S16 E03: Dino Michael, Senior Vice President & Global Category Head, Luxury Brands at Hilton

[Music] You're listening to the luxury item, the podcast on the business of luxury and the people and companies that are shaping the future of the luxury industry. Here's your host, Scott Kerr. Despite weakening demand for designer fashion accessories and other personal luxury items, spending on premium travel, high-end accommodations, and exclusive experiences continue to rise worldwide. Data shows the number of high-knit, worth individuals purchasing designer handbags and shoes has declined, while bookings for five-star hotels, private jets, and bespoke adventure tours continue to increase. Affluent travelers made wealthier in recent years by stock market rallies and real estate gains have splurged on their stays with abandon. Hospitality Giant Hilton's recent earnings report highlight that its luxury hotel segment is outperforming more affordable options, driven by continued spending from affluent consumers. This has led Hilton to focus heavily on expanding its luxury and lifestyle portfolio. My guest on the luxury item is Dino Michael, senior vice president and global category head for Hilton's luxury brands and branded residential portfolio, bringing nearly 30 years of experience in the hospitality industry. Dino is responsible for brand strategy, management, and expansion across Waldorf Astoria hotels and resorts, Conrad hotels and resorts, Elixar hotels and resorts, Nomad hotels, and Signia by Hilton brands, which together encompass nearly 500 hotels, alongside a pipeline of 100 and an expanding branded residential segment. Prior to joining Hilton, Dino held senior positions at several prestigious venues in the United Kingdom, including hotel groups, branded operations, and fine dining establishments. Welcome to the luxury item, Dino. Thank you, great to be here. Thank you so much for joining me. So you know, you're coming up to 20 years at Hilton, you originally joined as a head of food and beverage operations for the company. You transitioned into the luxury portfolio, taking on more senior roles than leading world of Astoria and Conrad, and now expanding to overseeing all of Hilton's luxury brands. So you've been in the business for a while, so over the past two decades, what do you see as being the biggest shifts in luxury hospitality? Well, that makes me sound quite old, but I'll give it a try. I've seen many trends come and go as we all have, you know, such as a particular region or country hitting the spotlight for a moment, you know, other trends are more permanent when you think about professional responsibility, sustainability, provenance, and so on. So many over the last decade, guest expectations have shifted towards your fairly highly personalized experience driven stays. We've been talking about experiences for a while. The modern luxury traveler values, you know, authenticity, that true sense of place over traditional opulence, you know, local inspired architecture, work of regional artists, you know, mercy and guests in that culture that they crave. And really creating, I think, experiences that are meaningful and memorable. And then when you look at the slightly younger affluent traveler, they're really prioritizing transformative experiences, you know, over comfort even. And we have programs like our collection brand Alexa has the pursuit of adventure. Conrad has one three five that reflects his trends. So, you know, if you've got one three or five hours spare, we'll offer you a curated local extortion, you know, sparks, curiosity, celebrates culture, and you know, great stories that hopefully our guests will relive and repeat for years. You know, and even our personal, commercial teams at Water for Storyer, they take great pride in being able to curate highly personalized identities. So I think modern luxury travel today is defined by those emotional and cultural resonances, spaces, experiences, and programs that really designed to make you feel unmistakably local and at least a lasting impression, I think. You oversee a portfolio of distinct Hilton luxury brands, each targeting specific guest profiles and experiences from iconic urban hotels like the Conrad and historic landmarks like the world of Astoria and hotels with a creative urban edge like Nomad your approach is that each brand is cultivated with its own story design ethos and service philosophy avoiding this one size fits all mentality, but does Hilton have a specific strategic pillars that drive its overarching luxury strategy? Yeah, I mean training unique identities for our portfolio, you know, obviously is paramount and that has to align with our broader vision that requires obviously that strategic nuanced approach. So each brand, as you said, has its distinct personality, we target a specific segment of the market, you know, so obviously Water Story represents and the elegance Conrad embodies that bold contemporary luxury. And Alexa as a collection brand, we celebrate the independence those those one of a kind properties and we safeguard I think those identities through clear brand tellers, you know, we define each brand's essence, its voice, its target audience. And that really makes sure that the experience is a tailored, you know, to that, to that, to that, we call it a design target guest. So no matter what your walk of life, the moment you step over the threshold of one of our hotels, we will make you feel like that like that design guest, how we've curated the experience, the service philosophy that the what I would call the hardware and the software of each brand. So the moment you cross over, we will make you feel like that guest, whether you're here for a day or week or whether that is how you live your life. And then when you think about the core Hilton values, you know, you just step above the brand, even the category and our values that revolve around hospitality, innovation, you know, making sure that we have a responsible operation woven into each brand. And that I think fosters autonomy and collaboration. So you thrive in delayed individually, but you've got the strength of our luxury portfolio buzzer top of that. If you look at the luxury hospitality industry now, the wealthiest households continue to have a ravenous appetite to explore the world and have real luxury experiences, higher room rates have done little to dull the demand for luxury hotels and resorts, which is why Hilton has been doubling down in the luxury space. You know, all the hotel brands in your portfolio are specifically targeting ultra high net worth individuals top business executives and luxury leisure travelers, but Hilton isn't the only hotel group aggressively pursuing global expansion of its luxury brands. And we're also seeing independent emerging luxury hotel brands are challenging the established players. So with companies like Hilton under immense pressure to continually prove value proposition, are you finding it harder to craft these unique consistent and differentiated culturally rich experiences. I always say I have, you know, one of the greatest and hardest jobs in the world. The competition is great, you know, heaps as an R toes and you're right. The space is growing, the challenges are increasing, you know, both the traditional brands and new entrance. And I think, you know, for our point of view, luxury hospitality, you know, it's about combining that personalization, the authentic connection exclusive offer offerings. We're all chasing the same thing. And I think the way we look at it is what can we do and what we focus on and what can we really excel at. You know, we're all talking for same customers. We're all getting the same answers. And I think what we need to do is create journeys that really resonate deeply with our guests. They really want to immerse themselves in the culture. Trust is a huge thing. Today's travelers are discerning. They, you know, they're kind of a little bit fatigued of the AI generated itineries. They're seeing what's popular on social media. And I think that trust for our brands is paramount. They want to know that we are, we have the inside of knowledge. We're not sending them somewhere. That's for the masses. That has, as you know, you know, you cue to look at that beautiful sunset and Santa, for example, you know, you've got the blue dome, you turn around of your shoulder. And there's a Q a 50 people. So when you think about our signature programs, as I said, like, come on one three five. That really illustrates this approach. Inspired by, you know, Baron Hilton, you know, Conrad Hilton's son who created the brand. Here's my new spirit. You know, these curated one three five our experiences. They'll highlight local culture, a little bit of adventure. And, you know, also bring home that unique essence of each property. I'll come around in Punta Mita, for example, as a beautiful tequila tasting experience where we'll take you through a culinary journey, tasting journey of tequila, tequila, miscal, really educational, which is great. I guess leave seem that is learned something locally. They've enjoyed it. So, you know, by, by anticipating these preferences, I think, and involving our offerings, we hope to continue to deliver these experiences. They feel effortless. They should feel effortless genuine. And most of all, I think deeply personal because through luxury really does still remain with authentic human connection. And one of the experiences you seem to be leading the way on is the idea of sleep. That Hilton's luxury segment adopted this sleep as the new status symbol connecting emotional well being and physical restoration to the essence of high and hospitality. Your own trends report highlighted quality sleep as a top priority for luxury travelers. Sleep tourism really been a big differentiator for Hilton. Not only a differentiator, but I'll all, if you think about what we're offering. across all spot 25 brands is a really good night sleep. I mean, look, it is the cornerstone of our approach to wellness. It's probably, it seems a little obvious, but I think so many people don't look at it the same way. When you think about, you know, programs that we've put into place, we have a sleep to wake ritual at the Conrad Singapore orchard, you know, the Celestial Circadian ritual at the Arizona Billboard, which is part of our Alexa collection brand. And I think for us, we look at science backed, you know, data, you know, locally inspired wellness offerings, you have to have that healthy tension. We want our guests to rest and rejuvenate. You know, sleep isn't really a commodity anymore, a commodity anymore. It's a real differentiator, you know, signals are attention to detail pair, emotional wellbeing. When you think about the, the economics of designing a bedroom, how many times have you been in a room where you can't sleep because there's a small blinking light or there's light creep coming from the door, blackout blinds really aren't blackout, you know, thinking about that highly curated, you know, arrival kit. So if you, we should know whether you've come in off a red eye or you've landed late landed early. So what's the right amenity in your room? Is it kind of mild to help you sleep? Is it a stronger caffeine to help you power through the day so you can get your, your, your restful night later on? Um, I want to talk about the world of a story hotel's and resorts. So over the past year, a world of a story hotel's and resorts has undergone one of its most active and transformational periods in recent history, major developments include landmark reopening, global expansion and new partnerships, the highlight being the reopening of the crown jewel world of a story here in New York after an eight year, two billion dollar restoration, the project transformed the 1931 Art Deco icon into a hybrid hotel residence with 375 guest rooms and 372 luxury condominiums while meticulously restoring historic spaces such as the Grand Ballroom, Peacock Alley and the Silver Car-Dar. It's been said that it marks the beginning of, quote unquote, a new era of quiet grand or world of a story. Your history with the world of a story brand began in 2018 when you were the global brand head there. Can you explain the new vision and brand strategy? You have to forgive me for being a pure brand guy now, but the way we look at World of Store in New York, you know, it's our beacon of timeless elegance. You know, as everybody knows, or many people know, you know, Conrad Hilton described it as the greatest of them all. He wrote it on the back of a postcard. I guess that was a very early version of what we would call manifesting now. And that Nolstar, I think, really guides every new world of the story around the world, you know, every property pays tribute to the original. It informs our history, but allows us to reinterpret for the future. And when you think we close the hotel for restoration in early 2017, we were able back then to gently tilt the spotlight if you remember to the West Coast when we launched World of the Story at Beverly Hills, which I think was the beginning of the brand's transformation. We've been working on what it meant to be a world of the story of beyond New York for several years, kind of leading up to that Los Angeles opening. And at that point, we had 15 properties in the portfolio against almost 40 per day. And I think we wanted to ensure, you know, how do you pay tribute to the original, but make sure that each new hotel is primarily centered on its destination. So I guess in simple terms, a world of a story of four London versus a world of a story in London. So each hotel across the globe features two nods back to the original, you know, a clock. So the clock, you know, the original clock in Biva Gale is at the axis of the hotel. It's the natural central point. It's where you would gravitate to meet. It's where you'd, I guess, navigate from. So every water store in the world has a clock, something that nods to that, you know, origins, whether it's our, our, our, our, our milleries, our milleries sphere at the water store in Amsterdam again, a nod to not only New York, but the country's, you know, Dutch naval tradition, or it's a beautiful hand carved sundial in the world of store immoldies that, that you come across the moment you enter into, I guess, the central area of the resort. So again, you remind yourselves of our, of our origin. And then we have a peacock alley or a tribute to peacock alley. So in some cases, it's a lounge, a terrace, but it's, it's our most welcoming part of our, of our property. So we wanted to make sure the brand personality also reflected that. So we have a hold it to reflect the service philosophy, making sure that we not only meet the needs of today's travelers, but also the trends we talked about earlier. And I think now having New York come back, you know, relaunch, restored that sets, you know, our new era for how we interpret luxury globally. It's, you know, it's relevant. It's locally resonate, sorry, resonates locally. And it's grounded in what we would call timeless elegance. And when you think about, you know, that vision coming to, coming to life with our new openings, you know, next couple of years, we've got London, Poland, Sydney, Tokyo, Hanoi, Jakarta, Jipo, all coming to life, all bringing, you know, something new to their cities, but respecting, you know, I guess the fact that we have New York as this wonderful origin story. And from a design standpoint, the new world of a story in New York is a collaboration amongst Kidmore Owings and Merrill for architecture and they're responsible for one world trade center, renowned power space, Pierre E. Fruchan, leading the hotel interior design and John Louise and you know, for the building residences, that story, did you want the design to tell? We took, or I took certainly as many of us did our responsibility for New York very seriously. You know, we know what it means to, you know, the country of New Yorkers, you know, I come across so many people who have a world of story, New York story to tell it. It's incredible. You know, I had my tromba, I got married there. You know, there was one gentleman whose father used to sell carpets at one point, a few decades ago at the hotel. So everybody has this wonderful history and we wanted to be really respectful of that. So, you know, in partnership, well obviously the landmark areas which you know and love, you know, we felt it was, you know, appropriate to take those back to their original grandeur, you know, almost beyond their grandeur. So when you think about all the public spaces, the, the circle of life mosaic on the park having you enter the silver corridor that you know, I've watched over the years, people painstakingly cleaning those. We're talking Q tip restoration. You know, my favorite room, which is the, the Baselden room, which was literally from a stately home in the UK where the owner sold it to you smell and whoever bought part of his stately home, he shipped it wherever, wherever you wanted. So I think the unified vision was the public areas had to retain their grandeur, their magic. And I think particularly now when you think about the trends around nostalgia and what I would call, I'm the, I'm the clamor for glamour, you know, people want to feel amazing when they go out, they want to feel that they've arrived. So I think there was this combined ambition to make sure that art deco grandeur, the magic was retained. Once you get, I think into the residential and, you know, hotel product, we could start again, which was great. You take it back to the concrete literally and we were able to reform that redesign and reengineer the entire building. So now from, if you remember, a 1400-ring plus hotel product, we now have a very elegant residential hotel piece. So we created two new port of caches so you could arrive discreetly elegantly, you know, still want to come on park out and you great or Lexington, but now you have two very quiet arrivals. You know, the efficiency is, you know, the collaboration between the two components to make sure that our team members can traverse quickly, efficiently through the building. There's no crossover, the guests can move within it within their spaces. We were able to, you know, create a brand new bedroom product. Again, still retains its art deco intent, but with all the modernity, you know, and technology you need for luxury hotel and luxury experience. Similarly with the residential side, we were able to create residential amenities that surpassed almost everything in the city, but you've got this beautiful integration of, you know, Pierre Eves' intent, and Jean-Louis' intent, but whilst different having harmony, but I think it's the way that now those two, those two segments of the building live very comfortably side by side is what makes the hotel so special. And that's why, well, the first story has re-emerged as Hilton's most visible embodiment of ultra-luxury. A brand now rooted in heritage and artistry and human-centered design. But does that idea of quiet grandeur appeal to the next generation of luxury travelers? Oh, I think so. If you look at the trends now, well, you look at, well, yeah, I was going to get quite luxurious, but he would say, you know, fresh fatality. We're seeing a real move away from labels, you know, that kind of garish, labeled, driven sentiment. Look at what I'm wearing. There's more of it if you know, you know sentiment. You know, luxury travelers today, that's very concerning. They can spot inauthenticity instantly. you know, a storyteller has to be earned, not manufactured, and that really comes from truth, whether that's a brand's heritage, designed for lost fee, all the cultural context of the destination. And when you think about the world of a story and how it's legacy spanzor recentery, and each new property even brings that fresh interpretation, but we keep it rooted in timeless service, that's not to say white glove or overly formal, but again, respectful, you know, elegant, subtle, and we want to have those iconic moments, you know, we want to make sure that our service is intuitive. We spend an awful lot of time with our team members talking to them about intuitive service, read the human cues, look at your environment, read the guests intent. So whether that's, you know, a world of the story or Alexa, which by contrast, celebrate scene divide individual property, where we uncover and amplify the stories already inherent in the local, I think our role primarily is to create those meaningful authentic experiences that really connect our guests for the destinations. Again, and I said this over and over in ways that they will remember for a lifetime and repeat for a lifetime. Last year, Hilton introduced Nomad Hotels into the luxury portfolio. Hilton acquired the majority controlling interest for Nomad Hattels for a pretty inexpensive price, for about $56 million. Christmas at Hilton's president Naseo said Nomad is in a crowded space, a space that we have wanted to be in for a while. It was pretty well known despite being only one hotel and it has a brand ethos that we wanted to scale up. What was attractive about Nomad as a strategic investment for the luxury portfolio? What gap did it fill in the portfolio? We're always looking at white spaces, particularly when you think about where we were at that point, obviously, water of a store is a classic, elegant luxury brand, Conrad with its modernity, Alexa with its independent one of the kind of luxury properties. Then you have our wonderful lifestyle brands, like Canopy and Motto. In that luxury lifestyle space that sits in the center, it was a gap for us. Nomad offered a strong entry into that segment, giving to travelers who want designed forward, culturally collected and really socially vibrant hotels. It has a distinct identity. It's stylish, creative, a vein, and I think it complemented where we were. By acquiring that majority interest in Sadell, the creators of Nomad, that's allowed us to scale it while using and partnering with Sadell, keeping their creative team, their energy, their dynamism, and they'll continue to lead design and operations. I think combined with our development distribution and operational scale, that's a perfect match. I think looking ahead, we see up to 100 Nomad properties worldwide. We recently announced, obviously, Detroit and Singapore. Then we have some branded residential component in Wynwood Miami. That brand is off to a great start. In Hilton's 2026 Trend Report, you identify a profound shift in how and why people travel. The report concludes that 2026 will be defined by intentionally, emotionally driven travel, where the why matters more than the where. The core theme reflects travelers' desire to connect travel with purpose, emotion, and personal meaning rather than status or social display, where way beyond the revenge travel phase right now, what do you think the reason why travelers are pivoting from escapism to emotional alignment? I can have said it, but the rest of the our shifting from escapism to emotional alignment, because I think experiences, they just hold more value than status. Again, I think there's a comfort, a self-confidence growing about, I know what I want, I know what I'm doing, and our Trend Report highlights that purposeful travel. I just want enrichment, you know, on an emotional level, on a cultural level, I think they're beyond just taking that one shot and moving on. They want to really stick around, spend time, really get to understand the destination or the particular event that they're attending, whether it's our immersive, our adventures, wellness focus, Conrad programs, our hotels, hopefully meet that desire for intentionality. And it's personal meaning. And I think our guests are relying more on our team members. Trust is becoming critical when they're turned to us for advice. And as I said earlier, the AI-generative alternatives are just sending to the most popular destinations, the most popular beaches, the most popular types of thing to do. And it's driving so many people, there's a little bit of fatigue. It's getting harder, once something is well known, I think social media touches to it, and what was unique is now overwhelmed. So trying to find that thing that is away from the masses and the cues is really critical. And I think the escapeism is intrinsic to the link to that. You can't escape to somewhere that has a thousand people on the beach. Hilton's primary model is asset light, focusing on branding, franchising, and management contracts. It's become a dominant strategy in the global hotel industry. I imagine your luxury development partners and owners have varied priorities, perhaps legacy and APAC, return and investment in Western markets. How do you go about negotiating brand standards, investment levels, and operational practices, sometimes with old winners and developers who have different long-term visions? Great question. I mean, luck is a commitment wherever you are in the world. I think given the international mix of our guests, then need to be broadly the same, whether you're in North America, or China, or Southeast Asia. We may have cultural nuances where we interpret our standards in a slightly different way. We may make operational changes when you think about a large resort. Really, when you think about rituals, that you can have in place at a 50-key or villa resort that would differ from a 500-key event hotel, I think for us, as long as the intent is the same, how it still livid matters less. So, for us, there is a baseline of standards. There is a baseline of quality that we won't go below. And we work with our owners, as you said, some of them are looking for an exit in a few years. Others, this is a generational hold for children and grandchildren. But the baseline is the same. And I think that quality level doesn't differ. And our owners understand that. We spend a lot of time with our owners at the outset, because most of our ownership groups are long-term investors. Even in those markets where they are looking for a return in a short timeframe, I think the investment is the same. And it's our job, the way my team is structured. We have regional specialists across the Americas, you're at Middle East Africa, Indonesia Pacific. It's their job to translate standards and operational practices that make sense regionally and culturally. So, I don't think it's necessarily a problem in my category. But it's something that obviously, when it comes to return investment, we look at that for all of our owners no matter where you're on the world. And these days, hospitality is less about aesthetics or amenities. And we talked about that. It's about the human experience where company, culture, shapes how guests feel cared for and how teams deliver consistent heartfelt service every day. Do you believe culture is the backbone of the guest experience team excellence and brand identity? It will always be the people. As I say, it's always the software, not the hardware. And if I just think about myself personally, if I think back to any one of my personal trips or business trips, it's the team that made the dress sense. If you talk to my family, I have three sons. And when we talk about our vacations as a family, they will always reference someone who did something when we're away. And I think it's that, those genuine apps that I get the most satisfaction from when I receive a guest letter. And when you foster that culture collaboration, and that's central to Hilton, not just luxury. We encourage our teams to think creatively, challenge the norms, we empower them, share ideas regardless of experience level, give everyone a voice no matter how junior they are. And we have this wonderful duality, I think, with our brands, where we successfully dovetail our Hilton culture and core values with each brand's individual pillars. I think our teams are our greatest asset. We invest in training development as everyone does. I think we have to equip them to innovate and deliver that service to be intuitive. We talk a lot about social cues. I mean, the example I always give is when a car pulls up and a guest gets out of the car, watch their behavior. If they walk to the back of the car, they want to get their luggage. Just give them, take a step back, give them a moment. If they get out of the car and they walk straight to the front desk to be greeted, then you know it can be a little bit more hands-on. They want things be taken care of them. So we spend a lot of time walking to our team members about that. And we have programs like Thrive, Sabatical and Thrive's Reset, which allows team members to pursue personal professional growth, take some paid time off and grasp to live or give a dream. And I think this approach really strengthens our workplace culture. It drives retention. I think we've got half the industry average, which we're really proud of. And again, we talk about our guest experiences. We start a lot of our team meetings internally by sharing a guest story. And I think for the fourth time, we've been named number one best company to work for in the US, by great place to work, and fortune. So I think exceptional fatality begins and ends with our people. To help stay relevant in the fiercely competitive luxury market, many companies are expanding beyond products and services into offering emotionally resonant immersive experiences. Luxury retailers are entering into the hospitality space through hotels and restaurants and private clubs. While hospitality brands are launching luxury product lines that carry their brand into customers homes, in a market where loyalty is increasingly linked to emotional connection, luxury brands are striving to engage customers in more meaningful and lasting ways. Luxury hospitality excels at delivering curated high-touch experiences. What does it take to lead in an evolving experiential sector like luxury hospitality? Why don't we thrive on curated high-touch experiences that resonate? They do need a balance design service, whether it's culinary innovation or immersive programming. We exemplify this through wellness rituals, Conrad or cultured assertions at Alexa. And a lot of storytelling, as you can imagine, at world of a story. But I think you're delivering that needs foresight, a huge amount of attention to detail and a commitment to being authentic. So with every interaction, every moment you've got to reinforce a guess and superb stead belonging their delight. And I think in this evolving experiential sector, I think our leadership is about anticipating and powering our teams and crafting genuine experiences. And there's a balance. And I think when you talk about relationships and brands and products, the pendulum pens to swing. So we look at it in multiple ways, whether it's brand partnerships that align with our brands philosophy. I always say that it used to be the case that when you went to a luxury hotel a few decades ago, it was better than home. That is almost impossible now. You have to meet our guests at home. So they have the high quality finishes furnishings, the amenities, the linens. So when you look at our partnership with Esau, our bathroom and native one of the story, our category partnership with Fred K. Linon, this isn't a treat for our guests. This is their way of life. This is how they live. So we're meeting them at home at the same time. So and then we look, you get a little bit more granular when you look at the Squagia partnership we have at the Worcester, New York, where we developed a unique scent. You want that emotional recognition. And again, guests can purchase the scent, whether it's through candles, spray, they can take that memory home. That's what you want. Or whether you get a little bit more local and you have locally made hot bags at some of our content resorts that support local communities. And I think right now, as I said, the pendulum swings, we're seeing a trend for nostalgic hotel branded a parallel. You know, guests want to take a little bit of that home, have some fun, you know, luxury certainly becoming more playful on the partnerships. Again, we don't necessarily have a one-size-fits-all. We look at the market dynamic. We look at what's relevant for that destination. We just announced a few weeks back our community partnership at World of the Story of London Admiralty Arch. We have Tlesmith who's a revered chef. I'm a London dining scene, you know, who will lead our signature restaurant. And then we have Danielle Balloude coming back with Cafe Balloude on the rooftop. And for us, you know, that is about really making a statement of intent around our partners and making sure I guess see that. And again, seeing that collaboration between a hotel brand and two-connary giants, I think is incredible. So, Dino, my final question is the luxury item question, which I ask all my guests. So if you were stranded on a deserted island and you could only have one single luxury item with you, what would that luxury item be? It can't be any form of air or water transportation to get you off that island or anything that requires mobile service so you can call your three sons or anybody to help to get you off that island. It's just you on this lonely island by yourself. What would the one single luxury item you would like to have with you? Well, on the basis that I can't escape, I would actually say and it's the one thing, fun of I can't travel with because of the size. I wish I could take my pillow with me. It's the one thing that stops me getting a good night's sleep and I think if I can have a good night's sleep, I can do anything. I'm ready for the day. I would say my pillow. Dino, Michael, senior vice president and global category head of luxury brands at Hilton. Thank you so much for joining me on the luxury item. My pleasure. Thank you so much. That's it for this episode of the luxury item podcast. Thank you so much for listening. If you found this useful and entertaining, I would be really grateful if you can share it with a friend or colleague. I would love it if you subscribe so you never miss an episode. And while you're there, be sure to rate and review us on Apple podcasts. It really helps other listeners find us. The luxury item podcast is a production of Silver Tone Consulting. I'm your host, Scott Kerr. Until next time.