length of the program. These two years, I wanted something really where I could take my time, learn and create good friendship relationship with people that was second. And third, yes, it was good in what I want to do after NBA, which is consulting. It's no, I just want to say it's it's interesting because I, you know, you both spoke about just your experiences with with, you know, reaching out to various alumni or even in some of the sessions, you know, we had our assessment day, things like that. And it's funny because I do find to a degree it's a bit self selecting almost, right? Like, like it does come down to, you know, a bit of that gut feel, right? Exactly. And, you know, I'm curious, obviously, you know, you really felt that, you know, through sort of the limited interactions you had as you were kind of, you know, going to choose. And, you know, I guess, was there any, you know, major differences when you actually arrived? Or did you find like all those things that were kind of, you know, in your gut about, you know, the values and talking with the people like, and then as you started to meet all the people in our cohort that was coming and meeting, you know, just, you know, how was that experience? So did you sort of immediately know, yeah, you know, hey, I made the right choice for me? Definitely. You even amplify when I came, you say, I like the people people for me, I say, I really good people, the majority are good people. And when I, when I came, if I wanted to do the consulting track, and a lot of people who had done consulting, they would have time to help me. I have a mentor, you know, North American Business Club, a mentor in an African business club, a mentor from the consulting club, people who didn't even get offered to go into consulting, but they have done the track and nobody, so they're just giving me time. Even if I forget that I have a mug, they'll reach out to me, are you available? Do you forget we have a mug? And that's, that really made it for me, I'm like, I cannot have all these people helping me and kind of feel like, and definitely I, when I came, I was like, okay, this is, this is really what I saw before. And to some extent, it's not fair for the school because I don't know if they can really advertise that, that value, you cannot really, you can talk about it, but you can only feel it when you are, you're in the school. So yeah. And I think that also an important part to that question is having clear your expectations. And that is something that's super important because there's so many things when you get here and there's so many things that are happening that if you don't go back to, okay, what were my initial expectations, you can be disappointed or frustrated or, you know, like I am kind of a nerd. And of course, like when they gave me homework or a lot of academics, like, of course, I would jump into it and be like, oh, let's read all the cases that do everything perfectly. But you have to remind yourself, like, oh, wait, I didn't necessarily academics wasn't my top priority. So you have to, like, go, and of course, those expectations can change because it's a two year period. You can, like, navigate and understand, like, okay, maybe my purpose for this MBA can change. But I think you really have to have a clear and whatever, like, me or natural or frustrated, like, we would like go back to our expectations, like, wait, remember that you came for this reason, I came for this reason, so let's try to go back to that. And I think that helped us a lot with that. It's something super interesting you just mentioned about, you know, how to face what's in front of you when you arrive, especially with this diverse set of people, which I think both of you truly represent, right? But given that both of you are high performers, you've got the track record as well to show in different countries, in, for example, in a video case, what's it actually like coming into a room with 65 or 64 other people who are also high performers, have all done some really cool things in their careers, what is that like in the first few months? I think I'm going to give an example with Nacho, my partner, because what happened there, a little bit dynamics of what happened was we're both, like, high achievement people, we're both, like, super organized. And if things don't go as planned, like, we get frustrated and, but I think we kind of, it kind of forced me to balance him out a little bit, because the environment puts so much pressure, like you have to read cases, you have to do like the job search, you have to socialize, you have to do so many things. And he, he got a little bit more stressed, you know, like type A gets a little bit more stressed and I'm usually like that as well. But if we were both stressed, I thought it was going to be like a time bomb and it was going to explode. So it really helped me manage stress differently, because I had to be a little bit the calm one and try to like, generate those moments of calmness so that the relationship wouldn't explode as well. So I think, and it happened in the team as well, like sometimes someone would get like super stressed or nervous and I kind of implemented that, that I had with Nacho with the rest of the team as well, like trying to like tone it down a bit and say like, okay, what are our expectations? What do we want to achieve? How much do we want to do and like, accept that we don't have to do 110% all the time? So I think it was very good for me in that sense that I, and I'm really thankful I did this with Nacho. And I know it's probably not the best work for him because he was really stressed, but I tried to help him with that and it helped me so it was great in that sense. Well, as Nacho's teammate, I can thank you so much for that and in my case, we're asking how it is to be in a room with very, very intelligent people. I think it's a weird feeling because it's a weird but good feeling because we're in an environment where you see a lot of people, like in some case way smarter than you, that will come up with some answer, you never think about, you're like, okay, for example, even the way to work, when you work in team, you think you're organized, but no, you'll find another person crazy organized, like very good reading everything like that's humbles me and make me pay attention more to how people do things to be able to learn from them. Remember in my leadership class, initially in the first two months, people who come up with some answers to some cases are like, how is this even possible? This is not the way to think, but quickly I catch myself like, now you're here to learn and these people are, you know, very smart and you so try to put yourself in their position and understand how they think. And this is without even knowing you, you change, they help you develop easily. So yeah, that's that's what I like the most. I agree that it gives you like, like almost whatever you have a problem statement now, it's like you kind of have the voices of different people, like now in the back of your brain, like, oh, how would they think about this, or how would they do this? And I think it's like a great, like, wealth of knowledge that we got from all these people and it's, yeah, I look at it from that perspective, like it's been super, you know, fruitful for me. And also, oh, wow, I was going to say, I forgot. One thing I want to add about this, yes, you feel surrounded by people who, some things are way smarter than you, but without, you don't know, but when you participate also in class or when you, when you work with people, they will see things in you that they like to. And they will tell you, oh, I like this thing, yeah, you say, and that reinforce, that help you know what you do good, and kind of also keep that and keep working on that part. So that's both for you, because I think that's what we wanted to get at is that actually you notice weaknesses about yourself, but it's not a bad thing, right? No. Because you guys have elaborated on how the people in the class are often indirectly helping you. But, you know, I wanted to touch more on that, on that diversity point, which is a reason I think you both mentioned of, you know, why you wanted to come to Europe and to ESA. You know, and, you know, both of you come from, you know, Steffi, as you obviously know, we have a very, you know, an R year in particular, we had, you know, a particularly small, you know, percentage of women, which is now recovered, you know, and no video, obviously, we, you know, we are trying to attract more people from Africa to, you know, to come to ESA. So, you know, curious, just on both your perspectives around, you know, being part of, you know, two kind of minorities at ESA and how that maybe, you know, changed your experience or any, you know, particular, you know, aspects of your time at ESA that you noticed was quite different just coming from, you know, both of those demographics. In my case, it's interesting because I'm from Africa, but I also spent like 10 years in Canada, two years in Europe, so I'm kind of a mix of all these, all this culture already. So I, for example, I ESA, I'm in the Canadian club, I'm in the French club. So for me, it was kind of easy to connect with all these people from different backgrounds. And I also try to help people that come directly from Africa because there is also a difference in the way of doing things that everybody has to get used to. So through the African Business Club, I will mentor the African then try to help them adapt to the new environment. But I think, and I hope, ESA will continue attracting a lot of talent from Africa that will also help enrich the whole MBA because their perspective, even for me, sometimes are different because I have lived for many years now. But this year, I think we were able to maintain the same number of students from Africa, but hopefully in the year to come that will increase. I think it was definitely a surprise and kind of a disappointment, like coming back to what you asked, like woke expectations versus reality. I did think I was going to be like, it was going to be closer to like 40% or something that an our year, I think it was like 25% or something like that. So I was definitely a little disappointed if not like finding the power group and the elements here, of course, but the few women that I met here and it's, it's, it's been great. And I think we're also having the right conversations about it. The other day, it was a women in business conference and there's been some great conversations there. And even though it was like two people on stage and 300 people listening, it felt like a conversation like it felt like we were debating and discussing the right things. I personally loved this talk about power couples and there were like two, two very successful people, a man and a woman and they were discussing the unconscious gender biases that we have. And that's, there are a lot of debates in me as coming with natural to the NBA. So it was definitely like, I think they're, yes, is doing the right job in touching the right points. What I would like to see improvement is also a different more diversity in the, in the professors. And I think they're, they're starting to do that this year as well, but I did lack some diversity in the cases. Most of them were led by men. Most of the examples were men in being CEOs and I did notice that. And I think it comes from, obviously it comes from reality, which is most of the CEOs are men probably, but, but I do think there could be an effort to, to try to get more cases that are women led out there as well. And your, your, your, your rights, if you also for case, um, from over part of the world, like very few case, uh, about Africa, probably a few cases also about Latin America. So I think those things, um, school probably has, has to work on, but we as a student or alumni have to help the school. Like what I'm trying to do, for example, is talk about ESC more to African unknown because they just don't know very, very, want to go to US or to HEC because in Africa in the West, especially you have more friends speaking countries would make for sense for them to go to, to France, but we have to, I think kind of advertise the school to be representative of the school outside. I think that will help attract both women and diversity and also help write the cases. I, for example, with Edward, my economic professor, start working on a case with about Benin. And so do a thing as a, as a student, we can help and do our part and yeah, I'm going to go back to your comment on power couples and, uh, there's no doubt that there are a whole class values, both yourself and natural a lot. Um, but look, I think it's super interesting to sort of understand what it's like coming to an MBA with your partner because there's your relationship and then there's the aspect of being at school, as you said, you know, studying and making friends and also your career and all those sorts of things. So there's anything you can share about how you both went about that. I know you already said you used to try and balance each other out, but whether any rules that you set each other or, you know, any advice that you could give to any other couple is looking to come onto this journey because from what we've seen, it's, it's been great. I think we're very lucky to have really good communication. Um, that's key, of course, and being very open about each other's priorities and being each other's cheerleaders, giving each other space when necessary. And I think even though like the bad part I would say is, I feel like you live every frustration double, like if you don't get a job, the other person suffers it too. And, um, if you don't, I don't know, like there's, there were so many situations with whatever, like natural had a frustration, it felt like a frustration of mine. So of course you're kind of set up for double the frustration, but you're also double the you know, but you're also set up for double the happiness. Like I've been able to meet a lot of Shanghai people from you guys, for example through Nacho. Um, we both had amazing sections, shout out to Sao Paolo and Shanghai. And I'm so grateful that I got to meet like almost double the people because of Nacho. Um, we had double the fun in that sense. So I think it's trying to hold on to those good things and the frustrations learning how to deal with them together and appreciating the fact that you have a shoulder to cry on if doing those frustrations. So it's, yeah, I would say that. And for you a video as someone who has been, you know, managing your, your relationship from far, is it, is it difficult to explain? Because on Stephie's side, she, you know, she's made a really interesting point. You kind of live and breathe and feel two journeys at the same time because you see it every day. But maybe your partner doesn't know the reality of reading a 50 page case and then going for a dinner and then making sure like your errands are in check. What is it like? What has it been like for you? As Stephie said, it's, it's, it's communication thing is communication. But once you say that, it's how it happened in real life. That's the challenge. Um, there are things you say with all the word you can, thinking it will be clear, but to have a person who doesn't understand because they just don't live in it, but you just have to be patient till the person gets it at some point. And sometime you have also, I would say you have to make some choices. Even if the person doesn't understand now, and I still go into, I'm still going through interviews. I don't have time to explain my too much. Maybe for some interviews and get this job and then come back to you to explain some units. Because you have to make those choices because if not, you not get a job and then frustration comes double. As I said, so it's, it's not easy. It's not easy. And, but you end up finding a way as long as everybody agree on the, on the goal, understand the ultimate goal. I think it makes it make it easier to always come back to the goal and it's, it's better. You know, I'm, I'm kind of curious to, to, to switch gears a little bit here and, and you know, you both have touched on it earlier about, you know, end of the day, biggest reason we're, we're at the NBA here is to make a, you know, step change in our career. Right. And, you know, a video is, as you mentioned, you know, a big part of coming here was, you know, wanting to be able to position yourself for, you know, in your career either right after later on being able to make an impact and step yourself, you know, wanting to sort of continue down the, you know, the tech and, and e-commerce space, you know, just curious how the, how the experience was for, for both of you, you know, within the first year and, and, you know, setting your sights on, on where you wanted to go and, and how that journey was in terms of, you know, just, just the whole process looking, you know, seeking out what you were, you were trying to get and obviously, you know, what aspects of the, you know, ESA community, you know, kind of helped you along the way. Yeah. I'll say the first year for me is that was stressful, stressful, even if I have my priorities. I know first priority was getting a job in consulting, second, really develop good relationship with people, and third, try to see how I can launch or develop my business. So for the consulting part of the school, help a lot. At one point, I was even thinking it was too much, but no, it was the right amount because sometimes you think you have, you have time, you will do prep later. But when you start the first term, the school will throw everything on you for consulting. And we've even knowing you start learning things about how to get ready for interviews. You remember getting on the Zoom call, whether doing more interviews, if I even be ready. But later on, I was like, Oh, that's what this guy was saying in this, this thing. And he kind of pushed you also to get, start getting ready to do, to do interview in consulting, specific in consulting. In the school have that in consulting and in IB. Of course there might be a way to do it better, to not stress too much because that combined with academies can be, can be a lot. And the clubs help, help a lot, consulting clubs, they've done a great job. Every year before us and our year, they've done an amazing job. If I have an advice to give people is to have your priority, right? Ideally, if you can start working on it even before the MBA, that will make your life, life easier. If it's getting a new job, if it's mainly, I don't know, just develop your network, have those priorities written down, and as they say, we can come back to it when you feel like things are not going exactly, exactly as you want. I agree. For me, my priorities were staying in Europe after the MBA without a European passport and improving my leadership. So in that sense, like for the first goal, I found it really useful. Since I was not in like a super structured path, you know, like consulting and IB. I found it useful trying to find a second year that wanted a similar goal or achieved a similar goal. It kind of happened naturally, like I'm one of the Argentinians from second year. She was super helpful. And whenever I was in doubt, I would reach out to her like, "Hey, I'm at this point in my career prep. Am I good? Am I bad? Should I change something? I'm nervous. I still don't have a job. What's happening is she would kind of calm me down and help me a lot. And I think that's something really powerful out of the MBA that you have the second years that kind of lived it last year so they can help you a little bit guide you. And it's definitely good to reach out to them. And that's kind of part of why I wanted to be in the leadership of the tech club in the second year because it was so helpful for me that I wanted to be able to connect with first years and offer them the advice I could from my experience. I think I was also, I'm not going to lie, I prepared a lot and it's difficult because coming back again, like you have so many things and academics, like for someone that loves to do a list, it's so easy to tick off. Like it's like, "Oh, I've read a case. Yay!" Like you tick it off. And it's like so satisfying. And then you're like, "Oh, job search. How do you tick off job search?" It's like, "What do you put in the to-do list?" I don't even know what to put in the to-do list. So it was definitely hard and you have to set yourself some goals and try to make it really tangible because not for me, it was kind of, I would always go back to academics because it was easy. So yeah, trying to put small goals, talking to people that really helped and preparing. I ended up doing kind of a structured path, which was the Amazon way, which also helps for any tech recruiting. So I ended up fortunately at Amazon, which sponsored my visa. So that was great. It was a successful story. And then on leadership, I'm kind of shy, but coming to the MBA, it's like an opportunity to put forth a new version of yourself. And I was like, "Okay, I'm going to try to take every opportunity I can to lead." Nacho really pushed me to that as well. He's always like, "You have to believe more in yourself. You have to speak out more." And he definitely helped me with that. So I really tried to implement that and took a lot of opportunities in like team projects to kind of lead the team project. And now it's like the tech club also to lead it like it's been a ride. So yeah, that's all of it. That's super interesting. You talk about this leadership aspect of the MBA because I guess the hope is that you guys are going to go on to become some incredible leaders and alumni of ESO, right? And do you think that of the 18 months that we've had so far, those experiences capture where it's like to really be a leader? Because you are managing some pretty high-performing, ambitious, busy individuals. So have you learned a lot from it? I think especially with the tech club, it's been a challenge because you have to, like I have a team of 18 wonderful people, which I love all of them, but they all have their agenda. They all have their priorities. And sometimes it's not the tech club. And you don't have a salary or bonus or a carrot to jangle in front of them and like get them to do stuff. So it's definitely been challenging to find different ways to motivate the team to get things done. And then there was there's a lot of different aspects. For example, we had kind of like a PR crisis where there was like one message in the WhatsApp that was super negative. So for me, it was almost like handling a PR crisis, you know, it was like, oh my god, did you see this message? My first reaction was like, whoa, we're gonna die. Like it was catastrophic. I was so sad that that message came out. And then I was like, no, I'm just like, step back, rely on the team, talk with the team about it, handle the communication, like it was like just like a PR crisis and I wouldn't have had it if it not for the tech club. So I think handling the club definitely exposes you to some situations that are kind of real life experiences. And for you a video, I mean, tell us a little bit about what you're working on. I think leadership wise, you have a lot of opportunity in NBA to develop your skills within your group first, because managing a project with even 10 people from diverse backgrounds can be, can be tough, it can lead to certain tough situations to navigate. So you learn first from, from, from there, even if you are not the one leading and you see somebody else leading, you will learn from the good and bad that person will do. And beside that, I'm very, I'm in the African business club, for example, I was the one leading the, the multi-culture organization, get everything ready. So that also is, is another challenge. So various opportunities in the NBA where you can learn, you can do good thing, bad thing and you will learn from it. And also, even in some, some certain classes, I was in the VCIC class with you, this, that was not purely leadership, but to learn how to be in front of people, talking, prison, the company, all these things, and those are good, good, good learning. What about, what about your startup? Oh, my startup, my, my, my beard, beard care, upper line, and overall main cosmetic line I'm, I'm launching, it is going well, especially this, this semester I learned a lot from these VC classes and search fund classes, how to pitch to investors and how I move, how just to, to, to raise fund. And also in the NBA, I find people who've been giving me good ideas about how to do the marketing, how to do this, or maybe I want to work with you. So yeah, that has been, has been great. And before, I hope before the, we finish this year, I will try to raise funds with some, some students. That's good. You've got, you know, also in the NBA, anytime you're trying to launch any, any business, or startup, you've got about 400 guinea pigs for all that stuff, right? I mean, here he pitched, he pitched just a startup idea he was working on. So yeah. Yeah. You know, I'm curious at various points here, you know, you both have touched on, you know, obviously when, when things get hectic, there's a lot going on, you know, spoke sort of coming back to, you know, priorities, expectations, sort of just making sure you're kind of, you know, grounding yourself in, in, in the right way for what we want to get out of this because we're here for such a short period of time. You know, we're now well into the second year, you know, both of you are, are sort of sorted for where you're headed, you know, post-MBA and, you know, just curious sort of how, how things have shifted for you from, you know, the first year to the second year in terms of, you know, where your kind of focuses are, and even expectations for, you know, the last few months here and just what was that, you know, adjustment like. Okay. In my case, I was lucky to get my internship and full-time offer in March last year. So if you're looking to get into consulting, come to ESA for that. So that's, that's changed things a lot. That's, I was less stressed. I was really focused on what I like. I chose my elective in that sense. So second year for me was more choosing the elective with the interest I have. I'm launching a business. I want to learn more about finance, raising funds, VCs, so that, that's what I did. And my second priority in this last year is really making sure that people, people I would like to develop relationship with, I, I do it because first year you are mostly with your own class, there's 64, 65 people, and you don't really get to, if you don't do the A4, you don't really get to know other people outside of that. But this year is, it's a lot of that for me, a lot of incredible people in the MBAs. I'm still meeting people. I was not close. I'm like, oh, this guy is nice, this girl is nice, especially in Shanghai section. Yeah. Yeah. So those are my two two priorities this year. I think my priorities for second year, you definitely have more time. So you do have the option to craft it a little bit more. And it also puts out some pressure because I've seen some people like doing part-time jobs and starting startups like him, and you're like, oh my gosh, can I start a startup? Like, I don't know. It's so impressive. So it's, you definitely put pressure to that free time and you're like, should I rest? Because then I start working and I'll never rest again or, you know, you really have so many things that you want to do, but so far I've been, as he said, like focusing on friendships or so many amazing people here, traveling, it's been amazing. And yeah, getting to know as much people as possible, the tech club and yeah, tech is going through kind of a rough patch, a lot of layoffs in the industry. So I do have an offer, but nothing's written in stone in this world. So I'm also still exploring options. And I've also had a little bit of the startup bug this second year. I think I read it as a blog, like something like 30% of students or the like five years after they graduate starts their own business. And probably like, if you look at the percentage of how many people also go to startups or smaller businesses, that is probably greater. And I think, yes, it kind of like nudges that a little bit into you because you see so many case studies, you're surrounded by so many creative people. You talk about ideas, you talk about things you've read, and it kind of fuels that. So I've been also thinking like, maybe I'll go to Amazon for like two years of corporate and then maybe do something myself or should I do something myself right out of the MBA. So I'm still like having that internal discussion, which is great because the MBA gives you the time to have that internal discussion as well. So it's. Yeah. I was going to ask you about that. The internal discussion, like now that you get to know people, do you find that the contribution that your classmates are making to your life choices is greater or do you think that it's more from the career service or family? No, I would say definitely greater. The career service help, especially for the social track, they help, but classmates also help me a lot. We have a lot of people, for example, in consulting who are a social student. And these people has been helping me even before I reached getting to the consulting, the CDC consulting app, so you are definitely that help. And also they help me know, you know, in other ways, meaning that when I was focused on doing a recruitment, they were like, just focusing on recruitment, I'm taking, we're taking care of the cases. Like we would brief you about the cases and that's also helped, helped a lot, not having to work to worry a little about academics. And you also have people as, as if you were saying who start businesses while doing, doing the MBA, who talk about the business or who want to go into search for something I didn't know about six months ago. And you start learning about those things and you just start, I know I want to start searching for some time in the future, but before I didn't, I didn't want to, I didn't know what it is. So yes, definitely people, teammates, second years, they, they help you a lot, knowing about sector you don't know, non-learning things you are not familiar with. And that's helped too. And one thing I wanted to add, sorry, the previous question about what is the focus for second year, because we also have time, my, my third focus is helping people doing the consulting track now. So giving mocks, getting them ready, because we, I get that last year and that was definitely helpful for me. Yeah, second, what he said, like from the CDC, I would give a shout out to Jessica from the tech part. She's been like doing this monthly seams, trying to get different topics out of there, like cybersecurity, AI, cloud, like, she's done an amazing job with that. But I do feel like most of it comes from like different, there's so many curious people that every day that you talk with someone, you learn something new. And definitely I feel like certain fads or fashions, like it's more exaggerated. So chat GPT is now like the thing everyone's talking about. And in my chats from Argentina, like it wasn't mentioned. So I wonder like if I were in Argentina, if I would know about it as much as I do here. So and I think the answer is no. So I think like it's great to be surrounded by so many curious people that read things that play around with things and you get exposed to, to those fashions like super early. So I think that's, that's a great thing out of the NBA. Might also be with the assignments that we have to do. I'll mention that. No, I mean, it isn't a thing you say about just getting that extra, you know, almost almost knowledge just by by being here, right? And I know that, you know, a handful of times and sort of not a specific example is coming to mind right now. But, you know, you're kind of like, Oh, wow, I wish any more about that. And then you realize, well, rather than me going and trying to struggle around the internet, I can call Steffi or a video and take three minutes of their time and they can explain it to me because they're experts in this field or whatever, right? So it's cool to have that, you know, kind of contact base, you know, with which to be able to bounce ideas off or whatever it might be. Right. I'm going to ask you a question just to get a sense of how people can capitalize on your experiences. Because I think you guys have seen and done a lot in these last 18 months. If today you could do something differently, what would it be? And why? Hmm. It's a very good question. Thank you. Yeah. I would say first, Mr. Barcelona earlier, that's that because I really moved the day before school started. So I'll have moved like a month earlier and connect with the people already here in the city. I think that would be first and maybe maybe second thing be since carrier was my first priority, also start, try to start a little bit early before the NBA. So I was not too much stress and I have time to go out and get to work even in the first year because that put a lot of pressure on me between October and February, the first year. So those are the two main things I will change. Oh, and sorry, third thing, add plus 100% to the budget. Yes. Those are really good advice. I would add maybe like the value of networking in the sense of not being afraid to ask for help and not being shy about it. I think I was shy in my first year about like reaching out to people, to alumni, asking for things. I think being like in the leadership of the tech club, it gave me that like card to easy card to talk to someone like, oh, I'm in the tech club. I'd like to reach out to talk to you about opportunities, blah, blah, blah, and it gives you that the card to talk and I realize like people are just willing to and happy to. And if they're not, it's like, it's not the end of the world. Like it's just a message that isn't reciprocated in that moment, but there's so many people that are willing to. And something that I'm starting to try to find now is a mentor. I haven't had that before and I feel like in such a big transition, like I'm moving to Europe, it would be great to find like a strong female mentor in Spain. And that's something that before the MBA like I hadn't thought about and the value of it. And with a women in business conference and we're having a session tomorrow on mentorship, like I realized its value and I'm starting now to think about it and look for one before maybe I was shy and I didn't know what to ask out of a mentor and I think that maybe if I had started before it would, it would have helped as well with some of the decisions that I have to go through. So yeah, maybe that definitely some of those resonate with me specifically in the budget launch video, but before we close out and it was sort of came to mind at the very start of this video, you talked about how one of your sort of longer term goals is around being able to create some impact and sort of get back to Benin or the wider Africa, where you come from. I thought it might be fun and interesting because we're all from the same cohort and I'm sure we're going to be following one another's lives and careers as we progress. You know, it's going to be cool to sort of hear from you both where you kind of hope to be, you know, in say 10 years from now and I hope you might be able to look back at this podcast in 10 years and find out, you know, how spot on or how far off you were. Wow. Interesting. I was saying 10 years, I would like to be somewhere in Africa, ideally in West Africa. It's the coolest part of Africa. So somewhere in West Africa, leading an insert take, insert take, a large insurance company have been provided low cost healthcare to people in that region. I hope I will be doing that. Okay, same. The dream is kind of similar, maybe probably going back to La Tam 10 years to Argentina where the meat is great and the people are great. When I said that I had to believe more in myself, that's the Argentinian trait. But I think, yeah, having the opportunity to have something with a group of friends. I have a really close group of friends from university, from Bain. And hopefully I've developed like some good relationships here at the MBA as well. So the idea of like being able to have a start up with them and, you know, as a team have that impact, I think that would be great. And having the appropriate work life balance, having a happy family, hopefully in 10 years. Yeah. I mean, in 10 years, what happens? No pressure. Well, I wish, I wish both of those things for each of you. But we want to hear from you guys too. I'm here. Go for it. I guess in 10 years, I want to be working for a video in this insurance company. He sold it to me. No, reef. Yeah. So good. Well, it's slightly more serious than I'm here. For me, as both of you, I think, no, my background comes in mining and I love mining and, you know, I hope in 10 years time to be back in Canada, you know, heading a mining company, but more specifically, a mining company that is kind of setting the bar for doing things responsibly. And, you know, you both come from regions of the world where there's plenty of mining and plenty of mining that has not been done responsibly in the past. And that is a big goal and a driver of me at ESA was to, you know, that's sort of an industry I love and I want to be able to acquire the skill set as I head into consulting now to be able to make that impact and bring that back to a mining company where it can be really raising the bar for that. Yeah. Well, Stephie Ovidio, thank you so much for joining us today. It was great speaking with you guys and, yeah, we hope you, we hope you enjoyed your time. Yeah. Thank you for having us. Yes, thank you. We had a blast. .