Remembering our daughter, the due date & our first marriage conference

Thank you to Quince for sponsoring this portion of today's episode. Let me tell you the seasons are changing. It's starting to be time that we can get out our denims again. We can get out our sweaters and there is no better place than Quince. So many of the things I'm constantly reaching for in my closet to layer up, dress up, dress down, come from Quince because they have very, very high quality products. I'm talking 100% Mongolian cashmere. They have silk organic cotton wool. They have those premium fabrics, but at an amazing price. Everything at Quince is actually priced 50 to 80% less than similar brands and that is because they work directly with ethical factories, hunting out the middle man. So you're paying for high quality, not brand markup. Actually just last night Matt was telling me that he grabbed his shorts. I don't fit my clothes up and hitting the gym and so I need new clothes. He bought me Quince swim trunks that are really high quality. I wear them all the time when we go on the pool with the boys. I'm excited to see what she picks out from Quince for me next. Your nice khaki shorts are from Quince. With the khaki that I wear like literally every day. Yep. Those are from Quince. You don't even know where your clothes are from, but if you had to guess they're probably from Quince because I love shopping their min section as well for Matt. You can wear them in many different ways for many different seasons. Find your next fall favorites at Quince. Download the Quince app for app exclusive offers or go to Quince.com. Get free shipping on your order and 365 day returns now available in Canada and the UK too. And when Quince asks you where you heard about them, let them know that unplanned sent you. It's the best way to support the show. Her memory comes with us everywhere. There's reminders of her everywhere. Parts of like the day that we met her ought to be still. Doesn't get easier. Part of the meeting making for me has been talking about it publicly. This has been very healing for me. Anyone that's sick of hearing about it like move on it's not for you. That kind of was still hanging on to like this separate life where I was like still pregnant. We were going to announce her name on her birthday and stuff. And so now that we've passed that date, like it's okay in my mind. I mean I don't care if you keep it private. What's up dudes? And welcome back to unplanned. Here we are again. We're back guys. On the blue couch. And you guys are still here. Thanks for being here still. We've been doing this for three years. I can't believe that. And especially thank you to those of you that are choosing to give us a good rating and review. Yeah. The people that are still leaving reviews on Apple podcast and Spotify and commenting on YouTube. It's still really important. And like I said on always here, if you don't listen always here, which you probably should. It comes out in Friday mornings. So you have plenty of time between Wednesday and Friday to listen to both of them. But what I say is that it doesn't just like benefit Matt and I. There's like a whole team working on putting these shows up and they're closely following how these episodes perform, how you guys are proceeding. And so for them to like I really appreciate you engaging in that way with our content. And I'm especially wanting to shout out Hannah Vick today. She gave us five stars, which was so kind. So generous. And I love this podcast. This is my comfort podcast, whether I'm working out, getting some work done at home. I love listening to this couple. As a young wife, I love hearing the authenticity and realness. Thank you for everyone that left nice reviews. That means a lot. Well, here we are. Here we are. We're married. Word. We're still married. We're still married. Why? I don't know why big help. Try that again. Well, we're married. You leave the episode. We plan our episodes. Matt just asked to act awkward. Okay. Valentine's Day weekend was recently a weekend. Wow, that feels like a while ago, but it really wasn't that long ago. We went to Nashville for Valentine's Day. We went for an interview for this show. And then also we stayed a little bit later to attend the money and marriage conference with the Ramsey Solutions company. And we were the youngest people there. Yeah, I think we were. I don't think there there probably wasn't a couple. Maybe there wasn't. There could have been a couple younger than us. They took really good care of us. They put us in like the platinum. It was nicer than VIP. They put us in platinum. They had amazing snacks for us. Really good food and drinks. I was a little worried about my attention span. Oh, really? Yeah, I started to get antsy sitting still for so long. I felt my whole days. I never sit down. Do you understand this? This is the longest I've ever sit down in my days if we're happening to be recording a podcast that day. That's true. My butt is never in a chair that long. Well, I felt bad because we were really close to this stage. And I take notes for everything on my phone. And then I would also get distracted and respond to messages, you know, over email or work messages. And then I'm like, I need to be better about like not doing that. No, I feel like we got some good stuff out of it though. Some good takeaways. There's a lot of a lot of great teachings that we learned while we were there. Yeah, what was your favorite? I think the one and this is I'm kind of stealing this from you. But what I choose to tell my story. The story I choose to my story that I choose to tell myself is. The story I'm choosing to tell myself is which like anytime you're having a conflict in your marriage anytime there's anything that's like splitting you apart, you need to acknowledge this story that you're telling yourself, right? Acknowledge the part that you're bringing to the table. Because oftentimes, I think in conflict, it's easy to point fingers at the other person rather than say the story that I'm choosing to tell myself is like. Well, I think the other thing too, like that's all true. And that was a good point you made. But also in like I think about in our premiere, what? I think about in our pre-marital counseling, our counselor told us that the issue is not the issue. Yes. And I feel like it's that same principle also kind of applies to this where it's like sometimes you could be telling a partner, hey, like get off your phone or things like that. But then it's like, you're not really getting to the deeper issue of why that's bothering you. And so this phrase, like this line allows you to go that like step layer deeper right away where it's like the story I'm choosing to tell myself is that you don't care about what I have to say. What? No. Instead of like get off your phone, you know what I mean? Yeah. And so yeah, I think that was a good takeaway, a good line. We need to start practicing that more. Something else that I took away is I downloaded it together. Oh, you downloaded the together app. Okay. And I used it on you yesterday. That's John. That's John's app. John Doloney plug and plug in it right now. Thank you, John for coming on our show. You haven't seen that episode. It's a good one. It's actually really great app. I love it so far. Yeah. And so it gives you a prompt for something to do with your spouse every day. And I did a prompt on you yesterday. Do you know what? You didn't like 10, 45 PM though. No, no, that wasn't the prompt. No, no, no, that wasn't an additional thing. Oh, this was today. No, it was yesterday. Oh, wait, what did you? What was it? Think. Is there anything that I did that was special? I can't remember. I was too tired. I was like fall asleep as we did. No, wasn't at night. I guess it was. I can't remember what I don't know. Tell me. My prompt yesterday was to give you a 30-second hug. And I gave you a 30-second hug. We could do hug a lot. So maybe it didn't stand out. Wait, yeah, I don't remember. When was that? I hugged you right after I put the kids to bed for 30 seconds. I literally held you and counted. Oh, wait, that's so sweet. Abby, I love the task. I thought you, you know, it's really funny now remembering you hugging me last night. And you know how the Disney rule, the rule they make for cast members at Disney is you don't let go first. You didn't move. I even thought I was doing it. I thought you were just like feeling really down. It could have been a hard month. And so I just didn't let go because I was like, I'm not going to let go until you let go. You always hold on until I let go. So you're like, man, I didn't know that was like a prompt. So that wasn't you reaching out. I really didn't need a hug. But once I saw that, I was like, yeah, I want a hug. So I have another prompt I'm going to do on you tonight. Not in the night. What is it? It's very good. It's not it's very clean. It's very clean. Wow. But you know, speaking of this marriage and money conference we went to, we learned about budgeting and having monthly budget meetings, which I think you you were really excited about doing those right, babe. Okay. And I actually was looking ahead or a calendar. You put it on the calendar, but we're going to be in Flagstaff. I know why our family. So we're certainly not going to know. So we need to adjust it. Right. So if it's not going to work, we have to plan ahead and say, Hey, when can we adjust? That's on you. When can we adjust? No, it's on us right? Let's figure out the time. Okay. So the budget meeting can't happen while we're in Flagstaff. So what is it? Is that I'm not the spender in our relationship? That's not true. We actually agreed on that at the money conference that I'm the saver. Okay. I wouldn't even get myself the word saver, but you're more spending than I am. Do you want to talk about what happened on Saturday? Sure. I'll talk about it. We happened on Saturday, maybe. Okay. There is a few caveats to this. Okay. One is thrift stores. I feel like at thrift stores, I get unlimited budget because it's a thrift store. I just moved our monthly budget meeting. That's a caveat for me by a week. So I moved it. It's groceries. I'm going to spend what I need to spend on groceries. Three, because I'm shopping at Walmart and Costco. Wait, why are we bringing up groceries right now? Why is that? That's I'm the spender on that. There's never been one strap in like, whoa, babe, you spent too much on groceries. I know you never said that about the thrift store either, but those are my things that I will go crazy. I'll just go out. I'll go crazy. Yeah. Next is a small businesses. Yeah. Out the door. I don't care. I'm just like it's we got a support. Yeah. And you found you found a local small business on Saturday that you wanted to support. I did some retail therapy. Yeah. And so what how much? I'm sorry. I never do that. Hey, you know what? I tested you and I said, is okay, I spend a lot of money today. And you said depends on how much and what it's on. Yeah. And I was like, close for me and the kids. And it's a small business and $500. And you said sure. So we did talk about it. That's a budget meeting in my opinion. Okay. Let me let me say this with caveat. I absolutely love our house. I love that we live here. I love our neighborhood. I love our community, I love it. But why I think you're the spender is is I was team pay off our house. - That is not counting, that does not count. - What do you mean? - What a freaking pile of horse crap. - Wait Abby, a house, houses are like the most expensive lie I don't know if people- - But that's not what people mean when they say spendy, Matt. - Of course. - They're talking about the casual purchases. - Okay, it depends on what, like, you point them in real. - Yeah, the fact that you agreed to this at the conference, we need to go back to the conference honestly. We gotta go back and have another meeting, but I do have to admit, maybe we're running into some hiccups because we did leave the conference a little early. - We did. Do you wanna say why we left. - You missed our kids. - And I cut it on the fact, 'cause I was like, it's Valentine's Day, and I'm missing two of my Valentine's Day. - Which was, I'm glad we left early. - I miss them a lot, and I feel like my max is three nights away, and we got there late on Wednesday, and then we stayed Thursday, and then we stayed Friday and left Saturday. - So yeah, we did. - That was plenty of time away. - We did three nights there. - I was missing them by Thursday. - Yeah. - I was actually missing them. I cried before we left on Wednesday. And our podcast with George Camel was really good. I just hope that we can find the third video angle because we are team scrambling right now. We're missing one of the videos. But yeah, we didn't interview with George Camel. That went super well. I felt more motivated in that interview with George than ever to not use a credit card, even though we never spend money that we don't have. - Not always. - But like, as credit cards are so convenient. I'm just a huge fan of their no nonsense, no BS format for personal finance. I was very motivated, though, to pay off our house early. - Yeah, rather than just, you know, sticking on the typical 30 year mortgage track. - Yeah. - I wanna like really send it and see how quick we can pay off our house. - Yeah. - So maybe that's, I think that's a goal that I have. - That is good. - I feel motivated. - Yeah, I honestly got teary eyed when I was watching some of those families do their debt-free scream. - Yeah. - It actually made me emotional. - It's cool. - I'm so proud of them. - Me too. I mean, like, think about how good it must feel to have no debt at all. - Oh, nobody has nothing. - Yeah, no student loans, no car payment, no house payment, nothing. You just own all your own stuff. And then your time is your own then. You can spend your time how you wanna spend it. And you don't have to work extra just to pay off stuff that you bought that you couldn't afford, you know? But obviously, a house is, I think if you have debt on a house, that's totally normal. That's totally cool. We have that. I don't know. I really don't know many people at all that have paid off their house, but that's the ultimate feeling of freedom in my opinion. - Yeah, I agree. - To just own your house. We did come back to see the kiddos, had some heart pizzas with them on Valentine's Day. And I had some chocolate covered strawberries. That was super fun. - We took our kids to a carnival yesterday, which was super fun. Both of our boys got their faces painted. They did some bounce house activities. - Well, we went to this carnival because my brother works for the husband and wife law firm here in Arizona. So if you live in Arizona, like I guarantee you probably know that name. It's kind of fun that he gets to do some of their marketing. - Yeah, their billboards are everywhere. If you ever drive, like you said, if you ever drive through Arizona, you'll see billboards that say husband and wife, husband and wife law team. - They have fun social media too. - And Blake, Abby's brother got the opportunity to be in the Dunk tub. What's it called? - That was like our main motivation for going, of course, he wanted to go to support Blake in his work of men. But then also, he was gonna be in the dunk tank. And of course, Griffin and Oggy were gonna think, that was the best thing ever. They call my brother Coco. - I missed the dunk tank. - Was it funny when our kids dunked him? - You weren't there? - I know, 'cause I was waiting in line for a barbecue. - So Blake was in the dunk tank and then we were given a soft, like they gave our boys softballs and of course they're not gonna be able to throw it right on the trajectory and hard enough to knock him. So then Blake gave them permission to like run up and hit the button. And you know that they were getting back in that lot. They dunked him probably like six to 10 times. It was so fun. And one time the guy handed Griffin this big old softball and Griffin's little hands. And Griffin threw it in the guy turned around and at the exact same time I chucked the dude at the head of the softball. - How hard did he throw this? - Not hard at all. It's the reason it went straight up is 'cause it kind of slipped out of his hand anyway. So it wasn't like going fast, but it was just funny. - Okay, genuine question for everyone listening. When your kids are having a great time at an event, like a carnival, do you, A, try to get them home on time for their nap so that they actually nap and don't get super overtired? Or B, let them stay as long as they want and sleep in the car. - I think it depends on their age. And I feel like they're at the age where they can stay as long as they want, but you were like, we need to go. - Well, okay, I think you were overstimulated. - I was overstimulated. I will give you that. But it was also about two o'clock. And then we had a 30 minute drive home and they're, which was gonna make them an hour and a half away from that. - I finally skipping naps for one day. I'm just putting that in really. - Okay, that's fair. So yeah, I mean we got, it was hard getting the boys out 'cause they did not want to leave. - They were having so much fun. I was like, just let them play. But you were ready to go, so. - Yeah. - But we did spend a lot of time there. They had a petting zoo. They got ice cream from the ice cream truck. They got Ninja Turtle ice creams. They had some good food and snacks. The bounce houses were great. I feel like if you would have stayed, Griffin would have loved doing that rock climbing wall. - Yeah. - And it was so cute. Our nephew CJ came too. And so Griffin and Oggy and CJ went to get their face painted, which, how fun is that? They also had a photo booth. And they got to pick out their own face art and Griffin, of course, got a tiger. Oggy, of course, got Spidey and CJ got a butterfly. It was so sweet. - Which, did you know that was Griffin's second time ever getting ice cream at an ice cream truck? I took him for the first time a few days ago. We were at the park. - I bought them ice cream before from an ice cream truck. - What you have? - Yeah. - Oh, this was my first time I guess. - We come in our neighborhood all the time. - They do, yeah. So I took-- - They had those playgrounds. They do. No, they do. It's smart though, because Griffin and I were at the playground. And I'm like, Griffin, do you hear that? And he's like, yeah. - There's something about the ice cream truck when it just happens. It's like, they catch you on that spontaneous thing where it feels like you hear it. They show up. It feels like, oh, it's meant to be. Like, we have to buy ice cream right now. And also, it just really is sad to tell your kid no to the ice cream truck. - Yeah, I was thinking about that, 'cause the popsicle that Griffin ended up getting was probably, oh Lord, this thing might have had a hundred grams of sugar in it. Like, it was just as massive. It was just as massive, you know. It's just, I don't even know what you call it, but it's all decked out. It's decorated. It kind of looks like a rocket ship. - Oh, 100? - Maybe closer to like 60 grams of sugar. - You're getting seriously-- - Oh yeah, these things are loaded with sugar. But it's just part of being a kid, you know? Like, when I had popsicles as a kid, I had ice cream as a kid. You can't like, deprive your kid of the joy of the ice cream truck just because it has 60 grams of sugar. Now you probably shouldn't get your kid ice cream truck popsicles or ice cream every day. - No, it's like once a month, not even though we don't-- - But he was so happy about it. Like, he was just so, so happy. Like, he was skipping on the way over to the truck and there was a bunch of other kids that were there too. - So fun. - It's funny though, 'cause now you don't even need, like I used to have to save quarters for the ice cream truck. That's what I would use to buy my ice cream is like save a bunch of change. - Did you pay back right? - I just used Apple Pay. - Yeah, they take Apple Pay. I used our credit card on Apple Pay. Anyway. - Don't tell Dave Ramsey that. - What are your thoughts on the fact that I got both of our toddler's private skateboarding lessons on a happy life? - That was so cute. We need to host those, like, we host swimming lessons. We need to host skateboarding lessons. I think a lot of our friends would join in. - You think so? - Yeah. - Tell your friends. - Well, is that guy interested in adding more kids? - He definitely is. - Oh, I already got like six signups. - Oh, seriously? - I'm not kidding. - We need to get it on the calendar, then, babe. - Okay, fun. - Let's do it. Because he's already getting come back. I think I scheduled him four time, like, in a month to come, but he could probably do like a two or three hour time slot if we have enough kids that could do a lesson. - Yeah. - And it's perfect. I mean, they love going back and forth from the-- - They see a littler skateboard. - Yeah, I think I need to go buy them a smaller skateboard because they're using a regular size one. - What is a local skateboard? - Yeah, there's a local skate shop here in Arizona. - That would be fun. - There's a bunch of local shops. - And then it's budget free. - Yeah, oh my gosh. Budget free. So you just, it's not even considered in the budget if you're supporting a local business. - Yeah. - Okay. - In my head. - That's the thing, guys. - This is why I'm not a charged budget. - I'm excited for everyone to hear the interview we did with George Campbell and his wife with me. - Oh yeah. - Because like Abby's out here, like-- - It's okay to go in debt for Disney. - Don't say that in front of anybody. Do not say it in front of George. - I have anything I am consistent. - Don't say it in front of Dave Ramsey's like people, you know? - Well, you know what? If anyone is gonna be able to convince me otherwise to be them, so I think I gotta say it to them. - Oh my gosh. I feel like Dave Ramsey really is the arch enemy of credit card companies. - I know you said when we were there that you were gonna say the ultimate, I'm like, have we paid off our house and this year then Dave has to come on our show. And he never said it. - I did. - I need to pitch that to Dave. If anybody knows Dave, let him know that we will pay off our house and do a debt free screen. - Because he's really gonna care that we paid off far away. - Yeah, he probably doesn't care. But in Ramsey Solutions, then we can interview him. If he says yes. - We'll pitch it. - We'll try our best. - We need to pitch it to George. At this point, we're just gonna be desperate. - We do have fun interviews coming up. - We do, yeah, we do. Wait, we do. What else do we do? - Not fun, but like really cool ones. - We have some wild ones coming up. - Yeah. - Yeah, so thank you for everyone that keeps coming back. - I'm not trying to tease you but I just wanna make sure it happens before I say it. - Yeah. - Because you never know. These things can always fall through. I hope not. This one's gonna work. These are gonna work. It's okay. - We're flying to Utah for it. So, there'll be a little change of scenery. - You wanna give your movie review of "Wuthering Heights." - I feel like you should go first. You're really good at movie reviews. - I know, I feel like we had a whole debrief about this. I feel like we agreed. - Well, first of all, it was very sensual with no nudity. - If you haven't heard of the new movie "Wuthering Heights," "Wuthering," - It's not new, but-- - It's not new adaptation of "Wuthering Heights." - You pronounce it "Wuthering Heights"? - I think it's "Wuthering." - It's with Margot Robbie and Jacob-- - Blorty. - Jacob Blorty? - Yeah. - Which apparently he's in a show called The Kissing Booth with this other girl that people thought Abby looked like. - Joey King, and I think that he looked like that. - And they would say, people would comment on our TikToks that they thought we were similar to the people from The Kissing Booth. Anyway, Jacob Alority and Margot Robbie are in the steamy romcom. But it's also-- - It's dark. - It's not a romcom. - It's dark. - It's not a romcom actually at all. - By the way, we're gonna get some spoilers to the book. So if you want to fast forward to the next talking points, that's totally cool, 'cause we're gonna spoil the end of the movie. - Okay, but here's the thing. It was written in 1847. - Okay, yes. So if you haven't read the book yet-- - But Abby Will stills, with due respect, there will be spoilers. - Yes. - Because there were some things different about the movie than the book. - Yeah. - That would have actually probably liked to know. - So what was different about the movie was that the movie ended where the book is essentially halfway through. And that's where the main character dies. And she dies essentially while she's pregnant. So she miscarries and she dies. And there's a lot of blood, and it's super dark. And I wish somebody would have gave us a trigger warning because we just had no idea going into this movie. - I told so many people that we were gonna go see this. And I feel like if any of our friends had known that this was part of the movie, they would have said something but we were like the first of our friends to see it. And I was like, wow, really was a terrible thing to watch. - Yeah. - And it's just so disturbing because in here's the thing too, I was really enjoying the movie. The movie was like great, it was like very steamy but with no nudity. Great to watch with your spouse. Like I thought, 'cause I feel like guys would also think it's very entertaining. The soundtrack was amazing. The acting was really, really good. Everything about it was so good. And I was like so, I was so invested. And then it got so disturbing with that element. It just felt like I ruined my day. - It's like I just saw like the color flush out of your face. - Yeah, the life drained out of me. - So that was a sucky way to end date night. Like it was a great date night up until that point. And then it was like, well, for real. - It did kinda ruin date night. - Yeah. - I couldn't really recover after that. - Yeah. - I feel like it didn't bother you in the way that it bothered me. Which probably makes sense. - I think when you see, like gosh, there was a really good book, "The Wedding People" that I got you. Which, like another story where there's an element of pregnancy law. - But not as big as this one. - And yeah, I don't know, like it's sad. It's hard seeing all these stories where it's just like not happy ending. A sad ending, like over and over again. Where it kind of like reinforces this idea of like, oh, once you miscarry, there's not gonna be a happy ending for you. That's probably why the movie was- - Well, she literally died. - Oh yeah, she's freaking died in the movie. Yeah, that was the ending. That was literally the ending of the movie. Also, there was nothing else. - And this is so dark too, but I mean, the book at least, she still dies in the book, but her daughter lives in the book. - Okay, well I'm saying, you call this a rom-com is psycho. - Not a rom-com, it's just a- - It is a drama. - It's a romance, it's a tragedy. - It's a romance though. - Yes, but it's a tragedy. - You really didn't like how there was- - In fidelity. - In fidelity. - Like it was really sexy until she was married. And to another man. And I was like, that's not sexy anymore. - Am I a bad- - I'm never gonna be aroused by an fidelity. - Am I a bad person that I was like rooting for them to get back together? - Ew! - What? It's just like- - No, I think you're the majority, I just- - They make you the- They make the antagonist, the protagonist in these types of movies. - My loyalty protagonist. - Like when I watch Breaking Bad, I've wanted Walter White to keep making meth. I was like, let's go Walter. - No, he was ruining his family. - I know, but it's like when in the movies where the antagonist is, the protagonist, I don't know why, I just wanna share him on. - You have a stronger moral compass in you. - Maybe you do, you're probably a better person than me. - Thanks a lot. - But I do like these anti-hero movies though. - Well the other thing that got me really taken out of it was the fact that they were like low-key brother and sister. - That was a little weird. - So that was also not sexy. - Not related at all by blood. But yeah, it was weird that they're like- - They're like step sibling situations. - Yeah, it's like they're step siblings. They're like sharing a bed when they were kids. - And then they're supposed to be like romantic. - But hey, he took the whipping for her. - Yeah, he got beat up by the dead brother brother. - Yeah, that's true. - Once you're in the brother category, you can't get out of the brother category. - Okay, then why did you give us so hot when he licked her head? - Okay, it was an isolated experience. - Why did you get the hots for Jacob? - I'm not saying that. - Did he say that to my friends at the gym today and I was blushing as I was saying? - Wait, what? - What? - Because it's part of the movie. - You just have to watch it, okay? If you're an adult and probably don't, and you're an adult, don't watch it with your mom. - Don't watch it with your, probably don't, do we know what, sorry. I think you should watch it with your sister in law. - What is it rated? - Honestly. - What is weathering heights rated? Do we even know what this is? - It's definitely R. - It's a Gothic romantic drama. - It's a Gothic romantic, yeah. - Yeah, it's rated R. Which is actually, which is actually shocking to me 'cause with no nudity, I would've thought it would be a P-13, but I guess it's 'cause of all the dark stuff. - The themes were so mature. - I will say the movie poster was sick. Like I thought they did a great job. - The whole thing was very well done. - I thought it was very well done. Here's my other thing. Margot Robbie is an extremely talented actress and the child actors in it were very talented as well. I mean, the whole thing was good, but I just felt so sad for Edgar because gosh, that poor man didn't deserve anything that happened to him. Same with Isabella. - Yeah, I really did feel, see at the same time, like I was rooting for Jacob Ellority and Margot to get back together. - Honestly, he kind of turned into like a major villain. - I felt so bad for Edgar getting wrapped up into everything. - Yeah, I'm like, then also, here's the thing, it's never romantic to have really bad communication. - Okay, let's talk about this stuff. - They have really bad communication. - Maybe this could be a topic of discussion with everyone listening in. Do you marry for financial security? Or do you marry for romance? - I think as a woman in the 1800s. - It was like a difference between life and death to marry for money. - Yes, yes. - So people did all the time. - Yes. - And I think that's why this book was so-- - That's so bival. - It was so controversial at the time that it came out because people didn't like the messages that it gave. - I also don't. I mean, infidelity is never okay. - Yeah, true, true. - Literally never. - But they love each other, babe. - No, that doesn't matter. - I know. - They should it. - I like it, you're a good person, you're great. - Well, I guess we both know who is going to step outside of our marriage. We're likely to step outside of our marriage. - Oh my God. - No, that's not even a, that's not even like a concern at all. - That doesn't leave the house, so I'm not worried at it. - I'm at our house, I'm a homebody. - I think you're the only woman I talk to throughout the day. - That's not true. - Other than producers that are in Texas and our team, all of our team is all over the world. So the people that work on our shows, I just, we just chat over the Google Meet. - Yes. But the reason we went for a date night, I mean, I guess this is taking a harsh left turn, but that let's just bring it back to why we went on a date night. Because I feel like we haven't actually been that good about date nights, so I'm totally honest. - We've been busy, we've been-- - But I also feel like we're really good at connecting after the kids go to bed. - Yeah, I think it's good that we, we're starting to do more date nights. Excuse me, we've also been dropping the kids off at your parents' house on-- - We've done it twice. - We've done it twice now on Friday nights, and then they'll like, that's what-- - That was a Saturday. - Oh, that was a Saturday. But it's what Abby used to do with her grandparents when she was a kid. She would go to her grandparents' house on the weekend, just for a night, and her parents could have some alone time going to date whatever we're doing at now, too. - Well, it's not every week, but we've done it a couple times. - We should start doing it every week. Can we do that while we're in Flagstaff? I would love to do that. A little date. - May. It's kind of a family trip, though. - That's true, it is a family trip. - But anyway, we went, my mom asked if she could watch the kids for the night, because that was actually the date of that we had scheduled for, I hate talking about this. I'm like so overtaken. I mean, I think it's good to talk about it because it is like the-- it's still hard. - Yeah. - So my mom asked if she could watch the boys, which was really, really kind, because that was the date of our daughter's C-section. So we were pretty certain we were gonna meet her that day. And so we got to do a little date, which was really unfortunate that we chose to see weathering heights for the date, because given the circumstances, it was actually probably the worst thing to watch and make you spiral if you've experienced a late-term miscarriage. So know that ahead of time, because I do know that a lot of you started following along potentially, or started joining when we started talking about the loss of our daughter and our miscarriage. So just know that, because I feel like a lot of people listening might also appreciate that little caveat there. I'm not trying to spoil the movie, but this isn't a plot twist that you want to be surprised by. And so, because I didn't appreciate being surprised by it. Like I said, it kind of ruined my evening, but anyway. So we went on the date night, and yeah, I feel like this whole weekend has just been kind of the worst. And I feel like almost anticipation of it was like, equally bad, honestly. - You handled it, honestly babe, you handled it really well. - That is not true. - The 20th, yeah. So basically, our daughter's due date was February 28th, and I-- - I honestly am okay with you saying her name. I mean, if you want to. - I'm okay with that too. I've just known you wanted to keep a private side and never said it. - Well, no, I think honestly, I didn't really know why. I wanted to keep it private, but I just wanted to trust my instinct, like, and I think I just realized this weekend, like when we were came to the day where we were supposed to have her, it was because I kind of was still hanging on to like this separate life where I was like still pregnant. And like, we were going to announce like her name on her birthday and stuff and so. Like now that we've passed that date, like it's okay in my mind. I mean, I don't care if we keep it private or if we do you want to say it's yeah I mean, I think it's yeah, I kind of want to honestly because I feel like what I'm learning is that like the name is really what gives anybody humanity and Like her humanity is what makes her loss like so painful, you know Because it wasn't that's why I hate the I hate the term. I'm okay. I shouldn't hate the term But sometimes the term pregnancy loss really rubs me the wrong way because like I'm not just grieving a pregnancy I'm grieving grieving a human. I'm grieving a baby. I'm grieving a daughter. I'm grieving like Emerson And so like this month is just sucked I He named her Emerson Nicole. I actually had a stillborn sister who was a year older than me and her name was Emily Nicole And so we named Emerson kind of like they share that middle name Which was really meaningful for us and then also our nurse that was literally an angel to us when we delivered her Her name was Nicole, so it also just felt like So appropriate, you know at that time and like Meeting full to our family But I will say like picking out that name After knowing that Her heart wasn't meetings like that. It's just a You never want that experience to be something you and your baby are experiencing, but Yeah, can you talk? I don't even know where to go. Yeah, no. I Yeah, well, thanks. Thank you for sharing that first of all Well, I just don't I think I've been thinking for so long about like how we can honor her and remember her and we talk about like, you know, I feel like with all of our other baby aren't like our two other babies All our friends and family knew their names before they were born and we would talk about them a lot before they were born And then we just kept it private like from social media until then and so now it's like in a way like she's given that same honor as our Our other two kids, you know, something cool that my dad said he wanted to do is to get like my dad doesn't have tattoos I have one tattoo. It's on my lip Abby has a matching one with me And so ever like when my dad said I was like I want to get a tattoo So I haven't I haven't actually gotten the tattoo yet, but I've been wanting to get a tattoo of her name on my arm and Abby's handwriting Um, and I don't know if that'll be my only tattoo that I ever get. I don't know, but When you mentioned like remembering her, I I think that's the best way like literally having her name written on my body I'm never gonna forget that girl. Yeah, you know, and like talking about her was our kids in a way that's like Not scary. It's like either way. It's like it is scary. Yeah, like but like trying to just like Trying to navigate that, you know, it's tricky and it's complex um And so like they call her Emerson and they have like a little bunny with her name on it. It says um What it says like Loved for a lifetime Emerson Nicole and it has her birthday and it has and the kids like sleep with this little bunny And they call it their Emerson bunny and so that's a really like tangible way that we can like Talk about her and we always say that we have that bunny to remember her by And like I don't know. I think there's a lot of the things that we're gonna do that we're gonna just keep private because It just doesn't feel necessarily right to share, but I would recommend like something that we're doing that You could maybe do if you also just find yourself in this horrible position Is to find a location that feels significant for you and that baby that you're missing So much and then find a way for the whole family to be a part and like visit there. And so maybe that is Like if you got to have like a gravesite. Maybe it's the gravesite. Maybe it's like Just like something that's just symbolic or there's some other reason why this location is really significant to you and if you're you're like Remembering the child you've lost and so um, we're just gonna continue to like revisit a significant location as a family and like I invite our whole family there for sure in September. Well, I mean We after after the miscarriage we saw after we lost Emerson We started seeing rainbows a lot and we talked about that and and with the rainbows though There was a friend of ours. I believe that sent us a picture of the rainbow over the superstition mountains Am I correct in saying that? Wasn't we had a lot of friends at was it did we see the rainbow for superstition mountains or was it our friend? That's all we did okay. I'm trying to remember who's like who saw it first. I was saying rainbows a lot You were seeing rainbows our friends were seeing rainbows All our friends started sending us the rainbows that they saw and um So actually like this is something really really speed our family did for us. So um This is just an idea if you have like a deer-loved one that's walking through Like lost like this um, they had Someone they know do like a hand beautiful painting for us with a rainbow And mountains and it was so it's so beautiful and so we hung that in our house this month So we can always look at it and just like remember her and Also use it as a visual aid for our kids too, you know Um, I think a lot of the same things that help kids also help us, you know It's just like visual reminders are great I have my necklace on with my charm that has my three babies on it And so it has Griffin, Oggy and Emerson all of the necklace and I kind of use that to talk about with the kids too Which is I've just I've been thinking a lot and I feel like I put so much pressure on myself too And I think I put that pressure too early on like I was not in a place in my grief journey to like Really get to like making meaning and room like doing memorial stuff like I wasn't I put so much pressure early on And it's like if you're in the fresh stages like don't do what I did like there's no This grief journey. I hate to say it. It won't always be this painful, but it is so long Like I've made peace with the fact that I'm gonna grieve her the rest of my life And so like there's no rush to this To this stage, you know where you're trying to memorialize thinking of everything um But it is something that's really important for me to do Oh, it's my nose running out of my nose I don't But um, so don't rush yourself or don't put pressure on yourself like I did because it it's Just on it's not it's a long journey and it I'm not always like this, but just The anticipation of like the end of February and like actually being in the end of February has honestly been like The shittiest like yeah, and so But you know we get up every day. We still Do our day because life goes on As much as it feels like a part of you never does Like you have to move on like you have to continue living and so that's what we're doing this year That's what we've done since the losses that we've continued living and Continue to get therapy. I'm meeting with my like mid-torn amaro who also lost a baby at 18 weeks and Like we talked about our daughters. She talks about her daughter and we call her my name We call immerse in my name my friends text me that and that's really meaningful to me And so yeah, it wasn't like it was just some mixed secret But I just couldn't figure out why I didn't want to share it for so long and then I figured it out this past weekend It just feels right and appropriate. So I'm just like Yeah, I don't know. It's just been it's like sucked so It doesn't Doesn't get easier. I you know, I really think that If I would have heard someone's story like mine before I experienced it. I would have been like that's really hard but I I know that I would have understood how hard it is And it doesn't mean that like like I said we're still living we're still Every day it doesn't look like sad and we'd be it looks like a lot of plans and we're And like hanging out with our kids every day. We're only out of the house going to carnivals going on like short trips I mean, we've been saying very busy But like she comes with us everywhere. Her memory comes with us everywhere and it's like There's reminders of her everywhere and so In parts of like the day that we met her Like legit haunt to be still so Yeah, I think the way that you explained losing her to our kids was really good and really age-appropriate It was as simple as our boys like explain these to our boys that her body just stopped working. Yeah, and Obviously then the question I think that Griffin asked was was my body gonna stop working Yeah, he said I don't want my body to stop working and I think you very gently Lovingly said, you know one day did you say like one day everyone's body stops working? Yeah, and I said hopefully it's when We have lived done a lot of things. Yeah, I lived a lot of life. It's really important that we Take our like take care of our health as much as we can, and we take care of our safety as much as we can, and just kind of keep it brief, you know, because I don't think it was as deep as I'm scared of dying. It was literally just like, you know, just like curious follow-up question, you know. And so, and I know that he's not like, he's still. Sorry, you got a little toilet paper on your eyes. Oh, great. Sorry, yeah, I think that's why they make tissues and not toilet paper. It's random. I don't like it all. The other detail I think worth adding is it was so, so nice. Some of friends of ours to show up on the date that the C section would have been, which was the 21st. And so, your friend Val brought you some ice cream, some like ones that from Trader Joe's that you really like, some mochi ice cream, as well as like the ice cream sandwiches from Trader Joe's that have the chocolate chips around them. My brother and my sister-in-law, who we're both, you know, very close with, they brought crumble cookies for us, which was super nice. And then, and then your friends from the gym, Caitlin and Ashley, brought you like a care basket. They did a dance on our. They did a dance? Home security camera, too. They did a dance on the home security camera? Yeah. I did not know that. They did. Really? It's on the. It's on the. That's hilarious. Yeah, on the out. You never told me that. I just find you to tell you right now. That's really sweet. She said it's because you moomed their home security camera. Oh my gosh, I did moomed their home security camera. I can't believe I did that. It's really hard. Yeah, so it's only up from here, right? Only up from here. I mean, we've gone through the hardest, the hardest parts of it. Obviously, the 28th is not going to be a fun day, either. Yeah. But. A part of me is like ready to get past this point because I feel like I can put some of this stuff to rest, but this just shows that the grief journey just doesn't is not linear and like everyone tells you that and then you experience it. You have so many good days in a row that you just like are like, "Oh, like, maybe we're done." And then you're just like freaking knocked back down. Yeah. So fast and so hard and I imagine like, yeah, this is just always going to be hard. But there's just no way it's never going to not be hard and I think it's going to get easier. But I feel like if I were to like talk to a friend down the line or if I meet someone and we talk about our babies that we never got to meet, like it'll always evoke tears for me. I just don't want to see a world where that won't like still just sting so bad, like the pain of that. And so it's just the worst. It's literally just the worst and so I just, yeah, I've learned so many lessons and I feel like that's what people need when they say like everything happens for a reason. But it is true, like I've learned so many lessons from this and I've gotten so much empathy and this has been like a crazy lesson in patients for me because like, I've never really had to be patient for so anything like this in my life. Like we have been so privileged, like I got married really young, we got, we had, we were blessed with fertility that just out of nowhere, you know, for nothing that we've done that has been really good and then to like experience this has just been a lesson in patients I never wanted to learn, but here we are. And I think just to maybe calm some fears, people might be feeling listening to this right now, knowing about miscarriage, hearing about miscarriage, it is very scary. It does happen. And while it does happen, it's one in four women who experience miscarriage in their lifetime. So you're one of those four, you know, we're a part of that dumb club that has been through something like that, but don't think like if you're pregnant right now and you're worried, like don't think that it's that likely, it's rare, it doesn't happen that often, but I mean, yeah, you still have one out of four, which sucks. And I think the reason it shocked us so much is just because it was in the second trimester when 80 to 85% of them, this is like some data that we have from our producer, 80 to 85% of losses happen in the first trimester before 12 weeks. So what we went through, what Abby went through, very rare, not common. And it's just like, you know, we just got, we just got a delta bad hand, you know. While the miscarriage has been really hard and it's been something that I think we're so going to be talking about forever, it's been good just to, like I'm glad that we were in therapy already when that happened. I'm glad that we've been still going to therapy. I think that's been really helpful for me, really helpful for you, not only doing solo therapy, but couples therapy, all of the therapy, we're doing every type of therapy there is. So that's been really good. And we'll even be doing some, in addition to the retail therapy that, you know, you did by the support of the small business recently. I think we have some travel coming up that schedule that I think we're hoping to have the travel scheduled around this week, the week that we were going to meet our daughter. But the, you know, with dates and coordinating with family members as well as coordinating with, there's like a brand that's going to bring us out overseas later in the coming months we're just, we're here for now. But I think it'll be good during the, like on the 28th, we'll be in Flagstaff with, with our family, with the kids, and I think that'll be good to just get away for a little bit that day. Probably. I guess the question we should end on is like, what does the future look like for us? We've been through this awful thing. It's been a really hard month that 2025 was a, was a hard year. Honestly, a big part of like meeting, making for me, I said this from like the first episode we ever made about losing our daughter is that like a part of the meeting, making for me has been talking about it publicly. And while there's a lot that we have kept private and like we'll continue to keep private. Like, this has been very healing for me. And so like, I don't know anyone that's sick of hearing about it. Like move on. It's not for you. And we did. Like, I mean, that's just as simple as that because it's for the people that it's for. And like, I have met so many women because of it, like not because of it, but that have like shared their story or shared about their babies because of being public about it. And that's just a small percentage of like, we know that there's so many comments and so many. And it's not like that is just, I, for me, that is honoring Emerson. And so like, I'll continue to talk about it like. And so, um, but obviously like, we, I keep saying like life keeps happening and we just carry the grief with us as we do the next right thing, you know? And so, I think we're just going to continue to live life as full as we can. And also just like with this new, like deeper understanding of like, what a blessing life is. I'm so conflicted now too because a lot of how we've connected with all the wonderful people here listening to our podcasts, watching our YouTube videos, TikToks, we've connected a lot over growing our family and the pregnancies that you've been through. Like, I think that's, that's what we found a lot of, a lot of people that are here. And so I guess the question for you is like, now that we've been through this miscarriage, now that you have experienced loss, how does that change, how we approach that in the future? All of that is true. But sometimes loss is a part of growing your family. She's still a part of our family and like, this, like you said, one in four women experience and like, this is a part of the journey for so many people. Yeah. Like, as much as we hate it, like, it is part of the journey. Because I think about people that watch, it must be hard to see pregnancy content. Right. If you're, if you're someone that's experiencing miscarriage has been through miscarriage, I know for you, especially right after it, I know it pissed you off to see pregnancy. It pissed me off. It hurt me. It hurt. Yeah. And that was my, like, I don't know if this sounds like such a jerk thing to say. But like, that was my responsibility to filter like what I was putting in my, my brain after women. You know? And so no matter what pregnancy is a celebration, like it is a, it is a joy. There's, there's so many hard aspects and I understand that there are so many realities that women face while pregnant that make it so much more complicated. They're not all fun. They're messy. They're hard. They're deeply challenging. And there can even be sadness and anger all mixed up in there. But no matter what, like the privilege of growing a baby and growing your family that way, it is always something that should be celebrated. And if there's anything that's made me realize that it is experiencing loss. And so pregnancy will always be, I don't know, like something to be celebrated, something to be talked about. And that's why it was so healing for me also to throw baby showers for my friends, even while I was still, you know. grieving it's not because I'm like some superhero it's because I know now how freaking amazing and what a blessing it is that they're able to carry a child like that you know so I don't think there will really be I think obviously there will be things that I do differently personally like as I navigate it and there's I'm sure my content will look differently post-loss pregnancy post-loss versus like before because I'm different so like my content will look different my content has always been a reflection of me obviously like that's not I'm not unique in that but like it's always been a reflection but it's like I don't is the question like do I think you answered it no I don't think you did anything wrong the past no I I wonder if it just like change your perspective and I think I think you acknowledging that I mean I think it's cool that you just took personal responsibility for the content you're consuming so I think for you you just when you were getting fed pregnancy content you just I think you got off I think you got off your phone I'm not a mental health expert but I think if you were to talk to many a lot of their thing you says like we got it we still have to assume agency right like there's things that are outside of our control like experiencing loss but what's inside of my control afterwards is consuming things that are not going to continue to hurt that same area over and over and over and over and so yeah there was I mean I didn't use anything for I don't know how many weeks and then even now I just I severely limit it and I just learn to regulate it myself too with what I can take and that's not revealing some like weakness in me and it's not revealing like that I have some unresolved parts of me it's just it's just part of it like part of living life when you've been changed so dramatically like life looks different afterwards we've talked so much today about so so much something else that Abby and I've been thinking about doing more so me because I'm still in the I'm in meaning making I want to make meaning out of what has happened I'm considering making some sort of you know short documentary similar to the type of videos that we've like made I don't know like we we have this our birth story that's up on YouTube but we don't have our miscared story and I feel like that's a story that I'd like to tell and I haven't even started the video there's so much footage to go through there's so much it's also really sad to I'll be honest looking through the footage of us telling people that were pregnant with Emerson because it was just like I started looking through it and I just got really sad but I want to make meaning out of it and so I guess what I the reason I'm saying this is if there's like any charities any any resources that you guys know of please share them in the comments to that our producer came up with our pregnancy and infant law support center it's P-I-L-S-C dot org and there's also the postpartum support international it's postpartum dot net I just want to make meaning out of this horrible thing that we went through and that went out of four women go through and yeah I just think you guys are awesome we feel so grateful for you being a part of this community and hopefully we can take this awful thing that happened and you know do some good in the world so please let us know if you have any ideas in the comments any any charities that you think are really powerful doing a lot of good I am a maximizer I am someone that like whenever I give to a charity I look up their their info on charity navigator I do my research and it's and it's not spur of the moment giving for me it's more so like year and giving where we we've then decided okay these are the charities that were supporting so anyway all that being said I think a documentary is coming coming I want to tell our story I want to tell Emerson's story and I'm hoping that in some way it can provide resources to people that have been through the same thing or we'll go through the same thing and just don't know it yet. - That's all I have. - Love you, babe. - Love you.