Roberto Kaelin on Building a Martial Arts Gym & Training Under Carlos Machado

(upbeat music) - What's up guys, this is Wesley Wazin. I'm Wesley Parker. - And I'm Bailey Parker. - And today we have Roberto Caelin and right here with us, Ma'am, super excited. He's been training martial arts since he was nine years old. A fourth degree BJJ Black Belt. First degree, Black Belt and Judo. A first degree, Black Belt and Karate. And also he's training Kung Fu, Muay Thai, Akito, Kindo, and-- - Yai Do. - Yai Do. - He's drawing the sword. - Oh, okay, okay. I'm familiar with a few of those, and not all of them. But, no, I definitely have to hear more about those, for sure. Super excited guys to have Roberto on here. I've been looking forward to this for a while. This is super, super cool. So, it's kind of just like dive into it. Like, I'm really interested to-- I kind of know a little bit. We've talked a little bit about it, but I'm kind of curious about like the origin story of Roberto. So, like, you started at nine. So, how did you find Jiu Jitsu? And was it like growing up in Peru, correct? - Yeah. - Once you found Jiu Jitsu and how that kind of transformed? - Well, in the 1980s, Peru was like a war zone. We have the terrorist group, San Pedro Luminoso, which is the Chinese path. So, you know, we had like curfews at night, like, you couldn't leave your house after 10 p.m. until five. You could hear like the machine guns at night. The terrorists would bomb the high tension towers. So, I remember doing my homework at Candelite. - Wow. - I guess you would just lose electricity. - Goodness. - So, yeah, it was like, it was like Beirut, you know? But yeah, that was Peru in the 80s. But if you go to Peru now, the younger generation had no clue how it was. So different now, it's like, you know, modernized. They have my dolls now. Yeah, you know, colonized, really have my dolls then. - Oh, that place from on the map, McDonald's. - But I was lucky enough that my parents had money. So, they would take me to this new world. And, you know, I was in American school. That's why I learned English. - Really? - Yeah. So, you know, I got to go to this new world. I got my dolls. (laughing) I got my dolls. (laughing) So, but still I had to live in that atmosphere. - Yeah. - Which was normalized for us guys. But then when I began like nine years old, you know, nine-ish, like I got a little fat. I got a little fat. So my mom said, no, you gotta do something to lose the gut. And I hated it. I just wanted to play my Nintendo, right? - Almost so you were a gamer as a kid too. - Well, who wasn't? - Okay. - Now I was playing my ninja turtle. So my Nintendo, and that's all I wanna do, right? So, I had a chauffeur back then. So my mom would tell me, she told me, what do you wanna do? So, one of my cousins was doing karate. So I said, okay, karate, whatever, right? 'Cause I didn't like soccer. And that was like the primary thing. So she put me karate. And I hated it. 'Cause it was all lazy. I didn't wanna exercise, right? So, like my chauffeur would take me there. And my mom had instructed him to like grab me and take me on his shoulder and get me in the dough joke. And I would kick and scream at it. So I saved my allowances. And I talked to it guys, it's listen man. I'm gonna bribe you bro. - That's hilarious. (laughing) - I'm gonna bribe you man, he's money. He's like, all right, fine. He's like, yeah, no problem. I'll take good money. But the problem is, if your mom sees that you're gay, it's clean. After you come back, she's gonna fire me. So, he's very smart, right? So he told me, listen, how about this? We go to this park that is behind the dojo. And you run laps, right? You run laps, so you're gay so, like sweaty. And then you just roll on the ground a little bit. So the next is dirty, right? And then it'll be cool. So yeah, I was fine. So I started running laps, running laps. And I was like, dude, this is harder than the karate man. (laughing) - What are we doing here? - Yeah, this is a hard thing man. - And I'm paying for it. You know, I'm paying for it. - Oh my god. - And it'll like, take me to karate. Take me to the stupid karate, I'll save my money. So I started going to karate and I started getting stronger. You know, when I liked it. - Yeah, I liked it because I was good at it. So like when I started fighting the kumite, the free fighting, I was good at fighting. So, and that was off what soccer. And it improved, if you're bad at soccer, man, you, you know. - You don't have a chance. - It's over, it's over. But I was good at something finally. And then my mom would punish me by restricting me from the karate. So once I, once, I got back greats all the time. So I got back greats. And my mom told me, okay, like I was on the phone and she said, where's your report card? And then she saw my report and she told me, no way, you're not going to karate today. So I got my bike and I drove my bike all the way like from one side to Lima to the other. Like an hour drive on my bike. When I came back, she just shut the door and had to sleep outside. - Oh my goodness. - In the 80s man. So, yeah, this is different back then, right? But she didn't restrict me anymore because she knew I was just going to rebel also. And after that, and that was with my Sensei Waiyo Salas and the guy's like a truck man, like muscle. And he was the perfect build for Shotokan karate. That karate is like a straight line. So he believed on the one punch kill and the shorter distance between two points is straight line. All right, so the advanced like a truck. So if you're skinny or frail, that's not for you because you're gonna go like this and bounce back, right? But this guy like a truck, so when he went through, he went through, right? So that was really good for him. But then the UFC hit, all right? So man, I saw Hoy's Gracie fight these dudes and it's like in the ground and everything else, like this is crazy. I gotta do this. - How old were you? - At that time. - I was like 14. - Okay. - And I had gone my black belt karate, I just got it. - Okay. - So man, I had to do this stuff. Right? So in Lima, there's the Japanese cultural center. It's in the district of San Felipe. It's this big building where all the Japanese people go to celebrate. But in the basement of this big building, you go down the stairs and it's like a big underground collision and they separated like pieces. They're all mats. One is for judo, one is for karate, one is for a kido, the other one's for kendo. And all the classics go simultaneously. So you can go to one class, it's over and you jump to the other one. And then you jump to the other one. - How long are the classes? - Like an hour each. - Like an hour each, like a typical class. - Yes, and they were ongoing. And they were ongoing. So I would just jump from one to another and then do it each one. So what I would do, like after class, I would like in high school, in middle school, ending middle school, I would go, well, 14. Yeah, that's like more or less. I would go from school. The bus I was stopped by, they were caged. (laughing) - It is gaming place. - Yeah, please street fighter. Please street fighter there with a crowd. Please street fighter. 30 minutes of that, then I would go to the Japanese culture or something and train all the way till like 9.30 and something's 9.45. And then I was out and back to my house. - Wow. - Yeah. - And I was at 14. - That was 14. - All the way till I was 17 and a half, almost 18. And that's when I came here, forgot it. - Did you find like when you were doing that, that you were leaning towards one particular martial arts that you kind of preferred? - Yeah, I was failing. - Yeah, I wouldn't miss a judo class. Because of the hoist crazy thing. 'Cause they have ground. They, we had a juditsu instructor in Peru, but he was in a crappy area. So I wouldn't go there, you know? So I wouldn't go there. So I would go to the better, better, better area. - Yeah. - And I thought judo and juditsu were the same stuff because the same arm bars and the same choke. I had no idea. - Yeah. - I had no idea. But still, and it was grappling. But yeah, I spent all my time there. And that's where I started growing up with this. Yeah. - Wow. - That was really cool. And so once you, so it was pretty much hoist crazy that is what sets you on this track, and you see. - Before hoist crazy, it was a revolutionary. He revolutionized the martial arts. Before hoist crazy, in the martial arts believed all these stupid stories of flying Chinese guys, you know, the master with the long eyebrows and the long beard, we totally believed the lies, right? Because nobody had to prove anything. They would tell you about the death touch and you believed it, you know? They told you, you know, this is too dangerous for competition, you never use this, right? So it's like, and something, stuff that would give you killed in the street, right? But when hoist crazy came around, he changed everything. Because now you would see the different type of arts, the traditional arts, being proven against each other. And you would see, it was all myth. It was lies. Like for example, they had a ninja guy. He went to the hero's seas against a Pat Smith, a kickboxer, and the kickboxer wrecked them, you know? And I was sure the ninja guy was gonna, like, you know, throw a puff of smoke and disappear and appear behind, you know, teleport behind him or something? No, he was faced bashed in. And I was marveling at that, you know? It's all the movies, because every Saturday, they had the Kung Fu theater in Lima, and I wouldn't miss it. So they would pass all the 36 chamber of Shaolin and all these movies, and I wouldn't miss it. All the Van Dam movies, all that stuff. And of course, you believe it as a kid, you know? But when you see an action that is so bunk, it's like, it's a revelation. Do you have any specific memory of like when you first saw any UFC fight? Like do you remember where you were or like what you were doing and or just the first time you realized like I want to do this. This is awesome. Well, I was subscribed to black belt magazine So in the inserts they have the Not a program advertisement The advertisement for UFC. So I ordered the VHS tapes Not to Peru, but to to someone in the States and when I went for vacation, I got them and I hadn't VHS and I watch I had a stack of them and I watch them. It was amazing That's my entry to and then I go to the Brazilian valetudos and then the and the world tournament saw fall jury to me in the mats Like like ours. The green and yellow bug in the day. Yes, I know what Tracy just told us about that when we did the podcast with her I had no idea that I saw that like the puzzle type or were they they have us up there kind of like this But no the colors were yellow and green. Yeah, that's how it wasn't back in the like when hoiler was young I used to fight and all that yeah like they the classics I used to watch that was a kid I was with Marvel of that. So that takes us to use you see hoist and that makes you want to come to the States right at once You see hoist. Yeah, so once you decide you want to come to the States. Yes, then what kind of happens after that? You research who's over here and well I research you came for college - so that was that was driving it or was it like that was a hook? It was like when Wesley said he moved to my hometown to go to college Right, right. Yeah, that was a community college. It was because I lived there. So no, I wanted I wanted to So since I was a little kid, I wanted to be a master in art. I didn't want to just be a fighter For example, I really liked the Ninja Turtles, right and everyone wants to be the Ninja Turtles. Everyone has like the Rafael donatello, Michelangelo and the other guy Leonardo, right? I wanted to be master splinter. I love that. But why because I like it my reasoning all right my reasoning was this Leonardo is a master of the sword. Michelangelo, the nunchakos, Rafael, the side and the Nutella of the bow. They all the old master of one thing But who taught them right master splinters and master of all? Right, so I wanted to agree to him. Yeah, I wanted to be a true master. So you know, he's the mastermind that controls all styles Not just one. So he's he's no one dimensional So he controls all so he can move and defense or attack in all planes Just one little thing. So yeah, I want to be the rat Super cool though. So once you move to the stage you move to the stage and it wasn't exactly because the college has kind of the hook Right, so the things I wanted to learn to do from that real master real master so back in the day, like I will go to the The internet we got the internet in the my high school lab like a bit of lab And I will research here and we only have one one form. It was moved sales form from Houston as school in Houston They got a form where they discussed MMA you need to wonder so like like read it Yeah, but it was like it was old was yeah, it was like red. It was red with like a white font. It was awful I was still on Peru, right? I was still in there. Yeah, I was in there. So I researched who was here and not many black bills were here But one attracted my my eye was Carlos Carlos macho and he was in Texas. So I saw I saw clips, but you have to like wait for like an hour for the clip to log Just to see a picture was like, you know, yeah, you have to turn that sound on Yeah But I managed to like sit there for like an hour and get the clips and he will talk and do his moves And I was like, man, it's amazing. This dude, you know, and And he was a good looking dude. So I wouldn't have to be like him Because the other guys look like you know, like warrior. I'm angry. But this guy look like a superhero Yeah, so and I was like 16 17. I want to be him So I said this guy so My I told my mom. Hey, what I want to do is I want to you know, continue my martial arts And she's like if you could do martial arts, you're gonna die of starvation No one makes money of that. You're gonna be a doctor a lawyer or an architect So man, I'm like and she's like you can go anywhere in the world you want Okay, I'm like, okay, Brazil. No way because you're gonna go to Brazil Okay, I'm like, okay, Japan, right? No, no, Japan. It's all just thinking, okay, whatever I'll do. Do no So I go, well, how about Texas? You're gonna talk to my counselor about Texas and everything and she's like sure because I got accepted to a university It's in my you know My acceptance stuff and they accepted me And that's the story I came here and the first day I arrived in the airport with my suitcases The orientation wasn't ready in your university. So I went to a motel and parked my bagus Called the Carlos school and went the same day to drink. Oh, yeah, same dream. Yeah And it wasn't in the film studio where they were filming a Texas Walker Ranger So I met Chuck Norris. Of course, he doesn't remember. I was just a little twerp. Yeah He doesn't remember but I remember him. Yeah, and we trained there Until until I don't know what happened that we had to move we moved to a squash court, which was awful and same dream And then we moved to the to the hole in the wall school where all the magic happened Really? Yeah, yeah, so leading you you moved to Carlos Now, what's the story about from your white belt to blue belt? To what happened there because we kind of talked about this a while back Yes, the problem was that I didn't have a car So I will go Carlos in his farmer's branch and I was in the dorms in Irving the University of Dallas in Irving No UTV US Judy you the University of Dallas and so I would spend all my money on taxis Because you know or if someone could could like give me a lift by bag then no one would want to take me So either have to live pay for gas money or beg and I hate it begging So I ran out of taxi money So I told my man in your car. It's like you don't even know how to drive And that's true How old are you now like where we're at now you you're in a university I'm probably I'm still 18 I just I just turned it not even 20s yet No, it was like two more three months into it. I lost all my money for 10 taxis I spent all my money tax. That sucks. Yeah And then Well, so I looked in yellow pages because the only way to find a school near me and I found molar So I want to Alan Muller's he was right there in the colinesis like close to the green is in Irving And I I stayed with him until the blue belt and that's when I learned to drive and finally got my Honda Civic As soon as I got my Honda Civic I sped up to Carlos. Yeah, yeah, so that's the story of course Moller taught me a lot. Yeah, but my sides were set on the master. Yeah, I wanted to live with the master And as soon as I had the wheels Bye, man. Yeah That's awesome. I I've gotten to meet Carlos like and what he's like now But what was Carlos like when you first met him in those early early days like how accepting was he to a brand new guy I mean, I got not really brown. You probably brought a lot to the gym with all your experience So I'm curious like what was he like back then? Well, I was like one of the younger guys. Yeah, so he like he looked at me like a pet Yeah, and in the mornings, which is funny too In the mornings I will go to Dallas, Judo to train with Vince Tamura. So I will go train the morning with Vince and at night with Carlos Okay, and in the morning, they were like the black belts were also like very like older men You know like over 40 most of them and they also took me in like a pet It was like they would all teach me their tricks Because I was just like a kid here and same with Carlos. So Carlos What he did was like when he got private lessons He will use me as his okay as his you know, he's dummy And I was happy because his his private were like 350 bucks an hour. So I could just leech Techniques, right? I just I didn't mind like being folded into, you know, right? I just leech the techniques and so and he would like go over every detail of the guys You know, and I was just listening and listening and then he would roll with the guy and I would watch Carlos He did and what he didn't teach that he did Yeah, he had a secret moves and I was like watching my watch like he would chase the hip and stuff Things that he wouldn't teach back then he teaches him now But back then he wouldn't really teach that I will watch him watch So yeah, I would like, you know, dissect his game. Yeah. Yeah, you think that was intentional by Carlos to like kind of hold some stuff tight I don't know, I don't know because right now he's an open book. He teaches every single detail. Yeah, but back then he he didn't You know, he he thought a lot obviously, but there's like like some details that he only did That he wouldn't really go over But I like checked it and looked at him and looked him and I picked him up and now he just issues freely So no one has to do that anymore. Yeah Yeah So once you met Carlos and you started training you have your blue bell and you start climbing the ranks Like did you come across any interesting characters or do you have any names that everyone was an interesting character Yeah, yeah, it was like that then it's probably a lot different. It was like a far worse than YouTube again. Yeah There was a lot of ego Yeah, you know the the quote of Deep your ego out the door. Mm-hmm. No one followed that They brought it all the way to the match. No, no follow that. It was just like, you know a bumper sticker Because no one followed it. Everyone had the ego, the size of a mountain. - Interesting. - Every day was a tournament. There was a friggin ladder and everyone was aware of. And if they beat you, they would brag. So every day, I remember driving there, you know, Honda Civic and pounding diacokes, just to get pumped up. Because it was going to be a war that day. Every day, right? So yeah, and when you got there, it was war. It would grab you and everyone had one speed. There was no light running at all. That was a myth. People would throw against the wall. They were friggin' holes in the wall. Man, the door was unhinged. The back door, people rolled out into the streets. - That's wild. - The wild west. - Yeah, within air conditioners, we put a big fan and people like crashing to the fan into the street and roll out. And they keep going because no one can lose. - Yeah, yeah. - So it crazed stuff. - And poor Carlos, he's non-confrontational. Man, he had to deal with these friggin' animals. (laughing) But that's not a really a good thing. I mean, yeah, it's very gun hole and very extreme. But the problem is that since you feel that you cannot lose, you restrict yourself to the game that works. For example, I would like fight close guard. I'm stronger than that. But I would resist opening it. Because if I know, if I open, then the guy who is crushing me. - Yeah. - So that's not very good because the match should be at your laboratory where you can lose. You can try new things, they pass. Now work your defense. But these guys would pass and then crush you with their friggin' animals on the face to make a point. So it was like that. But that kept us, as time went on, they got there. - Yeah, do you feel like that kind of culture and mentality, I'm sure it exists with some people in some places now, but do you feel like that mentality has changed? - Yes, yes, it has evolved. Just like juice has evolved and mentality has evolved. It's like, when you see like boxing or keep boxing, people from the stance scream like kill 'em. No kill 'em. If you go to a tournament in jujitsu and scream kill 'em, everyone's gonna jump and you say what's your problem. So yeah, back then it was the kill 'em mentality. And now it's not. - Yeah, I know it's more sport-oriented. - Yeah, yeah. 'Cause we've talked about that, about the difference that we see in jujitsu and the community and the culture of it versus other sports. So that's really interesting that it didn't necessarily use to be that way. - Yeah, that was a big drawing factor for me from boxing is the culture of jujitsu. So I'm glad that it's changed. 'Cause like you said, boxing is a lot like that. It's like killer be killed in the ring. It's still like that. - But it was like that back then for jujitsu. - But it was not good because it made you about one tracked mind fighter. You didn't open yourself to trying new things. - Yeah. - So for example, I remember when my game is the close guard. And I was fighting his huge freaking beast. And he also made close guard and I was attacking and Carlos walked running to me. He looked at me and said, "Open your guard." And I looked at him and said, "Cipro is all." Like, "Yes, Professor." And I didn't open it. (laughing) And he said, "Open your guard." And I said, "Cipro is all." And I stared at him and I didn't open my guard. And then he just like threw his arms up and walked off. And I was thinking, if I open my guard, this freaking animal is just gonna bum rush me and crush me, right? So yeah, you're not here man, you know? Yeah, you're not here. Because he was probably insane. He was like flailing, you know what? He was a bald dude. So he's like bald sweaty head was right on my face. He was going berserk. I was, I was not gonna, I was not gonna open my guard. (laughing) So yeah, and then I submitted him later because I did a battle of attrition, I remember. So I tired him out and then I had to start attacking. And then Carlos came up to me and he told me, I see your style, you use, you wear them down and they'd attack them, that's your strategy. And I went, "Yes," like I was such a genius, but in my head, I was just surviving. (laughing) I was just freaking surviving. And then I would get lucky. (laughing) What I'm doing is very intentional. Back then, were you like one of the smaller guys? Yes, I was the lightest of the advanced guys. Okay. And I was fighting. That makes sense. That's why I know it. His close guard is amazing. You feel my, you feel my biggest favorite existence. Yeah, you had to resort to it. And yeah, you feel my pain, yeah. Speaking, you kind of touched on the battle of attrition, like, do you have any other philosophies that like that you've picked up through your entire career of all martial arts that you kind of stick by? Like anything that is kind of like just how you view your style and how you play the game with Jiu-Jitsu, any other philosophies, battle of attrition is one. Battle of attrition, yeah. Keep moving, keep moving. And when you're in your worst position, move the most. It's not time to take a nap. 'Cause while you're taking a nap, they're planning. Yeah, that's it. And while you're moving, they're consolidating. And while they're consolidating, they're not submitting. So it's when you stop moving with the consolidate and then they will do submission. So yeah, keep moving. Keep your arms tight, your legs tight, but move, man. Don't fall asleep. That's the way they go. Yeah, and for that, you gotta have a good cardio. So train harder, won't be lazy. Yeah, yeah, definitely. I mean, Tracy mentioned, you know, in the last podcast about how that's one thing that you talk about is your diet, how good is your cardio? Are you lifting different stuff like that? So I'm sure all that plays into your game, right? Yeah, you take care of yourself really well. Yes, yes. Because I know I'm gonna pay for it in the mat. Yeah. If I don't like do my, my aerobics after class, because after class, when you guys leave, I put my TV and I do my hit training. Yeah, sometimes before we leave. Yeah. So I'm like jumping there up and down with girls and bikinis. But that's fine. I told the kids they shouldn't come join you sometimes. Yeah, jumping up and down. But it's worth it. It's worth it because in next time when I need to move, I'll just spring up. If I don't do that, you know, you've come heavy and sluggish. That's not the way to go. Yeah, I've always thought I was crazy. You do all these rounds and you roll with everybody in here. You know, like you're not taking the rest rounds and then you do your entire aerobics at the end. I'm like, and sometimes you tell me you lift it before you came in, I'm like, hang, how are you? Are you not sore? It's gonna be good. Well, I lift three days a week and do my aerobics really this. Yeah. Well, I see it training, it's not aerobics. Well, I know. It's not aerobics because you saw the girls I do it, but on the TV, but it's not really. That's really it. Yeah, I've seen it over there. It's like, it's definitely hit that we've got. But no, that's hilarious and really cool though. So when you move from blue to purple to brown, I mean, you're moving through the ranks. Is there anything that you took from, I'm sure there's a lot, like anything in particular that you took from Carlos, like as you move the ranks that maybe you didn't pick up on as a blue and white bell, but it started to become clear at purple and brown that you hadn't quite seen at the earlier ranks? Well, the thing is starting like coming together for like chasing the hip, moving when I'm like, you're resting instead of resting move details. Everything starts clicking in. You know, it's like, you see the matrix, right? You see the matrix? It's like when Neil suddenly sees the code. It just comes together at once. It's not like, you know, you start learning the moves, you listen to your instructor, you know, but there's a certain moment with everything just, you know, clicks together and you see the code. And then you start moving and it's like, it just happens, like a magic. So that's why I tell my students when they start and first are the white belts and they're all cumbersome and they're losing heart because they're not used to it. I'm just wait six months and they'll click together. It's like when you were learning to ride a bike, you were like, you know, wobbly, you're wobbly and maybe your parents are whoever was pushing you, right? Maybe. So they were pushing, but there's a point where they let go and you didn't even know. And you just went and you learned to ride a bike. You just clicked at once and you'll never forget. So it's like that. It's just a moment of realization, you know. Yeah, it just dawns on you. Yeah, that's really interesting. It kind of makes me think of me and Billy went to an open mat on Sunday and we're talking to somebody and there's this phrase, we've never heard of it. I think you looked at it. Oh, I did. You heard of Invisible Jiu Jitsu? Invisible. I've heard the term. Yeah, I don't know much about it. I just wonder if there is anybody else that we talk to you that do you remember what it is? It's kind of like how you described it, but maybe at like a black belt level, you know. I think that you need to step away from, when you go from white to brown, you're stuck in the forms, right? Like I should put my hand here, my hand on the shoulder, hip on the shoulder. You know, I turn this way, step one, step two to three. But I think that the ultimate level of this is like Bruce Lee said, be water, be water, be formless. Just feel, you know, just feel where the position points are. So you're not thinking, I'm gonna put my hand on your hip and my hand on your shoulder. No, you just go directly to the hip and shoulder because that's where the main controls are on the upper body and lower body. You just feel it. You just see the code. You don't have to think anymore. So if they have a butterfly hook, for example, you know to like raise your stance, turn your knee in, crush with your hip, like your pocket and at once, but you just feel it. You don't have to think about it. - Yeah, you understand the mechanics of why you do certain movements versus like, I have to follow step one, two, three that I was taught. - Exactly. you can connect it all together and say based on all these things I've learned, I can deduce in this situation, this is the right thing for me to do. I don't have that yet. Yes, at first you need a plan, right? So if I'm going to use like this, take down and it fails, I'm going to use that other take down and then I'm going to pass the guard this way and it fails, that way I'm going to use this guard pass, everything by the book, right? But it becomes like really structured. So if you're number one fails and then you're number two fails and number three fails, you don't have a number four, then you'll be fretting instead of just flowing with it, right? So first it's good to have a plan, but later you don't need a plan anymore. Yeah, I'm curious what it was like back whenever what was the class structure like it calls Carlos's gym like in the early days. It was the same was here. It was exactly. Yeah. So do you feel like that is informed because I've been curious before just being at other gyms, you know, sometimes people do warm-ups or whatever and then there's the infamous one-two clap that we have not done here until recently. We didn't have the one-two clap back in the day in a fairly recent thing. Yeah. Yeah. But it's picked up and now I'm doing it too because you know the master does it who am I to not do it? Right. Everyone loves to clap. So we're doing the clap and learning to do the one-two clap. The warm-ups we had very few warm-ups and I have zero warm-ups. So because I think that it's for the kids yes because the kids are not going to be doing push-ups at home or sit-ups at home. They just won't, right? They don't want it. They want to play in just turtles on their Nintendo games like you, like you know. But adults, wear adults and we're responsible to do our push-ups, your cardio, your lifting, everything on your own time. Exactly. Your own time. Oh, yeah, you do that all the time, don't you? Do it. Catch me at home doing my push-ups. You're going to do it because it translates to it next day. You have something you don't. I know. But if you feel the class with warm-ups, that to me is just filler. It's a waste of time. You're responsible for your own body. At that time that you're filling up with warm-ups, you could be filling up with techniques. My time as a human being, as we know it now, it's limited. So I want to squeeze my brain. If I could like take a cable and upload my all my information into your cerebral cortex, I would, right? But I don't, I can't do that right now. So I try to fill as much of the class with techniques. So I can pass you my all my knowledge. And if I can pass you my style, you can make my style yours and expand on it and digest it and make it your style. Then I have succeeded. So that's why I try to teach as much of technique as I can in that one hour. And we do technique. And not fill it with like fluff, like sit up some push-ups and you know, and shrimping. It goes shrimp at home. Yeah. Do some shrimps and eat some shrimp. Yeah, eat the protein. So what about like the new, it's kind of a new wave. We've been experimenting without the gym, the ecological approach, like kind of doing mini games that are very specific to the technique or to a position. Like what's your view on that? Have you been liking that? You think the results are pretty good when we've been doing it at gym? You know, I like it because there's some people who are lazy, man. And they like, they will roll two rounds and just jet. And no matter what you tell them, they will keep doing it. I can tell them, you know, you got to roll more and get your cardio up, man, because you're looking kind of crappy. So you need to roll more. I mean, if you want to roll two times today, three tomorrow and keep pushing that wall, hit that wall until you're dead tired. And next time one, you can go one more, right? But people like refuse. So these eco-drills are good because it forces them to like at least get some rolling in, even if it's just like situational. And these are getting some cardio in which translates. And also they get to like perform the moves in a life scenario, which you know, so they'll remember better. So I really like it. If I didn't like it, I wouldn't incorporate it. Yeah. Yeah, I've been enjoying it. I like doing it a lot. Now I'm moving on. So you get your brown bell, you get to your black bell. Yeah. What was that was there a big ceremony? Like what happened? What was it like when you got your black bell under Carlos? Well, my dad flew in. Yeah. And that flew in from Peru. And it was very emotional. I had to talk and I dedicated the belt to my dad. He got very emotional. Yeah, very much. He passed away in 2015. So when he passed away and we buried him, I put my ghee and my belt on his conference in the world. So it was he took a part of me. Yeah, for sure. You know what I'm saying? But he loved me very much. But he came over all the way from Peru and I dedicated it to him. And even Carlos said that I was very emotional. Yeah. Moment. So did he trim it all? Is it any time that any turning all year? My dad did some jewel back home. He got like to brown bell or something. Oh really? It's still comfortable. But he was something. Yeah, for sure. Yeah. So it was funny. I went with Seth. I took Seth to Peru. And he was like he was like eight years old. But he'd be he'd be training with me since he was like three years old. Yeah. Maybe even less because we like wrestle around, right? So setting my son by the way. And my dad was like, okay, let's see what you got. And Seth put him on a triangle. And he was choking my dad. I was like, let go. Let go. Let go of your grandpa. Man. Let go of your I want to kill him. He was like, he was 30 purple. The old man who was 35. I had to pray the kid off. Oh my god. Yeah. Oh, that's hilarious. Oh, Seth. I'm going to try and go that's hilarious. Yeah. Oh, man. So I guess it was a pretty big ceremony. I mean, based off what you said, huge ceremony. Your dad flies in. Yeah. Then what does it look like after that? Did you you said you wanted to be like the master splinters, right? Of of Jiu Jitsu and of of your own school. Yes. So did you immediately branch off and start looking to do your own thing? No, I stuck around like a couple of years still training with him. And then I talk, I talk Carlos. I went to open my own school. So he told me you're great. You're not great. And so I entered an affiliation with him. And of course, I moved as far as I could from him. So I wouldn't step on his toes, right? I wouldn't step on his toes. So, and that's it. But I came, I always went to visit him and train with him once a week and still do. I go every Thursday and I train with him every Thursday. Yeah. Unless he's on a seminar or whatever. But if he's on a seminar, I'm there. Yeah. Wow. I didn't know you went that frequently. Yeah. Every Thursday, I'm there. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. I didn't know that till like maybe six months ago. I was like, and every time I go, I learn something new. Yeah. Yeah. He like improves my game every time. We go for the little details and it's like a small class like some black belts and me and he like pays attention to my game. He like improves me every time. He finds like little things that I can just improve. So yeah. He's like, the man, I always said about Carlos. He doesn't do juice. He does magic. Yeah. The guy is a wizard. The guy is a wizard. How did you say that? Man, like I can't get my little jujitsu brain can't even compute someone teaching you something. I know. Same. I feel like that's one thing Tracy said in the episode is like you always have an answer, a good answer for every question we have. And she made the comment like, and if you don't have one right away, you will have one. You know, if I am, if I am an artificial intelligence, he's artificial super intelligent. Yeah. He's like way. Yeah. That's crazy to even imagine. That's really cool. I love him with all my heart. And I hold him in such admiration. Yeah. He's the best. Yeah. Carlos is the best. Yeah. And that's awesome. That's, I mean, to have someone that you look up to that much that is like really transformed and molded you is like super special. Yeah. After after my dad, he's been a father to me. Yeah. And I spent one-on-one like if we add all the moments and like all the hours, I spend with him one-on-one. I probably spend more time with him than my own dad. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. That's that much. Yeah. For sure. So I hold him in a really, really high regard. Not only in Jusu, but he's taught me about life, about life, and he's given me purpose. Yeah. And yeah, I admire him so much. Master Carlos is the boss. Yeah. For sure. Yeah. It was cool having him here whenever into the seminar here. That was really cool. So you, that's takes us into like you get your two years in from getting your black belt. You get your own school. So what are those first few years like? I mean, I got some friends that are recently new to owning a gym. Like, oh, kind of difficulties. We're there about kind of crazy stories. We're there. I'm sure there's some, the gym invasions. The gym invasions. That was like dough just for me. Yeah. We were gay guys in the white belts that come in, you know, and like trail like roll with me hard. And like, and I remember one told me, I wanted to go all out with me. And that's why I went all out and put them on his head, right? And then he like walked off the mat and outside the school and I was like, what the heck? Then he walked back in and he told me, no one has ever beaten me like that ever. And then he walked out again, never came back. And then I saw him in a tournament and he was a brown belt. No. Yeah. He put on a white belt just a, yes, that's crazy. And I was like, dude, yeah. I had also purples and the brown belts come in. Oh my goodness. Can you tell when they're not actually white belts? Can you tell when a guy is like five years more experienced than a white belt? - Oh, I know. (laughs) - For sure. - That's fair. - But yeah, but that hasn't happened after like, after I began to establish. But at the beginning, yeah, it happens all the time. New schools, with new instructors, especially when they're young, oh man, they want to prove themselves. - I think they still do that, how do you think? - I don't know. - But yeah, they, yeah. Probably, but then they were just disgusting about it. They would just wear a white belt and not say anything. - Yeah. - And just come in. I had you look, I still do that too. - Really? - Yeah. - And then later, tell me, yeah, I'm a black girl and you don't listen to that. (laughs) - It was, this test of year. - That's okay, okay. - So, yeah, that's pretty crazy. Those first few years, I mean, was it, were there some like growing pans with getting numbers in? Or was it like, you just put a sign up, people just start coming? - No, back in the day, we have to have the versus the yellow pages. There was no social media. So it was a pain. - Yeah. People, like, I had like this inflatable animals for the kids to play like, well, 'cause I put this like obstacle course, like, I mean, labyrinths with like blocks. Now we use blocks and like inclines and I put plush animals as the danger things. But back in the, it was the prototype days where I was testing my ideas. So I started with inflatable animals. So the place looked like a pool supply sticker. - Yes, we heard. (laughs) - It looked like a pool supply. And then the animals would just die and they were patching them. So it was like this for the birds, man. So they just freaking ridiculous. So then we moved into the plush animals. And the plush animals were explode because the kids just rip 'em. So I tried dog toys and that works much better. 'Cause they have, they resist more. - Yeah. - And they look good, you know? - Yeah. - Did you have a lot of experience with kids classes when you were training under Carlos Machado or was that like brand new when you started a school and figuring out how are we gonna do this? - Yeah, Carlos hated the kids classes. He didn't wanna do it. So he asked me to do it. But I couldn't do it at the time because during the, during the mornings I would go to Vince Tamura. And after that, I would teach in a place called Jim Kits. - Okay. - Jim Kits in your flower mound. And we were three. Actually, one, one was Rob Abel's who has no school, the Marcel Garcia. He was him, he was me. And the, the program director was a Taekwondo woman which was, she was great. I learned a lot from her. And there was that judo guy also. And the classes were immense. The first, it was a huge place. And the first, first floor was gymnastics. Sigma floor was the martial arts. - Okay. - And that's where they had all this gymnastics equipment. All right. So the woman made like stations with the gymnastics equipment. Something is, I came from a traditional school where traditional martial arts were you like, you sort of like a hardwood floor and hitting the, hitting the Machiwara, which is that you know, like the wind poles and stuff. So it was like hard stuff. But she was using the gymnastics stuff. And like, making her stations and like giving them like team names. And that like blew my mind. It was like, and so I started thinking about that. And then I thought, man, what if we make like an adventure? Make it an adventure. And they make it like a maze with all this equipment. And that's not enough. So I started thinking, what if we get like any electronics? We're like, any sorts of stuff. I started just like, you know, pipe dream, right? - Very big, yeah. - But what is the, has to explain to me obviously. So what is the second best? Use, I don't know, inflamed walls or plush animals. So we didn't do that then, but my mind was already working and those, you know. And in every school, every school, how you maintain a school is with the kids classes. Adults, you know, keep the lights on everything. But if you want to survive, you need the kids. And for the kids to stay, they got to like it, you know. So and kids don't think like adults. They think like kids, right? So if you teach the class again, like for adults, they don't go, they're kind of bored. And listen, out of 10 kids, two are gonna hold and want to like, you know, compete and they die it. But this is two out of 10, like her daughter. She's like, those, she's special. She has a warrior spirit and she wants to go. But for one of that, you got nine that don't. - Oh, right. - Because you want to go play Ninja Turtles and the Nintendo. - Exactly. (laughing) So you got to appeal to them. - Yeah. - Like a game, like an adventure where they look at that. And then you sneak in the Jujutsu. And then the Jutsu, like Tracy teaches, like, you know, like Champwood, like the shark and stuff. Instead of telling them to grab his wrist, you know. No, the shark, the shark chomps the fish, right? Stuff like that. And it keeps, it keeps them thinking, these kids thinking cartoons, when you grow older, you become more practical, more cold, you know. But kids live in fantasy, in a fantasy world, and something that we should not lose. - Right. - Because, you know, imagination is so important. And that's how you make your new moves and you have to be imagination. But that's the best for me to teach the kids and to get them engaged and for them to like it. If not, they're going to be, you know, bribing their chauffeur to make them run in the park. - To let them run out of the park and roll in the dirt. - Exactly. (laughing) You're gonna make that appealing. - Yes. - And yeah, so you get your kids' program of stylish, you come up with some really cool ideas. What about your adult program? I mean, you studied and kind of stayed the same. Was there any small adjustments that you made as you own the school and maybe you went from one location to the next? - I kept it as close to as Carlos started. - Yeah. - But as Carlos started back in the day. - Yeah. - Yeah. - Like I said, I was raising traditional martial arts. And I like to keep it traditional. You see, I don't even wear a rash card. Because back in the day, we didn't wear a rash card. - Yeah. - So like a fuse, right? Even when I go to Carlos, he's policies to wear a rash card. And I'm sneaking by right now. I'm sneaking by, you know, I know one day he's gonna-- - Tell you this. - He's gonna lay the law one day. But I run out and sneaking by and I'm not wearing a rash card. So I hope he doesn't listen to this. (laughing) Watch others part out. - Yeah. - Yeah, edit, edit. But yeah, I keep it very traditional, like they always. And I think I learned well that way. And I think it's worth it. - Mm-hmm. - And I have a suggestion box. As you can see. - I do. - I have a suggestion box that says, "Are you not entertained?" I have a gladiator. "Are you not entertained?" So if I urge everyone, if they don't want to, like, if they're shy about telling me, just put the thing, I want to look at the cameras. I want to look at the cameras. It's anonymous, I promise. And just put your suggestion. And if he's a good suggestion, I'll follow it. I mean, I'm open to change my ways. If, you know, if he's good, I'm not stubborn either. - Yeah, yeah. - Like for some of the eco-drill. - Mm-hmm. - Yeah. - Look at the clapping. It refused for a long time. - I know. - But you know what? Get on with it. Times over. - Yeah. - All right. - Yeah. - Open up for his birthday. I'm gonna get my rash guard. - I know. - But we're like a bandad. - A rash guard with my face on it. Like one of the kids, Dane, he has a rash guard that he got that has me on the back. Flexing has Darion on the front. It's hilarious. - That's pretty crazy, but no, that is really funny. - No, I mean, I used to not wear rash guard for a long time either, 'cause I just hated having the rash guard on. I wasn't used to it. - But then you would come home and complain about like, Gebert on your scale. - Yeah, yeah. - And I'm like, that's why you wear a rash guard. - Yeah, no, you also get really hot. - You just get hot, it's like, it's just hot. - Yeah, I mean. - I'm just used to it. - Yeah. I'm curious about what your mentality of what you thought a black belt was as a white belt versus what you think of a black belt? - Oh God, like how different. - I'm going over there. - Yeah, especially now, 'cause you're-- - Touchable. - Yeah. - Such a high, like, expectation and wanting to be a master splinter. - You know, you know, it's Kung Fu Moys where the master wear the eyebrows. - Yeah, I feel bad. - Like you build a Py-main from Ghibel. Untouchable, the touch of death. He looks at you, you're dead. That was a black belt to me. - Yeah. - Really? - Wow. - It's back then we didn't have a much black belt, see that. You know, we were all like, oh, white belts, or when we first got our first purple, we were just like, wow, man, we have a purple. Yeah, it was Carlos and us. - Wow. - So yeah. - So what about your view now of a black belt? What does it mean to you to see a black belt, another black belt? - There's black belts and black belts. - Yeah. - There's black belts and black belts, yeah. - Yeah. - Do you feel like you are now a master splinter? Have you achieved master splinter status? - I walk like master splinter. (laughing) - You're my team. - You know what? You're like master splinter, dude. (laughing) - And you definitely hold a roll like master splinter. - No, you do not. - Oh my gosh, that actually kind of brings me to another thing I'm curious about. Like, I mean, around the gym, I feel like you're very known for your pressure. Like you have insane pressure. Do you feel like the pressure that you use in your technique is it more of technique? Is it like a full lot, how do I put it? - Like a psychological aspect. Where you're just trying to physically, like you said, the battle of attrition, like physically pressure them down to the ground, or they just not. - You haven't trained with master Carlos, have you? - I got to roll with him now. - That's his stuff. That's all the pressure. Follow the hip, control the shoulders. The shoulders are the hips of the arms. And the hips are the shoulders of the legs. (laughing) - Yeah. - So yeah. those two points and you got the guy done and now if you just put that bonus of moving their head around you got the fight one but his game is pressure passing and I studied it and studied it and I just absorbed it yeah I'm also gonna say the things to dissect your instructors style but not copy it because because the copy will never be as good as the original pressure yeah because you have your own like body type your own upbringing your own strengths and your own weaknesses you know and if you copy the guy yeah you can be a good copy but you'll never be what he is you never be an equal yeah so you have to make your own style according to your own body type and your own movements yeah so that's the thing I remember one guy training back back in the day a guy from out of town came in was training with us and he told me everyone like fights like Carlos but you fight differently because I made it a point to like adapt to adapt so that's my philosophy on like copy don't copy you know just absorb the technique digest it and make it yours your own style yeah but that comes at a later later later belts you should be a brown belt you're already creating your own style yeah man I mean I mean the I've told my friends and like my cousins come and crush in here a few times that rolling with you reminds me of like if I if I was rolling with a boulder and a ballerina all in one that's like the master feels like is it feels like you really are dancing around me but at the same time I mean crushed the entire time yeah like the amount of yeah I mean I mean I know when we roll I'm like this is about to get intense because it's always a really hard I love it you just describe how it feels like all my juicer career rolling with with a master that's exactly how I would describe it exactly yeah wow it's like a boulder coming at you it's like you feel like Indiana Jones with like boulder coming at you but there's no escape so you just put your hands up like this and it's like a coyote with the umbrella the big boulder for you yeah same deal you just waiting for it to happen I mean you can see it but you can't stop it yeah that's how it feels yeah so now that you've been teaching for so long like you wanted to become the master but now you I mean you're I'm not a master yeah I'm not a master yet like thank you for everything but I don't think I've achieved it yeah there's still a lot of room to grow yeah I mean that's one thing we talked about Tracy's I don't I don't think you can ever master do you do too especially the way it keeps changing yes do you find you can become a master of your style right and that's what I admire Carlos so much because he has master style yeah or nobody can quite teach the details and stuff that he knows on the way the game he plays yeah for sure I can totally see that yeah but you know in the sense of what you and Tracy are talking about like you'll never know at all like you'll never know no no and whoever tells you that is lying to you for sure he's a fraudster no you can't no yeah and and and you know I lose respect for for teachers that you ask them a question and they try to BS you around and teach you something totally ineffective I respect them all to tell you you know what I don't know yeah but you know what let's find out together and then you start drilling and deconstructing for example I've I've students that bring me stuff from YouTube it's just crazy crap monkey monkey doing backflips cannot do this yeah yeah and they tell me okay what do you do how do you do this let's look at the video together right let's look at the video together and how do you defend I don't freaking know man you know and let's let's look at the video and let deconstruct the position and once you start breaking apart because you know that the movie is like building Legos you know how do you you know break the Lego apart you do this assemble you and start the same thing you learn the move and then to counter you the uninstall it so you know but if I told the guy show me the video or tell me how you do it I'm like yeah this way and it's completely wrong you know I would lose all respect for from the structure and I've seen it happen and it's just off yeah yeah yeah if you don't know you don't know yeah you know and learn it yeah learn it and get with your student and work on it together and that's more respectful anyways yes way more respect that one and that creates more of a bond with your students yeah yeah and your soul will respect like yeah we respect you more for it the line you know be honest yeah you were going to say something a second ago remember no well I have a question you've competed you coach and you've had your own and you have your own gym so I think we kind of already know where you kind of land in this but like where do you feel like you have your fire of those three like a gym owner the coach or the athlete the competes like where do you feel like you find like your most you find yourself yeah most fulfillment yeah I think I'm a great competitor and do you think it's change of the years like where you know he says the competitor since day one to where you're at now no because my opponent has not changed yeah because how I don't compete with other people I compete with myself yeah right so this is how it works I mentally I create a clone of myself mentally so I say for example me three months ago a complete clone if I fought him right now me of three months ago who will win you know if I say if I'm honest I'm like man I'm getting some weight I'm not training that guy would beat me yeah I need to get better but if I can confidently say I will beat him I will beat myself from three months ago it's going okay yeah so competition with other people it's good you know it gets you better and everything but those people you cannot continue measuring yourself with other people because things happen they can get an injury yeah they can stop training or you can stop training but or they can suddenly get much better you know yeah but it's better if you like test yourself with yourself is that a point it will always be around and it will it will keep you straight you know it will always is the measuring bar that you want to keep around yeah yeah it's interesting here you say that just knowing that Tracy's been you know learning from you this whole time and I feel like I hear that comment from her all the time yeah or like about other people too she'll be like you six months ago like you would you would kill you're the version of you from six months ago so it's cool to hear um yeah so you might see yourself very much as a competitor but it's so clear and obvious um what a good teacher you are as well and how like you're stealing that and you're seeing the blueprint of Roberto on Tracy I see Tracy in Roberto's blueprint on you I know like I get fat I'll I'll be rolling and I'll do something and somebody I'll be like oh that had Tracy written all over it so so like I said so competition is a big deal for me but competition myself it's a big deal that's why I hit the gym and I hit the the the the hit training and rolling and everything uh because I want to be better than myself yeah yeah I don't pick some some dude like a black belt from a Carlos I want to be beat him beat him and then tomorrow he gets hit by a truck yeah where where the my measuring stick went yeah stupid you know but I'm always around yeah I'm always around and I'm always there you know and I like to teach by example so I roll my students and I'm always in shape they never ever see me out of shape never and that's something I'm proud of and you know the way to teach you through example yeah for example definitely yeah I will never ask my students to do something I can't do yeah never so yeah if I can't do a move I'm not going to ask them to do it yeah I need to do them good you know if I'm not going to ask a guy to get in shape when I'm I can't even see my belt because my god is hanging over it yeah you know no no that's unacceptable yeah yeah yeah it says a lot I mean as a leader too I mean it's important you know of course and throughout your whole career of doing jujitsu you know someone who's been as dedicated anybody who's dedicated to the sport that they're in there's always going to be ups and downs anytime that you went through and you know any ups and downs you've ever has there ever been a moment where you felt like quitting or like hanging over never never never never the thing is this but if you don't have the mentality you will feel like the climb for jujitsu is just like a it's like a little roller coaster right you start climbing you start going up up up up and then you you hit a plateau okay so you go straight along and then you hit in the blow and you get depressed because you're not advancing so you start going down all right and then you you like gather your thoughts and gather your nerves and say no this cannot be happening so you you train more you study more you work out more you you diet better and you start going up again yeah and then you hit a plateau and then you get depressed and start going down and you get you put extra effort and you go up again yeah and then the plateau and like that but it's always an upward climb but with that little downward slope sometimes yeah yeah but when you are aware of the pattern you don't despair yeah but if you get caught in the in the downward depression then you say then you say all everything is lost it sucks I'm gonna quit yeah no no no that's the time to shoot straight up by changing something yeah something is not working so that's that's when you have to like look back and look at the clone of yourself what was working three months ago that you were in the steady climb yeah oh I was lifting more I stopped lifting because you know I stopped lifting no I've got to go back to lifting and lift a heavier, you know, or get more reps in or lift the same and start researching more. And once you're aware of that little pattern, like I said, the spirit does not sit in. Yeah. Yeah. I agree with that 100%. I think it's easier when you come to that point where you realize like it's going to go like this a little bit. And when you accept that, then you can take the little dips in stride and you keep going about. I mean, patience and discipline. What do you think in all the belt colors that someone kind of figures that out in your experience? Like, where people, I feel like I've figured that out like kind of introspective and I'm just a blue belt. I'm not even very far along. And I feel like, and that's not necessarily outside of my jujitsu game, like, but what I found in the beginning, I would hit those plateaus. And a lot of times it'd be like I'm trying a particular like a guard that I'm like trying to get better at and everyone's figured it out at the gym. So they're killing it. And like, I start to get bored like frustrated, you know. So then it forces me to change it up. And so I learned that pattern that of constantly changing and which added to my game and made me grow. Do you feel like that's something that happens pretty quick as a blue belt? Or is this something that usually happens later or is it just like sporadic for everybody? I mean, you hear a blue belt. The thing is that the hardest belt to break is the blue belt. That's why everyone quits, right? The purple, the brown. Blue. That's the hardest one to crack. That's why most people have done it because they don't recognize that. Yeah. Or they either, they feel like they've accomplished their self-defense goals. Yeah. I know enough to fight in the gas station. Yeah. I got out of my belt. Yeah. I'm a superhero up there, so I got enough. Yeah. But the other guy said that it's not enough. Now you've got to perfect the art. Now you don't do it just to get enough fight out there. Is this ridiculous. Yeah. Somebody out there is beating on a child if you fight another trained person. It's ridiculous and unfair. But now you're training to fight guys that are in this, in what we do. And yes, blue belt is the breaking point for many people. If you decide for that a blue belt, you'll be okay. If you crack blue belt, you'll be okay. Yeah. There's a less chance you'll quit. But this blue belt is the make or break for everybody. Yeah. Well, I mean, I think maybe part of that goes to your whole philosophy about competition with self. Like what is your actual motive for doing it in the first place? And if your motive is to learn and progress and do better and be better than you were yesterday a week ago, a month ago, a year ago, then, you know, that's enough to keep pushing through. Blue belt is the edge lord belt where they like were, well, back in the day, they were all this bad boy patches. Yes. Yeah, and then like the tap out gear, you know, bad for the sport, you know, and everyone's like, you know, everyone's like such a mature man, you know, fight, fight, fight. But that's where people lose hope too, like, you know, you know, they burn real fast. Yeah. They're like a match. They're not a steady flame. But if you make it and if you realize what you realized, you make it to black or you fail a blue one. Yeah, I literally cannot see myself quitting. I'm the type of personality I am as I, I don't have hop, I don't have little hobbies. I have full on dedication for many, many, many years. And I think you'll be okay. Yeah. I've only had three things I've ever been that obsessed with. Yeah. And this is, I did all those for a very, very long time. Being pulled up a chair and get comfortable because it's like, oh man, this is a right, man. Definitely not backing out. So that kind of makes me think like when you have a student that is earning their black belt and it's, they put in their time to obtain the skill, the skill and it's time for their black, what are, what are some things that you kind of hope that you bring them through all the years of training with you on the mat and off the mat like what are the things that you hope that you've passed on and have taken with them since discipline, dedication, stay fit, pass my teachings to others which is also very selfish of me because I have this notion of wanting to live forever. So I know I'm not immortal, but my style is so, so as long as my style is passed to you and you make it part of your style, I will live in you and your students forever, right? So I want that. So I get something out of it too, I'm profitable. So yeah, I live through all of you and that's important to me. Now how is used, my style is important too, you go, my name on your back man, you know, so yeah, reputation upholds, yeah, that's why it's so important for me and the kids and everyone that competes when we go and we compete, it's like you are representing our gym, I have the conversation with our kids all the time. I mean, you can be here or go to China or wherever or at Timbuktu and the first thing people will ask you when you tell them I do Jesus is who is your instructor, who is your master? And then if you do crappy, they say your master sucks and that's can't be, no, 100%. I mean, I can only imagine, you know, I'm trying to put it into my shoes, fit into your shoes and like someone talking bad about my Jiu Jitsu, you don't want that to reflect badly at all and you're like, it's a different perspective, I haven't really thought of, I mean I thought about it a little bit, but as I'm sitting here really thinking about it, like you put all this time and effort into people you know and you hope that they can go out and display the highest level that you showed them, you know? As much as they can display, because some people have a lot of like their own weaknesses, you know, and you can't expect all of them to be a Mr. Marker super, you know, no, you can't like explain them to be like, oh, buff, you know, taking down people and putting them on their heads, some people just don't have that, but they do have the dedication of making it all the way to Blackbelts, you know, so they have, they put in the time, they put the effort, the blood, certain tears, the injuries and everything, but they're not as good as you would like them to be, but they're as good as they can be, they themselves and that matters, because they beat their own, their own clone, you know, they're being their own person, their own weaknesses, and that is a huge part of the Institute tool, they'll point it in front of you, they'll point it within, and they conquer themselves, that is Blackbelts material for them, you know, so yeah. Yeah, no, I agree with that for sure, yeah, everyone's different and has their own inner struggles to fight through, you know, that's why when Brownbelts are going to be Blackbelts, I usually give them a test, for example, if they're overweight, lose weight, it's not as easy, man, some people have been overweight for their lives, but they do it, improve, like some people, maybe they're good, take down artists, they pass everything, okay, now I want you to improve your open guard, and they're like holy crap, you know, so yeah, they're not going to be Blackbelts until, I'm not going to tell me, you know what, you've got to be champion of IBJJF, like worlds, some people don't want to do it and don't have it in them, but I make them improve their weakness, so they have to break their own mold, and yeah, that's a good test that I set up on my students, yeah, well we're kind of at the back end of the story, you know, you've owned a gym for a while now and it kind of leads us to here, where we're at now on Keller, what kind of, like what is the future hold for you, what do you think, what do you, what do you hope that the future brings for your school, you know, whether it be just more members, new people, new relationships, anything on the horizon that you're looking forward to, I want to keep the future, I want to keep the nature of the school as it is, yeah, I think we have a great, like culture, yes, a great culture, everyone is helpful to each other, we don't have those ladders and like, you know, bad feelings and bad intentions, and everyone helps each other, you know, people ask questions, you know, in the upper belt's help, that's the nature I want to ferment here, I don't want, you know, ultimate fighters just walking down the hallways, shoulder bumping people, you know, no, that's not it, you know, we're a team, and this is our laboratory, here's where we're going to test our techniques so we can use them outside in tournaments, or mainly in the street, or wherever, yeah, but we need to have that culture that is, you know, very, very strong, yeah, yeah, that's really good, I like that, and then just kind of finish it off, a couple of little things, I'm curious, do you have any hot takes, we may have already touched on one, yeah, the, the, mainly one of the controversial ones is the warm-ups, the warm-ups, I'm strongly against warm-ups, yeah, yeah, but I think that makes sense, hearing all of the other things that you've said, because you place a lot of priority and emphasis on like personal accountability, for doing your part, so I mean that, that makes perfect sense for you to say that you take your own personal responsibility for your physical upkeep and well-being and the things that you need to do to be in shape to come here in the world. learn. I'm here to teach your armors not to push it to do burpees. Yeah. Yes, I mean it makes sense having heard all of the other things you've had to say. Yeah well to finish off I'm gonna give you like spit off some quickfire questions and you just like whatever comes your mind I grab off the bat it's kind of gonna kind of be like either or thing I'm gonna say so like for instance to start off I'd say gear no ghee ghee okay close guard or open guard close guard arm bars or chokes arm bars rash guard or no rash guard all right um leg locks or upper body submissions I guess well depends what you have yeah he'll hooks or arm bars depends what they give you so it depends it depends it's what you do now or uh back control no now over back control I think I have to perform back I know I know you would my pull it a lot but I just feel like with the bigger guys I it's so much harder for me to keep stay on top because it's been fresh of me so if I get to where they have zero weapons and I'm behind them you just gotta get you just gotta life to more like Roberto he was teeny tiny and now he's not anymore when he one day many many years from now when I get my black belt from Roberto he's in the set you gotta lift more you gotta go lift more that's how you get good but yeah about the the mount thing yeah like Russell Crowe said in the gladiator I like to see it look at my enemy so no the things I was really light but when I open my school I had these freaking monsters coming in and I was getting injured yeah so they were training hard I mean I will train harder Carlos but I kept myself light for competition and I still get hurt but once I opened my school I wasn't competing as much and these monsters were like hurting man I will get like football players you know like coming in and they're immense I'm five eight man so you know so these huge dudes were coming and yeah I will train everything but I will go home feeling it yeah but when I get and I say I'm just too light because they were like grabbing ragdome and yeah I would have to spring back like a freaking jaguar yeah but I really took the hit yeah but when I gained some weight yeah I feel different really that's kind of how I feel I mean I feel like one day eventually I'm gonna have to put on some muscle I just don't live lifting I mean if you're competing actively at your weight it's understandable yeah but if you're not competing as much gain some weight and you feel the difference yeah in your less you have more control too a lot of your story of being small and then when you own a gym it's some I would like to one day own my own gym as well and I will fall in that same category you're gonna feel it that too yeah I'm gonna have to live you know so yes you have to like train with the big dudes every single day and go home like you're looking your own wounds man and you're like next day you're gonna do it again and again and they only have one speed because they all want to prove to you how tough they are by beating you yeah because you have some dudes the bad thing is this you got some guys that they don't want to learn from you they want to beat you yeah yeah yeah so I mean I love the students I want to learn from me but I know some just I shoot to like prove themselves beat me yeah so and when they go hard yeah so if I'm like you gotta break me yeah yeah yeah yeah for sure I saw you pick I'm not kidding the time I saw you pick up L-Rick from close guard twice in a row man that man is so huge and you just lifted him fell and went back to your knees understandably because he's a giant and then you stood back up with him and broke his close guard I was like God was nuts yeah that was crazy yeah do that yeah and it's the best way to pass guards bring him right up yeah stand up right just like you got legs yeah the best way to pass guard standing up yeah so yeah start doing your your squats man well on that note Roberto I appreciate you for allowing us to have you on the podcast is there's been great really truly so guys that is what's the ways in I'm Wesley I'm Bailey and we'll go right here Roberto and again we appreciate it. Thank you Roberto