S15 E10: Julie Bramham, Global Managing Director at Diageo Luxury Group

[Music] You're listening to the luxury item, the podcast on the business of luxury, and the people and companies that are shaping the future of the luxury industry. Here's your host, Scott Kerr. The luxury spirit industry has been robust and expanding, fueled by rising disposable incomes, global demand for premium experiences, and evolving consumer preferences. Premiumization, innovation, and regional market shifts are shaping its current landscape while certain challenges and new consumption patterns influence growth trajectories. My guest on the luxury item is Julie Bramham, managing director of the Diagio Luxury Group, where she oversees ultra-hynet, worth private client sales, luxury commercial teams, innovation, and cultural partnerships for the beverage and spirits giant. Some of the premium and luxury spirits brands in her portfolio include Johnny Walker, Ton Julio and Casa Migos, Tiquilas, Bora, and Port Ellen Scotch-Wiskeys and others. Having spent more than two decades at Diagio, Julie is an accomplished leader and board member with a proven record in delivering transformational growth strategies and building brands across global markets. Her roles have included serving as Global Brand Director for Johnny Walker, and she launched the latest chapter of the iconic Johnny Walker Keep Walking campaign and Chief Marketing Officer in India, where she led the growth of Diagio's Scotch portfolio and building up the reputation of the wider industry in a business-critical market. Welcome to the luxury item, Julie. Thanks for having me, Skull. Thank you for coming on. I'm so excited to have you on. She now in late 2024, Diagio announced the formation of its luxury group, a division that includes a portfolio of luxury beverages including Johnny Walker, Ton Julio, Casa Migos, Port Ellen and others. In the early 2020s, consumers were accelerating their more expensive tastes during COVID. The whole premiumization trend led many beverage alcohol manufacturers tied their strategies into building up their premium and above-off rings as a way of mitigating the general decline in alcohol volumes, seen in more mature markets. This whole drink less but better trend also boosts the bottom line. Was Diagio's creation of the luxury group a proactive measure to mitigate risks associated with over a lie and so on a single market? We might have only formalized it a year ago, but luxury is not new to Diagio in most ways. But the formation of the luxury group was about pulling together all of our luxury businesses, so we can really leverage the connected power of them. So the Diagio luxury group, it's a consolidation of our luxury brand homes, our luxury private client business, premium brand innovation, strategy and effort, and also the expert craft people behind all of this. So essentially, Scott, what we've done is we've put our most precious assets together under one umbrella, under one strategy, which is really going to allow us to focus on accelerating growth in the luxury segments. So as you know, we've got a really wide portfolio, but our focus for luxury is predominantly Scott, to Keeler and Ron. And within these, we've got runs that are like centuries old, actually, and really rich in heritage. We've got a huge amount of precious aged whiskey and to Keeler stocks, more than anybody in the business. And we really want to make sure that we're deploying and allocating that against the biggest opportunities. So bringing it together into one luxury group is allowing us to build for the future. And that's kind of in our DNA as a company. And if I'm made, let me talk a little bit about some of the stories behind our founders. And so a couple of our biggest priority brands, Johnny Walker and Don Hulio, have greats of founder led stories. The Johnny Walker story starts with the death of John Walker's farmer, but sorry, John Walker's father, who was a farmer. And that led to John Walker selling off the family farm. He opened a grocery store in Kilmarnaq where he started blending teas and quickly moved on to blending whiskey. He spotted the opportunity to play with flavor and to build a brand before brands really existed at any scale. So he sort of believed what he was doing and the quality of his product. And that led to a business that grew and grew and and you know, the rest is history became the biggest and most famous whiskey brand in the world. And about a century later on the other side of the globe in the Highlands of Helisco, Don Hulio Gonzalez was a local farmer also. He started from very little but had the self belief and he was a real visionary to start his own tequila distillery in 1942, which eventually became Don Hulio brand. So these are two of our bigger brands in luxury. And so where I started from to say we've kind of been doing luxury in pockets for quite a long time. We've got these founder led stories that are such an incredible platform for us to build from. And along with the creation of the luxury division, you were pointed to lead it and charted strategy. You were formerly the global brand director, Johnny Walker, which you were just talking about. Johnny Walker's success can really be boiled down to the consistency of its message. The brand has been running the same iconic platform keep walking since 1999. The message embodies progress, perseverance and the spirit of moving forward. Aside from the now iconic slogan and marked a modern evolution for the striding man logo, it built a powerful emotional connection with a new generation of whiskey drinkers. At the time, what were your consumer insights showing that spawned the brand idea around personal progress? I mean, look, first of all, I should say what a privilege is to sort of work on Johnny Walker and and to lead it. At points, you know, in my in my time at the ad geo and I've worked on the brand in various different capacities over the years. And I think yeah, that's an inherited something that's so powerful because as you say, it's an incredible brand with an ethos that really stands the test of time. So the idea of progress is a basic human motivation right and to be able to build. It's far more than an advertising line. It's a brand idea of keep walking at the center of the brand means that we've got this incredible platform to work from and it and it's telly's back nicely to what we spoke about a few moments ago. So the sort of DNA of the brand Johnny Walker and how progressive John Walker was in building his business and passing it down to his sons who took the brand all around the world, which is now sold and 180 markets all around the world. And this idea of keep walking as an enduring sort of ethos and philosophy for Johnny Walker is, it is just so powerful, but so simple and so relevant. And it's exciting today. And by the way, I can't take any credit for the creation of keep walking was created back in 1998 actually, but launched to the world in 1999 and it has become one of the key brand assets for Johnny Walker. I'm not going to blame myself. I'm lucky to have what on it over that time. But it does guide how we how we show up as a brand. It does guide the decisions that we make and we're lucky to have people like Dr Emma Walker who I know I'm just so sure we're going to talk about Emma as we going through this podcast, but Dr Emma Walker as our master blender now because she is very much the embodiment of progress and progressive thinking as well. So it guides everything that we do on the brand from the advertising line, but perhaps more importantly to what we do and how we develop the brand and how we innovate and our tone of voice. So very powerful. So how has the idea of keep walking progressed over time so it's culturally relevant and resonates with current consumer attitudes. I'm that's a really important question. So whilst the idea of progress is an enduring brand idea, you know, for the reasons we spoke about so it's a basic human need a motivation how we bought it to life has evolved over that 25 years. I'd say when we started to keep walking, it was very much about personal progress and it was probably bought to life in a slightly singular maybe a bit in neat masculine way. Whereas now as we bring keep walking to life, it's much more collective, it's more inclusive, it's more experiential. So the idea of progress being constant, but how it's bought to life, you know, evolving over those 25 years has been, you know, great to see and great to be part of. And Johnny Walker brand is a core focus for the new luxury division. It remains the world's selling scotch whiskey, thanks to diversified market strong brand equity and continued innovation. Everything points to the brand being well positioned for long term growth. However, spirit makers like your parent company, Diagio globally have been facing regional and economic challenges is high interest rates and inflation. If it consumers wallets shift towards more health conscious choices, the emergence of weight loss drugs like ozemic and of course tariffs in the United States, your veteran of the industry and have been with Diagio for more than two decades, what is your personal assessment of the state of the global drinks industry and where do you see the growth opportunities through all these headwinds. And I think that's a great question and a great discussion for us to have. Well, firstly, I'd say it's really important to say we operate in the category of socializing, which is ever present across the cultures across all of the markets that we operate in. will continue to do so. But there is no doubt the socialisings changing. It's becoming more experienced-led, much more fluid actually in time and in place. But as a business, we spend a lot of time looking at trends, understanding the people who engage with our brands are consumers in order that we can adapt and in order that our brands can stand and lead the way. So that's kind of just a thought on socialising as an enduring pattern of human behavior that we're done is going to change. Then when we think about what it means for us in the drinks industry, I mean, we take a long, a long range view of growth and we believe in the long-term fundamentals of the industry. And for my part of that in luxury, we play a really important role in shaping trends for the spirits industry. You know, think about it. We can play with like high, high hand-touch experiences. We can play, you know, a relatively small scale with different experiences, personalisation that we then can scale and throughout our brands and throughout the business. And a couple of the things that we are playing with experience and personalisation, very big growing trend areas. And we're really leaning into this in lots of different ways, whether that's from experiences at our brand homes to personalise bottling, making sure that we're telling personalise storytelling through craft, which our brands have got in spades, but also bringing to life real, the real people who are making our brands, many of who have been doing so for decades. We've already mentioned Dr Emma Walker on Johnny Walker. She's not related to the Walker family. Believe it or not. Through to people like Lorraine Avasquez, who's the master of the distiller of Zacapa, who has been making brands, the cap of over 40 years. We've got these people and brands that are so skilled that they can carry the history of our brands forward. And then like keeping going about, you know, to your question around consumers and where we're heading, there's definitely been a shift in luxury over the last decade. And we're seeing younger consumers of legal purchase age and above really engaging more with luxury. So you might be surprised to hear that the average age of a Johnny Walker blue label drinker is typically younger than that of a black label drinker in most markets around the world. So we are seeing younger more diverse people come in and enjoy our brands at the higher price marks. We also know that about three quarters of consumers at the total luxury category will be Gen Zed or Millennial by the end of next year. And quite anecdotally, we have had an increase of younger buyers again, legal drinking age and above, join our private client list. And that's a global private client list. So I think, you know, really what I'm saying is we're seeing a real broadening of the consumer in the luxury space. And the key for us is to continue to find ways for our brands to connect with consumers and clients through experience innovation, personalization and so on. And this whole idea of exploration drove most of the growth and spirits in the last decade, a trend that was amplified during the pandemic as disposable income stacked up when people were unable to travel or go out. It fueled the genesis and growth of hundreds of new brands, many in the luxury tier, or boosted by a celebrity endorsement. But as restrictions ease and inflation balloon, the trend began to end. And some of the recent data shows consumers have been less inclined to take a chance on an expensive product and more app to return to everyday affordable standbys. How do you weather this whole trade down risk? Yeah, it's such an interesting time, not fascinating decade in the world of luxury to watch how the categories evolved through quite extraordinary times. And first of all, I'd say there has been a slow down in broader luxury. That tends to be evidenced a little bit more in personal goods, whereas what we're seeing in luxury experiences like travel and experience are still in growth. And we have the benefit of working in an industry that can move towards experience. So we can really lean into that. I would also say we do see real resilience at the top end of the category and had some amazing success on some high-end Scotch and tequila sales recently. So absolutely, there is a slow down in broader luxury, but we do see opportunity through the continued buoyancy of experience. Importantly, I'd also say, like premiumisation within spirits is a very long-term trend. And over the long term, high-friars spirits consistently grow ahead of our origin and tend to rebound really quickly. But within that, and in this extraordinary decade, how people are spending is also shaping. And we are seeing luxury consumers willing to spend on experiences and personalisation. But you asked the question about trading down. We would talk about that actually as accessible luxury, which isn't necessarily people moving down the price ladder, but it's recruiting new consumers into luxury. So we see accessible luxury as a growth trend. That could be, you know, some people may enjoy a weekend at the conor, but for others, enjoying a martini handcrafted by Agoparone at the bar at the conor. That might be their luxury experience as an accessible way to enjoy luxury. It could be a Don Julio 1942 mini or a perfectly crafted wistie sour experience at the Johnny Walker experience, but it is stretching up. And the idea of experience really does stretch all the way up to highly curated, white-gloved experiences like the private visits to Port Allen distillery or to Brawler distillery up in the north of Scotland. So we're pretty well placed actually to be able to recruit and talk to consumers who want to enjoy accessible luxury for our brands all the way up to clients who want to have very high, highly curated, white-gloved experiences at the very top end of our portfolio. And despite broader economic challenges, demand from these high net worth individuals for these exclusive high quality products and experiences continues to be robust. Earlier this year, Johnny Walker unveiled the Johnny Walker Vault tailored to these high net worth clients. Could you talk a little bit about this bespoke Scotch whiskey experience and why you launched it now? Yes, absolutely. And let me start by trying to describe a little bit of what we're doing here. So I'd start to say the Johnny Walker Vault is a global luxury platform. Okay. And it's about uniting bespoke blending, collaborations, culture and icons and experiences. So first off, the Vault is a platform, not only a physical space, but it actually is a physical space as well as part of that platform. And the story goes as follows. We opened the Johnny Walker experience just over four years ago, but actually we've been working on it for five years prior to that. And finding the right location and building for the Johnny Walker experience, as you can imagine, took us some time. And when we found building that we're in on Princess Street, we started to look at the lease. And we found that it used to be a bank. And the Vault underneath the building was still in perfect condition. So when it was a bank vault, this was used to house people's most valued precious belongings. And so we should use it to house our most valued and precious belongings. And so we decided, like kind of almost a decade ago, that we wanted to build our own Vault to house our incredible Scotch inventory from across our distillery footprint. And that would be the, you know, over 30 distilleries and that we own across Scotland. So it's a physical space in what used to be a former bank vault. And how we use it is Dr Emma Walker, who is our master blender and her team of blenders. I've got access to over 10 million casts of maturing Scotch from across Scotland. And Emma hand curates 500 of those to be housed in the Vault. So see the vault as a hidden creative Italian that sits deep beneath the Johnny Walker experience. And off those 500 whiskies, about 95% of them will will never be commercialised. So this space and bringing clients to this space genuinely as a money can't buy experience, they get to see and try products that would otherwise never be available. So it's an imbi-only space. We bring clients here and we share with them some of the rare Scotches that we've got. And they also get to spend time with Dr Emma and she, you know, if asked, spends time blending private blends, that's creating the best blend from the very best inventory that we have. And the private blend is an experience to have a blend made just for you. We actually call it your life story and a liquid. We accompany that with other sort of money can't buy and luxury elements such as, you know, staying overnight and enjoying the fabulous Glen Eagles along with the visit to the Diagere Archives where you can see the rich history of some of our brands. and then guests get presented with their blend in a crystal decanter handcrafted by Bacarats. So that is, you know, the very highest end the white glove experience that we've created from a platform called the Vault and the magic happens in the Vault. But beyond private blending, we actually want to use it as a platform to create an opportunity for these, you know, incredible whiskies that people can enjoy, even if they can't come and travel and spend time in Edinburgh. - Not long after you launched the Vault, the brand announced French Fashion Designer, Olivier Restein, the Balma Creative Director as your first cultural collaborator, how did Johnny Walker land Restein as your first partner for the Vault platform? - I was deeply involved in these conversations and I'm so thrilled that we got to work with Olivier. He is fantastic. Look, first of all, I'd say, think the brands that stand the test of time in this century old, century's old, I should say, category, are the ones that can reinvent themselves. So we talk with Olivier about reinvention, not being a threat to tradition, but how tradition survives. And so when we started to imagine not only creating these private blend experiences in the Vault, but something that we could take out there and tell our story to the world, we wanted a partner who could bring to life the created elements that Emma does on the brand. And we kind of go back to, what does the brand stand for? What are the values that we're trying to embody here? And we come back to, like four really important words on Johnny Walker, progress, boldness, craft and creativity. And when we start to boil it down to those four words, that John Walker stood for, that Dr. Emma Walker stands for, Olivier was a really obvious answer within that context. And he was delighted to work with us and is delighted to work with us. So we built a partnership with Olivier, which had him and Emma, closely partnering actually, both in terms of creation of five different blends from Olivier. We started out saying we wanted one. And Olivier said, well, I work in fashion, so we have four seasons. So let's do four. And then we decided to do another one. So it's really been a huge amount of time that we've spent together actually exploring where we want to take Johnny Walker through the eyes of Emma and Olivier together. Emma has been the genius who has bought to life, Olivier's dreams for the blend. And Olivier has spent hours and hours and hours sketching the design. How do we want this package into show up? What do we do beyond the bottle? What does the stopper look like? Not just the stopper, not just the box. What's the trunk that it comes in? What would retail space look like? How do we want to build and package accessories that could go through with, go alongside the blend? So he has been an incredible partner and really helps us to reimagine how Johnny Walker complained luxury. And so we've just launched, so we launched the four seasons earlier this year and we've just launched earlier this month's Couture Blend where we've got a luxury retail vault boutique at Harrods currently live in London. And later on this month, we are also launching out in Singapore. So wonderful, wonderful to see a collaboration, operate at the level of culture, but also at the level of product innovation and excellence through liquid, through packs, through retail experience. How often are you going to do these vault collaborations? So the vault will be a permanent range, if you like, and then we'll build in collaborations for a couple of years, let's say. So expect to see some work with us over the next year on where we go from here. These with other artists, are you moving beyond fashion collaborations? I don't want to say too much, but what I will say is we've greatly enjoyed and we're seeing a lot of value in working in fashion because of the clear synergies for all of the reasons I've spoken about. And as we work through a collab sort of selection and who are the creative geniuses that we want to work with, we come back to those four words, progress boldness, craft and creativity. So watch this face and you'll see where we go from here. - So where do you see the untapped growth opportunities with these high value audiences? - I think there's a huge amount of growth to be had. We are through things like the Couture Blend. We're recruiting new audiences into John Walker, who are currently fans of Olivier and his fashion. It could be people who just hadn't thought of Scotch in quite that way before. So huge opportunity for growth by bringing new people into the brand for sure. - Johnny Walker also teamed up on a brand partnership with Grammy winning pop stars, and being a carpenter, sent it around her new album, "Man's Best Friend" last year you partnered with Netflix on all the mid-ad addition Johnny Walker Black label bottles featuring squid game branding. Well, these type of cultural collaborations be essential strategic levers for Johnny Walker's growth and relevance moving forward. - Yeah, I mean, look, first of all, I love both of the examples you've just given. Neither of them are pieces of work that I've done myself, but I think they're fantastic. And we talk about re-endenting the brand constantly. I think these are great examples of that. So I'd say like we 100% believe that we grow our brands by placing them at the heart of culture, whether that's bar culture, to design, to fashion, to music, to entertainment. It really can involve collaboration and partnership. I believe the stat is something like brands that are embedded in culture grow six times faster than brands that aren't. And something like that's the can't ask that. So it's really important that we put culture at the centre of our brand effort. And what we talked a bit earlier about it, I'm continuing to stay relevant while staying true to our heritage, to our authenticity is really, really important on Walker. And we do that via values and the matching of values to collaborators. And I think Sabrina's a great example. She has a very clear view on the world of bold creativity. She stands for progress. She stands for self-expression and empowerment. So that partnership is all about working with progressive voices to tell stories of progress. So it all comes back to progress at the end of the day. One of the more unique brands in the luxury portfolio is the Port Ellen Distillery. It was established in 1825, closed in 1983. After its closure, Port Ellen gained mythic status as one of Scotland's coast distilleries, highly sought after for its unique Isla Whiskey. In 2017, Diagio announced a significant investment to rebuild and reopen Port Ellen and other closed distilleries, including Braura. After 40 years of closure, the Port Ellen Distillery officially reopened last year. Why is there so much renewed interest in these Isla Ghost distilleries, all of a sudden? - I feel so lucky to be in this job at this moment in time. We've got this incredible agenda. And let me just start back a step if that's OK, Scott. - Right. - So firstly, I think this category is relatively unique. If you think about it, a lot of the Whiskey that sits under Emma's guardian share pin the vault, they are Whiskeys that were laid down over 50 years ago in some instances by visionaries who wanted to lay down Scotch for the future. And what we're doing now is the stills are running at Port Ellen and you mentioned Braura also, which opened almost four years ago, is the stills are running and we're creating Whiskey that won't be enjoyed for over a decade, more like probably getting on towards two decades. Whiskey will tell us when it's ready. And much of that will be way beyond two decades. So we're in this sort of really privileged, unique position of saying we control from the past, but we're also creating the future. And we're thinking very far ahead in terms of where the future of the industry will be. So firstly, it's a great privilege to be able to sort of be a part of that. And then we think about specifically about Port Ellen. It's a real jewel, as you say. It's celebrated 200 years since it opened in 1825. And last year we reopened it after over 40 years of closure. And we had liquids that were maturing during its closure, including liquids that were being poured as single molts for the late Queen's commemorative bottles. But these liquids have made the distillery one of the most famous in the world. And as you say, you know, Isla is a real home. It's quite a sort of, it's an iconic, very, very iconic island in the context of Scotch Whiskey. So when we started opening some of those old casts, it was a very special moment. The product story on Port Ellen is very compelling. Port Ellen is crafted by the elements. It's perfected by patients. And we talk about it as being loved into being by human hands. And it's also a brand that stands for experimentation. And since Port Ellen reopened and the stills have reopened, the team has had a really complex journey. job trying to recreate the old special whiskeys whilst experimenting with new ones. And we do want Paul Tellen to stand for the future of Scotch, as much as it is known for being an icon in the past of Scotch. So we're only going to get to taste the fruits of the labour of the team as I say over a decade will probably more like two decades time. But what we do do today, you know, that's the point around experiences we offer a tour to private clients to come to Paul Tellen and as part of that they get to taste the original 1979 Paul Tellen which has a bit of a cult-like following. But truthfully the important piece is it's a really long term investment to build for the future and to be part of. So mentions that recent last Friday we were part of an industry wide, a great initiative actually called the Distillers 1 of 1. They hold an auction every two years with Sotheby's and we auction off one of ones, unique propositions from across the industry and we presented Paul Tellen Prism which was a 46 year old Paul Tellen house and the most beautiful architectural sculpture and that along with 38 other lots generated almost 3 million for the youth action fund. And it also represented a new record for the highest price ever for a bottle of Paul Tellen for us. So it's great that we can participate using old liquids. It's great that we can experiment about where we go with new liquids as well. Your portfolio also has two ultra premium tequila brands with tremendous brand equity and our top sellers. But really with different positioning Don Julio which has a more prestigious profile and the Katsomegos tequila which is positioned as a little trendier and maybe more approachable. Tequila remains one of the fastest growing spirits categories especially in the United States where it has reached record market share revenue and premiumization momentum. Don Julio has shown remarkable growth while Katsomegos has slowed in recent years after robust growth during COVID. What will define the next phase of growth of these two ultra premium tequilers with contrasting trajectories? I share your enthusiasm and excitement about tequila as a category to grow to a scene and where it's going to go. I mean I'd start again by saying like craft of tequila begins in the fields of Hylisto where you know the blue web or agave grows under the Mexican sun each agave plant would take between 6 to 10 years to mature. The pinion that stores the sugar is what becomes one day tequila. So it's kind of you know again it's not just made it's cultivated it's guided it's really loved into being you know a little bit like how we spoke about mortality in the next ago and as you say tequila is fastest growing course for its category very well positioned in terms of many of the trend and so things like exploration like the growth in cocktails growth in luxury growth in enjoying spirits with food it's hugely versatile and it offers loads of different experiences for people to enjoy across that you know that that that changing socializing moment and how people are spending their time. So tequila is primed for a really exciting decade ahead of it. Look we're going to keep going we're going to keep collaborating we're going to keep doing great work with cultural icons and in in in culturally important moments from things like Peggy good to we announced earlier this year partnership with the World Cup and coming next summer so we'll make sure that's key was at the heart of the big socializing moments of today. I think we should also think about Don Julio just like we do about scotch it's real craft it's got real tradition behind it and our job is respecting the craft and the tradition and experimenting and exploring to create the future will do that in a variety of different ways through great drinks programs through great collaboration to products innovation so very exciting category and much more to come. Well what's going to be key here is going to be brand storytelling at the end of the day it's really central to the success of ultra premium spirits especially as consumers taste have shifted toward experienced authenticity and emotional connection over mere product attributes and celebrity appeal consumers expect believable aspirational narratives that are more likely to advocate for brands that feel real and meaningful. How do you cultivate these narratives across your luxury portfolio so they don't sound like competitors or also focusing on rare ingredients or traditional craftsmanship heritage etc. Yeah I was a great question. I'd say craftsmanship heritage and ingredients are cool so what makes all brands successful but having narratives that go beyond that that allows to appeal to appeal to different people and different interest groups is really important. I guess one of the things that we're doing that feels right in this space is what we've to work we've done with our brand homes in Scotland and so we've really bought hard about how to bring our brands to life give a taste of Scottish culture and tradition but in a way that's unique to them. So whether that's through the Johnny Walker experience that I spoke about earlier where the vault is housed in Edinburgh or through to some of the ghost distilleries like Brawler and Portellan we think really hard about getting consumers and clients really rich multi-sensory experiences and we try to do it in a really personalized way. So let me talk a little bit more about the range of personalisation because I think that's interesting. So Johnny Walker experience everybody we've had over a million visitors come to visit us so far and every visitor starts the tour by taking part in what called the What's Your Wistley platform asks them a series of simple questions and that they can engage with and that helps them to understand their flavour preferences. When they then go so we give them a wristband of a different colour basically then go on the tour we tailor the drinks that they try on the tour based on their flavour preference. So rather than them going through lots of different don't like that not sure about that because of how it's mixed what we actually are able to do live in in the tour is give them personalised drink recommendations and they get to try some of them so that's the kind of table stakes for us as people come and enter the journey of flavour tour at Johnny Walker experience. And I should say as part of that we get a lot of non whiskey drinkers we built the tour around people who don't drink whiskey as much as people who do drink whiskey because a lot of whiskey experiences are quite heavy actually and really tailored towards whiskey or fish and ardos whereas we wanted on Johnny Walker to be able to talk to a really broad segment of consumers who engage with the brand but didn't necessarily know much about how to drink it. Personalisation at one level then we go all the way up to personalisation of a private client experience at one of our private client homes like Brawra or Portellan which is white gloved that will be a highly curated visit will have been working with the client for months before they arrive on their flavour preferences what they'd like to eat how they'd like to be entertained where they're going to stay etc so we're kind of spanning but I think at the sense for of it I would say experience is critical that's allowing us to build story telling that goes beyond craftsmanship heritaging an ingredients but of course they are part of the story that they really have to do. How are you telling these stories through digital marketing channels? Yeah look I think it's at the first digital and social is completely essential and bite-sized story telling is also you know we're in a very different moment of how we can tell stories from our brands and it's an exciting moment actually certainly very different to when I started out in the business over 25 years ago where our focus was on 62nd TV ads you know we're very much in a different moment which is super because it gives us lots of different opportunities to create different touch points for our brands so like I say the table stakes is people to expect a seamless blend of personalised physical and digital experiences we find that digital and social media drive how people find out about luxury brands they get their sound bites through it whether that be through short social clips whether that be through community platforms that are consumer led we're really leaning more and learning more about how consumer engages with us online but we're also doing a load of exploration and experimentation from search to creating digital customer journeys to building customer experience I spoke about what's your whiskey and when people enter Johnny Walker experience we've also got a similar tool on what's your tequila but we also have a CRM and for our private clients that allows us to interact with clients all around the world allows us to stay connected with clients all around the world and build highly personalised relationships and that then helps us to develop products to their preferences but also tailor what we offer for them so I think this is an incredibly exciting moment to be a marketer with the number of different touch points that we can create for people to interact with our brands and for our direct clients so I love a lot of love the sort of opportunity, the sophistication, the complexity, and that we've got, you know, at the moment through digital democratization. It seems Diagio's luxury group has made packaging central to its premiumization strategy by prioritizing sustainability, design innovation, personalization as you're talking about and enhanced consumer experiences. For instance, Johnny Walker Blue Label, ultra pioneer, the world's lightest glass whiskey bottle wing, only 180 grams, there have also been padded bottle shapes, intricate embossing and collaborations with renowned designers. What's Diagio's ambition with its packaging innovation strategy? Look, in terms of luxury packaging, we spend a lot of time working through a number of different aspects that we believe are going to help us to be successful with the consumer. From personalization to sustainability to beautifully crafted design, I think, you know, we've talked a lot on this podcast about the craftsmanship that goes into blending and Scotch and Keala whiskey and Keala creation. And I think, you know, like our objectives are to match the quality of the pack to the exception and care and crafting in our liquids. So it's as important that we put that level of craft into how it's packaged. I'd also say like category semiotic cues are important, but we don't want to slavishly look like everyone else. So we are pioneering an experimental. Johnny Walker, ultra light, did challenge the idea that luxury means heavy and it took five years of experimenting to create what's first of its kind innovation. The glass is so lightweight that it cannot stand on a base. It's hand blown into a teardrop shape and then stands in a cradle. So that's an example of us really pushing the boundaries and being pioneering. But there's loads of other examples across limited collections like special Johnny Walker decant has designed by Bacarat, like Peggy Gooth on Don Julio, which saw the creation of a special limited bottle with handwritten illustrations on the end set from Peggy, which is absolutely gorgeous. Well, Julie, my final question is the luxury item question that I ask on my guess. So if you were stranded on a deserted island and you could only have one single luxury item with you, what would that luxury item be? It can't be any form of air or water transportation to get you off that island or anything that requires mobile service, so you can call your pals to get you off that island. What would that one single luxury item you would like to have with you? I'm laughing Scott because I know this is your thumbprint final question. It's time to think about it then. Exactly. And perhaps the hardest question. Listen, I think you're going to expect this, but I have to go back to Brandon and say to remind me of home, it would be my own private Johnny Walker blend from the vault created by Dr. Emma Walker. And I'm so lucky to work with Emma being this job. We create very, very special limited number of private blends and minus extra special. And 1974, Portellan, you might guess the significance of that year to my life. It was the year I was born. It also has an 82-clin leash, which is really anxious, honeyd style and a blare-athlete deeply charged for that spicy flavor, which is to celebrate my time living in India. But I think it's just such a fantastic, as I say, my life story in a liquid and being away from home on a deserted island, this is the one thing that I'm going to have to remind me of home. I'm glad you didn't see the vault itself. That would have been great as well. I should have actually. Julie Bramam, Global Managing Director at Diageo Luxury Group. Thank you so much for joining me on the Luxury Item. Thank you, Scott. That's it for this episode of the Luxury Item Podcast. Thank you so much for listening. If you found this useful and entertaining, I would be really grateful if you can share it with a friend or colleague. I would love it if you subscribe so you never miss an episode. And while you're there, be sure to rate and review us on Apple Podcasts. It really helps other listeners find us. The Luxury Item Podcast is a production of Silver Tone Consulting. I'm your host, Scott Kerr, until next time.