Part 1: The 10 Players Facing the Most Pressure Next Season

[MUSIC] Coming up on the Zack Lowe Show. It's July 30th, but you're listening to this much later than July 30th. This is part one of two part podcasts with Kurt Goldsbury that we're hoping to drop over the next couple of weeks as I'm galloping around Europe on vacation. It's a very simple gimmick. The 10 players facing the most pressure in the NBA for the 26-27 season. We each made lists of 10 and we go in reverse order from 10 to 1, part one. This podcast right now is the first half of our lists, plus some honorable mentions. We hit the Celtics. We hit the Raptors, we hit the Rockets, the Magic, the Pistons, the Wolves, a bunch of teams and a bunch of interesting sort of pressure-facing players, if you will. Then we ended with a deep dive on the Indiana Pacers. Do you remember them? The Indiana Pacers, they didn't have any players on either of our list, so they had several honorable mention pressure players. This team was within a win and maybe an injury of the NBA title like a second ago and they're over under as 43 and a half on Fandall. They have a new center of each of Zubat's replacing Miles Turner. Otherwise, basically the same team minus Ben Matherin that almost won the championship. What do we make of this team? What should our expectations be? So it's Part One, Pressure Rankings, Pacers, hope you enjoy it. Welcome to the Zaglo Show. It's July 30th, but you will be listening to this sometime in August when I am in Europe, galavanting around. Kurt Gold's very here. We're going to have some fun. We're going to count down the 10 players under the most pressure in the upcoming NBA season given that most, but not all of the offseason drama and players changing teams has done. Mr. Gold's very. How are you doing? I'm great. I'm excited for you and your family to galavant. It is the season in the NBA calendar, where a bunch of us get to galavants. So enjoy it, Zach. The biggest major drama still yet to be decided, at least as we're recording this on July 30th is Kauai Leonard. The investigation continues or may be almost ending, may be about to end into the aspiration to ledge cap circumvention scandal. Baxter Holmes reported yesterday at ESPN that this process could, could in a worst case scenario for everybody involved, including me and you go into 2027 because you and I talked about this on July 15th when Adam Silver gave us press conference. It's not like investigation over a decision done necessarily. There's an arbitration process to which the union is a party. Is it appeals process on top of that if an arbitration goes one way or another? So yes, obviously, like we talked about that. It could take much longer than Adam Silver's. We hope to have this resolved over the summer timeline, unless there is some sort of like I called it plea bargaining agreement where the investigation is done. Everybody gets together. They hash out what's fair before going into set arbitration process. I have nothing else to say about this. We haven't heard the end of it, maybe by the time people listen to the issue for the end of it. Like Pablo keeps coming out with episodes are all very interesting. There was one about a Rhode Island soccer team that came out last night. Awesome reporting. I just, at some point, life will move on. Yeah, it just, I think it's interesting because the only thing I would add, Zach, is that Adam Silver seemed to take a pretty confidence dance throughout the spring that this was going to be resolved this summer before the, before the season. To me that's the most no worthy thing. I don't think that was ever realistic given the scope and as you alluded to, Pablo's continuing to uncover things. And then I thought Baxter's reporting was really relevant because if the clippers don't like the result or if the players association does not like the result, both outcomes I think are very likely here. There's going to be, there will be more things to do. So it's looking more and more so. Like I saw Adam speak in New York a couple of weeks ago and I texted you right after he said he's like, Kauai Leonard is a clipper. He said that like very adamantly and I was like, Oh, that's interesting. But yeah, the thing here is like training camp is weeks away, brain and angroom, grady dick that hang in the balance, Kauai Leonard hangs in the balance. This is just going to be messy and extended to the full. I'm excited to take a break from it and it's going to be great. The other offseason drama that did end in time for me to go on vacation was LeBron James signing with the Philadelphia 76ers after of course, they famously acquired Jalen Brown from the Celtics. Well, Bill Simmons was undergoing a colonoscopy. We've talked ad nauseam already on this podcast about that trade the sixers team, the state of the east. I just, I will say I'm excited to go on vacation again, it's July 30th because I fear Kirk that there is another week's worth of inside the bronze decision coverage coming because yesterday July 29th, albeit only five or six days after the decision itself was made public. There was a Dave McMahon story on ESPN, which I feel like is like the fourth in depth story about inside LeBron's decision to go to Philadelphia. Simultaneously, there was Rich Paul and Max Kellyman on our podcast network had Sean strontion to talk about the inside story of LeBron James. And look, LeBron is arguably arguably the greatest swear of all time. I have nothing against LeBron. I've loved following his career. I've interviewed him a few times. He's awesome. Like, I have said from the before he even chose the sixers that I thought it would be kind of cool. If he chose the sixers, I've said he's not ring chasing all of that stuff. All of that said, I kind of feel like they're having a little too much fun at the offices of clutch HQ, just sort of, it's not a victory lap. It's like, oh, did you guys miss the breadcrumbs? We had this breadcrumb here, the breadcrumb over here, did we tell you that this meeting happened over here? It's going to look cheeky. It's going to look cheeky for my taste. And the other thing is, all of these stories have fun little details in them that were here to for unknown. And like, oh, the Celtics were interested or the Clippers had this offer. And they come at the cost of things like this, anonymous quotes like this. This is from the men of that story. He didn't take the easy way a sixers source told the SPN. He's comfortable of being uncomfortable, which a lot of people aren't. Can we just settle down like you didn't say, did anyone say he took the easy way? Was anyone, was anyone making an argument that there was a harder way he should have taken? And why are you co-opting Daryl Moury's comfortable being uncomfortable and throwing it at his face after you fired him? And then added a source close to James. I gained even more respect for him. Everybody looks at a job as work. But when I saw that, I asked myself, let's say you worked for this company for 20 something years, and you know that you're going to retire in a few years. Would I go to Philly? Would I go somewhere that's a six hour flight and leave everything my family here to go there? It's really the pure story of dedication to his craft. It's basketball. There's not enough settle down juice in the grocery store to pour on top of that quote. Can we just all relax a little bit with this fawning, myth-making about a dude who decided to go play on a great East Coast team with Joel and Beat and Jail and Brown. It's just everything is a little, it's a little much. I don't know if maybe I'm just cranky, it's like a little, a little much with the, and then he talks about saying how he said, trust the process at the, the, the fanatics. He did not say that in any way, shape, or form to drop some kind of Easter egg about the six. There's a source close to James told the SPN, first of all, why do we have to have anonymous sources about a stupid quote if the fanatics that quote? He thought it was funny, but also it wasn't conscious. Okay. What the fuck does that mean? I'm just, it's a little too cheeky, it's all too cheeky and I'm done now. It's the drinks of content and I think they dropped a bomb in a perfect time to own the news cycle. They wanted to give them credit, you're right, they really played it out perfectly. Yeah. I'm happy about it. I haven't spoken about it. I think the MacNenneman column that you and I talked about two weeks ago, where we had gone back and forth about, man, this seems like it was realistic. That actually changed my opinion. I still didn't think it was going to happen, but looking forward, Zach Low, beyond this hysteria, I will say this, it makes the Eastern Conference regular season programming a lot more interesting because now those Philly, Boston games are juicy, the Philly, New York games are juicy, the Philly, Miami games. There's like a matrix of great Eastern Conference games and some inner conference games, but ultimately I'm glad this happened and I can't wait for October because October is better discourse in the NBA than August, that's for sure. You know Kirk, that was a really good take. I gained even more respect for you from that take. Even on to the gimmick of this podcast, the dust is settled and this is supposed to be, this is going to be a two part sort of evergreen podcast that they can drop in while I'm on vacation. So this feed does not go dormant. So the gimmick is just this. I said, let's each rank our 10 players facing the most pressure in this upcoming NBA season. Now that we've seen everyone exchange teams has gotten traded and we're going to go in reverse order. So we're going to pick our number 10s, facing the least pressure of the most pressure group. And then part two will have the guys that we are facing the absolute most pressure for the coming season. I expect that some sixers may come up in this discussion. And so we're just going to go rapid fire then I'll have a bunch of honorable mentions. We'll see how our lists overlap. And with that Kirk, I will let you lead off who's number 10 on your list. Number 10 on my list is Lamello. ball. The newest member of the Minnesota Timberwolves, a player who's now been hoisted from sort of a franchise that's happy to play basketball to one that expects to play basketball into May and maybe even June. I think Minnesota took one of the biggest gambles of this whole off season, sending out Nasrite, the beloved Nasrite, a fan favorite, and importing one of the most polarizing guys and the league and you factor in the fact that Minnesota has been to the conference finals two of the last three years. A tough second round loss to the Spurs last year and then this closing or opening Ant-Man window depending on who you talk to and it feels like a lot of this falls on the shoulders of the mellow ball. Will he be able to bring this team to the next level and suddenly level up that glow? And I'm pretty skeptical actually but nonetheless I think he has a lot of pressure, the kind of pressure he has never had on him as a player in this league. Here's the pressure and he was on my honorable mention list along with Rudy Gobert from this team and also I like to go deep cuts. Again, honorable mention. I had Taren Shannon Jr. just because there's this massive hole at power forward because not only did Nasrite go out, Julius Randall went out in a salary dump essentially to enable this move. But the pressure is now you have expectations that go beyond the play in. You have expectations of being a 50 plus win team and playing deep into the playoffs, which means going toe to toe against the nastiest, meanest, most athletic, most physical teams. And I think that was the doubt that Charlotte harbored about the mellow ball. If we got in a playoff series with Steph Castle or the army of Oklahoma City wings in your grill in your jersey pushing shoving, making every catch a chore. Are you going to will or are you going to are you going to get even tougher and out physical them and fight for the ball and fight for position and fight for rebounds. Are you going to get even more reckless with your passes and your trickery and your highlight real chasing and all that. I think it's the most fascinating one of the more fascinating experiments in the league. I'm kind of with you that I'm a little less like optimistic about it as a functional move than I was when it happened. I get why they did it. I think it will work to some degree. Like I get I think offensively they're going to be very powerful moving Anthony Edwards until less of a ball dominant role. I'm just interested. I think the cost though when you talk about filling power forward minutes from Randall and read to more McDaniels at the four Shannon junior trade liles this year on a minimum jail in Clark like that's Josh Green might help a little bit. It's a lot. It's a lot to ask and for I did my homework for this assignment and I said you know there's five types of pressures at low that we're going to talk about. There's contract pressure living up to big numbers. There's legacy pressure living up to career expectations. There's health pressure which I'll come back to and then there's like this foundational pressure when you're the center of an organization and then there's market pressure. I think Minnesota is a market that expects to win but the biggest thing we haven't talked about with Lamello is health pressure and I'm sure you've talked to people around Charlotte since their season where when they talk about this move they are unfortunately really skeptical that Lamello's ankles and lower body can live up to the grind that the modern NBA puts on these guys. He only played 28 minutes per game last year and that was no accident, Zach Lowe. That's the number that I think Minnesota fans have to ingest and understand why they were doing that and it's also a big reason why they were willing to get off of what some people consider to be their franchise player in this transaction. So can he withstand the health pressure or his ankles going to hang on to to defend Shay and these spurs dudes or is he going to be on injured list a lot. Number 10 on my list kind of a deep cup but I had some fun with this. This will surprise you I think. Read Shepard from the Houston Rockets. And again like I can go there's a bunch of obvious guys on my honorable mention but like this is an interesting one to me for a number of reasons. Never quite found his footing to the degree we all thought he would or should have in the regular season even under email Doca who is defense first incredibly demanding and just would not go all in to start read Shepard when they clearly needed a boost on offense with Fred Van Bleet out. Fred Van Bleet is back now. He's back as read Shepard comes off a playoffs that can only be described as an absolute catastrophe in almost every possible way shot 30% from the field 30 mostly 3s so you know not as bad as on paper got picked on on defense um committed one of the two absolutely inexplicable egregious turnovers at the end of game three against the Lakers trying to split a double team at half port that cost the Rockets an un like you should never in a million years lose that game and it ended up essentially cost it in the series. And he is the number three pick in a draft where Steph Castle was the number four pick taken by an in-state Western conference rival in an all-time potentially sliding doors moment that the Rockets may just the Rockets and the rest of the West may not be able to recover from and this is maker break now for read Shepard and break means is he a trade asset that the Rockets use in some sort of mid season move to sort of get a team to you know trading picks and future prospects for a veteran kind of player we'll see but I got my read Shepard that's all you want to go down your list yeah the 2024 draft class obviously it's a key year for these guys to make money to Zacklow you have to earn an extension and when you're drafted number three and you're draft you should be a max extension candidate very least and he has a lot to prove to get there of this season I just want to say I agree with that he was on my honorable mention yeah all right so I had Alex are in the same sort of sense like this is a time for you to to get paid young man number number what next time I'm on your list Chet Humbren oh okay we have our first overlap Chet Humbren is nine on your list Chet Humbren is way up at number three on my list so we could knock off two birds with one stone you do the honors okay I'll do the honors I can't wait to hear what you say obviously this is a young player who had become an all defensive type player a rim protector a stretch five um a key piece of a championship team things were looking great a year ago this was one of the greatest pieces of a potential dynasty for sure uh then this bird series happened and I think Victor wemmanyama just putting one of the ultimate sort of laser sights on one person it was a really interesting moment in NBA history for me he they obviously just have this cool rivalry and when we just sort of poetically made that a one-sided rivalry uh and that was all culminated obviously with a game seven performance that'll go down an infamy in Oklahoma where Chet Humbren was one of two from the floor in 32 minutes has four points three rebounds and two assists in a game where his team needed him the most uh and now and I know this is in your notes too what happens this year is that glow his his five year two hundred and forty million dollar contract kicks in uh five more years he has to rediscover that form that got him that contract in the first place his defense remained stalwart in that series but our lasting image of Chet Humbren when the chips were down in a game seven against the rival that is going to define his NBA life for the next five years to team and the individual of Victor wemmanyama our lasting image of him is passing up wide open threes and one play where he caught the ball kind of in the triple threat position but closer to the baseline on the right wing and it was like quick sand opened in the floor he literally just like tried to dribble and fell over and that was the end of Chet Humbren he averaged the 11 points of game in the western conference finals he took 11 threes total in seven games which is inexcusable he became a complete offensive zero for most of the series and given that the thunder had to sacrifice a lot of depth this summer to get under the second apron it just can't happen again it can't I don't expect Chet Humbren he he falls into a lot of a bucket where a lot of big guys live bam out of bio lives here sometimes Anthony Davis even lives here where I think they're great offensive games create expectations from people like why don't they average 25 game nothing to Davis has but like why don't they have why don't does anything to Davis average 30 game they're just they just don't play that way they're not built to play that way it's not the nature of their game but you can't be a zero you got to give me 18 you got to abuse a couple switches you got a screen and roll for some dunks and have just some impact on the game offensively and what was really interesting about that spurs series is they're total reluctance to have Chet Humbren play the five at all and if you look at what they did in the offseason it looks like they're still reluctant to have Chet Humbren play the five they lost a lot of their winged up they're resigned as they are heart and shane over keeping Lou Dorte and others they drafted another center in the Mara kid from Michigan they kept big jail in Williams but I have two thunder players in my top 10 he was one of them and I think he this is his jerk goes to the outback moment after the we believe loss where he just like vanished off the face of the earth and came back literally from the australian outback a better player. This is the moment that could define Chet Hungryrd's entire career. It could go Durknavitsky or it could go Ben Simmons. I expected to go closer to Durknavitsky, but we'll see. - Yeah. - Next on my list, we can be quick on this one. We talked about how the Raptors are in limbo with this co-I traded, if it goes through, they will have tons of expectations. Jakob Pertle is honorable mention on my list. I think he's just honorable mention his that contract is already a disaster and I don't see any turning back. Emanuel quickly doesn't feel like he's barely played for the Raptors, like can you remember a single thing Emanuel quickly has done on the Raptors. Didn't play it all in the playoffs against Cleveland and they were better defensively for it because Jamal Shed took most of those minutes and Jakoby Walter took a lot of those minutes. They're gonna need Emanuel quickly to be better on defense and then you look at his offensive stats and they're like about what you would expect if you were the Raptors. He's like 17, six and six, 37, 38% on threes, shoots a lot of threes. He just, and he played 70 games last year. It's not like he was out the whole year, but before that, the year before he'd only played 38, 68th year before that, it just feels like division was, we're not handing the offense to Emanuel quickly, but you're gonna defend point guards and you're gonna be this sort of like supercharged version of a George Hill where you average 16, 18th game. You're off the ball a lot. You can set screens for Scotty Barnes and reverse pick and rolls. You punish defenses on closeouts. And we've seen like a quarter of it here, a quarter of it there. For this team to take the form that it thinks it can take, they just need Emanuel quickly to be very good for a prolonged period of time. And I feel like people have just forgotten about him and he makes $32 million for the next three seasons. It's time for them to get the Emanuel quickly who they thought they were getting in the OGN and OB trade. And the NICs already got the OGN and OB, they get rid of getting in that trade. So RJ Barrett's done his job. He's not even on my list. I feel pretty confident about what RJ Barrett brings to the table for better or worse. He's an interesting extension candidate. I've talked about that. Emanuel quickly, it's like time for this to be a consistent real thing. - Yeah, I have no notes. I did not have him listed, but I agree that this person, like I was gonna bring up the OG part of this. Like don't forget that he was one of the main pieces in that trade, but yeah, dude, I don't have him on my list, but a monthly issue. - You hate Canada, that's all. - Do I? - My car got stolen in Montreal this summer. So that's a story for another time, but I'm sure. - Wow. - Yeah. Turns out auto theft is a big deal of Montreal's act. We can do a whole podcast on it. - Sorry, I just like your car, sorry, buddha. - Yeah, dude. Yeah, I don't know what else to say. - So pick your next guy. Who cares? We're done with him, Emanuel, quickly. - Donovan Mitchell, they played in the playoffs. Donovan Mitchell, this is one that I'm like least excited to talk about. I feel like this has been his saga for the last two years when I've been on your show. It's now or never. It was an ugly postseason. Technically, they made it to round three or whatever, but it never felt like that was around three level performance by this team. And Donovan Mitchell's part of that. He needs to be better. As I said, I think there's five types of pressure. On my list, this is what I would characterize that glow. There's a legacy pressure. This guy's so talented, so good. Yet he's never been real close to the NBA finals. He's too good of a player, I think, to have that legacy. And I still think Cleveland is really good. And I think this team has a chance to put it all together. And we talked about this on your show for months now. We didn't see a lot of mobility and Allen together this year because of injuries. They got hardened in the middle of the season. They still have a chance in a pretty open Eastern conference to make a lot of noise. And Donovan Mitchell has a chance to get MVP votes, all NBA consideration. We've seen it for years, but I think time is running out for Donovan Mitchell to be that guy. How about the $75.5 million player option? He now has in 20, 30, 31 curts. Does that put in additional pressure on him? Oh, there's got right pressure. Yeah, for sure. I had Mitchell, Hardin, and Mobley, all in my honorable mentions. Mostly because I'm just kind of like you bored of talking about the Cavaliers at this point, like he's having Mobley going to make the leap offensively. Let's say I have that discussion again in October. That'll be fun. And James Hardin, you know, Bill and I did our pre-playoff draft of just different categories that he makes up before the playoffs every year. And one of them was like legacy guy. And we got to the end and was like, wow, we didn't even think about Hardin for a guy who can flip his legacy. And it's like, 'cause I know exactly what's going to happen. He's going to choke in a real elimination game. And that's just going to be what it is. He's going to have some big games along the way. And he certainly did in both their playoff series that they won not so much against the Knicks. And I don't think they're done yet in the offseason, despite missing out on LeBron James. There's, I think some tepid cominga interest. Again, it's July 30th is a recording this. By the time you listen to this, John think cominga could be a cab or you could be something else. I think there's some, less also some level of Peyton Watson sign and trade insurance for the cabs. But there's apron issues on both sides of that. And I'm not sure they have enough really to get it done. But I think they know how big this upcoming season is for them with the East, you know, having beefed up around the edges at least, I think there are at least 11 good teams in the East. So gets a good pick. All right, I'm going to predict that my next guy, number eight on my list, is also on your top 10. How will Ben Carroll from the Orlando Magic? No. Honorable mention. OK, now, too, honestly, I don't do this much. But I'm like, I think I fucked up. I should put a monitor. I think that's fine. That's why we have two of us. OK, I'm happy to get there with you because this man has a lot of pressure on him for a variety of reasons. 22, 8 and 5 in the regular season, 46% shooting, 31% on threes. And again, the magic were slightly better with him off the floor than on the floor. I have talked about before. That's used as sort of a scarlet letter against him. I don't really believe it. I think that has a lot to do with the structure of their team and all the injuries that have happened to them over the last, you know, X amount of years. In the playoffs, 26, 9 and 6, the game, great counting stats. He always shows up. He always plays tough. 42% shooting, 33% on threes, 46% on twos. And again, why I don't believe in that scarlet letter. The team was decent when Bancara was on the floor, although not offensively. Their score in margin was about even. And it complete sinkhole when he was off the floor, partly because Franz Wagner missed a lot of that first round series against the pistons. And look, I mean, the story remains the same. His best nights, he looks like the number one option on a great team. For him and the magic to advance to the next level, he has to bottle more of the efficiency that defines those best nights, which means probably taking fewer jump shots because we're getting better at shooting long teams and threes because he takes too many of both. And also getting more comfortable and the shooting is part of this, not playing the number one option role all the time because you have another really good player in Franz Wagner. And you're going to have to learn to play off him a little bit better. And I just keep coming back to-- I think people are sweeping on the magic as a top six team of the east next year. I'm not going to say they're going to be a top six team. I'm going to have to look at the standings and all that. But they also have the Anthony Black question hovering over their head and the money question, because their payroll is huge. But Suggs, Bane, Bancaro, and Wagner only played 19 games together in the regular season. And that quartet was about plus 12 per 100 possessions. I do still want to see more of it together. Suggs was an honorable mention for me because it's like, OK, man, what is this just every year going to be you shoot OK to not OK from three and you're injured all the time? Is there a consistent player archetype that we can tap into? But I'm going, Paolo Bancaro. I've always been a not fervent believer, but I have been defensive of him against the criticism. He's just an empty stats, empty calories. A good stats, bad team guy. I think his passing and scoring ability around the rim are pretty interesting. But he's on my list. Let's I'll put it that way. But yeah, and here's why I would-- I mean, I've been horn on him. I got aggregated on this very show because of a Paolo take last year. Look, sometimes it's too slow. The ball sticks. It looks like an old Josh Smith tape is the bit I use and got aggregated for. The name you didn't mention, which is why I'm pretty confident about the magic this year, aside from the injury stuff, is Sean Sweeney. And I know you. I really do think Sean Sweeney is going to change the culture and the vibe there. I think he did a marvelous job in San Antonio. Marvelous job in Dallas before that. He's just one of these guys. And I think that'll trickle down into Paolo's game, the style of offense, I think the intensity of the team. And he's too talented. I remember the first time I saw Paolo play was the final four. And right now, he's just one of these guys you see in person. You're like, oh my god, this guy is so talented, so big, so athletic. He's a five-tool player. I still think he has a lot of potential to put that together. Maybe that's why I didn't have him in this list, because I'm pretty optimistic. But I'll meet you there. I think he does have pressure. And that team has pressure because-- because this core, this duo of Wagner and Bancaro, it's time for them to put up or shut up. And I do think I'd have to look at it too. I think four, five, six is definitely in play for the Atlanta Magic this year in the Eastern Conference. - All right, let's take a quick break and then we'll continue on our fresher player list with Kirk Goldsbury. - All right, I think it's your pick now. What are you on, number seven on your list? - Yes, I am on number seven and I'm going with Aaron Fox from the San Antonio Spurs. You are overlapping with me again. You had Chet Holmgren at number eight. I think I had him at number three. You had Aaron Fox at number seven. I have Deer and Fox all the way up at number two of my top 10 fresher list. So let's get into it. Well, let me get out of the way because you've obviously, you've got the more to say here. You know, when you talk to people around the Spurs, everybody was disappointed in the finals. They think they had a chance to win. When you were head by 46 minutes left, we were head whatever. You can roast them for that. But Deer and Fox's performance in the 2026 NBA playoffs was not good enough. Now, they'll quickly say what, Zach Lowe. He had a devastating ankle sprain. He was making it work. He was trying his best. And I will agree with that. That was a six week injury and the dude came back in two weeks. A lot of NBA players would not have even tried. That said, some of the things we saw, I think, were just too bad, even to say, oh, he's got a bad ankle. Like turnovers that were unforced and just mental mistakes. So I think the defining mental mistake of the entire playoffs was the botch layup over an OB enabling the an OB tip in in game four of the finals 100% and the greatest come back. This league may ever see in a big moment. And you know, those kinds of things make me put him on this list. So I will acknowledge the ankle injury with my friends in San Antonio, but this man makes a lot of money and they brought him in to make this team a real championship contender. I thought it looked like he had done that all regular season, but then there were moments in the playoffs where it didn't look like he was made for that. So, but you have him higher on the list. So I will turn it over to you, Zach Lowe. Well, I have him higher in the list only for two reasons. Number one, this is obviously a championship contender that needs at least for some amount of time as Harper and Castle really find their groove in the league needs his organizational capabilities and probably his mid-range shooting, which deserted him in the playoffs specifically in the finals with that ankle injury. He's also under pressure because he is starting a four year, 200 something million dollar contract that is right now untradable. And he's also under pressure because the guys behind him were beside him in the rotation are coming for his minutes if he doesn't produce. So it's a perfect storm of all kinds of pressure. The finals were bad for him. The playoffs were largely for him 15 a game, 41% shooting, 29% on threes and 47 and a half percent on twos, which is not good enough. ankle sprain was a big part of that. He also started the season with the hamstring injury. So he started kind of behind the eight ball trying to build chemistry with one banana castle and Harper and all those guys. And after the finals, there was a lot of defensive deer and fox. And the defense that kept hearing was, well, you know, disperse were still better with him on the floor than they were with him off the floor. They need his organization. They were incoherent without him on offense. And I think in the finals in parts, that was true. They had a slightly positive point differential with him on the floor in the finals and a slightly negative one with him off the floor in the finals. But for the season and for the playoffs, when the according to cleaning the glass, when the spurs had Wemba Nyama, who obviously is the keystone to everything. Castle Harper on the floor and Fox off the floor. It's not a huge sample size. And it goes about 180, 200 minutes in the regular season, something like that. And obviously less than the playoffs. They absolutely wiped the floor with their opponents. And so I get the idea that his skill set is part of what this team needs. That his clutch jumpshooting, which again, vanish in the playoffs. He shot 43% on mid-ragers in the playoffs, 52 in the regular season. I think they, if they want to win the championship next year, I think they need deer and fox. But I think the defense of him was a little overblessiferous given how he performed in the finals and what those numbers show. But I do think they need him. I do think they have a, he has a better season in him. I thought, I kind of expected him to shoot better from three, bounce back a little bit to his, his king's highs and this context, he didn't do it. And he's just an okay to good pastor for his position. He's not an incredible playmaker in terms of finding Wemba Nyama on Lobs and stuff. Hopefully that comes with chemistry, but he's a no brainer for wherever you put him on the Swiss. He's got to be there. But the trio you lined up there, obviously Fox Castle, Wemba Nyama, it feels like, okay, that's the core of this team. Sorry, Darren. Sorry everybody. You mean Harper Castle, Wemba Nyama. Yeah. Yeah, sorry. What did I say? I don't know. Fox. Yeah. That's right. So the two young guards in Wemba is obviously this, this core trio going forward. One stat to deer and defense that I think is really important is when Stefan Castle was the point guard after Fox went out against Minnesota. Stefan Castle, log two of the worst turnover games that we are seeing in postseason history. Darren comes back and sort of studies studies the offense. Those turnovers went away and then a related story, the spurs put away the wolves. So I do think his grown up maturity as a grown up point guard in this ecosystem is very valuable and was proved valuable in some times. But then the idea that this guy won the clutch player of the year awards act a few years ago for Sacramento just seemed like a distant memory, watching him down the stretch, hobbled on one foot, but how, you know, playing in those moments in the, in the, in the finals. All right. I'm going to go to number seven on my list. Jalen Durin, Detroit Pistons on a little mention. This is an obvious one incredible regular season all NBA, he's all NBA 13 appearances. One of the reasons he has of July 30th and more recording this is not yet signed to a contract with Detroit Pistons to play next season. And the playoffs were pretty much a disaster for Jalen Durin. He averaged about 10 points a game way down from the regular season, assist to turnovers about even he looked on steady, rickety, uncertain to the point he started trying his mid-range jumper, which isn't ready for prime time. And the roles to the rim that he feasted on in the regular season in the first round or Lando just took those away completely by switching and going under screens on Kade cutting him. And there was no plan B. And even in the second round, the Cads defended a little bit more traditionally against the pick and roll and he could not hurt them at all. A couple of you see glimpses of it, even in the playoffs, like a couple of times we would seal guys in transition and dunk on them. There was one game. He had like a three dunk sequence in a row on the Cavaliers in one game. So there were snippets of it. But the idea of him as like secondary offensive option, a guy who can face up and create against playoff defenses, a guy who can be a hub a little bit as a passer. It just wasn't there. I will say he's still only 22 years old. Like it's incredible how young he is. I'm a complete believer in his defense. He's been a little unsteady at times. His decision making can be a little hazier times again. He's 22. I think he has all the tools and all the will to be a guy who can play pretty much any scheme defensively. His rim protection in the playoffs was better than it was in the regular season. So I'm a believer he's kind of tied to a Sar Thompson in the sense that like one of them has to develop a little bit offensively on the ball to make this really, really sing in the playoffs. But I'm assuming he will be on the pisses next season. Again, it's July 30th. And I just think given what happened to him in the playoffs, he's kind of like Eastern conference Chet Homegren. It not that anyone ate his lunch the way when B H at home grinds lunch, but just the playoffs didn't go the way it needs to go for him. And he needs to dig deep and figure out why that is and how not to make it happen again. For a team that, you know, people are kind of hating on their on their off season. They've swapped out to buy his Harris for John Collins and more or less, you know, they added Isaiah Joe. They didn't do much. I don't really. I'm not in a rush for them to do much. They still have all their trade assets. I still think they're going to win a shit ton of games next year and be in contention for the number one seed in the East. But they've now reached the stage where the playoffs are what matters and he's just got to be way better. Average 20 points a game in the regular season didn't score 20 once in 14 playoff appearances. That's not good. That pick and roll play with with Cunningham and him had become one of the bread and butter actions in the whole league efficient despite just being spammed game after game after game. It worked. It worked until it didn't when it mattered most that Orlando series was tough to watch. Being outplayed by players that I think most of us would have thought are much below his standard coming into that series. But the thing he said the most that that I would would put him lower on my list in the honor of mention is the 22 year old part. He's younger than some guys that just got drafted in the first round. And he deserves some time to grow. But man, like I said, you have to score the ball on that team, particularly Zach Lowe and an ecosystem where offense is not the strong suit where shot creation is not the strong suit to lose the offense from Durin in that playoff run was particularly painful for that team. Uh, let's go. Let's do come more guys now. We'll pivot for a bit. But like, give us, give me number six on your list. We're getting towards the top five now. Give me number six. Uh, it is Jason Tatum. Uh, he's Celtics. He is number five on my list. Okay. So we, we are about equivalent on Jason Tatum. Go ahead. Okay. So I'm sure we're going to have some of the same things that fair enough. I think there's a perception that the Celtics either chose Jason over Jaylen or Jason over Jaylen and Jason, depending on who you talk to, there's a perception they, they did. That's what they chose. Jaylen is out on the Celtics anymore. Um, but like our friends in Minnesota, I think the expectations in Boston remain sky high, despite the massive trade of this year. And then that puts a lot of pressure on Jason Tatum. Um, and the thing that I would say is he has this market pressure associated with his team in Boston. He has the contract pressure of a 35% of the cap guy. And he has health pressure, which I was, I wish I wasn't talking about, but that's one of the big reasons. I think we're talking about him. He's, he's failed to finish each of the last two post seasons. As team didn't have him in those big losses, uh, against New York, obviously two years ago. And then last year when he, he got hurt against the sixers and couldn't play game season seven. Um, so Jason Tatum. Um, what do you have, Zach? Well, first of all, on my honorable mentions, I had both Peyton Pritchard and Derek White. Uh, because the Celtics don't expect to go down in the standings in the Eastern Conference. Um, the Jalen Brown trade is a bet against Jalen Brown, but it's also a bet on everybody who's left over from a core who's been huge as successful in Boston for a decade now, starting with Tatum, but also Derek White, whose three point shooting fell off a cliff last year. Uh, and no one knows if it was a fluke. You know, remember, he came to Boston and that was the weak spot in his game, the, the proof it spot in his game. And he, he had proved it beyond the shadow of a doubt. And then last year, slip back, really caused the Celtics against the sixers in the first round and cost them all season. And again, was it a fluke? Was it because he had a bigger offensive workload without Jason Tatum? Well, now Jalen Brown is also not here. Paul George is here, but he's not the same kind of just like feed that guy and let him cook kind of guy is Jalen Brown. And then Peyton Pritchard, you know, I've already kind of joked about it. I just like, let's stop with the Peyton Pritchard could be Boston's Jalen Brown or Jalen Brunson. Now that he's getting a higher role in offense, Jalen Brunson is one of one Peyton Pritchard is a fine player. I have no doubt he can score 20 points of game in the NBA. Jalen Brunson is a different animal, but Tatum, look, I mean, it's indisputably his team. He is still coming off in a Kelly star. I know he played the last 20 whatever games of last season and six of Boston's playoff games. And he played them quite well, 22, 10 and five in the playoffs didn't shoot it great, but he looked more or less like Jason Tatum coming back from in a Kelly's injury. Like he looked really good, didn't get to the rim quite as often, didn't finish quite as well, all to be expected. One of the finest all-around players in the sport still. But again, this team doesn't expect to take a step back and that's on it's his team. And by the way, they won the championship two years ago. The only players left from that team who played any minutes in the playoffs in 2024 are Derek White, aside from Tatum, Derek White, Peyton Pritchard, Sam Hauser, and Nemi Cata and Jordan Walls played 24 combined minutes in the title run in the playoffs. So that they've just gradually whittled away that nucleus around Jason Tatum. And I think in all of the attention that the Sixers have gotten for putting all these high usage guys together, including LeBron, for being the team that did go out and trade for Jalen Brown. And what does it mean for Jalen Brown to not be the number one option on the team he got traded for? And all of this, he's the most, Jalen Brown is the character of the offseason in the NBA. I don't think enough attention has been paid to like what this leaves for Jason Tatum to take care of. I agree more, I couldn't agree more. I think that Bill brings up the value of durability when he's talking about Jalen Brown a lot. It's like, hey, I know these advanced metrics. Yeah, the yada yada, but this dude chooses up innings. And the Celtics had a choice between a guy with a traumatic lower leg injury and a guy who is durable. And they chose the guy with the Achilles tendon injury and these calf strain issues. And I forget what the actual injury he missed game seven four. It wasn't a calf strain even though he's icing up his calf. I forget. Regardless, I think there's a lot of that pressure on this dude. Obviously, if he misses time in a Jalen Brown-less universe, now we're talking about Derek White and Payton, Richard being options one and two on an offense to win games. I think the Celtics still win 50 plus games in a world where Jason Tatum plays 70 games, 75 games. If his number drops like 50 because of his injuries, I just don't see this team keeping up that standard that the fan base has come to expect in the Jason Tatum era. So he has a lot of pressure on. All right, I'm going to reveal number six on my list. So I've revealed 10, 9, 8, 7, and you have also taken five, three, and two from my list. So my list is down to the end. Number six, and I did a deep dive on this guy on a previous episode, so we don't need to belabor it too much. Walker Kessler, the chosen, there you go. Wow, our fives and sixes are flipped just like that. I think it's self-explanatory, right? The Lakers paid $130 million and traded two unprotected first-round picks to get them on their team. He has, I like Walker Kessler as a player. People can go back and listen to the segment. I did about why I think this will actually work decently for the Lakers on both ends of the floor. There is no question that they overpaid for him and are now trapped with this team and have to figure out either this is the team or is there a way to pivot by trading Austin Reeves down the line or something like that because they're out at tradable assets because of the Walker Kessler deal. All that said, he's played no meaningful games in the NBA, basically, and barely played at all last year. And so yeah, I mean, for fairly or not, those assets, much like happened to McHale Bridges, they're going to hang around his neck until he improves that he was worth it. And that's it. I don't know. People can go back and listen to everything I said before. Yeah, and there's multiple kinds of pressure in this draft. And I think it's fair to say everything you just said, I would add, these guys don't get compared against each other very often, but a lot with Lamello Ball and Walker Kessler, both going from these environments where winning wasn't exactly paramount for the first few years of their career, being sort of nice stories and deep on league pass for years. Oh, that's over now. Now you're playing on Los Angeles. If reports are true, Luca donge, it's lobby to get you onto this team to the point where the front office gave out two unprotected first round picks and swaps to get you. And you played five games last year. So he has this market pressure that the Los Angeles Lakers, you know, the marquee franchise in this league can put on you more than any other team. But he also has, I think this this this other pressure associated with the transaction that landed them there, fair or not. And he has to fix a defense that sucks. He has to deodorize a stank that is a stank, a stank at the point of attack, with Austin Reeves and Luca Dongech in a world with SGA, Stephon Castle, Dylan Harper, Anthony Edwards, Jamal Murray, Stefan Curry, there's no shortage of guards that will punish you for having a weak point of attack defense in this conference. They are expecting a better defense in Los Angeles, but really the only piece that that is going to do that for them is Walker Kessler. And that is a lot of pressure for this young man. All right, before we get to our sort of collective top five, I only have two of my top five left, I'm going to read some honorable mentions from my list that I'm pretty confident are not going to be in your top five. Darius Garland, none of my top five. Up for an extension, let's see how you do with the Clippers. Josh Gidey, you know, young, super exciting Bulls team, is he a guy or is he just a guy that's going to get traded as the Bulls remake their team under Bryson Graham's vision? Do you have any Pacers on your list, by the way? I have Tyrese Haliburne and my honorable mention category. All right, table that for a second. John Moran, he was an honorable mention, almost cracked in top 10. Obviously, I don't think it needs to really be explained. Dyson Daniels, he's only on this list because he simply cannot shoot that badly from three if the hawks are going to be viable. It was under 20%. And I've heard some rumblings from the hawks and people who have been in the hawks practice facility that he's remade his jump shot or is remaking his jump shot, making tweaks to whatever the right terminology is. And then it's starting to look better because Dyson, Jalen Johnson, Lou Dort, it's cool. It's going to be awesome defensively. It's just isn't going to work well enough offensively if he's a complete zero as a shooter. I mentioned the cats got Jamal Murray. Is he on your list? No, he's not. Jamal Murray and Cam Johnson just because I refuse to shut the door completely on the nuggets as long as Yoke catches upright and healthy. Collelle Ware, just not on your list, I assume? No. He's a super intriguing player who could go boom or buy and the bucks really needed to go boom. Shade and Sharp fell out of their rotation in the playoffs last year. It always, his playing time always seems to go down when the games matter the most. And was okay offensively last year. There's always these glimpses, these weeks, these quarters where he finds the right balance of shot selection and like making the simple play on offense as a passer and then it tends to go away and he takes a lot along, too. Jalen Green, I've talked about a lot. I was here on your list at all. Honour will mention one of the biggest wild cards in the league as a player option $36 million for 27-28 season of the V-Nex. The only rookie who is on my list is Darius A. Cuff Jr. Only because, sorry buddy, you carried the hopes and dreams of an entire franchise and it's fan base on your back because there ain't enough, there ain't nothing to stare for the fans to glom onto. Except Keegan Murray, who's also Honourable mentioned on my list. And with that, oh, one more. You know, Gary Trent Jr.'s got a contract to live up to now. Oh yeah. Yeah, 464, Gary. I'm comfortable being uncomfortable, are you? Okay, that's my, that's most of my Honourable mentions. I left off a couple that I think you may have on your list. But let's take a quick break and we're going to change gears for a minute. I want to save the pressure stuff for the high pressure stuff for the next episode. Let's quickly take a detour. A team that I really want to preview and look at, maybe more deeply in October, but starting now. You mentioned you had Tyree's Halibur and Honourable mention in your pressure rankings. I have him, Pascal Siacum, and a Vita Zubat, all Honourable mentioned in my pressure rankings. And this, the whole point of this segment is like, hey, remember the Indiana Pacers, they were in the finals like a blink ago. They were up in game seven in Oklahoma City, a blink ago. Tyree's Halibur and Teres is Achilles, Miles Turner signs in Milwaukee and it's a lost season. And then now they're back. And they're back with the Vita Zubats at the five in a very controversial trade with the Clippers. And he takes the place of Miles Turner. And essentially the rest of the team is exactly the same as the team that almost won the goddamn NBA championship. And their over under on Fandall is 43 and a half. Now, the Pacers team that did almost win the championship was not a great regular season team. They started 15 and 17. Aaron Neesmith was injured at the beginning of the season. Andrew Nemhart was injured for much of the beginning of the season. And then they went on a run, they just never ended. A run of glorious chemistry, fast pace, incredible legendary, almost like unicorn level clutch play throughout the playoffs and almost won the title. And here they are at 43 and a half feels disrespectful to me. But I do have to say the most interesting question maybe in the Eastern top five most interesting questions is this was like a rhythm team. They clearly they found and it happened with the nicks in the playoffs. Like you see what a team just finds the right vibe isn't the right word because it's not a vibe. The right pace, the right spacing, the right chemistry. And the game just becomes a fuel game for them. And you see when teams have it and then you see when they lose it and everything becomes a little clunky, a little forced. They'll just not as easy as it should be. The Pacers found that gear. And just like can you just find it again after a year off and importing a new center and Pascal see outcomes a year older. Can you just find it again? Because Vegas is saying we don't think you can at least not in the regular season and the playoffs you have one of the great strategic coaches of all time in Rikarlow and a track record. But can they find it again? What do you think of this team? I would take the over on me to there for sure. But I am fascinated by this team. I think Tyrese Halliburton had emerged as one of the most exciting smartest offensive players in the league. In the 2025 NBA playoffs. I don't think that's a controversial statement. But it feels like a long time ago doing what he did in Madison Square Garden, doing what he did against the Oklahoma City Thunder Guards defense. The fact that this wide open fast paced offensive minded team could go head to head with OKC and just get within, you know, one game of winning it. They went 15 and eight in the NBA playoffs. It's as close as you can get to winning a championship without actually doing it and to have that cruel injury to rail it. I think we've all sort of forgotten how good they were. I have them. I think the other reason that over under his lower those act is the Eastern conference is a little bit better. And no one is tanking anymore presumably anyway. That's a great point to a great point. And I think like teams like Atlanta and Charlotte are on the come up. I think, you know, Orlando, it's just a deeper Eastern conference. Not to mention the heavyweight to the top with the Knicks and the Celtics and the Sixers looming up there in the Cleveland Cavaliers. So the average game in the Eastern conference is a lot harder now in 2026 than it was in 2024. So that's why I think that over under his low. But dude, I think we would be doing a disservice to the Pacers and their fans. If we said this team is anything less than a team to watch to win the Eastern Conference, I think I completely agree that they're being slept on. However, if I were to explain that number and why it's solo number one, Haliburton is coming off a miss season. And there's got to be some rust. He played in a pro-M game recently. It's incredible. It's a pro-M game. We'll see what that means. But there's got to be some rust. Siakum is now entering his like not quite mid 30s, but entering the time of his career as he's eligible for an extension, by the way, where some decline should be thought about. Ben Matherin is not here anymore, and not that I was a huge fan of his. They brought in Kelly Ubreh who on the one hand, I can see as a fit for their team because he wants to play fast and he's a quick decision maker. Now his decision tree tends to just have one branch on and it is score. But that's fine. Ben Matherin was similar and sometimes you need guys who have a different kind of decision tree than the rest of your team, and at least he makes his decisions fast, which is what Rick Carlisle wants. That said, is he going to play in the, like he completely flopped in Golden State because you just couldn't play the read and react style that the Warriors played. We'll see how that fits. And the point is, their bench is TJ McConnell who kind of showed some age last year for the first time after being a playoff hero and a pretty stalwart back up point. And Shepard kind of has had a lot of chances to happen, hasn't happened. Kelly Ubreh, behind them, Jarris Walker, flashes, flashes of playmaking and pull up shooting, kind of hasn't happened. Obi-Toppin looks great when they're running and was awesome in the playoffs. And then back up centers like J Huff and then Larian Dance Behind Him. I can see the bench being not as strong as it was in their title run and I can see them getting off to a slow start as they figure out, like I think of Vita Zubat's a better player than Miles Turner. I don't think that's arguable. But he's such a different kind of player offensively that that Halibur and Turner pick and pop, sometimes role, but mostly pop with Siakum sort of darting around in open spaces and finding little crevices in the defense. That's a sea change to a guy who's really only going to roll to the basket and roll into the paint. Siakum and Zubat's are both so skilled that I think that will all work eventually like they'll have some nice big to big sequences. Sometimes Siakum will screen and roll and like hit Zubat's on in the dunker spot. Pascal's a good catch and shoot, three point shooter, not a great one, but like mid to high 30s that I think that's good enough for this to work. But I think there's going to be some growing pains. The ceiling to me is still really, really high. If Halibur and is 100% by the end of the season, Zubat's gets back to the form from two seasons ago when he was borderline all NBA and Siakum has one more great year in him at least. I'm a believer in the Neesmith, Nemhart combo as role players. So I think the ceiling is still really interesting and the coach is elite in Rick Carlisle. And really this is like if you look at their books, tons of people are eligible for extension. So this is TBD like Nemhart top and Zubat's Halibur and Siakum. Right now they're set up to be basically a two year team. Everyone but Halibur and Neesmith and it comes off the books after 27, 28 as of now. So they have that sort of like, this is a clear two year we're all in. We traded what ended up being the number five pick in the draft. And I just can't wait to see how it works. I think the ceiling is still really, really high. I agree. I think Tyrese Haliburne could be first team on NBA by the end of this year. I think he could miss all NBA. I think there's a lot of variance in his performance this year for reasons you've already outlined perfectly. But my eyes are on him. That's why he's on this pressure list for me as an honorable mention. And you know, one of my favorite things about Rick Carlisle is he is coached effectively in many different ways. When you look at the course of his career, it's really amazing. The coach and Detroit one way in India and another way in Dallas, a completely different way. I think he's the exact right coach I'd want to go for Miles Turner to Zubach with. He's not going to say, oh, this is how we do it. We're going to run pick and pops with Zubach like that. That's not what's gonna happen. If there's a concern for me, it's that the Zubach fit, that wide open pace and space, we're running up and down, that I think really suits Tyrese and Pascal Siacum, and some of those role players, you mentioned. But ultimately, I trust the infrastructure. I trust Rick Carlyle and I trust Tyrese Haliburne to have some alignment on the floor. I think this will be a top 10 offense, middle of the pack defense. And I think that's good enough to be four, five in the Eastern Conference, and above that 43 and a half. - Yeah, Zoo is a much different player than Miles Turner. And I think the Pacers are, I think a lot of teams are, like Sam Presley talked about this, when he kind of had to trade Ludoort. He said something to the effect, I'll paraphrase of like, you just can't keep playing the same way every year, even if you've been successful playing that way. Sometimes you just have to change, because you have to keep the league on its toes a little bit. I think there's a little bit of that with the Pacers going from Miles Turner to Ibiza Zubat. So let's get tougher, more physical, more stout at the rim. And I do think, despite the fact that he's not a jump shooter, like Miles Turner, that he has better feel on offense as sort of like when the ball finds me in open space, can I make the right decision quickly? Miles Turner never really got there, and it was exposed a little bit in the finals in that regard. And so I'm optimistic, I wouldn't pick him to win the East, but we'll get back to that in part two of this podcast, which we'll air at some point soon. All right, that's it for part one of this two-part Zack Lo Show. Thank you to Kurt Goldsbury. He'll be back, of course, for part two. Thanks to Oscar, Billy, and Mike on production. Thank you all for listening to and/or watching the Zack Lo Show. Stay tuned for part two. 21 or over in president select states for Kansas, in affiliation with Kansas, Starkisino, or 18 and over in president DC, Kentucky, or Wyoming, gambling problem, call 1-800-Gamber, or 1-800-My-Reset, call 1-888-789-7777, or visit ccpg.org/chat in Connecticut, or visit mdgamblinghelp.org in Maryland. Hope is here. 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