Parents of Alleged J6 Pipe Bomber Say the Government Is Framing Their Son

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Let's start with Brian Cole Sr. Where were you? How did you find out your son had been arrested? I was in a hotel in Alabama. I was traveling, working. And a DOJ officer, FBI agent, gave me a call. And he started asking, he was asking me a few questions. And he was informing me that, you know, they had picked up my son. So, you know, prior to that, it was. About 6 a.m. in the morning, I was looking at TV and looking at the news. And, you know, they were talking about they were making an arrest on the J6 pipe bomber. And maybe 30 minutes later, I get the phone call. Did they say who it was? They didn't say who it was when I, the initial. The report you were watching. Report that I was watching. They didn't say who it was. They said he was in the process of making an arrest. And then like 30 minutes later, I get a call. Did you think, I wonder if that's my son? No, never in a million years. No, absolutely not. And they called and I was talking to him. And he stated that, you know, he was, I couldn't remember his name, but he was with the FBI. And, you know, they picked up my son. And, you know, I didn't grasp it for a second because it was so early in the morning. And as he was talking to me, the news went on and I can see, you know, they mentioned the name. And when they mentioned the name, I said, man, you mean to tell me you're on the phone telling me that the person they're talking about on TV is my son? And he was like, yes. You know what I mean? And he was like, they already they already reporting on the news. I said, yes, all over the news right now. And then from there, wasn't even 20 seconds later, I started getting phone calls from reporters. And. Yeah, that's how I found out. What did you think? You know, in a situation like that, Tucker, man, it was so many things running through your mind because you're wondering what's going on. Like, you know. It's hard to explain, you don't. To wake up to something like that, six or seven o'clock in the morning and someone telling you that your son has just been picked up, he's this infamous person. You don't know what to think. You really don't. I don't I didn't know what was going on. So the first thing I tried to do was try to get in contact with his mother. And we were all unsuccessful. And then my kids started calling in because each one of them, they made contact with each one of them in person. And and then that's when we went to the to the ring cam and we saw what was going on. You know, we saw actually what. What's going on. And that's why we knew we couldn't get in contact with her because, you know, they they raided the house and took her out the house. And you were at home when the raid began. Yes, my grandson and I. Your grandson. Tell us what happened. So I woke up, I guess, around eight and around 8:15 or so, I heard a siren. So I'm thinking, you know, my elderly neighbor across the street that something was wrong. So I'm like. Oh, well, I, you know, I hope Graham's is OK. Can I say for people who don't know, since I do know you live in a cul-de-sac in a suburban neighborhood? Yes, yes, you don't have a lot of sirens in your. No. And that, you know, and I'm like, wow, you know, because she's she's elderly. And next thing you hear is come out with your hands up. This is the FBI. I get up out of the bed and I go look out my window. And the cul-de-sac is finished. Filled. You have three different trucks with. I don't know if they're rams or or machine guns pointed towards my house, you have cars in the cul-de-sac, you have gunman's with rifle all behind the trucks and behind the tree with rifle. You could see rifles facing the house. So I get dressed, I go wake my grandson up and tell him the FBI. I'm sorry to laugh. You got to get dressed and come on outside. I said, don't don't take forever. So I get up and I go outside and they tell me to come towards them. And soon as I got to them, they took my phone and they handcuffed me and put me in the truck. And then my grandson came out a few minutes later. They handcuffed you? Yes, they handcuffed me and put me in a truck. My grandson came out a few minutes later. They grabbed his phone from him, handcuffed him and put him in a truck. How old is your grandson? My grandson is 17. He was 16 then, though. He was 16. Yeah, well, he was about to turn 17 because he turned 17 on the 14th and I told them, you know, be careful because my son is still in the house because I hadn't gotten to his room to to tell him. And so, you know, and, you know, just sitting there, I'm like, you know, what's happening? What's going on? I don't. Did they tell you why they were? Not at the beginning. No, he they just said, well, we'll tell you in a few. You wake up from a dead sleep to sirens. You look out the window and there are men with rifles aiming at your house. Yes. Come out with your hands up. You have no idea what's going on. No, no. And no one explains to you why they're handcuffing you and putting in the back of a car? No. And again, you know, you have to realize because of of what we do for a living, you know, there's a lot on the line if we don't do what we do for a living. There's a lot on the line if we don't do what we do for a living, you know, there's a lot on the line if we don't do what we do for a living, you know. So I should say that you all run a family business with a big extended family, including your son, Brian Cole, Jr., who worked there, the bail bonds business, you had it for a long time, kind of multigenerational, and it's a pretty big business, I think. Yes. And you're licensed in order to run that business, including to carry firearms, because it's bail bonds, right? It's like sort of a subset of law enforcement. Yes. And so I just want to give context for people who don't know. Oh, no, you explained it well. And so you're handcuffed in the back of a car, then you see your grandson handcuffed, teenage grandson. What are you thinking? What the hell? Can I say hell? Oh, yes, ma'am. So I'm like, what the hell? You know, what is. What is all of this? You know, because, you know, we are a nice, boring family, so I don't understand where all this is coming from. And, you know, so they come and then they just tell me, some people are going to come talk to you. I'm like, what the world? And I'm not paying attention at the time this passing that Brian hasn't, you know, joined us. And so, you know, and then I start as a grandmother. My grandmother would start getting on my grandson like, you're supposed to be in school. So I'm paying attention, fussing at him. I'm starting to laugh. This is so crazy. And then all of a sudden he said they cleared the house and he said, OK, we're going to go in and they're going to tell you. But your son, Brian, has been arrested as the J6 bomber. And you go blank because you hear what they're saying. And because it's Brian, you're like, no, you most definitely got the wrong person. This cannot, you know, this is not Pharrell. And he was like, yeah, we arrested him and he is downstairs, downtown at headquarters already. Now, mind you, he we and as he said, we went back and looked at the ring camera. He left the house about six something, almost seven o'clock. So they had already had him by time. And they did all this fanfare. If they'd already arrested your son, who they claim was a suspect in this attempted bombing. Why were they pointing rifles at you and handcuffing you? Were you ever charged with a crime? No, no. And that was one of their questions. They continuously asked us, you know, did we know anything about this? Did we know anything about this? Well, no. You know, no matter how many times we told them, no, they would, you know, ask the questions and come back to that same question. So. So it's three in the afternoon. You've had your coffee, but you're still staring blankly at your screen, rereading the same line, waiting for energy because you're just enervated. It's the afternoon slump. And that's why we're excited to partner with Trumi. So Trumi makes gummy supplements made up. mushrooms, I know. Sounds like the spooky ones. But these are not the mushrooms you're thinking of. These are the ones you put in your soup, the legal ones. Trumi makes products for the basics, energy, focus, calm, sleep. It's all made in America. It's third-party tested. There's no artificial dyes, no fillers. You can read the label and actually understand what's in it, which is pretty crazy these days. So the one to start with is Trumi Boost. It's made with cordyceps. 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At all. Because, I mean, again, we're not used to this. We're not on that side to have a clear understanding of everything that they do. But I was calm because I wanted to make sure my grandsons stay calm. And then once they got us in the house, then they unhandcuffed us. Do they apologize for handcuffing? No. No. They handcuff a grandmother who's not been charged with anything. Correct. And they don't apologize. No. And a grandson. Okay. Then what happened? So I don't know how long they discussed. Then it just seemed like this army of people started coming through the door. I mean, they were. Of your home. Yes. They were like all over. So my grandson and I, they had us in the living room because they sat up in the dining room to use the table in the dining room to do their reporting or whatever they do. And so there were two agents speaking to my grandson and I in the living room. And I was like, can we get him to school? He needs to go to school because he wanted to play in his basketball game. And I wanted to make sure, although this is a crazy life turning ordeal, I wanted to try to keep it as normal as possible for him. And so they were fine with that. They took him upstairs, let him get dressed. And then they took him to school. Now, from my understanding, later on, they talked to him in the car. I don't know what, how they questioned him or what they said, but they talked to him in the car, even though before we got out of the truck, I asked one of the SWAT members, don't talk to my grandson. Don't ask him any questions. If you have anything to say, you ask me. So outside of that, I don't know what they discussed with him. And of course, teenagers are always vague. He just asked me, did I know anything? About this. And then I know that anything that Brian did and a phone number, that's about it. But you know, they made sure that he got to school. They followed him to make sure nobody was following him to school. And that was, that was it. Yeah. And this phone number, I mean, they asked every single one of us about this specific phone number for some reason, you know, even, even over the phone. And I'm not going to say my dealings with the, the agent that I, that called me very professionally. He was very polite on the phone, very professional, very polite. You know, he asked me about a phone number, asked me to key the phone number in my phone. And then it didn't come up with anything, you know, told him no, but I don't know what, whatever this phone number, they were all, they were very interested in that one particular phone number for some reason. And, you know, they didn't tell us why. They asked both of you about this one specific phone number. All of us, all of us. My kids said the same thing. Everybody. And did anyone have the phone number in his or her phone? No. No. Huh. Do you have any idea what that was about? No. No. Um, so what happened to your son? I mean, when, when did you find out exactly what the charges were and where he was? So we didn't find out exactly where he was or what the charges were until, um, our attorney. Yeah. Well, what happened? First thing, you know, of course, the first thing we wanted to do is once I, you know, once we realized the magnitude of what was going on in the county, we started comprehending, I notified my attorney. I dealt with John Shorman for, for many, many years. Um, so I got in contact with him and he, he, you know, I was asked, I was saying, Hey man, uh, have you heard, have you heard what's going on? And he was like, no, I'm, I'm in New York. And I was like, okay, uh, well, you know, my son today, just, they just, the rest, they said that he was the, you know, alleged J6 pipe bomber and they arrested him. I need, I need you. And then John said, uh, you know, okay, I'm, I'm on my way. So he left New York cause I wanted to have someone in court with Brian the next morning, you know, for, for the arraignment. And, uh, the next morning, John came in and met, you know, met with him and, and stood as his counsel, um, for the arraignment that next morning. And, and then that, that's the only time we got to actually see him since that the day before was that next morning when he went to the arraignment, we weren't able to speak to him, wasn't able to talk to him or anything. Um, then after court, we found out later that evening that he was in, uh, he was, uh, you know, where, where he was located at. I don't want to, no, we didn't find out. Um, we, we thought that he was still, he was still downtown. We didn't find out until after the weekend, cause we didn't know where he was on Friday. We didn't know when we, where he was on Saturday. Um, and John kept, John kept reaching out to the U S attorney to find out where he was. And he kept saying he didn't know that he was going to try to find out for us. Um, and we didn't find out until like Monday evening, I think it was. And, um, once we found out, I asked, I asked Brian to call, and I asked one of our other agents, bonding agents to verify if this is where he is. And he did. And Brian said, well, I know you want to, you want to hear it for yourself, but he's there. And I did. And that satisfied me. And the next day, you know, we were trying to figure out how to see him cause we hadn't seen him nor talked to him. So he basically, he gets up early. Did he get up early? Yes. Every morning, every morning he gets up. Why did he get up early? So it started because he had a, he had a dog. He had a little Chihuahua. So he got up every morning to walk his dog and then he'll walk to 7-11 and then he'll walk his dog again and he'll go to work. What, what did he do at 7-11? Brian just likes to walk. So that gave him a destination to walk to. So he would go, he would get his soda or water or bottle of water. Um, he likes their pizza and their Chiquitos. Yeah. Who doesn't? I know, you know, I'm with you, baby snacks and back home, you know? So he was taking his morning walk to 7-11 with his little dog to get his water and pizza. Well, by now, by that time we had to put the dog to sleep. Okay. Yeah. About a month earlier. Oh gosh. Yeah. But that was his routine for years. Every day, get up in the morning, walk the dog, go up to the 7-11, get his pizza or whatever he was going to get his drink, come back home every day. That was his, that was his routine every day. Yes. And then he went to work and he worked at your family business. Yes. For how long? Oh man. Since he was about 15. Yeah. Since he was about 15, he would, you know, work after school sometimes, you know, when he was younger. Especially the summer. In the summer times, they all worked there at the summertime, worked, worked there during the summer and until he was an adult. And now he's 31. Yep. Yep. And he's worked for the family business the whole time. The whole entire time. And, and went to work every day, five days a week. Five days a week. He's the only kid that didn't take vacation or sick time. It's making me emotional. Why frame this kid? I mean, excuse me. It's crazy. Well, it's, the more you know, we've been, we just have been talking all morning. So I know a lot that I hope will come out, but it's like, it's one of the most shocking stories. I've certainly in all these years met a lot of people who claimed that they had a relative who was framed for a crime or whatever. I've never believed it. I believe it more fervently than I do in this case, because it's just. Cause it's true. You know. It clearly is true. Tell us about, and let me just say, this is a man with no criminal record at all. At all. No disciplinary record in school. At all. No social media. No. At all. And so they're telling us that this guy who's zero record of any run-ins with the law or school authorities and no history of like posting extremism or whatever, set bombs in front of the two political party headquarters for reasons, whatever. The whole thing is crazy. But tell us who he was. What's he like? How would you describe your son and namesake? Really, really good kid. Good guy. I can't call him a kid because he's a man now. Really good guy. Never caused any trouble. Very, very well respected. Respect every, he respect everyone. Always helpful. You know, just a general, generally a really good guy. Yeah. Never caused us an issue. I mean, his whole, his whole life never caused us an issue at all. You know, some, you know, you have kids, you know, I've had other kids cause me some problems, but the one, the one that don't cause, didn't cause us anything is, is, is going through all of this and don't, we don't understand, but he, he's, he's a really good kid. But, um, it is, you won't find anybody, anybody. That will say something negative about him. So we talk about Cozy Earth a lot. Their response to the show. We're not ashamed of that. We think they're awesome. Their sheets transform your room into a resort. The best part is they're made from bamboo, which we think is so cool. They surround you with soft, smooth sensation. The second you get into bed, they're great and they fit everybody's sleeping needs. And that's because they're temperature regulating. So if you're a hot sleeper, we don't want to know more. They help. They wick away moisture. So you don't wake up covered in sweat. Now we should issue one note of caution about Cozy Earth. These are so good. 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It's a first of its kind plan, created for how Texans actually use energy. Discover how much more you could save with Free Nights and Cool Summer. TXU Energy. Energy for everything. Visit TXU.com for more information. Rep number 10004. If he's waking up at 6 to walk his little dog to 7-Eleven every single morning and then go to work at the family business, you know, it kind of says a lot. So you have described him as having autism? Yes. So for me, you know, we had Brian Young. You know, I was 20. And he was always quiet. You know, he never had any issues. You know how children want to be entertained. Well, Brian never really wanted to be entertained. As long as he ate. And his diaper was clean. There was no problems with Brian. You know, my cousin, girlfriend used to babysit him. And she was like, I'll babysit him anytime you want. Because he really truly was no problem. He had no problem with entertaining himself. But again, I was young. Didn't really pay attention to that. I just thought he was a good kid. And I got a job at a pediatrician's office in Fairfax. And as he grew, you know, a lot of things that I saw a lot of parents bring their kids in with autisms and tics and stuff like that. I realized that a lot of those tendencies he had. And I wasn't sure. But when he became at an age where he can make more decisions of his own and doesn't have to, you know, do everything we say or everything we want, he never did. And then the headphones really kind of showed me. And then his speech and stuff like that. And always compliant. Always compliant. And there were other, you know, little things. And so. But a sweet-tempered kid? Always. Always. People got to understand. When we come from, when we grew up at, in the Washington, D.C. area, southeast side of Washington, D.C., you know, and we were young when we had our kids. We didn't, autism wasn't this big focal thing, focused like it is today. You know, we didn't know about autism. Oh, I'm the same generation. I know. Never heard of it. Autism, never even heard of autism. So, to see a kid like that. To see a kid like that, we thought it was normal because we were with him every day. Of course. We weren't educated on autism. We knew nothing about autism at the time. Now, hindsight, looking back now from what we know and what we've learned now about autism, the signs were definitely there. Yes. But during that, during the 90s and the early 2000s, you know, autism wasn't in the forefront of anything. You know, a lot of people didn't know too much about autism. Especially in our communities. Of course. You know, and, you know, I just wanted to say that because you have a lot of people go, well, they should have known something. We didn't know. You know, we weren't educated on that during that era. The reason I wanted you to explain that part of Brian's personality and life is because it may be relevant to this case. And I'm not going to ask you to comment on this because I think probably you can't because there's a trial. Yes. But the government has said that he confessed to this crime, and it is widely known, universally known, and there have been studies that show it, that prove it, that people with autism are much more likely to falsely confess to crimes they did not commit because autistic people sometimes have a great deal of emotional intensity. They are pleasers. They just want it to stop. They will admit, and studies have shown this, to anything if you push them hard enough. And so the fact that I'm reading in the paper that an autistic man confessed to a crime means a lot less than if you confessed to a crime or I confessed to a crime. It's like, this is a well-known thing. Right. I'm not asking you to comment on this because I don't think you probably should, but I just want our viewers to understand that. Anyone familiar with this stuff is like, oh, they picked up an autistic kid and he confessed, confessed. Right. So was he political? No. Not to my knowledge. Not to my knowledge. Not to anything. Not to anything that we've seen. No, there was no, no. And I played this back in my head. I mean, no, he never taught politics. None of that. I don't, we don't understand. You know, how do they. He lives at home and you work with him every day. So. Right. So if he were absorbed in some political drama, you probably would have heard about it. We would have known. Right. You know, and don't get me wrong. You know, we talked about current events, you know, when we did have conversations about whatever, you know, but he, you know, wouldn't force away one way or another in terms of political stances, you know, we're more so was right, was wrong. Yes. You know, um, so I just, I just don't understand, you know, where all of this is coming from. Why are they, you know? what how how so the government alleges i i don't know i hope to ask you this question i hope to understand what exactly the reasoning is behind his arrest and continued incarceration so the government said immediately like within a day that the pipe bombs were planted in front of the rnc and the dnc on capitol hill they didn't go off and it turns out they weren't actually real bombs we now know they were inert but that they were planted as a diversion to get law enforcement to go up to capitol hill as the capitol was being stormed by the what they described as insurrectionists so the capitol hill pipe bombings the government told us this many many times were directly connected to what happened at the capitol that day okay correct yes yes right so a couple of questions for you was your son at the january 6th no event no is the government alleging he was there no not to my knowledge did he have any contact that you know of and is the government alleging that he had contact with any of the perpetrators of January 6th? Not to my knowledge. Okay. He had not posted on social media support. No, he don't even have a social media account, no. Are you aware of any connection at all between your son and what happened at the Capitol building on January 6th? No. No. Has the government shown you any connection between your son and what happened that day? No, I haven't seen anything. No. So when they told you your son was the Capitol Hill, the J6 pipe bomber, did part of your brain say, "Oh yeah, I remember him ranting in the kitchen or cleaning his firearms at the kitchen table talking about storming the Capitol." No. No. The only way I, you know, so, I mean, that was five years ago, I put that out of my mind. I didn't follow it, so I don't know, you know, all I saw was the images that the media provided of them storming the Capitol, you know, and that was it for me. Right. I didn't follow it or anything. So I didn't realize what they were talking about until they showed me a still image. I'm like, "Oh, I remember seeing that video." When they, when the FBI showed you? Yes. Oh, but then not- What was in the image? It was just the gray hooded person. The gray hooded person who's security cameras on Capitol Hill picked up planting the bombs. Right. In front of the- That's it. In front of the buildings. That's it. And there, then they showed you these images to tell you that this was your son, Brian. Yes. They asked me, "Does, does that look like Brian? Does that look like his sweat hood?" I'm like, "I got a gray sweat hood. Who doesn't have a gray sweat?" No, that, I can't say that that's his sweat hood or not. Like, that's crazy. Well, I can't answer that question, you know? It just, it was, they were just trying to find something to tie him. Did they find any bomb making materials in your home? I don't know what they found. For me, that day was so, it just blew me out the water. So whatever they gave me, I immediately gave to the attorney. I really didn't look because I'm like, where is he? My children are worried about me, you know? And, and then of course, then the media comes and we just wanted to leave. You know, there's no way around it. A small business needs capital to grow. Whether your company is stocking up on inventory or repairing things, hiring more workers, you gotta have cash. So where should businesses get that money? Well, you need a trusted partner, obviously. Big banks are not the answer. Getting loans from family can work really well, but it could also be very, very complicated. So if you don't want to do any of that, we recommend Cardiff. Cardiff's application takes only a few minutes. You can get approved and funded the same day. It's a simple process. It's fast. It respects your time. Cardiff doesn't lecture you about how their company is gay during pride month. They don't care. That's not why they're here. They're here to grant trustworthy loans. 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Rep number 1-0-0-0-4. - But I'm just, I guess I'm just confused as to the core of any crime is motive. - Right. - Why did someone do this? - Right. - And the government, I think, is under the obligation to provide a coherent motive to explain why we arrested this person and are still holding him in jail. - I haven't heard one. - What, you haven't? - No. - I haven't heard no motives at all, none. - Can you think of a motive? - No. - No. Not at all. - Do you think that if your son, since he does live at home and works at the family business and is autistic and gets up at 6:00 a.m. to walk his dog to 7-Eleven, do you think if he was planning a bombing that you might've noticed? - I would think so. - Yeah. - Like his room was right down the hall from my room. And of course I'm a nosy mom. And because I know, you know, I like to go in there and mess with Brian because, you know, he doesn't talk a lot. - Yes. - And I like to just go and mess with him and try to force him to talk and yeah. - Yeah. And then he'll leave out his room. So I would leave out his room, but you know, I know the tactics. So I wait till he comes back and, you know, he's surprised, I'm like, "You still here?" "Yeah, 'cause I knew you were trying to shut me up." You know, so it's not, you know, it's not like something he can hide, you know? So I don't know where all this is coming from. I really don't. - But you don't understand, what the government is thinking. So like the Capitol Hill pipe bombs were connected to the January 6th demonstration/riot, what they call an insurrection. We can just say that because the government has told us that for five years. So you don't see, honestly, any connection at all between your son and the January 6th protests. - No. - No. - The government must be drawing some connection. - I would like to know. And again, we probably won't really know until trial. - When is trial? - February 16th, '27. My baby would have been arrested for, in jail for a year. - A year and two months. - That's it. - Why? Okay, so this gets to a question that you can answer since you're literally in the bail bonds business. And ironically, your son is being held without bond. - Yes. - But here's someone who has no criminal record of any kind, no record of misbehavior of any kind, but he's being held without bond when he has a family and a family home and a family business. And like, he can go back and be with people, but he's being held without bond 'cause why? - They. - They said that their only excuse was, and it's really crazy because they agree he's not a risk. He's not, he's not, he's not a risk to-- - A flight risk. - Well, he's not a risk to the people. He's not a risk of fleeing anywhere. And that he's never been arrested, but because of the alleged charges that they brought against him, he shouldn't be left out, released. Now, mind you, you know, we agreed and my mother-in-law said, well, he can come to my house since they feel, because they claim that, you know, things were different. We're done in my house. Well, he can come stay in my house. I live in a gated community. We can do ankle monitor. We can do house arrest if you want. You can come by and visit whenever you choose. He can do weekly check-ins, nothing. Only because of the charges that they allege that they put against him. - How long have you been in the bail bonds business? - 31 years. - So again, I can't overstate how much perspective you have in this. How weird is this? - Let me say this. If this was a case in another state, any other case, even similar to this, but in another state, another area, he would have been out of jail by now. He'd have been fighting this from home. I don't know if it had anything to do with, if it had anything to do with his, race, I don't know. I don't want to put that out there because just very recently, right after, actually right after his case, a county over, Loudoun County in Virginia, similar situation happened with some white kids. And they're home, similar situation. I don't know why he, I don't know. Well, if you think about it big picture, they didn't make any arrests in this case or any progress in this case that we know of for five years until a media outlet produced a story, which I am not endorsing because I don't have the information to endorse it, but in which they named a suspect on the basis of a gate analysis program they ran against the CCTV footage. And on the basis of that, they named a woman called Shani Kirkov, I think her name is, who was a former Capitol Police officer who now is in a security detail at the Central Intelligence Agency, amazingly, and they claimed that she failed a polygraph test when asked if she was the bite bomber. And we should mention that Shani Kirkov has denied being the bomber or having any involvement in the case. And, you know, it was almost immediately after that that your son was fired. He was arrested after five years of no progress on the case. It's like two weeks later. Is that true, two weeks later? Five to two weeks, five to seven, I think it was told on October 16th. It was about five weeks later. And November 8th. About a month later. Yeah. So I have so many questions about this. The most obvious question is how did someone who's publicly named, falsely or not, okay, I don't know, but publicly named as the pipe bomber, how does that person retain? A security clearance and then wind up with increased authority and a security detail at CIA headquarters at Langley? Like, what in the world are we watching here? Does that, I mean, you guys are. Makes no sense to me. Spends your lives adjacent to law enforcement. Does that make sense? Makes no sense. I've seen people lose a security clearance over DUI or DWI. Exactly. So, you know, I don't, I don't understand that one myself, you know. But the arrest of your son who has no publicly described connection whatsoever to J6. Gets arrested immediately after this person, this other person is named in the media. Yep. So this is why I wanted to talk to you, because it does seem like you're looking at a kind of made for TV movie type conspiracy. What's the other explanation for this? That's the only place I thought stuff like this happened. That's what I thought. That's the only place I cannot. I mean, I truly cannot. I've never thought that any like anything like this happens here. That the federal government would knowingly put an innocent man in jail and then hold him there without bond when they know he didn't do it. Yes. We have not spoken to our son directly since, for me, the night of December 3rd. I mean, we talk over the phone. But how much of a conversation can you have? Right. Over a jail phone. Right. He does give us video visits here and there. What can you say over a jail video visit? Especially with someone who's not, as you said, much of a talker anyway. It's like total isolation. Yes. Yeah. What's interesting to me is that there is a blanket pardon in place issued by the president, and it's in place. For everyone associated with the January 6th. Mm-hmm. Events. Everyone who was indicted. Yes. January 6th and convicted in some cases, they're all pardoned and the sentence is commuted. So your son is now in jail on January 6th related charges, I think. Yes. Why doesn't that apply to him? I can't. We can't answer that. That's something that the lawyers need to come back and answer. I can't answer that. I have no idea. I don't know the answer either, but it's very strange. The other thing that is strange to me is that, I think, tell me if I'm wrong, but that your son is charged with a weapons of mass destruction charge. I know, right? Crazy. Yes. But it has been publicly confirmed that the bombs were inert. Yes. They weren't actually bombs. They couldn't explode. That's my understanding. So how could you be charged with weapons of mass destruction offense for assuming he had anything to do with this, but let's say he did. They literally weren't weapons. They were weapons of mass destruction. Right. That's another question that you would have to ask our legal, his legal team. Yeah. Because I, you know, that's, I know I can't answer that. These are things that we just can't answer because we don't know, you know, how can they, you know, it, it don't make sense, you know, how, how can you charge them with that? You know? Well, by their own description, it doesn't make sense. They're the ones who told us the bombs weren't real. Exactly. You know? And I went and looked at the image of what they said. And I'm like, they gotta be joking. Why? Why did you think that? Those images was, what was those things going to do? Those. When you saw, have you seen, uh. The images online. Video footage of the bomb? No, they have still pictures online. Of the, of the actual device. Yeah. Right. Of the device. I think it was the device, um, they said under a bush. Yes. Or by a bush. So they have images of those online. And so, you know, again, I don't know anything like of this. Um, so I, I'm just floored. I, I don't understand where they come with that. Homeownership has always been at the center of the American dream. 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Who was John Doe Two and where was he? We spoke with survivors, investigators, law enforcement, even Timothy McVeigh's defense attorney. The story that he was telling me, I did not feel was the truth. Watch the OKC Bomb Files, streaming exclusively on talkercarlson.com. Home of the Save. Join for just $20 at bjs.com/mesquite and save 10 cents per gallon for six months. Open soon. Limited time offer. New members only. BJ's. Home of the Save. This episode is brought to you by TXU Energy. TXU Energy. Visit txu.com for more information, rep number 10004. Have you seen video of the pipe bomber? Because there is video out there of the person in the gray hoodie. Only what I've seen online. Online. Yes. I think most parents know what their children move like. This is not scientific, but it's real and any parent can tell you. If you see there's a crowd of people, you can tell which one's your kid just by the way he moves. Does that look like your son? Not at all. Not at all. At all. Cool. Cool. In the time since his arrest in December, has anyone in your family or his friends come to you and said, "Actually, you didn't know Brian had a secret life you didn't know about." No. No. No. No. Has anyone in the federal government indicated to you, and you don't need to use names, that this case is fake, that this is a miscarriage of justice, a travesty? I've separated myself and let his legal team handle everything, so I don't talk to any I don't, you know, I refer everybody over to our legal team, but I can't, I'm going to say no, no one has ever approached or asked. You just have to wonder about the FBI agents or federal marshals, whoever they were, the people pointing rifles at you and handcuffing you and handcuffing your grandson. Like, do they think that they're actually fighting for justice here? Do they really think that your son was the J6 pipe bomber? Or who knows? I have no idea, but I tell you this, and this is something that was raised in court. For him to be such a dangerous person, and I say this all the time, when they so-called, I guess, raided the house, why did they leave his firearm there? They did. If he was such a dangerous person. If he was such a dangerous person, why did they leave his firearm sitting there? Yeah. They left it on his nice. If you were thinking he was just dangerous, just, you know, whatever kind of person they trying to allege that he is, why not take that? Do that make sense? Well, because they know he's not a dangerous person. Yeah. And then again, you know, if he's this dangerous person. If he's this dangerous person, why follow him all this time? Why, when you come to my house, you don't evacuate at least my cul-de-sac? If all of what you're saying is in my house, I'm upset because if that was truly the case, why you guys let us live in a house that you feel is unsafe like that? That someone is dangerous like that. Yeah. And that is filled with bombing equipment and high explosives. I don't know. We don't know anything about that. You know, that's like crazy. I just. My biggest thing is. Why did they wait so long if they knew? Right. If they supposedly knew what was going on and knew he was this person. One, why leave a dangerous weapon sitting in in there? Why not? Once again, like she said, evacuate. Why not have evacuated the neighbors and evacuated the cul-de-sac? Well, here's what again, what we know, what we know is that a former Capitol Hill police officer who was employed at Capitol Police on January 6th. Found up working at CIA headquarters in Langley, and that person was named publicly in a media report as the Capitol Hill pipe bomber. And almost immediately after that person was named, they arrested your son. Yes. And again, to be clear, Shawnee Kirkhoff denies being the J6 bomber or having any involvement in the case. What were they doing for five years? When have they told you when they figured out that your son was the pipe bomber? No, not at all. How long do you think they were surveilling him? I. They, they've had pictures of him at the office. Yeah, the office. They've had pictures of him at the office. I mean, I've seen a picture of him at the office. Your family office. Yes. I've seen a picture of him walking and it's either one of the stores because we had a clogged, a clogged drain. But so I knew that that was the most recent picture. I don't know anything. Well, you sent him to the hardware store to get somebody to fix the drain. Yeah. But that was about it. And how long before his arrest was that? I would say maybe two weeks or so. Yeah. So they had been following him. But as far as you know, their surveillance of your son began after Shawnee Kirkhoff was named. Yes. The CIA person. Yes, from our understanding. Yes. Okay. So again, I'm not alleging this. I'm just noting that it looks like they didn't really focus on your son until media reports named a CIA employee. Okay. Okay. Okay. As the pipe bomber. And then, you know, not to be cynical, but it looks like they're like, holy smokes, we got to find someone to blame for this pipe bomb. Yes. Because the person who's been publicly named still has security clearances and reportedly is on the director of central intelligence's personal security detail. And I didn't know that. I didn't know that. I don't know that. You know, can't verify that, but. That's what it appears to be. Yes, that's what it appears. So it doesn't look good at all. So who do you, who do you appeal to? Like other than your attorneys? Like, are there any political figures who've called you and said, what is this? No. None. None. Not to be mean, but like, what about the civil rights establishment? Like where, where are they? Like where's Sharpton? I have no idea. I am being mean. Okay, I'll stop. But, but has anyone defended you? I guess that's all I'm saying. Or defended your son, your family? No. Only, you know, Steve Baker, you know, our attorneys, of course, you know, our family, you know, but as far as, you know, everyone as a whole, you know, they're, they're, I'm, I'm, I'm reading and I'm seeing people say things, but no. You live in Virginia, there's a governor, there are two senators or a whole bunch of congressmen. Yes. No calls from any of them? None. None. Um, I can't imagine what this is costing. You both just sighed. Yeah. I mean, you know, not only financially, but, you know, this is a, this is heavy. This is weighing on our whole family, our extended family, because we all protect Brian. You can ask anyone who has come in contact with Brian, family, friends. Neighbors, you know, just in passing that, no, they most definitely have the wrong guy, you know, and because he is autistic and we know, you know, how he is, we're suffering because he's suffering and he's trying to protect us by saying he's okay. You know? Um. It's, it's, it's, it's mentally, it's mentally draining, um, physically, uh, draining is, it's hard. It's hard, you know, not only the financial side of it, but the, the, you know, worrying about him every day, worrying about him every night, you know, and he, he, he, he does a good job. He does, he, he do give us a call every day. He does. He calls us every night, every, every single one of us, because that's his. That's his, his pattern. Yes. Twice a day, we hear from him twice a day, every single one of us. And, uh, I mean, he, you know, it, he's okay. And, and, and like I said, I, I, I take my, I, I give credit where credit is due. Um, and if I ask Brian, is everything okay? Are you okay? He's gonna, he's gonna give me an honest answer and he's okay. You know, they. He's in a, he's in a really good place, safe place. Um, and he's, they taking good care of him. I, I, and I, I gotta say that because I don't want anyone to think he's being mistreated or anything like that. No, I don't think he's being mistreated. They at least did that correctly. But he's in jail. Right. Yeah, he's in jail. He's in jail. So you've been in this business for 31 years. Have you ever met anyone who enjoyed jail? No one, no one enjoys jail. At all. No one enjoys jail, but I do know that things could have been a lot worse. Yeah. I do. You know what I'm saying? Right. And I, and I don't, and I, I don't wanna, I don't wanna, um, downplay and, and say that, you know, he's being treated this way. They, I, they doing this, they, I'm not gonna say that. I'm just gonna say, Brian is okay. You know, he's okay. He, he, he's not, um, he's not being mistreated. Well, you have a very forgiving and optimistic perspective, but I think for most people, the idea of having your son snatched off the street. Yeah. And his mother, you know, and her grandson handcuffed and then locked away for a year on ridiculous, untrue charges and slandered in public on the basis of no evidence at all. Mm-hmm. The whole thing just sounds like out of a movie or something that could never happen in this country. Yeah. Like a Netflix series. Yeah. Hank joined BJ's Wholesale Club the day he became a father of 30. I coach football. Yeah. Coach Hank saves up to 25% off grocery store prices, 30 pounds of pasta, three cases of protein bars, 75 sports drinks. And that's just pregame. He knows teamwork and BJ's knows savings. This is your home, coach. Home of the save. Open soon. Limited time offer. New members only. For the first time ever. Texans have an energy plan that combines free nights all year with daytime summer savings. TXU Energy. Show button here. Football is finally back. And prize picks is going crazy. TXU is going crazy with the deals to start the season, giving out promos every day in September. On prize picks. the picks you want all in the same app and now prize picks is available nationwide so what are you waiting for lock in for kickoff because everyone and everything is on prize picks what you want download the app today and use code spotify to get 150 instantly in lineups if you win your first five dollar lineup prize picks run your game um well i hope this helps and i think anyone watching this i don't think i'm easily fooled maybe i am i don't think so and i've certainly talked to a lot of people in a similar position and i believe your story completely and uh i hope that this gets wide attention and i hope massive pressure is applied to the authorities to stop this immediately well what we want to say this as a family we want to we want to thank you and thank you for allowing us to come on your platform and and uh talk about this um and you know just want to say thank you well thank you it's it's actually not me it was i you know i'm i'm paying half attention like the rest of us to most of the news just like you were when you're watching television oh they got the bomber or whatever you know it's like i wasn't paying attention i got a call from as i said at the outset someone i know in the federal government who's highly informed and very experienced and skeptical of everything who's like this is the craziest thing i've ever seen they grabbed this random autistic guy and put him in jail like right after steve baker named this federal employee as the pipe bomber this is shocking that this could happen and this is the craziest thing i've ever seen and this is the craziest thing i've ever seen and this is a federal employee who told me this in a relevant agency so i was uh highly motivated to meet you after that i'm grateful for him oh so are we because this is this is horrible this is a travesty you know and i'm so angry i am i am i am angry i am disappointed you know you know but i have to keep focus yes on my son you know for me as the mom as his mom and for his dad it's too different so you know as he just said he will open up to his dad but he won't open up to me that sense because he know how i feel he know i'm gonna worry you know and to know that he's been snatched away from me the way that he has and i can't talk to him openly and hug him even though he doesn't like hugs but he know i'm gonna do it you know and just being autistic when you're in a in an environment where it's so much stuff around you know you're you're it's chaotic inside it's overload right and so to be put in a place this chaotic so you're dealing with chaos inside and outside and it's out of your control you know and i can only emphasize what he's going through and there's nothing we can do to help nothing nothing and that's that's the downside and we know that he doesn't belong there and they know that he doesn't belong there and they're prolonging this and it shouldn't be and and this i i feel helpless at the moment and that's why i appreciate our attorneys i appreciate steve baker i appreciate those that are out there speaking out and trying to share the story because i i truly think that somewhere somehow someone is trying to suppress this boy and we appreciate you too for allowing us to come well i think i think someone is trying to suppress this i really do destroying a young man to do it is is unforgivable so and especially someone like brian this can happen to anybody not let alone a person with autism anyone anyone you know i just i am i am grateful to god that we have the ability to fight for our son that's exactly right let's just imagine if we didn't i was thinking that this word of what the what the government has said everyone has believed nobody is looking into nothing nobody is saying anything and that's that's one of the things you know coming on your platform we just want people to go and just do their own research let them go read just it's all there look at look at what the government is presenting it it's all right there you're going to see the let them make their opinion on the case that's all i'm actually i have looked at it it's a joke and they're liars and to do this to an innocent man is totally unforgivable and should not be allowed in a civilized and free country period yes so god bless you both thank you same to you thank you