Pope Leo’s AI Warning, UFC at the White House, and CBS Shakeups

What's up y'all? I'm Skyler Diggins, seven-time WNBA All-Star, Olympic gold medalist, and mom. And I'm Cassidy Hubbard, host and reporter for nearly 20 years, covering the biggest names and stories in sports and mom. And this is Anne Mom, a community for athletes, game changers, and moms of all kinds. Dropping May 14th. Tap in with us. You know, you could call me for free and I would probably do a better job. You're not available. And by the way, I define free. [MUSIC] Hi everyone, this is Pivot from New York Magazine in the Vox Media Podcast Network. Fine Cara Swisher. And I'm Cassidy. Where am I? I'm Scott Goway. I start in chat with what I- God, how is your tour going? I've gotten reports from the Castro about you or in my neighborhood. Yes, I was. And what is one of the most beautiful new theaters? Oh gosh. Yeah, it's not new. It's really old and they just renovated it. Yeah. Excuse me, I recently renovated it. It's great. It was sold out. One of my, a couple of my role models were there, David Acker, who is, who's of course I teach now, who's 88 and changed my life. Deets brand strategy at Haws, the chancellor of Berkeley, who was there, who let me in with a 2.27 GPA, my sister, my niece, my nephew. So it was a nice night as I often do and talking about the age crisis in the 90s. 90s that started crying. Oh, yeah. Just the Castro theater, a straight white man with erectile dysfunction crying and the child's serve in Berkeley. Oh, and the marching band. The marching band was there. My lawyer, Jesse Berg, sent me, he loves pivot and he said it was really fun and it was really good. I'm sad. Louis could not go. My son lives a block, two blocks away essentially. Yeah. And he was working. He's a chef. And so he had the night, the evening dinner shift. So he said. He was sad, but he wished you well. So how's it going? Where are you going next? What's your next thing? Well, I'm here. I'm back. I only went up for the show. I'm back in LA and it's my favorite place to visit in the world. I describe LA as the world's most successful failed nation state. It's kind of, I think of this p-capitalism here. There's more billionaires in LA than anywhere else but New York, but meanwhile 75,000 homeless. Yeah. It feels like I was at the town built on delusion, but delusion and creativity can sometimes create a lot of shareholder value. Yeah. Yeah. And I just, I absolutely love Los Angeles. I think it's, you know what it's turning into, Cara? What is it? It's turning into San Francisco and now everyone's shit posts Los Angeles. They do. That's the city because Shave just goes, looks good and it's thriving. Yeah, so it's just because on the remount. For sure. And it doesn't hurt that about, what is it, about $150 billion is about to become liquid on 4 trillion and liquid currency. Right. Yeah. Yeah. By the way, San Francisco rents last month, one month, one bedroom rents up 24%. Everyone's spending their money before they have it. Pending luxury home sales nationally are up 4%. In San Francisco, they're up 48%. Oh, I know. I've had, in back in the first comm thing, I had people knocking on my door to buy my house and I have people knocking on my door to buy my house again. It's that, it's that, and I'm like, no, but it's really, it's interesting. I think it's lesser price houses, which are not lesser priced, they're in the million, two million range aren't selling as well, but the really above three to seven, eight are really going crazy. It's a, it's a crazy market, but I'm glad Daniel's, I mean, it has been on the rebound for a while, but yes, Los Angeles is in that same, we hate ourselves spiral, hence, Spencer Pratt, but, but Los Angeles is a wonderful city at the same time. Oh, it's a disaster. It's just, you know, it's sort of sort of West Side white people that get all mad about whatever and some of them not even in Los Angeles. Oh, I will say and you know, it's not like a Karen, but it feels like I used to say it's a LA is a string of suburbs connected by my freeways. Now, I would say it's a string of bubbles. I mean, the right, the quote unquote, right parts of LA are you for their magical and you venture outside those bubbles and you see a little too much of the real world. Yes. It's a very beautiful bed. The homeless issue really is staggering here and relative to the amount of money they spend, I can, you really feel it's really interesting here. It feels like the mayor, mayoral race here, there were a movie of Beesophius choice personally, I tell you, I would describe it. Oh, here. Okay. But you, it's a, it is pretty decent. In fact, some of the presidential race in 24, you have who I would describe as someone who's perceived as incompetent and not that compelling, which is created room for rage, cosplaying a political strategy in a reality star. I mean, this literally is Trump Harris over again right now. Yeah. And you speak to people in LA. I'm not exaggerating. Reasonable, reasonable people who wouldn't think would be supporting a reality star. And they have just had it and they just want change and chaos and they don't care. Yeah. I understand that, but it is a type of person by the way, first of all, I would not say everybody is like that. It's shocking how many people are just, they don't even want to have a conversation. They're just angry. I get it. But here's what San Francisco, I'm just giving the comparison. We didn't really like the reality star, we erected, we elected Daniel, they're a technocrat. A technocrat, they should try to find like, that's the thing, not on the ballot. I know that, but it's ridiculous that this is like, it doesn't mean, you know, because something's bad, you should do something absolutely fucking ridiculous and disastrous for the city. But you know, they'll go through it. If they like this guy, they get what they get. That's what the end, it's probably a lot of corruption, a lot of incompetence, a lot of just a mess and abuse of people. Like they're going to hire, wait, they're going to go back because the old LA, you know, the only police department and you know, that era of real brutality is really, it was real. And so it's just, it's a wonderful city. And it should be doing a lot better. And the homeless problem is significant. A lot of it have to do with the weather. A lot of it has to do with a lot of things. It's not just that. It's that this is a place where people naturally are attracted to. And so all kinds of people. And so it's a really, it's a, anyway, so are you appearing in Los Angeles tonight? Is that correct? Oh yeah, we have Ted Miranda. So is our guest tonight? Great. Great. We've got about 30 friends from UCLA coming. Are you sold out in Los Angeles? Are you doing? No, we're about, I think we're about 90%. We're sold out in San Francisco in New York, about 90% in LA, it's a big theater. Also, I think LA just people do last minute. There's so many distractions here. Yeah, yeah. Are you in the same theater, which we did sell out for pivot? What was it? No, I think we're in the will turn. Is that right? Does that sound familiar? Right. And then I go to Vancouver Island for a speaking gig. And then tomorrow I take the red eye to Miami. And we're on Miami Saturday night. Oh, that'll be fun. You love Miami. Yeah, I do. I do. Well, we've got a lot. Congratulations on your turn. Congratulations, Ed. Elson too. It's really nice. These tours are really fun. I'm excited for ours in the fall. We have one of the falls, so get ready. Rest up. There we go. You'll have August off, so you can rest in everything else. So, first of all, I have to ask you, by the way, you're doing a lot of stuff, but did you watch the enhanced games last weekend? I didn't. I got to be honest. I'm sort of here for it. I think it's kind of, I mean, I kind of have this idea that just take, you know, holds barred and let pre-show show up. People are doing this to themselves anyway. But I did not. I did not watch it all the time. Let me just say, let me give people the people who don't know. The enhanced games is a news sports event that allows athletes on performance enhancing drugs and encourages them to try to break world records, events included swimming, track, field, weightlifting, and strong men. The experiment calls itself a global movement that unites humanity. Of course, it's a publicly traded company. Investors include Donald Trump and Jr. and Peter Teal. There's also a German executive I've met many times who's really into it. There were no things broken except by someone wearing a swimsuit that was barred, this special swimsuit. I don't know. Those stock has gone down. I'm curious if there was a fight where both of us were enhanced. Who do you think would win? You or I? Well, you know the answer there. Me. Yeah. I've never been in a fight. Yeah. I'm not a mountain person. If someone had me, I wouldn't know what to do. You've never been in a fight. Wow. Never been in a fight in my life. Never been in a fight. I think let me think. That might not be true. No, I have it. No, I have it. Yeah. And I, you know, I, you know, I was beaten up and abused X, Y, but now I was never, never been in a, never been in a fight. I think that, I talk a lot about this that I think in one of the cores to, I never missed a chance to, to virtue signal and preach. But I think one of the course, the core principles of for men as they get older is just quite frankly as emotional regulation. You know, are you willing to sit in discomfort and do you have control over your physical and, you know, well-being? Yeah. Well, it's an impulse to punch, right? It's an impulse to punch and men have it much more. I have, well, let me think. So, it's probably the most aggressive way of son. So there's no arguing that men are more violent, but that doesn't mean women don't engage in violence. Domestic violence rates and LGBTQ couples is about 25% according to the national Institute for Health and according to CDC anywhere from 17 to 40% of men are victims of intimate partner violence, depending, depending on the research methodology. There's discrepancy between whether it was a phone survey or web survey. And then furthermore, there's only about three shelters. There's only three shelters across the entire US devoted to male domestic violence. There's still a lot of shame and there's a view that might be under reported. Mostly women suffer from this problem, Scott. Yeah, but it's true. There's an assumption. - Yeah, I get it. - There's no arguing that men are violent, but that doesn't mean women don't engage in violence either. - Didn't say that, but the comparison is, most violence is committed by men in general, in general, in general, in murders, blah, blah, everything. Every statistic is largely meant. It's not really, it's just, I do think it's a function of gender, I do think it's a function of impulse control and everything else, but I'm a scientist. - Testosterone and cultural norms and-- - Yeah, yep, yep, yep. - Of course it's stuff. - And there's manliness, there was a really great cover of the Atlantic recently about the sort of the man-hating groups, and they're always back, they're always like, they're back, I'm like, they're always there, in some weird way. Speaking of man, men, there's construction crews are building the UFC fighting cage on the south lawn of a White House in preparation for the night of mixed martial arts, celebrating the 250th anniversary of the US independence over 4,000 spectators planned to watch from inside the arena, kind of looks like a roller coaster, and there's always complaining by Joe Rogan and others about gnats and bugs and outside, and a lot of some of the champions aren't coming because they don't usually do it outside, and it creates, if you're going for a world, these are actual competitors, if you're going for titles, it's not a good thing to fight outside, apparently. Wayans will be held at the Lincoln Memorial, which is, I don't know what to say about that, but okay, fine, fine. I just don't know what to say. It looks ridiculous, it feels clownish, but whatever he's the president, I don't know what to say. I'm not gonna get overly angry about it, but it seems ridiculous, but I don't know how you feel. - I was invited, I said no, I don't enjoy that stuff, and I don't need to be, I think it's just ingenious for me to show up and break Brad or party with someone who I'm constantly critical of. The event itself is brilliant. - Do you think? - Gosh, there's just an entire generation of young men and quite frankly, a lot of women, their mothers and their sisters who in America, in this little trigger some people, still vote for who they perceive will be most beneficial for their husbands and their sons, and young men are doing really, really poorly, and if you think about government, government in the United States, largely speaking, has been feminized if you look at the events. The events are basically like, the queen was merchandising and throwing them for government events are very feminine for lack of a better word. - Wait a minute, come on Scott, today you're very anti-woman today, I'm not currently white, - I'm not being anti-woman, I'm not being feminine. - I'm not being feminine, it's a bad thing. I'm just talking about it as it is. - I just think that when the government things are feminine, like what? - Oh go to anything at the White House, it feels like it feels like it's designed. Oh, 100%, they're very proper gentle, they're very feminine. And by the way, that is a wonderful thing. - Well, men can be proper in gentle, I don't think that men can do it. - Men can demonstrate wonderful feminine attributes. - Even like, metal giving is a feminine activity? - I would just try metal giving, but the event is-- - There's a lot of metal giving at the White House. - Government events and ceremonies tend to be very what people would consider, I think somewhat more, well, they're not a UFC fight, they're not a competition. - No, but they have sea sight as we down the line. - Even like comedy, the White House dinner comes the closest to sort of something stepping out of what is seeing as overly planned, nurturing, appropriate. Yeah, I think the events are very kind of very feminine. And what are these guys doing? That's not going to UFC fight. And it's kind of, you're gonna have, they're gonna have huge viewership. It says to Trump, reaffirms his view of one of the reasons he won the election. And that is like, I'm a man's man, I see men, I appreciate quote of the lack of a better term, masculinity, unfortunately, it's a fucked up, weird, reformative, dominant form of masculinity. But it's a brilliant marketing strategy, smart. - I'm not, I think it sometimes works. Like, let me give an example, this attempt to turn James Tallerico, like Stephen Miller, who's literally the most weak looking person you've ever seen, is he and others are calling 'cause they're terrified of Tallerico. So they're pulling out the anti-trans stuff immediately, saying the first transgender, he doesn't know how to eat barbecue, is that a Ted Cruz, another, like someone I could easily beat in a fight. The tofu barbecue, the idea of soy boy. I mean, this is not manly in any way. This is like this, I don't think it works as much anymore with people. It's deeply insulting. It might work in Texas, I hate to say it. I think that Tallerico people should take this very seriously because Kamala Harris didn't with the trans stuff that worked really well in the election. And it might work in Texas, but they're trying to, you know, paint him as gay. I think that's what they're, where's the girlfriend? - And the girlfriend's man. - Trans, is she trans, he's a soy boy. You know, this is all, like, and what I think about, it's so grotesque because I'm like, these are all men over 50 or whatever. I don't think, I mean, Stephen Miller looks over 50, even though he's younger. But this is this like, name calling bullying bullshit that is not part of being a man. Any man I know that I think are decent men. It's fine if people want to do this. When I was a kid, I went to fights with my grandfather and went to wrestling matches. He was a promoter and he loved it. So I see the entertainment and everything else in it. But the soy boy trans thing that they're pushing on Talleriko is so ugly and toxic. And unfortunately, it does work at some point. But I don't know if you think it'll work in Texas, but it might, it certainly could. - Yeah, I think there's a fairly large distinction between a sanctioned sport where it's a lot of men in top physical shape. I don't like it, I don't enjoy watching it. But I think that that is a legitimate sport. It's a huge sport. It's, I think, arguably one of the most successful sports of the last several decades. It's a well-run sport. It creates a lot of economic value for many of the fighters. So I think you can, I think in a bipartisan way, you can say that the UFC serves a purpose and a successful. The uglyness around Talleriko is not only that one, it's not true, but two, to assume that loving an accusation that someone is gay or trans is supposed to be negative. It trans, young people are people that, if you call someone that, it's, your opponent doesn't call you something unless they're trying to say to the world, that's a negative. - Right, absolutely no, no, and 100%. - And I hope at some point people regurgitate on things like that and say, quite frankly, it's, you know, someone, we used to call in college, you used to call people fags. - Yep. - To say, to be gay is to be bad. It's an insult. - Dikes in facts, yeah, I got it. - At some point, some people someone says, yeah, and, or what, it's like people online call me a Zionist and I respond proud Zionist. I mean, at some point people are gonna realize, going after people's sexual orientations, just says more about you than it says about them. - It does, but it's a tactic. They're trying to dream that in and that race and it's unfortunately it might work in touch. - Well, it is an indictment on Texas that these people have done the research and decided that it works. - Yeah, yes, absolutely. So I hope he responds. I will say this that-- - I'm not sure what the response is. - In defense, well-- - I'm not gay. - In defense of James Tolerico, he and I follow many of the same people on Instagram and it's not that leader's carer. - Yes, I know, yeah, some-- - It's some-- - It's some scorching hot young ladies who make their living with a webcam. - They just, they did it. They also trying to do it to Andy Beshear. They obviously betto everything. You know, it's, to me, it's, in the end, misogynistic. And speaking of that, the Justice Department has opened a criminal investigation. Of course, that's all leads to the same thing. The Justice Department has opened a criminal investigation into e-gene Carol, the formal magazine writer, who won two civil lawsuits against Trump, totaling, you know, close to $90 million in payments, tied to sexual abuse and defamation. The DOG probe is reportedly focused on whether Carol committed poetry and testimony typical. This is what they're doing to, whether it's to the Tisha James or whoever they're trying to go at. Specifically, Carol's saying she hadn't received the outside funding for illegal bills or lawyers later said, "Read Hoffman had contributed." This is the latest in a series of DOG probes, targeting Trump's opponents and critics, like James Comey, and the Tisha James and others. Though none of these investigations have led to convictions. In fact, they get laughed out of court. I spoke to E-gene Carol for an episode of On and July 2025. She talked about the threats she's received and why she has no fear. Let's listen. - It's stupid to be a freak. Why live your life that way? I've been here 81 years. I'm not gonna waste the last of it. We're ring about that guy in Marmalade colored makeup. It makes no sense. So that's what I'm gonna do. - So what do you think about this? This is talk about misogyny and getting, she's won the cases against him and he's trying not to pay them and he's doing everything possible to try not to pay them. And this is the latest parry using the Justice Department to carry out his toxic misogynistic efforts. - I think it comes down to this. So one, if she did say something that wasn't true under oath, that's real. And they're claiming that she didn't acknowledge that she was getting help with her legal bills. I don't know to the extent though, in a case like that, that is grounds for revisiting a case when it doesn't have anything to do with the actual crime she's accusing the president of. What is consistent here is the weaponization of the DOJ to go after his political enemies. So, This is just another example of the fact that we don't have a government that's meant to protect the people. It's now there to protect the president. And I think Eugene Carroll, I mean, I thought, okay, Eugene Carroll is ending the presidency because then he was, I mean, just to keep in mind, folks, this was a jury of his peers who heard a ton of evidence and they said, well, it was in liberal New York. Well, okay, New York, if you had nine jurors, five are probably Democrats before Republicans and two, to mature a conviction, all nine have to agree. So, so this was a, you know, this was, there's a reason that when someone is usually convicted of a crime, the public used to come together and say, this person is guilty and, you know, should be disqualified. Or you know, we keep it, every time this stuff happened, we keep, we kept thinking, that's it. It's over and it wasn't. But it's just, I do think it's important to have a legal scholar to say, in most cases, with this type of infraction, if in fact she, and she did, she did not acknowledge that she was having her legal bill. Well, it depends on when she was paid. They're going to have to investigate that. But they just, they're just grabbing its straws here is what they're doing. That's what they're trying to do to find some way to impune her. And so he doesn't have to pay that money. It's all, it's all about money. I don't even think it's about the money. I think it's about overturning a conviction of a perceived enemy and going after. The guy's made billions of dollars illegally on crypto. I think he still doesn't want to pay. He's a cheap bastard. He still doesn't want to pay. I'm personally, I'm surprised they did this. I would have thought they would, I think this just brings it up again. I would have thought they would want it to fade into the distance. He doesn't care. He doesn't care. Anyway, E. Jane, we hope, but this goes away, but it's such, it's such a fucking nuisance and such a ridiculous nuisance. Anyway, let's go in a quick break. We come back Pope Leo's warning about AI. I'm very excited to talk about this. Hey, I'm Matt Bichelle, comedian, writer and floating head. You may or may not have seen on your four-view page. I'm starting a brand new podcast. Wait, wait, don't swipe away. It's called, "That sounds like a lot." As in, that feeling when you check your phone in the morning, you read three headlines, and you immediately think, "Oh, that sounds like a lot. I can't deal with all this, but guess what? I can deal with it. And I'm going to get into it every Friday. I'll break down whatever chaos is happening in the world. Then I'll sit down with a comedian. You can be progressive and not be like fucking annoying. Maybe an actor. They go, "Promonism has gone too far." You go, "Why? Because of the Sadie Hawkins dance?" It happens. Maybe a filmmaker. Since leaving that show, I'm challenged to spare him. I just got to hang out and try to do stuff. You're the one with a charmed life. Could be a politician, basically anyone who responds to my cold DMs. We're recording the whole thing in a beautiful studio, so yes, you can watch it on YouTube, or you can listen wherever you get your podcast. This is not the place to get the news, but it is the place to feel a little better about it. That sounds like a lot, part of the Vox Media Podcast Network. Support for the show comes from ZBiotics. ZBiotics pre-alcohol probiotic drink is the world's first genetically engineered probiotic. It was invented by PhD scientists to tackle rough mornings after drinking. Here's how it works. When you drink, alcohol gets converted into a toxic byproduct in the gut. It's a build-up of this byproduct, not dehydration, that's to blame for rough days after drinking. Pre-alcohol produces an enzyme to break this byproduct down. Just remember to make pre-alcohol your first drink of the night, drink responsibly, and you'll feel your best. Tomorrow, so I have been using ZBiotics even before they were an advertiser. If I know I'm going to drink, I take a ZBiotic, and I found that on average, it takes away about a third of the "yuck" the next morning, if you will. So for me, that's absolutely worth it. May is packed with back-to-back reasons to be out. Don't let a rough morning after, keep you on the sidelines. Drink pre-alcohol, stay ahead of it, and make the most of every Saturday this month. Go to ZBiotics.com/pivot to learn more and get 15% off your first order when you use Pivot at checkout. ZBiotics is backed with 100% money back guarantee, so if you're unsatisfied for any reason, they'll refund your money. No questions asked. Remember to head to ZBiotics.com/pivot and use the code Pivot at checkout for 15% off. Support for the show comes from O-Doo. There's an endless supply of software out there that promises to streamline your workflow. That may be true for a specific aspect of your business, but if you need one app for accounting, one for inventory management, and another for sales, how streamline can your workflow actually be if you have to be the middlemen between them? O-Doo says they're the answer you're looking for. The only business software you'll ever need. But who can be your one-stop shop for CRM accounting, inventory, e-commerce, HR, and more? Plus, it's super customizable and easy to use out of the box. And the best part? They say not only can they replace multiple applications, but they say they'll do it for a fraction of the cost. Whether you're just starting out or already well on your way to scaling, O-Doo wants to help you put the clutter aside, so that's that you can do what you set out to do when you started your company. Thousands of businesses have made the switch, so why not you? Try O-Doo for free at odo.com. That's ododoo.ododo.com. Scott, we're back and we're going to start off their next topic with a question from a listener. Hi, Karen Scott. My name's Bridget, and I'm calling from Oakland. I'm asking as a Catholic Buddhist pivotarian. I was so delighted to hear that Pope Bob, also known as Pope Leo XIV, delivered his first encyclical, which was about AI, and he was speaking truth to power from a place of power, which is pretty rare. Have either of you read it, and if so, what do you think? Do you think it can move the needle towards putting guardrails up for this juggernaut that's really careening off the road already? Or maybe even rain in those dickheads who are mindlessly amping it up for their own self-serving profits? Thanks for all the humor and wisdom we've provided over the years, and keep it up. Yep, I just set prof G up for a dick joke. I love Bridget. I love our listeners and pivotarian. Let's start a religion. That would be so good. Thank you, Bridget. That was a great question. We love your sassiness. That's the kind of listeners we love. So to catch people, Pope Leo released his first encyclical this week of a 4,200 word letter to all about AI titled Magnificent Humanity, Magnificent, I can't say it's not, but Magnificent Humanity. The Pope acknowledged that artificial intelligence can be a valuable tool. He did not trash it, but also warned the aeroise could become a new tower of babble. He shared some strong words about what needs to happen next. Let's listen to him himself talk about it. Artificial intelligence needs to be disarmed. The word is strong, I know, but deliberately chosen because this moment needs words capable of attracting attention, awakening consciences, and indicating paths forward for humanity. Some of the specific things the Pope is calling for, government regulation of private companies, driving AI development seems normal, protecting children from violent sexual or fake information generated by AI, excellent suggestion, safeguards to make sure humans are responsible for all decisions tied to the use of weapons. Again, a great thing. He also didn't shy away from talking about people at the helm of AI. That was really the focus is who's running it. In the abstract technology in and of itself is not a solution to humanity's problems, just that it is not inherently evil. In practice, however, technology is never neutral because it takes on the characteristics of those who devise finance, regulate, and use it. Some big tech folks are on board here and through up a co-founder, Christopher Ola joined the Pope at the Vatican as the encyclical was presented, but reactions from DC and Silicon Valley have been mixed. Vice President JD Bantz called the Pope's warning profound. That was interesting. But interior secretary Doug Bergen told Fox News, I didn't know what tech editorializing was part of the role being a Pope. Well, it is Doug. It's certainly not part of your role as interior secretary. David Sax wrote the Pope rightly warns that AI must serve human dignity, not become a tool of domination and exclusion. Well, someone who dominates and excludes, which is a nice thing to hear. But it goes on. If we hand the government sweeping power over AI development and the name of safety, how do we prevent it from being used to censor surveyor control citizens? Honestly, this guy is so hypocritical. Anyway, what did you think of the take? And I think he's been listening to pivot or a lot of stuff we talked about for years. I love Pope being on this team, but thoughts on this? We talk a lot about the actions of the administration and different things that are just been really bad for brand US, whether it was the insurrection or cutting off USA. There's just been so many poor decisions that have really heard our brand. I actually think the best thing or one of the best things that's happened for the US brand, you know, to a certain extent, AI and just the economic boom out here and the fact that we the most seminal technology in a long time in terms of share creation and what might have an impact on the world is just owned and dominated by the US. That's very good for our brand. Nothing has been great for brand is is the is Pope Leo. He's just incredibly articulate. He comes across his measured brave connects world issues with spiritual issues and issues of dignity. And he's American. He went to Villanova. Yeah, that voice. Yeah. He's very good. He's got such a Chicago accent. I can't keep you wanting to go dub theirs. Yeah, right. Yeah. But just his comments, if you were just to distill his comments, never really powerfully believes that AI should serve humanity, not replace it. The biggest danger is the concentration of power. He's clearly he's talking a lot about incremental quality. And he's skeptical of a small number of companies controlling the infrastructure of intelligence. When he wants, he thinks AI could amplify inequality and create. He talked about a new oligarchy, where private firms wield enormous influence over truth, labor and governments. I would argue that the cat's already out of the bag there. One of the more controversial things, they're interesting things that should say is that AI is not neutral, that the algorithms encode the values of the creators, not of some sort of neutral view on different views of humanity, which I'm not sure. I actually think in a weird way what social media has polarized us. I think that because I think AI is different, I think it's more, I do think from a viewpoint in ideology standpoint, it's more moderating. And sometimes it comes across as quite politically correct, I think. He also talked about job displacement being a real moral issue. Autonomous weapons terrify him. He called for it to be disarmed and worried about weapons systems operating beyond meaningful human control. And then he talked about human connection and the thing I love. And I like the softer stuff, human connection, mattering more than synthetic intimacy. And then, and this is the thing, I think if you were going to try and translate this into some sort of legislation and we're not focused enough on this, is that children are the most vulnerable. And I was just thinking about, you know, think about when you learned to write and how difficult it was. Like, you were on your school list, right? Yeah, I was, but Claire's doing it right now. It's really interesting to watch. I got, I got in my senior year of high school, I got to see in English. I had a real difficult time writing. And I went through that pain. I went through that friction. And if I had just had AI, like write my papers, I never would have made those connections. I never would have gone through the friction of making those connections. And so, and I think the really, trouble writing, you're very good writer actually. I got season English as a matter of fact. Capitalist rise on the upside with your writing. Any? Well, because I did the work, right? And I think the question is, if you have, if kids have AI, do they ever do the work and make the connections? As a matter of fact, in my first year at UCLA, I was failing English one. And I said, what happens to be failing English one? Because it was a core class, you had to take it. It was a requisite. They say, well, you have to take English as a second language, despite the fact that it didn't speak a second language. Wow. Yeah, that was a pretty big, I got my act together. Yeah, the friction. You're right. The friction is what made you a better writer to struggle with it, to figure it out yourself. And this is the problem and the threat of technology across all of our youth. And that is why venture outside and go through the pecking order and the bullying order and figuring out your place and trying to find or join a gang, if you will, a friend's when you think you can have the reasonable facts and leave friendship on Reddit or Discord. Why take risks, go through the expense, simulation, enduring rejection of trying to find a romantic relationship when you think you can replace it with synthetic life like character AI's or porn. So the defriccioning of life and AI kind of takes it to a new level, especially that academia or academics, it teaches young people to never develop the key skills they have to really be successful in life and enjoy life. Yeah, absolutely. I think most important part is this. I do think who's making it matters? And he was very clear about that in terms of, he was saying, like, for example, it's not the morality of AI, it's the morals of the people who make it. And I think he was talking about it being a very small group of people who are very interested in money, really. And I thought it was very, one of the things he was named Pope Leo because of the last Pope to do something like this was over manufacturing and the mechanization of things. And he was very selected to pick this topic. He very carefully didn't insult technology, but he really clearly insulted its creators or said, we need to do better. And I think being the conscience, saying Doug Bargain is such a moron. I mean, of course he's the conscience of, you know, that JD Vance acknowledged that I think he's the conscience of the world of his world. And it extends well beyond Catholics, let me say. And I think it's really important for leaders like this to step up and suggest it. And I do think it does have an impact as people are talking about it. And they are talking about the issues he brought up, including these safeguards around weaponry, protecting children. And this is already in the air with people. And the fact that the Pope doesn't stand up without any and then had some tech people there. I thought he's such a savvy person. I'm excited to see what else he takes on. And of course, the stupid Trump people call him the woke Pope. But honestly, he's just, it's called conscience. It's not a woke conscience. He did say just to wrap up, when you were talking about automation and the last time technology appeared to be sort of a threat. The Industrial Revolution mechanized labor. And what he's saying is that AI risks mechanizing judgment and creativity and intimacy and even meaning itself. And his, the way I would interpret his comments was less catastrophizing around AI will kill us. But AI could potentially make us less human. Well, concentrating extraordinary wealth and power in the hands of a few firms and states. I just think, I think this guy distills right to the core of the issues. He is very smart. He is very impressive. He is not afraid. I mean, as smart as he is, he clearly had very smart people working on these. The people I've met at the Vatican have been amazing. But I love that he called it magnificent humanity. And by the way, I love that he made cliff notes for people. He made a little chart, which is really good. It's like excellent chart. I love a chart and I love a cliff note. Anyway, there's lots more AI to get to with a lot of little stories, but important. First all, it's Reduct.gov, Jump 30% after Google announced its first overhaul of 24 years. Many people are disturbed by this. Google change is included shift to AI with bigger, more interactive search box that lets users ask longer questions and upload photographs. It's a significant change for search. I have not used Google search in a long time in a weird way. I definitely use it for some things, but I tend to use, I use all kinds of search services. But it's not only through Google, is all I'm saying. It used to be only through Google. I like the simple box. I feel lucky box. I always thought it was fine, but I see why they're doing it. At the same time, a lot of people are like, now they're never going to link to anything, but what they want to link to. They've just sort of ended it for most people using Google to get to, say, media websites or whatever you're looking for. So that seems to be a shift. I think it's a smart ball move. I think they've been accused. When you risk what is arguably or do any twists, the temptation around what is the most profitable, largest toll booth in history, when you risk, there's just probably so much momentum to guys that don't fuck with it. I don't. Absolutely. Don't change anything. So I think it's actually a pretty bold move. And I do find when I do Google search, those AI overuse, they're actually quite helpful. They've gotten better. They were bad, and now they're good. You said that. You said you liked them. I do. So it's, I think it's the right thing. They have to respond. They have to push back. And the reason why Alphabet was such an incredible bi-trading at 17 times earnings last year was the market believes that OpenAI and AI queries were an existential threat to search that it was to become the new search. And what we're saying is they're both growing like crazy. But I find that I do oftentimes go to a cloud instead of Google. Yeah, exactly. Google just never gives me what I want anymore. It's useless in some ways. But when I look for how do you boil an egg or I don't do that, but how many minutes for JMEA, I'll go to Google, right? But now I actually am I going to cloud? You're right. I might do that. So they kind of have to. You're right. I know people are bothered, but they have to change. You're absolutely right. Next up, President Trump abruptly postponed signing an executive order on AI after former AI's art. David Sacks, reportedly voiced concerns that could prove to owners for the industry. He got back. He had lost power. He got it back, I guess. The order would have granted the government oversight on a new AI models before they released to the public. Very temporary oversight, by the way. And it was some it was voluntary. AI companies also been told that Trump was not happy that many of their chief executives could not attend the signing. That's probably more to the point. Being invited just 24 hours prior. I don't think this order was a surface. There was a brief attempt by certain people within the Trump administration who were more interested in safety issues. But David got in there and so did Zuckerberg and someone else. I can't remember. It was a third person who got in there and condensed him otherwise. But Elon, it was Elon. This was, I thought it was a good idea. The order would have required AI labs to share frontier models with the government 90 days before public release for security review. That seems like a very important and basic first step for any of this. And something that really struck me was the founders of this technology, the people that know more about it than any in the world are saying that this technology is potentially more liberating than nuclear fusion and potentially more dangerous. So here's a technology that the people understand of the best are saying is potentially more dangerous than nuclear weapons. We didn't let Oppenheimer start a company and start selling bombs to China. That's actually a very good thing. Well, I think there's a really decent rational argument that if in fact you have something that it is potentially more dangerous than any weapon in history. Wouldn't you want the government controlling you? Yes, we want it to be part of it. They're not only not controlling it. It's not only done under the auspices of the Department of Defense cooperating with the private sector, Lawrence Livermore labs, or what have you. We have people trying to go public and to have lawyers and lobbyists, many of whom stepped in here to say, you know, we all talk about the need for regulation. We've been to this movie before. We talk about, we show up and stand next to the Pope and say, in cosplay, Sheryl Sandberg, we need to do better. We need to reg-- we are open to regulation. And then, oh, no, get on the phone. Tell them, no, tell them, tell them to stop. Tell them his big bet on AI, 93% of GDP growth is now from AI, catbacks. Can't do anything to get in the way. And if you slow our runners down, the free games, anabolic steroid, pumped up Chinese models are going to come for us and beat us. And there's no truth to that. And if they did this correctly and they had standards, government review might actually make the industry better and make them less prone. Regulation at this point would be a feature, not a bug in terms of capitalism and these companies' ability to know how to develop what they can, what they can't do, what they need to check. But a 90-day review-- I know. I know. It takes a drug a decade to get through the empty. Exactly. It's ridiculous. There's still beef going on in the administration. Sacks is on one side and some others are on the others. And we'll see, eventually, this will happen for these companies. I just want to put it off as long as they can. Sacks is not working for the safety of the United States or anything else. It's working for his friends and so on, I'm Valley. You know who's actually increasing AI legislation and regulation? China. China. They are. That's right. The Beijing State Council issued a 2026 legislative work plan in May with AI governance language appealing or-- Or-- And about jobs, because they know what'll happen if people feel adrift in China. That's not something they can happen. They're so much smarter in how they handle these things, which is a really depressing thing to say. They released-- they enacted binding rules on AI emotional interaction, identity disclosure, and content-- Well, they read the-- They read the pope. You know. Anyway. We've passed zero AI legislation. Zero. Zero, except in the states. And there's more to come. There's a real anger brewing. And it's not-- it's something a democratic candidate should not kill the billionaire's kind of thing or pitchforks. But there's a pitchforky. I was just talking to Tim Miller on his podcast and he feels a pitchforky moment. And that's not what you want. You want something that makes sense. And unfortunately, because the tech people just can't possibly accept any kind of a stricture or a speed limit. They're going to-- they're going to unfortunately get the worst outcome for themselves eventually. It'll be just fine. Just as Lincoln said, no country can lose a war when it has public support, no country can win a war when it doesn't have it. If you look at what China has done with AI, and it is released a series of legislative policies and around emotional security, concentration of power, and it's made them public, the difference is the following. The Chinese now support AI. 87% of Chinese people trust AI versus just 32% of Americans. Because why? Because the Chinese believe that their government has the ability to protect them against AI and is regulating the technology effectively. 54% of Chinese people embrace greater use of AI versus just 17% of Americans. And 9 and 10 Chinese, 18 to 34, said they had faith in their technology versus 4 and 10 of Americans in the same age group. And young people, particularly-- I mean, good job, David Sacks, everybody. So you have the populace of China is embracing AI and trust it. And trust that they have a government to kind of soften the edges or reduce some of the externalities. Whereas in the US, you have people driving hundreds of miles to protest a fucking data center. Yeah, agree. So you want to talk about-- we just get it so bad, Zach, where we find-- We do. Well, it has to do with tech people being up in Trump's grill and controlling him. That's what it is. Trump believing that a lack of regulation-- he doesn't understand it in the street. He moved toward it, though. Why did he move toward it? Why was he going to-- it's really interesting. There's just-- largely probably because they wouldn't show up to his party. That's my guess with him, because he's so ridiculous. But in any case, we have to move on to this, because this isn't a topic that you've talked about. Overs CEO says it's hard to draw a connection between the companies rising use of cloud code and the expense, especially the tokens. And innovation meant to serve consumers. The company already burnt through its entire 2026 AI coding tools budget. This is to buy tokens in just four months. This is one of these indications you were talking about, right? This idea that, what are we getting here for our money? Am I paying too much for this muffler? That kind of stuff. There are 95% of CFOs, and I'm interested in studying my professor out of MIT, said that only one in 20 CFOs are a pinpoint to a positive ROI. And it's starting to bubble up into a real expense. And there's even-- and Vitya is claiming they're spending more now on AI internally than they're spending on humans. And so this is-- it's going to be very interesting here, because, for example, cloud is about nine times more expensive than some of the Chinese open-weight LLMs. And when the CFO see these bills and aren't immediately able to connect it, Uber's blown through its AI budget in a few weeks or a few months. And someone's going to ask, how is this making the consumers' experience for the Uber better? And this is how the whole thing on Wines, one of really credible CEOs, says, okay, we're going to scale back our investment here until we can figure out a way to more directly attach to some sort of consumer benefit or ROI. And I think where if you go second and third order effects, I think it goes to the following places. As well as the 80% of startups are hacking or using some sort of Chinese open-weight LLM. One, they use less expensive chips. They have cheaper power. I also think they're pricing it below market because a lot of local provinces in China have sort of their local champions that they're subsidizing. And I think what we're going to see is the Trump administration, when they start to see companies opt for their cheaper Chinese models. China stills our IP, develops 80% of what we have and sells it back to us for 40% on the dollar. Yeah. I'm going to interject. One of the things Mark Cuban had, when I was interviewing Dario Emote at a recent event, I said, send me a question. And I said, I had just written his essay, Dario's essay, Machines of Loving Grace. And Mark wrote me, this first thing he wrote me back was, explain the token economy to everyone here. Do you see a scenario where the high cost of tokens makes it cheaper to hire people for certain jobs? I thought that was a great quote. I did ask that. It was a really, he was already clocking this issue that maybe people are more less expensive than these tokens that they cost. And tokens of what you spend on computing just for people around. Yeah. Humans are less expensive. Or can be. I mean, Claude, I think it's Claude code max or Claude max. I've already run out of tokens. I'm playing with this shit so often. I had one of those prompts that says you need to upgrade to Claude max, which is $200 a month. What's interesting? Do you get the benefits? Do you get the benefits of the money you spend or just you're playing with it? At this point, it's well worth it for me. I'm just fascinated by it. I have discussions around. Right. So it's a hobby. Yeah. And I also use it to, I use it to find data. If I'm struggling, if I have a paragraph that just sounds clunky, I say, I say, how would you edit this or what analogies would be better? No, you could call me for free and I would probably do a better job. And by the way, I've defined free. I actually don't have that. I'm just saying. In terms of economic costs, I would say it's free. In terms of non-economic costs, I would argue you're pretty expensive. We have to move on. As sitting goal said, what is free white man? Oh, I'm just saying cost. But what's interesting of what I found out about Claude max, the $200 a month, I think that I'm about to upgrade to, is that it costs them for you to use Claude max. It costs anthropic $5,000 a month to deliver that product to you. Amazing. Yeah, just the cost on infrastructure and power. Once we sell more, we'll volume. We'll make it up in volume, right? Is that the. Well, no, the, what they're hoping is the laws, one of the first economic concepts you learn comes down. Is that, and it's called not Jehovah's Paradox, I forget this guy wrote a brilliant paper on it, but I just thought he just summarized the term elasticity. But the economic term elasticity is that as the price of something goes down, the demand for it goes up. Everybody thought, well, it's computing power goes down and becomes so cheap, chips will go out of business because you won't need as many for Mintel. What happens is that the cost of something goes down more and more people use it. There's a viable argument, and I've sort of been making this argument about what I call a "pocalypse-no," and that is all the catastrophizing around labor destruction. It's just a total bullshit that as the cost of AI go way down, we're going to find more uses for it, and we're actually going to end up hiring more programmers or vibe-codes. Could be. I do think the costs are going to actually go down eventually, but just not today. All right, Scott, let's go on a quick break. We come back. We'll talk about Elon possibly combining SpaceX and Tesla, just as Carousel was predicted. Support for the show comes from Hems. If you have weight loss goals, you already know how difficult it can be. 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To get started and learn more including important safety information, wagoviplinical study information restrictions visit hymns dot com. Support for the show comes from CoreWeave. AI is just a new tool that encompasses so much more. It's spurring a revolution across all industries and reshaping itself to become a big part of our future together. CoreWeave is at the center powering some of the biggest names in AI. As the essential cloud for AI, CoreWeave provides an AI platform that combines next generation infrastructure, intelligent tools, and expert support. It's powering the world's most complex AI workloads faster and more efficiently. From medical research and diagnosis to education, from complex visual effects from movies, to breakthroughs and science and technology. If it's AI, CoreWeave is uniquely ready to power with purpose-pilled tech. The big ideas, the wild visions, and what ifs and why-nots. CoreWeave is working to build what's never been built before. CoreWeave is the essential cloud for AI, ready for anything, ready for AI. To learn more about how CoreWeave powers the world's best AI, go to coreweave.com/readyforanything. Hi, I'm Maria Sharapova, host of the Pretty Tough Podcast. Each episode I sit down with high-achieving women to discuss the pursuit of excellence without apology. This week on the show, clinical psychologist and founder Dr. Becky Kennedy and I unpack what it really means to race kids today. I think parenting is the most important job in the world and the one that has the most impact on your world and the world. It is non-stop! Check out Pretty Tough, new episodes on Wednesdays. You can watch it on YouTube or listen in your favorite podcast app. Scott, we're back with more news. As SpaceX prepares to go public rumors, are again circulating that Elon Musk will eventually combine the company with Tesla. Obviously, God, I mean, we're not speaking, but I know how this guy thinks. Musk has reportedly discussed the possibility with colleagues. The two companies already share engineers and collaborate. There's all kinds of cross stuff that a lot of sketchy cross stuff. If you recall, at the time when he took over Twitter and collaborate on power and compute issues. Also, by the way, SpaceX got a $2.29 billion contract to build a satellite communications network to connect military sensors and weapons, puppets around the world. They have to deliver an operational prototype by the end of 2027. So he's doing well. He's doing well with his help of Trump, etc. It's a mutual benefit society for them. But this putting Tesla in here, it just makes complete sense. Someone said it was like two mortgage-backed securities, a bunch of companies that can't pay, wrapped around Elon Musk and a company that's okay, which is Starlink. So it's like a sort of a collection. And so he's shoving this stuff all together. It makes sense on a data point of view. It makes sense to hide a bunch of stuff. He already had these weird, very questionable transactions like buying cyber trucks for SpaceX, which makes no sense except if you want to look good. So why not just mash the whole fucking thing together and then make everybody buy it, who is in an index fund, which is another thing. So any of these comments, the contract, the merger, the NASDAQ situation? Well, you did predict it, but my analogy is the following. Snow White is hot. And the prospect of getting a marry snow White is super exciting. It's no white at SpaceX. But unfortunately, by SpaceX, you got to take on these seven fucking weirdos who are expensive and erotic. And I mean, XAI, which has been attached on to SpaceX and incredible companies and money furnace that's playing catch up. It's trying to be infrastructure provider now. So is Neta, by the way, book go ahead. And SpaceX, I'm sorry, and Tesla, I still think Tesla is a great product. I got them on the other day. I do think they have a fantastic car, but it's a struggling business with a multiple 192 times forward earnings and Apple trades at 33 times forward earnings. And then if you look at Tesla's just business in Europe, they've sales have fallen for 13 consecutive months. It's market share in Europe has gone from 1% to 0.8% while the EV market has expanded about 30% in 2025. And Norway sales were down 90% and Netherlands down 80% UK down 50%. Meanwhile, BYD regulations are up 260% in Europe. And the reason why it's valuation. I didn't say it was a bad car. I said, he didn't innovate in it. There was another new cars. And BYD keeps innovating. Every time you see a new one, you're like, cool, Tesla's the same, pretty much the same car for the past. And then they deliver cyber truck as their innovation. So that's my beef. Stocks are like brands. And that is their part promise and part performance. And the promise, no one articulates and gets more cheap capital on the promise part of that equation than Elon Musk. He's arguably the best salesperson and communicator in the history of the public markets. And the promise though, the performance is like so far behind the promise, for example, these things have not, the promises have not worked out. So Robo TaxiMiles, they doubled sequentially in Q1. But it's, he was saying that there would be a thousand Robo Taxis on the road about five years ago. Across all three Texas cities where Robo Taxis operate, Tesla has just 25 unsupervised vehicles. I mean, none, right? Meanwhile, their SF Robo TaxiService still uses a safety monitor in the front seat. And there are five more cities on the way, but must timelines famously cannot be trusted. And then he tries to create all of these distractions. Look over here robots. I'm saying I'm staying in Beverly Hills in Los Angeles. If I go to my deck, I can see a way mo. They're everywhere in LA, Cara. There's actually fewer of the Tesla Taxis Robo Taxis in Austin. They've cut them back. And then the worst car release, or the worst tech product the last year, was the Cybertruck, which by the way, is about to be bested by one of the great brands in history. You're about to see one of the biggest brand failures in history. And that is the equivalent. Heck has literally, like, infected so many things. And it's infected one of the curious brands in the world. It's infected Ferrari. The new electric Ferrari is about to be just hand. Yeah, it's getting panned right now. Oh, it's going to be it's going to be Johnny I've the Johnny I've demand. It's going to be one of the brand stories of the year. It looks like a Honda, right? It's it's it's basically they said Apple gave up on their project Titan and they slapped a they slapped a stallion on it. You're going to see oh my god, you're going to see the Ferrari Pierce. You're going to see so many 80 year old old men go ahead and tick-tock for the first time of their lives to ship host this thing. And SpaceX get this SpaceX account for nearly 20% of cyber truck sales in Q4 2025 because you pack a bunch of cyber trucks. So I think it's smart for him to do. It's more jazz hands. It's more pretending attaching something to something amazing to try and I mean, he's very good at this and you predicted it. Yes. But to take put Elon on top of something that's very exciting around rockets, data centers and space. Of course, rockets. Yeah. And he is a visionary. We need to be an interplanetary species. And now you have to buy it with NASDAQ. Explain to people very briefly what that is. So so people understand the index fund issue is that it's they've lowered the amount of time before job big IPOs go into the index and now people are reinforced to buy his company. Also open AI also. So basically the role was before you joined the S&P you had to be profitable for certain amount of quarters and you had to be in the index for at least a year. They've waved those rules because they realize it makes sense. They're big and important companies. What that means is if you invest in an ETF for an index you're automatically own these companies that those prices and at these prices at these valuations, I would argue. I mean, to a certain extent, the IPO markets might be over and that is the way I say it is the reason we went public, the reason Google and public was you couldn't raise three or five billion dollars from venture capital and private institutions in 1997. Now there's almost as much capital as not more in the private market. So logically you have to ask yourself why does a company decide to go public and one reason it's a branding event to it creates more liquid currency potentially but these companies have very liquid currency on the secondary markets. They do it because I think largely speaking and they don't want to say this out loud. Once the private investors go look, this thing's getting pretty frothy. Most of the juices been squeezed out of it. Well, who is stupid enough to take the valuation even further up? Well, okay, the last stop on the Trump Trump train right now is the public markets. So typically a company like OpenAI would have gone public when it was worth 30 or 50 billion but the existing investors of OpenAI and Anthropics say, oh no, no, no, no, there's still juice here. Let's keep this to ourselves and we'll find you capital. And then when they start going, wow, this valuation is rich for even us. Let's go see if mom and pop retail investor and people on Robinhood and people on Reddit who love Elon and people around the world who want to participate. in the economy are actually willing to invest. My prediction is these three companies, especially AI, are going to go through a pretty serious repricing, not a collapse, like a 2000 collapse, but a repricing. And then when you combine that with the fact that you now have access to private companies with different secondary markets, potentially the tokenization of small companies, it's just going to make the IPO less and less relevant because of the reporting standards. And this is the indices trying to say, we want to make it more attractive for companies to go public and also reflect, the S&P should reflect. I get it. It's just that people shouldn't have this unprofitable company with, or held up by one guy, shoved down their throat without, it's like getting the U2 album. Yeah, but you can say that is PNG shoved down their throat? It's the same thing. It is, but it's a profitable company. It's been a business like, let's just give it a sec. And the best returns have been companies that are growing faster and not profitable. Yes, it is. And at the same time, let them buy it themselves then. I mean, it just seems like a risky thing to stick in there this quickly. That's all. It's going to benefit the people, it's going to benefit Elon Musk, but maybe not the pension funds of nurses. I don't know, and I just don't think that risk is necessary. Well, in a weird way, there's so many dynamics of players. Well, my index fund, I don't want to own SpaceX. I don't know what not right now. If you look at the valuation of these companies, it's going to be probably going to be combined $4 trillion. It's like from 1980 to 2020, the amount of money being raised just across these three companies is just staggering. And what it probably will do on the short run is it will probably take the S&P down because so much money is going to come from every corner of the earth to participate in these things. To raise $150 million, the rest of the market feels that. If you want to talk about, I mean, what happens, I haven't fascinated by this because what happens when these three companies go public, 11,000 people in the Bay Area are overnight. Imagine everyone who goes walks into Madison Square Garden, places sold out. Everyone who walked in was a 31-year-old product manager making $180,000 or $240,000 to your good living, but some student debt can afford a house. And they walk out on the worst $7 million dollars. What happens? They have more kids. They buy a new house, is evidenced by skyrocketing prices. Upside here, you're going to see a lot of funds started. There's also tremendous new business development. The other thing you're going to see, which is a good thing, you are about to see the mother of all increases and philanthropic giving in the Bay Area. One would help. Well, I do, people do. Right now. These people will start foundations. Let me just say, if you look at the actual statistics, it's Mackenzie Scott, and then which is an enormous graph, like a big-long bar, and then all the others, including Elon Musk, down here. I'm not talking about the big ones. I'm talking about a lot of people, Americans are very generous philanthropic people. And when all the people-- Not these people. Sorry. I'm not talking-- there's two things here. When you do have this kind of liquidity event, you do see a bump up in philanthropy. Philanthropy is almost entirely correlated now, unfortunately, to big IPOs in the stock market. And a lot of people give stock to universities, that tax advantage. That's what I've done. Every time I invest in a private company, I give a certain amount of it away to one of my-- do you know, do the public education or teen suicide prevention? Okay. We've got to move on. But I will see where it goes. But it's a really interesting time. And I think Scott's right. There's going to be a decline in a lot of these. Anyway, but it's a really interesting time, given all three of these are going at once. All right. It's got one more quick break. We'll be back for predictions. Pregnant athletes are not fragile. Yeah, that's right. I said pregnant athletes. I'm Robin Hatchson, VPN head instructor of Peloton. And I paired my deadlift the week before my sun was born. I was also a quote, "geri-attrick," type 1 diabetes pregnancy. And so I know there can be a lot of fear and uncertainty about what is healthy movement when you're pregnant. That is why I got trained in a pre- and postnatal fitness. And this week on my podcast, Project Swagger, I am sharing some key guidelines and the story of how I stayed active during my pregnancies. Listen now at Project Swagger. In the span of a decade, Ben Shapiro built the daily wire into a conservative media empire. He produced hit podcasts that bit at liberal excesses and documentaries and lectures about founders, the genders, the gospels. He peddled polos, hats, candles, provided a home for de-platform to conservative stars like Matt Walsh, and minted stars like Candice Owens. Let's put a pin in that. The daily wire even has kids programming, a judgmental puppet named Zoodles. Zoodles. Zoodles. Who shares Shapiro's load-bearing eyebrows? This year, though, the empire showed signs of collapse. The daily wires, YouTube videos are down from millions of views to the low five figures. Web traffic is plummeting. Recently, Shapiro laid off 13% of his employees. As by the Washington Post, what had happened? Shapiro accused other conservatives of click-horing by embracing radical Islam, theorizing about the evils of Winston Churchill and mocking the widow of Charlie Kirk. The kid still got it. On Today Explained, the fall of Ben Shapiro. Today Explained drops every weekday afternoon. Hey girl, it's Tuffy. This week on Tuffy Talks, we're talking Kendall and Jacob. Reality TV villain Spencer Pratt running for mayor and a look inside the con film festival. Mind you, I bought the majority of my crystals from Pratt Daddy Christals. Incredible quality, but I never thought he'd be running for mayor. And it does pay me to say the words, Pratt Daddy. If you're not already following the show, find us everywhere at Tuffy Talks. Subscribe on YouTube and all the podcast platforms and Instagram and TikTok, so you can share with your other work bestie. See ya. (music) Okay, Scott, I'm going to start just very quickly. I want to call out something that happened. Two things, quickly, CBS News. Just named Tech Journalist Nick Bilton. It's the new executive producer 60 Minutes. Bilton is a longtime tech journalist and filmmaker who's never worked in traditional broadcast news. I know Nick. Interesting. He'll be interested to see what he's going to do there. This comes on. The heels of 60 Minutes correspondent Sharon Alfonzi announcing that CBS declined to renew her contract. She's an excellent reporter. She's a great stuff on character AI. She's been a wonderful reporter. The move comes six months after Alfonzi's report on abuse inside Salvadoran prisons was abruptly pulled before airing a month later. The time Alfonzi called the decision political and it certainly was in a statement. She said she did a really like she just burnt the house down leaving. Alfonzi said the exit is "a deliberate choice to penalize a journalist who refusing to sanitize factually actor reporting." She added sense of chilling message across the entire newsroom. And by the way, Sharon's not the only one. Anderson Cooper stepping out the way he is not usually leaving a few weeks ago saying, "I hope 60 Minutes remain 60 Minutes." He also was sending sort of a shot across the bow there. I just want to call it these two excellent journalists of 60 Minutes. And Sharon's a bad ass. I know we're just met or on text actually. But Anderson I think is done an amazing job. So these are two really great journalists. And I predict that they will do just fine. But good for them for speaking on. Especially good. There was a student who won an award at the Emmys last night, what was named a scholarship from Mike Wallace. And he delivered a blistering attack on supporting these two journalists and supporting others like them. And I thought that person was incredibly, it's very hard to speak out. And Anderson and Sharon and this young student did so. And I really, you guys will do just fine. I have Anderson in particular, but in general, good for you for standing up. That's all I just say. I think it's a really interesting, it'll be a really interesting case study, and it's a really interesting case study. And I think that's a really interesting case study. So what CEOs of smaller companies fail to recognize is the following. And it's the reason why I've never been able to grow a big company, to small companies. And that is, a small company is ready for our aim. The person at the top really does get to make swift, crisp decisions. I am the decideder, this is the way we're going, one of our key things here is speed, which means this is not a democracy. There's very few things that are less democratic than a small company trying to work fast, which is kind of like, what do we think? Okay, get on it. Ready for our aim. Let's start yesterday. And a large organization that's scaling, it's more about consensus and getting people on board and culture. And you're a speedboat ramming a tanker. And what you fail to realize is the CEO of a company like this. and what I think Barry has failed to realize is your failed Jackson, the coach of the balls. And that is your job, your bless with some unbelievable assets. Your job is not to coach Michael Jordan. It's to get along with him and be a resource for him. You're not in charge. They are. They're the assets when you're a Mekkelar Teta and you're coaching Bukayasaka at Arsenal, which by the way, just one of the prime link, this is very exciting. When you come into an organization, like CBS and you do have kind of these stars that are iconic, your job is to get along with them. And so I think. Well, let me say 60 minutes have been enormously successful. It's not. That's my point. I mean, no, but I'm just saying like pretending is just because they're in several edgons in this sassy new startup is going to change things. I think a lot of these errors are errors of incompetence, not of trying to change things and these old people won't change. These are like top level journalists that we're doing a great job and has had 52 years of success. Like, you know, they're doing well. It's not like they're not doing well. So why? I think we're speaking past each other. I'm agreeing with you. CBS is Michael Jordan. Barry Weiss is Phil Jackson. His job isn't to show up and reorganize and tell everyone how to dribble and play again. His job, quite frankly, is to get the only management of CBS is the following. Hi, nice to meet you. How can I help? That's it. How can I help? Yeah. And if the answer is go away and leave us alone, fine. If it's we could use more resources here. We have trouble here or we don't think our advertisers are how can I help? That's it. I love what you I'm sorry. I misunderstood. Let me say one of the things that happened at the Washington Post too, blaming these reporters like when Will Lewis was like trashing the reporters is like it's such an easy thing to do for people who think they're innovative. It's like you all suck. And some of some of the things need to change. But to say it's it's a problem of it's a bigger secular problem. That's the issue in terms of costs and everything else. And so just telling people just breaking things is not building things and that's that is really hard to do when you're I that's why we I never want to be a big company. I don't know about you, but I like us being a small speedboat. And if you make mistakes, you make mistakes if you don't, you know, that's how I feel. But I don't know about you. Oh, yeah. And this is this is a reason why I've never built a billion dollar company. I saw companies, you know, when they as soon as they have a CFL or someone in HR, I'm like time to sell. Yeah. But having been on involved with a lot of big companies, I just shock me. It just shocked me right away. The first thing I thought of what we should do this, this and this and the CEOs were, I was, okay, they really had to think about what would be required to get buy in to potentially change the culture to explain, be thoughtful to create the right incentive mechanisms to ensure the behavior lined up. And I mean, you really are there's some amazing things about a tanker, right? You can carry whatever it is. A hundred million barrels or ten million barrels of a product. But you are, you know, you're steering a tanker and it takes a lot of effort in a big engine room and a lot of people, it's, it is a different, there's so few people that can go from a lot of people. I would say, where are you in the alphabet? Are you from A to D? I'm good at A to D. Yeah, me some people are good at coming in. My old CEO at L2 Ken Allard was good at kind of D to D to H or I. And some people are can come into a company that's, you know, gone public. Dar Kostraschahi is amazing and it's very good example. And mate is like great from L to S. He came into a company that was already jamming, scaling, huge infrastructure, huge brand and said, okay, somebody needs to be a dollar. And also there's some people who come into companies that are distressed, who take a company from, you know, whatever it is, T to Z that come in and cut costs and repackage something, take it through bankruptcy and make a lot of money. Scott, your next book is the alphabet of management. Yeah, the better business. Yeah. All right. Well, I want to hear your prediction, though. I'm all confused and jet lagged right now. So I thought we were doing wins and fails. So if it's okay, I'm going to do wins and fails. Go for it. But my win isn't it just hasn't gotten enough attention and it's just so exciting and it's such a victory for the West. And I would argue it's actually in many ways. Well, Iran has overshadowed it and inflation. People really don't understand that something incredibly wonderful is going on here. And that is three years ago, Russia was supposed to take key in a weekend. And today, Ukraine is striking Russian, Russian military infrastructure, oil refinery, sports, bomber bases and semiconductor plants, hundreds sometimes, sometimes more than a thousand kilometers inside of Russia. Putin is on the run. He is on. I told you when I told you that a couple weeks ago that all these people said, Russia, he's in much more trouble than you realize. But go ahead. Just recently, they've hit the reasund refinery when Russia's largest fuel plants supplying the military, the Toopsie refinery and the Black Sea. They're going after ships. They're going after the Black Sea fleet, oil, infrastructure in perms, 700 miles from the border. The, yeah, the, yeah, the Laudary refinery, 700 kilometers inside of Russia. And even the English strategic. This country, that happened. Geez. If they started bombing oil fields in Texas, Buffalo or, or our, our military ships in San Diego, can you imagine? No, no, no, those Canadians were northward. If you're joining, building our submarines, what if drones were hitting? I mean, this is just incredible. And it's a function of drones. It's a function of Delta. It's also, quite frankly, we don't like to say this, must turning off Starlink and Russia has seated huge advantage to the Ukrainian army. That's always been a benefit. No question. But it is just, I mean, if you think about this, what are they doing? They're producing thousands of long-range drones per month in 2024. And 25, they're doing 3000. They're going to be a huge technology country when this is all. Oh, yeah. They'll attract so much capital, assuming, assuming it. I go there. If I was a young person, that's exactly, though the corruption is really quite impossible to deal with. But if I was a young person to go there, but there are significant corruption problems within that government. But there's a wonderful messaging sent to the world. And that is, there's a brutal lesson for authoritarians, that corruption scales until it collides with reality and technology and an motivated populist Russia built the Potemkin Village version of a superpower, yachts, parades, hypersonic missiles, shirtless horse cosplay. And do you craings me? I like that bar. Do you craings me while built software drones and engineers and just some numbers here to talk about? This is incredible. This is you're rushing them this morning. What? What? What? What? What? You're going to make your fascinated with or you about to go interview? I'm not. I'm not going anywhere. I'm going to be in my kind of I think. What is it? Ghost of Walter Mondale? Who's up next on with Kara Swisher? Russia has three times the population, ten times the economy, nuclear weapons, and one of the largest oil reserves in the world. And Ukraine is kicking its ass. I know. I love it. And you can't. What does Ukraine have? Ukraine has coders and hoodies turning home depot into Lockheed Martin. I mean, these guys. Amazing. So look, increasingly, and this is a lesson for us, unfortunately, right now. The future belongs to the side that can innovate faster than the other side. The audience with the boats and the drones. So that's my win. And it hasn't got enough attention. This is so exciting for the West for Ukraine. Can I make one, Geddy? If Potem feels cornered and scared, he might be terrible. Yeah, that's the fear. You know, that that's that to me is the biggest. Unless you're going to gnaw it, your enemy, you got to give him a way out. That's what that's Sun Zoo. Yeah, but I don't think he thinks that. I think he's terrified. This is a victory for also for the EU who has been steadfast in their support on like Americans. It's just very exciting. Trump will back him if they win. He'll go like, oh, I'm with the winners. I'm with them. I was always behind them. I always behind them. All right. What's your fail? My fail is I just I think the best I Timothy Snyder summarized it perfectly. I've been trying to figure out a way to describe what is effectively a $1.8 billion slash fund that Trump and his his spokesperson Blanche have been trying to pitch and even even some Republicans are finally blanching. And the best way to describe it is a terrorist immunization fund. Oh, and that is commit violence on my behalf. And I will not only legally protect you, I will pay you. In addition to the corruption, it sends a signal to weirdos out there who are cult members that if something gets in the way of Trump, whether it's people turning out to a pull booth, whether it's people showing up to inaugurate the other guy, which I'm claiming was not fairly elected, I want you to commit acts of violence. I want you to engage in terrorism. And you will not only get off. I'm going to pay you. So this is this is not a slash fund. This is not only corruption. It's a terrorist immunization fund. I love that word. And that is the way I can't take credit for it. It's Timothy Snyder who's when I'm just obsessed with. And I've had on the pot a couple times, who's at the New York City Toronto and talks a lot about democracy and autocracy. He's fantastic. And he's very brave. He's the dude Heather Koutner, but this is that's right. But this is imagine if nation in the Gulf found name your terrorist organization and said, you blow yourself up, you're a commit acts of violence, not only in our prosecutor, you we've set aside money for you. Right. Well, they kind of did that. Well, the PLB. You used to do that. The PLO used to say any suicide bomber we're going to give their family X amount of dollars. That's what this is. Yeah. Anyways, I hope that Democrats adopt that for it as well. I don't think it's going to pass. I think the Republicans tell us the others are all very much against it. There's a lot. And all of these hearings, why do you support the terrorist immunization fund? They should absolutely live with that. That's what this is. Anyways, that's what they say. The terrorist baking fund, maybe immunization. Anyway, alright, that's great. Those are both great. And you're going to have to have new ones for Monday just so you know, we want to hear from you. Send us your questions about business tech or whatever's on your mind. Go to nymag.com/pivot. Just a minute question for the show. We're called 85551Pivot. Before we go, I'm taping a live interview of on with Kara Swisher at the Rebecca Film Festival on Monday, June 8th. It is not the dead. Someone's got their nose up, Murdoch's ass. No, I'm not. I was out. I was booked before the deal. I was booked months ago. Anyway, instead of Walter Mardinayl, you're invited to the special dinner with Robert DeNiro but I am. I'll be talking to comedian actor and podcast pioneer Mark Maren, not Mondale. The original gangster. Yes, thank you. Yeah, the original. He's really quite a legend. And he has a new talk about him and he's also a great actor and funny comedian. Everything else he loves to try to protect his favorite. My favorite. I use it all the time. He's like, you realize Democrats literally annoyed America into fascism. Anyway, he's great. He's really great. Tickets are available now at the Rebecca Film.com/audio. What Scott's referring to is the Murdoch's, James Murdoch's, Rebecca. We will see you there. Okay, that's the show. Thanks for listening to Pivot. And be sure, Pivotarian, become a Pivotarian. Be sure to like and subscribe to our YouTube channel. We'll be back next week. Today's show is produced by our name and to our Marcus Taylor Gropon and Todd Weisman. Ernie Inertot, "Enter Near the Seven" so thanks to also to Joe Bros. and Mr. Farron, "Danchal on the Shock Crew" by Fox Media's executive producer podcast. Make sure to follow Pivot on your favorite podcast platform. Thank you for listening to Pivot from New York Magazine and Fox Media. We'll be back next week for another breakdown of all things tech and business. Pivotarian, Pivotarian. Have sex with the cult leader. That's okay. No. Cut off all contact with your parents. Give us all your money. No. I'm into it. Pivotarian. L.A. tonight's got.