Ranking and Reliving the Raiders’ Rebuilds

welcome into the ringer nfl show austin gale here we are doing a special raiders edition i can't believe they're letting us do this a raiders edition of the ringer nfl show logan i just recorded it's pretty much just me and him naming names who've played for the raiders over the last 25 years we try to structure a little bit uh we rank kind of our most optimistic moments are the best rebuild moments over the last 25 years it's felt like 25 years of rebuilding but it's a fun one me and logan have never uh podcasted together it was good to share our raiders fandom 232 year old uh bay area natives big raiders guys but i hope you guys like it shield's on vacation not sure when he's coming back i'm sure he's doing some fun stuff but um until then you got me and logan talking raiders for adults with crohn's disease or ulcerative colitis symptoms every choice matters trim fire offers self-injection or intravenous infusion from the start trim fire is administered as injections under the skin or infusion through a vein every four weeks followed by injections under the skin every four or eight weeks if your doctor decides that you can self-inject trim fire proper training is required trim fire is a prescription medicine used to treat adults with moderately to severely active crohn's disease and adults with moderately to severely active ulcerative colitis serious allergic reactions increased risk of infections or lower ability to fight them and liver problems may occur before treatment get checked for infections and tuberculosis tell your doctor if you have an infection and if you don't have an infection tell your doctor if you have an infection flu-like symptoms or need a vaccine explore what's possible ask your doctor about today call 1-800-526-7736 to learn more or visit trimfire radio.com welcome into the ringer nfl show austin gail here for the first time ever we've never potted together but we have this deep bond this deep bond over being fans of the oakland la las vegas raiders it's logan murdoch from real ones big big ringer nba guy big ringer guy i feel like everyone i talk to about you loves you it's great to finally get on the mic with you oh i appreciate it this has been an honor it's i'm really excited to be here um just to see you first and foremost because we typically um are on slack just either just trying to spew raiders propaganda that doesn't exist or we're just trying to like coke through it um and we're just trying to like coke through it um so i'm excited to actually do that on podcast um forum and i'm i love the ringer i'm how's everybody saying good things about me i appreciate that but like yeah i i want to say this before we we start though i was really nervous this weekend and i'm nervous right now going into this pod because i don't know what i am going to do i have no idea this is the first time in a long time that i've gone into a podcast not knowing what i'm going to do i've gone through a lot of emotions over the last a week preparing for this podcast a lot of this is torture going through the raiders history so i i think all we have at this point are cool colors evidenced by our jerseys and our hats and all we have but i hope we can like make light and make some sense of just the hubris that the raiders have given us over the last 30 years definitely to set the table here producers of the ringer nfl show are juna sutton nevins they reached out to the two raiders fans they probably know they're like hey we kind of want to go back through all these moments in raiders fandom specifically over the last millennium last two decades where you felt like they were finally turning the corner finally rebuilding because it feels like the raiders have been rebuilding every other year for the last 20 30 years and how i wanted to start was kind of start with how your fandom started i know you're from oakland you're from the bay so am i but i also want to hear like i thought it might make sense to start like the last time the raiders were actually good and i'm not talking about either of the times they've made the playoffs since 2002 i'm talking about that 2000 to 02 run with gruden gannon callahan like the last time they went super they got blown out by gruden it was a pure revenge game it was terrible to watch they knew their plays like i i think it makes sense to start with your fandom and like how i described that fandom to people is like that's what my dad told me about my dad was like oh man the gannon the gruden era because we're both 32 years old like that i was like like six seven years old when they were going on that run and it was like i i felt the fandom through my dad being like wow like this is what how good my team is this is how good gruden is and gannon is like what was that yeah that stage like for you yeah man um it started just in childhood i don't even think it's it started before childhood it started before i was on this earth right like my dad was a when he was growing up in the central valley he was um you know him and his brother which chose between the two la teams at the time um because you know where the central valley is located it's like you can pick you have a little bit of sauce from northern california a little bit of southern california right and so you choose and my uncle chose the ramps and my dad he chose the raiders because he loved their colors right and so you know he moves it to the bay for for college and it just like kind of sprouts out and then my mother she's from the east coast but her west coast team is the raiders right and so it was just it was kind of ordained on to me right and i don't know what time of when it was i look at pictures of myself when i was a kid it's my dad with raider stuff on it's me with raider stuff on it's my mom with raider stuff on like it was like kind of a cult you know and you know it's still sports right and we lived in um when i when i uh was born um we lived in east oakland like in um near san antonio park and so that's like a bar station that is it's near fruitvale station and that was like a station away from um coliseum so like we were just like really really interested to it and you know later i moved to lake merit and i just i my childhood was just everything about the raiders it was listening to greg papa because since the raiders sucked you couldn't watch them on television unless maybe you went to ricky's like closer where you're from or they sold out so i'm listening with just with everything that i have to the kenwood radio and i'm listening to greg papa and for some reason during my childhood there was a uh he is my friend that's one of my uh homies is greg papa and one of his best things to do is say touchdown raiders right it's like touchdown raiders he doesn't do it anymore i tried to get him to do it a few years ago but he's now the boys of the niners and will not do it but he used to say that a lot and when um when i was growing up he said it less and less because they didn't score that much and so it was just really just him just i got the last part of greg papa of basically just him saying oh another fourth down just trying to fight a terrible situation and that was basically my childhood of listening to the raiders on the radio station or i will go to a game uh here and there one of my first uh memories was um was being in mount davis it wasn't my first raider game was my first raiders memory uh of going to mount davis and pointing out that there was a chargers fan um this is early in the game but early way before the game point out a chargers fan and um in the top row and somebody else saying where's the chargers fan and throwing a hot dog at him that was my first ever raiders memory my second raiders memory is leaving um a raiders game and and going near we're driving back home because you know the the coliseum is in east oakland and we're driving back to lake mary and i see one of the paddy wagons and there's somebody that's in the paddy wagon that is arrested and is showing us his cuffs and smiling like yeah i did it like it was a badge of honor so um you know it was just it's it ain't obvious in me man that's that's my that's my raiders origin story i freaking love it dude what about you what about you mine's not that dissimilar man a lot of it was through my dad like my dad was obsessed with the raiders it's all he cared about and like one of my first raiders memories was on that gannon gruden run and like for people who don't know like john gruden was the youngest coach ever hired in the nfl he's the youngest coach hired even when he won the super bowl he's still the youngest coach in the nfl and he paired up with this guy named um he's the youngest coach ever hired in the nfl he's the youngest coach ever hired um rich gannon who was a former fourth round pick out of delaware who the patriots wanted him to play defensive back or running back he like swaps around the league never gets a chance to start and then he goes on like a four season run of starting 16 games straight and it's like this whole gruden gannon run where like he becomes the mvp of the league a guy they wanted to turn into running back so like this crazy story with tim brown jerry rice like they have these guys and my dad brought or bought this brand new big screen tv and this is back in the day where like big screen tvs were like the size of like a small kitchen because like you couldn't flat screen or anything and he bought it from a big screen tv and he bought it from a big screen tv and he bought it for that super bowl and they obviously got blown out and i i almost saw him throw like a coffee table through the tv oh my god from that moment on right the raiders went on from that point to like lose like 17 straight division games they uh had the worst record before you before you talk about i just want to get back to this how big this tv was because i had a similar tv and we took the tv out we could put a whole couch where that tv was yes yes that's exactly how big the tv was yes yes it was great and the picture quality was trashed but the tv was big it was 50 inches it like stood on its own base it was like taller than me it was insane so like that tv almost gets broken my dad i think a year or two years later buys season tickets to the raiders because he finally has money to like where like you said like a bart station away from going we also had this um oakland a's uh like decked out um rv that we take to the games like pre-game games and all that stuff and like we were then tickets season ticket holders from like 04 to 2014 can we pour one out really quickly for like how great pre-game used to be whether they're That was like the high point of Raiders fandom, even when they sucked. Like there were people, myself included, who never had tickets to games would just go to the pregame because it was so popping. You would just take the BART to Coliseum and then you would go, you'd get hot dogs. You would listen to it. There would be 40, E40 playing, Drew Down, Rick Rock Beach, Too Short, all the stuff. It was, it was amazing, man. Like, like the tail, what is your best tailgating experience? Before we even get to this, talk about your best tailgating experience. I was a kid, one of the first times they ever, you know, they had in the Oakland A's RV, we had this like mini 24 inch TV that we'd play Madden on. And I remember one of my dad's friends were playing Madden. One of them's getting like blown out, like 24 to seven. I was like, oh, I'll take over for his team. And I ended up coming back and winning because I was like a kid and playing Madden all the time then. And like, that was like one of my core moments. I also, my dad would always invite a ton of people to the tailgate because he's like cooking. And this was, he was like sober at the time, like easier to hang out with. But like, let's not get into that point. But then people would just come for the tailgate. Like they're like. They're like, oh, I don't have a ticket to the game, actually. I'm not going to go watch them get blown out by this random team. Like I'm just coming to hang out, eat food, throw the pigskin around. I mean, throwing the football before games, like in the parking lot, like was my favorite. And you mentioned Mount Davis. For those who don't know, Mount Davis was like this section of the old Oakland Coliseum that they would tarp off at times because they couldn't sell those tickets. But my dad had season tickets up in Mount Davis. And like you mentioned, like seeing that Chargers fan and stuff. Some of my favorite moments, anytime we'd see any fan in Mount Davis. Yes. You're like, boo this man. Like everyone just screamed. There's fights all the time. Like anytime. Before, it was a tradition that you'd play the San Francisco 49ers every preseason, right? Because it was like this battle of the bay and easy to do whatever. It was a battle, all right. It was a battle. And then they had to stop doing it because people were like dying after the game. Somebody got stabbed in Kansas City. That's right. That's right. That's right. It's crazy that you know all this. I feel like I'm explaining it to the listeners. But yeah, you're kind of in this. But yeah, like my favorite tailgating moments were definitely in those early days when we sucked. But just like everyone kept coming. Bro, it felt like even as a fan, you were going to battle, bro. You get off the bar, you go through that little. The gate tunnel, yeah. The gate bridge. It looked like you were either going to battle or going to prison, bro. Like you were literally walking through that cage and you would walk down. I don't know which way you would walk down, but I would always walk down the right. But as soon as you get down, there's like. You go on, it gets you onto a hill. You either walk right down the hill or left down the hill. I always walk right for some reason, superstitious. I went left, which maybe isn't good. But I went left because our tickets were on that side. So I'd always go left. Okay, yeah. Even if I was going to Summer Jam or some concerts or something, I'd always go right. Like even now, if I ever rarely go to the Coliseum, I'll just always go right. But yeah, it felt like you were going to battle. Yeah. So we were. What? So you're 32, I'm 32. We were eight years old when the Raiders lost that Super Bowl in embarrassing fashion against John Gruden, the guy they traded. They traded away. The youngest coach in the NFL. The guy that was taking their team to new heights and restarting the Oakland Raiders. This was not that far after they moved back to Oakland. After going to LA for however long that was. So you felt this ascent with Gruden and his team. They traded him away for two first-round picks and $8 million in cash. Faced him in the Super Bowl the immediate next year. And Bill Callahan, the coach, the offensive coordinator under John Gruden that took over, they're talking about in that Super Bowl being like, Rich Gannon was really concerned losing Gruden as a play caller. And they go into that game and it didn't even look like they belonged on the same field. And ever since then, they've been one of the most losingest teams in the NFL. Yes, there have been moments. They've cracked the playoff twice. But they haven't won a playoff game since that 0-2 run. It's the second longest active playoff streak or streak without a playoff win with the Dolphins being number one. This entire time, and this is what we wanted to go through, ranking these rebuild moments, these re-fire moments when you felt like, Oh my god, are we getting back on track? Because they've tried over and over and over again. And they're in the midst of one now with Kubiak, Fernando, Brady. We'll talk about that. But I feel like what we have to do is go over these two decades and look at what were these moments where you felt like, Okay, our chips are back in. We've got the coach, the cornerback, the team. This is the one that can actually go on a run again because I feel like I remember all these. All these times, my friends always make fun of me being like, Oh, this is the Raiders' year. And I felt that a lot in this run. And obviously, we haven't had the success. Yeah, let's get to the list, man. What's first on your list, man? I'm just sad. I'm crying. This is due. Let's get to it. I'm going to go first, an honorable mention. An honorable mention is Antonio Pierce in relief of Josh McDaniels. Not the immediate season after, but in relief of Josh McDaniels. The McDaniels era was truly terrible. Like awful. The players hated it. The players hated him. The fans hated him. It was terrible. Pierce, down the stretch, he goes 5-4 in the nine games that he takes over after they fired McDaniels. He wins three of the last four, including all three of those wins were against division rivals. Remember when he blew out the Chargers, 63-21. We upset the Chiefs in Arrowhead on Christmas. And then the closeout season at home, we beat Jared Stidham and Denver. It's like, okay, wait a second. And then they hire Antonio Pierce and it all goes shit. But wait a second. I was like, okay, this is a little moment here. The cigars with Max Crosby, Devontae Adams. It looked like this was it. That's my. Honorable mention. I don't know if you had honorable mentions before you get to the list. I didn't have an honorable mention, but that season is a little bittersweet for me. Was that the season where Caleb Williams was balling out of control at USC and we were supposed to be tanking? It was 2023. So I think it might. I think you might be right because Caleb was drafted in 2024. Yeah. So I think that. Yeah. So that was why it was bittersweet for me because I was like, yo, man. Like, okay, the Raiders suck. That's cool. That's what's up. Okay. That's fine. It was the first time I was like that. This is fine. Been here before. Been here before. I'm watching USC. Caleb Williams has a terrible defense, but he's like racking up numbers. And I'm like, okay, that's my quarterback right there. That's my quarterback right there. And then Antonio. The Antonio Pierce thing happens. And it's like prime Raiders stuff where the interim actually does better than the actual coach. We're probably going to talk about this a lot during this stretch. But I mean, it was just like the Hugh Jacksons of the world, right? Even the Tom Cables of the world, like all of these great assistants. Yeah. Great assistants from like previous coaching staffs that should have probably got fired. But, you know, we wanted to save money. So we just like, hey, you seem to get the guys in line. So let's come on over and be the coach. Antonio Pierce was in that mold. And I was the whole time I just saw my dream of Caleb Williams and Silver and Black just kind of like doing those. So even that's perfect Raiders right there. Even as being an honorable mention and bringing joy, it's actually sucks because, you know, we're didn't get the quarterback we should have gotten. Yeah, I think I got caught up in and something that I rewatched a ton of the 2000 to kind of O2 run and something that I feel like the Raiders have been looking for. And it's a commonality in like this entire process. These last two decades trying to get back on track, trying to make another Super Bowl run, figure out the coach quarterback is like the Raiders before, like in that run and something that I think Al Davis believes in. We're going to talk about Al, the former owner, his son now owns the team. We'll talk about him, I'm sure later. But like Al Davis was making sure that they were going to get the quarterback. He was making sure that they had big bad asses. And I think we were with Antonio Pierce, like it felt like for the first time in a while, we actually had bad asses and a vision to like be like when we blew out the Chargers and you could feel that like that identity with like Jack Jones and these defensive linemen like wanted to hit. Like I feel like that's when I was like, okay, I want the Raiders to still have the identity because people always talk about the brand and like, I feel like it's, you know, I'm wearing the bowler's jersey. You got the hat. Like it's like some of the easiest, you know, NFL aesthetic to put on because the silver and black is so iconic. Like they've never changed their jerseys, but like something that I miss hearing my dad talk about like the eighties Raiders and even like the seventies Raiders, it's just like how hard nosed and like under John Madden, under Tom Flores, like how much they just beat the shit out of you. And like that offensive line they had in 2000 and 2001, Barry Sims, Barrett Robbins, like they had Lincoln Kennedy, Lincoln Kennedy was like the size of the sun. Like they had monsters. I saw Lincoln Kennedy one time after a football game, after a Raiders home game at the sushi house in Alameda. And he's still like, he could get, he could just, he could just do a, he could do a pool right now. Just pull the whole ass and just like, and just hit a guy, hit an edge rusher for Tyrone Wheatley. Just spread the fucking seat for the whole fucking love Wheatley. Just a Michael Bush. I want to hear your number five. I can talk about this, this, this air for awhile. I want to hear about your number five. All right. Um, I'm going to go, uh, my number five is the hours out after the AFC championship game in 2000. I'm going to go with number three. When the Raiders beat the Tennessee Titans and, um, in network associates, Coliseum. Okay. Like this was, this, this was, this was probably the highlight of my, my Raider fandom. Right. Um, I actually went to this game. I went to both games. Um, my dad's company, uh, my dad, the company that he worked for had season tickets. And for some reason, like he got, he got jugged on the divisional game and the conference, uh, uh, conference championship. Game was good. Right. So I was in, I wasn't in Mount Davis. I was right across from Mount Davis, but it was jumping. And I remember it being fucking freezing that night. I remember it being so cold. It was, it was so cold. It was so loud. And I remember LL Cool J performed at halftime, took off his shirt and my mom screamed very loud in a way that I wasn't, it wasn't ready. It wasn't ready to get to, but, um, it was, um, it was one of the, the great moments. And it gave me so much love. It was one of the, the best moments of my life. It was, it was one of the, the best moments of my life. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. It was, it was one of the, the great moments and it gave me so much level of optimism. The Raiders are back. I mean, they had that team. Um, it was a second year of, uh, the, uh, receiver trio of Jerry Rice and Tim Brown. Then you had Jerry Porter coming out of the slot. Like you had a man, you had, you had Charlie Garner, but you also had Zach Kroger. You had, you had a guy named Jerry Porter. You had a guy named Jerry Porter. Think about those 98 and 99 teams where they go eight and eight and you're building something, right? We kind of had that a little bit in the 2010s as well. But like you had those 98, 99 teams. Then you had that 2000 team. Then you had the tuck rule game, which I don't really want to talk about what we have to talk about during this. But you have that. And then they come back and then they're the fucking Raiders again. And they're going to the Super Bowl and they have the best offense in the league. And they have the best quarterback in the league. Yeah. And they're going to the Super Bowl in San Diego and they're going to beat the brakes off of the Buccaneers. Who are the Buccaneers, right? That's what we're thinking at that point. I remember that night just being so optimistic. Well, no one expected the Bucs to get there. No one expected the Bucs to get there. They didn't expect them to make it through the NFC divisional round. I think they were like playing in the snow somewhere and they somehow sneak it through. And the whole thing with the Raiders was they were going to stay on the entire, the West Coast, that entire playoff run if they won down the stretch in the regular season, which they did. So they play the Jets at home, which is a rematch of a playoff game they played previously and they beat Chad Pennington and the Jets pretty handily. No, we own the Jets. Like historically, we own the Jets. Killed them. And then Tennessee comes to Oakland, Steve McNair, Eddie George, who was putting a thumping on us in that game. If you go back and watch, like he was still getting his, but we just had the better offensive line. We had the better running backs. We had the better quarterback. We had the better receivers. And then defensively, I remember I wrote a letter. I wrote a handwritten letter to John Perella, the free agent defensive tackle we signed prior to that season. We had Sam Adams added. We had Bill Romanowski on defense. Bill Romanowski called Al Davis. This is a four-time Super Bowl champ who had like, the record for consecutive games played at linebacker. He had like eight straight seasons of 16 games. He was found out later that during the stretch, he was taking steroids. A lot going on with Bill Romanowski, but he calls Al Davis before that. Hey, we kind of knew already. We kind of knew a little bit already. We knew. But in 0-2, he's already won four Super Bowls. He calls Al Davis. He's like, I want to help you win another Super Bowl. And then Al Davis calls him back and he's like, I think you look good in silver and black. And then like Romanowski is just there to win a Super Bowl with the Raiders. Can we just like stop and just be like, this was like the final eons of Al Davis having like the Pat Riley effect on guys. He puts his arm on your shoulder and say, you look great in silver and black. And it just gives you just like, just like super juice. Right. And he would do it. It really meant something. Right. Like he did it to Jerry Rice. He did it to Ronnie Lott. He did it to Tim Brown. He basically, he did it to like a lot of watch guys, but his touch just really worked during that time. And not only on that defensive one, you had, you had Rod Woodson in the secondary. You had Charles Woodson as corner. Right. You had, you had Buchanan who was great. Number 31. Yeah. It was one of my favorite. Phillip Buchanan was one of my favorite corners of that era. Right. You had a defensive line that was just stout. Right. Just, just grimy. Rod Coleman. Rod Coleman was a monster, dude. Like an absolute monster. And they finally got a defense that could, that could keep up with the great offense that they had. It was the perfectly built team. It was like if the Clippers had the unction go right. Right. Like it was finally, if you had that old team, like all the NBA teams are trying to do right now, that's what the Raiders did and did it successfully in 2003. Jerry Rice was like 40. Tim Brown. And they kept talking about like the two hall of famers, you know, both these guys are going to wear gold jackets, but they're like Tim Brown's in his late thirties. Jerry Rice is like almost 40 and they're still cutting people up. And this was like Gannon style, like paired with Gruden was like, and this is crazy. And I'm not making this comparison completely, but like partly it's like kind of Brady ask. And then he was hyper dink and dump. And every game you talk about how, you know, Gannon, oh my gosh, he's got, he's got like 10 completions to 10 different receivers, eight completions to eight different receivers. And he's constantly, you know, starting games with like 10 straight completions. He broke the NFL record for completions in a season. I think in a one, he also won the MVP that year. And he broke the record for most 300 yard passing games in a single season with 10 in that year. Like he was breaking ground. Like this is obviously before the passing era and stuff. And like a lot of that, he was taking it all under center, right? Like no gun for Gannon back there. Like all this under center stuff, all this play action screens, like short passes, all this. And like he broke like passing records. That were previously thought of like, you know, like the Marino era and all that stuff. And obviously like how much the league has changed and how much the passing was changing. It's like those records don't mean anything anymore, but like he was breaking ground. Gannon was, and Gruden was too youngest coach in the league calling all the plays, like breaking ground on this like West coast style offense where we don't need real deep speed to beat you. We're just going to cut you up with a thousand paper cuts with, you know, Jerry Rice, Tim Brown, Doug Jolly, the guy who would have no, remember the no gloves, Doug Jolly, just every time he's catching the ball, you know exactly who it was. Yeah. That was a good team. Yeah. Well, I mean, not even only that, like, you know, John Gruden's of the, uh, the, the Holmgren tree, which is, I believe is the, uh, I mean, it's all Bill Walsh, right? Like the West coast offense in general is just all, uh, Bill Walsh. And you could see just, um, just the, the way that that West coast offense was played through perfection, right? You had the perfect West coast offense, uh, type running back and Charlie Garner. You had, um, Tim Brown running fucking cross routes, right? Like you have, like no one can play his own coverage against them because they just like saw it all out. And like Gannon was a perfectionist. Gruden was a perfectionist. My favorite thing was watching replays of Gannon during this stretch and watching the sidearm of him. And this is what I'm coming to be as a quarterback of my, of my, of my own, right? Like the, I played for the Oakland dynamites. Um, fucking right. Yeah. But then my first year was, um, 2001. Right. And so like the person and I play quarterback for them. And that was the, the, the risk Gannon was the person that I like idolize. Like, this is how you be a quarterback, right? It's really, it's really cool to like have a team that's really good with the quarterback that you can idolize. Right. We don't have that anymore. And I remember just trying to throw like sidearm passes. Like, and he would do this thing where he would throw like this and then he would flick it like that. Right. Or he would like do this and like, but he was tall. He didn't have to, he did not have to do it. Right. And I remember like a whole practice when I was with the dynamites. I remember we was at, um, it was at, uh, Ira Jenkins park. And I remember trying to be like rich Gannon throw like this. And my coaches would have a fucking flip. Out brother. Like, no, you throw like this, you throw like this. You do not throw like that. That is how it gets blocked. You are not rich Gannon. That is a direct quote from coach. That's so fun. Um, but like you would have the, it was a perfect offense for everybody involved. Right. And I, can we just also talk about how unheard of it is for rich Gannon to be doing something like this at his age, especially the type of, there's no comparison to rich Gannon's career. There's not trying to find one. Like he joins the Raiders, I think at 33 or 34 years old. Right. He had never been like, he'd only been like a week, one starter. You're our guy once before. And it was with like his second or 13 by then. And like, it didn't really pan out. And like, you had to find an offense that would work for him. But then it was just like rare crescendo moment where like Gruden and Gannon getting together. I think it was second is Gannon or Gruden second year, Gannon's first year when like they really started to, to crescendo and like figure this thing out. And like to a former fourth round pick who the Patriots initially drafted to play running back receiver or defense back, literally anything but quarterback ends up panning out as a quarterback. Oh, eventually becomes an MVP goes to, to super like leads a team. It doesn't make sense. He's of the Jim Pluckett, um, Darrell, Monica, um, Ken Stabler, Ken Stabler. He's of that ilk, right? And a perfect Raiders quarterback. If you look down the line, like if you look like staffer stat Raiders have terrible quarterbacks, this is not our strong suit, right? But the art type is they are, they're a quarterback away from just, they just need minimal quarterback play, right? To win a Superbowl references by your hat. That you're wearing right now. The win over the Vikings, right? Just minimal quarterback play. We'll do fine. The defense will bring us home. We have some offensive guys. Marcus Allen will get it, you know, crazy run and we'll be fine. We'll get the fuck up out of here. Right. But Rich Gannon just kind of threw that archetype on his head because on paper, he is a late stage type of Raider quarterback that you get, right? But we're not expecting him to fucking ball, right? We're not expecting him to be, um, the MVP of the league. Like Rich Gannon basically is Todd Marinovich. What's wrong? Marinovich was supposed to be like, he basically was that right. And that was the guy, but he's like that at 34. His dad, Marinovich is dad. I'm pretty sure is the one who's like rubbing HGH on him as a kid. So like he was trying to build the perfect quarterback. Yes. Yes. Look at some Marinovich stories. If you can, this pod is going to go too long. If we dive into Marinovich, I want to take a break and then I'll give you my five. We can spend all day on, on the Gannon Superboy. I definitely think that's the peak of my lifetime and I don't know how much longer it will be. I hope not that much longer, but when, when we get back, I'll give you my five. We're going to get. This episode is brought to you by ethos. Buying a house is one of those moments where you realize, oh yeah, I have responsibilities now. And if you have a family, you want to know they could stay in that house. If something happened to you, ethos makes life insurance painless, get a quote in seconds, apply in minutes, all online with no medical exam, take 10 minutes to get covered today with life insurance through ethos. Get your free quote at ethos.com slash ringer. And FF, that is E T H O S.com slash ringer. NFL application times may vary. Rates may vary a lot sadder. I think moving forward. All right. Number five on my list. You mentioned it was a brief moment after that, that Tennessee win and going into the Superbowl. This was a brief moment as well. It is a 2007 to oh nine. I call it the Jamarcus era. And I was in Mount Davis for Jamarcus Russell's first pass week 13, against Denver. He was the number one overall pick. It was this guy that, you know, my dad always told me he could throw 40 yards sitting on his ass. And, and it felt like he was sitting on his ass the entire time. He was with the Raiders because his work ethic work ethic was terrible. I had, I was colleagues with Bruce Gretkowski, who was a quarterback. I'm sure, you know, with the Raiders in like oh nine, oh 10 or oh nine and 10. And he told me that to get Jamarcus Russell to watch film. And there's a lot of stories like this, like the blank DVD stuff where like they gave him a practice film DVD and said, watch it. Then he comes back today. He said like, yeah, that looks good. But the DVD was blank this time. Bruce Bruce told me that to get him to watch film, he and the other backup quarterback would have to go to his, house and bring Wendy's, four double cheeseburgers and four fries. And they'd get into his house and he'd be laying in this giant ass bed. And there's always other people in his house. No one really knew who they were. There are other people there. This guy held out for a $60 million contract, held out through week one. He's a piece of shit for all the money. And then this year, they're trying to get him to watch film and they literally give him the burgers and go through the film with him just to get him to watch it. This is the kind of laziness that was there. And why I was excited, it was the first time that we'd invested in my lifetime, a first round pick, in a quarterback. It was the first time we've invested the number one overall pick in a quarterback. And all the ceilings that people talk about with this guy, rocket arm, 80 yards on his feet, just legitimately a hose of an arm and this big body quarterback that I thought was going to change things. After that first pass, he plays a little bit. The rest of that season doesn't look that good. And even going into 2009, because he plays. I think he gets his first official start the last year or last game of that 2007 season. It looks like shit against San Diego. And then 2009, they give the keys to him. And it's just a complete disaster. One of the worst seasons. One of the worst seasons in Raiders history gets into. Or no, it's 08 and then 09 by then. He's benched and Tom Cable benched him and they never really play him again. He's completely out. But they say you always love your first. The Michael Bush, Darren McFadden, Zach Miller, Johnny Lee Higgins, Namdi Asimov, Derek Burgess. We had guys. And I thought Jamarcus was going to be able to unlock this piece and legitimately sets the franchise back another 20 years. And they had not drafted a first round quarterback. You know, since until Fernando this year, and obviously the first overall pick as well. It has been 20 years since we've made that kind of investment. I do think Jamarcus is a big reason why the league or the team was set back as far as it was. Okay. So there's a lot of things to go with this. First off, I'm going to. I have compiled a list of quotes from people going into the draft about Jamarcus. Oh, let's go. I can't remember being in such awe of a quarterback in my decade of attending combines and pro games. ESPN's Todd McShay. John Elway-like. ESPN's Mel Kiper. John Elway-like. It was very upsetting to watch Jamarcus Russell, Brady Quinn, and all these guys beating over the head like they have flaws. Cleveland GM, Phil Savage. Wow. So that was weird. And I just want to say, Jamarcus Russell at LSU was fucking awesome. Can we just acknowledge that, please? Can we just acknowledge that he was awesome in his junior year? He wins the Manning Award. Wins MVP of the Sugar Bowl against Brady Quinn. Kicked the shit out of Notre Dame, right? Was just like, just an all. And this is also coming on the heels of what we saw in the early 2000s from a guy like Dante Culpepper, right? We really love these big quarterbacks, right? Who could be mobile, right? And black. And he comes into this and it seemed like it was the perfect storm of bad team, bad fit as a player, right? Because you can pile on Jamarcus Russell all day. And I am going to at some points in this segment, but we do have to acknowledge the team that he was going into, right? This wasn't like it was a team that was organizationally sound. You know what I mean? That could get a quarterback to read the playbook and that there was just so much going on, right? Lane Kiffin didn't even. Lane Kiffin didn't want him. It was so funny because I sent you the video of the time when Jamarcus Russell got drafted. I sent you the video on Slack. And it's such an emotional rollercoaster because up until that, up until the time Jamarcus Russell's name gets called, I didn't even realize this. I just thought like my memory back in the day just was like, oh, Jamarcus Russell was the consistence number one pick. Like he just was, right? Even over Calvin Johnson, that's how good of a season that he had and the Raiders needed a quarterback. But if you look at that video, of Jamarcus getting traded or getting drafted, excuse me, it's up until the last minute, the Raiders are thinking about trading the pick, trading down to get Brady Quinn. They're also thinking about, okay, maybe we should get Calvin Johnson. There's just so much going on. They took like five minutes to figure out a decision and then Al Davis was like, no, we're picking Jamarcus Russell. Yeah. Because I said so. And he goes into that organization that is like, just like. Just like. From the Stone Ages. Like the Raiders from all, like throughout my existence have been in the Stone Age. But like to give you guys some perspective of how much the Stone Ages the Raiders were in, they would, up until like 2011, up until Al Davis is dead, I believe, they were, the way that they got their checks were they would go to the Oakland Hilton and pick up paper checks. Wait, I didn't know that. I did not know that. Yes. So this is the organization he's going into, right? Like the receivers were bad, line was bad, but even as a, as a team, they cut corners on salary, they cut corners on, on everything, right? Like they don't have a coach put in place. We were gritty though. We were gritty. Like Mount Davis and the Oakland Coliseum, or then it was like probably McAfee by then, like McAfee Coliseum. Like it was like, we know this is the worst stadium. We know we have a baseball field. This is the worst organization in professional sports. Yeah. Right. And then you bring a guy who clearly like, you know, how it looks at what we know now, had a substance abuse problem. Right. And then like you bring him into this, you don't give him any guidance. Right. You don't give him anything to, um, you know, lay his hat on. He sees just the dysfunction. It's not like you don't bring a guy like that into an organization like that. There was a, it was, it was an interview that, um, this brings it back to your Marcus Russell kind of just seen where his mind was at the time I was watching him on the pivot podcast, um, that he had really good interview. You guys should go check it out. But one of the things that he said was like, I went into, um, you know, this building and I quickly realized that like, shoot, if you put Tom Brady or or, um, or Peyton Manning in this building, it wouldn't turn things around. And I'm like, you're the quarterback. It's literally your job. One Peyton Manning and Tom Brady would turn this thing around and it's literally your job to do so. Right. So like, he just clearly didn't understand the weight of what being a quarterback on a professional level is. Right. Because at that time, especially then in college, you're in a more structured environment. Um, and you know, everything is kind of put in your hands and you know, when you're in the professional ranks, you're pretty much doing the same thing. You're doing the same thing. I have all that time to yourself and the Raiders of all places are not going to put a program in place to help you be good. So this is terrible all the way around. I mean, Al had like, it was in the last few years of his life and still had like kind of complete ownership of the decisions that were being made. Lane Kiffin, who he hired, you know, kind of, I think, I think thinking about Gruden at the moment, he was the youngest coach in the NFL, youngest coach ever hired when Lane Kiffin was hired for that 2007 season. He was only 31 years old. Lane Kiffin had never been a head coach any level ever before. And now he's the head coach of the Oakland Raiders with the number one overall pick with a quarterback. Like you said, like we find out later has substance problems, substance abuse problems, but then also has like an overall like work ethic problem that like he has to navigate. And you know, Lane Kiffin is not even the own, you know, the leader on this team. He's barely 31, 32 years old. Like I feel like it was going to be very difficult for Lane to handle the situation. Like Warren Sapp was on the team and he didn't, and he wanted Megatron. Like Lane Kiffin has said that he wanted Calvin Johnson, which is also like, it does make sense in hindsight, but also, but who's going to throw Calvin Johnson? Yeah. Yeah. No, I mean, we had Charlie Fry, Kyle Bowler, Andrew Walter, Bruce, it was like a really bad stretch of quarterbacks and like what ends up happening with Lane. So he has that 07 season where Jamarcus doesn't even start playing until week 13, the quarterbacks ahead of them. Like I think it was like Josh McCown, like dog shit team looks like that look bad four games into next season. Remember this guy has never been a head coach ever four games into 2008 fire, but they fire Lane Kiffin. He's not barely even scratching the surface on getting experience. They fire him. They move on to Tom Cable, who's kind of fucking awesome. He like punches a guy in 2009, which is great. He's one of my moments coming up. We'll get to him later, but like we'll get into, we'll talk Tom Cable, but like in 09, Cable gives him the keys. Cause I was like, you got to start this guy. He plays like shit. And then 08, they end up, or, or, or no way he plays like shit. And then 09, they end up benching him. And when you go back and look at, I pulled this data to Marcus Russell among all quarterbacks with at least 700 dropbacks in their career since the year 2000, it's 153 total. He has the worst EPA per dropback and success rate and completion. No quarterback in the last 26 years has ever done worse with 700 dropbacks that your Marcus Russell has. He was literally the worst. Zach Wilson's the only one who's even coming close. And you're right in that it was, you know, uh, you know, a handful of, of errors. So it's like a comedy of errors that kind of led to this situation. But I do think that, you know, there, I was watching some old regular season games from 2008, 2009. And the broadcasters are like this Raider team boos when your Marcus Russell's comes in or this Raiders fans boo when he comes in. Like we were done with him early in 2008. Like he barely got a year and a half before Raiders fans were upset with just all the stuff that we were hearing about his work ethic and him not getting better and him just looking like kind of just a piece of shit. And then they fire lane and we're trying to move on. Like that whole, that whole to Marcus runs. Like it was the second that we drafted him. I'm like, Oh my God, we're turning the corner. And then the following year draft, Darren McFadden, who's awesome. Then we drafted it was here at Bay. We're trying to throw the resources at it. And it just, it just never panned out. All right. We got to stop talking to Marcus Russell though. You got to give me your number four, four on the list. I'm just, I think I want to just bring some happiness right here. Right. I don't want to do it. Let me do it. It's fine. I'm going to go with a 2010 season, um, where the Raiders go, I believe that's number three on my list. That's number three. They go seven to nine. They, they, they sweep the division. Tom cables, the, the, the coach of the team. Um, I was at the chiefs game. They played the chiefs mid season was a weird brainy game that they had. And that was a Jacoby Ford game where the Jacoby Ford game, just YouTube, the Jacoby Ford game. It's in the rain. I was in the black hole for the Jacoby Ford gave. I was in the black hole. Me and my homie snuck down to go walk down for that game. And it was incredible. There was a fight that happened. It was amazing. But that game was great. The Raiders swept the division. Every victory came against a rival. They even beat the Seahawks, who was basically a division rival for a long time. They actually went eight and eight. That team was coached by Tom Cable. Offensive coordinator was Hugh Jackson, who I'm sure we will talk about for a minute. But they beat the Chargers twice. They beat the Chiefs twice. They beat the breaks off the Broncos. Darren McFadden was a man. It was just, oh, my God. It was the best kind of season. I really, truly believe this. The second best season that you can have as a fan of a team, behind, obviously, the championship-winning team, is the first season where your team just shows some spark. Where they go eight and eight. There's no expectations, but they defy even the ones that they do have. It was great. Jason Campbell was my quarterback. Why not? Right? Why the fuck not? Jacoby Ford was my wideout. It was great. Darren McFadden, it was great. There were vibes. There were no expectations. It was a fun one. The thing, though, about the Raiders, though, is you have to only take them in seasons. Just take it for what it is throughout the season, because it's not a promise of anything to come, is all I would say. But the 2010 team was my moment where I felt a lot of optimism. It's an unimpeachable year. There's nothing you can tell me. It's similar to 2015. It's great. I look back on it fondly. I have it number three on my list, skipping number four. Number three, I call it the cable guy and Jason Campbell, not Hugh Jackson. I have it stretching out from 2010 to 2011. The 11 being that first six games with Jason Campbell before he breaks his collarbone in week six, up 14-7. Against the Browns. This is within days after Al Davis has died. Al Davis, one of the last things that he did was he did not renew the contract with Tom Cable from 2010, that cool 8-8 season. Michael Bush and Derek McFadden are like this sick-ass combo, and we're finally figuring out a quarterback like Jason Campbell. I think he was 29 years old in 2009. We brought him in and weren't expecting much, but you could tell he was just a Raider. Right away, he felt like a Raider in his greediness. He had better scramble ability than Jamarcus Russell ever had. You started to just see a little bit. More mobility, better decision-making. It was all this no-interception stuff. 2011 starts, Jason Campbell goes 4-2 to start that season. Raiders are looking good. Tom Cable's gone, but Hugh Jackson's the coach. He breaks his collarbone within days after Al Davis dying. Hugh Jackson, this is in my dishonorable mention, Hugh Jackson grabs hold of the franchise. He's basically Doc Rivers. He's basically Doc Rivers in 2014 with the Clippers. He's like the GM owner. Hugh Jackson's one of the losing head coaches of all time. He has this run. He has a run with the Browns. That's on hard knocks. That's deplorable. Makes him look. I don't think he ever got a job after that, how bad he looked. And Hugh Jackson takes the reins of this team and says, we're trading two first-round picks. Or a first and a second-round pick that would have became another first if they made the AFC Championship. Hilarious. But they trade a first and a second for Carson Palmer halfway through the season. This trade that comes through, like I said, within days after Al Davis dying. And he legitimately tries to turn the franchise over overnight. And Carson Palmer doesn't really fan out. He had a couple of good games. Moments. Moments. But even when you look at from 2011 to 2012, that stretch where Carson Palmer's playing, he's very dead on with what Campbell, the production he was giving us from an efficiency perspective before then. It just felt like we took two steps backward. Right after Tom Cable stopped. Austin, can I be real, though? I kind of liked it when it happened. I wasn't mad at it when it happened. I kind of fucked with it when it happened. I was not pissed. I was like, let's keep it going. Let's keep it. It was just pure hubris. And honestly, even with the benefit of hindsight, and it's even stupid that they did it for all the reasons that you say it does. I looked at a 45-minute highlight tape from that year. I got a jolt. From Palmer? I got a fucking jolt. No, from the team in general. I just got a jolt. Oh, I see. Oh, this was great. I wanted to just to compare the trade. That first and second round pick for Carson. It reminded me so much. And it reminded me at the time when we traded a first and Napoleon Harris for Randy Moss. And you bring Randy Moss over and he plays a second round pick for Carson. And he plays like fine. I mean, people are like, oh my God, he was terrible. He had a thousand yards in his first year. He clearly didn't want to be there. Who was his quarterback, bro? It was all bad, right? But we brought Randy Moss in. He was fine. Then we trade him for scraps. And he ends up having this record season with the Patriots. And then with Carson Palmer, we traded a first and second round pick for him in 2011. And we traded him for a sixth and seventh round pick swap two years later. It's like, what the fuck are we doing? They were so short-sighted immediately after Al died. It took really long. It took really long. It took really long. It took Reggie McKenzie years to get back on track. Exactly. That's the GM who originally drafted Derek Carr and Khalil Mack. And that's like this new reset that we'll probably get to eventually. But Reggie McKenzie, one of the first things that he did, he's like, the cap situation is terrible. Remember when they signed, who was it? Jalen Walker? Or was it Jalen Walker? Or no, I'm missing it. The receiver over from the Broncos who was. Sorry, with a J. But he was Javon Walker. Javon Walker. It was an absolute dumpster fire for Aiden signing. It just started to turn into all that. But yeah, man. Yeah. The fun anecdote that I do have from that season, though, was my cousin actually played for that Raiders team. What? The 2010-2011 team. Jerome Boyd. Wow, okay. He played for that team. And I remember him. I remember I was still holding on to the football dream. And I remember asking him, because they played against the Green Bay Packers that year. And I was like, yo, what's it like going up against Aaron Rodgers? Jerome was a strong guy. He was a strong safety for the team. And I'm like, what's it like going against Aaron Rodgers? And he was like, yeah, man, he's so smart. I remember I went in for a blitz, just to act like I was about to blitz. And Aaron Rodgers is doing his little calls and being like, 30's not doing shit. Because Jerome was at the line. He was like, 30's not going to do shit. Don't even worry about him. And then he just threw a bomb. And that was a game I think the Packers blew out the Raiders. But that was a fun story, because it was really cool that my cousin was on my favorite team. That was really dope. Yeah, that's right. I don't think I ever had a close friend play for the Raiders. I would have been a big fan. I remember. Yeah, I think. I don't remember Boyd though. I would have to go back and grind the tape. I want to get to my number four. And I want to move quickly because this should have never happened. But I was drunkenly optimistic when Pete Carroll and Geno Smith was happening last year. We both were. No, we both were. I remember being hammered at my bachelor party. I got married last year. We made the trade for Geno Smith. It was a third-round pick. And I was like, Dude, we're coming off the whole Daniels-Antonio Pierce stuff that was tragic. I felt like we were getting an adult in the room. We're bringing in Geno. I was excited by the Chip Kelly thing at the time. Not really thinking about them never having worked together and maybe that being a problem. I also was not thinking enough about Pete Carroll's age or any of that. But I got caught sipping the Kool-Aid thinking, Brock Bowers, Michael Mayer, Gen T. I was like, You know what? Maybe this will work. Maybe this is what we needed. You weren't wrong though. But you weren't wrong though. You were not wrong. I was right there with you. We were in the slack together. We were just like, Oh. It was a summer of just like, Fuck it. Right? Pete Carroll's the coach? Fuck it. Right? Chip Kelly, I said this. This is verbatim. I wouldn't want him to be my head coach, but like, Offensive coordinator? That sounds cool. Fuck it. Right? Let's just do it. Let's go ahead. And then, I feel like me and you almost both got fired for how excited we were after the first game against the Packers. We were really, really too excited. We were talking a lot of shit in those ring of slacks. And I thought, I thought I was going to get fired. I'm not going to lie. I thought it was over with. I almost texted Bill. I think I shot a text to Bill and was like, Hey, better luck there. Some bullshit. I don't know what I said. I think I didn't text him, but I almost did. If I did, it would have been like the unsin because like, it was, it was that way. Well, when Gino threw that fucking pass, towards the end to seal that game against the Patriots, I was all in. He had like 300 plus yards and like the rain on the road in week one. I tweeted and then deleted. I said, this was what Jamarcus Russell was supposed to be. And I did the video of that. And then I just said, you know what? This is only week one and I deleted it. And I was done with Twitter after that. They beat the team that ends up going to the Super Bowl and the Patriots. And I remember after that game feeling like, this is legit. Gino threw 300 plus yards. Brock looks good. Mayer looks good. Looks like we can run the ball. Like defense, we're still figuring out. Jinty is a boy. Jinty is good. Yes. Yes. And, and then I feel like Bowers gets hurt in that game. You're starting to feel it. You're starting to see Colton, Colton Miller goes down the left tackle. I think it was injuries that stacked up. Mayer got hurt. I think concussions or something. And then, you know, it all started to kind of like collapse in when the mistakes start to rock, like kind of add up. And then you find out, you know, Pete's son. Chip Kelly is my offensive coordinator. Damn. Yes. Yes. And then the reports were like Chip Kelly's like calling plays that they didn't practice in the week prior. The offensive line for the Raiders was meeting without the offensive line coach, Pete's son, because they felt like they couldn't get better with him. Like that's how bad things were when you start to see the reports coming out. Like the whole, Pete, Chip, his son's Geno experience really fell flat on his face when like none of these guys knew how to work together to solve these problems. And even the guys, even working on their own, they did not have like the chops to really iron out. Well, we're going to be a lot of problems with the roster and all that stuff overall. Like I feel like we were right, like you said, going to be hyped going in, but the wheels fell off quickly and the reasons for them falling off kind of pretty clear. You know, Pete doesn't have it anymore. You know, the Seattle Seahawks don't win the Super Bowl last year with Mike McDonald. If they stayed committed and a lot of teams would have done this, they'd committed to Pete before like he was willing to retire. Like they gave him this whole golden parachute senior advisor bullshit and then he tries to come back coaching next year and he clearly doesn't have it. Well, it was like the Raider way, man. We like to get a lot of people that are washed and past their prime, right? It worked in the early 2000s. And then, like, we've just been trying to do that formula ever since. You want Art Shell? Fuck it. Let's do it, right? Let's get him. He hasn't coached in 20 years. Let's have him coach Randy Moss, right? Let's have him coach Warren Sapp. I'm just sad right now. God, Warren Sapp. Good Raider. So, he had a good year. He led a number two defense, but, you know, Art Shell was coaching him when we were 2-14. Yeah. All right, let's take another break, and then we'll get to our top three. You already know my three. This episode is brought to you by Nationwide. A football team is so much more than a set of players. It's a complete roster filled with depth and grit. It's offense and defense coming together to make something unstoppable. It's like how Nationwide is so much more than a great insurance company. They're one of America's largest financial services companies, too. Insurance and financial services together, that's a whole team. In and of itself. Team Nationwide. For your insurance and financial needs, Nationwide is on your side. Nationwide Investment Services Corporation, member FINRA, Columbus, Ohio. This episode is brought to you by Chevrolet. Chevy drivers need a truck that shows up the same way they do. That's why Chevy Silverado is number one in manufacturer loyalty, so they can go where others won't. Make their own way there and always get it done. And as long as Chevy people keep showing up, we'll keep building trucks that do the same. Chevrolet. Together, let's drive. Visit chevy.com slash trucks to explore the lineup. The Cable Guy and Jason Campbell, but you don't know my top two. We'll get to your top three. Let's take a break real quick. All right. It's time for number three. I want to know where you're going. I'm ready to relive these moments. I hope it's not the one I have saved for one. I'm really excited to relive those moments with you, but let's hear your three. 15 Raiders. Okay. Which is the season. Like I said previously, I love the season before the season, and this was absolutely the season before the season. The Raiders go seven and nine, laying the foundation for what will be their 12 and four postseason run in 2016. But this is when the babies kind of come into form, right? This is when Reggie McKenzie's draft picks finally blossom, right? You got Derek Carr, quarterback, just slinging the ball. He's not scared in the pocket. This is the year where the comeback year where he's just like slinging. It's to Amari Cooper. This is when Latavius Murray is like, is he McFadden 2.0? I don't know if he's really good. I like it. I like it. Khalil Mack, who's like is beginning a career where he's one of the defining edge wrestlers of a generation. Right. And there were just like really fun things, man. Like that last second fade in Baltimore. Right. You had Michael Crabtree, who was just just amazing. Right. Yeah. So another another pickup where you think the guy's washed and he goes, oh, my God. Those are the Raiders and he becomes something. Right. Yes. Yes. And they beat the Broncos in Denver where Khalil Mack had five sacks. Right. Like it's like we're building something. We're not just getting lost stars off the scrap heap. Right. We're not getting disgruntled scars without a plan. We have something. Right. Woodson's on the team. Like, yeah, he comes back. Holding up the O. Like, it was so sick one of those games where he's just like holding up the O, the black hole. And you're like, dude, I love Woodson so much. Woodson is like one of my favorite Raiders. He's one of my all time favorite. He is my favorite Raider. He's my favorite Raider. We should not let him go. He should have. He did end his career silver and black, but he should have never left. Yeah. So 2015 Raiders are my. It's also you're one of Del Rio. Right. Like that's the, you know, I think a commonality that I've hit on a bunch when I've written about the Raiders for the ringer or just like talked about it is, you know, how many coaches they've hired and fired really since that, you know, 2000 run. Right. Like starting with trading John Gruden and promoting the offensive coordinator. Uh, Bill Callahan, who didn't even want to call plays. He ended up having Mark Trestman call plays to that Superbowl run. Like since then they've had 14 different head coaches. No other team has had more than 11. That's the Cleveland Browns. And the average for every NFL team since then is seven. They've had double the average. Like, and, and so much of it is this like snip snap and like kind of the theme for this list. It's like, it's just a constant restart. Pete Carroll and Gino Smith and Chip Kelly. Let's get it going. Like, Oh, 2010, here comes Tom Cable and Jason Campbell. And Darren McFadden and Michael Bush and Hayward Bay. And like, and then it like resets again. And like, then they fire Cable and bring in Hugh Jackson. And then they fire Josh McDaniels and bring in Pierce. And then they fire Dennis Allen and bring in the next guy. Like they just have cycled through so many coaches and Del Rio in 2015, you started to feel it. And we'll get to my list when we start talking about 2016, but like Del Rio, you could really feel like, again, like, and this is like easy to say to you, but hard to kind of say to the listeners. It's like, he felt like a Raider, like right away. It's like, Oh man, this guy is gritty. He's tough. He, he wants to beat people up. He wants like, and like, yes, he's going to go for two to win a game in the season opener. Oh my God. That's 2016. We're going to get to 2016. We got to say, we got to say for 2016, I'm going to jump to my number two. And this might be like giving things away, but I think we have to talk about this before we get to 2016. Number two is right. Fricking now, dude, Tom Brady, Fernando Mendoza, Clint Kubiak, I think that a lot of the things that I want. I think they're going to be like, Oh my God, this is the first, this is the first, first round pick at quarterback. The Raiders have made since Jamarcus Russell. That's the first number one overall pick they've obviously made at quarterback since Jamarcus. I think Fernando Mendoza is nowhere near the arm talent and ceiling that people thought Jamarcus Russell was coming out, but the floor might be 10 stories higher with the work ethic and all this like character stuff that we're really excited by. And I think the, you know, you mentioned is this like calamity of errors when Jamarcus came in with Lane Kiffin, the youngest coach ever hired, never been a head coach before was not going to give that long of a leash. Literally lasted a season and four games. I mean, that's a lot of time. I mean, I think that's a lot of time. I think that's a lot of time. with that being the plan going in, right? The plan going in is like, hey, we're going to. you can talk me into this if Kirk Cousins can get you like a good month and a half right and then you know he kind of waddles and it's like it's very it's time to put in Fernando you can get six wins out of that that's fine I think I'm not worried about wins actually I'm worried about how many games Fernando plays and I think Fernando the most he should play is like five I think he should let Kirk run through the five I'm just so scarred from Jamarca's wrestling experience man like I'm just I know he's not that I know he's not that I know he's not that I'm just I gotta wait and see you're right last summer I was really I was very excited you talked me into a lot of stuff I was like really geek I just gotta see it happen man no you're right you know I really also by the way I'm just gonna ask for this before I get into my next moment tickets for Raiders Niners are through the roof so if any Ringer people or anybody out there listening wanna like you know how about you boy holla at me in San Francisco that would be sick in Santa Clara yeah it's a train ride yeah okay we gotta get this out of the way I'm gonna go to mine this is number two yeah this is number two okay I'm gonna go with the because we gotta get it out of the way let's do the tuck rule game man let's go to the season going with the tuck rule we have to do it we're going back I love it we have to do it where were you when it happened everybody knows who's listening I was with my dad I was with my dad watching it on TV and I mean he just legitimately was jumping up and down screaming expletives and like I didn't understand what was happening I did I did not understand how how like the call could get reversed like the call on the field was a fumble was a fumble and there was enough evidence and it still is a fumble there's enough evidence to not just support that it was not a fumble but enough evidence to overturn the call on a field to call it a pass when like clearly and like this whole tuck rule thing like it's like well he doesn't have to be throwing a pass if he tucks it it's all bullshit can I read the rule can I read the rule read the rule NFO rule 3 section 22 article 2 note 2 when an offensive player is holding the ball to pass it forward any intentional forward movement of his arm starts a forward pass even if the player loses possession of the ball he is attempting to tuck it back toward his body also if the player has tucked the ball into his body and loses the possession it is a fumble this this rule was abolished on March 20th 2013 by a 29 to 1 vote just one of the dumbest rules to ever be in the book and it's a nonsensical rule that if the quarterback is even if he's still trying to tuck it it counts as a pass that is not there's a reason it was abolished like it makes no sense at all and you watch it a hundred times over and every single time like it just makes zero sense do you think I don't know if this has ever been this has ever been axed but do you think this is like karma for the holy roller all the shit that happened for us in the 70s where we just got all the luck in the world kind of the sea of hands against the dolphins the holy roller the ghost of the post I mean we were also like cheating a bunch in the 80s and 90s or 70s and 80s just like filling but everybody was everyone was everyone I don't know I think it was just legitimately an awful like you see the I've seen the interview of the ref who called and he's like it's still an incomplete pass it's just like an it's just like an insanely abhorrent error by that ref like I don't even think Brady thought it was a pass like no one was advocating that it was that was good so hold on hold on so there is a clip that maybe we put in the description or whatever there's a clip that I sent you I don't know if it's a football life it might be a football life on the tuck rule and it's Brady and Charles Woodson discussing it and Brady's basically just saying it was a fumble right he's basically just saying it but I won a championship it was perfect Patriots just propaganda there right how did that video make you feel knowing that everybody knows it was a fumble probably the ref does too just doesn't want to admit it but how does that make you feel after all these years I got a stomach ache when I saw Brady like trying to play fight Charles Woodson after like I think Brady's off field behavior is cringy a lot of the time and I think that it sucks that Gruden never got another chance I obviously got Gruden part two and like when he was hired back in like 2018 or whatever like but like that was the last game we saw that combination of Gruden Gruden Gannon like that team that like went to the Super Bowl the next year that was the last time we saw a Gruden a piece of it the only time we saw Gruden again was in the Super Bowl when they beat the shit out of him like I feel like it was such a raw deal for Gruden to go out like that and like you read back on like what was happening and why they traded Gruden for two first round picks like in that that offseason it was like contract negotiations like stalled and you know it was probably some big ego play between the youngest head coach in the NFL some fiery guy that's like changing offense for you and Al Davis who obviously is like his way or the highway type of thing and when they finally got that opportunity to maybe get you know two first round picks like the Bucs were talking about firing Dungy and hiring Bill Barcells but then like those didn't end up like going through so they end up making this like big trade for Gruden I just can't believe that Al with everything that he's known like hiring Flores hiring Madden like why he felt trading Gruden when he did was gonna actually make this team better and I'm sure he but then you go to that offseason they spent so much money in freeing right they signed Rod Woodson they signed John Perella they signed Sam Adams they signed all on defense like and like Al Al was like fuck it I'm just gonna pay all this money to make the defense sick and as long as you know Callahan was the OC just kind of keep this offense afloat we should be good and he was kind of right but every year after that every year we've been battling to kind of recreate that like Gruden level leadership that we had in part one like it just hasn't happened this is from the great Scott Osler okay this is a column um right before I believe it was right after uh uh Gruden left and he said this is the relationship he speaks on the relationship between um Al Davis and John Gruden and he compares them to young Elvis and old Elvis old Elvis is Davis the Raiders godfather he's the NFL's rebel without a pause creator of the Raider mystique he still greases his hair on his back like Grandpa Rock and is deeply involved with the team and speaks in public as often as the real Elvis young Elvis young Elvis is Gruden the first year rockstar coach in big sports since Pat Riley catwalked the sidelines for the Lakers and Knicks if someone put out a calendar of hunky coaches Gruden would be January through June this player sees him as Sergeant Rock buoyant and teeth leading them out of the trench and that's what was what was going at each other right it was very much a battle of egos right like Al Davis didn't want to pay him he pays players that's the old school ownership state of mind and he didn't want to pay Gruden and Gruden was getting a little bit too much power right and that's basically it was a power struggle and then Gruden goes back however many years later and cashes in on that Davis money dude he was I mean like go like only a few years into that 10 year 100 million dollar deal I'm so happy by the way that we haven't spent any breath on Mark Davis and his ownership since he's taken over for his dad let's not even do it because it's not even worth it it's not even worth it it's not even worth it I'm going to go I'm going to go to my number one okay it's not the 2015 Raiders it's the 2016 Raiders it's Blackjack Del Rio and Derek Carr before Christmas Eve 2016 I want to walk you through some of the games going in to that you know that that game against the Colts we go for two in week one in New Orleans we have not won at that time a week one game in like 10 plus years we go for two to win it in regulation and it's Derek Carr to the crab and it is incredible like I was on cloud nine I cannot believe we went for it to win and we did in week one like something we had not done in a long time then down the stretch we have the Tampa Bay OT thriller where it's still I think the record for the most penalties any team has ever gotten in a game that they've won we won an OT with Seth Roberts we won a game we won a game when we had penalties bro that never happens it never happens at least in our lifetime that happened in our parents' lifetime all the time they would always win the game and the penalty battle yeah yeah and that's in that stretch they win 10 of their first 12 with Del Rio and including one too where Derek Carr like has a really bad pinky injury against the Carolina Panthers and it has to come back it ends up coming back and they win that game calls the pinky game like they were they were on this run right like week one was crazy the Tampa Bay game was crazy Panthers was crazy and we're the league darlings we're actually the league darlings everyone it's year three of Derek Carr it's I think year three or no year two of Del Rio and you know Murray's going crazy the team is just awesome we had like arguably the best offensive line in the league right which I think is a commonality with the 2000 2001 2002 teams where they had like Barrett Robbins Barry Sims Lincoln Kennedy like we were talking before on this 2016 line Colette Yosemite Rodney Hudson Donald Penn all on the left side all pro bowlers Donald Penn had allowed zero sacks that season up until this point we're playing the Colts we're up 33 I believe 33 to 7 Jalen Rashard running back that we had was going off DeAndre Washington our rookie running back was going off we were we were having our way with them Carr's throwing to fucking Andre Holmes and Clive Wolford and we're still dominating then the first sack and only sack Donald Penn gives up all season against veteran Trent Cole turns the corner wraps up Derek Carr's leg in a funky way why we're throwing the ball you know Mark Davis question giving him that second but it was like second and 22 like it made sense to throw it breaks his leg and you know the immediate we go to the playoffs we get blown out by Houston in the playoffs it doesn't even fucking matter and the offseason season in June, we give Derek Carr what was then the biggest contract in NFL history. And, you know, that's all she wrote, dude. Like that 2016 run, we went 12-4 that year. It was, I think, still the best chance we've had, by a lot, the best chance we've had to go on another run since that 0-1 season. And obviously, it was just snapped, just like that, with the broken leg. And like everything, Derek Carr was never the same. The Raiders were never the same. Darío was never the same. And it kind of reset this cycle of rebuilding and rebuilding and rebuilding. And that was 10 years ago, Logan. That was 10 years ago. And that sets the stage for John Gruden to just tear it down. Like, which really just pissed me off. Even like in the moment, it pissed me off. But all of Reggie McKenzie's work just gets torn down for no other reason than John Gruden's finally in charge and he feels like he has to do stuff. Let's trade Khalil Mack and get Vontaze Burfik. Why not, right? Let's get Ruchi Incognito. Oh, my God. Like, why are we doing this, bro? And that's why like Gruden part two for, you know, Raiders fans at the time, a lot of Raiders fans I knew, they were so excited when we got Gruden back, especially like dad-aged Raiders fans. People were stoked. I was skeptical. And then immediately made, hated it when we traded Khalil Mack. And even as like a nerd and like a PFF guy, all of the analytics were like, this is a great trade for the Raiders. They're getting a life's return. If they hit on these first round picks, blah, blah, blah. In the same year that Gruden's first year back, he trades away Khalil Mack and then in the season trades Amari Cooper. And I remember feeling like, you know, I don't know. I don't know. I don't know. Like I said, that 2016 season's gone. Like all that's gone. Like all of this. And then he's like, oh, all dead. And it's the classic like bad organization thing where you trade guys that you draft for just established guys. They basically flipped Amari Cooper for Antonio Brown and he didn't play it down for them. Yeah. I mean, all those first round picks were like Jonathan Abrams, safety sucked. You traded for, you know, Josh Jacobs who like they couldn't even get a second contract was maybe a good pick, couldn't get a second contract to it. It was terrible. I want to take the John Gruden, John Gruden like looks at it, doesn't do shit for him in terms of, you know, he has like, he's like the smart guy that has a lot of buzzwords that don't really mean anything. He's way past his prime. But he's emotional, right? And I think when you're drafting players, like emotion is actually can get you caught up, right? When the whole Cleland Furl pick over Josh, like it made no sense. Like the players that he was picking, I think he got, I think over emotional and over invested in these guys that like felt like were his guys. And like, that was the whole thing. He traded away Cleland Mack, traded away Amari Cooper for the opportunity. There's three new first round picks to bring in his guys. And the guys that he brought in clearly weren't it. And then, you know, everything happens with the, you know, the emails get fired. They were guys of another era. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. I do love that 2016 season, man. That offensive line, dude. Colette Yosemite, Rodney Hudson, Gabe Jackson, Donald Penn. We had a freaking line. Mike Musgrave at OC, the defense was playing lights out. Like we had dudes and, you know, I don't think we've ever been able to recreate anything close. I know they went to the playoffs again. What was it? Like 2021. But that was another, you know, bullshit run where they barely sneaked in and couldn't beat, you know, the Bengals on the road. I still think that's the best chance that they've had. And if I ask him about that, a 21 season was basically the Chargers lost it more than the Raiders won. Yeah, that's cool. And I'll take it. Yeah, I'll take it. Versace, the man. All right, give me your one. We have to do this. Randy Moss, the trade for Randy Moss, man. We haven't talked about it. The rate, like you referenced the trade. Uh, the Raiders since Napoleon Harris, the number seven overall pick that year in a seventh round draft pick. Who is sick? He was a thumper, like great linebacker. Like we, we moved on from Greg Beaker. I think his name was to like have him in as like a rookie. And like, he was awesome. My thing is this though. Like my thing is this man, if you're going to trade for Randy Moss, you better damn well have your shit together. And in the moment it was like, okay, we have Randy Moss. This is really cool that Randy, I can get rid of Randy Moss Jersey, which I did. Um, of course, um, but 18 baby, but this was doing from the start. I, I, I remember being optimistic for a little bit and I was like, who's going to throw it to him. All right. Like, is he like the Raiders? Aren't the place for him? You don't get disgruntled stars into an organization like this. Right. Um, and Randy Moss said all the right things in the presser. I appreciated it. But like, again, our team was not built organizationally to withstand Randy Moss. And you're not going to, you can't get Randy Moss and then hire Archelle after 20 years, of not coaching. And I believe the offensive coordinator of Tom was running, was running a bed and breakfast before he got back on there. And he brought him back to, and it's like, you should come to this too. Like the only time he's ever been Jackie Slater was the offensive. Like I was like, what, what year am I? Is this 1985? Like what the hell dude? And that was tough. That was tough. What are your emotions about Randy Moss? I hated it at the time. I, I didn't, I didn't, I did not think it made sense for what we were trying to do. And I also, I also didn't feel like we had the infrastructure to, to win with Moss. Like I, we didn't know who the quarterback was going to be. And I felt bad for Randy. I really felt bad for Randy. Even when he was like doing, like quitting on routes. I was like, I understand man. I, I felt how I felt about Randy Moss is similar to how I felt about Devante Adams in his last few years. Like, yo, just go free yourself, bro. And like, it's, Devante at least had that connection with Carr, right? But then immediately after they like released Carr in this like weird way. Like even how Derek Carr, who I'm like, not the biggest fan of. And I feel like there were highlights, but like after 2016, there were not a lot to speak of, but how they ended the relationship with Derek Carr and like how they traded for Adams and Adams was excited to go back to like Fresno State connection and like completely, like Gruden completely, like Gruden part two was such a disaster, dude. It was so bad. So bad. And Art Shell part two was also a disaster. And the fact that he brought back that offensive coordinator who had not been calling plays or even coaching in the NFL for the last 20 years. Are you sure? Are you sure Al? Oh my God. Really Al? Um, that was tough. I'm happy that you were, I was in a buzz though. I did have a Randy Moss jersey as well, but we were putting duct tape over the back of that thing pretty quickly. I gotta be honest. They did. The reason people hated Randy Moss in like 2009 or his last year, there was like maybe. And then he went to the Pats. Yeah. Then he went to the Pats and they got pennies on a dollar for him. Oh no, no, he wasn't there in 0-9. He was on the pass by 0-7 when they had that crazy ass run. Yeah, no, no. His last year was 0-6. So imagine the emotions that the Raider fans have. We go from the Randy Moss experience and go right into the Jamarcus Russell experience. All the Patriots go 16-0. And for any dad-aged Raiders fan, the Patriots are like after the division rivals, like second behind the Niners, maybe even ahead of them in terms of like non-division rivals that you fucking hate. You hate Brady. You hate Belichick. You hate the freaking Patriots for the tuck role and everything after that. So not only. I think Raiders fans hate them the most. Like more than regular NFL fans, I think Raiders fans hate them more than. Despise. Especially that run because we created it. Yeah. How much I was rooting against the Patriots and both those Giants Super Bowls was unrelenting. I would have been sick if I watched Brady get that ring and go 18-0 or 19-0 or whatever it was. I would have been livid. Like I could not have it. How did you feel though during Randy Moss' season debut against the Patriots when you had that awesome deep throw? I think it was Kerry Collins. Did you do that, Joey? That's right. Yeah, Kerry Collins. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. I mean, he had moments, right? He wasn't even excited about that though. He was like, we're going to suck this year. He hated being there. Damn, it's so funny that number one's your freaking Randy Moss moment. 2016 doesn't make your list. What about 2016? Well, you had said it. It was on my list. No, no, no. You had said it. So I was going, this is our list. We're just going through moments. But like some of the moments went together. It was fine. It was vibes. It's fine. My full list is day after the Super Bowl, five. Randy Moss trade, four. Jamarcus Russell trade, three. Or draft pick. Draft pick, three. Two is a 2010 season. And 2015 is the number one. The 2016 season was great. But like, yeah, the playoffs sucked. Yeah, it was terrible. I mean, it was great until Christmas Eve. Like literally Christmas Eve, Derek Carr breaks his leg and like the entire season's over. You're contemplating life itself. I had never bought a Raiders jersey until that point. Only the, were the ones that my dad gave me. And that, that off, that Christmas, I got a Derek Carr jersey. I'm sorry. I was like legitimately in hell. Like from, from that moment on, like thinking that Carr was like this quarterback we were going to be able to, I mean, we were excited, man. Like he had not gotten the contract yet. He's only three years into his career. We're 12 and four. Del Rio, Musgrave, Crabtree, Cooper, Mack, the offensive line. Like everything felt like it was coming together. And obviously, you know, it completely fell on its head. It was terrible. My, my five, five, I had Jamarcus, the Jamarcus start. Four, I had last year with Pete and Gino right before, like pretty much like that week one paths was the peak of that. And then I had 2010, 2011 with, with Tom Cable and Jason Campbell. Two is right now. It's Brady, Fernando and Kubiak. I'm excited. I'm excited. I feel good. And then number one, see Blackjack Del Rio, 2016. It's still my number one and it will be until, I mean, we went double digit games again until, you know, we're going to a playoffs with our starting quarterback and feeling good about it. Like I think it's going to be one for a while. We'll see what happens. My final question for you though is why the hell do we still keep doing this? Why do we do this? Why are we still Raiders fans? People ask me that all the time. Why, why are you still Raiders fans? When they moved to Vegas, we didn't even talk about the move to Vegas. I, when they moved to Vegas, I was like, I'm still going to support the team as long as they're the Raiders and they're silver and black. If they ever change the colors, I am gone. The, the, the jerseys matter so much to me. The silver and black specifically matter so much to me and I love being, I love being a Raiders fan, but if they change the name or the colors, I bounce. At that point, you're just literally rooting. They'll never do that. I hope not. You're literally rooting for ownership at that point. You're like, oh, I hope Mark Davis, his football team, like I can't do that. The thing I'll say is I'm not, and I'm going to, I want to ask you this. I've been telling people this. I'm not ruling out the Raiders coming back to Oakland. They've done it before. Don't, don't. Listen, listen. They've done it before, right? They went to LA from like 1980 or it was like 80 to like the 90s or something. It was 81 to 95. There you go. 1981 to 1995. They came back, right? And then they left again, I think for Vegas in 20. When was it? 2018? 2020. 2020. Yeah, you're right. 2020. 2020, they go to Vegas. Vegas is a cheap thrill. We all know. And they're making a ton of money. Every time you look at Raiders, or all the teams and how much money they're making on tickets, the Raiders are always up there because the tickets are so fucking expensive and no one can actually go. I think eventually, and I don't think it's going to happen with Mark Davis as the owner, but as private equity comes in and maybe other people come in and this Vegas thing and it's hard to create a home field environment, whatever, whatever, could you find someone who wants to bring this team back to the Bay and bring Oakland back? Because I think if you did, it would be. They would be welcome back in open arms. This is not a Dean Spanos charter. Exactly. Exactly. But I don't think it's going to happen. I don't think it's going to happen because the mecca of sports right now and where you want to be is Vegas, right? You're probably right. Of the moment, this is just what it is, man. And this is honestly, where they're going is just where sports is going. It's just some sanitized, made-for-TV thing. I'm not ruling it out. And I think even if it's 10 years from now, 20 years from now, I don't care when it happens. I think that there's always going to be this itch in the back of leadership, ownership's head of like. Especially if Vegas starts to come down. They're already. I'm seeing numbers about no one's going to Vegas anymore and blah, blah, blah. If things start to hit the fan, they can't sell out games and all the lure of Vegas is no longer there, dude, a comeback to the Bay would be so freaking sick. I really, really am rooting for it. Maybe it's foolish optimism, but what is this entire list? One of the greatest. The greatest place to have a stadium is where the current Coliseum is, right? Yes. It's the perfect place. It has. Right off the bar. Right off the bar. It has access to the airport. Raiders just didn't want to invest in our community. Terrible. If you know what I'm saying. But I don't know why I do this. I don't think that it's going to happen. I don't know. I think it's a nostalgic thing for me. I always go back to my childhood. It was a great childhood and the connection to my parents being Raider fans, stuff like that. And also, the excuse I give myself is that they were always a nomadic franchise. So why was I. The A's kind of hurt me even more. Like, fuck. Definitely. But the Raiders really embodied something in me that I can't just give up. The A's were easy to give up. But the Raiders, I can't quit them. Yeah. And that's where we're at right now. I'm sticking with the A's. I'm going to stick with the Raiders for as long as I can as well. Like I said, colors or whatever. I do think that part of the big reason is the nostalgia. The relationship I have with my dad is because of this team. And because of having season tickets with him. Being able to share this trauma and root for. I feel like a lot of this podcast is just naming names and I kind of wanted to throw some more out. But like Sebastian Janikowski, Shane Leckler, Chad Shillings, Jacoby Ford. They were. Kirk Morrison, Thomas Howard, Derek Burgess, Jay Richardson, Tommy Kelly, Richard Seymour, Terdell Sands. Like, we. Nnamdi Asamoah. Like, we had. Nnamdi Asamoah. Yes. One of my favorite Raiders ever. Yes. And I felt like that all these times that I've had this optimism, it's always when I felt like we've got badasses again. We. The just-win baby. And like, something that I think has been lost with, you know, the Al Davis to Mark Davis transition, but even just like in these decades of losing is, you know, another like very big Raiders mantra is like this commitment to excellence. And I think that the commitment and the work ethic and all that stuff, like feeling it like really come down in real time with Jamarcus Russell and a lot of the years after that and then maybe be propped back up just to be snatched with the broken leg on Christmas Eve 10 years ago, it feels like this. You know, you can't just say like the Browns, right? The Browns have like, it's been terrible for a really long time. And like, we've just been like a doormat in the league and maybe we've had like bright spots, but never true. Like, we feel like we're rebuilding moments and like some of this momentum going into the playoffs or whatever. The Raiders have had these like little sparks, these little seasons that have like reminded you of what it could be, but I've never turned the corner. I can't believe the Raiders let us do this pod. I can't believe either. Let's just say this. The NFL is a better place when the Raiders are winning. It's just a better time. It's a way better time. I hope the next time we do this is when the Raiders win the Super Bowl. We're in the Super Bowl. Let's fucking go. I really hope so too. All right. Big shout out to Logan. Thank you, Logan. Thank you, Arjuna. Thank you, Connor Nevins. Thank you, Christopher Sutton. This has been the Raiders version of the Ringer NFL show. We'll catch you guys next time. The autumn wind is a Raider. Don't fucking forget that. Swashing the sea. It's so good. So good. 21 plus and present in select states for Kansas in affiliation with Kansas Star Casino or 18 plus and present in D.C., Kentucky or Wyoming. Gambling problem. Call 1-800-GAMBLER or 1-800-MY-RESET. Call 1-888-789-7777 or visit ccpg.org slash chat in Connecticut or visit mdgamblinghelp.org in Maryland. Hope is here. Visit gamblinghelplinema.org or call 800-327-5050 for 24-7 support in Massachusetts. Or call 1-877-8HOPE-NY or text HOPE-NY in New York. That's why Chevy Silverado is number one in manufacturer loyalty so they can go where others won't. Chevrolet. Visit chevy.com. slash trucks to explore the lineup. This episode is brought to you by Core Power Protein Shakes. In football, staying ready isn't just about what you do on game day. Good recovery is just as important to be prepared for your next matchup. 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