Raina Moskowitz (The Knot) on the Wedding Economy, the Taylor Swift Effect and AI Planning

About 2 million people get married in the US every year. The average wedding in the US is $34,000. Even with economic pressure, couples are prioritizing the day. As the CEO of the knot, how do you think about the way that this K-shaped economy is impacting the way that people are thinking about their weddings? When I took this role, I had two big questions. One was, our weddings resilient, even in the face of macroeconomic pressure, and then is Gen Z excited about getting married. And all signs point to the New Yorker, publish a story, does the knot have a fake brides problem? I've been very transparent with our vendor community about ghosting. The team had this awesome idea, and we launched a new product feature called Close the Loop. We just make it really easy to say, "Hey, like you haven't responded to this vendor, are you gonna respond?" Or is this not a fit for you? The knot is now inside Chatchuby T. Our point of view is, let's show up wherever couples are. Over 50% of wedding pros are small businesses. It is our job to help them get discovered and to help them grow their business. I'm Samy Cohen, and this is Social Currency, a podcast that impacts stories that are shaping business, culture, and the intersection of the two. Before we dive in, I have a little ask for you. If you're enjoying the show and you haven't subscribed yet, hit subscribe. It is the easiest way to support the podcast and help me keep bringing you amazing conversations like the one with today's guest, Reina Moskowitz. Reina is the CEO of the knot, the company that has spent three decades helping millions of couples plan one of the biggest days of their lives. In this conversation, Reina shares what it was like replacing a founder who led the company for nearly 20 years, the economics of getting married today, and how AI is changing the way the couples plan for one of the biggest events of their lives. And towards the end of our conversation, Reina opens up about taking over the company just before the New Yorker published a story that questioned some of their business practices, and she addresses these allegations head on and speaks about what that experience taught her about leadership, and of course, where the company stands today. This is Reina Moskowitz's Social Currency. Half the brands in your car right now are quietly running on the same thing. Mattel, Jim Shark, if you're on your computer right now, it's probably in one of your tabs right now. It's Shopify. And if you've been sitting on a business idea, the hardest part is already handled for you. It's that every single time I buy something, and I'm ready to pay, it's one tap, done, all my details are already saved. That's Shopify checkout, and it's the difference between a sale and an abandoned card, which means the founders behind these stores aren't buried in setup. They get to spend that time actually growing. You'd be building on the same platform as the household names. Start your free trial at shopify.com/socialcurrency. With Shopify, nothing stands between your idea and your real business. So go make it one. One more time, start your free trial at shopify.com/socialcurrency. Reina Moskowitz, welcome to Social Currency. Thank you. Excited to be here. Before the knot, you went to Wharton. You had a long career at MX. You went over to Etsy after that. On paper, it's this very clean and very esteemed resume. But what I want to dig into is, is there a part of the story that you can share with me that's not something that you can find on your LinkedIn? I've learned so much at each stage along the way. Plenty you can see on LinkedIn, as you know. But I would say there's two things that maybe aren't explicitly stated on LinkedIn. So one is just throughout my time wherever I've been, just really thinking about where can I have the most impact. And I've moved around, even with in MX, I was there about 13 years. I probably had seven or eight different jobs because I was always just looking to say, "We're going to have the most impact right now and solve challenging problems." So that's something I'm drawn to. And then I've had great mentors as well. And that is something that is true today and really the through line for me. So one of the leaders that I worked for at American Express, he then became the CEO of Etsy. And so he had been a great mentor and I followed him over there to help drive that company forward. So I feel really, really lucky. I've had a lot of great mentors in my career and attribute a lot of my success to that. And just having great sounding boards and people to help get me to the next step. But also had great teams too. So I think that's really important. And certainly as I got more senior in my career as well, I have fantastic teams. So when you say that you've had great mentors and your mind, what makes a great mentor? And that you feel really comfortable and open with. And because you have a manager and you could go to your manager with a lot, I've had great managers too. But sometimes you need a sounding board outside of that. And someone that helps you think a couple steps ahead sort of get out of the day to day. And someone that really has your back and your best interests at heart, no matter what. And you know, Amix is a great job creating those opportunities. And it was just a really fantastic culture. Getting to know people outside of your day to day. People who look out for you and so and people to learn from outside of your day to day too. And so I just think it's important and something that people should prioritize and make space for. You do have to make time for it. It's easy to just like focus on the day to day. So you sort of like networking or other things, you have to really nurture some relationships. I now love mentoring folks as well. I think that's an important part of my role as well as making sure I'm now mentoring people. But I do think that has played a very big role and is something that that people should prioritize. I talked about Amix and how great the mentorship was there. But when you went to Etsy, that was really your first time working at a marketplace. And I'm sure you learned so much in that role. And it looked like you were there for around seven years. What's something that you accomplished at Etsy that you're really proud of? Oh, so much. So Etsy is an incredible company. You know, great team. We saw tremendous growth during the period that I was there all through COVID. So, you know, there's a lot I'm proud of. Truly scaling the company, the teams, you know, our customer growth. I do think navigating through COVID in that moment. So being at an e-commerce company where overnight we saw incredible demand. We're powering small businesses. And so in that moment, we're working to keep our employees and the team safe while demand is skyrocketing and making sure that these small businesses like can keep up with that demand. It was just a really scary but also like incredible moment. And so for me, that was like a real test of leadership. And I love just how the team came together. Rallyed in that moment, showed up for each other, for the customers. And so I did a lot in seven years, but I do feel like that was a pretty big moment for e-commerce overall. And certainly for Etsy where small businesses like save the day. Yeah. And that became a through line as well to why I was drawn to the knot. But really proud of that chapter, learned a ton and again, had great teams there. And while you were at Etsy, you get the call to move over to the CEO role at the knot. And I think what's really worth noting here is that you were the first CEO to come in replacing the founder, Tim Chi. And I'd love to go back to that day. And I'm sure there was a full process in getting your recruit in there. But we can skip the beginning part of the process. But I want to go back to the day where you got the call/email that said, all right, right now. We want you as CEO of the knot. Walk me through that communication and what that was like. You know, as I just said, like Adore at the Love what I was doing, had an amazing team, but was really excited about this brand, the knot, which is, you know, we were celebrating 30 years this year. So it's this legacy brand in an industry that is exciting. You know, it's about like weddings, but beyond that celebrations. And an opportunity to be like CEO of this global platform, I felt really exciting. But I will say, I've only worked at a couple places actually. I'm very loyal. I think so. Yeah. You know, at a certain point, it just felt like, wow, this is an exciting opportunity. It reminded me a lot of, you know, despite being a 30-year-old company, it reminded me a lot of the early days of Etsy, actually, where you've got this brand, the people know and love, but there's like a lot of opportunity to scale, to innovate, to scale. And it had like these, these elements that reminded me of the earliest days of my time at Etsy, which was so much fun and a chance to really build and innovate and take this beloved brand that's been around 30 years and say, okay, well, where are we going for the next 30? And so it just felt like the right moment. I met the team and met a lot of folks and it felt really right. And what was funny is, when the announcement came out, so many people were like, oh, that's a really good fit. I think, wow. Yeah. Well, actually, I got two big responses, like, oh, my gosh, I love the knot. And I was like, great, because I got married a while ago. So it was great to hear that. And then also, like, oh, that's a good fit. Because I think it just had a lot of parallels to a lot of what we did at Etsy, both in thinking about the couples we serve, but also the small businesses. So Etsy was a global platform where, you know, like powered by small business. And so that's actually, you know, when you think about the knot, like, and the knot worldwide, because we're actually a family of friends, we're a global platform. And most of our vendors are small businesses. And so there was just a lot of parallels for me. And it felt like an exciting opportunity to take all of the things that I had done at Etsy and think about, you know, how I can do it again, another global platform. So drawn on a lot of that experience, but also we're in a moment. where there's so much innovation happening, charting our path for the next 30. - And when you were making that pro con list, I also imagine you were talking to your mentors, people you had worked with before. - Oh my gosh, so many phone calls. - Yeah, can you share a piece of advice that stuck with you when you were thinking through, okay, do I take this role or do I wait for something else? Really a piece of advice that stuck with you about really stepping into a CEO role of this almost 30 year old company at the time. So first there's like never a right time. - Yeah. - So never a right time. There's never a right time to like have a baby or like there's just, there's never, there's no right time. There's no such thing. But for me, it's like, okay, am I gonna learn? Am I gonna make an impact? Am I gonna have fun? Am I gonna like who I work with? Stepping into a CEO role is a big deal and you feel the weight of it. And am I ready to bet on myself? And so a lot of it came down to just like wanting to bet on myself and taking all that I've learned and you know, putting it to the test. And also again, so excited about the colleagues that I'm working with and just the opportunity to innovate. And so, you know, there's no perfect formula at all. And there's no right. The main thing is there's no right time. - Yeah. - But it just felt, it felt right. And you just gotta make the leave. And you know, nothing's forever also. So I think if you break things down into, okay, well, you know, is this gonna be great for the next couple of years? Maybe not forever. I was at MX 13 years. I was at S-E7. So I've been places a really long time and that is my goal. But that makes the bar almost impossible to know. And so if you just like with any decision, it's like, okay, is this gonna be great for the next couple of years? Am I gonna learn? Am I gonna grow? Then like go for it. So no perfect formula, but helps to, helps to write it down. - On the other side. - Yeah. - If you can be transparent with us, I would imagine yes, so much growth, so much excitement. And you saw that there were all of these incredible opportunities ahead for the knot on a personal level that when you come into that type of role, when you are the first CEO after the founder has been there, can you share what a challenge has been stepping into those shoes as well? - You know, on a very personal level, like as a CEO, I have two kids. And my husband's amazing and he, you know, he helps, but like I feel, I mean, I work all the time. I sort of always have, that's a little bit me, but that's very real because I feel the responsibility of the role. And so I think there's no such thing as balance. - Yeah. - I do the best I can. I really am all in. I am all in at work. Anyone who's worked with me or has even like, partner with me in any way knows, I am all in. I show up on all in every day, but I also try to be all in for my family. So it's a lot. So I would say it's just, it's a lot, but I'm doing my best. You know, I was a bit concerned stepping in of like, you know, coming in after a founder. And in any scenario, like, you know, what is that going to be? That's big shoes to fill and continue to be. Like so please and excited by how the team is just like, ready to go. And just believes in our mission, believes in the brand, like loves our customers. So I actually feel like everyone just like, wants to show up. We just want to like reach our full potential. That was sort of maybe a concern, but the team has been amazing. And so not that everything's been perfect and there's a lot to do, but I do feel like the team is ready to go. Yeah. And so that's been great. So I would say that was maybe a concern, but it actually didn't pan out. And the team has been awesome. Just really wanting to make sure we show up. We do our best. We innovate. And so any resistance that I thought I was going to feel I just hasn't been there. So huge credit to the team. And I think made the transition a lot easier. And you also mentioned that the not turns 30 this year. So happy birthday. Three decades, which is also interesting when you think of, I don't know, off the top of my head, the exact age in the US where people are getting married. But it's, you know, somewhere around there. So 32. Yeah. So you're right in that range, launching back in 1996. Obviously this is before smartphones, before anyone used anything online to plan a wedding. And now you're in this position where you are sitting on so much data around how people are getting married, when people are getting married, the vendors, the trends, everything in between. I'm curious to hear, can you share a shift that you've seen in how couples get married that would surprise our listeners? I can think of some just anecdotally. But is there anything that comes to mind when you look at where people were 30 years ago and what's going on today? Yeah. So first, you know, weddings are incredibly resilient. So that is like, that is one piece actually remarkably consistent in some ways. So about two million people get married in the US every year. And the only exception to that was COVID, when you actually couldn't get together. Otherwise, it's like so steady. So that's amazing. And I've been really excited to see just like how resilient things are. But I do think it's sort of like when you get down into the trends and the details, that's where you're starting to see the shifts. So, you know, I would say more recently is where, I think there was an era where there was just like a certain look, a certain trend, and everyone wanted a wedding to like look and feel a certain way. People are really craving authenticity, personalized experiences. So, you know, it's funny when we talk about trends, it's just like everything is actually so personal right now. You know, you want your wedding to feel not like the other three or four weddings that you've been to that month or that year. And so I would say the shift is actually less away from like a certain like aesthetic or a certain trend. And more people want to just have the most personal experience that they can create. And so I would say that's different. But I would say the trend is like rather than just like one sort of standard, it's now incredibly personalized. And the themes like the vibes, like everything is just very personal. So that's a little bit of a divergence. Yeah. But on the surface, like, you know, the number of weddings, the average budget, like a lot of it is stayed fairly stable, but it's like when you look down in the details, you start to see some of the divergence. Yeah, it's interesting. I think back to when the knot was probably, you know, in its early days, there were like the Martha Stewart weddings. It's like, you know, there were almost like these industry-wide rules of like what you had to do. And it was like kind of weirdly formal. And a lot of that has gone out the door. Totally. There are some traditions. It was funny. I was just looking at some data, like the bouquetas, I think, because maybe like, you know, it's not, it's not so popular these days. Only about 24% of couples do that. So I was, I was trying to reflect back on like, I think I can barely recall that from all the weddings I've been to. But so there are some, but there are some traditions that hold. So like cake cutting is actually still, still very popular. And so, you know, it's interesting to see which are the traditions that people are hanging on to. Yeah. And then which are kind of making their way out. So the bouquetas, maybe it'll make a comeback again. Yep. It's kind of fun. Yeah. But yeah, so definitely seeing some trends. And I also, you know, to the point of like the average age of getting married. So, you know, 32, what we see is Gen Z, when they're getting married a little younger, their parents have more influence. And that might change some things. Whereas if you're getting married a bit older, and if you're paying for more of the wedding yourself as an example, then you're just going to like do what you want to do. So some of it has to do with like, you know, the age when you're getting married, how much influence your parents are having on the event or not. And so, I mean, there's so many factors that contribute. But overall, there is like not one standard. We had a wedding on our platform. The theme was neon peacock. [LAUGHS] I would love to see the photos. Yeah, OK, photos. So neon peacock. And actually, we named a conference room in our office after it, because I am obsessed with it. And we threw them in Anniversary Party. Because when I saw the photos, when I saw how personalized it was, like I just thought it was amazing. And so we have so many examples of that. It's less about cookie cutter. It's all about creativity. And that is definitely a shift. And definitely we'll continue with Gen Z, for sure. You've heard me talk about built as the loyalty program that lets you earn points on rent wherever you live. And they just leveled up even more. As of 2026, homeowners can also earn up to 1.25x points on their mortgage payments. And this is thanks to built three new credit cards, the palladium card, obsidian card, and blue card. All three turn your housing payments, rent, or mortgage, into flexible rewards. So you can choose the card that fits your lifestyle without missing out on points and exclusive benefits. Build points can be redeemed at top airlines and hotels, Amazon.com purchases, future rent payments, and more. Build points have also been ranked by top publications as the industry's most valuable point currency. Your housing payment is already your biggest expense, so make it your most rewarding. Find the card that fits your lifestyle and apply today at joinbuilt.com/socialcurrency. That's j-o-i-n-b-i-l-t.com/socialcurrency. And make sure to use our URL so they know we send you. Terms and limitations apply, such as to approval and eligibility. Build cards are issued by column NA members FDIC, pursuant to license from MasterCard International Incorporated. One thing that I would love to hear your perspective on is obviously the not-- I consider it to be a legacy brand. It's been around for three decades at this point. And when I think of brands that have really stood the test of time, continued to be relevant over decades, there's really like a core identity associated with it. So in your perspective, what would you say is core to the not's identity that's allowed them to have this legacy? Well, to your point, we're celebrating 30 years, really created the category. And I told you the reaction that I got when people heard I was going to the not was like, oh my god. So I said, core to the identity is the not please a very special role in anyone who's planning a wedding. in some ways she puts it. reform, like they're touching our brand, our product, whether it's through content, learning about, you know, etiquette or just like we have incredible content from our editors or finding a vendor or building a registry. So like, even if we are not the starring role in everyone's wedding, they're probably relying on us in some way to shape their wedding planning. And so I think that is very special. I think that people just have a very positive association with the role that we can play to make a very stressful planning process, like a little bit easier. And so we're also a very hot pink. The brand is very hot pink. Yeah. And we're sticking with it. So yeah, I think we've just, we've touched a lot of people. And wedding planning is stressful. Typically you're doing it for the first time and you don't know what you're doing and you're in it. It's this big, high stakes moment. And the knot is there is this like trusted partner. And we're going to lean into that. And you know, we talked, you mentioned the data. And we just have such an opportunity to help guide you through that planning process. And we have been doing this for 30 years. And now I believe we have an incredible opportunity ahead of us leveraging AI, leveraging the data we have to make it even more seamless. And so, well, I still think wedding planning will always be somewhat stressful. Any role that we can play in that journey, helping you plan, making it a little bit easier, a little bit more fun. Like that's what we're focused on. And so we hear incredible stories all of the time about like some role big or small that they're not played in this very big day. And you know, we take that seriously. We're going to lean into it. And we think there's a whole lot more we can do there. And in the span of of the 30 years too, the space has also become competitive. There are other players in the space. So what's funny? My brother just got engaged a few weeks ago to shout out Amanda to his fiance. And I'm just thinking for a couple that is newly engaged, that's not yet dipped their foot into the planning process, as the CEO of the knot. What do you want someone who is about to get into this new phase of life? Yeah. What do you want them to know about the knot specifically over some of the other players in the space? So first there's a ton of players. We know that people spend time on social platforms, planning, getting inspo. So there's a lot of options. And actually couples use like three to five platforms on average to plan, including like a, you know, a spreadsheet. So like there's just, there's a lot of a lot of ways. It's pretty fragment in for us. Again, we want to be that trusted source to help guide you. And what we do is like even if you don't have any sense of your budget or where like we're going to give you the tools to plan end to end. And so, you know, the thing I would want them to know is yes, it's overwhelming. That's normal. That's okay. The thing that we hear over and over is it's this, it goes from this moment of excitement to overwhelm. Yeah. So fast. And there's so much pressure. You start getting a million questions. When are you going to marry? I don't know. And so I think one, just like have fun. Take a beat. Sign up. We'll guide you. And so again, it's like leveraging the data we have. We've powered about 45 million weddings over 30 years. So we know like what the next step you should take is. And so our role is to just guide you along the way. And so, but take a beat. Try to have some fun. It's, it is overwhelming. And couples plan for about 14 months on average. So it's going to take a minute. And I would say just take it step by step and we can help guide through that process. The largest part of our business is like our vendor marketplace where couples are going to hire about 13 vendors on average. So that's a lot of decisions. And then you're wedding website, your registry, your invitations. There's just a lot of decisions. And so I would say take it one step at a time and like let us guide you through what is the next step you should take. We have in all of the innovation that we're doing, we have this checklist that people are just obsessed with. Okay, tell me the checklist. We're doing all kinds of innovation, right? We have our, our, you know, the not AI. We have all of these AI powered tools. The thing people love is our checklist, just knowing step by step what to do. And so, you know, I'm excited to continue to innovate on that and make it a gentick and like help you take those steps. But I would say if you're overwhelmed, if you're not sure where to start, just ground in the checklist. And we will take care of you. It literally like, okay, get your florist in places. It going through the vendors like, walk me through what someone should expect. So based on like how many everything is anchored in like days to go, right? So based on when your date is, it helps you sort of say, okay, are you 12 months out? Here's what you should be doing. You know, 10, 8, whatever, how many months out or even days out, here are the things you should be thinking about. And so it's just like a great blueprint. Yeah. But I will again, like, there's no way around it. What in planning is, is overwhelming. And so just take a one step at a time. I also think this is where it's so exciting to think about what AI is going to be able to do to like make it a bit less stressful. So we're excited and have done a lot over this past year to work AI into our product to just take some of the tedious steps out. So there's a lot. You're planning 14 months, thousands of decisions. It's overwhelming. A lot of opinions. Yeah. We can't help about really. Yeah. We're trying to help a couple of state grounded, state organized and like be the one stop shop really for you to make all those decisions. I agree. I got married two and a half years ago at this point and overwhelm was a feeling that I felt we were in every bit of research overwhelm with a business like the not. Your business is healthiest. The more vendors that people are using, the more that couples are spending. And now as we spoke about the average age of a couple getting married is 32. And there's been this rise in personalized smaller, more intimate weddings. And in all things economics, there's a lot of talk around the K-shaped economy and how the wedding industry is of course being impacted, right? You have the over the top like if it's it's kind of the spectrum, you have like the Imbani wedding, which is like the craziest of all crazy, right? And then you have more intimate, really small, beautiful, curated weddings that have a much smaller guest list. And in this process too, I saw that they're not even acquired an allotment company. Simply a lot. Simply a lot. Simply a lot. So how do you think about the way that this K-shaped economy is impacting the way that people are thinking about their weddings? Yeah. It's funny when I first started, you know, our data shows that the average wedding in the U.S. is $34,000. And I get so many reactions to that number from every direction, you know, sitting in New York City, people are like, what? You know, and then but that's the cost of my flowers. Yeah, that's sitting anywhere else. We're like, oh my god, that's so smooth. So it is it is in truly an average. Again, like when you look one level below, that's where the story, you know, starts to show the K-shaped, right? And so there's a very wide range. We definitely see it. So first, you know, as you said, the average is 34 in New York is about 90. Again, just an average. And so wide range depending on where you are, guest count is typically the biggest driver. And so people are starting to be very thoughtful about guest count. Big weddings are getting bigger. So, you know, those like 40, 50, 60 plus $1,000 weddings with higher guest count, you know, big weddings are getting bigger. And then we're seeing this intimate shift. And we see two versions of that. One is like still a very luxe wedding, but with just a more intimate guest count. And then the other is driven by budget. And, you know, maybe you're in a backyard or maybe you're making some trade-offs to be able to still have a wedding that is, you know, wonderful, but but at your budget. And so we are definitely seeing that K-shaped in the data. I think it's important for us. So first, our, you know, we've got planning tools, no matter what your budget is, wedding website, invitations, a different price range. Like, registry gifts at every price that we have. We have a wide range of products and tools that we offer. And then for our vendors, same thing. Like, we have to make sure that we've got vendors at every price point. So we think a lot about that. We think a lot about making sure that we've got, you know, wherever you are, not just in the US. We have global brands as well, just like making sure we've got all the right vendors so that you have as much choice as you need to plan the wedding that meets your budget. And the simply a little brand is exciting. You know, we definitely see a rise in, you know, people wanting to get a loapt, still wanting to have, you know, a small gathering with their closest friends. And we try to make it easy. A lot of times you need to permit if people are choosing to get married, you know, in city hall or outside or in a park or something. Everything we do is just how do we make it a little bit easier? No matter what is expensive, no matter what, it's still going to be the most expensive thing you've done to date might as my guess. And so just how to make it a little easier. So we're excited about making sure that we've got all the right vendors, we've got the right offerings. We just want customers to feel special. And so again, like hopefully people can just like, I mean, it's kind of impossible. Like the social pressure, like, and the social info, it's literally everywhere. Yeah. I should probably update my algoes or something. It's so much. But I think that puts a ton of pressure. But I think if people, if couples can really just say, hey, what's going to feel meaningful? What reflects our relationship? You know, what reflects the things that we care about? Like people can try to stay focused on that. I think that's the best outcome. It's hard to do. Yeah. But we do see it. Like the neon peacock wedding. You know, we see it. We've got so many of those where people just truly lean into what matters to them. And then prioritize whatever the budget is, like prioritize it in a way that reflects their values, reflects what they care about. I'm all about food and dancing. Same. My sister is like, like I always use my sister's example. She got married about two years ago. And it's like, she's like, photos and video and like her and makeup as an example and so everyone's got their thing that's gonna make them feel amazing and so we really just want like I really just want couples to like try to have a little fun yeah uh in the planning process and certainly on the big day and people do so what we see as well on the economic piece is one like even with economic pressure couples are prioritizing the day and I'm so excited to see that when I took this role I had two big questions one was you know our weddings resilient even in the face of macroeconomic pressure the answer is yes two million weddings in the US you know budgets holding steady like and then is Gen Z excited about getting married and all signs point to yes about 41% of the markets Gen Z now we even see Gen Z planning a little earlier sometimes last minute but also sometimes really early again it's the average you know doesn't tell the whole story but I'm really excited that people are continuing to to prioritize weddings because I think people are craving connection yeah we spent so much time on our phones endless scrolling you know we spent a lot of years and isolation which is just wild to think about and now people I think are ready to have a little fun to connect you know weddings are just this moment like you don't get that many moments in your life yeah to be with everyone you love and hopefully everyone you love hopefully it's not all your like in-laws friends but like sometimes it is yeah that's okay that's okay too everyone's got to have fun but I think you know people are really prioritizing this and I love that and so I just want our brand you know to play a role in that and help you have just not just the big day and have that like feel however it is that is you know authentic to you but then like those memories and so I just want to play some small role in that journey and I mean certainly have for 30 years but that's really what what we're after is just how to make it easier how do we make sure the couples just have this amazing unforgettable moment it's such a special occasion so excited to see that despite you know any pressure the couples prioritize it and then they feel that it was a good investment yeah I mean for me personally I spent more money than I care to admit on my wedding but every dollar was worth it you know and we hear that yeah over yeah over yeah over yeah even though maybe some things you tweak or do a little different by and large like we hear it anecdotally we see it in the data like couples think that it was worth it so I love that that feels like a great product experience and a great outcome what I would love to hear because I experience this myself talking to my girlfriends who've already been through a wedding or they're in the active process of planning one is the transparency or lack there a around pricing right obviously differs based on where you are globally what kind of wedding you're you're looking to do but from what you're doing at the not how does the not help with transparency because that it's so specific and each vendor so specific it is how do you think about that yeah it's a great question and there's definitely a lot of talk about this both from you know wedding pros but also couples and so we here here's my take on it and here's how we've been approaching it so first like anything you're doing you're trying to make all these decisions this is a very expensive day that you're planning and you're trying to manage a budget and we've worked to over the past year to increase our pricing transparency a ton and so now the majority of vendors on our marketplace do have pricing so that was like a very big shift over this past year because what we hear are couples want photos and videos and they want pricing those are the data points they need to decide who they're going to reach out to and who they're ultimately going to book and so you know we definitely heard a little bit from vendors like not wanting to share that because they want the opportunity to build the relationship and then share pricing whereas if you share pricing upfront maybe you know the couple opts out but I believe at the end of the day I want to make matches that makes sense so I don't want to waste the couples time and I don't want to waste the the wedding pros time and so to me if I know the couples budget and I know the vendors pricing then I can make great matches and recommendations and can help you find your wedding dream team faster and so I think pricing transparency is really important so that you know as you're doing your research as you're thinking about who are the vendors you want to hire you can make better decisions faster and so again it's like overwhelming it's hard enough you need that data to make the right decisions you know that's where we've we've leaned in we've the majority of our vendors do have pricing now and and also we're working on availability too and so I think that's a really important part of the planning journey but have definitely like heard feedback about it but I think it's important for for couples to have access to that and I would imagine many vendors are doing this but just having starting pricing right and then you can always upsell on the vendors side and usually I would imagine couples when it comes to photos I know for me I was like I'm not going to go with the basic package you want the extra totally so yeah so that's I mean that's what we've shared with vendors too anyone who is hesitant we shared that and we actually see now that vendors who have pricing get more leads oh interesting so it's like which means they get more bookings so you know whereas there was some fear that you might then you know couples might not reach out to you but then they probably weren't a good match for your business anyway so again most of our wedding vendors are small businesses like their time is finite couples are overwhelmed already so how do we just like find those matches faster so excited about the work that we're doing there and how to serve it up and also over time like how to customize it to to your point there's starting price but then what does this look like based on your guest count so there's a lot of room to innovate there but I do think pricing transparency is important to reducing the overwhelm and helping both size managed expectations and I'm sure you feel quite strongly about the social media of it all because the wedding industry is quite literally propped up on it I can't even tell you how many Pinterest boards how many TikTok saved albums or whatever it is on TikTok of like specific wedding things that I wanted to just remember when I was planning I mean my feeds are fully wedding oh yeah I'm sure how do you think about social media playing a role in on both sides the vendor side and also the couple who's selecting vendors and choosing you know how they're going to do their wedding it plays a huge role so you know between social media and also you know genai imaging like it fuels somewhat unrealistic expectations for the vast majority of couples and then vendors have to manage those expectations and that's a really tough spot that said I do think our vendors do an amazing job of saying okay like you want this Pinterest board you know vibe and this is your budget here's what we're gonna do yeah and so vendors are actually amazing in that way I'm saying okay if that's the look you want if that's the aesthetic and this is your budget like here's what we can do together so I think people need to lean into those relationships and those conversations and be creative the vendors are experts they know if you want this flower but it's out of your budget here's the best alternative and so you know social media definitely puts a lot of pressure on the industry and we're leaning into like real weddings you know and there's plenty of info there and again I think this is why we're seeing so many people lean in to just personalization and authenticity and so I think you know I hope to some degree people lean further away to just into what makes sense for them what reflects their relationship and not rely so much on all of that ask like not even inspirational just aspirational imaging I think that's really it adds extra stress to the process okay now I want to switch gears a little bit yeah and I want to ask about a story that was written in the New Yorker you started in the CEO role in January of 2025 and about 10 weeks in a reporter that you've never met publish a story called very very interesting title does the not have a fake brides problem and once again this is about a company that you barely yeah what was that situation like you just stepped into the role you have this story with accusations in it that the company has to respond to at some point so so walk me through what that was like when the article came out yeah so as a new CEO my plan always was to take my first few months to just listen and learn and anyone who's like ever worked with me or knows like I typically have like biased to action I am like ready to go ready to roll my sleeves and like get stuff done but I thought it was really important stepping in as a new CEO to a new company to to take a beat even if I think I know where we need to go I need to listen to our team and to our customers and so that was my game plan I would say this just was another input to my listening tour to the team to our customers I've met with hundreds of customers since I've joined you know tons when I when I first joined because I want to understand what do they need what's working what's not working same for the team internally what's working what's not working with our customers was working what's not working and what can we do better like I didn't join to just keep the status quo like I joined to to innovate and to deliver an amazing customer experience and so really for me this was just about listening understanding the needs of our customers and it then led to our product roadmap and I've been very transparent with our vendor community about the work that we're doing to raise the bar and how we can deliver on their needs and provide an even more more amazing experience for them. And so a lot of this ended up fueling innovation. So I'll give you an example. We heard a ton of feedback that about ghosting. That means a couple will reach out, ask, you know, say, hey, I'm getting married, and then the vendor responds, and then you don't hear back through your ghosted. And this happens in other categories, in other platforms, it happens in life, dating apps. - Yeah, so it happens. I kept hearing that feedback and it's like, okay, well, we know that couples on average reach out to four vendors in a given category. 'Cause you're doing research. You're reaching out to a bunch of DJs. You're reaching out to a bunch of florists, trying to get that pricing information. And so you don't always then close the loop with the vendor. And so when I kept hearing this feedback, I was like, okay, well, actually the team had this awesome idea, and we launched a new product feature called, literally called, close the loop, where we help couples, we just make it really easy to say, hey, like you haven't responded to this vendor. Are you gonna respond? Or is this not a fit for you? And we give you just a bunch of options, cute emojis to say, hey, is the budget not right? Is it just not a fit? Are you not ready to book? And what that does then is it helps to give vendor signal instead of just leaving them ghosted. It then gives them signal and feedback essentially so that they can iterate their process and they can iterate their workflows to better convert those leads to bookings. And so that's an example where we kept hearing this feedback and it's like, okay, what can we do? And in fact, we're also focused on lead quality. So it's the conversation we were just having, how do we make sure that people reaching out are actually a good match for your business? And what we're seeing is a really big increase as we improve those matches of conversations back and forth between couples and vendors on the platform, which means that they're engaging more. And so everything we're doing is to create like a vibrant helping marketplace and we're always listening to customer feedback. We have a report called Voice of the Customer and it takes all of these data points from research, design, customer support, like every, you know, things we're seeing on social, anything we're seeing to say, okay, what are the needs of our customers? And then that informs our product roadmap. And so I'm really proud of the team, the progress we've made, we've launched a brand new app. So another thing we kept hearing was, you know, I'm on your platform, I'm trying to run a business and the vendor app just like crashes all the time. Well, like, that's not okay. So we have an amazing team. They actually sit with me in New York and they joined with the sole purpose of just improving the vendor app. We launched a brand new app. The feedback has been amazing. It helps like vendors respond quickly to leads to help close the business. And so it's just an example of how customer feedback fuels everything that we're doing. That's always how I've operated. And so it was just another way to say, okay, hey, like what do our customers need from us? Great. That's where we're gonna focus. That's where we're gonna invest. That's where we're gonna innovate. So, you know, over 50% of wedding pros are small businesses. And so, you know, we take that responsibility very seriously and it is our job to help them get discovered, you know, by couples planning and to help them grow their business. So that's what we do. Yeah. And thinking through since customer feedback has been such a critical part in how the knot has developed the roadmap. Just thinking about the way that the wedding industry works, right, you have the vendors that are continuously serving customers again and again and again, because as you said, they're small businesses and this is their business, yet on the people who are getting married side, hopefully it's one in dots, right? So they're doing it once. So it's interesting because you get a ton of feedback from one side of the marketplace. And you get feedback from the people who are getting married, but it's also a little bit more abstract. Because it's not like you're doing this for years and years and years. Totally. Well, the vendors, you know, same thing, they do need like new customers every season and every year. So they really rely on us to get, again, get discovered. You know, we have feedback on both sides for sure. I think it's really important that we deliver a great experience for both sides of our marketplace and innovate on both sides. But our vendors are small businesses, so they need to both make sure that we give them visibility to get discovered and then tools. And so this is where, you know, they don't have a lot of time. I always say like, I want the DJ to be on the dance floor. I want the florist to be, you know, doing their amazing creative work, not having to be behind the computer or just like, having to run the day to day. Like what motivates them, the magic that they bring is their craft. And so we're investing in tools to just make their lives easier and make it more delightful as well. And what we try to do, and to your point of like sort of the dynamic on both sides is we're working to educate couples too. They just don't know that like you need to reply back to every vendor, like they're just, they're not thinking about it. They're dealing, they're thinking about all the decisions they have to make. And so we're trying to say, okay, how can we better educate couples who have, who likely haven't done this before and educate them on how to plan so that we take some of the burden off vendors who have done it over and over and over again. So I'm very excited about the opportunity, leaning into education and making, and again, just being that guide to couples, which will then benefit the vendors as well, so that the burden isn't on them to teach couples how to plan. And you had mentioned the ways that you're serving vendors. I would love to hear about Wedding Pro, because this is obviously a huge focus for your business. So if someone has no idea on the mechanics of how the vendor system works, can you explain that for us? Totally. And I'm really proud of the work we're doing on Wedding Pro. So consumers know our brand than not. They know we've got a brand wedding wire. We've got, you know, leading brands globally. But Wedding Pro is our vendor facing brand. Many vendors advertise on multiple platforms. And so we created a vendor facing brand and platform where they can really manage their business. We have about 200,000 wedding pros in the US. And some of them, you know, pay to be on a platform, some don't. And so we've got a wide range. Some have built huge businesses on our platform. Over many years, some are just getting started. And so we're trying to again be the place where if you want to be in the wedding industry, like to help you run your business. And so we match you with couples. Again, the tools are equally important. And something that I'm very focused on right now is community and education. And so I want anyone who's thinking about like going from DJ side hustle to wanting to do a wedding. You know, anyone who's going from like a hobby to a full time, making the leap full time, or really wanting to break into the wedding industry, we want to make that really easy. So that's why pros come to us. I've heard so many incredible success stories. There's this woman, Angela, who I've sent a lot of time with. She was an entrepreneur. She like actually, she was in like pharmaceuticals and then she was an entrepreneur. And then she decided she loves throwing parties. She wanted to open a wedding venue. And so she took out a loan. She built this venue. And then before her doors even opened, she booked 100 weddings. Just from advertising on our platform. I know it's a huge, huge thing. And in Ohio. Okay, cool. In Ohio. And she has a thriving wedding venue. In fact, I met her because she reached out to me because she was featured on Love Is Blind. So all of the weddings on the last season of Love and Blind was at her wedding venue in Ohio. Oh, and she just like credits all of it to the nut and wedding wire. And so we have these incredible stories. But you know, you've got to put a lot into, you know, Angela does an amazing job. So we have so many vendors who really like, you know, really want to care about the industry, really want to be in the industry and have built incredible businesses in our platform. And then we also serve, you know, people who are just getting started. And so everything we do is like, shape by how do we make it easier to get discovered and, you know, have the tools you need to grow? So it's been a ton of fun. It really motivates me. It's certainly been a through line in my career. And again, the team is just so excited about how we're innovating on both sides of the marketplace. Again, whenever we talk about our customers, it's like making sure we've got that right balance for both, but success is finding you that dream team. Another thing that impacts the vendors, but also the couples. Yeah, you just call them couples. Couples. Yeah, couples and bros. Yeah. Okay. So this impacts both sides, but I want to talk about the AI of it all because I mean, I sit down with founders every week for this podcast. Yeah. AI is basically a part of every single conversation because of the impacts that it has across every industry. I read a stat and this was actually from an interview that you had done and the stat may have changed, but it's around 36% of couples now use AI to start their wedding planning process. I'm sure it's gone up. So that's what I was thinking. The knot is now inside Chatchubt. That was an integration that happened earlier this year. And it looks like Etsy also did the same thing too. So a lot of companies are integrating into Chatchubt. My question for you is how do you think that AI? Obviously, the knot is impacted as every other industry, but it really does change the discoverability when people start their search in an LLM like a Chatchubt v. going to the site itself. So how are you thinking about how this new AI wave is really going to impact the discoverability on both the couple and the vendor side? My point of view is it's important to help our vendors get discovered wherever couples are planning. And so that means on our platform, if you're thinking about getting married, you know our brand, you come to us really proud of that, but you're also spending time on social. And so I want our vendors to be discovered on social. And now you're also spending time on LLMs doing research. And so our point of view is let's show up wherever couples are. And so we did the Chatchubt integration. We're doing tons of obviously marketing on behalf of our vendors on social and in fact, driving people directly to our vendor storefronts. And so I think we have this this opportunity. opportunity to really do even more. Our vendors are, again, their small businesses, they're not CMOs, they're not marketers. And so we're gonna be really innovative to help them get discovered wherever couples are. But it means we have to show up where they are. And so a lot of the knot was built off like very strong SEO presence. But that SEO presence is now translating to like really strong citation or other things in LLMs. And so we're working to make sure that by advertising on our platform that we give vendors the opportunity to get discovered. It's hard as a small business, to get visibility to get discovered. And so that's what we do is bring those couples to our vendors. So that's like undiscoverability. I think it's really important. And we spend a ton of time, our team's done an awesome job making sure that we show up. Now, within our product, there's also a ton of opportunity because we think wedding planning's just like a great use case for AI. You're planning for months. You're making lots of decisions. You need to stay organized. And so I think couples are going to plan a lot of places. But again, if we can leverage AI to just remove any bit of friction, to create a more seamless experience, to really prompt you to what the next step is going to be because we have 30 years of data. And so really say, hey, your wedding's in this date, like this location, here's your budget, here's what you do next, to just be that trusted source all the way through is where we're going to shine and where we do shine. And so there's the discoverability piece, there's the innovation for the couples, and then for our vendors too, like how do we just make it easy for them so that they do what they do? And we make it easy for them to run their business behind the scenes. So we've got a lot of opportunity across the board. And I think it's going to create just like more frictionless product experiences than ever before. It's time for a little lightning round. And then we're going to the three last questions I ask every guest, first one. And this is very much coming from your POV because you have a company to run. - Yeah, you and my POV. - vendors to respond to. So let it be known. Okay, favorite wedding trend of the moment. - A grand exit has really grown on me. You know, maybe it doesn't have to be too grand, maybe just a sparkler or something to just signify like we're entering the next chapter together. - Okay. - A grand exit. - Perfect. - A least favorite wedding trend. - Okay, for me, content creators. - Okay, that's a hot take. - It's a hot take. But I should probably step it up, but I don't post a ton on social. So for me, it's just, I want to be in the moment. And it adds like another layer of complexity. But again, I got married a long time ago. So that's just my personal hot take. - Yes. Okay, first look or save it for the aisle. First look. - Okay. - Destination or hometown wedding? - hometown. - Okay. - And hometown girlie. - Yeah. - Really, really love a hometown wedding. - Okay, great. A lot of people who have destination weddings will be in the DMs or commenting on the video saying, well, I loved my destination wedding. - That's okay. I mean, look, gorgeous. - Yeah. - I'm here for it. - Yeah. - And I'm happy to be a guest. - Yes. - Yes. - All right. Can you share a system that you have in place that benefits your career or business? And it can truly be a system for anything. It can be a morning routine that you love doing every morning, truly, whatever. - That's a great question. - So I love starting my day, just going through my calendar. So I take a few minutes every single morning and just think like, what's happening today? What's happening tomorrow? And really making sure my week is like on point. I think it's so important. I really invest a lot in my calendar. It helps me stay on track, keep track of my personal life, my work life. And so I do like a standup with my team every morning and we're like, okay, what do we have to get done? So I really rely a ton of my calendar. Okay, great. So the next question comes from the social currency corner where I get your input on something that's impacting business or culture and for this one, this is a fun one. So do Alipa just had a wedding and the images are inescapable. They're all over Instagram TikTok. She did this intimate London civil ceremony and then this blowout wedding in Sicily. And so you're sitting on the data of what millions of couples are actually searching for and booking. So I'm curious when a celebrity wedding gets this much airtime. How does it actually end up impacting mainstream culture after you see all the images everywhere? - Yeah, a ton of impact. Well, I'm gonna go back to last year to Taylor Swift because that was the engagement. - The engagement. - The engagement. So we actually did a study around like the swift dynamics of it all. And the impact is incredible. Certainly Taylor or Selena Gomez or do Alipa, like all of these moments have very big implications for the industry. It really sets a lot of the inspo, the trend, the destination then becomes very popular. So it creates economic impact. And so we saw within hours of Taylor Swift's engagement, like searches for garden weddings, spike, about 70%. Just in like hours. And so it definitely creates inspo. Her dress, you know, the dress will sell out immediately. It'll shape like whatever the next trending cut is for diamonds. And so it has a lot of impact. Again, though, it creates inspiration. But what we still see is people then take that and say, well, how do we make it us? And so I do think it sets the backdrop. And it creates a lot of economic impact for those brands involved, for whatever styles going on, or destination. But then people are saying, okay, but then what does that mean for me in my relationship and the moment that I wanna create? So it's definitely this tension. I think it's exciting. It's been so much fun to have like a front row seat, you know, the super bowl, like the bad bunny moment where there was a real wedding in the middle of the school. Like these create huge spikes in interest, in search, in demand, and it sets the trends. But again, people really are craving that personalized impact. So, you know, people figure out what that looks like for them. - Okay. All right, let's end with a listener question. - Yeah. - And this one comes from Aisha, and it's actually full circle to what we were talking about at the top of the episode. So I've always been the strong number two. The person who makes someone else's vision actually turn into reality. How did you know you were ready to be the one in the CEO seat? - Well, I love that. I loved being a strong number two. Like that's super fun. So that's, I mean, honestly, that's amazing. And again, you're never ready. I don't think there's a moment when you're ready. But for me, the brand really resonated. The mission really resonated. And it felt like I had done enough where there was a lot of pattern recognition and familiarity, but then there was still a stretch where I knew I was gonna learn and grow. And so there's no formula for this. But sometimes you've got to make the leap or not. I mean, congrats on being a strong number two. I love that. There's nothing wrong with that. I think that's amazing. But it's fun to take a leap and bet on yourself. But it's been a great learning experience so far. I mean, a ton of fun. I'm so excited about what's ahead for us. It's all about then sort of shaping the vision. And then making sure that your team is rallied and ready to go after it. Okay. That's a great note to end on, Reena. Thank you so much for coming on. Thank you. This has been such a fun conversation. I think so many people who listen to the podcast are either in the stages of planning a wedding, thinking about it. Maybe they're about to get proposed to and they're already anticipating the wedding process. So hopefully there is a lot of excitement and information about when people start that phase of their lives. And for anyone, I mean, I'm already married. Yeah, I find this really interesting. Yeah, it's been, it's so much fun. It's an amazing industry. It's been also just amazing seeing the depth of industry knowledge, the teamwork that happens in the industry. And then there's just, there's a lot of hype around it. So we're in it. It's been a ton of fun to learn. And thank you for having me and for the opportunity to chat about it. Of course, thank you. Thank you for listening to today's episode of Social Currency. Before you go, take a second to subscribe to the show where ever you're listening. So you never miss an episode. And if you liked what you heard today, please rate and review the podcast. It massively helps the work I do to bring this show to life. And if you have a friend who is as obsessed with business and culture as you are, send this episode to them because sharing the show is one of the best ways to support it. And if you want to keep up with the hottest business lore in real time, follow me on Instagram @samikoandtalks and subscribe to my news on our social currency linked in the show notes. Social currency is a production of social currency media and my new news network. The podcast is hosted and executive produced by me, Sammy Cohen, and produced by the Money News Network team. See you next time.