Pharrell Williams On His Vision for Louis Vuitton

Hey, we're Nick and Jack hosts of The Best One Yet. Behind every episode there's research, email, spreadsheets, and our shared Google Doc, the headline hammer. With Google Workspace with Gemini, Google's AI is built right into the premium versions of tools we already used, like Gmail, Docs, and Sheets. No new tools or extra logins, just personalized AI for the way we work. That means less time on the work around the work and more time finding the stories worth talking about. Get AI tools for work. Upgrade to Google Workspace with Gemini at GOO.GLI/Workspace with Gemini. This episode is brought to you by Macy's. I love seeing what comes through each season, but keeping up with every new trend can honestly be a lot. So, I like the idea of treating the new season less like a complete wardrobe reset and more like a cheat sheet for a few things you might want to try. For Autumn, it's all about richer colors and textures. Think chocolate brown, deep greens, grey and stone, with suede coming through and everything from handbags and jackets to shoes and accessories. Dark Indigo Denim is also having a moment, which is probably one of the easiest ways to make something you already wear, all the time feel a little fresher. Macy's brings all those trends together in one place, so you can work out what exactly fits your own style, rather than feeling like you need to follow everything. Hi, this is Imran Ahmed Founder and CEO of The Business of Fashion. Welcome to the B.O.F. podcast. It's Friday, October 13th. Ferrell Williams has been part of the global cultural consciousness for the better part of two decades as a rapper, songwriter and music producer. But earlier this year, when he was named Men's Creative Director at Louis Vuitton, his career took on a whole new trajectory as he stepped into the shoes of Virgil Oblo. He has giant shoes for one to try to feel, but that's not what I'm here to do. I'm not here to fill my brother's shoes, my brother's shoes are his shoes and the steps that he took are his steps and I would never want to get in the way of that. In fact, I would want to get out of the way of that so that people can see that for the rest of humanity's existence on this planet, this guy was here. First, look at what he did when he got that opportunity. This week on The B.O.F. podcast, I'm pleased to share the full conversation I had with Ferrell for his B.O.F. 500 cover story published earlier this week, examining his journey into the luxury industry and his vision for Louis Vuitton. Here's Ferrell Williams on The B.O.F. podcast. Ferrell. Yes, sir. Thank you for taking time to sit down today. Thank you. Good morning. Good morning. Well, we're here in Paris at The B.O.F. headquarters. Obviously, this is a place where you've been spending a lot more time recently, but today, I want to start with actually the longer-term vision of what you're trying to achieve here at B.O.F. and I wanted to start by actually going way back and I wondered if you could tell me about your first memory of fashion. First of all, thank you for this opportunity. Second of all, I would say my first memory of fashion is not dissimilar from anyone else's where I come from. We saw fashion on television, we saw fashion through the lenses of our parents, and when you're young, you kind of assume that fashion and attitude are like combined because you know, the swagger that someone has really convinces you that like something that they're wearing is cool or something that they're wearing convinces you that they have cool taste. It's kind of like music and fashion or like time and space. It's like swagger and taste or attitude and taste good, better and different are like combined. So when I was young, it was just like the weight of my dad wore his clothes, the weight of my mother wore her clothes or the way that like Michael Jackson on the television on some variety show was singing a song and the energy that he had in what he was wearing. It was all one thing. Right. Is there a brand that you remember engaging with or feeling drawn to early on? Probably like right around 3rd or 4th grade, yeah. Or 5th grade, you know, you start being cognizant of like name brands, but before that, it was like not really a thing. It was just kind of like you like the shape of things or the colors or like the fit of something. And those details sort of created this distinction and helped you sort of formulate your opinions about people. Somewhere between 3rd and 5th grade, you start being aware of like what brands were consistent with those things and what brands weren't, which were probably the ones they got frowned upon. And the ones that like you got joked about, I mean, I definitely came from very modest means. So it's not like, you know, I didn't learn what Gucci was until I started seeing what like the rappers were wearing in their videos, made by Dapper Dan, also like of course, you know, the V time stuff as well. Like I didn't know what none of that was until then. Right. Was that stuff that didn't make it to us? So we saw it, you know, like Elizabeth Taylor was wearing something Cartier, something or this actor or actress was wearing something by Tiffany. Like, yeah, we saw it on like the Johnny Carson show or something like that, but it wasn't in the vicinity of where I lived as a child. Virginia. Yeah, in Virginia. It was in Virginia, but it wasn't. It wasn't in your Virginia. It wasn't in a 20 mile radius of where I lived. But that didn't stop us from feeling it and since in it, when we saw it on television, you knew it was dependent on the person and the way that they carried themselves and their attitudes, you would know, okay, there's something up with like that fit, you know, that jacket of those shoes. The personalities convinced you first that it was cool. You've said recently that when LVMH, they aren't no family, Pietro, when they all approached you about this role, like you were completely taken by surprise. You thought it was going to be, because they wanted to talk to you about Nico or someone else, you know, why didn't you, in your head, imagine that this was a possibility for you. I had been talking about Nico for like two years. Like, I just wasn't even within the realm of possibility in my mind. I just was like advocating for my brother and just hadn't even considered myself in that way. That's why this whole thing has just been so mind-blowing and I'm just so honored and I've just been so like touched by the whole thing that someone would see me that way. There's so many things in you and most of which, depending on who you are, you will dare to make those things manifest. But then there are certain parts within you that you know we're there, but you're just not even thinking about it that way. So now that you've done your first show, are you owning it a bit more? Are you feeling like, wow, yeah, I can do this. Oh no, I owned it the moment I said yes, because it was different. I was chosen. So when that happens, then you take heed to the universe to happen you on your shoulder. Is that what it felt like? Yeah, that's pretty amazing feeling, right? To be like out of the blue, seemingly being offered a role like this. Yeah, I mean, weren't you surprised when you heard it? I'd heard rumblings of it. Oh see, I didn't hear no rumblings. Well, I'd heard rumblings of it, but I was surprised, you know, it all happened quite quickly. We were all kind of anticipating an announcement at some point because it'd been some time since the role had been vacant. But yeah, I think everyone was taken by surprise. Like I said, good, bad or indifferent. They just say no. But the minute that the universe bestows such an opportunity in undertaking in such an explosive proposition, that's when you get in line and you slay every dragon in the room. It's just not even a thought. Okay, so let's talk about slaying those dragons. Yeah. It must start with some idea in your head about what luxury means, and what luxury at a brand like, we don't mean. Like when you think about the word luxury in the context of everything that's happening in the world, what does luxury mean to you now? Luxury is evolving at the moment and it's necessary because luxury is basically like the convenience first and foremost. It's all about convenience. If you think about like the difference between like horses and carriages and the LaFarari, the word horse power was derived from the power and the respect that humans had for horses and their relationships to the carriages that we get them around in terms of transportation. Convenience continues to change and present itself as technology evolved. Then there's convenience in a different stretch. And I think luxury is being able to afford convenience and design. Convenience and what's perfunctory for people and the things that they're going to need when they're going. And I think that's why I like Vuitton, which is essentially like luxury goods, but it's really about the quintessential traveler. It's basically convenience in the form of bags, trunks, and things that you're gonna need. And you know, just being prepared and thinking ahead for you, that's a convenience. You pay for that. And when I got here, I was so excited and I knew all the things that I wanted to do because I am the consumer. So I know what it is that I'm looking for. I mean, I design from the lenses of what it is that I'm going to need. So it's like right in the line of like how I think. You said just now that luxury is in the midst of a kind of transformation or change. What was luxury before and how was it changing? Well I mean like just look at what Tesla has done to the automotive industry. People need to go to and fro, but do we need to have emissions be the problem that it has been for the past, I guess a couple hundred years now? No, we don't. There are better ways to do it. And that convenience has a price and that's luxury. Because right now luxury is more than a definition. It has like a picture when you look it up. It feels like it has a picture to it and that picture is incorrect. Whether it's not necessarily luxury. It has been for hundreds of years, thousands of years, but it's not necessarily luxury as the preference. But this is a leather goods house, right? And of course they do stuff with canvas. Are you saying that part of your vision? No, I'm just saying for example, and by the way, it's a choice, right? There's Coke, Diet Coke, there's also water. It's a choice. There's a range of things that we do and there's even more that are like in the plans that I'm super excited about. But I'm not trying to like teach anybody anything or dictate to people if anything, like I'm a pupil in this position, right? So I'm learning a lot myself. But what I am pledging to do is to share the things that I'm learning like every day. I learned so much. I'm like surrounded by masterful artists and so all I do is learn. But for me, the vision is to share these things with people who are looking for the things that I'm looking for. So share these things, but I'm not like dictating and pointing and teaching you, like your journey is your journey. What are some examples of those things that you want to share? I mean, I've learned a whole host of things, but I think maybe I guess more philosophical, but when giving the proper resources, when you know, being surrounded by like immense talent, it's okay to like dream beyond the realms of possibility. It's okay. Okay. Okay. To dream beyond the realms of possibility. Yeah. And make those things like really come to fruition, like it's okay to think that way. Like we're raised to like not think that way. We're raised to really think compartmentalized and being a box and it's like, no, we don't have to do that. I heard you say something on another podcast recently about having no roof, like having no limits. Is that what you mean? Like in a way, luxury is about also about aspiration. Hip hop music has aspirational narratives. And that is what I'm saying. Let's look at that, right? Like so when we say the word hip hop or rap and we say aspiration, the first thing most people are trained to think and what's been marketed to you is that that means champagne bottles, that means like super fast foreign cars. And that's not really what it is. For me, the aspirations of people who look like me is to one be economically free, to be educated, to have equal access to like healthcare, equal access to representation. And like I said, also education, first and foremost, so that you have the tools as an entity on this planet to go live and go build out and live your dreams, whatever they may be. That's a luxury. That's freedom. That's freedom. There you go. Freedom is a luxury. Not everybody has freedom. And want that. And so I try to tell these stories with like our seasons and like our campaigns and like our shows. And I want to tell these stories of like what freedom feels like and what it looks like when you, you know, having the resources and having the support and having the platform to do that and retailer, first mother, like woman with child in a campaign, black woman, for men's wear and quotation marks freedom, freedom. You see what I'm saying? That's luxury. Luxury is not just like material things. There you go. Luxury is a mentality first and foremost. That is really based on like convenience, freedom and convenience, the freedom to be able to do that. That word freedom is such a heavy word these days when you look around in certain places on the planet. There's not a lot of people who are free from their environments to even their legal systems. Like there's not a lot of freedom. So that's my job with this platform is to tell these stories and to inspire young and old. You can do it. What can't you do? You can do it too. And it's not easy. It's not always easy, some circumstances are tougher than others, but this is showing you that it can be done. It's not an opportunity that's afforded to millions of people, but it's just showing you, hey, this is possible. Yeah. As you're talking, I'm also having memories of some of my conversations with Virgil around his time here. How has the kind of legacy and tenure that he had here at Veton influenced, you know, how you're in a way taking the baton from him and saying, okay, I'm going to continue where you left off? Honored, first and foremost. Honored. When he got his appointment, that was like, wow, we were all so blown away and I was so happy for him and I told him many times and again, that was enough for me. That was enough for the books. So going back to your question earlier, when you were asking me how I felt, why didn't I think better about myself because, man, Virgil, that was enough. In my mind, that was enough for the, and maybe I was just happy for him. You know what I'm saying? And I was like, nah. That's good. That's like an amazing box checked. It was more than one for the culture, but you know, as you would say, that's one for the culture. Like a 10-footed culture in my mind, so like, never in a million years. And he has giant shoes for one to try to fill, but that's not what I'm here to do. I'm not here to fill my brother's shoes. My brother's shoes are his shoes and the steps that he took are his steps. And I would never want to get in the way of that. In fact, I would want to get out of the way of that so that people can see that for the rest of like, humanity's existence on this planet, this guy was here first, and just look at what he did when he got that opportunity. Have you got an idea in your head of how you want to push things forward from where he left off? Yes, but I don't think I look at it like that. I think I'm doing what it is that I was brought in here to do, which is push expansion and growth, not only in sales, but in perspective. My culture has been very a significant contributor to the bottom line every quarter. That's not lost on the house. That's not lost on the family. That's not lost on me, so that's important to us. Did they give you a brief when you joined? Like, you know, sometimes when they hire a new designer, the designer has to put together like a mood board or a vision or a project to say, okay, this is what I'm going to do with it. Did you have to do that? No, but I did. And what was in that vision? Well, I took them through the history, which they all knew, meeting Mark in 2003, starting to work together toward the fall of 2003, actually having the sunglasses come out on 2004. We launched sunglasses together, you know, they hadn't done it before. Like, it was all this 20 year history. When I walked them through that, then I walked them through the idea that like the other designers, how they approach things from Mark Jacobs being the designer of the house, period, women and men's to his collaborations, Kim Jones, Nicholas Gascar, Virgil, and then myself. And how they looked at fashion, how they approached designing and how I did and made a distinction that I design from a place of what it is that I'm looking for and what I need. Mark of that word, luxury, convenience, what's convenient to me and what I'm looking for when I walk in the store. And then I talked about like the archetype, which is the consumer and the idea that they're like essentially five pillars, five modes of like the things that we're looking for. But were the five modes? Well, that's the secret sauce. Oh, give me a, give me a flavor of it, though, because I, you know, I'm what I'm trying to understand what I haven't seen. Well, for one of the pillars is like formal, which we refer to it as a different name, but that's like one of the ingredients in the sauce. Okay. But formal. There's no secret that like we really went. Yeah, and to take, when I talked to Pietro, you talked about tailoring. Yeah, we went crazy with it, because before example, the consumer like myself. If I have the disposable income to be a regular customer, I'm more than likely going to be someone who owns a business, someone who's in a C-suite position of a business, or someone who works at a business. And if I do, I'm probably going to be someone that needs to, you know, you work really hard for what it is that you get paid, you're going to need to take some time to go to events and go to ceremonies, right? So I'm going to need formal wear. There will be moments of my like family where I need to go and I need to be dressed for something. I may want to go to dinner with my significant other or with my friends. Like there's all these reasons why I'm going to need that, right? So we think those things true. That's one pillar of my life. There's four others. I used to teach this fashion business course at Central St. Martins. Okay. And one of the things I used to talk to my students about is when they were, you know, they were obviously very creative. I'd say, you know, when you're designing, you need to design for people's life. If you're going to design for a woman, you need to think about all of the moments in her day when you can create something that she will find is appropriate for that situation. So this sounds very similar. Yes. Well, this is what we've done. It didn't have the distinct pleasure of like being a student over Central St. Martins Lane, but man, I have so much respect for the talent that comes out of there. It's insane. But wow. That's awesome. I understand. So you thought about the pillars. You also mentioned growth. You're here to help drive growth. This is already a 20 billion euro a year business. How much bigger do you think it can get? Well, first of all, I think it's north of 22. But growth is not just in my sales. growth is also growth and perspective. Growth is also the correct way to look at like our values, our core values, things that are important to us, the things that we stand for, the other things that we associate ourselves with, all those things are important. Sometimes growing deeper into the existing partnerships as well, which you will see soon. You'll hear of some things. New partnerships. Yeah. And then some other partnerships deepening. We'll be right back with more on the BOF podcast. Meet Fin. The single customer agent made for the entire journey. From qualifying sales leads to resolving support issues, Fin works across teams, carrying context from one conversation to the next. Learn more at Fin.ai. Hey, we're Nick and Jack hosts of the best one yet behind every episode. There's research email spreadsheets and our shared Google Doc, the headline hammer. With Google workspace with Gemini, Google's AI is built right into the premium versions of tools we already use, like Gmail, docs and sheets. No new tools are extra logins, just personalized AI for the way we work. Get AI tools for work, upgrade to Google Workspace with Gemini at GOO.GLI/WorkSupply.com Workspace with Gemini. That's GOO.GLI/WorkSupply with Gemini. You mentioned also just now, when Virgil's appointment was announced, it was 10X for the culture. Yeah. 10X. Luxury fashion is also becoming part of global culture now, right? It's like, there's a lot of conversation around the convergence of entertainment, music, sports, fashion. Why do you think that's happening? More people are online, and the impressions are big. So, it's just a matter of everyone having visibility of the same things in an Instagram feed or something. Yeah. Simple math. Is it good that this is happening? This convergence is happening? Like, what do you make of it? You know, there's certain parts of humanity that are so inspiring. There are other parts of humanity that are incredibly disappointing. But I know, in order for us to evolve, these things all have to happen. I try my hardest to just contribute to the things that I think are good, trying to be a part of the scaffolding for, like, what's righteous, pick up the pieces when our species does things that lets me down, and just keep moving, but I know that it's just a numbers game. It's just life. People are going to do that. It's going to happen. And I think what just keeps me going is just knowing that it's just math. That's just how it works. Just math, because. You're just dealing with a huge amount of people. I mean, it is 8 billion people on the planet. I think maybe somewhere around 3 billion are online, 3 to 4 billion now are online. Yeah. Maybe more. Right? So, devices of some type, like, just just bound to happen. So that convergence is bound to happen. And these companies are going to market. They're going to ride that notion. Right? Okay. More people online. Okay. Cool. We got to put money here. We got to put money there. That's just what companies do. They do that. So, of course, when the number of users rises, the ad agencies and the marketing companies are going to ride that wave. So the natural result will be that brands will be bigger and larger than ever. For us, I think we just try to do as much work as that LV is--the logo is awesome, but the brand image is very important. It's not just about Louis Vuitton or, like, the LV logo or monogram or domier. It's also about, like, the work that we do and the diligence that we put into our partnerships and making a difference in the world where we can. So we have to--or else, it's just, like, about bags, clothes, and a peril, and really the most important, valuable aspect to the brand is the people in here, because that's what keeps everything going. It's the people in this building, it's the people in the other locations, the humans. So we got to, like, make sure we stay close to that. Yeah, the thing is, like, as much as those platforms, which have connected billions of people can be co-opted or used for marketing, the customer's not dumb either, right? I think what really resonates in these online communities is real stuff, authentic messages, messages that touch people or reach people emotionally. That's what I mean. And that's, I think, when we talk about culture now, it's like, who in the culture is able to create messages and narratives that resonate with people, whether they be in sports or music or fashion or whatever. I think that's what culture is becoming because it's all coming together. So when we see Carlos Alcoraz and his veto ambassador now, and you see his narrative, just from over the last few months this summer, the experience he's had, people get excited by that. It's very important. That's what I was saying. It's like the material items that we offer are important and these are beautiful objects, but they are the result of something more valuable, which is the humans and their ideas that work here. And like the vision that we have, that's where the real true value is at. That's what you're buying. What culture maker is now, is people who are able to tell these kinds of stories. That kind of ties together music and fashion and sports and all of these things. I think it's a contributor. Yeah. I don't think there's like a one-size-fits-all situation, but like, yeah. What else is there that makes or creates culture now? If I could distill it down to anything as authenticity of someone's something or somewhere that is interesting, the authenticity of it, because so much is manufactured these days, so much can be fluffed, so much can be tuned and filtered, and so much can be affected, but the authenticity of something, someone, somewhere, nothing touches that. And it's in the digital world, everything is so interesting, but going somewhere physically and having that, creating that memory is like so much more valuable, and that excites me. As much as people get so nervous about AI this and AI that is like, come on, guys. If you're that nervous about it, then why do you talk to Siri? Why do you talk to Alexa? Okay. Why do you go search things on Google? I mean, everyone's interacting with AI every day, you know? Right now, yeah. Right. Yes, man. Yes. You are Discover Feed or you're for you feed or you're grocery order, you're Amazon, or like, it's already there, right? 100%. Yeah. Well, take a picture without a filter. Do me a favor, try that. People get, you know, that they always think about the furthest extremes, and they forget that their human nature is going to totally eclipse that. Your human nature will kick in, and you will use that filter when you take the photo. You will use the tune when you get ready to sing something. You will refer to your Apple Pay, you'll do all these other things, all these conveniences, fisheries. That's right. You're going to continue to do these things, it's just, but, but you'll also remember that like that moment that you get to hug your dad, you haven't seen him in a minute, that's different. Yeah. I think that's what it's going to do. It's going to enrich in like the tactile experiences for people, not just in the shot, but just in your like real life offline when you like, you know, you're going to be actually have to walk somewhere to go to somewhere to go do something and that's the beauty that I think that that's that's awaiting us like where when everyone finally understands that like this is a beautiful thing I mean you could have texted me and we could have it as an interview it would have never been as rich as it is at least from my experience. Text messages can often come off dry often think like they should have like with text messages they should have colors for like different emotions so people understand the intention like a few are upset someone like the text should be read only for a certain generation all of the different colors of hearts have different nuances of emotion in them I have yet to fully grasp them but yeah I see what you mean what we should do yeah like a blue heart and a green heart mean different things mean different things or like if I'm just like feeling like I'm having a great day maybe the text is like like blue or whatever but if like if I'm like an activist and I really want to say something about like the planet maybe the words should be green I don't know but the point is is that we're looking for things to help text messages out or like digital exchanges but this right here requires none of that this is all a sentient experience and that's what we know here in this house we know that feeling is important it's how you feel when you see something makes you want to get it it's how you feel when you put something on that lets you know it makes sense and it is aligned with your attitude and your swagger right sentience is so big here everything is about how it feels from a fragrance to a shoe it's just important we measure things like based off like how they feel so let's talk about that because I listened to this amazing conversation you had with Rick Rubin okay and you were talking about the creative process of creating your music and I'm curious now that you've got one collection under your belt like how do you compare the process that you use to create your music it's the same it's the same it's the same it's just different tools okay so talk to me about your now very famous speedy bag like what was the process of creating that bag and how would you compare it to creating an amazing track well I like sounds and I also like genres I will pick an era and a genre of music that is being not necessarily under-appreciated with something that people don't necessarily listen to at the moment or not big groups of people and pick that as something to go in study the rules of what makes that rhythm look at the textures of the instruments that they use at that time and either use some of those as well but then I might play let's say like I'm like really musing from like the 60s late 60s and I would channel like pretending that I'm courtesy me Phil and I would write like how he would write but use chords that are completely disassociated from anything that he would have done I like to mix those things I think that's interesting and also do something that doesn't really make sense like do like a verses and pre course that are in a major key but then go incredibly jazzy and minor super sophisticated minor chords minor sevens and like minor 13th and just really colorful chords as a chorus most people wouldn't do that and so how does that relate I'll tell you okay so I really like that like or like I go into like the genre of rock and like use chords that might be like for a change I would use like chords that come from the 19 early 80s gospel world something that rock and roll would never do not like steely dan or like you know Donald Fagan those guys are like you know do be brothers but more like full on gospel chords like as a change in the middle of a rock song that's interesting to me and I would pick an era of rock music that I felt like would never do that and you just make this really interesting like mix so like you take the speedy and because I knew I wanted to one of the things I wanted to do was like bags and I asked them when we first met and they were like well yeah you you know you're gonna this is the house it's like 85% of the business or something so you bags are important yeah it's like yeah giving you keys to the house like of course yes of course bags are part of them okay cool so I knew I wanted to do the album because Coco Chanel had a bag made for her and it was called the s square first and then it turned into the album so I know I wanted to work on that one and then I just kept thinking I'm like man but how do you not you know the most quintessential bag I think the most famous one of the most famous bags on the planet is the speedy yeah right it's like the most recognizable like expensive like handbag but it was also like appropriated so crazy and like just totally like counterfeited like beyond and I think that also helped to make it as big as it is you know it was everywhere right it was everywhere canal street markets in China you know like different places anywhere right so if I'm gonna make a splash and I'm gonna go in and shake it up what would I do I would go imitate Canal Street and that's why we have the colors that we have but I was gonna out canal canal so I wanted to be influenced by what they've done which is another thing that no one would do like wait you're gonna be inspired by the people who counterfeit yes what are you gonna do so you're copying us right so I pick primary colors and then I did what they wouldn't do which is use like the finest leathers we could find and of course that takes the price point up which is the other thing that no one would do and every season will use a different type of material you mean not just leather yeah leathers but yeah we're doing all kinds of materials but I'm just saying like there'll be other types moving forward you'll see I can't I just can't give it away okay I get it but it's gonna continue to level up and level up and level up like well so the element of creating unexpected collisions and mixes whether that be music or yeah you gotta shake it up something very familiar but then like approached from a weight what point of view and the hold on let me see that again point of view so it's like arresting it needs to be or else what am I doing yeah that's what I said like I enjoy reaching beyond the realm of possibility I don't like that word impossible because most of the time that word proves to be like false especially if you have the resources of an organization like this yes but it starts with the imagination yeah so you can have the resources all you want if you don't have that imagination and you don't have that gifting carol you know was gifted Ray Kawakuba is gifted because their imagination is endless 100% and I know God has given me this opportunity so I'm gonna say yes this was gifted to me but you know they're gifted very gifted individuals and that's where that comes from there are many other people who have been afforded similar opportunities and they couldn't do it because it's not in their DNA you know I'm saying so for me it's my responsibility to just I gotta go like because I'm not carol and I'm not Ray I have to really work hard and express myself and continue to show my gratitude and let people know where this all came from it's my job you also said that you think about the way people feel wearing your clothes like what do you want them to feel so many things one I want you to feel empowered I want you to feel seen not just my people who admire the pearl buttons and not just the habidashary but seen as a human being you deserve to exist in this world and not just want to be a part of like that expression because that's what fashion is isn't it it's a way of expressing who you are even when you think oh I just I dress down because I don't want attention that's still expression that's expression we just want to assist you in your expression and do a lot of the thinking for you make it very easy like you should walk in the store and not be confused even if there's so many things that you like you should always feel assisted you should always feel empowered to express yourself we talked about the resources of the house and this massive organization big studio what's it like to like work with a massive team like that how have you taken on the kind of leadership elements some you have to get all those people to buy into your vision help them understand what you're trying to do they need to feel their soldiers things what did you tell them on your first day when you started I think I spent probably most of the time and just expressing my gratitude and saying how much I admire. what they do and I wanted to hear them and I wanted to hear their ideas and I wanted them to express themselves and be very comfortable. That was the most, I guess that's the top line for me. And then we just got into the vision. I just, you know, showed them what I wanted to do. And we already knew what we were gonna do for the next show, like right before the first show was-- - You already know. - Yeah, yeah, we already were-- - Anything you can say now? - No. You're overseeing and managing a lot of different activities right now. There's this, there's obviously your music. There's your philanthropic activities, yellow, black ambition. There's human race. - Yes, sir. - And there's also being a good father and husband. Like how are you balancing all of that? - Schedule. It's really what it boils down to, schedule. And, you know, I don't do a lot of hanging out and stuff. - What do you mean hanging out? - You know, like, oh, let's go do heat. Let's go here and go do nothing. Like, I don't do that. - I know, it's all planned. - Does that feel like you lose a bit of the spontaneity of life when everything has to be so-- - Oh, no, no, no, experiences I have, but I don't do a whole lot of like socializing. Everywhere I go, it's informed and planned. I want to learn, I want to sponge. I want to soak it up. - It's purposeful. - Everything. - So when you're deciding what to do, like what purpose are you aligning around? - Just all the things that I need to get done. I mean, that sounds like such a dry answer, but it happens. - It does sound a little dry, but it's also very-- - But I don't have a lot of free time. So I scheduled the things that are important to me. Schedule a movie, like, that's important. But, you know, a lot of life experiences, they're just with, like, my family and my colleagues and we're all learning. Even when I'm with my family, we're all learning. All my kids, like, we're learning. They don't have nannies. We have teachers, we have tutors, you know what I'm saying? Like, this is what I want for my children. I want them to constantly learn and be curious. - There's gonna be lots of people listening who are keen to hear your advice. What advice do you have for young people who are looking to find their own creative path? - First, recognize that you are a living human being, which allows you to do so much, regardless of what your circumstances are and what your circumstances suggest, you're living at a time that presents opportunity for you to do things. And when you see a block, there's a way around it. Anything standing in your way, always remember no matter how tall and how wide it is and how much and how heavy it seems. It has a side. It has a backside. It has a top and it has a bottom. You can get around it. If man can put probes on Mars in 1976, you can get around this. Curiosity is gonna be the fuel to help you do that. And education, should you have access to it? I mean, now we have the ubiquitous nature of the internet, so pretty much you can look for anything you want online and get some pretty good information on what it is that you want to know or understand and go. And don't look back for what? You can see how far you come later. Carlogger felt used to always say that to me. Don't look back. I never look backwards. I'm always looking forward. Always. Why? Scared to look back. I think if I take my eyes off the sun, I'll lose my way. That seems like a really good place to end. Yes, sir. Thank you. Thank you for all. Thank you. I appreciate your time. You too, that was really great. The BOF podcast is edited and produced by Emma Clark and Eric Brea in the BOF studio team. With the Spark Cash Plus Card from Capital One, you earn unlimited 2% cash back on every purchase and you get big purchasing power. So your business can spend more and earn more. Steven, Brandon, and Bruno, the business owners of Sand Cloud, reinvested their 2% cash back to help build the company's retail presence. Capital One, what's in your wallet? Find out more at capitalone.com/sparkcashplus. Terms apply. Behind every episode, there's research, email, spreadsheets, and our shared Google Doc, the headline hammer. That means less time on the work, around the work, and more time finding the stories worth talking about. Upgrade to Google Workspace with Gemini at geo.gele/workspacewithgemini. That's geo.gele/workspacewithgemini.